Behind the Bastards - Behind the Bastards Presents: Weird Little Guys
Episode Date: December 15, 2024Here are a couple of our favorite episodes of Molly Conger's Weird Little Guys podcast series. Soldier of Misfortune: Frank Sweeney, Parts 1 & 2 Apple Podcasts Spotify iHeart  See omnystudio.com/...listener for privacy information.
Transcript
Discussion (0)
From audio up, the creators of Stephen King's Strawberry Spring comes The Unborn, a shocking true story.
My babies please, my babies.
One woman, two lives and a secret she would kill to protect.
She went crazy, shot and killed all her farm animals, slaughtered them in front of the kids, tried to burn her house down.
Listen to The Unborn on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
We want to speak out and we want this to stop.
Wow, very powerful.
I'm Ellie Flynn, an investigative journalist,
and this is my journey deep
into the adult entertainment industry.
I really wanted to be a player boy, my doll.
He was like, I'll take you to the top, I'll make you a star.
To expose an alleged predator and the rotten industry
he works in.
It's honestly so much worse than I had anticipated.
We're an army in comparison to him.
From Novel, listen to The Bunny Trap on the iHeart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Join iHeart Media Chairman and CEO Bob Pitman
for a special episode of the hit podcast,
Math & Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing, as he interviews the iconic and
prolific Martha Stewart in front of a live audience in celebration of her 100th book.
Did you ever think you were gonna wind up writing a hundred books?
Yeah.
You did?
Yeah, it's just a minor goal.
Listen to Math & Magic on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Welcome to Decisions Decisions,
the podcast where boundaries are pushed
and conversations get candid.
Join your favorite hosts, me, Weezy WTF.
And me, Mandy B.
As we dive deep into the world
of non-traditional relationships
and explore the often taboo topics surrounding dating, sex, and love.
That's right. Every Monday and Wednesday,
we both invite you to unlearn the outdated narratives
dictated by traditional patriarchal norms.
With a blend of humor, vulnerability, and authenticity,
we share our personal journeys navigating our 30s,
tackling the complexities of modern relationships,
and engage in thought-provoking discussions that challenge societal expectations.
From groundbreaking interviews with diverse guests to relatable stories that'll resonate
with your experiences, Decisions Decisions is going to be your go-to source for the open
dialogue about what it truly means to love and connect in today's world.
Get ready to reshape your understanding of relationships and embrace the freedom of authentic connections.
Tune in and join in the conversation.
Listen to Decisions Decisions
on the Black Effect Podcast Network,
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey everyone, it's John, also known as Dr. John Paul.
And I'm Jordan or Joe Ho.
And we are the BlackFatFilm Podcast. A podcast where all I'm Jordan or Joe Ho. And we are the Black Fat Film Podcast.
A podcast where all the intersections of identity are celebrated.
Oh chat, this year we have had some of our favorite people on including Kid Fury, T.S.
Madison, Amber Ruffin from the Amber and Lacey Show, Angelica Ross and more.
Make sure you listen to the Black Fat Film Podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Alpha Podcast
or whatever you get your podcast girl. Make sure you listen to the Black Fat Fam podcast on the iHeartRadio app, have a podcast,
or whatever you get your podcast, girl.
Ooh, I know that's right.
Hey everybody, Robert here.
Because it's the holidays, we will be continuing our normally scheduled Behind the Bastards
episodes, but every week we're also doing a compilation of one of the other new shows on our network.
Some aren't so new, but this one is.
It's called Weird Little Guys.
It launched this year with one of my friends and favorite researchers, the great Molly
Conger.
And you're going to listen to a two-part episode, which we've cut together for you with a lot
less ads than normal, about a guy named Frank Sweeney.
So please enjoy and happy holidays.
In the quiet town of Avella, Pennsylvania,
Jared and Christy Akron seemed to have it all.
A whirlwind romance, a new home and twins on the way.
What no one knew was that Christy was hiding a secret.
So shocking, it would tear their world apart.
911 response, what's your emergency?
My babies, please, my babies!
One woman, two lives, and the truth more terrifying than anyone could imagine.
They had her as one of the suspects, but they could never prove it.
You're going to go to jail if you don't come with us right now.
Throughout this whole thing, I kept telling myself, nobody's that crazy, crazy.
Uncover the chilling mystery that will leave you questioning everything.
A story of the lengths we go to protect our darkest secrets.
She went crazy, shot and killed all her farm animals, slaughtered them in front of the
kids, tried to burn her house down.
Audio Web presents the Unborn on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your
podcasts.
We want to speak out. We want to raise awareness and we want this to stop.
Wow. Very powerful.
I'm Ellie Flynn and I'm an investigative journalist.
When a group of models from the UK wanted my help,
I went on a journey deep into the heart of the adult entertainment industry.
I really wanted to be a Playboy, my dog. Lingerie, topless.
I said, yes, please.
Because at the centre of this murky world is an alleged predator.
You know who he is because of his pattern of behaviour?
He's just spinning the web for you to get trapped in it.
He's everywhere and has been everywhere.
It's so much worse
and so much more widespread than I had anticipated. Together, we're going to expose him and the
rotten industry he works in. It's not just me. We're an army in comparison to him. Listen
to The Bunny Trap on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. from the frontiers of marketing as he interviews this icon in front of a live audience to celebrate
her 100th book, Martha, the Cookbook, 100 Favorite Recipes with Lessons and Stories
from My Kitchen.
Did you ever think you were going to wind up writing 100 books?
Yeah.
You did?
Yeah, it's just a minor goal.
This intimate and wide-ranging conversation between friends covers the pivotal decisions in Martha's career,
the philosophy that has guided her,
and the source of so much of her creative inspiration.
They actually looked at the July issue
that I had prototyped, and they said, this is fabulous.
What would you do next July?
And I said, well, living is a limitless subject matter.
Listen to Math and Magic on the iHeart Radio app,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey, everyone.
It's John, also known as Dr. John Paul.
And I'm Jordan, or Joe Ho.
And we are the BlackFatFilm Podcast.
A podcast where all the intersections of identity are celebrated.
Ooh, chat.
This year we have had some of our favorite people on,
including Kid Fury, T.S. Madison, Amber Ruffin
from the Amber and Lacey Show, Angelica Ross, and more.
Make sure you listen to the Black Fat Fam podcast
on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or whatever
you get your podcast, girl.
Ooh, I know that's right.
The forces shaping markets and the economy
are often hiding behind a blur of numbers.
So that's why we created The Big Take from Bloomberg podcasts to give you the context
you need to make sense of it all.
Every day in just 15 minutes, we dive into one global business story that matters.
You'll hear from Bloomberg journalists like Matt Levine.
A lot of this BIM stock stuff I think, embarrassing to the SEC.
Amanda Moll, who writes our Business Week buying power column.
Very few companies who go viral are, like, totally prepared for what that means.
And Zoe Tillman, senior legal reporter.
Courts are not supposed to decide elections.
Courts are not really supposed to play a big role in choosing our elected
leaders. It's for the voters to decide.
Follow The Big Take podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen.
This is a story that begins and ends in bank parking lots, more or less, in the way that stories can
really begin or end. Our subject today was alive before the story begins and as
I'm writing this he's still alive but for the purposes of this telling we'll
start outside the Palisade Trust Company Bank in Englewood, New Jersey on February
23rd, 1962 when an 18 18-year-old member of
the American Nazi Party was arrested after skipping school to try to rob a bank with a toy gun.
And we'll mark the beginning of the end of his story in a Wells Fargo parking lot in Garden City,
Idaho on October 13th, 2018, when an elderly ex-con was caught on security cam footage,
getting into an altercation with a couple who didn't move forward quickly enough at the drive-up ATM.
In the decades in between, Frank Sweeney went to prison
at least half a dozen times, fought as a foreign mercenary,
got deported from both Rhodesia and South Africa,
helped an escaped spy evade US Marshals,
turned state's witness
against a Hitler-worshipping serial killer,
tried to help the mob, and waged a three-year campaign of terror and harassment
against a woman who made a passing comment about how he was parked outside
the post office. I'm Molly Conger and this is Weird strange one.
The first few episodes of this show were stories I already knew and thought you should know
too.
Kevin Strome was a prominent figure in the white supremacist movement for decades, and
it was big local news here in Charlottesville when he was arrested 20 years ago.
The Gerald Drake case was something I read about when it happened.
The cases against the gun-trafficking Nazi paramilitary group was a story I spent years
reading, paying 10 cents a page, one court filing at a time as it wound its way through the system.
But this one, this one is brand new to me.
And I think it will be brand new to just about everybody because for as many times as this
man shows up in the newspaper over the last 60 years, I haven't found any one source
that's gathered together the threads of his life and tried
to make sense of how one man's name could appear in so many other people's stories.
Because that's where I found him.
In someone else's story.
I was reading a biography of a particularly nasty little guy one will definitely get to
eventually in another episode, when my weird little guy detector went off, call it a gut feeling.
But this passing mention of a side character in the life of a serial killer
was enough to get me to put that book down and spend days digging through
newspaper archives trying to figure out Frank.
And what I found was kind of a bizarro world Forrest Gump.
One man whose life keeps intersecting with major historical events,
just wandering in and out of the lives of gullible reporters,
frustrated federal agents, and the innocent bystanders who accidentally became his targets.
Just bumbling his way through history, but without any of Tom Hanks' charm.
I know we don't really know each other yet.
I haven't earned the trust it takes to know you'll believe me when I promise you a two-parter
is worth the wait in between, but I think you'll agree.
Frank's story is weird enough for two episodes.
Frank Abbott Sweeney Jr. was born in August of 1943 in New Jersey to Frank Abbott Sweeney
Sr., a realtor, and Marie Gleason Sweeney, a homemaker who taught violin lessons and
volunteered with the Red Cross. As a lifelong con artist, a lot of what he's told reporters
about his own life is self-serving
fiction, which would sometimes get published without fact-checking and then reappear in
later accounts as fact.
It was in the newspaper, after all.
So I've taken great pains to verify what I can, debunk what I can, and take note of
the things I can only offer you with a grain of salt."
Some of Frank's own lies are easily disproved, like the resume he gave a Rhodesian army recruiter.
On it, he claimed he graduated from Georgetown University in 1965 with a degree in psychology,
but he couldn't possibly have matriculated at Georgetown in 1961. He was a senior at Tenafly High School in 1962 when he was sent to the Annandale Reformatory
for two and a half years.
He never finished high school.
His claim that his alias Francis Shellhammer derives from his mother's maiden name also
fails to hold up to scrutiny.
His mother was born Marie Gleason to John Gleason, a fireman, and Lottie Gross Gleason
in Chicago.
And I was generous here.
I wasted a lot of time.
I even checked his grandparents.
His middle name, Abbott, was his paternal grandmother Martha's maiden name.
I went as far as to track his family tree all the way back to Ireland, giving him the
benefit of the doubt that maybe there's a shell hammer in there somewhere.
I didn't find one.
It's possible that I started mixing up my Martha's, Mary's, John's, and Francis's
by the time I was cross-referencing marriage records from the 1870s, but he probably just
made it up.
He does a lot of that.
And other aspects of Frank's story would require a trip to the National Archive to sift through
dusty boxes of ancient court transcripts and an unlikely degree of transparency from the Central Intelligence
Agency or a deathbed confession from a mobster or a few tell-all memoirs from US Marshals
to ever hope to sort out.
The rest is somewhere in between.
But I'll stick with what we do know to be true, and I said this story begins outside
of a bank.
On February 23, 1962, Frank Sweeney skipped school.
Shortly after 9 a.m., he walked into a bank in Englewood, New Jersey, approached the teller,
and slid a plastic toy gun that he'd painted black out of a manila envelope.
I'd like to make a withdrawal, he told the teller as he cocked the toy pistol.
I don't know if the teller could tell the gun was fake,
or if she just didn't think this gangly redheaded teenager had it in him to shoot her.
Or maybe she just was having a bad day and didn't care anymore.
Because according to local news reports, she sneered at him, got up, and walked away, leaving
him standing there alone at the counter with his toy gun.
And bewildered by the teller's apparent disinterest in being held at gunpoint, he just put the
plastic pistol back in his pocket, turned around, and walked out the
front door.
And as he was leaving, an off-duty policeman just happened to be walking into the bank.
An employee told the officer what had just happened, and he turned right around and caught
Frank just outside.
He dragged him back inside the bank to be identified by the teller, and as the patrolman
is making the arrest, Frank says to him,
well I guess it didn't work. Later, under interrogation, he would tell the officers that
his plan had been to support the movement, to use the money from the bank robbery to support the
activities of the American Nazi party under George Lincoln Rockwell. At his arraignment, the judge
asked Frank, aren't you the fellow who's been painting swastikas on synagogues around here?
Frank denied this, and he told the judge, I never did anything illegal in my life.
And then he pleaded guilty to the attempted bank robbery.
There's no other mention of Frank in connection with that anti-Semitic vandalism the judge
mentioned, but I did find several newspaper articles about incidents of that sort from the prior two years, when
Frank would have still been a minor.
In January 1960, three unnamed teenage boys were accused of painting swastikas on parked
cars in Emerson, just eight miles away.
In February of 1961, someone hung a swastika banner over the entrance of the synagogue
in Tenafly.
Newspaper articles about that banner reference a similar recent incident at the synagogue
in nearby Englewood.
A few days later, someone painted a swastika over a plaque nearby.
In June, two teenage boys were spotted fleeing the scene after two trailers belonging to
a contractor were broken into and left a swastika painted on the floor inside.
In all of these incidents, police told the papers at the time that they had referred
the cases to the juvenile division. It's not like anti-Semitic incidents are
so rare that I'm saying that Frank is the only possible suspect here in
every 1960s Bergen County news article about a swastika.
I found plenty of other newspaper reports during those same two years about
a local man flying a swastika flag outside of his home, about attacks on Jewish businesses and
synagogues in neighboring cities, and other incidents that just don't fit this particular
pattern of teenage Nazi vandalism.
And the comment the judge made makes it sound like Frank had been there before.
But any appearance he'd made in court as a minor wouldn't have been reported with his name attached to it.
And it's hard enough to get any information about a juvenile case in 2024, so forget figuring
out what happened in 1961.
But it does seem pretty likely he'd at least been a suspect in some of those incidents.
Because at the hearing where he pled guilty to the attempted bank robbery, Frank did
admit that the police had spoken to him on numerous occasions, specifically concerning his
involvement in George Lincoln Rockwell's American Nazi party. For the attempted bank robbery,
Frank was sentenced to an indeterminate term at a boys reformatory, and he was released in October of 1964, shortly after his 21st birthday,
after serving about two and a half years.
After his first stint in jail, Frank returned to his parents' home in New Jersey.
He worked occasionally as a shipping clerk, but it doesn't seem like he was holding down
a steady job.
One afternoon in July of 1967, neighbors reported hearing gunshots in the woods.
An officer drove by to check it out
and saw a car parked on the side of the road.
The car looked empty, so the officer kept driving
without stopping to investigate.
Suddenly the car pulled out behind him
and tried to run the officer off the road.
A brief vehicle chase ensued,
with the officer following the vehicle
for about a mile before the driver, Frank,
parked outside of his parents' home, sued with the officer following the vehicle for about a mile before the driver, Frank,
parked outside of his parents' home, got out, and walked toward the front door.
The officer asked Frank if he'd been shooting guns in the woods, to which Frank replied
only, no, and then warned the officer that he was on private property before walking
away and into the house.
But Frank left something on the front seat of the car,
unfortunately, and it was a Thompson submachine gun
that he'd been firing in the woods.
The officer saw the gun and called for backup.
And when they arrived,
Frank opened fire on them from inside the home,
kicking off a 75-minute gun battle
with more than a dozen cops firing shots at the house
as Frank fired at them through the windows.
Frank's father and brother pleaded with him to come out, or at least to send the family
dog out.
After Police Captain Peter Zerla was shot in the arm, the officers lobbed four canisters
of tear gas through the windows, finally driving Frank out into the front yard where he was
arrested without further incident.
And as they put the handcuffs on him, he turned to Captain Zerla, who's still standing there
in the front yard, bleeding from a gunshot wound.
And Frank says,
"'Some shot when I got you through the window, huh?'
There's no follow-up I can find about whether the dog was hurt or how Mrs. Sweeney got the
tear gas out of her upholstery.
It was the 60s, so maybe her sofa was safely scotch-guarded or wrapped up in one of those
weird plastic covers that were popular back then.
But you have to figure she at least had to replace the curtains.
Frank entered a not-guilty plea and unsuccessfully tried to suppress the evidence of the gun
found on the front seat of the car, with his attorney arguing that it was discovered in an illegal search because
the cop didn't have probable cause to look through the window of the parked
car. That's not how that works. At trial, the defense put on three
psychiatrists to argue for insanity, and the state put on two of their own who
testified that Frank was certainly disturbed, but not legally insane.
The jury deliberated for just three hours before finding Frank guilty of attempted homicide,
assault with the intent to kill, possession of a machine gun, and something called atrocious
assault, that I've never heard of, we don't have that here in Virginia.
But in New Jersey, atrocious assault is an assault and battery, savage and cruel in character,
which results in maiming or wounding.
So that definitely qualifies.
And he was sentenced to six years, which honestly, that's kind of remarkable, right?
I'm not going to bat for the carceral state here, far from it.
More jail time doesn't really fix anybody, and we'll come to see that jail never comes
close to fixing Frank, but reading those 60s news stories about this event was fascinating.
This cop who got shot by a Nazi with a Tommy gun is described in every article as, quote,
lightly wounded.
I mean, he does seem to have not been seriously injured. He
was shot, you know, in the upper arm. I don't think it went through the bone. So it really
was lightly wounded, but that's not what they would put in the newspaper today. You know
it. And the cops didn't drive a tank through the front of this suburban home or unload
their guns into him when he came out. There's been such a massive culture shift over the years in the way we justify aggressive
police response and the way that we talk about the risk to police.
It's just interesting to see that it wasn't always that way.
But there's another unanswered question in the story of this siege in this New York suburb.
What was he doing that day?
I mean, shooting guns in the woods, obviously, but why did he panic when that cop drove by?
And why those woods in particular?
We'll never really know, even if he told us we wouldn't know he's a liar.
But the newspaper articles at the time do say that the officer
initially saw Frank's car parked at the intersection of East Clinton Avenue and
Woodland Street, about a mile from where Frank lived at the time. They used to put
everything in the newspaper. It's so beautiful. Every detail, every boring little
bit. I wish they still did that. And I'm eternally curious about details that probably won't end up mattering, but I pulled
up a map of Teneflay, New Jersey.
And there is a large wooded area you could walk straight into if you parked your car
at that intersection.
And those woods surround a large building that first opened its doors in 1950.
The Kaplan Jewish Community Center.
The clearest account of the next phase of Frank's life comes from an essay written
in 2019 by a retired Rhodesian military policeman.
Despite being the most likely to be more or less true, it's still riddled with
obvious factual inaccuracies, things that just can't be true. Maybe because it was
written as a humorous recollection meant to be read by his fellow former
Rhodesian soldiers and maybe his memory has faded a bit in the nearly 50 years since the event in question. But it does at the very least substantiate
Frank's own claim about having enlisted in the Rhodesian light infantry in the early
1970s. I'll try to walk the tightrope here of providing a little more context than just
Rhodesia was very bad and white supremacists from other countries were obsessed with the idea that they could travel there to kill
black people with impunity while still stopping short of taking us down the
long road of the history and consequences of European colonization in
Africa. That's far from my area of expertise and it's not why you're here.
Now even if you're coming into this with a completely blank slate for some reason,
you're probably thinking, there's no country called Rhodesia.
And you're right, there isn't.
There never really was.
Rhodesia was never recognized as a sovereign state, but we're calling Rhodesia here as
the present-day state of Zimbabwe in southern Africa.
In the early 20th century, Rhodesia was a British territory, the legacy of Cecil Rhodes's
British South Africa Company.
The area was effectively ruled by the company until the 1920s when it became a self-governing
colony of the UK.
And by the 1950s, decolonization was happening all across the African continent.
These fading European empires couldn't, or't want to hold on to all the colonies
they'd collected during the previous century's scramble for Africa.
In 1960, British Prime Minister Harold Macmillan gave his Wind of Change speech in an address
to the South African Parliament about the political necessity of moving toward decolonization. The wind of change is blowing through this continent.
Whether we like it or not, this growth of national consciousness is a political fact.
We must all accept it as a fact.
And our national policies must take account of it.
He'd actually given the same speech a few weeks earlier in
Ghana, but the press didn't pick it up the first time.
And I think the whether we like it or not part of that statement
matters a lot here.
He wasn't advocating for decolonization out of the
goodness of his heart.
He was reluctantly acknowledging the expensive and bloody
political reality of trying to hold on to these colonies at any cost. He could see the Belgians in Congo and the French
in Algeria fighting these costly wars with Africans who wanted an end to
European colonial rule. And as they worked towards extricating themselves
from these colonial arrangements, the British government adopted a policy
called No Independence Before Majority Rule, meaning they wouldn't hand
over sovereignty to a colony still run exclusively by the white colonial minority.
Now, obviously this is an immensely complicated bit of political history that I'm stripping
down to the studs and explaining badly so we can get through it quickly, so don't
think I'm giving the British Empire any kind of credit here.
This policy did not arise out of a genuine desire to undo the harms of colonialism and
address racism or anything like that.
That was not on their minds.
But I think they knew what it would look like if their decolonization looked exactly like
their colony.
And we're not talking about a PR loss here.
This is the Cold War.
They don't want to give the Soviets an opportunity to come in behind them.
But it was this policy, or rather defiance of it, that led Rhodesia under Ian Smith to
make the Unilateral Declaration of Independence in 1965.
White colonists made up just 5% of the population of the territory, but they were unwilling
to accept that the UK would only grant Rhodesian independence if they shared even a crumb of political power
with the other 95% of Rhodesians. And apologies again for these digressions. I just love the
context. I think it's so important. But that brings us to where we were going. The
Rhodesian Bush War. A 15-year period of civil conflict between the white minority-led government and the
African nationalist guerrilla forces.
The number of foreign mercenaries who actually traveled to Rhodesia during the war remains
up for debate.
Most of the countries the mercenaries came from were embarrassed by the whole affair.
International sanctions levied against the territory
after the illegal declaration of independence made it illegal for citizens of many countries
to participate in the conflict, even in countries that didn't have their own domestic laws banning
mercenary activity. And there was some discomfort within Rhodesia too about this perception that
they needed foreigners to help with what they saw as their war for independence.
about this perception that they needed foreigners to help with what they saw as their war for independence.
So for deeply unflattering and regrettable reasons, no one was very invested in getting
a thorough accounting of the situation, right?
Nobody benefits from knowing what happened here.
But at the high end, it was really only a few thousand mercenaries over the total course
of the conflict, with
best estimates for the number of them who were Americans being somewhere in the low
hundreds. So a lot of guys talked about it. But not very many of them actually did it.
This idea of American extremists traveling to Africa to violently enforce white rule over black Africans is one that modern white supremacists still cherish and
celebrate. Dylan Roof, who was welcomed with open arms at an evening Bible
study at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South
Carolina, registered the domain lastrhodesian.com a few months before he
murdered nine of the parishioners who
thought he was joining them for prayer that night. Roof made his final edit to
that site, his digital manifesto, just hours before carrying out that attack
in 2015. The cultural moment where magazines like Soldier of Fortune ran
full-page advertisements for opportunities to be a man among men in
the African bush looms
large in our memories. But the reality is there weren't many men who actually heeded
the call and their role in the conflict was insignificant. But unlike many of those Americans
who did end up in Rhodesia in the 70s, Frank Sweeney didn't see an advertisement in Soldier
of Fortune.
That magazine's first issue, bearing a cover story about American mercenaries in Africa,
was published in the summer of 1975, just as Frank Sweeney was already on his way home.
According to Frank, which is a dangerous way to start an assertion of fact, he walked into
the Rhodesian Information Center in Washington, DC in 1972
and asked how to join up.
The Information Center was not technically a diplomatic office because Rhodesia was not
technically a country, the fact that would get them into some trouble in Australia, but
they claimed that they were just offering information about tourism.
Frank says he was offered the contact information from Major Nick Lamprecht,
the Rhodesian Army's chief recruiter.
David Annabel, a reporter for the Christian Science Monitor, who interviewed Frank in 1975,
wrote that he'd spoken to another recent visitor to that office after talking to Frank.
This visitor walked into the office and was given a brochure printed by the Rhodesian Department of Labor about careers in Rhodesia. And after a
30-minute presentation about Americans already fighting in the conflict and the
pay and benefits a mercenary could expect, including paid airfare, all
violations of international sanctions in US federal law, the visitor was offered
Major Lamprecht's contact information.
That recruiter, Nick Lamprecht, worked closely with Soldier of Fortune founder Robert K. Brown
to strategize how the magazine can be used to convince more Americans to make the trip
in the latter years of the conflict. Lamprecht himself even wrote an article for the magazine
promising young American soldiers of fortune that it would be easy for them to find a beautiful
white Rhodesian wife.
I think Lampreck knew he was lying about how much fun you could have fighting in the Bush
War.
His own son Vincent had already fled to South Africa to avoid military service.
In what you may be sensing as a theme here, the details of Frank's service in Rhodesia
are a little murky. The details of a lot of what was going on in Rhodesia during those years
is not totally settled and Frank's own involvement far less so. He told reporter
David Annable in that 1975 interview that as a corporal in the Rhodesian
light infantry, his detachment had taken many prisoners, but when instructed to do so, they
just executed people, saying, we shot them right there in the bush when we were told
not to take prisoners.
He also admitted that his unit had taken part in raids over the border into neighboring
Mozambique.
He claimed that sometimes these trips over the border were to assist Portuguese troops.
And until late 1974, Portuguese troops were in Mozambique, fighting to put down the Mozambican
War of Independence.
And Frank said sometimes they'd go over the border to raid guerrilla camps, perhaps those
belonging to the Zimbabwe African National Liberation Army, which had strong ties to
the groups fighting for independence in Mozambique.
These Rhodesian raids over the border into Mozambique continued
even after that nation gained sovereignty in 1975, but
it's hard to pin down when Frank would have been doing this.
If he even did.
I can at least say that Frank was no longer in Rhodesia
during one of the war's worst atrocities.
A Rhodesian raid on a refugee camp in Mozambique
killed over a thousand civilians. David Anibal published a couple of articles in 1975
and 1976 about Rhodesia and he often quoted Frank Sweeney about his time
there. After all there weren't many Americans who'd been there and even
fewer who were easy to find. And Frank was easy to find. He was very public about his stint as a mercenary.
After returning home in 1975, Frank placed ads in magazines like Shotgun News and Gun Week that read,
The Rhodesian Army offers excitement and adventure. I know. I've been there.
Young Americans of European ancestry, write to me for free details pertaining
to recruiting. Frank Abbott Sweeney, 72 Creston Avenue, Tenefly, New Jersey, 07670.
When speaking with the reporter about his efforts to recruit others to make the trip,
Frank spoke warmly of Major Lamprecht and claimed that it was Lamprecht himself who
had instructed Frank to get in touch with as many white applicants as possible.
Which is honestly probably not true, but who knows?
Frank is described as a fan of Ian Smith, of white superiority, and of the need to defend
both, and is quoted as saying,
"...if I could do anything to preserve Western civilization in the area,
I would do it.
Frank told Enable that he'd received hundreds of letters in response to his ads,
and responded to all of them.
But then again, he also told Enable he was a college graduate,
and we know that's not true.
And Enable claims Frank showed him his discharge papers from the Rhodesian Light Infantry, which
were quote, in order, according to the article, and showed three years of good service and
a rank of corporal.
And that's definitely not true.
I'm sure Frank did show Annabel something.
He probably did show him papers that indicated as much.
And I don't fault him for reporting it. It turns out Frank was quite skilled at forgery.
Frank claims he was in Washington, D.C.,
getting recruited into the Rhodesian army in 1972,
but he may have actually still been in prison in 1972
for shooting that cop.
It's hard to pin down exactly when he was released.
One newspaper article years later puts his parole date for that conviction at 1974, but
I have a bad feeling that was just a reporter on a deadline who did the math on a six-year
sentence and assumed Frank served all of it, which he probably didn't.
When Frank was later arrested for his role in the escape of a Soviet spy, an FBI agent
puts his date of enlistment at 1973.
So the truth is in there somewhere.
Either way, he wasn't in Rhodesia for very long before he really, really wanted to go
home.
You know, war is hell for everybody.
And here we have another unreliable narrator, Antony Hickman.
Hickman is a retired officer in the British South Africa Police, which no longer exists
and confusingly was neither British nor South African and they weren't always really just
police.
But it bore that name because it grew out of the paramilitary force run directly by
Cecil
Rhodes' British South Africa company in the 19th century.
The BSAP was Rhodesia's regular police force, but the line between regular policing and
military operations was...blurry.
And during the Bush War, there were military units made up of BSAP officers, and they developed
counterinsurgency and counterterrorism units,
they oversaw the intelligence-gathering arm of the infamously brutal Silou Scouts,
and they killed hundreds of people by introducing poison, food, and medicine into the supply lines for the insurgent forces.
I don't know exactly what Hickman was doing for most of the war.
Maybe he didn't do any of that.
But these days he's retired in Johannesburg, South Africa, and makes detailed models of
trains and farmhouses.
In the early 1970s, he was assigned to the Homicide Unit of BSAP's Criminal Investigative
Division.
And in 2019, he wrote down his recollections of Frank Sweeney for a newsletter, published
by his Veterans Association.
Like any account of Frank's life, Hickman's essay can't be taken as gospel truth.
Between the lies Frank told him and his own fading memory of the 70s, it's not perfect.
Honestly, I almost discarded it without reading past the first page. Who's off to a pretty bad start when the first paragraph placed these events in September
of 1977.
Which would of course be entirely impossible.
Frank could not have been in a Rhodesian army barracks in September of 1977, because according
to the US Marshals, the FBI, the DOJ, the CIA, and the New York
Times, Frank was hanging out with a Soviet spy in the exercise yard at a federal prison
in Los Angeles in September of 1977.
But I'll cut Hickman some slack here on that faltering start, because there's ample
evidence within the story that puts these events somewhere in the springtime of 1975.
And the data side, there is enough meat to Hickman's account and the supporting primary
documentation he provided that supports the idea that this story is more or less true.
As a homicide detective, Hickman was involved in an investigation into Frank Sweeney for
attempted murder at a Rhodesian military barracks. One evening sometime in early 1975, probably, Frank
went to the bathroom at the barracks he was living in. Inside the shared
facilities, two infantrymen who'd been drinking were laughing and joking around.
One was quite drunk, undressed, and got into the shower to try to sober up a little bit.
Three men were chatting pleasantly enough, but Frank was humorless and sober, and he was
outraged when the drunk man splashed shower water on him. The men argued, and one of them
called Frank a bloody yank. And Frank's not a guy who turns the other cheek. He takes every insult very personally.
So a little bit damp and with his pride wounded, he runs back to his bunk and comes right back with
a seven inch dagger and pulls the shower curtain aside and stabs this naked drunk man in the lower abdomen. The other soldier ran for help
and Frank was quickly arrested.
And while he sat in custody,
a mysterious letter arrived in the mail.
The postmark indicated that it had been mailed
from nearby Salisbury weeks earlier.
The anonymous letter writer said that a private F.A. Sweeney
had been convicted of the attempted
murder of policemen in the United States.
It was Hickman, our essayist, who first suspected that Frank may actually have written this
letter himself.
And when he pressed Frank for a handwriting sample to prove it, he cracked immediately.
He'd sent the letter himself, hoping that it would be his ticket home, that they would
kick him out and deport him when they found out he lied about not having a criminal history,
and that he would get a free flight back to New Jersey without having to finish his term
of service.
And if that letter had only arrived a few days earlier, they probably would have done
just that, before anybody had to get stabbed.
The story Frank then told Hickman has elements of truth, but it's not quite right.
He told Hickman that the shootout at his parents' house had happened just the year prior, and
that he'd fled the country prior to being sentenced.
So he's cutting out this six-year period that he spent in prison for the
shooting and pretending that he had just arrived there in Rhodesia immediately after the events
that we know took place in July of 1967. And the timeline isn't the only thing that's off.
In this version, Frank says the shootout only lasted 10 minutes, not over an hour, and he had
decided to end the incident on his own
terms, when he saw that his father had arrived, rather than the truth, which was that he argued
with his distraught father for an hour while continuing to shoot through the windows until
he was smoked out by tear gas.
But the inciting incident in this version is similar.
He told Hickman about shooting guns in the woods, and the neighbors reporting the noise,
and the officer arriving in the car chase.
But he claimed the gun he was shooting in the woods was one he'd purchased from an
advertisement in Soldier of Fortune magazine, which is obviously not possible because that
magazine didn't exist in 1967.
I don't know, maybe he was just updating the story so it would sound more current.
But Frank said he'd purchased the Tommy gun from the magazine, but it was missing some parts. It didn't have a firing pin
and something else. So it didn't work. He manufactured the necessary replacement
parts, but he was concerned that in his modification of the weapon, maybe things
weren't 100% and he was worried that it would explode when fired. So he lashed it
to a tree and set it to fully automatic and rigged a string to the trigger
and hid behind another tree for cover.
This sounds so Looney Tunes to me, like a literal Looney Tunes cartoon, right?
This is, this is Daffy Duck behavior.
But he tells this story to Hickman and in his essay, Hickman writes, True or false, impossible to believe, Sweeney had the uncanny ability to sound
totally convincing. But it is significant to note that a
search undertaken based on Sweeney's fingerprint records
revealed no such incident.
Which doesn't say much for the state of Rhodesian intelligence because, yet Frank's taking
a little creative license here, the story he's telling is not 100% true, but he is
admitting to you almost all of the real details for the real crime he really did go to prison
for.
So you probably should have figured that out before he told you and you definitely should have been able to figure it out after he told you. They
could have contacted a police department or a courthouse in New Jersey and just
asked. Hell, they probably could have called any resident of Teneflai, New
Jersey at random and just asked, do you remember the teenage Nazi bank robber who shot a cop in his mom's front yard?
It's kind of a small town.
I bet everybody remembered.
But I guess they didn't do that.
They weren't even a real country,
so maybe they didn't have a guy
who knew how to do a background check.
The Rhodesian police continued to hold Frank in custody,
and while he was waiting to find
out if they were going to try him for attempted murder, he got some mail.
An envelope containing two United States passports and $300 in cash.
Both passports bore Frank's photo and Frank's birthdate, but only one had Frank's name
on it.
The other was for Francis August Shellhammer, a man who doesn't exist.
He explained to the officers that he was quite good at making such things, and even offered
to forge a pair of U.S. passports for Hickman and the other detective.
Hickman says that they declined the offer.
Remarkably, the Rhodesian government opted to drop the charges and just send Frank home.
Can you court-martial a mercenary?
That's not something I've ever needed to wonder about.
I don't know really what the options were here, but it wasn't worth it to them.
They sent him home.
So sometime in the summer of 1975, Frank Sweeney was kicked out of the Rhodesian light inventory
and deported from Rhodesia. He got his free flight home after all and was permanently
banned from a country that never existed.
Shortly after he got home to New Jersey, he wrote a letter to Hickman. Frank's mother had mailed him some more cash before all this trouble got started, and it
arrived in Rhodesia after he was already gone, and he wanted Hickman to put it back in the
mail for him.
His letter, which Hickman has actually held on to all these years, is dated August
22, 1975. So, if he's already home and realizing his mail is missing and writing the letter
in August of 75 that all the events before that happened earlier in 1975, you get it.
In addition to asking Hickman to mail back the money from his mother, Frank tells the investigator that life in America is loathsome compared to the time he spent in Rhodesia.
It's one big racial cesspool where the worst element is looked on and held in high esteem.
With my RLI training to back me up, I have seriously thought of forming my own anti-terrorism
unit here in the land of the red, white, and blue. The real problem is finding enough devoted men
to form a small cadre. If you ever do visit America, I would genuinely enjoy meeting with
you again, and I'm sure my family would like to meet you too. Even though my service in
the military was cut short, my loyalty to Rhodesia remains as strong as ever.
So now he's back in the United States and this is during the same time period that he's placing those ads in gun magazines to recruit other Rhodesian mercenaries.
He's also placing some other classified ads.
So he's engaging in this federal crime of recruiting foreign mercenaries using his own legal name and his parents address, that's not a problem. The United States government had no real appetite for enforcing the statute prohibiting him
from recruiting people into a foreign army. But when he placed ads offering four
MP40 Schmeiser submachine guns for sale, he didn't use his own name. He used the name Francis
August Schellhammer, the name from the forged passport, and he listed a commercial address
in Fort Lee, New Jersey. It seems Frank never actually had these Nazi
submachine guns, but he did collect the money sent by many interested collectors who thought
they were buying these imaginary guns.
It seems like a great hack to make free money, but unfortunately for Frank, that is mail fraud.
So in March of 1976, he's being interviewed by a reporter from the LA Times, and he's telling
this reporter he's enjoyed his time in Rhodesia so much that he's actually planning to move back
to South Africa in just a few weeks. Notice he's moving to South Africa, not Rhodesia,
because he is not allowed in Rhodesia. But he's planning this big move, he's
telling this reporter about it, he's bragging about his time in Rhodesia, but
at the same time, in March of 1976, he's also entering a guilty plea to that
federal mail fraud charge.
The LA Times article, which doesn't make any mention of his former or current criminal
charges, does say that Frank said that he'd recently been visited by the FBI, and Frank
says they came to his house to try to pressure him to provide information about other mercenaries.
It seems more likely that he's a compulsive liar who got a thrill out of working in this
kernel of truth.
Because the FBI had just been to his house.
That part's true.
But they were there to arrest him for mail fraud.
But he wasn't lying about his plans for an upcoming move.
After pleading guilty to the mail fraud charge, he skipped out on his sentencing hearing. He packed his bags and he caught a flight
to Johannesburg, but South Africa sent him right back and he was arrested by
US Marshals as he was getting off the plane at JFK in June of 1976. And while
Marshals were arresting him, his suitcase was loaded off the plane and it went
through Customs without him.
Customs officials seized a 9mm Luger pistol because he lacked the proper paperwork to bring the firearm into the U.S. from a foreign country. And inexplicably, there were no additional charges
brought for any of that. He wasn't supposed to have a gun at all, and he certainly wasn't supposed
to try to flee the continent while awaiting sentencing for a federal crime.
I know the 70s were a different time and it wasn't a big deal to bring a gun to the airport,
but fleeing the country to avoid going to prison has always been illegal, and I'm pretty
sure of it.
I found a couple of cheeky little articles written a few years later about how the government
ended up accidentally giving him that gun back.
It was seized by customs and put into storage while he was in prison.
When he got out of prison, he wrote to the customs office in New York to inquire about
it and they told him they'd return his property if he paid a $244 storage fee.
I don't know what that comes out to per month for the four years he was in prison, but that
seems steep. And so Frank claims he walked right into the customs office
inside the World Trade Center in May of 1980, paid the fee, filled out a form, and they
gave him back his gun. A spokesman for the US Customs Service said they had no way of
knowing he was a felon. Frank said it was all just a half-hearted joke, telling a reporter,
all I really wanted to do was test the gun laws to show there really is a need for federal gun legislation.
The feds are giving criminals like me our guns back in New York City just for the asking.
Federal gun laws are versical.
You know, he's not a great guy, but he does have some quips. You know,
he's just out there doing bits. And he ended up handing the gun back over to the ATF without
incident a few months later. But back to the mail fraud. He got the four years for the mail fraud
and was sent to federal prison. And it was in prison this time around that Frank would meet Christopher Boyce,
a young defense contractor
who'd recently been convicted of espionage.
In 1974, a 21-year-old college dropout named Christopher Boyce
got a job at TRW, an aerospace company
with a lot of government contracts.
He wasn't really qualified for the role,
having never worked in an office before,
but he started as a low-level clerk.
It helped that his retired FBI agent father
was the head of security at McDonnell Douglas,
another aerospace and defense contracting company,
and he had connections at TRW.
But TRW didn't just make satellites and jet engines.
In his own later testimony before a congressional committee, Boyce described the company as
a CIA contractor, something he'd had no idea about before his promotion to a highly
sensitive position working on special projects.
From inside the company's Black Vault, and with a top- top secret CIA clearance, Boyce had access to
the company's encrypted teletype connection with Langley.
On at least a dozen occasions, he removed documents from the vault and photographed
them.
On at least six occasions, he photographed documents inside the vault.
He later told Congress, obviously neither the government's clearance procedures nor
the company's security procedures worked very well.
I'll say.
In his new position inside the vault, Boyce monitored satellite communications between
the CIA, his employer TRW, and other CIA contacts around the world.
In his congressional testimony, Boyce describes a shockingly lax approach to security
for this allegedly super secure black vault.
He would come back to work late at night
to return the documents he'd stolen
and no one questioned why a junior employee
was opening the vault at 4 a.m.
He made deliveries to secure CIA sites without having the proper clearance to enter them No one questioned why a junior employee was opening the vault at 4am.
He made deliveries to secure CIA sites without having the proper clearance to enter them.
And on one occasion, he wandered into a CIA code room, picked up a clipboard, and was
flipping through the pages before someone politely asked him to leave.
Employees in the vault were supposed to destroy the code cards used in the teletype machine at the end of each workday.
Boy says they just tossed the cards in a canvas bag in the corner, and they used the document destruction blender to make Mai ties with the Bacardi that they kept hidden behind the cryptography machines.
He claims it was common for the vault to receive transmissions from Langley that weren't actually meant for them.
Misdirected communications, these CIA cables that had nothing to do with TRW or their work
with the agency, but no one really cared and there was no clear accountability process
for ensuring that these top secret CIA documents that had been sent to them by mistake were
actually destroyed.
And these are the documents that Boyce stole.
Okay, I know, Frank's not even in this part, but I have to tell you just a little bit about
the 1975 constitutional crisis in Australia.
I know, I know, this is an even more egregious digression than the history of Rhodesia, but
look at the show art. It's not just cool to look at. We are living on my red string board, and I've got
to put this pushpin in somewhere. Now, I know even less about Australia than I know about
the decolonization of Africa in the 20th century. Which is to say, like, not very much. I think they still have the Queen? I guess it's the King now. Do
they have to print new money after the Queen died? It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.
But I was delighted to discover that CIA meddling in an Australian political crisis was even
a possibility. How intriguing. You know, I know they like to keep it
south of the equator, but I thought that was just a Western hemisphere thing. Now,
of course, of course, the United States government maintains that the CIA had no
role in pushing Prime Minister Gough Whitlam out of office in 1975. But
Christopher Boyce went to prison claiming otherwise.
In the 70s, Goff Whitlam was the head of the Australian Labor Party, and his administration
was fairly socially progressive.
He was also considering closing Pine Gap, a U.S. signals intelligence surveillance
base in central Australia run by the CIA.
In 1975, the opposition party, which controlled the Senate,
deferred the passage of an appropriations bill.
I don't know and am not going to find out how the Australian government functions,
but this sounds like the silly little crisis we seem to have every year
where someone refuses to pass the bill that keeps the lights on at the government.
And Australia's Governor General John Ker, used the fallout of this crisis
as a justification to dismiss Whitlam as prime minister, which is apparently
the thing he had the power to do.
It's like they have a guy that can fire the president.
I don't know.
I just thought my business what happens in Australia.
And at the time, Whitlam dismissed allegations of CIA involvement saying
Kerr didn't need any encouragement from anybody to fire him.
But in his memoirs published decades later, he wrote that in 1977, President Jimmy Carter
sent Warren Christopher, the Deputy Secretary of State, to Australia to meet with Whitlam.
And Christopher told Whitlam that the United States, quote, would never again interfere with Australia's democratic
processes.
Never again?
Never again.
And Whitlam's personal secretary backs up this recollection of the use of the word again.
But I'll reiterate, the CIA says they were not involved.
They said they didn't do it.
All that to say though, our pot-smoking disaffected college dropout who was getting drunk at lunch
most days and making paper airplanes out of CIA encryption code cards probably didn't
know anything about the Australian Senate blocking an appropriations bill. But by his account, he did sometimes read those misdirected CIA cables
that he was supposed to destroy.
And some of those messages were about a growing desire within the CIA
to have Whitlam removed from office,
referring to the Australian governor general as,
our man Kerr.
So, he stole them. And instead of going to
the press, he and his childhood friend, a cocaine dealer named Dalton Lee, decided to
sell the documents to the Soviets. Lee would take the documents down to Mexico and deliver
them to the Soviet embassy and return with cash, which they split. And maybe it would have worked. Maybe not forever, but
would have worked for a while, if not for a little mistake, a tiny careless act.
In an absolutely absurd turn of history, Dalton Lee was arrested in 1977 outside the
Soviet embassy in Mexico City. He wasn't arrested for espionage or drug trafficking,
two things he was definitely doing.
He was arrested by Mexican police for littering.
But under interrogation about the drugs and documents
they subsequently found on him, he admitted everything.
Christopher Boyce was arrested by authorities in the US
just 10 days later.
And accounts vary as to whether or not Dalton Lee gave Boyce up in that initial interview.
He says he didn't, and he probably didn't need to.
The authorities would have arrived at the conclusion that it was Boyce who had stolen those documents,
whether Dalton Lee gave him up or not.
So, you know, we'll never know.
But this is where Frank comes back.
This is where Frank reappears in his own story.
I haven't forgotten him.
Because while all this CIA skullduggery and Cold War espionage is going on,
Frank is sitting in a jail cell on Terminal Island,
a low-security federal corrections facility in Los Angeles.
I can't find a good reason
for why he would have been transported to a prison in California after being
arrested in New York, but government inefficiency is as likely an
explanation as anything else. Christopher Boyce was ultimately convicted of eight
counts of espionage in 1977 and sentenced to 40 years in prison. And for
several months in late 77 to early 78, the two men were on the same cell block
at Terminal Island.
Much has been made of the apparent incongruity of Frank, a man who fought as a mercenary
against communist guerrillas, befriending Boyce, a man convicted of aiding the Soviet Union.
But I don't think either of them had a fully formed set of political
beliefs at the time.
Boyce's mother would later say that the two became quite close in those months.
Frank was, for reasons I spent way too long unsuccessfully trying to figure out, transferred
to a prison in Maine sometime in early 1978.
Boyce would eventually be transferred to Lompoc,
a prison a few hours north of Los Angeles.
And in January of 1980,
Christopher Boyce escaped from prison.
The ensuing manhunt for the missing spy
would last nearly two years,
in part because Frank was planting false clues
from Cape Town to California to lead investigators in the wrong direction.
And that's where I have to leave you today.
I do hope you'll come back next week for the second half of Frank's story.
There's a serial killer, a mob boss, a jailhouse letter from his wife's boyfriend, Frank stabs another guy.
And for reasons I'm still not 100% clear on, there
are a bunch of snakes.
Weird Little Guys is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more from Cool Zone Media,
visit our website, coolzonedia.com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app or wherever
you get your podcasts.
In the quiet town of Avella, Pennsylvania, Jared and Christy Akron seemed to have it
all, a whirlwind romance, a new home and twins on the way. What no one knew was that Christy
was hiding a secret so shocking it would tear their world apart.
911 response, what's your emergency?
My babies, please! My babies!
One woman, two lives, and the truth more terrifying than anyone could imagine.
They had her as one of the suspects but they could never prove it.
You're going to go to jail if you don't come with us right now.
Throughout this whole thing I I kept telling myself,
nobody's that crazy.
Uncover the chilling mystery that will leave you questioning everything.
A story of the lengths we go to protect our darkest secrets.
She went bat-shit crazy, shot and killed all her farm animals,
slaughtered them in front of the kids, tried to burn their house down.
AudioWeb presents The Unborn on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
We want to speak out, we want to raise awareness, and we want this to stop.
Wow, very powerful.
I'm Ellie Flynn, and I'm an investigative journalist. When a group of models from the UK wanted my help,
I went on a journey deep into the heart
of the adult entertainment industry.
I really wanted to be a playboy, my dog.
Lingerie, topless.
I said, yes, please.
Because at the center of this murky world
is an alleged predator.
You know who he is because of his pattern of behavior.
He's just spinning the web for you to get trapped in it.
He's everywhere and has been everywhere.
It's so much worse and so much more widespread
than I had anticipated.
Together, we're going to expose him
and the rotten industry he works in.
It's not just me.
We're an army in comparison to him.
Listen to The Bunny Trap on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
...
Martha Stewart has been a household name
for over four decades and still isn't done.
Join iHeart Media Chairman and CEO Bob Pittman
for a special episode of the hit podcast
Map and Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing,
as he interviews this icon in front of a live audience
to celebrate her 100th book, Martha, the Cookbook,
100 Favorite Recipes with Lessons and Stories from My Kitchen.
Did you ever think you were going to wind up writing 100 books?
Yeah, you did.
Yeah, it's just a minor goal."
This intimate and wide-ranging conversation between friends covers the pivotal decisions
in Martha's career, the philosophy that has guided her, and the source of so much of her
creative inspiration.
They actually looked at the July issue that I had prototyped, and they said, this is fabulous.
What would you do next July?
And I said, well, living is a limitless subject matter.
Listen to math and magic on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey, everyone.
It's John, also known as Dr. John Paul.
And I'm Jordan, or Joe Ho.
And we are the Black Fat Film Podcast.
A podcast where all the intersections of identity are celebrated.
Oh, chat! This year we have had some of our favorite people on, including Kid Fury, T.S. Madison, Amber Ruffin from the Amber and Lacey Show, Angelica Ross, and more.
Make sure you listen to the BlackFatFilm Podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Alpha Podcast, or whatever you get your podcast, girl.
Oh, I know that's right. on the iHeartRadio app, have a podcast, or whatever you get your podcast, girl.
Ooh, I know that's right.
The forces shaping markets and the economy
are often hiding behind a blur of numbers.
So that's why we created the Big Take from Bloomberg Podcasts
to give you the context you need to make sense of it all.
Every day in just 15 minutes,
we dive into one global business story that matters.
You'll hear from Bloomberg journalists like Matt Levine. A lot of this boomstack stuff
is I think embarrassing to the SEC. Amanda Moll, who writes our Business Week buying
power column. Very few companies who go viral are like totally prepared for what that means.
And Zoe Tillman, senior legal reporter. Courts are not supposed to decide elections.
Courts are not really supposed to play a big role in choosing our elected leaders. It's
for the voters to decide.
Follow The Big Take podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen.
I'm so glad you decided to come back for part two of the story of Frank Sweeney. If you you listen. the Rhodesian Bush War, possible CIA involvement in an Australian political
crisis, and we're just about to pick up with our escaped spy. The second 40 years
of Frank's life are just as weird as the first 40. There's a serial killer, a mafia
trial, two different secret wives, and a lot of misuse of the Postal Service.
I'm Molly Conger and and this is for your little guys.
["The Last Postal Service Theme"]
Now, when we left off last week,
Frank was making friends in prison.
His new friend in 1978 was Christopher Boyce, who'd just been convicted of espionage for
selling documents he stole from his job as a CIA contractor to the Soviets.
And then he escaped from prison.
Whether or not Frank was still in custody on the day Christopher Boyce escaped from
prison is surprisingly hard to pin down.
Several newspaper articles about Frank's role in the ensuing manhunt for the missing
spy put his release a month before the escape, but others put it a month after. Seems like
this detail would really matter, but no one seemed very concerned about it in 1980.
Newspapers that appeared to be quoting the same unnamed source from the US Marshals published
conflicting stories, with some saying Frank flew to South Africa shortly before Boyce's
escape and others putting that trip slightly after the escape, although both of these articles
say it was exactly 23 days before or after.
But in my frustrated search through 40-year-old newspapers trying to figure out which prison Frank was calling home that year, I found another surprise.
Another stabbing.
Shortly after Frank was transferred to a state prison in Maine in 1978, he stabbed another
inmate in the chest during an argument in the prison library.
And again, we have this problem that keeps coming up in Frank's life.
He loves to talk to reporters, and he loves to lie. It's the 70s. These
reporters don't have the internet. They don't have access to electronic court records. So
a lot of Frank's lies get published. When he files a lawsuit against the prison warden
in Maine about the conditions in solitary confinement, newspapers publish his claim
that he was placed in solitary for a stabbing he'd been suspected of, but he says the investigation cleared him.
A local newspaper in Bangar, Maine, however, had a reporter in the courtroom when he entered a guilty
plea to that stabbing. But regardless of whether he got out in December of 79 or February of 1980,
we know Frank flew to South Africa soon after he got out and that he stayed there for a couple of months.
The story of Christopher Boyce's 19 months on the lam is long and strange. Sean Penn plays Boyce's
friend, the cocaine dealer Dalton Lee, in the 1985 film adaptation of the book The Falcon and the
Snowman about the entire affair. I didn't watch it. There's only so much I can do. But remember, this is the Cold War.
A missing Soviet spy is a pretty big PR problem for the United States government.
There was speculation that the KGB had helped him escape.
Boyce himself called a reporter from a payphone a few months after the escape and
laughed about the idea that he'd had foreign assistance. He says he just climbed the fence
and walked out. The task force focused on finding Boyce believed all along that he'd had foreign assistance. He says he just climbed the fence and walked out.
The task force focused on finding Boyce,
believed all along that he'd never actually left California.
And they weren't too far off.
He was in Idaho the whole time.
But a lot of resources ended up getting expended,
pursuing a false lead planted by our friend Frank.
Now I can't prove Frank sent all of these letters himself.
I can't even find contemporary in his reporting where anyone ever outright said that they
believed Frank sent these letters.
And he was never charged in connection with his meddling in this investigation.
But just a few weeks after Boyce went missing, the United States ambassador in South Africa
got a letter.
The postmark indicated that it had been mailed
from within South Africa. And the letter said, a known mercenary named Shellhammer had assisted
the convicted American spy Christopher Boyce in entering South Africa by way of a fake
passport.
Now, who do we know with a history of forging passports, of mailing anonymous letters to officials in southern Africa implicating himself in crimes, and using the pseudonym, Shellhammer.
And he absolutely knew the feds would tie him to that alias because it was the one he
had used in those classified ads in 1976 that put him in prison for mail fraud.
And Frank was in South Africa in February of 1980 when that letter was mailed.
It seems he wanted the authorities to know he was involved.
Why else would he write his own pseudonym into the story?
So feds quickly turned their attention to Frank.
They placed a tracking beacon on his car.
They followed him for months.
And he probably knew he was being followed.
They followed him from his home in New Jersey all the way out to California,
and from a California motel he made several phone calls to an apartment in Hermosa Beach.
And when they searched that apartment, they found it abandoned,
but they found several letters that Frank had sent to a third man, another friend of theirs from prison,
one of which read,
Somehow they discovered that I helped him get into South Africa.
I suspect an informer has been at work.
But there was no informer.
Frank wanted them to find those letters, and Boyce was never in South Africa.
The only reason anyone thought Boyce might be in South Africa
is because Frank was planting false clues all over the world
to point them as far away as possible from a little hunting cabin in the mountains
of Idaho.
U.S. Marshals eventually got frustrated following Frank around.
A federal prosecutor would actually say in open court that Frank's arrest in July of
1981 was specifically intended to give them leverage to make him cooperate in the Boyce
case.
It seemed like he knew something and they wanted to know what it was.
As a felon, Frank wasn't allowed to have any guns. And of course, Frank had guns.
I did find one newspaper article that wrapped a sort of suspicious sounding hint that they
only picked Frank up for that gun charge because of an anonymous tip. So maybe that was him
too. But they picked him up in New Jersey at the end of July,
and he pretended to be very cooperative,
telling them that he actually had some documents
that would lead them straight to Boyce,
and he would happily show them to them.
He voluntarily turned over the key
to the bank deposit box he was keeping them in,
and inside they found several letters to Frank
that had been mailed from South Africa.
Sounds like more red herrings planted by Frank.
He'd flown to South Africa several times in the year and a half since his release,
and was probably mailing himself these letters on those visits.
So now, in August of 1981, it seems like there could be some evidence that Boyce really was
in South Africa.
Frank says he was promised placement in the witness protection program for his help, and
maybe they did make that promise.
If he really could help them recover their missing spy, that's a reasonable enough deal.
And just a few weeks after all of Frank's help, Boyce was recaptured.
But it wasn't due in any part to Frank's information.
During his year and a half on the run, Boyce obviously couldn't get a job.
So he made money the old fashioned way.
Bank robbery.
He kept it pretty small time, nothing flashy where you get into the vault, just
little stick ups, a few thousand at a time from the teller.
He's tied to at least 17 bank robberies in Idaho and Washington state during that time, eventually teaming up with a couple of brothers from Idaho. And it was one of
those men who turned Boyce in for the reward money. No honor among thieves, I guess. Boyce
was taken back into custody on August 21st, 1981. And he wasn't in South Africa.
Nationwide flight ended for Christopher Boyce here at the pit stop drive in, in
Port Angeles, Washington.
He was eating a cheeseburger and onion rings when eight federal agents jumped him.
Boyce was apparently living a triple life.
So Frank lied, obviously.
He lied pretty egregiously.
He falsified documents, he led US Marshals and the CIA on an international goose chase.
And maybe that's why he never got charged for it.
That's pretty embarrassing to put on the record.
But they did still have that gun charge they picked him up on to use as leverage.
So they set a sentencing date, but Frank didn't show up.
He was trying to skip the country, again.
Remember back in 1976, he got all the way to South Africa after skipping his sentencing date for mail fraud.
But this time he was picked up just a few days after he missed court when a motel clerk in Montvale, New Jersey recognized him.
When he was finally dragged in for sentencing, the government said they hoped Frank was going to be able to help them in the Boyce case, but nothing he said was of any use.
Frank said he had no choice but to flee the country and start a new life on a cattle ranch
in Australia with his wife because the government had reneged on their deal to put him in witness
protection.
I have to imagine there was some bickering back and forth between an indignant Frank
and an exasperated federal prosecutor because in the end, Judge H. Curtis Meener said,
I have neither the time nor the inclination to unravel all of the mysteries in this case.
However they'd all ended up in his courtroom, whatever the convoluted backstory is here,
this is a sentencing for illegal possession of a firearm, and that's really all the judge
can do that day.
So he sentenced Frank to four years. Judge Meenor said Frank was
an explosive type of individual and that he was dangerous and mentally sick. And
he urged Frank to take advantage of the opportunity to get psychiatric help while
he was in prison this time. And yes, I did say wife. When I first started poking
around trying to build my biographical backstory to sort
of sketch out a skeleton of this man's life, I found a New Jersey state record for a marriage
in August 1981 between a Frank A. Sweeney and a Dina M. Madison in Bergen County.
There are other men named Frank Sweeney, obviously, but it was a middle initial match and it's
the right county and it was one middle initial match and it's the right
county and it was one of the rare months that Frank wasn't in prison.
But it didn't seem right, so I set it aside.
But this offhand mention at his sentencing hearing about a wife sent me back to it.
It is him.
After the feds picked him up at the end of July 1981 on that gun charge, he was released
from custody.
He was cooperating. He took them to the bank to look at his fake evidence, all that.
And sometime that month, he got married.
I have no idea how they met or where she came from or what she thought she was going to get out of any of this or
if she knew Frank was planning on entering witness protection that month.
Or what on earth she saw in this man. But I do know how the marriage ended. Frank went back
to prison that very same year so they didn't have much time together. I don't
know where Dana was while Frank was away but by 1985, according to a decision by
the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals, Dana was living in Texas with her new
boyfriend Danny Lee Strong.
They couldn't have known each other very long
before moving in together because Strong had only
just gotten out of prison again for another
and a string of pretty run-of-the-mill robbery
and fraud charges.
And they didn't stay together long before they were arrested
for murdering a man Strong said made a pass at Diana.
She was ultimately only convicted of stealing
the victim's car, which they fled the scene in, but Strong got 99 years for the
brutal beating and asphyxiation of Robert Eugene Thomas. Frank doesn't really
factor into this story. He's in prison in another state this whole time, but his
name appears in a footnote of an appeals court decision upholding Strong's
conviction. Strong had sent Frank a letter after finding out that Deanna
was planning to testify against him for the murder.
I can't imagine what you write in a letter to your girlfriend's
husband about a situation like this, but all that to say,
Frank really did have a wife that he planned to start a new
life with in Australia, but she ended up watching her boyfriend
choke a man to death in an apartment in Fort Worth instead.
["The Last Supper"]
On January 9th, 1982, the UVA men's basketball team
lost to the Tar Heels in a close game, 60-65, at UNC's Carmichael Arena.
I'm not a basketball fan, and I wasn't born then, but I guess it was an exciting game.
UNC had knocked UVA out of the Final Four the year before, but Joseph Paul Franklin, an avowed neo-Nazi who'd recently been handed his first couple of life sentences for two of his many murders, didn't care much for basketball.
He was in the rec room at the Medical Center for Federal Prisoners in Springfield, Missouri,
and he was trying to watch American Bandstand.
According to Frank, whose time at the Springfield prison overlapped with Franklin's for a few
weeks in 1981 and till Franklin's transfer at the end of January 1982, the serial killer became enraged
when a black prison guard changed the channel. Later that year, Joseph Paul Franklin was back
in court. He'd spent years traveling the country, robbing banks, and murdering young black men and
interracial couples, so it would take years to sort out what to do with him. This time, he was
on trial for the unsuccessful assassination attempt on civil rights activist
Vernon Jordan.
On May 29, 1980, the Fort Wayne, Indiana chapter of the National Urban League was hosting a
banquet in honor of a visit from National Urban League president Vernon Jordan.
When a volunteer dropped him off at his hotel later that evening, a single bullet from a
.30-06 rifle tore through his back.
He survived, but it's hard to build a case against a drifter sniper.
Nobody saw him.
The investigators had some handwriting analysis on a motel registration card,
testimony from a grocery store clerk who identified Franklin as a man he'd had a strange conversation with,
and a general idea that the crime fit Franklin's pattern, but it was a bit thin. And then came Frank. Oh, Frank loves to talk. He loves
to be helpful. He's still in prison on that gun charge, but he told federal
authorities that in the brief couple of weeks he'd been on the same cell block
as Franklin, they chatted a few times and Franklin had confessed to him on
several occasions about shooting Vernon Jordan. On the stand, Frank testified about that evening in January
when the guard changed the channel to the basketball game. And it's a pretty
good detail. Frank was very specific that it was a UVA-UNC game that we
couldn't recall the date. They were only on that cell block together for a few
weeks and there was in fact a UVA-UNC basketball game during that time period that would have been on television.
He testified that Franklin was furious about the incident and spent days fuming about it.
The two inmates were walking together in the exercise area a few days later when Franklin
spotted that same guard again and turned to Frank and said,
I'd like to blow him away like I shot that N-word big wig in Indiana.
Frank says he also lamented that Jordan just wouldn't die after being shot and that he
was, sorry I didn't shoot that white slut first, referring to the white woman who'd
given Jordan a ride that night.
Frank was one of three jailhouse informants the government put on during that trial, all
men who'd been in jail with Franklin, and all of whom said Franklin had admitted
to various aspects of the crime in casual conversation.
Joseph Paul Franklin was actually acquitted at that federal trial.
Jurors said they believed Franklin shot Jordan, but they were hung up on the wording of the
indictment which specifically charged him with the shooting as a violation of Jordan's
civil rights.
Years later, on death row for a variety of other murders, Franklin did confess to shooting Vernon Jordan.
When the trial was over though, jurors who spoke to the press said they'd only believed one of the three jailhouse informants who testified.
Frank.
On cross-examination, Frank Sweeney seemed surprised to learn that the other two men had been paid thousands of dollars for their cooperation.
He wasn't getting paid.
But he wasn't upset.
He didn't need the money.
He'd inherited a quarter a million dollars, which would be about a million dollars today, when his parents died.
All he wanted was witness protection and a positive letter to the New Jersey Parole Board.
Just like in the Boyce case, he very conveniently had some information the government wanted
and all he wanted in return was witness protection.
And this time, he got it.
But he didn't get to keep it.
In 1984, Frank filed a lawsuit against the warden of the Alabama prison where he was
still serving his sentence on that gun charge.
He said he was not receiving the protection afforded to him as a protected witness.
The warden's response to the suit was that Frank would not stop telling people that he
was a protected witness, which was causing a lot of problems.
You're not supposed to do that.
In court, the warden's executive assistant said that the prison was considering contacting
the Office of Enforcement Operations, the division of the DOJ that administers the witness
security program, to recommend his removal from the program, because they believed he
was intentionally causing problems by talking about this constantly.
And it seems he was ultimately removed from the witness security program around this time.
And maybe that had something to do with his decision to testify on behalf of Anthony Spilotro,
the hotheaded Chicago mobster who handled the family's business in Las Vegas.
It couldn't have been an attempt to get back in the program he was testifying for the defense.
But maybe it was just spite.
He wanted to get somebody else kicked out of the program.
In 1983, when he was still in prison
and still considered a protected witness,
he briefly shared a cell with another guy in the program.
Frank Culotta was a mobster.
He was a member of Tony Spilotro's Hole in the Wall
gang.
If you've seen the 1995 Scorsese movie Casino, it's that.
Quite literally.
Frank Marino, the character played by the guy who played Phil Leotardo on The Sopranos,
is supposed to be Frank Culotta.
Joe Pesci's character, Nicky Santoro, is based on Tony Spilotro.
Just watch the movie, it's all very complicated and our friend Frank Sweeney had nothing to
do with it.
But in 1983, the real-life Frank Culotta was sharing a cell with Frank Sweeney
because they had both turned state's witness against very dangerous men.
Frank Sweeney had just testified against a serial killer and
Frank Culotta had turned on Spilotro after the FBI played him a recording of his friend talking about having him killed.
When Anthony Spilotro went on trial in 1986, Frank Culotta was out of prison and in the program.
And he was the government's star witness against Spilotro.
Frank Sweeney was finally out of prison again and home in New Jersey when he read in the paper that Culotta was going to be testifying.
According to Frank, he felt compelled to contact Spilotro's defense attorney because when they were cellmates,
Culotta would often brag about committing perjury.
So the defense flew Frank out to Las Vegas
and put him on the stand.
He claimed that after one of Culotta's appearances
in court back in 1983,
he came back to their shared cell and bragged,
Frankie, I just put another one away.
You've heard of the traveling circus.
I'm the original traveling perjurer.
On cross-examination, Frank Sweeney admitted that when he'd been in the witness protection
program, he had on several occasions threatened and even faked suicide attempts to get what
he wanted out of federal prosecutors. I wish I had
more information on that. That is incredibly strange behavior and it does
actually happen again later. In the end though, his testimony in that mob trial
is just a strange little footnote, his third brush with the witness protection
program. His testimony didn't matter much. I don't think anyone believed it and
the case ended in a mistrial over allegations of jury tampering,
and Anthony Spilotro went missing before they could retry the case.
The mobster and his brother were later found buried in a cornfield in Indiana.
Frank Culotta stayed in the witness protection program for years,
and Scorsese hired him as an on-set advisor when he shot Casino.
Culotta died of COVID in 2020.
And in 1989, Frank went back to prison for mail fraud.
Again.
The court record is too old to get any documents without haggling with an archivist,
but the docket sheet does say that in addition to another 57 months in prison,
the judge also banned Frank from ever offering anything for sale by mail.
So at first I assumed he was pulling the same scam he ran in 1976, where he placed ads for guns he didn't actually have,
and then ghosted would-be buyers after they sent him the money.
But it's much weirder than that.
I wish it was guns. It wasn't guns this time.
He was running what one journalist called a cat scam. He'd cut the tails off regular house cats and then run ads offering them as exotic purebred
cats for $300.
If he really was as independently wealthy off his inheritance as he claimed, did he
really need $300 for
a mutilated cat? Maybe he was just addicted to mail fraud.
As for the cats, one of the earliest mentions I could find of Frank in the newspaper archives
was a 1958 article about the embalmed cat he got for his 15th birthday. He was looking
forward to dissecting it
and adding it to his collection of oddities
that already included a cat skeleton.
So I hope all his fraudulent cats found happy homes,
even if their buyers were unhappy about losing $300.
But it's in an appeals court decision
related to a parole violation
in this second mail fraud case,
where we find the details of a campaign of terror against his neighbors that foreshadows the events at the end of this
long strange tale. He was paroled in 1992 after serving about half of this sentence,
and he was on probation for three years. Just days before that three-year period ran out,
he was charged with a probation violation. He'd been convicted
in New Jersey of sending obscene materials through the mail to a minor. I know, I know,
this show is starting to feel like a tour of America's weirdest sex crime guys, but
to be honest, I don't think there was anything sexual in his motivation for sending porno
mags to a nine-year-old. I know that doesn't sound possible. Bear with me.
But after he got out of prison, he's living in an apartment back in his hometown of Teneflay, New Jersey.
A family of Russian immigrants moves into the apartment next door.
They have children. Children are noisy.
Frank says he asked them to keep it down, but the noise continued.
In what the Second Circuit Court of Appeals would later call a rather bizarre set of circumstances,
he decided to get back at these noisy children by engaging in a lengthy harassment campaign
against the entire family.
At least twice, he shut off their electricity.
On multiple occasions, he filled the lock on their front door with staples, making it
impossible to open.
He had the family's mail forwarded to Des Moines, Iowa.
The father of these noisy children was a doctor.
One of his colleagues received a letter purporting to be from an AIDS charity, informing the
recipient that the doctor, the father of those noisy children, had tested positive for HIV.
And along that same line of thinking, he also sent a letter to the children's school,
informing them that the nine-year-old boy had been exposed to HIV by his father.
And he sent letters to the Jewish Community Center, where the family remembers,
informing them that the entire family had been exposed to the virus.
Remember, this is 1993.
Telling people that this doctor has HIV could ruin his career.
The school could call social services and they probably wouldn't be welcome in the
sauna at the community center if people believed this.
And in what would be his ultimate downfall here, he signed their nine-year-old son up
for catalogs that sold pornographic materials.
It seems like he believed that the child's father would get the mail, which apparently
wasn't going to Iowa anymore, see the catalog, believe his son had signed up for it, and
would punish the boy.
And if the boy was grounded, he wouldn't be so noisy.
But it backfired, and Frank was discovered as the culprit.
Police searched his apartment and found the typewriter he'd used to write all the letters,
and he quickly confessed.
He got four months in jail in New Jersey for sending obscene materials to a child, but
the parole violation landed him back in federal prison for another year.
And maybe this trip back to prison gave him a chance to test out his own advice.
You see, between getting out in 1992 and going back in 1995, Frank was profiled in the New
York Times.
The journalist, Charles Strumb, actually used to write for the Bergen Record, the local
paper Frank used to end up in every time he got arrested in the 60s, but Strumb didn't
come home from college and start at the record until after Frank's armed standoff in the
front yard.
And they weren't talking about their shared hometown.
They were talking about Frank's new consulting business.
In 1994, Frank put a classified ad in USA Today that read,
Going to federal prison for the first time?
We will tell you what to expect and how to survive.
Our consultants are graduates of the federal prison system.
Frank A. Sweeney and Associates, Box 15,
Demerice, New Jersey 07627.
Frank told Strum that the idea came to him while he was reading the paper one morning in September 1993. Lawrence Powell,
one of the LA police officers convicted for his role in the
beating of Rodney King, was quoted in the paper as being terrified at the
prospect of going to prison.
Strom writes that Frank told him,
I thought to myself, my god, there's probably a lot of
people going to prison who's never been in jail before,
primarily white collar criminals. And they're probably terrified
too. They're just as frightened as he is. So I thought maybe I
can use my misfortune to help people and maybe make a profit doing it.
The article says Frank claims to have 27 clients after just a few months of running his new consulting business.
Though the author also prints without question Frank's claim that he left high school in the 11th grade because he was
bored with it, not because he was in a youth correctional facility for
bank robbery.
In the article, Strum writes out all of Frank's crimes and convictions, but that 1962 bank
robbery is missing.
But again, they didn't have the internet then.
Of his criminal record, Frank told the reporter,
I remember it was Nietzsche who wrote,
The crime is not in the act, but in the stupidity of being caught.
I was caught and stupid.
And he'd get caught a few more times in the coming years,
but he stays humble.
That Nietzsche quote is still his favorite to this day,
according to his Facebook profile.
He had to take a break from his new consulting career
when he went away for a year in 1995,
but he picked right back up when he got out.
A 1997 Newsweek article about his business claims he was up to 87 clients now, with white
collar criminals paying Frank $1,000 for assistance in getting favorable placement.
So not only did Frank promise that he could advise you about the differences in food,
facilities, and culture at different federal prisons, he claimed he had connections and
could influence your placement.
A Bureau of Prisons spokesman denied Frank
had any ability to arrange transfers
or promise placements at specific facilities,
but at least one client told the reporter
that prison officials had denied his request for a transfer
during a five-year sentence for embezzlement.
But after he wrote Frank
and included a check for $1,000, his transfer
came through.
Now, promising these transfers seems like it would put Frank back in mail fraud territory.
But if he had stopped short of fraud, this isn't actually a terrible way for a guy like
Frank to make a living.
He really had been in a significant number of our nation's federal prisons. He'd
been in facilities all over the country spanning decades. He's in a great position to offer
advice about how to get through your sentence as smoothly as possible. So if he'd stuck
to lifestyle advice for the incarcerated, I might say that this could have been a success
story for Frank.
There was another article about his consulting business in 1998, but then he kind of disappears.
I'm not sure what he was up to.
He pops up briefly in a couple of articles in 2000 and 2001.
An old prison friend of his called him from a jail in Reno to ask for help exposing an
alleged smuggling ring run by one of the guards out there in Nevada.
David Wayne is described as one of the most dangerous inmates in the state prison system after a variety
of escape attempts and prison riots involving Wayne holding hostages. And in 2000, he wanted
Frank's help leveraging this information about a corrupt guard to get a better placement.
So friend or client, hard to say. But the guard did end up charged with smuggling a
handcuff key to an inmate, and Frank spent about a year advocating for Wayne's transfer.
Considering he had once held two prison nurses hostage for 12 hours by rigging up a Rube
Goldberg-style contraption that would stab the women's eyes out with scalpels if anyone
opened the door and had successfully escaped at least
once, a low-security placement for David Wayne was out of the question.
But then, quiet.
Frank moved out to Idaho and stayed out of the paper.
He's not a very good driver, so I know he moved to Ada County, Idaho around 2001 because
that's when he started getting
a lot of traffic tickets there.
In 2008, he was charged with battery and convicted, but he only served five days in jail and successfully
completed his court-ordered anger management class.
The docket indicates the victim, a woman who appears to be a nursing assistant in the Boise
area, got a restraining order.
But the Frank Sweeney who tried to rob a bank
and fought in the Bush War and had a mob boss fly him to Vegas and bragged about
being able to influence prison officials, that Frank seems to be gone. He's just an
old man living in Boise. Until 2015. In December of 2015, Frank went to the post office near his home in Garden City, Idaho.
He parked his truck in one of the accessible parking spots out front.
A woman saw him get out of his car, which did not have a placard indicating he was supposed to be
parked there, and said something to him. We don't know exactly what she said.
Now, me personally, I probably wouldn't have said anything. For the most part, it's not worth it.
It's not your business. There are plenty of people who are not visibly disabled who really do need
those parking spots. Frank was in his 70s at this point, so even if he didn't have a state-issued
parking placard, he's old.
Just leave him alone.
But she made a comment about it and the situation escalated.
Pretty seriously.
Court documents only say that they had a verbal altercation, so at least she didn't get stabbed,
which he's done at least twice to people who offended him.
But whatever she said, and for whatever reasons she chose to say it, she didn't deserve what
happened next.
The victims in this case are referred to only by their initials in the court record, for
obvious reasons.
But it can be tricky to keep track of people with just a letter, so I've given them all fake names just to make this a little easier.
We'll call the woman from the parking lot, Ellen. Her husband will be Sam.
And their adult daughters will be Kayla and Lucy. Again, it is possible to figure out who these
people are, but please don't. They've been through enough." Two weeks after that, he did exchange in the post office parking lot.
The postcards started.
The probation office in Boise got the first one.
Ellen's adult daughter Kayla was, at the time, on probation for a misdemeanor DUI charge.
The letter writer claimed that he had, just the night before, been in the car with Kayla,
and she was so drunk that he had to jump out at a red light for his own safety.
Ellen's husband, Sam, received a postcard
at his dental office the same day,
informing him that his wife had been in the post office
the week before, and she was so drunk
that she was falling down.
The letter, though very brief, contained a lot
of really specific personal information.
The fact that the couple had very recently purchased a new home,
including the name of the suburb where they now lived,
the city where their other adult daughter lived,
the names of both of their daughters,
and information about Kayla's arrest that year.
Ellen received a third postcard that week
addressed to her at home.
This one contained her social security number
and an allegation that her daughter Lucy
was engaged in acts of
prostitution at her place of work, which was named.
After the family received the first postcards in December of 2015,
they met with detectives at the Ada County Sheriff's Office in Boise.
And despite investigators' best efforts,
the family would continue to receive increasingly bizarre and frightening postcards for three full years.
Their neighbors and nearby schools received postcards that appeared to be from the state's sex offender registry, informing them that Sam was a sex offender.
Specifically, that he had sodomized a nine-year-old boy in 1978.
It probably goes without saying, but I will say it anyway, that is not true. But
it does kind of remind you of what Frank did to that doctor in 1993, doesn't it?
Adding to the victim's distress, Sam passed away unexpectedly in January of 2016, just
a few weeks after all this started. And obviously Frank knew one of his victims was dead. Some of the letters sent to the man's daughters taunted and blamed them for driving their father into an early grave, but oddly some of the letters pretended otherwise.
While most of the postcards were signed Carson Wells, the name of Woody Harrelson's character in the movie No Country for Old Men, some were signed with the names of her own children.
Ellen received one of those
just two months after her husband's death.
Proporting to be from her daughter Lucy, who lived out of state, it said,
Dear Mommy, my blood test just came back and yes, I am HIV positive. I'm sure I was infected
by one of the two Crips with whom I was having an affair with. Regrettably, I will never
be able to give you and Daddy the grandchildren you so desired. But we know now that Daddy is a pedophile. He may have harmed the grandkids.
Has he been released from jail? And again, this is a woman who just lost her husband.
She knows this postcard isn't from her adult daughter. Even if she hadn't already gotten
a dozen other bizarre postcards, she would know that. No one's writing their mother a postcard on a typewriter.
It's not 1932.
And again, the recently deceased man was not a pedophile, nor was he in jail.
He had just been buried by his family.
Ellen and both of her daughters continued getting postcards, even after Ellen moved.
And Frank was also sending the postcards to other people, pretending to be members of
the family.
The Idaho Black History Museum received one signed with Ellen's name, address, and phone
number that was so laden with racial slurs that you can barely tell what it's supposed
to be trying to say.
Lucy's boss received one advising him that his employee was having rectal intercourse
with black men, although Frank described that in more vivid terms.
Now for as strange as this man's life has been, you'd be forgiven if you forgot where
we started.
Frank is a Nazi. He was a member of the American Nazi Party and he fought as a Rhodesian mercenary.
He's not just a guy who loves doing mail fraud and hates his neighbors, he's very
racist.
And a lot of these postcards fixated on the idea that Ellen's daughters were engaged
in interracial relationships, very graphically and racially describing specific sex acts
that they were, in his mind, having with Black partners.
And he was particularly upset that Ellen, a Latina,
had married a white man.
He called her racial slurs and wrote to her daughters
calling them mongrels.
It seems the only time he wasn't sending postcards
was when he was out of the country.
You see, he might have another wife.
It's not entirely clear.
But several times a year, Frank would travel to Erfurt,
the capital of the German state of Thuringia in central Germany,
to visit a woman he's known for a very long time.
Ute Schoenig, who performs semi-professionally as a belly dancer under the name Madame Chamilla,
has on several occasions referred to Frank as her husband.
This may be literal.
It may be a cheeky little joke.
My German is not good enough to really read tone.
And it may just be that they've been in a relationship for so long that they
think of each other this way.
My research game is strong, but a potentially non-existent German marriage
certificate evades my grasp.
Nevertheless, he does own a home in Erfurt, and she lives in it.
She refers to him occasionally as her Hausbesitzer, which you could translate as landlord, but
you wouldn't really.
You'd call the person you rent your home from your Vermeeter.
Hausbesitzer just means he owns her house. And he occasionally calls her
Liebchen, my love, and she calls him Frankie. When he visited in 2015 and they
went to see her mother in the nursing home together, her photo captions are
about Frank's visit to his mother-in-law. As with so much in Frank's life, it's
hard to pin this down. I have a handful of photos of Frank with this woman
that appeared to be from the 80s or early 90s
based on the photo quality Frank's apparent age
and, to be honest, her hair.
But we're talking about Germany,
so dating by the fashion could put us off
by a decade or more.
No offense, you know it's true.
But at least in the present era of his life,
he's visiting Germany every now and again. She breeds and shows Mexican and Peruvian
hairless dogs, some of which have been quite successful internationally. Some of her show
dogs list Frank Sweeney as a co-owner. In September of 2016, his victims had a brief
reprieve from his letters because he was in Germany
attending a seminar on dog genetics with Ute.
These rare breed dogs are very prone to genetic problems and inbreeding,
so I'm glad they're staying on top of best practices, I guess.
But when he was at home in Idaho, the campaign of harassment was relentless.
He even found a way to outsource the terror. Frank sent
postcards to inmates in prisons all over the country. He signed them with Ellen's name
and address and requested that the men write her back. She received at least 75 letters
all addressed to her at home from murderers. And as if she might not get it, like maybe she didn't put two
and two together here, like maybe she thought this was some totally separate, unrelated
new problem she just happens to be having. Frank made sure she understood that he did
this. He sent her numerous postcards explaining the situation.
Every creep, every social degenerate who is written to you has your address, social security
number and date of birth.
Likewise for Lucy too.
Some of these freaks have already passed this information on to their criminal friends outside
of prison.
Last month I visited your house twice in the early morning hours while you slept.
Naturally, I've removed my license plates so that street cameras could
not identify my car. And I still patrol the post office daily in an effort to spot you.
You only have your big mouth to blame for all of this.
In December of 2016, after the first full year, he wrote to her saying it was their
anniversary, telling her, I intend to be with you for life.
The letters just kept coming, reminding her that he was watching her outside her home,
that he waited for her at the post office almost every day, and sending her postcards
containing her own personal information, like her license plate number and information about
her family, just so she knew he had it too.
He continued writing to Ellen and both of
her daughters calling them racial slurs, sluts, whores, threatening to report them
for assorted imaginary crimes like tax fraud and drug dealing and always
remembering to write them on their birthdays. Investigators were stumped.
They knew the letter writer was the man from the post office parking lot. He said
as much in his letters, but Ellen didn't recognize him.
She had only a vague description of his vehicle, and she didn't get the license plate.
Why would she have thought she needed to?
The postcards were always wiped clean of prints.
They were perfectly generic.
United States Postal Service issued materials that he always bought in small quantities
and paid cash.
He may truly have tormented this woman until one of them died. If he hadn't done
what he's always done, more crime. And here's that beginning of the end.
It's not the end, but I told you the story that began outside of a bank in New Jersey in 1962 would start its final chapter outside of a bank in Idaho, 56 years later.
On October 13th, 2018, Frank got into another argument in a parking lot.
These victims too are only identified by their initials in the court records.
So I'm going to call them Liam and Denise.
They were in their car outside the Wells Fargo in Garden City, Idaho.
Frank honked at them. There was, again, some kind of verbal altercation. Maybe they gave
him the finger or shouted. Who knows? You know, this is the kind of thing that happens
every day. You know, you don't pull forward fast enough. The guy behind you honks. You
tell him to fuck off. Nobody's being their best selves, but life goes on.
But not for Frank.
Frank can't take it.
He stabbed a guy in the guts for splashing him in 1975.
So two weeks after Liam and Denise experienced this angry driver at the bank,
they start getting postcards.
Like Ellen and her family, this family too, starts hearing that their neighbors and nearby schools are getting postcards that pretend to be from the state sex offender registry, alerting people that Liam is a pedophile. He's not to recycle from one victim to the next, right?
Like that has to mean something. But I can't figure it out and maybe that's for the best.
These postcards too are generic ones from the post office, typed on a manual typewriter. And again,
some of the postcards are signed Carson Wells, and sometimes they're signed
with the name of Liam's adult son.
And again, there were letters to the family from murderers answering requests for pen
pals.
But you know what the bank has?
A lot of security cameras.
And unbeknownst to Frank, shortly before he started terrorizing his second set of victims,
his case wasn't just a local matter anymore.
In September of 2018, the United States Postal Inspector Service started looking into the
Post Cards.
That's right, the mail police.
That is a very real federal law enforcement agency with jurisdiction over male crimes.
According to their most recent annual report, the USPIS initiated more than 5,600
investigations in 2023.
And during that year, 4,100 cases related to their investigations ended in convictions.
Most of those numbers are things like mail theft and people mailing drugs.
Also, though, a couple hundred people a year are assaulting postal employees.
Knock that off.
Don't do that.
Be nice to your mail carrier.
So now we have the mail police on the case.
And as soon as they start trying to figure out what's going on here,
again, this is September of 2018,
they're just looking at the postcards to Ellen and her family.
But within a few weeks of them opening the investigation,
the Idaho State Police let them know
that someone is sending postcards
pretending to be from their office.
And these are these postcards about how Liam is a pedophile
that are being sent to schools and neighbors.
And because these postcards are made to look
as though they are coming from
the State Sex Offender Registry though they are coming from the state sex
offender registry, which is run by the state police, people are contacting the state police
about them, and now the state police are talking to the male police, and now the male cops
see that there are more victims.
And all of these postcards seem to be from the same person.
When postal investigators speak to both families and compare the letters, it's clear they're all from the same person. When postal investigators speak to both families and compare the letters,
it's clear they're all from the same person. All of the victims say they know who is sending
them these postcards. They just don't know who he is. Ellen knows it's the guy from
the post office. Liam knows it's the guy from the bank. And they both describe some
kind of older truck, and an older man who's thin with a stiff
gait and a very terrible distinctive scar on his face.
They're describing the same man.
And surely a bank teller or a postal service clerk would recognize a description like that.
Local cops had shown Ellen photo lineups on multiple occasions over the last three years
as they're investigating this, but Frank was never a suspect, so he was never in any
of the photo arrays.
Each time they showed her photos of potential suspects, she said, he's not here because
he wasn't.
And so she never picked out any other possible suspect.
But once the postal investigator zeroed in on the man in the bank security footage, both Ellen and Liam separately identified him in photo lineups. And bank
employees did know who he was. So by Christmas of 2018, the male police have Frank's bank
records. He's been paying a private investigator. That's how he knew so much personal information
about all of his victims.
Information about their real estate transactions, what kinds of cars they drove, where they
worked, where their adult children lived in different cities and states. He's paying
a PI.
Idaho is one of several states where you don't actually have to have a license of any kind
to offer your services as a PI. So she doesn't have one that can be taken away.
And she hasn't been charged with anything.
Maybe she only helped Frank with information that didn't cross a line,
and maybe she didn't ask enough questions about what he was doing with it.
It remains unclear how he got everyone's social security numbers, though.
But the PI he was paying is a woman in her 80s who seems to still be in the business
just for the love of the game.
Barbara Jacobson describes herself on her website as a cross between Nancy Drew and
Jessica Fletcher with the tenacity of Columbo, and credits her success to her Christian faith
and divine intervention.
An article in a 2017 issue of Christian Living magazine
quotes her as saying, God is my business partner. Now again, this woman has not
been charged with a crime, but it seems like a bad sign that she either didn't
know or didn't care that the client asking her for a lot of personal
information on people had a five-decade-long
rap sheet that included convictions related to harassment by mail. You're either deeply unscrupulous
or very bad at your job, and I'm not sure which is worse. Either way, this investigation is
rapidly coming together. The postal investigator has Frank's bank records,
he's been identified by the victims,
they're closing in on him.
And maybe he knows, maybe he doesn't.
He did move very suddenly in February 2019,
leaving the house he'd been renting for over a decade
right as they got the warrant to search it
and renting a different house nearby.
But he's still sending the letters. So if he knows they're onto him, But he's still sending the letters.
So if he knows they're on to him, why is he still sending the letters?
On February 13th, 2019, six weeks after they know Frank's their guy, right around the time that he's moving to his new house, a clerk at the post office calls the investigator to say that an old man
with a terrible scar on his face just bought a stack of postcards with cash.
And the last postcard arrived on February 19th, 2019. It signed Carson Wells, but the writer
identifies himself as the man who blew his horn at them in the parking lot. And then he reminds
Liam and Denise that all the murderers who'd been writing to them had already forwarded their
personal information to criminals on the outside. But it was already over. Two weeks later, they searched Frank's home. They took his
typewriter and his list of federal inmates, the ones he'd been writing to as his victims,
and they found portraits of Hitler and Nazi memorabilia and white supremacist literature,
and two live rattlesnakes. Rattlesnakes don't live in Idaho. These aren't snakes
that he got outside. These are snakes that he is breeding?
Frank has a lifelong interest in reptile breeding. I think he's a member of the Idaho
Herpetological Society, or at least he was before he went to prison. And shortly before
his arrest, he commented on an online obituary
for an old high school classmate,
reminiscing fondly about how they used to collect snakes
in the woods together in the 50s.
Once he's in custody, Frank confessed immediately,
telling investigators on the day of his arrest
that he'd sent the postcards
because he felt like these people had embarrassed him,
and it made him feel better to know he was causing them emotional distress. Shortly
after his arrest, he wrote to the judge to ask the court to intervene in what he felt
was an inadequate response by the jail to what he called many of the infirmities that
affect the elderly and says he has the urge to commit suicide if his demands aren't met.
And I don't want to sound like I'm brushing this off.
I'm not saying that this couldn't possibly be a valid concern.
People die in jails and prisons every day because employees don't care or don't have
the resources to provide adequate care.
This is a very real problem.
And the urge to harm yourself is always very serious.
But this isn't Frank's first rodeo. Remember
in the 80s he used to threaten suicide and would even fake suicide attempts in
order to manipulate employees of the witness protection program. So this may
not be a brand new issue for Frank. At any rate, within months of his arrest he
entered into a plea agreement.
So once the male cops got on the case, they actually sorted it out pretty quickly, right?
The USPIS got on the case in September of 2018, and within three months, they knew it
was frank.
Maybe they should have called the guys who solved male crimes earlier?
I don't know.
But if there had been more communication
between different law enforcement agencies,
the whole situation could have been resolved
when he sent a single letter for a third victim,
which he signed with his own name.
But when a US Marshal searched Frank's house
two years before his eventual arrest,
I guess they didn't bother to check in
with the local police.
Because in April of 2017, Frank sent a single letter
to Gerald Schur, the man who founded and for many years ran
the Witness Protection Program.
I can't think of a worse guy to pick
if you're going to send a threatening letter.
Schur was long since retired by 2017. He passed
away in 2020 at the age of 86. But is there anyone on earth who had more chips to call in with the
U.S. Marshals? You think a U.S. Marshal isn't going to come to your house if you sign your full legal
name to a threatening letter to the guy who invented witness protection? You think you're
going to scare the guy whose job was protecting mobsters from other mobsters?
Truly a stupid move, even for Frank.
You poisonous, licentious old Jew.
I thought that you would have been long dead from cardiovascular disease due to obesity.
I was very much hoping to sit shiver for you, to pray Kaddish over your fat corpse, you
loathsome I will remember you although it's doubtful you will remember from WITSEC
units in Otisville in San Diego parading with your entourage depraved women from
the Office of Enforcement Operations. In 1984 you expelled me from the program
leaving me to fend for myself as a known informer, a rat in the general populations of very dangerous prisons.
It had been more than 30 years,
but Frank never got over getting kicked out of the program.
He flew all over the world helping a spy in 1980
trying to leverage information on Christopher Boyce
to get placement in the program, and it didn't work.
The information he gave was not only not helpful,
but by fabricating unhelpful information
in order to get something from the government,
he made things worse.
And when he finally got what he wanted
by testifying against a serial killer in 1982,
he couldn't keep his mouth shut about it.
And so he was removed from the program in 1984.
In his letter to Schur, he claims that as a result of losing his protected status in
1984, he was attacked by another inmate the following year.
And he does, without a doubt, bear a huge scar all down one cheek to this day.
Somebody cut Frank's face open pretty bad.
He takes care to mention in his letter that the assailant was black,
though he chooses different words to say that. And who knows why Frank got cut? I'm not
making light of the violence that happens inside jails and prisons, but you'd have
to do some real mental gymnastics here to come up with a satisfying explanation for
why a black man would cut Frank up in retaliation for Frank's testimony
against a Nazi serial killer who traveled the country shooting black men. I just don't
think that they would be mad about that. But I can think of a variety of reasons why a
black man who encountered Frank in prison might get into it with him.
I mean, racist to hide, Frank's just kind of a hothead, not a great guy to hang out
with, always getting into it with people.
But also, he loves saying racial slurs.
So I can think of a variety of reasons why this might have happened that had nothing
to do with him testifying against a serial killer.
We can't take Frank at his word, and I couldn't find any reporting from the time about a prison knife fight in 1985, so who knows?
After Scher received the letter, which Frank had signed venomously yours, Frank Abbott
Sweeney, a U.S. Marshal was sent out to Idaho to speak with Frank. And Frank admitted that
he sent the letter, but he said he meant no harm by
it and he allowed the marshal to search his home.
It seems like if anyone had compared notes, Frank could have been identified as the Garden
City postcard writer far sooner. The language in this letter was very similar to some of
the postcards. If they had just showed this letter to the sheriff, maybe they would have
recognized it. But I guess they didn't, because he wasn't.
The local police in Pennsylvania, where the letter was received,
charged Frank with terroristic threats, but
that's a non-extraditable misdemeanor in Pennsylvania, so
they couldn't bring him back to face the charge.
So he's got an open warrant in Pennsylvania if he ever goes there willingly,
but he probably
won't, and with Sher now deceased, it doesn't seem like that's likely to amount to anything.
On December 16, 2019, Frank Sweeney was sentenced to 51 months for six counts of stalking.
A few days later, his German wife posted a photo of her Christmas Eve dinner.
A friend asked her if Frank would be celebrating with her that year.
She replied that, no, Frank has been ill for several months and can't fly right now.
She didn't say that he was back in federal prison for at least the fifth time.
Frank Sweeney was released from prison in December of 2022.
I just noticed as I'm writing this that it's his 81st birthday today,
but it won't be by the time you hear this.
He's still in Idaho.
He's still playing the violin,
and he still co-owns a few Mexican hairless dogs
on the show circuit in Germany.
In that 1994 New York Times article
about his prison consulting business,
Frank quipped that his favorite quote was,
"...the crime is not in the act, but in the stupidity of being caught."
Which he attributes to Nietzsche.
I think regardless of your stance on the philosophical nature of crime and punishment, though, there
are better quotes from Frank's thousands of appearances in the newspaper over his six
decades of crime.
Maybe Judge H. Curtis Meener had it right in 1981, when he cut off the bickering in
the courtroom over exactly what the hell happened with Frank's mysterious South African letters
about the missing spy, saying,
I have neither the time nor inclination to unravel all the mysteries in this case.
Because we never really will unravel all the mysteries of Frank's past.
He played a big part in so many much bigger stories.
They've made whole Hollywood films out of so many of these little
slices of history that Frank passed through.
From Cold War spy thrillers to Scorsese dramas about organized crime,
Frank's there. He's not in the movie. He's just out of frame while history happens,
doing something really goddamn weird.
Weird Little Guys is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more from Cool Zone Media, visit
our website, CoolZoneMedia.com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app or
wherever you get your podcasts.
From audio up, the creators of Stephen King's Strawberry Spring comes The Unborn, a shocking
true story.
My babies, please, my babies.
One woman, two lives and a secret she would kill to protect.
She went crazy and shot and killed all her farm animals, slaughtered them in front of
the kids, tried to burn her house down.
Listen to The Unborn on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
We want to speak out and we want this to stop.
Wow, very powerful.
I'm Ellie Flynn, an investigative journalist, and this is my journey deep into the adult entertainment industry.
I really wanted to be a playerboy, my doll.
He was like, I'll take you to the top, I'll make you a star.
To expose an alleged predator and the rotten industry he works in.
It's honestly so much worse than I had anticipated.
We're an army in comparison to him.
From Novel, listen to The Bunny Trap on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever
you get your podcasts.
Join iHeart Media Chairman and CEO Bob Pitman for a special episode of the hit podcast,
Math and Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing,
as he interviews the iconic and prolific Martha Stewart
in front of a live audience in celebration
of her 100th book.
Did you ever think you were going to wind up
writing 100 books?
Yeah.
You did?
Yeah, it's just a minor goal.
Listen to Math and Magic on the iHeart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to Math and Magic on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your
podcasts.
Welcome to Decisions Decisions, the podcast where boundaries are pushed and conversations
get candid.
Join your favorite hosts, me, Weezy WTF, and me, Mandy B, as we dive deep into the world
of non-traditional relationships and explore the often taboo topics surrounding dating,
sex, and love.
Every Monday and Wednesday,
we both invite you to unlearn the outdated narratives
dictated by traditional patriarchal norms.
Tune in and join the conversation.
Listen to Decisions Decisions
on the Black Effect Podcast Network,
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey everyone, it's John, also known as Dr. John Paul.
And I'm Jordan or Joe Ho.
And we are the Black Fat Film Podcast,
a podcast where all the intersections of
identity are celebrated.
Oh, chat this year we have had some of our
favorite people on including Kid Fury,
T.S. Madison, Amber Ruffin from the Amber and Lacey
Show, Angelica Ross, and more.
Make sure you listen to the Black Fat Fam podcast on the iHeartRadio app,
Alpha Podcast, or whatever you get your podcast, girl.
Ooh, I know that's right.