Bear Grease - Ep. 369: Ted Koppel - Story of an American Journalist

Episode Date: September 24, 2025

Ted Koppel, a renowned American journalist with a career spanning more than 60 years, joins host Clay Newcomb on this episode of the Bear Grease podcast. They discuss Koppel’s life, his family, and some of the most memorable moments from his remarkable career. If you have comments on the show, send us a note to [e-mail] Connect with Clay and MeatEater Clay on Instagram MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, and Youtube Clips MeatEater Podcast Network on YouTube Shop Bear Grease MerchSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. First Lights fieldware collection is made for the work that happens long before opening day and continues when the season ends. Products built for early mornings, full days and real use. Hard wearing where they need to be versatile where it matters. No shortcuts. Just gear designed for the work that earns the season.

Built to perform, built to last. Check out. First Light's new field. Worldware gear at firstlight.com. This week's episode of Bear Grease is very unique. I had a once in a lifetime opportunity to sit down with legendary American news broadcaster, Ted Koppel. I did an hour-long interview with Ted. And what I've learned is that if you are below the age of 35, there's a chance that

that name wouldn't ring a bell in your head or if you saw his face you might not recognize it. But if you're over the age of 35, I would say you probably recognize the name Ted Cople. He was a broadcast journalist for ABC Nightline from 1980 to 2005. And his face would have been as recognizable as any American president. As a matter of fact, he has interviewed every... American president since Nixon. And he's interviewed, you just name a world leader over the last 35 to 40 years. And Ted Koppel has set with him.

And he was on Bear Grease, which I think is pretty cool. We talk about his life. We talk about his career in journalism. And I really think you're going to enjoy this episode with a really unique guy. I also wanted to tell you and remind you about the meat eater live tour, the good, the bad, and the jolly. We're doing a Christmas live tour. We're going to seven cities across the south. We're starting in Birmingham, going to Nashville, Tennessee, then to Memphis, Tennessee, then to Fayetteville, Arkansas with the W. I think there's potential for people to think we're going to Fayetteville, North Carolina.

Great city. But we're going to Fayetteville, Arkansas. then we're going to Dallas, Texas, and then to Austin. And it's all right before Christmas. And you can buy tickets right now. Go to the meat eater.com slash tour and buy your tickets. I really think they're going to sell out fast. And the Meteor Live Tour is like a variety show.

It's like a two-hour variety show. There's going to be music. There's going to be storytelling. There's going to be contests. potentially an alhuding contest of which I would be the King Supreme Judge there will be a lot of audience participation we're going to give away stuff

and truly it's just guaranteed to be a good time it's going to be Steve Renella Brent Reeves Janus Putellis Dr. Randallis Dr. Randall Williams and myself along with in every city we're going to have special guests and I can tell you this is

just a lot of fun. So check that out. And then lastly, before we get to the interview with Ted Cople, check out Meat Eaters White Tail Week. If you're looking for a refresh on your First Light gear, check out White Tail Week September 29th through October the 5th. September 29th through October the 5th. And I truly believe that First Light has the best whitetail gear on planet Earth. It ain't cheap. I'm not going to act like it's cheap, but nothing that's good is cheap. But it truly is. We've got some of the best white tail kids, and they're all going to be on sale.

So check it out. Without further ado, thank you so much for listening to Bear Grease. This episode will drop on iTunes and all the audio platforms, but also YouTube. You'll be able to watch me grilling Ted Cople. The man who interviewed the first American guy to interview Putin. He interviewed Nixon.

He interviewed Clinton. He interviewed Mikhail Gorbachev. He interviewed the great leaders of the earth. And now it's his turn to feel the heat. I hope you enjoyed Ted Koppel. My name is Clay Newcomb, and this is the Bear Grease podcast, where we'll explore things forgotten but relevant. Search for insight in unlikely places.

And where we'll tell the story of Americans who live their lives close to the land. presented by FHF gear, American-made, purpose-built, hunting and fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore. Mr. Cople? Ted. Ted. Just Ted.

It's great to have you here. Thank you so much for agreeing to meet with me and for coming to Arkansas. Well, I had to you. You threatened not to do it if I wouldn't talk to you, right? Well, it's a pleasure to meet you. I grew up watching you. I was born in 1979. So my childhood...

You missed the early years. Miss some of the early years. But I grew up watching you, knew your voice. It was just a kid for much of your career. Sure. But thank you so much for being here. I've got a little introduction that I would like to read. Sure.

for people listening. That's about you. It's a little bio about you. And you can add in any corrections or adjustments or polish it up if you wish. It better be good. Well, okay. This was not written by chat GPD, by the way. This is legitimate.

I'm glad to hear it. So we'll see how it accurate is. Ted Cople is an American broadcast journalist and author. His career at ABC News spanned more than four decades. and included roles as a foreign and diplomatic correspondent, but was best known for his 25-year tenure as anchor and managing editor of ABC News Nightline. During his time at Nightline, which began in 1980, he became one of American television's most trusted voices.

Koppel has won dozens of prestigious honors for his work, including numerous Emmys and Peabody Awards. After leaving Nightline in 2005, he continued his career, as a journalist, including serving as managing editor for the Discovery Channel and analysts for NPR and BBC and a senior contributor to CBS News Sunday morning. Which is what brings me here? Which is what brings you here today. Right.

I'm really most interested. I find there's been a lot of media about your career, which that's what people see. People see your career. They've seen you interview Richard Nixon and Mikhail Gorbachev and world leaders and presidents and orchestrated kind of to the American people, the Iranian hostage situation. I mean, all these like key events. And that's kind of the shiny, you know, glimmering part of your life that people are interested in. That's the Iranian hostage crisis. That's what you were listening to.

every day when you were three years old, right? Yeah. Yeah. Best I can recall, yes. Yes. Yeah. No, you got it all right. You got it right.

Well, and part of what I'm most interested in is what got you to that place of of success in your career because oftentimes people see somebody that's been really successful. and it appears as if they just, they, that it just, that just showed up in their life. Well, you're Ted Koppel. Of course you're going to be interviewing world leaders. But there was a, there was a journey that got you to that place. And I kind of want to start at the beginning to give some chronology. You, you were born in London, England.

Actually, I was born in Lancashire, which is up north, just south of the Scottish. border. And then my parents moved down to London at the beginning of the war. So, but you were, that's where you were born. I was born in England. And your parents fled Germany. They did. Because of persecution from Nazis. Yes. Wow. They did. Wow. They did. My good fortune, that they did. And that they, a little later on, decided to come to the United States. That was the best of all. What kind of persecution did they receive? Like, what was going on? I mean, I know the stories. I know the general idea, but specifically your parents. Well, specifically, my father was arrested a couple of times and held for a few days.

And fortunately, one of his best friends from school where he had grown up was a judge who was able to get him out. And who told him at one point, I think you better leave. You might not make it out the next time. Why was he arrested? I have no idea. Well, I mean, he's Jewish. So that was a good reason. Were they looking for Jewish people to do something like minor that they could arrest him?

Or were they just straight up going and saying, you are a Jew? I am now taking you in? Or was it anything specific? You know, frankly, I wasn't around at the time, so I can't tell you how they did it. Okay. But they didn't need many excuses. I mean, they ended up killing six million people. So, you know, that was just the way it began.

Yeah, yeah. And then when they came to London, were they... Not to London. I'm from Lancaster. Yeah, they went up to Lancashire because my father had run a factory. in Germany that made rubber tires. And Lancashire, as you may or may not know, was a big textile center of the UK.

And you need textiles for the interior of automobile tires. So they invited him to come to Lancashire and set up shop there, which he did. And he started a tire factory in Lancashire. And you lived there until you were 13. Not Lancashire. I lived, I was, actually, I was in boarding school when I was 11. Okay.

So for the last two years, two and a half years, I was in boarding school before we came to the United States. Okay. Okay. So you were, though, in England until you were 13? Yes. Okay, now this may seem a little, may not, it seems to be not a relevant question, but how do you not have an English accent? Well, I'll explain how it was when I first came over. So I was 13 years old, and here's this scrawny little kid, 13, with an English accent, in high school, in study hall,

absolute silence, an old boy's school. And the little English kid raises his hand and says, and this is how I sounded back then, please, does anyone here have a rubber, which in England is an eraser? In New York City, it was not. And as you can imagine, that was the source of some of,

So this actually happened. This is not a, this is not a, this really happened. I wouldn't make this story up, trust me. Yes, this happened. And, you know, from then on for the next few months or so, making fun of the English kid and his accent was very much a part of it. But A, I've got a good ear for accents, and B, I was young enough that I was still very flexible.

So did you intentionally change your accent? It wasn't a matter of intentional. It was a matter of, you know, as you'll notice over the course of the next couple of days when I'm around you, by the time I leave here, I'll be sounding just like you. Code switching. Code switching. Is that what it's called? People accuse me of code switching sometimes.

Right. Because you basically adapt your language, the words that you say to best connect with you. with the person that you're dealing with. When I talk to people from here and where I'm at, I might drop her into low gear and bring in that Ozark accent. I'll start sounding like you. I told you. But then when I'm with Ted Cople,

I might tone it up a little bit. Code switching. Code switching. Yeah. Is that a term you came up with? No, no. This is a linguistic term. I've never heard that before.

A linguistic term. Yes, sir. I've heard something there. Yes. Code switching. Because I would have, if you told me that somebody lived in England for 13 years, I would have thought you would always had a touch of an accent. And I did for the first few years.

I really did. I mean, even when I went off to college, I have tapes, audio tapes, of some of the programs I did at the college radio station. And the little kid still has very much of an English accent in those days. Yes. So what brought your parents here? What opportunity opened up in America that brought them here? What brought them here, I have to believe, was love for me.

And the thought that the United States was still, is still, I like to believe, the land of opportunity. It certainly worked out that way for me. Were you an only child? I was. Only child. Wow. My parents were quite advanced in years by the time they married. My mother was 40.

When I was born, my father was 44, 45. So, you know, it was it. I was kind of a one. You were the apple of their eye. I was a one-shot wonder. It was going to be me and no brothers and sisters to worry about. Did they live into your career long enough? that they saw you be as successful as you would become?

Not really. They saw me be a war correspondent in Vietnam. And I found, after my dad died, I found a diary that he had kept of every time he heard me on the radio. Every time. Wow. But they never got to see me on Nightline.

No. If there's one thing that I know about people, it's that where we come from affects our worldview, who we are, who we become, our character. Right. Tell me how your parents impacted your life. Like, are you still living out, would you say the value system, the character that you have inside of you today would be, congruent with your parents, would it be different? Is it shifted? I think that's a very good way of putting it.

I think the value system would be the same. I think who I have become, what I've done, there was no background for that in my family. I mean, the idea that I would become a journalist, the idea that I would, I mean, over the course of the past, let's see, I've been doing this now since 1963, so what are we talking about? 62 years ago, over the past 62 years, I've probably covered seven, eight different wars. That shaped me a lot. I've spent more time with the U.S. military in one place or another, one form or another,

than many of my friends who were in the military. I was never in the military, but I've spent an awful lot of time with them. Most recently, someone was remarking on my backpack out there, which has coppel nightline on it. Last time I used that backpack was in Iraq. I was embedded with U.S. forces there when they invaded Iraq. That was 2003, so that's already 22 years ago. Interesting.

Were your parents people of faith? Yes. Are you today a person of faith? Less so. I'm married to a Catholic woman. she and I have been very respectful, rather, of one another's religions. I am less of a believer than my parents were. I understand.

Do you? I do understand. Okay. I do. Yeah, that's interesting. You don't relate, but you understand. That's a good way. to put it, I think.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So you, you got married in 1963. 63. 1963. Right. And at that time, you had just gotten out of college.

You went to Syracuse and Stanford. Stanford. Is that correct? Yeah, I just got my master's at Stanford. I had worked for a local radio station in New York. I went to the New York Times. they offered me a job as what was called a copy boy in those days. Sounds a little derogatory.

Well, Copy boy. Believe me, it was derogatory. Coffee boy, what coffee boys? They weren't trying to make it sound derogatory. It was derogatory. It was derogatory. Exactly.

I mean, you know, you were a copy boy, you got coffee for the people who counted. Yeah. The editors, the reporters. Yeah. Right? That's like Josh, my producer. That's, well, you got very, very close. Your wife was nice enough to bring me this cup of coffee.

She is not my copy boy. She is not your copy girl. But she does get coffee sometimes. She was very gracious. She was a good hostess. So, you know, I did that for about a year. And the New York Times offered me a job as a copy boy. And I said, well, what is it?

pay. And my wife and I had just married. Actually, we'd been married for a few months already. We had a baby on the way. And they were paying, I believe back then it was $65 a week. And at the time, I was making $90 a week at a local radio station. So I couldn't take the pay cut to go to the Times. and after a year or so, one of the one of the disc jockeys at ABC at this radio station,

WMCA, got a job at ABC and told me they still had a couple of openings. So I went and applied for it. And they said, you know, you're very good. And we'd like to hire you but you're 23 years old. You know, we can't hire a 23-year-old as a correspondent at a network.

And I said, well, you're talking about a radio correspondent. I said, I don't sound 23, do I? And he said, no. And I said, well, if you don't tell them, I won't. And they waited a couple of days, and then they came back and said, okay, you got the job. And I was whether you be safe for 43 years. On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over. They just get darker.

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being honest. Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers. Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, Iheart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. Were you reporting when Kennedy got assassinated? I was. That was open early on.

Well, that was in 1963. That was my first year. First year. Yeah. Now, were you on assignment to, you had a specific assignment after that? Well, at that time, I was doing a program called Flair Reports with five other people. And these were little three-minute news features. They were doing three-minute news features in 1963.

Yes. I thought it was more of this long form. I thought this was new that we were doing these little. Yeah, no, that's... Okay. Yeah. You could have been. You could have been at ABC.

You could have been doing... Could have. You could have. I think you landed on your feet here. Yeah, I did. You did expect to. Didn't expect to be a journalist. Well, there you go.

So you, what did you do with the Kennedy assassination? You were assigned to Lyndon Johnson? I was assigned to stand outside Lyndon Johnson's. In those days, 1963, The vice president of the United States did not have a formal residence. There was, there is now, there is a vice president's mansion. Okay. Back then, there was not.

And he was living in the home of a woman, I believe she was from Texas, and her name was Pearl Mester. She was known as the hostess with the mostus. Okay. Yeah. and Lyndon Johnson and Lady Bird were living in her home, waiting to ascend to the White House. But they were going to be living there. And I was assigned to stand outside the house and report on the new president of the United States as he made his way to the White House.

He was supposed to... Literally him coming out the door. Literally him coming out the door. He was supposed to come out. I forget what the time was. Let's say 7.30 in the morning. He didn't come out until 8.30. They had nowhere else to go.

So they stuck with me. And I had lived for an hour. Oh, really? Really. Live television? Live radio. Live radio. I wasn't doing television in those days.

It was just radio. And so that was, you know, in some of the time. In some respects, that was one of my first big breaks. They realized I could add lib. What did you talk about? Were you like, they have nice landscaping out here? You know something? I remember one thing in particular that I did talk about.

There was a guy who had this huge dog. It may have been a mastiff. And he had tied the leash of the mastiff to the handle of the driver's side of his car. and he was literally walking his dog around the neighborhood. Driving it. Driving it. Because the mastiff was so big that if he had tried to, you know, jog. He would have pulled him around.

He would have pulled him around. I thought maybe the guy's lazy, but now I think maybe he's smart. He was smart. He was smart. And the dog didn't seem to mind it, you know. And so you're reporting on your ad libbing about what you're seeing, sending outside of Lyndon Johnson's after Kennedy's assassinated. I was doing at least three or four minutes on the man in the dark, right?

Journalism at its best. At its, yes, at its basic. So you got that job, you were married. One thing that was interesting to me, and this relates to your relationship that you have with your family and your wife. As I understand it, after your career had launched, you stepped down from your career. to allow your wife to go to law school and pursue her career? Is that the way that happened? I'll tell you what. I'm going to give you the inside story. Y'all rolling? You're rolling? You got this?

My wife and I met in grad school at Stanford. I was taking a master's degree. She was getting her PhD. She was very close to getting her PhD when we decided that we were going to get married. And I thought about it, and I thought about it. And I said, I don't think I can handle this. And she said, what do you mean? And I said, the idea of doctor and Mr. Coppel. My ego wouldn't let me handle that. And to my everlasting shame, I talked my wife out of finishing her PhD. A few years pass. Ten years, 12 years.

I'm thinking back now, and I'm ashamed of myself. Right? I mean, what I did was not right. And so I went back to my wife and I said, you know, that wasn't right and I want to make it right. I'll take a year off. and let's head back out to California and finish your PhD

and she said, you know, I've been thinking about that. I don't really want to do that. I want to go to law school. I said, okay, I'll take your first year of law school off. So I went up to ABC and I told him and they said, well, you know, let's see if we can. can't keep you part-time. And so they put a microphone in the house, and I did a daily commentary from my home.

After I did the carpool, took the kids to school, fixed breakfast, fixed their lunches, did the shopping, then I recorded the commentary. And word got out that I had done this. And back in, this had to be about 1977. Back in 1977, the house husbands were not that much of a common thing. Wasn't a thing. Wasn't that thing. So, you know, I got a lot of play as a house husband.

And I became the patron saint of house husbands. So the irony of all irony was, Ted, having done a really despicable thing, when he was 20 years old or 21 years old, ends up becoming a hero for doing the right thing 12 years later. There. Now you have the whole story. That's an incredible story because most people wouldn't have pulled that off. I mean, I don't think most people would have had the character to see that they'd done something wrong and actually go back and fix it.

It's kind of you to put it that way. Well, I think it's true. Well, thank you. All right. Yeah. Interesting. Well, that checks out because that's sort of, well, now you gave me the inside story that no one's ever heard. Only on Bear Greas have heard this in all the reporting in the world.

A couple of other people may have heard it over the years. Yes, it's just a cook. But I doubt that the Bear Greas listeners had heard it before. They probably haven't. Right. They probably haven't. I want to talk to you about the non-viewing listeners. need to know that at this point

you were checking your notes, right? It's true. First time I checked it. Now, you became known, you told me before we started there are two kinds of journalists. There are those that come in with them. Two kinds of interviewers, not two kinds of journalists,

but two kinds of interviews. People that have a list of questions and then people that actually engage, like a human would engage in normal conversation. In a conversation. And shift and flow. Listen. Now, you can, you know, if you want to be kind to your kind of interviewer, you can say it's two kinds of interviewers, one who prepares and the other who doesn't.

Who needs notes. Right. No, I mean, you prepare. Right. Right. You did your homework. Yes. You were a good boy.

How do you, so you've set across from world leaders. give me a highlight reel of the world leaders that you have, if there were a top five, who would Ted Cople's top five world leaders that you've interviewed me? Okay, well, let's lump all the presidents together, okay? American presidents. American presidents, that's one. Have you interviewed all of them up until...

I've interviewed Trump. I've interviewed Clinton. I've interviewed Obama. I've interviewed Nixon. I interviewed Reagan. I interviewed, yeah, actually, I have interviewed both, both bushes. Yeah. So, you know, hold.

We're going to put them in one category. That's one category. Yeah, because they just, those guys just get a job for four years and move on and just kind of inconsequential. Inconsequential. On the other hand, what else is there? I interviewed Nelson Bandela. When he came out of prison.

Did you go to South Africa? I did. I interviewed Putin. I was the first, certainly the first American journalist to interview. Is he short? He's about my size. Yes, he's short. Okay.

Yeah. Okay. Just checking. Yeah. And in fact, he and I was standing up when I was interviewing him. because it was supposed to be a brief interview. They were going to get me 10 minutes. And I kept going.

And finally, one of his aides was crawling on his belly on the floor and tugging on my pants to indicate to me in case I had forgotten. You kept going, though. I kept going, though. You kept going. You had him. I had it. What year did you interview Putin? That was when he became president.

What would that have been? About 1990-something. Late 90s? Yeah. Okay, so Nelson Mandela. Nelson Mandela. Putin. Who are some of the other?

We've got all the American presidents now. We've got... Gorbachev. Gorbachev. Yes, I was with Gorbachev at the Kremlin in his office. when he was sitting across the desk, Cremant, like this, when he was interviewing,

not interviewing, when he was saying goodbye to George Bush. So that was kind of a tofer. When you, wait a second, I'm giving you a twofer here, you're just going to ride right over it. I mean, how many other people interviewed,

you know, had Gorbachev and... Carry on. My apologies, sir. No, no, no, no. That's, you know. Gorbachev and, and Bush.

At the same time. At the same time. That's not bad. Right? That's not bad. Right. That's almost like the time I interviewed Roy Clark and Warner Glenn at the same time. Roy Clark, I know.

Who's the other guy? It's a joke. You probably don't know the Roy Clark I'm talking about. It was an inside joke for my beloved Bear Grease people. Roy Clark is a plot. bear hound man, a legend in East Tennessee, and Warner Clark is, Warner Glen is probably the oldest living working cowboy in America. Incredible man.

He was an inside joke. I think you just trump me to coin a phrase. Maybe, maybe so. Okay, world leaders, though. You were giving me your top five world leaders. We're close to five, so. Oh, yeah. I think we're, you know, who else have we got?

Now, would any of your listeners know the name Elie Wiesel? I'm not familiar with that name. You're not familiar with it? My wife probably is. I bet she is. My wife is. Yes, she's nodding her head. I should have just said yes, should I?

No, Elie Wiesel. Elie Wiesel was a survivor of the Holocaust. And he came to this country as a refugee. and he began working for peace all over the world. And he ended up winning the Nobel Peace Prize. He was a wonderful man. He really was, an extraordinary human being who had survived many, many things.

I mean, he was in one of the death camps. His father was killed there. I believe his mother was killed there also. Anyway, so, Ellie, do we need more, or can we go to a different line? Well, I have a question. When you think about your life, are interviewing world leaders? Because in your job, that would kind of be a pinnacle marker of success. Is that meaningful to you or no?

Less than you might think. Yeah. Yeah. I thought that. I thought you might say that. Well, you're a sensitive guy. Is that going to undermine your credibility with all the bear hunters? If I say you're a sensitive guy.

No, because people that would know me at a surface level might think they would understand these like external accolades that might be meaningful to me. Right. And they wouldn't be that much. I mean, I get to do my interview later, but what's the most meaningful accolade to you? Well, the most meaningful accolade that I have, no, no, I'm not trying to sound cute, but would be how I am when there are no cameras and no podcasts and no people, how I am as a husband and a father.

That is the pinnacle of my success aside from, which would even be a layer deeper, what I believe God expects for me and how I live. So my connection to him. But people might see me sitting with Ted Cople or me, some hunting escapade that was an adventure. Those things are meaningful, but they are. You're absolutely right.

But having said that, I have a whole lifetime of having done the one at the expense of the other. You know, we have four children. I have four children. Guess who takes care of them? When daddy's off fighting the way, war or covering the war right right right uh you know i was in vietnam laos cambodia over a period of about three

years in and out we had at that point when i first went to vietnam we had two kids by the time we left hong kong in 1971 we had three and a fourth on the way my wife was the one who took care of it everything would you have done it the same way if you could do it again no what would you do different what i would do differently is i would show a little more spunk i would say no on occasion when our son was born he was born in hong kong it was a very difficult birth it was a caesarian birth. He'd had the umbilical cord wrapped around his neck. He very nearly, very nearly didn't make it.

Two days after he was born, or three days after he was born, I forget which exactly, I went off to Cambodia. Why? Because there was a war going. And you were at the peak of your career. You had to make it, or you were before the peak of your career. It's certainly, I mean, if Nightline was the peak of the career, this would have been, this would have been 20 years, 20 years before the peak. Well, you were scrapping to fight to the top because that's the hardest part.

And I want to ask you a question about it. That's right. Like when you're in your 30s, when you're in your 20s, when men and women are fighting to get a hold on life, their career, the things that are ultimately going to help their family. Right. That's the time when we also have our children, most people. And it's so difficult in the moment. Because I would have the same scenario to some degree, not to the degree that you traveled, have I traveled, not even close. But my wife would say, yeah, Clay spends a lot of time away.

But it's such a difficult thing because all that made you who you are. Did it come at the expense of your family, though? With your family. Sure. Okay. Yes, absolutely. No question. I mean, my wife has been heroic in terms of how she has kept the family together.

She's been heroic in terms of doing everything that a husband would have done if he'd been home. But would she want you to have done something different? Today? I know her pretty well. but I can't answer that. I don't know. I think in her heart of hearts, she would say,

if I thought he could have stayed home without becoming embittered at the loss of opportunity, I would have wanted him to stay home. But she didn't want me to lose that opportunity. And she didn't, not because of anything she wanted, we could have gotten along with a lot less. And during the early years, we did.

Yeah, those are difficult questions to answer. You know, it's part of what you and I are going to be talking about. Culture. What makes the culture of a given society? What's important? There are some things that translate from the country. country to the city. A lot of things that don't, right? But things like that, a man doing what he feels he has to do for the family. Is it really for the family? Well, yeah, he puts food on the table.

Right. That's important. Right. In some cases, it's critical. At some cases, he's the only one who can do it. in other cases not so much could i have made a living without traveling all around the world without covering seven wars yeah could have done it um but you were correct i was i was a man on the go on the come right when you when you look at your career with all the all the accolades that like I read at the beginning, what's most meaningful to you today? Because are you 85 now? Yes.

So you've had a lot of time to evaluate all the stages of life. I mean, it's so life is, you're right. Life can be confusing because, I mean, I'm four, I turned 46 yesterday. And the things that I value today are far different than they were 20 years ago. and really even different than they were 10 years ago. Well, happy birthday anyway. Thank you.

Thank you. And, you know, in every decade that passes, you're able to evaluate and see the fruit of that decade. And at 85, what had value in your life? What's the most meaningful thing? Because our culture does value success. It values money. it values all this stuff

and then people would look at you and go, oh man, this guy's been massively successful. He must be the most happy man in the world. Are you? I'm very happy. What is the most important thing to me? My wife. My children

are all grown. But how old are your kids? 17 to 23. I've got four. Bears 19. He's 19. So you're at that stage where they're kind of phasing out, right?

They're going to lead their own lives. But I got news for you. You're going to be their daddy until they die or until you die, whichever comes first. Right? It never stops. You don't want it to stop. You want them to be, to a certain degree, not dependent on you, but you want them to turn to you as, if not their best friend,

one of their best friends, right? So that stays the case all the way through. That'll never change. Yeah, that's good advice. Last spring, Clay Newcomb and I collaborated with Jason Phelps at Phelps game calls and building each of our own favorite turkey diaphragms called prime cuts. Now, I'm going to tell you, I love mine because it's easy to use. I'm not going to go, I'm not going to win a turkey calling contest.

It's just not going to happen. But when I run this call, I get the sounds that gobblers are looking for. I have a great turkey hunting track record. If you go listen to real turkeys out in the woods, they're not going to win calling contests, right? That's who I listen to. I can make those sounds on my cut. I also hunt with Phelps's cut, and I hunt with Clay's cut because they're all three great cuts.

Check out Prime Cuts at Phelpsgamecalls.com. I think you'll be glad you did, and you'll find out that the Steve Ronella cut is an easy-to-use cut for beginning callers who just want to start making good turkey noises and getting action. I've got a, Misty, if we need, Do you have any specific questions? I've kind of got one more thing.

And I could talk to you for another hour, but I want to honor your time. We asked for 30, 45 minutes. You're going to talk to me for another hour. Okay. When I see Dustin crawling over here and pulling on my pants, I'm going to wop him in the head and then we'll talk for another 20 minutes. I learned that from a good newscaster.

So I interview a lot of people, was never trained in it, was never just kind of just started doing it and became a podcaster. You're a natural. You're very good. Well, thank you. Thank you. My question to you is when you're interviewing, when you interviewed world leaders, or anyone that you respect, it may not have been a world leader, may have been someone no one knew. How do you not get nervous?

I mean, essentially is the question. It's not a very articulate answer. but how do you maintain control? How do you actually get out of someone what you want from them? How do you do that? I remind myself that he's not really or she's not really talking to me. I'm the instrument through which that person wants to reach the audience that I have. When I was doing Nightline and when Nightline was at its peak,

we sometimes had audiences up to 9 million people a night. Huge audiences. So when people want access to that audience, they're going to put up with a lot of nonsense from some guy they might not give the time of day to if it were just talking to him I don't care about you, Clay, don't you know that? It's your audience I'm after.

I want to talk to those bear grace folks, right? That's right. No, but I mean that's what we all do. We're simply in. instruments of reaching a different audience. Do you think, is that the way modern journalists think? Or like these opinion, opinion media people where, because I would say that's kind of the way I do journalism.

I think, I think it is. It sounds like, sounds like it. I mean, I want to, I'm not quite as I'm just trying to let you funnel through. I mean, I'm kind of trying to, I mean, I'm just, I would have this same conversation if there was no audience, you know. I'm just kind of expressing my interest. But do you think most, is that still a thing where a journalist is just a glass window that's just reflecting into another audience? No, journalism has changed tremendously.

And it's the technology that has changed. I mean, the fact is, I would bet that do you have a lot of, any idea how large your audience is? I have an idea. Can you tell me? After this I will. Well, that's no help. Okay. So let's just pick a number. Let's just say 50,000 people. Okay. And they're all over the United States. You're not reaching them by radio, you're not reaching them by television, you're reaching them through the internet, right? That's right. The internet has done a curious thing, because the internet brings literally, sometimes, millions

of people together over an issue without the controlling influence of a journalist. there aren't a whole lot of journalists the way I would define the term in my business anymore what are they for the most part you know what you're getting you know what the ideology is they tend to be and if they are not ideologues themselves than their commercial ideologues.

Okay. Right? Okay. So that, for example, a viewer of Fox News and a viewer of MSNBC knows pretty much what he or she is going to get. It's not the same thing. And they're tuning in because it's telling this person, it's reflecting back to this person kind of what they want to hear.

Exactly. And you know that. So if you're... There's a sympathy. You know, there's a sympathy. There are sympathetic vibes going back and forth between the television set and the viewer. And that never happened before. That wasn't common before the Internet, really.

It wasn't common before the Internet, if largely because you had ABC, NBC and CBS. There was no CNN. There was no MSNBC. There was no YouTube. There was no YouTube. There was no Fox. And there is a reason why Walter Cronkite was at one point considered the most trustworthy person, the most trusted man in America. Now, was there ever an election that said Walter is the most trusted man in America?

No. There was, I think, one magazine article that referred to him as such. And it stuck. And it stuck. And it was, you know, there was a certain... You knew him. I knew Walter. Did you ever have to arm wrestle him or fistfight him?

No. I'm more likely I would have arm wrestled with Dan Rather or Tom Brokaw. Yeah. Both of whom are good friends. Were they your rivals? Oh, yes. Were they really? Oh, sure.

Was there animosity? No, no animosity, but rivalry. But there was a professionalism, though. I mean, it's kind of like a... I mean, probably more than there would be today. I think so, probably. But we really, I mean, you know, when I say, and I don't know your audience, but I'm just assuming, and you can correct me if I'm wrong.

You're stereotyping us. Not yet, I'm not, but I'm just about to if you'll wait for a second. I'm stereotyping in the sense that I believe that many members of your audience would look at a network correspondent, would look at me or look at Dan Rather 20, 30 years ago, and Tom Brocault, the same thing. We're all about the same vintage, right? And say, you know, those guys,

those guys were all a little bit left of center, right? Maybe not even a little bit left of center. But back in our day, what else did you have right where else could you go there was ABC there was NBC and there was CBS so you had no choice but

to broadcast left of center you wouldn't have got a job is that what you're saying no what I'm saying is you as an audience member could have flipped the dial and said yeah I'm not crazy about these guys for whatever reason your personal reason Right. And then you would have said, however, I got no place else to go.

There was no CNN. There was no Fox. There was no. But if I tell you now, and I tell you that with great sincerity, we tried very hard to be down the line. We tried very hard to be honest reporters. We tried very hard to give you a story without ideological twist. Having said that, I will tell you it's been my life experience

that the reporter on the ground is always going to have a slightly more liberal outlook than the people back, for example, in Washington. When I was in Vietnam, for example, and would come back for one of these year-end shows, I would always get into fights on the air with our diplomatic correspondent who covered the State Department, with the White House correspondent who covered the White House. Why? Because I was bringing back the point of view of the grunt on the ground in Vietnam. And they didn't much care for the war.

They didn't think the war was going all that well. there were even a few of them who thought that we were losing the war. You couldn't hear that in Washington back in those days. So was the reporter on the ground more liberal than the reporter who was covering the State Department and the White House? Absolutely. But were we, by definition, left of center? No, we tried very hard to be right down the middle. that's kind of gone.

Yeah. Yeah, it's almost like you have to pick a side. Well, either that or pick no side. I would argue that the networks these days are less ideological than they were 40, 50 years ago. I'm pretty confused about that, but I... Are you? What do I mean... I mean, like to say like a...

I mean, you could pick either side like a fox. news or a CNN. No, no, no, no. I'm talking about the broadcast networks, ABC, NBC, CBS. Okay, understood. You think you know what the ideological slant is of the anchors on ABC, NBC, and CBS? I'm not sure that they have one. And they shouldn't. But I also think that the stories that they do are less tough than the ones we used to do. Point of view. Yeah. And it's a point of view that comes from an 85-year-old geyser

who's been out to pasture for quite a while. So what's your prediction of how things are going to go? Because the Internet truly is a technology that changed planet Earth. Humans have never done this before what we're doing. And like media was so impacting to society for so long. And now it's, you know, people are getting their news from everywhere. They're getting their news from where they want. There's news coming to your phone.

Like what's the projection of what media is going to do to this country in 20 years? I'm not optimistic. I don't think it's leading us in a good direction. Let me put it this way. 30, 40 years ago, a couple of guys sitting at a bar having an argument happened all the time. Now that argument ends up on the Internet, and before you know it, you've got half a million people.

engaged. And where they're getting their information may not be the best place. Part of the problem is people's information frequently has an ideological bias on the left and on the right. And the end result is you've got people in our country today who are at odds with one another. only because of what they're hearing or reading or seeing on their carefully selected medium, which reflects their point of view to begin with. That's why they picked it. And it's driving us as a people further and further apart. I agree.

Do you? Oh, yeah. Good. Absolutely. I think it's tearing us a support. part at the seams. I mean, and I don't know that there's a better solution, but yeah, it's interesting. It's not whether there's a worse or a better solution, the problem, the technology has

and it's not going away. It's picked us up in its teeth and is running down the road with us. Yeah. Yep. We have no say in it anymore. I mean, how do you, well, I'll ask you later, how you feel about influencers. What is an influencer? Do you know?

I do. Are you an influencer? I don't want to be. Are you? I mean, I think some people would consider me that. I mean, I'm just being honest. I'm not, it's not a flattering term to me. Neither is being a podcaster.

I don't interstate. Being a podcaster is like being a used car salesman. Really? I don't want to be a podcaster. No. Well, that's easy. Stop it. Well, but I am very interested in people and their stories.

and interpreting their stories to the world you are a very good communicator and so you should do it you have to do it on the medium that's available to you right and i you know so far you haven't received an invitation from the network but maybe you will maybe you think you'd give me a job at cbs would you take it well you know what talks you know in the poorest sight in the country i'll tell you what you know what they don't give away these days in the richest city in the country what's that a whole lot of money a whole lot of money same here man same problem here yep i don't know um are we uh are we good dustin okay i saw you inching up i thought you're going to crawl over here and pull my pant legs yeah i think mike is almost

done of his setup so yeah okay misty is there anything else i need ask how old were your daughters when you stayed home the year you stay home it would have been Misty asked how old his daughters were when he stayed home well the oldest daughter would have been 13 or 14 and then the next one would have been 11 or 12 and the youngest would have been about 6

and I had a son at that point and he would have been about eight right seven or eight what do you mean who cooked better between you and your wife Misty do I look suicidal to you

all I keep thinking about is I heard an interview with Jimmy Carter on the radio and it had something to do with pork chops and peanut butter and i cooked it that evening and they were awful i mean they it must have been me because i'm sure you know if jimmy had cooked them they would have been just fine but i i was lousy on the pork chops and and peanut butter have you ever had wild game um if i well i'll

tell you when i would have had wild game when i was in boring boarding school I was in boarding school in like 1951 52 53 in England in England and that was shortly after the war the war ended 1945 Second World War I know we had a lot of rabbit really yeah but it would have been farm raised rabbit no no no it would have been oh no like wild hunter killed rabbits yeah in the boarding school in England well that was the only meat they could get. Yeah.

Oh, after the war. After the war. It was distressing times. They were distressing times. Okay. So I, you know, I ate rabbit with gusto. Okay.

I'm not sure. Could have helped you in your quickness and agility over the years. Never know. Either that or my stupidity. You can't tell. I'm trying to think, I have never.

there is no question about it. I've never tasted bear. How does bear taste? Bear is, in the words of one of the early explorers of America, it tastes betwixt pork and beef. Betwixt. Betwixt. Pork and beef.

Yeah. Well, I like pork. Mm-hmm. And I like beef. I'm being quite serious, and I would say this. Believe it with all my heart. Is it gay-me? No.

You would eat bare meat that I cooked for you and you would think it was beef. Really? 100%. I will tell you a cook World War II story. Meat was rare. My mother came home one day bearing a steak. I had never seen a steak. My father had many times, right?

But not during the war. And she cooked that steak, and my father ate it, and I ate it, and she touched nary a bite of that steak. Now, you're thinking, I know what you're thinking, horse. Hmm. No. What else could it have been? A steak. If it was red marbled meat?

Not marbled, but red meat. Red meat? Yes. Well, I mean, I would have thought sheep or beef, but was it a mule? No. It was a whale. Whale? Whale meat.

Whale meat? Tasted a little bit fishy. Naturally. But red meat. Right? Have you ever had, what's the name? I was right on my, I should have just gone for it. Uktukuk.

Uktuk. It's, it's, it's the outer layer of skin of a whale. with a big chunk of fat, the Inuits, the Arctic, people in the Arctic eat it. I believe it's Muktuk. Muktuk. Oh, my gosh. They eat it. They put seal oil on it.

How's his pronunciation? Mr. And it tastes like the ocean. Let the record show that Misty is sort of moving her hands in a flat facing the floor back and forth indicating. I stand by my second swing at bat. mucktuck. Muktuk.

But it's the fat and outer layer. It's beautiful. It's black and has a little square and it's white and they eat it. It tastes like the ocean. It tastes like you're in the Atlantic, you know, swimming with a fish. It's bad. Can't wait. It is not good.

Can't wait. Well, steak. Well, you have achieved your primary goal here. Yes. Which is to so exhaust me that I can't read. interview you, but I'll do the best I can. Well, Mr. Cople. Ted.

Ted, truly a pleasure. Thank you. This will be talking with you today on Bear Creek School. Definitely be in the top... 20 to 20 interviews I've ever done in my life. Top 10 or 20. No, no, no, no, no. Much, much higher than that.

Much of much time. I set you up for that. For those not watching, I lifted up my hand. It was counting on the five. digits. He thought I was going in for top five. No, truly an honor. Thank you so much for coming to Arkansas. My pleasure. And taking the time. I wasn't, when I asked your producer if you would sit down with me for Bear Griex, I honestly thought there's no way he would do it. So your kindness and generosity is noted. Well, together with kindness and generosity, please include

stupidity. It was a pleasure. It really was. Thank you. You were very nice. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over. They just get darker. I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a sleeping bed. And there was a full of blood. Oh, my God, he doesn't have a hit.

Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors, where the terrain is unforgiving, the evidence is scarce, and the truth gets buried under brush and silence. Indications were he should be right there. But he wasn't. This season, we're going deeper. From cold case files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwards.

Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. Because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments and the people left behind trying to piece them back together. He's not an honest person. He's incapable of being honest. Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers. Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th.

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