Berner Phone - Justin Silver: Understanding Dogs & Your Own Demons

Episode Date: January 27, 2022

Expert dog trainer, comedian, actor, and podcaster, Justin Silver discusses what he's learned from understanding dogs and what's it's taught him about humans. He delves deep into the psychology of dogs and how they communicate while also reflecting on his own psychology, relationships, anxiety, OCD, depression, and career.--- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/appSupport this podcast: https://anchor.fm/berninginhell/support Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

What's the deal with the cat versus dog debate? Why do dog people hate cats? I don't think dog people hate cats, but I'll tell you one thing, ready? And you can use this in your act. You ready? I'll give you a joke. You know why dogs are cooler than cats? Why?

Because you'd never heard anybody say, oh my God, my dog's so cool, he's like a cat. But how often do you hear people like, no, this cat's so cool, he's like a dog, right? Ready, set, go already? Do your sick, the Armani. Emporeo Armani, I did, I used to do the Armani as in BMW. Emporeo Armani presents the fragrance for him, the fragrance for her. Two fragrances get together. Emporeo Armani.

You can start the episode like that. That's what I'm going to do. It smells like a gummy bear forded. Let's go. Yeah, I did. I did, I, that was into the hey day when voiceover artists were making like good money. $180,000 a year for doing like four gigs. You would just go to the mailbox for a living.

I was like, oh, this is going to last forever. But the funny part, even though you are a great voiceover artist, you still hate your voice. There's times I hate it. When I hear the Jewy New Yorkness of it, I'm just like, ew. It's why I won't do like, you hear your grandpa. You're like, how did you get inside me? my grandma I hear my grandma what are you talking about so I like so but for acting I've had to like really learn how to take it out like I can take it out but sometimes I'm just like you catch me in a moment where I'm a moche it's coming back in why are you doing this to me you start nagging yourself yeah guys we are about to get seriously a moche with Justin silver I've actually had eye on you for a long time oh really to have you on the pod that's so cool because you had neurotica which is all about psychoses and that is where we thrive um and burning in hell

You also, you're a podcaster, you're a comedian, you're an actor, you're a top dog trainer, you're an author. Thank you. This is just facts, not even compliments yet. We're not doing compliments. We're going to hell. We're going to break you down and build you back up, Justin. I appreciate that.

I'm already broken down, so let's just start from the rebuild, please. I want to say, I just got to your apartment. It's immaculate, beautiful, especially for a straight man, and you have the most adorable pit bull. Oh. How are you single right now? How am I single right now? I think, well, I date, and I think that when someone sticks where all the different things

line up, you kind of just know that. And then, yeah, the two, you just kind of just, it flows naturally and easily. But I don't think, I don't know. I just think that that comes, you fall in love when you fall in love and all those other things have to line up, but you can't force that. And when it happens, it happens. And there's times I've been in, like, great love. And then those relationships even, I don't think that because relationships,

breakup doesn't mean they weren't successful for the time that they were. Agreed, 100%. But now I'm at the point where I'm like some, the, I want something with longevity and I'm ready for that. And my life is like, is going in a pretty good direction despite the voices in my head that try to convince me that they're not all the time. So I'm sort of like, uh, and it's been like a rebuild from like a few years ago where I was in LA after I had that CBS show and I had quit doing comedy and I was like, I was sort of

waiting for other things to materialize. And I came back to New York to sort of rebilled. build things but now I'm in the place where I'm like I kind of just like pop my head on the ground the other day and I was like oh wait things are flowing and going pretty good so um so hopefully that won't be for long well one thing that attracted me to des was when I met him he was fostering a pit bull oh and he definitely needed your help his name was Flynn he was this huge blue nose pit oh I love the blues and Des would be like and the dog would stop and there was something so hot about I was like if he could handle this pit bull he could he might be able to handle

me right right there's something sexy about a dude who like walked with a giant dog off leash in the streets like someone had a joke about that I think it was like I can't remember it was she's like if I see it she's like if I see a guy walking a dog off leash he's like oh this dude fucks who the hell was it I can't remember but like Corinne sent it to me the other day and I was all about like watch his guy off leash and then he'd like play with the um the rope but then he'd always like pull his back a little but that's what happens when you're with an older man but anyway what have you learned about humans through training dogs.

So check this out. Or learned about yourself. So check this out. So I wrote the book, The Language of Dogs, which is basically like prescriptive nonfiction where it's basically explaining like how dogs think learn see the world

and how to set them up for success by teaching them the things you want them to do in all the different stimulus where they would act out otherwise, right? So in the process of training dogs that came from being a personal trainer, which is what I think helped me work with people. Because you have to, when you're training dogs, you're training the people to train their dogs.

I don't believe in that thing. Like, give me your dog. I'll program your cable box and then hand you the remote control. It doesn't work that way. Yeah. Like, you have to be integrated. It's parenting, right? So, so many life lessons come up for me when I'm working with animals that the next book I wanted to write and I may still do it is everything I've ever needed to know I've learned from dogs.

Yeah. And the point, and some of the biggest things in dogdom is understanding when owners call me with problems that dogs are always. learning from us either directly or inadvertently through our behaviors so we have to be clear on what we want them to do and set a path for them and then any correction is course correcting back to this original path and every time I'm on session with whether it's like a high aggressive session or someone who you know there's a lot of like you know single women in New York City who have these codependent relationships with their dogs after they went through some divorce that kind of thing and I'll catch myself saying things where I'm speaking to the

psychology of what they need to do to bridge the communication gap, because that's really what it is, just how to communicate with them. And I'm like, wait a second, that's the kind of thing I should be telling myself in A, B, or C situation I'm in my life. So it's like, it's almost everything. You, it's funny, there's a lot of people that will get a dog to think it's going to like solve all their problems. What is this codependency you talk about? Because a lot of people suffer from codependency just with normal relationships. Well, my thing is, I believe we treat animals the way we want to be treated and in a and if you're into dog rescue or like you know I mean you buy you get a dog because you want to love something and it's very easy if you feel even if you're not feeling

lonely to coddle that thing and to baby it and treat it like a stuffed animal with a heartbeat yeah and so when I pull dogs off the street like you have big brutus over here who's adorable but I have dogs that are I have dogs that are 11 pounds and then I have dogs that are over a hundred 150 pounds, right? If you look at all the different dogs I train, and a lot of those dogs, you know, I spend so much time with them. They're basically, you know, I'm on a lot of people's wills. If something happens to me, it's like, God, it all happens at the same time. There's going to be like 30 dogs here. And thank God they're loaded. So the will also comes with like, you know, half a million dollars for some of these dogs. But when I think about

an animal like Brutus, like my mom always said to me, she's like, you know, I had like a bit of a troubled background. I had a bad relationship with my father. And I was like always a really sensitive kid and an artist like all this artwork you're seeing in the apartment like I did a lot of these wow so um I always had this thing with animals where I would want to save them and fix them and I would walk by homeless people on the street as a kid I would like start crying and make my mom like give them money like I've always had this very kindred spirit very sensitive very sensitive very which is not a bad thing it's not a bad thing if you can if you could sort of manage it and control it and understand there's other aspects of your personality or your strengths which is what I'm

to get to in a second. So my mom would, when I started doing Funny for Friday, which is my charity and my rescue shelter, I started, I'm sorry, my charity for rescue shelters. I just had this big affinity for underdogs and dogs had it had it rough and wanted to like fix them and give them like a happy life. And it's very easy to want to just feel bad for them about their sad stories. So when I look at, if you take Brutics, for example, like he's a dog that was on the streets in L.A., he was dying, he was emaciated. They had to pull the skin of his scrotum off the pavement because it sort of melded to it from the heat. Well, I have videos of this. And like, and for me, when I look at them, it's very easy to want to coddle him and just be like,

oh my God, you had like this horrible, sad story. Like, let me baby you. And you could also look at, I mean, and when you're asking me about codependent relationships with dogs and people in New York, a lot of people do this. They're like, you know, if they're, dog gets separation anxiety, they want to coddle it because they feel bad for the fact that the dog's suffering. But in my mind, the way I explained it to them is like, what we want them to be happy balance is free is for them to have a sense of autonomy, to have a sense of self, to need us because they need food in their bowls, but not need us to the point where it's like they're screaming, crying if we run out of the room. We want to build like strong, happy young men and women

and learn how to self-soothe if you're not around. Yes. And actually, that is something that dogs do you there's techniques that you do in training which teaches them to manage their emotions so that the we'll quote a quote and call thoughts in their heads run through as opposed to making their body move which then the body moves the brain moves the body moves the brain and then they start going into some sort of physical and emotional type of spinning we'll call it you can do techniques that teach them to they can have their feelings but it doesn't mean they need to act on them right just like us just like us doing a breathing exercise when you're feeling anxious instead of smoking a cigarette or instead of like you know running around the apartment like

anxious you could be like wait i'm just going to sit here and manage my emotions this is so similar to humans because as a girl i love a bad boy i love fixing a sad a sad boy but if you think that you're just going to take someone and be their savior and that that's going to be a healthy relationship and change them to be what you want sure and you like are making in your head for them that's not healthy it's you finding someone who has their demons and you've your demons and you both knowing your boundaries and giving each other the ability to like be confident in yourselves yeah which is kind of what you've done with brutus I feel like but it's but it's but the thing that I do I agree with you we'll get back to that in relationships I think but I the thing with I try to the way I explain

it to clients when they're asking me like why dogs are reacting to all these things in the environment I try to explain to them like the environment is your relationship with them right so I always explain it like this scene interior a train car going across the country. The relationship between you and that animal, just like the interior of that train car, goes through all these different environments. Do you understand what I'm saying? So you're trying to build a healthy, balanced communication and relationship with them, right? So that's why when I'm working them and I'm working with clients, I'm like, what would you, if instead of feeling bad for this animal because of their past or because their expression of

anxiety is something that's very sympathetic and empathetic, if this were you or this were like a child that you had what would you want for them you'd want them to feel comfortable in their own skin you'd want them to feel confident you'd want them to love you but not be excessively needy you'd want them to have a skill set you'd want them to feel socialized with with other kids you'd want them you'd want all these you'd want all these things for them that where where you would love them the right way so that they were strong in their sense of self and their sense of being right and when i'm working with people and animals with that and i'm and especially with dogs like brutus Like I realize like where I have to be tougher, where I have to be like not take his shit,

where I have to be coddling and nurturing to him, where I have to like educate him, set him up for things so that he knows how to solve his own problems in a way. So it's like in a way, I'm like I think about like the little kid inside of me that's like needy and how, you know, we all have that. And I'm like, wait a second. I look at it almost like a dog that I'm training. So does that like bring that full circle? And I this is so fascinating to me because I also think there's a lot of animal lovers

that listen to this pod. And I recently saw something because I. I love, when I was a little kid, I used to just raise my hand in class and be like, I love animals. And they're like, okay, shut the fuck out. Like, what are you talking about? But I do feel like, I thought I was so special because I love animals. And I recently read about like how people who go through trauma have an affinity for animals.

Yeah, that's what I was saying. And I was like, wait a second. Let me don't fuck down. No, that's what I said. My mom, you say, she goes, I feel like you're always trying to fix yourself. You're trying to heal yourself by trying to heal all these dogs, which is true. Wow, that's deep. But healing them in the wrong.

right way like that's the area where I really feel like I heal things in the right way as opposed that you know you can there's transference you know what I mean you can trans just like you were just talking with codependent relationships you can transfer your you know feeling of low self-worth or feeling like you were inadequate to trying to fix somebody so that you feel like you were the you know you represented some sense of strength and you know something you can there's transfers but the one place where like emotional transference is kind of healthy is where you're like wait a second here's me loving something the right way making it stronger more competent happier and then like you know the circle sort of complete so it's like in a way it's like my emotional

transference to animals in a way to like fix the little kid in me is sort of a good thing for them and for me and for other people like it's like that that's where yeah that's where like the cracks in us allow the light to shine through i was going through the worst time in quarantine like a really bad depression and i started volunteering at an animal shelter because i could i was going through like internet bullshit and i couldn't stop looking at my phone but when i got to the shelter you can't look at your phone because you're working and things are simple like when you're dealing with people there's so many complicated things like I think group settings are really fucking hard sometimes awkward you don't know when to talk what to say you try to be funny you hurt someone's

feelings like it's so complicated and with animals like their intentions seem like very simple you feel like you understand them there's like this pureness to the relationships where I almost feel like myself when I'm with an animal or sometimes with humans they're everyone's looking at you through all these lenses that you don't know who you are. Yeah, well, the nice, there's no social mask with them. Yeah, and we relate. It's like children. It's like children.

And we relate to them on a level that's very primal. Yes. And I, one of the nice things about having this dog, and I, you know, I like big, beautiful pit bulls like this is that when we, you know, I went through depression and quarantine too. And I lot right before, right before lockdown, I put my 15-year-old Pipple Chiquita, 16-year-old Hippled Chiquita down and she was my first one. Oh, I'm sorry.

But no, no, it was beautiful. We did it right here in the living room. We had beautiful music plan. Like, it was her time to go and I feel like I like, the way I say it is I landed that plane so gracefully so she didn't even feel the wheels touch the ground. It's like, that's our job as dog owners. And then I got this dog sweepie who had a lot of medical issues and I raised all this money during COVID.

I trained him and I was putting it all on social media, which is how that the language of dogs, and we'll talk about how that TikTok page started blowing up is because I was showing examples of how I was training him from the ground up, but I was also raising money for his medical needs, and I ended up raising like $10,000. He had to get all these surgeries, and out of nowhere, he just sort of dropped dead. Wow. And I went into the depths of a depression that was so real that it was so physically overcoming.

And again, it was like the middle of winter during COVID. I just put two dogs down. And so I got out, and I went to L.A. just to get into some sun and start fostering dogs. And I was like, I'm not coming back until I find, like, the one that's right for me. And I found this dude. And, you know, when you've been doing this as long as I do, just like we were talking about dating earlier, your list gets very narrow.

You know exactly what you're looking for. Just like, you know the red flags. You know exactly. And I was like this, I wrote a list of 16 things that some of them were superficial, but most of them were like the necessities of what I would want. And like... Same as dating. There's a little superficialness in the beginning.

Right. Yeah. Well, I want them big and beautiful like this dude. but I also need they also work my dogs work for a living like we train we work together this is my training part and so um getting him and then bringing him back here and the relationship I have with this dog and how fulfilling it is and necessary it is for me to get up get out of the house because I have something to care for and while I'm working with them I just I never think about myself and as and as and as comedians and performers and artists and and also we're so self-aware to

the point that it's painful but also but we're also the product of what we're doing like you know you and i were shooting social media right before this and it's like you know we're also the businesses that we're working on we're the products and so you can focus you know it's like how many times you have to look at pictures of yourself yeah you know for for necessity yeah and the nice thing about working with dogs and and having a social media page that's more catered to them is that it's not about me do you know what i mean it's about like of course it like channels through me but like it's it feels like uh it's something where i feel like my like something something for the greater good is acting through me

which is what I think the charity is and all those other things yeah I think I've had trouble sometimes growing up I didn't have a religion and I didn't I played an individual sport I know you were a boxer I was a tennis player oh yeah so I always felt like I never felt like I was a boxer I know these things you actually told me we we go way back like we had little instances when we see each other yeah yeah yeah yeah when Mike Eone was performing at the daily show and I think we got into it we were all there in the green room And tennis and boxing are very similar, where it's individual, and you're just fucking obsessed

with yourself and how good you're doing. And I never felt like I was part of a bigger team or a bigger moment or a bigger reason. I have a lot of like, why am I on this earth? And then you get a pet, or you're fostering a pet, you're taking care of an animal, and you're like, out of your own head. Yeah. And you have to be present because, like, what? If you lose the dog or the dog is in harm because you were spacing out on your phone,

like, that's not okay. Yeah. Yeah. And the cool thing is like, you know, the nice thing is like, you know, my charity, funny for Fido is where is like the confluence of those two passions. You know, I've been doing that for 20 years. And like I told you, we're about to shoot a tour on it where it's like bringing all these comedians together to raise money for the rescue shelters. And I got to tell you, like in all the things I've ever done in my life between the TV shows I've had, the books. Like that's the thing that when I, when we do that show and I write the check over to the shelters and like the comics who were my idols, like, you know the davidels and colin quins and Seinfeld did the last one in gaff again and they everybody does it when i see like everybody's sitting there and they're they're laughing their ass over there's all these people with these like homeless animals in the crowd they were raising money for and i signed that chag over like i just can't like i just start weeping from it you know it's like it's the nicest it's like the purest and nicest thing in my life and i'm like you know things like that are just

like it sounds so cheesy but it's like that really is when people talk about like the spirit of giving and generosity it's like man I my mom always tells me she comes to them she's like I'm so proud of you and I know what she means and I don't mean in a narcissistic vein type of way I'd mean in a way with like you know man like you got to give yourself credits on like you've done good kid well we're in an industry where it's a lot of like what's the follower count what's the money you're bringing in what's the last thing that you did that made you relevant yeah now that you're like on the dating scene and you've learned from your past okay what do you And you said with dogs, like, you kind of know what you're looking for.

Oh, yeah. What are you looking for in terms of a human? Is this basically becoming like a hinge? Is this becoming like a hinge? Well, I'm also fascinated by like single guys in the city and how their brains work. Okay. You're asking what I'm looking for? Yeah, like, what do you think is a good, like, what are the things now that you've experienced a lot that you want in a relationship?

Or you want for a happy partnership long term? You know what I really love? And, like, listen, of course, there's all the physical attributes of somebody that you have to be attracted to. And I like sex to be very, you know, hot and good. And I like, of course. And I'm like, I'm like, I'm a pleased. You're like, I want sex to be sexy. Yeah, I want sex.

But I'm a pleaser in that way. Like, I'm kind of like, you know, generous in the bedroom. He's saying he likes to go down on you. That's what he's saying. That is what I'm saying. I'm trying to, listen, I try to, I'm, I'm not a fuck boy and I try to make sure I do not come off that way because I know that I look that way. But I am not. I swear to you would not

there is something about like muscles people assume that you are vain and fuck boy I have a douchebags uniform you do I do but I'm not that way at all but like the nice the sort of passion in the bedroom is an important thing and like of course there's a physical attraction

and all that but the most important thing for me is I think like when it's so cheap when people fill each other's gaps and I'm sure you experience this with like you were talking about like the age difference with the two of you and how there's nice things at the fact that he's older and he settled down in certain ways that give you room to be able to do the things that you want to do and so the two of me advice on things that he yeah and i always love i always like i could tell him about ticot yeah but i like i love i love when when aspects of

things that i've learned in my personality and the the things that i've known how to do can lend themselves to this thing that that other people that person wants to accomplish and the two of you kind of just keeps stepping up together. Yes. And it ends up becoming like, you know, you and her versus the world, which is a cool thing. What if she's a cat person? I like cats. I like all animals.

Can we discuss this for a second? Because I'm working on bits about it and stuff. And I, I'm an animal lover, but I also grew up with cats. I grew up in Brooklyn. So we only had room for cats. And I fucking love cats more than anything. What's the deal with the cat versus dog debate? Why do dog people hate cats?

I don't think dog people hate cats, but I'll tell you one thing, ready? And you can use this in your act. You ready? I'll give you a joke. You know why dogs are cooler than cats? Why? Because you'd never heard anybody say, oh my God, my dog's so cool, he's like a cat. But how often do you hear people like, no, this cat's so cool, he's like a dog, right?

Valid point. But I also was thinking in the bathroom today, I've never heard a person who owns a cat say they don't like cats. Like they'll insinuate, like, yeah, my cat was like an asshole. But I do think dogs have this like, this, like, They just want everyone to love them and they want to listen to them and they love you giving the boundaries where cats are like, I make the rules, bitch.

The thing is with cat, like, we're dogs evolutionary niche. We're not cats evolutionary niche. So dog, please explain that. So there's no such thing as dogs without humans, right? Like, dogs are domesticated wolves. Okay. And where they're evolutionary niche.

Dogs do not exist without human beings. Even though there's wild dogs now, those dogs have re-acclimated toward the wild and like the plains of Africa. Okay. But so because of that, the, you know, the cute little puppy dog face, and you can watch this if you watch a Netflix series dogs, the reason they give that

puppy dog face is to be more endearing toward humans so that they get fed, and that developed early on from wolves, and they have something, I mean, I can explain the science of this, but I don't think people are going to be interested in that. So dogs are biologically programmed genetic to work with us and work for us. There they, we, a lot of people believe we wouldn't have survived if it wasn't for the dog. They were everything from our alarm systems to our hot water bottles, to our nannies, to our hunting parts. partners and people thought that human beings would not have existed if it wasn't for if it wasn't for them so we are genetically pro like human beings and dogs exist together cats although great company and can be trained and you know uh wonderful life partners and pets don't necessarily need us how you don't you don't see often in other countries you do but you don't see a lot of feral dogs you see feral cats all the time they don't really need us to exist Cats would have survived without us.

Dogs would not have. Yeah. They wouldn't even be here. So that's why I think that. That's very interesting. I also would use that too as an argument to be like, cats don't need us, but they still choose to hang with us, which is nice. I love all animal.

I mean, I rescue birds off the street. But the thing is, you know that dogs are the only animal that look to the right side of your face to determine expression? The only thing else that does that are other humans because at a necessity. So when you look at me and you see, you look to the right side of my face to determine expression, right? Which lets you know if I'm happy, if I'm sad, if this episode is going good, if it's not going good, if I want you to, like, put your feet off up my couch.

You know, you understand? So the only other animal that would need to do that are dogs. Primates don't even do that with us because monkeys don't really need us to, they don't need us to live. So that's why I think, you know, people are just like dog man, best friend, but cats, second best friend. Okay, good. I have one question about dogs, my one issue with dogs.

Brutus has this very special relationship with you. When he sees someone else, he gets so excited. With my cat, she will not fuck with you for like a good three months, and I like that about her. Because I'm like, she will never love someone like she loves me. She's a cunt. And so am I. And I feel like. No, you're not.

But I feel like with the dog, if my dog got so excited to see someone else, I get jealous. I'd be like, oh, that person's done nothing for you. and you're fucking whoring yourself out to this person. Back to our codependent relationship this year. Well, the dog always love the owner the most or like whoever gives them food. Listen, if this is the truth, okay? If they're basic, this is what I love about them so much,

they don't hold on to the past the way we do. So that's why, like I was saying before, like when animals come from sad stories, the best thing you can do, and this is also, we could talk about trauma, right? The best thing you could do is nurture them in the present and fulfill all the needs that went missing as if

they had what they needed from the beginning and they reset. So when people bring their dogs to me and they stay here for like a week they're loved, they're cared for, they're fed well, they're trained. If those owners never came back with those dogs know the difference, no. I mean, they

would still remember that person and they'd be excited to see them, but as long as their needs are met and they're being loved and cared for and given everything they need, they move forward. Which is nice, which is what's so nice about them. And so, you know, I'm trying to just get his paw out from the wire here. He's all about you.

He's very involved in this podcast. Well, no, he's all about you. He loves women. But the nice thing about a dog like this, it's like, does he remember, if he saw his former owners who actually were really abused him, would he remember them and still run to them? Yeah, of course they, of course he would. But the nice thing is that they reset and so you can sort of start their lives over

at any point. Yeah. So it's not, and it's not a matter of them being lawyer or disloyal. It's that they think in the present and they think in the moment. And that goes back to what we're- Wow, how freeing must that be. But that's what I said. That's why being with them, it's like you forget about yourself.

You forget, that's what, that's what you were talking about earlier. Like the relationship with animals is so beautiful because it's like you're, you're so present in the moment with that. You know what I mean? And if, and if they have these sort of, the best thing you can do when you're trying to mitigate fractures of the past for them so that they heal and they move forward is to bring them into the present and forget their sad stories and just like we're doing with me in this podcast we're rebuilding me yes how have you changed as like a guy a lover a boyfriend

over the years oh my god how old are you now 40s when I was in my 30s I was like oh this is where all the this is we're all like the 20 year olds when I was 20 that I'm trying to get with are going and then when I hit my and then when I hit my 40s I'm like here's with the 30 Is it like, it's, I think it's, I think the, also intellectually, intellectually, they fucking, they also like, know their passions a lot more.

I feel like in their late 30s and 40s, they're emotionally, like, more understanding of themselves and other people. They grow up. They grow up. And also, they're interesting. Like, I feel like they know things that I don't know. Yeah.

Guys in their 20s are kind of like squirrels in like a fun way. But you want to emotionally like respect the person. Yeah, you want, yeah. And you want someone who like, you want, I think it's important. And this is like another thing. Like the reason I tend to like an age split is like and not in an enabling like let me take care of you baby type of way.

Call me daddy all the time. I don't mean, you can call me that sometimes. But the reason what I like about it is like it's nice to anticipate a woman's needs and plan things for her accordingly and be able to support her in a way. Not only just like if, you know, on fun dating stuff that you want to do, but for like bigger picture stuff. And I think that it takes a certain level of maturity and after dating, you know, different women and living with different women, I've sort of, you know, I kind of pay attention to how women think and, you know, ways to take care of them that are, you know, it's not just like financially and things like that. Yeah. Especially now. You sound like you're, you have to be empathetic and

emotionally intelligent to like understand animals. And then also just your apartment and has very detail oriented ladies, you can't see it, but I can. And it's hot. I do. I want to know, what is your relationship with anxiety? Oh. And when it up again. So I've had OCD ever since I was a kid and I have there's interesting things. There's OCD and then there's obsessive compulsive personality disorder. The latter sounds more severe but it's not. It means like you know intrusive thoughts. Repetitive thinking, ruminating. That's what I have. Right. Free floating anxiety. I wish I had the other OCD where I like needed to be clean all the time. I mean there's obviously tap things three times. Yeah. Well I had that too but like I

had my my my mom and dad's divorce when I was very young was very confusing for me and and it was like and they were like um things that happened when I was young or I was just like I sort of there's this there's this theory and anybody who experiences trauma will understand is called the angel in a world of devil's theory and this is why when people have extreme experience a lot of abuse they tend to feel shame or they take it on themselves like if a woman's raped a lot of time it makes they feel shame as a result of that. And especially when it's young, right? When there's trauma, what happens is, and this is just the psychology of how the brain

works, and I've read about this a ton, and it's helped me a lot in mitigating things from, you know, small things I have anxiety about to large things I have anxiety about. But it's easier and safer if you're a child who's experienced some sort of abuse to think that you've done something wrong, but the world is still a safe place because the latter is intolerable and it would mean the actual ground your, standing on is broken and you'll fall through it. So the angel in a world, the devil in a world of angels theory is what happens is that's where anxiety disorders tend to come from. If you think that you are inherently bad for some reason, because it's for a child to think that his parents

are wrong or bad would mean that just like a dog, it means like they're not getting thrown a bone, they're not going to eat, they're going to starve, they're going to be abandoned. That's, that's impossible. That means the world you're standing on is not safe. Imperfect. Right. But if you are imperfect and you are fucked up and you are a little broken or you've done something wrong, that's fixable. So that's more of a, that's more of a positive, right? But that creates self-hate. So it creates self-hate. And because it creates self-hate, that forms, that self-hate is often overwhelming, especially for kids. So what do they need to do? They need to distract themselves. So if you have OCD and you need to repeat things 10 times, or you're running around cleaning

or whatever the expressions of that anxiety are, it's a great way for the brain and the body to distract you from feelings that are uncomfortable because they're overwhelming. However, it is the lesser of the two if we're talking about being a devil in a world of angels rather than an angel in a world of devils. So when I was younger and my parents went through their divorce and there was very difficult things that I had to deal with from, you know, relationship with a stepmother that was uncomfortable. I was often scared and I would go to my dad's house on the weekends and I couldn't sleep and he lived here in Manhattan and it was overwhelming this is Manhattan in like the 80s yeah and in order to sort of not feel the uh the confusion and the pain and the frustration of what was

going on at the age that I was not able to process it I started counting things and measuring things with my thumbs and making beeping sounds and you know understand what I'm saying and and the nice thing about you know growing older and and learning about yourself and self-introspection is that comedy is such a wonderful place where it's like I can even though it's still painful something I can look back and laugh at those things because the majority of my act is about you know anxiety and uh OCD as a kid and how that manifests now and it's like you know you'll you'll understand this I don't think there's there's anything more gratifying than when we get up on stage and we talk about something personal and something honest and

something real and a crowd of strangers that you don't know is looking at you and smiling and laughing because they identify with it because you're not really performing to be like hey look at me I'm so great I get all the laughs you're connecting with them yes and the best sets are the ones where even if it's a theater there's this feeling of intimacy that's going on where we're connecting with one another and that's the other time that even though it is about me and the lights on you and the microphones that's the other time and I'm sure you experience this too where I feel the same flow that I do with dogs where time sort of goes away because even though I'm talking about myself I'm just like right now like I'm not paying attention to what I'm saying I'm looking at you right

like I'm connecting with you even though I'm talking about myself like my I'm trying to get you to understand what I'm saying and if there's listeners paying attention it's like we're talking to them so while when we're doing that and we're performing my even though it's you know they have the voice in your head which is the voice of your act where you're going and then also pay attention to the room all just like when you were playing tennis and you're in the middle of a match, like you're so focused in the moment on what you're doing, that time goes away. Yeah.

And whatever problems I have or issues I have, it's like the act of actually talking about the worst things in my life is the thing that in the moment, if something bad is going on in my life, I'm not thinking about it. It's just like, it comes full circle. It's funny because sometimes you know you'll be in the green room and there might be like some people

and you're like trying to impress them, you're feeling weird, and you're just like, I just want to be on fucking stage. Like, I can't navigate this right now. And you feel like almost safe in that moment on stage alone at least telling your truth and being having you fear this weird sense of control just because yeah you're so in the moment yeah and oCD i because i suffer from it too as a form of thinking you can control the future because you feel out of control like i would i would do all these things before

tennis matches and i thought it was just oCD and my therapist was like no because you're trying to control the future think if i do this i'll win when it's like you can't control the future it's it's a if you think about it like ocd and it very specifically is an attempt to find balance yeah what people clean up and things need to be neat and in order why because things feel chaotic and out of order so that's why cleanliness is one of those tapping with patterns making sure to think checking checking checking is bit why do people check if they have body dysmorphic disorder they look in the mirror 10 times or feel parts of their body if they why do they do that because we're you're checking to make sure everything's okay and everything's in place and if you have if people have histories

or even something current that's going on where things feel out of order of out of place we're trying to find balance with that you know and this is interesting like I'm going through a bunch of stuff right now where um and i'll just be honest with you like i i just went through something like romantically that was very painful um and and overwhelming and then um there's also like all these career things that have been that i've been putting off and haven't allowed to flow from me because i get you know i do lots of different things you do i do and i get and i do too many things at the same time which i feel like sometimes i feel like i'm pushing five bowlers up a hill and as a result none of them are moving and so I actually was like wait a second I have to make a

decision to ask for help and allow these things to be put in motion and they just started moving immediately like we're going to be going on tour with funny for fido shooting it doing it as a series probably selling it or so you know like these are big things that have always been like pulling at me to do and I've never known how to integrate the two um in after I had that that TV show so these things started moving and when things are going really good sometimes I get anxious because I'm like wait a second I don't want to fuck things up or I'll suffer from what are all the things people do for avoidance? They're like wait I feel overwhelmed so they procrastinate or I feel overwhelmed so I start running too I start trying to control everything so I there's this thing that

I do and this might be helpful to listeners because you asked me like how I manage anxiety I was pretty much the question I think about there's different aspects of our personality and I think about this thing the healthy twin and it's like Justin adds his best as the adult that he is right now being self-aware, intelligent, having different resources, knowing that he knows a thing or two about a thing or two, what's the mental state that you would need to be in to handle whatever situation you're in? And you can easily identify. Like, what are the strengths that I can lean on because there's the other part of me that's feeling weak or inadequate or inefficient? And you understand? Yeah, that it's not all you. Right. So I tend to write down the

characteristics of like my healthy twin, right? Who's the person you're talking to right now? Because, you know, there's also like a little ranting kid of me that doesn't want to do that, that just wants to have fun, that feels overwhelmed, and things are scary. And I write down the characteristics of this aspect of me that's the person that I want to be. And then I can see that you know you're capable of. You've done it all before. 100%. This is just, this is a form of, this is something that like Nathaniel Brandon talks about

and the six pillars of self-esteem of how to recognize and build self-efficacy, the ability to think and learn, to know what you need to do, to get through the everyday things. in your life and know that you have the confidence and the ability to learn the things that you don't know to succeed in those things as well like I'm butchering it but that's basically what it is like self-esteem is self-efficacy so I write down those characteristics and then I start you can almost like feel an automatically biological shift like I'll calm down I'll stop like running around the apartment I'll feel settled I'll start breathing slower and longer not because I'm even trying to I'm like wait a second I'm reminding myself about aspects of my personality

that are quote unquote good enough and efficient and then I break it down I'm like okay so whether it's getting over somebody after a breakup whether it's a career shift that you want to do a divorce that you have to go through an illness that you have to take care of that you that you're overwhelmed by what the what the first thing to do is like think about anything in your life that could be overwhelming I'm like how would that person handle this specific scenario yeah and then I break it down even further. I'm like, okay, so what are the list of things that I would need to do? What do I actually have to do today? And then I try to, and I'll wake up in the morning and I'll just sort of first try to get myself into a mental shift of where I'm thinking like the person that I,

the aspect of me that I need to be, so that I can go through my day and act as if. And then eventually, whether my mind agrees with me or not, same thing as animals. When I work with them, I was like, when people are like, you know, he's dragging, he won't walk. I'm just, one of you has to make a decision so whether you have to pull or not pull you still have to walk to get across the street because they're scared of 10th avenue i actually did that this morning that's why i'm saying so i'm like one of you has to make a decision and if you move your body the brain will follow and so it's almost like just setting a clear course you know you're basically saying like this is where i need to go this is the this is the highlighted route and just moving your body through it and then i think

if you bring the body the brain will follow and so right now even though there's good things and things that, you know, emotionally were painful for me as a very recently. I'm like, I have to move my life forward. And if I just go on my emotional brain, I'll get overwhelmed or I'll act out or I'll go into depths of sadness and I won't and I'll stay stuck in those things. You have to fake it before you make it. Even like the whole like I have to go on a stupid walk for my stupid mental health, you have to at least fake that you want to go on the walk before you go on the walk. Hannah, I never, the gym is like something that I've maintained this this discipline with yeah and seven out of ten times I don't want to go but I never regretted that I but I know I'm like afterwards it's like you're

going to have that dopamine hit you're going to feel you're going to wake up like I know what's going to happen after so I just drag my body there yeah I also like the good twin bad twin mentality because it really is you disassociating to being like I know I'm not going to take my own advice so what advice would I give to this friend and then because I give such fucking good advice oh my god and then I can't no one can take their own advice but if you really disconnect to be like you need to be your own best friend it's like a form of self-soothing well I always think about it like this and trusting your voice yeah I don't think about it as the bad twin I think about it as the part of me is sort of the adult in his 40s I'm still going to not to say the second who has his

shit together who like has accomplished these things and then there's like the little kid in me that's like still wounded scared set all the things every kid is you know what i mean and in a way if you kind of go and full of the voices that aren't even yours of that were you know parents parents coaches whoever who didn't believe on you bullies yeah like it's it's kind of cool to know that like you like we all we all have to like reparent ourselves and there's so many adults that you know are like everybody's like a baby yeah you realize we're all just little kids we're all just little kids and you see people who are like emotionally shut down they just sort of they stuff things down it's like they've in a way that they they they may get a bunch of shit accomplished but they're suffering you know the you know the

average man suffers what is it that thing uh in quiet desperation mm-hmm joe rogman talk about he's like wait the majority of men live lives suffering quiet desperation meaning like you know without the emotional intelligence to know like wait a second there's these are not things i need to stuff down for the fear of facing that does has a joke that like men fart how women, or women fart how men cry in private. Oh, yeah? So it's like men are upset. They're just not showing it.

And I actually wanted to ask you, because you are like quite a masculine looking dude. You definitely sound like you could beat up a couple of people on the street and you could hold drone in a bar fight, you know what I mean? And you probably can because you were a boxer. But anyway, what do you, how do you associate with like other dudes and talking about anxiety and was it hard for you to realize that you're a guy dealing with anxiety because you're you weren't of the gen z time where you no no no no no how do you feel right right no i you know

it's interesting it's like um because of my related like i was raised by women i love that so i was and i was very raised by very strong women my grandmother was like a holocaust survivor my mom grew up dirt poor and like worked her ass off and like made herself very very successful wow um At a very young age, I have two sisters that I adore. I also have my brothers on my dad's side, but I was always sort of like looking for a father figure and like older dudes. And the interesting thing is that I think that the relationships I have with, and I have tons of guy friends, the relationships I went to this there, I went to this boarding school, which was like instead of going to juvie because I was like, you know, I was acting out a lot as a kid. Yeah, but it's like, you know, we kind of had, you know, I had a codependent mother that was able to like kind of rescue this situation. a little bit and, you know, so I didn't have to go there. And so I went to this boarding school

where they, it was kind of self-helpy. And as a result of that, the friendships I formed there from the time I was 15, I still maintain those friendships to this day. And I've always just like, we always kind of thought in this way where we learned how to like express our feelings. And the cool thing is that, you know, the dudes I hang out with are dudes, dudes, dudes, dudes, you know, Big Jay and Dan and like, these are like, they're masculine men and Lewis. and my friend Jesse, but it's like in quiet moments or when we're all hanging out, like, we're all really sensitive. And dudes are like that.

And I think guys, in a way, not in like the male feminist version of let me show this woman how sensitive I am so that, you know, there's like that fake version of shit. Yeah, so they can get laid. Like really strong, the really strong masculine men I know are very, very in touch with their own feelings. And, you know, Big J is like a mentor to me in terms of comedically, but one of the things that makes him such a powerful force in my life and such a force on stage is his vulnerability. And I think that there's such strength in vulnerability and there's strength in being like, hey, I'm scared of this thing. I'm overwhelmed. Like I'm feeling these emotions. Like I used to suffer from this thing where I was like, women want this sort of neanderthal man who can beat everybody up. And it's like, that's not really accurate at all. It's like there's strength.

and vulnerability. I don't mean becoming like a spineless jellyfish. Like I, you know, I, like, I have self-assertiveness. Like, I know how to accomplish things and get things done. Like, if I'm walking with a woman and someone like disrespects or like, they're going to lose a tooth. You know what I mean? But at the same time, I think it's like men are as vulnerable as women are. Yeah. I mean, they may not be outwardly, but men, like, we feel all the same shit that women feel. And what people don't realize, it's like, no one gives a shit about how men are doing. Like, Chris Rock has this joke about it. You know what I mean? Like, no one gives a shit about how men are doing. And this is what's great

This is what's great about This is what's great about being raised by very strong women And never having seen women in this I've never seen women as weak Like to me whatever To whatever version of feminism That people are like waving a flag at That they think people didn't see

I'm like I've always This is the plate that my life was served on Like I was raised by a very strong independent woman And like my mother was my mother and my father You never questioned that your mom should have equal opportunity As a guy No my mom owned her company My mom owned the company

mom was the mom and the dad yeah my mom owned a company with like 150 employee was hers wow right so because my my sort of perspective on women was always that they're strong competent independent human beings i've i i i sort of realize that like this idea of like this sort of quote unquote toxic male was never really like that just wasn't going to work for me yeah and i was like wait you just have to embrace your you have to like embrace your sensitivities and you also have to have to embrace your masculinity and those two things can you know they can coexist at the same time you nailed it which in turn is like that's sort of what I try to do on stage I used to have this very cocky act like my not my personality is very cocky yeah but I used to have this very cocky act

which was in a way sort of like trying to masquerade or hide the fact that I had these like issues and problems and vulnerabilities like ever sure and then the thing that made that act what I think is really good and that I love doing is like no now it sort of embraces those things and it's not at the expense of being like, well, you know, you know, I'm still cocky at the same time while I'm talking about vulnerable stuff and my OCD and like my problems and my issues. Yeah, it's attractive when someone is like, yeah, this is me. Yeah. And I'm not afraid to talk about it.

Yeah, owning yourself. Owning yourself. And I also think with Big Jay owning his stuff, you don't know that other guys are experiencing the same insecurities and fears unless you speak out about it. No, dude. So many dudes. All the toughest guys I know. know right and we know i know dante like tub like dude scary men i've cried with these dudes yeah you know

what i mean and it's like these are like you know dudes are sensitive like guys are sensitive and i also think what you said not acting like the generic strong dude that you think women want because women want what makes you unique it's same like women like i could just act like i want to be just like hot and likable and chill and cool where it's like no a guy's gonna fall for you for what makes you different that X weird shit about you it's let me tell you something with every woman that I've ever fallen in love with it's always the things that about themselves like it's these little things about them that they think are unattractive that I find that I find the most endearing because it's like oh wait this gives me permission to be human too I'm like you know what I'm saying

I love that yeah and like and also like a lot of times because because I'm trying to keep from jumping all over you. I'm getting him excited because I love to get dogs pumped up and be like a lot of times and you'll get, I'm sure you'll get this too because you were just on a TV show and like people seeing you from the things that you do out in the world can they can have like a false perspective of who and what you are. You know what I mean? And if like from, you know, from the high fidelity role I had, it's like, you know what I mean?

They can sort of see you as something that you're not. And I always get a little bit weary when, you know, your DMs light up like crazy. so to mind and like when women or in certain men come at me in that area i'm like i always want to just be as exposing and honest as as possible for the beginning and be like just i'm i'm very very human here and very flawed and like john really forget that there's a human behind the character and they can they can even you as a stand-up like you're yeah they can take you at face they can take you at face value as opposed to realize they like they have you know it's the process of getting to know somebody is really nice and it's like the sooner you can get the sooner you can cut to

the chase the better I think like they're gonna if you fall in love with somebody they're going to they're going to see all your holes anyway if someone's going to meet you for the first time would you rather than watching you training a dog or watching you on stage um I don't know they're I mean if they you know if they make it to date too they're going to see the other one in 24 hours so what's the difference because some comics are very like I don't want people to see me on stage like that's no I kind of like you kind of like in that area it is really like what you see is what you get here yeah yeah like i talk about all that like what you see is what you get here so i kind of like that before we play our final game i just want to know you mentioned that you quit comedy at one point

yeah why and where was your headspace at that time i had just dogs in the city the cbs show had just premiered and we were waiting for a season two and it was very difficult to do both at the same time i was like which direction is my life going in yeah and i moved out to l.a because i just had it with new york and i still feel that way today actually and like new york just drives me crazy but even though you're the most new york person i'm the most new york person so that's why i have to stay here because i acting wise i work so much more here but the um i was sort of in this holding pattern where we were waiting for another network to pick this show up it's just this is pre like instagram being able to put videos on it was like 15 second little things like there

was the power of social media was not where it was youtube was not like this you know youtube was like jenny marbles was just like the first one you're like who wait this is a viable space to actually make content. So I was, so I was, I had just come off the show and I moved out to L.A. And I was like, the dog stuff was something that was becoming very, very viable. But I was not able to really take control of it myself. I was still sort of relying on networks and, you know, powers that be. Powers that be.

And so because of that, it was taking a lot of my attention. And I wasn't really able to give my attention to performing. And, and what I realized is after being there and sort of staying in this holding, I was like, wait a second, I really miss the things that I have control over that I love doing. And so I came back to New York, and I was like, I'm just going to, and it had been four years of living out there and like the LA comedy scene is not the New York comedy scene. And I was basically like, you know what? I'll figure out a way to do this dog stuff in a smaller way, but I miss acting.

I miss doing standup and then I move back here. And I was just like, all right, I'm going to start over again. And the nice thing is like, it just started to move and start to shift. Yeah. And this week is like the time with the moment where. where I was like, wait, let me open up, let me just open up the door again to the way the dog stuff works in with comedy and performing.

And I was like, you know, my partner and director and producer, we're going, the tour that we've been wanting to do, funny for Fido, we're gonna do this city to city, I'll host it, we'll put some of the best comics on there and we'll do rescue shelter stories interspersed with the comics that we're putting on because that's where the money's going. And I was like, I've just always been trying

to keep these two worlds separate. And I've never known how to let them coexist together And it's kind of like the thing that I started doing, which is the way to actually do it, which is through my stand-up comedy charity thing. And also, I think you were originally casted because you're not only a good dog trainer, but you're charismatic and entertaining and funny

and people want to watch you. I think. But I also think what's interesting about you is it was hard what you're trying to do because it hasn't been done before, really. But you have to kind of take that to be like, okay, then I have to fucking create it. The truth is like, one of the things

is like there's no mentor for this specific thing. And, like, you know, there's been, I had, I had the highest produced dog training show ever, right? It was on CBS at prime time. And it all happened because I was like, come to work, watch me work this with dogs, and then I'll sell you in the room, which I did. And then I wrote books for it. And I was like, okay, but I also do stand up and say fuck all the time. Like, how do you, like, I don't know how to, and the only thing I could think of was, like, comic relief with like Whoopi Goldberg. And I was like, how do I do this?

And as a result, like, one kept pulling me away from the other, but I was like, wait a second, I've had this charity event that I've done for years. all these like highly successful people from the entertainment in the street are like are counting everything is done for free because people want to be able to lend their talents to something that is animal involved and that it feels people want to do philanthropic things yeah and even this week i was like wait a second i got to stop pushing these two things away because they want to merge yeah and so it's like yeah no one really has done that and i think for people listening like just because people haven't done something before does not mean that it can't be done. No, but you have to ask for help and allow other people who have a vision and believe

in you as the same time to like do their job and not control everything, which is something I'm learning to do. I'm learning how to like let go a control and allow people to like help me do this thing and be like, I work better on a team. And one of the thing that's always kept me from doing this is I've always felt so alone in it. And then I was like, well, you know, Justin, you're actually not alone if you allow these other talented people who want to be a part of this project, do their job and you take your hands off. Yeah. But one of the things is like, the reason I love being on set is because you're you're one of the screws in a big machine. The reason I loved my first dog training show and I didn't like doing it on YouTube, even though I think the YouTube

videos were better, was the fact that like there was a crew there and I was just like, my job is compartmentalized and I was suffering from taking on too much and you know as a comic where the writer, the actor, the director, we're doing that all. Marketer, the salesman. Right. So now give yourself another career that's equally as difficult and you're on your own without I was like I just started to like I get panicky and like who could do that and so one of the biggest lessons I've learned is like and honestly like over like years and like specifically this week is like you have to ask for help and allow other people to do things with you yeah so that you could because I can't do I hate being alone if you're gonna like actually dream big you have to

delegate like if you want things to grow but yeah bigger than yourself you need more people than yourself and I'm a control freak too especially creatively yeah and I've learned that you You just have to try, and the right people, like, you just will find naturally as long as you, but you first have to open that door to people. Yeah, and you, yeah, like, yeah, that was exactly what happened. I was like, I wrote this manager, a very personal letter. I said, let me explain to you why I'm very overwhelmed right now, and I need somebody to help me guide this career.

Here's all the different points. Here's the point. And they were like, they're like, wow, there's, you have a lot of shit to do and a lot of stuff that you've done. Let me help you manage this. And I was like, thank you. I do think also like accepting the stuff that you're not good at is so freeing just to be like like I realize I'm so bad at admin like even just booking a flight. Like I will fuck that shit up so easy. And then how about the things that you don't want to do? The things you procrastination like listen I have I get I get so many emails from like you know from my dog one from like I'm like there's things that like I'm not good at admin either and I don't like making my making a schedule returning tax like I live on do not disturb and it's like I've never been good at like like small little menial tasks.

I've never been good at that. And so I've always like hired assistance to do that kind of thing. But it's like it's so much easier. Like everything's coming in on your phone at the same time. So it's like I'm always so scattered with that shit. I'm like these are the things I don't want to do. Yeah.

And it doesn't make you like not successful. It means you can't put your focus towards that. I had a good entrepreneurial advice where someone was like, for example, let's say you have to return clothes. And you know you're going to procrastinate it to adding stress. You're not going to do it. You don't even know how to fucking get a box. For me, it's Amazon, but yes.

But yeah, like, listen. say something they say okay what is the price that like you're willing to pay because sometimes to have this done for you exactly that what is your three hours worth that it could take you to return this if it's $100 fucking pay the $100 and that was really enlightening to me to be like oh you don't have to conquer everything you actually can like it's part of self-love too to be like I'm a healthier person if I give stuff to other people yeah 100% I just I have to do that with like a few of the projects that I'm working on right now where it's like I need a production team to do these because I don't want to do them. Yeah. I don't and then I procrastinate doing them because they

annoy me and the reason they annoy me is because you know the project is fucked. Yeah and like if you're busy doing all these like tiny little things you can get to the big stuff like you got to get up in the helicopter and see big picture with shit. Exactly. And that was the thing that was keeping me from moving these projects forward. I was just like sitting there on like an aunt on the ground like doing all the little stuff and I'm like no I have to be in the fucking tower. Especially if you have ADHD like me next thing you know your friend texts you next thing you know you need to get you want some food next thing you know you see something on Instagram you're watching a goat video for 10 hours goat video oh my god I love the goat video yeah yeah yeah what's that one's name

fuck I mean I follow so many of them I'm obsessed with them um Justin you're very comfortable in hell you that we could talk for hours on so many different things are so interesting ladies I'll do this again slide into the DMs we're not done oh don't fucking go anywhere it's time to play the seven deadly sins oh shit Okay, what are you greedy about? What am, um, what in my attention? Getting dogs to sit. Now, attention, yeah.

Yep. When did you accept that you wanted the limelight? Uh, tomorrow. What are you, who are you envious of? I'm envious of my, I'm envious. It's kind of envious, but I don't like hate them for it. I'm envious of my friends who their card kind of got picked a little earlier. Yeah.

And they have a lot more wind at their back. Because I think that's like, you know, for all of us, it's like the way we're all, like you have to be good enough to be in the casino sitting at the table, playing a hand to begin with. But then it's just law of averages and luck. Yeah. And when I've had really great luck in my life, like with shows and things like that that have popped off from me, I've felt like, oh, the lane is clear for me to do

the things I want to do and there's no traffic. So I get envious to the people where there's see feels like there's less traffic and I feel in every way like career wise relationship wise like I'm I'd love to be like I think they're starting to but I'd love to be like moving a little bit smoother and faster further along you know and like a chick on my arm to like be kind of sailing into it with. So envious is like a weird way to put it but I was just like when I see that I'm like that's what I want. But it's funny you say the word like I see and I think about how back then, like you were, your brain was never meant to be seeing so many people's lives at one time. Yeah, no, social media is dangerous. It's, it's like I, I've done an entire

podcast episodes on this where it's like the compare and despair thing. And that's something like, my OCD falls into that. And then you can sit there and you could be paralyzed by feeling like incredibly scattered, looking at what other people have, feeling you're too far behind to get there. So that's why I'm saying, like, I feel like all these things that are moving from me right now. So it's important to like keep my eyes on my feet. But if you asked me to, like, lift them up a little bit, you asked who I'm envious about. I'm like, oh, there's the dude who's just like, their number got called a little earlier. Yeah.

That's a nice place to be. I mean, you know the momentum. Like, how great was the momentum of being on that show? And now, like, now there's gas in the tank for this thing that you're doing now. Yeah. Like, you know what I'm saying? And then there's also the sense of me trying to get control where, like, something bad will happen, where a lot of people are talking about it or people are talking shit.

And you want to look at it on social media because you want to see the car crash, how bad it is. But then you also just have to be like, no, I don't need that. I don't need that distraction. Ari helped me with something. We were on the road and he put an app limiter on my phone and didn't tell me the code. My mom knows it. So it's like after an hour, that thing, I can't look at social media, which is great because I can get really trapped in that.

I don't really, it's not so much even looking at other people's stuff. It's more like how my stuff is, like always taking my own temperature. Yeah. And that it completely is your value. Also, Mike Feeney told me something that was pretty wise and a, funny metaphor he was like we're all like popcorn and we're popping at different times dude this is just nature can i tell you something i swear on my fucking dog's life you say that that visual image is exactly the way that i've expressed it before yeah i've never heard that from anybody else

it's fucking it's genius because it's like we're all the same temperature we're dealing with and nature pops things at different times there's a great book called um the drunkards walk how randomness rules our lives. And it's written by Leonard Modlano, who is a mathematician and also a screenwriter. He wrote McGuiver. He's like, and he explains the laws of averages and how even in things where you think statistically, they follow a certain format like sports. He shows how the laws of average in every single career, every relationship path, how these things are really the number one fact. It's like right time, right place, like that, how strong that is in our lives. And the dangers of being like, wait a second, what am I not doing to get what? And it's got, it's nothing

to do with that at all. And it's like, the whole book is a little too mathy. But the first few chapters, he goes through all these different careers from actors to studio executives, to sports figures, to financial advisors, to be, and he's like, let me show you how what happened is the laws of averages is called their number. And the way people misconstrue it, because our brain is sort of like looking to assign value is that you think, like, know that person did something special. Not to say that we don't all have special talents, special things, and that hard work doesn't pay off. But yes, that's the price of admission to get into the casino,

to be sitting down so that the number lands on black. You know what I'm saying? Yes. And people undervalue how much luck and randomness is like, you know what I mean? I also think there's a different between like wanting to be a stand-up versus like believing in your heart that you are a stand-up. I think about like why like Rihanna was so successful. like she really believed that's how she got to the table yes but like you have to have that

belief but then there's the average but that's also how you have to stay at the table the hard thing is to be like you know how long like if you're like oh what i'm doing isn't working what i'm doing is or like how many people do you know like joe pesci's a perfect example like he'd quit acting he was like i'm not good it's like no your number just wasn't like that that colonel had not popped you but also like you with dog training you don't question am i am i good enough but you are a dog trainer and that's just you where there's a lot of you where there's a lot of people who didn't make a dog training because they didn't have that same like purpose that you have you know but the thing and this is true like you know the the the one thing

that I I don't have like a lack of self-belief if anything I get frustrated with the other and listen an accurate self-appraisal is the most important thing in any career but specifically one where you're like acting in comedy like people who think they're better than they are or think they're worse than they are don't have an accurate appraisal of who and what they are I know there's people that are better me I know that I'm better than other people I know kind of where I fit. I know where my room for progress is. Like, I see these things pretty clearly. And I don't have a lack in belief in my ability in any way. I don't. Like, there's, I don't think I'm not good at this thing. I don't think I don't belong there. Like, I think I do. But

sometimes you get just frustrated looking at your watch, which is when, like, you know, you have to be grateful for what you have. And, you know, I sit there on that chair. And I'm like, wait, this is a beautiful apartment. I have this dog. And I'm healthy. And I'm like, you know, I still look really young. And my body is fit. And like, my mother's alive. And like, you know, there's money in my bank account. And there's. And there's, food in my refrigerator and I could have been in that tsunami or died from like that's where gratitude really comes and they say you can't feel anxiety and gratitude at the same time yeah which is powerful I also just saw a TikTok which is where I get all my information about this guy talking

about the concept of time and how like you feel like there's a like where you want to be in your future and he's like instead of you thinking that you're riding time like times riding you if that makes sense so you're always going to be in the present moment so you're like it's like being breathed in a way like you're not breathing you're being breathed exactly so it's like instead of you being like oh i can't time like my future is already set out and i'm just waiting it's like no no no no you're yeah and they say it has been proven like if you're just taking each moment as good as you can then like you step back and you look over the last five years and you're like holy fuck this was what i want that's exactly what happened to me like i was just like wait a second

all the thing the reason i came back to new york i was like wait a second the things that I was like I wanted to start acting on TV again I started acting on TV again I wanted to start shooting short films again with like friends I started doing that I wanted to start performing and headlining like I like I started performing

and headlining and I have like that's now I want like I was like wait a second these are the things that four years ago when I first came back I was like this is what I said I wanted but the interest that that finish line is always moving

yeah it's always moving it's like we're chasing a carrot because you're always in the present right and if I think about like oh if I got this I you envisioned this like different version of you even like when bad shit happens to me like I had some bad shit I went through and I'm like I wasn't happier before I'm still me right once you understand that then you start seeing the value of like event in your future differently sweet let me tell you something

that whole like everywhere you go there you are yeah it is so true I was I remember when I was like when I was moved to LA I was like oh my god if I just had a house here and like a beautiful woman that I was in love with and like I had like like dogs all around me and I was like and then when I had that I was like I was still right there yes it's like objects in the mirror are further than they closer than they appear you know so like whenever you get there when things start to when the blur from the distance goes away and it actually comes into the four you're like wait a second in the course of a day I still had the same anxieties that I would have had moments of joy I would have like you think that things are going to and if you suddenly do think

you're the shit you're you're probably becoming an asshole yeah there's something like If you suddenly think people think differently about you and you think you're a different kind of person, like then you're kind of going through a phase of just ego. Yeah, and then that's going to fade anyway. Exactly, which is a high. Ooh. Everything that goes up goes down.

All right. What do you gluttonous about? What do you overindulgin? What am I gluttonous about? What do I overindulgin? Well, I want, what do I overindulgent? I can get lost in a substance or two. Oh, what's your goal to?

I can party a little hard. Different ones, but like, I can like, after i can get a little bit like uh after the shows when i'm trying to come down yeah that one drink can come to two to turn to the three but i'm like you know but that's like you know i can get i can get i can't i can't get i can't get i can't get i can't i can't get i can't i can't i can't i can't i love people who smoke weed a lot of my friends do i think it's so cool and i wish i was that laid back but i'm just not i ruin every party but i have positives on that too like I get like I'm gluttonous about, I don't know if gluttony is the word, but I also like, you know, I can't work. I can't exercise enough. Yeah. Like I'm like, wait a second. Can I walk there always take the stairs? Do they like into my mind? I have this. Do you have fear being fat? Are you fatphobic? No. Justin? No, I'm not fat phobic. I'm not fat. No, no. I always like I just like, I have. As I'm walking down the streets of New York, I'm like, I think of myself as this machine that always needs to be being built. Like I can like I can work out until forever. But it also brings you joy to know that you're like doing good for your body. You're. You're. You're like doing good for your body. You're. You're. You're. You're.

eating your body like a machine that I'm also glutt this is true I'm I'm I'm I'm glutness uh I'm gluttonous uh I'm glutness on the like affection and romantic tip mm yeah once that switch goes on I'm like I can't get enough yeah yeah yeah I love that but I'm but I'm not but I'm not but I'm not a whore yeah you're not one at a time and you're not love bombing you're just showing no I'm not like if no I don't I don't I don't do that although I do love very deeply and very passionately. Have you ever heard issues where um people think you love your mom more than them? No my mother drives me crazy. No I don't know I have like strong boundaries with that woman. You mentioned her multiple times as pod so I wanted to just for the listeners. No no no no I'm like a mama's boy

I have very like no my no not at all you separate the two yeah my I can't spend 10 minutes with her in a room like our phone conversations are like three shouting sentences back and forth and then one of us hangs up I mean, I'm not... That's healthy, that's healthy. When was the last time you experienced extreme wrath or anger? Let me say this. I mean, honestly,

every time I walk out onto the streets in New York City, I think this play... You don't realize how much of a dump this town is until you adopt a dog in L.A. And then bring it to New York. And I'm like, yanking him this way that way there's like garbage like i live this is rated one of the most

beautiful blocks in new york city like every year by the new york times and i walk outside and i'm like this fucking filthy shit hole and people walking outside like i get so angry like dude i'll be on the phone like i was reading a joke about this i was on my i was on the phone with like a friend of mine in and he's like is it 9-11 every day there like why is it's like i'm like shut the fuck up like just normal peddle like i get i get like angry this is something i've had to make i have to like learn how to make peace with yeah like i i love i fucking hate this city and you're like so just didn't leave i'm like no i'm being a brat because it's like everything i do is basically here but i'm like and the energy is unlike anything else it drives me fucking crazy we're we're in the lower east side and we're

right by like a turn into a bridge and of course all the assholes want to cut the line so from like five to seven is straight honking and des loses his mind like he's like why are we like i think he wants to go down and literally start yelling at people we're right by the turn so everyone's fighting you hear people cursing each other out all the time and this is just the chaotic energy that is the city yeah the k let me tell you living in manhattan has warned me to a fucking nub like i'm just i'm telling you like probably in the spring i'll be like renting this place out and moving new and out of borough i think jurs i like it in jersey i like it in hobeok and in jersey city because like it's beautiful it's beautiful it's clean it's open like i grew up in brooklyn and i really even though people think

it's all the same sometimes I'm such an out of borough person we're like I like hearing the birds yeah I'm not saying I'm trying to go to the country but like I like hearing the birds that's why I like dude we have I have blue jays out here there's robins there's like there's like there's fucking owls here yeah that's why I like that we have the garden in the back but like I get overwhelmed by that and then someone did something like as recently that was like very personally like offensive to me and I was just like you know I'm not going to get into details of that but I was just like I was in a fucking raging thing fit so yeah wait are you 100% Jewish yeah yeah I guess so yeah I'm almost on but you could get

casted for an Italian you think yeah because I was saying that's Sicilian behavior you're you're speaking of yeah but you know Jews is just the smarter version honestly true they're not his knucklehead here when was the last well you have the cockiness of an Italian I really do when was the last time you were a sloth so a lazy piece of shit didn't go the gym didn't do anything holy shit dude the momentum like i that was one of the depressions of quarantine i was like people i had all these like workout stuff in the house and i wasn't doing it and i lost like eight pounds of muscle which on my frame is a lot and i was just like i was like i didn't i would wake like i didn't look at a clock i didn't know what time it was i was like it doesn't really matter i was just like

eating whatever the fuck and i was like the momentum of like going to the gym had died and i was like and i didn't get and i never got comfortable in it i was just like like I felt so slothful and lazy that's why I think with depression like you're fighting it all the time but doing nothing so it's exhausting and here's another one I was like I was I got the second co I got COVID again and like I had a quarantine here for like five days and it was right in the time when you know like right when the holidays are going to start everything dies down in our business the fucking way I start spinning out because there's not enough to do yeah like that time of year always drives me crazy then they had COVID and the weather was bad and I was like just in this apartment I was like you're stuck with your thoughts are you a coffee guy but not a big coffee guy like two cuffs a day yeah but both in the morning yeah yeah I just like I'm like an engine that runs hot

like I need a lot of shit to do yeah and if those things are attended to then I relax yeah if there's a lot of balls in the air that I'm juggling I can't like settle down until like those things are sort of like they're tended to properly I'm the same I don't give the fuck when was last time you let your pride or your ego get in the way of something today the speed that you answered that today. I mean, it's always checking it. It's like, it's always. Like, I've, it's like,

dude, moment to moment I have to do that. Like, in a big way, um, where like I've self-sabotized. Oh, yeah. Here's like, in career wise, like a big way where I self-sabotage is like, I get frustrated, um, like dog-wise things. Like, to me, I'm like, how do, like, why don't you just know how to do this? Like, I have a million clients, like, I have a million clients all the time. They're like, how do I do this? And I get like very frustrated where I'm like, I get short with them and snappy because to me it just feels like common and and by the way every great dog trainer I know we all have this very low frustration tolerance and frustration with clients we all do with the humans with the humans because to us things that seem obvious it's like you're just like how are you still come on man yeah so I I forget that I'm like Justin that's your ego and like someone's asking you for help and something and you're fortunate to be like an expert in this position and you're it's like you need to like be gentler and con and I always always end up apologizing after a first session and I'm like I am so sorry and then I end up being like very generous and giving them like for and like they always stick around because I'm

a sweetheart but I'm like dude your fucking ego about the fact that other people should know this thing that like you've just managed to cultivate over the course of 20 years and come on dude and I'm like you're being a fucking prick right now you're being a prick well yeah I know that des was learning about stuff and there's like a way to do things and when you don't do it right It is frustrating because it, like, moves the process backwards. And he would, like, yell at his brother, like, to do something and the brother wouldn't do it. And I'd be like, why? Like, this is difficult.

You're dealing with a live animal here. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That, yeah, and then, yeah, and then I do that in relationships, too. But I always apologize. Like, I always, like, I get sensitive and I have a sensitive ego. And if, like, if I get rubbed the wrong way, I peacock and I puffed my chest out. And then I'm like, da, de, deb, and then I'm always just like, I feel like an asshole. But I'll always own up to it.

This is 40s behavior. Guys in their 20s. Or it's still peacocking. And then by the 40s, they're like, yeah, I do that. Yeah, we do that and then we apologize. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Forties are dope. When was the last time you lusted over someone?

Ooh. Within the past 24 hours. Where, do you have like a celebrity crush or like? Celebrity crush? Yeah. It was always Catherine Zeta Jones was my celebrity crush. Oh, nice. No, I don't, like, not specifically right now.

She likes an older man too. Oh, nice. But older than you. Well, she's older than me. Yeah, but she's with, I'm just, I'm just, oh yeah, she likes to go up. She likes to go up, yeah. Yeah, you might, but he's gonna die soon, so.

Catherine, my, you know that joke I have how my mom wants me to date Charlize Theron? No. Oh, I'll send it to you so you go about, like, my mom's like, she wants, she's like, she's like, she's convinced you were put on this earth for Charlize. She just thinks we're right for each other. And I'm like, she's like, she's like, you got to get, she's like, you know, Charlize still, she'll send me articles.

And I'm like, I have like, I do like five minutes on it. That's amazing. I'll spend it to you. Okay, to wrap this up. Yeah. Final question. Yeah.

What advice would you give to people on how to cope with your hell when you're going through it, your darkest times? What do you do? There's nothing better than your family of choice rather than sometimes it's your family of origin, but the fucking people in my life are unbelievable. And the amount of times that I've just called people like when I'm in the death, of something I've been like dude I need you that takes balls it's it's there's because I'm always like they don't give up they know no and that's what I mean like there's I have

incredible relationships with people I do I have great friends I've like and they've the people I love the people in my life and I've been there for them and they're there for me and it's like they know if from being so open and honest with them all the time they know me in and out and they're always like you know sometimes you know the right thing to do a certain situation, but it's painful or scary or hard. Yeah. And so you, first of all, need that reaffirmed, like, no, this is the right thing that you do. But you also need, like, especially in comedy, where I always imagine, it's like, we're like a pack

of buffalo that are all running together. Yeah. And sometimes you can feel like you stray out and you get a little bit lost on the planes. Like, you need those, you need those other ones to run around and kind of hurt you back in. Yeah. But, like, it's, yeah. And you have to kind of admit, like, I'm not okay and I need to speak out. I have no problem doing that.

I have no problem saying, like, hey, like, I'm a little unwell. You know what I mean? Like that Rob Thomas song, like, yeah, I believe that everybody, yeah, well, he's a buddy in mine. I have a great story with me and Rob. Yeah, me too. That's my favorite from him. But, like, you know, everybody's got their shit. Yeah.

You know? Yeah. You don't have to dwell on it. You know, like, this is a touchy-feely podcast, so it sounds like, you know, I don't walk around 24-7 thinking like this, but it's like, I've opened up with you. Like, how, how bonded are you when I, like, I could call you. I can call you now. Forever.

I mean, me and Brutus are another level of bonded, but, Justin, this has been incredible. I knew it was. We could keep talking forever, but it's been 120, something to let people go. Where can people follow you, listen to you, watch you, give me all the goods. Okay, so here's a lot now. So it's at I am Justin Silver from my comedy on TikTok and Instagram and all those. I am Justin Silver.com is my website. I have road dates coming up.

Myself and Natalie Cuomo have anxiety attack that is on February 3rd at the stand. And then I am headlining five shows at Comedy Connection, Rhode Island on Super Bowl slash Valentine's Day weekend. So it's the 11th, 12th. On the 13th, I'm going to be there, but not doing anything. And then we have the Monday show on the 14th. All my dog stuff is at the language of dogs. The website is the language of dogs.

I have a YouTube channel for that. I put a lot of shit on social media. So good, you guys. Yeah. And then interestingly enough, I just dropped two podcasts. And we're starting the language of dogs podcast again, where we have different, you know, you'll be on there. We'll have, we have guests on there. I answer people's questions.

There's a Patreon page for that. So people can get answers to all their dog dilemmas du jour. And there's funny aspects to it. There's a philanthropic aspect to it. And then funny for Fido, which is attached to that, people can donate year round. We give the money to the animals that need it the most. I vet them out personally. So people are like, I just want to make sure this money's going to the right place.

I make sure that we do it. that social media is funny for Fido and then we're actually right we're starting to plan this tour and shoot this as a series that I think we're going to sell. So exciting. Yeah, it's cool.

Also, we love Natalie Cuomo on this pod. We just had her on. Finally, any words about Pipples just that people should know if they're thinking of adopting? Yeah, they're just like every other dog. So the idea is like when people go like,

oh, I actually knew a Pippel that was like really friendly. I know this, like all dogs, like, the whole like breed stigma is ridiculous. They're, some of them are as aggressive. I train as many golden retrievers for aggression as I do pit bulls, right? There's just the most of them in New York City and L.A., so that's why there's like the numbers are higher.

It's just because of how many of them there are. But they are, they just, you know, they're just big, strong dogs. And just like any strong, big strong dog, they need discipline, boundaries, affection, and you have to know what you're doing with them. No different than if you had a big, strong golden retriever. But, but, and if people need adoption advice, like I do this all the time like they can always just on the patreon page you're like hey i just don't thinking about adopting can you give me some guidance and i'll do everything from vetting out the different rescue shelters

in there in whatever town they're in to giving them advice on that and i'm sort of helping them coaching them even through the first 24 hours of what to do and then i offer like you know i have i do virtual training all the time with people and i train people in australia wow so thanks so much guys for listening to burning in hell today and we'll talk later bye peace Ha ha.