Begin Again with Davina McCall - Kate Nash: Why OnlyFans Is Funding My Music Career!

Episode Date: April 16, 2026

What if staying true to yourself cost you everything? In this episode of Begin Again, Kate Nash opens up about the reality of building a career in an industry that often tries to control, define, and silence you. From becoming a breakout star at 18 to being labelled, misunderstood, and written off, Kate shares what it really feels like to grow up in the public eye and fight to stay yourself. She speaks candidly about the music industry today, why it’s no longer sustainable for artists, and the difficult decisions she’s had to make to keep her career alive including starting an OnlyFans to fund her tours. For Kate, it’s not about controversy, it's about survival, independence, and refusing to play by rules that no longer work. This conversation also explores the emotional side of that fight. The pressure to be perfect, the anger that once fuelled her, and the conscious decision to move beyond it. Kate reflects on identity, feminism, and the power of women supporting each other in a world that often tries to pit them against one another. At its core, this is a story about resilience, creative freedom, and what it takes to take back control on your own terms. 🌟 Follow for more honest conversations about identity, growth, and beginning again. Follow us here: 📸 www.instagram.com/beginagain 🎥 https://www.tiktok.com/@beginagainpod Follow Kate: https://www.instagram.com/katenash/ ✨Sign up for the Begin Again newsletter for all your behind the scenes access, recommendations and much much more at: https://linkly.link/2g2xx (00:00) Intro (00:01:31) Intro to Kate Nash, fame and problems of public image (00:04:51) Exploring identity and history through music (00:08:01) The evolution of Kate’s Music and dealing with online hate (00:12:34) Kate's Catholic upbringing, the challenges of Shame (00:19:15) Kate's relationship with her sisters (00:23:06) Do Health Ad (00:24:27) Bloom and Wild Ad (00:25:29) Kate's heart surgery (00:32:17) Kate deciding to quit her job and start performing music (00:36:26) Dealing with fame (00:39:20) Manager stealing from her, and healing from (00:47:33) Moving to LA (00:48:57) Kate's breakout role in Netflix series *Glow*, and learning to wrestle (00:58:31) Why the music industry is broken! (01:01:41) Starting an OnlyFans account to fund her career (01:06:04) How fans can support the music industry (01:08:23) Kate's protest around London (01:12:00) The reasons Kate is fighting for the music industry and culture (01:16:12) A surprise letter for KateSponsored by: Do Health - The waitlist is open. Begin Again listeners get fixed early access pricing when they sign up today at dohealth.co/beginagain use code BEGINAGAIN Bloom & Wild - use code DAVINA for 15% off at https://www.bloomandwild.com/?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=begin_again  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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When I got famous, I was like, oh, I hate this. I hate this so much. Like the sort of British attitude of just like, oh, prove yourself for the rest of your life, even though we do love that song, but fuck you. And you're just like, okay. I don't think people understand how brave you have to be, to be 100% honest.

And Kate Nash, you are what we are missing in the entertainment industry. When I was young, I wanted to be good. I love doing my books and my hair, but also I want to be a musician, I want to be an actor. You had an experience when you were younger that just blew my mind. My mum felt my chest and my heart was going, and we went straight to hospital. I basically found out I had this heart condition

and I was working in Nando's and I took time of Nando's to have heart surgery. He had this moment of, I don't want to go back to Nando's. I want to live. I just went for it. But then I was in the gutter. Everything that I went through in my career, getting dropped, getting stolen from, being 18 in the Daily Mail, like, deciding this is who you are.

How did that happen? In the music industry, we are. In the music industry, we are treated like fools. The contracts that we sign, you sign them at 17, it's fine, you'll be in there until you're 67. They'll own 80% of everything you're on. But you know, it's the way. But there's dreams I have, things I want to achieve.

I would sabotage them all to get vengeance. They'll really have to come and meet us at the line. And we decide where the line is, you know, my bum and the government. We've got something for you. I can't, I'm in shock. I mean, I was really looking forward to this today because you are, you are, I feel like you are what we are missing in the entertainment industry, in the

broader sense, because you're not just a musician. It's not just in music. It's like music and acting. You are a maverick. And you are truly yourself. And I don't think that people really understand how difficult that is and how brave you have to be to be 100% honest and that's what you are and I love it. Yay! Kate Nash, yeah. I think it's like it would be so hard for me not to be myself and I think that's what I have actually wrestled with because I think you're right, there are consequences to being 100% this is who I am, this is what I can do, this what I can't do, was what I don't want to do. And my career's been very like this because of that.

But like for me personally, it would have been harder. Yes. To do the other thing. Yes. Because really what I learned when I got famous, I suppose, you know, when I was young, I was like, I want to be a musician, I want to be an actor, I want to be famous, I want to do this, I want to do that. And then you kind of get fame.

And I was like, oh, I hate this. I hate this so much. These are, I could sort of just go into these rooms and I'd self-destruct. I mean, I remember going to the glam awards in 2008, I think, and I set all the fire alarms off in the building. Because I just, I was like, I hate this. It just all seemed so phony. And I can't be in those environments.

Well, you can't be phony. Yeah, I can't be funny. You can't be funny. Do you know what? There's something very relaxing about being around someone. who is honest. Is that? There's no...

Not all the time. Yes, there is. It is. It is. Because there is nowhere to go with the truth. Mm-mm-mm. I think the truth, yeah, it's... It's important to me as an artist as well to try...

That's sort of my code of conduct is how can I be truthful about who I am right now in my music, in my work. And that changes, isn't it? Because like... Yes, because we're always changing. You're like constantly. evolving. And so, yeah, even like my interpretation of what that means will change. I mean, that's another thing I hate is when people look back at old interviews and they go, well, you said this. And I was like, that was 10 years ago. I'm like a different, but we've got to be

allowed to change. And isn't that, oh my God, so relevant to today? I feel it's so important to be a mess and to be like, make mistakes. And I feel you really get that. I get it. It's how, what are we saying to young people that the perception of you is more important than the real. I think that's actually what we are saying. The perception of you is more important than the real you. So just to make sure you come across as perfect. Otherwise, extreme consequences. And I just don't see how that is a human experience. Like, it's not human, is it? I was just wondering, would it be all right if you just subscribed? Thanks. Hang on. I want, before I go into all of this, we're just getting in so quickly. This is too much. This is going to, I just quickly want

to ask you at the beginning of this podcast, just in case anybody turns off halfway through, that I want to ask you what you are doing right now in your life. So you've got new music coming out. Yes, I do have new music coming out. It's a cover of Shnade O'Connor's famine. Talk to me about Shnade O'Connor. Incredibly important artist. For me, but for everybody. Sheenade, you know, she became, she says that she was, you know, she accidentally had this pop hit and was seen as this pop singer, but actually she was always a protest singer. And famine, I'm half Irish, so my mum's from Dublin. And I don't know if it's an age thing, but just the connection to root and where you're from, I think becomes more and more important as you get older because you're just trying to understand. who you are, why you've made certain decisions and what maybe impacted those decisions and looking back and thinking, oh, why did I feel that?

Or why did I do that? And maybe I, you know, you're just trying to understand and you're thinking about losing your parents and life becomes more serious. And so I think like going back to figure out who I am and where I'm from is more important than it's ever been. I've always been really interested in it. And I grew up like every summer in Ireland. and had this idea to sort of explore that in my music work a long time ago, but only until the last couple of years was able to really work on this music. And I wanted to start with this cover of Shnade O'Connor's Famine

because it's such an insanely incredible song. Like she just gives you a history lesson. And when I heard it, I was like, how come I don't know this? How come I wasn't, you know, taught this at school, but also at home? With dual nationality, I don't know England's history, apart from like the version that we're shown, which is so different how other countries in the world see us because we had an empire.

And we just have such a bloody history. And I think with the rise in nationalism and what we're sort of seeing in the world today, it's really important for me to dive into that. And Shannade says, if there is ever going to be healing, there has to be remembering than Greece. so that there can be forgiving, there has to be knowledge and understanding.

I love that. And I sort of want to honour that chorus there that like, actually the more people that cover that song, the better because you can sort of educate people. And I'm really interested in the relationship between England and Ireland and what we're seeing in England with all these flags going up everywhere and what that means and why people are feeling where they feel and sort of say, well, you know, we don't know our history, including me. You know, I'm not, I don't want to just point the finger.

I'm in it as well of saying like, I want to learn more and may perhaps like learning could be healing instead of like being reactive and angry and, you know. Do you know what's so nice is that I feel like we've watched you evolve. We've watched you grow up. Yeah, yeah. And that's an incredible journey to see you go from, I know.

Young girl, teenager to now. Yeah. And how you are coming from a place of love and understanding now through going through your journey. You have to go through the journey to get that. You do. You have to crawl through the sewage to be able to get out the tunnel, don't you? You can't like jump out of it. I've always like that metaphor of, you know, the Shawshank Redemption.

and then at the end of the movie, like, crawling, he's crawling through all the shit. And I've always thought at times when a hard, I'm like, you just can't escape the tunnel if you don't crawl through the shit, that you just can't click yourself out of it. And actually, if you don't crawl through the shit, then you won't get out of the tunnel.

So you have to do it. And there are so many metaphors in that movie. Also, the little scratches on the wall that he makes the tunnel with. I always think in terms of my politics, my beliefs, feminism, activism, I just want to be one of the little scratches. But that's really a lot, you know. If we all are one little scratch, that makes a tunnel. So like, I think sort of saying, I care about everything and I want to change.

It's like, we can't change everything. We can't take on the whole entire world. But what can you do in your little space, like be a little scratch? And I think as a musician, obviously, like, there is quite a lot I can do, really. But I want to be trying to do less now and really being specific about what I'm saying. Like I don't repost loads of stuff on Instagram anymore. I don't sort of shout about everything. I wait and I go, well, what do we think about this?

And let me do something really informed and only speak when I feel I really know what I'm talking about. And I feel this is worth me like diving in, which is kind of what I did with. my single germ last summer because as a feminist and also, you know, having so many LGBTQIA plus fans and trans people in my life, this issue was like untouchable and don't get involved in this. It's so hot and so scary and there's so many, there's so much vitriol online. And I just thought, I just can't, I can't care about comments for my heart. Like, who cares? We all know anyway 70% of it is just bots. I know exactly.

All our lives. You kind of have to like transcend comments and accept everyone's going to sling mud at you and then just say what you think because all of that stuff it just doesn't really matter. Do you know what's interesting? Because I'm 20 years older than you and when I look back at my life growing up

when I was 17, 18, every club that I went to was so unbelievably inclusively inclusive. Like we had everyone there, trans, straight, gay, like everyone. Yeah. And no one gave a shit. Yeah. I don't think people get shit in real life.

But it's because we hear online from these two ends at the spectrum, we think that it's all like that end or that end. Yes. But it's not the vast majority of people are just loving. I think most people will get on if you shove them in a room. Yeah. You know, and like put on some good music or just give them some food. Well, music is the key. It really is the connector.

It really does bring people together. And I think that people become radicalised and isolated. Yes. And then they get attacked. And I've had the experience as well. I've had that experience of being attacked on Twitter. And it is this kind of, oh, the first time it happens, you're like, whoa, that's the, it almost feels physical. It's not.

But you just feel like you've been in a fight and you think, oh my God. Like I actually get why people double down, find safety, who's got my back, and then end up down some pathway of like just being, yeah, it's okay. Like actually, did you know this? And it's sort of falling into these like, I just think get off your phone. Just get off your phone. And I mean, is that not something that you've learned with time? Yes. And how much happier.

As a young person growing up and all of that, I've just realized the less I'm on my phone, the better. Yeah. You want to do good. I do want to do good. And I don't like to do good. So I'm like, I want to be good. I don't want to be a sinner. I'd like to, I'd like to talk to you about,

because Catholicism really does imprint itself on someone's psyche. If they are, and you weren't even really religious. When I was young, I was, I mean, when I was young, I was just bored in mass, like a little kid. And then when I became a teenager, sort of 12, 13, 14 and then 15 16 changed but 12 13 14 I was I was I'm Catholic I really want to do my confirmation I loved it I loved doing my books and my home and kind of getting my outfit and going to my know like I really liked it I was quite like it's like a club yeah and then I went to school and I'd see like anti-abortion videos and I was like

abortion is wrong it really is wrong you know like I took on all these like I'm like oh masturbating you're going to go to hell for that I'm like yes I want to unpick that a bit Really better pray. Because that is a really sad side to religion. Full stop. Yes, I know. Pleasure. No pleasure.

Yeah, no pleasure. But in particular for women. Well, of course. Like what the fact? We're not supposed to have pleasure. I think it's because we could just control the world if we wanted to. You know, we could all just be like, right, we're going on birth strike. It's over.

You're all, we're going. The human race is done, guys, because of us. My mum, if she wanted something to get done, she used to like withdraw sex. Yeah. Really? I want a car, withdraw sex. But like there is. It worked.

Is that what it is? Is that what it is? It's a great place called Lysistrata, where they wanted the men to stop going to war. And they all stopped having sex and the men stopped going to war. Is that what it is? Is it, I just don't know why it's such a threat, our reproductive system and our sexuality. But it's always been the way of the witch trials. It was always like, you know, it comes from.

from it was midwives, weren't they? They were some of the first people called witches were midwives. It's always been connected to this. Kate, can I just tell you something? I don't even know how long we've been sat here. I don't know where we're talking about me.

But you've literally blown my mind like 10 times. Midwives, being the first people. I'd never really thought about that. Can I just say, I'm learning a lot today. I'm really enjoying it. Thank you so much. Oh, God. Honestly, because that is true.

It's a threat. it's a it must I mean I try to understand it because sometimes I think well why does everyone hate women so much why do they want to kill them and take away their right to vote or like in history yeah for sure like but now like take away right to abortion

and they're trying to do this like one vote per household thing in America and it's but why you know I don't I think fear it's got to be surely it's got to be fear based because of our cycles you know it's really interesting because lots of you know

know women like trying to get pregnant and there's problems with sperm and men's sperm like their DNA in the sperm gets fragmented as they age but because they can sort of just spunk forever everyone's like oh they can have babies till they're 80 but that's actually not true it's and obviously women have we have different bodies and different uh situations but like it's always on us the focus is always on us and become like you know just the patriarch has done a lot of damage this is when you said I informed myself. Yeah, yeah, I'm trying to do that because I think it's, I don't know how else to function in today's, you know,

I can't watch another random person on TikTok, explain something to me and me think, well, who are they? And do they have any knowledge about this? I feel like I've come off TikTok because I didn't really understand it, but I feel like I should go on because I want to put love on there. Oh, well, you should be on TikTok. I need to put love everywhere. You should not scroll on it or watch anything,

but you should exist in TikTok. love on. That's all I'm going to do. But you were sharing, you've done so much for women, a conversation about menopause. Why the, it didn't exist before you. I did. No, but like it, had we ever heard about it being talked about? That's why it did it. What the hell? What? But that's, you know, like, these things, it's so crazy. Like, how, I, you know, we're so unprepared for our experience, but we're so blamed and responsible. And yeah, like, growing up in a Catholic school, I had a teacher who told me and some girls, oh, I can't really tell you this,

but if you do have sex, I'd use a condom, because we weren't allowed to use condoms because we're Catholic. Oh, wow. Which is why so many religious kids get married really young. So she did you a complete service. Yes, she's like, please don't get pregnant, you know, your teenagers. Because she knew that teenagers want to have sex. Oh, God, that's so good.

Yeah, but it was like if she had, if someone had found that out, she probably would have got fired. Because we were being told in religious studies, you'll go to hell for masturbating to circle back. Did you? did I masturbate? Every night I masturbated from quite young and I like, I was like,

this feels good! But did you feel like you were doing something wrong? I think I did. It's hard to... It's hard to... It didn't stop me. No. But I would pray a lot and I think I just loved praying

and I'd have masturbating and in my bed I'd be praying or masturbating and that was kind of maybe I'd be praying after I masturbated. Because I feel like... I didn't think I really even knew what it was. Is that idea of us getting pleasure from something being a sin. And release and like stress release. Stress release.

It's such a fucked up. You can't do the thing. Guys can. Yeah. But you can't. So you went to Catholic school and I'm seeing the kind of like who you were. Very, very good girl. Yes, I was very good.

I was good and I wanted to be good. And then I. I wouldn't say I got like, I was like, I'm bad or anything, but I started sort of wanting to socialise and drink and like liked boys. And I'm like, I remember once a girl in my class talking about kissing another girl. And she said, oh, it'd just be so disgusting to kiss another girl. And I was like, oh, yeah, that would be disgusting. I'm thinking, I'm like, that's quite good.

Actually. Hang on a minute. Think about that. They're there tonight. After a good prayer. Do you know what I mean? But really for me, so I think like I wanted to go clubbing. My sister would go to garage clubs.

So let's talk about your sisters. You're the middle child. I'm the difficult middle child. So I want to just check in with you about that because I've got three kids. Okay. And like society, it's a bit like. the gen Zs, etc, etc. Yes.

Tells us that the middle child is the difficult one. Did you? We are. But are you? No, I don't know. I mean, I'm thinking about all my sisters are going to say watching that. I think we were all pretty difficult in our own unique way.

I think everybody thinks that they've got a problem with their position in the family. Everyone does. The oldest thinks it's difficult for me because I had to do everything first. Yes. And then everybody else has to. rules were stricter for them, right? Yeah. And then by the time the baby, it's like, oh, they can quote.

The younger one goes, my oldest two hate me because they think I'm spoiled. Yeah. Well, I think, you know, I'm not sure. I just think we were very, like, physical with each other. We used to beat each other up a lot. Did you? Yeah. God, yeah.

It was practice. For glow. When I got the glow audition, I thought, I can do this. I fought my sisters for years in the streets. We actually got told off really badly once. My mom was so ashamed because me and my older sister had a physical brawl in the street. on the way to school at like 7.30 in the morning. I don't know what had happened.

And I ripped her shirt in half. I like, and she was like punching me in the head. And I was like, and our neighbour saw. And she had to go home and change because I like literally tore her shirt in half. And my mum found out and we were in so much trouble. Like Irish mother, like ashamed. Ashamed.

It was pure shame. But we did beat each other up quite a lot. And it was always two against one. It's so interesting. that's safe fighting because you love each other. Yeah, well, it's that weird dynamic with sisters. Well, maybe it's siblings in general, but we would be locking each other in the shed

for two hours, throwing shampoo on each other, like in the living room, like, and then being like, oh my God, mom's coming home, how do you have found we fix this? And punching each other and all this, and then you'd be, oh, sure, watch The Simpsons, and you just sit there, and it's just normal. And even now we can have, arguments and we can have serious arguments but then you can just turn things around with siblings

very quickly for me anyway I'm very close to my sisters and I know they have my back 100% that keeps coming into my head safe they yeah they will always be there for me and always do what they can for me and same with me even if I'm being punched in the head by one of them like someone else tried to punch me in the head. They would kill them. Yeah, we would be like, we're together. You can't join it, you know. So we do have each other's backs.

But yeah, I don't, I struggled with tantrums a lot. And I'm in redhead. I think, you know, I was quite fiery. I was very stubborn, which I got from my mother. And yeah, I think we all were difficult in our own special way. And it's hard. it's hard growing up being a teenager and everyone's trying to do their best.

My poor dad had so many like women in the house and he would just kind of sit there like he's quite quiet my dad and we'd always be really surprised when we'd see my dad at a party or something because he'd be really chatting everyone like, why didn't he talk like this at home?

Who's he? Because you don't let him get a word in edgeways. Oh my belly's rumbling, I might actually have to have that banana bread. Yeah, add some bit. Yeah, yeah. And we put it in the napkin Yes. And then that vote goes to be rously.

Amazing. So you've got to take care of yourself, that's self-love. But you get a banana bread when your belly's rumbling. Not a joke. That is important. Yeah. Your sleep score is low. Are you getting enough five-blades?

Make it stop. You might remember when Dr. Rang and Chatterjee was on this show. And he said, knowledge isn't enough. I mean, there's more information and data available to us than ever before. And somehow, we've ended up actually. checking an app to find out if we're tired. I know when I'm tired. Knowing isn't the same as knowing what to do.

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SUVW, German engineered for all. Amazon presents Jeff versus Taco Truck Salsa, whether it's Verde, Roja, or the orange one. For Jeff, trying any salsa is like playing Russian roulette with a flamethrower. Luckily, Jeff saved with Amazon and stocked up on antacids, ginger tea, and milk. Habaniero, more like habanier, yes. Save the everyday with Amazon. You had an experience when you were younger that just blew my mind because I had this brain surgery in November 24. It has changed everything.

Everything's different. But you had that, I feel like, at 17. Yeah. With your heart issue. But how did... So can you just explain to everybody how you discovered something was up with your heart? I spat my coffee out. I'm triggered.

I'm triggered. I'm like, she talked about the heart. Oh, God. And that, because I think, were you old enough to understand? Did it have an impact? I think yes and no.

I think it did have an impact. I think going through what you, like going through it at your age so consciously. Yes. It is so much harder. Because I really remember feeling quite dumbfounded by it. So how did you? you discover it? So I used to get heart palpitations a lot. Probably when I was started, when I was

like a teenager. And I would say that, but also I'm asthmatic. So I take venterlin. And my mum is very, she's a nurse. So she was a nurse. She would hire now. She's a hospice nurse, right? She worked an hospice, yeah. She's amazing. Oh my God, amazing. Amazing. And that I think also is part of the impact on this. So I used to take ventaline, which does cause palpitations. So when I said my heart's faster. My mum would say, well, you take venterlins, so you're probably having palpitations from that. Don't worry. But then a girl at our school had seven heart attacks. And how old were you at this point? 17. 16, I was 16, I think. And she survived. Incredible, crazy story. Had a heart transplant. It shocked our whole community. It was like family friends, sort of, I'll never

forget that day. But then when I said, I've got palpitations after that, my mum, it just took a different approach because this really serious thing had happened and she felt my chest and my heart was going and she went what the and we went straight to hospital and I started getting ECGs

and basically found out I had this heart condition and I was at the Brits school at this point and I suppose I was applying it for universities or things about doing that. It's a bit of a blurry timeline. But the doctor sat me down and told me these percentages of survival, what problems I could have when I'm older, pacemaker,

stroke, heart attack, what the surgery included. And I was just sat there and I was thinking, I don't even know where I want to go to uni. Like, I'm finding that quite overwhelming, like three years, it's a really big commitment. You know, so then choosing life or death Yes. It just felt too big, I think, and I think I numbed out because I just thought, oh, what am I going to have for dinner? I don't really know. You know, you can't. Yes. What am I doing this Friday? Like, everything's kind of a big decision and a big commitment when you're young. Yes. And so trying to decide, because I sort of had to take on this decision of the risk of the surgery, the risk of not doing the surgery. And I just didn't know what to do. And your mum was with you. Yeah, my mum was with me. helping you navigate. She was really angry with the doctor for putting these kind of stats on me

and we were trying to figure out together but what happened is I had this episode at school where if I was told, if you get chest pain, go to hospital if you're having palpitations and you get chest pain go to hospital and I had palpitations

and I got chest pain and I was so scared that I just like went and sat in a room at school and I was thinking is this really happening? Am I making this up? Am I making a big deal out? Yeah, I don't really not.

Am I being difficult? Yeah, what do I do? I'm just going to hide in this room. And I think the deputy head found me in the room crying. And she was amazing. She took me to hospital. I went to like Croydon on a Friday night, A&E. It was awful.

This guy covered in blood in some like drunken spat next to me. He was like, do you come here often? And I was like, no. And I'm hooked up to all this stuff. And essentially it got so bad. that I didn't have to make the decision. I had to have the procedure. And by the time that happened,

I had gotten rejected from all uni's. And I was working in Nando's. And I took time of Nandoes to have heart surgery. I mean. And so I remember, like, yeah, having the heart surgery. And it was so scary because they had to laser off part of my heart. What did you think when you went? in and they put the anaesthetic into your arm.

Did you go to sleep thinking? So I didn't go to sleep. Are they had to keep me awake? Oh, they kept you awake? Yes, of course. So it was weird because I was on drugs. During the operation, you were awake? But I felt, you know what's so sad is I was this teenage girl and I was like,

everyone's seeing me naked. Oh! And I was so embarrassed. And I was sort of more embarrassed about being seen naked than maybe dying or having a pacemaker or something, you know. God, isn't that interesting? And then I could feel the tubes because they had to keep me awake for it.

Go up your veins, is it? Up your veins? They put like three holes here, two holes here and then these tubes like you can feel them going up and it hurts. And then you're on fire in your chest and it was quite cool, I guess, to experience that. I thought this is very intense

but quite a cool to know what this feels like. And then I was in like recovery in hospital my younger sister came in and I had to have a catheter. because I realized after it you can't go to the toilet. You can't stand up because you would bleed out. Right. So they tried.

I know. I was like, oh, God. So then I tried to try a bedpan. And I was just too nervous then. I couldn't use a bedpan. So they had to do a catheter. And then I had like a bag of pee and my sister's like taking photos of it with her digital camera and like making fun of me and being like, I'm going to put this on Myspace. Yeah, my space is a thing.

Yeah. But I had some alone time in there. And I remember like, you just don't get cleaned up. I said I had all the blood everywhere. And I just lay in the bed by myself. And I think I had this moment of thinking, I don't want to go back to Nando's. And so I quit Nando's to sort of recover from this thing.

But then I needed another job. I ended up working at River Island. But when I went back to River Island, I was like, I have to do something. My friends are going to uni. My friends are traveling. My friends are doing this course. And I'm working in River Island at the Harlequin Centre in Watford and I'm just not doing anything.

And I really want to be creative. And I booked my first gig. I had this time at home and I'm going to make these demos. Did they get you a guitar? Yes. So I broke my foot and I was like depressed. And I think because I'd had the heart and then the foot. My mum and dad bought me my first guitar.

And I had my laptop and I was making these little demos. And I made this deal with myself. Once my foot is healed, I'm going to go live with my MySpace page. I'm going to upload all these demos to MySpace. And I'm going to go to Trinity and Harry, which was like the local bar that had nights, music nights. And I'm going to book a gig. And before that, I would have been so scared to do it. So these two events in your life gave you the courage.

What could have been seen as... And I don't think I consciously connected it. No, but what could have been seen as disasters that could have made you think, oh, poor me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You never went victim. But yeah, I do think it's looking back on it without me consciously connecting it at the time. Because when you're young, I don't think you can. I think, well, that's obviously why I was so adamant.

I'm not going to have a backup plan. I'm not going to, like, you know, secure myself in the other way. I need to do something now. I need to do it now. I need to have an interesting life, you know. But I think this is what near-death experiences give you. Yeah. Yeah.

I want to live. I want to live. And I don't just want to live. normally I want to really live. Yeah. And it's this immediate feeling. And it gave me the courage because I was so scared at the thought of doing a show.

I didn't know what was doing at all. And I made a flyer. And it's actually 20 years on April 13th to the day of my first gig. April 13th, 2006 was my first gig at Trinity. Wow. And I went live with my MySpace. It's funny as an adult. I think if it happened to me now,

it would be even more stressful because like you know about risk and you know that consequence. You've lost people. People I know have died. And there's an awareness. And like you're saying, you really know life isn't going to last forever.

And it gets a bit more serious, isn't it? And I think when you're young, that sort of numb, numbness came in, but then action. And I've got to live. I've got to do it. And I want to do fun things. I want to do,

I want to have an interesting life. And I've worked hard at school. And like, I want to be creative. And I just, I just went for it, but I got paid £30 for the gig, which I didn't know I was getting. And once that £30 on in my hand, I was, oh my God, you can actually get, you can get money for doing this. And I woke up the next day and I quit River Island. I called them.

And I said, I've made some steps in the right direction towards the career I really want. I've played a bar in my hometown. And I got paid £30, okay? And I was like, I can't come back to work. And then my boss said, can you return the fob? And I said, no, I can't come. I'm sorry, I just can't. I'm done.

I'm done. I can't come back. I'm just, while too busy now, trying to book gigs all over London. And I just really went for it. Okay, guys, I need you in my begin again gang. Listen, it's the most funnest, most awesome club in the whole world. And I want you to be part of it.

So when you sign up to our newsletter, you get all the bits that I don't share anywhere else. Things that I'm loving, what I'm reading, my favorite outfits, some of the most gorgeous Begin Again stories that you've sent in. I actually really love reading those. It's one of my favorite parts of the week. And the really fun bit is I will also share some Begin Again secrets like what guests we've got coming up and you'll know before anyone else does. So come and join the best gang ever. The links right below and it just takes five seconds and

it's free. Can you look back now and see what a brave young woman you were? Can you appreciate how brilliant and brave that was? Yes, and I'm really okay with my younger self now because I had to do a lot of work. Because when you are famous from 18 and you have a number one record at 18, made of bricks, and then for the rest of my life, that's what I'm mostly known for.

You know, I haven't had my other music isn't as commercially successful, which has been my intention, you know, not to chase commercial success. Yeah, you're just true to yourself. Yeah. Yeah, it's not about that. It's not about that for me, but other people will project onto me what that means as failure and sort of see me as an 18 year old, like forever. You have to do a lot of work to be okay with that. And I've done that work. And it's really, my 10-year anniversary of Made of Bricks was so healing for me.

After everything that I went through in my career, getting dropped, getting stolen from, and feeling like such an idiot. And all the trauma of that stuff I was saying, like, being 18 in the Daily Mail, like deciding this is who you are, you're a fake, you're, you know, mockney accent, your acne. I didn't get famous until I was 25. Yeah. But at 18, I don't know how you coped. It was, yeah, and it was really cruel back then.

And all that stuff, right? Tell me some of the things that the papers used to say about you because I bet you remember. Fat, ugly. I mean, just that... There's an 18-year-old. Fat, ugly. And I took actually more personal,

I felt like my peers who were men that were young that had debut albums that were extremely successful were geniuses and legends. And I was like a silly little teenage girl. And writing your diary is stupid. And that has been so reclaimed now, which I absolutely love.

I mean, I used to write a diary. You used to write a diary. And I interviewed an amazing kind of big thinker in the business world. Robin Sharma, that he's written that book up there at 5am Club. And he journals every day, he wakes up at 5 and he journals and he writes and there you were being ridiculed for it. Yeah. But meanwhile, everyone's doing it now. You were the OG.

The OG. But it was also like a huge success and kids love, young girls loved it and connected with it. And so it wasn't something silly. And what I realized, I think, I was lucky to realize, that if you're calling me these things, and I look out and I see loads of girls that are like getting my hair cut and look like me or you're calling all of them those things as well. And I realized that really early on. And I think that empowered me and made me be able to handle it to be like, I'm going to be okay for them because these lot are attacking all of us. Like I'm actually not alone in this because if they read that, they're going to think, oh, well, I'm not okay either.

and I'd also gone through a manager stealing money from me. Yes. Can you just talk about... Sorry. Sorry. Yeah, well, no, that was a big thing because, you know, you were quite... Your manager from quite young and you trusted him. Yeah.

And I mean, it's like a breakup with a... Well, it's like a breakup with a lover. I did trust him to guys. You know, you're like, what? It's the... Such a betrayal. Such a betrayal. And you feel so stupid.

Someone steals, you feel such a fool. You feel such an idiot. I mean, I hate the word shouldn't, but that's sad that you felt like that. Yeah. You were wronged. Yes, but it's good to me that it happened now. It is because in the music industry,

we are treated like fools that shouldn't really understand the contracts that we sign. You sign them at 17, it's fine, you'll be in there until you're 67, doesn't really matter. own 80% of everything you learn. But, you know, it's the way. And you're like, okay, that's the universal contract that I'm still in now. And we're used as bartering chips and we're very, like, soloed off.

And like, you know, don't tell people this. Don't, it doesn't matter. You know, just drink this, take this line, blah, blah, blah. But yeah, I really, I learned to be okay with my young self on the 10-year anniversary tour because I'd felt like after getting stolen from, I'm not worth anything in this industry. I am stupid. I've failed. I need to toughen up.

I need to know business. You know, I need to be a hard nut. Like if I'm going to do this, I need to be, you know, like, girl boss. Like, we've got to be everything. And I just couldn't really do it. I just was, it wasn't really me. And the interesting thing was going on the Made of Bricks tour. And I suddenly was met with all of these people who grew up, you know, with the music and they were there.

And everyone sang every single word. felt like their hearts were like pounding out of their chest. There was friends, you know, people had come to celebrate this thing from there from 10 years ago. And I, there was a group of girls who wrote to me. They were in Manchester and they said, our friend at school, we all used to grow up listening to you. You were everything to her. Like, she was Mariela and she didn't, she lost her battle with mental health and we're here for her tonight. We really want you to read this letter. And I got the message.

And then when I was playing, I looked up on the balcony, I just saw these girls arm in arm. I knew it was them. I could just tell the way they were together. And I thought, this is why I'm not a hardener, you know. I mean, I am a bit of a hard nut, but not in terms of music. Like, I'm not going to harden. I'm not going to become bitter. I don't have to be able to do it all.

And if I close that off, actually, and if I close off my vulnerability, my willingness to be open, to bring people in, which is my nature, I'll lose all of this. This is why I have this and this is valuable to me. And so it made me okay with it all. So I kind of healed in this really loving way and I sort of sat with my teenage self. I feel like she was on stage because I went through all these songs I'd written

some of them when I was 16 and I was like, go on. You fucking sorted us out for a whole life. Like, that's pretty amazing. Thank you, 17-year-old, 16-year-old Kate for, like, taking care of life in such an incredible way. And I felt, yeah, I was like, I'm good with you. I'm good with whatever the Daily Mail or Internet or people or whoever have said it doesn't actually matter because you did this.

And that's what my whole life is sort of about now. Then you moved to L.A. Then I moved to L.A. Like, how did that happen? So I made an album there in 2012, and I had an acting. manager there and it just became a bit of a escape. Once I made this record that I went through a breakup. I made all these friends through kind of making music and having an acting manager and it was what I think is interesting because you went to the Brit school. Yeah. And you've done what society

doesn't allow artists to do, which is you flip-flopped. I do, yeah. Acting, singing, acting, singing. normally you're a singer and then you go and do a bit of acting and they go oh no they've done acting like they're going you've brilliantly straddled the two

was that a conscious decision when you were at the Brits like right this is what I want to be I want to be both things I think yeah I grew up writing songs music felt like the predominant I would say like calling

I suppose and that's your call music is my way of expressing myself yeah and then I studied theatre at the Brits school and I loved theatre and you know

Had I not done that, I wouldn't have made made a bricks. Doing theatre made me comfortable with myself in a way that I think doing a music course wouldn't have because I had to sit in these silences and create plays from scratch and, you know, perform in the silence of the theatre is really intimate. And you do as an act to have to sort of shed things from yourself

to sit on stage and be another character. So I think that helped me find my own voice in a way. Kind of weirdly shedding stuff about yourself. helps you sort of find yourself again. So when you went to L.A., was it like a conscious decision to explore that side of yourself a bit more? Yes, it was two things.

It was, I'd gone through a breakup, I'd got dropped by my label, I made a punk record in... Can I just also say, sorry, so brave. No, it was like... No, it is what I love... It's mad, I love you. I love you.

What was that NME? NME said something about it. Kate Nash's created career, suicide. Yes. It sounds amazing. And it sounds amazing. It's my favourite headline.

Is that not the best great? That's what you are. Yeah. You have done this unimaginably brave thing. You've jumped off and you've done something you wanted to do. And it's fucking great. I will just like push the big red button in the room. Yeah.

Sort of despite the consequences sometimes. I mean. I have that. I do like doing that. Sorry, we will get back to L.A. I know I keep interrupting. You were angry. I was raging, yeah.

Yes. It was female rage. Yes. It was female rage. It was how I'd been treated by the media. How I was boxed in by my label. They told me, oh, I don't like that vocal. It sounds like you're screaming like a little girl.

And I was like, what the hell's wrong with screaming like a little girl? Like, that's cool. I think that's really punk. I was in a weird relationship, the media with this, that and the other one. I just was like, you know, I needed to let the rage out. It's very powerful. It was, it was. It had to, that was one of those albums where I thought,

I need to make this or I'm going to die. You know, it was that female, youthful, like, like, I'm at war with, like, misogyny and how I've been treated and how this fame thing and how people see me. And just, what I want to do is, like, make art and music and have community and put on shows. And punk was really important to me. And so I found my outlet for all of that in that kind of punk music.

It was quite rare what I was doing. I fired my band. I hired all women. No one was doing that at the time. I got really emotional watching Chapel Rhone actually at Redding because she has a full female band. And I was like, she's the biggest pop star in America. Like over here in so many countries.

And she is an all female band. When I did it, no one was doing it. Sound check felt like we had to prove ourselves to crew members. And I just thought, how cool. But at that time, I did feel those young girls are looking at me. They don't necessarily relate to me. But there should be a woman on stage. stage doing each job. There should be like my lighting engine should be a woman, my sound

engineer should be a woman. Like we need, first of all, I need more female company on the road. And I also just need examples of women in music. Because if you want to be feminist, you have to also create those positions. I'm an employer, I guess I realized. I'm an employer. So I was on this like war rampage and I'd made this album in LA. So I had friends there. And I just kept going back. And when I felt bad at home, I would go there. And then I started like dating people. and I got a manager there and like a music manager, which was the one that stole from me, but it became this sunny people are like,

how are you? You know, this like, have a nice day thing. I fucking needed that. I needed sunshine and blue sky and people to be, wow, you're a musician, that's amazing. You've had a number one record, incredible, and now you have a whole other career, so cool, instead of, oh, you just had one hit when you're 18,

You're nothing. You know, like the sort of British attitude of just like, oh, prove yourself for the rest of your life, even though we do love that song, but fuck you! And you're just like, okay. It's quite a weird attitude that we have here. And I needed L.A. at that time. And so I got there, I think it melted my...

I think had I not done it, I just would have... If I stayed in London, I would have become really paranoid. Yes. Really? Oh, everyone's looking at me, judging me. They know me as this, and I sort of would have stayed in that shell or as in LA, I could be new. I could be in my 20s and I could go, who am I?

Who am I as an adult? Who am I? Find, figure out who I am, you know, which everyone's doing in their 20s, but without the media, without this sort of voice. The heat. Yeah. And then it's sort of, yeah, cultivated with me getting glow

because I had gone, I'd also like to give this acting thing a proper go. I'm an audition. So for anybody that didn't get to see, it's still on Netflix. Yes, three seasons. So everybody can see it. Yes.

If you didn't see it, I'm just going to speak to camera. I never do this, but... Go. Watch it. It's really, really good. And heartwarming and life affirming and life affirming and moving. It's everything. And weird and funny.

I can't... I'm iconic. Yeah, yeah. Well, you tell everybody... Sorry, I was about to launch into... You tell everybody what it was about. So Glow is the gorgeous ladies of wrestling. It was a real...

show in the 80s. It was the first time they put lady wrestlers on TV. And it's, there's a documentary about it. You have to watch the documentaries. Oh my God. Okay. Unreal. You send me that. Yeah. So they were real wrestlers and a lot of them weren't from wrestling backgrounds. They were just wanting to be on TV shows and they had the good girls and the bad girls and they lived in a hotel together for real. And it was the 80s. So it was un... God, wait. So this was on telly in the 80s. I totally like missed this. Yeah. It became a kids show really.

It's like Big Brother or something, you know, like everybody living together in a hotel. Yes. And sort of that wasn't really, you know, they weren't like treated the best. There's some girls saying, like, we had these chainsaws and the audience thought there was no real, not they were real. You know, the sort of health and safety that didn't exist in the 80s applied to that situation. And wrestling, which is quite, you know, a wild industry. And predominantly, historically, always men. Exactly.

I've never seen... It was this first thing. And it became a kids' show, but they also had songs. So they used to rap in the ring. And it's just ridiculous, really bizarre, really weird raps, girls that can't really sing or rap, you know. I saw that one with you. Yeah. And that's based on how it really was.

Brilliant. And they did all these weird. skits and then that would turn into like the storylines of the wrestling characters. So it was based on these real women. And then ours is obviously a fictionalised sort of comedy drama of these women in LA who end up learning to wrestle. And it was very meta because that was what we were doing too. How hard was it to learn?

It is quite hard to learn to wrestle. Yeah. It's, I mean, it's quite scary. But it's a good kind of pain as well. There's like something about. pain in that physical fight. I mean, you were used to that. That's what's so funny.

Your sisters have basically trained you for that part. They train me so well. They train me so well. And all those punches to the head and spine. It's like for anybody else, it would have been an assault. But you were like, I was like, yeah. This is a walk in the park compared to being with my sisters.

It was such a thrill to hit the mat and feel the adrenaline and learn to take. the pain and at the beginning of training after a few seasons it would be like or after season one or two we'd be said oh you've got ring rust you need to run the ropes and kind of toughen up and you do get this kind of strength

it's a bit like touring on the second day of tour is the worst day of tour because you have this bang over from like your neck and you go oh I see because you've been dancing you've moved and you're just not tour you've just done one gig and you feel destroyed and you

how am I going to do this for six weeks. Yes. But halfway through, you're just tough. Stamina. Yeah, you've got stamina. Your muscles are all warmed up. But wrestling, it gave me a physical connection to myself

that I'd never had before. And Chavo Guerrero, who's a wrestling legend from a family of wrestling legends, he was our coach. Chavo was so great with us. He was the least sort of PC-trained person to have in with us. But the most safest, the Guerrero, name like taught the original glow girls. That's why I think it was quite witchy, because weird stuff happened on set.

Go on. Stuff would happen that would be happening to people in real life that would then show up in the script and would become part of the storylines. We'd call it a gloman. The girls would be like another gloman. It's a gloman. Oh my God, it's a glomen. So something would be happening and then like that.

Something would be happening to one of the girls and then like similar storylines would show up in, I just think women altogether we're channeling these real women. This is like sinking periods. I mean, of course we synced periods. It was, we would get in so much trouble from the first AD. The first AD, I think, like, quit on the first season because he was like, these girls, you just can't control them. We'd be being told to shut up and, like,

Alison B. would be, like, leading a musical number. And, I mean, the camaraderie. And how close we were by episode one. Because we'd already been in each other's crotches. And I think one of the girls were stretching and, like, queefed like in my face on one of the mats like before we'd even shot the first scene. We were really close. We were really close.

In case anybody doesn't know what a quefe is. It's a fanny fart. DeVina. It's what it is. Teaching you guys again. Yeah. I can see that clipped up on Instagram. Women are feared because we have a community.

Yes. Yeah. Of a bond. An invisible bond that we have. have with every woman in the world. I can usually walk down the street and I see a woman and she looks at me and we just go, like, I got your back. Yeah, because she's also like, thank you, Davina, and I love you and I'm so obsessed with you

and you're like, that's all right. But it's a... No, there is, there is that camaraderie. It's why if you see a woman crying, walking down the street at night or even during the day, you're like, are you okay? I've always done that, do you? Yeah, yeah, if I'm driving plays, do you need a lift, right, like what's going on? do that as well. I get people lifts. I get people Uber's home if they're too drunk to

order one or something on a bench. I'm like, you really need to sit with you while I wait for it. Anybody watching this, please take a leaf out of, do that. Yeah. But I think a lot of girls do you do that. Help people. Right. But any man watching. Yes. Let's make the world a best place. Let's all try a little bit. So you, glow. We know what glow is now. Yes. You got this part. Yeah. It was literally made for you. Did you have the no. Yes, I did. I did. What did that feel like?

So it's funny because the reason I got the audition for Glow is because I did a pilot for Genji Cohen and Gus Van Sant that never came out about the Salem witch trials. It was called The Devil You Know. I played a character called Bridget Bishop. And I played Rhonda Richardson in Glow. And I just like that alliteration. Bridget Bishop was a real witch, you know, from the 1800s.

God, another part like literally made for you. And it was this incredible experience in Boston and based on history and very much like the audition was like putting piss and cake and like I stuck a thing up a woman's vagina in the woods and kissed her and then I'm like, you know, I was like, oh, I love this. It's just like insane.

And we all thought that was going to get made. It didn't get picked up. But I got the opportunity to then audition for Glow because Jenji knew me. And I knew, I felt. that witch show. And then when I got the opportunity, I was like, I'm getting this. I'm getting this. I just knew. It just felt so right. You know, I don't know what that is, but it just feels when you're like, this I can actually 100% do. This fits me like a glove. I can do this, you know. And yeah,

I did have that sort of, I'll do anything to prove I can do it and get it. But I just did a scene and then I did an audition tape of Britannica, the wrestling character. Because our characters had wrestling characters. And so I did one of the songs, I did this like weird little tape. I don't know. I did have that knowing. It is the thing, isn't it?

It's weird that. It's weird. Because yeah, a lot of the time you're just shooting in the dark with stuff. But I do come back to feeling like some things really do feel like they're meant to happen. And I think we have loads of,

I think we have loads of choices and loads of directions that we can go. But every now and then you get to this point and it's like, oh, this is going to spin you there. And also, sometimes you need a win. Yes. Sometimes you need a win

and I needed a win and I got glow and I was like all that praying finally, no but just in career you need a win sometimes. I'm always talking about

the universe. Yeah. You know, when I look out for myself I've got my back and when I haven't got my back the universe has. Yeah. And something happens.

Yeah. And I do have a sense of that spirituality and connection to that. The knowing. Like you know. Got instinct, intuition, you know, magic and fairies and whatever you want to call it, universe, like connection to something bigger than ourselves.

And every now and then there's a real strong feeling about it. And sometimes there isn't and it's confusing. But when there is, yeah, it's a knowing, isn't it? The thing that I'm channeling love into at the moment is venues. Okay. And I know that you've got some big thoughts about this. And I, you and I think we were reborn in nightclubs. Yeah.

I was, I found myself dancing. Dance floor. Yeah. And I follow all the kind of EDM accounts on Instagram. Yeah. But all the small venues, they can't afford to stay open. Oh, I know. government is making it almost impossible and the taxes on alcohol and makes it impossible

for these venues to stay open. So they're all closing, which has a knock-on effect for DJs, musicians, kids. Where are you going to go and release your tension, your stress? How can you let go? How can you hear of new things? It's so important. How do musicians start? Like you started with a broken ankle.

We play the guitar going, right, when this is done, I'm going to gig. And you could. Yes, I could afford to do it. Yes. 30 quid would actually buy me some drinks at the bar and like I could say, you know, it's so hard for young people now. I don't think people are thinking through this pipeline. What will glastrum re-line up look like in 20 years?

I don't know because I don't know what UK artists will have been able to develop into what I'm saying that like I have with my bandmates. Flow state practice. Practice, practice, practice, practice. Practice is really important. Practice your craft. If you can't actually practice it, this is why I, went down the music avenue first because I couldn't practice acting because I couldn't get into a university to do it. So I couldn't, you know, if you don't get given a job, it was like,

I can book a gig, I can go and do a gig. And like doing shows and playing music has made me a better performer. The more I do it, the better I get. That's the cool thing about performances. It's, it was something always new to discover, right? And the government are actually trying to help now and I think we do of the ear of MPs and I was invited to Parliament to speaker and music venue trust event where all the MPs, I told them shut up and like listen to me, got them to put their fingertips

in the air for foundations. Did you? Yeah, because it was one of those rooms where the sound if people talk, you know, like a wedding when it's like, why is it so loud? Everyone's just talking at like this volume but it'll just, like, just talk and everyone's drinking champagne and I was like, I'm going to lose them, I have to just walk through the crowd and tell everyone to shut up because I'm here to talk about something really important and you all know who I am.

So listen, because I've got experience, got 20 years of experience under my belt. And I'm telling you that this is a massive problem. Even me, it's massive. Even me. I have, you know, a catalogue that's even though Universal take 80% of, I'm still earning a living from it. I'm selling out venues.

I have thousands of fans, millions of streams. You know, I can book the tours and people will come. I'm losing so much money doing it. This is insane. So how is anyone who has less than I have? This is insane. I mean, I started an OnlyFans account. Yeah.

And a campaign called Butts for Tour buses to get attention, obviously. But also to genuinely make up for the losses and trying to get all my invoices in before Christmas and like... Can I tell you something about your OnlyFans thing for me? It was about the most punk thing I've ever heard in my life. Thank you for getting it. Oh my God. I so got it.

Yeah. I was like, it just, I really, really, really love you for that. Firstly, because it really highlighted how absolutely messed up. Yes. The music industry is. Yeah. That you cannot make a living at your... From millions of streams.

And thousands of people buying it. Millions of streams. How much do you get on Spotify per stream? 0.0.03 of a penny. I think it is per stream. It doesn't add up to very much. It's insane. And then depending on who the rights holders are.

But the two of them point the fingers at each other. So Spotify responded to me recently and they were like, well, we're not really in control of like who holds the rights to Kate's music. And we've paid out over 500,000 pounds to one of her songs. I'm like, first well, that's not enough money. 20 years. Like, that's almost over 100 million streams.

That's not enough money. That's insane. When you think in the olden days of records, what that would have 100 million records sold. Yeah. And people just aren't being paid fairly for their work. No. And then what's happened with the music,

live music side of things is it's so expensive to put on a gig, the cost of, the same as everyone else at home, you know, the cost of living crisis, everything's gone up. So when I, there's less some rehearsal rooms now because in the pandemic rehearsal rooms shut down or people that used to rent out gear and vans, a lot of them closed. So everything's a bit more expensive.

Even before going on tour, I spent thousands on wages that have gone up, rightly so. Obviously, I believe I want to pay people well. But wages go up, rehearsal room costs go up, renting a van or a bus has gone up in price. The petrol has gone up. Printing merch has gone up. Now venues are taking a percentage of the merch that's also gone up. Eating food has gone up. Hotel costs have gone up.

But musicians' fees for some reason, none of our stuff goes up. The value of our music's gone down. I mean, when you say it like that, that is nuts. Yeah, and I'm not putting on insane shows. I'm not, because of the amount of men in my DMs telling me that they'd love to be my tour manager and fix all my problems, please fuck off. I am, I have really a great team.

And I'm making a choice, Davina, to keep a human band. Yeah, I know. I could just stand on stage with backing tracks and cash in. But I have something really special and I believe in live music and I love musicians. And I think that culture has the right to exist. And I believe I have the right to be able to afford to pay for that 20 years in. If you don't fight, it will literally fucking disappear. It will disappear.

It will. It will disappear. And yeah, I have a lighting engineer and a sound person. And like if I do a London show, I might put a bit extra into the show. But I'm not doing crazy stuff. You know, I'm not building huge. sets and, you know, pyrotechnics or stuff that cost loads of money and bringing an extra. It's like, it's a quality of its standard.

It's like the standard I set for my show that I believe I have earned that the sound and the lights and my band should be able to be there. I'm not asking for the heavens. Of course I would do more if I could, but the basics I have to cover. I have to. People are paying tickets to come and see me for 20 years. It's got to be a good show. And you just, I was like, if I can't do it, you know, how are people, and I'm seeing the results of like young people, but they're, you know, in 30, 32, 33, they just can't go on tour, they can't do shows.

They're stuck. They're stuck. And they're some of the most talented artists that we have in this country. And we pride ourselves on our cutting edge, London, UK, like we are culture. It's like you're fucking killing it. And it's not going to be there. It's not going to be there if you don't protect it. have to protect it, nurture it.

How can we support you? Oh, my OnlyFans.com. That's Kate Nash. No. But wait, say that again slower. Only, let's just say it. Well, to support me. Yeah, to support you personally to be able to keep going.

Onlyfans.com forward slash Kate Nash. Thank you. I was saying to people on tour I would say, don't stream my music. That might help. Buy it if you want to buy it. Bandcamp. I mean, stream it.

It's fine. Sort of sarcasm. I know people stream. but if you stream an artist, it doesn't support them financially. So don't have any delusions about that. Buy their merch, buy their only fans. And write to your MPs. The government, I think, is the way forward.

Because these massive companies, Live Nation... When we write to our MPs, what are we asking? What do we need them to do to help music? Yeah, so you write to them to tell them that you care about music. that it's why it's important to you and that you're worried about the cost of touring crisis. You're worried about seeing venues in your local area close. And that is really depressing. Yeah. And that you think that musicians should be paid fairly for their work, that you value their work.

There's a fan-led review. My friend Sam Duckworth and the Music Venue Trust are doing a lot of work to, if you believe that we live in a democratic society, then this is why data is so important. important, right? Because fans' voices really matter because that is democracy. If the public think something and tell the government something, the government is supposed to act. That's what we believe we live in a democratic society. So collecting fan-led data could help us change the industry. So follow the fan-led review and participate in the surveys. And that will help us. I think the only route forward is changing the law. I don't think these companies that make millions are going to changed the law. And I just want everybody to take a leaf out of your book because I think people

sometimes as a fan you can think, well, what difference am I going to make? You are going to make a difference. Be one of the scratches. Yeah. In the tunnel. We need all of you. Just be a little scratch. And look where the scratch is led. Yes. Freedom. Exactly. I did do it. So the day that I had my London show and I was doing all the only fan stuff, I went and did this protest. where this bus, Save Our Scene, have this bus, and they were like, we could put your balm on the back of a bus and we can go around London. I was like, yes, let's do it.

We went to Parliament, we went to Live Nation, we went to Spotify, and I was there with like a megaphone. And people were getting like velvet sofas delivered into the Spotify building and I'm there like, pay artists, barely! And I get to the venue and I said to my manager, I think I've gone. I said, I've thrown a brick through a window. And she was like, literally,

And I said, no, no, no, not literally, but I just don't think there's any going back from here. But I don't care. I don't care. I hate this exploitation. Can I just show you? Look at my legs. It's injustice. It's not fair.

I don't think you about here. In, I think it was 2002, I presented the Brits. And Brandon Block, one of his mates at his table, said, you've won an award, mate. And he hadn't. that he came up to accept to the award that wasn't his. Oh no. And then he had a fight with Ronnie Wood. Oh my God.

Those in the days. And it was, I was like, oh my God. It was so brilliant. Yeah. And it was because it was punk. Spirited. And it's been neutralised. Yes, it has.

Everything's so styled. Yeah, you've got to. No one's real. Yeah. Everyone's pretending. I'm getting my ass out and shouting. But you're getting your ass out. Yes.

You're throwing the brick through the window. I'm made of bricks, you know. I've got a few to spare. But like, thank you. Because it's empowering people. It matters. It matters. They can't get away with this.

These people are first-hand, I've had first-hand experience of it. I'm angry. That anger has not gone away. Just because I made girl talk. Don't. You know. what I'll say to them. Next time, next time you try and take me out, don't miss.

Yes. Don't miss. Because I will not give up. I am from like Irish stubbornness. Do you know what that means? You're the middle child. I'm the middle. I'm a redhead, for God's sake.

You messed with the wrong woman. Like I will keep going until I'm in a coffin. And like, and if I'm a ghost, I'll do it when I'm a ghost. but I just, there's dreams I have for my career. There's things I want to achieve. But before that, I would sabotage them all. Yes. To get vengeance.

No, not really vengeance. To make a difference. To make it possible for people to have this path. Yes. To have done what I did because it will be a dead end. It'll all be for nothing. If it can't carry on, what's the point? If there's no community and lineage and like you can't inspire,

Like, who inspired me and made it possible for me? Like, what is the point? Also, more importantly as well, you as an artist, connect people. How am I going to connect with other people without music? Without younger generations as well, being able to come up and do it. You bring people together. And we do value that. We do value that.

But we're not putting any actual monetary value on it. And that is the world we live in. We need that monetary value for younger generations, for there to be future artists, which I think in a world where, you know, like I watched a documentary on IPlayer called Once Upon a Time in Northern Ireland. Amazing documentary. And it shows Belfast at the height of the troubles where you couldn't park your car and leave it on its own without the army just blowing it up because it was so dangerous and like so violent in a city. And it was this metal gated place where there was just like shopping and that was it.

And people were just sort of, there was no existence. And then, you know, what came out of that, a guy who almost got dragged into a car and killed one night and he said, you know, if I'm going to die, I want to die, doing what I love. And he opened a record shop. And people travelled the country to go there because they wanted to be with each other

and listen to music and meet people. And then they went to a punk venue. And it would be, you know, you didn't discuss religion. Everyone was mixed and they watched punk bands. And it was like culture. It does matter. Without it, you know, we just have ads. That documentary really inspired me to remind me as well that, you know, in these political times, you can sort of become really casual about all this violence that's happening.

And in the doc, this character who, not character, is a real guy, he owned the record shop, he says, they're like, I wanted to tell my kids when they said, Daddy, what did you do in the troubles? I said, I partied. I had a good time. I drank. I did drugs. I went to punk shows and I like, I didn't kill anyone, you know. And that's really, really valuable to hear in these like aggressive times. It's really important.

So I just passionately want to see things change because I have dedicated my life to participating in culture and putting music at the forefront, right? And I'm not doing that for nothing. that it all just goes away. It's first of all, it's ancient. You can't erase it from humans wanting to connect like that. But I just, I hate that exploitation and how badly these people have treated artists. Have you got other artists on board with you?

I think a lot of artists care. A lot of artists are quite scared to speak out. I've had so many people message me since I've sort of started speaking out. Privately, but they don't want to come in. But also they've been able to share some of my content and some of it's gone viral because it is, the collective feeling. And we can amplify your voice as well as members of the public, like get on board. Yes.

And some people, to be fair, if they're on major labels, it's really hard for them to speak out. And, you know, people do get blacklisted. You know, I'm aware that I have burnt some bridges. But I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. And I think I'll be fine. I just think, you know, like I said, next time, don't miss. because everybody owes you basically because...

No. Yeah, they do. No, no, no, no, no, you have. You've been honest when it's cost you. It's cost you, but you don't care. And that's really rare. I do get a kick out of it. I do get a kick out of it.

I do think it's my heritage. I just think I'd rather... That's what I'm saying. Like, all these dreams I have, I think I'll feel more satisfied if I have made a difference and sort of taken down some of the baddies. maybe it's the Catholic in me or something, I don't know.

It's interesting that the thing that was so difficult for you at the beginning, the thing that was, you know, the shame and the guilt and everything, but actually it is the fire in your belly. Because I really believe in right and wrong, you know. And I say that with also allowing for human mess and I think people can make mistakes. And I'd love for all these companies to turn around and say, yeah, do you know what we're going to do the right thing? We're going to make it fair.

They're not going to do that. No. So we have to change the law. And they better believe that that's happening. And actually, I'm glad because it will be worse for them this way around. Because if they just did it themselves and came to meet us at the table, they could probably get away with a bit less. But when we change the law, they'll really have to come and meet us at the line. And we decide where the line is, you know, my bum and the government.

Oh, my God. Yes. There's one more bit I want to do for you. We've got something for you. And Molly's going to bring it to me now. Okay. This is a little present. What is it?

This is from Helen. We've got you a little letter. I'm going to read it to you. Okay. Oh, that's a quartz heart. Are you ready? From Helen? Yes.

So this is legit from my sister? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Dear Davina, I was meant to write a letter to Kate, but like you'll have learnt in your conversation with her, We're not one for sticking to rules or very good at doing what we're told.

Fortunately, or maybe unfortunately for some, it runs in the family. Oh my God. Our lives have given us so many opportunities to start over again and again and again. Whether we wanted those opportunities or whether they were thrown at us, swerving our entire life projections, I feel like it made us all really adaptable to anything new, uncomfortable or unknown. Adaptable, yeah. I think this year is going to bring a whole new beginning again.

That too. No, I feel like the world is beginning again. Feels huge this year. Yeah, it does, isn't it? Something seismic is coming. And when she said recently, I won't know what to do with myself once this is. finished. It totally threw me. I was confused thinking, what is she talking about? She always knows

what to do. She's always got something up her sleeve, some battle or cause she has to get behind, some project she's been working on for months and years and she's just forgotten to mention. I've never thought of her as someone who could feel lost or stop. I guess I forgot she was human. like the rest of us. And the relentless warrior that everyone sees if the same relentless one was the one we got at home, which is just as fucking annoying when your sister's fighting, alas. I think looking back at all the new beginnings,

whether that closed doors she wanted to keep open or not, she'll realise she entered the next room and ended up taking it over. Suitcases splayed, opened, full of endless clothes, shoes, and a comforting chaos that she thrives in. God, Helen's great with words. Wow.

And hopefully now, as we're a bit older and wiser, she can be a bit kinder herself and take my most consistent advice. Get a therapist. And go on holiday for fuck's sake. From one Nash who can't switch off to another. We were made to get back up and try again with tights full of ladders. Nobly concrete cuts in our knees and just keep stomping forward.

It's true. Here, here, forever. to keep you grounded. Helen. That's the nicest thing she's ever said to me. Frame it. Frame it. She's going to punch you the next time she sees you.

Yeah, she will. She'll knock my teeth out. I can't. I'm in shock. I'll cry when I get home. You know, I can't. How nice is that? I'm so happy for you.

I'm like, I'm actually in shock that also you read that to me. This is the weirdest moment of my life. I feel like, Come on, this is your. You are. That's what this is kind of, isn't it? You literally are the biggest icon.

You are. Like, no, but you are. You are. Like, you've literally been on TV with me and my sister's watching you, like, growing up. Like, I'm in your DNA. You are in my DNA. You literally are. And you just read me a letter from my sister.

We love you. Kate Nash. We love her. We love you. It's a framer. I can't believe you did that. Thank you for doing that. So just in case you missed this episode here,

if you love this episode, I know you're going to love that.