Beef And Dairy Network - Episode 134 - Rosemary Burns

Episode Date: May 25, 2026

Susan Harrison, Tom Crowley and Linnea Sage join in this month as we meet the daughter of Rosemary Burns, a woman who won tons of cow manure on Beef Call. Stock media provided by Setuniman/Pond5.com and Soundrangers/Pond5.com Music credit courtesy of epidemicsound.com: It's All About Us / Jaslyn Edgar   Help support this show and unlock bonus content! Become a member at https://maximumfun.org/joinbeef

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The Beef and Dairy Network podcast is the podcast companion to the Beef and Dairy Network website, as well as the printed magazine, brought to you by the crossed horns sale over at Mitchells. and you heard correctly all nozzles are 50% off. All nozzles of any kind. Now, this month I was contacted by Carol Burns, who, it turns out, is the daughter of Rosemary Burns, somebody who won big during an episode of Beef Call, our weekly live quiz web stream. The magic of the prize that she won was that she didn't even have to enter the competition to win it. Here's a little reminder for you. Hello, this is Popalworth's Bed and Breakfast.

Hello, is that Rosemary Burns? Yes, hi, can I help you? On the contrary, I can help you by telling you that you've won this week's beef call Big Prize. Sorry, I... Do you want a room? No, no, I don't want a room, although I'm aware that you won a bed and breakfast.

Yes, yes. How can I help? You've just won our big prize this week. Oh, but I don't think I signed up for any kind of competition. So you've won, do you want to know what you've won? Yeah, well, did you, okay. You've won 100 tonnes of manure. Oh no, no, no, no, no. A full 100 metric tons of top quality bum gravy.

Oh, sorry, I don't want that. If you look out of the window or open your door, hopefully if the timings have worked out, you should be able to see a big lorry turning up with all that special fudge. Oh, no, no, but we've got, we've got, custom is already here. They're going to see that.

There's a big heap of God's marmalade out there for you. Oh, God. There's so much of it. A real brown porridge breakfast there for you guys. And so joining me to, I assume, thank me for my part in making that happen and to thank the beef and dairy network for the part it has played in her mother's life more widely. It's Carol Burns.

Hi, yeah, sorry, can I just correct you there? I'm not actually ringing to say thank you. I'm ringing, well, this is the only way that you agreed, as you know, it's the only way you agreed to talk to me was to have me on as a guest, but which, to start with, I don't feel comfortable with, but anyway, the reason I'm coming on is to find out about the role you played in my mother's. life. Right. I guess once you... I'm definitely not thanking you. Well, maybe once you found out the ins and outs, you will be thanking us.

Okay. I mean, that's very confident, but okay. So your mother, Rosemary Burns, she, of course, won our competition to have a hundred tons of manure delivered to her home. That's a generous prize, especially when you consider that she didn't even have to enter the competition to win it. So maybe you want to rethink the idea of not thanking us, because that's a very generous prize, don't you? think? Well, no, I definitely don't want to rethink the idea of not thanking you. I want to make sure that I continue to sort of not thank you. And I don't see how that can be a... Are you saying that was a competition prize? Yeah. So without even entering it, she was selected to win

the grand prize of a hundred tonnes of premium bovine batter delivered directly to her home. I just don't see why my mum would have any interest in that. Like if she was a farmer, fair enough, but she ran a B&B, and we didn't even have extensive land around it. So why would she want that? Do you see what I mean? Listen, let's talk about when she won and took delivery of that wonderful shipment of pasture pudding. Did she contact you on that day? Yeah, she gave me a ring.

And I bet she was delighted. No, she wasn't delighted. She was absolutely raging. Did she mention the consistency with the manure and the obvious quality of it? Oh, my God. No. No, obviously not. She's not saying, like, I've just had, you know, this huge shipment of devil's play-doh, and it's top-quality stuff.

No, she wasn't saying that. I'm sure it won't surprise you. She was just absolutely apoplectic. Why is there all this shit on the drive? Why is there all this shit on the drive when I've got to change, like, five of the guest bedrooms, including, like, sorry, most importantly, Benedict Cumberbatch was coming that day, right? What, to stay at the B&B? Yes, to stay at the B&B.

He wanted an authentic English experience. Right. Because he was researching his next... I mean, he is English, but... Interesting. So do you think... I mean, this is a bit of a sidebar. Do you think Ben did come of a batch at that time

felt like he was losing a grip on his Englishness? Yeah, I do think that, actually. Because he was working so much in America, that's interesting. Yeah, I think that probably happens to a lot of actors. Anyway, that's not the point. The point is... And so do you think he was probably quite delighted then when he turned up at the B&B,

and there was, you know, a hundred tonnes of the King's Compost outside? Yeah, no, he wasn't delighted with it. from what I understand, you know, when Benedict Cumberbatch arrived at the B&B, mum was caked in shit. Do you think that would make you delighted? Do you not think, though, in a way that, you know, the most authentic English experience of all is to be welcomed into a home by someone who's totally caked in that unholy curd? Authentic as in what, like in the, you're talking about like in the Victorian days or something?

Well, maybe, you know, you haven't said what role. You haven't said what role he was preparing for. Was he preparing for a period drama? In which case, you know, a smiling innkeeper covered in shite is exactly what you want, isn't it? Hello, my name is Kevin Kranmer and I'm a manure delivery driver. As long as I can remember, I wanted to be a ballet dancer. Ever since I was a child, I mean, I remember it began because I looked out of my bedroom window one day and I saw a leaf, one of those leaves with the kind of seed attached

that certain types of trees drop to reproduce. And it kind of... Oh, one of the ones that's like a little kind of... The little helicopter leaves, exactly. And it pirouetted through the air, and I thought, imagine if a person could do such a thing. And my father said, you know, they can. There's a thing called ballet.

And I said, oh, can we watch one, Dad? And he said, no, it's boring. The men in my family, we all end up working in quite... what they call disgusting lines of work for the simple reason that in my family all the men have no sense of smell so my dad was the same his father his father before him my grandfather was a fishmonger but not any fishmonger

he would deal mostly in well certain types of the smelliest kinds of fish you can get and his speciality was the squid anus which you may have seen it sold in breadcrumbs in various restaurants and particularly gastropubs. And the squid anus ring was, it's a real delicacy, but when you first remove it, it's the stinkiest piece of fish, the stinkiest cut of sea life you can get, and not the weed

know, but other fishmongers refused to deal with it, but he was absolutely capable, of course. And that's why you became a manure delivery driver, delivering premium bovine gut butter around the UK. I believe you're, I believe since you were 16, you've been working. working for the Shite Family Ship Farm? Yeah, Shite Family Ship Farm is working directly with Beverly Shite. Beverly Shites are one form? So are you telling me that even if I was to approach you

with a lovely room temperature jar of dolmio pasta sauce? Yeah. And open it just underneath your nose. That wouldn't do anything for you. I'd maybe feel a bit of the sort of the vapor of, slight splash of tomato sauce on my top lip, but that's as close as I'd get to the delight. light of smelling it. Because I guess you're aware of the light of smelling it only from seeing the

reactions of others to the opening of a dolmeo. When you see the puppets sort of breathe deeply and go, this is our dolmio day. In the advert, yeah. Then I feel like it must be something really special. It communicates that feeling. What would you give for just one instance of being able to smell a freshly opened dolmio job? All my arms and legs. Did you tell you what she ended up doing with all that lawn lasagna. Yeah, she said that after she tried to

move a small amount and realised that it was like way too much for that she just ended up setting fire to it. But, you know, the effect of that was that it made the surrounding area so hot. Like the B&B has never been that warm. It was so hot that Benedict Comabash was just like

wandering around with his top off. But that led to the paparazzi surrounding the B&B for the next. three weeks, which was, it might sound fun to you, but it was really stressful. But do you not think that that's bringing quite a lot of much-needed attention to what I think was an ailing B&B? I got the vibe off of when I spoke to her that the B&B wasn't necessarily that successful. And that suddenly you've got the world's press there, you've got Benedict Camberbatch with

his top off, lit. Is glistening torso lit by the flaming dumps? Well, okay, I'm not going to lie. There was an uptake in terms of people booking into the B&B. There you go. There you go. No, because often those people that booked in, when they turned up, they were really disappointed that Benedict Cumberbatch wasn't walking around, topless.

So, you know, they weren't happy customers. And then we had, like, David next door would take his top off and walking around in the drive, in the hope that that would help mum. But it really didn't help. You know, Benedict Cumberbatch is a good-looking actor in his 40s, isn't he? and David's an oxygenarian ex-geography teacher, so yeah. So it's not what people were after? It's not. It's really not.

It's nice of David to do that, though. Yeah, to be honest, well, he was, you know, a lovely guy. And, yeah, he was quite fond of mum. I think mum had quite a few, you know, suitors, as it were, and he was one of them after dad left. So your mother was single at this point? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Yeah, it was interesting actually, because she, yeah, I think she kind of had a bit of a new lease of life after my dad left, because she actually ended up, I don't know if I should tell you this, but, well, the guy that dropped off the manure, as you know, it didn't just happen the once, did it? Well, this is something actually that our listeners won't know because we sometimes like to do things, you know, we like to do our good deeds and not necessarily crow about them because if you're doing good things in the hope of people thinking you're a good person, then are you being a good person? It's one of those philosophical arguments, isn't it? So we like to do good deeds and not tell everyone. But I guess because you brought it up, we can reveal that after that first shipment of 100 tonnes of Barnyard Brownies, she continued. you to receive shipments on a on a on a biweekly basis yeah um by the way i don't think you should worry about people thinking that you're crowing about being a good person because you're not so you know this wasn't a good deed this was extremely discombobulating if you can imagine i mean can you imagine this for now can you imagine like a massive shipment of manure turning up at your place but you don't know when you know you don't know when it's going to happen Yeah, I love a surprise.

Rosemary was on the docket like anybody else. She was down for 100 tonnes of premium jersey cow manure. So just like any other job, I dropped it off down there. I pulled up on the street corner, as I normally do. But just as I was pulling up to the curb, I saw a man he was hanging about next to the house just inside the front gate. and he at first I didn't recognize him because he had his hand over his mouth and nose, as people tend to do, you know, when I'm 100 metres away or so,

because they, the kind of, it's described as like a brick wall of smell hits them. Again, I'm just going on other people's reports. So, but then as he sort of removed his hand to say like, what in God's name is wrong with you, I realized it was the actor, Benedict Cumberbatch. I only met Rosemary a few minutes later after Cumberbatch. batch had retreated inside, sort of retching and pinching his nose. When I pulled the lever to release the manure flatbed, you know, the truck, it has a piston and it lifts, and so you can just deliver the entire cache of manure all at once. And so I'd begun unleashing it, and I heard it

begin to pelt the pavement when Rosemary stepped out of the house. And that's when I first saw her begging me to stop. So I'm just pretending I can't hear her. She's on the pavement. She's vomiting just behind her out of a first floor window. Benedict Cumberbatch is vomiting out the B&B as well. It's a real kind of orgy of vomit and shite going on. And it's quite overwhelming, actually. Or at least it would have been if I could smell it.

But fortunately, I can't. So that was one sense less to worry about at that moment. Visually, though, it was absolutely repulsive. Anyway, the point is, the guy who dropped off the manure, mum and him, it seems like, you know, they did kind of, yeah, they did sort of click, you could say. She said that in some ways, please don't misquote her or me on this, but in some ways there had been a silver lining to all the shit on the driveway. And that silver lining was Kevin.

So she was very, very angry for a long time. But then there was one day I turned up and it almost seemed as though a Zen calm had settled over her a little bit. So I unload the manure and unusually there's no screaming, no begging. She just said, do you want a cup of tea? And as it happened, I did want a cup of tea because while obviously I can't taste it, the heat of the tea sort of, it sort of burns my mouth in the closest approximation I can have to a pleasant. flavour. So she brings me the tea and I said, scalding hot, please. In fact, I said if I can have it straight out the kettle, that would be great. But she said the extension lead wouldn't reach outside. So I had to have the next best thing, as fresh from the kettle as I could have it.

And she said, once I had a lovely scalding sip or two, she said, well, why don't you stick around for a bit and help me with the manure for once, since you're dropping it all off here? And she was the last delivery of the day. So I thought, well, all right, why not? So I hop off the truck and I say, well, where have you been putting it all? Because it had been cleared every time I went around and she said, oh, I just burn it. And I said, is that why all the houses around you appear to have been abandoned? And she said, they did say something about the reeking stink of burning shit every couple of weeks. Yeah, so all I know is that, you know, he would turn up after the manure had been delivered.

she would set fire to the massive pile of manure and then obviously Kevin would have to take his top off. So anyway, I helped her to kind of get the rest of the manure kind of off the street and off to the side and then set it on fire. And she had a full-on gas mask on at this point

because I think she'd had to go out and buy one because the smell of the burning shit had really started to take its toll. And so she had her, she was replacing the filter in her gas mask when I realized I was really sweating and getting very, very hot after all this enormous bonfire of manure. So I took my shirt off and one good thing about working in a menial job like delivering manure or similar delivery jobs and that kind of thing is your physique does really see the benefit. And at the time, you know, I had an absolutely glistening eight-pack

on my torso. And so she, I... I could tell that she was through the lenses of the gas mask. She was gazing at the midriff. And I thought, oh, hello, something's up here. Okay. So what happened next? Well, you know, I don't want to go into too many sordid details. But what I will say is the top stayed off.

The gas mask stayed on. And lo, there was half an hour of red hot boffing. You know, for mum, I mean, I hate to say this. but for mum, I think that was a good thing. Okay. Not the manure, but the consequence of the manure, which was Kevin taking his top off. So that became the routine from then on. I mean, every two weeks I'd come back with another 100 tonnes of manure,

lift up the flatbed, drop all the manure off. I'd stick around. She'd bring me a scalding hot cup of tea. We'd set fire to the manure. I'd take my top off. She'd put the gas mask on and we'd get to it, by which I'm. mean doggy style sex? No, this is

a couple worth bread and breakfast. Hello, is that Rosemary Burns? Yes, hi, can I help you? You've won 100 tonnes of manure. Oh no. No, no. No, no.

A full 100 metric tons of top quality bum gravy. Oh, um, sorry. I don't want that. Bum, bum, bum. Oh, I don't know. Oh, no.

I do I do I do I do I do a lot of I do a start I do start I do start Ida I do start oh Ida POMBum Polly policy POMP policy

POMPBOLOC POMBBGravey Oh DIV I do have a POTC Policy policy Bum Bamb Bamb Gravy

Oh sir I do Cubs Bum Bum Gravy Oh sir Well, how do you feel? Tell us how you feel, Rosemary, having won the big prize. Just tired. Enjoy the manure. Enjoy all that special fudge. So Carol, your father isn't in the picture romantically as far as your mother's concerned at this stage.

Yeah, I mean, their marriage broke down a long time before that. Was he not providing her with any manure? Absolutely zero. manure, if that's not a euphemism. No, that's not a euphemism. I think that in any successful romantic partnership, the couple should be exchanging manure. Certainly on special occasions.

No, I mean, my dad was a, you know, is a lovely guy. And, okay, fair enough, the passion in their marriage had gone a bit. And even I noticed the way that he would look at my aunt. But nevertheless, that can't be explained away with just massive amounts of manure that was lacking. in her life. No, I don't mean to be rude. And of course, people have their own preferences when it comes to these things. I just want to make clear to the listening audience. You at the time were, I believe, 32 years old. Yes, 32. And she was in her mid-70s? Mid-s to late 70s, yeah. Which was a

surprise to me, because when I first saw her, I would have guessed she was about 82. But to be fair, she had to spend a lot of time burning very toxic manure so, you know, those fumes can have an effect. Sure. I mean, I think some listeners might be thinking, what, you know, this seems unusual. Well, if any of your listeners are, you know, men, women, people of the world, then they'll know that sometimes these things just, you know, the chemistry just works. Sure. And these things happen. Sometimes even without you knowing why, either party really knowing why. Sure. Or at least that was the way the first couple of times. And then quite soon after I realized she had quite a bit of money put away.

So that's kind of why it carried on. Okay. So talk me through your thought process then when you realized that she had a bit of money behind her. I thought that she had quite a lot of money, and if we kept having sex, I could convince her to give me that money. Right. And what did you want the money for? Ballet. Ah, I see. So I thought I can probably get the money to do this from her if I sell her on my dream of being a ballet dancer, going to the conservatoire and being trained. And at first she wasn't certain. And so I said, all right, well, let me do a demonstration for you.

and I did a very, very basic ballet routine just to demonstrate my natural abilities, which I have to be honest, are not great, but I had my shirt off, so she was somewhat convinced, still wasn't certain, so I took my pants and trousers off as well, and my legs, as much as my torso,

have become absolutely rippling, shimmering and gleaming, muscular, adonis-like muscular, physical ideals, basically. through my lifetime of menial work. And on top of which I've got a very big penis. And of course, lit by the light of a burning pyre of bum onions. That creates a kind of effect.

That's right. And if you're lit by the fire, specifically the very warm flame, the warm coloured flame that comes off of a towering pile of shite, that will even enhance the image of the human body better than any lighting set up in a movie studio. And so she agreed to pay your fees. Yeah, I mean, after another half an hour of hard rutting, she was convinced. I'm a bit confused, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, tired.

I'm a bit confused, Carol, because everything you've told me so far sounds pretty positive for Rosemary. Okay, it was for a while, but let me just tell you what happens. she would phone me every time there was a shipment, right? And, you know, at first she was really pissed off, but then it got to the point where when Kevin came into her life, she would ring me in, she'd be really happy, and I'd appreciate hearing that. And then one day she rang me in absolute tears.

Right. Of joy? No. Tears of absolute sorrow, because it wasn't Kevin doing the delivery that day. It was Melissa, a Spanish woman, who had taken over the delivery process. But she must have known, mustn't she, that when she gave him the money

to go to the Royal Ballet School, that he would have to stop, you know, making the regular visits from Browntown. I think she just hadn't really thought through in terms of the consequence of that. You know, she was so... She was so keen to help him. Kevin, how would you describe

how you treated Rosemary in this regard? Would you say, You ghosted her? Yeah, that's essentially true. Well, ghosting is a strong word, though, because I didn't actually ghost her. That suggests that I never returned her calls or whatever. It's just that every time she phoned me after I'd confirmed the money was in my account,

I just pretended to be a dressmaker from Edinburgh. And whenever she called, I'd just go, oh, the alterations will be ready in a couple of days. And after a few rounds of that, she got very confused and just gave up trying to contact me. More after this. What most people don't know about this podcast is that all the editing is done by somebody I hired called Dr. Boff. When I was looking for an editor, there was a number of different candidates, but Dr. Boff stood out because they were eager to learn more about what the job entailed. They knew they wanted to work for me. They seemed like a good fit, and their excitement around the role really made them stand out.

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Try it for free at ZipRecruiter. Ziprecruiter.com slash beef. That's ZipRecruiter. Meet your match on ZipRecruiter. Message for Dr. Boff, just put that in the middle of the episode. Thank you. Carol, when you think about their relationship, do you not think that there was something inevitable

about the fact that once he'd gone to this Royal Ballet School surrounded by young lithe bodies, he'd be a bit less interested in a clapped-out old B&B owner? All right. Look, I don't appreciate, I just don't appreciate your tone after what you've done, after the tumultuous effect of delivering huge amounts of shit to my mum's drive at random points and, you know, creating complete chaos. Yes, there were highs, but there were massive lows as well.

Yeah, and also, like, after that point, it just got, the delivery's got more and more frequent. Sometimes there was, like, more than one delivery a day. You know, it's way more than mum would ever be. had a burn. And one time I went around there and she was just lying down headfirst in the pile. Oh, just what, full body just down on a huge pile of bovine landmines. Yeah. She was probably enjoying the, you know, it gives off that kind of warmth. No, she wasn't enjoying it. She'd reached her absolute wits end. She didn't know, you know,

she didn't know where to turn. She, citizens advice bureau were not very helpful. They'd never encountered this before. She couldn't get through to anyone apparently connected to your podcast or company or whatever the fuck it is. So yeah, you basically ruined her life. So I am unthanking you really strongly and publicly. What was ballet school like? Obviously, you'd had this dream since you were just a little boy and then suddenly it was coming true. Must have been amazing. It was the greatest experience of my life. It was absolutely everything I dreamed it would be until the end of my first term. And at the end of each term, there's a performance that is publicly viewable and it's assessed to show just how much you've learned across that term. And that's where

everything started to go wrong, really. So I was doing my routine, which was, you know, on point and then a few spins, get lifted by the dance partner. And I was just gearing up to the final move of that routine. When I realised everyone in the audience's faces had changed, the expression they had is what I'd come to think of as manure face, where you're driving a truck up to the farm and when the smell hits them, their face screws up and they recoil

and they start to look very uncomfortable. And it was that look that they had on their faces. So the first thing I did, of course, was turn around and see if perhaps a manure delivery truck had arrived in error to the wrong venue here at the theatre. but that wasn't the case and I then leapt into the final move of the routine

that I had rehearsed which is a grand jeté that's where you'll know this it's where you do the full splits in the sky are you sort of jump up from both legs go in opposite direction legs fully splayed wide open like your whole body is just about to tear in half and it was as my legs parted

and my groin was exposed to the room that I mean there was a lot of screaming there was some vomiting people started running out of the building. I think it's at that point the fire service were called. And as I landed, a flawlessly executed landing, by the way, it was at that point that I realized, oh God, I haven't washed my leotard once all term. Of course, because you weren't able to smell. I couldn't smell anything wrong at all. And that kind of nylon, it dries very fast. So what I've been doing is, is soaking and

drying these tights in my fetid sweat solidly for a period of about three months. And on that final Grand Jetta, you'd basically let out a kind of neutron bomb of stink. It was a waft as if the gates of hell had been opened, I was later told. Right. I mean, it was appalling. People in the audience looked like they'd been shot in the face with a gun. It was, I felt completely and utterly ashamed. And I thought that was as bad as it could get until the principal of the school led me off the stage and out the back fire escape doors of the theatre and told me, in no uncertain

terms that I was never to come back to the school and that I would never be welcome in the profession of the ballerino ever again and he told me that through some quite heavy vomiting and then after all that after all that you put her through she died oh yeah not because of the the regular deliveries of a fertiliser flap tracks no no not because of that she no she died bunch of jumping. What I'd say is that if you have a dream, the lesson I learned was never ever try to achieve it because if you have that dream and then have it snatched away from you,

you just want to pull both your eyes out and die. It's the worst thing that can ever happen to a person. To know that the dream was possible and that you've lost it is the worst thing that can happen to a person next to being drawn-and-quartered. But it's fair to say that you didn't pull your own eyes out and die, you actually took out your anger, which I think, I can imagine, was quite profound on someone else. Yeah, the, so there's this thing called sublimation, where you take one emotion and you, you sublimate those feelings into something else, whether it's a calling, a pastime, or you,

you simply transpose the emotion to a different situation in your life. So I very quickly realized the person to blame for this humiliation, for this disappointment, was actually, actually Rosemary, the woman who'd made this dream possible in the first place. Now, obviously, that's kind of quite a sick way of thinking you essentially defrauded an old lady of all of her life savings to go and do this. It's not her fault that you couldn't smell and ruined your career by wearing a crusty old leotard. But you were somehow able to square that circle in your head at the time. Yeah, I mean, it's an interesting perspective you've got there. I don't see the logic of what you've said myself.

Right. But, you know, in this world, people have to find their own way of making sense of things, don't they? And, you know, I wouldn't judge you for having that perspective, just as I'm sure you wouldn't judge me for what I did. But so what I did end up doing was, well, I thought this pain, this agony of failure will never end. till I have exacted revenge on Rosemary, which is when I thought, aha, playing the dressmaker from Edinburgh, that went quite well.

Accents are obviously a skill I can call on in times of need like this, which is when I decided to get a job as a chirpy New Zealand bungee jumping instructor. Right. Called Clough? Clough, the bungee jumping instructor? So the next step was just to set up

a bungee jumping instruction company, which is quite simple really, because they're not regulated. There's no official body you go through. If you've got a length of elastic and a bridge somewhere, you're home free, basically. So I sit up cliffs bungee jumping school.

Right. And I put entry fee, five pounds, five pounds, and wrote that on some flies. Put one of them through Rosemary's door. It stopped there, really, because I didn't need anyone else to come. And, I mean, I think since being,

left by me, she was needing some sort of distraction. So she turned up the next day. So I'd set up shop at Cheddar Gorge on the logic that it's one of the sharpest plummets in the United Kingdom, and it would be the most convenient way to set up a bungee jumping enterprise. So, yeah, I mean, the rest is history, really. She turned up, I said, ah, Rosemary, nice to see it, and I've showed her the harness, how to attach it. I thought I'd better sell this, otherwise she might get scared and not want to do it. But to her credit, she was very brave. She was actually really, really keen to try it out.

And she said she always had wanted to, and she'd been too frightened. And I said, no, don't know, it's going to be fine. And so she put the harness on. And I told her about how that length of very, very strong elastic was attached to an anchor point at the top of the cliff face above Cheddar Gorge. And all I did then was just say some encouraging platitudes, like, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take and eventually convinced her to jump off,

but obviously it wasn't an extra strong length of elastic. It was just a particularly large, licorice whip, and it wasn't attached to anything. So then I just watched her plummet, and, you know, I thought, this is your moment. You know, she's going to be smithereened in moments. You've got to have your say.

So I pulled off my fake mutton chops that I've been wearing and the crash helmet and also the goggles. and I shouted down, ha ha, Rosemary, this is what you get for humiliating me. By the way, it's me who you sent to ballet school, which didn't work out, by the way. And she had sort of rotated in the air and looked back up at me and had heard what I said and said, why are you doing this? This doesn't make any sense. You were the one that took my money. It's not my fault if things didn't work out for you.

And I said, you would say that now, now that I've had my face rubbed in the dirt in the worst experience of my life. And she said, listen, we should have a conversation about, and by that point she'd just been absolutely obliterated on the rocks below. Well, Carol, I'm very sorry to hear about the circumstances of Rosemary's passing. Are you sorry about the rest? Is that an apology? Like, can we extend that appellate?

Well, for a start, I'm not apologising for your mother's death. Well, true. Although I suppose indirectly, you know, her reason for doing that extreme sport was to get over Kevin and she wouldn't have met Kevin had you not been delivering huge amounts of manure. Thank you. You're right. She wouldn't have met Kevin. So thank you for that. What do you mean? Thank you. Okay, well, before you go, Carol. Just what? You know, we're... Okay, we're very sorry for any distress caused.

Okay, and to make it up to you, I've been making some inquiries, and I've managed to secure a delivery today for you. No, no. It's 100 tons of premium cow down. No, I'm saying no. Any moment now. No, no.

This is an absolute no. If you look at the window, you should see the lorry will be reversed. up the drive right now. Oh my god. No, make it stop. And I am aware that at your home, you don't have very much outdoor space. No, no, no, no, no. So don't you worry, we've whipped it into a slurry. We've, we'll be funneling it through your postbox. A special delivery of that special hot liquid fudge sauce. No, no, no, no, please. Please stop. Stop there. No. Kevin? Is that you? Oh my God. You do look sexy without your top

Well thank you Matthew for being so candid Oh fine pleasure I guess I'm interested in like do you have any reflections on this Now this the dust has settled You know Rosemary is You know Dead and buried

And how Do you sort of look back on all this and I think You could have done something differently No I mean what about admitting publicly on a podcast to murdering someone. Is that something...

Ah, but you see, I haven't murdered anyone. Yeah, I mean, I'm not a legal expert. I can imagine certainly the police might take a different view than you've arrived at there. I'm right, if they do, then they might pop around and want to ask a few questions,

but of course I won't be there when they come calling. It'll just be hemish and he'll have lots to tell them about the latest women's fashions coming out of Milan. Oh, I see, so you'll pretend to be a Scottish dressmaker. Yeah, I pretend to be the dressmaker from Edinburgh.

Yeah. I mean, you've thought of everything. Hmm. Well, Matthew, thank you for talking with me today. Oh, fine, yeah. Thank you. I've enjoyed it, actually. Good.

And are you back delivering shites? Yeah, no, straight back to the old shite wagon. Beverly was very nice about it all. I explained everything that had happened with taking the money from the old woman and not washing my leotard and everything. thing and she was very, very sympathetic about it, actually. She said a similar thing that happened to her actually and she'd, you know, winked and I went, oh, right, and, you know, I assume there was some other older person that she'd, you know, encouraged into the grave at some point. But anyway, I don't

know for sure, but she was very nice about the entire situation and I'm back on the wagon. So, you know, I'm seeing plenty of that manure face again, only this time it's at appropriate moments. A big thanks to Kevin Kranmer and Carol Burns for speaking with me. I would like to dedicate this episode to the memory of Rosemary Burns. But I'm also a bit conflicted because she never actually paid the delivery surcharge on any of the manure that she received. So her estate is actually in debt to us and we will be using everything within our power to claw those funds back. So that's what we've got time for this month. But if you're after more beef and dairy news, get over to the website now where you'll find all the usual stuff as well as our

off-topic section, where this month we run down the top 10 restaurants in Glasgow that will let you take in an eagle, it turns out. So, until next time, beef out. Thanks to Susan Harrison and Tom Crowley.

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