Berner Phone - Ashley Gavin: Open Relationships & Outside Babies

Episode Date: June 11, 2023

Ashley is back with a new comedy special out that I LOVED! Watch it here! She opens up about her open relationship, how is happened, and how it's going! She also talks about the process of creating her first special and creating comedy as a lesbian in a straightt male dominated field. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to Burning Hell Ashley Gavin is, I think the first ever that I've allowed on the pot But it's gay pride month So I was forced to Obligated by law People were going to burn down this

studio. I'd be canceled. And I was, I had you in my phone just for this month. I've been waiting. Thank you so much for going to get breakfast with me. Breakfast with me in June. I appreciate it. We've been trying to work on it for so long. I've been trying to get a meal with this fucking June rolls around. Oh, hey. Do you know what I actually realized that most of my podcast guests are gay. Really? Like major, I basically have a gay podcast. That's great. I'm a competitive podcast to you. You are and you're winning. No, no. Your gay podcast is far more popular than my gay podcast.

I've been appropriating gay culture, and I need to apologize to you. Yeah, you played, like, professional level tennis. I appropriate a lesbian. I've just said you're a butchy straight girl, but really what you're doing is wrong. And now that we're here, and it's June, it's time to have the uncomfortable conversations, Hannah. These are the uncomfortable conversations. Or maybe I'm not a butch straight. Maybe I'm just a femme les.

You could be a femme. I wouldn't even, yeah, I mean, oh my God, that's such an interesting, yeah. If you were, if you were a lesbian, I would never call you, like, a butch lesbian. Because, like, I'm a bitch. And even when I use butch for myself, I'm like, I don't think I'm butch enough for butch. Like, you know, like, I consider myself. You're just Jay and Silent Bob. I am, if Jay and Silent Bob had a baby.

Can you stop quoting literally every video that I go viral? that I have go viral, there's like seven of those. And every single one of those guys thinks that he invented that joke. And I'm like, this joke has been around for a while, bro. I get it. You just, you nailed it. I didn't mean to, and I'm a 35-year-old woman. Speaking of being 35, you posted a very vulnerable Instagram story saying,

guys, I'm finally looking older. Yes, yes, I did. What made you do that? That's the vulnerable Instagram story. That's straight. I'm looking older. Meanwhile, I'm posting shit, like, about my chronic pain and, like, homophobia in this industry. Trying to help trans people right now.

You're like, you admitted that you have a wrinkle. What was that like? That was my, like, straight, privileged perspective that I want to apologize for. But it was, it's kind of cool to see someone. say that. I don't know if I'm being stupid for talking about my age on stage or in Instagram, because I know I look younger than I am. Yeah. Because I have this. I have a disorder. Everybody. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Literally everyone. No, you're, I do not look 35. You don't have a poor. Um, thank you. But I also think 35 isn't young. I mean, it's an old.

Zoom. No, no, no. comedic comedic zoom on my face 35 is not old I see I have a very hot grandma so I know you're a hot grandma so I'm like investing in myself long term my mom I know was her hottest like after she had kids

I actually think in your 30s and 40s can be when you're at your hottest because you lose there's just something that happens in a woman's face or a person's face and I don't take gender out of it I don't know how men are. But I actually think some of the lines are, like, kind of beautiful and, like, define your face in an interesting way. See, what I do is I don't.

You know how to dress. You, like, know yourself you're more confident. Well, yeah, confidence carries everything to be hotter. Do you look in the mirror a lot? Yes, but more than anything, I'm editing. I'm looking at my clips, watching my tapes all goddamn day. Like, I just sit and stare. I'm working on a new show right now.

I just watch myself for an hour and a half. straight through pausing, taking a... You're just staring at yourself all day, and it's not good for you, and we wonder why the suicide rates are up. Everybody's staring at themselves all day with discontent. Yeah.

I really don't look in the mirror that much. That's smart. Or I just don't... I have the, like, reverse biisomorphia where I look in the mirror for, like, a second, and I'm like, she's fucking hot. No, I have that. I have that.

I definitely have that. But I think for me, it's like I'm noticing new lines on my face, and I'm like, You know, it's interesting because I'm like, I don't want to do anything crazy, but I was like, oh, this is, for however confident I am and however masculine I present, this is like such a female, like, experience that I'm having, like looking at the lines at my face, being like, what do I want to do, if anything, about this? It also is you realizing you're human, because, like, our whole 20s, you hear all the, like,

oh, you're so young, you're so young. And you're like, well, I feel like a feral mess. And like, but enjoy your youth. The thing is that I didn't know that I was a feral mess. My 20s were the worst. I had the worst 20s and I had no idea how bad it was. Like I look back at my 20s and I'm like, what the fuck were you doing, dude? You were in therapy?

That was you in therapy for that long. You were sober. I never had a drink in my life. And that was you in your 20s, that that shit. That shit. What was happening? I was just in these horrible relationships. Oh.

And not really allowing myself to like, I didn't start comedy until I was Yeah. I wasn't allowing myself to be my full person. My hair, bro. What was going on? I shouldn't admit to this, but before I found a straight woman really sorted me out. I dated, I dated this straight woman. A true ally.

Yes, true ally. She was having sex with me, so that was great. If you're, listen, if you think you're an ally, hey, you. Hello, female listener age, let's say 24 to infinity. Are you really an ally? Have you given a woman an orgas? Have you given a woman? Have you received one from a woman?

If not, check your privilege. Are you a giver and a taker? Top or a bottom. Are you versed? I think all lesbians are switchy. Yeah. We don't say verse as much in the lesbian community. I was saying how long we could go without talking about sex.

Oh. No, fuck that. Don't have sex with me. We'll have sex with me, but go listen to my podcast. We're having gay sex. you're trying to change the subject about your hair it looks so bad so here's why it was it long it was long well right now it's crazy long i haven't heard this is like the longest it'll ever get but i it was really really long i didn't know how to dress i knew what like i could see what i wanted to look like

and i just like no idea how to get there and like just like sort of like half did it and then abandoned the project you know my eyebrows were all fucked up and this and if you go in my past life I was a computer scientist and a computer science educator. Yeah. And I have like a TED talk and like these keynote speeches that are just out on the internet of me just looking horrible. And now they're going viral because though they went viral at the time as a TED talk. But like now they're resurging because people are looking for my comedy.

And then my fucking TED talk goes into their algorithm. And that's why you have wrinkles because you've been through it. I've been through it. And it's so beautiful. I've worked in two male dominated fields. Yes. Sorry, I got, I get very pumped up about that stuff. You grabbed a tit, too.

Yeah, I did. I know that's not why. My shirt is, like, not really staying on right now, because I'm an ally. I do, I do think, I, like, don't do. Are you not stripping for lesbians on your podcast? You're not an ally. You're not an ally. I don't wear bras.

The second it hits, like, 65, I stopped wearing bras. Um, you're kind of like, sorry that I just stare at your boobies. No, it's, you have, but you're kind of, like, they're not massive. They're not, like, massive. They're quite perky now that I'm staring at. I've never stared at your tits before, Hannah, and I feel super uncomfortable doing so. No, but you're right.

They're small enough that I could pull off a top like this. That's what I'm saying. But they're big enough that a nip could slip out in this, and it would be a moment. Like, people would talk about it for at least a day. They'd be like, did you see one on a fucking tits slip out? You should do that. It's a good publicity.

I think actually, in order for a nip slip to matter, you have to be a level of fame that you're not called. quite at. I love you, but you're not quite there yet. No, people would be like, she's so thirsty. Yeah, exactly. If you're going to do a nip slip, you have to be of a certain level of fame. Otherwise, people are like, oh, free nipple. If you're not at a... No, you have to have a nip slip after you've hit a certain level of fame, and then you're going down, you're downward spiraling. And then you're back up.

People are like, yeah, she's definitely, you know, overdosed on Ozempic or something's going on. Do we have a topic or do we just talk? Because I thought of something. What? I was thinking, I was lamenting. As I often do. As you often do. only way of thinking you do because she's a smart overthinker um thank you i appreciate that i am a smart overthinker um i was thinking i was just thinking about how i'm doing everything on the internet as a comedian i've never had a fucking credit like i've never had a break and every break that i've had is like through my own work and like it's just one little viral video at a time and i was like no other woman is doing it this way and then i thought and i caught myself and i thought

Hannah Berner is the only other woman making it on the internet right now. Okay, are we going to make out? One. No, I do have to say, everyone has to run to watch your special. I'm such a fan girl. Thank you. And this is the thing. I consider you.

It's free on YouTube. I consider you a mentor to me. And I kind of, it was like a mentor that I like put on a pedestal where I was like, the industry isn't, you know, noticing her yet. But I know her. Like, she's special. and she's got the goods and like who knows what's going to happen she's grinding so for me to see the person that I respect and admire to then like crush it so much I I'm like one of those

fans where I'm like she's mine like I'm like that's my girl like that's very sweet like I feel like I was part of the journey in a way where I watched you when you could have quit so many times when it was really bad when it was honestly sad at some points like pretty sad like we were like what what's going on here um but in the when was that for you because i don't think i knew you at those points in my career no i had hope when i met you you were telling me the stories of oh my god they were yeah like just dark stories dark dark stories that i was like thank god i didn't know you then because i would been pretty kind of a bummer to be around bummer i try not to be a bummer i try to like operate this line of like

I will never be that person who's like where did they come from they make it look so easy but that's the thing as two New Yorkers I don't want to be around fucking hyperpositivity I don't want that energy I love your shit where the second I see you I know you'd never lie or bullshit me like I'll look you right in the eye I'm incapable and that's what I fucking love about you

yes and that's why you're so good at comedy but I do have to say as a straight person on Pride Month actually shouldn't it was May but I watched your special and everyone needs

I'm telling you you have to watch it run and watch it after this you explained something so fascinating to me because I'm dumb

and did not think about it of how you were doing cruises during a time I mean it was probably a decent gig yes it was

honestly like for the downsides of it the upsides were that I had stable work stable middle class work as a comedian

I still couldn't afford to live in New York on that alone, but like, you know. But you're doing gigs and there's a clean show. And on the clean show, they said you cannot talk about being gay. Correct. So that means you cannot talk about any romantic relationships. No. Where the straight comics can talk about dating and kissing. Even hooking up, that's probably fine.

Right, if they do it in a clean way. If they do it in a clean way. So you literally can't talk about anything relationships because you're gay. There was a point where I was like, do I have anything where I could lie about the gender of the other person and just use like it felt but to me as a first of all me being like I hooked up with a guy like it's going to be so disturbing I look like this on stage I'm wearing a backwards baseball cap and a men's t-shirt right now it would confuse everyone it would have been so uncomfortable for the audience I mean maybe not maybe the audience is from a homophobic enough area that they they hear butch dykes just being like oh yeah I'm straight the conversion camps where the guys like and then I met Emily and She really, she's my best friend. And they hurt my, watching gay people talk about how straight they are now is like actually some of the most, I don't know if it hits you the way it hits me, but it makes me cry like immediately.

No, it makes me very upset. But then I think that they have like a sexual relationship of their head with Jesus. Like Jesus is hot. Yes, yes. They're like, he's my man. I love him. Let me drink him up. Sorry for the a is more.

Just pour it on my face. Blood all over my face, Jesus. Blood on my face. I'm actually trying to... I haven't worked on it yet, but I thought of a bit about how, like, women should do lesbian conversion camps to just learn about orgasms.

Yes, you should come and work it out at Sunday school. We should have you back. That was the best show. When it's good, it's good. Yeah. When it's bad, it's a shit show. I do remember, like, I was the token straight,

and I was like, I could pass as gay. You do. You are queer passing for some reason. her passing for some reason, but I think they could sense that I didn't choose the life that I lived. And no one does. I mean, some of you did. You chose to be gay. I did choose

to be gay, but I thought really hard about it. And can you imagine, well, going back to the real, can you imagine if I were straight? Can you imagine? It'd be a shit show. But that's why I avoided talking about being like the, first of all, I would have to like use these fake

pronouns for the people I was talking about dating and I would use they and it felt so weird and I felt like I was back in middle school and I was like so uncomfortable not because the voice the homophobic voice that I hear in my head is like well like why not just do that if you have other things to talk about and it's like actually I prove that I have so much more to talk about because I did no relationship humor I mean I 100 percent which is insane because my career just started on pretty much purely relationship humor and like napping I got to say I'm not like super proud of the set.

It's not like that half an hour clean, but it was like a writing challenge for you. It was like a writing challenge. And there were a couple jokes in there that I was like, I couldn't believe that I made that one clean, interesting. And it worked at this like PG show.

There were like a lot of feminist jokes that I was able to make work in that clean PG show. Or like sneaky feminist. Yeah. Or sometimes just like blatant feminism. I have this men versus women being crazy bit that I've had for a really long time. That worked.

And yeah. And thank you for plugging the special. That's why in the special when you're like, you know, I wanted to date with this guy and then I just end up eating his pussy. Like you always much better than that, but obviously that was the line. The joke is,

and just so you know, the whole set, that set is sort of about this process of blowing up on the internet and having to, for a portion of my career being criticized for how much gay material I did, even though I don't think it was excessive. But then for another portion of my career, it's like they only want the gay material

because I like blew up on the gay portion of the internet. Wow. So it's about like just being tokenized in both feeling that in both directions. And so the set is basically like, okay, I'm going to do a set that has almost nothing to do with being gay for like a really long time. And then you're going to hear the gayest shit you've ever heard in your entire life at the end. It's also like comedy is about speaking your truth.

So it's so funny. It's like go back in the closet for this set. And you're like, I don't even know who that girl would. be. Yes, yes. But when you explained, like, how a male straight comic, when he talks about relationships, jizzing, whatever, that's just him being a comic. Yeah. When you talk about your relationships, that's gay shit. Exactly. Even if, even if, even if I'm like, and when women talk about their relationships, they're just talking about sex. Pussy, pussy, pussy. So it's like, it's those levels. We're like, I'm still above in that. We're like, I'm, oh, Hannah's talking about

sex. But with you, you're just making gay jokes that I don't understand. I do have an advantage. I think, with a pretty sizable chunk of male comedy people. Because if you, and you even read on comments, like, oh, this woman is actually funny because she's like a dude. That's what men say to me. I have people come up to me and be like, you're not like a woman comic. You're like a comedian. Why?

Because I like tits. Actually, you're so fucking right. You're so right. But that's why a lot of women comics going throughout generations have. covered their tits and that kind of stuff because they're like, she's a woman, but like not fully woman right now. They don't want to see you have the power

and the charisma and hold power up. Because when you make someone laugh, you like, you are dominating them. You're controlling them. You're bringing out an emotion or an involuntary response when they laugh. That's an involuntary response.

So for a man to like see you, see your tits, and also, So, like, you have control over them. That's a lot for some men. Not all men. I know some men love funny women. Yeah. And I think you are God's gift to masculinity.

Like, thank you for being attracted to powerful women. Yeah. But, like, for a lot of dudes, it's, if they see you as attractive, they want to have the power. I did a man on the street where I actually asked guys, like, why do men comment women aren't funny? Because I'm finding people think this joke was bad. But, like, why do you have to then say all women aren't funny? like whatever and they were saying it was kind of like you're stealing our jobs like it was their thing so like we're new like johnny come lately to this like male dominated field humor is ultimately at the end of the day as everything is to get pussy like there's like things that we have evolved to do is it worth it getting back with your ex is it worth it getting back with my ex that that was the worst no no i hate her no i try to you know like those

Metropolitan magazines where they're like should you get back with your ex is it worth that like I was trying to be like got it got it like I think just if it was clickbaited you clickbaited me I dated this woman a few years ago um she's eight years younger than I'm 35 she's 27 she's eight years younger than I am when we started dating she was 24 and made it very clearly she was like you know I really like you but like I'm not ready where you are and I was like I had said to her, I was like, look, I'm really only to date. I really only want to date seriously, someone who's ready for marriage. I really just want to be in an open relationship with you. Well, we weren't in an open relationship at that time. At that time, I was closed. The pandemic hit. We had fallen in love and we were like, fuck it.

Like, why are we going to break up? This is such a wonderful relationship. It's pandemic. Like, let's just see where this goes. And it was the most beautiful, perfect relationship I had ever been in. I loved her so much. But I knew what was coming. knew what was coming and so at the end kind of like when the pandemic started to like you know open up

she was like I still am really looking to explore my sexuality and like you know like have my 20s and stuff like that does that what you call it Gaby? Yeah she was like a little Gaby yeah she's by and so I was like yeah get out of here like you you know like go go out there be in the world kid and that kind of thing that sounds like that was very mature of you to like let her go well what she's a she has free will I mean one of the things I love about my girlfriend is her autonomy and her free will

yeah I did not I was not angry I was not I had no malice or anger yeah towards that she was super clear about it I understood it yeah I was super clear about my boundaries she respected them and told me

that she was not ready for marriage this is so not a straight relationship continue well I've also like I've had to see some fucked up shit in the queer you want to see some fucked up shit in the queer world, watch the queer ultimatum. Holy shit. My God.

People are saying I look like one of the girls who happens to be toxic. No, you're... Veronica or something. You don't look like anybody. No. You do not look like that one. Okay, I've gotten multiple messages, and they said she's not getting a good edit either. Well, let me tell you this.

The edit that you got in reality TV was very clearly fake. This woman is doing things in one shot. There's no doubt. I want to be clear. If someone's like, I got a bad. that at it. Watch the shots. Watch them. Are the words coming out of her mouth in real time

without cuts? Looking away, the audio comes from somewhere else. She did that. There's a difference between an edit and an unhinged individual. But there's also context. Like, what is she reacting to? Did she actually react to the right things and stuff? She was at a table.

Mouting, she was going fuck off. Like, under her breath to her partner. I don't care what is happening at the table. Yeah, yeah. That is, you just don't do that. Going into reality TV with a partner, holy shit, like you're putting both of you out there

and you have to have a like, let's not embarrass each other, let's respect each other at the end of the day, no matter how much we get pushed to have conflict. She said, I love you to her partner and then said, say it back. You're telling me that's a bad edit. That's not a bad edit. They didn't clip that in.

from another portion of the conversation. Maybe earlier the girl said, tell me, I love you, and I'll say it back, and then she said it, and the girl didn't say it. No, no. I'm just trying to, I'm play doubles advocate. There's literally no way. Watch it, watch it.

It's okay. I'm too traumatized. It'll be triggering. So crazy. I'll be triggering. Excuse me. I'm sorry, I said she was crazy. So now you're...

So then we got, when we got back together, well, we were still in love. Yeah. We never fell out of love. We took like a year, year and a half long break. And we saw each other. once over that period of time love was very much there she was like i wanted i wanted to like hook up with her she was like no i i'm i'm just still not ready so like let's not do that but then um then a few

months went by and we got dinner again and this time we had a slip up and i we like we didn't have sex but we we hooked up and that was funny every straight man got very confused when you just said that we didn't have sex but we did hook up he's very confused i would say there was no genital contact with with fingers or mouth so I would say okay yeah I don't know that makes sense it was pretty second base yeah I don't know but um uh you felt it was there and then but she was like I'm still not ready and I don't want to lead you on and I was like okay well I'm let's see this is hot the amount that she's like I know God I'm the longing I'm sold I want to date her now I know she's so touch a queer communicator and I was like let's do this I don't

want to see you that often because it's too much for me but I would like to see you and also I'm going to I'm going to seriously date other people and if someone comes along I'm going to tell you like I'm going to tell you like this is your last window here because I loved her very much and I wanted her to know how serious I was and I wanted to be open because it felt like open as a communicator because it felt like it might have been going back but I didn't want to go back into it and have the same result yeah I wanted her to know that I was seriously looking for marriage so I was like dating these other people and then the hookups like increased in frequency and all of a sudden we were planning a vacation and so I straight up said to her I was like we can keep going down this

road but I need to know now am I a person that you can see yourself spending the rest of your life and is that something you're going to be ready to do within a reasonable time frame like the next few years and she was like yes I I think that's what this is going to be and you know we kept talking through it and we were like should we keep it open and that's how I got into the open relationship because we were easing back into our relationship not because I ever thought I'd be in an open relationship or saw that for myself or her

but it was just like we were already doing it so we were like and she was already feeling like I'm a Sagittarius I want to be free so you were defining the situation that you happen to fall into yeah yeah and so and also like I'm on the road all the time and you know sometimes I'll meet people on the road and that's fun so we were basically like let's just keep it open

like no dating other people like no relationships with other people no serious dating but as a lesbian the stereotype is you hook up once you have 400 orgasms you fall in love I am quite good at being so up front about the whole thing so if I go into hook up I'm like

I'm in an open relationship I don't date other people I don't develop feelings with other people it's just like hooking up and fun are you okay with it? It's so funny because straight people, I think, really have trouble pulling off open relationships, or it's, like, really not an option that often. Yeah, I mean, I do think it's more present in the queer community, particularly with men. I think lesbians are starting to adopt it.

What do you think are the benefits to an open relationship? She told me the other day that she was like, we were talking about, we were talking about eating pussy from, from the back as one does i love that doing that she had mentioned in one of her hookups that that had happened i don't know how we got there but i was like i did not know that give me give me a name like just like um jessica male name oh stephen perfect because you're not like i was like i did not know that stephen was like throwing down stephen is eating your pussy from the back like i didn't

know that you're like i know i had to compete with stephen i mean i was like i was not aware that stephen was putting the moves his face is in your fucking ass like i didn't know that stephen on these hookups was like putting in the work i thought it was coming in 20 seconds right that's what i thought and i had like a little bit of jealousy but i had like you impressed i was impressed yeah i was like okay i think what it does is like when you open up a conversation we do not go into the nitty gritty details I don't want to know I don't need to flare my jealousy up for no reason

this is something she is allowed to do these are things that I am doing why flare it up when we've like agreed to these like guidelines but I will say like it makes it so much less like what you're talking about with porn

I don't see her desire as something that I need to get riled up about I see it as just like a normal thing that she has does it even turn you on a little a little bit a little bit when i when i found that out i was like this is hot that i'm feeling like i want to step up my game for this particular evening yes you know what i mean you're not like oh she enjoyed something with someone else you go oh we can enhance this moment exactly and i also feel like there's so many different pieces of it i think the communication is the biggest one like we are so i have never been in a

relationship where I'm so honest with someone in a kind way and someone is so honest with me in a kind way. I also love how you guys have gone through like a lot of different stages of your relationship and like that's what strength is. Yes. In a relationship. It's not two people just being like, we never fight. We never did anything. It's like no, we battled shit. Yeah. I mean, we don't have like toxic fighting. We of course have had like arguments or discussions, I guess is like more of the discussions. But like she and I like don't like get riled up at each other. We really be good at fighting. Yeah exactly. We really discuss and sit down and when when you are able to be honest with a partner about like attraction towards someone or like you know maybe she she introduces like a new

she's like hey I met someone I'm going to go on a date with them. How are you feeling about that? And I'll ask my questions if I have any questions like when you're able to talk about that for some reason you're able to talk, it makes every other thing in your relationship so much easier to talk about. That's really interesting. And do you have to tell each other every time there's a new person? I think, is there a rule? We have, I think the way we look at it is, yeah, I wouldn't say that's necessary, but like if something out of the ordinary happens, we tell each other. If I hook up on the road, she knows that that happens. But you don't have to be like, hey, I hooked up was on last night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If I'm, like, going on a date in New York City, that's out,

that's, like, not something I usually do. Yeah. That's something I would tell her about. Yeah. I think if she saw the same person, like, twice in a week, that's something she tells me about. But the date is for a hookup. Yeah. It's not like, oh, I really want to meet someone. She doesn't really do dates, but I'm seeing women. Yeah. Oh, yeah. So you have to court. Yeah. It's a little bit. If it's in New York, we're going to go on a date. Yeah. But if it's on the road, it's a little more like, do you kind of tell yourself like I'm her person and she's enjoying sex with other people I try not to think about the sex she's having with other people because I know how hot she is yeah so you know like I I you know that's not also I'm speaking for I'm actually not a jealous person

really as in like I want people to want my man yes I but I but I like when he think I'm I'm jealous if he's like, well, that girl was really funny and great energy to be around. I'd be like, divorce. That woman was powerful. I get jealous over weirder things. Like, if he's like, oh, yeah, that girl's, like, really pretty, I'm like, yeah, well, she can't play tennis. So, I'm just sitting around the tennis court. Embarrassing, embarrassing.

That'd be funny, like, you challenging a woman to a duel, and it's just tennis. I think, like, I do love that about her. I love other people, like, looking at her. I'm like, yeah. Yeah. But I think I, it's a line where it gets easier. There are things that like have, I've been challenged about and like then like had to mull over and be like, this is actually fine, like, calm the fuck down.

But like, I think ultimately it's made it, it's made the relationship like really, really strong. But because of the trust in the communication. Yeah. I have so much trust in her. I know she would never, ever jeopardize, like, our relationship. And it just takes away the boogeyman. Like, I met a woman on the road. I talked about this in my recent podcast that I had, like,

I haven't had, like, an instantaneous spark with someone in a very long time, but I had like... See, I'm jealous for her right now. That is a phrase that you're like, even in an open relationship, you're like, that's... A spark? Absolutely not. I got sick. Yeah. I just got sick in my butt hole. I didn't know I was going to feel this way

I thought I was just hooking up with a woman after a show Yeah And then it occurred to me that I was like Oh, I like this person You got a little butterfly And I instantly, as soon as I got back I was like, I have to tell Jen Because this was out of the ordinary

This is something that might have made her uncomfortable So how do you cope? Well, I told her and I... She murdered her? She is dead now. Well, I told her and I like wept. I cried because I felt guilty That is not something you can control.

But that's the thing. That's why people aren't in open relationships so they don't accidentally find themselves getting a spark while someone's eating them out. That's the whole point of not being in an open relationship. Right. So then I told her. I'm just playing those out of care.

No, no, no, play it. I'm going to, we'll see this situation through. I told her and she was like, look, I don't love hearing that that happened, but it would be insane for me to think that I'm the only person that you could ever feel a spark with. and it took out the demon. If you met someone that you had a spark with

in a closed relationship, you might be thinking about that guy for a while. Yeah, and what could have been? What could have been? And it's like this whole fantasy in your fucking brain. Which is dangerous.

And as soon as I talked to Jen about it, it took the boogeyman out of it. I was like, this woman trusts me so much. Like, I will never jeopardize this relationship and she won't either. So then it's like you don't talk to that person anymore. What I did was I had a conversation with that person and I was like, hey, like, we obviously have like a connection

and I do feel like I can see you again, but like I can't treat this like a relationship. And while that spark happened, like, you know, I'm not going to be texting you every day. I'm not going to be like none of the things that I think tend to follow a spark are like got to happen. Yeah, that's so right because when you meet people, like you either hit off or you don't.

Like, I joke, like, I was married the first time I met this. Exactly. And then there's a path that almost 90% of us follow. One, you have that feeling. And when you're in an open relationship and you're communicating, it's like, I almost, like, it took all of the heavy weight off of that path. And now I can, like, go my own direction. And you're also self-aware that you're like, I'm going to have sparks with a lot of people. Yeah.

I think the way to prevent. And this is how you squish it. That's when it's when it's closed. that's when it becomes naughty then it becomes naughty it's naughty and then it and then you're like having all of a sudden you're having an emotional affair yes which is honestly so much

worse what we've concluded yes than if I would rather yeah like the guy I'm with to fuck someone and be like yeah it was hot but like I would never spend a dinner with her right exactly it goes back to what I said where him being like there was a spark right exactly and then you're like what are the rules am I allowed to flirt with this person am I allowed to like be friends with this person and then you're you're building

an emotional affair. Whereas what having that conversation with Jen did for me is it took almost, it took the air out of it. Yes. And I was, she's like, yeah, I mean, I've met people too that I'm like, they're fun to be around, but it's like, we haven't done the work that me and you have done to establish this. And then it comes full circle where you're like, holy shit, doing the work and like being in love with this person is the thing that I want every day. That's the thing that I like treasure. The fact that this person like trusts me so much like that we can have an open conversation like this and like not fight like genuinely just sit there and have this like an uncomfortable thing happened like uncomfortable things are going to happen throughout

your entire marriage yes and so like it just I don't know I think it's I see people who have like cheated um because of this like idea of this spark which they had had with that person initially but then they've done work and then they become like more of a comfortable type of love and then they leave for the spark and then six months in they're like oh fuck i'm in the same place that i was and i hate myself yeah yeah exactly so that's that's so powerful like that i didn't never i don't i don't i'm not really cheating is like not i don't think a part of my personality i i it feels like weird to say on the air like but it definitely clarified what do i do with when i see someone and i instantly develop feelings like what do you do with that it also makes you less jealous because

you realize the same way you had a spark with someone and then consciously were like yeah but they're not my girl they can do that too yes so you're like oh i've done it they've done it we're the same we're two humans and of course hearing that she would have that with someone would be not fun to hear yeah but ultimately at the end of the day i'd rather hear that and know that she came to me and wouldn't be you know on her phone texting that guy or seeing that guy's friend you know what i mean well it's it's the classic joke of people being like when i heard about that he dated other people before me and you're like all mad then you're like you've dated other people before him so let's just like let's be honest and move on and realize we're both existing in the same world this has been

so eye-opening for me and you're so vulnerable about your open relationship i know it's one of those things where I'm like, it is not traditional. So it's like, what are people going to think and how are people going to judge me? I think people are more judgmental when they don't understand it. And I want to clarify, like, I've never wanted to be in an open relationship. I was like totally monogamous. Like, never really had a desire to see other people always in those relationships. Like, that's why I said, like, cheating, like, is so, it's just something that I would never do to someone. Yeah.

And yet being in an open relationship makes it feel like, oh, even less. That's why I think I wanted to talk to you because I feel like we had a very similar stance on stuff. Like we both love monogamy. We would never cheat. So for you to then say I'm an open relationship, it felt like something that

I wanted to hear how your brain works and how you do it. And it makes it seem less like this freaky, you know, queer shit that people do. Yes, yes. Yeah. By you explaining it makes it seem so like it's logical thank you i appreciate that and i yeah you're not doing like some people think it's like some like wild sex capade no totally not like people put so many stereotypes on it i'm not like neither one of us is like hooking up with a ton of people yeah like we're you know and we're also

practicing safe sex so we sort of like have to have these conversations around like how we're practicing safe sex and getting tested and yada yada yada also there's something hot about like the fact that you don't have to but each day you are consciously choosing each other. Yeah, I think that is another part of it. Like, you could, it's crazy how you could meet someone that you have a spark with and then within like 48 hours be like, nah. Rather than doing this whole, like, new relationship energy, like, when you fall for

someone, your body goes fucking crazy. Yeah, it's a dopamine. You're sick and you're thinking about them all the time and yada, yada. And it's just like, it sucks all of the air out of that. And it's not such a big secret. So you realize how it really is this like mental hormonal experience? Totally. Totally.

Wow. Love is like I, obviously I felt that with Jen, like when I met her. But the thing that I love about Jen is like it's been such a long, slow burn and it just like keeps getting better and better and better. And I never thought that I would have like such a peaceful growing relationship with someone based on my horrible 20s. Whereas it was, when I fell in love, I was like physically ill. Yes. Felt like I was going to die, obsessed with this person. You know what I mean?

And then you're ignoring every red flag. Yep. And then all of a sudden you're living with them. You're crying in their bathroom. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. It's once a guy told me that he loved that our relationship was a slow burn, and I took it personally. Like, I felt like it was like, oh, so he doesn't mean we have this, like, crazy hot love.

It's slow burn. burn. I'm like, what the fuck does that mean? It's so much better. I think he meant that we just didn't fight. Yes, yeah. But I was like so burnt. I was like, you didn't really like me at first. I mean, I'm writing a show about this right now, but like that's sick feeling, like physical, physical illness of falling in love. I didn't, I had like, I had butterflies of Jen, but like I didn't feel that. And now I know enough about myself that if I feel that

for someone, run away. Like my childhood, idea of love, the one that I feel the most in, like, my nervous system, usually not a good sign. Like, usually that person is going to fuck me up. Yeah. And Jen, like, my heart is, like, protected. You know what I mean? I don't need to feel sick and upside down, like, I'm protected. Well, it feels like the home you want.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not the home that you know. Yes. Which is sometimes very hard to decipher. Totally. like she's my I feel like that kind of love was my past and and Jen is like the love my future and what I'm trying to build and what I want my children to understand love to be speaking of your future what are we what are we manifesting what are you focusing on what are you looking forward towards this is like we're going to brunch and this like what I want to talk about I don't am I special is out like go watch it are we doing plugs or are we just talking plug your shit well my special's out it's on YouTube it's really good it's amazing why did you decide not to give it a unique title honestly i just wanted i was so nervous and for good reason about what men would think of the title and the thumbnail and stuff like that and i just wanted it to be clearly

evergreen a comedy special for everyone yeah so like i wanted to it's called live in chicago and i that's all i know you always have a reason behind everything and i was like i wonder what her i wish going back and looking at the set the title that i should have given it that i didn't think of that I think was evergreen is outside baby because the inside outside baby joke and also the special is like you can always change it born into the world so it's always just change the title what is wrong with me you can just change the thumbnail you're so right like just do it outside baby yeah you already got the generic one I think you should do it I think outside baby's and then do like a re promo of it yeah because it is my outside baby it's if you know the joke the

special is my outside baby so good so like yeah that's what i would and that's not like it's not a lesbian title it's not like uh like it's just like yeah you're like oh what does that mean exactly lesbian comics do have that like you're opening the doors for us a little bit i hope so or just like that we're all helping each other yeah no i don't i do not care also i have total confidence that these men are going to come whatever they think of me from the photo yeah i know if they see me Well, I feel this way about it. Anyone that sees me is going to love my set. Well, it's like me with, it's mostly, first of all,

it was like 95% women that came to the shows. Then boyfriends started coming, more boyfriends. And then I started this whole bit of like, okay, there's a little too many straight men here. And that I'm fine as long as they have a chaperone. That's what I say. Because like a guy who's like alone with his friends, that's so weird energy.

Oh, with his friends, I don't mind. Just one guy alone. I get a lot of one guys alone. Yeah, no. Because guys don't, my male friends, they don't tell people. that they're in the closet for you. They are, and I just want to let,

if you are a male fan, please tell your friends. Like, they're going to like it too. It's not weird that you like it. It's quite normal that you like it. We have a lot in common. Yeah. And just invite your friends. Yeah.

A lot of times it's like, oh, my boyfriend, he's 38, and like he didn't think he'd connect with you at all, but they laughed the whole time. And like, it's nice, but like, you're also like, yeah, he had preconceived notions. Different people laugh at different things, and that's why it's so important to have a diverse audience. And you like, I like the tension.

But this recently, as I've been getting more straight guys at my shows, this one guy walks in. Sorry. So, so. No, it's just sounded so like you were going recently with the straight bad. This has been a thing I've been dealing with. This guy comes in and he's late. And I kind of, you know, obviously, and it's like a theater. Like I didn't have to call him out. Like I could have easily ignored him. But I was like, hey, what are you doing?

Why are you late? And he had, I never get heckled negatively. Like, it's always positive heckles. Like, it's always girls. Yeah. Shut. The fuck up, please. yelling punchlines, like, because they're excited for it.

Jesus Christ. If you do that to me, I'm going to, I'm going to shoot it up. I'm going to shoot up the theater. They want to tell a story that they're excited about that. And I love, it's fine. We can deal with that. You're so nice. It's never, I mean.

I'm not on my podcast, so I can say this. Don't do that. Don't do that. But like, it's all out of love, and I know that. It is out of, I will say. I go, why, I go, why are you late? And he goes, yeah, I'm late like your fucking period. In front of, first of all, what does that even mean?

Like, what is that mean? At least congratulate me. I forget what I said. I think I'm a married woman. You don't think I want as his baby? I thought of a really good comeback, like, after the show. But during it, I kind of, for a second, I was like, this has never happened at my show for. The whole crowd got upset.

Like, they were going to, like, stone him. And I think I said something like, yeah, you'd know about my period because you're five, six, and you're right at my pussy or something. I said something, like, I went a little too far. But, like, there was definitely a better one, like, okay, don't. I say something like step back and like you know what ovulation is or something like there were just so many things I could do I like I like the idea that he works at a period app you stealing my data it was one of those distances that like I didn't fully understand it I don't know that it makes like I don't know that it makes sense I don't know that it fully makes sense other than that I know what I

want to say period I'd be like yeah I'm going to get an abortion like your mom should have that's what I should that's what you should have said so anyway those are the three options but the first one was fine Everyone laughed, but I remember thinking, like, this has never happened because there's never been a straight man. I don't know that that's even a negative heckle. I actually think what he was trying to do was play with you. He was so. That's a dude being like, oh, like, I'm riffing with my girl. So the whole rest of the show, I, the crowd, like, obviously, like, turned on him. So then I was like, I need to have fun with this. And he is dead now. I decided I need to have fun with this, because I was like, I don't like the crowd thinking I've beef with this person. Yeah. So then I was, you know, I joked about him having a beard and I was going after him about, like, beards. I think I post this clip, but how it's like man makeup. And, like, they use three and one.

It is man makeup. It's contour. He's covering his 70 chins, whatever. And then I'm like, you look like a fucking lumberjack. And I was like, what do you do for a living? And he goes, I'm a lumberjack. And he actually was. So then we, like, made friends and it was good.

But anyway, it's a different tension. But I talk about you. I talk about you in my set. Because I have that question. Yes, yes. I started doing, I'm so, from you, you've made me. Sorry, this is all about me now. I don't realize how heteronormative.

you're not my set is because it's coming from my perspective maybe I have a thing where I say you know sex is not as good as society makes it seem but I've had enough lesbians come to the show and call out not for lesbians that I've had to start addressing it and then it's become part of the bit

where I go except for lesbians because it's not I can't speak for that if there is a man and you can use this in your bit if there is a man involved if you look at the sexual satisfaction charts you love a chart have the highest Yeah, I do love a chart.

You love a chart. Lesbians have the highest level of satisfaction from sex. Gay men the least. Because it's like a quantity versus quality situation. The more men you inject into a situation, the quicker it's going to go. They're trying to bang them out. Yeah. You know?

So there's a stereotype, and this data reflects that stereotype. So I apologize. Yeah. Don't apologize. There's a stereotype, you know, that men, and I do think it's true, knowing my gay male friends to a degree not all of them obviously they're like they hook up fast yes like in stairwells it like very quickly so like of course that sex is not going to be as good as lesbian sex where the women have fallen in love over the course of three days they've spent 700 orgasms 700 they don't

they haven't spoken to anyone else they adopted a cat together they've talked about their love languages they know everything they know exactly where the clit is like I'm not talking with the generic location of the quid. I'm talking like two, two millimeters to the left, off center. Like, they know. So they're having really good sex. It takes longer.

So that makes me mad because people are like, lesbians always get a U-Haul. Anyone would get a U-Haul if that person made you come 800 times. Like, that's stupid to not get a U-Haul. What, you're going to kick them out? That's insane. Do you do that in the bit? No.

That is so funny. That is so funny. Stop making fun of lesbians for U-Hauling. They're coming. They've got so much oxytocin and dopamine in their brain. They're not making good decisions. I'm in between all the orgasms. It's insane.

I'm fascinated by it, but you will pack up a couch for come. Yes. We'll pick a sofa easily. We'll take yours. I think that you've gotten a lot of swag recently. Thank you so much. You really have. I think you've always had swag, but I feel like enough people externally were like, oh, we see you

for you and we love it, that you were just like, oh, like, you kind of, I feel like lost some just worries about you. I feel mentally I'm doing better. I struggle with, like, a scarcity sort of fear. You know, I lost my dad when I was a kid. It, it affected my mother, and it affected, like, my family in a pretty massive way where it wasn't just, like, the loss of my dad. It was, like, a lot of other cascading loss.

so like I have a pretty big and that does something when you're 11 I was 11 that that does something to the development of your mind yeah so I have a little bit of like uh how is this going to go wrong yeah how I'm gonna lose all this and I'm constantly having to adjust and be like this isn't going anywhere Ashley like you're it's okay like it's a little bit of fizing yes what they call yes my therapist called it yeah and I think it's like that's like a generic for me it's like specifically like, oh, I'm doing theaters right now, but how long could that possibly last? People are going to come and hate the show and they're never going to come back. But it kind of makes sense when catastrophes have happened to you at such a like,

yes, really influential age. Yeah. You're like, okay, well, if A plus B, C, why wouldn't it continue B or C? Right, exactly. It makes sense completely. So there's a lot, but I think what I, you know, I practice meditation, I do it every day. And so I try to be mindful. and I think part of that was honestly just being like

you can afford a couple nice sets of pants you can afford like and when I say afford I'm not talking like yeah I'm talking like you can buy something for yourself H&M and Zara me and you are very similar where like we love the like in the weeds working hard almost like chip on our shoulder

like I love that shit and the second something good happens and you're like what are people supposed to do now right exactly I like I'm like well yeah I mean and then I'm just sitting on shit because I'm like this could all be taken away yeah I might be back on carnival and you don't want to be looking back at this fake regret of like I shouldn't have bought all those pants because now I'm homeless yeah exactly when it's like why did we go to catastrophe I didn't I realized the other day I didn't have like I have my stage I started with my stage stuff because it was easier to write off and also like I felt like oh that's for work so I got clothes some, a couple new pairs of pants, a couple new shirts for just being on stage. But then I realized that, oh, I don't have anything to go on dates with my girlfriend. Like, I look like I do on stage when I go on dates. So I look like, like, like, what I say in my set, a middle school fuck boy, just like at a nice

restaurant with my girlfriend. I know, I know. I would say this is more staged than anything. But, but you become comfortable with, like, being uncomfortable. And then the second you're not uncomfortable, you're like, ooh, this is actually uncomfortable. That was wordy, but you know what I mean? Yeah, totally. So it's something I actively work on to try and just like let myself have a little more freedom.

And I've worked so, I don't know that people really know me, but I promise you, I've worked really hard for a really long time. Like this vacation is the first two-week vacation that I've taken. And it's a privilege to have that length of time to do something. But it's the first vacation longer than five days that I've taken in over 10 years. Wow. So I'm, like, really excited to do it. Do you think you're going to get... Do you think you're going to get antsy at all?

No. I really... You've set it up. I've set it up. I have a new person working on my social media clips. We've been talking about it. We're just going to have the clips ready to go. I'm going to schedule them before I leave.

I'm not touching my phone. I recently just came back from, like, my first long trip. And I remember the girl who helps me with stuff was, like, just remember, you're not going to lose relevance in a week. And I was like, whoa. Who said that? And then I was like, okay, you're right. I was thinking that.

A week's not long enough. But actually people, like, loved my Paris content. And that was just me having fun. Because at the end of the day, you know what I love to do? He's create content. So I'm sitting there, and I don't want to be that Instagram girlfriend, but I'm like, it's pretty funny if I took a photo of this statue and made fun of it. Because that's what I enjoy.

For sure, for sure. And not with a pressure of, like, if I don't post this, people forget me. This isn't everybody. I just burped. I don't know if you got that in the audio. But, yeah. Your fans are excited for you. Yeah.

There are people out there who are like, fuck yeah, like, go to Paris. Like, that's so awesome. They can sense when you're burnt out, I feel like. Yeah. I've been thinking, like, ah, this balance of, like, authenticity, but also the effortless and the, you know,

I got kind of like a mean comment the other day. Like, I've had some frustration around the Internet lately. Like, the bigger you get, the more stuff you're going to see that isn't really true or takes, like, a little thing and, like, makes it really huge and I think like people I got some flack for like talking about it like it's interesting because if I talk about being gay or like my chronic pain or like my relationships or like therapy or whatever people like yes I can relate to this but when I struggle when I'm talking

about struggling as a creator it makes certain people uncomfortable because I think they're like well I support you you know what I mean I don't know and I'm kind of trying to figure out as a creator like how much of that do I actually want to show yeah it will you decide my thing is I'm fortunate to be with someone who has been in the industry for a long time and has experienced a lot more things than me and he's puts the hammer down when it comes to I'm not allowed to look at comments and I haven't been allowed for like I say I'm not because I'm literally I'm I'm scared because if I see something that I don't want to see and then I tell him he's like he doesn't he doesn't he He's not going to be like, oh, I feel glad to go see, you look to the comments.

And I just, and at first I was like, this guy's being so annoying. Like, he doesn't empathize with me. He saved my life. Yeah, he's. It's saved my life. And I, he's helping enforce a boundary that he knows is correct. And if I didn't have him there, because if you, the second a comment hinders your creativity, they win. The second you're like, oh, I don't want to post this because of that thing that person said last week, they win.

I know. It's interesting, though, because sometimes I learn. With my fan base, I have learned a lot because it is such a specific, I'm specifically speaking to my podcast. Yeah, I'm not speaking podcast. Podcasts, those are the real ones. Like, people listen to this, they're the real ones. It's the people that are like... A clip goes viral and you get shit that you shouldn't hear. That's fine. If someone wants to tell me I'm not funny, if they're not close to the content, that's fine. But when a fan says something like, you know, the way you plug the Patreon was negative. That's something that I'm like,

is there anything to be learned here? Because on your side of it, I'm like, I do want to expose parts of like my artistic, for the young artists out there, I actually think it's quite important to discuss some of like the shit that I have going on that I'm dealing with. But then again, you get a comment like that,

you're like, am I putting people off? Am I being too negative? I think you're right. It is nuance where when you're getting feedback from people who are like real ones. Oh, this was not feedback. This was a, this was a me. And I actually said that to them.

I was like, if you have feedback, here's how you do it. If you feel close enough to me that you are irked. You are irked by the way I did something, then you should have the decency to contact me in a way that feels like you are close to me. You would never speak this way to a friend. I feel like you can see when people have been in the comments too much. Like, you ever see someone whose career is going really well and you go up to them?

And they're like, yeah, it's just tough out here. And you're like, what? I'm like, oh, yeah, you've been reading your comments. That's me. You need to stop. Okay. Because at what point, what do these people know about who you are that they're going to tell you? Like, in the beginning, I get that.

And it almost explodes. You're going to get to a point where the comments are, like, the positive and negatives are just, it outweighs itself. I think one of the things that's hard for me about it is that I thrive off of audience feedback. I'm a good comic because I'm objective about what I'm hearing in the room. I feel the discomfort. But that's different than keyboard people. I know. I know.

I know. I know. But my brain is like so wired towards that feedback and understanding and like the live experience. It's like... It's a lot of people see things through a lens of, like, their own experiences that doesn't actually help you. I know. You know? But, yes, exactly.

You're like, I know they were having a hard day. I think the thing that I'm going is, okay, if they're feeling that, what about the 80% of people who are, like, pretty more normal, would never leave a comment or watching this. Do they feel, do they identify with that comment at all? Well, it's like, yeah, like, you wear a sweater, and, you know, you post, you're like, do you guys like this outfit? you see the wide range of responses. That's just being human. That's just people having reactions, but you can't tailor every sentence

to, like, make everyone happy. Tell that to the queer community, please. I know. I'm an ally. The queer community can do anything they want. One of my favorite, I have not done this, but, like, when I say a sentence that I can feel the queer community going feels exclusionary,

even though it's about my fucking experience as a human being, I want to then throw in like just to be annoying I just want to throw in like you forgot about intersex people because people will get people will like nitpick what you excluded

but if you really wanted to take this to its logical extreme well what about asexual people what about intersex people I love when you make someone without a kneecap like it just it just I love the list goes on of white girls I love it so much

white girls just I feel like you have those moments where you're like I heard all the white girls Oh, about race. White lesbians. You cannot talk about race. You cannot do it. Because they are so anti-racist

and also have never met a black person. I have no idea how these folks have never spoken to black people and are also like, I am black people's greatest champion. It is such a, it's like, they know that they don't want to be racist. but they have not literally I grew up in New York City so I feel so comfortable

with so many experiences obviously not like all of them New York certainly has like communities that are more present than others but when it comes to race like how Colin Quinn talks about it he's like I'm not saying I don't see color that kind of shit exactly exactly like I feel like

I've had so many of these conversations not that I'm better than other people but like talking about race does not make me super uncomfortable if you grew up in Wisconsin. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. And then those Wisconsin gays who moved, they moved to New York so that they can come out as non-binary

and that's wonderful. But then as soon as you make a joke, that's anti-racist. I'll do anti-racist jokes. I have this joke right now about abortion rights and how they're making exceptions for rape and incest.

Thank you so much. You know what you have to do? to get a rape exception in some states, you have to go to the cops and file a report about your rape. And then that file is in the control in the hands of that cop.

Have cops traditionally been the best people with life and death decisions? So the joke that I make is tell them the baby's black. You'll have to get the abortion immediately. And what this does to lesb-I mean, when I say that to lesbians, they're like, they're like, they're like,

they're like, I want abortion of the race. So there's stereotypes of, you know, like the woke culture. And I went to your Sunday school, which is mostly queer people in the audience. Can you say it? Yes, of course. I was like, oh, fuck, did I say that? No, no, no, no. I know the straights are just figuring out that we've reclaimed queer.

They just found out about this. It's been like eight years, nine, ten years. The process of reclaiming queer probably started in like the late 2000. maybe even earlier. So the queers are out and about and they're having fun at your show. So I think this is going to be like the most woke show ever

and you stand up there. Oh yeah, I opened the show. She yells down their throats and calls them all out on every like hypocritical, hilarious bit that you could think of. And I'm like, this is hysterical and I think it's because you were forced

to grow up in New York City in this stand-up culture that was so like, you just got to be a comic, you've got to be a comic. Yeah, yeah, yeah. taking those skills and used it with your like woke knowledge to make people think. That's my, you're describing like what my, what my dream is as a comedian.

No, it's incredible because it's so easy to pander. It's so easy to pander. I think it's disgusting. And you hate pandering. I hate it. And I love the fact that you start and people look at you and you're like, okay, let's go hear her, you know, hate on some conservatives. And then you twist it in so many different ways that you're not obvious. with your directions and it makes

I think it makes your fans realize like how fucking smart you are. Oh, thank you. Because you are incredibly like, I mean, I don't want to say the word woke, is that bad? Is woke bad? I think it depends who you're talking to. Yeah, but ultimately like you make everyone

look at things differently to ultimately like understand each other more. I want to, my comedic perspective is that first of all, I want people who never thought that they would come and see me, you know, or maybe they do maybe they just love comedy but I want someone you I want I want you to come to a show and be like oh holy shit I didn't think I was going to hear her say that yeah and not like in a shock value way not like that I just say something that I don't believe yeah but like I'll say you know what of my favorite opening jokes from that section is like I miss straight men so much if there's like a straight guy because they laugh so hard like I'll suck your dick immediately sir like I'll be straight for this show but then i'll twist it and i'll say and they laugh at everything because they have no trauma

yeah they're just very free yes so like and that is a joke that is like it's not shitting on men and it's not shitting on lesbians it's just sort of like it's shitting on everyone really it's shitting on with truths yeah yeah so like not that i'm purposefully doing that but i i want everyone in the room to be like i both disagreed and agreed with her vehemently at the same time exactly And I think also, like, it's different when, like, a straight white guy, like, makes fun of woke people because of where it's coming from. It's like, are you mad? Because they're, like, lamenting. Like, woke culture only benefits me.

Like, people, people taking me seriously only benefits me. But, like, also, like, calm down. But to have woke people laugh at you making fun of wokeness brings people together, if that makes sense? Because I think they need to be released, too. There's a self-awareness, yeah. so so scared scared yes especially on the liberal side of things people are so we have now we're cyborgs now yes a lot of these people have grown up so on their phones that when we were growing up you had a different persona on the internet in fact it was not necessarily linked to your identity

because we didn't really have social media we had like yeah blogs and tumbler and like things like that where instant message where it wasn't entirely clear who this person was posting these thoughts on the internet we were exploring our identities and personalities now it's like everything you say can be dug up and used against you and I really do think that and define you and define you and it's not separate from who you are in real life and I think that sort of comment thread culture is present in comedy clubs where people are like can I laugh at that what's the person next to me in a I see people whiplash turn to their neighbors

after certain jokes that I do that are anti-sexist, anti-racist, anti-this, anti-that but they're like, oh my God, can I laugh at that? Because she said... And you love it. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, and then I scream at them.

Yes. But the thing, what's crazy is I remember the moment where I was like, oh shit, people are listening to me. There's like a power with it where you're like, oh, I can affect things by how I talk. And the fact that you are a lesbian comic

who's gone through similar trauma that other lesbians have who has dealt with like horrible shit and then to make fun of it like that's a power you have like I can't speak in the same way that you can because I haven't dealt with like

homophobia and shit like that but you can make fun of it because you've been there and then you could twist it around because you've been there like you have a power in that yeah I mean any darkness that you can make lighter is pain released that's another thing about people who don't attend a lot of comedy, particularly on the woker, more liberal side of thing, I don't think people

realize how much pain release is happening. You're like creating space to let go of some of the darkness that you have around a topic. Like when you make a joke, like what I was saying about the cops, that's like an opportunity for you to be like, there's like a hopelessness and a helplessness in the world right now. I think people are realizing these systems are so massive. Like how can I actually do anything about them? And comedy gives you an opportunity. to release a little bit of that. Not to let go of it, like, go out there, vote, like be politically active.

Yeah. This is a reminder to do that. But also, it doesn't have to be so dark inside of you all the time. And, you know, a lot of these, maybe, like, lesbians are going to brunch with their friends and, like, saying everything they think they should say. So you're, like, that lesbian friend at brunch that's, like, let's talk for real.

Yeah. Let's call some things out. And let's, like, have a conversation. Because it's so, it's just so. particularly with queer people, it's, the bar is higher. Like, we're really hard on each other. We're really hard on queer creators.

For everything that you say, like, there's always like, what about this? And it's like, okay, all right. Like you're holding each other accountable. Yeah. If you could hook up with one man, who would it be? No, I actually, because people, like, ask me this is like, if you had to, like, sleep with a guy,

because I've never slept with a man. I've never hooked up with a man. I've kissed a boy in the seventh grade. but I actually think that I would go I love like I'm into femininity and I love like you know I just very feminine women I tend to go for I think that I would do the opposite

I think I'd go for like You want to get man handled? No, oh my God Did you just gag? Do you throw up in your mouth or no? I think I'd just rather have the I don't know what I want because thinking about having sex on the man makes me like a little uncomfortable.

As it most of us. Yeah. But I think most people are like, oh, would you want like some twinky little guy like a like a Timothy Chalemay? I think I actually need to go the total opposite. What about Cheney Tatum? Because he's like pretty. He is.

Yeah, I get I get. Yeah, sure. I don't know. I was more thinking like like a like a lumberjack. Oh. Like more like a, I know. Who's Aquaman? Yeah, like that type of dude.

Or he doesn't even have to be in good shape. I would prefer it if he smelled nice. I love that. You just smell so nice. Yeah. They smell really good. Yeah. I don't know about how men smell.

I don't smell them as often. You like when I'm around them, I just kind of. Well, sometimes you all get a whiff of like a cologne. See, I think cologne smells so good. Yeah, because women should wear cologne more. straight yeah that's like you are attracted to males like when i smell like perfume i'm done like i'm instantly like where you know like i have a question i have a question for you so i'm currently in this difficult thing with my husband this took a turn where we're currently in a different

difficult situation with my husband we want to start watching porn together but obviously it's hard it's hard with like comics because like the second you put it on you know both our minds are going and you could like, you know he's going to say, like, it's just immediate, like, because porn is funny. Foreign is funny. Yes. So then, but then he's like, no, find something. But immediately, I think, first of all, I'm like.

Can I make a suggestion? Yeah. Does he want to watch women? I think so. Do you, I guess that was a really weird question. I should have phrased it towards you. Would you, because I know, I know your porn preferences from doing the podcast. I prefer watching women.

Yeah. First of all, I feel weird that, like, I enjoy watching these women with him. You're self-actualizing. Yes. And then, two, if I think the girl's hot, I suddenly get jealous if he thinks the girl's hot. You got to drop that. That is what's going to... The fact that he's, like, getting off watching...

And I'm watching him watch a girl? The hot part is you. You're the hot part. I mean, that's, like, hot, but the really hot part is you. I've tried watching porn with my girlfriend. It's, like, not for us. Why? just didn't work like it just because I don't super love porn to begin with she's more of a porn head than I am

because Paige told me just remember like the guys just see like yes they they don't even like I need a story Jen is more like that Jen can see the boobies and just like get turned on yeah whereas I this is really funny she's so feminine you wouldn't think it but I'm like I would rather like listen to an audio It's so gay. I would rather listen to an audio, like, no, I think this is actually very feminine. I know, but I feel like it's given, like, you need a spoken word, like, while eating an oat milk. Latte? I'm so turned on by this latte.

I do think it gets, it gets, like, mental with me, but also, if there's a guy in it, I'm very aware of the girl, because I'm self-actualized, where I'm like, is she feel safe? Is she enjoying this? Is she creeped down? by him do we not like like he said that did she not like like i'm all in my head with that so if you just go like the lesbian's out of comedy show yes i'm like i don't feel safe i don't feel scared by i get so triggered and poor it's not even that you don't feel safe you're like just everyone around me feel safe yeah because i feel safe but if you guys aren't safe but i can't laugh if you're not laughing

that's like when if i go to a strip club immediately i'm like does she want to be here is she okay and someone's like just give her your fucking money, bitch. And I'm like, I don't know if I don't want her to feel like I'm... I have trouble at strip clubs, too. I wonder if it's similar. I get really anxious. We're overthinkers. But you know what the... Okay. What I'm about to say is so male. And I'll get back to your porn in a second. A lot of strippers are queer, is what I've learned over the past year. My friend is a, like a stripper. And so she invited me to her... I hooked up with her. Why? No one forced you to say that.

You were like, fine! I fucked her, fine. Before she was dancing, I had like a little fling with her. She invited me and my girlfriend and my buddy Lucas after I tape my- Is Lucas straight? Yeah, Lucas is straight. I'm very confused by that friendship, but continue. He and I are the same person in two very different bodies.

Okay, because I was like, is he in the closet? What's going on? No, no, no, no. He's like, he's kind of like you. He's like one of the biggest allies that I know. Okay, so he's coming for my brand, continue. but we all went to the strip club that she worked at and everyone recognized me every single one of those girls was like are you wait so you were like p ditty at the strip club i just was lesbian on those hose i but i felt so uncomfortable about it because unlike unlike a dude i was like are you guys like okay like someone was like throw a one at her and i'm like i'm not throwing a one at her it's so disrespectful that's so degrading yes exactly i don't like this is their job and they actually like

Or they like, they were like, they're mad if you don't. Exactly, exactly. Because I'm new to the situation. Like, they're numb to it. No, I had, when I just got there, a stripper came up to me and was doing her job. And I just told her straight up. I was like, it's too early in the night. I am not comfortable yet.

Yeah. Please don't waste your time. Go, like, find someone. Because I'm just going to order French fries and kind of overthink for a while. I had one. Yeah, I need to, like, stew over this. I need a $50 French fries and, like, kind of try to some time. interaction I had the last 10 minutes because I'm overstimulated right now.

I had one lap dance. I was not doing sales and all these sales guys like bought me a lap dance with this girl. And she was like on me. And the whole time I was just like, girly, like if I will, what do you want me to do? Like I literally was like, how can I make this more fun for you? Because you have a long night ahead of you and this is not for me. Like I don't know what's going on. Like I'm like, touch your boob and I'm like, I did not ask.

Like I need to ask her. Like this is weird. Touch her boob. No, no, no. You're not supposed to touch them. No. But I will say they are more comfortable, it seems, and from what I've heard, with women. With women, because we're not going to be...

She was having fun. Yeah, exactly. But at first, I came in very, like, is this okay? Right, but guys aren't... Not many guys are doing that. So, you're saying more women should go to strip clubs because it's just fun for the girlies? I actually... Yes, I think so.

I think so. It's also, like, dark and loud, and I'm not the... I don't drink, so... Yeah. I'm not the best in that environment. Yeah. Why did I come all the way here? for this.

You're amazing. Thank you. I appreciate it. Because you're like really smart, but you're also really like creative and that's very rare to find in a person. Oh, thanks. And it freaks me out a little bit,

but you're a little comedic genius and I'm obsessed with you and I'm so excited for your future. Thanks. And people who, like the little devils who listen, they've known you for a long time. Yeah, I've been doing, I've done this part like three or four times.

Yeah. So I think they've also been with you a little through a journey. Yeah. And I feel like it's really just, you've so much fun stuff going on in your future and we can't wait for the journey. I'm trying to figure it out. The writer's strike is definitely like, okay, well, do I, do I, like, work on something for, like, after, I can't meet with anybody.

No one's meeting with anybody. Yeah. What do you work on? And so I'm working on a piece of stand-up, like a more, like a solo show. It's, it is comedy, but, like, you're going to cry watching it. It's comedy the whole time and also you are weeping. I am weeping. So it's like more deeply per-

It's about the death of my therapist So it feels like a therapy session Wow, I love that My, not to bring it my husband again But he's made like documentaries And specials about the death of both his parents So like it's beautiful when you can find that balance Yes

You're feeling so many emotions You're laughing, you're crying or throwing up You're having diarrhea It's that's I'm obsessed with that And also it's gonna be therapeutic for you You know that Yeah, yeah It already, I mean, it's, I've only run it twice, but I'm running it all summer at my weekly show, Sunday school.

Well, not every week, but many of the weeks will be dedicated to the show. So if you come to Sunday school, best show in New York. It was amazing. Hannah's there sometimes. Hell yeah. Come back. I would love to. Where can people follow you?

Where can people watch your stuff? Any plugs we forgot. I mean, like, if you're going to do one thing, go watch the special. And I feel like just from that, you'll probably decide whether or not you want to come. come see me live, but I have all these tour dates. Like, you, if you let you know, you're a fucking human. You know how to use your goddamn brain. But my name is Ashley Gavin, so just search it on whatever social media.

But if you're going to do one thing, if you're like, I want to see more, go watch the special. And I think that will take you down the funnel of things that you can do. Wow, go down Ashley's funnel. Yes. You will not regret it. We're all deep inside my funnel. It's cozy. It's warm.

It's guerrilla grip. Thank you so much for talking to us today. I don't know if that's true. And we'll discuss. More hell later. Bye guys.