Barbell Shrugged - How to Train for Your Training Age w/ Anders Varner, Doug Larson, and Travis Mash - Barbell Shrugged #509

Episode Date: October 5, 2020

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Shrugged family, this week we are on the road headed to Bentonville, Arkansas to hang out with the fine folks from Walmart. How cool is that? We're headed to Bentonville. We're bringing the camera crew and we're going to be recording podcasts. We're going to be hanging out with the people from FitOps. So Walmart, of course, we are going to be dropping three training programs for fat loss, cardio, and muscle gain in stores in San Diego, Los Angeles, Palm Springs, and LA, Vegas, which is really cool. I mean, it's unbelievably cool. We've got the sickest display. We've been doing tons of work on the graphics. We've been building the programs out. All the websites are hooked up. All the books are getting finalized. I can't believe this thing's happening. It's so cool. And to really cap it off, we're headed down there

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Welcome to Barbell Shrugged. I'm Anders Varner, right here on the screen, hanging out with Doug Larson. Coach Travis Bass is at the beach this week. Loving it. Dude's out there getting his bronze on. How many pounds are you down now?

Ten, at least. I got to check now, though. We've been healthy here, too, at the beach. 10 whole pounds doing that intermittent fasting. Yeah. Eating healthy even on vacation. Good for you. I like that you're intermittent fasting, but you popped on the screen this morning smashing a banana.

So unless you're in yesterday's eating window still or today's eating window, it's from 6.30 a.m. to 2. It's going to be tough. Well, okay. So here'sm. to 2. That's going to be tough. Well, okay. So here's what we started doing. What works best for me is a block in the morning, a block off during the day. So I'll have a four-hour window in the morning and a four-hour window in the evening. Yeah, because lunch, I'm busy anyway, So then I don't really think about eating. I hope some keyboard warrior out there is, like, on Twitter, like,

Matt, I don't know about intermittent fasting. You can't separate your window. You cannot separate the feeding window. Absolutely, I can. I did. I did. Today's show, we're going to be talking about training age. We just did a show

on training age for beginners, getting people from kind of never entering into the gym or thinking about strength training. Today, we're taking that concept from the beginners all the way to intermediate and advanced lifters. A lot of the mentality,

movement patterns, training programs, how you can kind of do some goal setting to figure out where you want to be. And Doug Larson, tell me your favorite part when you start to see people kind of leaving that beginner mindset and actually turning into a real strength athlete, kind of going from that beginner to intermediate side of things. And a lot of the, just the progressions and changes that you see in that person, they kind of symbolize they've left that beginner side of things. Yeah, with beginners, I mean, it's all the obvious stuff. Like they just don't know how to do anything. So like really all they're doing is just showing up every day and they're learning the movements.

They're learning what proper technique is. They're kind of trying to figure out how much training volume they can tolerate and how to like how to actually recover the mindset stuff is always important but i feel like it it doesn't tend to be as important for athletes when they're when they're beginners compared to once they're advanced i feel like once you get to the advanced level like if you're at the national championships everyone's good everyone's strong everyone's prepared and then mindset becomes a differentiating factor to a much higher extent than if you have a bunch of beginners at a meet if there's a bunch of beginners in a meet it just matters okay well this guy has a little more natural athleticism and he's way ahead of the rest of the group and

and this person over here has been training really consistently but that beginner over there he trains inconsistently or he just started like There's so much space between all the people at the beginner level that mindset doesn't really play into it in the same way that it will for a bunch of advanced athletes who are all very dedicated, all very consistent, all have been lifting weights for a long time. And now mindset is going to be the difference between hitting your past PR and or hitting two kilos over your past PR. I feel like you start on the physiological, mechanical end of things, just learning the basics of the actual movements. Then as you get more advanced, you tend to progress more toward mindset

being a very focal point of your training. Yeah. Mash, would you see somebody, especially when it comes to kind of the Olympic lifting side of things, like what are some of the characteristics that you start to really see where they go, oh, that person's not scared anymore. Like they're ready to start training, kind of getting out of that insecure beginner's mindset and getting into actually like a real training program and being able to make moves.

A lot of these is like when they start, you know, asking questions and start giving feedback and then you start to see that, you know, they're more than just some robot that I'm programming and that, you know, they're going to do whatever I say. You know, when they start to realize certain things about their own body, which is important, like, um, for coaches who give just like, you know, blanketed like programs, you know, the thing you're missing is that individual feedback, you know, so when an athlete starts saying, you know, I am noticing that, you know, the percentages that you're prescribing me, you know, I'm really having a tough time meeting those numbers.

You know, when they start to respond and realize, hey, I'm getting beat down from this or, hey, you know, this is too easy. You know, hey, you know, I feel like I don't have enough leg strength. I can't stand up from a clean. You know, when they start giving that feedback, then I know that they're no longer this beginner, that they're starting to be, you know, intermediate. And then that's the good're no longer this beginner, that they're starting to be intermediate. And the good thing about that is when they start to give you feedback,

even if it's not even that good of feedback yet, but when I start to respond and give them things from what they're telling me, they're going to get better simply because they believe that they're going to get better. Yeah. I actually feel like once you're training advanced athletes, you're going to be at all times focusing on whatever their weak link is in the chain. They're going to be strong kind of across the board. You could have a power lifter that deadlifts 600 pounds, but there might be some reason that you're talking to that person about having weak hamstrings. Even though you're like, well, how do you have weak hamstrings and deadlift 600 pounds?

It doesn't all the way make sense. It's not that hamstrings and deadlift 600 pounds like it doesn't all the way make sense it's not it's not those hamstrings are are absolutely weak they might be relatively weak compared to compared to his quads or whatever it is yeah and uh with a beginner athlete they don't there's not going to be those like very specific things you're working on because you're just trying to get them on a general like even templatized training program like you're brand new to lifting like you're gonna be doing you're just gonna be doing like um you know roughly equal equally spaced kind of balanced training program you're not working on like big a cemeteries necessarily you could be depending on the

athlete but when you get to the advanced level it's like kind of like travis said a second ago you might have like you know be good across the board but for some reason you're not able to stand up with your cleans you know at a very at a very fast pace. And so now, now you're looking at that guy saying, okay, well he, he lacks squatting strength, but more specifically he lacks speed and power. And so now we're doing velocity based training with that person to try to fix that one weakness. Cause that's the one thing that's holding him back from getting a PR. So always looking to see what the weak link in the chain is. What's the one weakness you can fix that will will that will push that person forward is kind of more on the advanced end of things where beginners you're just making them strong everywhere because they're just doing general training because they're

just getting in the game yeah i actually love this uh the intermediate stage it's like my favorite thing because one if you're a gym owner or you're a coach like 99 of your athletes are going to be intermediate weightlifters. Like to think that you're going to have these like advanced people all the time rolling into your gym and it's not called bash elite or Westside barbell or catalyst athletics. Like it just doesn't exist. The general population is built out of beginners and intermediate athletes that want to get stronger. They want to lose weight. They want to look better.

They have no interest in standing on a platform in front of people and doing feats of strength. They just want to get healthy. And when someone shows up, they have this insecurity about everything they're doing. You tell them to back squat, and at the lowest, scariest level, they take the bar out of the rack with their arms, and they put it over their back, and you go, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, you've never walked in a gym before. We've got to start back at zero.

We're going way back. We're negative three right now. Or they go to rack it. Yeah, and they take it off with their arms. You go, holy crap. What did you use to? What in the world? How dare you disrespect my barbell like that?

But they don't know. They don't know. It's not their fault. They haven't even watched a YouTube video on monsters. They haven't watched the Bulgarians in the training hall for hours on end with their friends just sitting on the couch. It's not their fault. So the biggest difference and what makes me so happy is when that person has been in the gym for six months to a year and instead of being terrified and insecure about the way that they move and how much weight's on the bar and wondering if they're doing it right, they just walk over and start squatting. And they don't even realize that

they've, they've advanced past this, you know, stage. It's this internal confidence that builds inside them that they are doing it right. And they can actually get stronger. they've they've seen enough of the benefits by doing things um in in like uh in a progressive manner not just in weights going up but in their form getting better their body feels better they've built muscle they've gone through they've set a couple prs they feel good about what they're doing And like the snowball has built large enough that they are, you know, able to, to get up, walk over to the bar, confidently put it on their back, step out, you know, they're probably breathing properly. And then they sit down into a nice squat and you go, oh, wow.

Like you have developed into a legitimate strength athlete that can that can go and attack weights versus you know sitting there and that that time when they walk out of the bar out of the rack and they have like 95 pounds on it and instead of like sitting down and squatting they look at the coach and they turn their head with a bar on their back and they go, is this right? And you're like, it was until you looked at me and asked. Yeah. I just want you to sit down now. Don't look at me. You got it.

Some athletes, I literally have to stand behind them. You know, I stand behind. I'm like, look, I'm going to stand behind you because you can't look at me. Stop that. No, you're going to injure yourself by rotating is i think one of the biggest determining factors when someone crosses into but you know from a beginner into being intermediate would be well for two years they're going to have neural adaptations and so they're going to be like getting better you know form gets better every day their weights go up every day and then then after about two

years they're going to have a year of like do do you go find out, is this person going to stick around? Because when that stops, a lot of people want to exit, you know, like when they really have to, you know, become a weightlifter, they find out it's more than they thought. And so after that third year, if they stick around and then they're like, okay, this is a grind. I'm really going to have to be specific and like, I'm going to have to work for every kilo I get. Then they become intermediate so like you know i know it's like is everybody going to be three years no but like i think for the majority two years they're gonna they're gonna pr all the time third year they're gonna have to grind through yeah if they survive through that then i think they move on to that next stage of being an intermediate but man a lot of people i think a lot of i – I wonder what the percentage is

of how many people stop when it gets – when it becomes real. And, like, you know, they think they're a weightlifter. You're no weightlifter, man. If you've only been lifting two years, like, no offense. As a coach, I'm like, you're not a weightlifter yet. You've got to survive that third year. It's like what happens when you don't PR every week? Don't look at your coach and be like, I haven't PR'd in two weeks.

They're going to shoot you is what they're about to do. Well, how long should their window be? If they're laying out a program or they're just showing up to their CrossFit gym or they just walked in to do – they're part of a strength training program, Olympic lifting program like if they were pring every month every time there's an rm written on the board and now now it's max for day like how long what is like the actual window of how long it takes to get better once once you kind of get to that third to sixth year. I think even after that third year, there will be times where you make a big gain.

Like I know Jordan Gintrell one time, he went up. It was almost like 40 kilos in – it was like 20 weeks. It was a massive jump. And so we just figured a couple things out. So you still have periods of something good now that's uncommon so everyone if any of my athletes listening don't expect that so like that just is a one in a million but you still have periods of bigger gains but then but you know like i think um we should get special arnold on our show sometime with power

and grace he's done really well this quad he would say, as long as his athletes are PRing, you know, two or three kilos every time they compete, then he's happy. So then you're talking 12 weeks. If you get two, three kilo PR every 12 weeks, that mess adds up. Because I watched his athlete,

Jordan Delacruz, at the beginning of this quad, you know, we were at a meet, and it was Morgan King, you know, was ahead of her. And, like, but I could see it happen. None of the other coaches. I'm really good at watching things happening and looking at the data. And I saw her creeping, you know, and I talked to Spencer at that very meet I'm talking about.

I was like, your girl's about to take her over, you know. And sure enough, you know, now she's like the king of the hill in that 55 and a 49 kilogram, you know, kilogram girls classes. She just owns it because she, you know, Spencer two or three kilos,

two or three kilos, two or three kilos. That's mess adds up. You do that three or four times. Now you're talking about, you know, 12 kilos on your, on your total,

which is a huge jump in 12 weeks, actually. I'm really surprised by that, by somebody that has such elite lifters. Yeah, you know, I think Spencer, a lot of people could learn from him. We learn from each other. In the world of weightlifting, there's a couple coaches I have to consider my go-to, and he would definitely be one of them. Others, Kevin Simons, they're always looking for something new. They're trying to learn and, you know, get better.

And then there's some coaches that are like, this is the way I coach. And, like, that is not a coach I'm afraid of. You know, so, like, if you're listening, if that's you, I'm definitely not afraid of you becoming a better coach than me. But, like, Spencer, Kevin, they're always digging. He's very good at velocity-based training, I think, and weightlifting, he would definitely be the go-to when it comes to velocity-based

training. I think Kevin, on the other hand, he has really dissected that whole prolific chart. He takes it to a whole new level of looking at data on the volume. Anyway, so yeah, I think you should not be okay

if an athlete has gone a year without PR. Some weightlifters or some coaches are like, that's just part of it. I'm like, ah, be damned. I'm not going to agree with you on that one. Yeah. In my most intense training, which is probably like, just say regionals one to, you know, six years after that, seven years after that, it's basically 27 to 32, 33 years old. My snatch and clean and jerk went up 10 pounds a year, like in the most linear possible way. It was exactly 10 pounds a year like in the most linear possible way it was exactly 10 pounds a year 10 pounds each 10 pounds each yeah yeah that's good so 20 pounds total every year yes um yeah

and every time i would like hit that new 10 pounds one I got very confident that I could just continually grow at that at that rate for really as long as I was like mentally checked into training really hard but also it was like kind of depressing because you work so hard and then you realize like you're going to put all of your energy into this and it's going to be 10 pounds on each lift, 20-pound total. And it doesn't seem like that much when every single day you're under the bar just grinding for 10 pounds. That adds up because if you think of an athlete that competes three times. Totally. Yeah, so it's about what you're saying.

I think if you're taking two or three kilos total on their total, that would be exactly what you said. Let's say it would be somewhere between – they're going to PR two to nine. Yeah, exactly. So six to nine kilos is what they're talking about in a year on their total. That's exactly what you're talking about. That's exactly – I i fit that that trend perfectly um i think that's a big trend for you because you're a crossfitter and so like we're just doing snatch cleans you're you're doing a million other things so yeah impressive yeah i

think that that part is i and you know up until the the open or like a month or two before that i think that that that's the interesting part and probably why we were successful as a gym. Yes, we bought into the CrossFit thing, but we were really just a strength gym. It sounds it. We then did CrossFit because that was the most fun sport to play when you were strong.

We didn't really have the like it wasn't like a the the big grinding training sessions were always 60 90 minute lifting sessions it's not like we were doing conditioning when we're six months out and i bet if you went and looked at you know i actually watched a video of frazier the other day where he's talking about his training and he was like, somebody, somebody asked him why he doesn't sell his, his training online. He goes, nobody wants to do what I do. It's like, I lift weights all day long. And he's like, and then I sit on this rower and then I sit on an air bike and then I, and then I go run. He's like, I don't really do all that stuff. It's like my training is so boring that nobody would want to do what I do.

Like you think you want to do Frazier's training program, but nobody wants to, nobody wants to do that grind that he puts in. Oh, I know. I don't want to do. Yeah. Well aware, bro. Rowing all day long. But yeah, I... Sorry, Travis, you were talking about the PR is like five pounds a week, and then it kind of tapers off eventually after years of training.

It's five pounds a month and five pounds a quarter and then five pounds a year, and then it's just like, God, I hope I can PR ever again at some point. And then it's time to retire and all that. That's about right. That's a good summary. Show recap. We'll see you guys next week. Earlier I was saying that initially it's all about just learning how to do the movements

and just learning how to lift weights. And then mindset becomes more important as you get more advanced because it's just assuming that you know how to lift weights. And then effort becomes, I don't know about a bigger factor, but it becomes at the highest level, something that differentiates people. But similar to that, rather, recovery is something that in the beginning, you don't have to worry about as much. You don't have to think about it as much because if you PR every week, then you're not trying to maximize your recovery because you're making

progress and everything. You're recovering. Yeah. And you're not beating yourself into submission because you can't, like, if you're a beginner and you have no idea how to snatch, then you're not snatching one and a half times body weight. And so it's not beating,

you're not beating yourself up snatching 65 pounds and working on technique. Right. And so as you get more advanced and as you're able to, able to kind of just assume that you're going to train and assume that you're going to train really, really hard. And now you're still not recovering. Sorry. Now you're still not hitting PRS. Then you're like, shit, like I need to do something. What can I do? I'm already training really, really hard. My volumes are really high. Okay. Now, now focusing on recovery becomes a much, a much bigger part of your, of your brain space, so to speak, because you're doing everything right, so to speak in, in the weight room. But now the other 23 hours of the day is where you need to put your effort.

Yeah. It's like, I call it being a master of the mundane. And like, one of the things I think that is why, you know, Hunter was able, Hunter Elam the things i think that is why you know hunter was able hunter elon was able to go from like you know she was like no one at the beginning of the squad no one knew her name other than you know and she's a really pretty lifter and so then two years into it she's making world teams and she ends up you know going from zero to making two world teams and so the reason she did it, I believe, is her ability to and her willingness to become a master of the mundane, meaning she does the little things.

And people, you know, no one is going to become a master of the mundane like Hunter. I would dare say there's not a better lifter in the country at that, meaning she's going to do the recovery. She's going to eat perfectly. She's going to sleep perfectly. She's going to avoid parties. Like she does every little detail that

she can do. Boy, that is a big differentiator. A good and a great athlete is one. The other one would be mindset, which I think is the biggest separator. I've told this story on the show before, but probably not a long time.

Years and years and years ago, back when Mike McGoldrick was training for the CrossFit Games, this was probably like 2012 or 2013. And we were at a movie. And it was a late movie. It started, you know, not late, late. But it started like 7.30 or whatever it was. And so it's not going to be done until, you know, 9.30. And there was like 15 minutes left in this movie.

And we're there with like 10 people. And McGoldrick's sitting in the middle of everyone. And we hear a beep, beep, beep, beep. And he's like, oh, I got to go home and go to sleep. And he fucking got up and left. Wow. Like, we're at the movies. And it's almost over.

And he was like, got to go home. Got to get my nine hours or whatever it was. Got to train in the morning. And nobody said shit. Everyone was like, oh, yeah, that makes sense. All right. Get after it, Mike. Good job, dude.

We'll tell you the ending. Yeah. I mean. I think we were at the movie Training Day, I want to say. Is that right? That's a dope ending that you don't want to miss. You don't want to miss that ending. Oh, I don't know if I could do that.

Don't quote me on that. That movie probably came out 10 years earlier. I might call into work and be like, I'm sick. I would get my nine hours, but I don't know if I could leave that movie. It's not like he asked anybody, like, you think I should go home? He's going home. It's just obvious that I'm supposed to, you think I should go home? Like, he didn't get anyone's opinion. He's going home. He was just like, it's just obvious that I'm supposed to get all my sleep. I need to go.

Thanks for hanging out, team. I don't give a shit about this movie. I'm going to go to CrossFit Games. I'm out. Yeah. He went to CrossFit Games, didn't he? He did. He did.

Like two or three times, I think, right? Regionals multiple times. He went to the Games in 2013, I think was his single year. He was one of the first people to snatch 300 pounds, I remember. That was... Yow!

Yeah. He was snatching 300 pounds when everybody else was snatching 225 thinking they were cool. He ruined everybody's lives. Thick! Wow. You know,

I think a cool thing for people that are listening to know is like um last year at the pan am championships you know you know we were there in where's it guatemala i think guatemala and so so i took the time you know you're there all week to like i was like i want to know why certain people are doing really well so there there was like, I went to Jordan Delacruz, who was on a tear. I went to, oh, I went to Kate Nye. Or now it's, yeah. Yeah. Kate Nye, right?

In our last, I'm totally blanking. You know, Kate. The girl who's super strong. Yeah, yeah. Like the strongest girl in the country? Yeah, the girl who's dominating. No question mark at the end, period. Yeah. strong yeah yeah yeah yeah so uh strongest girl in the country yeah the girls dominate and then no question mark at the end period yeah i know and then i went to um el bode if you guys ever you know bode uh he's from canada he's like unbelievable like he's literally he's going to

medal in the 96 kilo weight class which is like the strongest weight class and so i went to those three people and i'll and their coaches and, you know, so what about their programming? You know, and there was one common denominator between the three of them. It's the way that they compete. They're very cool and calm under competition. Earlier I said the biggest differentiator is mindset. It totally is. And like no athlete will listen to me.

Like, when I say, look, you probably should get sports psyched. I mean, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I'm saying this is a gap in your game that you're missing. And that if you fill that gap, you're going to be unbelievable is what I'm saying. But people are so afraid of, like, admitting that they are not perfect mentally. I'm like, nobody's perfect mentally. Not even Kate, Bodie, or Jordan. Everyone's got things that they are not perfect mentally. I'm like, nobody's perfect mentally. Not even Kate Bodie or Jordan. Everyone's got things that they could get better at.

But like, if you want to be great, that's something you got to get a hold of. Taking a quick break to thank our friends over at fit together. Fit together is having a body weight challenge starting today. What that means is fit together is giving away $600 in cold hard cash. That's right. Starting October 5th, you have to go download the Fit Together app. F-I-T-T-O-G-E-T-H-E-R. And on top of the $600 cash that they're going to be giving away, we are going to be giving away $600 in programs. We're matching it. That's $1,200 total. That is a really good deal for waking up, doing some body weight exercises, taking a video, posting it to the Fit Together app, finding Barbell Shrugged, finding me, Anders Varner, and having a radical community that's super positive and fitness focused, which is what fitness people need in the social media world. That's what we like. We like to see deadlifts and hikes, and we like to see people walking and putting their Fitbit on and telling us how cool they are in the gym. What we don't like to see is politics and pandemics and craziness and people yelling and negativity.

I don't like any of that. That's why I choose Fit Together. I love it because we have the coolest group. We've taken over the entire app because all of our people are on there. We have the biggest group. We've got the most people. on there. We have the biggest group. We've got the most people. Everyone likes to share. It's awesome. And that's why when we partner with them, we like to match. They've got a $600 cash prize going out to their winners. We're matching it with programs. That way you got cash, you got programs, you're going to get jacked, you're going to get rich, padded back pockets. Padded biceps. Life is good. Go download the Fit Together app. F-I-T-T-O-G-E-T-H-E-R.

Fit Together in all your app stores on all your devices. And make sure for the next 30 days you're posting your workouts, your body weight workouts, or just body weight exercises to the Fit Together app with the hashtag BodyWeightChallenge. And enjoy. find me at andrews runner find us in the group also i want to thank our friends over at legion legion athletics is the number one brand of all natural sports supplements in the world naturally sweetened and flavored supplements scientifically backed ingredients and doses, 100% transparent formulations. There's no proprietary blends and there's a 100% money back guarantee and free shipping. Check it out. We partnered with Legion about six weeks ago now, seven weeks ago, something like that. And I'm a daily user. I take the grass-fed whey protein and the vanilla, and it's easily

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I feel like many of the athletes that you have, and I'm sure this is, you know, there's athletes that are young around the country, but this is probably the first time in U.S. history in which athletes go and stand on platforms as kids. Most kids in the history of our country aren't waking up thinking, I'm a weightlifter. They're like soccer players or baseball players or football players or hockey players. Those are the sports they play. And then when they don't have the bodies or the speed or whatever it is that they get outed from the game at some point. Then they win. Then they're like, well, I was pretty good at lifting weights,

so maybe I'll do that. And then they become Wes Kitts. Right. Like, I don't know how Wes Kitts couldn't – I don't know how you become, like, a better football player or a better designed football player than Wes Kitts. Like, he only has to take, like, four steps. That's basically why he's the best snatch and clean the jerker

because of those muscle fibers. How do you – So expensive. How is he – I don't understand how he's not the NFL. It doesn't make sense to me. He ran a 4-3-40 laser. That's insanity. Yeah.

I don't know, man. And when you watch him walk out onto a platform, he actually gets like – he does the opposite of what so many people do where he like actually plays with the crowd and he wants the noise and he wants all the attention where I would imagine people that don't have that confidence or don't have like a big game mentality, they get scared when they walk out there because all the eyes are on them. They don't want that at all. It's something that when I watch him, I'm like, that guy is just a boss. Yeah. He is getting everybody into this. He wants everyone to watch him lift the weight. Yeah.

At Pan Am Games, he was really playing to the crowd, and he won. It looks like he's about to cry before he lifts it. Yeah. I remember watching that. And he goes like, you know, raises everybody to get up. And we were going crazy. And then, of course, he made the big cleaning jerk to win the Pan Am Games. And then he took his singlet down and had his USA on.

He was pointing to his. And I was like, that kid, that was an amazing moment. And he's not my athlete, but I was as pumped for him as I was for any of my athletes. Is he staying out in California? Because they got moved to 2021, or is he still coming back? Oh, yeah.

He's going to stay through the Olympics. Yeah, so he's going to stay in an extra year out there. And then he'll be near Doug. He'll be coming to Tennessee. He'll lift weights with Wes Kitts. He'll be in the middle of all of us. I think he's going to move to that Knoxville area.

I think another thing, once you leave that beginner thing, beginner stage, you really should, if you're interested in competing, you've got to go start doing it right away. Just because it's fun. I think that competing is a separate skill.

Yeah. And it makes you know what's possible. You pick somebody that is always right ahead of you. When I was competing, there was never a time where I was like, I'm coming after Ryan Fisher and Josh Bridges. No. It was always the guy that was two spots ahead of me. I could beat that guy. That guy's a child. I'm coming after him. You actually get to see where you stack up and what is a reality. If you're in your 20s and you've been training for two, three, four, five years and you haven't gone to a competition to see what else is out there, that will fire you up and get you moving and really caring about your own training more than

anything. Like probably already, if you've been training for a couple years and experienced all the great things that happen to your body and confidence, it's really easy to quit because you're like, oh, I'm there. I look good. I'm lean. I know how to eat. I have enough muscle that people are somewhat impressed. But then it's like, well, you got to go use it. You got to go play the game. You got to go find out what else is out there so that you can see what you need to get better. And that's a rude awakening on day one when you walk out onto the platform or you walk out on the local CrossFit competition and there's some dude in your neighborhood that you've never met that just crushes you. But that gets you also – yeah, that's a rude awakening, but then it motivates you to get better. Totally. Like, if you don't embrace that, the whole competition, you know, thing, then you're going to have a tough time being a great athlete in anything.

That's got to motivate you. I know, you know, Ryan and Morgan, Hannah, they're always looking at, you know, the world standards. Like, what do they need to do to medal at a world championships or at a Pan Am championships? That's what motivates them is like, you know, because most of them are like, especially Morgan and Ryan, they're at the tip top in the country at their age and weight. And so then their goal is also to start, you know, Ryan, he run the American Open this past year as a youth. And that's a, you know, that's the big, one of the big national open meets. And so he's getting to become the tip top of the 67s in America, no matter what age you are. But looking at the world, some people used to get comfortable with that. They'd be like, all right, I am the tip top in the country.

And so they would be happy. But now athletes in America are like, athletes in America are, hey, see, hey. Athletes in America are no longer. Magnolia's going to be the strongest one in your family for sure. She's the owner of it, that's for sure. Are you the boss? So, you know, that is the difference now and in the past is that people are no longer okay with just being the national champion.

You know, we're looking to be the world champion. That's a massive step, though, because like John North and those guys, that was like their goal. Nationals. That was their big thing, to go lift in the empty bowling alley and win. I'll never forget the empty bowling alley for nationals that year. That was insane. Travis, have you ever heard of the Pygmalion effect? You know what that is? It basically means that the higher

your expectations, the higher your performance. On the opposite side of that, there's the Gollum effect, which is like the lower your expectations, the lower your performance. Totally. You've got to have high expectations or you're not going to perform well. Absolutely. Looking at the World Championship numbers is setting the lower your performance. Totally. It's like you've got to have high expectations or you're not going to perform well. Absolutely. So we're looking at the world championship numbers

is setting the bar very high, and you're much more likely to get closer to those numbers if that's your standard. Yeah, both of them, you know, Morgan and Ryan have both competed in one world championship, and both of them have medaled in the world championship, in the youth worlds. And so, like, none of them have gone. Ryan has been to one international meet that he did not medal at.

But then, like, last year, his final youth Pan Ams, he won overall the best lifter. So, you know, this side of the continent, he's – at that age, he was the best in the whole Western Hemisphere. And so, yeah, things are changing. You know, I think C.J. Cummings, Harrison Morris, Kate Nye, you know, they have led us into this whole new era of like – or what Phil Andrews would say the new normal is like

we're not okay with making a team. Nobody is okay with making a world championships or making an Olympic team. If we come home without medals, we're disappointed. That's a great thing to see in American weightlifting. It's super common now too. Even 10 years ago, nobody thought that America could go and compete on a world stage at all. No, they thought America sucked.

In a way, everyone's identity of who Americans were was weightlifters had to progress, which, you know, in a way comes back to this whole, you know, the training age thing is like changing your identity of who you are as an athlete and who you are in the gym to, to stepping into the new person. Like the fact that I just remember all the Cal strength guys that i followed on the way up none of them have the same mentality or had the same mentality and conversation that you have with your lifters right now like i i know the difference because i see it and and like just watching videos and watching um like shankle those guys never were going to go to the Olympics. They knew it. They never even thought that was a possibility.

And they sure didn't think they were going to win or get a medal or they just wanted to make a world team was their goal. Yeah. Then that's what you get. You get a world team. Congratulations. Well, that's a cool medal. Yeah, I mean, yeah, making a world championship is cool,

but like winning is way cooler. Yeah yeah also as you progress from from beginner to advanced like as you get more advanced everything gets that much more individualized we kind of already touched on that a little bit but then in addition to that all of your nutrition recovery needs to become more individualized and injury prevention becomes more individualized like if you have nagging injuries like you might have just instead of having just a strength coach well now you have your strength coach you have like a team you have your strength coach you have your your nutritionist you have your physical therapist you might have like your massage therapist you might have your orthopedic surgeon depending on if you if you need that person like now you have a whole a whole whole board, a board of folks helping you and not just one coach. And I, ideally, you know,

all those people are in communication with each other. If you're going to the Olympics, maybe they are, if you're just a random, I'm trying to go to regionals athlete, maybe they're not. But if you have the ability to, to have a team and to have them all kind of on the same page where your, your strength coach is kind of the main person and they're connecting and dealing with the physical therapist and nutritionist and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So the advice that all those people are giving you are all aligned

on one singular goal. That's best case scenario, having a team to help you out. You know, there's a new app called Coach Now, which we switched to for our online platform. But I use it for my in-gym athletes as well or on-campus athletes because you can invite the PT, the ortho. You can invite all those people onto this app, and they can see what I'm doing. They can see the program. They can stick and watch videos.

So the PT can look and see, you know, hip shift or there's instability, you know, whatever. And so, and we can all share on the same platform. And so that's been a bit,

that sold me on the, and it's really inexpensive by the way. And like, I'm just a coach now. I'm not plugging it. I don't get any money. It's just a good app but yeah yeah i think uh a lot of the you know and thinking about where people should be there's also these like crazy traps that people fall into um once they start seeing a lot of the results um or or feeling more confident that there's like these secret programs and

these secret things that they need to be doing. Like it becomes the time once you get pretty confident and you start seeing the results that you also are on Instagram and you're like looking for that perfect like serum to, to make you a beginner and hit all the PRS. And one of the reasons that I even brought up the story about me being on this like very linear, linear growth pattern that didn't seem linear until I kind of like look back at all the numbers of like increasing my lifts,

10 pounds a year, snatch and clean a jerk each 10 pounds a year so like you can try every program that exists in the world and it still equates to 10 pounds a year like yeah the goal really is like to have fun with your training and continually just get better over a long period of time because like you know it's hard to beat your biology yeah and i'm like a 10 pound a year pr kind of guy and when you do that for like six years in a row five years in a row whatever you know those numbers were, you start to see I'm increasing a lot on a yearly basis, but that's where my biology is. I'm like a 10-pound-a-year kind of person. That's just where my body wants to be. That may even be at the highest threshold of what's possible,

but Matt Frazier is going to be 15 pounds a year. I don't even know if he's PR'd anything lately. He didn't have to because he was so strong at the beginning. He didn't have to PR anything. He's in my hands. That's kind of what I was saying earlier. It's not the weak link in his chain. It's not his focus anymore. He can just maintain

his strength and his Olympic lifts and then just focus on cardio all day. Yeah, he just sits on the rowers. Big advantage. Yeah. Pushes blood through his body. I know.

But yeah, I think that so many people like go around and program hop and they – you feel like you've done the basics for two years. And now it's time for like – you need all these cool methodologies that people are selling. And it's like, no, just keep doing the basics. Keep coming back to general linear periodization, progressive overload. Those things never really go away. It's tried and true and proven that you should just continually increase the weight on the bar once you hit a stopping point back down a little bit take a deload week and and then go back to increasing weight on the bar it's like a really

it's a you know that like program hopping there's like a balance of doing the basics the majority of the time and then going and trying some cool stuff just because it keeping it fun but for the most part like the basics are going to get you where you need to go and i feel like my whole career was just a perfect example of that of like i would go and mess around and do some stuff here and there. But 10 pounds a year, snatch, 10 pounds a year, clean and jerk. And all I was doing for 95% of training is squat, deadlift, snatch, clean, jerk, press. If you're improving, you should stick with the coach you have. You know, like if you're going like a year or two and you're not, then it's time to have a conversation and like either change some things up or then move on.

But if you're improving, I saw a lot in this quad. What happens, you know, there's so much pressure, and you want to make the Olympics. And the truth is there's only eight total spots, four men, four women, and the majority of people are not going. And so, like, I saw a lot of people freaking out, leaving their coaches, and, like, I didn't see it work out. You know, Kate Knight has been with her coach the whole time.

Jordan Delacruz, her coach the whole time. Sarah Robles, her coach the whole time. Maddie Sasser has jumped around a little bit, but she's just a beast. But I don't know, you know, she may or may not. I guess Maddie Rogers, you know, jumped. But then CJ's been, you know, the best, but the best ones. CJ Cummings, he didn't jump around. CJ Cummings, he didn't jump around. Wes Kitts, he didn't jump around.

My point being is this, is that if you're improving, you should stick with the coach because he's figured you out. Especially if you're intermediate to advanced, where it's a lot harder to get people to get stronger, I would stick where I'm at because then you go to a new coach, well, they've got to

start at square one. They're going to try something, see if it works, and then tweak it. I would stick where I'm at because then you go to a new coach. Well, they got to start at square one and they got to, you know, they're going to try something, see if it works and then tweak it. So it's going to take them a long time to, before they understand how you work. And so I wouldn't leave a coach who's understood it. Like if Jordan Delacruz left Spencer Arnold, it would be crazy. Cause you know, she's two or three, two, three, two or three kilos. And now she's like unbeatable. And so you wouldn't want to leave because you know, she's two or three, two or three, two or three kilos. And now she's like unbeatable.

And so you wouldn't want to leave because, you know, there's some magic at Cal Strength or some magic somewhere else. You know, you're getting better. And he understands you. You should stay where you're at. Yeah. Even if you know a lot about programming, which presumably you do if you're training advanced athletes, like you're still not going to know specifically if this athlete is going to respond the best, like maybe they're going to respond to, to everything at some level, but what are they going to respond the best to? You're not going to know if them squatting three times a week or five times a week is, is which one of those things is it one time a week, two times a

week, three times a week, four times a week, five times a week. How often should this person be squatting? You don't really know until you test test you might have a good idea or like an assumption or you know you might have some educated guess and you're going to use that but you're still it's still going to be trial and error you're going to say i think this is probably going to be best let's try it out and then it's reassessed in a couple weeks yeah you're going to have to figure it out it's a big puzzle it's a bad yeah so then then you go backwards because you know assumably if you're with a decent coach, he's already figured that out, and so you just keep rolling with that.

So you're going backwards every time. You know, like I saw a few people, you know, left Sean Waxman, and it did not – I think – I'm pretty sure they're all out of the game now. Like it just didn't work out. Like they didn't progress at all from that moment. And so because he's a good coach and he knows the data and he figured you out. So I would definitely give a word of caution on doing that. Plus, I would also, one thing about intermediate, like as a coach,

I think at that point it's a good time to listen to your athletes and let their input be in your programming. I think advanced, I think if you look at beginner, intermediate, advanced, the biggest differentiators are this. It's like beginners just do your program and shut your mouth. Intermediate, give me input and I'm going to use it. You're going to see the input in the program I'm designing for you. When you're advanced, the majority of what's in there should start to be

what you're telling me because you know your body. Like even it was the great Alexia, the Russian, he started doing his own program, and then his coaches would just give him input. So the role's reversed. So because, you know, when you're that level, you know, you've been in it 10 years, who am I to tell you? You're going to know.

Yeah, with advanced athletes as well, you're going to rely, you kind of mentioned this you're gonna rely a lot more on their on their how they feel and their their feedback because they know how they know how they feel to a much better extent regarding their training compared to a beginner say you know if you do a beginner you do they do a clean you go how that feel they go oh i don't know tell me tell me how to do it like it's way more about just telling them what to do uh compared to the advanced athletes where like their technique 99 spot on and you say uh we'll try just widen your grip like a half inch and see how that feels

and then they do it and then you go well they look pretty good how to feel and they're and they're gonna say uh it kind of felt okay but it was a little sticky in this spot or whatever they're gonna give you some feedback that's like nuanced and actually can help you make a better decision. Whereas beginner athletes, they're not going to have all those distinctions. They don't know really what feels good because they don't know how it's supposed to feel. So they don't have anything to compare it to. So there's a lot more of a dialogue with the advanced athletes. And it's a lot less just telling someone what to do because you're the boss, so to speak,

and it's a lot more working together with someone to achieve a result. Yeah, you start to ask them. I know with my advanced people, say like Hunter or Jordan, when something goes wrong and I see it, instead of me just saying it, I ask them, like, what did you feel in that movement? And so what I'm trying to do is get them connected, you know, so they're going to start to say, well, the bar was out in front. But then I offer advice on how to correct that. I don't just tell them the bar is out in front.

You know, they know. They're like, no shit. And so what do I do to not let it be in front? You know, like, I see so many coaches that that's what they do. They're like, the bar is in front or your butt shot up. And they know what happened. It's like the bar is in front or your butt shot up or and they know what happened it's like how do you not let that happen so then it's time to say look you know keep your chest up and sweep the bar in off the floor you know you got to start to give them cues

and then you know that's the big difference a beginner like they have no idea what just happened they can't they have no kinesthetic awareness no proprioception yeah but even with beginners that's like the most important part of coaching if you say don't do that they go okay i won't what the hell am i supposed to do yeah like focusing on the negative the negative piece like your butt flew up don't do that okay what would you like my butt to do yeah what's the alternative yeah there's only infinite number of possibilities that you can do with your butt. But I know one that you don't want me to do. How about you just tell me the thing that I can't.

Where should it be? Yeah, what would you like me to do? Here, here, yeah. Like at least an advanced athlete sort of understands positioning where you're like, then no. Your butt came up too early. Don't do that.

Okay. How about something positive, something you want me to focus on? Sweep in the barn, keep your chest up. Yeah. You got to give them something. A common thing to read in business books is if you're a manager and you're trying to like tell an employee that hey they didn't do something so well but you're trying to manage the relationship and not get anyone too riled up is you they suggest you use the compliment sandwich it's like a cliche thing to do in in business where like you tell them hey you're doing a great job but this thing over here isn't going

so well um but but you're but you're doing such a great job great job so it's like like good good stuff bad stuff and then good stuff then you get real feedback and then you leave them feeling good again and so we kind of adopted that model with coaching technique where instead of just focusing on the negative hey your butt shot up too fast or whatever it was

we say okay here's how to do it correctly this is how the most common way people do it incorrectly here's what you did and then again here's how to do it correctly. This is how the most common way people do it incorrectly. Here's what you did. And then again, here's how you do it correctly. So it starts with positive, negative, positive. I do the same thing, especially if there's an athlete I'm thinking of.

I'm not going to say her name, but I definitely am like, man, that bar was moving fast. Now, if we keep your butt down by sweeping the bar and keep your chest up, you're going to be unbeatable. So, yeah, I have to keep it 90% positive. your butt down by sweeping the bar and keep your chest up you're gonna be unbeatable so like yeah i have to keep it 90 positive if i were like say damn dude why do you keep like i actually dude as you're saying that i had like the little feeling inside me i was like dang like like i was like pretending i was the athlete in my head i was like damn travis believes in me yeah travis

travis thinks i'm awesome like you gave feedback but, but I walked away from it feeling good. Yo, I actually – Kendall did the online competition. Yeah. And I don't know where you guys – did she come out to the farm for it? No, we had to do it. We didn't have good enough internet to do the Zoom in the bar. Because it's an aluminum. So that was at your gym? Yeah. No, it was at Crystal's garage.

Gotcha. Wherever it was. So I watched the live. And I didn't even know you were there. I thought Crystal was just coaching because she was the one changing plates and helping out with loading the bar. And then I kept hearing this voice in the background.

I watched probably like 15 minutes of her clean and jerk session, and all I could hear is, no one can beat you today. No one can beat you today. You're moving so fast. You're never going to miss a jerk. No one's going to beat you today. There's no chance you're going to lose. Wow, I didn't know.

I honestly didn't know people were listening. Well, I didn't see, you know, honestly didn't know people were, you know, like was listening. Well, I did. I didn't see you until you, she started getting like, uh, until she started putting some weight on the bar and then you start doing the coaching thing where you start pacing back and forth where you're like, fuck, there's a lot of weight, but I need to not act like I'm nervous for her, even though I'm pacing back and forth like a maniac. Um, it's like, we all do the same. We all do that. Anytime there's something on the line you're like can i just lift it for you i i know i can lift it i'll lift it for you you take all the accolades

that way we all win yeah we'll do that yeah but it was like i i i didn't see you at all for like the first two or three lifts that i watched because the timer on that whole thing was super weird but i kept hearing this voice in the back like no one can beat you today no one can beat you're so fast you're not everything looks so strong yeah I know it's gonna keep it positive man like you know like the one athlete that I'm referring to is like you know we in the one year she went from being like pretty good to like the second best youth in the whole country like it was just by like me making things extra positive you know it just crushes her when i if i were to say i was like if i were to say come on man keep your chest up if i were to say that to her and that's all i

said she's wrecked like yeah i think that a lot of yeah a lot of athletes would look at morgan would look at kendall and think, oh, they have no problems. They can clean and jerk so much. Not true. But they don't realize that the amount of weight on the bar doesn't eliminate the fact that you still wonder if you can pick it up. Yeah, and with Morgan and Kendall, they got to understand. Let's say that – and Kendall's getting there, but Morgan, you know, Morgan, no one's going to be him. Like when he goes to a youth or junior competition, he's winning.

And so, but that's not what he's worried about. He's worried about being the best in the world. And so like if his clean and jerk stays at 190 and doesn't go to 95 or 200, like it's wrecking his heart. You know, he's like, he's trying so hard to get there. So it's still, yes. Purpose of life. Yes. He doesn't care that he's like he's trying so hard to get there so it's still yes purpose of life yes he doesn't care that he's the best american like uh you know like yeah he's been the best in his age and weight class since he was you know born but like now he's trying to be the best so like

still a lot of pressure so if yeah if his total goes from 330 to 325 at a meet he's going to be sad even though he's still dominated by 30 or 40 kilos, he's sad because he didn't go further towards being the best in the world. So, yeah. And that's the way I am as a coach. I'm putting those pressures. Those brain games, that's an athlete thing. I bet if you were to walk up to Sidney Crosby, Matt Frazier, Tom Brady,

like he's been in the NFL forever. I can't even remember a time when Tom Brady wasn't the best quarterback in the NFL. And then I bet if you walked up to him and you're like, do you get nervous before games? He's like, are you kidding me? There's like 400 pounders over there that run a 4.8. They're trying to kill me. Of course, I'm terrified right now. Just just because i've practiced this a lot doesn't mean that those guys aren't trying to rip my head off i'm totally every athlete goes through those like mental games and you know just yeah i need travis mash

every time i do something in business be like no one writes copy like you do. Ever. No one's posting on social media like you do. Yeah. You know, like, I would love to know the one I look at and think about the most is, like, Jordan De La Cruz is, like, her facial expression is, like, they always joke with her on her team. It's like Power and Grace. They'll say that she's dead inside. Her face is just, like, she never looks different. Whether it's, like, she's got to make this lift to win the pan am games which she did you know uh or if it's make this lift uh like what

it doesn't change oh it's a world record she'd be like okay it'd be like nothing would change whereas most people are gonna you're gonna see them get a little bit more excited which sometimes the majority of time that's them trying to mask that they're scared. Yeah. Jordan is just like the exact same no matter what. Yeah. How do you get to that point? If every athlete could get to that point, that would change a lot of standards.

Travis Mash, where can they find you? MashTheLeague.com, but I'm at the beach, so if you're anywhere near Surfside. Come to the beach. I'll be on the beach, y'all. Killer. Doug Larson. You can find me on Instagram, at Douglas E. Larson.

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