Bear Grease - Ep. 259: Render - Bucks, Boats, and Sabots

Episode Date: October 9, 2024

On this Bear Grease Render, host Clay Newcomb is joined by Bear Newcomb and Josh "Landbridge" Spielmaker as well as long-time Arkansas hunting buddies Moe Shepherd and Shane Auman. The guests share their favorite Bear Grease deer stories, Clay talks about the "good old days" before there was social media and streaming video, Bear avoids a questionable boat deal, and we learn the correct pronunciation of the word "s-a-b-o-t." If you have comments on the show, send us a note to [e-mail] Connect with Clay and MeatEater Clay on Instagram MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, and Youtube Clips MeatEater Podcast Network on YouTube Shop Bear Grease MerchSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. First Lights fieldware collection is made for the work that happens long before opening day and continues when the season ends. Products built for early mornings, full days in real use. Hard wearing where they need to be versatile where it matters. No shortcuts. Just gear designed for the work that earns the season.

Built to perform, built to last. Check out. First Light's new field. Worldware Gear at firstlight.com. My name is Clay Newcomb, and this is a production of the Bear Grease podcast called The Bear Grease Render, where we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the scenes of the actual Bear Grease podcast. Presented by FHF Gear, American-made, purpose-built, hunting and fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore. Welcome to the bearer grease render.

Man, the Deer Stories episodes are some of my favorite of the whole year because I get to go and talk to all these people and cherry pick their stories. That's what you do. But usually what I don't say to the guys that I'm talking to, like Mo, is that you got to go through a bunch of duds to cherry pick the one that you pick. Is that right, Mo? That's right. That's right.

How many does it? I won't tell how many he's thrown in the trash. No, actually, what's interesting is that to me, when you tell somebody, tell me your best deer story, that means something different to everybody. Somebody might tell you the most, like, sentimental story that they have. They might tell you about, like, the first deer of their son, killed. Or they may tell you a story about how their uncle poached a deer when they were nine years old, you know, and something just like off the wall. You'd be surprised how many times that happens. And I go, man, that's a great story. You have another one that we could celebrate,

you know, on the platform of American hunting culture. Game of fish violation. Yeah. But a good deer story. Is there a statute of limitations on stories, like when you do something that violates a lot of. There's a bear grease code of honor. Like we've told illegal stories on this hunting podcast. It's true. I mean, when we talked about Louisdale and Charlie Edwards,

there were a lot of illegal hunting stories. Andy Brown talked about his dad running over a deer being run by dogs back in the 60s in Polk County. Because they didn't have time to shoot it, that he run it down with a truck. He did. I mean, it was,

but it, we, justified it based upon the intent and the the intangibles that it brought to us understanding where we're at today. So when Andy Brown told about his dad shooting deer with the 22 and all this stuff, it made sense because now we're like, man, how much further have we come along that we're, you know, most hunters are thinking about conservation and the law, you know, compared to back. when it was kind of just a suggestion.

Yeah. So the answer is, yes, there's a gray line. I think the thing I love about the deer stories is it is kind of you're looking for the intangible things about it. Like, you know there's that when you sit around a campfire at deer camp, you know there's that one guy that you just can't wait for him to tell any story. Yeah, yeah. The story of going to the porta potty before he goes to the deer stand is going to be good. Yeah. And we get to have the creme de la creme of all the deer stories.

So, yeah, it's a lot of good stuff. Yeah. Well, I better introduce my guests. I've got Bear John Newcomb here here. And then we've got Josh Fillmaker. Present. Mo Shepard. I don't even need to introduce you, Mo.

I'm here, though. I'm not even going to, I may not even tell you something really nice that someone said about you. I hear it all the time, so it didn't really imagine. Remind me what Lake Pickle said about Mo. Oh, really? Oh, Lake pickle. Lake pickle. But our guest of honor, you didn't know it, Shane, you've been tricked.

You're the guest of honor. This is my longtime buddy Shane Alman. It's funny. I hadn't seen Shane in many years. Like, just like an hour ago, I was like, man, you got old. And he was like, he actually said that to me. He said, you got old. But no, man, me and Shane, we go pretty far back.

Yeah. We've been to Canada together. we've we've uh I feel like we've done a lot of stuff together over the years yeah we've done quite a bit of running around turkey hunting bear hunting yep worked some shows together when you was doing the arkansas bear and buck journal before you bought bear hunting magazine so yeah yeah no so listen y'all you might not know this bear let me paint a picture for you about how the world used to be okay got it we used to live for this time of year for Walmart to get those.

See those DVDs up there? Yep. Did we not, Shane? We did. That's fact. Mo? Went through a bunch of them. I mean, because you wouldn't even,

the world did not have much of an internet presence. And so now we, you know, people that are interested in hunting or interested in kayaking or interested in cars or painting their nails or whatever people are interested in. You can watch it every day of the year and there's all this content.

It's true. It wasn't that way. And in the fall, usually late August, maybe the first of September if they were late, they'd put on the shelves hunting DVDs from Primos to H.S. H.S. Strut. Night and hail. A lot and hail. A bunch of those.

The juries. Who else were some of the good ones? Then you had Fitzgerald and Noel Feather. Yeah. That's going way back. Yeah. Barry and Gene Winsel, they had probably some of the best ones, bow hunting

October white tails yeah really good but yeah there was there was a lot of them well okay the first time

I ever saw Shane he was on one of those DVDs what yeah Shane was uh you didn't tell us we had a celebrity here

oh big time big time no wonder he's a guest of honor see see you didn't know I had somebody in my back pocket did you no no

Shane tell me a little bit like you you hunted with HS was it Hunter specialties. Yeah.

So back in that, so early 2000s, a good friend of mine of Philip Vanderpull, which lived there at home, which he had always been obsessed with videography type work, steel pictures and stuff, and hunted a lot. So he got into kind of freelance videoing. And we hunted quite a bit together. we would we killed a few he videoed me killing a few bears it was featured on a couple of videos and then we uh he got a uh a role working for hunter specialties just freelance selling you know getting content for them and selling to them so i the the first few years that was good

whether we done that i was the one that was drawing tags you know somewhere in the midwest so it'd either be like Kansas, Iowa, Illinois, wherever. And that was kind of the deal. You know, he would, I was just wanting to go hunting and he was wanting the video. So it worked out good for both. I was getting the hunt, you know, which, you know, which now we wasn't going on any guided hunts. I mean, everything we was doing was on public or permission land at that time.

And then so be it there one of the years, I was fortunate enough to kill a really good deer that was actually the color covered. That's what I was going to say. I bet money I've got that DVD up there somewhere. Yeah, and that was a piece of property. It was just like today, I mean, we pulled up and talked to a guy and he said, yeah, you can hunt, which everybody had asked, he let hunt. I don't know how we was able to beat our way in there and around everybody else and end up killing a super nice deer. How big was the deer?

172. Oh, 172. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, pretty good, pretty good deer for a redneck from Arkansas. So. And then you, so you hunted and filmed with hunter specialties for quite a few years. Yeah, four or five, something like that.

And yeah. That's, then that's the way I would have known you. I was like, hey, there's this Arkansas guy over there that's filming for hunter specialties. Yes. And then you shot professional archery.

Yeah, it's done a lot of archery shooting through the years. Shot a lot of ASA and IBO tournaments. Shot on, was on Matthew shooting staff for several years. Yeah, Good time. We met a lot of great people doing that still.

Haven't done that in a wildest life gotten away, you know, doing other things. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, man, Bear, you should get Shane to watch you shoot two or three shots, man. He's a pro. I taught Shane a lot of what he knows.

Not about bo hunting. That's what I'm talking about, Mo. But I'm sure that he could transfer some of that knowledge back to you as a pro shooter. Matter of fact, I just remembered. So I went to, I believe it was in like, oh, 2007-ish, was in Vegas shooting and just so happened. Wayne Indicott was on the line with me. I think he was up at Wayne's shop. Yes, up in Oregon.

Yeah, super good dude. But yeah, he was, he was, I've shot a few tournaments with him and he was just always a pleasure to be around. super good, which they all are. Did you ever beat any of the real well-known guys just like one time or one shot that you'd like to highlight? No. Yeah, probably a couple of times. There's some of them that I had a day.

This is your chance to be like, man, one time I beat Levi Morgan, one shot. I had never shot against Levi. But, you know, you do have some really good shooters right here in your backyard that travel and still shoot professionally today. Yeah. One of them is a friend of mine, Nathan Brooks. Yep. Yeah, me and Nathan go way, way, way back.

We run the roads a lot, you know, and when we was in our early 20s, so, you know, 30 years ago, we've done lots of traveling. Yeah. And now you own a company called Musloader Magnum products. Magum products. Known as MMP. Correct. Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. And it's, y'all make, now, Shane taught me the correct way to say the word. S-A-B-O-T. It's always been a mystery to me. How do you say it, Shane? Shabo. No. Yes.

That's not ever been on the list of options. Actually, I was going to call it a Sabo. Yeah, Saba-Bo or Saba-Bo. Depends on what part of the world. Do you call a Coos-deer, a coos-deer or a cow's deer? A coo-deer. Okay, and then you call a Sabbath a... Shabot.

The average hillbilly would call it a Sabbath. Yeah. Yes. That's what Mo calls it. It's a Sabbath. Well, this guy makes them. And his company, 30 years ago, I mean, y'all created the Sabbath. Correct.

Say both. Say both. Say both. So, yeah, in 1985. So Dale Ramsey was the original founder. Dale was a lifelong friend of mine. I've known him since I was a kid. And he was an injection molder by trade.

That's what he'd done. and he got interested in muzzleloaders. Well, back at that time, you know, there was really no good bullets. It's just a cast lead bullet. Well, he got to wanting to do something different. I mean, guys were just had they had these old, like, hawkins style musloaders. I mean, really primitive weapons. Yeah.

They were jamming lead down those things where lead was, you had a bullet that was the size of your barrel, which seems like what you would have because that was all the technology for the last 500 years. Had that or a patch ball, that's all there was. Well, I mean, yeah, you're right. I'm saying that's all there was for when I first started buzzler out. In the late 70s, that's the way it was. You either had a patch ball or you had this old lead ball or either greased it or just stuck it in or dry and shoved it down the barrels.

And the accuracy was very low with those. Yeah, so when Dale started that, he got to, he kept working with it and then got to shooting, you know, just a jacketed pistol bullet. Still today, a lot of guys still use just a jacket. at Hollow Point, like a Hornaday XTP or a Barnes XPB. So anyway, that's the bullet he started messing with and got them to shooting. And then had a product that was working. So when he decides to go to the shot show and first of the year, he goes to Houston, Texas,

and just so happens, sets up a little booth. And Tony Knight was there, which Tony Knight is who, not muzzleloaders. Well, that was the year that he introduced the MK85. which is an in-line musloader. First in-line musloader. Which changed the game. Yep, changed the game. So Dale and Tony was at the forefront of modern musloading.

And that's kind of how that got started. And then... I mean, so he, but he created the Sabo. Yes, he created. Sabo. Sabo. Sabit. Now, I remember this from years ago, I was just talking about this.

and there was some French folks. Well, the reason it's a say-O, it's a French word. What does that word mean? Don't get me the line. Okay. Well, it was a French word because they used it with cannons. Yes. So they would have like, you know, military cannons but wanted to shoot a smaller caliber ball out of a bigger caliber hole.

And so they somehow packed this. This a bow. bullet in a subbo. Am I right? Yeah. And so that was kind of the idea. Yeah. And then Dale was like, hey, I'm going to fabricate injection mold, this little plastic packaging for a 45 caliber bullet to shoot out of a 50 caliber mussela. Yeah.

Correct. And what's the physics behind why that changed the accuracy of muzzleloaders so much? I think the big thing was the quality of bullet. They get a little better bullet, getting them loaded better. And then at the time whenever Tony invented the gun, it was so much ahead of everything else on the market. When you just have an old traditional Thompson Senate renegade or hawking, it was just pretty much a... With not much rifling in those. Yeah, like a turn in-48, you know, then you have...

And you got the new inline that has a whirl to it, and it really straightens everything out. It straightens everything out. Now, it just worked. I mean, it just is a good combination. for, you know, the everyday guy that wants to go hunting and don't, it is not, not wanting to reload, try to size bullets and things of that nature. They, there's a good combination for just a general hunter, for sure. And so he had the patent on that still does.

He had to design patent when he first started, and then it went away. Okay. So, but for decades, if you had a, I can't say it any other way, a sabbited bullet. Yeah. That you bought at Walmart. You were using one of Dale's MMPs, which is now Shane's company. You were using one of their sayboats. Yes.

I mean, and you're still making them today. Still make them today. And still the leader in making seaboats. We try to be. You know, we do have a competitor. I mean, they make a good product as well. I mean, there's no. No, they don't.

Yeah, well, I hate to down anybody. But, you know, I think there's enough enough for both of them. I'm not going down anybody's stuff. They probably, they might down mine, but that's okay. So that's competition. I just, it's an interesting story. So I do Dale. Dale has since passed away.

I met Dale just a time or two through you, hunted on his place. And he was just an eccentric, real neat old guy, just like, super, I mean, super intelligent, probably weighed a buck 40, stopping wet. Maybe. Am I, is that? Maybe. Yeah, yeah. He has, at his heaviest in his life, he was probably 1.40, yeah.

And he was a, he loved to hunt. I mean, it was a serious hunter, white-tail hunter. I grew up over here in Harrison, Arkansas. And kind of a genius. That's the way I remember him, just with, with his ability, like with guns. Yes. And, I mean, just a genius. Yeah.

And I remember, he said one thing to me that I'll never forget. I'll never forget it. It was at a time when in the outdoor space, I don't know why I was talking about this, but I just said, we've kind of done everything that we can do. I remember saying, it was a conversation. And I was like, there's no, basically I said there's no room to like have something new in the outdoor space because like everything's been done. I mean, we've got grunt calls and mechanical broadheads and air guns and rifles and. pistols and I mean I don't know just camouflage and leafy camouflage and waterproof boot like and I remember he said he said you're wrong there there will always be innovation yeah always no matter what no matter which direction that you go and anything and and what it did for me was uh I believed him when he said it he was just like no there always be innovation and uh it it uh it uh I mean, it's like the world is just so big.

Like, there's just always a way to be better. Yeah. And that, that's, that's one thing that got me interested. When Dale passed away, um, me and him had been talking about things and, you know, quite, you know, and question him and, well, why don't we, why don't you, why didn't you do this? Or why didn't you try this? Well, I'm not interested anymore. So he had kind of lost interest, wasn't interested in doing anything, but I kept talking to him and

talked to him and, you know, he's told me a few things, well, I think this might work. where I think this may work. And I kept that in the back of my mind. And then whenever, after he passed away and then they decided that the company is going to go up for sale, I don't want to just let it go away. You know, you don't accomplish nothing. He don't try, you know, so what's the worst can happen? I'd go broke.

So what are they going to do? Take my name at that point, you know, so. So anyway, we, uh, bold entrepreneur. So anyway, we, we, uh, come to terms and, and got it taken over. and then I have actually been working on some of the things that we've talked about, trying to make a little better product, different, not as, not as much a design difference that you can see, but just improvements and everything that's available today. You know, there's better materials, better machines, better mold.

There's just, there's things that can be done better that will work, I think, in more high performance guns better today than they maybe currently are. Increased performance of the, Yeah, the bullets and the way they shoot. And now of the sidebow. Yeah, for sure. Good try. I tried to say it.

On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over. They just get darker. I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a sleeping bag. And there was a full of blood. Oh, my God. He doesn't have a hit. Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors.

Where the terrain is unforgiving, the evidence is scarce, and the truth gets buried under brush and silence. Indications were he should be right there, but he wasn't. This season, we're going deeper, from cold case files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwoods. Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. Because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments, and the people left behind trying to piece them back together. He's not an honest person. He's incapable of being honest.

Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers. Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, IHeart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. What does MMP sell that, like, I would buy as a muzzleload hunter? Well, we sell bulk, say bows, or sabbets, whoever we're talking to. So bows, yeah. So bulk packaging of those, and then we do offer some bullet and sable combinations for the guy that just wants to buy a 12 pack of bullets and don't want to go, you know, we've got those. And we do handle a few, a line of athlon scopes, optics, you know, they make some pretty affordable, pretty good scopes for the price point.

They're really good. And so we handle those. That's kind of where we're at currently. looking about expanding into other things. You know, have more of your one-stop shop for muzzleloader stuff through the website. But, you know,

kind of work in progress, you know, getting to that point. Yeah. So you just don't sell like pellets or powders or any of that stuff. No, powders or pellets. It just seems like that is much,

that there's so much taxes and hazmat fees getting them shipped in and having to return around and reship them to somebody else. It's almost, it's probably just hard. Yeah, pricing's hard. It's hard to get, you know, make anybody a deal, you know, especially when Bashpro and Cabela's, those kind of places. Have that such bulk that they don't work with. Yeah. Speaking of hazmat, have I ever told you about the time?

My Pyrodex powder story? A couple times. A couple times. Why do you use a PyreDex for? Okay, good. I got an audience here. Well, yeah, for that one. Yeah, it's on that same hill where this one come from.

I remember it well. Do you remember this one, Josh? Oh, I love it. I love it when I got an audience. Okay. I may remember it when it comes out. It was all of it. One morning, it was late in the year.

I was trying to kill a bear in National Forest on purpose. It was carrying a muzzleloader. It was light. It was right around Thanksgiving. And I remember it was a. frigid cold morning, super cold. And I planned to walk the whole day, so I wasn't wearing a lot of clothes. And, you know, I didn't bring a big jacket or anything.

I was just like, man, I'm going to be moving all day. And I didn't plan to get, I left the truck before daylight, didn't plan to come back till dark, and I was going to move most of the day. Well, when I got in there, it was just so dang cold. I got on the north side of this mountain. I was just freezing. I mean, I'm like a mile and a half from my truck, and it's like 8 o'clock in the morning, and I'm just freezing.

And no sun in on that nose side. on the north side and uh as i i go man i'm going to make a fire i'm just dying and uh i'm on the just a slope as steep as a cow's face and i'd take a flat rock and turn it up like this and put another rock underneath it and make me a little table and i'm sitting on this hill and so the hill's going up and the table's right here and uh all leaves are wet on the north side just sopping wet right there's nothing to start fire with And I go, well, I've got some Pyrodex powder. And so I take out 100 grains, the Pyrodex powder,

and I mash it up like mortar and pestle on that rock and get a pile of Pyrodex powder about that big and about that tall. Two pellets, 250 grain pellets. And I've got a little stack of half-dry twigs like right here that I'm going to light that powder and it's going to go, and then I'm going to put those twigs on it. Gopts. And everything's going to be great.

Man, I was wearing a pair of glasses, I remember, and I had a lighter. And all I remember is when I flick that lighter, Mo, my entire vision was filled with fire. That is not a joke. I mean, I saw nothing but orange fire. What did you think is going to do the way that fire comes out of the end of those barrels? I don't know, man. But no, you hadn't told me this story. I just thought it was just going to just burn.

Like just a little, just like, just like, just have a little flame about that tall. That would probably last about a minute, minute and a half. And man, it just, I'm telling you, Bear, it was. Sticks and twigs go everywhere. I, I, okay, now, I don't want to over-exaggerate this. I don't think it blew me back, but I jumped back. And when I was on that hill,

I landed like eight feet away and my glasses flew off and my glasses had embedded like sparks in the glass or my god there was plastic lenses that there were like fire marks glad you had the glasses

where he's still cold singed my eyebrows I was worked up so much after that it warmed me up but it's cinched my eyebrows and you're like burnt hair smell you know but it didn't it didn't

I mean it did it it It wasn't like any permanent damage. So anyway, Piratex Power, Powder. That's my Piratex story. And I proceeded to hunt the whole day and didn't see a single living animal. Shooks. Yeah. Yeah.

But that's bear hunting in the late season, too. Yeah. No doubt. No doubt. That's awesome. Bear, tell, so the other day, Bear told me a story. And I don't even think he thought it was funny. And I just started, like, cackling laughing.

Tell me about when you were mowing the other day. This has nothing to do with deer hunting. We're going to get back to deer hunting. Basically, I was mowing this yard and kind of like this little subdivision, old subdivision, and some guy comes walking down the road right next to me while I'm, like, getting a weed eater. And I can tell he looks pretty rough, but he walks up to me and, you know, I'm just like, how are you? And he's like, I'm doing pretty good. And he asked me, are you a fisherman?

And I was like, matter of fact, I am. and he was like, well, I've got a deal for you. And he like just starts to sell me. Bear is mowing. This guy like stops him. And it's like, hey, hey. And anyway, he starts telling me about this bayliner boat that he's got, like just down the road. He says it's a full bayliner 16 foot or something with an 80 horse mercury on it.

And he'd sell it to me for 300 bucks. And I was like, well, shoot, my John boat needs a motor. You know, if it runs an 80-horse mercury for $300, like, come on. The funny is far as the story is that Bear then goes with the guy to check out this $300. You're following down there to check it. Yeah, we start walking and I start kind of asking him some questions about it. And he's like, you know, he's telling me, like, if you just take this thing to the car wash, you get some gas in a battery, you'll have it on the lake by tonight.

And I was just like, man, this must be in pretty good condition. and we get pretty close to his house and he's like, and I'll tell you what, I've also got this 2003 Mustang convertible. It's not a running condition, but if you've got the time,

you know, you can get it fixed up. I'll give it to you for 150 bucks. I was just like, what on earth? The items just start stacking up. So, I didn't see the boat.

Unbelievable deals. Unbelievable deals. Where's the boat on the lake? But I could tell the guy was pretty rough and I pretty much knew there's a catch or this isn't what it seemed. So I kind of went in there knowing I wasn't going to buy anything,

but I wanted to just check it out. I mean, sure. Yeah, I mean, $300 or a dairy drug addict down the road. Well, anyway, we get to the boat. It's probably Mo's cousin. Could be. And it was just the junkiest boat I've ever seen in my life. Had like trees growing out of it

and was like, you know, all the flat tires. and he told me, he was like, just bring a battery and gasoline. So we'll get started a chainsaw. Chainsaw to cut the trees out of it. And I was just like, there is no way that thing would start. And then he said, well, I'll tell you what, I'll give you the Mustang and the boat for $500,

which is $50 more. All right, when you do that one in a stand-up comedy skit, that's your hook. All right, that's your hook. You say, and then he offered me. me a package deal, both of them for $500. I laughed when he told me that story. That's hilarious.

Anyway, I told them, you know, that's a little rougher than what I'm willing to work on. And he told me, you know, he was like, put $100 down right now. I'll save it for you until the end of the day. He's got a layaway program. This dude needed some cash. He needed it bad. He needed some cash. Anyway, I hated to leave him hanging.

Bad part might not even been his stuff. Yeah. No, it turns out it wasn't. Turns out it was his brothers. His brother is... He starts... He's talking to me like it was his. And then his brother pulls up and he says,

this boat is my brothers. And we're trying to sell it. We're trying to sell, you know, all this stuff. And so, like, he kind of, like, switched the story when his brother pulled up. But it was his brothers and his brother was going to sell it. Wow.

But anyway... Now, son, this is why I wanted to bring this up publicly amongst the community here. is that if you'd have had a regular haircut, that man would have never profiled you as a drug user. With the mullet cut. Am I right? That's true.

It is shorter. How much you cut off your hair, Bear? Good three inches. Maintenance cut. It'll be back in like six months. Okay. That was a great story. That was a great story.

Okay, okay. I was going to ask Bear what he, brought for show and tell today. Well, let him tell a deer story. We're back on to deer. Okay. Tell us about Dan. Oh, yeah.

Well, I was going to get to this one. We talked about the deer stories, but you might as well start because there was a story about a gar hole, gar hole in somebody. Oh. And anyway, basically we had this deer camp last year, and River, my sister's co-worker, she invited him to come and hunt with us. and it was like one of his first times to ever hunt. And he had like, you know, good knowledge of how to shoot a gun and everything and basic safety.

So, and he'd hunted before. So I put him out, you know, in this like pretty good spot that I figured he may be able to see deer. It was opening day a rifle. And anyway, I drop him off there. And then I take me and then another buddy, we go and we hunt. We kill a nice buck. We come back and pick him up. and he shot a spike, and we were pumped.

You know, it was his first deer, one of his first times hunting. We were just glad that he was able to get one. So anyway, we have like 15 people at this camp, and, you know, we have some, like, prime spots. And so it's kind of like all the people that killed deer in the morning. It was like, you know, they're kind of getting the gar hole pretty much. It was just kind of like cinnamon area. Bear was kind of telling people where to go.

So none of these people, few of them had ever been to this place. Yeah. So bears like, okay, you're going to go here, you're going to go here, you're going to go here. He's not acting like his dad. Yeah, telling people what to do. Yeah. Anyway, so my buddy, Dan, he kills his first deer. And he said, you know, I don't need to be in a good spot.

I'm just glad I got one. I just want to go hunt. And so I didn't even have a spot for him. I just told him, you know, there's this, you know, I described an area to him and told him, you know, there may be some deer in there if you just go look for sign. and, you know, I mean, he'd like almost never hunted, so he didn't, you know, I couldn't tell if he would really know how to read sign or not. But I go hunt, we come back, and he has a big, wide eight point on the bed of his truck.

So he tagged out on bucks in one day. And it was his first time to ever hunt. Out on public land. Yeah, on public land. And his second one was a nice eight point real wide. Anyway, so he kind of like develops his name. Let's clarify, just because the audience may not exactly, we all may be on different levels of what big is.

A really big one. I'd say it was 90 inches, but it was. Respectable. Yeah, yeah, no, no, not degrading the deer. I just don't want people to get through one idea. Yeah, he wasn't like a 130 inch eight point. Yeah, yeah. It was like two and a half year old, but real wide.

Yeah, yeah, you know, like probably 16 inches wide and a little four inch time. I mean, a buck. Yeah. Oh, it was the biggest. we killed the camp and so he you know kind of he killed two bucks one day he doesn't hunt with us for the rest of season uh you know we he wanted uh archery hunt this year with a bow and so he got a bow like two weeks before season and you know i took him out shooting showed him you know how to sight everything in and he gets to shooting pretty good and uh he says you know if y'all go hunting one

weekend I want to just come. He said, I still have deer meat from last year, so I don't really need to kill anything, but I'd just like to go. Anyway, so he comes, and I've got four other guys with me. And, you know, we kind of like dish out the spots. And he was just like, don't give me a good spot. I just, because, you know, he'd killed two deer and it'd only been hunting once. So he was pretty, pretty happy with his success rate.

And anyway, we put them, it was the same thing. I just had an area that I figured there may be some deer in. And anyway, he drove down there. And he called me right at dark and is like, and he didn't have a tree stand. He didn't have hunting off the ground. It was his first time to ever hunt with a bow. And he calls me at dark and is like, I just shot one.

And I was just like, you've got to be kidding me. Another buck? It was a doe. Okay. But still. Shot it off the ground. Yeah, he hunted. That's tough, isn't it, Mo? That's tough off the ground.

At like 10 yards. too. I basically just told him like if one comes in like draw away before it's close and it's exactly what he did. And I mean, he just shot a deer. So you're basically the world's greatest guide. I wasn't with him at all. Right. But you told them where to go. You told them what to do. You taught him how to shoot. I mean, yeah. He seemed to a place that he thought he might see something. So. Yeah. Well, that's a, that's a great story to get us talking about the deer stories.

Mo, what was your favorite story? Well, there was two stories that was really good. A guy on there told both of them, and I think his name was Mo Shepp. I saw that one coming. Do you like how I put you right there at the end? Yeah, yeah, he saved the best for last. That's what you need to do. That's what I did.

That's what I did. I got to tell you what Lake Pickles said. I decided I'd be nice to you. He said, we need more. Mo Shepherd on there. That's what he said. He said he loves the way you tell a story.

So now Lake, now Lake's story. Pathetic. Just a joke. Lake's a good storyteller. Lake's a great friend of mine. He told a great story. The only reason I make fun of Lake gave him a hard time is because he's such a nice

guy. I don't think anybody else does. So I choose on my public platform to ridicule Lake Pickle with On X. All right, Mo, go ahead. But, yeah, you done a good job of cherry-picking those stories on all of them. I mean, they were all really good stories. The short stories were good.

Yeah, yeah. The longer stories were good. But I think my favorite one was the first one that your friend, Mitch. Mitch, yeah. Told about the deer that, you know, he set up on and right there close to him. He thought he had a good shot. He apparently missed it. and then this other deer comes in,

and I've had that happen to me before, you know, as far as a deer you see a deer, then all of a sudden it just vanishes. And you're watching that area, and you don't never see the deer again. You don't know where it went. And all it would take is take your eyes off that spot for five seconds, and the deer can turn and walk away,

and you never know it left that spot. Right. Or they may stay there a long time in that same spot, especially old mature bucks that are woodwise. Yeah. But I really like that story about that because of just the way it all progressed through. And he talked about, you know, his patience. And then he thought, there's no way, no way that that little button buck, you know.

Yeah, yeah. Could bend that deer. And well, maybe it was because I never saw nothing else move after that. And then all of a sudden here comes that deer that he had first seen that movement of, you know, 20 or 30 minutes, however long it had been, you know. Yeah. Pretty awesome story. You know that happens all the time

A guys get busted, never even know it. No, they get busted. A deer just comes in, a big one will come in. And man, it may pick up your scent, or it may see a movement where you've turned your head or something other. Yeah. It could be several things, but you're right. You know, I think humans think about time differently than animals do.

I mean, you've got to assume that they do. Like, to us sitting in one place for 20 minutes would be hard. and it would be hard because of a lot of different reasons. We're on schedules. Our nature. Even as we hunt, we're on schedules. Yeah. Deer's not on no schedule whatsoever.

He wakes up and he has 24 hours to survive. To survive and then start the next day for him. And so, I mean, that big buck, him sitting there for 20 minutes. I mean, most people probably would have got busted or just or the buck would have just slipped away. You know, I think that butt and buck coming out. saved him. Yeah, I don't think the deer would ever come down there where he was at. No, but and buck, because I think it had smelt where he'd done all the stomping around.

Yep. And it was trying to figure out, that's my thoughts on it. Yeah. Buck was standing up there thinking, is that guy still around here? Did he just pass through? What do I need to do to breathe the next day? And I really think deer think like that. I mean, I don't know, but they've got to think somewhere another to survive like they do out

and where they're hunting pressure on them. Josh, which was your favorite story? Man, I really like Keith Polk's story. Keith's story. Yeah, I think it had, it was one highlight after another, man. And I think for me, having been in an old crappy tree stand for years, you know, you get up there halfway and you're like, crap, I can't, this thing is about to throw me out because it's tilted. And every one of us, I guarantee have adjusted those tree stands up while we're up in the tree because we didn't want to climb down. And the way he talked about putting that wingnet on there and thumping it, you can just totally see that thing.

He did a great job with describing it. But then from that to go and to get his brother and then, you know, rally racing back to get the deer. And then the way he described that vine going over the top of the truck. He's pulling that. He does a great way. You know, when somebody's describing something, you know, some people could have just been like, well, a vine tore it out of the truck. Right. But he described how it went over the hook.

over the glass, over the cab, and you kind of just envision it. You know, you can see it. But I could just, I could see that, you know, I could see. Yeah, when they told, when they told said they took off with the tailgate down, I thought something's going to happen. Yeah, exactly. I didn't know what about it.

Something's going to happen. Yeah. Exactly. Did you notice that the three-wheeler made an appearance in that story? Oh, yeah. What did he do? He just rode a three-wheeler? I think he just had a three-wheeler.

I think Keith put that in there just for me. any story is going to be better if it's got a three-wheeler. But I just, I love the nostalgia of that story with, with everybody at the Shell Station. You know what I mean? That, that takes me back. Just everybody's sitting around with tailgates down. And, you know, that, unfortunately, those days are, are pretty much gone, you know. Yeah.

Everybody wants to race to get their pictures on Instagram and Facebook as quick as they can. The new shell station. The new shell station. On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is a over. They just get darker. I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a sleeping bed and there was a full of blood. Oh my God, he doesn't have a hit. Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors, where the terrain is unforgiving,

the evidence is scarce and the truth gets buried under brush and silence. Indications were he should be right there, but he wasn't. This season, we're going deeper. From Cold Case, files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwoods. Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. Because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments, and the people left behind trying to piece them back together. He's not an honest person.

He's incapable of being honest. Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers. Season two of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, Iheart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. I put a picture of that, speaking of the Dushel station, I put a picture of Keith's buck. It was a nice buck. Yeah, it was.

It was bigger than I thought. I thought he was going to, you know, the way he described it, I thought it was like, you know, he acts like it was real big in their mind at the time. Right. But it was a pretty good buck. It was a nice deer. Even, no matter who you are. At the gym, it was a giant because they were young hunters and dandy deer.

so. Shane, have you ever falling out of a tree stand, the climbing tree stand or anything? No, but I fell out of a hang-on. Really? How far did you fall? Well, my harness caught me, but I was 18 to 20 up

when I fell out. How'd you fall? Fell asleep. Is that right? Yeah, sure enough. Just rolled out, sitting there with my elbows on my knees, and it was one of them, you know, good cold days,

and the wind hitting you right in the face, and when the sun started, you know, beating down on you, you know, just just dozed off. And, I mean, I just fell out just head first, you know, and harness caught me. I bet that's woke it. It did. Yeah. Yeah. No, and it did, it took a, it took a little bit to figure, you know, really sink in what happened.

Did you have your tether at the route to where you didn't fall plum out of the stand? No, I fell plum out of the stand. I mean, I was, you know, my chin was about it. my platform. You know, I probably had that much slack. I bet that was a chore getting back up in there. I got wall around there and got a hold of one of the steps, you know,

and then kind of, um, I don't, to be honest, I don't even know how I got back in the tree. Yeah, I bet. I bet it was all adrenaline.

Yeah. But I do know whenever I, whenever I, whenever I'd done that and it kind of comes to, somehow I, my bow was, you know, here on the hangar.

You know, when I went to grab it, I grabbed something where I don't, what I thought I was grabbing at. Um, but it, uh, I had a hold of a string or cable enough that it derailed my bow.

So I went, I had to go home, you know, repress it and put it back together. But yeah, it was a H-T-R and it derailed it and bent one of the modules. So I don't know. Oh, when you went to grabbing for it. Yeah, so I grabbed it pretty hard. I grabbed it pretty hard. What made me ask that question was thinking about Keith in a tree adjusting a platform. One time, Bear, I think I was 19, one year older than you, I went and was hunting on a cold day when there was a bunch of ice on the north side of a pine tree.

I went up, like down low, there was no ice or snow. And when I got up to the top of this mountain to hunt, there was a skiff of snow on the ground and there was a quarter inch of pure ice completely on the north side of the trees. and I had a Logi Bayou, climbing tree which Logi Bayou's had a metal strap with a rubber rubber band. I just had a

piece of rubber around that flat strap. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's the way I remembered it. It was metal, but it had a rubber around the flat strap. Well, I go to climbing this tree that's just covered in ice. And I get up, I mean, as high as I'm going to

get, 18, 20 feet. and the rubber is grabbing onto the ice side. And it just wasn't a problem. Like you just kind of went up it, and it couldn't really slide because the teeth were biting into the bark of this pintry. Right. Well, when I got up there,

I got, you had to kind of stand up to get turned around to sit in the seat. And when I did, I took my feet off of that platform, and I didn't have a rope attached to it. And that platform just went down. It ratcheted like this all the way to the ground. Just hit the ground. I mean, just, pooh, just straight down. And no, that is actually not entirely true.

I was standing on it, and it went down, and I caught like right here. I had taken my weight off of it and then went back on it. And that's when it started down. It went to the ground, and I went down, but my arms caught on the top. Yeah. That makes sense. And so I'm hanging and it just ratchets. And you haven't gotten your harness hooked up yet.

I don't even think I had a harness at that time. Yeah, that's probably pre-harness. Yeah. You just tied a rope around your waist. Yeah, around the belt loop. Yeah. And so I'm setting up in this tree, big pine tree, like probably 18 feet, let's just say. And I just, I'm comfortable.

I'm safe. But I'm just like, what am I going to do? He just went on hunting. Well, I basically just wrapped my feet around that pine tree. It would just lean forward as fast as I could and bring it down about four inches and just, I mean, it took me 30 minutes, but I worked my way down. Do you remember whenever I was like just learning how to use a climbing stand

and I was like 13 or 14 right over there? And it was real cold and I tried to climb like a red oak tree that was kind of like slanted. And I got all up to the top. the bottom slid all the way down. Same story. Hard barked red oak. Yeah, hard barked and it was cold and I was like,

oh, I had to come get you. Yeah, you came with the climbing sticks. Oh, I forgot about that. Completely forgot about that. And what did we do? Just put the climbing sticks up? Yep, and I just climbed down. It was like right next to the house.

I don't even remember. Well, I know I'm the oldest one here, so I'll tell this little story. When I first started bo-hunting, I was just a young teenager. and we didn't even know what tree stands were. Back in the 1800s, they didn't, did they? Yeah. But I'd read a lot about, you know, archery hunting, you know, your best, if you can get up in an elevated stand above the deer.

So I first started bow hunting for four or five years. You know how I got, you know, what kind of tree stands I sat in? I stood on limbs. Yeah. I actually stood on limb with my recurved bow. And the first deer ever shot, I shot standing on a big white oak limb on a white oak tree. Oh, that's cool. That's awesome.

You know, I wasn't that high up. I was probably 10 foot off the ground or something like that. But it worked. It worked at the time. That's some primitive hunting right there. It's a primitive hunting. Traditional bow crouched on a limb. And then I finally, I think I was about 25 or 26 when I bought my first climbing stand.

And did you have you ever fallen out of one? Never fell out of a stand. I've done what he was talking about. I have dozed off a time or two, but that's something when I'm, and it was on a lock on stand, which you have nothing around, you're anything.

But I had my tether on my harness tight enough when I kind of leaned forward, when I dozed off and went forward. I think that's what woke me up. I felt it pulled my shoulders like that. Oh, so you didn't go all the way down. No, no, but if I hadn't had a, if I hadn't had a harness on,

I would have fell out that day, I think, because I had dozed off. Yeah. Yeah. But that was several years ago. that was probably 25 year ago when that happened to me. So, wow. Shane, what story stood out to you?

Well, I liked them. I liked them all. There's all unique, you know, in certain aspects. But, I mean, really, and it ain't because Mo's sitting here. My favorite ones were Moes. I'll be darn. Because I relate to what, you know. Look at that, man.

Yeah. Someone did like your stories. Yeah. Yeah. That's first person. It's told me that. Clay ain't said a thing about my stories. Yeah.

He won't. but no, just because of knowing what the country's like over here where he hunts and it's a lot like over at home. I mean, it's rough. It's big woods. It's hard to get to. You know, just everything about I can relate. You know, just kind of relate to it. And it's, you know, you don't hear a lot of people, you know, talk about hunting in our kind of country.

You know, really very seldom. I mean, it's always you're either, you know, in the south or the Midwest. You know, it's a whole different, a little bit, just a whole different hunting food plots or something like that. Just a whole different hunting experience. And I mean, that's what I've grown up done. And I just, that's just, I relate to that. So, I mean, I enjoy it when I hear somebody talking about it. Yeah, I hear you.

I hear you. Which one does you like, Barry? I liked Mitch Sykes, the one where he killed the big buck over the scrape. Whenever he talked about just seeing the deer cross the road and then like finding just a pocket of white oaks. and then going up and finding those scrapes that just it just got me pumped. Yep.

Yeah. That's all, huh? No more stories after that. I mean, they were all good. I also liked yours, Moe. I mean, I didn't want to say it. He didn't want to say it. I didn't want to say it, but no, I did,

just because it was, like, especially the one where you were walking and you see the buck down below you, I hunt quite a bit like that, especially in muzzleloader or modern gun season. Clay knows that because we and him has talked about that a lot. And especially in places where deer get pressured, a lot of times they stay bedded up, but I've killed two or three that I've watched get up out of their beds doing that same thing,

not knowing I was there or maybe even seen me. And I've seen deer get up and leave and me never get a shot at them doing the same thing. but it's uh it's i enjoy hunting that way i guess what i'm trying to say now what was the gentleman's name was talking about he's the the guy killed the kid killing the deer where he's pushing his the fence down with his horns yeah his name is henry susong yeah he told the story last year yeah yeah that that guy is a he is he is an incredible bow hunter he lives in east tennessee yeah hunting country like here yeah it is not a destination white tail yeah yeah at all.

But those guys also hunt Illinois. His truck, he has a big, a big room, way big, like twice as big as this room that is just literally from the floor. I mean, he's got deer mounts starting about four foot on the wall that go all the way to the ceiling. Him and his boys are real good deer hunters over there. But they spent a lot of, they kill a lot of them in the big ones in Illinois. way they got a I'm pretty sure they had a 200 inch deer in there and wow and six couple one nine didn't you put a picture of that last year I probably did I was thinking I seen a remember a picture of that last year after the stories that you'd put on you know social media or something there of that room with all those deer and you said this is yeah this is a room that'll impress anybody that guy he's he's 82 and I mean just just just just couldn't wait to talk about deer hunting I mean was just giddy I mean just like we were coming down through that

I mean, he was such a great guy. I love it. Yeah, yeah. And then that little story, to me, sometimes those little funny stories are, I like them just because it's just something different. I really like Bob Wilson's garhole story, too. It's short, but it made me laugh. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, because I think we've all been, like Barry was telling earlier, kind of garthole with these friends and that.

I think we've all been in that scenario. If you've hunted very long on both ends of it, you've. went with people that sent you to a place and you was thinking, why am I here? You know, I ain't seen a thing. And then you took people with you that this guy coming. I wasn't expecting to be here, but we've got to put him somewhere to go. Yeah. So I thought we've all kind of been in that scenario if we've hunted very much.

Yeah, for sure. Shane, what's your favorite deer story? Your, like, personal deer story. Like a big, if I'd ask you, what would you have told me? Would you tell me about one of your big deer? Would you have told me about something funny that happened? Yeah, I mean, I've got personally, probably one of the big deer that I've killed, but since that time, you know, it's the one I've witnessed my boys shooting deer.

And there's, it's just hard to, it's hard to wrap the, you know, explain that feeling you get when you see your, you know, one of your sons shoot his first deer, much less 150-inch deer, which that was that's probably one of the better highlights. This last year we had a we had a buck that I'd found there pretty close to the house. Just showed up out of the blue. I don't know who, where he come from because that's out of the ordinary for a deer like that to be there. And so my oldest son,

which has killed a lot of stuff and a lot of big stuff. He told his little brother, said, I'll let you, I'm going to let you hunt that deer. and which was kind of shocking to me because, you know, that's pretty generous. That's pretty generous, you know. So anyway, we, we, me and Trenton, we, we, we hang a stand. I get everything, you know, set up the best I can for him.

And we was hunting every evening we could, you know, when season opened and in, and evening after school or when I get off work. But so on, I believe, I believe it was actually October 1st. It was one of them days, kind of like this past weekend. it was hot there at home. We get out there and get in a tree like at four o'clock and just freaking, you know, burning up and just went, why, why am we sitting here, you know?

Because it ain't, just happened to look over. He said, there's, there's a deer coming. Well, I get to watch and, well, it's this freaking deer that we'd been, you know, had got word of, and I had found him, got those pictures of him. And so I knew, knew exactly who it was or what it was. Well, he comes out and he kind of bypasses this, but he goes through a strip and goes into a little bit of a mode off field, you know, behind us. And I seen where he went through, and there was kind of an old, there's a little

swag in this field where they'll come back and forth across. And I don't know what he was doing, why he went over there out of the way. Went out next thing. I know we turned around here he's coming right back on the trail that comes right by us, you know, and he comes in front of Trit in there, you know, 18 yards. and I'm standing right over his shoulder and he puts an airth of him and we watch him fall. And I mean, it's just the dangest thing. Do you video it with your phone?

No, I was so shook up, Clay. I had it in my hand. I couldn't even get it, you know, get it out and turn your mind. Yeah, I was. But yeah, you know. But yeah, you know, so you know. Oh, that's cool. 150 inch deer?

147. Wow. That's a heck of a deer. Yeah. Nine-pointer, you know, he had a really, really good frame. I mean, he could have been, he was a nice deer for sure. Really, really good deer, you know. Wow.

But that's probably one of the best, just everything, you know, just, yeah, mainly probably because he's older brother. So, I'll let you hunt him. And if, if you miss him, then I'm going to go kill him. Well, he didn't miss him. So I guess that was a good thing. Oh, that's cool, man. That's cool.

Well, Mo, if you hadn't made any more hunting stories since you told us that one, since I told you those? Well, that was eight, nine years ago, so yeah, I've had several stories since. No, no, no. Now, we recorded you telling them like two, three weeks ago. Oh. Have you hunted any of this year yet? Only one day is all I've been.

One day with my bow. And I bear hunting one day with my bow. It's just been so hot. It has been hot. I don't remember the last time it rained around here. I don't either. I was thinking about that today. Where I live down here, you know, north of Mountainburg,

the last measurable rain we had down there was, seven weeks ago and we got a little over an inch and two days span down there. We haven't had a drop since our horse pastures are burning up. I'm feeding hay to our horses. Yeah. Wow.

Josh, what's on your list? I have some white tail trivia. Oh, shoot, I forgot. Yeah, we're going to end with some white tail trivia. So you didn't know it, Shane, but you should have been listening. I should have. And whoever wins gets a... This saddle.

This custom And a self bow from bear Yep Colt George saddle You ever going to ride in that saddle? I have Look you can tell it's getting a little patina on it Okay I see it now

That's the saddle my buddy Colch George made me I just remember you told me when you got that He told you that you better use it So I have I have I like to keep it in here on the stand Yeah it's a pretty cool saddle Okay yeah Okay trivia let's go

Okay I got five questions regarding white tests. Tell us the rules, like the first person to answer? What I kind of want to do, I wish I had something for you all to write on because I want, I want everybody to give an answer.

Yeah, I want everybody to give an answer. And we'll see you. We could be honest. We could be honest. Should we just, oh, because I could say the answer and then Mo could cheat. Yeah, but I want,

I want everybody to say an answer, even if it's the same answer as someone else. But be honest. Playing on answer the same way Clayton. does because his answers is using very good. We're using the honor system here too. Okay, honor system. Okay. Okay. First question is regarding deer antlers.

Okay. Bar and I were having this discussion. I think that... Wait a minute. This is with the stories, right? No. No, this is whitetail trivia. You know, a lot of people from this country call them horns. Yeah, I know. That's right. Okay. I thought it was trivia about the stories. No, this is white-tail trivia.

Okay. I thought it was white-tailed deer. Deer stories trivia would have been way better. We have these white-tail hunters. They should know about white-tail. Okay. Okay. Okay. So deer antlers start growing mid-March to early April.

Okay. Where'd you learn that at? They teach you that in college? No, because I didn't see the inside of the college. Well, I was told once that they start growing as soon as they shed their horns. Really? They start from that pedestal down there. You obviously haven't read the internet.

A deer biologist told me that. though so he's probably wrong he probably wrong he didn't learn how much can deer antlers grow in one day an eighth of an inch a quarter inch a half inch or a full inch full inch full inch full inch half inch half inch full inch is one quarter of an inch a deer antler can grow up to a little over an inch and a half per week. I mean, you think about that. How does like 190 inches of antler fit in like the three-month growing season? Do the math.

That's what it says. That's what a reliable source said. An inch per day. Hunt internet. No, quarter inch per day. Okay, so let's do the math here from April, May, June, July, August, five months, 30 days, 150 days. That's an inch per day.

Well, okay. I mean, that makes sense because not every single time is 150 inches. So that's multiple points of that antler. Right. Antlers grow in different times. So I think it could work. Your point, your question was, I was with you. I was with you.

I've heard an inch a day. I thought I had as well, for sure. And that might be like all of them. The deer me and Shane are killing, but we'll grow an inch of day. Yeah. Okay. Question two. Question two. Yeah, in your mind.

This one is fill in the blank, so you're going to have to give me an answer. Okay. I don't know if you guys, so I spent a lot of time at the White River fishing, and in the fall, I see a lot of deer swim the river, even when it's flowing pretty good. And I'm always amazed at how. Does this Josh Storytime? No, this is the question. This is the question. I'm always amazed at how good a swimmer's deer are.

Why is that? What characteristic about deer makes them a good, makes somebody answer first besides Clay this time. Shane? I've got my answer. There is a, there is a characteristic about deer that makes some good, good swimmers. I've never thought about that. I guess, I don't have a good answer. Okay, Mo?

Their hair. Okay. What about it? The way it sheds water and stuff like that, it don't soak up with water. Okay. Webbed. hooves. I think Mo's on to it.

I think it's a buoyant hair. Like if you, I know a deer hide, if you put it on water, I've never done it, but I can just envision it flow. That is a good point because like you tie flies. Clay and Mo got it. The reason is that deer hair is cheered. Deer hair is actually hollow. Okay. And they say that the buoyancy of the hair of a deer will keep a third of its body out of

water. Wow. Yeah. So that was a pretty good question, Josh. Okay. What is the max lifespan of a white tail dude? There's got to be a range here. You're saying max has max lifespan.

Like the oldest deer to have ever lived? Not the oldest deer, but a max like general lifespan. Deer commonly lived at 10 years old. Okay. But is that max? Would you consider that a max? 15 max. Sorry, change my answer.

13. I'm going to say, I'm going to say, and you're saying an average for maximum life. Yeah. Well, not like the oldest deer in the world. There's no such thing as an average maximum. That's why I was asking. Don't question the question. Don't question the question, Steve Renala.

If you get an average. You get a podcast and you got to question every question. I say 10 years. 10? I'm going to go 10. 20. It's 20 years. They can live probably in captivity.

Is it shorter for bugs? I don't know. That's a good question. They said that deer typically live three and a half to six years, but can live as much as 20. Okay. Because I'm where they're at, too. What is the max speed of a white-tailed deer? 35 miles an hour. 34, 36.

27. 30 is what they say. The price is right. What did you say? 27. That's close. Okay. Last question.

And this one is definitive. There's no gray area here. Okay, good. How many states have the white-tailed deer as their state animal? Oh, gosh. Seven. Four. Two.

Three. What did you say? Seven. The answer is nine. Really? Nine. Nine states, which would be Arkansas is a state animal. Illinois.

Michigan, Mississippi, New Hampshire, Ohio, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, and Wisconsin. Okay. Okay. That was pretty good, Josh. We had no winner. No winner. What do you mean then no winner? You guys all were terrible answering this question.

Just argumentative, unruly. There's no winners today. I'm not going to pull Spencer Newhart here. There are no winners on Bear Grubour. But you have to look at the source of the questionnaire. Oh, no, you don't. Oh, that was pretty good. I like that, Josh.

See, I thought it was going to be questions about the stories. Like, here would have been a good question. What procedure did Gerald Brewer take when driving his truck to try to obey the law when he was with his. young mentee. Now say again. He took the cap. He took the caps off his muzzle loader before he put him in the truck. Oh, yeah.

Okay. I see. Gerald Brough. Okay. Another question would be, I'm just shooting from the hip here. Okay. So Josh won. Okay.

We're continuing the trivia. Okay. How wide was the spread on the buck that Mitch Sykes kills? the hide and seek buck 22 24 dish right at 24 okay 18 I thought it was 18 too 24 inches it was 24 inches wide yeah see this would be good mo's shepard mo's listening I was listening okay if you follow clay newcom on on Instagram here's another question what color was Mitch Sykes Ford Ranger was it gray he didn't he didn't even have a Ford Ranger on my Instagram.

The picture you posted. I think he published. Oh, no, I'm sorry, Keith Polk. Keith Polk. What color was Keith Polk's? What color was, Grey? Nope.

I don't matter if I've seen that or not. Maroon. It was tan. It was tan. Classic tan. Yeah. Yeah. Ford Ranger.

Well, hey, this has been really good. Shane, it's been good to catch up with it. You too. Hey, where can people find MMP? Like, how do they, who's, who's a customer you're looking for here? Just any muzzleloader hunter that's needing parts, just get on the website, MMPSabos.com and check it out. And yeah, we'll be proud to help you out. And you can even our phone numbers listed on there.

You can even call us if you need an assistance on anything that you may need or think you want to try. Right on. Good seeing you again, Jane. Maybe it won't be 12 years before we see each other. Maybe not. Yeah, we didn't even talk about, though, where we, you know, they met at an Arkansas Arkansas Black Bear Association event. Oh, nice.

Yeah, in the early... Back in the early years. Yeah. Mo, thanks for coming, man. You bet. I always appreciate you telling stories. They're always good. Appreciate it.

Barry, you didn't get to talk about your self-bow? What are you making? It's real quick. Self-bow that I'm working on. Elm? Yeah. I absolutely hate him. I absolutely hate him.

You don't have a clue, do you? No, I just know it is the worst. Looks like white elm to me. Now, why are you making an elm self-bow? It's just the only dry stave I have. Oh, really? I won't have another one for like two months. Is that a traditional thing to make it out of elm?

I mean, people make a lot of elm bows. Okay. But it's not, I don't, the poor folks. Yeah. Have you studied it? Have you studied any of sats of fress wood? I've heard some guys make them with sassafras. Yeah, that's why I was asking you because, because I've noticed.

somebody made out sass-fress. It's had to be a pretty big. That's pretty sad when a young boagers got to make a blow out of the elm wood. I can show you some sass-fress that's bigger in. Oh, really? Yep. Dang. That'd be good.

Well, yeah, I appreciate it. Good to see everybody. Yes, sir. And, hey, next week, next week we're starting our Osceola series. We're getting back in. All the bear greasers that feel like they kind of, got to take some time off and enjoy the podcast, like the stories and stuff. We're getting back on track and we're doing some hard-hitting history that means something, okay?

No, we've been working on this for like a year and a half. Yep. I read my first book on Osceola a year and a half ago. Also, not to foreshadow, there's a potential of some inductees into the Bear Grease Hall. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, no, I'm really excited about the Osceola series that's going to start like next Wednesday from when you see this.

But also, sometime in the next month, Bear, when Misty's here, Brent's here, probably get my dad up here, we're going to do an official induction into the Bear Grease Hall of Fame. It's been like two years since we've done a Hall of Fame induction. I didn't realize that was an official event.

Oh, yeah, everybody wears suits and stuff. Black tie, shoot, plus one. Yeah, it's a, it's a big deal. It's been a couple years, We've got a couple of candidates. You've done a haircut. You didn't know it just for it. Yeah, you probably had to get a haircut for that.

Another one. Another haircut. All right, guys. Last spring, Clay Newcomb and I collaborated with Jason Phelps at Phelps game calls in building each of our own favorite turkey diaphragms called prime cuts. Now, I'm going to tell you, I love mine because it's easy to use. I'm not going to go, I'm not going to win a turkey calling contest. It's just not going to happen.

But when I run this call, I get the sound. that gobblers are looking for. I have a great turkey hunting track record. If you go listen to real turkeys out in the woods, they're not going to win calling contests, right? That's who I listen to. I can make those sounds on my cut. I also hunt with Phelps's cut,

and I hunt with Clay's cut because they're all three great cuts. Check out prime cuts at Phelpsgamecalls.com. I think you'll be glad you did, and you'll find out that the Steve Rinella cut is an easy-to-use cut for beginning callers who just want to start making good turkey noises and getting action. This is an I-Heart podcast, guaranteed human.