Beach Too Sandy, Water Too Wet - 385: Reviews of Caves with National Park After Dark

Episode Date: April 15, 2026

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Welcome to Beach to Sandy Water to Wet, a podcast featuring real reviews written by people who just need the world to know what they think. Between you and me, I wanted to like this podcast, but I'd give it zero stars if I could. Hello and welcome to Beach to Sandy Water to Wet, the podcast where we read the worst reviews in the most dramatic fashion. I'm your sister host, Christine. I'm the brother host, Zandi. Welcome, welcome.

We've got some special guests here today. We have Danielle and Cassie of National Park After Dark, and it is an honor to have you two here to discuss caves today. Very special. We're doing caves. Oh, my God. Thank you so much for doing this. Did we know they would react like this?

I'm like, wait, this is amazing. No, I don't think so. I didn't. Cassie hates caves. I'm so claustrophic. Hell yeah. Jesse. I'm sorry.

Sorry. Hell, yeah. Listen close then. I did do a quick search of your, what do you call it? Oh, I think you meant on your, like, private detective website. I did a background check. No. I did a quick search of your archive, and I saw you did really early on a mammoth cave episode.

Is that right? Yeah. I think our second episode. It was episode number two. Oh. And we, as people who grew up relatively close to mammoth cave, spent time there growing up. American Close, where it's like a four-hour drive. Right.

It's close or whatever it is. probably less. And so we thought we'd do caves. We did not know it would be this triggering for you. I love caves and I bring Cassie into a lot of caves on our travels. I'm claustrophobic. Oh, Cassie's clausty. I'm sorry.

It's okay. I have been getting over my ears. We're not forcing you into a cave today. Just metaphorically. I'm here for bad reviews of caves. Honestly, probably one of your reviews is in here is what I would imagine. Yeah. Yeah.

It's like my friend brought me into this cave and I was terrified. She and I host a podcast. I didn't realize how many cave. There's so many caves there are. I knew there are a lot of caves, but I didn't know how many caves you could like visit that were structured with places to visit. Yeah. When it comes to caves and my favorite experiences in them,

Cave of the Winds right outside of Colorado Springs, Manitou area in Colorado, in Colorado is so fun. I loved that cave. But Cassie and I have been into quite a number of them on our travels. Cassie's like I always end up in a church or underground.

But Danielle on our travels. And not church like a mass. Like I just really love the architecture of old churches. Oh, okay. I was like, oh, this is an interesting twist. I was like, huh. I'm learning so much about you, Danielle. Yeah, I will say I was recently in Egypt and we went to a chapel inside a

cave and I feel you would have maybe appreciated that. Why didn't we go there when you were in Egypt? We also went to Egypt at three years ago. Of course you did. We got to talk about that sometime. Sorry, that's the, we recorded episode with you all and you went everywhere. I feel like that was a topic that you all have traveled everywhere. Extensively.

Well, Alexander made a joke. Okay, so quickly, let's back up a little bit because we want to tell people about your show, but we were on your show recently. You were kind enough to have us as guests, and we learned that you really have been everywhere. I'm sure your listeners already know that. but Alexander even made a joke like oh well from one of the reviews like well have you been to the Middle East and you both went yeah actually we have and we were like okay we get it and then you said oh and

one time we went to Antarctica and we went okay we're at a loss but can you give people a little bit of insight into like what you guys do and what your show is for sure so our show national park after dark we talk about stories that happen in the outdoors we like to focus them on national parks in particular, but we'll jump into national forests and sometimes state parks. And we will tell stories of survival, dark history, true crime, just obscure things that have happened in the outdoors in particular. And we've been doing it for about five years now. But telling these stories has translated, we've actually started taking listeners on trips to some of the locations that we've talked about on the podcast and then also just other places around the world that just are really cool.

And we decided we wanted to take listeners on trips because we found these places that are kind of hard to plan on your own. So we thought it would be a great idea to come up with these itineraries and bring people along so we could all do it together. Quick solo trip to Antarctica isn't a big deal. I could plan that in my sleep. Seriously. Alexander who didn't even show up on time to this.

recording. Yeah. Well, as far as places that we've been, of course, we've been a lot of places, but we've never been to Mammoth Caves. Okay, that was my question. How good. That's a good one. Somewhere we've been that they haven't. It's the first. It feels good. It feels good. Other than maybe Cincinnati. I don't know. Yeah. Have you been there? Yeah. Have you been there? I'm dripping through. There is a haunting at the cave, well, for a number of reasons, but there was this guy, which, let me know if you know about this, this guy who got trapped and they spent like days trying to get him out.

Floyd Collins. Floyd Collins. That's right. Yeah. It was that's quite a dark story. Yeah. The cave war situation. Yes,

the cave war. That's right. Yep, that too. Yeah. The fuck. Wild times. Like really cool as a movie.

I'm going to visit mammoth caves in May for the first time. No way. Can I go? I love mammoth caves. But wait, why are you going? We're going to accidentally be there too that day. I'll let you know in case.

We want to accidentally be there on the same day. Cassie, are you working on your fears? Is that what's happening? Yeah. Well, I'm not going to do any of the spulunking things. Please don't. Put me in a giant cavern under there with like lights and I'm fine in a cave if they are open. Like spacious enough. Yeah, I don't want to go. You know when you go to visit a cave and they have those little cardboard cut out things and they're like, if you can't fit through this, then don't come in. It's like, I don't care if I can fit through that. I am not going near this. that. Yeah, Mammoth Cave is a special place to us.

We went as kids a couple times. And then when I was in the summer before I went off to college, I went on a triple date. It was an accident with a guy that I crush on. And the girl he was sort of seeing that I didn't really realize he was seeing. And then he took both of us to Mammoth Cave. You knew it was like really dark in there. Get away with anything. It was like a rom-com.

He would like be over here and then run across the cave. Like a comedy. Holding both of your hands, but neither of you could see. As we like traverse over the ledges. Well, he was famously very athletic. I'm very famously, infamously not. And one of the roughest parts is that he booked the like eight-hour spalunking journey. And I was like 17, 18.

It was terrifying. Like there was a certain point where they, somebody had to turn back. And they sent people back. And then they were like, well, if you fall. here. It'll take about 12 to 24 hours for somebody to come rescue you. Like if you fall into this thing and you'll definitely break at least two limbs. And I'm like, what the fuck? And then they make us jump over. Anyway, so I'm kind of with you, Cassie. I feel like caves are more dangerous than people kind of let on. Yeah. And to hear that if you make a mistake that it's going to take hours

to rescue you and you're going to break some bones. And that was like a punishment. Like he was like scolding me. And I was like, I mean, I'm not going to do it on purpose. But, like, if it happens. Like, this is hard. You have me crawling through a cave right now in the dark. And I tried to look cute that day because I thought I was going on a date. And, man, it was a big mistake. So we brought some reviews of caves today because that's kind of what we do here.

We did do an episode of one-star reviews of caves ages ago. I do not remember that one bit. Don't you? Because somebody said they didn't have cell service inside the cave. Yeah. And that was like a major complaint that they didn't have cell phone service down there. Yeah, it's crazy that there aren't towers down there. That's really weird.

It's surprising. There's like fiber optic cables. Like what the hell? Yeah, they put their shit underground, don't they? Yeah. Turn to a bat. Let them carry it through. Tie it to a bat.

They have a lot of bats in those caves. I looked it up and it was like one cavern. It was like, yeah, it's anywhere from like two to 500,000 bats are in there. Jesus. Is it like two to five thousand? We've seen two total, but there might be 500,000. There could be 500,000. Who's to say?

Here is a review of one. Winda Cave National Park in Custer County, South Dakota. Oh. Wait, we've been. Well, Astro. Astroska, okay. We've been to the park. We've never been in the cave because actually the fun part about Win Cave is that there's a lot of stuff above ground.

And they have a lot of bison and prairie and it's really beautiful above ground. And we went after hours. Distracting. We didn't break in. Danielle, she was like, no, let's just stay up here. We don't need to go down underneath the ground. He's like, look at the beautiful sunset that's happening. There's a bison and a sunset.

What the hell else do you want? Why would we go there? There could be two baths down there. Honestly smart, considering the elevator situation they have. I have heard. Every one-star review was about the elevators. Wow. Okay.

I'm going to read one that's not quite about that first. Here we go. Here's a one-star review. The cave is a dry cave, meaning you won't see most of the beautiful features. Stalactites, stalagmites, columns, etc. of other caves. It's fine if it's your first cave, but not worth it if you've seen others. Whoa. Throwing shade to win cave. That's so funny because I actually was just recently researching when cave and they have, I'm forgetting the term for it at the moment, but they

have what's known as this honeycomb structure that's in this cave and they don't have the stalagmites and stalagites, but they have this honeycomb. feature that is only here in the whole world except for like one or two other places. So it's really interesting. And instead of a cave, you know, when you think of caves, you think of tunnels that go left and right. They go up and around and everywhere. So this cave, you can get really lost in because you can be in one place and you could be going

up, you could be going down, you could be going to the side diagonal. That's where I'm in trouble. No wonder you don't like caves. You're researching this shit? I know. This is scary. I mean, I would probably go, but... I'd probably get lost and have to find the elevator.

I heard that it breaks down a lot and people get stuck in it. Okay, well, maybe never mind that. They do. Just wait. Oh, we'll get there. So the first thing I have here, this was sent in by Kathy, and it is a review sort of tongue-in-cheek post by Mammoth Cave National Park. They shared this on their social media.

This went like semi-viral. I don't know if either of you saw it. saw it. I don't know what your ratio of like National Park content is on your algorithm but I imagine it's pretty high. I don't think I've heard of this.

Oh, okay, great. Come experience what has disappointed millions of people for over 225 years. Mammoth Cave National Park recently rated as one of the most disappointing U.S. tourist attractions. While we think the world's longest cave system in over 4,000

years of human history is amazing, others find that the cave is, quote, very dark, and there is, quote, nothing cool here to see. If you would like to experience the disappointment of Mammoth Cave, visit our website and choose from one of our many activities that will leave you unfulfilled. You can be disappointed by a, quote, dry hole with very few stalagmites, end quote, or discover nothing, quote, other than trees on an over 80 miles of hiking, biking, horseback riding, and water trails. Fair warning, there are bugs in the outdoors, cellular phone. service is spotty and there are stairs on some of our cave tours. A world of regret awaits you at Mammoth Cave. Make your cave tour reservations and find all the information you need to plan your very own not enjoyable visit to Mammoth Cave National Park. Hashtag just another cave park.

And these were all taken from real reviews they've received over the years and they kind of spliced it together into one mega advertisement. We love when the National Park Service gets spicy. They are, they're good at it. They're good and I think we've noticed a shift over the last few years especially now that we've been, you know, paying attention to them more than ever. The algorithm is. Right. We can kind of recognize where the shift of, oh, there's some Gen Z people in their social media. 100% creation now. And it's so funny. They're very clever. A lot of the parks do lean into either different trends or things like that self-deprecating. Right.

It's like they are the federal government, so there is some parameters they need to stay with there are now. There are. There are parameters? But no, yes. For some people, they're parameters. Yes. But they do a good job with working with what they can, I think.

And that's a perfect example because that makes me want to go even more. My next one is one of my most. Yeah, it's not a fun experience. Here's a one-star review of Wind Cave National Park. Oh, this is, I think, probably where the elevator shows up. Or doesn't show. Or doesn't show. Okay, fair enough. The absolute worst experience I've ever had in my life. So we take the short tour. We're going through the cave and everything's all good. Our tour guide was nice and very helpful. We reached the end where we are supposed to take the elevator back to the surface. The elevators are broken. absolute panic breaks loose. Babies are crying.

What the, okay. Who brings babies in a cave, it says? First of all. So they're, they're agreeing with whatever you're screaming about a bit.

Well, no, I'm like, the baby doesn't know the elevator's late. Like, the baby's crying. Yeah,

but they can tell other people are panicked. Maybe. Maybe everyone else is screaming. And the baby's like, guess I'll do it too. The baby's picking up on the vibes. The vibes are bad.

Yeah. Especially with that echo, too. Like, the baby starts crying. Here's the reverb. Here's the, A baby crying was like time for me to cry more. It's just echo location all around.

Oh my God, the bats. You're so right. Babies have echolocation. That's what I've heard. They could have helped find the way out, but they weren't listened to. The Spurs is like, stop your baby crying. Wow. So crazy.

Not one off the rails. Okay. People start pushing. The lights start to go out, et cetera. What? So instead of immediately turning back around and going back the way we came, it takes the park rangers 20 minutes to run. realize that's the solution.

So we begin the ascent back up the cave. For some reason, it made sense to put the old people in the front of the line, and then the park rangers pushed past us so they can make it to the top of four-hour group. So what should have taken 20 minutes took two hours. A bathroom or water break were never provided through our journey, even though the park rangers were drinking from water bottles in front of us. Fantastic. Oh, yeah.

It's like, what do you expect they're going to be like, here's my. a camel back, like have a sip. It's like, I mean, I guess if you are dying of thirst, that's one thing. And bathroom breaks? What are you talking? A bathroom break. They didn't put a bathroom in this emergency exit of this cave. Yeah.

It's a cave. It's full of holes, you know? Don't use the bathroom in the cave, people, is not what I'm saying, okay? Use the cave as a bathroom is what you're saying. Only if it's an emergency. Just kidding. No, you shouldn't be getting. A refund was never even offered when we reached the surface.

I will legit need therapy after this. this experience. Do not go here. Turn back now. End of review. They were not the only person complaining about the elevators. But I will say, just like, I think all of these, the five-star reviews, it was like 90 plus percent were five-star reviews. And there'd be like such a small sliver of one percent, including ones where the elevators break down all the time. Also, if the worst thing that has ever happened to you is that you had to walk back. Yes. Through a cave, you already walked through. Yeah. Yeah. Which. I don't know. Sounds cool.

One of the wonders of the world you had to walk through. It was the worst thing that ever happened. Yeah, but I wasn't watching the wonder of the world. I was watching my tour guide drinking his fucking water the whole time while I died of thirst in the back. Not trying to judge you, but we wouldn't be friends. And like to write a one-star review about this when it's like, oh, the tour guides were great, other than them drinking water part. But the tour guides were great.

Place was cool. It's just the elevators that are out of everyone's control. And the babies and the old people. and putting all the little people first. And then also I was going to say, like, what about these lights turning themselves off? Like, this is scary. That's scary. The elevator stops working.

The lights are turning off. The babies are screaming. Like, I mean. Yeah. Because I'm not saying it was not a scary experience, but come on. Well, by comparison, this isn't obviously a review or anything, but I was doing research on a cave. Carl's bad caverns. And there was a terrorist attack in there, and people took people hostage to them, shooting it up.

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slash beach-2-Sandy for free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com slash beach-2-Sandy. Have you been to La Jolla in California? They have a lot of sea caves and sea lions. Sea lions. Yeah, I have been there once a years ago, and I remember the sea lions in particular

because when we went, there was this overlook and you could see them. So I was looking and I was taking photos. And there was this woman who was, I think she was advocating for the sea lions, but she was doing it in a very scary way where she was screaming on everybody. And I remember I took a photo with them. And I was very far away. They were in the background. And I took and I was taking a picture.

And this woman was like, you're so ugly. Don't take a photo. You're killing the sea lion. I was like, I don't always remember my experience in La Jolla. Wow. And I found this lady on YouTube because she had been harassing a ton of people. And it was all about like saving them and not interrupting them. But I was so far away from them. They were they were just sunbathing. Yeah. I was going to say people go up and like pet them, which like you're not supposed to do. So like she should really focus on those people, not the people taking a selfie from afar. Yeah. Oh my God. Yeah. No matter how ugly they are, you know. They're so territorial.

Not just this woman, but the sea lions are very territorial. The woman's territorial to me. So, yeah, I feel like they're going to tell you. And I feel like we just recently read reviews and where there was a sea lion who attacked a grandma. Maybe it's a little dramatic, but like kind of did. And then also just sat there with all of their belongings. They put their lunch and stuff and their cell phone next to the sea lions and then walked away and came back. And it was like, yeah, exactly.

And then they were complaining. So it's sort of like, that woman needs to be kind of more involved, like on the ground. in that sense, I think. Yes. But to just be calling people ugly for taking the juice. And then to be like, you're killing the sea lions as if, like, your face isn't, like, pretty enough to-so- ugly are killing the sea lions. Like, what?

Also, like, the sea lions probably fucking hate her because she's always screaming the whole time. No, I was thinking you're interrupting them. You're the one bothering them. Jesus. They are stinky, though. I hope she's having a nice day. I hope she's, okay. I hope she got the help she needs.

I've been there. a handful of times. Never seen this woman, thankfully, but... Seriously, we neither. I just remember, they're so stinky and loud and annoying, but I mean, cute. I like sea lines. I just... They are cute. Keep them away from me. Okay, here's a review of La Jolla Sea Caves. A cautionary tale. This is a post on Reddit, and this person, just a little background, had posted on R. San Diego asking for advice on kayaking at these caves. A lot of people do it. They said it was great. And then there's the cave store, which is a store there. I've never been in there, but you can go in and there's access to the caves underneath. You have to pay some money.

Oh, I didn't know. But they have like a gift shop and then it leads to the caves. And this is someone's experience. Here we go. We noticed an adult male with a child kayaking near the entrance of the cave store cave, and my brother commented that it was weird that they were so close, especially since the surf had gotten much larger and stronger. Caves were closed to kayakers at this point, and I believe this one is always closed to kayakers. Lo and behold, two minutes later, this kayak comes into the cave and capsizes. Uh-oh. The surfs started to get more violent inside the cave,

so the little girl made her way to the rocks. Oh my. At that point, she was panicking, seeing her father getting slammed by their kayak against the rocks. I calmed her down enough. Distract, distract, distract, distract. To convince her.

That's in parentheses, that wasn't clear. Distract. You know, we started playing finger puppets. I've always had them on hand just in case. You never know. I love how it made me think there's, like, a sign there, like in case a kid falls off the kayak, Like distract, distract,

Location, location, location. Or their father's getting battered and beaten by the surf. Okay. Everyone's okay in the end, by the way. I didn't. Okay. I should have said that earlier. Well, I saw Danielle and Cassie taking notes for their next episode.

It's like, where was this again? Yeah. An adult male. Distract, distract, distract. To convince her to scramble over to a taller rock so that my brother and I could pull her up onto the viewing platform. So at that point, they were, she wasn't even in reaching distance. She was on a rock. in the water freaking out while they're trying to distract her from a distance before getting her

closer. Jesus. Fucking terrifying. Anyway, my sister-in-law and husband were trying to convince the dad to climb up out of the water as well, but the father was concerned about losing his kayak, not rented. This is not rented. This isn't a rental. I paid a lot of money for this.

I mean, do you guys find that when you're doing stories like, do you find people where you're like, what are you thinking? I imagine. Close weekly. Almost weekly. I mean, I assume that was an obvious. Yeah, but no, yeah. It's, it's.

What a no world. So he handed all his belongings to them, including his kayak. Eventually he got out. His legs totally scraped. Meanwhile, a sea lion was sleeping in the corner, not giving a fuck about what us humans were doing, although his presence did come in handy when I was calming the little girl down. The moral of the story, don't go into these caves unless you are confident in your kayaking abilities and know how to maneuver in tight spaces. Don't bother going in when it's high surf, not worth it. End of review.

And the top comment is, reality is an excellent teacher. Wow, that's deep. And that's true. And that is what we've always said. And that's read it 10 years ago. So a little different than the vibes now. I imagine. Anyway, that is a review of La Jolla Sea Caves, which I really enjoyed. But seeing the kayakers, it does not look appealing. I've seen them and they just kind of sit there. Because they're with a tour, and it's so many that they just, like, kind of go out and just kind of sit there. And the sea lions are like... Slowly go around.

Yeah. And the sea lions are like, what the fuck are you doing? And stay away. And everyone's just kind of... That sea lion was probably judging so hard. Oh, my God. He's like, not another one. Yeah.

Not again. But he did put out with his kayak. That's true. That is true. That is true. Against the odds. Yeah, I feel like I've wanted to be a kayaker. And every time I try it, I'm excited.

And then within 20 minutes, I'm. not excited. And it's because I'm working on my upper body strength. And last night during hot Pilates when I was serving the plate like this, you know, as you do, like two pound weights. We obviously know what you're talking about. Yet like my arms were like this with two pound weights. And I was thinking that's like kind of the same motion. I've used in your farms for kayaking. And it's a sneaky sport as far as needing endurance and strength. Because just paddling like that and that motion for that long just feels not fun for me. I know this is going to come as a shock to everyone with stuff.

Not for me either. My last kayaking experience was really nice. I was at a friend's cabin in Minnesota and we went out. And I will say the worst part was getting in and out of the kayak for me. I couldn't. My balance doesn't exist. And I was just like, what the hell do I do? My friend had to like walk me through how to step into a kayak and then step out.

And then the next time I was like, I can't do it. again. But you're so right. I remember, like, we were out on the lake and it was beautiful, really calm. And I had this, my arms are hurting. And I'm like, I don't know if I could make it back. We had not come back. You have a moment of panic. That's the thing is like at least like three feet deep. Like it wasn't like, but I was like, at least with hot yoga or hot Pilates, whatever, you're like, oh, I can just put my arms down. But with kayaking, you're like, well, now what? Now I'm in the middle of. Yeah, now I have to get back. Yeah. It's not like there was like a tide to bring me back to shore. It's all up to me.

I have a review here. This is of Wookie Hole Caves. What? Oh, yes. You've heard of this? Just kidding. Oh, I'm like, Wookie Hole. I would have believed anything you told me at this point.

I was like, tell us more. You could have gone on and on and on. I feel like this sounds made up, but it does. Oh, that's because it's in the UK. No wonder. That explains. That sounds like a UK name. Wookie Hole.

Doesn't it? And then they're like, it doesn't mean anything weird or dirty? And you're like, then don't name it. something like that, you know. This is a review of Wookie Hole Caves. It is in Somerset, England. Oh, I've been there. To Somerset or Wookie Hole?

Not Wookie Hole. I've been to my step-sister lives in Somerset. No way. Well, now you have somewhere to visit next time you go over there. This is sent by Joe. Here we go. One star by George. Very overpriced and way too commercialized.

What a shame. People are taking our history. and spoiling it. To get the same experience, just stand in a cold shower in the dark and hit yourself in the head with a rock. What? They're doing caves wrong, but what do I know?

The cave is unstable. There's a waterfall somewhere that he got stuck under, I think. Sounds lovely. The actual cave part is quite interesting, but short, the rest is just commercial rubbish designed to part you from your money, in my opinion, not worth the entry fee.

And then they attach like these unbelievably beautiful photos of this just gorgeous cave and caverns. And I don't really know what's commercialized about it. Like I'm looking at a bunch of nature. I mean, I don't see. There are McDonald's down there. Oh, we're unaware of. Oh, is that what you think they're talking about? Just one.

And a Starbucks too. Yeah. Yeah, I'm really amazed because stand in a cold shower in the dark and hit yourself in the head with a rock. That does feel like some of my caving experiences. Yeah. Oh, when you were hit by a rock by your ex and he was hoping you tumble down. You're like opening it up every time.

I'm not talking about that cave. I went to a cave in Belize one time. Oh, duh. I should have remembered your Belize cave experience other than the one you talk about all the time. I'm trying to live up to Cassie and Danielle's experience. Yeah. Just trying to throw out of you. Well, I've been to a cave in Kentucky.

Cool, cool, cool, cool, cool. Belize cave experience? Were you hit in the head with a rock? Well, I just feel like. So Blaze was doing this. This was her honeymoon. Talk about a true crime story right now. We did a few caving and there was one that was like advanced.

And after this belonking incident, the famous belonging incident of 2008, what? You're saying you did the advanced one? Yeah. Why? I wouldn't. I mean, not that I'm more active than you. It was advanced for a resort place. Like it wasn't advanced.

Like if you had children, you shouldn't be on the advanced one. Yeah, but maybe. Okay. I'll let you finish. I'm sorry. Basically, there were these two older people who had just got married and they were heavy smokers. And they were like, can we smoke down there? And they were like, no.

And so that we did the thing. And the whole time they were like, we need a cigarette. And they were like, we can't smoke down here. And they were really struggling. And they even knew at the beginning, they're like, I don't think we're going to be able to do this, but we'll try. And I was like, what? They were from Canada and they were just like these two, they were just like, we're just going to see what happens.

And anyway, long story short, they had to be kind of like escorted back. But Blaze and I got then like a solo like tour of this cave and it was very narrow. And so there was a lot of like accidentally thawking your head on things. And then you'd be walk around, they'd be like, this is where sacrificial things took place. But don't touch any of the pottery. And you're like, what? It's just right there. That's cool.

It was pretty cool. It's like most places could never, like, put things out in the open. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I was amazed that they just let them sit there. Interested people not to take them. Oh, here, I have one right here. Since then, I've been cursed. One of the more interesting parts of touring together as siblings.

Intimate, but also, yes, interesting. Is that we share a hotel room whenever we travel for shows. And we learn something about each other. through those travels. Yeah, we have teeth grinding problems. And you would have thought this is something we would have discussed sooner. But for some reason, in my mind, I was like, this is just a thing I do. And then we start saying in a hotel rooms together and we're like, wait a minute,

we both do this and we probably should figure out a way to address it. And thankfully, there's Remy. We didn't even, maybe we asked the universe to bring Remy to us. But either way, we got an email saying like, hey, would you be interested in working with Remy? And we were like, both hands up face, please. It's meant to be. It's destiny.

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It was like I went straight out because I'm so excited. It's custom fit, everything. And it's an easy process. and so worth it. To protect your teeth with Remy by using code Beach to get 50% off your new night guard. That's 50% off at shop

R-E-M-I-com slash beach with code Beach. Thank you, Remy for sponsoring this episode. We both have had, let's just say, therapy experiences throughout our lives in that we have tried many times to get many different therapists.

And it's a struggle. It can be really tough. The good, the bad, the ugly. You know, we've got stories to talk. Yeah, especially when it comes to finding one that takes your insurance. Yes. Because therapy is very important, but can get very expensive.

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visit rula.com slash beach two sandy to get started. That's rula.com slash beach two sandy. You deserve mental health care that works with you, not against your budget. Well, I have a quick one of Sunny Jim's Sea Cave in La Jolla. It's a different sea cave in the area. Sunny Jim's Sea Cave. Yeah, I have no idea who Sunny Jim is, but here's a one-star review of his cave. You pay dollars to see nothing, really.

It's ridiculous to think you're visiting the pyramids or a historical place, O.L. The pyramid. Which... Don't bring them into this. Kind of a cave system. No, not that I've been. I hear some people here have been to Egypt, but...

Some people. A majority of people in this call have been to Egypt. I've seen the pyramids. We went in one of them. There's caves down there. It felt like a cave. Yeah, see? But yeah, apparently this person

expected something like that or a historical place. Sunny Jim's... Sunni Jim's... Funny James seriously. Like, come on. That's so ridiculous. Didn't live up to the pyramids.

The seven wonders of the world. Sunny Jim's, oh my God. It should be number eight. You're right. It should be number eight. It should be number one, frankly. Okay, okay. Good point.

So of next, I have a little game here for us. Okay, so I'm sure you've heard of subpar parks created by Amber Scher, and she's made some really awesome posters and art and like spin-offs from that. And so she's collected quite a number of really good one-star reviews of National Parks. I'm going to read some real reviews of caves. Some of them are from her collection. Some are just ones I've found. But I am going to remove one specific complaint.

So it's sort of a fill in the blank. So you can all guess like what this complaint is. And I don't know either. We don't prepare these together. No either. I have my own game for a little. all three of you. So here is one of Mammoth Cave to get us started. This is a one-star view. There was a time many years ago when Mammoth Cave Park had some of the best blank in Kentucky,

but not anymore. Hot dogs. I was, I was serious. I was going to say chicken fingers. Okay, Sandy, that was fucking weird. You guys are freaky. And the reason why I was going to say hot dogs is because during the cave war, they set up hot dog stands. Oh, that's right. When Floyd Collins was trapped. And they're like, come on down. We got hot dogs and other shit. I did not know that.

Yes. And that's why I was going to say. And then they sold postcards and shit. They're like, this guy's trapped. I just thought of it because after Mammoth Caves, there's a place that sells hot dogs right there. Like that's kind of food card type thing. Well, I mean, you're all kind of right. The answer is food.

Oh, really? This guy was complaining that the food used to be the best in the whole state of Kentucky. Which is doubtful to me. I feel like after a cave where you're like, I could have died in there. The next hamburger you have is the best hamburger you've had in a while. It sets the bar. And that is true. The best meals we've ever had are following a really difficult time outside.

I think when Cassie goes to Mammoth Caves, that's going to be the best burger ever. Whatever you eat after that, like when you're here. Black bean burger that you popped in your mind? Black bean burger? Hell yeah. Okay. Here's the next one. And this is of Luray Caverns.

And the review is one star. Total scam. Their bottomless pit is blank. Why lie to people? Has a bottom? Is it bottomful? It doesn't go to the center of the earth? Like, huh?

Pretty good. It's only 30 feet deep, they say. Uh-huh. Oh. They say it's only 30 feet deep and visible with a flashlight. However, I did look into this. It's more like 174 feet and then like 280 at its deepest. So I don't know where they're coming up with 30 feet.

Maybe there's like one spot. But that seemed to be incorrect. I probably thought they saw the bottom. Oh, you're probably right. Yeah, because they didn't do the advance tour. Yeah, they maybe got like the kiddie tour, you know. They just get to see the little 30 foot hole. Okay.

Here's one more. This is a Waco Mammoth National Monument, which is not a cave. Isn't that like the site of a tragic? Yes. A massacre sure is, which is unfortunate because I just realized the review is as follows. I was expecting blank, but everyone is dead. I did not do that on purpose. And it is not about the Waco Massacre.

It isn't? That's crazy. And I'm so sorry, everybody. That's not intentional. I was expecting something, but everyone is dead. Everyone's dead. Yep. But everyone's dead.

So what is this is a monument? It's the Waco Mammoth National. monument, obviously. Oh, now I get it. I have no idea. I'm sorry. Some of these are clearly not caves and I just got excited. Hey, that's good.

I don't even know if this is a real thing, let alone a cave. I was expecting witnesses, but everyone's dead. Like animals or sorts? I was expecting mammoths. But all the mammoths are dead. That's so stupid. There were a lot of reviews complaining about a lack of of mammoths, set anything with the name mammoth in it?

Yes, it's very upsetting that they've been extinct. Very sad. This is a review of Hawaii Volcanoes National Park, which is also not a cave. I'm realizing as I do my whole game. There's lava tubes. Okay, I think there are like that's right. There's lava caves. Is that what they're called?

Lava tubes? Yeah. Cool. They're all underground, underground throughout the island where the lava kind of kind of funneled around and then there's caves now. Yep, I guess. That's right. It is.

It's full of caves. Technically a cave is actually what I meant to say. It's full of caves. Paid $20 to get in. Didn't even get to touch blank. Oh, no. Oh. Oh, no.

What do people want to touch, but they shouldn't? Lava. Yep. I'm like, don't tell me they want to touch the lava. There it is. Oh, no. Mammoth Cave. I'm not saying the cave is bad.

I'm just saying all it has going for it is it's blank. And this one's not food. It's not food. Just making sure. That's, I don't. That's, yeah, that's a good answer. It's actually not even a real word, so I should probably just tell it to you. I'm just saying all it has going for it is it's bigness.

Okay, I would have accepted size, I guess. Size would work. Bigness. It's bigness. That's funny. It's not bad. It just has some bigness, and that's it. Some people would appreciate big eyes.

I would say so, right? I don't know. Size matters, you know. So this is a review of Carlsbad Caverns, one star. And I wonder if you'll get this one right. It was super comfortable with its climate control, walkways, and lighting, that it hardly felt like walking through a massive cave system hundreds of feet below the surface. It felt more like being in blank.

If you like an adventure, this isn't it, one star. Whoa. Being in inside. It's got to be dramatic. Prison, like something. Okay, that doesn't really make much sense. Climate control, walkways, lighting. They have that in prison.

Disney World? Walking paths and lighting. Yeah, I think they have that in prison. It hopes. From what I recall of prison. We went, well, I went in middle school. I had to go. I did not.

I don't know why. I had to go too. You did that? Wait, what was the answer? The answer, it felt more like being in someone's super cool family room. But if you like an adventure, this isn't it? So they're basically inside a giant cave with a lighting system, and they're like, this would be a cool family room. I've never been in a family room that was made of rock and geologic adventures.

And honestly, it's not super cool unless you have surround sound. And you do, think about the reverb in this place. Oh, okay. All right. Okay, this is the last one. Crystal Grottoes in Maryland. As soon as we got into the cave, I suddenly realized I hate blank. Caves.

Caves. I'm just jumping in immediately. I'm like, oh. It's caves. It's caves. I realize I hate caves. That's my game. Thank you for playing.

That was so good. I forgot to come up with a word for it. That was a fresh game, and I love games. So I just jumped. I was like, I got to play. I'm sorry. I feel like I ended that one so fast with that last one. It was, I left it at the end of purpose.

Okay. Well, I have my own game, so here we go. This one is called... Two games. Oh, yeah. We love games and bits. This game is called Mammoth Cave or Acadia National Park. Oh.

And it's where I'll read a review of one of them, and you'll have to guess which one it is, because I know you too have special connections to Acadia, and we talked about it in our episode with you. Here's one review. This park is a disaster of human overpopulation, made me wish for... a plague. Acadia. Acadia. That's Acadia.

Yay. Because I remember us talking about how fucking packed those trails are. You did say how packed it gets. You made me wish for a plague. By the way, was that written pre-2020? Because that feels like you kind of don't say that anymore. I didn't write that down. It's too soon, too soon.

Yeah. It is way too soon. Yeah. Had a park ranger freak out on me while holding his gun today for parking the wrong way. while my wife and kids were in the car. Nice work, U.S. Park Ranger's Service. Oh, boy. We got pulled over in Mammoth Cave for speed.

In the cave? No. If in the park for speeding and got like a $450, it was crazy. So I'm going to say Mammoth Cave because I feel like they're just not messing around over there. Acadia. Really? Really? Which surprised me to read that because I actually did read a lot of Mammoth Cave reviews

where people were complaining about how the reactions to a car. A car. A car. Which, in a national park, people do some stupid shit with their cars. Okay, here we go. This has to be the most boring national park in the country. So you're insulting. Somebody.

It's got to be mammoth cave. It is. They're wrong. But still. But still. They're wrong. We don't agree with that. But.

Yeah. Uh-huh. Okay. Here's another. After two and a half hours, we maybe went a quarter of a mile. End of review. This is tough because, and I don't know how it is in Mammoth Cave, but in other caves that I've been to that you're part of a tour.

It's very slow moving. Right, and you kind of have to wait for the next. Yeah. But with, as we talked about on our other episode with Acadia, the trails can get really congested. So I could be 50-50 on this. I'm good about a cave. I am too.

I was thinking of the beehive trail that you took us literally that long to move. I'm going to go with you guys. This was Mammoth Caves. No. Sorry, I was like looking at it. I've never had a line there. I've never been in like a line there.

I think the only thing that was slow for us was yeah, waiting for a group ahead of us or something in the tour. But this was not my experience. But actually being down there, I have no idea how far I went. Like I have no gauge. I don't have that gauge above. ground, distance. I just was walking until I sat on my little chair.

So I don't know what a quarter of a mile is under a cave. As the bat flies, they say. So stupid. I'm sorry. All 500,000 of them. Oh, I forgot there was the rest of the review I wanted to read. This is of Mammoth Caves. This is what it says.

Cass, you're going to love this. The tunnels we crawled through a loop back to the main trail after maybe 30 feet. So you weren't even going into the cave. You were just doing tiny loops through really, repetitive crawl spaces. The guides wouldn't even go in sometimes. They would just stand on the main path and tell us to crawl through one side and we'd come out right by where we started.

What the fuck? This is terrible. It feels like something at like the Sidstani Museum Center. Yes, it sounds like a children's museum. They have an ice cave system. We can like go through and there are crawl spaces. Go ahead, honey. Have a good time.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, you're in a cave. Ooh. Like, oh my gosh. Exciting. I'll be right here waiting for you. I guess for people wanting the experience of spululking without the actual danger of getting lost. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Or whatever. It's kind of. It's like there's only one way and one way. Honestly, that might actually be best for me. I mean, I'd rather do that than alternative for sure. That's true. I'll also just not crawl.

Than actual spalunking. Yeah. Yeah. Cassie did too, for being cave adverse, she has done probably the most cave episodes between us, if not all of them. I like to traumatize myself. Yes, it's a fear. Yeah, I get that. Or just like you've known, you know so much that it's a really logical thing where you've learned so much that you're like, why would I like these? Why would I like these? I've read. They're just too informed. Too informed. Yeah, there was one, she just did. She did Nutty Puddy Caves, which is entirely.

Is that? Like, that's the most. traumatizing. Is that also in England? No, it's in Utah. It's in Utah. Oh, that's the only other one that makes sense, Utah. Okay. But she also just recently did one in Wind Cave where they were down there for like practicing.

And somebody got lost during the mock practice thing. Practicing one. Like a giant operation. They were doing mock rescue. They were there for a course and they were doing a mock rescue. And one of the girls participating in the course. got lost and it turned into the biggest rescue mission in the park's history, girl. No, that's horrifying.

So if she was in that little loop. Oh my God, if only. Everything would have been fine. And you guys, I feel like you didn't respond in the way that we would have thought you would if you knew about nutty putty caves. I don't really know about that. In a bad way. Cassie, do you want to do the honors of telling them?

Oh, my God. Don't make me relive this story so much. Okay. The Nottie Caves traumatized me researching it. It was horrific. But this cave is closed now because of this incident. But essentially, this guy and a friend went splunking here. And it's really tight.

There's really short passages. And he went in. He was trying to go one direction. But he miscalculated where he was. going and essentially he kind of went downwards and the way he ended up is it went down and then it curved

forward and he got stuck like that. Oh my God. And they called in rescue to come get him but he was so contorted in a weird way that his legs to get him out they would have had to break both of his

knees to get him out and they didn't do that so he was under ground fully upside down for hours and he was talking like to rescue to his wife and like we're going to get you out and all of this stuff anyway if you are upside down for a certain period of time all your blood rushes to your head and to your heart and it overloaded his heart and he died with full rescue personnel around him for hours they weren't and then they just shut the cave and he He's, I mean, his remains down.

Jesus. I didn't remember the cave, but I think I've seen, like, pictures of that. Yes. And there's a movie documentary. It happened in 2009. Whoa. This was not a long time ago. Oh, Jesus.

There's like, yeah. I knew it was, like, a notorious cave. No, I didn't know that. I hear Nutty putty and I'm like, that sounds hilarious. That's silly. It's, it's. Spelunking is really, really a sport. or past time that takes a certain type of person that is just like, okay, I know that this could

happen, but I really want to get down there and see what's going on around here. And for someone who likes caves, that's just like another level that I just don't want to enter. Yeah, it's not for me. Some people do that only underwater too. Yeah, that's like that's hot. Add not being able to breathe to that. Right. Add a limited amount of oxygen and a timer. Yeah, forget it. Yeah. No, good. Anyway, oh yeah, I forgot. I do have one. more. The people at the visitor center were nice, but I really don't know how they keep a positive attitude

with all the people going in there. End of review. It has to be Acadia, right? I feel like it's Mammoth. Or I'm at Mammoth. I feel like it's... Yeah, Mammoth, just the way the, like, in here. Going in here, exactly. That was my thought, too. It's Acadia.

Why? I'm so bad at the game. I was surprised at that. Because I also, like, no offense to Mammoth Cades, because I love it so much. But if you work at Acadia, which like the drive in, like everything about that part for me is like such a beautiful area, every little thing. So I'm like,

I would keep a positive attitude just from that alone. And no offense to Mammoth Caves, but it's not the most exciting place to get to. I would say it's easier to have, it's exciting to be in the caves. It's easier to have a shitty attitude if you're working at a,

in the middle of nowhere, Kentucky. I'm inclined to agree unless that's your thing. And it hopefully is for these people. But the visitor center is very nice. They redid it since we were children. So I don't know what year was, Maymouth Caves,

but last time I went, it was so nice. I did read a lot of reviews of people getting a loss on their way, and weirdly, yeah, it's a little confusing. But other than that, highly recommend it. I'd rather get a loss on the way than inside the cave, so that's fine. What? And you'd, like, pull into freaking cave city, like dinosaur world. What's the worst that could happen?

Exactly. You get to see some fake dinosaurs. Exactly. I was a little thrown by that one, but because Acadia, obviously, in Maine, New England, positive attitude, New Englanders. Oh. don't really always mesh as far as being kind of nice. And we are kind of nice.

But we, what is that? Have you seen that map? It's like, acts mean is mean. Acts nice is mean. Axe mean is actually nice. And as far as like in the United States, like, Southerners act nice but are mean. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, right.

Yes. So I think that sometimes we can be a little off-putting, but we really do want you to have. have a lovely experience when you go see Acadia. Especially like places like that. I think anyone who wants to work somewhere like that and give their time to a place like that, you know, they're excited for people to be here. We'll yell at you for parking like an asshole, but we'll be happy.

We won't necessarily brandish a gun, although it does sound like someone did. Someone did. So never mind. Yeah. Okay. This person said holding his, there's no way this park ranger's like, like, where are you, why are you parking that way? Like, that's ridiculous.

It's my first day. They probably saw the gun. Yeah. I 100% think that's true. It's probably like a taser. It's probably not even a gun. Oh, yeah. It's like a fidget or something.

You gave me a fidget. I don't have it on me. You should see the one she gave me. They're dual purpose. It's really intense. It's black, sleek looking. It's not as, it doesn't look like a gun. It looks.

It's not a gun. Sorry, a fidget spinner. What is he talking about? It's like this fidget thing. Our mom was like, what is that? I'm going to hang up on you. That's our mom. On him, not you.

Anyway, well, thank you, Alexander. That was a lovely game. I feel like we failed, but it was a great time. My perspective, you all did wonderfully. Thank you. Well, we want to say thank you to Cassie and Danielle for coming on the show, to read or I guess just listen to us, blab about one star cave reviews. Thank you both for coming on. Can you tell people where to find you?

You can find us at National Park After Dark on all social media things. Their website is amazing. I love it. Oh, yeah. N-PADD Podcast.com. We love our website. We had a great web designer who put it together for us. And I kind of do the back end upkeep with adding episodes.

And we have book recommendations and documentary stuff for every episode we do. Anytime we talk about it or use it as a reference, we'll add it there in case people want inspiration for reading or watching. Nice. And yeah. National Park, at York. Yeah, actually, you know, on top of it. And we did an episode with them. So that was really fun.

So go check that out. And we had a best time. And yeah, we appreciate you guys. Yeah, thanks, y'all. Thanks for having us on. It was so fun. Yeah, tell me when you come to the cage. Yeah, please.

Oh, I will. I will. We'll get a hot dog or a vegan hot dog. Beach, too, Sandy, Water, Too Wet is produced and hosted by Zandi and Christine Cheever. The show is edited and mixed by Sarah Borges Wendell of VW Sound. Pluto TV has thousands of free movies and TV shows. You swear? If I'm lying.

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