Bein' Ian With Jordan - No Thorns, No Roses W/ Harley Flanagan | Bein' Ian With Jordan Ep156

Episode Date: July 23, 2025

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O'Henry, O'Henry. Eamfodance.com for all my dates this weekend, July 18th, 19th, I am at Addison Improv Dallas, Texas. Then the 26th, 27th, Indianapolis Helium, let's sell it out. And the following weekend, I'm so excited to be in Buffalo, New York, helium comedy club, August 1st to 3rd. And then I'm going to Chicago's Anees, Irvine improv, Oxnard, levity live, Fort city, commie

come Fort Wayne, Summit city, comedy club, comedy connection, stress factory. I'm going all over EM finance.com and I'm doing Montreal just for laughs. Ah, ha, ha, I've been wanting to say that for the past 15 years. I auditioned for almost 10 years for new faces. They said you're too big for new faces, but just big enough for a big old showcase. So I'm going up to Canada,

and I'm also gonna be in Canada for JFL Toronto. Everything is coming up. Five ants. Oh yeah. YouTube.com slash at symbol Ian finance comedy. That's where you're going to get my travel show. Ian do an odd guy doing odd jobs. I'm putting it out once I get a certain amount of subscribers.

So subscribe. I got a lot of stuff on there. A lot of stand up punch up dot live slash sure. And Jensen for all her dates. Come out and see us live. It's a good time. Enjoy the show. Telling jokes and having smokes, riding bikes all through the night. It's a wild ride when Coffee ice no matter what Now you know he likes it in the butt It's a wild ride When you're being Ian, being Ian

Life is shit but you're positive Let's find out what it's like to live a life Being Ian, being Ian with Jordan. Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of being Ian with Jordan. Jordan is on assignment in upstate New York on vacation. I'm holding down the fort and I couldn't be happier to be here with the man, the myth, the legend, the one and only, the guy who started all Harley Flanagan. Who are you? Ian? I'm all right, man.

What do you think? It's a, it's like the retro room. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yes. Well, now we went and got coffee and just off the rip. I have to say, I am so excited that you also have a cat named Glenn. That is a strange coincidence.

I thought I was probably the only person with a cat named Glenn. Yeah. And as it turns out, and they're both 10 months old. That's what I was going to say. Not only are they both your jaw dropped. I was in shock. It was amazing. I thought maybe you knew this from now my Instagram and we're like pulling my leg. No, no, I got a cat named Glenn. He's the best remarkable named after Glenn Danzig, which is ironically, I guess it's not ironic. I mean, who else could it be? But my cat is also named after Glenn Danzig. Does he know it? Have you told him?

You've told him. He's a cat guy too. This would be why my cat got the name. Yeah. Because I know of Glenn's fondness for felines. Now it's like an honor when someone names their child after you or like a middle name.

Or their dog or their cat or their horse. How did he feel when you were like, I have a cat named Glenn. Well, I haven't actually seen him since he got the news. Cause I got, I got, I got the ducking. Fuck you. No, no, no. Actually, cause last time I saw him was when we did the tour and I got the cat recently. So I just sent him a message and you know him a message. And we write each other off. It's like he reaches out to me when there's something important to tell me, like I have some shows coming up, would you like to do them?

Yeah, yeah. And then you hit him back, you're like, I have something important. Yeah, I have my cat. I just told him I was just so you know. Just so you know, we have a cat and we named it Glenn. Yes. I don't need to. Dude, my, I have, so when I was in sixth grade, my mom took me to Tower Records

to meet Glenn Danzig. He was doing an autograph signing for Seventh House or Black Acid Devil. Wait, Black Acid Devil is the name of the song. Seventh House. No, Black House the Devil is the name of the album. Came out like 96, whatever. I was first in line. I brought my guitar and he signed it and taught me how to do my first bar chord. And he was like the nicest guy ever. Yeah, man. He's a really good guy. You know, he gets a bad rap and I'll tell you, I've known him since I was like 12 years old and he's a good guy I've always I've always liked him he's always been you know I remember back in the old Misfits days and I will tell you from having seen it myself he was always super gracious to fans he would sit there and sign everything you presented him with you know silk screening, misfits logos on your leather jacket, whatever.

He was always super cool. Well, they made an announcement. They were like, he will not discuss or sign any misfits. Well, yeah, because it was like in 96 or 97. And rightly so. And that's why I got. And rightly so. Oh, yeah. Of course. He was fucking tired of it.

Yeah. And you know, that's his bit. But that's how I got into the misfits through through Metallica and the garage days covering last year. I fucking late bloomer. I was I was in sixth grade. That's like, oh, I'm sorry. I forgot you started. That's right. I'm a hundred years old.

Yeah, I love like trying to hang up like I was in sixth grade and I like the discovered the Misfits through Metallica anyway. Well, you discovered it through like through my talk. Oh, come on. Anyway. Well, you discovered them through like, I mean. Through them. Yeah, through meeting them. Through them. Yeah.

I discovered them through them. That's fucking insane. Well, I was going to say Glenn was really nice to me and then really nice to my mom and then, cause she brought me single mom. He's a fucking good guy, man. Well then he tried to give us concert tickets and then wanted to show her the tour bus. And my mom was like, we're leaving right now. And I was like, you fucking bitch, Kled dancing could have been my stepdad.

I don't know if that would have been the case, but it could have been. You know what? He's a, he's fucking, he's dude, I named my fucking cat after him. What else do I? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Me too. You know? Yeah. And I did it because he's a standup guy.

Not because I'm a fan. I am a fan, but I wouldn't be a fan if he was an asshole. Yeah. Was there, when you, so wait, how old were you when you met the Misfits, Glen and everyone? Like 12. Yeah. What was that like being 12 and being at the center of everything and being the coolest fucking kid?

Like did you realize that or were they just like your friends? I was the coolest 12 year old in the room But I didn't know that because I was the only 12 year old in the room So, you know, it's not hard to be the coolest 12 year old in the room when you are the only 12 year old in the room. I mean it didn't hurt that I was in a band and shit like that. A lot of kids that are... Go all the way back practically. A lot of kids are in the Little League World Series end up drug addicts and committing suicide because they peaked at 12. Well, you, I could have very easily turned out that way.

And I was in the little league world series of punk rock. Yeah. Did you play sports or anything growing up? Like how the hell can you go to school when you're drumming for the stimulators? I didn't, I didn't get into sports until I was an adult and I chose to start training, you know, when I got into jujitsu and that wasn't until the 90s. So no, I never had a family that pushed you towards anything athletic or academic or anything of that nature. Like when you were, so when you were like 11, 12 and you're drawing for the stimulators and you're like touring and you're going to Canada and like all over Europe, was anyone in your life like the older

kids that were in these bands or any of them like, Hey, maybe you should. There wasn't any older kids in bands. There was young adults in bands, people in their twenties. Yeah. But did any of them take you under their wing? Like, Hey, why don't you read or like? They taught me how to party harder. Yeah. I mean, I'm not talking about like my aunt

and stuff like that, but they didn't do homework with me and shit like that. That wasn't really, you know, no. Come on, man, dude, I did, I was doing fuck, I did meth the first time when I was 15 with Lemmy and Filthy Animal Tailor. So, you know, this is what I learned. These were the adults.

The adults were not there to teach me how to do math. I didn't know if like one person out of like a hundred had a soft spot for this kid running around. They all had a soft spot for me, but they were all out of their fucking minds. Yeah. You know, so if you're fucking crazy, what's your, your soft spot still leaves you at crazy? You know if you're a drug casualty and this that the other you may have a soft spot, but that's still who you are you know, I actually um, I

Ran into a cheetah chrome from dead boys not that long ago on tour and it was very emotional for both of us because you know again here's somebody that I've known since I was around 12 and you know I have a lot of love for Cheetah because like he is kind of like an uncle to me in that way that I grew up around him and so on but at the same time this is a guy who was a complete depraved fuck-up total piece of shit, scumbag, junkie, fucking like everything wrong that you could be. And essentially, this was kind of like not just my uncle type figure in a sense, but also the people that raised me to kind of turn out the same by example. turn out the same by example. So it's like kinda like having, you know, love for a delinquent or abusive family member.

Like you still, you love them, but you recognize that, wow, I mean, these people used to do really crazy shit in front of me and I grew up thinking that was cool. Like I just like, for instance, for them, fun was, forget about the drugs, this and that, just like stupid, silly shit was pissing in the ice machine upstairs at Max's. You know, that everybody's putting,

that mate getting their ice cubes from. And that was just silly funny punk rock. It's good old fashioned fun. And me at 12, I'm seeing this and I'm going, ha ha ha. So, you know, and it just progresses and progresses from there, you know, like what's funny, what's gross, what's pushing boundaries, what's just grotesqueness which all these fucking, all these PC fucking wannabe

motherfuckers need to remember, punk rock was all about being gross, all about being you know vulgar, all about just like pushing it to a place that was kind of offensive to people you know. That's why I guess why people think Gigi Allen was cool, even though that was just a fucking, that dude was just a garbage person. Yeah, did you ever run into him? Oh, he was on the lower east side. I didn't, I stayed the fuck far away from that.

I didn't, if I smelled him coming, I wouldn't be on the block. I would have fucking thrown him in front of a bus just for him to be no more. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That's just a, I have nothing good to say about humans like that. Yeah. Steve Bader's at least was a, I look at him as being the original of that type. Maybe not the original, but one of the originators of disgusting front men. But Steve at least was also part of a great band a great band and wrote great stuff and was a great

performer. He wasn't just like somebody shitting on himself and sticking hot dogs up his ass. I can't actually give that any respect or credit. People who want to watch that are just as much assholes. Depraved. No, they're just as much assholes. I'm not even going that are just as much as depraved as, yeah. No, they're just as much as assholes. I'm not even going to go as far as saying depraved.

They're just assholes. And I'm sorry, I'm not into that whole jackass culture. Yeah. I don't get amused by people fucking making assholes of themselves or like being gross. Yeah. When I was 12, I used to laugh at like, the dead boys doing stupid shit.

And when I was 12, I used to do punk rock shit, spit on walls, lick it off, gross, whatever. Come on, man. Trying to create a night that special someone will never, that, that, trying to create a night that special someone will never forget will make your night like the 9 11 of sex with blue chew.

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sent you. Summer's here. Dress like it in Chubby's. Chububbieshorts.com slash Ian. I can't really peg you as someone that would take a prank too well. No. No, no. Like even if someone put a buzzer on their head and was like, nice to meet you, I could imagine you just- I remember a big fucking, this friend of mine who's ex-con, big motherfucker, he sat down at a bar next to me, pulled the chair out from under me, and I fucking sat on the floor. I got up, he's standing there laughing at me, and I... Well, that's a dickhead move. Well, I smacked his fucking face hard.

We almost got into it, because he's like an ex-con. Like, he froze, I froze, we both looking at each other, and this fucking asshole next to us started talking shit to me, and we both punched him. Because he was just like, motherfucker, that's my friend. Like, so we did just got it just like, wait a second, like, first of all, you just pulled the chair out for me. Now I just smacked you. What motherfucker? Well, and then it's like, oh, really? No, this is between us, motherfucker. That's very Charlie Chaplin. That's very funny. It was fucking, it was so like, it was so fucking.

You sit the same time. Oh, yeah, we both fucking hit him. It was both hit that motherfucker. And anyway, that asshole's dead now, so he's off the hook. But anyway, yeah. Well, there's this funny video. Well, I think it's funny because Gigi's whole thing was like, I'm going to kill myself on stage.

And so whatever he he was talking about it and some girl in the crowd goes, all right, so do it. Like kill yourself. And he walked off stage. He was like, fuck you. Like just a child, you know? The whole shit is childish. Even talking about him is fucking childish.

Let's move on. I'll do anything you say. I am so scared right now. Fuck that guy. Fuck that guy. I got no time for it. I got no time for him. What was it like having to relive everything in the documentary Wired for Chaos?

The film, the film, yes. The film. It was, well, the first couple times that I got to see it, it was already a done film. So I actually didn't really get to see anything until my first... I saw it when it was like a rough cut. It was almost done. They said, basically it's the same film. They just switched out a few photos and stuff. But I saw the complete film and it was pretty intense, man. I will be straight with you.

I did shed a couple of tears watching it the first three or four times that I watched it because it's got a lot of real traumatic shit in it that I wasn't really expecting to have in a film or to, you know, let's just call it. I talked about shit in this film that most people will never talk about even with their therapists or their closest friends if they if they'd been through it just because you know I went really in and uh so that was uh it was interesting but also somewhat cathartic yeah you Yeah, I mean why now? Because the movie got made now?

When was I supposed to do it? No, I mean like, Jesus Christ, people hit you up years ago like I wanna make a documentary about you. I mean like, you have a prolific life. Yeah, but let's just call it what it is. I mean that's cute, let's make a documentary it what it is. I mean, that's cute. Let's make a documentary. But what are you gonna do?

Make one on your phone? What are you gonna make a little bullshit documentary? Like slap it together, DIY? There's a million of those. And at the end of the day, who gives a fuck? It's like, they're a waste of, the editing sucks, the stories are no good, the whole thing.

You wind up selling something completely short, and at the end of the day, who gives a fuck? It winds up being a bunch of effort wasted on nothing that comes out half-assed. And quite honestly, it was never something that I had on my mind. I never said, I'm gonna have a movie one day, I'm gonna make a movie.

I never even planned on fucking writing a book. So the fact that I wrote a book in itself was a big step and was a big move on my behalf. And then the fact that now there's a movie, that was not something that was ever on my agenda. And to be fair, a lot of money got fucking spent on this thing, a lot of fucking editing, graphic, animation,

fucking reenactments, fucking there's like over 600 pieces of archive like stuff that we needed permission for like almost all of it for footage and photographs. Have you kept like ephemeral, like actual physical things? Oh, I'm like, I'd say close to a third of the photographs are from my own personal archives and they're actual photos. They're not like scans. They're prints that I was given over the years. You know, when you're- That photo of you, Iggy and Andy Warhol and Joe Strummer.

Oh, Joe Strummer. That's right. Yes. You, Joe Strummer and Andy Warhol. Yes. I'll be playing with Iggy soon, but no, that was Joe Strummer. Yeah, I did already, but, um, with the misfits and Iggy Pop. But yeah, um, that was taken by a legendary photographer named Marcia Resnick, who just passed away a couple of weeks ago. She was an amazing person,

a great photographer. And obviously I knew her since I was 12 when that photo was taken. So you know, yeah, a lot of work went into this film. It definitely wasn't some DIY, like let's make a hardcore documentary. This thing took work. The producer has won many awards.

He had a film called Citizen Ash that was on HBO, was nominated for all kinds of shit. I mean, the guys, I'm lucky to have worked with them. Excuse me. I'm lucky to have worked with any of the people that were involved. Well, you can tell the way it shot beautifully, but I love how it intertwines in between your life.

And then there's these moments when you're in your house and it seemed like those moments were the ones where you were the most kind of open and vulnerable. And was that, I wonder if that was like a choice rather than just like, hey, we're gonna go to like this cafe or walk around the Lower East Side. Like kind of came out the way it did. You know, I mean, this thing was very natural.

You know, it, uh, you know, I just told my stories, uh, in different settings. And then they, they had about, they had over 50 hours worth of interviews from other people. A lot of the interviews didn't even make it into the film. There was a lot of people who didn't make it into the film at all. And for every one clip, every interview you see like five minutes of

was like a two hour interview. So you have whatever, 10 minutes of Ian McKay or Daryl Jenifer or five minutes, whatever it is. I can't tell you for sure, but there's two hours worth of that interview, which has a lot of great stories in it, but they had to really sit and say, okay, how much do we actually have room for?

Like, this is a great story, this is a great story. We got five great stories here from Ian McKay, but we have to pick one that fits into the theme. And not just that, but what fits into the narrative. Like we only have so much time to tell this story, so it has to have an arc to it and a beginning and end. And somehow we got to tell this person's life with the right stories that tell the whole story instead of, because it could have easily just been two hours of fight stories or two hours of drug stories

or two hours of fucking stories or whatever. But that's not what it was about. It could have been easily two hours of just what happened with the Chrome Eggs lawsuit? What happened with this lineup? What happened with that lineup? What happened with that lineup? And all of a sudden you got a documentary about the fucking Cro-Mags.

Which is not what it was because quite frankly, my life has been way more interesting than the Cro-Mags as a thing. I mean, I grew up in an insane world of some of the most legendary musicians and artists in the world way before the Cromags was even a thought. And by then I had already seen more than most humans ever fucking will.

So my life, not to shit on the band at all because I'm still doing it, it obviously means a lot to me but it's just one part of a really much more insane story. Yeah. You know? Yeah. I thought there was something so interesting about that. Going back to that picture, like in, in, in one sense, you're this kid that's

experiencing adult things and like living a life by the time you're 15, that most people would never be a part of for better or worse. But there were these little slivers of like such beautiful innocence, like that picture where you just pop up and your tongue is out in this iconic photo of Andy Warhol and Joe Strummer. And then that story with Darryl when he would go to your grandparents house and you were like putting the army men together and then he like throws the bomb and that's such like a little brother. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought that was like really great

that those were included. Because the juxtaposition of the two worlds I thought was like super interesting. I mean, yeah, I'm really glad that made it in because I really loved Darryl and it really just goes to show the type of big brother that he kind of, you know, was to me. Yeah, you know, I'm really, I'm proud of the cast that they assembled, you know, there's some really significant

people, some really heavy hitters, and I think they were very insightful. You know, it's interesting to step outside of the picture and hear what other people have to say about something that they observed from a distance, because obviously I knew I was out of my mind, and I knew I was going through this, that, and the other, but to hear what other people had to say about it who were witnesses to it

was kind of interesting. Yeah, it was interesting hearing, you know that tattoo on your chest is like so iconic, the demon like going at the world and to hear other people's perspective of like, you came back and you had this tattoo, like to hear other people speak about it, I thought it was interesting.

But also, was there any, cause it's almost like kind of throwing your own funeral where you get to hear the eulogies of like, cause everybody always wants to like, if I die, I wish I could be in the back hearing everyone talk. Were there any moments where you were like struck or like pissed off? Like, Hey motherfucker, that didn't happen that way. Not at anything that happened in the past that was in the film, but it was very strange. And you say that to... I did point out several times how, you know,

most people don't get to see their life flash before their eyes until they're like on their deathbed. And here I am kind of seeing my whole life play out in front of my face every night on the big screen in front of an audience and then having a fucking Q&A. Which was, you know, slightly awkward. Well it was just fucking, you know, the first time I walk in from the back of the theater

and I see my childhood taking place, well actually check this fucking shit out. You wanna hear a wacky fucking story? So the first night that the motherfucker plays, not at the film documentaries where it premiered at Doc NYC and at Slamdance, but the first night that it actually went into... IFC? Yeah, no, no, at the Roxy in New York. Oh, okay.

Downtown below Canal Street. And it was, now mind you, I had just gotten back from Frankfurt where I played the night before. I had landed at fucking LaGuardia, I think, that afternoon. And then I had to go to the fucking film. So I was already punchy. Yeah. And I had to fucking watch my life on Ferle in front of me

on Father's Day with my eldest son there. And then while I'm sitting there fucking jet lagged and fucking bugging out on the fact that while I'm watching my life on Father's Day, I'm watching my whole life story with my oldest son, and then my wife reminds me, you know today's the 10 year anniversary of your mom passing. And I'm like, No frills delivers. Get groceries delivered to your door from No Frills with PC Express. Shop online and get $15 in PC optimum points on your first five orders. Shop now at NoFrails.ca It's good to have a routine and it's good for your eyes too. Because with regular comprehensive eye exams at Specsavers,

you'll know just how healthy they are. Visit Specsavers.ca to book your next eye exam. Eye exams provided by independent optometrists. I'm sitting here on the 10 year anniversary of my mom leaving this planet, watching my life story on Father's Day with my son. What in the fuck is the universe? And your jet lag. Well, it was just like, I'm just like.

And you're like, these people better fucking like this or else I'm going to lose my mind. Oh, these motherfuckers. No, but you know, actually that's the last thing I ever give a fuck about. I already, this to him is, it's, you know, it's not a life thing. That's such a wild, full circle moment. It was crazy, dude. It was actually crazy. It was actually like, this is really fucking It's not a light thing. That's such a wild, full circle moment. It was crazy, dude. It was actually crazy. It was actually like, this is really

fucking bizarre world shit. There's a saying in the rooms I go to where they go, was it odd or is it god? It was an odd god, if anything. Yeah, yeah. You've had the same rusty razor since high school. It was it was an odd God if anything. Yeah. Yeah. You've had the same rusty razor since high school. It's time for an upgrade.

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And so that when when you were I mean and then obviously on top of it, there's tapes of your father speaking and playing a blues song. Yeah, he plays some guitar. That's kind of cool. He made it into the soundtrack. Yeah. He finally got to be a published musician. Yeah.

Yeah. That's, I can't imagine the mindfuck, but that's also a beautiful thing to be able to share that with your son and the world at the same time. And it's almost like sitting back and being like, this is I've created this thing by just living my life. And now we get to watch this play out. That is very weird. Yeah. You know, was there ever a moment when you were making this, where you're like, I got to stick, this is too much. I can't. Well, I actually had nothing to do with making it except for being part of the, I got interviewed and I walked in on a couple of

the interviews and that's the only reason why there are a couple of scenes where I'm interacting with it because they would flee and then yeah, like they were, they were being interviewed and I just happened to walk in on the interview and that's where that interaction took place. So it wasn't like, that wasn't even set up or staged, it was very spontaneous. Which added another little bit of dimension to it because you got to see the relationship in real time. But I had nothing to do with this fucking film. the relationship in real time. You know? Like, you know, so.

But I had nothing to do with this fucking film. I didn't see it, I didn't have anything to do with dictating like, you can't mention this, or you have to put this, like you know, so. That's what makes a good documentary. That's what makes an actual documentary, because otherwise it's not really a documentary. Otherwise it's a fucking paid for commercial. Yeah.

You know, like that was, and in fact, that was one of the criteria's for it to make it into doc NYC and into slam dance, which are both documentary film festivals. One of the biggest, most important rules is the subject can't have jack shit to do with making it. Otherwise it's not a legit doc. So I didn't even get to see the motherfucker

until it was on a screen in front of people. Were there any parts where your heart just dropped? Yeah! Yeah! Fuckin' several! Like what the fuck? Yeah, like okay, where do I go? No fuckin fucking where.

God damn. And now I gotta do a fucking Q and A after everybody just looked so far up my fucking asshole, they could see my tonsils and the fucking light shining through my mouth, you know? Yeah. I mean, it's not, you know, it's not always pleasant, but whatever, man.

I ain't afraid and I ain't ashamed and I don't give a fuck. So show me the money, fuck everybody. Paul Rubin's Pee Wee Herman a documentary just came out. Yeah, you saw it So the the whole crux of that was that he was so involved that it almost made it impossible to be made Yeah, well, you know, that's him. Yeah, but I know I don't have that problem I give you all the credit of the world to not be looking over the shoulder like and just allowing it to happen You know worst thing they could have done was get something wrong and I had my wife as one of the producers So that wasn't gonna happen because the fact is this they first of all they couldn't have done it without her and actually

She was the person who? When editing my book before we were even an, before we were even involved with each other, we were involved with the creating of my book. I was writing it and she started editing it for me because otherwise it would have been one fucking 400 page sentence. You know, or probably like an 800 page sentence with no punctuation, no comments.

Just fucking, yeah, you name it. It would have been hieroglyphics. It would have been not readable. Because I can barely read my own handwriting when I go back to try to read my notes. So this shit would have been fucking retarded. And so she turned my mess into something that was readable without changing my words, just making them make sense.

One of the habits I had was throughout the course of this 800 page book, I would tell the same story three or four different times in different ways just because I'm writing it as I'm remembering and a lot of times you remember the same thing several times over the period. Sometimes your mind's working faster than you plan. Yeah, so she would go through and say,

okay, this version of this story reads better than this. And I'm telling basically essentially the same thing, but she basically took my nonsense and made it readable, made it something that, okay, this has a beginning and an end and it makes sense from there to there. She's the one who said this needs to be a film. And this is back when we were working on the book. The book came out in 2016 or 17. I can't even remember.

So she said this shit needs to be a film. Yeah. And we had, she had different ideas. She thought it should be a movie first. And then, you know, went through the idea of it should be a movie based on the book. Then went through the idea of it should be maybe a mini series. It should be this, that the other way. There were a lot of different thoughts about it.

And it wasn't until we had the meetings with eventual the director, Rex Miller, and then the ideas all started. And I stayed the fuck out of it. Well, I got to say, you, you said that the documentary in the book wouldn't have been possible without your wife. I would just like to say, I don't think you said that the documentary and the book wouldn't have been possible without your wife. I would just like to say, I don't think you'd be possible without your wife. It wouldn't be possible that I'd probably be

in as good shape mentally or physically. No, that's what I love about the documentary and also I love love and I love how you guys met and fostered a friendship and then turned that into, I just think your love story is beautiful. You know what, I am just the fucking luckiest motherfucker that I know. And just to, not to backtrack too much,

but as we were talking about the production, I feel like they wouldn't have got it right without her because she, having edited the book, knew from birth to where we were, I wouldn't have got it right without her because she, having edited the book, knew from birth to where we were, the series of events and the order. They would never have gotten that shit right. And also she went through all my fucking photos

and knew what was what. So they made a great film. They couldn't have made it without her. And I just lived through it I had nothing to do with anything except fucking being a completely out of control fucking maniac. Live fast rules. You know I survived yeah all I did yeah and now I hopefully you know I am reaping the rewards of it because I'm living a fucking great life I have a fucking I got a great life I

have an amazing wife great kids I'm fucking out touring you know I have a fucking I got a great life. I have an amazing wife great kids I'm fucking out touring, you know, I got a movie out How the fuck could my life be any better after all the shit that I've been through? Yeah, you know literally I mean, what do you what do I need a few million bucks? Sure, that would be nice But I'm fucking you know, I'm knocking it the fuck out of the park every day. Yeah Yeah, and on top of it all, you're in the retro room and here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here, man. Retro.

You know, who's Harry on top, dude, who thought this would ever be? Oh, the places will go, bro. Yeah, I loved it. Not not to heart, but I I I love there's there's a moment in the documentary and I cannot wait for everyone. I saw it at IFC Center when it came out. Yeah. And there was actually I don't know you you weren't there. No, there was that was the second showing and I was already like I just got back from tour.

Yeah. Yeah. She was like, don't want to go see it tonight. I was like, no. Yeah. I saw it the other night. Yeah. I'm good. There was yo I it was so perfect because the crowd it drew in was like this relic throwback to old New York because there was almost a fight in the crowd. That's perfect. Why would there not be a fight in the crowd?

Someone stood up and was like, I study at Renzo Gracie. Harley saved my life. Shut the fuck up. And I was like, yeah, yeah, baby, shut the fuck up. It was incredible. And I was like yo, this is fucking awesome. RGA baby, don't fuck with us. Yeah, somebody had to let him know. Yeah, yeah, it was awesome.

That's cool. Yeah, yeah. Whoever that was, yeah boy. It was very fun. They put the lights on and everything. It was fucking awesome. How come I hear about this now? This is so perfect.

But there was a moment where you're talking about your childhood, you're like, well, they didn't know. And your wife took up you so much. It was like it was a stupid decision. Well, yes, she didn't. She's not a big fan of a lot of the things that were going on in the 60s. You know. Yeah, I know. I I love that.

Finding someone like that that rocks with you good or bad is incredible. Hey man, ride or die, man. You know, that's how we roll. You know? Yeah. And also the fact that you connected with Erika, who took under your wing and that was like such an important piece to the puzzle too. It absolutely was, you know, and and you know things just had a really the way this film put itself together it was really it was all meant to be you know because she came back into my life not that long before you know she's got in touch with me when she was 18 but then it's like she reached out again right

when we started working on this and we started really rekindling our friendship and you know, I mean I speak to her a lot. Just even the other day. I really am like her father and I have such a good relationship with my sons. After everything that I've been through with them the ups and the downs to connect in the way that I do with them now again man I'm knocking it the fuck out of the park like yeah you know like I remember one time after you know me and my son got into it in a good way. And I just remember thinking, a lot of people don't get past the shit that they have with their fathers or their parents

until their parents are on their deathbed, if even then. And I've been fortunate enough to get through to the other side of the drama and the bullshit that we had, you know, largely to do with, you know, the separation of me and their mother. And that happens, that's normal.

Kids go through their shit. But we got through it and now I'm like, wow, we got your whole lives ahead of you and we're already good. That's like for a dad, that's like, you know, I don't have to wait until I'm like 75 or 85 or 95 to say I'm sorry, son. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Finally, so I love you. It's okay, dad, I'm sorry, dad, I love you too. Yo, we fucking got that shit out of the way and these guys are fucking just young men. They're just starting their life. So I'm like, yo. That was cool to see them at the merch table. Shout out First Unitarian Church, shout out Joe Hargore.

Yeah, Joe Hargore. That was great. Bringing them on the road to sell merch. But also I loved it because, you know, I mean, look, like you and I want to ask about this in a second. But, you know, half the movie is violence, violence, anger, anger, Harley, Harley. And then there's this turn where it shows you taking care of Erica when you don't have to. And I thought that that was like so beautiful and that like was such a nice thing to see. You know what man, real is real.

And that can take all kinds of different shapes, you know. And just because you are hard doesn't mean that you can't have a soft spot, you know. Which is why I loved seeing that. Some of the toughest people that I know are also some of the Like most caring people. Yeah, so, you know, you can't always go on that, you know, and You know Somebody pointed out to me who came to one of the films that even when I was like 15 or 16 and I was looking out for them because they were younger than me. So like even at that age and even as a kid I did have a sense of

you know look out for those who are like unable to or who aren't able you know whether they're not physically strong enough or you know intellectually smart enough to realize this is a sketchy situation that they're in or whatever I always had that kind of more of a big brother thing than say that fucking you know there was a lot of people on the scene who were like straight fucking predators mm-hmm you know like people who had no business first of all hanging out with people as young as they were. Yeah. Never mind like plastering them with fucking alcohol

and whatever drugs that they felt like doing. It's like, wait a second, you're like 30 or whatever the fuck, and you're like, giving drugs to like 15-year-olds or 14-year-olds. Like, I, you know, I talked about this when we did the film showing in San Francisco, because it was showing down the block from a house where I used to hang out with all these people

and this dude would be sitting there shooting me and all these 14, 15 year old kids up. And he was a grown ass man, him and his girlfriend. So it's like you got like four or five young kids and you're getting them all high on meth. Yeah. You know. So, you know, there's a lot of scumbag people out in the world and I already had been exposed

to a lot of scumbag people at a very early age. And, you know, even though I became very aggressive and so on and so forth, I never, I don't feel like I became a scumbag person. I just became a very angry person who really didn't know how to navigate all of that shit and process it too well. And also the violence actually, you know, not to go shit around it got me through because it protected my ass. If I wasn't so fucking goddamn crazy, I would've probably got eaten alive living where I was. So you mentioned earlier being like, like we were talking about addictions, everything,

like everyone has something and you know, like how do you deal with- He's strung out on cigarettes still, still. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He can kick all that other shit, but he can't kick that. Yeah, then this motherfucker goes, "'My doctor says cigarettes are bad, but marijuana is good. Yeah. Well, they didn't say marijuana is good, but it's less bad for your lungs. My doctor told me, he goes, he goes, you know, I'd switch to American spirits or more organic.

I was like, what? So that's what my friend who's on a fucking oxygen thing from his COPD used to say. Now he's like, sucking air. I'm just going to,. I'm just gonna leave that there. Well that's why I'm not gonna switch to American spirits. I'm gonna stay more romantic like that. This is my kind of asshole right here. If you're gonna be an asshole, go all the way, man. That's what I'm saying.

You know what, yeah. Yeah, so like, I don't know, man. I know Hare Krishna was such a big part of you guys. Are you still? No, I'll kill that elephant in the room right now. Actually, I don't follow any religions. That was a very helpful tool in the process of me trying to reach some kind of place of enlightenment.

But in that path, I eventually wound up rejecting not just that religion, but pretty much all religions. Doesn't mean I have any less love or for any of the knowledge that I learned. But I'll just put it, I'll get real, get right to the chase. Religion comes from a culture that has a caste system and that just doesn't work for me.

I don't believe in caste systems, and I believe that most religions, if not all, are completely tainted by politics and self-serving different things, and sexism and homophobia and all kinds of shit that means nothing to me. So unfortunately, you got some positive things that you can get from religion, but there's been a lot,

there's a lot of bad things that go along with religions as well, and therefore I just don't, I don't pitch religion at anybody, I don't fucking practice any religion. I'm on my own path of enlightenment, and I'm happy to say that I did learn some really positive things through Krishna consciousness, but I am not a Hare Krishna.

I'm not a Christian. I'm not anything of the sort, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, nothing. When you were a Hare Krishna, were any of them like, come to the airport with us? No, actually, they told me, no, actually, they actually said, you actually are doing greater service by spreading this wisdom through your music than you could ever do by standing on a street corner. Right. In fact, one of the devotees, when I tried to move into the temple, because I was so

disillusioned with material life and even rock stardom and just all the ego that I was starting to witness in the music industry. Everybody was trying so hard to be important and to me it just seemed like such a crock of shit, all of it. And they were like, look, this is your calling. That's like a great carpenter refusing to build a house because he's decided to renounce building

and it's like, why are you wasting this talent that you were given when you can do these amazing things and build somebody something that they can live in and all these, you know, and I'm like, you know what? They convinced me that this is your calling. You are a musician. You're supposed to be playing music. If you don't take up your sword and fight this battle, you're actually dishonoring. Were you at a point where you were like,

I'm throwing it all away? Fuck yeah. What were you gonna do? Who the fuck hasn't been at that point? I was gonna fucking meditate on God and try to fucking find my way back to spiritual life. Other times I was gonna fucking just do tons of drugs and overdose, you know?

Who the fuck hasn't wanted to give up? I'm just not a give up type of guy. So I always managed to, after my mental breakdown, I fucking suck it up and I get the fuck my shit back together and I get up and I keep swinging. I go down seven times, I get the fuck back up eight. Sometimes I need a little moment to just fucking recover. Krishna Consciousness gave me a lot of very important tools, just like seeing

a therapist, which I started doing at the beginning of the filming of this film, gave me some tools to help me deal with certain things. Did you go to therapy because you're like, this is going to be so heavy. I went to therapy for that exact reason. And it was actually recommended to me by, first of all, Jocko Willink was the person who told me that he believed that I had PTSD and that I should seriously try to work on getting some kind of help or something. He was the one who convinced me that I had PTSD.

And when fucking Jocko Willink tells you you have PTSD, if you don't listen, you're a fucking idiot because he's a fucking Navy SEAL. And if he tells you you have PTSD, you probably should fucking give it a thought. Even if you don't, he's right. Not you, but just in general, like anything you tell me, I'll do.

Yeah, pretty much, and I respect the man, and I respect him a lot. And him and a few other friends of mine that I train with, different Black Belt friends of mine who were also combat veterans, were also pushing me towards trying to speak to someone besides them about all my trauma and my aggression and this, that, the other.

And long story short, I told my boy, I was like, look, I'm not gonna fucking play this therapy bullshit. I'm not gonna go trial and error and find somebody that works for me. If you can get your therapist to talk to me, you know, they work at the VA, they're used to real shit, they're used to dealing with combat veterans and not like, oh, I'm upset because of that, like real shit.

Like my fucking best friend's brains were all over my shirt. Like I'm losing my shit, I wanna fucking flip out. I need somebody who can talk to people like that, because I'm fuckin', I'm that fucked up. So he made some calls and got me in touch with his shrink and I've been seeing a therapist now for about fuckin' five years and, you know, it has, just like the Krishnas,

it has given me a lot of very fuckin' powerful tools to help my progress. So I think it's critical that you get help from somebody that knows more than you about, in this case, how the mind works, how trauma works, how it affects you not just mentally but physically. It's a physical thing, not just a mental thing. I wake up in cold sweats. There's a physical thing, not just a mental thing. I wake up in cold sweats. There's a reason I'm flipping out of my sleep.

There's cortisol in my system because of the dopamine fucking surge and all these other chemicals that are being released in my system. I mean, you fucking go to AA or whatever it is you go to, NA or whatever the fuck. So you know a little bit about these chemicals that release in your body.

It's real shit. So when you're thinking, I'm having an emotional fucking meltdown, maybe actually you're just having a chemical situation going on in your body and you're trying to regulate it and fix it by, in my case, raging the fuck out because it raises my dopamine level. Where in your case you take a quick drag off that cigarette and you get that nicotine hit and all of a sudden you feel normal again. For me, when I fucking get pissed and my chest fills up and my shoulders pump up and I feel,

now I feel good. I'm ready to go. Say it like- Then I'll be there to say, here, have a cigarette. You're not yourself when you haven't smoked. Exactly. But that won't work for me. Like a Snickers commercial. That's when I'll smack the cigarette out of your hand and bite you in the face. Okay. So, you know, that's, but that's, you know, so you get it to, you know, to a place. It's like rage, depression, all that shit also works like a drug.

Yeah. And if you aren't aware of that, you can be on a fucking roller coaster all the fucking time and not even know why or even know that you are on a roller coaster. That's what the thing with PTSD is you're coping in a way that you've made for yourself with these things that you're completely unaware of. Absolutely. And you get these triggers and you're going back

to these behaviors that are self-soothing in a way. 100%. That you've learned through the experience and then they almost feel comfortable. 100%. It almost feels like a warm blanket when you get into these situations. You know people who are depressed so much that it's almost like it's a form

of sense gratification for them. Like they don't feel right unless they're pissing and moaning and getting an audience of people to piss and moan with them about the destitute of their pissy moany situation. And the more people they can trap into talking about their misery with them, the more stimuli they're getting. It's like people with the like buttons.

I have a former band member who can't shut the fuck up online. No matter what he says, he's just got to get that joke. He was on the cover of the Omega Sessions. I know nothing. Cause he won't shut up about it. I know nothing except for some people get strung out on something as simple as a like button. What's a dopamine rush?

It's like a slobber machine. And then they'll do anything to get that dopamine. Exactly. Whether it's true or not. And to the point where you're arguing with bots. Yeah. Because you just need to see that there's a climb in the numbers. It's like the fucking one arm bandit.

You just wanna see if you're gonna get a jackpot this time. And you know, so here we are, you know, I'm wired for chaos, you're wired for nicotine, you know. And with our powers combined. We can really destroy some shit. We will smoke in public. We will fucking smoke and fight. Fuck you, I'm smoking on an airplane.

He's smoking, I'm kicking your ass. Yes, let's go. Yeah, I mean like, I, you know. See, if you were a pothead, we could get along and we could sit there and chain smoke weed. Bro, if I was a pothead still, I would be like, why do you know that I was mean in the third grade? Like, I would not be fun to be with.

My answer would be, because everybody's mean in the third grade like I would not be fun to be my answer would be Because everybody's mean in the third grade except for the person who's being Punished by the person being mean I needed to hear that Ethan go get us some pot Get out of here Anyway, all right Ian next and how many more goddamn questions we got on your character Get out of here, you're the devil, Harley. Get out of here. Anyway, all right Ian, next and how many more goddamn questions we got on your couch before I go eat dinner?

I mean, what the fuck, I thought we were just hanging out. Jesus Christ, all right, here's a question. This little kid, Ethan, you talked to... Make it sound like there's a little kid in the room. The boy I keep in my basement. Ethan, you talked, okay, about growing up and you were white and Puerto Ricans gave you our time. He tried to play soccer at the field across the street and some Puerto Ricans took his

ball away. Recently. Recently. See, those Puerto Ricans. Give him advice. Well, let me tell you something. They're just trying to make a man out of you. Yeah.

It took me a long time to realize they weren't being mean. They were just trying to toughen me up so I'm I got nothing but love for the Puerto Ricans that were mean to me when I was a kid because they toughened me up. We're going to Walgreens you're getting thank-you cards. Yes they were just trying to show you some tough love, man. Don't take it so personal. I haven't touched a soccer ball since. So it's probably for the best. We gotta bring it back to his football.

Brother, brother, you gotta lighten up, man. Lighten up, Cabadon. Shit, come on now. Well, look, man, I don't wanna see what you're like when you're hungry. Let's get you some food. I'm gonna have a cigarette. I can't thank you enough.

Really, that's why you're cutting this. He's having a fucking nicotine fit. He's blaming it on my fucking appetite. This motherfucker, all this talking about fucking cigarettes. He can't take it. He's gotta go fucking smoke one. All right, motherfucker. Get some fucking nicotine gum and just call it a fucking wrap.

It's not the same. No, it's like the medibles. Dude, who knew I was gonna stop smoking because Harley threatened to bite my face? That is all I needed, man. Bro, if that doesn't get you to stop, nothing will. I have bitten faces. It's been documented.

It's been documented. Dude, I have always thought my nose is too big, so please do me the favor. I usually go for cheeks, because it's like, you know, I don't want snot. Yeah. And I don't like boogers. I don't want to. This is more apple like and it gives you something to like, you know, the yeah. I do have a friend who bit this guy's nose off in San Francisco back in the day. And because there's those glands over here, they couldn't get it to stop fucking bleeding.

It was a real problem. Jesus Christ. Yeah. Anyway. Have you ever seen dirty work when Chris Farley, there's a Saigon hooker that bit his nose off? That's like the running joke in the movie. There's the Saigon whore who bit my nose off.

Well, you know, they'll do that though, Saigon whores. I know. This is what I've heard. I don't know, they'll do that though, Saigon whores. This is what I've heard. I don't know. This is why I keep going back. That's why the name. Okay. All right.

I can't thank you enough, man. Really. This was like. You can. Thank you. All right. You're welcome. There it is.

Why don't we tell the people where they could see it, where they could check it out. You got a pay-per-view coming up. What's the deal? Wired for Chaos, we just did like a two week theater run where I was doing Q and A's at the end of them every night, which is, we were all over the fucking country. It was pretty nuts, pretty grueling.

And on August 8th, it's gonna have a one week digital screening and you can get all the information at wiredforchaos.com. You can get it at harleyflan.com or Chromags.com. But yes, so August 8th, one week digital screening in North America, and then there will be more screenings rolling out. The rest of the states, Europe, fucking Taiwan, wherever.

Fucking, it'll be all, this thing's going to be so all over the place. You're going to be sick of hearing about me and seeing my fucking ugly face, but you will still enjoy the movie. If you're a Saigon whore, you'll be able to check it out. And then you can go on a biting spree. Dude, I, if, if, if you have a chance, go see it. I've seen it three times once at theaters, twice on a screener. It's incredible.

For someone who is so responsible for so much memories and growth and a genre. Good shit as well as bad shit. And I own the bad shit. I don't just, you know. I love, you gotta own the bad shit, man. No thorns, no roses. Bro, it makes us what we are.

Yeah. And you can't be, it's not that you're happy. Did you just say no guns, no roses? No thorns, no roses. Yeah. Nevermind. Yeah. Oh God. EFIDADS.com for all my dates. I'm going everywhere. Patreon.com slash BDNPod. And I got to ask one more question, okay? Can World Peace exist? I don't think humans have evolved to a place where it's truly a possibility, sadly.

I was trying to make a joke about the song World Peace from Age of Quarrel. And of course, I have no sense of humor. I'm just funny. I'm not really a fan of humor. I'm not a fan of humor. And that's why you're not no sense of humor. I'm just funny. I'm not a fan of humor. You're not a fan of humor. Not really. No wonder I've been bombing every joke. When you've been through as much as I am, you kind of laugh at life. You don't laugh at jokes. Yeah. You know, well that's why you and I make a good pair. I think like a buddy cop film, nobody ever wanted.

I'm going to go outside and smoke a joint and I'll see you while you're smoking your cigarette. Sounds good. See everybody. Bye bye. Later, people. It doesn't matter, it doesn't matter what you say anymore.