Bear Grease - Ep. 46: Jerry Clower - Southern Identity, Raccoon Hunting, and Comedy

Episode Date: March 23, 2022

On this episode of the Bear Grease Podcast, we’re diving deep into the heart of southern cultural identity and the mind of Jerry Clower. Does that name ring a bell? Jerry was thrust into national fame in the 1970s when a story he told about coonhunting topped the country charts. I’m interested in those odd places where rural culture -- and specifically hunting -- crosses tracks with the mainstream. Wilson Rawls bridged that gap with his book “Where the Red Fern Grows,” and Jerry did it with comedy about hunting varmints. He’s been gone for a long time, but I was able to meet up with his old Amite County neighbor in East Fork, Mississippi: a man named John Newman. He’ll give us a behind the scenes look into who Jerry was, and some of it may surprise you. And believe it not, Brent Reaves met Jerry Clower and saw his famed Gold Cadilac. Brent swears it was as long as a battleship. Trust me boys and girls, you’re not going to want to miss this one!   Connect with Clay and MeatEater Clay on Instagram MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and Youtube Shop Bear Grease MerchSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Built to perform, built to last. Check out. First Light's new field. Worldware gear at firstlight.com. What did it look like? It was red. Red suit it had on the lapels, like on lapel, the stitching was white, so it stood out against that.

White cowboy boots. Yeah. And red pants had a big white belt with a belt buckle size of a Studebaker hubcap. And he had an embroidered coon on the left lapel. Really? Yep, coon face right there. On this episode of the Bear Grease podcast, we're diving. deep into southern culture and identity to get a view from the captain's chair of Jerry Clower's mind.

Does that name ring a bell? Jerry was thrust in the national fame in the 1970s when a story he told about coon hunting topped the country music charts. I'm interested in those odd places where rural culture and specifically hunting touches the mainstream. Oh, Wilson Rawls bridged the gap with his book Where the Red Fern grows and Jerry did it with comedy about hunting varmits. He's been gone for a long time, but I was able to go meet up with his old neighbor in East Fork, Mississippi, and A. Mitt County, and he'll give us a behind-the-scenes

look into who Jerry was, and some of it will surprise you. And believe it or not, old Brent Reeves met Jerry Clower and saw his famed gold Cadillac that Brent swears was as long as a battleship. Trust me, boys, you're not going to want to miss this one. It was beyond my comprehension that somebody in my family didn't know him because the stories that he told were stories that I could identify with as far as how he grew up. My name is Clay Newcomb, and this is the Bear Grease podcast, where we'll explore things forgotten but relevant. Search for insight in unlikely places and where we'll tell the story of America,

who live their lives close to the land. Presented by FHF Gear, American-made, purpose-built, hunting and fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore. First of all, I want you to know that I come from right for Liberty, Mississippi. Now, that's 12 miles west of McCone, Mississippi, 65 miles due northeast of Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and 116 miles due north of New Orleans, Louisiana.

It was there that I first saw the light of day out at Amit County, September the 28th, 1926. I was born there. If you recognize that voice, many assumptions could be made about you and your history. You're likely over the age of 30, have some tie to the southern United States, are a fan of old country music,

and I could likely guess your political leanings. Throughout any culture in the world, there are insiders who represent a sector of the population. These people are significant and carry the values of their people, but their interpretation of those values is amplified through time. My friend Steve Ronella recently said that if you can ice fish in your state, that state isn't in the South. And I completely agree with that from a geopolitical boundary state.

standpoint. But I'd like to add a second layer of analysis. If your family listened to Jerry Clower, you're likely culturally southern. And I'll make a definitive statement. If you don't know who Jerry Clower is, you aren't Southern. I'm sorry. Or you've been locked at a chicken coop your whole life. We've been talking about hunting raccoons with hounds and exploring the cultural impact of the book where the red fern grows. We've pontificated. On that time, Coon Hunting did a tomahawk dunk on mainstream culture, and they loved it. I'm looking for patterns on how to positively portray rural life to a sector of the population that may not understand it. Wilson Rawls did it with his book, and we'll see that the brilliant humorist Jerry Clower did it by telling a human story.

You see, Jerry was catapulted into the national spotlight in 1971 because of a short tale. he told about a coon hunt in Mississippi. The story was so intriguing, producers from New York City traveled to meet him with, in Jerry's words, a pocket full of money, and the following contract launched the 45-year-old fertilizer salesman into immediate stardom. Jerry wasn't a musician, but recorded 27th full-length recordings through MCA records, producing two gold albums and a platinum record, and he became a member of the grand old Opry, wrote four books, and hosted multiple television shows. Jerry's first album made more than $10 million in the first ten months and stayed in country's top 20 on the chart for 30 weeks. Author Willie Morris said

Clower's comic art demonstrates the richness of the spoken language in the South in all its inwardness, nuance, and sweep. He described it as extravagant Southern talk. Jerry would become known as the mouth of the South, and in a time of racial upheaval, he was outspoken in his support of racial integration and support of African Americans. Jerry has been gone since 1998, but I traveled to East Fork, Mississippi, in A. Mitt County to meet with Jerry's longtime neighbor and fellow East Fork Baptist Church member, Mr. John Newman, who will help us unravel Jerry's life and comedy. Mr. John is a good. clean-shaven, handsome feller in his early 70s with a head full of white hair, mid-length

sideburns, and a worn pair of leather boots. But most importantly, he knew Jerry well and loved him like a brother. So Jerry, he was born in 1926. He passed away in 1998 at the age of 71. What do we know about his early life that probably had some impact on just who he was? Tell me about his early history, just as a kid. Jerry was born during some real hard times in the history of the country. Depressions were pretty common. We went through two of them, went through a couple of world wars. Jerry and his brother Sonny both served in World War II. And his mother told me that one of the saddest stories that she could relate to in regard to her children in that at one time both of them boys were missing. They didn't know where they were, but she prayed that God would look out for them,

bring them back home safely, and they did. But Jerry was brought up in some pretty tough times. His mother was a sole provider. They didn't have a lot of the luxuries of life, just like a lot of people. A lot of us that lived in this part of the country, that grew up in the South during some pretty tough times. Jerry said that his county was so poor people couldn't afford to sin,

and that he ate so much slick, shiny-boiled ochre that when he was a boy, he couldn't keep his socks up. Once went asked if he hadn't been poor If he would have achieved what he did He said, quote, no Because I probably would have been arrogant And I wouldn't have had a coon dog He was a joy to be around

He loved everybody He never let his fame or his fortune Go to his head Many times, different occasions He would call me up, asked me what I was doing This was after he had moved back into the East Fork community And he said, John, come on over We're going to put on some coffee

I want to tell you about where I been, who I saw. But everywhere he went, anybody that he had in contact with, and Jerry knew a lot of people. He knew people all over the country, politicians, athletes, people from every walk of life, business characters, so many people that he knew he had an influence on. Now, tell me how you knew Jerry. I knew Jerry when I was just a small child.

Jerry was a few years older than me. At the time he lived in Yazoo City and became a fertilizer salesman there from Mississippi. Chemical Corporation, and it was just by coincidence and an accident, as Jerry has told me before, and as he related in some of his stories, he kind of backed into show business. Yeah. But he was always a big talker. He was a good salesman.

He had a lovable-style character. If you met him, you never forgot him. And I think he was on a sales pitch over in Texas, and somebody asked him, to Jerry, with the talent that you've got, you need to use that. you ought to make a record. So Jerry was selling fertilizer. He started using just some stories just to kind of loosen people up. That's right.

I mean, just like he naturally would. That's a sales pitch. And somebody heard it and said, you are so funny. And the guy said, hey, I want to record you tell one of these stories. And he did. In 1971 at the unlikely age of 45, the fertilizer salesman recorded his first comedy album titled Jerry Clower from Yazoo City, Mississippi, talking with lemon label out of Texas. The album was a series of stories of Jerry just talking.

Each was titled like a song in an album, and they sold over 8,000 records for $5 each. And some radio stations started playing it. And then he got the attention he needed. The next day I got a telephone call from New York City said, Mr. Clowa, I'm vice president of a major record company. You have some talents, and the next time you're in this vicinity, would you drop by, we'd like to talk to you? I said, I ain't never going to be in that vicinity.

I said, man, you don't leave. Yeah, Zoo City, Mississippi, and just drop by New York. If y'all want to see me, you're going to have to send for me. Two days later, the telephone rang. The Deca label would sign Jerry to a recording contract. The album would later become one of his two gold record albums selling over 500,000 copies in just one month. A gold record is one that sells over a half million albums.

If you remember Robert Morgan's quote from our Boone series about how most great artist, explorers, and writers do the best work of their life in their 30s, you'll see that that must not apply to fertilizer salesmen. Well, that's what's so interesting is that he didn't get into it until, you know, he wasn't born into it. I mean, he was, it was later in his life. That's very rare, I would say. It is.

Usually people have show business in their targets from a young kid. That's something they pursue. That was, yeah, he backed into it. It wasn't what he was trying to do. He did. He backed into it. And then so he, this guy recorded this record or recorded him telling some country story. Do you know what story it was by chance that he told originally? Yeah, I think it was

knock him out, John. Oh, really? It was the Coon Hunter story. Okay. Herein lies the reason we're talking about Jerry Clower. His all-time most popular story was about raccoon honey with hounds. Very interesting. We'll hear more about this story later. I've heard it said that he was, he was a humorist, not necessarily a comedian, which to me, to say someone's a comedian just means that they're funny, which I think he would qualify for that. But the way he described himself is he said, I don't tell funny stories. I tell stories funny. And that's what I'm so struck by as I've listened to so much of his stuff, is that the stories are often just kind of, it's the normal life of it that sometimes is what's so interesting. but he has this cast of characters that he always goes to. So almost all his stories,

all his, all his routines have this cast of characters. Can you name most of them? Well, that was Marcel. There's Eugene Ardell, Raynell, Bernal, M.L. New Gene. Uncle Versy, Aunt Pet, old man, Zais. That was my great-grandpa. Mr. Versy, quite a few of those characters. And so were those real people? Some of them were that I know. of. And he used their real names or not? In some instances, he did. Tell me what you know about some of those characters and some of the things

that he talked about. Well, one in particular to my great grandfather. The story Mr. John is about to tell is the real story that Jerry titled The New Chandelier. And you can listen to it on any streaming platform. It was

included on Jerry Clower's greatest hit album. The Magnolia Electric Association had just began to establish rural electric service here in our county. That was back in the late 40s. All you had to do was sign up, be willing to pay for the pole to be put up, and electricity run from that pole to your house, and they took care of everything else. So they had notified our church that while they were in the community, they would be glad to provide our church with electrical service. So the church had a business meeting, monthly business

meeting, and it was brought up, said, hey man, look at here. Here's a golden opportunity. for us to have electricity and lights at our church, and we need to think about this. It was brought up and voted on that we go ahead and let them put up to power poles and have electricity. And the moderator, which was a pastor, said, is there any amendments or is there any discussion before we vote? And my great grandpa said, yeah, he had something he would like to share. But before that, one of the ladies in the church said she thought it would be a marvelous

idea for the church to go ahead and get a chandelier. Since we was going to have electricity, as the amendment was brought up, my great grandpa stood up and said he was against that. The moderator said, is there any discussion? And Uncle Versa Lettbetter said, sir, I'd like to speak. I want all of you to know that if we go buy a chandelier, there ain't nobody in our church got enough education that when we order it from Sears and Roebuck,

if they could spell it, then if we order it, ordered the chandelier and it got here. There's nobody in our church that knows how to play it. And what I'm concerned about is we don't need to spend this money on those chandelier as bad as we need lights in the church. So that actually happened? I'll be darned. But then technology wasn't like it yesterday.

Most people had never been no further than 50 or 60 miles an hour. They weren't exposed to education. education like we are today, didn't have access to advancements in technology. And he didn't know. Right. He was speaking his heartfelt convictions, but he honestly did not know. In this story, Jerry told it almost exactly as it happened, but he told it funny. And because many of the stories were true, or almost true, they were relatable and showed

the character of the people, all the while poking a little fun at the stereotypes. But because Jerry was at the wheel, because he was one of us, it was okay. It made us feel okay about being Southern. And strangely, maybe even a little bit proud of our quirks. You know, the South seems to be known for these big characters, like storytelling. And maybe if you're deeply embedded and it's hard to see that maybe in other places it's not as prominent. But was Jerry surrounded by people? that were like him.

And I know nobody else made it in show business, but was he impacted probably by people that taught him how to tell stories and be funny? I think a lot of that just came to him naturally. He was associated with a lot of people that were of the same character makeup that he was. I guess in regard to that, they just did not have the people orientation

to be able to express themselves and connect with people the way he did. Yeah. But I don't think that Jerry ever, realized until he got into show business the impact that he did have on people. Yeah. I think there are three components to Jerry Clower. Number one, he was undoubtedly gifted at collecting stories and delivering them in

unreplicatable, funny, and compelling ways. However, number two, no man is an island. And I believe he would have learned components of his storytelling when he was a boy by listening to others in rural Mississippi. I'm sure he collected dialects and picked up on where to put the emphasis. He learned how to use sound effects and put it all together to create this unique style. And that brings up number three. Jerry Clower's style affected the way the South would and still does tell stories.

Up until researching this podcast, it had been a while since I'd listened to Jerry. Years, actually. And some of it stuff I had never heard. Coming back into his comedy, I clearly saw his cadence, style, dialect, mannerisms echo through the way that people now tell stories. He helped interpret for us what was funny. You know, a lot of people that are comedians are extremely intelligent, number one, and are extremely socially aware. For him to be able to find the nuance of funny stuff inside. of his everyday culture.

The stuff that other people were like walking right past. I mean, just shows what an alert, aware, intelligent guy he was. Would you agree with that? I would. Jerry, he had a way of relating to people. He was a very comical person. But to me, knowing him as well as I did, he appeared to me to be a lot more ease in a private climate. Yeah.

We've been to his house on numerous occasions. And he was a lot more comical because I think he was a lot more at ease with people that he knew and in a setting that he was familiar with, such as his own home or his church. So he was more funny when he was with people he knew. Oh, yes, definitely, definitely. One thing that I've always been quite proud of, my wife had got her master's degree over at William Carey College, and Jerry gave her this plaque in recognition of it. And it's from the Knock Em Out John Foundation.

He gave this to my wife. When he gave this to her, he told her how proud he was. of her and he looked at me and he said you know it's a miracle that you were able to accomplish make the deans list these honors that you have received it was a miracle and with what you have to put up with at home I knew he was making reference to me I said Jerry let me tell you what a miracle is I said I can't sing and I know that and I said I know you can't either because I don't sit with you before in church and other services and you can't sing I said you couldn't carry a tune in the bucket and I doubt if you know the difference between a guitar and a piano yet you have been

inducted into the grand old opera that's what you call a miracle and he grabbed me around the neck with his right hand and with his Bible clenched in his left hand and he looked up in the heavens and tears run down his face and he said john ain't god good ain't god good so it was a real moment for him it was just even while you were trying to be funny yeah and just and said you know making a joke about him not being able to sing, but being in that grand old opera, it impacted him. Just in that moment, he was just grateful. It's moments like this with no cameras or recorders that you can see inside of someone. Jerry grew up dirt poor.

He didn't hit the big time until he was in his mid-40s. He truly appreciated what had happened in his life. I think it hit him hard on October 27, 1973, when he was inducted into the grand old Opry. Now, if you're familiar with country music, there's no need. to qualify that statement, but if you're not, this is a big deal. The Grand Old Opry is a weekly country music concert show held in Nashville, Tennessee that started in 1925 and has played almost every Saturday night for the last 100 years. It's the longest running broadcast in U.S. history.

It's been called the home of American music and country's most famous stage. The Opry inducts certain people as members who are people of influence in country music. but usually they're musicians, but Jerry was one of the rare inductees that wasn't. Members are required to perform at the opera a certain amount of times each year, and in its history, the opera has inducted over 225 members. You guys know old Brent Reeves. He is Bear Grease's Goodwill Ambassador of the South and our chief cornbread contassuer.

He grew up in the heyday of Jerry Clower's career when listening to the grand old opery was one of the highlights of the week and wildly, Brent got to meet Jerry. Can you imagine a young Brent Reeves meeting Jerry Clower? And I had to laugh

when I heard what Jerry called him. We had what was known, I'm not even sure if it's still there, but there was an event center and it was called the Bradley County Cultural Center. Cultural Hub of the universe is far. As far as I know. Cultural hub of Bradley County.

Exactly. And this is in Warren High School, and it was on the campus of the high school there. And it was an auditorium. And for our junior year fundraiser, we got Jerry Clower that booked him to come and put on a show. So, 1983. That would have been 83. That would have been about the peak of his, I mean, inside the peak of his career. Yeah.

And I have no clue what it. It cost us to get him. But when he left, he handed the check back and said, give it back to the school. No way. He came from his home. He drove up there himself and the biggest, longest Cadillac I ever saw. By himself, he had, all he wanted was a place to change, to change into that suit that he wore, that signature. What did it look like?

It was red. Red suit that had on the lapels, like on lapel, the stitching was white. So it stood out against that. Yeah. And he had an embroidered coon on the left lapel. Really? Yep, coon face right there. And I got to meet him and he was so nice.

Now, how did you meet him? Since it was our class and it was like 10 or 12 of us that were selected to go over and help set everything up and to be there to help them since it was our project, our fundraiser. So I got out of class early that day to go over there and help him. Plus, I wanted to meet him. I mean, this is somebody who I had seen on television and heard these stories. my, we had the records. Remember of the grand old opera?

Oh, yeah. The whole, the big, it was a big deal. Yeah. And I heard him on the grand old ivory. Well, my dad and I, I told you this before, my dad and I were to go hunting at night. Of course, we were running, he was chasing coyotes then with the pack dogs. But until the race got going, we'd listen to the grand old opera on AM radio in his truck. And sometimes, you know, on Saturday nights.

Yeah, Jerry Clyer would be there. And so I've been listening to those stuff. stories my whole life. And this was, you know, a guy that was in my radio. It was in, he was in our community, you know, the community that, the culture, I guess, that I grew up, man. So it was, it was a big deal, him coming there. And I remember it being packed full of folks. Now, so was it open to the public? Yeah, they sold tickets. Sold tickets. Sponsored by your class. Sponsored? To raise money. Mm-hmm. Gotcha. And that's what it was. So you, you said he pulled up in a Cadillac. I mean, you saw his

Cadillac. Oh, yeah. What color was it? Gold. I'm telling you, it was long as a battleship. It was huge. I heard that he had a gold Cadillac. So I'm just confirming. Is that right? Yeah. Yeah.

Well, that's what he was driving. And like I said, he came by himself. He had a dressing room. They brought him some cold drinks to drink. And I think somebody brought flowers and stuff. But he took time to talk to anybody that wanted to talk to. When I shook his hand and I was a junior in high school, he said, boy, that's a man. hands handshake that's nice he said you're a pretty boy and uh that's what he said are you serious

yeah absolutely and we talked i'm not going to forget that one we uh you're a pretty boy he said you are a pretty boy and uh of course you know manners yes or no sir he remarked about that and we just talked and you know i tried to talk about i just assumed he had a pen full of coon dogs at home i mean yeah but you know obviously he didn't yeah and uh he just had one embroidered on his lapel of his red sports coat. Sure. Which every man probably should have. Yeah, he had on white cowboy boots.

Yeah. And red pants had a big white belt with a belt buckled size of a Studebaker hubcap. Big fancy shirt, you know, pearl snaps on it in that red signature jacket. So do you remember the thing? What did he do when he stood up? Was he the only act of the night? He was the act. He was it.

So how long did he speak? I would imagine about an hour. Jerry Clower has famous story. And he kind of... The greatest hits, I would assume, is what he talked about. Of course, he did the one about Knock Him Out John. You know, about, you know, shoot up in here amongst us. One of us has got to have some relief, you know, when he got up there with the Wildcat.

Of Jerry's entire career, his story called Knock him Out John is his most famous. As always, the story starts out at Route 4, Liberty, Mississippi, and then he begins to give very specific geographic detail of where this town is. 12 miles west of McComb, Mississippi, 65 miles due northeast of Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and 116 miles due north of New Orleans, Louisiana. It's so detailed you're drawn in with great curiosity of why this matters. And place did matter to Jerry, just like it mattered to Wilson Rawls. Then he proceeds to tell what they'd done during the day before they went coon hunting that night.

This particular day we wasn't too busy. All we had done is just cut down a few fence rolls, shucking shells from corn and went to mill, drew up some water because that was wash day, helped get to sial back what rooted out from under the net wire fence, sharpen two sticks of stovewood real sharp, and pegged them down over the bottom wire. or the fence where the hog couldn't root out in the moor.

And had a rat killing. If I'm lying, I'm dying. Jerry had a knack for using intricate detail of obscure activities to peak the interest of the listener. He went on. Well, this particular day after we got through the rat killing, I walked out on the front porch and I hollered. And them dogs come out from other house barking.

They knew he's going to cune hunt. And I hollered again, and my neighbor, way across the sage patch, hollered back. And that meant I'll meet you halfway. We met in the middle of that sage patch, and he had his dog's old Brummy and Queen and Spot, and I had Torrey and Little Red and old trailer. And we went out into the swamps, and we started hunting. Oh, we was having such a fine time. Caught four Gret Beggins.

He and the neighbor then run into the landowner, Mr. Barron, who had gotten rich by selling cotton for a dollar of bail during the first world war. Incredible detail. And with those riches, he bought some good coon dogs. Along with him was John Eubanks, who was known for being a professional tree climber and loved knocking coons out of trees. Both of these guys were real people in Jerry's life. He had some world-renowned dogs, and we hollered three or four times, and they started hunting. And we listened and directly. Old Brummie, old Brummy didn't bark it, nothing but a coon. He had a deep voice.

And when he cut out on him, it was a coon. Don't worry about no possum or no bobcat. Brummy was running a coon. And then old trailer and old highball and them famous dogs and Mr. Barron's got in there with him. And old John Eubanks said holly he, speak to it. And my brother's son would holly holly look fun. And oh, it was beautiful.

Shortly, the dogs fall entreat on, I quote, the biggest sweet gum tree in the A-Mitt River swamps, and the group goes to the barking dog. John Eubakes didn't like shooting a coon out, and he only liked to knock them out of the tree for the dogs to sort out, so John proceeds to climb the tree with a sharp stick in his hand. Knock him out, John.

It won't be long, and John worked his way on up to the top of the tree, and, who, what a big one. and he reached around in his overhauls and got that sharp stick and he drawed back and he punched a coon but it wasn't a coon it was a lynx we call them souped up wildcats

and they make cats and then Jerry says that thing attacked John up in the top of that tree Jerry often purposely mispronounce words as was the custom of the people in his region

What's the matter with John? Knock him out, John. This thing's killing me. And John knew that Mr. Barron told her the pistol in his belt to shoot snakes with. And he kept hollering. Shoot this thing. Have mercy, this thing's killing me.

Shoot this thing. And Mr. Barron said, John, I can't shoot up in there. I might hit you. John said, well, just shoot up in here amongst us, one of us got to have some relief. Jerry's colorful sound effects, the details about the dogs, the surprise of the wild cat in the tree, and the absolute distress of John fighting that lynx created an unforgettable story. Now, something I don't have the answer to is why Jerry called it a lynx,

which is a northern cat that never ranged into the American South. Ever, kind of like the Black Panther. Anyway, you got to listen to the whole story. You can search for it online, and it's called a coon hunting story. On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over. They just get darker. I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a sleeping bag, and there was a full of blood.

Oh, my God, he doesn't have a hit. Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors, where the terrain is unforgiving, the evidence is scarce, and the truth gets buried under brush and silence. Indications were he should be right there, but he wasn't. This season, we're going deeper, from cold case files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwoods. Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. Because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments and the people left behind trying to piece them back together.

He's not an honest person. He's incapable of being honest. Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers. Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, Iheart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. And Jerry's comedy skits, he had multiple skits that talked about coon hunting and multiple skits that talked about quail hunting. Was he a big hunter?

Was that just kind of a part of his background that he reached back to? It was part of his background. He was a big quail hunter, big coon hunter, big fisherman. Yeah. I had headed to McComb one day. And I passed by his house, and he was standing in his mailbox. And I turned and went back. I said, Jerry, what in the world you doing standing out you in this heat?

He was wiping his forehead with the hanker's feet sweating. And I said, man, it's hot out here. What's you doing this heat? He said, well, John, I'm going to tell you the truth. he said bass pro shop in Jackson, Mississippi called me and wanted me to come up there and pick out something on the showroom floor. Said there was one stipulation. I said, what was that, Jerry?

He said it had to be a bass boat. So he said, I went up, picked me out a bass boat, and they own their way down here now to deliver it. And I was afraid that if they missed my driveway and wound up over at your house, I'd have trouble getting my boat back. I'll be darn. were the coon dogs that Jerry talked about, were they real coon dogs? That he had Brummy and Highball.

Yeah. Now, the man that actually owned Highball lived about a mile across his pasture. Is that right? Yeah, he owned Highball. And he was a, that dog was known all over the country. Back when that dog was living, most folks might not could have told you who to sheriff of the county was. They might not knew who the tax successor was, but they knew,

about highball. Now what kind of dog was highball? I think highball was a red bone hound, I believe. But there were several other dogs that had some notoriety too. One of them was rowdy. That was owned by my uncle. But old spot and brummy. But back during that particular time of history in our community, that was a big source of recreation. Yeah. And they coon hunted. And the dogs. Money for hides. Right. Right. Selling possum hides. And, You probably heard Darius talk about flagging the conductor down on the train. Yeah. Ask him, did he want to buy some possum hides?

Possum meat. That's what he asked him if he wanted to buy a possum to eat. Yeah. Yeah, he flags down the conductor of the train, stops the train. The conductor gets out and says, what kind of catastrophe has happened that you've stopped the train? And the guy says, well, I just wondered if you wanted to buy a possum from us. and the conductor said, are you crazy? You stopped the train just to ask us if we wanted to buy a possum?

And the guy said, yeah. And then the conductor goes, well, it's crazy that you've done this. But since you have, I like possum, so how much you want for the possum? And then he said, Man said, you idiot. You mean to tell me that you have done stopped a hundred car banana train. seeing if we wanted to buy a possum, you must be an idiot. But I like possum, and inasm as much as we have stopped, what do you want for him?

Marcel said, we ain't caught him yet, I just want to see if you wanted one. Jerry's stories were a combination of fact and fiction, but some of the stories were entirely true. This story is titled Marcel's Talking Chainsaw. It's on the Greatest Hits album. So this is a story. This is one of Jerry Clower's bits that he told over and over. It was one of his more famous pieces. Yeah, tell me where he got that, the real story behind that one.

Marcel had been to the Pupwood Yard, and he'd come back by the beer joint. And he wanted to get him one of them big knee-high belly washers and a moon pie. And he went to the front door, and it knocked on the door. And the man went running the beer joint, said, boy, get away from that door. But you ain't got no business in him. And Marcel told him, said, well, I ain't going to cause no trouble. Said, I just want a big soda pipe and a moon pie. Now, why did he run him off?

Because this is the real story. This is the real story. Michelle wasn't old enough to go in there. Oh, okay. He told him to get away from that door. Marcel went back, truck, pulled out that McCullough chain saw, fired it up and come back and stuck it snout of it in that door, and it ripped that brace and bracket and the hinges off the door.

And that screen tangled up through that chain as it went around that bar. Folks give Marcel a beer joint. And that happened. That happened just like that. That happened. Just before you crossed the Amit County line, that beer joint was right there on the lift. So Jerry just told the story pretty much like it happened. That's right.

Except for the brand of the chainsaw. Right. Tell me how. He did not. I don't think he remembered what the brand of the chainsaw was. But McCullough was the first name that came to his mind. And he said McCullough, and when he did, it's like he told me, he said, man, folks started buying McCullough chainsaw, didn't even know how to crank them.

You know what's so funny about that I was born in 1979 The first chainsaw I remember my dad having would have been in the mid-80s And it was a McCullough chain saw Which I don't even think McCullough's business anymore I don't think they are You told me McCullough sent

Because of that skit And how big it was McCullough sent some chainsaws to the family And kind of helped them out Some four-wheeleres and go-karts I believe it was I'll be darned Send it to Jerry Clower

Just as, hey thanks for plugging McCulloch chain But Jerry could advertise. At one time he was spokesperson for Chrysler Corporation. I think at one time he was spokesperson for Lincoln. But man, the promotional items that companies would give him. Just hoping it would make it into one of his stories. He carried a lot of weight.

He was influential wherever he went. Mr. John remembered a funny story about Jerry. Jerry was always pulling pranks. He was a prankster, but he pulled up at church one Sunday morning. and he was the first one there, and I got there just within a minute or so after he did. And he got out of his car, and he made a quick dash for the church steps. I knew then, knowing Jerry like I did, I knew that he was up to something. And he had on his bright red coat and his designer jeans,

and he ran up to the church steps, and he put his foot up on next to the bottom step, and he pulled his breeches leg up above his cowboy boot, So I would be sure and see the new boots that he had on. But I walked right by him. I didn't shake hands with him. I didn't speak, didn't say good morning, Jerry. How you doing? I never acknowledged that he was there.

Walked right past him and he ran up behind me and grabbed me around the neck. And he said, John, you know you've seen them boots. You're just jealous because you ain't got a pair like them. I want to discuss with Brent Jerry's impact on the South. What do you think the impact of Jerry Clower was on the people of the South? You know, because he kind of rose up from the ashes in a sense of poverty. Yeah. And unlikely character.

I mean, became famous when he was in his 40s. Yeah. He was a fertilizer salesman. Correct. Yeah. And he became famous in his 40s, which is highly unusual. I mean, usually by that time, people are kind of, their trajectory is semi-set. And he, until he passes away when he was 71, he just has this incredible career, becomes a member of the grand old opera, writes multiple books, records, records, has number one hits on country radio, which wasn't even music.

Right. But they were playing his skits on the radio. And his style, his mannerisms, they were very familiar to people in the South. Sure. But very unfamiliar to, oh, is that familiar? funny? Could that be on the national stage of comedy? What do you think the impact of Jerry Clower was on the South? I can relate. You know, we talked about Wilson Rawls, you know, and I told you about I could relate to Billy in the story. But the tales that Jerry Clower

put himself in, some of it based on truth, some of it just made up because he had a great imagination. But I could identify with that. It was to the point to where I saw, I saw him on television. He would host a country music show that came on on Sunday afternoons. It was beyond my comprehension that somebody in my family didn't know him because the stories that he told were stories that I could identify with as far as how he grew up or bird hunting, you know, having a dog that, you know, tree and coons. He talked about that I had value with. And shucking corn and shelling peas and mules and going barefooted and being high. hot and being so hot that in the summertime that you wouldn't button up the sides on your

overalls and eating eating so much bold ochre that he couldn't keep his socks up yeah exactly these were all things that he talked about i had either done or seen done i mean it was just and you weren't seeing that anywhere else no so you're this kid being raised in southern arkansas which i will note even for the south there are different kind of cultures inside the south like i i'm from the south, being from Arkansas. But we lived in the highlands, which is quite different in, you know, where you grew up in southeastern Arkansas. Right.

Where Jerry Clower lived from you would have basically been same agriculture, same influence of the river bottoms and Delta and just a couple hours away, really. Yeah, he just lived on the other side of the Mississippi River. Yeah. So you would have had even probably a stronger connection to some of that than a lot of people. I would hear stories. you know, we would hear the funny stories and then my dad would tell one and it would have the same type characters or the same.

Yeah. He would talk about a wagon, you know, Jerry Clare might tell a story about riding a town in a wagon. And then my dad would tell a story about him riding in a wagon. So it was easy to transfer, you know, my kinship, I guess, to the stuff that he was talking about, regardless of the subject. And, you know, like I said, a lot of that stuff he was making up. But it all went back to the story. I'd heard all my life and the things I had witnessed with my own eyes.

You know what I think it did is I think it validated poor poverty-stricken people in the South because you think about the media of that time. The country music scene would have been focused in some ways on the South. I mean, not entirely, but there would have been famous people, you know, Dolly Parton and Loretta Lynn and all these people. But the mainstream influencers of the time certainly would not have been. from, you know, a guy like Jerry Clower. Right.

And so for him to rise up and to tell our stories, you know, quote unquote, our stories, talking about our people and him being so funny and so likable. You know, you wouldn't listen to Jerry Clower and just instinctively say this man is intelligent, but a highly intelligent man. Yeah. And that made us, that validated us. I read a article one time talking about Jerry Clower that when he was on the Grand Ole Opry, He was of all the folks on there wearing overalls and playing music and talking about being from the country,

he was the only guy on there that had a degree in agriculture out of every member of the Grand Ole Opry. So he had grown up living. He lived what he portrayed, you know. I mean, it was a, I think you can see it's easy to see truth in that. And it will connect with somebody, even though you may not know his background, but you can tell when someone is genuine. And it all kept it off when I got to meet him in person, but he was a genuine person. And what you saw on television and what I saw on television, what I listened to on the radio, it was him.

Speaking of Jerry's college education, he started off at a community college but ended up playing football at Mississippi State. Jerry was a pretty big old boy. Jerry said the first college football game he ever went to in his life he played in it. Is that right? So he played, what school did he play for down here? I think Jerry went to, I don't know if he went to Southwest Junior College, but he went to Mississippi State. But he went to high school.

Yeah, he went to Eastford. We had East Fork consolidated high school. And did they have a football team here? I don't think they did. So how did that work? Because that's what I thought. I thought he didn't play high school football, but he ended up in college football.

He was just that good of an athlete. He just went and tried out for the football team, having never played. And made it, played for Mississippi State. Yep. I'll be done. In Jerry's humor, you'll often hear sports analogies used. I want to dig deeper into Jerry's humor and why it was funny.

First of all, he would start off with an intriguing story that had to happen or been made up or partials of both those things connected. And he would give an inordinate amount of detail, usually in the beginning. Yeah. Like he would say... He'd paint the picture. Yeah, he would tell, he would give his address and say, I'm from East Fork, Mississippi, 165 miles from Baton Rouge. I mean, just give you all this.

And you're just intrigued because of the tone of his voice and the ways describing it. But you're just like, you have no idea why this is relevant, but you're like doing geography in your head, you know, like figuring out where he's at. And then he starts talking. And he, you know, I've heard it said that comedy, the more specific you can be inside of comedy, the funnier is the more you can relate to it and so he just gives these random details all over it and then his accent was just i listened to it today and it's it's almost an artifact uh you know he's he's been gone about 24 years jerry clower has yeah he died in 1998 and so you know his accent in the way that he structured his sentences very unique and and probably unique even to that part of mississippi when you listen

back to it, you hear sentence structures and completely improper usage of words. But that made perfect sense to them and was correct. Yeah. And so the accent was intriguing. The details were intriguing. The hooks were perfect. The names and the stories and the places where he over-exaggerated stuff that you knew he was over-exaggerating would be super funny.

But he often, too, pitted country people against... city people sometimes. And usually the guy from the country would not always end up looking to be the smartest, but he was usually right. Yeah. And it was usually the hook in that or the bringing it home or however you the phrase would be is that guy used common sense. The country guy used common sense above, you know, a college degree or something. Yeah. You know, it was like, I've always kind of parried it with like the Andy Griffith show, a show that I have seen all of them hundreds of times, and they never get old to me.

Those stories, when I hear Jerry Clowers, they never, even I know the punchline's coming. I know what's fixing to happen. I could do his whole act myself just about, you know. Yeah. But they're still funny. And I think it's probably a mixture of nostalgia, of listening to it and thinking back,

you know, when me and my dad was, down on the potlatch road, Timmer Company Road, waiting for the dogs to strike the last time I heard that, or one time that I heard this story. And so there's just a lot of meat in it. It's just a lot of good, wholesome storytelling.

So there's a book written by Jerry Clower called Stories from Home. And what it is, it's an interview, it's a transcribed interview that they did with Jerry Clower. And he talked about a intentional decision that he made when he got into comedy to keep it clean. And there were people in Hollywood

that advised him like, hey, you're going to have to be more risque if you want to be successful in this sphere. And he just, he said he didn't believe him. And he made that decision that he was going to try to keep it in bounds, you know. And he teetered on the edge sometimes of, you know, jokes that might not be appropriate for kids.

Every now and then he'd say something that would kind of be, you know, on the edge. Right. But it was always like, you know, stuff you would let your kids listen to. No, I respected him for having, just having a value system that he stuck to his whole life, you know. I can't speak enough about Jerry's character. I'm impressed by stuff like that.

And in the book, Stories from Home, Jerry said, quote, I stayed with MCA records and got to where I liked it. At first they said, Jerry, unless you put a little risque or vulgar, vulgar stuff on your records, you ain't never going to be known nationally. But I defied them. I have never used risque material. End of quote. I've read about his positions on race relations in the South and kind of his story with that.

He was really ahead of his time. He was. In a pretty profound way. He was. What do you think about that? Jerry was, as I said, he was a devout. Christian, he read every word of the Bible to be true, and he accepted the fact that God accepted everybody, regardless of race or anything else. And Jerry was ahead of his time back then,

because a lot of people were pretty objective to integration. Didn't want to mingle with black people, and for whatever reason did not associate with them that much, but Jerry did. And he respected everybody, and I think that's why everybody respected him, because he didn't cut any ice. with anybody. Race color didn't mean anything to him. He loved everybody. Jerry's ideas on race grew over time, which speaks to his ability to change. In his book, he said he grew up with some of the stereotypical mind frames at the time, but when he came back from the war, he said this, quote, After I became a Christian, my convictions got to pricking my conscience.

I would have to compromise my Christian convictions if I believe some of the things that I had been taught as a child. End of quote. Here's another story. It's in reference to the 1963 bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church, a black church, by the KKK. Jerry said, quote, I was in Birmingham selling fertilizer after they bombed that church. They bombed and killed three precious little black children.

The following Monday, I was driving through Birmingham, and I had the radio on, and this guy was a disc jockey, and he was black. and he was trying to rally all the black children. He said, just say I'm somebody. I stopped at a red light by a school bus, and a little black boy was looking out the window at me. I let the window down, and I said, I know you are somebody, son,

and if I could get this scoundrel that bombed you just because you're black, I would. End of quote. I think this shows Jerry's heart. He also had a famous quote where he said, it's still a mystery to me how godly people can tithe their income, give to the poor, read the Bible, pray, love folks, and let God run every fiber of their being, except how they treat black people. End of quote.

That was big stuff coming from a white comedian in the South in the 1970s. It was Jerry's connection to place that made his words carry weight. He grew up in segregation and his ideas on race relations changed after he was an adult. As we close down, I want to explore the power of place. Well, what I learned from where the red fern grows from Sean Tutan, literature expert, that connection to place is really intriguing to people even if they're not connected to that place. So seeing Billy Coleman's connection to the Ozarks in a genuine way was intriguing because you could look through his eyes and see that landscape and his life and the shapes of his life. And even if it's different from you and you'd never been there and never going to go there.

I think that's what they did with Jerry Clower too. Could have been. Is that they saw the rural poverty-stricken South in a lovable nice way. They probably already had that image of it. You know, you look back at cartoons. and hillbillies and they're, you know, wearing one strap overalls and they're barefooted and they got those crazy looking hats and smoking a corn cob pipe and all of that. So they, they saw that, they saw that part of it immediately. But then they, he puts those very vivid stories

about the characters in there and they're good people. They may be dressed that way, but there's, there's always a redeeming quality about most of them. Yeah. So, and you can identify that with whether you got to be there or get to be there or not. Here's John with a couple more stories about Jerry. I know one time I went over to Jerry's and I took my coon dog. He followed me over. I went over on a horse. We got in Jerry's yard and a rabbit, a big rabbit run out of one of Miss Homeroleen's flower beds.

And my dog took off after him and he had a real deep bow. Oh, you could hear him on my way. Oh, ho, ho, ho. He was just to bark and trailing that rabbit. They was going in flower beds and out. and Jerry, and I was hollering at the dog trying to stop him, because I knew Ms. Homeline didn't want that dog in the yard. And about that time, Jerry come to the door.

Jerry hollered, what are you doing? I said, I'm trying to catch this dead gum dog. I said, don't you hear him? He said, yeah, I do. He said, man, leave a dog alone. He said, anything got a voice like that ought to be singing in church choir. Jerry came over one time. I forgot what the occasion was, but at the time we had a circle.

driver. He pulled up in his car and he got out and he had on a pair of sandals and he had on a pair of cut off pants and a real loud color, high while you type shirt. That coon dog, my mind looked up and seen Jerry and he done like his shin. He twisted his hand looking at. He didn't know what the world that thing was and he went and got under my pickup truck and wouldn't come out. And I told Jerry that we was going to have to go down to Liberty and talk to my attorney because he had rent the best potential young dog that I had ever had. And if he wanted to settle this out of court, we could. If he couldn't, he was going to have to promise me some puppies off the next

gyp that he knew of it that was going to drop a litter of puppies. But, I mean, we was all time pulling stuff like that on. What Jerry say when he told him about the litigation. He laughed. He laughed. Jerry toured right up until his passing in 1998 and had plans for more records. He gathered his content from people in his community. And Mr. John, his neighbor, told him a story that Jerry was very intrigued by.

He even told him that he was going to put it on his next record. Unfortunately, Jerry never made that record and will never hear Jerry tell this story. But we can hear it from Mr. John. And if you listen, I think you can hear Jerry's voice telling it. One of those was a fellow that lived here in the community. He was a lot older than Jerry. he lived to be, I guess, on up in his late 90s. But as he began to get older, he reached upon in life where his family encouraged him to go ahead and buy him a car.

You know, he'd have his own transportation. He could get out and go. He didn't have to get nobody to take him where he wanted to go. He'd have his own wheels. So he bought him a 62 Chevrolet Biscay, Biscay, and he got him some driver's license. Or he could get out and go where he wanted to. But they knew he was going to have to have a tag, a car tag, and some ends. insurance and that they would have trouble getting him to differentiate between the liability and the collision, the comprehension, and all that, he just wouldn't understand it.

And it would create an argument because he felt like he didn't need all that junk if it was his car. They just told him, said, well, Uncle Tom said, if you've got insurance and you ever involved in an accident, the insurance will buy you another car. That was just a simple way to get him to understand and bypass the comprehension, the liability, the collision and everything else are in the guard automobile insurance. So he went to town every Saturday morning,

but a stop sign didn't mean nothing to him because he had always went in that direction. And he felt like people ought to respect him because that was the road he had always traveled. And he wasn't going to stop for nobody. So it happened. He ran a stop sign one Saturday morning and a fellow from Baton Rouge running to him, hit him.

Turned his car bottom side up, told Uncle Tom, wanted didn't kill him. So they called the law. He wouldn't he wouldn't go to the hospital in the ambulance. He just sat there by his car and the state trooper came out and investigated the accident. Well, he knew Uncle Tom and he just didn't know how he was going to get across to him that he was in the fault. So he went up to him and he said, uh, Uncle Tom said, uh, I've investigated the accident and said, it's pretty conclusive as to what happened. And he said, I'd like to have your version of what happened here. And Uncle Tom said, well, I said, I was headed over to McComb. We're going to get

me a haircut. Going to get some groceries and said, I come down this road all time. Everybody knows. And then this idiot from Baton Rouge comes flying through him, and he hits me, tires my car up. And so that's what happened. And the state trooper said, he didn't know how he was going to explain that to Uncle Tom, but he said, Uncle Tom said, I'm going to have to tell you now. I said, I've investigated an accident. He said, it's my duty to inform you. I'm going to have to give you a citation and uncle thompson said well son i appreciate it it's mighty nice of you know said uh i don't know nothing about a ford said i never did like a Chrysler product and said i ain't never rode in or drove a citation and if it's all right with everybody was involved i'd rather have another chivalage

oh me darn but jerry rolled when i told him he said that's going in my next oh man that's going in my next album and and that was it last night that he ever was at home. We talked a long time. In the four word of the book, Stories from Home, Willie Morris says, quote,

all our distinguished American humorists have been serious people, their hearts as rueful as they are married. I'm funny because I'm sad. It was attributed to Mark Twain, and I'm sad because I'm funny. Jerry Clower is an artist of deep values, values which yet exist in our society,

civilization, hard work, loyalty, honesty, community, family, friendship, generosity, love, and with all a vibrant aversion to the hypocritical, the bogus, and the unpitying, not to mention an instinctual distaste for cynical barbers, dilatory hitchhikers, and all souls of greed. He understands the world because he assiduously lived it. End of quote. Jerry Clower was a complex and brilliant man, deeply connected to place, sure in his identity, loyal to his people, but also intolerant of its errors. He gave voice to the South and dignity to a group of people coming out of a rough time, a people often misunderstood by the nation. He was deeply connected to the land as a hunter and fisherman and attributed his time in the Coon Woods to building the fabric of his character, a throwback to the ideology that Daniel Boone's legacy ushered into the American psyche.

Like I said from the beginning of our series on where the Red Fern grows, I'm fascinated when hunting touches pop culture in positive ways. Just like Wilson Rawls, Jerry wrapped up our way of life and put it at a human story, and people loved it. As we look to the future of hunting and rural life, I think we have a pattern here. We've got to have a deep love of the land, its wildness, and its critters. But we've also got to love the people that live from its bounty. Wildness only makes sense to people that don't know it firsthand when it's wrapped in the life of a human.

So we, like Jerry, have to become better storytellers, storytellers of the human experience because stories carry our culture. Thanks so much for listening to Bear Grease. You can listen to all Jerry's albums on all the major streaming platforms, and you're sure to get a laugh out of it. Please share our podcast with your in-laws and your crazy hillbilly neighbors this week. We'll talk to you next time on the Bear Grease Render. On Blood Trails, the stories don't end when the hunt is over. They just get darker.

I've seen something in the road. I instantly thought it was a slid. that there was a full of blood. Oh my God, he doesn't have a head. Blood Trails is a true crime podcast born in the outdoors, where the terrain is unforgiving, the evidence is scarce, and the truth gets buried under brush and silence. Indications were he should be right there, but he wasn't.

This season, we're going deeper, from cold case files to whispered suspicions, from remote mountains to frozen backwoods. Each story begins in the wilderness and ends in darkness. Because out here, there are no witnesses, no cameras, just fragments and the people left behind trying to piece them back together. He's not an honest person. He's incapable of being honest. Somebody somewhere knows something. I'm Jordan Sillers.

Season 2 of Blood Trails premieres April 16th. Follow now on Apple, IHeart, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an I-Heart podcast Guaranteed Human