Beef And Dairy Network - Episode 78 - Beef Security

Episode Date: December 20, 2021

Mike Bubbins, Tom Bell, Amy Mason and Alasdair Satchel join in for this episode in which we respond to the alarming rise in beef burglaries in the past year. Stock media provided by Setuniman/Pond5.com and Soundrangers/Pond5.com  

Do you like wine? Then you'll love Scottish wine. My family has been struggling to make wine on our freezing rocky hillside vineyard on the Isle of Mull for generations. But this year, with the help of Mitchells and their new Industrial Christ Acid into Wine Conversion Solution, we've almost ditched the grapes entirely, and now make a sparkling, tangy, black wine using old car batteries. Perfect for a special occasion, or for cleaning persistent guano stains off the head of a statue. Buy your Scottish wine now at scottishgrapes.grape.com Get your Scottish wine forward slash wine forward slash scottishgrapes forward slash grape.

Agus me ra hitha Mitchells. Hedger ash gintrach. hello and welcome to the beef and dairy network podcast the number one podcast for those involved or just interested in the production of beef animals and dairy herds the beef and dairy network podcast is the podcast companion to the beef and dairy networkds. The Beef and Dairy Network podcast is the podcast companion to the Beef and Dairy Network website and a printed magazine brought to you by Scottish Wine. Now, security is a basic human need, like water, shelter or beef. But new figures published this month by the British Beef Security Watch, or Babasowa, show that burglaries of beef have risen by a shocking 60% this year alone.

We don't know why, but it is thought that thieves perceive that beefs are easy to retrieve. It's hard to conceive, but in some cases these beef thieves hope to deceive to achieve when they heave sheaves of beefs into their sleeves and then take their leave. The owners, of course, then relieved of their beeves. At least, this is what this podcast believes. Frequent targets include beef farms, slaughterhouses and butchers. And someone who knows all about this is Keith Poggles. Hello, this is Keith Poggles. I'm a security consultant these days.

I run Poggles Security Solutions. Previously, we might have known this as the Iron Vanguard. We did a security consultant these days. I run Poggles Security Solutions. Previously, we might have known this as the Iron Vanguard. We did have to change that name. That turns out to be the name of a fascist youth movement in Armenia. And they've got the dot com. They got in quick. Well, thanks so much for talking with me today, Mr. Poggles. We've seen the headlines this week. Beef break-ins are up 60% this year alone. There seems to be some kind of trend. Farms, slaughterhouses, butchers being broken into, beef being stolen.

I would imagine that business is booming for Poggle's security solutions. Yeah. Just talk us through the service that you provide. Well, as you say, there's never been a more important time to protect your beef. It's chaos out there. And what you need is somebody who knows what they're doing. We make sure no one is going to take your beef. So the idea being, essentially, we go in and we try and steal your beef. And more often than not, we'll succeed. And people will say, how did you manage that? I thought we had everything sorted. And we'll come back so here's what you know here's what you need to do so when

you go to these properties what kind of security measures do people tend to have doors they often use doors and they'll lock those doors interesting yeah and i'll have to often explain to them well look we can we can get that door open. That surprises a lot of people. These doors you're talking about, I imagine, are the kind where a key is needed to, and correct me if I'm getting the terminology wrong, unlock the door. Yeah, it's a key system. So you'd have, yeah, how do I describe it? So the key will be specific to that particular door.

Um, yeah. Tricky for you then. Yeah. So we wouldn't have access to the, to the particular key, but there are ways to, um, open a lock without the key. Really? And I think people need, I think people's eyes are finally opening to that. I think there'll be a lot of's eyes are finally opening to that.

I think there'll be a lot of people listening who, you know, maybe they have their own beef facility of some sort, and they may well have spent a lot of their own money on these door systems with a unique key that corresponds to the unique door. And who can blame them? Because that message is still out there. Well, it's still one of still out there get done you know you know get through a wall isn't it and close the wall behind you i'm not here to say that

we shouldn't have doors at all but i think people maybe have been led down the garden path a bit by some of the the door campaigns out there that have convinced people that a door is going to stop people getting into their premises i wonder whether maybe it's it's bred a kind of complacency you know i don't need to worry i've got i've got doors there is a complacency and you think the door was invented goodness knows it must be 100 years old at least you know times move on you know don't they so um listen i'm well i'll say it's my turn up and I see there's a door, I'm happy, you know, because we're getting through there.

Somebody who has recently upgraded their security system is the owner of the Roberts Slaughterhouse in Llancaig in Wales, Eli Roberts. Not only has his slaughterhouse complex had doors for many years, he also employs full-time security personnel. However, in recent weeks, he has fundamentally changed the make-up of this staff. I went to meet him to find out more. What would you say if I told you I could find an employee that was loyal, strong, a tremendous endurance,

ruthless when it needed to be ruthless, and would work for nothing? Well, that's not an employee anymore if they're working for nothing, but... Well, what if I told you they didn't know that? Okay. I mean, we have really sort of hit the pay dirt here because I am quite proud to say that I have hit upon employing chimpanzees. I asked Eli what was attractive about replacing human security guards with chimpanzees.

Two words. Human error. And I'll give you another word as well. Greed. So, security at the plant is very important to me. You know, it's it stops people breaking in and stops people

breaking out, more importantly. I was employing a couple of the local lads to be security for me, but the workforce was depleting. I mean, it depletes anyway, I mean, through industrial accidents and malnutrition and whatever. But, I mean, people would escape. I say the word escape, it makes me sound like I'm culpable.

But, I mean, people were leaving without permission and it cost me an arm and a leg. It cost them an arm and a leg when I found them as well. And you can't trust people. Either they want to pay you or, you know, this is inhuman. I said, well, I tell you what, then I'll get someone who is inhuman.

Right? If this is below you, right? You think you're an apex predator? You think you're king of the castle? You think you're top of the pyramid? Are you indeed, right? I'll tell you something about nothing, right? Any one of those lads that work for security for me, put them in a cage with Jill. Jill's a chimp?

Jill's a chimp. She'll take her face off. She'll take her face off? She'll take their face off. Take their face off. She'll take their face off, yeah. What does Jill ask? Asks nothing in return.

So really, you see a chimp as the perfect security guard. Think of it, right? They'll work all day. They're hard as you like. They've got no sympathy whatsoever. They've got no compunction about going in a verticommerce too far. Assuming you take them away at a super young age, they develop a bond with you.

I've become like a father figure to a lot of those chimps. So do the chimps here, do they think you're a chimp? Yeah, they think of me as like a hairless, as a hairless chimp, I suppose. Which, let's be honest, is what we are. I was interested in how Eli had obtained the chimpanzees. Do you know how much a chimp costs? I've got no idea how much. Twelve and a half thousand dollars US.

Right. I'm going no idea how much. $1,200,000 US. Right. I'm going to laugh, man. What does it cost to drive a transit van to Central Africa? A couple of hundred quid. Tops. And you get like 40 or 50 chimps in the back of a transit. Easy. Is what you're telling me that you didn't pay the going rates

that I assume is you pay a poacher, which is, you say, £12,000? No, no. $12,500 is the market price legitimately to go and buy a chimpanzee on the open market in America. Legitimately? Legitimately, yeah. I mean, from like a private zoo like they have over there,

you know what I mean? Right. I could have paid $40,000 and had a giraffe, but that's no good to man, no fucking beast. Yeah, I need security. If I needed leaves nibbled off the top of my trees, then I'd think about going to South Africa

with a transit and bringing back a giraffe. But then I'd have to cut the roof off the transit and, you know, you'd never get that past customs. So let me just

clear this up then. Yeah. You could have bought chimps from a private zoo or private collection in America. Yeah. For $12,500 each.

Dollars each, sure. Yeah. And how many have you got? Working for me now. Yeah. About 4012,500 each. Dollars each, sure. Yeah. And how many have you got? Working for me now. Yeah. About 40. Right, 40 chimps. So you could have bought them,

but instead you, am I right in saying you drove a transit van to Central Africa? Well, you do the mathematics. I mean, 40 chimps, well, you're talking best part of half a million quid.

You know, transit I had anyway. Drove through France, down through Spain. I had a mate near Gibraltar. Took me across to Morocco, down through Africa. Took about two or three weeks all in, you know. Lovely. And then, yeah, I mean, it's purely down to how dedicated you are and how much you want those chimps.

You know, and I wanted them. So, I got them. You drove to Africa with your van. Yeah. What happens next? Did you speak to poachers? Is that?

Scum of the earth. Scum? Scum of the earth poachers, yeah. It is absolutely rife in Africa, poaching. Do you ever hear about poaching of chimps going on in Wales?

No. Well, exactly. So, they get a safer life. They bring them to Wales where they can live without fear of being poached. So you've stolen the chimps from the wild? Yeah.

In order to... When they're young, like get them away from the parents young. Right. You get more in a van then. And you're saying that by doing that, you're protecting them from poachers? Well, yeah, because because i mean like i said poaching in africa is absolutely endemic but i mean there's there's almost no poaching of uh of primates in wales so by bringing them here if anything i'm keeping them safe from poachers

but do you think that some people might think you are being a poacher well no because i'm not killing them for their ivory. You filled up the transit with 40 baby chimps? Infant chimps, I would say, not babies, yeah. Yeah, okay. It's still not clear to me, actually, how you sort of got them in the van. All you've got to do is, I shouldn't be telling this, you'd be bloody going to business yourself and getting your own bloody chips. But I will tell you, right?

So, but if I catch you doing this, I will fucking, I will cut your throat. And I mean that. I do mean it. Get a transit van, right? Park it up. Put a couple of leaves and branches around the door.

Open the back doors. Put a little ramp in there, right? Get something like a big pot of food, big, big bananas they go crazy for, right? Get a few bananas in a pot so they can smell it. Open the doors there, get a bit of banana stew on the go, chimps turn up, wide-eyed with appreciation usually, you know? Oh, what's this we got here?

Oh, it's a magic magic magic free source of bananas and wow we haven't got a tree to get it it's just here for us and uh eat their fill and then when they're sleeping drive to the next place so when they wake up and they're still in the back of your van yeah are they angry it's hard to tell with a chimp if they're happy they're screaming their heads off if they're in pain they're screaming their heads off. If they're in pain, they're screaming their heads off. If they're missing their family, they're screaming their heads off. You know, you never know what it is. And what about the people there?

I know it's a very sparsely populated area of rainforest, but there are people there working for charities who stop poachers and that kind of thing. You know, what did they have to say about this? Oh, bloody do good, as you mean. Yeah, I met a few of those over there. Right. And did they have a problem with this oh bloody do good as you mean yeah i met a few of those over there right and did they have a problem with what you were doing well let me tell you what i tell you what i have a problem with stop at a transit van hello um my name is janet bingham and um i am the mother of warren bingham who sadly went missing in the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Warren disappeared at the age of 19, two months ago. I asked Janet to tell me about what he was like. Warren was a lovely child. Lovely, but I think it's fair to say he never quite fitted in. You know those girls at school who've got um a horse and their only friend is the horse and they talk about a horse all the time well he was sort of like that but he didn't have a horse right so he's fair to say he wasn't a popular child no no i would say deeply deeply unpopular um popular with me of course not so much with his father right so a

troubled childhood or um troubled he took great uh comfort from nature the natural world i remember coming back from work one day and we've got quite a large garden with a sort of i don't want to say lake but sort of a large pond let's say and there was a swan that you know sometimes used to come come into the garden and he was there chest bear trying to ride the swan you know he'd fashioned a little sort of little tiny reins for it and i was having none of it you know pecking all over the place but he was going full pelt and what he was on on the water so he was kind of using it like a sort of natural jet ski. Exactly. And, you know, with it thrashing around, it was building up quite a lot of speed. And he was sort of speeding around the pond. He was sort of having the time of his life.

You're painting quite a vivid picture of his early childhood, this child who'd loved nature, riding a swan around the garden. Did this interest in the natural world continue into his teenage years? Absolutely. He threw himself into nature in all kinds of ways. I did actually get a little bit worried at one point because he did sort of share the bed with the dog and they sort of became very sort of, I wouldn't say romantically attached, but there was definitely some kind of real depth of feeling there. So Janet, tell me about Warren's decision to go to the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Yeah, so Warren decided to go to the Democratic Republic of Congo, and obviously I was worried about that. His father, however, I think it's fair to say was sort of less concerned. He, in fact, seemed delighted. Mere sort of seconds after Warren had left the house, my husband was turning his bedroom, Warren's bedroom, into what he called a scream therapy chamber. And he started fishing out of the recycling, all the egg boxes, bits of cardboard, bubble wrap, taping them to the walls of this little room. cardboard bubble wrap, taping them to the walls of this little room. He put a duvet on the wall, and he'd invite his friends over to sort of just scream obscenities.

And that's actually filled up even more now with recycling and soft furnishings. And now only a man can just sort of crawl in there into a little space, and they all take turns. Right, so your husband and his friends are taking turns turns to just a bit this clear in my head they crawl into this space that's kind of full of packaging essentially and and soft material and just scream out their frustrations yes they often they scream out their frustrations and often he will i can just hear him saying john it john it and it will be muff. They'll shout out all kinds of things. I heard one of them shouting about Cursed Yule Sop, but I think that might have been more of a sort of amorous shout. A sort of lustful cry. Yeah, a lustful, I'd say lustful cry. Do you think that's, you know, I know I'm not here to talk about your husband. I'm here to

talk about Warren, but I'm interested in this nonetheless. Do you think that's a healthy mental space to be in? Just kind of screaming your wife's name into a duvet? I mean, it's very much the man I married. Don't get me wrong. I mean, nothing about this is unexpected. I mean, if you'd asked me the night before my wedding, where I saw myself in 40 years i'd say we are going to be living in separate bedrooms and he will have a special little room our son's bedroom that he's turned into a room where he can masturbate and scream i'm beginning to get a picture of the kind of home that where warren was brought up and it kind of helps me understand actually why he may have wanted to go and do some volunteer conservation work somewhere as far away as the democratic republic of congo

yeah no i would say that our family home um was not happy by any stretch of the imagination um but i mean to be frank that's how i would want it to be i sort of feel like there's a mollycoddling of children and people in general. And, you know, I mean, that gives me some comfort to think that Warren chose to go to one of the most water-on-countries on earth, to the jungle, but he was well prepared for that by his childhood.

Eli Roberts met Warren in the jungle two months ago. You know, some bloody university student from Britain going over there to bloody do a good deed. To get a bloody job, by the way, to get a proper job. Not trying to stop me from giving it, you know, liberating chimps. A gap, you know, whatever that's supposed to be, God knows what that means. A gap between his ears, I think.

Standing in front of the van, you know, big sign, holding like a placard saying no to poaching. He had his badge on and like a lanyard and stuff and some sort of ID with him. Screaming and shouting

Blue Murder, you know, calling me all sorts of names and all that. All right, for him to jump on a plane, that's not okay for a chimp to get in a transit and go back to Wales. And suddenly,

Mr. Bloody I'm a Gap Year student with his dreadlocks wants to try and stop a transit and go back to wales and uh suddenly mr bloody i'm a gap year student with his dreadlocks uh wants to try and stop a transit van and thinks in what can only be described as an extreme lack of judgment that if he stands in front of the transit van i'm gonna stop and i had to go uh well basically tiananmen square on him i knew something was wrong when i stopped receiving whatsapp messages from Warren. And the thing is, I was receiving them very, very frequently. Daily, I'd receive messages of him in the arms of yet another chimpanzee. Once he put a wig on, a blonde wig, I don't know where he got that from. You know, to some people that would be heartwarming. But for me, you know,

I did sort of worry slightly for the chimpanzee, you know, because it did remind me somewhat of him and Belle, our late Labrador, and their very close relationship that they enjoyed. So yeah, it was sort of this sort of gallery of chimpanzees and my son. And so when that stopped, I knew something was terribly, terribly wrong. And I hopped on a plane to the Democratic Republic of Congo. Running Warren over with the transit van is shocking enough. But more shocking still is what he then did with his lifeless body. And the thing was, I mean, luckily for me, I just chucked the student in the back of the van then. And didn't have to feed the kids in the back,

the chimps, until Morocco. You know, the local lads, nice little fellas there, you know, they were, I just said, listen, have a couple of courage lads and if anyone comes poking a nose around here, just tell them he was bitten on the cock by a spider. So, yeah, I mean, I'm sure he's missed by someone, but I certainly didn't miss him.

Literally. As soon as I arrived, I went straight over to the Charities HQ, met some lovely gentlemen. They actually told me what had happened is Warren had been bitten on the end of his penis by a large spider and died. I mean, it's amazing you had to fly all the way there for them to tell you that they didn't think to ring you or let you know that no he'd been bitten on the cock by a spider no it was um a dark day in what's been a very very dark life i found it extremely moving speaking to the gentleman tell me about the emotions you feel when you you find out

your son has died because he's been bitten on the knob i was devastated sad but then there is something lovely about it because to me being bitten on the penis by a spider is a noble death. I mean, Warren loved nature, and nature loved him. And to die by the bite of a spider on his private parts is, you know, I mean, the best any of us can hope for. There's definitely great comfort in knowing the manner of his death. I'm interested in whether you ever had any suspicions about the man of Warren's death. If anything ever sort of didn't add up to you about the story, do you ever feel it's implausible that he died because a spider bit his tallywhacker? Are you trying to suggest that he wasn't bitten on the cock by a spider? trying to suggest that he wasn't bitten on the cock by a spider. Has it not occurred to you that it's strange that, you know,

I believe you weren't able to see his body over there? No, I mean, no. What you don't understand is what the gentleman explained to me, is that when you're bitten, the poison actually sort of dissolves your body and sort of rumples up and then evaporates. So no, I wasn't able to see his body. What would you say if I told you that I personally had information about the real story of how Warren met his end? I mean, if you're trying to tell me he wasn't bitten on the cock by a spider,

I honestly don't know what I'm going to do with myself. Right. Okay. So that's something that's very important. That seems to be something that's quite important to you. It is, because it... Warren being bitten on the cock by a spider, it might sound strange, but in the madness of the last couple of years, this has been sort of a glimmer of hope,

a sort of natural order. And I'll tell you something else. I actually visited a spiritualist in Glastonbury, and she told me that I, in fact, was a spider in a past life. So, just hear me out here, it's almost as though I bit Warren and caused his death,

and I find great solace there. Well, the information that I had about the real story about how Warren met his end was just that I happened to know that it was a really big spider. Thank you. Thank you so much. I was interested to know whether Eli had had any trouble with the chimps. They'd been good as gold. whether Eli had had any trouble with the chimps. They'd been good as gold.

You know, there's always going to be a bit of a power struggle at the beginning. There's going to be a literally, well, I was going to say doggy dog. It was actually chimpy chimp. But, you know, so there's a boss now, Big Steve. You know, they know he's the boss. Oh, so Big Steve, one of the chimps, has kind of risen to the top. Big Steve is the big chimp on the site, yeah. And as a mark of respect for a fellow striver to become the best,

I've given him a crossbow. You've given one of the chimps a crossbow? Yeah, Big Steve, yeah. And does he use that? Oh, yeah, his aim is not the best. But, I mean, yeah, he's shot that a couple of times. I got a load of that from him. He hasn't worked out the draw mechanism yet,

but I mean, I'll draw it and cock it for him and he makes a funny little scream like he does and just fires the trigger and yeah. Well, he lacks an accuracy, mind you. He makes up for it in a lack of remorse. So, you know. So I guess they've got this kind of almost human-like kind of society and hierarchy.

Yeah. So with Big Steve at the top and then a kind of a system that's emerged, that's really interesting. There's a harem of female chimps and there's people that work for him. They're a cracking security him. They're up there cracking, cracking security team. They really are.

You know, I mean, as far as the crossbow is concerned, you know, what big Steve lacks in accuracy, he makes up for

with a lack of remorse as well. Because, I mean, well, this is a funny story. When we got back to Wales from Africa

with the van, I'd been in such a rush to get as many chimps in there as possible and get out of there. Like, you know, so didn't make enough thorough checks, I'm very honest with you, you know, but I was obviously doing my best

in the difficult circumstances. Well, the only bloody, one of the, what he thought was an infant chimp turned out to be a silverback gorilla. What, right. Yeah, Lenny, I called him he was big big big old boy len well so when you put him in the van he was a silverback at that stage or he was

a baby gorilla who no no he was a full-grown silverback yeah you didn't notice no no he was it was dark and uh i was still bloody uh chuckling to myself about the uh the gap student that um thought he could stop a transit van you know so uh so what point did you realize that one of the juvenile chimps was in fact an adult gorilla i thought someone was afoot when we got to like north africa i was waiting to get on on the little boat there and uh i have a racket from the back of the van and i i had a little peek inside there there was a uh and this like a shadow in the back and it looked like a i thought i thought one of the chimps had grown a lot in the last couple of days. You know, I had no idea how fast they grew.

But yeah, by the time we got back to Wales, opened the van up and Lenny, I called him. Huge thing. Yeah, full grown bloody silverback in the back there. So this is, and there's an important life lesson to be learned from this as well. Because you naturally assume then that big Lenny's going to be learned from this as well because you naturally assume then that Big Lenny is going to be the boss and well yeah

how did he did he get on with the rest of the chimps because obviously he's a different species yeah and he was I hate to say the word bully but I mean

he liked to put it about a bit but by complete fluke there was nothing no skill involved but yeah so one of the first people

that Big Steve shot was Lenny complete fluke with was nothing no skill involved but um yeah so one of the first people that uh big steve shot was was lenny complete fluke with a frostbite yeah bolted him in the just below the left eye and he was dead right at the floor i mean it was a of course i mean if steve was uh was was uh popular before that i he was, you know, king of the castle. Well, let's talk about their role as security guards. You say they're doing a good job. Have they had to apprehend anyone yet?

Or, you know, is it just a case of, you know, sitting around and twiddling their thumbs? We had a runner about three weeks ago. We had a runner, usual sort of thing. Oh, I want my freedom. You know, I haven't been paid for weeks. I haven't seen my family. I'm terrified, all usual sort of thing. Oh, I want my freedom. You know, I haven't been paid for weeks. I haven't seen my family. I'm still terrified, all this sort of nonsense.

And Big Steve was, you know, he wasn't involved himself. It was two of the other fellas there, Chris and Helen, two of the younger ones. And they were off like a blinging shot after him. And he got up near the not far from the bus station way there and Helen

grabbed him by the collar jumped on him had a cracking lovely jump and he sort of toppled backwards and then

Chris went straight for the face basically took the face off near enough and then Helen was making hell of a racket

and she just was I can see it I was biting on it and just bit a couple of of a racket and she just was I could see it I was biting on it and just bit a couple of his fingers off and that was it then

done so you know didn't kill him he's back he's back back on the site now he's

I gave him two days off and he's just got the eight fingers there but I mean there's plenty of people from the arbitral have got less than ten did if anything he fits in better now

more after this okay this advert is going out to anyone with the dick and balls this episode of the beef and dairy network podcast is brought to you by manscaped who are the global leaders in below the waist grooming clean yourself into the new year with their new ultra-premium body wash. Look, let's stop beating around the bush. Each of us has that special area, and you've got to keep it clean. You've got to keep it clean. There's not many things in life you have to do, actually, when you boil it down. There's not that many things you have to do actually when you boil it down there's not that many things you have to do jury duty if called um conscription the only other thing really is keeping that you

gotta keep that area clean guys and uh manscaped might be the way to do it so use the code beef for 20 off plus free shipping at manscaped.com. And get all in on confident and smelling good this new year with Manscaped. After acquiring the chimps, Eli contacted Keith Poggles at Poggles Security Solutions to ask if they could test his new security system, something which proved to be much harder than Keith had assumed. It was a tough night, actually. So tell me about when Eli called you.

It was out of the blue. I hadn't heard of Eli before. And he said, look, I know you're the best. Are you up for a challenge? Yes, of course. He said, I won't tell you what we've done. Just see if you can get in. And he went for it. It was the diamond package. Yes, of course. He said, I won't tell you what we've done, just see if you can get in. And he went for it.

He paid me. It was the diamond package. The Poggles diamond package is basically a full military assault on your premises to see if your security system can stand up to it. Tens of trained professionals will try and steal your beef, including former members of the armed forces, armed vehicles, and bad dogs. We were completely honest. We put it on the website as a bit of a joke. We didn't think

anybody would go for the diamond package. We had to buy a helicopter. Oh, right. It comes with a helicopter. Yeah, it comes with a helicopter. We had to buy that. We didn't have that. We had to learn the basics. Turns out that's quite hard. Had to call in a lot of favours. Soldiers and we got a lot of dogs. It was an astonishing level. It seemed like overkill.

But it wasn't. Yeah, it was not at all. The assault began at 2am. Keith was at Poggles HQ, watching the events through the body cams of the soldiers. Got about 30 men. And there's Chopper and then there's ground units coming in with dogs. That's all. We fly under the radar, they drop in.

OK, we're going in. It's all going perfectly. They land, no one in the courtyard. Courtyard's clear. Unbelievable. You're thinking to yourself, Robert's absolutely messed this up. There's a door, not even locked. Corridor clear. We're looking up and down the corridors. We're going, where have they hidden these?

What is this? Where's the beef? Where have they put the beef? Where are the cows? No beef down here. And then there's this noise. What's that noise? Control, we can hear some movement in the walls. What you first thought is, we found them. It's the cows. You think this is it? This is it. They've put the cows in the walls.

Fake walls. It's a classic. You know, you've got to be very careful. This close to that many cows, there's a lot of methane. No live ammunition. Because that could go up. But it was not the cows making the noise. I had

barely seconds to see what actually it was there before just a barrage of shit flew at us. Oh, we're being covered in shit! This is a cut-brown, Herbie! Cut-brown! It was like

just a rain of shit. It was, you know, a medieval battle and the arrows are flying down, except it's shit. You know, apologies for the graphic image there, but this was a lot of shit being thrown. And through this melee, through this sort of mist of haze of feces and detractors,

40 frenzied chimps tear through the men. Control, we're under attack by I would estimate 30 or 40 chimpanzees. It was... It felt like an hour, but it must have been a minute, 30 seconds.

Holy shit! These are trained men, but it must have been a minute, 30 seconds. Holy shit! These are trained men, but 40 chimps. Throwing that much shit, they'd presumably been eating beef. They'd got that boost, they'd got that energy boost. And it was... We screamed, you know, the dogs, get the dogs in there! Get the dogs! We screamed, you know, the dogs, get the dogs in there.

Get the dogs! But the chimps were ready. They bonded quite quickly with the dogs. And they rode them around. They're born entertainers, chimps. It's torn my coat off! It's torn off my coat! The thing is, these soldiers, OK, they're trained, but they're trained to kill people.

And there's that second hesitation. A chimp. Can I? Are they endangered? Is this the ones, the palm oil ones? Is this them? You know. And that's all it takes. In that split second, you've lost the advantage. Oh, you've gone.

And it's fair to say that they are violent. Oh, they're wearing the dogs around i mean it's quite by this point they know they're on top it's it's imagine sort of a feral apocalypse crux so of all of the staff members that you sent into the robert slaughterhouse how many came back well chips always leave one they always leave one Pull back! Pull back! The Syrian bastards are everywhere! Fuck me! Harry, mother... Yeah, he's quit the job, actually. He doesn't work for me now. I think that's understandable, isn't it? Yeah. Well, best of luck to him.

Well, that's it, isn't it? That's all you can say, really. That's what I said. Sorry about the, you know, chimp slaughter. Sorry about the, you know, chimp slaughter. And so I assume the following day you had to ring Eli and give him the good news. You weren't able to steal any beef. He rang me. I mean, he was excited to do it. Yeah.

And I just had to sort of, you know, say, well, look, excited to do it. Yeah. And I just had to sort of say, well, look, well done, first of all. Then a second of all, I just said, listen, just be careful. Watch your back. Because

40 chimps that well trained, now with dogs, they could turn. I asked Eli whether he thought the chimps would turn. Did he think that one day Big Steve might challenge his authority? I hope he does. I mean that. I hope he does, because I've seen the look in his eye and he's thinking, hello, I can be the big dog here. I can run the whole place.

I would love nothing more than to go mano a chimpo with him. Even if he was wielding a crossbow? Well, I mean, that's neither here nor there. His aim is bad. What I would do in that situation Of course is I would take the crossbow off him I'd distract him in some way I'd probably I'd get like a pencil and jam it in his ear

Or something like that And then when he was screaming in pain Take a crossbow off him And I'd shoot him in the Well in the chest probably Or the stomach area. And then as he was bleeding out, I would take my top off, bare chested, and I'd thump my chest over him, stand on his torso,

and then I would be known as King of the Chimps by the other chimps then. But it hadn't come to that. Not a day goes by I don't think of him, I relish him challenging my authority. But as it is, he's happy with what he's doing and I'm happy with him doing a good job for me. So he knows who the boss is. So what would you say to the people I feel like I have a responsibility

to say this who would say these chimps deserve to be in their natural habitat? They're not... Right, let me ask you a question, shall I? Let me flip it around and ask you a question, right? These people are saying this.

Are they naked? Probably not. Are they covered in their own excrement? Unlikely. Has their hair ever been cut? Probably. Well, there we are then. So they can be all high and mighty,

how come they're not in their natural environment and yet they are quite happy not to be in their natural environment oh so you think a human's natural environment is just to i don't think it is what's natural isn't it so you think it's natural for humans to be naked of course that's how we're born how you come out how you come out is how you are that natural. Everything else is by nature, not natural, right? So unless you're standing there naked as the day you were born, covered in bits of your own excrement with matted hair and kemp beard and nails caked in mud, then you're not being natural yourself. And now you can tell me that chimps should be in their natural habitat.

Well, I'll tell you what. Go live in your natural habitat first, and then you can throw stones. In fact, and try throwing stones because I can tell you something for nothing. A chimp can throw a stone further and harder than you can. And one of the big fuckers has got a crossbow. Okay, okay. Well, I take your point. Yeah. What about the

legal aspect of this, which is that what you've done is almost certainly illegal? Here we go. Legal. Who said? Legal for who? Legal for who? So someone in London, in Westminster,

can sit there on a green leather chair and tell me what's legal and what's not legal. And then some bloke with a flipping horsehair wig and a gown and a wooden hammer can tell me what I can and cannot do with a chimp. Don't be so bloody ridiculous. So do you feel like the chimps have their own system of, their own kind of legal system, really?

Natural justice. Right. Which is what, you know, what makes the world go round. You know, think of all the species, all the hundreds and millions and thousands of species in the world. Only one of them have got a crown

cord. How long have we got cords for? Cords? Yeah. I don't know. A couple of

thousand years. How old is the Earth? Four and a half billion years old. The universe is 13.5 billion years old.

13.5 billion years. And fathomably large. Not only larger than we imagine imagine but larger than we could imagine and expanding exponentially and millions of species most of which

the vast majority of which no longer live they've lived and died they've shuffled off this mortal coil they've had their chance at the wheel and every day more and more stars are being born and more and more stars are being born and more and more planets are coalescing and every day the universe expands

and it's not only bigger than we can imagine, it's bigger than we can imagine. And you're telling me that all that unfathomable vastness, that enormous magnet, we literally come out and even begin to wrap our heads around how big it is. And in all that infinite space, in all of that, you think that

some bloke telling me that I can't put a chimp in a transit van and give him a crossbow is law. It's some immutable truth. That's ridiculous, isn't it? A big thanks to Eli Roberts, Janet Bingham and Keith Poggles for those interviews.

And Poggles Security Solutions is offering a deal to all Beef and Dairy Network members. It's 50% off the price of the bronze security package. And that comes with a free guarantee that they won't kill any of your security guards unless completely necessary. And if they do, they say they will clonk them respectfully on the back of the head with a heavy torch. So an open casket funeral entirely possible in that scenario. So that's all we've got time for this month. But if you're after more beef and dairy news, get over to the website now, where you'll find all the usual stuff, as well as our off-topic section, where this month we look back at World War II and ask,

could the whole thing have been avoided if Hitler, Stalin, Chamberlain, Emperor Hirohito and Franklin Delano Roosevelt had done karaoke together on the deck of a naval destroyer on the eve of war? The answer's no. So, until next time, beef out. Thanks to Alistair Satchell, Tom Bell, Mike Bubbins, and Amy Mason,

and also all of the listeners who answered the call on Twitter and provided the voices of those poor, poor soldiers being torn to shreds by chimps. You all did a fantastic job. Okay, until next time, goodbye. This week on Maximum Fun's pro wrestling podcast, Tights and Fights,

Austin Creed, best known as WWE's Xavier Woods, tells us why his fans find him so easy to love. So I think it's less me being good at it and more people wanting to be a part of something. And it's very easy to be a part of these things because I constantly am screaming about what I'm interested in. Austin Creed on the perfect wrestling podcast,

Tights and Fights. Find it on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Somewhere between science and superstition there is a podcast look your daughter doesn't say she's a demon she says she's the devil himself that thing is not my daughter and i want you to tell me there's a show where the hosts don't just report on french science and spirituality, but take part themselves. Well, there is, and it's Oh No Ross and Carrie on Maximum Fun.

This year, we actually became certified exorcists. So yes, Carrie and I can help your daughter. Or we can just talk about it on the show. Oh No Ross and Carrie on MaximumFun.org.