Barbell Shrugged - How to Compete in Weightlifting, Genetics vs. Hard Work, Volume Training as a Base of Strength w/ Richard Gonsalves, Anders Varner, Doug Larson, Travis Mash - Barbell Shrugged #442

Episode Date: February 19, 2020

“BACK SQUAT BUNDLE” Launch Sale saving you over $350:   20RM Back Squat One Ton Challenge Squat Cycle Squat the House Nutrition for Weightlifters Movement Specific Mobility   Get Strong Here and use code “squatstrength” to save ______________________________________ In this episode of Barbell Shrugged, Anders, Doug, and Travis discuss:   Why competing is important for strength   Genetic Talent vs. Hard Work Why you have to grow big legs and a base of strength High rep work volume training before  Technique, rhythm, and timing And more…   Anders Varner on Instagram Doug Larson on Instagram Travis Mash on Instagram ______________________________________ TRAINING PROGRAMS One Ton Challenge One Ton Strong - 8 Weeks to PR your snatch, clean, jerk, squat, deadlift, and bench press 20 REP BACK SQUAT PROGRAM - Giant Legs and a Barrell Core 8 Week Snatch Cycle - 8 Weeks to PR you Snatch Aerobic Monster - 12 week conditioning, long metcons, and pacing strategy ______________________________________ Please Support Our Sponsors   “Save $20 on High Quality Sleep Aid at Momentous livemomentous.com/shrugged us code “SHRUGGED20” at checkout.   US Air Force Special Operations - http://airforce.com/specialops   Organifi - Save 20% using code: “Shrugged” at organifi.com/shrugged   PRx Performance - http://prxperformance.com use code “shrugged” to save 5%   ------------------------------------------------------------------ Show notes at: http://www.shruggedcollective.com/bbs-ep442 ------------------------------------------------------------------ ► Subscribe to Barbell Shrugged's Channel Here ► Subscribe to Shrugged Collective's Channel Here http://bit.ly/BarbellShruggedSubscribe 📲 🎧 Listen to the audio version on the Apple Podcast App or Stitcher for Android Here- http://bit.ly/BarbellShruggedApple http://bit.ly/BarbellShruggedStitcher Shrugged Collective is a network of fitness, health and performance shows that help people achieve their physical and mental health goals.  Usually in the gym, but outside as well. In 2012 they posted their first Barbell Shrugged podcast and have been putting out weekly free videos and podcasts ever since. Along the way we've created successful online coaching programs including The Shrugged Strength Challenge, The Muscle Gain Challenge, FLIGHT, Barbell Shredded, and Barbell Bikini. We're also dedicated to helping affiliate gym owners grow their businesses and better serve their members by providing owners tools and resources like the Barbell Business Podcast. Find Shrugged Collective and their flagship show Barbell Shrugged here: SUBSCRIBE ON ITUNES ► http://bit.ly/ShruggedCollectiveiTunes WEBSITE ► https://www.ShruggedCollective.com INSTAGRAM ► https://instagram.com/shruggedcollective FACEBOOK ► https://facebook.com/barbellshruggedpodcast TWITTER ► http://twitter.com/barbellshrugged

destroying plateaus eliminating the flat asses growing the tree trunk size legs building barrel abs crushing prs and massive savings this week only the five-day back squat bundle launch sale included the 20 rep back squat program one ton challenge one rep max back squat cycle squat the house the express accessory back squat program and then the two bonus products to make sure you're eating right and moving right. Nutrition for Weightlifters, how to eat to get strong, and movement-specific mobility, giving you all the recovery, mobility, and warm-ups that you need to keep your joints and tissues healthy. And this week only, you're going to save over $350 on all five products

using the code squat strength. So get over to barbell shrug.com forward slash back squat bundle. All one word B-A-C-K-S-Q-U-A-T bundle B-U-N-D-L-E and use the code squat strength to make sure you're saving all the cash. Today's episode is the final experience from our trip to Sweden. But before we get started, I want to thank our friends over at Organifi. The green, the red, the gold. All of the beautiful drinks to make sure you're getting your vitamins and your minerals.

Make sure you're getting over to Organifi.com forward slash truck to save 20% on the green, the red, and the gold. This is three years running. You guys love them. We love them. All you need, a little bit of almond milk. You can do water. It's just not as delicious. Get you two scoops of green.

Some people go one. I like to double up on the micros because I like the micros. I don't get enough salads in my life. I don't eat enough veggies in my day-to-day when I'm doing the shrug things. When I'm lifting the weights, I'm not worried about the asparagus. I need to be, but I'm not. That's why Organifi is here giving me all the vitamins and minerals that I need to be healthy. Organifi.com forward slash shrugged. Friends, yeah, I got to go over there. You got to get your micronutrients. Organifi.com forward slash shrugged save 20%. Friends, today, Richard Gonsalves, Aleko, you're going to talk about weightlifting.

We love it. Snatch, clean, and jerk. It's going to go deep, and it's going to be a lot of fun. Enjoy the show. Welcome to Barbell Shrugged. I'm Anders Varner. Doug Larson. Dude, we're at Aleko. We're hanging out at Homestod. This is the fourth show. The Sports Center's brand new. I got this fresh hat on right now. It's squared up real tight.

Travis Mash. Squared up real tight. If you're watching on YouTube, there's a reason I look so damn sexual right now. It's because of this hat. Richard Gonzalez. How's it going? Olympic weightlifting gangster. We've been talking for like 20 minutes right now. I'm riveted by the stories you have. Tell me a little

bit about your Olympic weightlifting background. Snatching 150. That's 330 pounds out there for you mere mortals in the United States. Mere mortals. Yeah, man. You have all the weightlifting knowledge of the sport. Where'd you start

snatching clean and jerk knowledge of the sport. Where did you start snatching Clean and Jerk? On the spot. Yeah, on the spot. I started when I was 18. Hold on. Yoakum is just rolling in with the goods. Do you see how quickly I can be distracted? Yes.

There it is. More swag, more swag, more t-shirts. You're no longer Yoakum. You're just yoked. Yeah. Oh. Killed it. You look good in that turtleneck, too.

No one wears the turtleneck that well. Talk to me. Tell me how you got so strong, dude. I didn't. I don't recall being strong. I don't recall being strong. You got too many strong people. Yeah.

18. I was a swimmer, I think. Really? Yeah. You and Eddie Hall, huh? We swam together. And then we were at school, and it was University of Toronto. There was a very, very good weightlifting coach there

and a lot of very good weightlifters, Akos Sandor, Buck Ramsey. Akos has been to the Olympics. Steve's been to the Olympics. Everyone's been to the Olympics. Yeah. So it was a really cool environment to go to. And I remember someone said,

oh, I bet you can't clean two blue plates. And I had no concept of what two blue plates were. And I've never even done a squat with a bar. I'm like, okay. And I picked it up and I was like, okay, this is quite heavy. So I'm like, but I'm going to clean two blue plates. I remember it took like a month

and then I cleaned two blue plates. And that's how it all started. And it was fun because when you're 18, you're a junior, I'm going to clean two blue plates. I remember it took like a month and then I cleaned two blue plates. Yeah. And that's how it all started. And it was fun because when you're 18, you're a junior and 18 to 20, everything went really, really fast. And I all of a sudden found this like identity. Yeah.

You're good at something finally. Yeah. And that was really cool to be included. And the environment that I've been in has always been, I was so lucky, it's always been an elite environment. That's good. I didn't go through a grassroots level.

All the guys that I was training with, they were like national team. That sounds like nationally performance. Yeah, it's very similar. When you're in that environment, it's just much easier to get stronger. But it inspires you to push and push and push and push and not just, okay, this is what I'm supposed to be doing at 18. Your expectations are so much higher.

Yeah, your expectations are like, I want to snatch 180. That's why when we introduce you and we say, you snatched 150 kilos, which is 330 pounds, you're like, yeah, I'm not that strong though. Because he was at a gym that did what? Everybody. Raise the bar. Ooh!

Right on the wall. Right on the wall. Lico what? Everybody. Raise the bar. Ooh. Ooh. Right on the wall. Right on the wall. Aliko, back there. Raise the bar. But it is easier when you're at a gym like my gym or what sounds like this gym. So your perception is different. You go to – it all depends on – your view of reality is not even truth anyway.

It's just a few images that you happen to have picked up. It's what your mom and dad said to you. It's the friends you what they said is real and that becomes your reality but when you go into you know a typical gym and two blues is a lot of weight yeah it's like oh wow two blues you come to my gym and they're like set two yeah go to the corner brother you know but like but then you see like uh morgan you see a 16-year-old clean and jerk 190 kilos. You're like, oh, I have work to do. And now what you think is heavy is something 190 kilos. So then when you do 120, 130, 140, it's no big deal. It's just part of the process.

It's part of the process. It's part of the process. It's the steps to get to 190. And so it depends on where you go. It's a huge part. How long was it before you stepped on a competition platform? As a junior, it was relatively quickly because where I'm from, in Ontario, in Toronto, they have a really good system where when they see someone has potential,

they try and get them to compete. They try and get them to learn how to try and get them to learn how to compete. And then you learn how to train to compete. Instead of just learning weightlifting and then train your whole life to never compete, the system there really teaches people how to compete and how to train yourself to compete. And so I really appreciated that. I had really good people around me, I think. And my coach also, he's like, if you want to train here, you have to compete.

You have no choice. So I was like, what is a competition? Well, that comes out of, like, the best weightlifting schools. You can go online and watch Klokoff when he was, like, nine. Yeah. Like, doing clean and jerk snatch and on and smashing it. Well, that's how you hook people. Look, everyone listening, if you have a gym and you really want a weightlifting team,

you know, the minute you get them in the competition is when you hook your fish. Yeah. You know, when you're like, you compete and you go six for six, which is really what you want to happen for your young ones, and they're like, oh, I accomplished this. People are clapping. It's fun. I'm with my team.

That is where the fun is. And then you understand why am I coming here and working my butt off every day? No, it's for this payoff. Was weightlifting cool at this time? No, this was right before it was cool. And this is where it kind of helped me in my life because right when it all of a sudden now it's a commodity, I already had the skill of doing weightlifting. So that's how I got into coaching and stuff so i got i learned it i got a free education in weightlifting

basically that then helped me become an adult and why do you think you were strong swimming isn't necessarily no i think i think there's a lot of genetics to do with it though like i have freak legs i'm not very strong up top but i have do you know why were your parents strong yeah my dad and on my dad's side there i'm for i was born in goa which is a portuguese colony in india cool uh so that that's where my heritage kind of come from that's so unique yeah so first person i ever met from goa yeah yeah it's like to come all the way to sweden to find the kid from Goa. And now I live in Sweden.

And the journey, people don't understand that. A lot of people now that I meet, they think, okay, I'm going to start weightlifting. I'm going to go to the Olympics. But honestly, it's not like that. You need to do – first you need to attain, okay, go to a meet. Learn what it feels like to compete. Compete state or provincial. Attain something.

Earn a spot up. I mean, the best competition I ever had that I did was 140 and 172 or 173, something of that nature. And then right after that, I hurt myself. And I remember trying to get back to that point was awful. When I was doing it for other people, when I was doing it because, oh, shit oh shit if i'm not at that level i don't deserve to be a weightlifter i remember i got i understand when people are in that mindset yeah because i've been there and then when i let go of that finally and it was when i was in poland that's when i had the best training of my life

i didn't care about competing i just was training for fun that that's and going through that journey i think i i started much earlier than a lot of people start now so i got to help a lot of people along the line right i had a very similar experience with that when i was i trained martial arts my entire life but then when i started fighting mma i felt like my training used to be really awesome and then my training like because the reasons for training changed my training actually got worse yeah in some respects and then once i stopped competing then all of a sudden training became fun again and i started getting better faster because i was having more fun and i wanted to be there more and i was

enjoying it more yeah and it's so important like the being happy is more important than your conception of what is strong yeah the yes and but you can also not be like dumb to the fact that yeah you're strong do that or you're not strong don't do that like it's do what you're good at dude and for many of us weightlifting really is just the gateway to personal development yeah like we can add five pounds to the bar but that five pounds doesn't mean shit unless you're figuring out why you're why that five pounds is important to you and then all the pieces that go into actually getting stronger of eliminating the trash from your diet eliminating all the bad friends you have in your life actually having positive thoughts learning how to talk to yourself in a way that accentuates your life and it helps you grow

weightlifting's just this basic physical thing that's so simple for us to add five pounds to the bar. But because there's an Olympic stage and because you can go compete in front of people now, you get the ability to be happy. I think there's a 100% athlete paradigm. You start doing this thing and it's fun. You're having a good time. You're learning this new movement. You're feeling that snatch perfectly. You're like, oh, this is amazing. You're competing. You have your friends and you're having this new movement you know you're you're feeling that snatch yeah perfectly you're like oh this is amazing you're competing you have your friends and you're having a best time then

someone says oh you know you're pretty good at this i think you could do x then yeah you have a bad shift then you go crazy and you're like you obsess over trying to make this world team or trying to meddle at the world or trying to whatever that thing they've told you you go you lose your mind yeah training is like you know you have one bad training session in your life yeah or you have a good day and it's great and you let that dictate your feelings in life and then all of a sudden you start hating it yeah you're like why am i doing it like he's telling the story of my life. Because it's the athlete journey.

We can all go right back to those specific spots. And someone says, just have fun. So you're like, all right, let's go back to where I started, and I'm just going to enjoy it. I don't care what happens that day. I'm just going to embrace the process. And now you fall back in love with it. And if you can survive that middle part and you can get back to this part,

that's where you really find out what kind of athlete you can be. And you can leave. Then at the end of all of that, you can leave the sport being like, I loved it. You know, let's go tell the world. I can go work for you, let go and tell the world about how this amazing experience is. Yeah, along the way, like what kind of was your journey? mean you find it you start competing that was exactly literally it was like when you find it it's fun no no but it's true it's so and i think a lot of people can relate to that but there's a part to it at the end that not a lot of people are brave enough to say that okay

i need to let go of this image of being at proving myself on a world stage and just do it and be good at it and love it a lot of people don't they feel uncomfortable in that zone yeah what happened to me was i was good starting off right i you can say okay he put him on a world stage or put him on a national team do something when i was a junior and i was doing well as a junior but i wasn't really good at weightlifting honestly i was quite was quite shitty. Like, in terms of the technique, I just happened to be one of those people who gets strong quite fast when you put a little bit of pressure on them. Okay. When did you realize that you had really strong legs specifically? Was that like?

It was when I went from, okay, I squat a bar, to then I went to 100 kilos, to then my back squat went to 150, to 170, to 190, to 210, to 230. It just went like. Yeah. what kind of time period was that i would say it went from let's say let's say i started off at 100 kilos because that was the first heavy back squat i remember doing like okay i can't do one quarter is a good number yeah so it went from 100 that was like okay that's nice it's gonna work some time to get to 120 but then instead of taking a year to get to 120 in a year i got to 200 and then the thing is to get from 200 to 220 it's the same amount of work as from 100 to 200 and then to get from 220 to 225 it's so the the higher the weights go yeah the the less that genetic talent plays a role so much and you have

to really work at it you can't just lean back and and not get hurt and not get it yeah and recover so the higher you go i realized that i can't just coast through i started hitting those walls and that was what was happening to me in the weightlifting when i was getting around 90 snatch and 140 clean and jerk my clean trick would always be better in relative regard i started noticing that i couldn't just every week i come in and do five kilos more yeah and then i said okay now i need to work at this then i worked at it then then you build this image okay this guy's in his tiny town in this tiny environment you snatch 110 or 120 and you're a good weightlifter you've been

on the scene for two years okay now i need to start thinking about a national team how do i make a national team and i remember my first try at a national team i i bumped out and i missed making it but then my uh my second try my what it was university ad at the in kazan, Russia. I really tried to do it. And I remember this clean and jerk. It was the best clean and jerk of my whole entire life. It was 167. The best I'd done in training was 155.

And I was like, fuck it, just put it on. And there's a picture, actually. There's a picture out there somewhere. Because I trained with Hayden, Adi. This was around that time. Two of my athletes. I always forget that Adi was a good weightlifter. Yeah.

Because she's so good at macros. She's a really good weightlifter. They're sitting there on the side, and there's this picture in this gym, UTM gym, and they're going with their mouth open because I have this weight over my head because they know what my training is yeah they've trained with me every single day and even I'm like oh my god that just happened it's probably if they told the truth before you attempted they're like no yeah I know and as your coach I would have deep down you got this but inside of my no there's no that's a huge jump like wait did you smash your openers and then feel really good

and just throw on something that's 12 kilos more than your max? I was always better in competition than I was in training, always. And then so that competition, the training leading up to it, I was so out to prove that I could do something, and that was around the time that I wanted to get to 300 kilos total. I remember that. I was in that range then. It was like, okay okay i need to snatch 135 and clean jerk 165 or in around there that was so you're at like an intermediate level at that point and i was so focused you should have

played crossfit you could have been a huge celebrity you'd have been a stud yeah yeah if you showed up to crossfit in 2012 there'd would have been like, oh, my God. This guy's got a 300-kilo total. Then you just do butterfly pull-ups. So you hit this 167 and made this team. And then what? So then it went down. Then my training was like, oh, my God, horrible training.

I'm going to go to this big international event, and I'm going to blow it. Because I remember my coach saying to me, what the fuck, Richard? Don't embarrass me. I'm like, you're right. I'm going to go there to not embarrass you. But it ended up working. I remember going to Russia

and I remember taking in that trip. That was my olympic games that was the best trip of my entire life sure man like that just being meeting other people from the country you're on this national team you're representing your country that i met ian there ian wilson and honestly i was so happy on that trip that i ended up doing really well i went six for six and that makes a huge difference when you stand on the platform. Is that the meat that you said was your favorite? That was the biggest meat of my life, and it was my favorite meat. It was like the pinnacle.

Everyone was watching from home, and they're like, I cannot believe you didn't bomb out. Because there's a rule, right? I think it's a 20-kilo rule. You have to start within 20 kilos of your total. So I had no choice but to start at like 128 but the i couldn't i couldn't snatch 120 and trade so they're like nice yeah so everyone was like oh my god he's gonna go he's gonna bomb out everyone thought you're gonna bomb it sounds like you thought you were i thought i was gonna go how do you go six

for six you're like is it 128, 129, 130? Honestly, it was just a reality. And the people there were so nice. The weightlifting environment, the camaraderie. People didn't care what you snatch and clean and jerk. In that environment, it didn't matter because there was a kid there snatching someone else's back squat. It doesn't matter at that point.

It doesn't matter what your numbers are. You just made the frat. Exactly. You're accepted the frat. Exactly. Have some fun and do what you're good at. That point was the best point of my life. There's almost a sense of gratitude.

I felt this any time I made it to the regional for CrossFit or whatever it is. It didn't matter if you finished last or if you won the thing. Everybody wants to win, but once you're in the warm-up area, you look around and you go, I know every single person in here has at least done the work to make it to this level.

So we don't care. Right. That's the way, if you go to a World Championships, you'll see Bodie hanging around the dude from Qatar, hanging around the dude from Great Britain. So around so yeah and hanging around the the dude from great britain so you have uh sick kid's name he's such a nice guy anyway 96 kilo guy from great britain yeah and they're all buddying and then you know the 96 is like a b or c lifter bodie and meso are both obviously and they don't care that's the other thing right i felt this is when i got

to say a huge shout out to ian yeah ian wilson i remember this i thought oh my god i have no business being here i snatch 130 135 this kid snatches 170 and ian was like oh man cool lift i love when you do this this is so i love your technique how do you want to train together like that just put me over the moon that that you know and that's who i'm talking to is not the like elite elite lifter there's there's a lot of people who are who can go through this journey in different sports in a job you don't have to be that superstar to enjoy what you're doing yeah and i think that's really really important great message well the thing that we talk about

all the time is just kind of the lifelong pursuit of strength. Yeah. And for everyone, that's a different piece. Yeah. Not everybody's designed

to win gold medals at the Olympics. Yeah. But everyone is designed to find out what strong feels like. And it changes your life. So many people, they say,

okay, it's dangerous doing weightlifting. They see one guy break his elbow or something. It's more dangerous to not be strong. Brett Contreras, that quote of his. That's the best thing I've ever heard in my life. If you think lifting weights is dangerous, you should try it. Or you should see how dangerous being weak is, something like that.

That's awesome. I often laugh about when they say that, like weightlifting is dangerous. However, they'll let their 7-year-old go out and put full pads on and play American football and crash into each other. I'm like, what? That is, but that's not. It's all relative. If you look at the percentage of injuries over like 100 contact hours,

it's super low. It's lower than soccer i'm pretty sure it might be relatively one of the lowest it's lower than batminton too yeah yeah dude pickup basketball is like the dumbest sport in the world yeah right you're gonna tear your ankles yeah that's why firemen aren't allowed to do it a lot of places more more injuries happen to firefighters playing pickup basketball while they're waiting to get calls than being injured on the job. Then they can't go do their job. Richard, tell them about your training sessions.

I mean, I remember when Adi and Hayden told me, like the three sessions a week of four hours long or what. Yeah, it was Monday, Wednesday, Friday. There was like a power power day a pull day and then a classic classic day and we trained from seven o'clock till 11 usually that's that's how i trained from 18 to 27 tell them let's break those days down so monday basically a power day it was usually it was usually a complex sort of day depending on who you are depending on what you're weak at i can tell you what mine was it was always front squat and fucking jerk yeah wait like as a complex as a complex so it was a front squat and a jerk yeah uh try and kill your legs yeah yeah and then

and depending on where you were in your training cycle the the volume would go up or down uh and it would get more specific maybe just a jerk depending on how close you were to competition and then your next exercise would be something of a clean complex or a snatch complex followed by say a drop snatch followed by a very heavy squat in terms of a heavy eight heavy five or heavy three squat yeah exactly so you have both your front squat and your back squat in the same session. So rep maxes. So more of like an 8RM. Exactly.

So that's how we – everything that we did was not off of like percentages. It was off of like an 8, your best 8 that you could do on that day. And then what we changed depending on where you were to competition is the repetition. Instead of 8s, it might be 3s or 1s or whatever. I think there's also in the programming for Olympic weightlifting, not many people think about the volume and the hypertrophy piece in the CrossFit space. They just look at it like it's written on the board, clean, doubles,

and they just max out their double. But the assistance work that goes into that, that's the sports side, but very few people are because in CrossFit, everybody just goes from clean to conditioning. But they never put in the assistance work or the hypertrophy work or those brutal 8RMs. People take that for granted. This is something I learned when I couldn't rely on my legs anymore.

When I needed more tools in the toolbox, I realized the bigger your base is, the higher you're going to go. It was like literally that simple. It was literally that simple. If your base is not big enough to support that, sure, maybe you are super genetically gifted or whatever, but you're going to get hurt. It's going to happen at some point. That's like a reality. And I think that base really prepares you to do phenomenal things.

That base of strength. That base of strength. Putting those eights in, putting those fives in and like trying. Adding some muscle and getting stronger. Adding some muscle, getting stronger, putting the...

It's really important. It's much more important in my head than just doing max reps all the time. 100%. Once you have that base, then where do you put your focus? Then once you build that base, then we start building the mind.

And you build your head on doing the same thing over. So if you do something at 50 kilos, it's the same at 120, it's the same at 150. That's what we really, really focused on. And if that technique changes from 50 to 150, that's then where we focus on changing it. So it becomes much more specific to using your strength in the next in that next why was that day one considered power day i was waiting for you to say power snatch power clean yeah is it power development what do you say yeah power development but a power snatch to us is different than how most people categorize power snatch so how i would describe it is it was more the feeling the rhythm so you can land under 90 degrees and it's still a power snatch.

It's like if someone throws you a baseball and you catch the baseball and you stop. And you're stopping all that energy. That's what we considered a power snatch. And yeah, we try and catch it as high as possible. Right, right. Okay. But if someone throws you a baseball and you hold your hand and you use your arm to slow it down, that's what we considered a full snatch. And oftentimes people catch their power snatches too high.

They don't actually. Power or no. Yeah, exactly. You get caught in the power. You get power caught in that little thing. But to us, power snatches or power cleans, the purpose of them was more of like stop controlling. Eccentric control.

Eccentric control. Eccentric contraction of your muscles. This is great. It's almost like triphasic training almost. You have this day of where you're focusing on eccentric control, which I think is super important. I think that's important to injury prevention and weightlifting. A lot of you guys, a lot of weightlifters, they have zero eccentric control,

and they're at such a risk of injury. I have girls. They bounce out of the bottom of everything. Yeah, they're like, meow, meow. I mean, this is awesome. They have the mobility, and they have the elastic strength, but they have no eccentric control. That's why you do so many tempos and pauses.

That's exactly why I do so many tempos and pauses. And I actually took two of my females, and we did a lot of triphasic training, like strictly like, you know, they prescribe, because they had zero. And so just doing a little wasn't enough. So we went all in, eccentric phases, and it was a – finally, it was like two humans. I was having trouble making strong, which was blowing my mind. But then, you know. I came across this problem.

I met two people I couldn't make stronger. The whole world. We fixed it, though. We did that, and then, boom, they both skyrocketed. Not only did they skyrocket for during that time, it's continued now. It's like we've given them some eccentric control. I would say that was the biggest difference in the programming that we did because oftentimes our tempo stuff was mixed in with power. Power snatches,

your general weightlifting jargon of what power is. It was always mixed there. And then your strength days where you build your pulls and stuff was always on that Wednesday. So let's talk about that day. Yeah, so the Wednesday

was the shit that no weightlifter likes to do. Yeah, I hate pulling shit off. Yeah, do it for five. It makes me want to throw up even thinking about it. Come into the gym, Richard, snatch pull, five reps. And you just take one step and go, okay, I'll see you tomorrow. Oh, I'm sick today.

There he is, the guy that made it all happen. Eric, CEO's walking through. So starting your first thing that day is pull? There he is. The guy that made it all happen. Eric, CEO's walking through. So starting your first thing that day is pull. Snatch pull, clean pull. Out of the gate. Out of the gate. Damn.

Oh, and then also another thing that I remember, he used to make a rule for us. It was before he comes to the gym, always warm up ourselves with press. It doesn't have to be heavy. Just warm ourselves up with push press or military press. I never did it because I was never good at press. I'm so horribly bad at press.

What a typical way to do it. And he wasn't there. He wasn't there at the gym. I feel for your coach. I know, I know. I'm mad at you right now. You know, I regretted it so much later on. Then, I mean, think about someone who can press like 70 kilos but can jerk 180. Yeah.

That's a big difference. Yeah. And like, yeah, oh my 180. Yeah. That's a big difference. Yeah. And like – Yeah. Oh, my God. You're striking me hard. I know. But you're both sides of it.

You set world records and do all this stuff as an athlete. Now you're on the coaching side. How many things do you wish when you were an athlete that you had – Oh, so much. I wish I listened to that one thing. Yeah. Yeah, because that is such a great way to get hurt. It's a great way to get hurt. It's a great way to get hurt.

Ian Wilson, like that dude has got zero upper body strength. Like we're friends. I love Ian. But, yeah, he could jerk 211 kilograms, clean and jerk, and probably could like strict press 60 kilos. I'm exaggerating. But it was really low. But then he started getting all these little injuries. But, like, your coach was hitting the nail on the head. It'm exaggerating. But it was really low. But then he started getting all these little injuries.

Your coach was hitting the nail on the head. It doesn't matter. Not everything is to drive your snatch and clean and jerk up. Some things are to allow you to keep doing snatch and clean and jerk without getting hurt. And you guys don't listen. If you didn't have to do it heavy, then what was the real objection to doing it?

If it was your weakest link? Yeah, it was my weakest link. And at that time, I was quite young and i didn't want to do things that i wasn't good honestly but then when he was in the room i didn't have a choice to do stuff right but i i honestly i was embarrassed to press 50 kilos i swear to god i was embarrassed to just go there and press you don't want to see other people looking the room looking at you? I'm the same way. The thing that I don't do in my training is strict press just because it's so fucking boring and I suck at it.

I love strict press just because it's so manly. Yeah, because you got a big ass shoulder and you're strong as hell. I mean, it's just so manly to take something and just like... Yeah, for you. Mine's like... It's not like... I have different noises. I've seen Morgan, argh. I have different noises. I have seen Morgan into doing it.

Like, I watched. I've learned, too. I used to prescribe, like, accessory work. Some of it is in the other room. And then someone told on him that he would go over there and not do it all. So now I follow his little tale over there. But, like, I've seen him. He's finally getting upper body strength.

Gamify accessory work. He wanted to be in your same boat. He would not want to do that stuff. Now I'm over him watching every rep because I don't want him to get hurt. There's a reason. When a coach – guys, when you're listening, all seriousness, there's always a reason. All you need to do is ask.

Like me, ask me why I want to do that. Even if it's just accumulation, getting good reps. That's what was the big thing that I learned between, say, becoming an athlete and a coach. You don't need to have blind trust in your coach. You can ask. You can have blind trust. You can have trust in them, but it doesn't need to be blind.

You can ask them, and they will tell you. I love that. But just talk to them. And if they can't give you a good reason, then you probably need a new coach. Yeah. A lot of people, they think that, okay, And if they can't give you a good reason, then you probably need a new coach. Yeah. 10-4. Yes.

A lot of people, they think that, okay, this is my coach. This is the only thing that is in the world, and nothing else exists. And that's not true. Nope. Go and hear what everyone has to say, and then pick what works for you. I'll be honest. Like, when Morgan, he's only 16, and we have conversations, and Ryan. And if they say

well what about this and if it like semi semi makes sense i'm probably gonna do it because you know what he thinks it's gonna work so guess what's gonna happen it's gonna work yeah so like we have that connection already you know i've already been training in five years so like you know i i trust him if he says i really want to get my squats make me more confident this is a conversation we really had deep down we all know morgan does not need to squat at all now he already squats 265 kilos he's just a baby he did it at 15 so like that's the last thing he needs but if that makes him feel more confident i'm fine let's squat more yeah we'll get you to 600 pounds if he makes you feel like Hulk. Cool.

If you walk in the training room and feel like the most alpha, it's working. That's a thing, too. He loves to save a heavy front squat for three days out from when he's going to compete because he knows he's going to be stronger than everybody. I bet he rolls that singlet halfway down, and he just fucking alphas people in the training room. I'm 16 come watch honestly even at i would do that all the time don't let the bar roll down

even at youth worlds he did that he did and everyone You saw everyone go, what's happening right here? And so there's something to that. Yeah, totally. But that relationship, that coach-athlete relationship, it's one of the most important relationships you can have in your life. It can be super really, really good for you, or it can be really detrimental. It depends how much effort the coach puts in, and it depends.

As an athlete, in my opinion, you don't have so much onus on you because the coach should know better and the coach should help steer you. But also athletes should do a little bit of research and go and say, okay, they shouldn't be blind to everything. They should ask questions. They should have some knowledge. And I hope my athletes go on to coach too. So I'm preparing them.

Especially Morgan and Ryan who've already let me know that that's their intention. So I'm already starting to teach them. I know that Ryan will be going on to college next year. Exercise science is kind of what he wants to major in. So I'm already starting to teach him. So when he asks what about this

I'm like here's why. And so I have no problem with that. I enjoy it. I want to teach them my craft that I spent my whole life on perfecting. It's cool when they can then pass that forward. Yeah. And maybe they add something that they've learned that you don't know. And that's how the community

grows and that's how you grow really, really good clubs. And that's why really old clubs end up being really cool or not or not yeah remember the back squat bundle barbell shrug.com forward slash back squat bundle all one word you are going to save over 350 dollars over 50 percent on five products the 20 rep back squat cycle which is making people grow giant legs and a barrel core the one-ton challenge one rep max back squat cycle and squat the house our accessory back squat program all saving you over 350 50 off get over to barbell shrugged.com forward slash back squat bundle and

use the coupon code squat strength all one word to save the cash our friends over at momentous let me tell you i know you've been following me on the social media i know i've been testing the moment to sleep product and it's awesome i can't wait to tell you what i'm noticing first of all it comes in a pill form i took it last night you take one pill 30 minutes before you want to fall asleep the formula has ingredients, including melatonin and a special kind of magnesium that can actually reach your brain. This is really the key to their magic because when the ingredients reach your brain, they have the calming effect that you're looking for as you're trying to fall asleep. But I'm loving this because it's helping me fall asleep and actually stay asleep throughout

the night. I was nervous that this was going to make me wake up feeling groggy, but that's not the case. I'm waking up feeling fresh and recovered. And the best part, in my opinion, is I can actually see what it's doing to my sleep quality by looking at the WHOOP data on my wrist. My restorative sleep is crazy high when I take it. And Momentous has actually tested this themselves by using Whoop, and they're finding that slow-wave sleep is increasing with Momentous Sleep. code shrugged20. When you are checking out, the discount will be applied over at livemomentous.com forward slash shrugged, L-I-V-E-M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S.com forward slash shrugged. You're going to save $20 off. Also, WOD on the waves, friends. February is the month. We're making the big push. I want to go cruising with you. I want to get on the boat. We're going to leave out of Miami.

You're going to spend roughly $700. Packages start at $699. You can get all your friends. We're going to do the fitnesses. You can get over to WODonTheWaves.com. Use the coupon code SHRUG. You're going to save 5%. It's going to save you a couple hundred bucks on your cruise.

All of the activities are so fitness focused. We got a private island. We're going to be hanging out. Rich Froning is going to be there. I'm sure there are going to be other people, but I just want to hang out with Froning because he's the fittest. He's the fittest of all time, the greatest of all time. I'm really excited. They have workouts scheduled on the boat every day that we get off the boat. There's going to be tons of activities planned. So you'll be able to work out, see all the people that you follow on Instagram, actually be able to hang out with them, meet them. We've got crazy cool activities planned throughout the night and I'm really excited for it. Coupon code SHRUG. You're going to save 5% on your order. And the cruises start right at $699 per person. So, WODonTheWaves.com. Come cruising with me.

I think one of the coolest things ever was last week before I came here, we did a little clinic. And Morgan and Ryan are helping me. And I'm listening to them telling, you know, everyone's kind of practicing snatch or clean jerk or whatever it was. And they're walking around giving them feedback. And it's feedback that I've given them. And to see them pass it on to these other people, I mean, I was such a proud coach. My heart was like, brr. I'm like, that's my boys.

You know what's funny? That's exactly what you just said. My job now is to basically go and sell weightlifting equipment. And I don't really talk about

anything that has to do with weightlifting equipment. For sure. What I tell club owners or I tell a new gym operator or something is the semantics

of weightlifting are the most important to the culture that you build in your semantics. Put your weights away. The semantics of loading your bar,

the semantics of those things build the foundation of who your members are going to be, who they're going to... And that comes from a weightlifting club. It's like when John Wooden, no matter where you're at in the program, he used to teach people how to put their socks on. You got to put your socks on the right way.

That was like the day one of basketball practice at UCLA. Really? Yeah. So you'd have like Bill Walton there, like all these future Hall of Famers, and every year they'd start the program by learning how to put your socks on properly. But from what you're saying, letting them know the culture of weightlifting and why people weightlift and what's important, then you say that's why you buy the best bar in the

world because this is way more than just lifting weights it's a lifestyle it's something that will be with you forever it deserves the best possible product and that that's on face value you take away the name and you take you don't know anything about it and most people look at weights as a commodity product but anyone who's anyone knows that weightlifting has nothing to do with the equipment you're training on it's the feeling that you get out of it that's more important than hitting a world record snatch because not everyone's going to hit a world record not many people at all and so on a on a bigger level what it personally to you, how it feels to you, the feeling the equipment you're lifting on gives back to you, in my head, is the most important. The feeling, have you ever been to a gym that has the worst just feel? It could be super strong people in there, but it's just the worst feeling.

You go in there, you don't feel welcome. Gym culture is one of the most important things. And as soon as you walk in, you know. You're like, oh, these are my people. I found them. Or. Or I need to get the fuck out of this place. No shit.

This place sucks. My soul is leaving my body right now. That's the worst place to be in, in a bad environment. It's like the worst place to be in. I feel so lucky that i know about that because i can go anywhere in the world and all i have to do is go find the right gym and i know that i can make friends i have no problem as you just described my job yeah that's literally my job my wife we just moved from the west coast to the east coast and she was like well are you like

worried about meeting people i was like no why would are you worried about meeting people? I was like, no. Why would I be worried about meeting people? I just need to go to a gym. And I know exactly where my friends are. I just don't know who they are yet. But I know exactly what they look like. And where they are. I know what they talk about. I know what they eat.

I know how they sleep. They're all there. And they like fucking aggressive rap music. Like, let's get out of here. I don't care how old they are. They put the fucking Eminem Pandora on and they get to work. I know who they are. Right. And that's just the gym culture.

Super important. Yeah. Right. Like creating that structure. Like you're talking about, how do you put the weights away? How do you load a barbell? That stuff.

That's, that's the part that you learn that nobody really ever teaches no and that that's important stuff that is really really important stuff it's the things that's the things that people take for granted that just because they don't know it they think that oh it doesn't exist but it exists yeah do you actually teach that to club owners so that's like all that that's how i i am the worst salesman in the world. Yeah. I want to know what your flow is. What is your flow? Let's say you go in a gym,

go to my gym. What is your, what is your deal? I usually talk to them about exactly what we're talking about. Oh, I come from weightlifting, but at the end of the day, who am I?

I'm some young kid. I'm not old enough to be a, the job that I'm in anything like that. So I usually just go and I talk to them about weightlifting and i try and tell them a little bit about where i've been in in my life and i have started my own gym yeah and what was really important in that gym was who was there and then after that the gym just like grew itself it became and we only focused on weightlifting and powerlifting that's all we did and at the time this was right when CrossFit was getting bigger,

so there was the Reebok CrossFits and stuff opening up. And everyone said I was crazy. They said, no, you must have CrossFit in there. And I was like, yeah, but I don't know how to do CrossFit. I don't know how to teach that. I know how to teach this. And I don't want to teach it. I want to teach this.

I'm good at it. And then what ended up happening was people started to notice that they were getting better when they come see us. And they were feeling more involved in this community. Our community of 30 plus females was the best thing in the world. Because they said, oh, we can't do this. Yeah, sure you can. And then they teach each other that they can do it.

And that was the best thing that started the best advice when people ask me like oh should like can i open a cross gym or should i open a gym like i don't know but if you do there's some things you should think about like who are you what do you like to coach and how do you make it fun because there's plenty of people if you're just trying to open a crossfit gym because you see other CrossFit gyms that you like, then you're just going to try and be like them, and there's no way to niche your community and really have those core values inside there.

Anyone can open a CrossFit gym, but in order to have a successful one, you have to have a specific type of person and a specific vibe, and then all the people that are looking for that vibe will come find you versus trying to be like the gym down the street or the one that you like on Instagram and being somebody else. I was thinking an easy way to look at it is like,

are 80% of your friends fitness people already? Is that just already who you are? And you're just scaling that into a business? Or are they weightlifters and powerlifters? Yeah. And when you say what's my process, I always ask people, like, what is their intangible quality that they're going to commoditize? Totally. What's yours?

I'm quite good at finding good people, actually. I think I've – that's a really good question. But I think I have a really good feeling for when someone is authentically passionate about what they do so i i generally don't care if if someone buys as a lego or they don't buy a lego because say someone who just wants to copy someone they buy a lego there that's a transactional purchase for one thing they're not going to be my want to be my friend they're not going to be interested in having a long-term friendship. A lot of my customers,

we're friends. I can go anywhere in the world I want now and not be alone. That's quite cool. That is cool. I'm very happy with that. I'm very proud of that. And that's, I guess, a super tough question,

but at the same time, I'm just good at finding... Mash, have you thought about that? What really separates Mash Elite from the intangible pieces yeah I think it would just be like my attitude as far as you know I think my attitude and

the athletes I surround myself with it's like our level of what we think is good yeah I think it just you know when someone comes to my gym what they thought was good probably no longer it's a different paradigm and so we just you know you snatch you know you snatched you know you snatched 140 perfect that's good but you know that's your step along the way to a long process of getting really good yeah i think even with my football players it's

been that way you know first time i started coaching so like i'll meet an 11 year old football player for example and i'm gonna you and we do goal-setting sessions. And if he tells me, hey, I would like to play in college someday, my goal has always been to shift their paradigm up one. So I'm like, that's cool, but wouldn't the NFL be better? Why only college? What gives you that limit? Why that ceiling?

And so that has always been my mindset. And so I think the athletes that come there and embrace it and stay have the same feeling. Like Morgan and Ryan talk about, you know, we're five kilos away from a world record with Morgan. And so we're talking about world records and meddling on the world level. We're not. Nationals is part of the process. We're winning that.

Yeah. So, you know, you're not going to beat my boys there. Yeah. So that would be it. It's like, you know. I level what we think. I think, man, don't you think reality is just, like I said earlier, I mean, what is reality? And why is your reality what you think it is?

Because your mom and dad told you? Because your friends told you? Because maybe you first went to a gym that that was their ceiling? It's just lies. What is normal and what is like a lot of people, they like to just do things because people tell them to do it. Yeah. They don't understand what they're doing.

And we talked about this earlier before we were on here. When you meet a lot of people, all really good people are the same and all really shady people are the same. I love that. He's so right. It's so simple. Totally. You don't have to go and find the nice things. You don't have to do that. He's so right. It's so simple. Totally. You don't have to go and find the nice things. You don't have to do that.

And that's one thing that weightlifting, like you said, very easily you can go and find a group of people that you know will meet a criteria that you can fit with right away. And then identifying what your intangible qualities are, that I think is a really, really important step. If you want to, you know, be a good weightlifting coach and believe in yourself and say, okay, what I'm doing has value in the world. Yeah.

Yes. Do you still own your gym in Toronto? No. So what I did was I got this opportunity basically after that competition. Do you know that there's other places in the world that aren't freezing cold? Toronto and Sweden. You could go to like San Diego and do it all. I'll go back to Portugal.

There was the option, should I do this internship for the Laco in Chicago or should I do the internship in Sweden? I remember this. I remember my boss is like, Andres is like, okay, do you want to go to Chicago? I was like, aren't you a Swedish company? He's like, yeah. I was like, Sweden it is. Sweden's way cooler than Chicago.

Where we are right now. But equally cold, yeah. Both are brutal. So you started this gym after? Yeah, so after this competition in Russia, in russia i i started this gym because i was done school now uh i needed to make some money and so i was like i want to train and make money so i rented a little everybody so it's the typical make all the money i was making i got a little bit of money from the you weren't aware of the intangibles at that point no yeah but i

actually knew i was a good coach i knew I knew I was good at communicating to people and they liked how I coached and they got better. You know you're a good coach when you're a good coach. I already know that you'd be a good coach. Like if I were younger than you,

I would want you to coach me. I already like your philosophy and the way you talk. Yeah, and that's important. Communication is more important than if what you say is right or wrong. That comes later on.

100%. But for two different athletes, to get them to do the same thing, you need a thousand words. You can say jump up to this person and jump down to this person to achieve the same outcome. Stand up, fast, through the middle. Yeah, exactly. And as a good coach, learning those semantics

or learning those intangibles, you need to change a little bit depending on who you're coaching. That process after Kazan taught me that. It taught me how to be a good coach and really coach people more. But then I was trying to balance both. I was trying to train. In the daytime, I was trying to train people. And then in the nighttime, I was trying to be an athlete. And that didn't go so well, actually.

That actually is when it took a little... We all know about that. It's common. Ultimately, in the beginning, when you start coaching someone, the technicalities of the lifts and the training and the results, they're not that important for the first couple weeks or months. They want to know, do I like this person? Does this person like me?

Am I accepted? Am I having fun? And if all these things are falling into place then they'll stick around and then if they stick around then they have the opportunity to have good results but if they leave then you're sunk yeah and it's so it's so weird but in that time i remember when i was a competitive athlete i thought that like okay 130 135 140 these are numbers that are strong and are good and I want to do them and I want to keep going. And I remember my technique was nowhere near as good as what it is now. It's so awkward.

When I competed in weightlifting, I wasn't as good as when I stopped competing in weightlifting. But it's almost when I let go of that and just, you know, embrace the process and lift it to enjoy it and lift it to become better at lifting and not lift to make a team. Those two were two separate things. I was most happy and I did my best in weightlifting after I stopped competing at weightlifting.

It sounds so weird. It's not weird at all. I think that I'm like right in that place. Like in the CrossFit side of things, yeah, my times might not be maybe I'm 10% slower. But I enjoy going and doing one and a half CrossFit classes a week. Or my lifts are still 95% of what they always were. But they don't break me. That's exactly it.

I was telling you. He's like, how much do you snatch now? Around 120, 125, 130 sometimes. That's still really good. That's exactly it. I was telling you, he's like, how much do you snatch now? Around 120, 25, 30 sometimes. I still really good. That's not my point. Those were my,

those are 95% of what I was doing at a heavier body weight. And if you really, I think the difference between 100% of your best and 95% of your best is literally just being

super fucking pissed off and filled with anger and rage and testosterone when you approach a barbell. And now you're like, I love this. Eminem this playing in the back this is so much fun i'm so happy that i get to snatch and clean and jerk versus like being angry and i have to make this team and all this external pressure that doesn't really mean anything in the long run yeah now back to my selfish question of like um this the gym like

how did it go did it so it went really well it went so it went super super well so i got uh what i did was i got all my buddies so i was doing well in the business side but then i'm like okay there's this mentally handicapped team of powerlifters that i used to help when i was in in school and they're awesome yeah and them in the gym just hypes everyone up. When they come in and they just start pounding weights away, and they're so happy. And they're so emotional. I love it.

They're like, ah. Yeah, and so we got them in. We gave them a place to train for free, and they didn't have to train at the university anymore, and they were super happy. Then the best thing I got to do was I got to pay my coach to be a coach at my gym yeah that was the best thing that was the best thing i ever did with my gym he was he he was an important person to me and he never got paid i got my weightlifting education for free so yeah i

felt like i wanted to do something to give back to him and the name of the gym was sabaria weight lifting that sabaria was the name of his weightlifting club it's not my name and i asked him for permission to use it and he said yeah please use it so you brought the coach from the university to you and now you're paying him yeah so he was doing that three days a week for four hours for free before yeah i wouldn't do that but yeah exactly you can't hire mash but that's also why you know what i what he didn't want to get paid because he said if i get paid i don't get to choose who i coach and i said you don't have to worry about that i'll pay you regardless yeah but

he only coached at nighttime for an elite group of people and what i learned there is if you're trying to make a business out of this a weightlifting gym or a very intangible thing where you can't just tell what's, what's tangible in this business, you need the, what our model was. Our competitive team was not where we made our money. It was what made our reputation.

It made, it made our reputation. And then on the other side of it, teaching people that they can belong and they can be there and they can learn all those things, but they maybe don't have to go and be on a national team. That's where we trade someone a dollar to be part of that value. It's pretty much like that in every niche strength sport or even I mentioned mma earlier every martial arts like you have all your your competitive mma guys that train for free of all your your national caliber weightlifters powerlifters jiu-jitsu guys whatever it is like the team is there because they want to compete and they want to do really well yeah but they often train for free and then you have like

the 200 members who actually make all the money to keep the gym open totally that that is same at my gym you know i i guess when i said that i wouldn't do that but that's exactly what i do because i actually pay my like not only do i do it for free i pay them so but like um they're a massive expense line they're massive and so uh but yeah you have that it often keeps the gym owner motivated as well because most gym owners want to train the elite guys who are their best people right but then and then regular people is kind of fun at some level but really oftentimes they're there for the guys that are really really good they're really good is what keeps you motivated what keeps you up at night saying how can i get one more kilo on you know ryan snatch right so it's

the same and so like um so you started doing crossfit powerlifting and like how many members how did it grow and so we only did powerlifting and weightlifting and our main member base was the CrossFit community to get better at CrossFit oh so you're I feel like those gym yeah your gym at that time was I know multiple of those gyms that were around me and they all smashed yeah they stayed in their lane yeah and it actually turned out to be a longer do do what you're good're good at. Yeah. It was simple as that. Do what you're good at and grow your reputation. And you wouldn't think that the people that are paying $150 to $200 a month at the CrossFit gym would then turn around and buy the 20 punch class at your gym.

Exactly that. And now you've got people paying $500 a month to go learn snatch, clean and jerk, and then go to the CrossFit gym and learn how to do kipping pull-ups. But they all did it. What it was, it was so funny. I got that question so many times. Oh, but we pay this other membership. Okay. When we teach snatch, clean and jerk.

Do you want to learn snatch, clean and jerk? Pay us $100. You could also learn snatch, clean and jerk one day a week at your gym and not be good at it. It's super simple. Yeah. Yeah. And then when, after a year, it stopped being a question.

People didn't question it anymore because you get good. You come and you train with a good environment with good coaches, you get good. Do you know Sean Waxman? He fucking smashed that model. He just did snatch clean jerk and taught all the CrossFitters in LA how to move well

and crushed it. And he's got a beautiful gym still. It's a phenomenal model. So you grew that gym. Yeah, it went from like when I finished there, so it went from 10 or whatever we started with. And then by the time I was done, it was about 70, 75. That's awesome. And so then you decided to make this move to Sweden. Yeah.

What did you do? Did you close it or did you just? No, I was really upset about that. I was like, okay, one piece of advice, guys, whoever is listening, do not build your gym around yourself. Do not be your intangible quality. You need to teach other people to whatever value you come into the equation with in terms of intangibles, you need to pass that on.

If it can't exist without you, you did not do a good job. I could talk to you about this for like hours. I really believe that and I had so much anxiety over this. I did something I was super proud of and then I'm like, oh shit, if I walk away from this, it falls apart.

The energy in my... Go ahead. By the way, as you're saying that, it doesn't mean just teach it to anyone. If you have the intangible quality of recruiting and building a team and relationships and all that, you don't just pick some random person and be like, well, this guy's terrible at it.

I'll just teach him until he's good at it. That's not the game you're playing. You want to recruit someone that's already pretty fucking good at what you're also good at and then just perfect and refine and tweak that person to be your style maybe or as best you can. And give them the tools to teach someone else. There needs to be a trickle model where otherwise it's not going to last for 10 years. To be your style maybe or as best you can. And give them the tools to teach someone else. There needs to be a trickle model where otherwise it's not going to last for 10 years.

And then you didn't really build anything. And then you didn't really build anything. You were there. You did some sort of e-commerce or commerce. Yeah. So then you left and what happened? So basically just at that time I had a friend, Daniel and Rachel, and they were like the passionate gym owners. They wanted to open up a boxing MMA gym.

And I'm like, look, I can see the passion that you guys have on this. I have built this huge culture already for you. We have this coach. Her name is Amanda. She's on the national team in Canada. They can fit together and they bought it for me. And they took it and did things with it that i could never do on my own yeah they they took it and scaled it and now it's like 150 200 members like

it's like it's like it's beautiful i have the boxing yeah everything like they're they're killing it they basically i saved them the first year two years of building the culture they got this like super injection of culture of atmosphere and then they took that and ran and they and they because they're such good i could there's something about i'm good at finding people and they are outstanding people yeah and they the community was so important to them and they really relied on that and pushed that and now their gym is thriving that's also a massive skill on their side to be able to bring the sports that they're teaching, the MMA side, and then mesh the weightlifting and powerlifting side into it because those

don't always flow well together. They started to learn that you can share people. When people don't fit so well in the hierarchy on this side, they can find a new identity on this side because the cultures are the same. They taught the same culture. Hard work. Yeah, hard work. A lot of weightlifting gyms are killing it now

that they partner with the gymnastics. You know? And so then you wait until the girls get to the... At a certain point, you're either going to continue on and be an Olympic caliber or collegiate gymnast. Yeah, right around like 13. They kick you out. Or somebody says, look, it's not going to work. Well, you end up being

an amazing weightlifter. So like, it's a going to work. Well, you end up being an amazing weightlifter. So it's a brilliant model to partner with a gymnastics club. And that was really cool. I think that for me, I felt like if I just stayed there, I really like to grow. I really like to do stuff. I really like to keep going. And so I saw a lot of people say, why are you going to go to Sweden for free? And I'm like like i see opportunity

there's it puts me in a spot where i can maybe do something yeah but if i don't do it i don't have the opportunity and okay you trade that for money yeah and money is is funny like that right like why does someone take a 40 000 job why do they trade x amount of time for 40 000 so they value themselves they value it's it's odd how people put that value on money. They don't put the value on opportunity. There's a term in economics called opportunity cost. What do you give up by taking money or what do you give up by not taking money? It's very important to think about that.

We could be on Skype right now doing this, but we're in Sweden hanging out with you in person. We could do anything else like we travel specifically because of what you're saying it costs a lot of money to bring a full team on the road with you all the time yeah but there's a specific reason that we have a videographer do it we're here doing it because of exactly what you're talking about yeah this interview is cool but dude we get to go lift weights and then we're really going to be best friends by the end of the day. And you meet the people and you form relationships. A lot of business owners and this selling my business taught me this.

A lot of business owners, they think on like a balance sheet, money in, money out. I need 10 members to break even. And that's also how people buy equipment. They say, okay, I can't buy a lego because i i don't uh i i can't get 30 members in the first six months yep so immediately put a ceiling on yourself yeah say okay i try and talk to them about utility it's very different utility sure it takes in money but it also takes in happiness takes in time there's much much more things to how much utility your life has your person at the end of the day

yeah right and a lot of people who start businesses when they try and just copy something they don't think about the utility that that business brings to the world that the business brings to themselves that's an important thing to think about you talk about the happiness piece did you start to be become unhappy with your gym any point? I was unhappy that I couldn't see myself growing. And that's ultimately what led. And also because this was a big downturn in my weightlifting career. I got hurt and I couldn't go to the Commonwealth Games because I couldn't qualify for the team.

I wasn't good enough. What a weird time in the athlete's life. Yeah, I was so down that I got this opportunity to go to the Commonwealth Games as a volunteer and be in front of Aleko and I worked with them there and then they really

liked me and then that's where I got this internship in Sweden and I said, yes, absolutely. Man, that turning point for an athlete when it's like, it's the end. Yeah.

That's what I sold my gym to. They're coming to terms with it's the end. It can be one of the most darkest places an athlete will ever go. I know for me, personally is it can be one of the most darkest places an athlete will ever go i know for me personally it was like one of the most depressing moments and like you some people fail miserably in this time and they don't ever come out of it you know there needs to

be more i think there needs to be more help for athletes to transition from athlete to you know working at identity right if yeah but this was big thing. My whole identity was built around being a weightlifter or gym owner of a weightlifting gym. That was who I was. If you ask me who I was, I'll tell you that. But not anymore. Yeah. And building that new identity is quite difficult. It's hard, especially if you're a kid.

Man, I feel like this is just like the hero's journey of where everybody goes. You have to go to the top and then realize that you've been chasing this thing that doesn't exist. You built the whole thing in your mind. And then the crash, you got to go find out what it was all for. And it was in that middle period that I was like, And so, okay, then I applied for my visa. And it turns out i can't get into sweden for like six months and so i don't have a gym i'm not good at weight lifting

you're just like and my girlfriend broke up with me all of these things happened like actually what i what happened she didn't break up with me she actually went to Poland at this time started dating a real weightlifter I was like fuck it so I went to Poland because I knew I was going to have to go to Sweden and this time in my life was so chill

it was live in Poland, eat pierogies, go to gyms hang out with people go to Spawa Spawa is one of their main training centers. As I went to Spawa, I know a lot of the Polish weightlifters. They're like, why don't you just train here for a couple months? I'm like, yeah, sure, why not? Best weightlifting I've

ever done in my entire life was in that period. Because you had a little money from selling in the gym. You're waiting on this opportunity. It's sweet. I got better. So between Commonwealth Games is when I was injured and then

there was a whole year to Pan American Games. So you got healed up. I got healed up. And then I left. So it was maybe like a year and a half in between that I wasn't lifting. And then I left for Sweden. Can we talk a little bit about weightlifting? I don't know how much time we have.

I'm just curious. In Canada, you guys have for such a small country, I'm not talking about population, you guys are really Canada's killing it. They have good communities in Quebec, in Vancouver,

Calgary. They have really old communities of weightlifting that pass down skills and generations. They teach kids how to be good and then some kids go into this, some kids go into that and some go foomp. Some kid like Bodhi goes foomp. And Bodhi comes from like a weightlifting family

and Bodhi's brother Noah is awesome at weightlifting. He's a world team member. He's really good. He's really, really good at weightlifting. His sister's good at weightlifting. His brother's good world team member. He's really good. He's really, really good at weightlifting. His sister is good at weightlifting. His brother is good at weightlifting. His other brother is about to make the NHL in hockey.

He's an amazing family. Well, I'm assuming that person is much lighter than you since those are pretty much your numbers, and you repeatedly say that you suck at weightlifting. You say that guy's awesome? Yeah. No, he's about the same weight as me. What's that all about? He's got the same numbers as you, basically.

He's been in Sweden, and they're all humble. I think you've been in Sweden so long, you're just being super humble. Now, I think that when I was growing up, the competition wasn't the level that it is now. So I think my perception of myself and other people's perception of me was, okay, you're quite good in this environment. But now I think I compare myself to a lot of people that they do it now and I'm like, I'm not really that good. It doesn't matter.

So I never really talked about it. Weightlifting was not as cool. No, it wasn't as cool. You didn't have a lot of people doing it. And now the level is just like... That's the same thing in the CrossFit thing. Everybody knows now what good looks like and it's not even close to what it was like back then. in in canada his name is david samoa when we he was in my time

of weightlifting and he was just a little bit better than me so if i was doing something you do like five kilos but same same level as i was and i kind of expected okay all the generational weightlifters from my time basically stopped. Right. But he kept going. And now he's snatching like 160 and he's cleaning 190. What? Yeah. He kept going.

He kept putting the work in. What weight is he? He's 89 kilos. I haven't met this guy yet. He just had this big breakthrough, this world champion. And I was like, holy shit. Good on you, man. You had that peace that I didn't have you had that piece to keep pushing you had that key piece could i have done it maybe did i have the mind to do it absolutely not yeah you had the p he got

injured he did he went through all the same shit i did but he never gave up he that's the best story and and no and identifying that and seeing it, I was so proud of him. How do you feel about that story? He went to Worlds, so it's great. Is he going to go to the Olympics? Probably not. If you put him one cycle back, yes.

But wrong Olympic cycle just because Bodie's there. And I think, I don't think, it wouldn't make sense in my head. And 89's not an Olympic category. He would have to go against Bodie. He's not beating Bodie. I don't care how many cycles he goes back. No offense. No, but Bodie didn't exist in the last cycle as how he is.

I see what you're saying. In terms of opportunity, the Olympic candidate for the last cycle snatched, say, 155 and clean jerked 190 in 85 kilos. And that's basically what he's doing. So he's Olympic caliber athlete from Canada. But the wrong quad. Bodie is probably going to medal at the Olympics. That's how good he is.

Bodie's already lifted more than any American ever at that weight class, at the 96. He's, like, phenomenal. He's had 400 pounds above. He's a 96-kilo lifter, and he's actually had 182 above his head several times. It's not quite. He snatched 176. I was there at the Pan Am Games, and I saw it, and I'm like,

he darn near won the Pan Am Games. Dallas might beat me up for saying this. If they'd have made some wiser decisions on his cleaning jerks, I think he would have won that. He was on fire. Yeah. A lot of people, they don't know this, but they go, especially they don't see a journey.

They just see the result now. And so they think, okay, I'm going to do that. But then the thing is, people don't just become special. He was special at 13. He was special at 15. He was special at 13. He was special at 15. He was special at 17. He was special the whole way through. That's my favorite thing to think about somebody like LeBron.

It's like LeBron's been a gangster since the day he was born. He was the best on his block and in his city and in his state and in high school and in AAU. There was never a basketball court that he didn't walk onto that he was just like not the best ever. And they don't realize that. They see that he snatches big weights now. And I'm like, yeah, but when he was 15, he snatched like 135, 140.

He was special then also. Some people can just keep going. They just hold that. And these are all different. What I'm mentioning now, you have like me who went through life as probably most people do. Then you have David who keeps going and makes it. That's the beauty. Who fights for it.

You know, that fight, that little bit of crazy to dream. I respect that very highly. And then you have the Bodhi who's like, wait, that's a special guy. Yeah. He's special. And he was special at 12 and and that's that's the you don't have to be any one of them but be like you have to you have to tell yourself what am i yeah we talked quite a bit about your past but what's what's the future

look like for you what's like the next three years for you um i think i'd like to stay in sweden i'm doing quite well at my job in my role i'd like to develop in my role and i'd like to stay in Sweden. I'm doing quite well at my job and my role. I'd like to develop in my role and I'd like to help build the Aleko brand more because I'm responsible for Asia, Middle East, Australia, all the export countries. What a fun job. Yeah, it's quite a fun job. I've been to quite a few places

and I'd like to build that up and I'd like to build it to a point where people associate the brand with this community. At the end of the day, the reason people like Aleko is because it's attached to a very specific community. And understanding that community and building that up in regions where the training knowledge in Asia is not very high. It's so condensed to the circles of the federations. China. The people who lift.

But the average person there doesn't know this stuff. The maturity level of fitness is quite low there. I see that as a big opportunity to teach. I've had people from China DM me. I'm like, why are you dming me man like lose but they don't have access to those people yeah it always blew it blows me away when these countries where i know that have the best way there's an entire world that's ever existed yeah they're messaging me i'm like you need to message yeah anybody on that team and they're amazing so um i to me i have so many questions

we do have to go eat lunch we the guy you got it all right the guy just came in and said he gave me the the lunch the lunch the lunch all right i'll keep it simple though let's talk just snatch give me like four important points to technique. I want to hear what Canadians say. Oh, I don't know if this is Canadians. Or say Richard. What I've learned, I would say Steve, what he's taught me, and I definitely teach that forward.

I usually start teaching it backwards. I always teach snatch backwards. And I start with the catch position. And then I transition so like overhead squat yeah yeah and so then we i usually break it down into your pull your first pull from your floor right your throw your second pull and your catch so yeah those are those are what we focus on in terms of the teachables of the snatch right and at the end of the day we don't really teach the technique of what your body is going to do rhythm timing and direction those are what we teach sounds like um like my one of my mentors don mccauley that's you know you always talked

about rhythm yeah let me ask you just one off the floor hold on before we go diving into a new question can you expand on that those three points yeah so most people will say okay keep your butt down keep your head up keep your knees back keep whatever and for the most part yeah for the average person there are overarching physical rules but what we like to focus on is rhythm for example when your feet land you catch the bar for example why do we have wood on our platforms? There's something called proprioception. You need to have feedback to tell your body to catch things.

There's a stable base. There's a stable base. And then direction. Where is your body moving in relation to the bar? A lot of people like to keep moving up as they're pulling the bar up. And that's not correct. Exactly. And so you go down. Down. And so you go down. Down.

And so when you go down is important. So we teach timing at the last time, at the last phase of it, rhythm, timing, and direction. Let's hear about timing. What would you say? So the timing is why I always time the feet with the catch, so to say. And then you can also go into timing of the throw. You can go into the timing of the pull.

But an easy one to start with is are you catching the bar in the right spot at the right time? Are you catching it and then putting it back into the right spot? Those are all things that can lead, that can take away kilos from you. When are you catching the bar? When are you throwing the bar? Yeah, I think that's, I look at the snatch more abstractly than just a bunch of technical cues. Shrug up or shrug down? Yeah.

Shrug up. Shrug up. He's talking about up. I would say shrug up to throw the bar and shrug down to throw your body under the bar. Sweet. Do them both. Do them both. Dude, we have to go eat lunch just because Joachim just came and yelled at us.

Where can people find you? At Aleko in Sweden. My first name dot my last name at Aleko.com. There it is. How do you spell your name? Richard. Like everyone spells it. Dot Gonsalves.

G-O-N-S-A-L-V-E-S. Beautiful. At Aleko.com. Right on. You don't do the Instas. Can they watch your snatch and clean the jerk on social media?

Yeah, do you want to see one? Oh yeah, we'll check it out here in a bit. Coach Travis Mash. Mashleet.com or find me on Instagram at Mashleet Performance. Right on.

Douglas E. Larson, where can they find you? There you go. Find me on Instagram at Douglas E. Larson. I'm Anders Varner at Anders Varner. We're the Shrug Collective at Shrug Collective. Oneug collective at shrug collective one ton challenge.com snatch clean jerk squat dead bench

2 000 pounds for you men 1200 for you ladies testing the lifelong pursuit of strength get over to one ton challenge.com download our brand new ebook making strong people stronger we'll see you next wednesday friends that's a wrap make sure you get over barbell shrug.com forward slash back squat bundle use the coupon code squat strength for the 20 rep back squat program one ton challenge eight week one rm squat cycle as well as squat the house accessory program plus the two free bonuses that is movement specific mobility and nutrition for weightlifters so you can eat, recover, get super-ject. Our sponsors today, Organifi.com forward slash shrugged, saving 20% on the green, the red, and the gold juices.

All the micronutrients you need to stay healthy. Our friends at LiveMomentous.com, L-I-V-E-M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S, LiveMomentous.com. L-I-V-E-M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S. Livemomentous.com. Use the code SHRUG20 to save $20 on your very first purchase. I love the sleep aid. Love the protein.

You should do it. And then WOD on the waves. Come cruising with us. So exciting. So exciting. WODonthewaves.com. Use the coupon code SHRUG to save 5% on your stay.

Friends, I'm headed to Arkansas right now. As you're listening to this, we're hanging out with the FitOps crew. I'm talking one-time challenge, talking personal professional development as a trainer. And if you can, please get over, check out the FitOps Foundation. They're doing amazing work with veterans with PTSD, getting them training certifications. And it's a true honor that I get to go down there and meet everybody, record shows with Doug. And who knows? There may even be a John Cena sighting.

It should be exciting. We'll see you guys on Monday, friends.