Bear Grease - Ep. 152: BEAR GREASE [RENDER] - Deer, Dogs, & Old Friends

Episode Date: October 11, 2023

This week on the Render, Clay Newcomb is joined by Gary “Believer” Newcomb, Brent Reaves of “This Country Life”, Andy Stanphill, Aaron Stanphill, and Luke Alston.Topics discussed include: How Clay knows the Stanphill Brothers through Scott Brown, and how they met Luke. High country archery fall from grace - probably because they bought an airplane. Pulling back a 70 pound bow in the 90’s. Running dogs & Charley and Louie Dale Edwards. The dividing line of July Men and Walker Men. How running deer with dogs got banned from the Ozarks. When seeing a deer was worth interrupting the Sunday Church Service to go run deer dogs. The crew’s favorite stories from Deer Stories - The Unexpected (Part 1). What we do with our deer racks and how that’s evolved through time. Lum and Abner and the Dick Huddleston store in Pine Ridge, AR. Does anything other than a black panther drag its kill into a tree? We really doubt you’re gonna want to miss this one… Connect with Clay and MeatEater Clay on Instagram MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and Youtube Shop Bear Grease MerchSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. First Lights fieldware collection is made for the work that happens long before opening day and continues when the season ends. Products built for early mornings, full days and real use. Hard wearing where they need to be versatile where it matters. No shortcuts. Just gear designed for the work that earns the season.

Built to perform, built to last. Check out. First Light's new field. Worldware Gear at firstlight.com. My name is Clay Newcomb, and this is a production of the Bear Grease podcast called the Bear Grease Render, where we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the scenes of the actual Bear Grease podcast. Presented by FHF Gear, American Made, Purpose Built, Hunting and Fishing Gear that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore. Well, welcome to the Bear Grease Render podcast.

So for anybody that is new to this, the Bear Grease world, the Render podcast is where we talk about the Bear Grease podcast. The Bear Grease podcast is a documentary style podcast, Brent, right? Agreed. And so the Render is where we gather up an eclectic crew of usually just, like gritty Americans that come in here and we talk about last week's podcast. Man, I'm pumped about the eclectic group of people that we have here today. So I'll do my introductions to my left.

Brent Reeves, looking sharp, brother. Always clean socks. Good, right, one left. Good. Man, this country life, so Brent's the host of this country life podcast. We'll come back to that. Okay. To your left, two brothers that I,

You guys are like legends in my world. I mean, I'm not kidding. I'm going to tell you why. You've got low standards. I've got Andy and Aaron Stanful here today. Aaron was a storyteller on the Deer Stories podcast, and he's going to have another story on the next podcast. But let me describe how I know these guys.

Prison? Yeah, I went to prison in 2003. I knew it. No. So I was one of my. heroes, and still is to this day, is Scott Brown. Scott was like four years older than me, which is the perfect age to idolize somebody and to kind of be influenced by who they are. Scott went to the University of Arkansas. I get married, my first married home was in Fayetteville.

I started working, and Scott was from my hometown. Me and Scott start working together, which worked the same place. And so, and by that time, Scott had knew you guys. and was hunting with y'all and he talked about you guys like y'all were just like the best hunters that ever lived he did and so i just i believed him back then and uh no no no do you remember one time erin i rode in the truck with you and scott to go hunting uh see i was just like a little pipsqueak it was just like It was. It's just like Brown, who's this guy? Why is he here?

That's the way I felt being around you. It seemed like us, a group of guys, we hunted all the time. Me, Lucas, Scott, we went to the management area three days a week. So you may have been on one of those trips. Yeah, I was. I remember it, so you don't. But didn't you come to our camp one year? Well, yeah, I did.

So that would have been after that, probably the same year. Okay. Y'all camped in some public ground over here. and I went to the camp and it was all the guys I'm getting ahead of myself let me go ahead and introduce the whole crew so our buddy here can jump in

to Aaron's left is my dad Gary the believer nukem how's it going dad do you hear your name come up in the podcast a couple of times? Yeah man I love it I'm getting almost as famous

as old Render Man over here Render boy Render boy Yeah you agreed with me too didn't you You knew it was the Black Panther that stole Mose Buck There's no question about that I mean, everybody knows that the regular cougar won't go up a tree.

Yeah. Of course. You got to be a black one. It had to be in a black one. Just like that one right there. You see our black panther over there, Andy? That's nice. Yeah, that's a nice touch.

So to Dad's left, Lucas Austin. Luke, good to have you, man. Thank you. So Luke was a storyteller, too. Man, he had a home run on the last story on this first episode. He did. It was fantastic. It really was.

And I told it, so, Luke, I've known you most of my life, but we weren't, our circles never, they overlapped briefly. Yeah, because you're enough younger than me. And then when you and Scott, when you came to Fayetteville, it was about the time I was leaving Fayetteville. Right. And, uh, but I remember you as a young pup, your dad bringing you the bowshoots and, I mean, you as a youngster. And, uh, I remember. So I've known you when you said long time, that's accurate. Yeah.

You know where I remember your face most, Lucas, was on Polaroid pictures at the Bow Shop. For real. Oh, killer. I mean, there's just some things you just remember. Yeah. I remember seeing, you know, this guy four or five years older than me that was killing deer and hogs and stuff.

I feel like you kill. I feel like I remember there was a picture of you with a hog. so anyway just stuff you remember but uh no i told i told luke that for what a lot of times for what i'm trying to do in a stories podcast a sentimental story is a hard one to pull off and i i'm glad i didn't tell him i'm glad i didn't coach him because i just trusted him that he would know how to handle a story i often coach people not to tell sentimental stories because everybody Everybody's got one, and they don't always translate. Do you understand what I'm saying?

I mean, I'm not trying to be, like, mean or something. But, like, everybody's got a story about when their kids' first deer, or this or that. And a lot of times, it's super meaningful to you, but as far as entertainment value, it's hard to translate. He knocked it out of the park with this one. Like the, I meant it. I meant it when I said, sitting there listening to you tell the story, I was like, take that gun away from that boy. Shoot that near. And then Ryan gives him the gun.

And I'm like, oh, dang. I was a little upset. I was like, shoot, I didn't really want him to take it. And then he gets the bead. And I'm like, yeah, he's about to shoot that buck. And he's like, nope. And I'm like, no, Luke, don't give it back to him. Back when I knew Luke, he'd have shot the two doze that come out of cart.

That's like I never got there. That's why I made the statement that I have not always been this way. Because, yeah, when, because when Aaron and I run around together, there was nothing safe with me. And, but things have sure changed. They sure have. A lot of things have changed. Well, no, to go back, so Lucas, Aaron, and Andy, y'all all knew each other real well for years and years. Aaron, tell me how you met Lucas.

I was a sophomore or a junior, probably a sophomore in college, went to the University of Arkansas. And right the first week I walked into a computer class. I don't even remember what the class was called. But anyway, I walked in there and I was lost and just trying to find somebody that looked like me, you know, to set by. And I saw no boy sitting up over the high country archery shirt on. That's a mark right there, isn't it?

I thought, I'm going to go set by him. And anyway, we become best friends immediately. We, that was it. We were peas and carrots after that. In our deer camp the next fall. Yes. Yeah. Now, that brings up an interesting name.

High Country. When you told that story to me the other day, what the, High Country used to be, this is a little bit of a rabbit trail, but Dad was a, big high country man back in the day high country was the top of the line bow in the 1990 yes it really was it was hard to beat it was fast good looking it was it was I'd like to do a marketing a marketing inquiry and a business like like to understand what happened

because they could they were so big the name was so good the bows were so good and today I think they're actually still in business. I think they're still in business, but they're, like, not a major player, unfortunately. That'd be interesting to find out what happened. You know, I would bet they bought an airplane. What do you mean? What do you mean?

Tell me what you mean. Well, it's kind of a deal in banking. If you get your, you know, first time you really get in a big box, you want an airplane. Sometimes you buy it about 10 years too early. Mike drop moment from the old banker. Bought an airplane. What kind of high countries did you have?

Oh, I had Excalibur. Yeah, yeah. I had several, and I blew a lot of them up. You know, I got one shooting 340 feet per second back when guys were shooting 220, You know, and I almost won a big archery turnip with it because I could shoot out to 40 yards pretty flat. I mean, you put it at 40 yards and just come up two inches and wacko. And, you know, it was pretty amazing. Took it home and I thought, I'm going to go to this really big shoot down in South Arkansas

with a bunch of fannies. And I pull my bow back in the backyard and both limbs. just folded up. And I never went to another tournament until, you know, Louis Dale got me to go to a tournament one year out at his house. And so I'd just quit tournaments after that. There was a bow shop and worn, and this would probably be, man, it was way early. It was late 80s, maybe 90 at the most.

And they had a 70-pound high country in there. And I knew the guy that run the bow shop, he said, man, you got to shoot this thing. I said, what's it said it? I said, 70 pounds. That's all you, I can pull that back. I was worried I wouldn't go to have children for a long time. That was the hardest thing.

That thing was stout, buddy. I mean, you had bows back then, a 70-pound bow pulled him back today and won back 30 years ago. I guess it's been 30 years in it. It was a big difference. I remember that was my first introduction to how. country was that was a man's bow. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, man. I didn't get one. Andy, when did you start bow hunting? 1995, I believe. So I was 15 and 95. How much younger? Aaron's the older brother. I think there's three and a half years between us.

Yeah. So I just basically wasn't strong enough to shoot a compound bow until, you know, 95, really. I shot a crossbow there for a couple years. and started bow hunting in 95. And that was the first year that I hadn't even killed a deer before then at all. And hunted a lot. And I think in the podcast last week, Aaron, you mentioned, you know, how hard it was to even kill a deer with a bow back then. You know, I don't know if it was just a lack of experience or what it was, but we, it wasn't, I mean, I was hunting hard out there and just, you know, wasn't seeing the number of deer.

And anyway, that first year that I started bow hunting in 95, I killed my limit. I limited out that very first year. And so, yeah. 95. Yep. 95. Dad brought up an interesting name there that came upon the podcast, Louisdale. Louie, if you've listened to the Bear Grease podcast, you know who Louisdale and Charlie Edwards are.

I actually went back and listened to all three of those episodes from early in the Bear Grease were. on Louisdale and Charlie because on this episode, Louisdale and Charlie came up. You probably knew them pretty good, didn't you, Lou? Yeah, because, you know, coming from a dog hunting family, you know, there were just certain areas of dogmen, you know, and you knew not to go that way with your dogs because that Edwards, you know, that was their territory.

We had our territory. And, you know, and back then, everybody had a place. pin full of dogs. And, of course, my family was similar to what Travis Ross said. They run in his dad, Gene, and my dad and uncle and all them running the same circles. Okay. So your dad. Fox and wolf hunting was the main thing.

And then they just ran deer when season opened. It wasn't that they had specific deer dogs. They just had running dogs that would run a deer. You told me how many dogs your dad and uncle had at one time. Between my dad, my uncle, my grandpa, it was not uncommon for us to have 50 hounds. And when I say 50 hounds, I'm talking 50 walker running dogs, not tree. They were specific to running coyotes and fox and deer. And so I grew up in that.

Steel hunting was not in my family. So I kind of broke the mold with steel hunting. And, you know, in my dad's generation, there were no deer. Kind of like Andy Brown talking about his dad, Barney, who I knew as a young man, he was a character. Let me tell you. And if you were offended by language, you would get offended quickly in his presence. But he was a good man. Love them July hounds.

And Andy even mentioned, you know, his dad cast him. them julys well i i come from a family of folks that hated julys oh really yeah my if it wasn't a walker it wasn't worth having now but a july is a walker not in my world okay uh not in my world they weren't but they looked they were they were a tricolored white black and brown dog yep did they would they have looked any different uh they're built built basically the same so but there was a difference but you could tell them looking at them if it was a if it's July. What would a July would be sleeker, thinner?

Not necessarily. Maybe, but more of their coloring. They'd be more of a yellowish color. They didn't have a lot of white on them. You said, No, they were, they were not black white tan. They were kind of yellow,

yellow black tan. Okay. But it is always fun to listen to them old timers, you know, fuss. The July men versus the Walker men. I mean, it was a dividing line. It was just like OU and OSU. If you're a sooner fan or if you're a cowboy fan, you know, you could get in a fight quick.

Now, Travis said something that I would have qualified that I kind of just let it go. He said his dad was a fox and wolf hunter. Yes, sir. Which we all know, and he knows it too, that there hadn't been wolves around here for 100 years. Right. Or probably 130. years. But that was what everybody referred to as, you know, I guess back in the original days of

whenever it was 130 years ago or whatever, however long ago it was, we did have wolves. And, but when you hear of somebody talking about fox and wolf dogs, that's what they're talking about, coyotes. Yeah. Yeah, it was kind of just a given. I knew he was talking about running coyotes. Yeah. And he did too.

Yeah. Fox and Wolf Hunter. Yeah. Yeah. If you're saying the associations around the stock. still to this day they don't say fox and coyote it's fox and wolf fox and wolf hunter associations yeah

huh at least the ones I'm familiar with dad did you know Barney Brown Andy's dad I did not he died in the mid 90s maybe yeah we were pretty young we're Scott and I there's about a year of difference Scott and I

he was probably 10 or so when his when his grandpa passed he loved his ham probably more I mean I and you'll you've probably heard Andy say this very thing that the dogs ate before the family did I mean he cared for his dogs and uh because they put meat on the table you know it was it was kind of a net it was a tool yeah and uh does your family any of your family still run dogs they do not uh most of my family's gone my uncle still living but and in poor health

and he was the he was the sure enough dogman and who was that everybody's going to know him as as dude Alston okay his his handle his CB handle is the watchmaker

okay he uh he he worked at Thomas jewelry had his own jewelry store for years and he his trade was working on watches okay okay is it are you a little bit sad that that's gone

I am because some of my greatest memories of my previous generations, my father, my grandfather, my uncle, and all those guys that a lot of them have passed on are memories that were made with dogs. And it was a totally different kind of hunting. And I know for folks that have never done it, it might have been controversial.

It was never controversial. for me. I understood, you know, I understood the game. Because I saw the love and respect that my family had for their hounds. And the feeling, two totally different feelings that you get from running dogs to steel hunting,

running dogs, an adrenaline rush like, like I can't explain, you know. And there ain't no deer management. with that. You're not... You're not being very selective. You're not being very selective, you know, as I've heard my uncle say plenty of times, you know, you just build a fence of bullets and hope they run into it.

Yeah, that's right. But most of them guys did it, not for killing anything. They won't hear a good race. Yeah. And so having a good dog was better than money. And because you could sit around and talk about a good dog. for generations. Money's gone, you know.

And some of the finest men I ever knew, best storytellers I ever knew were dog hunters. They could tell a story. And it's kind of an art to tell them a good story. Not everybody has honed their craft. I'm afraid they're, I won't get off on a wild goose chase here, but I'm afraid our younger generations are losing that because of social media and texting and the lack of communication.

But I'm going to tell you something. And telling a story to me will outlast most things because people are going to remember a story that they heard, you know, just like all of us sitting here right now. I could tell so many stories that we'd be here a week. And I'm not sure that a younger person could duplicate that because they don't know that they've soaked it all in or know how to articulate what they've seen, what they've. experienced. So I'm extremely thankful to have been exposed to people that could tell stories, have some

stories of my own, and so very important. Last spring, Clay Newcomb and I collaborated with Jason Phelps at Phelps game calls and building each of our own favorite turkey diaphragms called prime cuts.

Now I'm going to tell you, I love mine because it's easy to use. I'm not going to go, I'm not going to win a turkey calling contest. It's just not going to happen. But when I run this call, I get the sounds that gobblers are looking for. I have a great turkey hunting track record. If you go listen to real turkeys out in the woods, they're not going to win calling contests, right? That's who I listen to. I can make those sounds on my cut. I also hunt with Phelps's cut, and I hunt with Clay's cut because they're all three great cuts. Check out Prime Cuts at Phelps gamecalls.com. I think you'll be glad. I think you'll be

glad you did. And you'll find out that the Steve Ronella cut is an easy-to-use cut for beginning callers who just want to start making good turkey noises and getting action. Did y'all have any exposure to dog hunting, Aaron and Andy? Very little. But we did have some. So listen, in Arkansas, there's basically four regions of Arkansas. There's the Ozarks, there's the Washtals, which is a southern mountainous region.

there's the Gulf Coastal Plain and there's the Delta. It's not really four quadrants, but it's like that. In the mountains, well, I mean, 50 years ago, you could have run dogs anywhere in the whole state, and that would have been common throughout the southern United States running deer with dogs was the way that deer were hunted. And then gradually just things changed. And dog hunting in the Delta,

it was less practical there because of lots of private land. But in the Ozarks, I heard, I heard this from someone who knows the story that in the 90s, there was a commissioner of the Arkansas Gaming Fish Commission that lived in the Ozarks that just wanted dog hunting gone. And that was his agenda on his seven-year term as a gaming fish officer was to eliminate dog hunting in the Ozarks. And he did that. Yeah, I was going to say, I think one reason we weren't exposed as much as we hunted public. land. Yeah.

And I think just prior to when we really got to hunting, they banned hunting with dogs on public land. Yeah, there was the early 90s. You know, lots of times we'd be hunting. And we could hear dogs that were joining the management area on private. And lots of times they'd run deer to us or, you know, be honest with it, we'd, I remember trying to sit close to those fence lines. Well, there was one year that, I don't know who pulled the strings, I don't know if it

was dad or who it was, got us into that joining property. We did. And so we could, I don't know how many, there were several hundred acres. Yeah. So, I mean, we got in there. We did. That was my first chance or first opportunity to run dogs. And, man, I remember it was, it was awesome.

It was. It was excitement. You killed a deer. I killed two deer. And I killed a bobcat. So when we left camp, when we left camp, I had never been exposed to that. So when we left camp, dad looked at me and he said, you know, we're after me. I mean, we need meat.

You know, we're over here camped. We don't have any meat. And if you see a deer, you pull the trigger. And so here come them dogs. I could hear them. And, man, I was excited. And, you know, of course, just like they told me, here, you know, we're two doze out in front of the dogs. And I had a lever action 30-30, open sites.

And then there were two doze. And which I don't know back then. I don't know what the laws were, but anyway, so these two doves were out in front of these dogs, and it was probably 150, 175 yards away up the hauler and made the two best shots I've ever made in my life. The first one dropped, and the second one I miss, and of course I levered another one in there,

and I missed a second time, and the third shot, I got that next one, but, man, it was awesome. I mean, we were all excited, and I was hooping in the hollering, and I had a great time doing that. I'd like to have got to do that more. Yeah. Yeah. You know, to me, it's a lot, it's a lot bigger issue than just can you do it in one spot or not.

When you look across the big traditions of hunting in North America, there's really not a lot of places where you can still run dogs. And I said on the podcast, I grew up as a bow hunter in an area where they could run dogs. And I killed a few deer in front of dogs hunting with the cunning ham, some good friends of mine. and I loved it, but we didn't have deer dogs. That's not the way we hunted. Dad was a bow hunter. But now I am adamant. I mean, just I'll debate anybody in the world, Brent Reeves,

on just the importance, the cultural importance of keeping some of this stuff alive. I mean, yeah, and if you live in some area where they're running dogs and you don't want to have dogs, and, you know, I could talk about the pros and cons, And the cons would be dogs don't understand private property lines. And they just don't. And a deer's going to run somewhere and a dog's going to follow it. And man, the way that that was handled in the decades past when people knew their neighbors, they understood kind of what people were doing is they just kind of tolerated when things, when a dog came across or when it was just kind of a known thing. thing and it worked.

They had a system that worked. And then as the world has changed, which it has a lot, people are moving into these rural areas. I mean, in the 70s, 80s, and 90s where we all grew up, there wasn't a lot of, quote, unquote. Yeah, outside. Yeah, there's no reason to go there. Today, a lot of people buying recreational property in rural America everywhere, coming from different places. And so it's a lot more of a society that is, it doesn't know each other. that's and so there's there's there was a system that worked and it's much harder now and and even back

then when I was a kid I remember people that hated the dog runners for sure and uh in in in my mind it's like for what we're for what we're up against culturally I I love it I love it and I love that there's still there's still a lot of dog running going on a lot of families are still yes are still doing And even some younger generation of people that are still running dogs and whatnot. Yeah, it's not extinct. In some of the counties that you have a lot of National Forest in, Scott, Montgomery, Polk, still a lot of dog hunters. You know, and I miss it just because, you know, it was something that generations of my family did. and still have, you know, the connection to the memories that were made doing all those things.

And, you know, I could probably reel off 90% of the dogs that my uncle and my dad owned. I could still, I could describe them to you, tell them, tell you their names and all those things. And it was the night before modern gun deer season and my family was, was better than Christmas Eve. We'd gather at my grandparents' house. And my grandpa was a World War II veteran, hardest working man I ever knew, ever will know. He had no hobbies, zero.

But other than he liked to go deer hunting. And carried a shotgun, buckshot. He'd shoot the world down. I guess he shot it every deer every single. And didn't kill a lot. You know, he's kind of like, you know, kind of like Barney, Brown. My grandpa was born. It was either 1916 or 1917.

And one time my grandpa was not one to throw a lot of kudos your way, a lot of compliments. He was a real tough guy. But I skinned a deer one day in front of him. And he said, you know what you're doing right there. And that was maybe one of the first and only compliments I ever got for my grandfather. And we got, oh, it meant the world to me, you know, that I had a skill that my grandpa thought was pretty neat. But I think that year, I think in that one season I killed more deer in one season than my grandpa did in his entire life. And my grandpa lived to be 83 years old.

So he was in that generation of where there were no deer at all. You know, I can remember a story. I can't remember who told this story, but I, know it was true because I heard it from more than one person that somebody had not made it to church that Sunday morning and on the wherever they were at, they seen a deer across the road. And they drove to the church house, kicked open the door and announced to the congregation in the middle of the sermon, I just seen a deer across the road and everybody filtered out of the church house, went to the house, gathered the dogs, and the race commenced.

and to the best of my knowledge this occurred in like July and it was it was not even a hint of deer season you know season didn't season did not matter they seen a deer they're going to do their best try to collect it so

Brent of the stories you heard which one stood out to you so there was seven seven stories on this episode well they were all good I figured you'd probably like mine the best. Did you tell one?

The Apple story was great. Dale Craig. It was. It was wonderful. And while I was listening to it, I could see. He told a story very well. And I could see when he dropped that Apple, the Apple started rolling. I thought, oh, I know where this is going.

Oh, did you think he was going to call Adirian? I did. I did. I really did. I thought this is going to be good. And it fell out. It went that way because I was reminded of a story of a friend of mine told me 20 years ago when the snort wheeze crazed just started coming out.

He said, you know, deer never did that before 2001. Exactly. Before they started calling it. But he said, I bought one of these things. He said, I climbed up on my deer stand. He said, I was sitting there. He said, when I first sat down on that stand, he said, pulled it out of my pocket.

He said, I didn't know which end of this thing that blow. He said, I just went, whew, and blowed it like that. And I said, I looked at it. The next thing I know, I mean, it was a good deer. It was a 140-inch deer come crashing through, and he shot him at the bottom of his stand. Just from that one little blow thing, you know, that he did. He said, and it wasn't even close to what it sounded like. He said, but I heard it coming.

So it reminded me of that story that I had, you know, some connection with. Something unexpected calling in a. deer. Exactly. Yeah. And I killed a turkey one time in Missouri. I was crossing a fence and I was a lot closer to that turkey than I thought. When I put my hand on that bobwire, it screeched in the staple.

It went, gow, and the turkey gala. And I just said, I sat down by the fence post and ten seconds later, the turkey poked his head up over a hill and I killed him. So I know what that guy was dealing with. Yeah. So identified. You know, this episode, came together and I had I had more I've got twice as many stories as what's been told on this first one

and I I cherry picked kind of entitled at the unexpected because every story there was something unexpected that happened from Dale's apple to Aaron peeing out of a tree calling one in to to Mo Shepherd's mysterious deer in the tree. to Andy Brown's dad, hitting one with a truck. Me, I threw mine in just because I could. Me hunting with my daughter down below me, which was just different. That's the best story you have ever told me. You said that.

I loved it. You know what I did? I told that story to Aaron. I learned a trick. A lot of times if I'm telling a story, I recorded it in here by myself. And he was here at the office. Aaron came here at the office to tell me a story. story and I said, hey, let me tell you a story.

And it was, it was easier. It was easier to like kind of get the five. I feel like you could do a part two, three, four through 30 on Deer Stories and they would all be fantastic episodes. Yeah. They really did. Well, I'm going to make at least one more and maybe even two more. And, you know, I could have done one on big bucks. I probably will at some point.

It's not near as fine. Well, it might, it would be. It could be, though. I mean, to hear everybody's, like, biggest buck story, might do one on the deer that got away. You know, dad tells a story on the next one of a big one that got away. It was a great story. I want to go back, though, to Dale Craig and the Apple.

When Dale Craig told me that story, I told him afterwards, I said that's one of the best stories that I've ever heard told on this podcast. I thought that. Just the way it happened. That's the kind of story I like. But Dale Craig is the kind of guy that I can't say that he's never listened to a podcast, but it would not surprise me in the least if he said, Clay, I've never listened to a podcast in my life. I mean, you know Dale Craig, Dad, you know him.

He's a rural cattleman, cowboy, farrier. And I went to his house, and it's the first time I've been to his house. I kind of just have known him most of my life. And I went to school with his boys, but they were just kind of people I knew and always had a lot of respect for. And so I finally went to his house and I said, man, I'd love to see some of your deer.

And he was like, yeah, I got a few out here. And I mean, people like me have him hanging on the wall, like right here, you know. And if I meet you, I'm like, hey, you want to see my deer? I'm in here. Dale was like, yeah, yeah, I got a few. And we went out to a storage building. him and he had some racks in there and he pulled them out and set him in the grass and I mean

they were just all just it was five or six you know 140 to 150 inch deer and I was just like oh man wow this and he's telling me the stories you know this one came from here and this one came from here some of the places he could see from his house he looking miles away into the mountains from his house he'd say that deer came from over there and then he's like come out here for a minute and we walk into his barn and these deer weren't up i envisioned like just deer all over this barn he had he had barrels full of racks that he probably hadn't looked at in 15 years that he starts pulling out and i mean like deer that would be mounted on my wall i mean like 135 to 150 inch deer just on the skull he just well it meant something to him or he wouldn't he wasn't well

Well, it reminded me of, again, I'm kind of reminiscing on the Louis-Dill and Charlie episodes, but the final episode of the Louis-Dill and Charlie series, I asked Stony Edwards, I said, do you have a bunch of the racks of the deer that your dad killed? And he was like, no. And I was like, what do you mean you don't have any deer horns or your dads? And he said, they didn't keep them. And I was just like, what? And he said, he said, Clay, he said, when we did.

We'd have deer camp, he said that week of deer camp, whoever killed the biggest deer was a big deal. It was a big a deal as anything in the world. And we'd have those racks sitting over there. And he said, when we started packing up deer camp, dad would tell some kid, hey, if you want to take those horns home, you can. I mean, it just didn't mean anything to them. And these horns meant something to Dale. But my point is, this guy is a big buck killer. I mean, a big buck killer.

And, you know, he's not advertising it to the world. He's not, I just went to him and cherry-picked some of his stories. But those are the kind of guys I like to have on the Bear Grease podcast. Guys like Luke and Aaron and Andy that hadn't been on many podcasts. Well, he's a good storyteller. He did a great job of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm going to tell you something.

He is one of the hardest working human beings that's ever. ever lived and probably it'd be hard to it'd be hard to argue this probably one of the most successful cattle ranchers around and he is a working dude and he has he has raised some hard working deer killing machines too and his daughter's one of them she's killed some thumpers but he's he's taught all his kids yeah to live life live a life like him hardworking, you know, good hunters. So, yeah, Dale could sit around to tell you stories until the cows came home, literally.

Yeah, that was a good one. Andy, which of the stories did you like? Man, I remember listening to the episode. I thought, man, this is, you know, I'm going to talk about this one. Every one of these guys, you know, had something that really struck home with me, you know, I just went through the roller coaster of emotions

throughout the whole episode I felt like you know some of them were funny errands and Andy's were hilarious you know Were you surprised when Annie's dad ran that deer over? Unbelievable You know to back over the thing again was just putting the icing on the cake

for me but you know back then like he said you know there wasn't all that very many deer so when you finally seen a deer you did what you had to do to put meat on the table. So that's just where we come from. I really appreciate that episode or that, Andy telling that story.

But no, for me, you know, Luke, yours really, I mean, I just want to give you a big old bear hug when you finished. You know, man, because I can relate with that. I mean, I have a six-year-old boy, and I'm getting in, you know, he's finally getting into it, you know, and he's really wanting to be out there. And this is our first year, opening weekend of both seasons was our first time to get out there.

And, you know, every year previously, I've been shooting my bow a lot, you know, in the summer and getting ready and doing it all for me. But it's not about me right now. It's, I just want to get him going. So I related to you, you know, so much it's a huge sacrifice for you to let, you know, him pull the trigger on it. And, yeah, I was basically just about in tears at the end of year, at the end of years. Like I say, I just want to give you a big bear hug. Yeah, I had a lot of feedback on yours, Luke. A lot of people really said that was a neat story.

It was. You did a really good job, Luke. Yeah. Appreciate it. Yeah. Aaron, which one stood out to you? And you can't say Luke's now. Okay, Luke's?

You could say mine. If mine stood out to you, that's fine. I'd like to hear about it. But we've given Luke all credit he needs. I mean, this is his, like, second podcast. I don't want him to, like, start thinking, hey, man, you know, man. I'm too busy to be a podcaster. I liked all of them.

I did. I didn't have a favorite. I did like the fact that Andy Brown said, he said, if we'd have met a car, we'd have just run over them. He meant it. Yeah. Man, on stories like Andy, I'm cutting you off,

to be your turn just a minute. To me, when I hear a good storyteller, it's always some obscure thing they say that isn't relevant. You know, is it highly relevant that you never forget. Yeah. Yeah, and Andy said, we were coming down through there and we're going so fast. We'd have just run over somebody if we'd have seen him. You kind of, you just like, you get it.

If we'd have met a car, we'd run over them. We'd just run over them. Yeah. It's like kids and cussing. You can be talking about anything and say one cuss word, and that's what the kid's going to go back in the house. How do you know that, Brent? I'm just saying. I saw it on TV.

Yeah. Okay. But I liked Andy's honesty with his, you know, with his dad. Yeah. I enjoyed that. I enjoyed the history of his dad. And what that meant, you know, to his dad, killing a deer was a big deal.

They had their family. It was part of the sport, too, but, I mean, none of that deer went to waste. It would be totally unethical today, you know, to do something like that. But back then, it was a different time. Yeah. I enjoyed that.

I really did. I had to talk Andy and tell him that story. So Scott told me, he said, man, you ought to get my dad. dad to tell about Barney Brown in that particular story. And I had texted Andy, and he didn't respond back immediately, and he called me. And he said, Clay, if I tell that story, they're going to run us out of town or, you know, something like that.

And I said, I hear what you're saying. And I said, I don't want you to tell if you don't want to. I said, for real. But I said, I think we can give the context in such a way that it will. be, it'll actually be really powerful because that's where we came from, whether we want to acknowledge it or not. It is what it is. And I felt like it, the, he did such a good job of telling the context, the history of his

dad, I mean, his dad going to prison and, you know, just the hard times, what it meant for them to kill a deer. I mean, just, it was perfect. I loved it. I loved it. I did too. breaking in the Lumen Abner store. I wish he had a lot of listeners might not know what he's talking about.

Right. I mean, it's Lum and Abner. I mean, they were the star Hollywood people in probably what, the 20s or so? So the Dick, I'm glad you said that. So the Dick Huddleston store in Pine Ridge, Arkansas was the basically the home office of Lum and Abner, which was a national radio program that ran for 23 years in America. and these two, basically these guys, we talked about them on our Arkansas podcast, we did,

but Lum and Abner were the face of the American hillbilly for 23 years when radio was the biggest thing. I mean, they were national celebrities. Like you would have recognized the president of the United States and Lumman Abner. And they were based out of Pine Ridge, Arkansas, down there where we were at. And so the Dick Huddleston store was the Dick Huddleston,

Lumman Abner store. The Jodham Down store. Jot them down store. It's still there today. It's incredible. It's a museum now. You put a post of that store. Yeah. A couple months ago.

Yeah. So, Barney, he knew how to pick him, man. Yeah. You know, do I get the little grocery store down here, the Lumen Abner store, sir? Yeah. Well, I thought it was interesting that they turned, he turned himself in. Yeah. He went and told his uncle, you know, boy, I'd like to hear how.

how that story went, you know? Yeah, yeah. What happened there? But, uh, no, that was probably, I'm kind of like, I'm kind of like, well, a couple of you have said all of them, all the stories were really meaningful. Andy's was, probably was my favorite just because it was so unique. He's just so gifted as a storyteller. Yeah.

Yeah. He's one of the best storytellers. Yeah. Yeah. And I've, obviously, I've known Andy. my entire life. Spent a lot of time hunting with him, worked with him for almost 11 years. And that guy can tell a story like nobody else.

And you can see the same thing. You can be standing right next to him. See the same thing? And he tells that story and you're sitting over here, man, that is a... At times you'll be like, no, wait a minute. Was I there? You know, Scott's got it too. He's got a little more zest.

Yeah. Yeah. And, oh, yeah. Scott's got some of the same. Yeah, Scott can tell, he can tell a good story. But Andy could sit around and tell you countless, countless stories about his dad, about all of his wild youth and all the hunting trips he's been on. And he's, I know he won't be offended to be telling this, but he is literally a calamity just waiting to happen. And, you.

You know, he's notorious for dropping stuff out of the tree stand. In fact, he dropped his light out of his tree stand two days ago, you know, and it's shining up in the tree right at him. Crawl down and get it. Yeah, he crawled down, got it. But, you know, he's, he come by it honest. His dad, Barney was a storyteller. Barney was, he was full of it.

I mean, he could put a little icing on the cake. and but anyway well it's it to me it's a unique intersection with somebody with a high level of competency and a high level of ability to tell a story come together

yeah because anybody could I mean you could go to school and learn how to tell a story or you know I mean storytelling is a big deal in the world really when you look at just even television I mean everything is a story but when you have somebody

like Andy who's a veteran hunter and is a what I would say I mean I would 100% say I mean he's a bona fide woodsman for the woods he hunts he knows what's going on and so when when those two things meet it's pretty unique yeah yeah last spring clay Newcomb and I collaborated with Jason Phelps at Phelps game calls and building each of our own

favorite turkey diaphragms called prime cuts now I'm going to tell you I love mine because it's easy to use. I'm not going to go, I'm not going to win a turkey calling contest. It's just not going to happen. But when I run this call, I get the sounds that gobblers are looking for. I have a great turkey hunting track record. If you go listen to real turkeys out in the woods, they're not going to win calling contests, right? That's who I listen to. I can make those sounds on my cut. I also hunt with Phelps's cut, and I hunt with Clay's cut because they're all three great cuts. Check out prime cuts at Phelps game calls.com. I think you'll be glad you did. And you'll find out that the Steve

Ronella cut is an easy-to-use cut for beginning callers who just want to start making good turkey noises and getting action. Dad, which one stood out to you? No question. They were all pretty boring until Willow Newcomb came out, my granddaughter. Now I tell you what, I was really... Did you remember that story? No, I did not. It's not one I've really thought about that much. I didn't even know. I probably didn't even know what happened. But, you know, it was pretty neat in that you accomplished a lot there.

You held up your duties as a father and you twisted it to where you could deer hunt. I think we've all done that one or the other. But probably, you know, I'm like you guys, every story was just unbelievable. But I would go with Mo Shepherd. Really? I mean, you find your deer up in a tree? Yeah. And another thing I liked about it, you know, I'm out of that age where I don't know how to corn hunt.

I don't know how to put a camera on the side of a tree. I just go out and hunt deer. And that's what he was doing. He was out there just hunting deer the old-fashioned way. And he killed that buck and a mountain line pulled it up in that tree. I just almost 100% sure. Or a Black Panther. It could have been a black panther, like that place.

You know, that was, that was part of Mo's story that if you were paying attention, you would have caught something. He said there were deer in that area in the fall. And he hadn't even been in there scouting, but he knew when the ice came that those deer were going to be in those old home places with the greenbrier above the ice. That's good woodsman. Yeah. He knew, he didn't even have to go scout.

He's just like, there'll be deer there. He wasn't hunting a pinch point or a, trail. I mean, he was hunting where they were going to eat, and I can relate to that. Yep. Anyway. That was a significant ice storm that year. I told you the story the other day. I remember it well, too.

I told you the story the other day of that same ice storm. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, they were starving. It was bad. Yeah. They had cut out trails in that ice. That's the only place they could walk.

If I got off those cutout trails, they were slipping and sliding everywhere. Wow. What do y'all think happened to his deer? I mean, there's debate. You could debate, and it would just be speculation of, did an animal drag his deer from that pool of blood? Because, I mean, a question I would have had for him is like, well, wouldn't you have seen drag marks through the ice?

Like if the deer had been laying there and something carried it off. But the ice was so hard that they weren't, it wasn't like snow. So, but there is not a beast in these woods that carries, like a jaguar or a leopard carries stuff up in trees to eat. I mean, even a mountain line doesn't do that. A bear doesn't do it. Oh, you were serious when you said they don't do that.

I thought you were to showered it. Could they? I know they do. Well, well. A Black Panther will. Yeah. No, I mean, I'm saying some animal acted outside of its norm. What do y'all think happened? Anybody have any gut feeling? Hey, I got the answer. I know what happened. I mean, I know Black Panthers and I know I know mountain lines.

That mountain line caught that deer right where the big block of blood was. Yeah. And he knew if he drug it off, ever animal in the woods would follow that trail. So he ate quite a bit of it, cleaned the blood up, was real neat, drug it off. Crimesse. Drug it up in that tree. And he was probably a Black Panther. But I don't know, that could be crazy, but I just know it could be the deer. We all, almost every deer I've had to track, I don't like tracking them.

They're going to do that. They're going to run. They're going to lay down. They're going to bleed. They're going to jump. and then the blood gets real thin. So the deer probably laid down, something scared it, it jumped, ran off, and then the mountain line came in, drug up that tree.

That's a good. Maybe it jumped it and then it killed it somewhere else. Yeah. Now, the other part of the story was that it was real steep country, and Mo went downhill looking for that deer. He kind of made an emphasis that he didn't go uphill, but that deer was two benches up. Yeah.

But what do you think, Aaron? Will a bobcat do that? I mean, no. The bobcat won't do that. I mean, they don't, it's not typical for, and I mean, I'm not a bobcat. I am a bobcat expert. I mean, look at me.

They're not, a leopard or an African, a jaguar or a leopard will take kills up in a tree. I mean, typically, I don't think a bobcat's going to do that. I don't think they'd be big enough as me. think they're big enough. Yeah. Not as big as that deer was. I thought maybe, and I listened to it, I had to back up.

I thought, well, he shot the deer and it jumped off that bench and lit in a tree. But it was up above where he shot him. Correct? Yeah. Yeah. So I went back and I thought, dang, Mo, I got your answer. I'm fishing to call you up. And I thought, wait a minute.

Maybe it was above. And so I went back and listened to it again. And, yeah, it was above where he shot it. So the only other thing other than something dragging it up in that tree is it makes a loop and jumps. Yeah, I bet if Mo was here, I bet he'd tell you that that physically wouldn't be positive. I'm just having to picture how he's describing it, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I found a deadhead one time about 15 feet up in a tree.

I have no idea how I got up there. It was tangled in like small, small branches. Deerhead. Yeah, a deerhead. Way up in a tree. It probably wasn't 15. We've got a lot of bald eagles. You know, the deer may have ran off.

The deer may have ran off and died at the moment I found it. It may have rotted down the ground and buzzards, chcoons, everything. I'd have chewed it up for days. And then an old bald eagle may have come in there and grabbed it. I don't know. I mean, and put up in the tree. Yeah. You know.

A melanistic bald eagle. There you go. Yeah. There you go. What do you got, Dad? You're right. I didn't know this. Mountain lions do not carry prey up trees.

So there you go. I've been wronging my whole life. I didn't say black pants. You're right about the airplane, though. But here's the thing is that in all animals, there's a typical way in which they're going to act. And would a mountain lion be capable of carrying a deer up a tree? 100%.

And the thing that's not up for the bait is that something carried that up a tree. And it wasn't a human. I mean, it's like, a human didn't do it. An animal did it. So something did it that was here. And then it was pretty compelling to hear him say three years later, he saw a mountain line. And, you know, for those of you guys that don't know, Mo, in my mind, Mo is, like, highly credible in terms of any way I evaluate someone in the woods. I mean, like, he's the real deal, like a lot of these guys that I'm talking about.

And so, I mean, he tells me he sees the mountain line, I believe him. And so, just interesting story. Yeah, when you spend as many hours in the woods as a guy like him, you're going to have a story like that. I mean, everything happens to you, you know. Yeah. That was a great thing. Have you ever seen a mountain line? No, but he has.

Have you? You have seen one in Kansas. Oh, I have. Absolutely. You forgot. I did. Well, I was thinking around here. Yeah.

12.30 in the afternoon. 80 degrees, middle of Kansas, wide open cattle pasture, both sides of the road. Andy and I are driving down the dirt road, and a cat jumps the road. I don't know if he landed once or twice, but he was a jump to fence. Jump the fence, hits the road, jumps again over the fence, and just goes right out across the pasture and was gone, middle of the day. And there was no question what it was. Yeah Probably 2010

Just guessing Really? Yeah Sure enough Have you seen one in Arkansas You think, Andy? So my cousin Jared and I

Were bohane Around Eureka Springs And The guy that owned the local Bow Shop Whatever his name I can't remember What's...

Still got the bow shop Over around the Beaver Dam Anyway, he had pictures Of some cattle They had some claw marks On the hams Of the cattle and so anyway going knowing that we uh we got permission to bow hunt on him and uh yeah so we

we were just sitting there row hunting and a uh a doe come running through the field out of the woods just really you know running running hard and we thought what in the world you know and uh so this it wasn't all that far away i wish jared was here too to confirm the story but because it seems like you always need two people to confirm it but yeah we won't we We're not going to believe in that you're going to do with a big cat. And it was right as a pasture. So you saw it playing his day? Playing his day.

Running over after this dough up over the hill and that was that. So as we sat there, Jared, he always had a predator call in his pocket. And he thought it'd be funny or smart to try to call this thing in. He started on this call. You know, on this call, like, what in the world are you doing? I was trying to get the heck out of there. The last time I'm home with Jared. Yeah.

But they didn't come back. Didn't come back. Didn't come back. Well, interesting. I've never seen, I've never seen one in Arkansas. I've seen them in different parts of the world. But Luke, which story stood out to you? Well, just like the rest of you guys, they all stood out to me.

The dog hunting connection with Travis. Mm-hmm. I enjoyed it because talking about transitioning from being a lifer, dog hunter, going all the way to the mountains to try this new method of hunting with Dale and they end up right back in a dog race. Because I've been in several situations exactly like that. You know, I'm off, you know, in the 90s and the early 2000s trying to still hunt. you hear in the distance you hear that dog open and immediately you start looking to man the battle station

because you know golly I'm sitting in the right spot right here and a lot of times then here they come everything changes when you hear a dog too guarantee it does yeah if you're carrying a lever gun the hammer's getting cocked the seat is getting snapped off your shoulder and your gun trying to get all comfortable and because when it happens it's like that and you're shooting skills and all those things out the window they go and you just sling as much ammunition towards them as you can. Well, Isaac, what was your favorite story? Gave me validation.

Peeing out of the tree, Dave, Isaac, validation. He gave you some relief, didn't it? I've heard that story. I've heard that story for years. And there's the first time I heard it straight from you. You're pretty sure you've damaged your bladder, huh? I spent a lot of hours in a tree stand. I mean, I used to hunt a lot.

And I didn't know any better, you know? I'd hold it. And I remember holding it so bad. I would just get to hurting. And I don't do that anymore. But I carry a bottle now. I don't know what it would be able to be. else does but yeah I think I damaged my blighter as a kid just holding it because I just knew that if I was

go to bathroom the deer would smell me and then I wouldn't get to kill a deer you know but that particular day that all worked out that all worked out that was that was I'll never forget that and it they come in just like you had a breadcrumbs to the woods you know the part that he didn't tell was he calls me and he says hey I've shot some deer you know so I It was getting dark, and I drove up there, and he's sitting there on the side of the road, sitting on top of his climbing tree stand. So, well, Aaron, you know, where's your deer at?

He gets up, picks up his climbing tree stand, and both of those deer are underneath that climbing tree stand. That's how big these. Hey, that was my... You didn't have to tell that part. Hey, that's my favorite part of this story. I mean, you... It was a big deal.

Oh. Lots of my life. I, to this day probably, if I wasn't after a big buck, man, a yearland deer comes by. Oh. The idea that you wouldn't shoot a yearling is beyond me. There was no chance I'd have passed them up. I mean, that was a big deal. We were fired up. We were fired up. I killed one. I killed two. I was talking to camp. It didn't matter if they were yearlings or not. That was my favorite part about that story. And you remember what I said. Do you remember how I introduced him?

Oh, yeah. This man has killed. At least, well, as of two days ago, 25 deer that would score over the pop and young. You know, you got a big-time deer hunter here, but when he gets started, there's not as many deer back then. No. So, I mean, to kill two deer in one day, I could relate to that man. I mean, when I started in 77, holy cow, people, the entire city of Hot Springs, there was only two of us that could kill a deer with a bow and arrow. You know, the gun hunter guys didn't know how to do it. Yeah, they were raised in deer camps.

They didn't know how to kill the deer with a bow, and I didn't even know how to hunt. But it just hit me one day. Hey, if I'm hunting humans, I'm going to McDonald's, and I'm going to find a McDonald's. And so it was real easy for me to kill deer. And if I could kill two little deer, I told this story.

I don't know if it's on a podcast, but I'm sitting in a stand one day, and a big dough comes out, boy, When I'm getting all ready, I'm going to nail her. And I look back and she's got a smaller dough behind her. And I'm thinking, okay, easier to get to the truck, better meat. Well, I look back and there's two more. And the last one was the small one.

So I let them all walk and I whack that little guy. See? This is where I come from. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There is no zero shame in killing a small deer. I mean, as long as it's within the boundaries of the law. Hey, I got another deal that might be good for some of the young guys. You set your goals in life, and many, many times you set them way too low.

But because I started in the 70s, my goal, and I didn't know how to deer hunt, my goal was to kill a deer every year with a bow and error. All my buddies thought it was funny. My dad thought it was funny. everybody just laughed at me. So my goal was to kill a doe, a deer with a bow and error. So when it got up to where you guys were coming on, killing big bucks, hey, I was still happy to kill a doe.

Yeah, yeah. Where if I'd have said, I'm going to be a big buck hunter, you know. But anyway. Yeah, no, you always said that to me, and that made a lot of sense. And it also... But what I've seen you do, though, is stay true to your roots and not really be influenced by what society said was valuable. And I kind of live in both worlds. Like, you know, I mean, I love to target a mature deer and try to kill him, and that's real important to me.

But I also very quickly can turn into a doe hunter and go out and shoot a dough and it just be like a big deal. And it comes from that. And yeah, what you would, the trend of the age is, and especially now that we have exponentially more deer than we used to have, options are, there's more options. You know, and it's kind of funny. It's like something happened about 2005, 2010, and everybody and their mom could kill a deer with a bow. I mean, and it happened probably because of just more people were doing it. It happened because there was more information about how to do it. The technique changed about that time.

Yeah. And in states where you can bait a deer on private land. Absolutely. And it's happened around here. I mean, people use corn to kill deer. Absolutely. And we can talk about that another time. But it changed the way deer hunting is today.

Yeah. Probably for the worst, but that's a discussion we have some of the time. But prior to that, I didn't know people baited deer at all. No. It just wasn't a thing. It was something that you heard that happened in South Texas. Yeah. We hunted, we hunted, we hunt for days to see a deer.

Yeah. I can go get a fourth grader right now. Put him in a blind with a crossbow over a corn piling. He can harvest a deer this afternoon. And he's never shot a crossbow before today. Yeah. That was unheard of on our day. Um, it's just the way things have changed and it's good or bad it is what it is.

Yeah. Yeah. No doubt. No doubt. Aaron, I think that like when you and I first met, you, you, you thought you didn't have very many deer coming from where I was from. First time y'all took me hunting. I thought I had died and went to heaven. I remember that. I mean, because I saw more than one deer. I remember that. Yeah. There were, there were, there was, wow. I saw six or seven deer. You know what I mean? I'm like, by golly. It's not a fact.

First, the first, I told this to Clay when we were talking about how you and I met and everything. The first day we ever hunted together, Aaron killed 11 point buck. Shot him in the throat. Because they got that, I mounted that deer. Still got in my shop. Yeah. I said, well, what happened? He goes, well, that's what I could see.

I'm like, good enough. It worked. I was so proud of that deer. That's the biggest buck that's ever lived. It's probably 95 inches. I mean, I was so proud of him. Hey, I was going to bring up. Aaron killed two days ago, Dad, 147-inch deer with his bow here.

Really? That's amazing, man. I really congratulate people that do that. But, hey, one thing I did, I was so impatient. If a deer walked up, I'm going to kill it. No one that if I'd sit there all day, a buck probably would walk in. And the way I hunted, I had several big bucks come in, usually October 20th through November the 5th. And just it wasn't meant for me to kill them.

I mean, I very seldom ever missed a deer. They usually dropped within 50 yards. But a big buck would come in. I wouldn't even be nervous. You know, and I'd just do all this kind of stuff and finally get on it and forget it. at 30 yards and I got my 20 pin, stuff like that just happened. And you were hunting public land too. I don't think you ever killed a deer on private land.

You probably did one or two. Maybe in Texas. I went on a Texas hunt a couple times right then. But anyway, and another thing, most of you guys would be embarrassed to tell this. I'm not, but I was afraid of heights. I jumped off a big old building when I was 10 years old. And I think that's why I had my knees replaced. and I mean I could not stand up on a stand

I could not shoot to the back I couldn't shoot I let so many deer go on the right hand side left hand side I just let them walk I mean I hunted for the deer to be right here I didn't even want them in front I wanted them right there and so I mean I think about all the deer I killed I probably could have killed twice that many if I could have stood up and turned and as I got the last five years

I got a little bit over that but Mm-hmm. Just kind of, everybody's got their own little niche. You got the big bucks, and you, I know you killed a bunch of big bucks. Yeah. Brent, you did the deer stories, so this country life, deer camp, deer camp stories. Mm-hmm. Deer camp.

Did you bring us to see that, Bologna? Man, let me tell you, Petty Jean Bologna made right here in Arkansas. But the pepper relish, that was the trick. That was good. Good stuff. It sounded good to me, man. I thought it's funny. He said he still had his mouth full.

He was chewing as fast. He could when he walked up there. He wanted to make sure his buddy didn't get any of that same. Yeah, that's my nephew. That's my nephew. You'd have to be hungry. Brent had half a bologna and relish sandwich, and you walked up to him and you were like,

hey, you might have had the rest of that? Well, that's my nephew. Now, he's twice as tall as I am, and he would eat it, I'm sure. Oh, that's funny. That's funny. Well, shoot, guys. This has been good. Been real good.

This is just the beginning of the Deer Stories podcast. This is always one of my favorite times of the year because I get to go and meet with guys. I mean, just like, Luca came down to where you live, met with you, Aaron came over here, dad's got a story. I went and saw Andy. I went and saw Mo. I mean, you know, just like, it's kind of like, for me,

it's a lot of fun gathering up all these stories. And I'm interested in other people's stories too. It's hard, in some ways doing what I'm doing is it's kind of a bummer because there's a lot of great people that listen to this podcast that hear these stories and are like, oh, they need to, Clay needs to hear this story. Yeah. And it's very difficult to like parse through, like if you message me, you're like, Clay, I got a great story. I mean, you do, you probably do. I know you do. I tell you what I'm interested in. I would like to hear, does Willow remember that?

I would love. She, I actually brought it up to her. I told her, I said, Willow, you're on the podcast this week. And I told her, and she, she, I don't think she has any recollection of that. Is that right? Yeah. Because that, the whole time I was listening to it, and I sent you a text when I listened to it, that's the best story you have ever told.

And I was there with you when we talked. told the world the story about the bear slipping in on us. You know, but that to me was the best story. Was it the story or the way told it or both? It had to be a combination of all of it. Because I could see the whole thing playing out. Because, you know, I know you, obviously, and Willow, and I could see her. And I've seen pictures of her when she was that age.

And I could see all that playing out in my head because I would take my oldest daughter, Amy, with me when we would go duck hunting. And she'd be sitting in the blind. Or I'd take Bailey with me now, you know, and she would at that age, and she'd just be playing in color and then just have it a ball and while I'm trying to kill a deer. But really just spending time with them. But to hear my daughter Amy and to hear Bailey or my son Hunter tell a story from their viewpoint of a story that I've told with them with me,

it's different. They see a whole different thing. And to me, it's a better story. So I hate that you don't remember because that's the story I would love to you. I thought about it. I think it was just like, and I'm not trying to say that we did that kind of stuff all the time, but we did that stuff all the time. Right.

I mean, I think it was just like a Tuesday. Yeah. I mean, it was special because we killed a deer, and it was special because I, you know, just the unique, I never did that again just like that. But, I mean, they went with me a lot. Well, it was just perfect. It was a perfect story. Yeah.

The where you were at was perfect. It was good. I looked, I thought about, too, a photo. I've taken a picture of almost every deer that I've ever killed. And I cannot find that picture. And I think it was the beginning of the digital age for me when I went from actually taking real photos that you went to develop. And I think we took pictures of that on a cell phone and they just are gone. And it was before social media.

I wasn't on social media then, or nobody was, I guess, 2006 to speak of. And so I think now I can go back 12 years into social media and find pictures, which is risky. Because, I mean, who's to say Facebook's going to be around tomorrow? I mean, but anyway, it just, it was a gap of about five years or where I hardly have any pictures. I know you're running out of time, but I'm the grandpa. Let me tell you something that it really impressed me is you got a little girl that's real compliant and real smart. And you just say, you've got to do these things. And she goes, okay.

And she did them. Your little boy, you got a little boy? When he was four years old, he'd be throwing rocks. I mean, you know, just forget totally what the instructions are. Yeah. And start pitching rocks in the creek. Hey, daddy, to watch this. Yeah, yeah.

Would have totally blown it. But Little Willow. She followed the rules. She did. She did. You know, I actually thought about another hunt that took place in almost the same spot, different scenario, with my two youngest sons, Bear and Shepherd. That didn't turn out so good. It was in that same field, but we had a blind.

I actually had a pop-up blind. And I don't remember the scenario, but I had both the boys in there. and they were probably three and five. So it'd been a couple years later because the sister's older. And I remember seeing some deer way off, like a quarter mile away off, like 20 minutes before dark,

and the deer weren't going to make it. And I had a bow. And I told the boys, I said, boys, y'all stay here. I'm going to go try to get that deer. And I had them stay in the blind. And I slipped out the back and went and stalk these deer

and was gone for way longer. than I thought I was going to be. And when I came back, I heard Shepherd just crying in the blind, just bawling. I mean, for like 300 yards away, I could hear him. And I was like, oh, no. And I went over there, and they got scared, they got scared, you know. But they could have seen me the whole time. I was never out of sight of that blind, but I was a long ways off.

And so they lost track of me. And then I was on these deer, Aaron. I mean, I was like about to kill them, and it got dark on me, you know, and I went back. I felt terrible. I mean, to the point, to the point I just like almost cried because I could hear him from, anyway, that was a nightmare. And I learned something on that one. I really did, like, because I was like, I will never do that again. And, you know, leaving a kid, because my dad, I don't know if I ever told you about my dad,

but my dad wasn't afraid at all to leave me in the woods for long in the dark. And I would get scared as could be, but I'm kidding, Dad. I'm not kidding. Well, no, I did it that way. You know what? A lot of it had to do with, I didn't know how to hunt. Everybody thought you couldn't kill a deer. And I was so committed to kill a deer that I wouldn't go, I mean, you know, I'm going to kill a deer.

And I don't know if we got time, you can cut this out. No, we got time. I don't tell these dead gum follows of yours what a whim you are. He's 10 years old. It bothers me to see him 13, 15 years old. He kills his first deer. Well, at 10 years old, I got the best spot in the whole stinking world, man. I mean, I hunted 40 years.

This spot was the spot. I mean, you had everything there you wanted. 60 piles of droppings, everything. I mean, I counted her a single acre and tree. I counted them. And so I put a stand up in there. Everything was set up perfectly. 10 years old

We had to be back to town by like 10 o'clock I need to kill a deer Because I'm only hunting on Saturdays You know And maybe Sunday morning Occasionally And so I walk him in here And I go okay right there

He climbs up in that tree It's black dart And so I turn around to walk off And I hear I hear him cry You know most daddies would have said hey, don't worry about it, Clay. I'm going to get over here in the corner and sit down in that bush,

and I'm going to be right here the whole time. But that never entered my mind because I got one day to kill this deer, and if this little dirt ball won't set up there, so I put him in the car and the truck, and we went over, and I shot that little old deer, and I got my goal done for the year, and I'm ready to quit now. So, but that was the craziest stand I'd ever seen. And you don't see that anymore.

It's your, when you got, when you guys came up and started hunting, you couldn't find stuff like that. But for some reason, first 10 years I hunted to see 30, 40, 15 piles of droppings under a white oak tree was very common. 60 was kind of unusual. So I don't know what, if you'd have come in there, there'd have been a whole herd of little doze walk in. you. No, that hunt, it's a wonder I made it through. Because I just, it was the first time I'd hunted by myself. And I mean, it's like probably an hour and a half before daylight.

Because he had to go drive 10 miles to get to his, it's not like we were hunting like down the ridge. He was going somewhere else. It's just the way we had to hunt because there were just two good spots and they happened to be miles apart. I don't remember the details. But he put me up in that stand and I was just like, No. Bro. Oh, I cried like a bad.

I was scared. I was in the fourth grade. Never hunted by myself. And, uh, oh, yeah, it was intense. But really, you were so tough. He was so tough. We would scout a lot of times on four winters, fast four winters. I mean, we'd be running through the woods going, right here's a spot.

Yon! Anyway, and he'd be right. Might take him a while to kill. you up you know me and my buddy would do that a lot of time just for the fun of it but it's a real effective way of scouting and clay would be right there with us never wore out just wouldn't quit so I thought man put him in a tree holy cow this would be easy baby got scared got scared Clay I'd like to say something before we wrap this up because it sounds like we're coming to a close here I want to say thank you for

for us getting together. I have to thank our friend Scott Brown for getting us together. Scott's one of the he's one of the best hunters, woodsman. He does not hunt bait.

He does not go and travel all over the country hunting. He hunts some of the in my opinion, some of the worst places you could go to go deer hunting. But that sucker is consistent. He'll kill deer when nobody else will. He's the real deal hunter.

But he's, He got us together, and in doing so, I'm sitting here today, sitting across from a couple of guys that I, I've realized sitting here, I've missed y'all a lot. And as I'm walking up, Aaron's like, how long is it been? It's been over 20 years. It's been over 20 years. And my goodness, life will just fly right on by, right in front of you. And I think of all the things that have happened since the last time we've seen each other until today a lot. I mean, both my folks are gone.

Both my brothers are gone. You know, I've married and got step-sons and, you know, and done all these different things. I know y'all, you know, probably done the same. And I'm sitting here thinking to myself, I'm grateful that you cut, that you shot me a text, you know, and said, hey, you want to tell a deer story? And I'm like, I sure do. You know, not knowing if I was going to be sitting right here,

looking at you two boys. Before we got here, Luke, I was thinking of the very same thing, how a white-tailed deer can bring us back together, you know, and bring us together in the first place. Yes. If you hadn't had that high country shirt on, we probably wouldn't be here together. And that was in the fall of 1997,

when Aaron and I both, that was our that was both we were both transfer students going to Fayetteville yeah not knowing a soul i mean i didn't i didn't know anybody i didn't either you know what what you said at the end of your story i thought it was really powerful in that i mean it's not there's nothing about a white tail deer that is is going to cause somebody to have a i mean there's nothing magical and we talk about a deer being magical and all this stuff we love to hunt yeah yeah but really what brought us together because what's valuable is a human relationship yeah in all the pie everything that i do inside of bear grease and stuff really we're talking about deer hunt we're talking about the land

we're talking about rivers we're talking about mountains and lions and deer like all this natural stuff but really what's interesting to me is how humans interact with that and then how humans interact together around those things, like the relationships that we have. And you did such a good job of saying, you know, a white-tailed deer is really what brought us all together and, and, and becomes a medium to which you can exchange and have a relationship. Like, you'd have a bond. Like, I hadn't seen, well, I saw you 10 years ago. I hadn't seen Andy in probably 20 years. And I mean, me and you, we can, anytime we see each other, it's like, we got a connection. And it's, it's deer. But it's bigger than that.

And that's special. It is. It's special. And I'm sure there are other things in the world that people can connect over, but there is nothing in the world that is more in order. And I could even use the word primal than the hunting connection between humans. I mean, that is the bond that made the human species was hunters connect. I mean, really, when you, it's like boiled it down to, like, I have to. be safe and warm and have shelter.

I have to reproduce and find a wife and I have to kill stuff to eat. Maybe you could throw in a little bit later. I got to find some land to grow some crops on. I mean, it's like pretty basic level human stuff. So for us to come together and talk about deer hunting and how it's connected to us, it's like, I love it.

Yeah. Yeah. I thought you did a good job of saying that. I appreciate it. Good stuff. Yeah. Yeah, thank you for having us on. It's been fun.

Thank you very much. Yeah, well, we'll do it again. Brent, closing words, wisdom, go. One, two, three. I talked about it in my podcast. It's tradition and legacy and the value of sharing something good with people that you love and people that you like. There was, how many stories were on this podcast? Seven.

There were seven examples of everything right there. It was good stuff. Mm-hmm. That's it for me. Excellent. Thank you all for coming. Great to see everybody. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over.

They just get darker. I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a sleeping bed. And there was a full of blood. Oh, my God. He doesn't have a hit. Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors. Where the terrain is unforgiving, the evidence is scarce, and the truth gets buried under brush, and silence. Indications were he should be right there, but he wasn't.

This season, we're going deeper. From cold case files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwards. Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. Because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments and the people left behind trying to piece them back together. He's not an honest person. He's incapable of being honest. Somebody somewhere knows something.

I'm Jordan Sillers. Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, IHeart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.