Barbell Shrugged - Switching Goals: CrossFitter To Weightlifter (and Vice Versa) - 224

Episode Date: August 31, 2016

Alex and McG talk about their recent swaps in training goals.  McG going from long time CrossFit athlete to doing his first Olympic Weightlifting competition, and Alex going from years of weightlifting to doing his first CrossFit competition.  What did they learn?  What had to change?  How did nutrition play a role?

This week on Barbell Shrug, Alex Macklin and I do the old switcheroo, a.k.a. Trading Places, a.k.a. Dan Aykroyd versus Eddie Murphy. Whoa! What does that mean, though? Hey, this is Rich Froning. You're listening to Barbell Shrugged. For the video version, go to barbellshrugged.com. With just 10s? Yeah. Yeah, probably. But if you've got, like, 10s and 20s and whatever the fuck on there, like, you've got a lot of surface area.

I don't think any—I think people just make claims without even actually looking at any kind of, like, physics. Like, they don't have a physics background. They don't know any shit about, like, stress and engineering and fucking math. They're just, like, making your logical assumption based on whatever you think, and you just don't want your people to do it. Yeah. Rant over. I just want to see it one time when you have a

bunch of plates on like somebody drops it and like the plates just fucking explode so we can finally settle that case that it is bad

for the bars and the plates because I haven't really ever seen anything like that what was the claim oh when you like when people mismatch

the plates like you don't put the bigger plates on the inside and work your way out people just like stack tens on tens on tens

but I don't know people just don't want to fit for no reason I think it's just people just want to just make fuss. Make fuss. Can we start today off with a word to our sponsors? I really want to thank Reynolds PVC for making the best Schedule 40 PVC pipe out there.

You sponsor so many affiliates and gems across the nation that, you know, it's about time that we thank Silverline. Is that the only PVC supplier in the country? You know, I think that Rogue is a supplier now as well, but I'm pretty sure that they might get them from the manufacturer, Silverline. Thank you, Reynolds PVC pipe. I made up Reynolds. It's actually Silverline.

So three-quarter inch PVC, thank you very much for a great product. This is in every gym in the country. What's your world, maybe? What has PVC done for you, Alex? Well, I guess in a serious sense, I mean, it's how you learned how to weight lift for the first time. And then if you suck at it, people are always like, go back to PVC. So that is –

Hey, you know how we did that Aliko episode where we went to Sweden? We should find out where they're making this shit. We should go to the Silver Line Manufacturing. Go see where the PVC is made. What a great idea. I don't think you want to see how PVC is made. That shit's fucking kind of dangerous. I've been to...

I used to do that. They did a whole documentary on HBO about how it was like killing people in Louisiana. In a previous life, I was in plastics manufacturing plants like this. Yeah. I've still got my boots and in plastics manufacturing plants like this. Yeah. I've still got my boots and hard hat if you guys want to go. The chemicals don't seem to be very safe for people, so I don't know if you want to be in a PVC making plant. Where is Silverline?

We just took a harsh turn. I don't know where we are. Yeah, we just – I say we do the episode. We still love you. BPA-free Silverline is a new addition. It's organic. It's healthy for the planet.

Cool. All right. Thank you for that. Any other sponsors that we want to thank? Yeah. We've got 25 minutes left to fill in with sponsors. Yeah, real quick, I would like to thank everybody who's in our online programs. Yeah.

Right now, we're for real. Yeah, yeah, for real. I mean, the PVC thing is true, too. No one gives them low. I know. Yeah, anyone who's in our online programs, thank you guys so much. Yeah, people in the Shrug Strength Challenge are killing it right now. Absolutely.

Really excited. Wrapping up month one. Looking good. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. All right, what are we talking about, pimps? Yeah, guys, welcome to Barbell Shrug.

I'm your host, Mike McGoldrick, here with Alex Macklin, a NCTP behind the camera. Word. He's mic'd up today. We've got something a little different. We have no guests to interview, and we are MackleRoy and Kurt Mulliken-less. Today, Alex and I are going to do things a little different. We have no guests to interview, and we are McElroy and Kurt Mulliken-less. Today, Alex and I are going to do things a little different. We had a really fun topic, and we're going to call this episode The Old Switcheroo. We keep doing different movie lines from trading places.

So the past several months, Alex and I have kind of traded places in our training. He came from a weightlifting background. I came from a cross-fitting background. And we both kind of switched sports for the past few months, and we wanted to kind of dedicate this episode to talking about that and the differences in our training. Yeah. I mean, I guess I'll ask, like, why did you decide to do weightlifting?

I mean, because you did weightlifting a little bit before, but now you just made this, like, big – and I've always been trying to get you to like do some weightlifting for a while. And now what made you actually want to decide to like start doing it? Yeah, doing weightlifting. To be clear though, you were doing hardcore – not hardcore, but CrossFit. I only did hardcore CrossFit. Hardcore CrossFit.

What is hardcore CrossFit? Yeah, I mean you – like you trained for the games and then you did the games and you were doing grid league for a while yeah um and then you decided to just do weightlifting yeah so basically i mean the weightlifting i did was to supplement crossfit right it was to get better at crossfit and um i always have enjoyed it and it always kind of came natural more natural to me than anything else in crossfit um it's just fun i just like the movements i I like to go fast. I love the intensity.

And honestly, I just wanted to change in sport because I don't know a lot about the sport. I know a little bit about the lifts. I don't know a lot about competing in weightlifting as a sport. So it was a good experience for me to learn if I like the sport or not and to learn more about it for coaching because I've got clients that want to do meets. And honestly, I wanted to dive in and know what it feels like, know how to choose weights,

know about cutting weight, all that stuff. You really don't get any experience unless you do a meet. You don't get that experience when you just weightlift in a gym. So signing up for a meet was my way of kind of, you know, stepping up and trying to learn a little bit more so I could help with my coaching and then personal experience as well yeah so like when you were doing your training um well who was doing your who was doing your programming like uh so yeah i didn't write my program these past few months i have a coach his name is max elhaj uh with training think tank he's been on the show

twice yep max been on the show really great guy very very smart so you know disclaimer for all this stuff i'm gonna talk about today is like it was all his programming that helped me with this. Yeah, sorry, PBC. I know. I was about to say something to you because I was like, this is fucking distracting me. I just love it. Where were we? Michael's playing with the damn PBC that we shouted out this earlier.

Yeah, so Max has been my coach now for a little over a year. He's, you know, very helpful with the goals that I want, and I came to him and said this is what I want to do for the next few months. So he was pretty excited because it's just knowing that I have something specific that I'm going after. If you're a coach and when your athlete comes to you and gives you a very specific goal that they want to do, it's way easier than where I was for about a year before that

when I was just kind of wandering aimlessly. Now, what was your specific goal for this? Well, it was at first I had a total in mind that i wanted to hit um so when i went to him and said i want to i want to hit a 300 kilogram total and why 300 well at first it was 290 because based on where my current lifts were before i started this weightlifting cycle i thought okay 290 would be like a really good goal that would be like prs and some lifts and it'd be cool to put that together it's just's just a starting point. 290 kilos.

290 kilos total. So I think also I chose that based on what some qualifying totals were for like American Open. Yeah, because you compete at a 94. 94 kilos, yeah. So 290, I believe, is the 94 kilo for the AO. Yes, I think so. So that would be like 130 and 160.

I think it's even lower than that. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah, I think it. So that'd be like, like 130 and 160. I think it's even lower than that. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's maybe 281. Yeah, either way. So that was where it started. And then when we started the cycle, obviously, we need to know where I'm at. So we did a mock meet, like a meet simulation where you were here for that. We came in and we set up a clock and like I got the weights out and I picked my openers and we just did it for the first time. And I did like a two minute clock follow myself kind of like a worst case i pr both my lifts so i was like and i and i this is fresh this is fresh this is not even not even trained yet i haven't been doing any prep for you know the weightlifting and uh this is like the first week to see where i'm at and i end up here both my lifts and i that was a higher total than

what i wanted so I went back to max and I was like well I already did my goal like do I just shut it down or do I continue on and that doesn't happen every day but no I mean the truth is I just undershot you know I didn't know so I had to pick something so uh from there but but doing that meat simulation was really good because it was at the very beginning of the cycle and I could say all right I know now like what would be good to aim for for three or four months from now. What did you hit in that initial testing?

I've got numbers right here. I hit a 134 snatch and a 165 clean and jerk, both were PRs, and that was a 299 total. What are those in pounds? So 134. So that 134 was 297? Yeah, something like that. Yeah, 295. 297? Yeah, something like that. Yeah, 295.

295. Yeah, 295. And the clean and jerk 165 is out somehow. That's 360-something. 360-something. So both were PRs, which was awesome. I was fired up and very excited. Yeah.

And then you went back to your coach, and you're like, Max, I want to hit a higher number now. Yeah, let's be a little more ambitious. So need to, I want to hit a higher number now. Yeah. Let's be a little more ambitious. So I said, I want to do a three 10 total. I think, I think that's, I think I'm capable of that. So that would have been five, basically five kilos more in both of them. Okay. So what did, so now you went back to Max, he started giving you a program and like, what was your programming like? Oh yeah. So, um, I, based on the weightlifting programs I've seen in the past, it was really different because as much as we work and travel, I'm really responsive to outside stress, meaning like I get

overtrained really easy. I don't want to, I want to use that term very loosely. You get beat up. I get beat up really easy. You know, if I have a stressful day at work, it affects me in training. Like I can feel that stuff. I'm just very high strung naturally, and a lot of that stuff affects me. It was a lot of me kind of self-regulating. We had training days, and it took a couple weeks for us to settle in. When we started, you remember seeing the volume. It was a lot. You were doing a lot.

That would break me. Yeah, and it was working. I was getting stronger, but I was getting really beat up it was basically it would be like it would be like two or three really good days and I'd have like five kind of not so great days and I was getting beat up my knees would hurt so it took a couple of weeks for us to kind of learn and figure out what is the best volume for me for the next three months um which I think is a as if you're a good coach like that's something you got to monitor and check out. So it was a lot of feedback and forth between Max and I and, like, you know, we wanted to get to a point where I could squat as much as possible to get my strength up

and not beat my knees up, you know. But there's also some tradeoff, right? Like, you're aiming for big numbers. It's not, like, it's not supernatural numbers. Like, trying to snatch 300 pounds and clean and jerk almost 400 is, like, that's, like, really stressful on the body. Right. At the same time, you shouldn't not be able to walk either.

So we were trying to find that balance. Right. And did you do more, did Max program more technique work or does he think that you're, yeah, like what was, was it technique? Was it strength? What was kind of like? No, it wasn't a lot of technique. We weren't doing a lot of like specialty lifts.

But you had already had familiarity with the lifts. Yeah, I mean, I've been doing Olympic lifts of like specialty lifts um but you had already had familiarity with yeah i mean i've been i've been doing olympic lifts for like seven years so i mean by no means am i saying i don't need technique work i definitely do and i actually was going back to him saying like i think i need more of it um but what we were doing was working and i was getting stronger every week so it's like if it ain't broke don't fix it right now um i i honestly if you i You know, I honestly, I like his approach to it because I would basically, like, Monday was, like, an intense squat kind of intense snatch and squat day. Yeah. Tuesday was, like, all recovery.

Like, I just, like, came in and rode the Airdyne and, like, did some spinning. So you didn't do any strength work on the set? Every other week or so I would maybe do some overhead. Like, my overhead work is really, really strong. Yeah. It's, like, way more strong than my pulling. Yeah, because strong than my pull you jerk like what like you almost jerked 200 kilos almost jerked yeah yeah like 195 or like 197 you barely split jerk that too right so that's not a top priority we would just kind of touch on it and then Wednesday would be uh more clean work and

and heavier front squatting volume that kind of of stuff. Thursday off, Friday kind of cycle back a little bit. It'd be some speed work. And then Saturday we would go either every other week or every four weeks we would do a meet simulation or Saturdays would be another recovery day. So really I only had three tough training days a week. Okay. And the rest were either rest and recovery. Right.

When you were training, did you feel that your technique after more practicing more the lifts more frequently did you feel like your technique got a little bit more dialed in or yeah did you change it up um I think I learned a little bit each time when I went in because I know I noticed when when you first started yeah you because you had come from this more of a CrossFit-type background, you were lifting like a CrossFitter, but near the end of your training, you started looking like a weightlifter. Oh, awesome to hear that.

Yeah, you look good, man. What I mean by lifting like a CrossFitter, not to say that's a negative thing, but it's just different because you're trying to go for efficiency yeah um but with weight lifting it's all about generating the maximum amount of force and power to get the bar up like using a lot of your leg drive yeah pulling very aggressively underneath with the bar rather than just kind of just kind of diving in i remember even you told me like you just kind of got to fall into it because I was doing the CrossFit stuff, but now you're doing the opposite. Yeah, I went the opposite.

And I want to talk more about that too, like the change in training I did because I went all weightlifting. I do believe that you can do both. I think that you can get bigger strength numbers and improve your cardio and all that stuff at the same time. But losing the cardio was not a concern for me. So we went 100 weightlifting right like it was all about being becoming as powerful and explosive as i possibly can at this time so uh with that said like the training was very specific to that

and i noticed big time like how much faster i felt yeah um i noticed how much my squat went up like my squats were going up so much because i went years without ever really dedicating myself to squat cycles. It wasn't ever a big weakness of mine in CrossFit. Right. So, I just didn't really ever follow them and do, like, a lot of volume in it. We did a lot of squatting this summer. What kind of rep ranges did you do? Like, kind of percentages and rep ranges?

Yeah, it kind of varied. So, man, let me think because it changed, you know, month to month almost. But, you know, for a couple of weeks we did some volume cycles. You know, it would be sets of five to eight reps for three or four sets, which crushed me, like absolutely crushed me. You know, like I think at one point I was up to six sets of eight front squats at like 315. That's a lot.

And I remember – I think you all remember seeing me that day. It was downtown in the middle of summer and i'm literally laying on my back in between sets like oh my god this is so hard i'm so out of shape but the next week i adapted and like i didn't you know it just a lot of it was new was a new training stimulus stimulus and it hurt and sucked but the next week i had adapted and i just i was adapting pretty quickly to some of this yeah well that's what the body's supposed to do the body you have to put like you, you have to put the body under stress for it to actually grow and adapt. You know what?

And that's why I like having Max as a coach and shit – having a coach, period, is because on paper I would – if I went through something like that, if I had programmed that, I would be like, oh, that's too much. I got to back off. It's messed up. Man, you got to like – you got to just shut up and like listen to the program and do it because you, you, in training you need stress to adapt, right? Right. Like, and programming that for yourself though is hard because the psychological side of

it, you want to, you want to think, you want to have control over it so much that you're not sure if it's too much or too little. Yeah. So it's, it's just really hard for me to do. Yeah. You definitely shouldn't feel, at least for weightlifting in my personal experience, like if you feel too good during a training cycle, you didn't get stressed hard enough. Yeah.

And oftentimes, like near the end of a training cycle for, you know, prepping for a meet, the shittier I feel near the end, the better I performed at the meet when it's time to go because that means I'm going to peak at the right time. Man, that's so true. So once a month we would do a meat simulation. Yeah. Oh, my gosh.

Every time you say meat simulation, it's not a good word to my ears. A mock meat. A mock meat. Is that any better? I'll stimulate my meat. Oh, shit. I did a really vulgar hand gesture. If anybody has a metal band out there.

Meat simulation, not meat stimulate. I want to see a metal band. Meat simulation. All right. Meat simulation, not meat stimulate. I want to see a metal band. Meat simulation. All right. So once a month we basically practice doing a competition. Yeah. So you were put under competition standards.

You set yourself on a timer. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You gave yourself three attempts. But on top of that, we also practice different deload cycles, right? So, I mean, like I said, i've never done this before and if you have a good coach like they're going to try these different things and experiment from it and take notes from it and learn from it so every month we kind of tried a different d load for that week and each one of them was pretty different each one of them worked i got better and better and

better on each one so we just took note of that and kept trying those things and by month three i had done three simulations and we kind of used that last one to use for the actual competition so did you do four months of this um i started and let me see here i like in like in april mid-april yeah and then the meat was uh because it was before when we went to cookville yeah yeah and then the meat was in july yeah yeah so about three or four months which is which is typically yeah it's about three months yeah three and a half training cycle was perfect perfect yeah and uh I thought I picked a good timing for the meat and all that because I also did a bunch of diet stuff too which we'll go into but yeah um yeah I'm curious like I mean that volume would you describe

six by eight would have absolutely destroyed me I'm curious to how how your recovery was especially since you were... Yeah, well, I mean, on paper, a lot of people would look at it and be like, that doesn't look like a lot of volume. I wish I could graph all of the loading, like the total work done in certain sessions and show you the progress over time. So for about five sessions over a period of 12 weeks,

we did clean and jerk clusters. The first week it was if you don't know what a cluster is it's basically it's formatted like 1.1.1 the dot means basically like a period of rest between reps and the point of doing clusters is that you can usually use higher loads because it keeps the intensity higher so you basically it's basically a triple but with more rest put into it all right because let's say you want to do a back squat uh for a set of three and you do 300 pounds if you want to do a back squat cluster 1.1.1 it's the same amount of reps but if you do 10 second rest

between each rep you can go a little heavier it's a little more intense all right so that's the point we have a whole video explaining yeah yeah so i just wanted to kind of went on tangent there but uh every couple of weeks we would do clean and jerk clusters, sometimes week to week, sometimes every two weeks. And we made progress in those over a period of 12 weeks. Week one, I was doing 275, 1.1.1 for five sets clean and jerk. And then by the 12th week, I did 330, 1.1.1 for five sets clean and jerk, which, like, I remember doing it, and the 275s wrecked me. Like, I did 330, 1.1.1 for five sets clean and jerk, which like I remember doing it and the 275s

wrecked me. Like I was tired. It was very exhausting. It was really intense, but just the slow progress over time, you know, I didn't try to go to that 330 within a week or two weeks over 12 weeks. It was really easy. Yeah. Like just added, you know, five or 10 more pounds each week. It's the same volume. We just kept it very simple. And by the end of it, I was smoking the 330, which I would have never seen myself doing. That's a lot of volume. And was that easy for you to not want to jump straight to the biggest? Well, I didn't necessarily know that that was my goal to try and get to like a

cluster at 330 for five sets. But, but yes, it was, it was, it's, it's really tough for me sometimes to think more so that this first week was kind of easy. Yeah. You know, and people maybe do that in programs a lot. If you start like a volume progression in the beginning of something, it feels really easy in the beginning.

Right. But it's easy in the beginning because it's got to have room. You've got to build. It's got to have room to build. If it's hard the first week, how are you going to keep progressing? So just be patient with that. But, yeah, it was a lesson in patience that, like, you know, big picture over 12 weeks, like, this is going to – we're going to grow that much.

And, like, man, you were saying earlier, if you feel good throughout the whole training cycle, you're probably not stressing enough. That's so true because I felt myself each week, like, almost breaking. Yeah. You know, I was, like, almost to the point where I was, like, man, I need to email and be, like need a day off like yeah so I think you should almost almost almost always be right there yeah you know so that makes you stay on top of your recovery and like you have to do a

lot of the extra work to really kind of uh make sure that you are ready for the next week for that little progression yeah so all right so you had the 12 week 12 week training and you had a meet at the end of the 12 weeks. Now, well, I guess you wanted to talk a little bit more about what else you were doing, like why you were doing this cycle. The nutrition side of it is something, too. So I wanted to compete as a 94-kilo, and I weighed 215 pounds at the start of this. Which is about 98. Yeah, 94 kilos is 207 pounds.

So I had, like, seven pounds to lose. But I also wanted to get really strong. Everyone I talked to, even you, you were like, you don't need to do any cutting between now and then. You'll be fine. Seven pounds is not much over 12 weeks. Yeah. Like you could cut five pounds in a couple of days, right?

A week or so. If you don't want to like completely screw yourself. Right, right. So I didn't want to do that though with it being my first meet. And I recommend this for beginners too. uh if doing your first meet is somewhat stressful for you and you're learning the sport don't make the nutrition and the cutting weight added on as well yeah don't make that a stressor so i knew that if i just planned my diet a little bit better and clean things up a little bit over the 12 weeks i could kind of cut down yeah so i

got with jason phill um, and we worked on our nutrition and basically he just looked at the calories I was at. I sent him all the food I was eating for a week and he's like, all right, we're going to put you on a slight caloric deficit, which I barely even noticed. I was, I was eating on average like 3,300 calories a day. He put me at like 2,900. Yeah. And, and we just monitored it and I was losing like a pound a week and it was very easy. It's about right. There were some days that I felt kind of hungry and was like, man, it's so hard. But honestly, it was really psychological.

It was just because I was cleaning up the food, and I was eating so much fat and protein, way more than you ever realized. What kind of foods were you eating while you were on the school campus? Were you saying you were eating so much fat and protein before him? Yeah, before that, before that, yeah. We kept it pretty balanced, like 30-30-30 almost. I'll say like a third of each macro. You had that McG Buffalo chicken, didn't you? Yeah, man.

That's one of the most popular recipes we've ever put out. I mean, I don't – I can't remember who showed me that recipe, but I apologize. I'll give you a shout-out when I do remember. No, fuck him. No, but, yeah, so, I mean, I just cleaned up the meats, and, you know, I was eating – You were eating a lot of like fatty meats.

I was eating a lot – I was like eating a lot of pork and burgers and stuff like that. Stuff that's just like really cheap and easy. Yeah. I started eating a lot more chicken, a lot more ground turkey, a lot more fish, and I started losing weight pretty quickly. I made it a point to get vegetables in at every meal. Yeah. Which is pretty hard to do.

But like I noticed night and day difference on how lean I felt. Right. We feel fuller because the vegetables, you know, fiber and all that kind of stuff. And then I would experiment, too, with meal timing. So on days that I would do weigh-ins, I would notice that if I stopped eating before 7, I would wake up, like, 5 pounds light the next day. Like, my metabolism would kick in so hard overnight, and I would wake up and feel super lean and light.

But if I ate, you know, around 830 or 9, I could notice night and day difference the next day. I would actually wake up heavier sometimes. It was crazy. You know, I would fluctuate three or four pounds a day, but I noticed significant difference when I stopped eating before 7. Yeah. So basically you went on like a mild caloric deficit just to cut those last few pounds.

Did you go all the way to 94, or did you kind of stop a little just shy? Let's say a week out. I emailed Jason and was like, hey, I weighed in this morning at like 205. And he was like, oh, perfect. Let's add some carbs here. Oh, so you were under. Yeah, I was a little under a week out. And he was like, let's add some carbs back in.

You'll be fine. And it worked out perfect. I showed up to the meet uh the day before i weighed in or excuse me i weighed in that morning and i i was uh 0.1 kilo over i just went and like did a lap around the parking lot and came back in and i was under it's perfect do you know what if when he puts you on the caloric deficit do you know if he cut what did he cut did he cut all macros across the board or just cut like protein or did you cut fat or carbs like what do you cut yeah so he didn't give me a specific macro to cut.

He just said, follow these macro guidelines. So, um, I would, I would, I mean, I guess he did in a sense because it just depends on what my macros were before that. But it basically put me at like a third for each and then we just pay, we just focused on the calories. Now every week or so he would say, I mean, I'm sorry, a third, like what do you mean a third? Like it was split evenly.

Oh, okay. Gotcha, gotcha. Like, 33% of each one. Gotcha, gotcha. So, 33, 33, 33. Protein, carbs, fats. Protein, carbs, and fats. Okay.

So, it was all pretty balanced. Right. And then, every week or so, we would check in, and he would say, all right, we're going to cut 100 carbs out this week, or we're going to cut out, like, 50 grams of carbs this week. So, it would bring the calories down just, like, a little bit. Yeah. Enough to where, like like 50 grams of carbs this week so we bring the calories down just like a little bit yeah enough to where like like 50 grams of carbs i barely noticed 200 calories yeah yeah it's really not much at all yeah um so yeah i mean that's how we progressed each week and i felt great during it it was really easy it was one

last thing i had to worry about and i didn't feel like i was just really concerned that i would cut too much and it would eat into my strength gains performance Perfect performance, right. But didn't at all. But you got stronger the whole time. I got stronger the whole time. I felt great. I leaned out a little bit. Like, it was perfect. You hit new PRs during your training cycle, too. Yeah.

Because you hit that 380 at Cookville with Rich. Yeah. Yeah. That was perfect. I PR'd same day. Yep. Let me see. I was trying to – oh, yeah.

So how did your – okay, so you cut the weight and then now you got to compete so how did that go like what was your experience like with that it was really good um i did a meet in chattanooga and um when i was let me start with the good first what went really well is that i did not bomb out i hit hit both of my openers. I was very happy with that. I felt good. The weight was good. Everything was perfect, right? I missed both second attempts. I ended up with, I think, a 290 total, which was disappointing because in training, I had hit a 303, which, you know, I was like, oh, that's... Training's different. Yeah, I know. I know. I was like, oh, you know, like hitting both second attempts for me wouldn't be a problem. I did it. I did it five times this

summer, you know? So I was a little disappointed in that, but, um, on the good side, you know, it was my first meet. I didn't bomb out and I qualified for the American open. So that's really cool. Um, on the other side of it, where I was somewhat disappointed and want to reflect on and learn from is I prepared to basically follow myself. I thought that would be worst case scenario for me because I'm very high paced when I lift. I warm up very quickly. I do all my attempts very quickly. Like I just like to move.

You're a crossfitter. Yeah. Coming from the background I have, people like sit down. I'm like, I cannot sit down in a chair. I get stiff. It's hard. That's a big reason why a lot of crossfitters don't like doing weightlifting meets because it's so slow yeah like you're gonna sit there and maybe wait like five minutes in between an attempt can you prove to me that

sitting in the chair is fucking doing anything come on well i mean the thing you don't have a choice though yeah that's just how the sport works it's based on the order yeah sorry let me get to that yeah so that's what i learned was me thinking that following myself would be worst case was not the case. It was actually harder for me to wait longer. The way that this meet was done, it was really stretched out where basically all the guys went in one big group. We don't know that going in.

Right. We didn't know that. So I basically, like, would do a snatch attempt, and then i waited like four or five minutes six minutes ten minutes maybe like it was did you have anybody helping you like kurt kurt's there warming up yeah kurt was helping okay it was there helping me warm up he was very helpful so it does help because having somebody help is like huge he thought i thought i was driving him nuts because like like i just wanted to be told what weights

to hit like just tell me what to do and when to do it, and I just want to go crush it. He was kind of all over the place because it was tough. You've got to be good at coaching meets, and you've got to be really resilient in terms of when or when you're not going to go, which I think just comes with more weightless experience. If you're coaching at a meet it's you just gotta you just gotta get the experience you gotta learn how to read the cards but then you also gotta have a feel for uh how the meat is being run yeah it's just it's an experience thing yeah so i hit my

opener on the snatch my i missed my second attempt and then i was like f it let's go up and try more and what was your what was your first attempt my opener was 130 130 kilos, so 286. Okay, so that was like well below your order. Well below my PR. My PR is like 142. Yeah, so you went – No, I'm sorry, like 139. I thought you did 315. No, I've done 305.

Oh, 305, 305. Yeah, so like pretty conservative. Pretty conservative. Just to get on the board. Smoked it, felt great. Exactly what you should do. My second attempt, I don't know what went wrong. I just missed. What was that? It was like a 10-minute rest one. Exactly what you should do. My second attempt, I don't know what went wrong. I just missed.

What was that? It was like a 10-minute rest, and it just threw me off. Yeah. It was 135, which is a number I've hit millions of times. And the third attempt, excuse me, I did 135 again. Third attempt, I pulled it so hard, I just kind of threw it over my head and just walked off the platform. I was like, damn it.

Yeah. So with that said, I was like, you know, bummer, but I didn't bomb out. That's okay. And I was like, damn it. Yeah. So, but that said, I was like, you know, bummer, but I didn't bomb out. That's okay. And I was like, you know what? To still hit the 300 total, I could still get, I could still clean and jerk 170 and still hit that. So, it wasn't over. Now, where I was really thrown off was the time between the snatch and the clean and jerk. They had to do all the other people again for the clean and jerk.

So, I honestly, it was like two hours. Yeah. Which which i have never i didn't prepare for that so your adrenaline just it drops drops i had you know get ramped up again aminos again get all fired up and i felt good i hit my opener on clean and jerk i hit 160 kilos um i hit 165 on my second attempt but they called me for press out which it was a good call. I just was kind of lazy. And then I had nothing to lose, so I went for 170 and just missed the clean. By that point, it was just so much waiting that I just, you know, not blaming it on that, but, you know, first comp experience. Yeah, I mean, well, that's really meet conditions, though.

There is a lot of – well, especially these local meets. At national meets, like if you decide to go to the American Open, you'll probably be lifting with people's very, very similar numbers. Yeah. And it actually kind of – it can go that way because so many people are so close together. Yeah. But typically, like, you're pretty – you're all around the same. Yeah.

So sometimes it can be like – Five lifters doing the same number. Yeah, five lifters doing the same number. Or you're, like, five lifters out, and then you're like the next person out, and you thought you had five minutes, and now you only have like 30 seconds to go out there. So it really – that's why competing in weightlifting is just – it's really hard to duplicate in the gym. Yeah. And, I mean, because you don't know that aspect of the other lifters and the timing.

Yeah. If I had to add anything about the experience in it, it was a lot of fun. The training is a blast. Yeah. I just don't know if it was for me because I felt like the opportunity to perform was just so short. And I like to just have lots and lots of opportunities throughout the day to just kind of hit it all day long. You mess up, you can go back again on the next event and crush it. For sure.

And CrossFit. So, I mean, like, nothing against the sport at all. Like, I loved it, and it was a great experience. And I'll probably do another one again. I just don't know if I'll dedicate a whole summer with only that. How did you feel, like, when you stepped out on that platform? Like, what was – I feel great.

I don't get nervous. I mean, I get nervous. It doesn't – it's not – I wouldn't say it's like a negative nervous. I feel so strong and powerful. And you do feel kind of a little out of body. You don't necessarily feel all the positions that you normally practice. But I set up really quickly, which could be a big problem maybe. But I see a lot of high-level lifters do it.

I like to just go out and grab the bar and go. I don't like to sit there and get quiet and settle in. Like I'm, I'm ready to go when I'm, when I'm like on the platform. Yeah. Yeah. Would you do another one or do you? Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think I absolutely would do another one. Um, you know, qualify for the American open. So I'd like to go do that. That would be fun. Uh, I don't know if I would dedicate my, all my training to just that. I'll do probably some combination with it, but just the Olympic weightlifting training I think I'm probably done with. Yeah, yeah.

Well, how did you celebrate? We went to Chili's, you remember? Yeah. He asked that on purpose. Whose idea was that, I wonder? Curtain. Actually, it was his. Yeah, Curtain CTP came out.

I mean, I'll be honest. I was pretty upset with the total I got. I was like, I've hit 300 so many times. I was pretty bummed. But you never hit it, but you've never done that on the platform. That's what I'm saying. I know it's totally different. It's totally different.

No, I knew that. I know that. I know that for sure, and I'm not going to throw a hissy fit about it. Right. So my boys came down to help coach and film and celebrate and stuff, so I had to take Chris to Chili's for being such a good sport. We got that video of you. Yeah, and if you watch it, I put it in reverse mainly just to make Mike laugh here.

I'll edit it in here. It makes it look like you missed your openers. Yeah. I edit it in reverse just for comedic effect. He texted me. He's like, I hope you're not mad. I was like, no, man. I mean, people need to see that side of it.

You need to see the risk of failure. And, like, that's the scariest thing I learned about the sport is, like I said, there's not a lot of opportunity to perform. Well, I mean, you know what I'm saying by that? Yeah. Well, you have a very narrow margin. Yeah, risk and chances are so high that that's what makes these people great athletes is you have to show up at that exact moment.

Oh, yeah. You've got to show up. Weightlifting is very precise. I did not show up. I didn't show up that day. It's consistency, right? Just like at Chili's, always consistent. Man.

I mean, man. Yeah, that is why consistency, though, is really important. If you're training, we were just talking with Justin Thacker and that when people, they're always chasing PRs in training, but the thing is is that if you can chase consistency in training, if you know you're always going to hit 95% because you smoke it every time in training, then get on the fucking platform and you're going to hit 95%. Yeah.

It doesn't matter. I mean, some coaches might disagree with this but i don't like missing like i don't like it becoming a habit no you definitely shouldn't miss and i'm not i'm not trying to brag about it because some people could say well you probably didn't push enough or you weren't intense enough in your training but i disagree like i could count on one hand how many heavy like high load percentages miss misses i had over the whole summer like i do not like missing and i do not like training with that kind of fatigue or environment because it's such a skill that, like,

I don't want it to get in my head that it's even an option to miss. It would at least have to be two hands. Seven of them happened at Rich's house. Oh, yeah. Never mind. My bad. I stand corrected. But that was a different environment.

Different environment. Oh, man. CDP calling you out, dog. He did. No, he's right. But that was a different environment. Different environment. Oh, man. CTP calling you out, dog. He did. No, he's right. But it was a special occasion. Minus that day, I would say there were not many this summer. And that was just one thing I tried to practice on.

When you're training with Rich, you switch it up. I did. It was six times. Six times. That's true. So if you have six fingers, you're good on my hand. I absolutely agree with that statement. There are times to miss.

Like, you absolutely should. If you go through a whole training cycle without missing any reps, then you're probably not lifting as heavy as you should. But like that should be when you're going for max effort attempts. Like you miss those. And then you really should only give yourself maybe like one or two. When I worked with Travis Mash, he would program how many times I could miss. Like he would say no more than one miss or absolutely no misses.

You should, when you go into your training program, if you're doing weightlifting, you should give yourself, like if you're working up to a heavy one rep max, you should say, I'm going to miss, I give myself one miss and that's it. And you have to have enough discipline to say you're not going to go for it. But, yes, you do not want to make a habit out of missing. But there should be times where you do go for the fence and you may miss. Yeah.

I got one more thing I want to add. I got my singlet from Viking Weightlifting. It's a Canadian company. And I want to give that dude a shout out. As soon as I ordered it, he emailed me and was like, sent me the tracking number and was checking in on it, asked me how it fits. So if you want to buy a singlet, they're a good website. Check them out.

Yeah. And that video, I was going back to say, that video of McG at his meet, the best part of it is because it has Michael Jackson in it. I mean, that's the best part. I'll clip that in right here as a little commercial break, and then let's take a break. We'll come back and talk about Alex switching from weightlifting to CrossFit. Oh, yeah.

I can't wait to interview this guy. Weightlifter doing CrossFit. Hashtag weight weightlifting to CrossFit? Oh, yeah. I can't wait to interview this guy. Weightlifting doing CrossFit. Hashtag weightlifting doing CrossFit. Hopefully they just enjoyed some Free Willy right there. Home. Yeah. Do-do-do-do. Do-do-do-do.

Do-do-do-do. I'm only human. It took me a second to know what movie that was from, which I feel so much shame for. You never watched Free Willy? Yeah, it just took me 20 years ago. Me and Kurt were singing that in the car, and then this motherfucker bust out the Free Willy 2 song.

We're like, come on, Kurt. Oh, who did? I saw Free Willy 2. I wonder what happened to the free – well, the whale is dead, I think. Yeah, he does. Where are you going with that? I was just wondering what happened to the Free Willy kid. Is he like a normal dude now?

Is he strung out like a lot of child actors? Was the whale's name Willy? I don't think it was. No, it was like Keiko. It was Keiko. So who's Willy? Free Willy is the whale. Welcome back.

Let's just go back to fitness. Let's go back to fitness quickly. So earlier in this episode, we were talking about my journey doing my first weightlifting meet, how my training changed from CrossFit to Olympic weightlifting. And then now we're going to put the ball in Alex's court for a little bit and talk about your experience from going from weightlifting to CrossFit. So, again, the old switcheroo. The old switcheroo.

So how many years have you been weightlifting? I'm Dan Aykroyd. He's Eddie Murphy. Wait, you'd be Eddie Murphy. I'll be Eddie Murphy. You'd be Dan Aykroyd. How many years? How many years were you just doing strict weightlifting?

Probably since 2012. So four years of strict weightlifting probably since 2012 so uh four years like a strict weightlifting like a lot of people were when i was it's so funny because when i was posting all these videos of me doing crossfit they were like oh shit how's doing crossfit now i was like well i did start off doing crossfit how long was that i mean it was like two years i mean i did but you never got like i never got no i never got i never got anywhere really with a lot with CrossFit because I just found strength training just to be so much more fun. Okay. I was going to ask why you went from that, from CrossFit,

into weightlifting so quickly. Well, because I was weak as shit. I wanted to get stronger. Was that a necessity? Yeah. I mean, actually, I thought by trying to get stronger and improving my weightlifting because I was like, well, I want to get better at CrossFit because I was getting my ass kicked in WODs.

But then I was like, well, I just like weightlifting better. So I just made the switch. Gotcha. Yeah. How many meets have you done? I don't know, man. I've done a few, maybe like a dozen. I don't know.

Ooh, can I tell a story about your first meet real quick? Oh, yeah, yeah. This dude, it was his first meet. I filmed it. And they go, and Alex, you know, he's going up. It was his first attempt at his first meet real quick. I'm going to have to edit this in there. This dude, it was his first meet. I filmed it. And they go, and Alex, you know, he's going up. It was his first attempt at his first meet ever. And then he's going. He's putting his hands on the bar.

He's getting ready, and he's about to, like, lock into position. And they go, Dan Flagg? And Alex throws his hands up like, oh, like he just got caught stealing something. And he just walks off the platform. He went out on some other dude's turn. Oh i was so i was yeah how nervous were you tell me what that experience was like for the first one yeah i mean i wasn't i wasn't very nervous but i was just amped up like you know how you get that like that feeling just being that adrenaline is

all high i was just amped up like i look back at that at that video and i'm just like why the fuck was i just having this like gorilla open mouth face all the time? Mike, Mike Bledsoe was my coach there. He was like, calm the fuck down. I'm like, I am calm. I'll try to link the Dan flag video. Oh, you've got it. Yeah. Yeah. It's on YouTube. I'll try to link it. It's such a new, it's yeah. It's like a new, a new rookie move on my part. But, yeah. That's great. All right. And then talk to us about some of your best experiences.

From weightlifting? Yeah. I mean, yeah. We'll get into the CrossFit. Just going to meets, different meets. The weightlifting community is what I love about weightlifting. I mean, I'm sure with CrossFit, the CrossFit community. If you compete, you meet all the people. They're probably all doing the same things especially if you're like

everyone's there just have a good time yeah and then you just you just hang out with people and you hook like you know connect on facebook hook up with other weightlifters oh yeah no like connect on social media like i've gone to different towns i think the community thing about competing in the sport is is yeah is there any trash talking oh of course there's trash talking but i mean friendly yeah yeah i like to trash talk and i kind of was at my first meet and i don't think the other guys like it so much at your weightlifting yeah oh shit i just like i like to goof around when i'm warming up it helps me stay loose everyone else probably not so much yeah they're probably like to shut this dude up yeah well weightlifting is

the definitely from from seeing crossfit uh like how the competitions it's it's definitely different but i guess we can get into that like yeah okay so um weight lifted for four years and then all of a sudden now you're crossfitting what sparked the transition well after the american open uh in well, I actually competed the whole 2015 year. I trained and competed with an injured back. And after the American Open, I tried to go back to competing or tried to go back to training for weightlifting, but I literally could not do anything.

I couldn't squat, couldn't pull. My back just hurt. That's kind of hard when you're doing weightlifting because you don't have any options. Yeah, you don't really have any options. So I actually took a lot of time off. I took like maybe two months off completely, just didn't do anything, sat on my couch. And then I hooked up with Zach Greenwald. He does this, he basically does structure, like strength balance type training, rehab type training for injuries and stuff. i got with him and uh was working

with him on uh getting my back healthier sure uh it was actually really it was really humbling experience uh at first because he was literally having me lift with like 95 pounds like very lightweight just with the bar because because he was working on fixing my movement quality, which you have to, if you're used to lifting heavy weights and you now have to take some steps back, like you've got to be okay with that and realize like this is going to make me healthier. This is make the pain go away. Like just be okay with that in the moment.

Yeah. Because that was really hard for me. I was like, fuck, I want to lift heavy weights, but I can but i can't yeah i was gonna ask how you dealt with that because i feel like most people wouldn't ever do that kind of training unless they had an injury something's gotta like scare you into it you know i mean it basically did like i at seriously at one point in time uh i had thought about just walking like just quitting like it was it got so bad training all together yeah oh wow because it had gotten so bad. Like training altogether? Yeah. Oh, wow.

Because it had gotten so bad that I literally couldn't do anything, and it wouldn't get any better despite all the things I was doing. And I just, like I said, that little stint of sitting on my couch playing Fallout 4, I was just like, wow, I don't know if I can get back to the gym because it just was so deep. I was digging so deep. And then, you know, coming back, having a plan really helped me get back in the gym. But it hurt for a little while to get back into it. This was your first time having a coach write for you individually, wasn't it?

Yeah. Okay, so you've always kind of followed templates. No, actually, that's not true. I had Bledsoe coach me for a while. But this was the first time, like, it was actually not having to do anything with weightlifting. This was more just rehab type stuff. Did you gain any weight during this time off? Oh, yeah. And that's probably when your nutrition kit kicked in as well.

Like, you got really passionate and interested in nutrition. Like, you post stuff all the time and you share stuff and advice all the time on nutrition. Well, the main reason why I started getting nutrition is because, one, I wasn't doing anything. I wasn't lifting heavy. And I was like, well, if I'm not lifting heavy, I'm not going to look like a fat ass. You know what I'm saying?

So if I'm not training, if I'm not lifting heavy weights, I'm going to at least do this. Because I'm honestly a person. I need something to shoot for I need a goal I need I need some kind of competition something to shoot for so to me like losing all the weight was was my challenge right I need some kind of challenge because the training was challenging but it wasn't challenging if that makes sense um so anyways to answer your your question, Zach is big on just balance and not just strength balance but just being balanced all over the place.

Energy system. Energy system balance. Yeah, same thing. Like I was super in, you know, anaerobic. Right. Very just – Gone five to ten seconds for four years. Yeah, that's it.

I hadn't done any conditioning in forever. I couldn't even tell you the last time I did a workout. I remember me and you worked out one of your first workouts when you came in, came to do in CrossFit, me and you were training together in the same room, and you did something like an isometric hold on the rings and then like an overhead carry with like a 10-pound plate, and it was like intervals. It wasn't like just go, go, go. Yeah. And you were huffing and puffing. I was like this dude right here.

No, I have no kind of like, you were doing like a warmup. Yeah. No aerobic base, no aerobic base, no, no, no breath, no nothing, no nothing. Um, and so Zach was like, well, you should, he was programming that stuff and he's like, well, you're doing all this work anyway. You should do a CrossFit competition cause you're going get you're gonna get in shape um so yeah i just decided well i was like okay i'm gonna do one you did the open i did the open yeah which was a lot of fun and it definitely i mean the open is a lot of fun like i've never done the open before either uh but it kicked my ass. Very exposing. Yeah, it was very exposing to how bad, one, my endurance was, and then, two, my skills.

Like, I had not been doing any kind of gymnastics. Yeah. I had not been doing any kind of bodyweight stuff, and so, like, moving with any kind of bodyweight stuff was just super challenging for me. Yeah, every time we want to film an overtime video, you're like, hey, why don't you just teach me this? Yeah.

Well, it's different. I learned a lot about how CrossFit especially, I mean, I knew this before, but it was just evident now after doing it. It's like very, very skill-based. You can do a pull-up, but if you've got to do like 50 of them, you better move really, really well. Like, movement quality became very obvious. Like, CrossFit, a lot of it is about movement quality.

Yeah, you're limited by that ceiling if you have really poor movement quality, which is kind of how you got injured in the first place probably. Well, absolutely, yeah. I mean, imbalances in strength and then poor movement quality. Yeah, it can only carry you so far. Yeah, for sure. What did you learn through the Open? Other than how much skill you needed.

Did it light a fire to start doing other competitions to maybe ramp up the intensity more? Yeah, I mean, I definitely, well, CTP, me and CTP went head-to-head. CTP whooped my ass on, what, 16-4? Was that the deadlift one? Yeah, the deadlift one. I beat you on the last one, that thruster. Oh my god.

CTB was wearing those I made the dumbest rookie mistake. I just bought them so I wanted to wear them. The Mark Bell strong sleeves which are made for like one RM max attempt. It's like made for going to a meet. They're like knee wraps but in a sleeve but I wore them during the thruster workout.

And your feet turned blue. Dude, it cut off my circulation so bad, and I couldn't get them off, so I rolled them down to my calves, but they're so fucking juicy and big that they cut off my calf circulation. So I was just dying, dude. I looked over at you in the middle of the Y. We both looked at each other with this nonverbal look like, what the fuck did we just sign up to do?

Don't get me wrong. I would have been screwed either way, but that did not help. I think it exposed just, you know, I think it did kind of light the fire. Like I wanted to get a little better. Because, I mean, that's the thing about CrossFit. I mean, I did it before. It's that competitive aspect to it. Like, you know, you're doing WODs and you want to go faster or whatever.

Yeah. I think what I like about it, and I'll keep this about you, but what I like about it is if you have a bad day in a certain movement or whatever else, there's a lot of other things you can go do. Oh, yeah. If you have a bad day snatching and clean and jerking, there's not really much else you can do. That's such a huge – yeah, man.

That was huge because when you do weightlifting, yeah, if you know you can't hit 60% – you know you can hit 60%, 70%. Some days you walk in the gym and you're like, fuck, you fail at 70%. You're like, this is bullshit. But then with CrossFit, you can typically always do the movements. Yeah, there's something else you can work on. Yeah, and it's almost every single time it's like you've never done it before, so it's almost like every single time you do it, it's a new thing.

Yeah, the weightlifting, I feel like it's such a direct measure of where you're at physically at that moment, maybe, versus CrossFit, it's not always that exposing with how in shape or not in shape you are at that time. I really liked how when I started doing more CrossFit that I can just know I can just go in and just work. Like I didn't really have to think about it too much. I could just go in and just work and just do the movements.

Right. So after the Open, you – well, this past weekend, you just did your first competition. So talk to me a little bit about the training the past several weeks. You did kind of prep for this specifically. Maybe it started ramping up a little bit more. Tell me about that. Yeah, so let's see.

Well, first I had to get healthy, so my back had to heal. This was before the Open? This was, like, basically during this whole process. This is still now. Yeah, this is still the entire process. My back had to get to a point where, uh, I could actually lift some, some heavy weights. Um, and so what would you say that Zach was like, uh, the little kid and you were like the whale and he free, free, free, free, free me. Sounds gross. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Fall out for Jesus. Good job, Zach. Uh, but so I had to get healthy so I got healthy and it took me a few months to do that and then he slowly started increasing my like weight lifting volume because at the time I still wanted I still do want to train and compete in weight lifting but at the same time he was giving me a lot of aerobic work yeah so I So I was doing like 30-minute AMRAPs, 25-minute AMRAPs, very, very deep, full breathing, just focusing on going through the movements, not getting like super redline, just breathing deeply and just completing the work.

Right. Sounds like general activity, like just doing anything for 30 work. Right. Sounds like general activity. Right. Like just doing anything for 30 minutes. Right. But what I found is that after doing that for a while, I could push myself a little faster. Yeah. And then that level of intensity with keeping the same level of breathing, I could go a little harder. Did it surprise you that you don't have to bury yourself to get better conditioning uh yeah well and then we talked about this whole time we were filming episodes and we talked about

aerobic capacity and and then uh yeah you don't have to completely put your dick in the dirt to get better conditioning you don't have to do that um there are times and places for that and we certainly did do that but it wasn't very often right yeah it was a lot more just uh work just long extended duration of work but very very deep for simple movements simple movements some of the movements like uh you know like box jumps step ups carries i did a lot of carries i actually did a lot of to read to help with my back to build balance. Through your hips. Through my hips. And I did a lot of overhead carries.

Did a lot of yoke walking. Did a lot of farmer's carries just to balance myself out. Yeah. But then would incorporate that into the conditioning. So I'd do some things like an airdyne for a bunch of calories, for like 10 calories or something like that. And then I'd go do some other stuff like a carry or some crawls, just very simple movements. Gotcha. So that was kind of getting you back into health, starting to add in some conditioning,

getting you maybe a little ready for some competition. How much has it changed since you started getting ready for this competition you just did? Not much, really. I really did the same types of work like the whole time through. There were some times where I did some skill work like I did gymnastics skill work. I worked a lot on my handstand pushups because they were not good. You were kipping handstand pushups. Were there any skills that you just didn't have that you got

during this time? Definitely kipping handstand pushup. I could not do one before. A regular monkey grip muscle-up, kipping muscle-up. I had actually not done kipping muscle-ups for a long, long time. Like I had them when I first started doing CrossFit, but I totally lost how to do them, and I didn't do them well at all. Yeah, before he started, you were doing basically a false grip,

kind of a little bit of a hip kick um or hip kip here we go yeah and then uh we worked on a little bit we worked on was actually having like a neutral grip so you can probably you can get more reps that way because you can just hold on better in the rings yeah and i i learned how to position my body a little bit better for that kip so keeping the legs straight instead of like doing this little fish thing or whatever. Yeah, you were doing a lot of upper body pulling. Yeah, yeah. Cool.

Double unders. I had not done double unders in forever. I got way better at doing those after not being able to do them. Yeah, you were having trouble in the open with those. I remember. Oh, yeah. I can't remember. 16.2.

16.2, yeah. I remember all the ones that gave me shit. Yeah. Yeah. But watching you the other day before this competition, you looked pretty comfortable. Yeah. So I did a lot of skill work.

I did a lot of skill, like, gymnastic-type skill work to work on those things. Cool, cool. How was the competition? It was fun. I mean, CrossFit competitions, it's funny that you said that CrossFit competitions or weightlifting competitions were very high stress for you because I feel that CrossFit competitions are, like, way super high stress. Yeah.

Like, I feel pretty relaxed at a weightlifting competition. Maybe that's because I've done so many. Yeah. But, like, even still, they're still nerve-wracking. But with CrossFit competitions, competitions i felt like i could never come down like i was just always up yeah that's important like uh the best athletes in crossfit competitions are the ones that can get up when they need to yeah and then when it's done they can go right back down because they can recover between the events they can relax and they don't

burn themselves out all day long those that stay up all weekend long tend to burn out oh yeah i just never felt like i could come down because you always have that – I had this, like, constant anxiety of, like, the next workout. Yeah. And I can't remember who said this, but I don't remember who said this, but you've got to not think about the next workout. Think about what you've got going on, like, right now. Like, don't be thinking about the next – don't be thinking about, like,

the workout, like, after the one you're about to do. Think about the one that you're about to do now. That was Hurley from Lost. Oh, okay. Or Gandhi, one of the two. That was me the whole week, and I was like, well, event five, and it's like event two. And I'm like, well, event six.

I'm like, I don't know what I'm going to do. I might get fatigued in this workout for event five. Yeah. You can't think like that. You drive yourself crazy. Yeah. And so I felt like I was always up. Like my heart rate, my adrenaline was always up, and it couldn't come down.

Yeah. I don't necessarily remember saying that I got nervous for the weightlifting meets, but I thought it was different in that you have a lot of opportunities to maybe fix mistakes in a CrossFit competition because it's so long. Whereas a weightlifting meet, you only have like three chances for each lift and it's done. But when I was competing though, I definitely fucked up like a lot during that competition. Right. Like specific examples. One, burpee ring pull-ups.

We had to do burpee ring pull-ups. You jump off the rings. The rings fucking fly all over the place. I couldn't catch the rings. I just felt like so unathletic and uncoordinated, like whatever. And it gets you because you're under the time pressure. And I'm like – and I remember what you told me, and I try to remember this and I try to do this as much as possible,

but sometimes it's just when you're heat at the moment. But you've got to relax, slow down, and, you know, focus and think about what you're doing. And then you can, you know, you're less likely to make another mistake. Yeah, stay a little more present, right? Like you have way more time than most people think in competitions, especially in CrossFit competitions because the workouts are just longer. So people that, like, run out the gate and, like, rush and make mistakes, it's like take a second.

You've got a lot of time to catch up with everyone else. Yeah, don't freak out. I saw some people, like, rush and make mistakes. It's like, take a second. You've got a lot of time to catch up with everyone else. Yeah, don't freak out. That was – I saw some people, like, when they made mistakes, they just flipped out. And when you keep – when you do that, one, that wastes time. And then, two, it gets in your head. Yeah. So you just kind of be like, okay, and then take a few –

like, slow your brain down and then just go back to doing the work so when you made a mistake in an event what did you what helped you get over it so you could focus on the next one um or did you well there were a few times where i just was like i definitely did freak out because i forgot to do it i forgot to just chill out but there's a few times where i got no repped or i missed i messed something up and i'm like i just i just kind of just you almost it's very it's crazy i don't even didn't realize what's happening but you just have to kind of just be like okay and then tell yourself yeah i have a job yeah just just keep just keep is there is there anything in your training or or how you

train would you change from now that you've learned um what it what shows up in competitions for example like practicing getting no re reps practicing you know doing movements a little bit more extra um or just making the standard a little bit higher just so when it does come time for competition it's really easy so one of the things that i was noticing for that people were doing and uh when you again it just boils down to movement quality. Uh, when you're practicing and you're training, you've got to also practice movement quality there. Like if you don't practice movement quality and training, you're not going to do it in competition. So slowing down and actually getting, focusing on getting the rep. Like a lot

of people I saw out there, like we had to do these like box or squat rep. Like a lot of people I saw out there, we had to do these box or squat jump overs, and a lot of people were getting no rep, and I kind of felt like you should not get no rep on that. Yeah. It's low-hanging fruit. It's low-hanging fruit. There are some movements you should never get low rep for. You should never get low rep for a burpee.

Yeah. You should never get no rep for a squat, an air squat or something like that. It is better to control, have good movement quality, You should never get a no rep for like a squat, an air squat or something like that. It is better to control, have good movement quality, and get the rep than try to just super go fast and then miss and then get no reps. I think Ben Smith said, I'm pretty sure it was him, you compete how you practice. Right. So if you practice at a very high standard, it's going to be a piece of cake in competition. If you're honest with yourself and you're doing wall balls

and you know it hit that target or it did not and you correct it, like come time competition, it's not going to be a problem at all when it happens to you. You'll just deal with it and you've been there and you accept that. But if you are someone who is only going to do 30 reps because that's the number that's written, and regardless if they're good or not, you just get them done and move on, man, you're going to get a reality check in competition.

Oh, yeah. Because you don't always have – you may be doing correct reps, but the judge may see differently. The judge may see differently. That's out of your control. Yeah. So the more that you can practice that kind of coming through that adversity or, you know, being resilient in competition like that,

the better off you're going to be. Yeah, and I think in training, yeah, you need to focus on – that's where you would try to learn how to speed up. Like, again, it goes back to, like, CrossFit is a skill. Like, after doing this CrossFit competition, seeing now, like, how fast some people move, like, I'm like, holy shit. Like, I felt like I was going, like, as fast as I can, and then they beat me by, like, three minutes. Yeah. That's because they can move with high quality, very, very fast. And that takes

practice in, in training. Yeah. Yeah. You can't do that out there. Tell me about how much the nutrition changed. So from when you were weightlifting to, you know, going into this, like base work, this healing, what you did, and then how you ate this past weekend. Let's start back. All right. Well, nutrition. So, yeah, I decided to clean up my diet. I competed at 85, and I was at 85, you know, at the beginning of the year.

But then, you know, I did my little – What is that in pounds? 187. 187. I did my little man cave stint. I got up to about almost 200. When you were playing Fallout? Oh, yeah. 187. I did my little man cave stint and got up to about almost 200. When you were playing Fallout? Oh, yeah, my little Fallout cave. I can't remember you back at 200 pounds, but, man, that's crazy.

You never looked fat, but you just had some weight to lose. Yeah, I just had some weight to lose. But the main reason why I wanted to cut is because I still do want to go to the American Open at 77 kilos, and they raise the totals quite a bit. So I had a better shot given the time frame that I had to prepare because I'm coming up from I lost a lot of strength through the time off and all that kind of stuff. So I wanted to get back up.

I wanted to go to the American Open. So I was like, okay, 77 is my best shot at doing it. So I'm going to cut weight. So, yeah, I mean, I basically cleaned up my diet quite a bit uh you know i i followed a meal plan um you know it was macros basically and a lot of macros and nutrient timing yeah um just followed it as strictly as possible gotcha i probably deviated from it maybe so or four or five times. So you were pretty strict and you leaned out and got to the weight you wanted.

When you started crossfitting, how much did that change? Did you start adding in more calories because of how much more energy you had? No, because my training has been pretty much almost the same. Gotcha. Yeah, like I had been doing this type of training the whole time. Yeah. So, you know, I ran a deficit throughout the whole time and then um it really

didn't change much and i actually i got back on a deficit just before this competition because i wanted to get back down to like 175 and you feel good you felt great yeah it's about this your body can your body people people probably think they need more food than they do like and i think deficit that depends on who you're asking for calories too. It's a mild deficit. Like you were doing, like 400 calories. It's not that big. It's not going to kill you.

Well, what I'm saying too is like my deficit could be a surplus depending on someone else who calculated the calories. Like it just depends. Right. So if it's that close, it's just like this is the calories I was eating, period. So I went from about 200 to 175. Gotcha. What about the food over the weekend of competition?

Did you weigh everything out and measure it then? No, I didn't weigh anything. I didn't really track anything or stick to a plan per se. I just kind of went on based on feel. Why not? Why not? Just because, I mean, i didn't want to add that stress you were out of town yeah i was out of town too and i just didn't want to add that stress of keeping up with all that shit yeah like uh a lot of competition was a little more important maybe

than you would have um you know i don't i don't know i can't say that because this is the only one i've done i mean mean, what would you do? How would I eat? Yeah. When I'm training like I am right now, so we can get into that too now that we've kind of both talked about our journey up to this point. I don't like to weigh and measure. It's pretty stressful to me. Yeah.

And I just would rather train more to kind of fill in the extra calories I ate. So I'll be honest about it. I want to be able to eat what I want, and if I have to start putting on weight, I need to exercise more. Disclaimer, Mike doesn't eat like an asshole. No, no, no. I do put on weight really easy, though. So I have to either exercise a lot more or start cutting the calories. But what about during, like, a competition?

Competition, man, it depends on the events, but for the most part, I keep the foods really, really simple. Like, baby food, deli meat. When you were doing your serious competitions, did you weigh and measure? No, no, no, not at all. I actually probably under-ate when I was competing a lot just because. Well, you don't want to eat. Just time, too, yeah.

I was drinking a lot of shakes. I was eating a lot of fatty meats just because all that stuff was just really easy to put down. Yeah, I think during a competition, especially a CrossFit competition, like what I was eating a lot of fatty meats just because, like, all that stuff was just really easy to put down. Yeah, I think during a competition, especially a CrossFit competition, like what I was saying, your adrenaline is so high. At least my – I was so amped up. The urge to eat was just not there. Yeah. You'll hear people say all the time, like,

I bonked in the competition because I ran out of fuel. I didn't eat enough. I don't think that's true at all. I think you had enough food. I think you're just out of shape. You're probably not ready for that amount of volume in a day. Seriously, though. Oh, yeah.

I mean, yeah. You know, I'm not saying you don't need calories all day long, but you don't have to eat meals in between the events. If you have a long period of time, you should probably try and get a little bit in, but otherwise, drink shakes and just you need to practice that kind of setting before you go do it. Yeah. Like, doing three bouts of exercise in a day a lot of people go do these competitions whether it's scaled or rx and they've never worked out three times in a day that's pretty shocking and stressful on the body so at least try and experiment with it before you go do

it yeah and i think too it it yeah it depends on the competition. Like, I'll be honest, like, for me, this one, so it was scaled. The team I was doing was scaled, and it really wasn't that much. Yeah, the volume seemed kind of low. Yeah, the volume was not that high. I don't think it has to be that high. I know that people want to go and get – that people want to get hurt. I mean, not hurt. People want to walk away feeling like they got crushed.

They like that feeling. People love being sore and wrecked after competitions thanks for a better story yeah but you know and it's more challenging people want to be challenged um but i don't necessarily think you need to like bury people either so i think a good balance of it i mean i think yeah in terms of like the volume it wasn't that challenging but i was definitely challenged in other ways yeah exactly that that can be perfectly fine make the events events more fun. Put some thought into it. I might go off a tangent on this, but, like, people that run some competitions,

they think, like, I've just got to bury everyone, you know? Like, that's what they're signing up and paying for. Maybe, but at the same time, like, this is health and fitness and fun, and, you know, like, people should be able to walk away and go back to their jobs on Monday and not be destroyed. That's very true. Back to nutrition for just a second. Yeah.

Did you, so you didn't take Mark Bell's advice for the competition on what to eat? What was Mark Bell's advice? I don't know, but you want to say it, so go ahead. No, I was just hoping he'd remember. I couldn't remember. We heard it in the car when we were driving. What did he say? I don't remember.

What does Mark Bell eat before? I eat that ass. I didn't hear that. There was I eat that ass. Yeah. I didn't hear this. There was no eating of ass. There was no eating of ass for the competition. There was a lot of baby food.

I ate baby food and I did just really light, easy, digestible type things because you don't want to eat some big ass heavy meal

before you try to go do a fucking walk. Or experiment with new foods or pre-workout. Did you get the PWP? I got the nervous shits like you wouldn't believe, man. I probably shat like five times like that in one day. Like, it was just, my stomach was in knots.

Like, I don't know, I guess it was just being up so much. It just, ah. Did you eat more the night before and then wake up the next day and you weren't very hungry? How did you eat more the night before and then wake up the next day and you weren't very hungry? How did you do it? I mean, we ate a pretty big meal the night after the first day and then the night before. And I ate breakfast as normally, like I normally would.

But, yeah, I mean, I think there's just the nerves. It was just constant. That's pretty common. Yeah. Man, thinking back, it's crazy how much it's changed. My first competition, I remember, like, I was following, like, zone very strict and was eating.

I was counting grapes and almonds. And I remember even the night before the competition, I was at dinner, and I got a steak and a sweet potato, and they had a roll, and I was like, oh, I can't eat that. That'll mess me up. I'll be wrecked tomorrow. Looking back, I'm like, you should have eaten the roll. You wouldn't have died.

Oh, man, I was a mess on my first comp. But competing is fun. Crossfit competitions are fun. You learn a lot about yourself. Yeah, you definitely – especially if you do a team, like there's a lot of communication involved in it. Like we were not that practiced in that. But you just got to learn from that when you're working with a team.

You got to make calls, like, on the floor. Like you're working with a team you got to make calls on the floor you're going to need somebody to take charge somebody's going to need to be the leader and don't have four leaders have one person saying it and everybody else just needs to and having that understanding beforehand

so that the communication is more smooth you have one person that has the ideas and this like, this is our plan and everyone trusts it, it goes a lot smoother. Yeah. And a big thing about competing, too, is just, like, there are going to be irregularities with judging and shit is going to happen. Like, it is not going to be – you're not going to have, like, a perfect competition.

Yeah. These are volunteers. These guys are there doing it for free. Yeah. Like, there's not going to be – I not going to have like a perfect yeah these are volunteers these guys are there doing it for free yeah like there's not going to be i saw i saw a lot of people yeah i mean they get pissed off like at their judge or whatever but if that happens you just kind of got to be like all right what's going on it's already done anyway like well even even during even during the workout like if you're getting no rep no rep no rep you just need to be like all right what am I doing? Explain to me what I'm doing.

Because getting mad or getting frustrated, it's just only going to waste time. That happens on the highest level. Even watch CrossFit Games athletes. The good athletes calm down in the moment. Everything else is shut off, and they're literally stopping having a conversation with the judge going, what am I doing wrong? What do I need to fix? And then they fix it.

That is a lot smoother, and it gets fixed a lot faster. Oh, yeah. Yeah. The chaotic, the ones that are, I mean, it's not bad. I'm just saying like they have crazy high stress or just yelling. They're like, they're not freaking out. They're getting attacked, you know. Even psychologically, if you just were nice to that judge and said,

what do I need to fix? They're probably just going to be nicer on your reps than if you're an asshole. Treat your judge like it's Comcast customer service. If you call them with a bad attitude and start yelling, they're going to keep no rep in the shit out of you. What did you say to them today? You got Comcast? You said something?

Oh, they said, we'd like to check your credit. Oh, you pass for, you don't have to pay a fee up front. You have great credit. And I was like, because I'm a fucking baller. You said that to them? Yeah. Yeah. I was totally kidding.

That's so funny. Yeah, I mean, and it's just, it's all about, and the other thing was just make the rep count. Like, make the rep count. If you have to go slower or, you know, take your time with a movement to, like, make the rep count, that's still faster than getting no reps. Yeah, integrity in your training will pay off. So what's next, man? You did the team comp.

You got the itch. You just signed up for an individual. Oh, I know. Training going to change now? What's up? Well, it already is team comp. You got the itch. You just signed up for an individual. Oh, I know. Training going to change now? What's up? Well, it already is changed. I just got my new programming. I'm going to do Battle of the Barbells in Murfreesboro in November.

It's a great competition. Yeah, you've done it? I've never done it. I've been there several times. That's my old stomping ground. That's where I started CrossFit. I think it's November 19th or 20th or something like that. I'm doing an RX this time.

Very cool. So I did it scaled this time just to get a little taste. I definitely wanted a little bit more of a challenge. I've got to learn some new skills. I've got to get my pistols and I've got to get some handstand walks. Got my coach. He's on board. We're going to practice that stuff. But right now, focus is going to be on my thing. This time I noticed you asked me about the training I was doing. It was a lot of aerobic work. But what I noticed is that I can pace, and I have enough discipline not to go to this, like, dark place, red line zone.

But I'm bad at going fast. Like, I can't. I did a Bergeron beep test. You know what familiar with that is? Yes. Tell the folks that. I don't remember it. You're CrossFit. You remember it.

It's like thrusters, pull-ups, and burpees. Yes. And it's an EMOM. It's an EMOM. I think it's seven of each. Seven of each. Every minute on the minute. You get a minute.

You go as far as you can. I got one round. And so I have no ability to go hard and in this anaerobic type zone i can do the pacing very well and the deep full breathing stuff but i need to work on being able to go fast gotcha so uh or faster gotcha go in that hurt zone yeah yeah yeah so um leading into that also um what did you learn from this past one that you'll kind of apply to this upcoming individual comp? I don't know.

Like in your training, what will be different? Will you, you know, push a little harder? Will you be more diligent learning the skills that you know are up and coming? I definitely do plan on practicing skills a lot more. Maybe picking up the speed. I did a lot of things very, very slow and deliberately during training just because that was what was called for, and I don't think I pushed myself as hard as I could have.

Gotcha. So I think I definitely am going to push myself a little bit harder, maybe a lot harder, especially on these conditioning workouts. Gotcha. Uh, so I think I definitely am going to push myself a little bit harder, uh, maybe a lot harder, especially on these, on these, in these conditioning workouts. Gotcha. Cool. I mean, you've got some, some workouts, you just gotta be able to go in that hurt place and dig it out because that's just what the, that's the sports, what you signed up for. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So I need to get used to that pain. Cause I have like almost zero pain tolerance right now. Make some more caffeine. Yeah. Like if you asked me to to that pain because I have like almost zero pain tolerance right now. Make some more caffeine. Yeah, like if you asked me to do a Fran, I'd probably just run away.

You did a Fran recently. What was her time? Maybe like 3.30 or something like that. It wasn't bad, but oh my God. You probably have video of it. I was just on the floor crying. No, it's on the intro of one of these episodes. If you go back, it's just him on the floor for a long time. It was awful.

And that feeling just, oh, it scares me. Yeah, I mean, you can adapt to that. That pain tolerance, you learn that and you can make progress in that. You just get a little bit more comfortable each week digging into that hole and getting more comfortable with that pain. Is that kind of your – like you like that stuff. I mean, not right now. Right now anything that intense really messes me up

because, I mean, I took basically the summer off of any conditioning. And then the last two years, I've only been training for grid. So, I have not been doing any of that middle ground training for CrossFit for, like, almost three years now. So, I'm working with my coach now. We're kind of building back up. And I want to be able to do some team competitions. I'm actually going to do one in October with two other buddies of mine. Yeah.

It's a good way to, again, like, I think it's so important to pick competitions, even if it's not perfect. Just picking something because now I just have this new, yeah, I just have this new purpose in training, you know, and it's, I take it that much more serious. Yeah. I don't do well with not having a training goal. I'm the same way. Yeah. Like for this weird period between when I finished the weightlifting meet and then trying to come up with a new goal. I'm the same way. Yeah, like for this weird period between when I finished the weightlifting meet and then trying to come up with a new goal, we basically did numbered training sessions where it was like 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and I would just kind of cycle through them based on how I felt.

And, you know, it feels good that I'm touching on everything. What I mean by touching on everything is like it's a good mix of all different types of training. Touching on everything? No. Too far, too far? Yeah, but now that we have a good goal in mind, it's very clear what I'm aiming towards, and I just want to go crush that.

Yeah, I'm the same way, dude. I like competing. I enjoy competing. I think training without competing, I wrote this yesterday on my wall, because people were like, oh, you pit the bug. I'm like, well, I just like competing. Training without competing to me is silly because you don't have anything to test yourself or challenge yourself or give yourself new things to shoot for. Have y'all met anyone who's really good that doesn't compete or doesn't

have that? Yeah, I know a lot of athletes that honestly were in CrossFit for several years and were really good at it, but took themselves out of it because they don't like the stress of competition. They just like being really good in the gym. They just like doing things that they're really good at. And I even know some team athletes that have competed at the CrossFit Games that honestly didn't even have fun doing it. They're just really good at it and kind of ended up there, but don't like the stress of it, don't like the pressure.

They just want to go in the gym and do what they're good at, and I think that's perfectly fine. That's perfectly fine. That's a little different, I guess. So that's someone who did compete and then got out of it. Okay. Yeah. Do you know anybody who, who, uh, like is just really bad-ass and didn't ever compete for like a goal? Not necessarily off top of my head, but I mean, I'm sure there's someone, but you can't, you can't. Yeah. I can't, I can't think of anyone. What about you, Alex? Uh, I don't think so. I don't think I know. We're

not saying that there's no one, but I was just curious if you all knew anybody. I can't name anybody off the top of my head just because, I mean, if you're training and you recognize your skill, like you're probably going to want to put it to the test. Like most people, I think, would want to do that. There's a lot of – I'm sure there's a lot of dudes out there and ladies too that are fitness badasses that don't necessarily believe in competition or sport, that like to just train in their gym and do whatever else on their own

and have their own metrics of what fitness is. I think that's awesome. Yeah. I mean, I've heard this before. It's like, well, I just want to compete with myself and whatever. That's totally fine. But you still need to give yourself some kind of objective standard. Yeah.

And there really isn't anything like competing because you don't control. You don't have any control over it. It's you now performing. So put your training to the test. That's what it's about. Yeah, I tried that for a while, the competing against myself, and I still kind of go back to that sometimes

when I finish a comp or it wasn't fulfilling. However, I always end up like, well, this just isn't stressful enough, meaning it doesn't push me enough. It's too easy for me to kind of bail out on it. And I just don't care that much. Even if I lose, even if I'm not really that good, or come in last, like people are afraid, I don't want to come in last. Like, okay, well, you still did it. And now you know what you need to do to not come in last. Like, just, I don't know. Hashtag your laps ahead of everyone on the couch.

Right, exactly. I mean, I just think that if you train anything, and CrossFit is a sport, you should fucking compete. That's how I think it should be. That's how he feels. That's how I feel. That's how he feels. That's how I feel.

Cool. Anything else you want to add? This has been fun. Man, I don't know. TTP? No. Well, we really want to thank Silverline PVC for being my foot massager. We also want to thank the movie Free Willy.

We want to thank Fit Age for keeping me cool this whole time. For real, though. It's delicious. I don't know, guys. Anything else? Shrugged Trank Challenge? Shrugged Trank Test? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Go check out our programs. Like CTP was saying earlier, this podcast is brought to you by all the people in our online training programs. What's up, guys? Thank you very much. You guys make it happen. And these dudes are actually coaching there. You're a coach. Yeah, we coach in there.

He's a coach. McElroy's a coach. Kurt Mulligan's a coach. Everybody gets a coach. Real coach. Everybody's a coach. Oprah. Oprah. I never watch them. Everybody's a coach. Oprah. Oprah.

I never watch them. Alright guys, thank you very much for watching. Peace.