Bear Grease - Ep. 35: Bear Grease [Render] - Misty's Tell-All Squirrel Hunt, Alone-ish, and Folsom Fluters

Episode Date: January 5, 2022

On this episode, the regular Bear Grease Render crew is joined by Rick Spicer, a bushcraft expert and flint knapper who was on the last Bear Grease Podcast. Rick talks about flint knapping and about being on the show "Alone: The Beast" where he spent thirty days in the Louisiana woods "sort of" alone. Misty gives a full on expose of her squirrel hunt when Clay gave her shooting advice and didn't buy her candy (JERK!). The crew ponders if the fluting of the Folsom point was utilitarian or had deeper meaning. Finally, we get to the end and answer the question we started with - why does the information about these ancient people matter? This episode is a great ending to a great series. Connect with Clay and MeatEaterClay on InstagramMeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YoutubeShop Bear Grease Merch Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. First Lights fieldware collection is made for the work that happens long before opening day and continues when the season ends. Products built for early mornings, full days and real use. Hard wearing where they need to be versatile where it matters. No shortcuts. Just gear designed for the work that earns the season.

Built to perform, built to last. Check out. First Light's new field. Worldware Gear at firstlight.com. My name is Clay Newcomb, and this is a production of the Bear Grease podcast called the Bear Grease Render, where we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the scenes of the actual Bear Grease podcast. Presented by FHF Gear, American Made, Purpose Built, Hunting and Fishing Gear that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore. We need to get some mustache wax As part of the red shirt

So Daniel Rup can keep his mustache on the microphone Okay I'm I'm I'm gonna say My berry My hairgris mustache wax is fresh out

I had some right there Oh that would That would be spectacular Yeah too bad For those of us that have mustache Oh well I should grow a mustache You should grow a mustache

I hope I don't You should grow up my mustache. She'd look great. We should get Misty a fake mustache to wear. Just so I can bid in. You say you don't feel so out of place. I don't feel like an outsider. Yeah.

That would be really good. You can wear one of those turkey beards. Well, you know, I'm so good. I feel pretty thoughtful. Let's get the fake mustache. 2022, Misty gets a mustache. Yes, for sure. Actually, not my personal goal.

Hey, welcome to the bear grease render. fantastic to see everybody here today. It's really good to be seen. It is 2022. It is. Okay. Envision, envision yourself in 19 and 99. Okay.

And think about talking about 2020. We were preparing for Y2K. Yeah. I got my water purifier. Had my water purifier. I'd stoke up. A couple cases of shotgun shells. Exactly.

Are you kidding? Is that? No, I'm dead serious. Okay. Yeah. I'm still ready for Y2K. entire container full of Pinot beans. Oh my God.

Well, my mom... Hold on. My mom got a pound. No, you got to stop. Oh, no. You got a container full of what? Pinot bean. Pinot.

Pinto. No. Pinot. Pinot. Pinto. Say it again. Pinot. Pinot.

You might as well be saying acorn. I do say acorn sometimes. Yeah. Yeah. Get out. I admit that my family is a ganky background. He really does. My family's all Yankearnies.

I don't want to know. Oh. Okay. Back to my original question here. You guys started to took it and ran. I didn't even hear a question. I think it was like what I was trying to get at was, okay, if you're going from 2021 to 2022, it doesn't sound like that big of a leap.

No. Okay. But imagine I wrote 22 today for the first time, wrote it on a piece of paper for whatever, you know, dating something. You did this or I'm imagining. I did this. I'll show you what I did. Look, in that little note right there, I put one, two, 22.

Okay. And I thought, golly, can you imagine in the 1990s? You know, I would have been a teenager thinking about 2022. Okay, stop that thought and now think about 2045. Do you see my point? Yeah. I don't know. The Brent will be alive.

I'll be dead. Brits, Brit's hoping for next week. I'm looking for the end of this render. Point being, time seems to be continuing to progress. Yes. So,

happy new year. Happy new year. I don't know what kind of a... Is this a question? Intro that was. This was a thought exercise. This is one of Clay's questions that we don't get to answer. He actually answers for us.

Foreshadowing. It feels a little bit like, do you all remember deep thoughts with Jack Hayden? Yeah. It is a little bit, a little bit jack handy. Except not funny. I'm not sure the on-X guys and Rusty Johnson would have given me this much flak. They definitely wouldn't.

So now you're being critical of that. That's because they only spent a week with you. We've known you since 1999. They're still dealing with the fallout. I think I met you in 1990. It would have been 1998. No, it was 99. 99.

1999? 23 years ago. The longest 23 years is. You could have killed somebody and get out of prison by now. I know. And be done with it. Well, I said all that to say, happy New Year. We have one mystery guest with us.

Hey, if you were, if you really followed Bear Grease, you could probably guess who it is. You could guess it was. I bet you could. The patterns. Yeah, you could see the pattern. The pattern. And here's the pattern. And you can guess, be thinking, if you listen to the last podcast, which you should have,

the Folsom Part 4, the Missed, the Unsolved Mystery of. fluted stone. There would have been a guest on there that's here today. I'll introduce him here in just a minute, as is our custom. But to my left, Dr. Daniel Rube, great to see you. Happy to be here. Really, you considered shaving your beard after you saw mine. Well, your mustache does look really good.

That's the nicest thing you've ever said to me. I know, and I really hate to say it. I'm begrudgingly said. It looks good, a little too good. Okay, to your left is our mystery guest who will come back to, to his lab. Josh Lambridge spillmaker. Hello. Happy New Year.

Great to see you. My biggest desire, my thing to see this year is the render when we all get together and that chair just breaks on Daniel. It's coming, man. It's like hanging by thread. You are risking your life, shimming in. That's going to be good. To your left, back from wherever he came from, Brent Rees.

Hello. Great to see, Brent. It's good to be seen. Everybody heard Brent's holiday greeting. We appreciate it. I thought it was great. It was almost like Christmas party. Oh, I hate I miss that more than anything.

And the cookies. I don't guess nobody saved it. We all got one. Yep, we got one and then no more. We did leave an empty chair for you last time. That was good. I took a picture of it. That was good.

We've been traveling, man, for the holidays and all that. Been to Texas and meeting folks, meet and render people. Fans of the render down there. David McDaniels, good guy. You think a lot of us talked to him here. Absolute wonderful guy. Good family guy. Nice.

I had a cup of coffee with him. I bought it, so the next one's up in him. You can send me the bill? Can you imagine? Me buying coffee. That means when I go through Texas, he's buying me coffee. That's how it works. Perfect.

You've been Coon hunting a lot? I've been cuntling a lot. I went last night, man. It's like 25 degrees. Michael Roseman, Sunspot lights, calls me. He says, hey, you're going hunting tonight to prove my theory? And I said, I'm going hunting tonight to Tree of Coon. He said, well, my theory is that they don't, and I don't think it's a theory.

you say it gets like 28 degrees Coons don't move they do move Is that the threshold 28 degrees? What they do is they move around in the in the dent tree when your dog tree is on them

but they ain't coming out So There would be There would be a different Temperature regimen For different parts of the world Because there's parts of the Coon range Where 28 degrees

If they didn't move below 28 They would never move Yeah But down where Brent is Which is further south than even here That's pretty darn cold Yeah And I

It does matter, too, the recent weather patterns. So we've had this super warm December, and then it got super duper cold. And that's what I remember when I first started coon hunting in high school, Jeff Cunningham, who got us, me and my other buddy, Coon Hutton. We wanted to go coon hunting on a real cold night. And he was like, Clay, these are the nights that those Coons eat all year round, so they don't have to leave the den. Right.

And we didn't believe him. And we went coon hunting. And we rarely treat anything. It was super cold for the region. My thing was I just enjoy. I fixed me a thermos of coffee. I'd loaded the dog up and we hit the woods and I sat out there in the dark. There is something great about hunting when it's cold.

And it's clear, man, you could hear forever. And when he did strike and open up and tree, he was probably 360 yards away, I think. I looked on my tracker. I mean, it sounded like he was just right there. Yeah. It sounded good. You know, sound does travel different on a cold night. Oh, yeah.

It's crisper, clearer. Good. Man, we got to go Coonhuntunutton. Me and Brent got to go Coonutton. To Brent's left, my boss and scheduling manager, who I would like to request a Coon Hunt with Brent for it, my wife, Missy Noodle. Nice to be here. I definitely don't want that job.

I quit. I want you to have. I don't want to be the scheduling manager. I get to be the boss, but you're not quitting his boss? I'm good with that one. I don't want the scheduling manager. That'd be kind of stressful. Hey, Misty went squirrel hunting with me the other day.

It's a true story. I would like to, can I speak freely? Sure. You're the boss. Sure, you're the only one without a mustache. Listen, you guys, I haven't shot a big old shotgun like that a whole lot since I was a little girl. I remember having a good shot. Brent will remember from Bear Camp when you and Isaac were trying to teach me that I have a left-eyed dominant. Oh yeah. You're crazy in the head. A crazy in the head.

Whatever. No mustache and left-eyed. What kind of woman is this? I know. So I'll just be honest. I'm not a great shot. I haven't shot a lot of squirrels like ever. So Clay tells me, hey, come with me. And we're going to have a lot of fun. This And he, you know, when he takes the boys, he gets some candy, like some of our kids. Did he buy you candy? No. First off, no. I was expecting candy. I feel like I'm being sideswiped.

Well, you said I could speak freely. Second. I would have bought you candy. Second, hold off. You know what? You should know that she wants candy. I don't want to say I want candy. Exactly, Clay.

I'm sorry, Daniel. Well, this turned. Oh, Daniel. I apologize. You do. Listen. So then we go and we shoot. I can't even remember.

I just remember that Clay started mocking me. Like actually mocking me. My hand is over my mouth. He's holding his tongue. Not just mocking me while shooting, but afterwards when we would be around other, like, expert shooters, he would start mocking my proficiency. I mean, just I would walk up and I didn't know what was happening,

but there was lots of giggling, and it had to do with me, and it had to do with that gun. And I told Clay, these are. This is the worst, what is it, R3? Is that what they call it? Hunter recruitment. Yeah, this is the worst hunter recruitment strategy I have ever seen in my life.

It's not like I woke up that morning and thought, gosh, I really love squirrel hunting. No, I did not. Here's the question of them, see, did you enjoy it? I did. I had a great time. Okay, she said all that. We had a fantastic time. Wonderful.

And I'm going to go ahead and as the host of this show. I'm going to go ahead and say that I did not mock her. He giggled. I did giggle just a little bit because the first squirrel that we shot at. No, stop. This is terrible. Yeah, this is horrible hunter recruitment. If people feel like if they go hunting with you, you're going to mock them afterwards.

I was just trying to help you hit the squirrel. By mocking her. By mocking me. Through verbal humiliation. No, no, no. To a giant audience. I just gave her a small bit of feedback on her aiming. That was all.

Like, don't mess it up. No, no, it was very, very close. articulate feedback. And then giggled about it with others later on. I'm sorry for that. And then giggled about it. That's the part that really stung. You know, like we had this great time.

And then I walk up at all the Christmas parties we went to. Sure would have been nice to have a little more candy and a little less giggling. You know what I'm saying? That's what I've been saying? All these years I've known him. Wow. Just a little more candy and a little less giggling. Missy if it makes you feel better, I've hunted with Clay a fair amount, and he's never bought me candy.

Has he ever giggled at you? He's never stopped giggling. I don't know that he's ever, he actually might have giggled at me. I remember the time when we, that famous picture that's on Instagram now when we were young and you were good looking and I was not.

That hog that you've got so beautifully displayed out on the rock there, do you remember that, how that went down? I remember killing it. Yeah, here's what happened. We, Clayson, we pull into the, we pull into the,

to the National Force. I'm worried about where this is going. He's like, hey, I think there's some hogs. I bet there's some hogs down here. And I'm like, awesome. I'm so excited because he told me so many stories about killing hogs. And we get out of the truck. And we have to climb the hill to this field.

And he said, we get to the corner of the field. He's got his, bow. I've got mine. Well, I say mine. Gary Newcomb's old boat that I had told him. We're in Gary Newcomb's old pants. Probably, probably. And he said, here's what we're going to do.

If we see some hogs, we're both going to draw, and I'll count to three, and we'll both shoot at the same time. I'm like, okay. So sure enough, we crest the hill, and it's barely shooting light. I mean, it's just about to be dark. And he goes, look at that. And there's probably half a dozen hogs out. And he's like, okay, you draw, I'll draw. And I draw, and Clay's goes, one.

two and he just drills this hog and the hog scatter what happened to three shoot on three man you're supposed to get that squared away he said one two three shoot I totally forgot about that

because me so Misty I feel your pain I actually had a really good time 22s really started up relationship let me say though and this is connected to our mystery guess who I'm going to introduce.

My first cousin, Todd Marriott and I successfully pulled off a double where we drew on hogs. We were in tree stands, counted to three. We had a little more time to plan. Did Todd do the counting? To Clay's credit, it was a very last minute, like, fly by the seat of our pants. And we pulled past the spot that I thought, I bet there's some hogs up there. And, I mean, we jumped out of the truck and literally within five. minutes, 10 minutes, I had killed the hog.

I had not. The other time with Todd, it was a little more, it was a little more strategic, quite strategic. We went in, found a white oak acorn tree drop, rain in acorns, hogs on all underneath it, went in, hung stands, woke up way too early because we didn't set our clocks back, and it was time change. And we got in the tree like hours before daylight sat there. Daylight, hogs came in, killed them. Just like, well, pretty much killed them.

It's a really long story. It's a really long story. But that's connected to Rick Spicer, our mystery guest. Because Rick knows my other first cousin, Todd's brother, Sean Marriott. That's right. There's a lot of name dropping on this podcast so far. We're going to need a flow chard. Let's welcome Rick Spicer.

Rick. Yes. Hand clap for Rick. So Rick was the fulsome napper on the last podcast. Rividing audio, by the way. Yeah. Well, that's all Clay's doing. I'm just a knapper.

You just, here's that. I just click, clack, clack. Yeah. Clay's the only captured it all. But, no, I really appreciate her being able to be part of that. I had a great time. Yeah. So the trend with guests that you could, in the future, be able to forecast who's

going to be here. If you're local, I'll try to get you on the render. You know what I mean? Sure. But like, so the other guests would have been Ronella, who's in Montana, David Meltzer. He'll never be on this podcast. He knows better. I think you're setting yourself up right here.

Like, what if... You see what I'm saying? I mean, I'd be careful. It's not, there's no hard and fast rules. I think that Rick is special. She don't want to be. And that's why he's... She don't want to be this game.

There's going to be no... Rick came in like last minute and had not made many fulsome points. So it's not like Rick is like the national fulsome guy. He is a fantastic flintnapper, though. Look, he gave me this piece right here. Oh, my gosh. He made that. When I was listening.

of this on the way up here. And he started working on that Folsom point. I thought, man, it's going to be so cool. Everybody on the ring is going to get a Folsom. Merry Christmas. You know, you're just hand next to our candy. Yeah, these are easy to make. Hey, this is gorgeous.

I'm holding the one Rick made, and it is beautiful. Thank you. Now, that's not a Folsom point. How would you describe that point, Rick? That's basically a pretty standard arrowhead. It's a side notch point with some fairly heavy ceration. so it doesn't follow any specific... It's just a functional hunting stone point.

Exactly, and that's exactly what I made that way for. Okay, Rick, let's say you're a Paleolithic hunter. You've suddenly appeared in North America, by which way is a complete mystery to modern science and all of us. And you got a big piece of stone. What kind of stone point are you making to put on your arrow? Well, a lot of it has... And you know nothing that you know now.

I'm going to make the easiest thing. I can, right? Like, what tools do I? I mean, I've actually put myself in similar situations before where I've, like, walked out into the woods with nothing and tried to be like, what can I make? You know, I've done things, like the most extreme example. I lived for a month one time out in the woods with nothing. Really? Yeah. Did you really? Yeah. Where were you? A swamp in Louisiana. Really? Yeah. Did you, oh, wow, we need more info on that. Okay, answer the question, then we're going back to that. We're going back. No sidetracks. question is what kind of stone point would you make so the reason the the idea is that maybe rick would have been the one that came up with a fulsome point let's see so yeah it has everything to do with like

what tools i have available to me what type of stones around but essentially the first thing you're going to do is like try to break the thing it's like you're going to pick up this rock and figure out how to break it and you can do that by hitting the rock on something or pick up another rock and hit that it's got to be the right kind of rock though it's got to be it does yeah metamorphic or it's going to be harder yeah it's going to be harder than the rock that you're hitting

harder than the shirt itself or the flint that you're hitting because if it's not it's just going to break when you hit it right like if you pick up a piece of sandstone and try to hit it it's just going to I'm saying the you can't just go out here and pick up a piece

of limestone and nap it or no because sandstone the geologically the structure of the stone is not right you need a stone that's amorphous or that is is consistent throughout because if it has a lot of impurities, it won't.

So the entire napping process is built around a concept called the Hertzian cone. Either the Hertzian cone or the conchoidal fracture. You ever take a BB gun and shoot a window? What happens to the back of the window? No. No? No, I've never done that before. Let's just call it a piece of glass.

How about that? It doesn't have to be a window. What happens to the BB, though, when it hits the window? What does the glass do? Well, it just shattered. Breaks? No. I mean, it might.

But if it doesn't break, I should have prefaced that. Yeah, it makes a little cone. Yeah, makes a cut. That's a herdsian cone, okay? Okay. And so, and because glass is crystal, it's amorphous in nature, okay? It's the same throughout. So we're looking for stone that has that same type of properties.

So if you take a rock and you strike it with another rock, what you're getting when you strike it is a, you're creating a herdsian cone. So it's in the, In other words, it's a predictable angle that you know what's going to happen when you hit it. And that is what makes napping possible is because once you understand what angle to hit the stone, you can predict the angle at which the stone will break. And that allows you to craft it into a particular shape. And that only happens when you're working with stone that is consistent throughout.

Exactly. So that would eliminate sedimentary stone. Right. Within reason. But yes. For the most part, yeah, you're not going to be working with, limestone or sandstone. So yeah, no sedimentary rocks as far as what you would be napping. Okay. So going back to you living in the woods for a month, define for us what having nothing means?

The clothes that I walked in with. Really? Just walked in with some clothes. Yeah, that was actually part of a history channel project that I did. Oh, really? Yeah. What was that? It's a show called Alone the Beast. And you can watch it on who. I didn't know you were on that. You can watch it on. You can watch it on. No, I saw it. You saw Rick? Yes. It's all coming back to you now. I was coming back.

I thought I was having a flashback. He was very people. Yeah, there's three people. And it's like a process or not a limit, but it's basically can you make it? Was one of the three people a hippie? I feel like there's always in those shows. On a different episode, not on mine. Is there any way that you all think this story will now overshadow the story of me,

the perception of me being mean to my wife? to my wife. Oh, come on. We'll bring that up appropriate. Okay, go ahead, Rick. No, the only reason I bring it up is because, like, that, you know, well, first of all, there's no rocks in Louisiana. I don't know if anyone knows that or not.

If you haven't spent any time down there. So one of the things that was most frustrating to the whole experience is I've developed the skill and I couldn't do it. There were no rods to nap while I was down there. So, it's, you know, in a way, it's sort of pointless that I bring it up in the sense that I wasn't able to realize those skills or to, test myself in that situation, but I have done it

here in the Ozarks. Once you get done with this story, I've got a story of why there are no rocks in Louisiana. I thought you were going to say. One time I lived in the woods for 31 days. I didn't even have close.

So how did you live right? We figured out, we worked out how to cut up an alligator with Reed. Whoa. Really? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we processed a whole alligator with a common read. There were three of us in the beginning. Okay. So you're working together?

Were you competing against each other? No, no, no. It was a team effort. Nobody got voted off the island. It's like the anti-survivor. No, it's like, yeah, it was weird that they shouldn't. The collaborator. I'll say this now because I don't think I'm under any, like, contracts or anything

anymore. But like, the name was really misleading. There was, we weren't alone ever. So, like, they tried to hook it on to the other successful series of alone. Oh, the marketing of a loan. Because it was like the same network. Right. Right.

But like they should have called it something totally different. And I think that was a lot of the issues they had with promoting it is because we weren't alone. You had a crew there. Yeah. And we weren't filming ourselves. I mean, we would at night. But we were, there was a whole film crew during the daytime. So not only will we not alone in the sense that there were other people in the experience with us, but there was a whole film crew six days a week out there with us.

You could put just an asterisk, like alone. Right. I think that I like the direction you're going, I think that we should all suggest alternate names. Yes. Together in the woods. Aloneish. There you go.

Yeah. Aloneish. That's so good. But the main point is that you did. You guys, you didn't get support from these people though. No, yeah.

It was, we were out there figuring it out. And I mean, I'm not a big guy. And I think I lost 23 pounds. Oh, uh, yeah,

it was all over. Did the camera crew, were they eating? Like, would they just pull us snicker bar out? I have a lot of respect for those guys because they respected us. They never ate in front of us not once. And so, yeah, they were actually, I really got along well with the camera guys that were there. They were very encouraging. See them with gummy bears.

No, they were cool for sure. And in fact, we would know, they would leave when we were like, they're eating. We know what they're doing. And come back. You just think about it while they're gone. And they'd come back and we'd be like, what'd you guys have for lunch? They'd always find a way to change the subject or something, you know. They'd be like, I don't really know what you're talking about.

We were having a meeting or, you know, something like that. We were a room. That's cool. So Rick is the flintnapper. That's a whole other podcast. Yeah, no kidding. Yeah. You know, I know Clay Hayes who won alone.

Yeah, that's a big deal. Boy, it really is. Yeah. I mean, not only did he win $500,000, but he's, he's laid in the woods and I would have, I've never watched those kind of shows. We just don't have network television having for 20 years.

We do that funny. And so I never, no candy. No TV. Mocking me when I'm giggling. We're seeing a window into life. I would be pretty unfamiliar with these kind of shows. And when I talked to Clay, it was, it was interesting talking to him because I talked to him

after he'd won, but during the period of time when he couldn't tell anybody if he won. Right. And he was under contractual agreement to not give any Intel away. They were like, where'd you get the new car? They're serious about that stuff. Yeah, I followed him out in the parking lights, too, what kind of truck he drove. Oh, you got a brand new four-by-fourth, man.

I don't know. How much money did he win? I mean, this is not like private intel. This is the whole marketing of the show. So I'm not like giving away inside of him. $500,000. $500,000. Yeah, $500,000.

That's what I understood. Yeah. And he said it was 100% legit. I mean, he said they turn you loose, and he was in British Columbia. Yeah, I've lost a lot of those. I actually have several friends who have been on that show, and it's legit. Like, they're not playing. They come in for periodic medical checks to make sure the people aren't going to die.

Yep. Clay is thin. He's a thin guy. Yeah, he's a super lean guy. He put on as much weight as he could before. So he put on 20 pounds, which was really hard for him, put on 20 pounds, and then he lost. He lost 20 pounds in the first 20 days, I'm pretty sure. Oh, wow.

And then he stayed 74 days. But, man, on those shows, I kind of got to, once Clay was on there, I started following it and kind of started getting some intel from other seasons. And usually it's one or two things that happen that give someone this major advantage. Right. And they were in a very non-game rich area of British Columbia. And Clay is an excellent traditional archer. He killed a deer at some point.

And it was the only big game animal killed, as I recall, in the whole show. They're allowed, like, 10 items? Isn't it like 10 items? I believe that's right. Yeah. You get a list of 10 things. One of my items would be an RV. Is that, is that?

One of mine would have been gummy bear for Misty. Just one gummy bear for Misty. Send these to my wife. So when I came home on day four, she'd be happy. Day four. Okay, back to We're recording a podcast here. Back to why there are no rocks in Louisiana.

I forget about it. I'm serious. I have a really legitimate answer. Do you know this? So I have my own reason, but I would be curious to see if it's the same. It's a little bit. It's a little destabilizing. The environmental soil science major is about to explain this.

Don't be thrown off by Clay's. Do you know this? That's just a mode of operation. The best thing to do is just nod and then let him say whatever he knows. Okay. Okay. The Wachita Mountains are the place where the South American Continent bumped to the North American continent. The mountains buckled.

At one time, those mountains were 10,000 feet tall. The Wachita Mountains. The only mountain range ran in east and west in between the Rockies and the Appalachians. Those mountains were snow capped. and at one time we're on the coast of what we would call a gulf i mean it wasn't the gulf of mexico at that time there josh at that time there was no country of mexico oh really um but the ocean did they still have mexican food a shallow ocean came all the way up to the interior of what is now arkansas yep and so there would have been a 10,000 foot plus range of coastal mountains

where the waschatols now are those mountains eroded over time and filled in what is now called the Washatoll Basin, which the Washataw Basin is essentially parts of East Texas, all of Louisiana, and parts of Western Mississippi. And so the sediment of the Washatolls formed Louisiana and all that stuff, and all the rocks stayed here. So Louisiana is the runoff. Louisiana is it filled in the ocean. And then the rocks, when you go down the Washatals, I mean, it's rocky and rough because all that stuff stayed.

I really don't know if that's why. Oh, really. There are no rocks and losing. What do you think? Well, I think to add to that, I would say that obviously, like, the Delta and where the Mississippi flows into the Gulf, it's a huge alluvial plane. There has been eons worth of silt and sediment deposited there. Sounds like he's supporting Mike.

You didn't use the word of lubeal, though. Yeah, Alibuio really made that explanation nice. Soon as he went, Aluvial. I thought, why is what? Rick spends a month in the swamp and all of a sudden he's the expert on the render. He said alluvial and I was like, God, this guy's... He said all the Louvial. I like that word.

You had me in alluvial. It's the Rick Rinder. Rick Rinder. You just got Rick Render. The reason Rick is here is he is now the new host. I have been fired. I think we're on the same channel. I think we're on the same channel.

I think we are. You had the early version. I had the later version. I think they mesh. You need to disagree here. Man, that was good. That was good. Switching topic slightly.

Just a smidgen. Daniel Rup has been on a roll, and he killed another deer this week. Oh, man. Number four? Hey, number four. And all giving Clay a hard time aside, I would not be able to hunt if it wasn't for Clay Newcomb. Oh, wow. Oh, wow.

His podcast just took a swift turn. A little tear my hair. Yeah. It really took a turn. So, you know, we've been away for a long time, and it has been so fun. This has been your first fall back in 12 years. First fall back in 12 years, and I just got my fourth deer with a bow. That's awesome, man.

I'm just having a wonderful time. That's awesome. Hey, your son is in a lot of pictures. Is he loving this? He really, I'm probably this spring going to get him a bow and start taking him out. But he comes with him. He came with me this last time. Now, did he?

He didn't hunt with you, though. No, I just don't have a setup for. for two of us to be way up in a tree. Right. But this last time, the whole last hour I was out, it was just raining 30 degrees. Yeah. Nasty. Raining turned to snow.

And then I took this deer. And so the whole place was wet. And I went home and got my second son who loves to come with me and track them. And he tracked it with me for about an hour. Oh, really? He had to do a pretty good track job. He got out in front of me. I was like, his name's Zion.

I call him Big Z. I was like, Big Z, get out in front of me. You know, he just did a great job. That's awesome. That's probably a really good way to introduce him. Yeah. Let him see the kind of the drama of the trail job. And you know, when you get a deer, I'm like, oh, my gosh.

Yeah. I'm pretty sure I got a good shot. I saw it, but did I? You know, are you going to get this deer? We're going to find it. You go like 15 minutes without seeing blood. Then you're like, oh, I got it over here. You know, it's so fun.

He went, she went about 175 yards, but a real circuitous. past, path, you know, just all kinds of, did you hit it a little bit far back? A little bit far back.

But, yeah, it didn't make any difference. Super impressive. Well, this is what he, if you hit him very far forward, you'd miss them.

Yeah, exactly. This is, this is what he told me. I'd be glad to give you some advice. You're looking for advice. Every time I pull back on a deer, I just hear Clay giggling.

Not at all. Not at all. That's good. Congratulations. That's good. Yeah. Lots of deer me. He stays.

With me, he's gutted and now skinned and processed three of them. How old is he? He's 13, 14, he's 14. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, it's good. You get to hunt. Yeah. Time to hunt.

On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over. They just get darker. I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a sleeping bag and there was a full of blood. Oh my God, he doesn't have a hit. Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors where the terrain is unforgiving, the evidence is scarce,

and the truth gets buried under brush and silence. Indications were he should be right there, but he wasn't. This season, we're going deeper, from cold case files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwoods. Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments and the people left behind trying to piece them back together. He's not an honest person. He's incapable of being honest.

Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers. Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, Iheart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. So Rick makes his own woes. does pretty much everything. Am I right? Yeah, I mean, yeah.

So he, every single component of his hunting weapon for bow hunting deer he made. The only thing that I routinely use that, you know, I don't. Is it crossbow? I used, I do hunt with steel broadheads a lot. Okay, that's right. Yeah, to clarify, like I have hunted a lot with stone points. Right. And I have taken a couple of shots at deer and learned some, some tough lessons.

I have yet to take one down with a stone point. Yeah. But you're using a self-bow? Yes. Which a self-do, do you know what a self-bow is then? Nope. Okay, a self-bow is a one-piece bow. It's a bow that has no lamination.

It's been carved from a single piece of wood. That's right. As opposed to a traditional bow like those hanging on the wall that have laminations. Yeah. So you basically took a stave and whittled out. Cut down a tree, split the trunk into pieces, and then carved the bow from one of those pieces. It'd be the most primitive type of... archery equipment.

Yeah. So, yeah, that's pretty cool. That's real cool. You know, I've spent a fair bit of time with a stone point on the end of my arrow hunting. I told you about it. Yeah. So there was a year where I took some stone points that my friend David Bond here in northwest Arkansas made for me.

It was a hybrid primitive deal. I was using a recurve bow, so which is a modern traditional archery. Yeah. And I used a carbon arrow, and I took a 125 grain fill point on a bandsaw, cut a notch out of the field point, put the half of the stone point into this little wedge on a field point. I should have used J.B. Well, but I used sinew that I bought, you know, sinew and epoxy. And basically attached to stone point. to a fill point so that it had a threads on it so I can thread it into a carbon arrow. And I was going to try to kill a bear with it.

And I hunted a long time and just never killed a bear that year. And then I was telling Rick this. I was later tree stand white tail hunting trying to kill a white tail with it. And I dropped it just for whatever reason the arrows didn't fit on the string real good. And it was, and I dropped an arrow out of the tree. and when that arrow hit the ground with no real force behind it

that stone point snapped Wow and it's that was humbling because most of the humans that have ever lived on planet Earth let's just say a lot of them made a living off stone points

and I mean just to think it is not easy to kill stuff for the stone point especially when your family depends on it and your wife is left eye dominant. It's really hard. It didn't humble you very much, though.

Listen to this. She's like, did you get a deer? No, you better have some candy then. I'm a gummy bear. Somebody else. I'm going to night. No, I've always, I've kind of tiptoed around the primitive world. I've never gone as primitive as some of the stuff that Rick's doing, but had deep respect for the guys that really shot primitive.

archery. So, yeah, my father-in-law, David Albright. Primitive archery usually goes like this. It follows, it's patrilineal. Patriline law. It's always like somebody's something. Okay. Is the guy that you know that's done this.

Yeah, I feel like that's fair. No, I was inspired to get into traditional archery when 20 plus years ago when I was a compound archer but I would go to my brother my brother's father-in-law's house who is a fantastic traditional archer yeah and he just built his own bows it's a lifestyle you know and as it is for so many of these guys and he made his own bows and and he just was like as a kid I mean you know 20 something I was like now that is a cool way to bow hunt but it was so stinking hard I just didn't think it was approachable and it would be about 10 or 12 years after I met him that I finally kind of dove in. And that's what you kind of have to do.

You do. I just have to dive in. There's just a lot of time involved in it. You know, and I get it. You know, a lot of people just want to go deer hunting. They don't necessarily want to have all this extra stuff that they have to do. Yeah. But if you enjoy, like, working with your hands, crafting things, experimenting with things, like, it's a really rewarding way to go about it. Being hungry.

Yeah. That too. Yeah. Rick is pretty thin. I mean, I'll be personally admit, I don't kill as many deer. A lot of my friends do. It's the ultimate act of hunting self-limitation. Sure.

And that's really what we do with every aspect of modern hunting. 99% of people. And there's some percentage that don't, but we limit ourselves. I mean, I went duck hunting last week, and it was the policy amongst the brethren I was with to only use 20 gauges. Oh, really? And it'd be like, well, why are you just using a 20 gauge? And they're like, you know,

there. It was just an idea of self-limitation. And so we constantly, constantly do that. So transitioning into talking about the podcast, I invited Devin Pettigrew here, but he lives in Colorado, so he couldn't come. We could have gone there, field trip. Field trip, Molder, Colorado. I thought his section was so interesting. I talked about it with a couple of the different guys, maybe, maybe all of them, but about the transitions, the technology transitions. That was really interesting to me because that's something we see throughout history is human technology increasing and there's always some kind of drama at the transition and we know that the fulsome points were in vogue in being used by this culture for a thousand years i don't remember if it was on the

podcast or not i think maybe i took it out but when i was talking to devon i was like no it wasn't him if somebody else i was talking to i said does a thousand years sound like a long time to you and they were like, yeah, it seems like eternity. But to me, that sounded like a really short amount of time. When you're thinking about human history and all the other thousand-year blocks that are in there, and just for this short period of time, there was this real radical technology that was used, it phased in, and it phased out. And just there would have been people having conversations about it.

They would have had extremely practical conversations about that technology just like we do with our broadhead stuff. I mean, essentially, we could have a conversation today about using cut on impact heads or using expandable broadheads. All of us would be like, oh, man, you got to do this, or you got to do that,

or I can't believe you did that. There had to have been a time when they were like, man, I can't believe you're still fluting those things. Most points were like, this go of music. Dirty flute. You're like, this is really cool.

This is really terrible. It was great for the time. Yeah, this is like three years of this, I'm out. So I was probably put too much thought energy into form or function, or like, was it functional? And I have decided today, this morning, I listened to the podcast again, I decided it wasn't functional. It wasn't.

No. Yeah. I mean, I just think about all the guys that have, you know, if you don't have an outlet for art, like we don't have any, material art from that time period. And the thing that you do from that time period of human history, but not with the fulsome culture. Not much.

If you don't have that and you're putting all your energy into this thing, at some point somebody should have said, this is my signature. You know what I mean? I'm going to flute this thing. Because I would have done it. You know, I can't tell you how many decks I've built where I just do a certain thing to make it look cool or have a signature about it. I think that probably there was the guy that fluted and then he taught, I mean, if we're talking about small family groups, there had to be a guy

that was the first one to flute these things and he taught everybody else how to do this. And then it just kind of carried on until people, you know, either had their own signature or they found something more functional. So I've decided it is not functional. Hey, I want to give some backing to what Josh just said. When Josh started talking, I didn't know he was going to say that. But Josh is extremely crafty with his hands. Josh is a very skilled carpenter. He ties flies.

He builds Dan's got the belt. Oh, yeah, where's your ball buckle, Dan? I wore these pants to church yesterday, so I have my church belt. Oh, wow. Is this black bear not good enough for your church? And then, and Josh also makes hats. So working with your hands. Josh makes purses, leather purses?

Leather bags. Yeah, leather bags. Does your wife have a mustache? She does not. Not yet. I'm saying that's coming from a place of a guy that works with his hands. You know, the one thing that I thought about that when I can't remember the gentleman that was saying at the Folsom site, the Folsom expert. Meltzer.

Meltzer. He was saying you could kind of tell there were probably three different. Yeah, he could identify different. individuals based on their style. And he was kind of saying, I wouldn't be surprised if these, these, these, these folks kind of had their own signature. So one of the things that made me think was in the, in the cultural anthropology class that I teach, there is a hunter-gatherer group that was still in existence up until like the 1950s

that was studied extensively. And so there, we would have been really similar to Folsom peoples, but they had an, intense desire to all be the same, to not stand out. So it was real egalitarian. So you could observe their actual behaviors because you're not looking at the ground. So there are bands of 25 to, you know, 30 people that would go around these water holes and they would hunt and gather. And I can't remember the mechanism that they used to hunt.

But what, yeah, I do. They shot arrows. And so they had these entire rituals as they would make arrows and then they would exchange them. because they needed to have everything level because personal property would cause tension. They were hunter-gatherer Amish. Basically, yeah. And so there probably were three different folks that, you know, that chip those rocks out.

But then if they were really interdependent people that were living day-to-day, subsistence dwelling, I don't know if I don't know if like other hunter-gather cultures that we've been able to observe in real life would, espouse this really rugged individualism of, I'm going to leave my mark on this. So I'm deeply intrigued by what you're saying. Are you agreeing or disagreeing? He's the idea of function. He's disagreeing with me. Because that's what Dan does. I think function. I think, I mean, they wouldn't do it if it didn't work. But it probably is also beautiful and something you take pride in. But the idea of kind of setting yourself apart would not have been something. I don't know if that would have existed.

I think that is an excellent point that gives a whole layer to the culture that I've never even thought of, that these people would have had, and they would have. It's not like these were, these were humans that had the same cognitive capabilities, us, they had the same emotions, that they were just like us. One of their babies could have been the president of the United States, and they would have had deeply set culture just like us. Yeah, highly sophisticated. It's just hidden from us. And so the idea that they would have just had these values of no one can stand out. But I was going to say that could be to his point, because it would be non-utilitarian if they just didn't want to change stuff.

Like if a generation woke up one day and they were the hunters and they were like, we're doing this like dad did, 99% of the reason is that it's because that's the way we were taught. There wasn't this idea of self-discovery or we're trying to be different. The way they survived was they were the same. That is non, I mean, that is part non-utilitarian. And that's where, it's just a whole different. You know, two, I mean, make up a percentage, but probably two-thirds of the world that is interdependent, agrarian. You know, they have a huge value for honor and tradition.

In the West, where we're ruggedly individualistic, we kind of have this luxury of what kind of clothes do I wear? And does this shirt me? and does this express me well, you know. But most of the world that doesn't live at our level of wealth, they value tradition because tradition is what keeps you alive. Why are we so ridiculous? I am fully convinced that we have as Western thinkers, you can't help.

We are, our worldview is dominated by things that are very hard to control or to see and understand about ourselves. Us sitting here trying to understand these people is like us trying to read braille and having no idea what any of it means. And we will... We will read... If we're not careful,

we'll read ourselves back into that. Yes. Like, you know, like, of course it would. I can't help but compare it to the Mac PC argument. Let's go. Because of that, because I'm a Mac or I'm a PC, you know. Like, I like Macs because I like to say because of functionality, because it's easier to use.

But also, I think they're cool. Do you see what I'm saying? And so like I was listening to y'all argue and I thought, and I wondered if maybe they had like probably not shirts that said I'm a Mac, I'm a fulsome. But somebody somebody said the fulsome fluters would have been a good three on three basketball name.

The fulsome fluters. But I wondered about when it stopped, when the utility wore out on it because they got to come to a point If you're only, what is it, Rick, 30% of the ones you make are coming out? Well, there's 40% failure rate, I believe. So, yeah. Well, that guy, Bob the Airhead Maker, he's only going to be able to tote so many rocks with him.

And when they take that process out of there, when it doesn't have to be fluted like that, when it doesn't have to look just because Grandpa did it. You know, somebody's got to say at some point, Frank, you're wasting a lot of rocks. Frank, you idiot. I think it was a frustrated wife. Frank the Fluter. I wonder Frank got his wife some candy before he made it. We know your grandpa always did it like that and his grandpa.

Yeah, I believe that there are actual examples of that type of thing. Like, do you know the Sloan site here in Arkansas? You familiar with that? I'm not familiar with it. You should really check that one out. So it is a very significant depository of this Dalton. The Dalton point is what's prevalent at the Sloan site. And it's near Curley's Ridge here in Arkansas.

And there's different types of rocks there. But as I understand it from things that I've read about that, as the stone sources begin to get further away and they would dry up, then they started to like not produce the points the same way anymore because the resource wasn't as good as it once was. And of course, that's still very much a theory. But I think there's some evidence to support that theory that when they could get high quality stone and it was available, they were going to produce these really fascinating articulate points. But when that went away, they didn't spend as much time or they like began to work on a different type of point because the resource wasn't as rich as it was. Yeah, because it's more valuable as it decreases unavailability. So there's a lot of factors at work here. And it's probably not just one thing.

My conclusion is that it's impossible for us to know, which we, we know that. Agreed. It's clear that there was utility utility to the fluting in the way that it fit into the haft and all the things we talked about on the podcast. guess that made it functional. But I also like what Dr. Meltzer said is he said, essentially he was like, maybe it could have been both. Sure. Yeah.

You know, he said they found bits of red ochre in places where they napped, which typically, he said it could have been part of the mastic, the adhesive that they used to plug it in, you know, to plug it into the half. But he said, usually red ochre was part of a spiritual. Ritualistic. Yeah. Yeah, like they were putting ochre on these points, whatever they did. So I think, I think Misty Newcomb nailed it on the head, despite being left-eye-d-d-d-eye.

He's probably trying to make up for that. What did you say about computers? They're functional and cool. They're functional, but also they're kind of cool. That's it. Functional but cool. I mean, I don't think it's a stretch to think that one led to the other either, right? Right.

And it could also be the chicken egg thing. Like as far as like it wasn't functional first and then because it was functional, it became sacred. And we, you know, or for whatever reason, it was the other way. It was, we decided this was sacred, but we know. But as we used it, it was also very functional, which reinforced that. Yeah. But to your point, we'll never know. But it's fun to talk about.

Yeah. So can somebody, so I really, and it's me, it's not anyone else. I still do not understand what an addle-addle is. He was describing it, and I'm so sorry. I should have brought one. I made one. It's basically a stick. It's a stick.

It's a stick, but there's a lever arm. Okay, so it's a stick, and they vary in length, but on average, we'll say they're about two feet long. On the back, there's a spur. So it's a stick, and it has a little spur on the back, okay? The spur is where the back of the spear fits into, okay? The other end is a handle. And so it's a platform on which the spear sets. And as you throw it, it extends that lever.

It's so simple. I mean, all it is is a stick with a spur. You hold on to it. And they get more complex. So that's what he's talking about, the wrist motion. Yeah. Oh, okay. I'm so sorry.

Now understand. You know, I'm glad you said that because we spent a ton of time verbally trying to describe what a fulsome point looked like. I was torn with overlapping content because the thing, you don't want to do in literature and different things is overlap too much. So you say the same thing over and over because people get bored. I asked Brenella, Meltzer, Devon Pedigrew, and then Rick showed us what one looked like, trying to describe a Folsom point.

Because I just felt like that was important. And then I said, go Google it. And if you had an image of it, it would make sense. Man, I've been thinking about this for five months. And I just now feel like when I see a Folsom point, I get. it. And it came from watching Rick make one, actually watching him make one. And by get it, I mean, I see the value in it. I see the skill in it. I see the art in it. I understand the functionality of it. And it took that long. I said, I let to say, I did not describe what an

adelaal out was because I thought everybody knew. Hey, do you have a video of him making that? Did you put on Instagram? Yeah. Do you know what social media is? Did you put one? He did. Have you ever heard of it? It's called Instagram. It didn't show the actual flute breaking off, though. That's what I want to see. That's what I want to see. Well, I mean, it was, I was holding the audio equipment.

Uh-huh. What I was doing was equivalent. It was probably harder than making a fluted point. Probably. Okay? What was you showed in the video was you. I want to see the stone. I was holding the audio thing and then I was filming like this.

I was filming Rick. So, hey, I made a, yeah, it wasn't great. In the fifth grade. Did you really? In the tomato field, my brother, my older brother, Tim, no, I'll tell you why. I can't bring it. My older brother, Tim, he's big into finding their heads and stuff. He knows a lot about him.

Anyway, he's eight years older than me. When I was in the fifth grade, he was telling me about, you know, the Indians that lived here, out here where we raised tomatoes, where we had just found some points. You know, they used atlattles and bows and this and that. So he explained to me what it was. So I got two tomato sticks, and I put a fence stapling into one, and I shortened another one. And when he came back home, a couple days later to visit or whatever, it just lived just down the road, I threw it at him. I missed him, but he got the part that I threw and chased me down and beat the fire out of it.

So they work on both ends. But it did work. I mean, I had that fence staple on the end of it. It worked good. Oh, yeah, you can throw it. You know, there was a history channel show Top Shot. It was like a marksmanship competition where they, you know, everything from modern, super modern firearms and muskets and all that stuff. But they did a big part of the competition with Adeladdles and they were.

Oh, sweet. They were tomatoes stew. Did you know it, Missouri. Missouri has an outlottles season. Missouri specifically has an outlaw season. That would be awesome. I think every, I think it is a crime against humanity and our ancestors. that every state in this country doesn't have an adelaal season.

I mean, how many deer are we going to kill with Adelattles? Right. I was about to say, that needs to be like three. You can't do it in Arkansas. Or a spear. You can't do it. They're worried we're going to maim a bunch of deer. And they're right.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Dan. Oh, wow. Well, you're getting the same treatment I got. No, no. No. Nope. What's the reason. You, I mean, that is the thought process, which I believe is an incorrect

thought process. I mean, have reason to back up? We are here. Adel Adeladdle's work. Follow that back. Adeladle is the most primitive human tool on the earth, and I legally can't go out in my backyard and try to kill a deer with it, but I can use a 30-ought six.

Well, here's the thing else you got to think about that. If we were standing in the court of law and they let me, in my lawyer let me talk, we would win this one. This is the classic mistake. You're going to defend yourself. I do not need a court-appointed lawyer. I will speak for my... This is what everybody does.

You're going to get the Adel Adelado season taken away, Clay. How many people? I think they should, I think we should have. Here's the add on to that. Adelato's work, obviously, because we're here. Folks also used to build fires without a fire starter. And out of all the people that you know, how many people you think can walk right out there in the woods

and set them on fire without some type of. Rick Spicer. In this room? No, no. Two people misting. And Rick. Not in this room. that.

Very few. Sorry, you got demoted to that level. That's the deal. No, I think we have to hunt with them.

They're doing it. It's been for several years. That's their new motto. Missouri, we're doing it. They're doing it. Shout out to Missouri. We get a

shout out on the license plate. I was just thinking about South, I'm sorry. I was South Dakota came up and we love South Dakota

and South Dakota's. But for they had a slogan that said meth. Oh, yeah. We're on it. We're on it. And that's what I was trying to think. Yeah.

Yeah, it was an anti-drug. This is for real. It was anti-drug. We're on it. Like they're going to test out. Except where it said meth, we're on it. It's not a joke. They didn't run.

They didn't have too many focused groups on that. I think they were grateful for COVID. I mean, I think they were like, great. Something else to take everyone in the Tintchon because it was a year before. And they were about. Yeah. Mark that time. Take that out.

Yeah. Just lost all the South Dakota and listeners. We're not nervous. We're just real quick. Oh my goodness. Says the Drug Task Force guy. I think the idea that history defines us whether, that was your main point. History defines us whether or not we know it.

But just like the fact that we're all standing right here because Adil Adel's work, and I don't even five minutes ago, I didn't even know when one was, history really does define us whether or not we know. That's a pretty big point. You know what? The conclusion of the series, that's what I love about what we're doing, is that this is not, I didn't plant Devin to say what he said. And I started out with a genuine question. Like, why does any of this matter?

Why is it important? And, you know, we could talk about that for an hour, why it's important. I mean, is this just entertainment to understand this stuff? Is it just entertaining? Or is there something more? And, you know, Devin, right at the end, just said, he said, anthropology is powerful stuff it said these all this stuff is defining us whether we want it to or not so with or without our knowledge of what happened at Folsom

and what these people did and those things are defining us and I keep going back to this idea that we're in a time period when human nature and humans we're we're like we're looking for a new definition of what it means to be human and then you could take that a thousand different ways you have a thousand different examples. There's no salvation inside of being a hunter. I don't want it to sound like that. There is something that is very defining and very simple and very architectural, meaning that it is a pillar of our humanity that we can't get away from, no matter what we do. You can choose to get away from it for some period of time usually. But the fact that we're meat eaters and that we

lived by an intimate and skilled connection to the land that is a primary definer of our humanity that has to in 2022 and in the future continue to define what it means to be human. And so by looking back at this stuff and saying these people were just like us, all right, just it changes. I meant what I said in that it puts perspective on my. my problems. It puts perspective on the challenges that I have inside of my life. It really does.

And it just kind of grounds you, moving away from satisfaction and identity inside of some of this temporal, ephemeral stuff. What do you guys think? I agree. Absolutely. I have simplified my life over the last three years to, I don't watch the news. You know, what's the old saying? If you watch the news, you're misinformed.

If you don't watch the news, you're uninformed. You know, I get the majority of the things that are going on from people telling me, hey, I saw this. This is what's going on here and there. I have simplified my life around what's the old thing I say to you? If it ain't gunfire, it ain't, you know, everything's probably going to be all right. And that's where I tend to lead my family in that direction of simplifying and getting away from all the distractions and everything that are going to be.

going on and we just pretty well concentrate on taking care of each other and our friends and our neighbors and doing the right thing and you go but these folks that were making these that's what they were worried about they were worried about everything that they could wake up in the morning and see and that was their world and that was of course it may have something to do with whether or not here now but you know i may be wrong thinking but it's it's right thinking for me why does this matter misty to me when we talk about bear grease what i always how i always describe it to people is bear grease is not just a podcast that clay does, but it's a metaphor for how we live our lives. And that is we hold on to ancient principles and we live our life by ancient principles,

but use progressive tools. You know, so there's things that really shape who we are, how we live as a family. I mean, everyone who listens to this podcast should know by now that biblical principles are a major part of that for us and that shapes who we are. But it doesn't mean that we like harken back to some good old days that of like, you know, I don't wear prairie dresses from the 1800s, although it's really on trend right now. But, you know, we, I use computers. We are, you know, we are very progressive people in one way. And we're always, and I think that that's what you see inside of some of these tools.

It's like you see progress and you see I would define tools differently than, you know, than an arrowhead now. Those aren't really tools that I use. but we use progressive tools to accomplish and to live lives that are governed by ancient principles. And I think that any time you look back at history and you look back at those things, you learn more about that. You get a data point. Dan, what do you think? Why does this matter?

For me, what really helped me through this whole series on the Folsom is you go back 10,000 years to people and they were people. They had culture. They had sophisticated ways of engaging with one another. They had really complex relationships and lives. And I think that narrative corrects a lot of thinking that, I mean, before I probably didn't think a lot about 10,000 years ago and people, but just the idea that when you go back, being human is a very, very unique thing. And then I think looking at today and realizing how, and you've said it before, Clay,

how absurdly different our lives are today. that the vast majority of all people that have lived, it really does put our lives in perspective. And I think because our lives are so different now, if 10,000 years ago, there was, you know, I'm making this up, two ways to define yourself. One was a fulsome point and one was a Clovis point. Today, there's 10 million ways to define yourself.

And the vast majority of them feel, you know, just overly empty. And we just go from one to the other. And I think that to me, it's grounding. Yeah. Yeah. Rick, why does this matter? For me, like, especially as someone who has kind of a foot in both doors, like on one

hand, I'm a like Earth Skills practitioner. I would, but on the other hand, I sell the most modern technical outdoor equipment made for a living, right? Yeah, yeah. Rick is part owner in a really cool outdoor store, which you heard on the podcast. Yeah, I spend money. We appreciate that. We appreciate that.

We appreciate that. Maybe Rick will give you your money back. get a discount. No, we're buddies. No, I think, though, that there's a lot of value for me in that because the rate at which our society is changing is like exponential right now, right? Like, things just change faster and faster. And I don't know that there's a way to stop that.

And I don't know that that the speed at which things are changing. Well, I'll just say that I don't think it's good for us. But I think that as a species, as a species, I don't think that our brains. were necessarily made to handle all of the things that are going on at once right now, the way they are. And so for me, looking back, I would use a lot of the words you folks have already used, you know, grounding, connective. And it feels really good to slow things down and look back at how people would have lived

and what they needed to live. And it reminds me that we don't need most of the things. that we have around us right now. Yeah. You know, uh, because they're just things. Yeah.

What matters are the people that are around us, the relationships we have with those people and the relationship we have with this earth. You know, I go back to this idea that these Folsom points in a thousand years and we could have picked any style of point it could have been there's other styles but just what we talked about was Folsom. That Folsom point being transferred generationally, we see a stone point because it last,

outlasted the erosive nature of time, but what other values and principles were passed down with that stuff? Because there were fathers teaching sons how to nap stone. I know from being with Rick, it's not a fast process. You're in close proximity. You're talking. I mean, I like to think about it as a, as a kind of a metaphor for just generational continuance and something stayed so stable for so long. I think families want that with their kids and not that our kids would be just like us. I don't care if my kids are just like me. There are principles and values

that I hope my life would impact generations from now of Newcombs that they would be able to go. I'm a product of that. I'm a product. I'm not isolated. I didn't come up with this version of who I am, you know. It's kind of a metaphor to me for generational content.

too. And to look back at stuff like that gives you vision, clarity, just thoughts of, yeah, life is more than just making more money next year than we had this year, getting a newer car, putting a good Instagram post up, being successful in what you're doing. I mean, like, life is bigger than that. Looking back does give us a sense of we don't need as much stuff as we think we need. And the ridiculousness of this Western world we live in puts incredible value on material stuff that will not outlast the erosive nature of time. Right. No.

Right. Josh, why is it important? I'm not a philosopher like Dan is. I think the thing that I draw out of it is looking back at ancient peoples like this makes me identify the things that were produced in their lives that caused our species to continue on. And really that comes down to relational activity. You know what I mean? Husbands and wives and children and investing and providing and doing those kind of things.

And the gratitude that we must have for those things and not a sense of burden, but really a sense of gratitude that we have the opportunity to build relationships with one another. We have the ability to invest values inside of our children because it's easy to get overwhelmed with the crisis and all the things that are going on inside of the world that when we stop, you know, it feels like the world is moving faster and faster and faster. And in a sense, it is. But when we slow down inside of our families and we slow down inside of our minds and we stop reeling and we start thinking through things and we start thinking through consequences. of our actions, that I think that that produces a lot of value in our lives and a lot of peace and hope. Because I think those are the things that are lacking inside of our society right now is peace and hope. It's all just fear. And so it makes me stop and think, what can I observe

from those people's lives? They worked hard. They were creative. They were strategic. And applying those things inside of my own life with, you know, Christy and I, as we talk about our marriage and raising our kids, what do we need to do to produce the fruit in the future? I think we can glean a lot of those things when we look back historically. And yeah, I think it's, I think it's very thought-provoking, you know, looking, looking at the fulsome peoples, looking at how they made their points. It provokes a lot of thoughts. That can produce a lot of fruit. So I think it's good. Josh, I bet you buy your wife candy. I buy my wife whatever she wants.

I'm sorry. I really, I had a great time. I genuinely did. We had so much fun. We had so much fun. We did have a great time. I did best with him about giving me a hard time about my shot. It was just when you look on over her shoulder and there's this big red squirrel up in the tree.

You're going to keep doing it. The gun was pointed like way over here. here and the squirrel was like over here. Okay, listen. Trick shot. I am not. I am not. Also white oak.

Like a ricketts. I got you, girl. Fantastic stuff. Fantastic stuff. I could talk about Folsom points for, you know, I've feared that four episodes on Folsom would get old. It didn't to me. either. I really enjoyed that last episode. It was one of my favorites.

Really? Why? Why was it your favorite? You know, I love, I think I love the craftsmanship of listening to things made and talking about, you know, how they would have hafted it. You know, in my mind, I'm visualizing all these things. I thought it was a great, it provoked a lot of visual activity inside of my mind. And I, that's something that I really enjoy. I heard a lot of people say that they felt like is their favorite one in the series. But what was cool about it too was such a diverse series because we started off with George McJunkin.

And hardly even talked about Folsom really. It was about George McJunkin, you know? Yeah, super fascinating stuff. And the next, already told, already foreshadowed what the next episode is going to be about. Yeah. And it's not

just about duck hunting. Like, don't think that. But it is a very specific issue that has broader applications to wildlife management in this country and the decisions that we make and how we build hunting culture. How's that for foreshadowing C.J. You're trying to bring in an addle-attle season for ducks. Why wouldn't we? Why not? Hey, so we're here, buddy. That's some flu-flu flinching something. You see that spear right there, Rick? Do you see that? Yeah. I made that spear with the full intent when I was like 21. Uh-huh. the full intent of using it to hunt a deer in Arkansas.

And I called the authorities that be. And they were like, you can't hunt a deer. I thought it would just automatically downgrade. Like you can use a, during gun season, you can't use a boz. You can't use a bazooka, but you can use an ad lathe. I was like, hey, it's bow season. I can use a spear, right? And the dude laughed me out of the park.

Really? That's unnecessary. The city park. He was, he was. It's as unnecessary as a good. He was metaphorically. He metaphorically laughed me out. He didn't laugh at.

He didn't laugh at. He wasn't rude. Okay, good. His name was... No, no. He was very professional with me. But he was just like, no way. I mean, he treated me like I was a college kid,

which I guess he had the right to do. Adelaidell 23. Missouri's doing it. Missouri's doing it. Hey, we just keep going on and on. I wanted to say this about Missouri. You know, Missouri has a new bear season. Shout out.

is doing it. They just instituted a new bear season. Man, if you do anything in your life, support when new seasons arrive for species. They've taken a little bit of flack in that people, there's different things where people are like, you know, anti the new bear season in Missouri, which is ridiculous because the best thing, Daniel Rup,

that could ever happen to you if you were a big game animal is that there would be a season for you in that state. because where animals have cultural... It's Dan season. See, that's why hunting is such a complex story. Where animals have cultural value, their habitat is protected and they are protected. Where an animal has no cultural value, put it out the door we don't care. And we've got a thousand examples across this plant where that has happened.

You go all over the globe, and they don't have as many big game animals as many as we do here in North America because they killed them all because they didn't culturally value them through sport hunting. Roll it up and smoke it in your... Yeah. Smoker. Pipe. I was looking for the Native American word for... Peace pipe.

Roll it up and smoke it in your piece pipe, man. More tigers in Texas than there are in India. Wild. I don't know if that's true, but that sounds great. All right. Well, great to have everybody. Rick, great to have you. Thanks for coming.

Thanks for everybody. I enjoyed it. Yeah, man. Hey, check out Rick, Packrat, Bushcraft. Kiki and the beard. Kiki and the beard. Brent Reeves. With an A.

With an A. We all know what that stands for. Daniel R. I'm Arnold. Oh, D.R. Daniel Rup. D.R. Daniel Rup on Instagram. And then Newcomb Farm. Yeah.

Yeah, you got to follow a newcomb farm. A very visually appealing Instagram page. If you want to see some produce. produce and some beautiful animals. Slightly lean into the left. Oh, here we go. Boy, you go to you.

You just can't stop, can you? It's so great to have you. You could have so much better, Missing. I just, I don't even know what to stay here. Have a great, happy new year. Happy New Year. Happy New Year. First Lights fieldware collection is made for the work that happens

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