Berner Phone - Book Club Bonus: Yesteryear by Caro Claire Burke

Episode Date: August 21, 2026

It's finally here - the Yesteryear episode. What book should we read next? Let us know in the comments!   Call [phone] to leave us a voicemail! International Dialers can leave us a voice memo on WhatsApp: [phone]   FOLLOW DES: Tickets: https://punchup.live/desbishop Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/desbishop Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/desbishop X: https://x.com/desbishop YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Desbishopcomedy TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@desbishop5   FOLLOW NICOLE: https://www.instagram.com/nicoleclyons/   Produced by Nicole Lyons Productions Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nicolelyonsproductions/ Website: www.nicolelyonsproductions.com

Hi, it's Hannah Burner and Des Bishop. Thanks for calling the burner phone. If you leave a message after the tone, we may have to make it into a podcast. Hello, our little dialers, our nerdy, bookish little dialers. Welcome to our bonus episode. It's me and Nicole, and nobody's missing an app. I don't know if you know this, Nicole, but when I initially suggested back before you were involved in the podcast of doing a summer book club,

I got insane pushback, but I think that's because people thought it was going to be like the episode. Oh my God, the amount of people that were like, no fucking way. No way. Which put me off the idea. But then we decided to do this, the way that we're doing it.

And it never really happened. Let's face it. It's been months since I read yesterday year. But since this. since this is our inaugural book club episode, and I want to remind you, Nicole, that, because I remember exactly where I was sitting when you said you were reading it, and you were so excited, because I was only in the middle of reading it then. You were so excited. And then, as it turns out, you did not finish the book. You have not finished the book. Nope. I landed on Chapter 32,

do. So that's like a little over halfway through. And unfortunately, I just was like really falling out of it. Yeah, you stop caring. Yeah. So. Yeah. And everyone was so excited about it. So I was like, okay, I'm waiting. Every real I've seen about this is someone going, I tore through it. I couldn't put it down. I posted a picture of me reading it. The amount of my friends who DM'd me, I can't wait to hear what you think about this book. So I'm like, all right, it's going to catch a meet like soon. I'm going to catch on to it soon. but I completely fell out of it right in the middle. It's very interesting. So before I spoil it for you, which you've consented to, which is exciting because we're going to get like a live spoiler here. I want to let the dialers know that this is, it's a format I've never done and it's got a few flaws in it. One of which is I have, I never saved the message. like chronologically or really labeled them correctly.

So there's not going to be like a great order to the conversation. The conversation will be mostly driven by you guys, the dialers that messaged in. But I didn't organize it so that we could discuss themes together. There may be some crossover on the themes. So forgive me. This is a bonus, a bit of fun. All right. So it's a little all over the shop in terms of how it works as a format.

Secondly, like I said, I haven't read it in months. And my co-host in this situation has not finished the fucking book, which I could have just done this on my own a month and a half ago. But the good news is that Nicole doesn't know how it's finished. And you got halfway through the book. So before we give the big spoiler, why don't you have a guess on, oh, and by the way, everybody else, guys, this is for people that read the book, okay? For all 30 of you who are plugged into this. So, or if you're never going to read it and you're just listening for fun, then here we go.

Nicole, based on what you know, based on, you at least got to some of the sections where she was, you know, in some other time, right? Yes, and that's kind of where I fell off because I was more interested in her past than this bullshit going on at the farm. And I was like, I want more of that stuff. I was really hope, I'll tell you how I was hoping that it would end. I was really hoping that she is kind of manipulating us the whole time and that she, you know, does not align with these beliefs and is just using it to monetize. and that's not who she really is. That was really the direction I was hoping it would go. If this ends up being a situation where it was like,

I bumped my head and had a dream type shit, I'm going to be really pissed. Okay. So what's your guess? What is it? What is it? That's all I have. I mean,

I only got halfway through. It also was months ago. So. I have to tell you, okay? Because already we failed as a book club review. I have to tell you that the ending, the reveal and everything that happened around it, I think ruined the book for me personally. Really?

For two-thirds of this book, even though I had issues with it at times, the entertainment value of her and the trad life and her sort of like inner monologue, even though that in itself really... The two things don't really align, but it was entertaining enough for me to enjoy it. All that was really good. And I didn't really care that much about what the reveal was going to be, you know, if the payoff was good enough. But the problem is in general, like you said, the back and time stuff,

it was kind of pointless and like overly grotesque. So what happened is she gets canceled. You're getting the idea right at the beginning of the book. that she's a cancellation's coming right the fucking you know the the assistant is is banging Caleb and uh it's like my life was perfect and then it all went tits up so we know that right but what happens is the cancellation is more severe the the fucking assistant accuses her of sexual assault like les you know like girl female on female sexual assault and it all it all gets out and like it destroys her career right around the time that Caleb is like running for office, you know,

so you have all this kind of like ridiculous kind of like, I can buy my way out of anything. I'm giving Caleb's dad a voice, but, you know, it's just like all that kind of like, you know, old money. And as a result, she decides that she's going to, she's going to start over literally living the child life that she was espousing as if they were living in 1855. And old Caleb is literally Caleb, who goes along with it. And those three kids that she has in the house, or three or four kids that she has in the house, are the kids that she had after all this shit went down, or maybe including one that she had already that was too young. Anyway, long story short, she decided to live that way. And Clementine, you know, the daughter,

finally finds a way to like liberate them from this horrible life. So they're just living in the modern time, like it, as if they're in the 1800s. And she gets, she gets sent to jail for neglect. I know. Honestly, for me, it fucking ruined it for me. Wait, so how are they going to do this as a TV show? Well, let's let's not get too wrapped up in this. that because I want to hear from the dialers.

And you have lost your privileges because you didn't finish the book. And that's fair. And that's fair. And it would have been, this would have been really helpful to have a female perspective. So I apologize. I let you hold down. Well, good news. Good news.

There's a lot of female perspectives coming our way. I don't think we got any male perspectives on yesterday. Not that we get male perspectives anyway, but we certainly don't. So as I see. said, there's no rhyme or reason to these other than I put one of them together because it was the same person and it seemed to be two concurrent thoughts. You can start with whatever you like, positive or negative. Hello. Okay, so I'm calling back about yesterday year. I sent a voicemail in saying how much I was hating the book. I still think it was way too long, but I did finish it.

really likes the twist at the end. It's not at all what I was expecting. I actually didn't know what to expect. How are they going to tie this in the past and the future? The protagonist, Natalie, she's like the most detestable protagonist you can possibly have. But a lot of good themes, a lot of current themes, how fake the internet is, exploiting your children online, which is like a hot, a hot, button issue these days reminded me a lot of Ruby Frankie.

But yeah, overall, still too long, but really liked the end. So, uh, interesting. What everybody thinks. Okay, thanks. Bye. So, so interesting, because I feel like I was kind of like the opposite. But what I, what I'm 100% in agreement with is I was enjoying, you know, aspects of the, the current theme.

You know, it's funny. she was detestable in every way, but she was very entertaining in the, you know, in the, when she's talking about her life in the past, you know, there was a lot of aspects about her that were entertaining, even though the parts about her that were the most entertaining are, kind of like, it's a little bit of a contradiction because she was, she was so aware of like modern life, like the way that she was like so dismissive of her roommate in college. And just always just so astute at being observing and being critical of the way that like the angry women live or the, you know, like the, you know, the, like she was so astute. about it, right?

But yet when she goes to college, like she, you know, she's, she's like wearing these like, like pioneer type clothes and, you know, there's like all this crazy innocence about her, but yet she has such awareness of the world in a way.

It's just like, again, not important though. I didn't let that get me down because what she was actually aware of and how critical she was of it was so entertaining, you know? and the way that she described things was so entertaining.

So I did find her detestable, but I have to say, I was getting a fucking kick out of her. You know? Like, I was weirdly team Natalie a lot of the time, just because she was so fucking entertaining, you know?

So yes, I agree with you on aspects of what made it good, and for two thirds of it, I really was into it. But the difference for me and you, Diler, is, the end of it kind of like ruined it for me. And everything being just that little bit overly exaggerated also ruined it for me.

You know, the type of cancellation and stuff like that kind of did also ruin it for me. But I did enjoy like all the stuff about the angry women. Like, like her as the trad wife, internet modern character, not the not the back of the day. character. But her as the trad wife internet character and her inner monologue being so different and so materialistic but also judgmental. I did

enjoy all that stuff, I have to say. And all my issues with inconsistencies and stuff that didn't really bother me. But you know, you had read, you had gotten some of that. I was on her side for, like when we're hearing the backstory and how much of a

fucking loser Caleb was being, which I tapped out not long after that, but I was like, I could feel the rage of that person. So I was kind of, that's why I was kind of hoping that it was all a fucking scam and that she was really like a strong willed person that just like took advantage of the life that she had. But I mean, it's. Basically, like, the ending is like she had an absolute 100% nervous breakdown, you know, like, and completely forgot, completely forgot the life that she lived. And since we've started on the end, can I also point out, I, it annoys me. But, like, implausibility really takes me out of a story, like on TV shows, books, and I'll allow a certain amount of it go. And I'll allow magical realism, which, by the way,

There was a time where I thought this was going to be like a bit of a Gabriel Garcia-Marquez, like, you know, magical realism thing with like how she ends up back in time. And I would have been open to it if they did it in a way that made sense, even though it was kind of annoying me throughout the whole thing of like, what, like, how are they going to say what the fuck is going on here, you know? Yeah, that's why I was like, I had to tap out because I do some movies sometimes too where I'm trying so hard to predict the ending that I can't focus on the present. and I was so bothered by like, what the fuck is this other thing that's going on that I couldn't really allow myself to engage. So can I ask any follow-up questions? Well, can I just say, but when I'm talking about implausibility, I'm not just talking about the fact that the ending was weird.

I'm also talking about the fact that she was this insanely famous person, right? and who also had this spectacular fall from grace. How in the name of God is somebody that famous with literally children that escaped from her, right? And are living out there in the real world, how are they allowed for that amount of time to live the way that they're living without like constant barrage of media and people and, you know, child protective service.

Like, I don't get it. It's like, oh, in this, by the way, same fucking house. Same house. That they wouldn't have like a constant barrage of visitor. Like, it's just so implausible what they were trying to say happened. That it was just like, fuck off. You know? And then she's like in jail.

I don't need her to have redemption. like I don't I don't need that at all but I just you know I need it honestly I needed it to be more than just a fucking a nervous breakdown not to mention like you know she steps in the one fucking trap you know she steps in the one trap she got this horrible injury and like like like as if they're all gonna just like like like as if Caleb even was just going to be like just fucking deal with it like it's just so stupid like the last and the last and the The end of it for me was just so fucking annoying. Like, I wanted to throw the book across the room. I was like, what a waste of my fucking time, you know? And even though there were numerous times while I was reading it, where I was like, oh, this is so annoying. But, like, I was still so curious and I was still, like, enjoying aspects of it.

So I was like, I didn't care. And I was like, I was like pounding through it. But there were times where I was like such fucking nonsense, which, of course, I didn't take notes at the time I should have. But then the end is really, really fucking, it really pissed me off. especially because like the sexual assault, like you don't even, you can't even know for sure

if the assistant was like totally making it up or if actually there was some like lesbian desire. You know, and it was just so like, it was just like so deliberate. Uh, anyway, what were you going to say? Well, I don't know. Is it pointless? I only read half of this.

I'm just trying to digest the ending and make sense of this. Oh, because you got spoiled. Well, so... Well, why don't you wait and see if some people message in about it? Okay. Do you know what I mean? Let's see if some of your concerns get alleviated by the dialers. Let's take another.

Hey, Des. I'm upset that you never did the yesteryear episode. So I'm adding. Yesterday was so crazy. It was a little bit confusing how it flipped from current day to... like olden days and i it just kind of blew my mind like how much of a narcissist this woman was but as the book kept going on it just made me wonder if she had like a real mental problem and like how important it is how you are raised like clearly her mother's

just did not parent her enough in proving that this strict parenting and the like strict Catholic or not even Catholic they're Christian ways and also lying to your children like her mom lied that their father left and when the girls got to a certain age wasn't just honest. It could have changed the whole shape of this woman's life. It just, it got so crazy towards the end that it just, the ending sort of ruined the beginning of the book for me. Like, I thought it was going to go somewhere else. It made it a little bit unrelatable to what's going on. It was a current day, trad wife situation. So that's my thoughts on it. Okay, Bye bye. So far we're aligned. We do get some positive takes on it. Yeah. So that was another problem I had,

which is like, yes, there was clearly some like pathological shit. Like she was so cold and distant from the get-go about everything that you go like, oh, this is a very disturbed woman that's managing to pretend. that she's not as horrible as she is. But at the same time, it, it, yeah, that, that, I have a, it's not that I, it's not that I, it's not that I need to know why somebody's like that. It's not that I need to know what, what damage in her childhood could create somebody as she is, because some people can just be like that, you know. But at the same time, it was, uh, it did.

totally align with her childhood, even though her childhood was kind of like wasn't ideal, and the mom was lying, you know, and all that religious stuff, it was all just, you know, when you step back and you're done reading it and you look back in it and you go, yeah, none of that really, none of that really added up, did it, you know? Was it? And then how judgmental she is of the sister? Did you get to any of that, how judgmental she is of her sister? Yeah, a little bit.

Yeah. because she marries the alcoholic guy. Again, you know, again, fine, you know. I can understand the mom, you know, lying, you know, not wanting to know that she's divorced and keeping that, you know, idea in her mind. But I just don't know if it would create enough of the, how insane she was. But again, I don't, I'm not a psychiatrist, so I can't say. What were you going to say there?

Nothing really. I mean, where I am struggling as a half reader of this book is if she, they agreed to go along with actually, like, living in, you know, ye olden times or whatever. Why does she pretend that she just randomly showed up there and is afraid of all of them? Well, that's the whole thing is that she had like a nervous breakdown. She had a breakdown. Yeah, and she's like, I guess she's disassociated. associating like she's separating herself from. So what happened to the baby she was pregnant with?

So I guess that's one of the kids that is in the house. So she did have that baby. She was blacked out like a like months question mark. Well, she's not blacked and this is years. Well, it's years later. Isn't the oldest, the oldest new kid is probably that kid is, let me get the names because it. So.

Yeah, because she like is, she in this scenario, like, wakes up and is like, well, I was pregnant yesterday. So what happened? You know? Yeah. Well, yeah. Well, basically, like a long time has passed. Like a lot of time has passed.

Like, in other words, like these kids. So in the book, you meant to think, like, these kids are like versions of the kids that we already know. But they're not. They're actually like new kids. And then Mave is not as young as she. appears she's actually she has developmental issues she's she's got some sort of like learning disability so she's like she's disabled in some way uh i don't know what the correct term is but so

that that that that mave mave is not as young as she appears in the book you know and all that was just honestly it was like too grotesque for me and i'm aware i know these horrible cases of that family, whatever, in the Mormons. Were they Mormons that those ones were the kids were living like in squalor? I think so, yeah. The Ruby Frankie thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

I know that there's been some horrific stuff. But this was just like so grotesque and so implausible that it was just, I would have preferred to be disappointed that it was just a dream than what it actually was. You know? Because obviously or like because it's kind of like a very long point of like, oh, you say you're a trad wife. Well, this is how horrible it was back in the day, you know. But don't forget that Caleb, old Caleb is fucking Caleb. So he just starts beating the shit out of her out of nowhere.

Yeah. Suddenly he's like, get out of bed. Get out of bed. And I did read. There's some people have issues with that that like she finally comes when she's basically getting raped. which is problematic in its own right. But she's problematic. So on one level, it's like, yeah, well, she's fucking insane.

So, okay, maybe that, maybe that adds up. But it's also just like, you know, it's like, like as if this guy was going to like go along with this, you know? I know he's gone up. He had like no purpose in life. So I feel like it, like at least from where I was at, he had literally no purpose in life and was doing nothing. was like staring at walls and watching porn and she was taking care of the kids. Like he just fell into this political thing because of his dad, right? Like otherwise he had no desires or ambitions in life.

Yeah. But after he, after he has a fucking affair with the assistant, then he's suddenly like, you know what? This sucks. Let's, let me go along with whatever fucking insane idea you have because you've ruined my political career because you've been accused of sex. assaulting your fucking judgmental assistant who's been like poisoning your your daughter's mind with the truth about what she was. You know, what's a trad wife, you know? Do we feel bad for the

assistant? Like this is a, what happened? No, because the assistant, because to me, the assistant is just as bad as the rest of them. You know what I mean? Like for me, the assistant, by the way, I'm not dismissing that maybe something, but I don't think something bad did happen. I think she was just like, it's just like all the dark side of the internet, I feel like, you know, she's just like, I'm going to take this bitch down, you know. Again, it's just everything about it in the end just left me feeling icky, which that could be considered while. It was a very moving, a very affecting book. And it was. It did affect me a lot. Just some of it was just like annoying frustration, you know. Let's take, let's take some more. Let's get, let's get more

inspired. Okay, I'm calling in a second time about yesterday because my pit bull was in the background talking and screaming like a child. I didn't put in the first. I wasn't giving him attention. So I am very interested to hear your thought. One, as a man that read it, obviously you aren't like a manist to see your man, but still interested of that perspective as well as somebody that is in like social media and influencer world. I think it was a five-star book, but I totally understand why a lot of people think it's a one-star book.

But I think that's, like, what makes this book so successful? Like, this author was able to make people either feel, like, so uncomfortable or, like, really enjoy it. I think that that is, that means a lot. Like, if an author is able to make people either love or hate it, and there's, like, know in between of like 3.5 or whatever. I personally loved it because it made me like, like there's a lot of chapters that I felt really uncomfortable. And it was scary.

I'm scared after reading it. And I don't like it at all. It's like not a good vibe at all. But that's what I love about it. And like that's a kind of mindset that I would never be able to understand. understand or get and like having the unreliable narrator and like takes place like all in her head. Like I really like true crime stuff too. And I think it's because like I want to understand like how they rationalized XYZ in their brain. Like it won't make sense to me and I want to try to make

sense of it. Even though you can't make sense of something that's crazy and insane. But so like the book being told from her perspective in her mind the whole way whole time like, yeah, I don't know. It was a very interesting book, and I can't wait for this author to write again because I think she did an amaze me the job. Yeah, interested to hear your thoughts. Okay, well, I mean, in fairness,

she was actually kind of mirrored exactly what I had just said about maybe that's a good thing. I don't know, because I had all the feelings she was talking about, but then the ending it didn't it affected me in a way that it was like it wasn't the type of feelings of like like the writing like helped me to understand stuff it was more just like annoyed by annoyed by it in a way that was less to do with the book and more just to do with the decisions um and so yeah obviously I did a bit of reading about it but there's a lot of talk about the unreliable narrator And like, I love an unreliable narrator.

I think was it on this part or was I talking about it? I think I was talking about it in the Bishop Exchange. I reread Wuthering Heights because I was going to go see the movie. But then the movie got such bad reviews. I never even went to see it. But I really enjoyed reading Wuthering Heights in my adulthood because I hadn't read it since school. And like, that's an unreliable narrator, you know. But like in a way that like kind of like adds to the story,

you know, like all her judgments. But I, in this case, I feel like at times, yes, it was a traditional unrelial, the narrator. But at other times, it was just like, she would just was like a vessel for the writers. Like, obviously the writer wanted to do this tradwife thing, but also just. like a vessel for the writer's thoughts as opposed to the character's thoughts. Does that make sense? In a way that I don't think helped the story, even though, as I admitted earlier, I was finding the right. I think, by the way, I listened to an interview with the writer afterwards.

And I love her. I think she's fucking really interesting, great conversationalist. Fun fact, she wrote this book before she was pregnant. I think when I was listening to her, she was pregnant. So she was probably going to have a different feeling because there was certain aspects of the motherhood stuff that felt like it was written by somebody who hadn't parented, including myself. So it didn't bother me. but at the same time, like, it was, it was like so insanely detached to the point where at times, it was like, I can understand being detached from your child, but it was almost like,

it was like a lack of like understanding about parenting itself. But that's like it, that's kind of like a deep, that's like a deep criticism, to be honest. But like I said, I loved the writer, love listening to her talk. She has a podcast, which I haven't listened to, but from the description of the podcast, I'd say that's also worth listening to. And I would still be very, I would still be interested in reading the next thing because the truth is that I, like, absolutely ate this book up. Like, it's not like there weren't aspects of the book that I wasn't, like, loving. Because I was actually, like, at times, like, loving it slash fascinated. But I remember throughout the process, because by the way, Hannah got sent this book.

book. I only read it because Hannah got sent to it and I fucking started reading it. I got sucked in. I didn't even know about it. I only knew about it because it showed up at our door. But I remember while I was reading and saying to Hannah, it's like, yeah, at times it's so good. And that times it's so fucking dumb. It's like annoying me. You know? But like the goodness of it makes me think that like this writer has a lot more to offer. I don't even mean it in like a condescending way. Like I think she's super like, like if you were to take certain passages from this book, you'd be like, wow, this fucking genius and funny. And You know, so I got, I got no problem with, with the writer at all. And I don't even have a problem with the book. It's just, it probably feels like it's getting more criticism because it became like a phenomenon. And now you got the Anne Hathaway series that's like going to come out of it. But anyway, that's my take on the unreliable narrator. And at times like just the certain aspects of her character, they just don't. add up, you know, almost like the writer was trying to put too much through her in a way at times,

which, like, it was a contradiction that she could be all these things. And people can also disagree with that, you know? Let's take another. Okay, this is for the yesteryear episode. I'm planning on calling back once I finished the book. I just got to chapter 55, which is a is the chapter way to find the blue truck. More than me, David. And I am stunned. Also, I know this is past the due date, so I hope it makes it to the episode, and I hope you actually end up doing a yesterday episode. I just was really slow about reading the book.

But now I'm listening to the audio version. And oh, my God. The blue truck. I think that's, I think that's the beginning of her realizing that something's up, if I recall correctly. Because, again, I'm not like, so I wish. we could find the second part of her message. The, I think that was like,

that's the first bit of a reveal about like, oh, fuck, there's something up with her situation, you know? So is this like Shutter Island coded? Like, that's kind of like how this unfolds. Are you unfamiliar with Shutter Island? No, I love Shutter Island. I don't know. I mean, a little bit, I guess,

except that like, I mean, except that nobody's doing it to her. That's the only thing. You know what I mean? They gives her idea. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I was just going to say something. Oh, yeah.

Actually, I know that we're 35 minutes in and I know we're relying on the messages, but, uh, what would we say, like of the main, like, so the trad wife part of it, I think is success, right? I think putting an eye on that world and the hypocrisy of it, not just between the fact that she's pretended to be this person and then she's something else, right? But obviously also, you know, contrasting it with the trad wave thing. So aspects of the trad wave thing, very entertaining and interesting. Internet culture, monetizing your family. you know, like basically how social media, you know, like basically it's no longer your life. It's like your life as it appears to others.

Like all that stuff also super interesting, especially because it's very satisfying to see it through the lens that we all know is true, that it's inauthentic. You know? In fact, it's quite shocking how people can buy into these tradwife influencers in general, you know? Other than if you're that way inclined politically, I guess it alleviates or it, what's the word I'm looking for? it rationalizes the way that you think. Okay, so I guess I can understand it from that point of you. But other than that, like, how can you not be like skeptical of the way these people live? Even though the angry women that she described, which by the way, I haven't mentioned this part before, but I think part of why I found particularly the early parts of this book so entertaining is that

anyone in the public eye has experienced the type of criticism online that she's kind of talking about. So that was just kind of fun from the point of view of a personal thing of like, oh yeah, I know the trolls or the angry women, you know, all that stuff. But so all that was fun to take a look at, you know, and I'm assuming that's part of why the book is so successful because that does feel so current and important. Are there other themes? I mean, it's clear that the writer is a liberal, you know, he's quite critical of that sort of like Republican mindset.

And then, you know, Caleb, in a way, Caleb's such a flawed character, but he does represent the guys that are getting sucked in by the Manosphere, conspiracy theories, anti-VAC stuff. So yes, all that stuff is in there in a way that's, like, like entertaining. Are there other themes that I'm that I'm missing? Probably also like yeah, motherhood and identity as a woman outside of motherhood. Yes. In the in the half that you read,

did you feel? Because like, you know, the thing with her, which is, I guess interesting is she's she's in control during during her normal time she's in control because she's like she presents is like hyper smart right and she's living within the restrictions of this odd Christian upbringing that she's had and the odd Christian life that she's married into she's living within those confines but almost in a way like Cersie Lannister or the Empress Dowager, you know, in the, you know, like in the end of the Qing dynasty, where it's like these women that actually have all the power, but they have to make it seem like they don't have all the power. You know, so she's doing that, though, quite successfully. But is it, what did you take from that in terms of her identity?

as a mother. Well, I, again, only right half. But from what I recall, that detachment that she had and not feeling those motherly instincts and like really struggling. And then also was it Caleb's mom who was kind of like the pillhead who was like, oh, you just got to take these and like the wine and stuff like that. Yeah, I don't know. I like, I kind of liked that part even though it's kind of like, are you crazy? Like you're not, I think that all of our expectations that. we put on her, like, to be a mom. And, like, she, perhaps this isn't really something she ever

wanted. And she's dealing with some degree of postpartum. Yes, postpartum, yeah. I thought all of that was really interesting. And I, I really liked those parts about her because it's just not what you would expect to see from that character. And this is just with my context, not, you know, knowing the second half of this. No, no, no, that's, you read that part. The body of that, the body of that is, is quite... I liked that about her. I thought that was very interesting because, you know,

it was different and she still felt the pressure to like, you know, her husband can't fucking get it together. And she's like, you know, I'm trying to like go on these walks.

I'm like doing anything I can to like stay sane and I'm not feeling this bond with my child. Like I thought all that was very interesting. And I don't, I didn't even find that unlikable. I felt that that was relatable. That was relatable.

Yeah. But yeah. Somebody pointed out, which I thought was pretty interesting, just somewhere that I read that, actually, let me make sure it wasn't this. Somebody messaged in, I took a screenshot of it. Somebody actually sent like a, let me just make sure it wasn't this, because this is from a dialer. I'll read that in a second. No, somebody I read somewhere was saying that if they could have just let go of, this you know these traditional

gender roles or like marriage roles that they had in their head they could have had a happy life because she was such a good earner and Caleb would have just been happy being a kindergarten teacher and they would have had a happy life you know that like but unfortunately he had to try to live up to whatever fucking weird you know life his father wanted for him and she had to you know maintain the the the trash wife life. Although she, you know, she only happened upon that, though, in fairness, you know,

she only happened upon the trad wife life. But, uh, anyway, I don't know if they would have been like, like, because I feel like he, as much as she wanted a man. Yes. And as much as he loved doing nothing, like, I think that he still felt lesser than for doing nothing, even though he had no motivation. Like, like, like, like, because they had issues in the bedroom. Like, I feel like he, they, there's no way that they would have been. Yeah, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, except that. probably part of the reason why he had issues in the bedroom was because he felt inadequate, whereas if he could have just been secure in himself that it was okay to be that type of man and she was okay in herself that it was okay for her to be the boss.

But that's the problem is that she wasn't attracted to him for because of his weakness. You know, she was only attracted to him really because he was a good looking and he had status when they originally met, right? And he was conservative. Let me read this. Rare read out on Burnaphone. This isn't the WhatsApp. That's why. Yesterday year. I've never completed a book before where I hated the main character. So unrelatable. I judged her so hard from the first chapter to the last page.

I was convinced it was a dream the whole time and it was pissed about that too like you were. I thought the ending was better than the whole rest of the book, interesting, different to me. The author did a great job of evoke emotion. Mostly rage from me, though, which seems to be a pretty consistent theme, not just from us. One thing that was confusing and I can't stop thinking about, oh yeah, this is important, was how much better old Caleb was it sex. She described it as how sex was meant to be. And it was really him the whole time I don't get that. Yeah, especially because it was basically rape, you know, which is weird. But that's one of those questions that's out there.

And I've seen a lot of people pissed off about that out there on the internet. The angry women on the internet. I am one of them. No, but just because she talks about the angry women. No, I know. Like from the beginning, I was like, well, that's me, L.O.L. But, yeah, I mean, it must be because they finally settled into those roles of like, he's the head of the house and she's submissive.

Yes. So they finally have made peace with that. But what's annoying is that it's only because she suddenly had a fucking nervous breakdown and is not doing her job. That's why he's pissed off. You know what I mean? Like we don't know what their sex life was like. I mean, obviously they were banging because they had a lot of kids after the fact, you know. We don't know what their sex life was like before she had a nervous breakdown and suddenly.

Caleb had to fucking smack the shit out of her. Fucking tell her to go fuck herself, even though she had a animal trapping. And by the way, like, the whole thing about the animal trap is it was the only one that was out there. You know, it was just like for show. Right.

Also, the kids didn't seem surprised. Like, they seemed like they were not like, why are you? If I remember, Oh, I forgot to tell you,

the two older boys, no. They're fucking. I'm looking. They're, they're, they're, oh, what does it know? Oh, oh, I know what it was. The part of how they were surviving was the other kids that were out were like given the dad food and shit. They kept, the dad was actually keeping in touch with the outside world.

Interesting. But I think behind her back. If you have a thought, can you say it while I run to the loop? Yes. I'll be able to hear me. Okay, so you'll have you'll have to answer. Okay, I guess does head a shit really bad, but Um, what was I going to say?

Oh, but I felt like the kids that were in the house, they weren't acting like freaked out or surprised by her having a nervous breakdown and trying to escape from all of them. Like they seemed just annoyed and inconvenienced, at least Clementine, by her mom having a breakdown. So it, it didn't seem to, like it was new to them, but would love your response when you return from the Lou. Well, I think the older kid was Mary, right? Clementine was the daughter from the...

Oh, Mary, Mary, Mary, Mary, Mary. Yes. That's not important. You can hear me? Yes. Is this professionally inappropriate? It's not any less inappropriate than you man spreading at the camera on the last episode. I was on Ian Finances podcast with short, short, short. I saw that. I was like, Jesus, he's doing it to everyone.

Well, it was a bad angle. So anyway, yeah, but yeah, but yes, they weren't so freaked out. Yes, exactly. They should have been having more of like a reaction. So those, but see, some of them were going to this like house. So, oh, you didn't get to the point where Mary comes back a little freaked out, right? And what's her face thinks? Oh, she's met somebody that she likes.

You didn't get to that part. No. Yeah, that's because she starts seeing the other family. and they have like a house of the other side of the forest that, you know, it turns out they were hanging with the dad. Anyway, all that stuff was just so annoying to me. So let's not focus on that because I think that's well established. Let's take a few more before we wrap it up on our expert. Now, here, I enjoyed the book clubs.

Now, I have to admit this was a very haphazard. But if we didn't again, no, if we did it again in the future, though, I would do it in a much like tighter timeline. Because part of the problem with this was like, it was just, I was getting messages for different times. It was hard to find them. I would do it from a, from a tighter timeline. And maybe even, maybe even it might be one where we could do like live call-ins just for the bonus episodes, you know. Yes. And I'll actually read the book.

I'll finish the book. Yeah. Well, that's important. And I think that we can probably structure this like with the themes or like random stuff coming up. Yes. Yes. That's the thing. It was a lot of, there was a lot of like organization that I needed to do that I didn't do.

But it doesn't matter. So let's, let's take another. Hi, does. I just finished yesterday year. And if I had to give it out of five stars, I don't know whether to give it a three because it left me feeling so achy at the end. or to give it a five because it left me feeling icky like the twist. So that's where I'm at right now. Also, I feel like the husband being involved with the twist surprised me

because wouldn't it have been easier for him just to leave her? Because he has all the money and the connections. So he can get out of this. situation, but I guess marriage was important to him at the end of the day. I couldn't figure that out. I guess she said that he was living in his ideal world because he could do whatever he wanted and lock her away. I don't know, but the book left me feeling very icky, but I guess that was the point. And I know that narrator was supposed to be unlikable, and I was fine with that at first. but it just kept getting worse.

And there was really no likable character other than the daughters, I guess. So yeah, I don't know how to feel, but I'm excited to hear other people sucks. Well, my friend, it looks like you're not on your own. We all don't know how to feel. We're all confused about our feelings on this one,

which is heightened by the book's popularity. Let's take a few more before we finish up. Hey, Des. Hey, Nicole. This is a message in the hopes that you all do the yesteryear episode because I did read the book very quickly in the hope that you all would do an episode. So, Des, in terms of your conflicted feelings, I'm curious if we were kind of in the

same spot. I really enjoyed the book. And it's one of the books I've read kind of fastest most recently. but the allegations that she was a lesbian at the end where like the nanny when she is like talking about the sexual assault allegations that they were against her and not the husband that was a real like okay is that what's happening so that was a confusing moment for me but then like thinking back to that scene like she was noticing details of like oh the nanny's pants weren't button and like she talked about like the print on her underwear so that's

like, oh, is it just because she's so, like, repressed in so many ways that, like, any expression of intense emotion is going to then bring up all these other things. So that, for me, was, like, kind of an eyebrow raise. And then was talking with friends about why was the husband able to get hard and have sex with her in yesteryear, but not when they were, like, living, quote, unquote, in modern times. My friend's opinion was, it was like, oh, because he's a misogynist. And in yesteryear, he has this. complete control and then it's able to get hard. But then, like, thinking back to him as a kid, obviously that misogyny in him seems to have been learned versus innate kind of with this

idea. He wanted to work with kids and, like, be a teacher and this and that. So that for me was also the interesting thing of like, okay, so he could get hard with her in yesterday, but not in modern times. And then obviously the point where, when they're in modern times and she sees his porn and it's like straight porn, you're like, okay, so he's probably not gay. because I feel like that could have very also easily been another, like, excuse for their lack of sex life. Okay. Thank you both for the pod.

Hope you really do the yesterday of your episode. Would love to hear other people's thoughts and also does your conflicted feelings about it. I mean, I think we've represented them. But I, the lesbian sexual assault allegation was definitely one of the things that, like, annoyed me. Like, like, I didn't mind that the producer won. like blowing up her spot and or or even that like that was always going to be the case when she hired somebody like that you know who would clearly be judgmental like classic you know that that that that didn't surprise me but like it wasn't just the nature of like her saying she assaulted her

but just like i don't know just how easy it was to pull off her demise in a way that was just you know i don't know it was it but again i'm not going to get I'm talking too much. Let's take a few more because I'm really enjoying hearing other people's point of view. Hi, Des and co-host or producer. This is about yesterday year and I didn't know we were supposed to message in, but I read it and I despised it. I felt like I read a whole book and then the last page said that it was a dream. I felt like there was no point in reading the book. The narrator was completely unreliable. You don't know. when she became crazy. To me, she seemed crazy the whole time from college, from the things she described, from her whole marriage. You don't know if her kids are crazy, if her husband's crazy, maybe he's totally normal because she's just crazy. So I felt like what was the point in the whole book with such an unreliable narrator who was telling you the story, her producer, like what actually

happened in the room when she, you know, was with her producer? I just felt like, what was the point? because who even knows what was real and what was just a crazy person describing events that didn't actually happen or happen in the way that she saw them. I agreed with that previous caller, by the way, except that I wasn't as, I wasn't the unreliable narrative thing, like, I get, but I didn't have that much of a problem in that like, when, so she goes into this dissent into, like, like enough that the whole yesteryear section was like basically a manic episode, that pre, like all the previous stuff was just the rantings and ravings of a crazy person. You know, that didn't bother me. I didn't, I didn't think of it as that severe in terms of unreliability. But I agreed with the sentiment and the energy.

Let's take what I thought was the same person. No, I fully read this as a mystery. Like I, in people keeping like, this book is not a mystery. I'm like, no, it's a fucking mystery. The whole time I was trying to figure out what the fuck was going on. I was like, she's in another world. She's this. She's that.

She's just nuts. Oh, no. Actually, I think maybe this is real life. And it's just later. And then like, oh, it was so good. No, she loved it. Damn. I fucked up.

And then also, it took me so long to, like, get into it. And then literally in the last three days, I went from like 25% complete to finished. Like, I have not been able to put it. it down. Interesting. I literally, I, like, almost started crying at the end. Like, with Mary being, like, Mama, you lied to me about literally everything in this world.

And I'm, like, her being sad that, like, her mom doesn't get to see the beauty of the world because her mom's fucking nuts. Like, and, like, accepting that, like, you can't change people, no matter how much you want them to change, they have to choose to change themselves. And, oh, my God. I loved it. I love it so much. I feel bad that I haven't represented the first part of this person's message

because this is like a deep love for it. So, you know, mixed, we can't say that we didn't put out, you know, various viewpoints. Do you want to play the other WhatsApp? Sorry, can I defend myself on the WhatsApp? So when you guys send WhatsApp, when I save the file, it's saved, it doesn't save an MP3. I have to convert them. So in the converting of this, because I was doing, you know, I was getting, I was going through these WhatsApp, listening to WhatsApp trying to find the yesterday years. And then in the converting, I have obviously mislabeled some of these. So I,

I apologize. I'm an unreliable narrator. Yesterday year, sorry for being behind on the trend. but I finished it last night, so I've slept. I can't stop thinking about this book. It was terrifying. I hated it, but I also loved it so much. And I rarely rate books five stars, and that was a five star book for sure. Wow. Another five.

I can't stop thinking about it. And how scary it is, especially in our world right now. But also, like, Natalie is obviously nuts. Also, my name's Natalie. So that was a whole trippy thing in itself. Natalie is obviously nuts. Like she's like clinically something's wrong, right? And she's like neglecting her kids and like it's really bad and like understood she's nuts.

Caleb isn't clinically insane. And he's allowing his wife to do this to his kids and continuing this and like treating his kids like this and not being like, hey, this is wrong. and, you know, we should not as the person that's not, like, actually insane. So, like, that's also not good. Like, he should also be getting 30 years because he did it in his right mind. Anyway, I just, I, like, don't even know what to say or how to process this book. I'm so scared. I loved it.

I don't know. Wow, wow, wow. More than one person said that, too. I'm so scared. By the way, I just want to say a little aside for the Caleb's mother, who's like a pill pop and alcoholic, I found it hard not to visualize Parker Posey from, what you might call it? White Lotus. White Lotus. I unfortunately that she was park opposed to me I couldn't shake it you didn't have that

I didn't see her no because I don't know I feel like I saw someone with kind of like white almost white hair like blondeish white hair interesting yeah Natalie was blonde to me and then when I saw the pictures of Anne Hathaway I would say it's Anne Hathaway yeah Natalie was blonde to me does she describe her hair I don't remember, but I also saw her as blonde. Yeah. That's the only thing that sucks when things like, you know, once you have an image in your head, you know?

Like I can't, I read, I watched season one of Game of Thrones and I read all the books. And like, Tyrion Lannister was always that guy, you know, which is unfortunate in a way. Yeah. You know? So Anne Hathaway will, it's not my Natalie. She's not my Natalie. Hashtag not my Natalie. No, hashtag not my Natalie.

Who would you have cast? Oh, who would I have cast? I mean, honestly, even though I shout on Wuthering Heights, I would probably cast. What's your face? Margot Robbie. Margo Robbie. No, no. No, I haven't read the whole book of me.

No, you can't. What is her name? I have a vision. You have a vision? Who's your Natalie? My Natalie would be Elizabeth Moss. Elizabeth Moss from the Handmaids, though? Yes.

Well, better Cassie. Well, no, but she's, I'm not saying Elizabeth Moth isn't good looking, but to me, Natalie is more traditionally attractive than Elizabeth Mose. What if Elizabeth Moss was the sister? Well, here's the thing. Elizabeth Moss is an occult. You know that, right?

What? Scientology? She's a high-level Scientologist. No way. Yeah, like a front row at the main event Scientologist. Whoa. You didn't know that? That's why it's the great paradox of the Handmaid's Tale is that she's in a cult.

That's unfortunate. I mean, but for me... You didn't know that? No, but I mean, part of the reason that I was like, maybe her is because I'm trying to think of somebody who could... play all of the things that I described or that we talked about. Waterford's wife could,

Waterford's wife would be a good Natalie for me, but it's basically the same role. Mm-hmm. Anyway, it's not important now. Is there any, is there any that we didn't? Yeah, we have a couple. All right, play them out. But we'll play them out in our presence.

And we'll make a comment if needs be. But we're under no pressure to make any more comments. A full hour. Hi, guys. Hi, Caroline. Love you guys so much. Oh, that means it's recent.

So I'm calling about yesteryear. The problem is I already called, and I talked about when Natalie didn't want to send her kids to school. So she told Caleb all these crazy things the teachers do in school. And I was saying people actually really believe that shit. But then Zaz said he didn't like any of the original phone calls that he got about yesterday. year. So, does, can you give us a hymn? Like, help us out. What do you want us to say? We'll say or do anything. We really, really, really want this episode. Everyone wants the extra episode about yesteryear. Please, please, please. Okay, love you guys. Bye. Did I say I didn't like them or that just there wasn't a lot of good ones that came in? That you didn't agree. Like, I think there was initial positivity out the gate. Oh, right. Did I say that? Oh, my apologies.

My apologies. I don't think I could find those original ones then either. But we didn't see hers, which is annoying. Early, you know, she messaged in early and then late because she had a Caroline reference. So, all right, let's take a couple more. Hi, this is Taylor calling in for the yesteryear episode. I just wanted to give my impression. I sort of liked it I thought the ending was really disappointing I was thinking it was going to be way more sci-fi dystopian

but yeah it's kind of just really you know something's wrong with that lady if you've never read I've never known man it reminds me a lot of that in the writing style and kind of the concept but yeah I would say a little bit disappointed I liked the concept but just wasn't executed that well

love the pod and please let's keep up book club. Bye. To me that's like the fairest review. Because like if I was taking a little bit of my emotion out of it, I'd say that's exactly what I thought. You know, great concept, badly executed, not sure how I feel. But thank you. See, I feel like a book club could work, you know. I think we could really make this work. I'm really sorry for talking so much and not finishing the book because that was probably really annoying. There's going to be a lot of Caroline hate out there. I can tell you that.

I'm really sorry, but you guys have inspired me to finish it because the ending does sound interesting. And I do love a book where everyone's fighting about it. So I might be able to power through. But I am sorry for talking so much with no. I was a real man in this episode. I talked a lot about something I didn't know anything about. So I'll talk this. Forgive me. Wow, you're such a Caleb. You're giving Caleb vibes, and I'm giving Natalie vibes. What's going on?

I also don't think, I will say, I don't think he really wanted to be a teacher. Like, I think he just kind of like someone suggested that to him, and he was like, yeah, I could be a teacher. All right, I'm going to admit something. Other than the fact that she's insane and, like, neglected her children to the point where she went to jail for 30 years, I kind of like Natalie. Wait, it was 30 years? Oh, sorry, yeah. For the neglect.

Yeah, but like whatever, dude. The end is so stupid. Is there one more before we go? Is there one more before we go? Yes. Not my Natalie. I don't think we did this one yet. Okay, so I'm calling in regarding yesterday year,

and you gave me exactly what I needed. deadline to finish this book because this book is horrible. I hate it. I'm only reading it for this podcast. I'm struggling through it. I find it way too long, too descriptive about the old and years part. I'm about maybe like 60% of the way done. And she's just not a likable character at all. This lady hates everyone. She hates her husband. She hates her kids. She hates her sister. She seems to like her mom, but that's pretty much it. So I will finish the book within the deadline, and I will give another voicemail in for the ending,

which I hope makes this book worth it. But so far, really, really do not like this book. Okay? Thanks a lot. Bye-bye. Fun fact, I think she liked the ending because she was one of our early messages because it was her second message.

And she said, I messaged in to say how much I hated it. It was too long. But I think she liked the ending. if you were called for me. This is my ally. Yeah. This is exactly where I am in the book and exactly how I was feeling and why I dropped out. Well, now you got to read the rest.

I have to. You know. Now we've got to think of another book and we got to do it properly this time. I know. Gotta think of another book, man. Because, you know, I was thinking about a movie. Maybe people will comment if there's anything else like hot right now. Well, Hannah's mom suggested a book to me yesterday, my mother-in-law,

which is which is better to say Hannah's mom or my mother-in-law What's my mother-in-law? My mother-in-law feels really formal. Yeah. Hannah's mom, Lenore, uh,

suggested so, uh, oh God, what's the writer's name? It's, it's based in Ireland. It's like a historical fiction. It's the woman that wrote Hamnet.

Um, let's just put it on the list. Let's just do it. Let's just do this right now. Let's just fucking do it. It's like a prompt for next week. We have to say it in this episode what the new book is going to be. So it's written by Maggie O'Farrell.

And it's called, let's just fucking do it. Because Hannah's mom, you know, I should have got, you know what I should have done? I should have done, we should have got Hannah's mom on this pod because she read yesterday. But though, she was annoyed by it too. latest book. So we're going to read this. We're going to read this. It's called land.

All right. What's it about? Setting. Ireland in 1865 in the aftermath of the Great Hunger. Right? Love a fucking famine story now. It follows Tomas and his 10-year-old son, Liam, who are mapping the county for the British Ordinance Survey Project.

But he experiences, Tomas experiences a life-altering encounter. okay so is that is that is that that's not interesting enough for you i'm not yet you know i don't like old books it's not old it's new it's brand new it's brand new it's brand new everyone's gonna think my reading comprehension is so fucking bad i swear i went to college and i graduated you want to read fucking dr sues what the fuck do you want to read no i'll i'll be brave i'll tell you what i'll listen to you when you finish the fucking book. Then I'll listen to you.

I'm such a loser. Yeah, I'm not like a big like books in the 1800s kind of girl, but I could, I need to commit to something for this show. That's my suggestion. How about that? If somebody has another suggestion,

we're a fan of female authors on this podcast. So if somebody has another suggestion, but I am a big fan of historical fiction. So that's my suggestion. Message in, because we don't have to do ads for this one.

So whenever this one goes up, message in, your suggestions you can hit me up. 911, 517. Oh, God, I nearly. Damn it. I nearly had it there. Oh, my notes, my notes are not working.

Whatever the number is. 917-5-1-2-17-58 or 17-48? 5-8. 9-17-5-1-1-7-1. 22-17-58. Message us or WhatsApp us on the WhatsApp number. And let us know if Land by Maggie O'Farrell is good enough for you, or if you have another suggestion.

It doesn't have to be a female author, but it seems to be a theme. And thanks for listening to this incredibly long waffling episode. But it was an experiment, and it's the beginning of something. So thank you, everybody that messaged in over the last five and a half years that it took us to do this episode. And we'll talk to you guys next time. Thank you.