Barbell Shrugged - The Number One Way to Build Muscle, Gut Health Bro Science, Using Tempo Training to Break Plateaus w/ Anders Varner, Doug Larson, and Travis Mash - Barbell Shrugged #439

Episode Date: February 10, 2020

In this episode of Barbell Shrugged, Anders, Doug, and Travis discuss:   The extreme basics to understanding gut health. How to use tempos to bust through plateaus How long should you be in a hypertrophy phase Post Activation Potentiation for hypertrophy Using bands and chains for loading muscle and decreasing load How to build a base of strength in a year long program And more…   Anders Varner on Instagram   Doug Larson on Instagram   Travis Mash on Instagram   TRAINING PROGRAMS   One Ton Challenge   One Ton Strong - 8 Weeks to PR your snatch, clean, jerk, squat, deadlift, and bench press   20 REP BACK SQUAT PROGRAM - Giant Legs and a Barrell Core   8 Week Snatch Cycle - 8 Weeks to PR you Snatch   Aerobic Monster - 12 week conditioning, long metcons, and pacing strategy   Please Support Our Sponsors   “Save $20 on High Quality Sleep Aid at Momentous livemomentous.com/shrugged us code “SHRUGGED20” at checkout.   US Air Force Special Operations - http://airforce.com/specialops   Organifi - Save 20% using code: “Shrugged” at organifi.com/shrugged   PRx Performance - http://prxperformance.com use code “shrugged” to save 5%   ------------------------------------------------------------------ Show notes at: http://www.shruggedcollective.com/bbs-ep439 ------------------------------------------------------------------   ► Subscribe to Barbell Shrugged's Channel Here ► Subscribe to Shrugged Collective's Channel Here http://bit.ly/BarbellShruggedSubscribe 📲 🎧 Listen to the audio version on the Apple Podcast App or Stitcher for Android Here- http://bit.ly/BarbellShruggedApple http://bit.ly/BarbellShruggedStitcher Shrugged Collective is a network of fitness, health and performance shows that help people achieve their physical and mental health goals.  Usually in the gym, but outside as well. In 2012 they posted their first Barbell Shrugged podcast and have been putting out weekly free videos and podcasts ever since. Along the way we've created successful online coaching programs including The Shrugged Strength Challenge, The Muscle Gain Challenge, FLIGHT, Barbell Shredded, and Barbell Bikini. We're also dedicated to helping affiliate gym owners grow their businesses and better serve their members by providing owners tools and resources like the Barbell Business Podcast. Find Shrugged Collective and their flagship show Barbell Shrugged here: SUBSCRIBE ON ITUNES ► http://bit.ly/ShruggedCollectiveiTunes WEBSITE ► https://www.ShruggedCollective.com INSTAGRAM ► https://instagram.com/shruggedcollective FACEBOOK ► https://facebook.com/barbellshruggedpodcast TWITTER ► http://twitter.com/barbellshrugged

CrossFit West Richland. I just got off the phone with the owner over at CrossFit West Richland and they have 50 people already signed up for the One Ton Challenge at their gym. Athletes at their gym following One Ton Strong, setting PRs. Makes me so happy to see profitable gyms bringing our events, bringing the One Ton Challenge, bringing One Ton Strong eight-week program into their gym, getting people fired up to do the snatch, clean jerk, squat, deadlift, and bench. Gym owners, if you would like to host the One Ton Challenge, I need you to send me an email at anders at farbellshrug.com right now. We're coming up on double digits in gyms right now that are going to be running the challenge in 2020. I ran about seven of them last year, not to mention the CrossFit

Games and Mr. Olympia, which are like the big highlights of my life. We did it over in Sweden and we had about 60 athletes run through it at CrossFit Homestead. Look, if you're looking for cool ways to engage your members and you're not interested in throwing just another CrossFit competition, which there's probably 75 of them going on in your state this weekend, do something new. Do something cool. Get everybody in your gym lifting big, heavy, strong weights and having fun together and send me an email.

Anders at barbellshrug.com. We will get you set up with the one-ton challenge. I'm so excited to see how quickly we're able to make these gyms profitable. CrossFit West Richland is going to do a five-digit number, and it's going to cost them about an afternoon, a morning on a Saturday. And I'm so stoked to be able to facilitate some of the systems and marketing that we've used to get the One-Ton Challenge out to the world in their gym and they've got athletes coming from different states multiple hours away it's just such a cool thing to separate

yourself in the market and actually get people strong actually have a fun event that's different than everything else that's going on in your city, in your town, in your state. One-time challenge. So send me an email, anders at barbellshrug.com, and we will get you taken care of. Today is another show with Coach Travis Mash, Doug Larson, and myself rapping about strength. Coming to you two days a week. We're having big coaching shows on Monday with Mash, myself, and Doug.

And then on Wednesdays with our big guests that we go out, travel the world, and bring them to you, the smartest people. We're going to take a break to thank our sponsors in the middle. Let's get into the show. Welcome to Barbells for Rock. I'm Anders Varner, Doug Larson,

Coach Travis Mash in the house. We're at Mash Elite Performance. I feel like we just had like – we didn't even get to Max Out Friday yet. I feel like we've already been hanging out with the strongest youth lifters. Like we've had – it's international. We had an international kid back there today. How do all these kids show up here? You know, I don't know how I started coaching so many international athletes.

It just happened. But it definitely is my favorite thing that I'm doing. That cat from New Zealand is fast. Fast. I like watching him. Give him a shout out on here. Who's that? Isaac Logon. He's a team New Zealand guy. I didn't even get to see him lift.

What? No. Where the fuck were you for like two hours? I was with the other kid that was 14 years old. He was stronger than me. He made me look terrible. Timo lifts. Yeah. He's about to go to Argentina for Team USA

at this thing they're doing. When I started talking crap to him, as soon as he walked in, I was like, dude, I'll lift with you. I was like, we're doing snatch balance triples. I was like,

what are you going to get today? He was like, oh, I don't know. Typical like teenager. Like, maybe. I was like, well, I'm going to hit like 100. That'd be a good day today. He was like, oh, I don't know. Typical, like, teenager. Like, I'm fine, maybe. I was like, well, I'm going to hit, like, 100. That would be a good day today.

He was like, oh, I was going to hit, like, 120, I thought. I was like, oh, okay. You're – Yeah, like – It's like body weight in half. Somehow your 28-inch waist is significantly stronger than me. That kid is a lot like Morgan. He's, like, tall and lanky but strong.

Yeah. Yeah. Like, he's like – you don't see him coming. No. And then he looks for you. No. If he walked by Yeah. He's like, you don't see him coming. No. No, if he walked by in the grocery store, I would think nothing of him. He just dominated. He did youth nationals a few months ago and dominated.

What's his national clean and jerk? I'm pretty sure he's somewhere around 115 and then 50, like 145 or 50 clean and jerk. He's 15, so he's a 15-year-old youth. What's he weigh? He's 81. So he's way too skinny. He's got to gain some weight.

81? What's he, like 5'11"? He's fairly tall. No, he's 6-something. He's Morgan's height. I think he's taller than Morgan. I think he's like 6'1". Oh, yeah.

I feel like that kid could eat like 4,000 calories a day, though, and not gain a pound. He needs to eat 5,000. Yeah. You got to figure that math out, brother, and eat more than that. Yeah. He needs to live uncomfortable for the next like five years at a minimum. Our strength coach at Ablash has said, because, you know, most of us were always trying to gain weight. And he said, if you're walking around and you're not trying to hold back vomit,

then you haven't eaten enough. And so literally, I mean, I took it to heart. I'd be walking to class like holding it back, like gagging the whole way to class. This is the best. So Doug last night sits down on my couch. My wife, Ashton, she looks at him. She goes, what's in the bowl? He goes, oh, some ground beef.

She goes, is that it? He goes, and some walnuts. He's eating them with a spoon. Ground beef and walnuts. Ground beef and walnuts, huh? Sounds awesome, actually. Delicious, right? It was great.

Yeah, delicious. Such a meathead meal. And I was telling him the story. I might throw some sauce in there. Like he has a pesto or something. Something, yeah. That's a home run. I'm a guest in someone's house.

I just raided his fridge and took the minimum. So she had a friend over on Sunday night, and I sat down. It was like 9 o'clock or whatever. I just needed to eat something, and I made like three eggs, a cup of egg whites, and I put a bunch of sauerkraut on there because I assume I need some good gut health. And she looked at me, and she goes, what are you eating? And I was like, well, it's like some eggs and sauerkraut on there because I assume I need some good gut health. And she looked at me and she goes, what are you eating? And I was like, well, it's like some eggs and sauerkraut.

She goes, that sounds disgusting. And I looked at her and I was like, yeah, I guess it does. But at no point in me making this meal did I think about what it tastes like. I only thought about the macronutrients. I would need to hit a specific number for what I consider to be a good meal. But taste never crossed my mind. How important is gut health? That is a place of nutrition I have not gone.

Well, it's like the brain of the lower. It controls a lot. The belly. Just think about, here's how I try to explain it. This is a rabbit hole that a real scientist could go down forever. Okay. When you eat something, there's an entire environment in your gut, in your stomach, filled with billions of bacteria and you have the option when you eat

something to feed the really positive bacteria inside your gut or you can feed the negative bacteria inside your gut and if you feed the bad ones long enough it creates an incredible amount of problems in your life from i mean literally from anything or if you just feed the good ones the good ones continue that it's like little armies in there would that be like a very basic way that was like that was bro science city right there that was awesome do you yeah well that's how i try to explain it to people. Well, to the layman. Explain gut health because I don't really know all the actual science of what bacteria is in there. Do you eat sauerkraut?

What's it, kombucha? What is it? I do, yeah. I eat a lot of fermented foods. You do? I don't know that really any more detailed than you just laid out. There's good bacteria and bad bacteria, and you want to feed the good ones 100%. Beer is fermented. Beer is fermented.

Ah, there you go. Beat the system right now. Dude, kombucha, there's certain kombuchas at Whole Foods that you have to be 21 to buy. Sweet, there you go. So if I drink beer, am I feeding my good gut health? Because if so, I have great gut health. Actually, I mean, I wonder

at some level if there's any truth to that. Obviously, there's the downside of drinking too much beer but like i wonder if we're siloing that one particular potential benefit of if fermented beer specifically actually contributes to to some positive gut health at some level i don't know i think of here's here's the story that made me go oh oh, shit, gut health is really important. I went down to Mexico for a bachelor party. I kept it relatively good, just alcohol, no water. Right.

And until the last day, yeah, I didn't get sick until the last day. I went to the last day. I went and got an iced coffee from Starbucks, and the ice was just loaded with trash. So I got home and I'd never been so sick. Like it was, it was coming out. It was, it was awful. And I started doing research on like Montezuma's revenge. Like what is going on with me? Like I'm dying. I'm four days into this thing. Nothing's getting better. And four days. Oh, it would have gone on forever. And until I started reading, like what exactly is happening and it was like well you've basically digested poop from another country through ice and the bacteria is now in your stomach and it's like waging a war so everything you eat is you're

losing and you're losing hardcore yeah so everything you eat like the bad bacteria in your gut is just it's just getting rid of it like you're just eliminating good bacteria there so i was like okay well how do i get good bacteria so i just learned about probiotics and i went to the grocery store and they have like normal human bacteria like probiotics and then there's like women's health and then there's old people and then there's like you're almost about to die and your one pill is like 90 billion good bacteria and i was like give me that one so i just started hammering probiotics next day i woke up 100 i'm solid then took the next day off felt like trash started loading

back up on probiotics the next day 100 now i'm like just every day just overload your body with good gut bacteria and that's what kind of like the way you talk about my bro science it's kind of like there's a billion different there's billions of different types of guts or bacteria in your gut so if you just think if I can eat vegetables and I can eat fermented foods, I'm overloading and feeding the good ones versus eating a bunch of sugar, which is just going to exponentially grow the bad ones. Right. And just try and build the army in your favor as much as possible.

I feel like if you're getting outside a lot and you're not using too much antibacterial soaps, you're not taking a lot of antibiotics, and then you're eating a lot of fruits and vegetables, and fiber is what feeds in a lot of ways, what feeds the good bacteria. So if you're eating a lot of fiber, then you're feeding your good bacteria. Yeah, I feel like I do all that. Yeah, then I think you're in a pretty good spot. I think if, say, you take some antibiotics and it kind of just kills all the good bacteria in your gut all the bacteria not just good good and bad but you're trying to replenish the good by eating some probiotics

i think there's some diversity issues that you get with that like if there's many i don't know how many different types of bacteria are actually in your stomach but there's there's certainly hundreds probably thousands probably more right and uh but when you take a probiotic pill you get like six different types and so you're replenishing something good um but it's not not like a true replacement it's a band-aid at best and so like avoiding antibiotics and whatnot is is a really good place to start i've always done that just in my immune system if you can avoid them. There are many instances when antibiotics are very important for you to take. That is my last, like, stitch. If I cannot get better, I'll get that.

I try to fight it off. Because I want my own immune system to do its job. Because if you're always feeding. Plus, if you keep taking antibiotics, I mean, your body starts to adapt to all that. And then that doesn't work anymore. So even with breastfeeding, when I was learning about breast milk to me is one of the coolest things ever. Because it changes. Every time your daughter or your child goes to the boob, the breast milk changes.

There's a different formula. So when a baby is first born, there's a protein that is in breast milk that babies cannot digest. And doctors had no idea why this enzyme or protein existed until they realized that the baby drinks it. It feeds the bacteria in your gut. It's actually not for human human consumption it's only to feed the bacteria and the way that your body communicates to the boob what your gut needs is through saliva so your saliva communicates to the nipple telling the breath telling the mammary gland or wherever like what to produce what your body needs when you're five days old. What's the best way to survive?

And it's producing this protein to fill your gut with as many quality bacteria as possible to start fighting disease instantly. How good would it be? What if a grown-up did breast milk? Have you ever tried breast milk? Yeah. Have you? I did. I've totally tasted it.

I didn't have any. I haven't subs totally tasted it. I didn't have any. I haven't subsisted on it. I didn't have any. I've tasted it. My curiosity got me. It's very sweet. Yeah, it's very sweet. It's like honey almost.

Really? See, I thought that I would definitely try it, and then the baby showed up, and I was like, what? I see you get a little sick after a glass or two. After you shotgun a bottle. I had to know. My curiosity got the best of me. Yeah, I was super curious before, and then it showed up, and I was like, I'm not really into that at all.

I didn't even remotely consider it. I'm into some weird stuff, I guess. Dude, I saw this thing. I forget exactly where I saw this, but it was the Google search results in India. When you type in, in India, if you type in, I want my wife to, the number one Google search result that auto-populates and pops up is, my wife to breastfeed me. Was this like an internet meme or was this real? I don't know.

I don't know. That's so good. But I heard that somewhere and I was like, what? Is that fucking real? Yeah. It's like a specific India fetish or something very specific

I mean I had to know yeah yeah my wife I hope she doesn't listen to this episode yeah I mean

there's definitely my wife will text her yeah huh my wife will text her yeah Marcia my wife's trash she listens to all

the episodes yeah she'll be like Drew do you know what they were talking about yeah

dude one of the things that comes up in the in the group a lot we get a lot of questions about this and I think it's like, so by Drew, do you know what they were talking about? Yeah. Dude, one of the things that comes up in the, in the group a lot, we get a lot of questions about this and I think it's a, to, to people that have been in the weight room and training for a long time, it becomes almost second nature to us and it never ceases to amaze me how many people have not used or not comfortable with tempos. And I want to spend time just kind of breaking down why we use them, ways that we can use them to work on weaknesses.

A lot of the pieces of mobility, stability, creating explosiveness, putting yourself in a deficit or putting yourself in a bad position where weaknesses are and how we can increase strength using them and proper ways to implement them into a program. That's a whole lot of things. We can start back at the beginning, but we get this question a lot, specifically on the One Ton Challenge program that you wrote. I've used tempos tons. I actually feel like I use them more now than I did when I was training really hard because I love the way that almost the hypertrophy that comes along with a lot of it, especially in working a lot of negatives and just time under tension.

But when you are just kind of at the very basic level, can you just walk us through what goes on in your head? First number, keeping it very simple and just how we write out tempos, what they mean from the concentric, bottom position, eccentric. Did I get that right? Yeah, you did. Well, it goes eccentric, down pause, up pause, concentric. And then the top pause.

Yeah, didn't sound right when it came out. And then let's just start there, and we'll roll through that. So, I mean, I'll tell you the reason. Eccentric, controlling the eccentric is important for several reasons. One, a lot of weightlifters are super hypermobile, and so they don't have a really a lot of decelerating qualities to their body. And so, like, that is a big risk of injury. You know, like, for example, Hannah, the girl you saw who's a really good, the 16-year-old who's so good.

You know, she, we did a lot of eccentric work with her. And because there was for a long time, her squat was stalled. And so I started reading Triphasic Training, you know, he's been on your show too, right? Caldeets. Yeah, yeah. And so we started using, you know, so we started using his program a little bit. Not completely, but we definitely applied the concentric phases. And it was the first thing that really shot her out of this plateau.

Because she was so hypermobile and she had no deceleration qualities in her body. So for one, it helped her to decelerate and to stabilize the joints which is like you know if you have no uh deceleration or like you don't have the ability or the mechanics to decelerate you're definitely at a very high risk of injury yeah the joints the hips the knees and so um one of the things i want from athletes is when they get older when they get my age not to be as beat up as I am. So I'm trying to help stabilize and avoid a lot of these senseless injuries, especially because these guys are so young. They have 15 years left on their career.

So that's one. But two is, yeah, the centric, especially the centric contraction, which is the lengthening process of the muscle. There's a lot of good hypertrophic qualities to that, meaning it's just a really good way to add muscle size. And there's only two ways to get strong. You can either make a muscle bigger, which makes a bigger, stronger muscle, or get better at the movement.

That's the only two things you can change. Now, there are other things that affect strength, but there's nothing you can do about it. i can't affect my limb lengths or my you know my muscle fiber types or you know the way my you know my muscles you know where they attach and where they originate there's nothing to do about that but i can do something about hypertrophy and i can do something about um getting good at a movement another thing slowing it down too allows you to really focus on the position so like on a front squat so you know if i if i go slow say a five centric is a very typical you know eccentric

tempo that i might use i can really practice on sitting straight down keeping a vertical torso you know when you're just going through the motions a lot of times you do it mindlessly you're not thinking about it when you go slow you can think about all right sit my butt in between my heels you know make sure my my knees are tracking with my first two toes i really believe that's the reason that i mean i don't know if you've been following along but it's literally 100 on squat cycle the first eight weeks every single person is pr'd after eight weeks i got a lot of good feedback from 20 pounds to 100 pounds in eight weeks. It's insane. But I think that the front squats with the tempo, the three seconds down, is the number one reason why that's happening.

We're doing it. We're testing back squats, but we're training with front squats, and we're using the three-second count on the way down. And I think that the reason that we're hitting 100 on the first mess or first two messos is so many people go into the gym they back squat and they start at the top they're at the bottom and they stand up and they don't think about anything that happened in the middle mindlessly bounce out of the bottom and like they don't control it they don't think about yeah where their knees going where they're sitting and every time it depends upon where you're at and who your coach is,

but the majority of coaches are going to say roughly send your hips back, push your knees out, and sit all the way down. Right. There's nobody talking about stability. Right. Nobody's talking about a bottom position, how strong are you in the bottom of the hole, and what does the movement look like

on the way down because if it's out of line and it's you got a hip shift on the way down things are going to be jacked up you're not actually going to be able to get stronger just rewiring really poor movement patterns right so when you add that tempo and it's three seconds no one ever thinks about like what is three seconds on the way down? Yeah. It's a lot longer. Yeah, but instead of just going boom, boom, and bouncing, you're, like, controlling it. So you're getting that eccentric deceleration phase, and you're really focusing on what you're doing. The isometric contraction is probably my favorite because the number one way to strengthen a joint at a specific angle is with isometric contraction. So if you really want to get strong in the bottom, where we all need to be because when you catch a big clean you got to be or snatch when you catch a big

snatch or clean in the bottom i got to be in a good strong sturdy position to receive the weight you know because then you got it's a force absorption which no one talks a lot about everybody talks about producing force producing power but nobody talks about like absorbing that force so you get a very good strong position you get the hips and the ankles and the knees and the spine strong and stabilized in that very bottom position well it's going to definitely help your clean and your and or your yeah well especially if you don't catch it in an absolutely perfect position where you get a nice clean bounce right and like you get stuck down there for a second now you got it now you have to come out of the hole from a from a static isometric and you got to be strong and one thing

people don't talk about is this is that if the athlete who can lift the longest without injury is eventually going to win yeah like um if you take two people starting at the exact same time you know and they're relatively the same even if one guy's a little bit stronger guy or girl is a little bit stronger than the other person if the other person can stay longer injury-free, they're going to win eventually. I mean, that's really, at the end of the day, what happened to me as a power lifter is I did not start out as strong as I do in the world. But over the 10-year career, I then eventually became. Right.

It's like Warren Buffett. One of his primary principles is don't lose money. Yeah. That'd be great. If you go up, up, and up, and then you crash, and then you try to get up, and up, and up, and then you crash, that's a different thing. But if it's athletics, it's stronger, stronger, stronger, injury.

Getting back to where you were, maybe a little stronger, injury. That's a great point. And that's one that people don't get. Even a big honor I've ever had is Dave Hoff, who's a great power lifter who just totaled 3,100 or whatever. Wait, is that his third time over 3,000? Yeah. God.

I didn't know he was over 3,000. I knew he was over three a couple times. And I will say this. His deadlift was perfect. I watched his benches just today. It's hard to argue. They were beautiful benches. His squat, I saw, is iffy.

It's always a little iffy. But, like, still, yeah. You're pushing the boundaries, man. You're playing a sport with 1,200 pounds on your back. Yeah. So, anyway, so somebody was interviewing him. God. And he said that, like, I remember meeting him when I was at my prime.

He was just a young boy. But he was at Westside when he was 14. So, he was coming to see the WPO, and he asked me, he came up to me. So funny now that he's the man, and he's like, you know, do you have any advice for me? And I told him to look at powerlifting as a marathon and not a sprint. And so, meaning, if I just get a little bit better every year, eventually nobody's going to be close to you.

Yeah. One thing, I mean, Ronnie Coleman didn't win his first Mr. Olympia until he was like 35 or something. I remember. In the documentary, he was like, it takes a long time to make a world-class body. I was like, you're the man. I love you. I remember seeing him the year before he won the Olympia, and when I saw him, I remember

being like, why is this guy not winning the Olympia? And then sure enough, the next year he won. But when I met him i remember being like why is this guy not winning the olympia and then sure enough the next year he won when i met him he was yeah i think it was 1999 when i met him he was giant his arms were so big i remember because they were all there it was at the arnold classics yeah i met him i'm like why is who is beating this guy is my question but of course the next year nobody was beating him yeah, dude, the plate of chicken he eats in that documentary, when he's still a cop after he's won Olympia like four times, that plate of chicken is no joke. You know he's eating like six of those a day, too.

I wonder why he continued to be a cop. Did he really enjoy being a cop that much, or was he just like trying to keep a steady job? Well, you won Olympia. What is it, like 25 grand back in the day? No. No. Even when he was still like 200, 250,000.

Wasn't? He was a good baby. He had sponsors giving him way more money than that, too. I know, right? Like photo shoots and all that shit. He wasn't hurting for money, no way. But I bet his train of thought was like, well, this is a steady job. That's what I like to do.

Benefits. Yeah. That's the time when you get pulled over. Imagine if Ronnie Coleman, dude, just shredded, shows up. You're like, ah, fuck. Whatever you say, sir. Let me give you the flip side of that. What if that's the dude

who busts you for steroids? I'd be like, all right. I'd be like, come on. Ronnie Coleman uncovers the biggest steroid bust in Texas history.

What an injustice. That's right. I'd be like, no, this is not right. How did you know there were steroids in there? He's like,

ah. I know where all the steroids are. I know everyone that has them. Dude, when they said that. I know all the people. It's Metroflex, right? Did he train that? Dude, they said when he walked into Metroflex, there's a video. You've watched the documentary, haven't you? I've seen a couple.

Have you watched it? No. Unbelievable. Oh, my God. The new one or the old one? The new one. I've seen the new one. Unbelievable is like. It was kind of depressing. Yeah, it's definitely depressing. Unbelievable is not depressing at all. Oh, my God. The new one or the old one? The new one. I've seen the new one. Unbelievable is like...

It was kind of depressing, but... Yeah, it's definitely depressing. Unbelievable is not depressing at all. That's fucking amazing. Incredible. The new one is depressing. If you love Ronnie. Yeah.

I do. How do you not? When he... When they have like video of him showing up like before, like early training days, and he's got like the spandex on his legs,, and the veins are popping through the spandex. Yeah! You imagine. That guy is no joke, even without the juice.

He did powerlifting before bodybuilding, right? Did you ever see him in the powerlifting world? No, but I saw Johnny O'Jackson in the powerlifting world. We competed against each other at the same meet. I mean, clearly I beat him. But still, I remember, even though I was winning, I remember looking at him thinking, I might win, but you look so much cooler than me.

You look great. You're so shredded. He was just sitting there where you wait to go. And I just remember seeing him. He just had mounds of muscle on top of muscle. I remember like, I'd almost take second if I could lift like that. I would totally give you 200 pounds of my back squat for 8% of your body fat. I think bodybuilders just look so cool.

They look like real live superheroes. They look like Ninja Turtle. They do. But yet they're real. You don't realize how, like, well, hold on. When we were at Olympia this year, we saw the guy from Texas. What was his name? Flex?

Oh, Flex Wheeler. No, it wasn't Flex Wheeler. The guy that fell off the horse in Ben Pekulski's documentary. Oh, yes, we did. And he did not look giant at all. I don't know if he was just off training, off juice. Yeah, yeah. What's his name?

He trains at Metro Flex, too. I know exactly what you're talking about, but I'm blanking out. Why do you? yeah. What's his name? He trains at Metroplex, too. I know exactly what you're talking about, but I'm blanking out. Why do? I can't remember. Baldhead. I almost had it. Fell off the – oh, man, this is brutal. But, yeah, we saw him, and he was not – there's people in your gym that look bigger than him.

That's like when I saw Lee Priest. Like, he was not an enormous human. He had enormous muscles, but he wasn't a very than him. That's like when I saw Lee Priest. He was not an enormous human. He had enormous muscles, but he wasn't a very big person. He's like 5'4". Yeah, he's very short. He's short. I mean, so is Ed Cohn, though. But those guys, when they stand up there, though, man, it's freaky.

That was what was so cool about Ronnie. He was just so giant. I just love it. I just love the way they look. I love bodybuilding. Juice or no juice, it just looks cool like the first i don't know about you guys but i'm the first thing that got me in the weightlifting was lou frigno i was watching the incredible hulk when i was a kid and uh i just never even thought that there's a real person you know i

don't know what i was thinking as a kid and then my uncle was like yeah that's uh lou frigno i'm like what do you mean that's lou frigno i mean that's a real person and it blew me away that that is a real human being that looks like that yeah and i was like what do you mean he's like oh yeah he's a bodybuilder he starts telling me all this stuff i'm like what can i do that you know so like that's literally that's what got me started like yeah you can go to the gym and start lifting weights and get bigger and stronger i'm like oh yeah well yeah i'll just do that forever yeah it wasn't a power lifting that got me in the or weightlifting it was it was a bodybuilder lou ferreira right it looks cool yeah i remember in college like off-season football like for about

two or three months me and my buddy ken we would do the the ronnie i'm sure this is not ronnie's workout as if he only has one workout he ever did but like you know out of a bodybuilding magazine we pulled the r Coleman workout routine. It was like six days a week, kind of structured like legs press pull, legs press pull throughout the week, plus a ton of volume, a lot of assistance work, et cetera, et cetera. And I fucking loved it. I loved going to the gym six days a week and doing two-hour workouts.

You back squat five sets of ten, then you fucking lunge five sets of ten, then you do already else five sets of ten. It was just tons of volume. Tons of volume. And we'd put on like 20 pounds. Sure you would it was awesome like a lot of power lifters and by and power even a lot of weightlifters could learn from that just doing a season you know like even ed cone like in his off season he was smart and if i'd listened to him i think my career would have yeah a lot longer. He only did two meets per year. He did the senior nationals and he did the worlds, and that was it. So when the worlds were over, it was off-season.

And he would do bodybuilding. And, like, I don't know if you ever saw him when he was at his prime. That dude was jacked. I mean, I remember him being in the Flex magazine. Am I Ed? Yeah, Ed Cohn with Dorian Yates. They were side by side and they were comparing

the best power lifter, best bodybuilder and his back was as good as Dorian Yates'. It was huge. His back was huge. Dorian was a monster. And Dorian,

he's one of my favorite too. Dorian's like known for his back as well. Yeah, I know. And like here, you got this, you know, little power lifter.

His back was just as, I mean, maybe Dorian's is still better but i mean definitely comparable that's actually and going back to kind of the tempo stuff that was the first places i really actually started to hear about working on negative sets uh or like really long negatives was always for hypertrophy it was like a weeder principle yeah long eccentrics it was yeah it was hold it as long as you can and then especially the end where your elbow like if you're doing a row where your

elbow usually just like falls out like really holding on to those at the very end or doing pull-ups when you see people just like fall to the bottom of them it's like no even even after you get past 90 yeah like holding those those positions um very key. Yeah, I got a question. In the One-Ton Challenge program, in the very first squat cycle, someone asked me this on the phone the other day. I think it's the day three or whatever, day four, something like that. Of each week, there's a back squat set rep scheme. You build up two heavy triples.

You do a heavy triple, and then you do a set of 10, and then a heavy triple, and then a set of 10, heavy triple, and a set of 10. Yeah, waves. Yeah, you do waves. Heavier and lighter, heavier and lighter. What are all the reasons that that can be programmed? Great question.

I was just writing about it today, but that is part of the post-activation potentiation. So when you do a triple and then a 10, so when you do that 10, your body is recruiting the fibers for the heavy triple. So it's actually recruiting more fibers, and you're able to go heavier for the 10 reps. And not only will you do it heavier, you'll do it better. You'll be more efficient when you're doing it. So a lot of times people will set like 10 RMs,

and sometimes even it will go the opposite, and they'll set the 3 RM too. So it's for two reasons, but mainly it's for post-activation potentiation to be able to go heavier and to recruit more fibers for that 10RM. So, yeah, it's really just another way to add more muscle. Yeah. I told him that that day wasn't specifically a strength day. It was more a volume day than a strength day. And you would go heavier on the 10s because of the 3s.

Right. Good. I'm glad we're on the same page. I was like, I don't know. I'll ask them, though. Even when we do, like, eventually there will be some 1s and 4s, and it's the same thing. It's like, you know, you'll do the heavy one, and then it makes the 4 seem easy.

So you're able to handle more weight for, you know, those 4 reps, therefore getting stronger, adding more muscle. Because you don't have to do 10s. Everyone thinks that hypertrophy is just like tens and eighths. It's not true. It's like the biggest, the number one principle to adding muscle is going to near failure. There's a dude, which you guys should get on your show, Chris Beardsley, who is an amazing guy. I see all his stuff on Instagram.

It's fantastic. I love it. Yeah, he does all those infographics, you know. Yeah. But, yeah, if you read his stuff, you know, the number one – there's lots of ways. You know, there's like – there's metabolic stress, the pump. There's muscle damage. But the number one way is going to near failure.

So that's the key. If I can use more weight for those four, five reps, then I'm going to get more muscle mass yeah yeah um when how long do you want people in a hypertrophy phase i mean really i mean i'm really like louis simmons even even at a peaking cycle we're still doing hypertrophy we just might so for example let's say that we're about to peak you know snatch or and or clean and jerk like we we are not going to necessarily you know be too abusive but we're still going to do things that's going to get you know hypertrophy instead but instead of like rdls which is you know when you do eccentrics where you're really lengthening the muscle and as you lengthen the load is going up which is rdl that

creates a lot of damage it's hard to recover from yeah however i can do i can do um like back extensions and it's not that case as it lengthens the load goes away because of the angle yes you're on and so it and the load goes up as you contract totally different while i can switch it from that to that so i'm still doing our burgeoning because i don't want to like you know a lot this is a louis simmons thing you know you don't want to stop or perjury when that's helped you get to where you are you don't all of a sudden cut it out yeah backwards right when you need to be have the muscles to be the biggest and strongest that they're going to be so you just switch the exercises and go to exercises that will not create as much damage yeah they'll still give you a perjury but in a different way yeah you can change the reps up too

i guess there's ways that just loading it so you don't have to. Yeah, you can do like instead of like pec flies, you could do like I could do the pec deck. So as it goes, as it lengthens the pecs, it kind of the load goes away. And as I contract, the load gets stronger. So it's just really switching it up from loading that eccentric to loading the concentric.

If you still wanted somebody to get a lot of hamstring work, so to speak, a lot of posterior chain work using RDLs, but you didn't want them to get sore, would you use chains or bands? So you're still doing the movement pattern, but you're decreasing the load as your mechanical advantage is lessened. Yes. But you probably won't get the thing about the RDLs. What makes them awesome is the fact that it's like you know that you are loading that lengthening phase it's that's a great way to get hypertrophy yeah but yeah you still could and the key is what i'm trying to do at bare minimum is don't lose any of the muscle size

i've gained right when i need it the most that is my number one goal but if i can get if i can continue to get some hypertrophic qualities, I will. You don't need a lot of stress for short-term maintenance of size. No, not at all. Metabolic stress is not that. It's easy to recover from.

It's the muscle damage that's hard to recover. I really need recovery to focus on snatch and clean and jerk. Metabolic stress is easy to recover from, but the muscle damage is not. Yeah, actually I'm very curious. When you have a 16-year-old in the back that is going to win gold medals one day. Yeah. I know you've seen me in my garage, my PRX Performance home gym.

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we're going to get back to the show. How does the bodybuilding hypertrophy stuff fit into his training program? Big time. I was going to say, I feel like that's a massive piece of a double day or a week.

How does that play into the whole thing because i also see him doing the competition lifts all the time and he's doing the big heavy deadlifts for doubles and triples i mean he's in the back doing heavy pulls off blocks like those to me are barely that's just loading your system letting your body know it's time to fucking grow right and he's about it's not specifically hypertrophy it's not but know, we are only three weeks out from the American Open. Yeah. So we're close to competition.

However, after the American Open, we've discussed that we're going to take, you know, the first three months. And, like, there's a meet or two, but we're going to lift through it. And, like, we're going to focus on hypertrophy. Yeah. And we're going to – it's going to look like a bodybuilding or like an early powerlifting routine. And he's going to do squats, presses, and we're going to add some muscle. And, like, we're totally going to lift through junior nationals because nobody's going to beat him.

So we're going to lift through junior nationals. And, like, he might not, you know, set a PR there, and there's going to be a lot of people talking junk. Yeah. At least I'm saying it now. But, like, the goal being later in the year, you know. So, like, I'm talking about three to six months. The focus is nothing but hypertrophy. Mainly because, like, you know, later in the year, you know. So, like, I'm talking about three to six months. The focus is nothing but hypertrophy.

Mainly because, like, you know, he's so tall and skinny. Like, I want to stabilize him. I don't want to get him hurt, you know, like Ian Wilson, who's awesome. But, you know, we only got his best lifting was when he was a junior. That's the last thing I want for Morgan or for Ryan. You know, I want their best lifting to be when they're, you older and peaked yeah but it's so important you know like right now we're still doing i'm proud of you just like he does it you know he probably he leaves the back and he does other things up in the front of the room where it's you know i'm proud to be this less muscle damage

because we're about to compete what do you think about the this new hot topic maybe it's not new but it's just the way people are talking about, like the reps in reserve not going to failure. Right. RIR. So, like, okay, one of the keys, you know, the same thing. A lot of the RIR is from Chris Beardsley is that I want to go as close as I can to failure without complete failure.

So if I leave one or two in the tank, I can recover. I can come back and do it two or three days later. But if I go all out and go to reach complete failure. So if I leave one or two in the tank, I can recover. I can come back and do it two or three days later. But if I go all out and go to reach complete failure, it's probably going to take four or five days. So another key to hyperproperty is going as close to failure as you can without going to failure so I can recover and do it more often. So there's frequency. That's a big consideration too.

So it's really a fine line. It's like going there but not quite there so you can recover and do it again. So in that case, you're looking at how much volume you can tolerate over a period of months. Right. Like if you're not going all the way to failure, then your monthly volume is much higher potentially because you can recover from it. Right. So it's going to – if you go to complete – maybe you go to complete failure once a month or something. But if you go there, if I go every week, I'm only going to be able – say I go to failure and squat. So I'm only going to be able to squat twice a week or something. But if you go there, if I go every week, say I go to failure and squat.

So I'm only going to be able to squat twice a week at most. Well, when they're talking about complete failure, say I'm on incline dumbbell press, and I had a set of 10, and I'm like, I can't get one more. Is that considered failure? Or is failure, okay, I hit the 80s for 10, and now I'm doing a drop set, and now I just hit the 60s for 10, and now I'm hitting another drop set. Is that failure where you're literally blowing the muscle out?

There's nothing left at the end, or is it one set, we hit the max for a day, and we're done? Either or. It's like once you go past that you know failure mark then it's gonna be hard to recover from no matter what you do so you might as well if you go to failure for one set complete and utter failure you might as well blow it out because you know you're it's gonna take a long time to recover at that point no matter what you do so regarding what you said earlier about like the rdls like if you do heavy rdls ands and as your hamstrings are lengthening, the weight is getting heavier and heavier.

As you get more bent over, it feels heavier and heavier. You're more likely to get sore doing something like RDLs than you are to do some other hamstring exercise. If you do machine hamstring curls, you're not going to get ungodly sore where you can barely walk sore by doing you know three to five sets to failure but you might you might be like limping around for four or five days if you did rdls to failure for four or five sets especially if you have a straight knee where you're really getting like a big stretch right so are some exercises um better than others to go to failure on you know like um yeah like if you wanted to go to complete failure like a leg curl would be a better choice unless you have that hole where someone's trying to pull down you know that'll make you a source rdls you know what i mean by that yeah you know because like you know as you lengthen breck interiors does a lot of that stuff

for his glue exercise it'll tear you apart and so in a good way overloading the eccentrics like when you use two legs up one leg down like that type of thing or like you know when you curl up and then your partner's trying to pull down and you're trying to resist it. Right, right. Now that becomes just as rough on you as the RDL. Because you're, you know, as you go, as you're lifting that muscle, the load is getting higher and higher and higher. Because you got the pull down. Actually, on that note, do you guys use weight releasers or anything like that for your big squats and whatnot ever? We don't, but we should. Like, I need to get some, that's funny you say that,

weight releasers are one of my favorite ways to set PRs. What you're doing, you're doing post-activation potentiation. The first time I ever squatted 805 raw was with weight releasers. So I lowered 900, 100 pounds flips off,

and then I squatted 800. So it's a great way to set a pr and like to break through a plateau and some people like yeah but you can't do that that at the meet but once you've done it your body knows you can do it and like it's learned that weight and so in now in your dna 805 you're there so we do it all the time with bands so you'll work up to a heavy band single or triple whatever you do take the bands off. Keep going. Odds are you're going to set a PR that day. Are you using a lot of bands and chains with Morgan?

Some. I try to get the most out of the least. So if a straight weight works, we're going straight weight. But the minute it stops, yes, we'll add bands, chains, whatever. Let me get this before people. Just on the squats and the pulls, not on snatches and clean jerks. Oh, whatever. Yeah. Let me get this before people. Just on the squats and the pulls, not on snatches and cleaners. Oh, Jesus. The people, the craziest.

That wasn't even like part of my. We've been at Westside and had Louie's adding bands to our cleans before. I really feel like you guys are the first people. He's like, oh, I'll fucking load it up, see what happens. He's never done it with anybody. These guys will fall for it. Yeah, Bledsoe looks like, Bledsoe, try. Did Bledsoe do it?

Oh, yeah, we got a whole great video on YouTube of us doing banded cleans and snatches. We did some of that, too. We went on it there. Years ago. One of our girls, Jackie, who used to be a top-ranked weightlifter, she did it. She set a power clean PR. So she did a bunch of sets with bands of power cleans, took the bands off, set a power clean PR with that old, like a deadlift bar.

So it was a deadlift bar that doesn't spin, and she set a PR. A pretty big one. It was like a five-kilogram PR. It was a massive PR. I think if you have a light band where there's almost no tension at the bottom, but it just keeps the bar from going quite as high, and the bar, when you're going to catch it, it's going to come down a little bit faster like you got to set the bands up correctly to to find that sweet spot

where it's not like just slinging the bar back toward the ground you know twice as fast don't go with the green man but i do oh my god i do think at a minimum you can um you can use that as a tool to help yourself learn to get under the bar faster because you have to get on the bar faster if the band's pulling it down just a little bit faster than gravity would alone or cut your head off yeah um you know have you ever tried a reverse band cleans no so the band's going away and then once you get past say mid thigh then there's no band tension at all and you're back to normal but it's a little heavier off the ground that i would like to try now not with my livers but i'd like to try yeah have you tried that uh i

have tried that before like purely purely just for fun um so i don't know like what kind of long-term training effect it it may have given me but but i've done it for fun for sure yeah um i think for at a minimum for monotony's sake you know and off season like like hey like like let's fucking put two greens on and where it's way heavier at the bottom it's extra 100 pounds you're pulling through it and then it's kind of like it's kind of like it's heavy off the ground and then it's gone by the time you get to mid thigh and so it's like you're doing a mid thigh block pull yeah you know i mean so it could be a fun way just to to switch it up i think it'd be awesome but i don't think there's

any big downside to it really yeah it'd be awesome to do that and clean like 400 and then take like, and like erase the bands. Use Photoshop. Edit them out. Edit the bands out and be like, yeah, clean 400 pounds again. When you have, did my voice just get real weird? No. Sounded like that to me. We've got these, you've got a six foot1", really, really skinny kid in the back.

Tim, yeah. He moves really well. There's a couple things you can clean up, but, I mean, when it comes to hypertrophy, that dude just needs to be lifting a lot of weights. He needs to be lifting lots of weights for lots of reps. When you start to look at people like Morgan, like when I see Morgan over the last six weeks, I feel like you finally hit puberty. That's what everyone says.

He finally looks like his jaw changed. Like a man. Yeah. He does look different than the last time we were here, which was not that long ago. Four months ago. It's been a big change, and he's set lots of PRs. He's got his clean, 191 now. So when you think about the training program of what is, in a way, the percentage of what needs to be done on just the lifts,

the forms dialed in. Yeah. The dude just needs to get ridiculously strong in this sweet spot of life where you're just naturally just juiced out of your mind to grow. Agreed 100%. And that's part of this phase we're about to go on after the American Open is, like, not as much. We might leave a lot of snatching in there because, you know,

we just now dialed in the snatch, and he's, like, he's doing better and better with snatching. So we'll probably keep that. But, like, cleans, probably not at all. It's, like, there's no point. He cleans 200 kilos. Yeah. He's 440 with cleans.

What's the world record right now in his weight class? And he's cleaned 96 and barely missed the jerk. So he's all over the world record. Friday. Right there. We're doing it. That's right, Max. Friday.

Two days from now. I hope so. But yeah, you're totally right. The goal is just to get stronger, bigger, stabilize him. I just don't want him to get hurt. I love when people give me advice. I'm like, show me your example. There's no precedent for kids like him, Harrison and CJ.

There's no precedent. So no one can tell me that they did X with anybody because you don't have an athlete like him. Do you spend a lot of time thinking about just how long it takes to develop connective tissue and the length of time that is needed to actually protect joints when someone's right when you're cleaning 400 pounds and you make it look relatively easy like he does there's a lot of things that happen at the bottom of that squat even though he makes it look easy easy i mean he cleans frontored 500 two days ago or four days ago.

Yeah, 500 pounds. That's fucking insane. I'm trying to learn from mistakes that I've seen from CJ. And I'm not throwing – Ray is an amazing coach. I'm just saying. Well, no one's seen freaks like this. So you're in a league that just doesn't – there's not a lot of people coming before you. I'm trying to learn from him and from Harris the mistakes I think I've seen them make.

And especially from Ian, who was kind of ahead of his time. I think he was the first of these new group of monsters. He was the first, so he got hurt. And so I'm trying to learn from all of them and not make those mistakes. I think one mistake that Ian made is all they did was push snatch, clean and jerk to where he broke as a junior. And so, like, my goal is not to do that with Morgan, is to, like, stabilize him and, like, you know, spend, like, six months a year hypertrophy stabilization,

six months a year snatch and clean and jerk. And, like, a mistake I think, you know, maybe with CJ would be, like, maybe they ignored technique, you know, a little too much because he was winning and doing so well. But, like, you know, will that come into play down the road? Maybe, you know, like a lot of coaches would say that, you know, his snatch is not perfect even though he's killing it, you know. So, like, it's hard to say if they're right or wrong,

but I'm just trying to like, okay, maybe I'll try to avoid that. So, for example, his jerk used to be terrible. So, we went backwards and spent several months. And now his clean and jerk are both beautiful. Now we just spent the last six months on his snatch. Yeah. And we had to go way backwards, which some people wouldn't want to do because his snatch is not going to go up. And they're going to be like, oh, you're not PRing every meet.

Well, now he just had a huge, massive PR. Now they're like, oh my yeah just it's part of the process it takes a long time yeah and you got to be able to avoid you got to ignore what people say and like um which is tough even obviously you can hear my voice it irritates the shit out of me but like i just got to ignore that stuff and do what you know is right yeah i feel like there's a piece of it that seems, man, as a coach, you want to, like, wheel your dude out and say, like, look at how cool he is. But having, like, an eight-year window of peaking for two quads, potentially three, which is 12 years, that's a long time to keep someone healthy

and lifting in the 400-plus pound range. And, like, mentally healthy. Yeah, motivated. Like, you know, snatch, clean, jerk, squat every day the rest of your life and see what happens. Before you say, I can't snatch, clean, jerk, and squat every day. So, like, my goal is how do I make it fun for him. I will say this.

Anytime, like, if he's like, oh, my quad is tight, all right, take two days off. Peace out. I'm not the coach that's going to be like, don he's like, oh, my quad is tight, all right, you're taking two days off. He's out. I'm not the coach that's going to be like, oh, don't be a sissy. Like, he's not a sissy. Yeah. You know, if something's bothering him, something is bothering him. Yeah.

So, like, I'm like, oh, two days off. I do that with all my young ones. Anything, if they're hurting, don't come in. Yeah. Because it's like a long-term process. And I just don't want, you know, my nightmares to have the same thing happen to him that happened with Ian.

It's like your best years are as a junior. Ian did a 170 snatch and a 211 clean and jerk as a junior, and now he's done. He never got to do those numbers as a senior. That's the worst possible scenario. Never hit his real true peak. do those numbers as a senior. That's the worst possible scenario. It's like, you know. Never hit his real true peak. Did you know there was a time where Ian was equal? Actually, he was beating Lasha.

And then no one will ever know because now Ian. I love Ian, too. This is not me hating on him. I've actually tried to get to be his coach. He's awesome. But I just don't want that to happen to Morgan. It's like yeah that's my nightmare is that well i feel like morgan has such an advantage and i don't really know much about ian but we were talking a little bit about it earlier and you mentioned like it's in their dna yeah when you have put in the reps pre i think about this a lot now just because like in hindsight read like seeing how you

get to where you are as an athlete or like the lifetime of your strength career as an athlete and like why am i good at what i do now well it's because i played like a jillion sports right i just was around weights all the time right i found crossfit i learned a little bit of gymnastics when i was younger. Like, all of it plays into this ability to be able to do this stuff now at a somewhat okay level. When you look at Morgan, it's like, dude, he started when he was nine. He's got eight years of experience, seven years of experience in before he hit puberty.

It's freaky his whole dna has been rewired in a way that like it's been dying yeah to be fed the testosterone needed to grow into the environment that he has been brutally forcing on his body for a long period of time now yeah like in five years when it finally is like okay we've given you the reinforcements now you're a giant what is it what do you if you were to project the the perfect training plans and the perfect cycles and the perfect everything that he could um go through like is like what does it look like someone that has when when they're 29 years old the peak of where you can i mean my peak strength i think was like 32 right so that's a decade out from now a decade plus

i'm assuming he'll peak when he's somewhere around 28 you know yeah at 27 because he started so young he'll probably peak a little earlier at 27 28 which is where we hope, you know, then he'll snatch. I hope somewhere. Fuck! Somewhere. I just fell out of my chair, team. Somewhere. We're good. Holy shit.

He almost pulled the whole table down. Did I break the whole chair? About to take down the whole MASH podcast, though. Oh, my God. We're good, guys. This never happened on the history of Barbell Strong. Andrews broke a chair. I wish that was filmed. But I'm hoping he's somewhere around, you know,

like a 190-230 is what the goal is, you know, or more. You know, but, like, that's what we're thinking, like a 190, 230, 240. But that would take perfect. That's just what I'm assuming. Who knows? Like, you know, who knows what his body's capable of? Wait, one more time. What is he at right now?

Right now he's done a 140 snatch, so a 308, and he's done a 191 clean and jerk. But I think what's going to happen is that that gap between his snatches and his clean and jerk will start to narrow now that I've turned him loose on his snatches and we've improved his technique. So now he'll start. He'll probably set more snatch PRs than clean and jerk PRs for a while. So I'm assuming we'll be somewhere around 145 and 190 soon and then uh then we'll go that's where we'll stay with that 45 kilo gap so you're playing the game of quads going forward yeah like 2020 is an olympic 2024 is the goal 2024 will be i'm hoping is this is his

and ryan's first olympics so we. So we should have two boys that are like, it's going to be really hard to keep either one of those guys away. Yeah, they're monsters. He had pulled 407 out of the rack in the front squat today. It was 145 pounds. Even just thinking about that is insane to me. He did 396 easily, and he had a mishap on the 185. He blacked out a little bit.

It happens when 407's sitting on your throat. Yeah. But how do you think about structuring out a quad knowing you've got this raw talent? So the goal is, like, there's a volume that we're trying to get to when we're two years out. Like, we've got it that planned. And so, like, I'm basing that off of what, you know,

talking to Piros what you know talking to piros you know like where he needs to be to do what we want to do and piros has kind of given me this this dude what a great resource i know yeah it's great a lot of coaches like americans are so stupid so a lot of them i this is why it was so easy for a powerlifting to come into weightlifting and start dominating because these people like they they're so it's so important to them that they're prideful. And so it's so important that everyone thinks of them as the source of knowledge. And anyone that might threaten that, they don't want to listen to or they want to dismiss. And I'm like, Stu's a three-time gold medalist.

I'm going to listen. I'm going to learn something from him. Wait, are there people you talk to that are like, don't listen to Piros? There are several American coaches. There are several American coaches who refuse to listen to him. I'm like, perfect. Don't listen to him.

This is perfect. I'll keep dominating you. You don't listen. Anyway, he's given me this volume checklist of where we should be to get the goals that we want so that's the goal we're working towards so um so we'll slowly add that in over a long period of time and like you know i've told him and more m and ryan both that they can they need to slowly be to there's a certain there's certain parameters

i gave them that they need to be at come the Olympics of next year, 2020, because that begins their quad. By then, they need to be dialed in on their sleep, their nutrition. They need to be accountable. They're kids, so I'm not tracking their macros, but I will. Come 2020, the Olympics, both of them, I'll know how much they're eating, how much they're sleeping. Everything will be dialed in.

So that will be step one. Let's get these kids ready to be real athletes. Yeah. Two will be working towards that volume spot of like, you know, being able to produce, to perform enough volume to get to where they want to get, which they, you know, both of them talk about winning the Olympics. They don't, neither one of them. It's so cool that you have two guys in the same gym that they do not talk about making the Olympics.

They talk about winning. They talk about world records. That's a good environment. What does Ryan need to, like, what are the numbers he needs to hit? Snatch, clean, jerk, as far as just one. To win the Olympics, in his weight class, what is like the... I mean, he's going to need to be – How about in 2016, what were the winning lifts?

I would need to look. Even roughly. You know, if he's in the 140s and he's in the, you know, like say 140s and 180s, he'll be in the ballpark because, you know, you got CJ who's snatching – who's a weight class above him, who's like that 150, 190. So if he's 140, 180, he'll be in the ballgame. Yeah.

Which he's, you know, we're hoping he's going to be at 130, 160 like right now. So those are the numbers we're talking about already at this American Open. So he's definitely not, you know, he's like 10 kilos out on one and 20 on the other. Yeah. So he's definitely not, you know, he's like 10 kilos out on one and 20 on the other. Yeah. So he's very close. How much do you spend, I guess, when I look at them? I mean, we talked on the last show that we all did together about a little bit of the stability issues and stuff in the bottom of his squat.

But, man, those guys, they just need to get jacked. Like there really isn't like a huge, it's not doesn't isn't going to play a massive role but like when you write a program for somebody like that over four years it's really i would think it's like let's just go slower yeah it's go it's go well it's go slower to a degree but yeah there comes a time where there's certain things that need to be done by certain times yeah but two years out it's like it's all we need to be going hard. But two years out, we need to be training 11 times a week at least to work towards training even more.

The goal would be like to train 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 times a week is the goal, is the ultimate goal. Knowing that you have a four-year block. Well, here, actually let me back that up knowing that you have a four-year block well here actually let me back that up so you have you have a four-week block between olympics but um it's not like you're guaranteed to go to the next olympics four years out you still have to qualify along the way and all that so so you can't get too far away from your weight class right so i was going to ask like if you're trying to hit a world record or trying to you know to hit a certain number,

does it make sense to bump your body weight up 20 pounds so you can hit those numbers and then try to back your body weight down while still hitting those numbers slowly? Or maybe not 20, but like 10 pounds. Yeah. Play a body weight game. Wes does that a lot. Wes from Cats. Yeah, Wes Kitts.

He gets pretty far above his weight class, and obviously he's working out. He holds a lot of muscle. I know he kind of looks like a fat dude until he takes his shirt off. Yeah, right. Right after he won Worlds, he posted an ab selfie. Yeah, like he is ripped. Jacked. I guess the clothes he wears.

Plus he's a 109. Do you think he's going to be a little extra fluffy? Jacked. Jacked. A lot of really big guys, they're like that. Like big bodybuilders. Eddie Hall was like that. I thought he had a big beer belly on him, that type of thing.

And then I saw a picture of him, and he's just like a fucking eight-pack. But he's just 350 or whatever the hell he is. 400 pounds. He's a big eight-pack. Yeah, Fisher's like the leanest, most jacked dude that I'm friends with. And we were sitting at dinner with him last time we were in new york and he was hanging out and i kind of looked i was like his shirt just like kind of like goes over like it but he takes it off it looks like puffy yeah no he takes his shirt

off it's like you have 17 abs in there showing that's right he is the most jacked dude i love the way ryan i'm a little bit i have a man crush crush. I want to look like that. If I look like Ryan, I would walk around naked my whole life. I would walk in the grocery store with maybe underwear on at best. I love it. And if someone's like, why are you naked? I'm like, look at me. Have you seen me? Yeah, look at, what do you want me to do?

Yeah. Would you put clothes on? Look what I created. Yeah. I was born with a lot of this and then I made it way better. Chain your wife up. So I mean. Yeah. Yeah. Would you put clothes on? Look what I created. Yeah. I was born with a lot of this, and then I made it way better. Chain your wife up. Yeah. Yeah.

If I were Ryan, you need to get married quick or something bad will happen. He's not getting married quick. Yeah. I wouldn't get married quick. If I was Ryan, I would not get married quick. I'd let all the bad things happen. I'd be experimenting way too much Radman

We're going to wrap this thing up Right on MashaletePerformance.com Mashalete.com Doug Larson Instagram Instagram MashaletePerformance What's your TikTok?

I do have TikTok. You on TikTok? I do have TikTok. What are you, in your 40s? You would actually. Dude, TikTok's interesting. You might crush TikTok because you could get on there and rap. I have. Oh, yeah.

You could get on there and do your rapping, dude. I still, I just TikTok. I just. Yeah, it's terrifying. I'm just playing, trying to figure it out. I just got on today. It's terrifying. Do you have a, have you started,

I got like 25 hours. I posted a picture of me front squatting or a video of me front squatting. When he was sitting in the room with us and not paying, hearing a single thing

we were saying for like 15 minutes when we were setting up equipment. Oh, he was locked. Dude, we're in the car driving here. He's making his first TikTok post

and it's like, you basically, you can take the picture, you can put the video up and then you put your own background music to it, whatever, and they have all these 15 seconds you could put the video up, and then you put your own background music to it, whatever. And they have all these 15 seconds of every song that's ever existed. And he's got, like, this, like, hardcore techno banging.

And he's, like, in the passenger seat, mute volumes all the way up. He's going through all the effects. And I was just like, you know who TikTok's really cool for is the one person using it, not the other six people around you that have to listen to the hardcore techno music, the house music. You know, that's all Gary Vaynerchuk talks about is TikTok. Yeah, that's the same thing right now? The first place I heard about it was Gary Vee.

I'm pretty sure he probably owns a percentage of it. He owns a percentage of all. I know, he owns Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, so I guarantee he owns a part of – because the way he pushes it, I mean, I would have to own it for me to push it that hard. I'm like, everything he's – TikTok, you should be TikTok. Why aren't you on? Why aren't you on?

Why aren't you singing? Yeah, I mean, he could be talking to, you know, Apple. Are you guys on TikTok? Well, dude, tell me you saw the documentary Dr. Dre and Beats by Dre guy. No. Phil Iveen. Phil Iveen.

On TikTok? No, no. It's not about TikTok. Whatever the guy's name is that created Beats by Dre. He was like the business guy behind it. But he was the same way with Beats by Dre. Anytime a celebrity showed up around him, he's like, put these on. Can I take your picture?

And then you put it on social media. Put these on. Put's like, put these on. Can I take your picture? And then he put it on social media. Put these on. Put these on. Put these on. Let me take a picture. And the next thing you know, it's a billion dollar company. Dr. Dre went from

the hood in Compton to a billionaire. Not Johnny. Jimmy Iovine. Jimmy Iovine, yeah. Smart. Gary Vee, TikTok. Yeah, so everywhere he went,

he had access to all the famous people, gave everyone the beats by Dre, and then took their picture, put it on social media. Do you guys realize how much control you have? Once you're as popular as someone like Gary Vee, you can literally affect the outcomes of companies

because of what you say. That's a lot of power. I'd like to try that out. You do. You do do it. It's a much smaller world. You're pretty well known, and you have a platform. But not millions like he's got.

Not like Gary Vee. You're working on it. I'm trying. Gary, if you're listening. Call me. Yeah, call me. You ever heard of my podcast, Barbell Life? Yeah.

Doug Larson. There you go. You can find me on TikTok. You can find me on TikTok. You can find me on TikTok. You can find me on TikTok. Oh my God. This show is really, really. You're turning red.

Oh my God. That just sounded like nails on chalkboard. It's going to be really funny how we're laughing about this right now because in five years it's going to be all TikTok and Instagram is going to be dead. Find me on TikTok at Doug underscore Larson. You can find me on Instagram. I love it. Find me on TikTok at Doug underscore Larson. You can find me on Instagram. I love it. Find me on Instagram at Douglas E. Larson. How many posts do you have on TikTok?

Two. I posted two today. Yeah, go check them out. Check them out. Check them out. I got two followers. I don't even know who the fuck they are, but they like me. They love me.

I do like that. They're your friends. They are followers. Yeah, they are followers. They're my first cult members on TikTok. They're my followers. I'm Anders Varner, They're my first cult members on TikTok. They're my followers. I'm Anders Varner, at Anders Varner on Instagram and TikTok. You can find us at Shrug Collective.

Because we're the Shrug Collective. Snatch, clean, jerk, squat, deadlift, bench. The lifelong pursuit of strength. Add them all up. Find your one-ton total. The goal is 2,000 for men, 1,200 for you. Ladies, you can get over to OneTetonchallenge.com forward slash stronger. Download the 97-page e-book where we teach you all six lifts.

Teach you how to make strong people stronger. Onetonchallenge.com forward slash stronger. We will see you guys next week. Tick tock. Making strong gyms stronger. Send me an email. Anders at barbellshrug shrug.com gym owners if you would like to host the one-ton challenge at your gym i know we can benefit your gym benefit your

members we can bring strength programs to your gym that are fun they're engaging you're going to bring the community to your gym so they can see how beautiful your space is and you're going to be the only person in town hosting this event. And it's going to be amazing. We're hooking gym owners up with programs, marketing assets, emails, everything you need to make sure the word gets out in your town that you are hosting a very unique, very new, and very cool event at your gym, the One Ton Challenge. So shoot me an email. Anders at barbellshrug.com. I can't wait. I cannot wait for you to have this at your gym, the one-ton challenge. So shoot me an email, anders at barbellshrug.com. I can't wait.

I cannot wait for you to have this at your gym. You're going to make money. You're going to be the coolest kids in town, and everyone in your gym is going to be lifting weights and having fun together. It's the most important part. Having fun lifting weights. That's what we're here for. Thank our sponsors over at PRX Performance.

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