Berner Phone - Rotimi Paul: The First Purge & Privilege

Episode Date: June 10, 2020

Luke introduced Hannah to Rotimi a couple months ago. He discusses growing up in Guyana and Antigua, the culture shift in America, playing Skeletor in The First Purge, why he decided to become an actor, how he met Luke at Abercrombie and Fitch, the Black Lives Matter movement, and how to find your creative tribe.Sign up for your trial today at noom.com/BERNStart your Beach Body On Demand free trial membership when you text HANNAH to 303030Download Best Fiends FREE on the Apple App Store or Google Play!Enjoy your first week of EveryPlate meals for only $3.99 per meal by going to EveryPlate.com and using code bern1--- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/berninginhell/support Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to Burning Hell. What's up, you guys? Welcome to the scary depths of hell. We had a week off last week. We wanted to amplify some other voices, but we're back this week, okay? I am with a very special person, actor, producer, and writer, Rottimi Paul. What's up? How you doing? I'm doing very well. Thank you for asking. The way people might know you is you were actually Skeletor in the movie The First Purge, which we'll get into. And you're also one of Luke's Gilbranson's, Gilbronson, whatever, however he says his name.

It's not Porty, beautiful man. one of his longtime friends who introduced us and then I was like scouring the internet for more info on you and I found your Instagram and he's a very handsome man everyone so check him out for your own enjoyment and it says Esselin's son trying to leave things better than I found it

is your bio Eslin yeah Eslin is my mom's name and I feel like that's kind of my place in the world uh as in the son if i can just do that right i think i'm i'm doing all right so what i feel i'm going to cry that's yeah i mean that's that's my motivation um why is your mom so amazing um i think my mom's amazing to me just because of you know we didn't have the most amount of time together my mom passed you know when i was younger And she's the reason that we came to New York from the Caribbean.

So I feel like my life would have been on a different trajectory had I stayed in the Caribbean. But she poured all the love that she had into me. And I remember the conversations that she had with me, you know, up until the moment where she passed. And those were all conversations to help me be the best version. of myself, the best man I could be, even though at the time I was a boy. So I think now, you know, as an adult, all you want to do is like make her right. You know, I think like that's the motivation. It's like, I need to know that her sacrifices were worth it. So that's kind of where that comes. But she's a, she's still a figure in my life. You know, she's an amazing

lady. It sounds like she's really living on through you because it's it's what you're remembering of her and what you represent from her and what she's created. Definitely. I think she, you know, like any mom, she wants what's best for her kid, right? So the things that she did, you know, you kind of, or at least I hold on to and I kind of, we play those things in my head. I'm like, am I on the right track, my on the right trajectory? I still kind of, you kind of, or at least I, I hold on. I to use that as guidance. In addition to her sister who helped raise me after she passed, my and Bridget Ann, I kind of have her in my ear as well, but I can also just pick up the phone and talk to my aunt, whereas with my mom, it's more of like a feeling of guidance of like,

maybe you want to make this right here, get off at this exit. You just kind of feel it instinctually. I think that's where she kind of plays it. It sounds like she's a part of your conscience. Definitely. Yeah. Where in the Caribbean did you grow up? I grew up in Guyana, which is in South America. So I was in Guyana first, which is where my dad still lives, and then I came to Antigua, which is a small island in the West Indies. Some people go for vacation, but our claim to fame is 365 beaches,

one for every day of the year. So between my early years in Guyana, which is in Lyndon, Ghana, if anyone knows, Guyana, and then Antigua, where I lived in Upper Gambles on Fort Road between those two places, I feel like a lot of my early childhood memories are all there. Why did you leave Guyana? My mom, just opportunity. My mom's side of the family is the Antiguan side.

So she was going to be closer to family. Some of her sisters had spent time growing up on the island. Her cousins were there. There was a support system there. And she was going just for herself, employment opportunity, better life for me at the time. It must be wild to grow up in a place where, like, Americans consider vacation. And to you, you're like, this is my life. Yeah, yes and no, right?

Because I always say, like, you don't live the vacation experience every day. Yeah. Right? In fact, like, you don't even know you're in. what other people would consider the third world. It's just your experience, right? So it's like you grow up and you may not have the money that, you know, the tourists may have, but you, as a kid, I was very happy, you know,

we were able to play sports. I think our schooling is very good in the Caribbean. Like when I came to the States, I was way ahead educationally. Oh, yeah. Which I don't think a lot of people know. We have really, really good academics in the Caribbean, especially when I was in Antigua, I remember really loving, loving class, loving, you know, school classes. And then when you come to the States, it's like you just, you're open up to more as far as

opportunity. Yeah. But as a kid, yeah, I mean, you, you see tourists coming off the cruise ships because they all dock right there in the harbor and they come off and they're in, you know, they're in St. John, but they don't really travel out too far. They stay where all the trinkets and the shops are at. I remember my mom let me go down one day and like sell shells that I polished from from the beach by the house

and you would just get like a Kong shell and like... You're like $400 a shell. You just get whatever you can get. Like I just look at what other people were selling. I think she was like setting the price maybe but she let me go and I thought that was my first opportunity with like there's more there's more out there.

There's more than what I know. Yeah, you know, like these people are coming from somewhere and they're coming and they're spending money, but what, what do their lives look like? You know, tourism is the biggest, is like our biggest industry for most of the Caribbean, right? But, you know, definitely Auntie at the time that I was living there. So I always just started to like, you know, what that was like, what that was like, what the American experience was like. Even though I was born in America, I had no idea what the American life was like. I never lived in the States. I didn't know what, you know, that experience. was, I didn't even know I was born in Americans, so that was like 13 or 14. You know, for me, as a kid, seeing kind of, you know, Americans come off and, like, enjoy the island, it was just a different experience. Like, I didn't spend my days vacationing. I spent my days going to school, being disciplined, getting in trouble, playing sports, you know, hanging with friends when I was allowed to. Just casually drop getting in trouble. I like that. I told you this when we first met, my when I was 14 years old I was told by my tennis coach like if you want to go pro you have to

move to Florida that's where people are hitting the most balls and like you can't New Yorkers can't compete with like the all around outside tennis facilities in Florida so I moved I had this coach from Guyana and he had this small academy um with all West Indian kids and me and I lived them for two years like from 14 to 16 and it was just the most incredible experience of like like being a part of this West Indian family anything from we would know it's good people though right like for people who don't know may not have encountered you know much uh western you know or Caribbean culture it's just good people I feel like like they're very loving I'm also from Brooklyn.

I'm from Brooklyn, so the community, they're, like, West Indian communities, and they're so hardworking, so positive, so, like, they, I just, I mean, the food, when I went to, I've been to Trinidad, I've been to Jamaica, I've been to St. Lucia, but, like, through the, I feel like, you know, I'm saying I'm, your sister from another mister is what I'm saying.

I went to, first out, um, the, the food, like, the ox tail, like the curries, the rotis, I mean, that's more Trinidadian, but like, I fell in love with it. I was listening to Dance Hall at, like, 14, and I thought I was the coolest person ever. Because you were, though. Because you were, at the time, you were probably, like, listening to, like, Sean Paul in Vegas at the time you were 14. Yeah, no, no, no, I mean. Do you remember Dr. Evil? Hmm? Remember Dr. Evil?

Yes. Yes, so I would, like, rap to Dr. Evil. I was calling guys Batty Boys. That's not allowed now. No, you definitely don't want to do that now. That's not the era that we're currently in. No, but back then, I was just, I love Caribbean culture. So that's when I met you.

And it's funny, I can kind of sense sometimes when they're from the Caribbean. I got to the point where I even could tell differences in the accents. Like Barbados is like, Barbados is like the Irish. Like, they never finish any word, you know? They speak heavy on the front of the word. Like Rihanna. Mm-hmm. And then, like, I feel like the Jamaican is also very difficult.

Trinidad, I thought, was really beautiful. Guyanese, I thought was beautiful. But yeah, I just fucking, do you miss it? I still have all my family, I have a lot of family that still lives in Caribbean. My dad still lives in Guyana, so just to go visit him, you know, I have to go to Guyana. or if he comes up, you know, we can hang out here or some of the families in London. But I've always traveled to see family, so it's no different, really. A lot of the family is still in Antigua.

We have, you know, we have our properties there, and my aunts have some business there. So, yeah, it's great to go back. You know, we have a little boutique hotel that I stay at now because that's what the family does. Like I said, tourism is still one of the biggest industries. So the villa is at Sunset Lane. If anyone's interested in going to Antigua, it's a beautiful place. Boyap up. You know, but yeah, it's also, you just feel comfortable.

You just feel at home, in a sense, when you're with your family and just kind of hanging out. Is this the biggest culture shift when you came from Antigua and you're in the city? Or where did you go in America and you're with your mom? What freaked you out? a lot of things were very different I will say so I came to New York and I came to Long Island I went to Freeport so Freeport Long Island was a blessing for me at the time just because it was so it was probably as multicultural as you can get in Long Island I had you know friends who had who were white and had a certain

experience. I had friends who had Caribbean parents. I had friends who were black, I'm black American. My next-door neighbor, their family was Trimdadian. So there was real connection there in terms of just food and music. My cousins, so my aunt had two sons who I ended up growing up with like brothers, Joani and Asani. And they became my kind of guides into the American experience. I remember they had the dog style, the Snoop Doggy style record. And I remember listening to that and being like, oh, okay, okay, hip hop. I get that. Different than Caribbean culture. Yeah, like, the music is so different. Music is completely different. But, like, growing up, you know,

you listen to Bob Marley, Maxie. You listen to what your parents are listening to. You have some American kind of exposure, but it's like, Michael, Jackson. Like, I was a really big Michael Jackson fan because that's what I heard in Curbiel, right? And I thought he was, he was everything. But I had the VHS of Moonwalker. And me and my friend would just sit there and, like, look at that. And I thought, this is, this America. You know what I mean? People moonwalk. Everyone just walks around moonwalking. I mean. Everyone, everyone, you know. Anyone can do it, I'm sure. Everyone's just cooler. That's how you go from class to class. You moonwalk. You moonwalk. You moonwalk.

So, yeah, that was a little bit of the culture shock. Like, you know, it was cold in the wintertime. I remember people asking me to speak a lot, you know, just to hear me speaks. I always felt like I was other, you know. You always felt. They liked your accent? Yeah. I mean, to them, it was, like, fun to hear it.

But to me, I just didn't want to stand out. You know, I still, to this day, I don't feel like I'm someone who wants to stand out all the time. I kind of just like to exist and do my thing and, you know, be created and, you know, have my time with my friends and family. But sometimes you're asked to speak. You're asked to speak up. You're asked to be heard. And at that time, I remember feeling like, I'm good in the corner. I just want to learn and go to class, you know.

But that's an interesting word you used. Like, you didn't want to be the other. And, like, othering is definitely a thing in America. because if others is when you're not the like primary or like privileged race or person, you feel othered. It's like it's like band-aids coming and just tan. Like if you're not color, you're an other. And those are like the small little things that a lot of people I think are hopefully realizing more now. Um, so you have like a calmness and like kind of quiet confidence to you. I don't want to say shyness, but like you have,

Yeah, you don't have to be the loudest guy in the room. What made you want to be a performer? That, I think, comes from, like, self-expression. I think, for me, understanding kind of how I communicate and how I kind of convey emotions, I think emotional intelligence is something that I tap into on, like, a human level with most of my interactions, right? like being in touch with how people feel, being in touch with how I feel.

I think acting and performing, whether it be on a stage or on a set, you know, with the cameras rolling, I think that process does something from my spirit where I'm able to communicate feelings. I'm able to communicate emotions that I otherwise probably couldn't communicate. So once I figured out that connection for myself, on a selfish level, I was just like, oh, this this works this works for me and after I figured it out in college but after I finished I was at Syracuse University after I finished that I came down to the city and studied at a conservatory so that William S. Conservatory at the studio and that two-year process kind of just like crystallize exactly what I wanted to do

as far as you know being an actor and what that meant and the type of actor I wanted to be and why I wanted to do it, all kind of crystallized in terms of me understanding how it made me feel and how I could interact and tap into how other people were feeling. Then I was like, oh, then it's not about me per se. It's about what I bring to this collective, what I bring emotionally, what I bring intelligence,

as far as intelligence, all that sort of stuff is really exciting for me. And then I can kind of open up and be, be more gregarious and be louder. And it's probably the same for you, right? I'm sure you on stage as a comic, you know, is a more in-tune version of who you are, Hannah-Burner, on just like a Tuesday in sweats,

talking to your girls on the phone. For sure. For sure. You, I mean, and the, you hit on, like, empathy and, like, listening and understanding, and that's a huge part of comedy. is observing. Like when you can't write jokes unless you've been like living and experiencing and reflecting and then even performing, if you're not listening to the audience, you're fucking annoying them. Facts. Facts. I mean, reading the room is probably one of the one of the things

I hear over and over in that world. Read the room, man. Understand what the audience is, you know, feeling, working with. Who they are. I also think, well, actors are very smart. They're a lot of my actor friends are so fucking smart but you the i feel like the biggest part of acting is first admitting to yourself that you want to be an actor was there any guilt in going into a creative field like did you have expectations from your family to go into something more traditional oh man well you know you know caribbean folks right um that's not like the most thrilling news for them to get like i've made these sacrifices people worked as hard as they work to get you to this place um and you want to throw that away basically you know what

I'm saying like for me I remember my aunt saying well why would you want to do that like you're smart you know I believe you have something to offer like and I don't think they're mutually exclusive I don't think if you're smart you can't be an actor or vice versa I feel like people express intelligence in different ways also when you said something to offer acting offers so much to the world and communities. Exactly. It's just a different kind of thing. And especially in times like, you know, going through a shutdown, you know, being scared.

When society kind of turns on its head, where do you go? You go to the arts. You go to music. You go to your favorite TV shows. You go to films that provide you a sense of escape, sense of being in a better place. You know, these are all artists that come together that make those things happen. You know, a bunch of artists, sound artists, lighting artists, directors,

actors, musicians, all these people coming together, do their art. And then we have these gifts that, not gifts in the 2020 word, but gifts where I feel like we're able to transport ourselves. We're able to take some of the burden off. And that's super important. At least I feel it's super important. Yeah. No, I 100% feel like the stories that you tell and the people,

that probably felt less alone by watching the arts are where yeah i escaped you too i just i tried to be normal until i was around 26 i did like marketing sales and then i was like had to hit my which i find so crazy i can't i can't see you trapping and bottling that creative energy until you're 26 and then being like all right you know what now i'm going to go now i'm going to be i was playing tennis The comedian. Yeah. I was so focused on tennis and I put all that creative energy

like in a box and on tennis court I'd get yelled at for laughing too much or like I was always like pushing boundaries and then finally I just felt like I got in the right lane and was able to run freely. But what was something that you

like you just went straight into it? Like how were you so, how did you know as such a young guy that this was your passion? Well, I took, I took time figuring that out, right? Like, I majored in sports medicine. That's, I did exercise science as a major, and then I minored in theater. So it was, as I was going, what happened?

You were dabbling in it a little. Dabbling, just kind of figuring it out, right? And then what I realized is I felt the most alive when I was challenged to construct characters to understand a world outside of my own to be in the space of play i felt the most alive version of myself right and i made the decision to to follow that and say even if i'm unsuccessful in this pursuit at least i will have a feeling of like purpose within myself yes right and that's a scary that's a scary thing yes but if it doesn't scare you you're in your comfort zone and your comfort zone is going, taking you anywhere.

I've never been in my comfort zone. You know, even when you audition and you get a role, I think then I'm even more like, okay, now the real work begins. Now this character development begins. Now I pour all of myself into this role. I think when you have that little bit of fear or that little bit of uncertainty, I think you're able to rise to the occasion to kind of excel because you're challenging yourself.

It's not like you're doing something that's monotonous where you don't feel yourself being challenged. I think with the creative pursuit, you're constantly challenged because the goal is constantly changing. There is no set target. Like the target keeps, it's like the net and tennis if it kept moving. If the end line kept moving, you know, if out of balance line kept moving, and you had to figure out how to continue to play the game and be successful. And that's an immense challenge. you have to realize that if I never, you know, get to get the touchdown that I enjoyed the journey of doing it. Because realistically, I think in a lot of these creative fields, these goals that you

have are, you can obsess about the goal or you can enjoy what you're doing and the goals will hit in different ways. I always say, like, don't, you know, create these crazy five-year plans when it's like you don't know what the world has in store for you if you like really love what you're doing you don't know what's going to happen it's actually kind of restricting um yeah i mean you can have you can have an idea of what five years out look like but what are you doing in the here and now to to act on your calling you know if you feel a call to to be a creative I feel like it's super important to, you know, be truthful to that creative calling in the moment. You know, what do you, if you're a comedian and in five years you want to show, you know,

or you want to be headlining, I don't know, headlining arenas, if that's what you're calling is, right? But you're not writing jokes every day. Then, you know, are you really in it for the love of comedy? Are you really in it for that pursuit and to kind of, you know, expose the rawness of your humanity to the public? Or are you in it for the result of having 50,000 people buy tickets to see you in an arena? Yeah, that's an after effect. That's such an after effect and that stuff will happen. Of the daily grind, yes, an after effect of the daily grind.

Exactly, exactly. And I think because this is like a mental health. podcast, there's so many creatives that listen to this or people who are like tempted to become creatives. So I think what you just said is so true. And creatives will drive themselves insane if they're not doing what they want. I read something. I'm going to mess it up. But like someone said that like they had these contests for like the best poets in this like really established literary whatever. And like half of the poets had by bipolar disorder and it's like so many creatives do have mental health things happening but it's like

part of you think differently so create differently and be fucking amazing and don't worry about like the structure that you're creating into like if you know everyone was worried that um you know film could only be viewed one way that you wouldn't have you know streaming services you wouldn't have YouTube, you wouldn't have all these other things that creative just came up with and say, look, I don't have the means to make this feature length, but I have a camera. I can make shorts. I can make a vine. I can make, you know, at this point, Instagram clip. I can make, you know, like, whatever it is, if you have the creativity in you, you'll find a way to get it out. I think that is the end result. He's a beast. You have to. You have to. So while you're doing your creative

your shit, you're acting, you're going on castings. How did you meet Luke O'Brienson? Okay, so shout out to Luke. I met Luke at the time that I was studying at Esper. So I came to the city right after college, and I knew that I wanted to study to continue my education as an actor. I wanted to study in New York.

I wanted to be around what I thought were the best actors in the world, people who really cared and loved craft. I was like, all right, got to find somewhere to study the city. And I decided that I would just be looking up, you know, different acting school. Some folks in my family had connections

to different places where they were, check this out, check this out, do research. And I was walking the streets one day and somebody stopped, me on the street and said you should come and work in your off time at Abercombe and Fitch on Fifth Avenue. Now at the time I had no interest in a working at Abercombeian Fitch because I had heard that I probably wouldn't be working there and B and B I wanted to devote my time to finding a school.

Turns out they had a really nice sales pitch and that you could leave at any time and just go on castings, going on auditions. Because I was doing commercial print work at the time and going on commercial auditions, doing that sort of stuff. I had already had a commercial agent at the time. So I was like, oh, this is perfect for now.

How old are you? Huh? How old were you? 22 I think baby yeah so I decide um this is perfect I am going to take this make some money and paper class right um and that was the that was the goal so it worked out perfectly that when I got there it was easy it was not stressful I just smod They said hello. What was your job? Were you one of the hot dudes in the front? I just stood at the door.

I didn't have my shirt off. I just had a shirt on. I was a reader, I guess, was at the finish at the time. I had a shirt on. Luke actually was one of the dudes. Luke was one of the dudes that had a shirt off. Wait. Was Luke required to?

Luke, because Luke had done the campaign. Luke had done the Abercrombie campaign. Okay. So he was one of the campaign. guys that came to the store and obviously he was modeling at the time as well but he would get whatever that rate was for that position which was a separate thing right and you had to be approved by corporate and it was like a whole process was Luke's like face on the bags or something on a bag yeah I think a couple times yeah for sure no that is a huge part of this

I like to bring it up all the time. So he'll love it. He hates when people talk about it. He doesn't want to be seen as a model. He's currently trying his hardest to be as unattractive as possible during quarantine. And he's like, I can't even say anything. I was talking another day, man. I have my little scraggly beard growing out.

I can't even throw shade his way. Because it's like in quarantine, why are you shaving and doing like, why are you trying so hard? But he's trying hard to look like a ragamoss? Like a woodsman. I said he looks like the guy from, not lost, castaway. Oh, castaway? Yeah. But anyway, so how did you two hit it off? Um, he's just a good dude. Like, the thing I think people who don't know him would assume about him is that he's super, uh, self-involved or interested in the thing that they know him for like because they know him as a model they feel like he's equally interested in the fact that

they know him as a model the thing that I really dig about Luke is that you know as far as like looks all-American you know great smile great shape but even better person like the way he interacts with like sisters is is dope on the things that he cares about just outside of like industry stuff I find to be um in line with kind of my values um and I just feel like you know he's not afraid to be who he is like I know he were joking on him for the guitar and I remember him picking up the guitar I'm just going to learn I'm just going to learn guitar I was like all right you know what I'm like I met him as like, I play guitar, I make jewelry, but you saw him become that guy.

I saw him become that dude. Like, there was a transition into the person that you know. Yes. And, like, that transition is amazing. Like, the thought of, like, him doing the jewelry and all that stuff was a concept. You know, it wasn't, like, who he always was. He was always very into being from Minnesota. and like I would go over the summer and like we would go cliff jumping and like I will

go for the fourth of July. How times did you go to Minnesota with him? Uh, at least three. Well, he invited me once, but then it fell through, so. You got to, you got to come. He invited the summer house group for fourth of July and I was like, there's a pandemic happening. But we'll see if things get better by then. Did you like Minnesota?

I love Minnesota. I love Minnesota as far as like just being able to be outdoors, being able to be on the lake, going cliff jumping, going, you know, just out into nature. But then more than that, I think, like, I love the people. Like his mom, I don't know how close you got, but his mom is amazing. Like Cindy's next level. Yes, Cindy and are pretty tight. We DM all the time. Yeah, okay.

So, you know. Occasionally I get a phone call. Do you know where Luke? kids and I have to tell you're not answering that's this message on no but she's great you know I feel like when I went and just was able to kind of hang with his family and they took care of me like family I was like oh I see kind of where he gets that from you know I think something that you got to have kind of built into you it's like ingrained into the fabric of who he is and I think that's just like the fabric of that community like I

I received so much love going out there. I was like, oh, this is something. I could definitely come back, you know, next year or the year after. Yeah, because it's a get-out situation, and it sounds like it was better than that. That would have been the most tragic ending to my venture out of New York City. You were like, look nice. The family's a little weird, but no, just kidding. It was focused on a lot of weird conversation, but other than that, it was great.

You know, I feel like, I feel like get out changed everyone's perspective on traveling into, like, suburbia as a black man in America, being on your own. Because I was, you know, like, for me, if you're out there by yourself, like, you're out there by yourself, like, I don't know anyone, you know, I don't know anyone in that area. So I really, you are really just relying on the fact that like, all right, I'm here with Luke. So whatever Luke's doing, I'm doing. Whoever Luke's hanging with, I'm hanging with. So hope everybody's cool with that, you know. You're like, okay, we're jumping off a cliff. Let's go.

Yeah, like you're doing the 10 footer. All right, you graduate 20 feet. All right, let's do it because everyone else is can't, you know, can't not. I stereotyped Luke. I was like this fucking guy. Like, he walked in. I was like, he's probably such a douchebag and, like, play. hockey I saw that first episode um like I was flirty but I also was like he's probably small-minded

he comes from a small town in Minnesota we probably have no we don't have any similar values but he kept laughing at my jokes because he gets it and I I'm aware when people are like in it with me like someone would say something we'd both look at each other and have the same reaction and like I realized like I was very wrong about him and that's why I think I was so frustrated during season because I felt like some of the girls didn't get to know him and we're trying to tell me what kind of guy he was when I was actually like you knew we were spending a lot of time together off camera like because if I'm going to mess with the dude I want to understand how his brain works to understand how we're going to

ruin each other's lives you know exactly how we're going to yeah damage each other definitely I mean so in addition to him you know bullying you in tennis you guys actually did have an opportunity to become friendly and, you know, get to know each other. That's cool because I was just stuck on how you could be a collegiate athlete and let Luke dominate you. Because when he tried to play me one-on-one at football, I demolished him. I spared no. Well, you've gotten some false information because Luke has never dominated me on the tennis court

or in the bedroom. wait did you play sports in college um yeah so uh football uh i was about my my high school team was really good i don't think i was really good um oh shut up so i think what happened was i was probably like someone who understood my position um i was able to have some success uh and our high school team was was pretty good at the time we had a couple a couple guys to play in college um my friend brick play pro, play for the Jets for a couple of years. Did you play for Syracuse? Played Syracuse, yeah.

This is so funny. You guys, this is the most humble man alive. If you come on, listen to my podcast, I mention about six times each podcast that I played tennis for the University of Wisconsin. I had to pull that out of you that you were a collegiate football player. That's a big part of your life. But is it, though?

I feel like the work that you put in to do anything well, right? does define a part of you but I feel like life is so much more who you are once you leave you know once you leave the comfort of like especially the college experience and you're forced to solidify your views on life on things that matter and affect other people

I think that's when you kind of come into your own right like the intellect in your comedy now wouldn't have been the intellect in your comedy in you know your junior year of being in college. I think that, to me, even it's like what I love about your comedy is

how you bring, like, your intellect to what is, you know, funny on the surface, but you make us think about it, right? You make us think about, you know, what we find attractive or what we don't know is damaging and what we don't realize is damaging.

You know, I think you find that comedic bent, but that takes a certain level of intellect. I think you grow into that, right? You need experiences, right? You need experiences. You need a lot of trauma. Yeah.

You need to collect that trauma, hold on to it. And then. Why didn't think I was messing with Luke? I was like, the jokes I will have after this summer will be incredible. But also, I wish I had the perspective you had where I think tennis was so close to my ego that I would put so much pressure on myself. But if I was like, tennis is a part of me, but who I am as a human is so much more important, I think I would have dealt with pressure.

share a lot better, but I just had that, like, killer instinct where I was like, I'm going to be a tennis player and that's all. I didn't want to face my actual demons. So, like, I think honestly, it's also the type of sport, right? Like, for me, the best part of being on a team is the team. Like, I love the guys that I, you know, would be out grinding with because they had a similar experience. Like, you know, being there for summer workouts and, you know, just grinding. and just trying to be better. I feel like that experience overall kind of bonds people. I don't know how kind of the tennis experience,

but it's an individual sports. I feel like, you know, always the team dynamic. But those memories are the memories I kind of walk with, not like the identity of, I never really identified as like an athlete. I was just a guy who was like, all right, well, I'm able to do this thing in college now. let me try my hand and when I found what I love to do then I was like I need to do that thing

like I need to do the creative thing for me you know yes and it's harder sometimes when you are talented at different things you're like I could be an athlete and stuff but it's like but doesn't make you happy and I say that shit all the time I'm sorry for anyone listening for repeating it again. But I want to fast forward, you get the part as Skeletor and the Purge and you're in movie theaters all over America as a kid from Guyana. Most people don't even know where that is. You team massive. Yeah, yeah. How did that feel? Um, it felt like, like what we were talking about earlier, um, having moments where you're making your mom, For me, I was like, this is a moment that she would be so proud of, you know, because she would have seen the hard work that it took to achieve that particular goal.

The work in studying, the work in failing and just going on auditions and not getting the role, dealing with that, you know, dealing with hearing no, finding value outside of the arts and finding value outside of just my talent. working on my talent, working on my craft, going back and studying with, you know, different teachers that I respect here in the city, doing all those things to then get to that point. Yeah. It's like the tip of the iceberg that people see when, like, it's really a whole, yeah, the whole mass is kind of underneath the surface. I think that is that's the best that's like how I feel when I like headline a show

and like I went to San Francisco and I headlined but it was like all the little nights that I did in basements with people who didn't laugh that like made that moment feel so good because I like I put it you had a moment of of earning

something right there's nobody can put a price on a moment that you earned nobody it's like a celebration yeah like it's not even like like oh i'm let's celebrate all the other shit because i'm so fucking ready right now um i always say that to people who were like i wish i just got an opportunity i wish the right door would open especially acting people like if the right director saw me and it's like if they saw you right now are you fucking ready are you ready what are you doing remember i saying before about what are you doing daily like

what does your daily grind look like are you are you you you know For you, like, I see you'll have just, like, funny stuff that you just throw out on Twitter and then you repost it to IG or whatever. And I'm like, you know, that's so genius just the way her mind thought about that. And those are just like a little something free that you give, like, Dale, like you just like throw those out. I feel guilty because I don't, in my head, I don't see it as work, but that's why I guess it's like I'm always working because I'm doing something I love, which is trying to create

different things that make people talk or laugh or like think deeper about something so it's like I remember even acting like I love acting and that's why it's interesting for me to talk to you because I think in the future I'd like to get into it my favorite class in middle school was drama and those two hours life just didn't matter and it's kind of thing that I'm like I can make money doing something I love that much and it's like you can if you love it. And that's the thing that I feel like anyone who's a creative that's listening should take away is, first of all, if I can do it, anyone can do it. That's because I don't feel like... But you're also the most humble person in the world, so that doesn't say much.

No, I feel like if I can, you know, bring something and have something to offer and have something to say, then your life experience can also bring something to the table and you have something to say. a lot of people think they don't have something to say that's the thing you just got to really hone in on what it is you bring to the conversation and really focus on that and be sure about that so that when you are given that opportunity you say something and it starts with not even like what you can bring but what you actually care or like want to bring because you could have interesting things you say but if you don't aren't really passionate about it like I think I got into this because I had experienced like mental health problems or I'd realize that like more women needed to be aware of like locker room talk and like honesty of a lot of parts of our lives. So it's like,

yeah, you do have shit to say. I've known how many people who are like, no one wants to hear me talk. And I'm like, that's you creating that narrative in your own head. No one else said that. Like nobody told you that no one wants to hear you talk. You just have this, I don't even know it's masochistic, but this sort of like, I need to feel less than sort of mentality that you're putting on yourself. And I feel like that's the most limiting thing. Like, I for sure know that my life didn't bring me to the States and afford me all these opportunities so I could be like average. Like, that's not why things happen to where they happen. Like, I didn't have the pain of losing my mom early so that I could like, I don't know, uh, you know, live a life that

was super mediocre and be okay with that. Like, I know I at least have to try to be excellent than what I love. Yeah. If I thrive and I don't achieve anything, then that's one story. But to not try at all, I'm not, yeah, I'm just not built for that. I'm not okay with that particular idea or reality. A hundred percent. I even think that like us being like we, I think I see myself as just a vessel

for like all the other voices that are scared to talk who've gone through and I'm just a vessel of their voices because I'm loud and I'm not afraid to say it but like I say it because I'm not alone when I say it because you know that other people experiencing the same thing and I think what you tapped into is you're the one that's unafraid for me you know when I was studying and figuring out the type of person I would be in the acting space

the type of actor I wanted to be a lot of of that is just being unafraid, you know, a quote that I really hold on to is on the other side of my fear is my freedom. Once I figured out how to push past the things that kind of boxed me in and made me feel introverted, made me feel reserved, I was able to really find my truer self, you know, a lot of the, even like, even etiquette, even etiquette is something like, I can't do that or I have to ask permission, you know, for that. That's something that's really placed upon us. We have to understand how we exist even through that. So once I really started to understand, listen, trust your voice, trust your inner voice, say the things that you want to say.

If you're wrong for something, apologize, but don't be afraid to be wrong. You know, don't be afraid to make mistakes, to be imperfect, because that's truly living. Be genuine. Be genuine. You know, don't try to kind of package yourself to meet Hannah. You know, don't package your, you know, don't package yourself to meet Luke. That's one of the things I would go back. I wish I knew that when I was in my early 20s. I think that's one of the things everyone wishes they knew, right? Be your highest self as quickly as possible.

Like this generation now, I think these kids are finding their truth so much earlier than like the generations that came before them. If you have a kid that's like 10 to 15 years old, they, I think, are experiencing the world in such a different way. they realize much sooner that they're not alone you know it took some people social media yeah especially with social media you find your tribe way quicker whatever that is like you know the theater let's say you know you have athletes in in junior high they know other athletes exist a because they're on a team be because people value athletics way sooner but like that one person

that may be in the middle of the country in a really awesome high school music theater program goes to Juilliard or NYU and they're like, oh, oh, okay, this is my tribe. You know, everyone who didn't get it when I was 15 wasn't supposed to get it. But now I'm amongst people who are going to help me, you know, thrive

and create and kind of be who I'm called to be. I think that's dope, just understanding that. you know, your tribe is out there. People who are like minds, they're out there, and we'll eventually find them. That's the comedy community for me. Like, once I started hanging out with them, I was like, these are my people.

And yeah, you feel less alone, but then you also realize the more genuine you are with yourself, like, that's how creatives become successful because people are like, how do I do something unique and cool and interesting? And it's like, just be you because no one else is the same as you. That's called How to Be Unique.

And also, like, you said something about the comedy community. The comedy community in New York, I feel like it's just a special breed. Like, I'm a huge fan of comedy. Like, put that aside. We can talk comedy all day. We can talk history of comedy. We can talk comedy working, you know, comedies working now. But we know some of the same people.

But just even the people I know in comedy are just great people who are, even if They're working through their own shit to themselves. You see what I'm saying? Like, every comic is working through something, but they're true to themselves. Like, you're going to meet, like, a human being, like someone who is authentically themselves. Because these comedians will tear you apart

if you're being fake or front-week in some way. They will shit on you for anything in the realest way, and you just, they tear you down to nothing. And then you have to build yourself up. Just on back up. And say, who the fuck am I? And everyone needs to fucking do that. Like, it's been an incredible experience to meet comics who comes from all walks of life

in this one place where we're all just trying to get a laugh. Yeah. It's a beautiful thing. But in terms of performing, you playing the Skeletor and the First Purge, the Purge is a very interesting, scientific, like, social, like experiment. It is an experiment, yeah. Yeah, so it's basically the idea that they're giving America one night

where crime, there's no punishment for crime. Yep. And then shit goes down. I mean, whatever can go down, you can imagine will go down, right? Where you remove the legal ramifications of of criminal activity, right? So anything that you can conceive potentially can happen.

And I think that concept is terrified. But it's also super interesting to see, all right, well, how does it play out? How do you navigate that world? Because what you're doing is you're removing the construct of decorum, the construct of law, you know what I mean? Like the things that kind of, one of the tenets of society, that social contract is, oh, if you do something, something happens. Are they saying that it would lower crime rate in the future if everyone let it out in that moment?

Yes, basically that's the premise where, you know, you believe that if you have this one night of sort of an anarchy, you can reduce the overall desire to commit crime 364 days a year. So that's basically the overall, I guess, premise to the people is like, we'll give you this. In return, we expect 364, no violence, no crime, no nothing. So you are playing, like, the anti-hero in it, you called it? I believe, I believe, yeah, I believe Skeletor is considered an anti-hero. I feel as though everyone is the hero of their own stories, though, right? Like, if you were seeing the person through a different lens,

you know, I don't know if Scalator is a bad guy. I don't know if he's a good guy. It depends on where you're coming at the conversation from. But I do feel like there's going to be a lot of people who capitalize or seize the moment in terms of opportunity, in terms of, yeah. Look, there's a lot of things that I can't do 364, days a year that I can do tonight. But there's also a lot of opportunity that I don't have

364 days a year that I have tonight. That could be opportunity around finance, that could be opportunity around retribution. That could be opportunity around whatever conversation you want to have. You know what I'm saying? I love apocalyptic shit. I love social experiment stuff. But then it's funny because we're looking at this time in the world, like these last three months that have been a little apocalyptic feeling in terms of like. And that's not good. like the world should reflect a movie like the world should not reflect I was about to say like have you been sensing any kind of similarities the thing is like people even if you don't want to people are like DM you like oh my god like there was like a police department that used like the purge horn you are real things like to but I do like the idea I was just I mean

thinking about everything that's going on right now, just how, like, the system that was created needs to be questioned sometimes. So it was interesting how the purge they're questioning that. And then we realized, like, the system was created by white people to benefit white people. And the fact that this time right now, it, like, it has to be dismantled. And white people who created need to help dismantle it with the people who have suffered by it. So I think that's, that's the only way you accomplish that goal, right? If that's the, go you need you need white people to look and say this is a problem specifically because you design you know if you design something you're probably some of the most equipped to undo it to deconstruct

you know I think that that work is super important but then also you you have to realize oh we all have a part to play in this I have a part in dismantling this system. And, you know, not only do I have a part of dismantling the system, but in rebuilding something that serves all, that serves everyone, when you have that sort of inclusive approach, now you're talking about like, okay, we are, we are serving humanity. We're not serving sections of human. I even think when you were talking about how, when you were in Guyana or in Antigua,

you lived your life you didn't really know how other people were doing their thing and I think a lot of white people during this time were not aware of the privilege and that like how the policies the system the structures that were created around them like held some people back and enabled them to freely move up in society and now that people are like fucking seeing that like it's so powerful I think for white people to just fucking wake up and see that but it's not it's not even waking up you know assuming that people haven't been asleep like they've been very they've had their eyes open they've been awake they just haven't been seeking the education you see what I'm saying I feel like what's happening now is uh people are being educated on things that other people may have known for 50 years yeah 100 years right um you're like it wasn't Being hidden from people. There were certain truths that I think existed. I think now you have a situation where people are actively looking for information to educate themselves and say, oh, okay, how do I understand this?

How do I benefit from this? How do I now say, what part can I play in changing this? If this isn't right, if you see what's going on and you say to yourself, oh, like, wait, that's not right. You know, I may be a white person, but I don't agree with that. I don't agree with that treatment. Something's terribly wrong if that's what's happening in the world. You can no longer be blind to the fact that you need to now educate yourself in how to change that. Because to see it, realize it's wrong, and do nothing and say nothing is probably worse than the person who is, like, completely unaware that it's actually happening, right?

So you have different sex of society now where it's like if you say it's not a problem, that's one camp. Nothing's a problem, everything's fine. I don't know who that is, but I'm sure you exist. You say, I see a problem. I can't live knowing that I'm not doing something to actively change and fix the problem. Then you have people who are like, I see there's a problem, but that's not my problem. I don't know how to help you solve that problem. I'm detached from the problem.

That's a very, that's a difficult space. I think that's the space where I did. Yeah, that reminds me of, I tweeted, like, kind of a joke just about how, like, someone else getting rights doesn't take away from your own, right? Yeah, the pizza joke. It's not. It's not.

And it goes back to, like, someone saying that it doesn't affect them. But that's so smart, like, for someone to be able to visualize, look, it's not this finite, you know, finite resource. Yeah. When I was talking about your intellect and comedy before, that's part of what I'm talking about, right? You find a way to look at something that we all recognize is very serious, but make it accessible to your fans, to the people who, you know, listen to Hannah and say, look, I like her by the way she makes me feel about that. right you give them something that they can digest and say you know what that's that's true it's not like i could try to show things from different angles yeah it's like that's no one like that you can realize like me helping you eat doesn't make me hungry right it doesn't mean that it actually

benefits society like i've taught i'm very feminism and how just like you as women in the workforce or like or gay rights being able to get married it only fucking helps now now we're talking you know you're talking gay rights you're talking trans rights you talk you know yeah rights or rights right so when when you talk about like you know uh having this value placed on on black lives and you see Asian American stand up you see white American stand up you see um Latino identifying Latinx identifying um um and stand up and say, we're fighting for these black rights and these black lies because we recognize that if we don't do that, you know, what we're doing is we're diminishing humanity

on the whole, right? We understand, literally, we understand that if we all come together, that's the only way this thing changes. It can't just be this voice over here of black people fighting for black people. It needs to be the allies of, you know what, we all understand this is a problem. You know, we recognize that. Now, how can we individually

have the tough conversation? Because it starts, I think personally, it starts in the home. It starts on the most personal level before it gets to the macro, right? It starts with the burner family are going to be way more impactful than like,

you know, the conversation that you may have at a speech or at a rally, or at, see what I'm saying? Because the conversation that you have on a personal level, you can affect someone's heart. Now, what you can do on the bigger scale is, like, you have a platform that is, you know, big where people can see what you think. Now, if you put that information out there, you're putting it out there, and people can now say, oh, wow, that's something I probably wouldn't have seen.

and if I did see it, I probably wouldn't have seen it in the same way. I probably wouldn't have been able to digest it in the same way. And that's the value I think that people using their platform to speak up. Like people using their voice to say, hey, listen, we get along okay. I know, you know, we have this social contract where I tell jokes, you laugh, we do them back and forth, blah, blah, blah, and, you know, we understand each other, but I also need to understand that something important is happening over here, you know. let me bring your attention to this and hopefully you can take individual action of your own.

I think that's so important. It's like, yeah, you can be a comedian, but you're also using that to be a human. You know what I mean? When I first started posting, one of my friends, actually a college football player, his name's Darius and he, he messaged me like the first post I did. It was like kind of before the movement got heavy, but just you have something about George Florida and he was like, thanks for posting this. Like, I think a lot of, like, there's a fear. Like, I feel like you might be in an awkward position because you have a brand and you don't want

to get like capernicked. And he's one of my black friends. At first I was kind of like, damn, like, I don't know. He was being so nice to me. Like, thank you so much for speaking up. We don't want to hurt. Like, it was kind of just like, no, no, no. This is bigger than that. And then it like all hit afterwards where he was like, like, this is, he was like thanking me for like doing one insta story in the beginning that I was so pricing like my brand and I'm like this is fucking people getting killed wrongfully killed but you've been trained but in reality kudos to you but kudos to you for your perspective on that right perspective is it's it was trained to be like I'm not worth yeah speaking up about it could get you in trouble

That's not it. That's not it. That's not it at all. I feel I congratulate, you know, people who are standing up and using their voice to list of change. But that's a personal decision that I feel like you should do from a place of I understand the value of me speaking, not from a place of this congratulation makes me feel good. This is not the, you know, getting out. a joke you know hoping it lands for the applause that's not that transaction the transaction is

the humanity that I'm leading with needs to be needs to be out in the world it needs to it was like if I lose a brand deal because of this they can go fuck that's not that's not that's not the brand you want that's that's not the brand you want if you if you if you leading with humanity makes you less marketable that's not the brand you need to be working with. But if you think about it, like the Kaepernick shit made no sense. And like people were not, like, it was the way it was marketed that made it seem like it wasn't for black lives. It was some like, oh, he's anti-police. Like, it was marketed in a way that people were able to convince each other that it was wrong. And that's what that's, that was also,

that was also a couple of years ago, right? So what you, what you had happened in the time between Nike coming to his back and saying, you know, we understand what your movement is about, understanding that it wasn't anti-American, wasn't intended to be anti-American. This is for people who obviously, you know, didn't want to listen to what he was saying, because he said that it wasn't anti-American. He has a whole, you can even find it on YouTube, I'm sure, but, you know, he's in the locker room laying out kind of what his plan was for. you know um what he was trying to bring attention to and what he was trying to highlight uh i don't

think people even listened or did research on why he was doing what he was doing and that's why they just took the headline that was given to them and that to me is is that's that's lazy if you if you hate someone fighting for the justice of human beings because you were too lazy to do research that's that's problematic at least understand what he's saying and then judge for yourself If you say, all right, I understand that he is, you know, I understand that he's fighting for social justice for the value of black lives in America. I just don't agree with that. That's one thing. If you understand that, right?

But if you're understanding, if you don't care to understand what he's even fighting for, you're just saying, I don't agree with that because this headline makes it seem an American or anti-military or anything like that, which I don't think anyone wants to, you know, be. un-American. I feel like everyone wants to be patriotic. I mean, who wants to to who's not their own team? Against our, our certain people put their lives in life for us. I was just saying yeah, no one's trying to root against their own team like no no I think I think that that was never that was never the goal but I do feel like you know you're able to see kind of narratives being usurped and changed and and I think that's what you all have to be mindful of. I think educating yourself, even, you know, this is everyone. This is black people, white people. Anyone who is, you know, valuing truth, I think you have to kind of do

research for yourself and say, all right, let me, before I even speak on something, let me understand, what is this person talking about? What are they, what values they're promoting? Do those values align with my own? If they do, what can I do to help? If not, then I'm not going to to add you know any sort of fuel to a fire of the vision and the visiveness and that that sort of thing i feel like that's super important but you have to first understand what you're talking about yeah one thing i learned one like in terms of education which you're talking about one thing i learned in college was the idea of like social constructs blew my fucking mind because i thought that society was just this is how it is and i didn't realize that like society can like create a gender

or like can tell you that like you know women can't do this or and I was like doing research recently about just race and I learned how basically like race is a social construction yeah it's definitely a social construct but it has real ramifications real ramifications but the way it started was it was created in order like for money and power to create a hierarchy and say, like, obviously, it's embracing, like, everyone's different, but it was a social construct to say, like, this race is, you know, better than this race so that they can organize it and have an excuse to, like, take advantage of people and stuff. The stereotypes and shit that comes with race was, like, a social construction

so that, like, white people in the beginning could, like, have slavery. And I think what you have to do is, for me, as an individual, once you figure out like okay these are these are social constructs at play now a do i buy into them do i do i understand them um but then educate myself on the different angles that people may come to that conversation with right understand you know what the uh inherent advantages and disadvantages of those constructs are in your society um and to your previous point understanding all right if these things you know marginalized certain people over time the accumulation of that marginalization has an effect on

the community of those people now how do I as you know someone who is trying to be conscious in 2020 help you know with the balancing of that of that ill effect that that takes care it it takes a certain level of research and intellect, but I think more than anything, it takes empathy, right? It takes empathizing with someone who may not, you know, on the surface look like you. But even Luke and I don't look the same, but I feel like we're able to talk about things that allow us empathy, you know, within kind of our own circle. And then, you know, he has his conversations with him. I have my conversations with my family, but just having different people in your life where you can

talk about whatever you know whatever um kind of question you may be having that you may not inherently understand i think those things are those things are super important and constantly questioning things like even i was recently learning about just like how the business of jail and how like i just thought that like when you do bad things you go to jail like that's what we're You should watch, you should watch 13th by Abilad de Venet. That's probably one of my, one of my, one of my, one of my, I think, most impactful documentaries about the topic of mass incarceration. I think that is something that should be required viewing for everyone. You know, I think understanding, you know, this is people, I mean, these, these, these.

These are people who, for lack of a better term, haven't been given the fairest shake. But then are asked to achieve the exact same in society. I think that is, that's unfair to be as mild as possible. What needs to happen is when you have understanding of like some of the social ills that we were talking about, you can then say, all right, this still exists today. All right, how can I really apply myself to helping this cause? Mass incarceration comes from a few different social problems, right? I think funding for education, that's one area.

you know, laws that are selling the books that maybe shouldn't be reformed. That's another area. You see what I'm saying? So like there's multiple layers to addressing that mass incarceration problem that like schools a pipeline. All that sort of stuff has a cause. You know, we can't just focus on the effect. We have to address the causes and really invest time and resources and love into fixing

some of the problems. But I do feel like it's on. saw on all of us, man. I find myself, you know, doing research on trying to figure out what part I can play, you know, in terms of obviously educating myself, but then, you know, putting forth that knowledge to good use. There are petitions that exist, their donations to be made, their marches to attend, there's books to be read. You know, there's all these things to do individually. But then you have to understand kind of how that fits into the whole way. And I don't know.

I'm just so excited to have you on because I feel like at first you're like, I don't know if you should get into that much. You're so well-spoken and like well-versed on so many different things. And from your- I mean, I think what for me, what I always want to, I always want to stress that lived in. experience is the best education right when I have to when I have to look at these these topics that might be social topics of today from the lens of all right I have family I myself resemble the people who are dealing with some of these

issues as a black man in America how do I approach fixing some of these problems. How do I educate myself on these problems? How do I understand the root of the problem? Because if I don't, how am I able to help? How am I able to be of service? If I were to be, let's say everything works out, I'm able to get great opportunities as far as the acting career

as I want. I'm able to achieve a certain level of what people would deem success, but I'm not able to contribute anything to the conversation of humanity for all people, I think that would be a failure. I think for me personally, my mom would think the self-indulgence of fame and success detracted from the humanity of who wrote to me was supposed to become. I think that would be tragic. So for me, it's really understanding that the life that I'm living, the experiences that I'm having,

you know conversations with police all that stuff is to help shape a better future right when you were talking about my bio i think i say something about leaving things better than i found them i don't remember exactly um but that would tie into that right yeah um you know i think it's part of i can speak for myself it's part of my job while i'm here to achieve success for something right to know that that I'm contributing to this other conversation. And hopefully that can all come together. Hopefully I can be an artist and have something to say with my artistic talent.

And people will also value what I'm doing for the cause of humanity. That may not be. That may not align. There may be detrimental repercussions one way or another. But I feel like you need to always be truthful to yourself first and foremost. foremost, right?

I think I'm with a team of people who are like-minded in terms of understanding that helping humanity doesn't make you less than artistic talent. My agency, I think, would respect how I feel about, you know, wanting the world to be better. I think my agency, I was super proud of them posting words. of support and allyship, I think as an artist, you're looking for how people respond in times like these. You're noticing silence. You're noticing support. You're noticing, like, for me, I value all the conversations I've had with, like, the people who follow me having, like, access to me and being able to DM and say, look, you know, I appreciate you speaking on this,

or just having questions or having conversation, I think that's what, if I were to understand, social media, that's what it's for for me, you know, is to understand that, like, that's the, someone explained to me, like, when I was first trying to, like, get on social media, that wasn't on for many years, but when I got on, someone said, look, the reason why you should, you should have a social media presence is, it is basically how people can communicate with you, like, years ago, you would want to have communicated with an artist that you felt moved you in some way. You would have had to write a letter, join a fan, club you're like now people can use their phone and say hey i really appreciate what you did with

this or i like you know what you said about this or i saw you at this place and i said hello those are all connection points that i truly value so i'm super thankful and you know people are like excited about the work that i didn't like man skeletal tour was crazy and could i put a lot into that right i'm not i'm not one that's like i know i don't care about my work and i care a lot I really, I really do value my crap, you know, and when people are moved by it, I want to be able to have that connection. I think that's super important. I think that was beautifully said and a perfect transition for our final game because

we've been on for three hours, just solving the world's problems. I'm just grabbing my computer charger. we're going to play Seven Deadly Sins. Are you ready? If you survive the purge, I feel like you might be able to survive this. We'll see. I have to plead. It's a different kind of pain. Okay. What are you greedy about? I would say I'm greedy about like who and what I give my emotional energy to

like I feel like not everything deserves a response not everyone deserves a response I really feel like when I do invest in something or someone I give all of myself like if you have my cell phone number if we're friends, if we have ever been friends, I think I show up for people. So, yeah, I truly

believe that when I apply myself to something, it's something that I feel matters, whether it's a cause or a movement, whether it's a person, whether it's a friend, a family member, whoever. Who don't you respond to? I don't respond to people who leave with hate in any arena. I don't respond. typically the people who are self-indulgent or self-involved that to me that to me speaks to a greater like you're serving a you're serving yourself as a God like you you have a real a real bias or skewed perspective you don't feel like a dick because you know kind of what you're dealing with I don't feel like to think like

if I don't respond to you, it's because I see something that I personally don't want in my space, an energy or a vibe that I don't really agree with. And I think that sort of stuff is truly cancerous. Like, if you allow negative energy, negative vibes continuously in your space, how can you ever achieve to, how can you ever hope or aspire to achieve something positive? Right. Have you ever heard that you, you are the, the summation of the five people you spend the most time to give the most attention to. So if you have like three people who you know are negative, you're like, man, you're that thing, you're negative,

you don't, you know, care by anything outside of yourself, you're selfish, you're this, you're that, you can constantly tell them about themselves, that's more than 50% of the people who inspire and kind of voice, and who you are. Mm-hmm. It's the space in your brain is like your own conversations you have with yourself and other conversations you're having with those people. And that's like where decisions and energy and actions like stem from.

Exactly. Crazy if it's wrong people. But think about it, right? If you have those people who aren't thinking about like we were talking about causes and humanity and stuff outside of yourself, right? How can you have conversations with them? about those sort of things because that's not what they're thinking about. So you guys are talking about things that are in your own world, right? So those conversations are never going to happen

there. So you're not really growing. You're not being stretched. You're not expanding your, even just your own consciousness. You're kind of staying trapped in whatever it was that kind of brought you two together. Yep. Yeah. I think that's like so many friendships are like that. I'll be talking to someone. I was like, I don't even like them anymore. And I feel my energy being sucked out by them. But like a couple years ago, we actually were in a similar place, but it's okay to grow. I just, I asked you that because I'm so bad at like not responding to people, even when I feel like I'm being used or I'm being like pushed out of, like, uncomfortable for some reason. Like, did you just say you can know that you're being used

and like respond? You know. Nah. Well, this is the thing. It's like, because I have a following now, I'm able to help people. But it's like checking. Oh, in that way. Okay. Yeah. But it's like check my messages. Like,

I'll have like 10 messages a day just like asking something of me to help. Got you. No, I have like. It could just be like, can you promote my business or can you, you know, send this message to my friend?

And I don't have that. I have like authentic conversations. I only have like three people following. So it's like it's a very different. I'm able to talk to like everyone that I, But I will respond, even though, yeah, you know, so we're talking on, like, a personal level at this point. Yeah. I can't even, like, I'm not there.

I can't even put myself in your shoes. Real friends, though, you start seeing them shift in terms of ways of being like, oh, this person just cares about, like, what success is coming in my life, not like, are you good? Are you okay? It's just like, oh, has this, is this happening or is this happening? And it's like, is that all you care about in my life? Is if I'm, like, making money or, like, doing well. Got you. I have a random question for you.

Did you have witches in your family? No. Like, did you, you know what? I know what you're talking about, but, like, for me, my family was. Every culture has, like, you know, in Italy, they have the no-na. Like, did you have. Every culture, I mean, Caribbean culture, we have lore, we have, you know, especially folklore that speaks to magic. And you have to understand how Caribbean countries were formed, right?

These came from a mixture of stannies. You have traditional natives of certain places, certain islands. Then you have a mixture of Africans who were enslaved and brought. over so they came with their own ritual and culture and customs so all these things mixed and they mixed with Christianity that was brought and given so that that mixture does derive senses of magic and and things that are outside our understanding but for me for my family personally we were Christian so I grew up in a Presbyterian church in Antigua and when I was in

New York, we went to First Presbyterian in Freeport, Long Island, that was my church home. So that's my family experience, but everyone's going to be different, right? I'm just saying I wouldn't be surprised because you're very empathetic if you had some people that were special in terms of, you know, understanding. I wouldn't doubt it. I wouldn't doubt. I do feel like the way things have happened, I do feel a protection over me. I do feel like I can go into spaces that others may be afraid of and feel like I'm armed. You know, I think I'm armed with, you know, the love of the Lord. I feel like I'm armed with my mom's love. I feel like there have been ancestors who are looking over me.

You know, I do truly feel that. But I don't know anyone personally like, hey, bro, I got you. Don't even worry about it. Like that audition, don't even prepare. Just go in the wing. you know, you'd be all right. I don't have that. The words will come to you.

The words will come. Like, just, you know, just touch the page. I don't personally have that experience, no. Okay, well, next question. Sorry, I needed to ask that. Of course. Because my witch senses, we're saying that you have witches and your family.

Good wishes. I appreciate it. I appreciate this for the love, so I take it. Who are you envious of? I'm not envious. I'm kind of envious dude. I'm thankful for everything that I have. Envious of.

I'm envious of, I'm envious of anyone who, like, can have a conversation with their mom about something. Meaning, I'm like, real, I'm real envious of, like, I feel like that, that's a special bond. you know and I feel like that's something that I would be interested in seeing for myself like that's something that I'm like oh man I would want that um it's like someone who could pick up the phone called their mom but like hey I'm struggling with this you know I have my aunt so I'm I'm thankful for that my aunt is my heart um and definitely I owe a lot to to her uh to her love and her guidance but that that's probably something I would look at and be like, oh, this is just interesting.

It makes me cry thinking, like, yeah, your aunt has stepped up in a way that, like, probably saved your life in. Yeah, no, definitely. She's a special life, but she gave me a home. She gave me, you know, I could have went to Europe and been in London with my family there. I believe that that was on the table at the time. And I remember thinking that that could also work. I love my family in the UK.

But I felt, I felt as though I had the infrastructure at that time with my cousins being similar age and, you know, I would have went to school with them and so on and so forth. I kind of inherited some of their friend groups. It was just a good, you know, it felt, it felt right. And they valued my feeling at a young age. I think it worked out. But yeah, outside of that, I don't know. know who I would be envious of outside of that. Oh, people, people who, like a, people who are creatively super free, like, like a childish

Gambino, Donald lover, you see what I'm saying, where I can take risks and be kind of, um, just, he's not playing by pre rules. He's not waiting for anyone to say it. It's okay. And that's, that's super inspiring for me. Like that, that I can say for sure, because people, like that inspiring me to go out and create to write to you know not wait for the next big opportunity or big role but instead partner with other creatives like i may just call you up and be like

yo hannah i just want to try something comedic like me a comedic video i've never done that before and i'm terrified of what that looks like you know but i have trained an improv and i love that and i have a good team that worked and you know what i'm saying like i can see myself doing something like that because I like the challenge of stepping outside of my first seat box, just for myself. So people who are creatively free is attractive. Yeah, and connecting with a creative community, something you're scared of someone else might not be and be like, I've done this before.

Come on. Yeah, right. And you just need that. Like, there's so many people. The reason I did stand-up was because my friend just goes, I was supposed to do a live podcast at Caroline's. And my friend goes, open with 10 minutes of stand-up. And I was like, no.

and she was like yes do it and like that's how up again it was my friend that's how you got on stage the first time i did stand up was in front of 250 people at caroline um it was my people first of all let's just clap it up one time for hannah burn now i'm a crazy person i'm like i didn't realize till after that like you're not supposed to just do 10 minutes you're supposed to like do open mics with like two minutes of jokes then get your first five minutes And after, like, two years, get 10 minutes. And I was like, I have shit to say. I'm here.

That's why, like, Godcham, you know. Listen. I love him, like, because he didn't play by the rules of, like, oh, well, you can't really be an actor and a singer. Or you can't, like, he just was like, this is what I feel and this is what I'm going to do. And I'm not going to wait for someone to say I'm ready. I even joke, like, I love Lil Dickie. Like, I'm not, like, I've been known about him for so long, but. Dave's a great show, by the way.

Yeah. I love that. that show, but most stand-up comedians would say you're not ready to get a show bought unless you've been writing for six years, even on stage for eight years. Little Dickie started doing videos, didn't even do stand-o comedy, wrote his own, he wasn't like a writer for shows for years. He just fucking did what he wanted to do. I think he's great. That first season of day was something special. I found a lot of inspiration in that. I thought the way they tackled mental health, I think Gata as a character, also, you know, having that authentic life

experience being brought to the screen in that way, and having him lead that episode, not being like, I need to tell this through the gaze of Dave, I thought that, that's how you do that. So my hats went off to them. I remember seeing that and being like, yeah, this is, this is what Arkin do. Arkin speak to these conversations. But it was probably scary for them. Yeah. But you got to take that risk, you got to speak that truth, you know, and people will gravitate towards it because it comes from that authentic place, right? And also comes from an understanding and an empathy that I feel like we need, we need in TV. We need

different voices to get us into stories, right? I think it was important to see. see a black, you know, long-haired, dreaded, tattooed, human being lead the conversation on mental health in that particular universe, right? That to me mattered a lot, right? And I think we'll continue to see kind of those inclusive sort of stories lead the way because they're infinitely more interesting. They're the world that's around us, not like the world that we want to paint, you know? Yeah, that characters are so much more complex than, like, tokenizing

like a female or a black guy or whatever stereotype you're trying to just, like, be a little more interesting. Exactly, exactly. When was the last, no, what are you gluttonous about? Oh,

overindulition. Ice cream. Every day, all day, twice on Sundays. I love, I love ice cream. I'm a connoisseur, though. It's not like, like a light subject. This is like something I'm passionate about. You know, like some people have mine. Inform me a little. Huh? Inform me a little bit. What do I need to be shoving?

What do you want to know? Like places? You're talking about like, like, I'm a odd fellow's fan. I'm a Morgan Stewart's fan. I'm, you know, ice and vice. Like, what do you want to know? I was, there was an ice pop up right by my apartment in Long Island City. A ship was hot. You live in the dream, man. Like, for me, I feel like ice cream is something I indulge it. I've always loved ice cream. Back in Guyana, I remember ice cream, you scream, we all scream for Igloo Ice Cream. Igloo Ice Cream was, it came in a tub that was about like this big.

It was, for everyone who's listening, maybe a half a foot deep and about as round as a frisbee. and the creamiest ice cream, I will never forget Igloog ice cream. That, to me, began the love affair, and now it's taking me across the world, man. Like, if I would have a show, it would be a show on ice cream. I would travel the globe, you know, tasting gelatoes and just ice cream. What's your favorite, like, go-to flavor, and then, like, your favorite, like, you're feeling a little frisky flavor. That's impossible. I think ice cream has become like artisan, right?

You have people who make seasonal ice cream where they're playing with flavors. You have, you know, infinite numbers of possibilities now of, you know, non-dairy, you know, I think it's just too much to say I have a favorite flavor without it being like chocolate. You know what I'm saying? Like, chocolate is my favorite flavor. That was a very basic ice cream question to ask. The rookie question. I'll forgive it.

Notchiola. Geola? Nochiola, the, or whatever it's called, the hazelnut flavor of gelato. I fuck with. Oh, got you, got you, got you, got you, yeah. Okay, when was the last time you experienced extreme wrath or anger? Well, I guess I like that. to consider myself a peaceful person, but the, I think the idea of seeing justice not be served in any

capacity infuriates me. That bothers me to my core. I feel as though, you know, you're seeing a society where you know, we've ever seen lives being taken and no accountability. I think that that needs to change. That that's angering. And then bullying. I think anytime I see somebody who identify as a bully, that bothers me. That in the moment, nothing makes me anger than seeing somebody to try to bully

somebody else. As normally something you're witnessing, not something for me that I'm feeling in the moment is happening to me, but seeing it infuriates me. Yeah. If that makes any sense. No, 100%. And that's part of like your empathy and knowing how it feels and how it affects everyone around you. When was the last time you were a sloth? So like lazy?

You talk about like quarantine? I'm in the sloth every day. What's the other question is that? I'm doing this interview from the last. couch. Like we're looking at each other. I'm on my couch. What sort of questions are these? This was written before quarantine, okay? What we're doing in the middle of quarantine in New York City? I have not left the apartment. What's one thing you've been doing to stay like healthier sane despite us being all grocery slots? I have I have dumbbells right here.

I have dumbbells. I've been doing push-ups. I have like an ab mat. I'm like doing my my little ab circuit my bicycles and stuff like that you do it the same time every day I don't do it the same time every day I do it when I feel called to do it I'm not disciplined in that way

in quarantine normally if I'm going to the gym I like have a gym time I'm afraid if I waited for someone to call on me to do it I would never be called on by anything nothing we'll call this bitch to do that that. I either have to like part yourself. I'll like half ask so many YouTube tutorials or just

like get distracted real quick. But um. But what did you do for a tennis? Like whatever your tennis I love playing tennis. The work, the like working out was always like the work, you know? Like so now even now I've been saying fit by trying to play tennis with my friend because I love tennis and then workouts just feel like a chore or it makes me miss like, oh I wish I missed when I was working towards like wanting to be a champion. Like I still get weird with that because I haven't worked through all of it. Super competitive even if it's with yourself. Like why am I doing squats? Like my thighs don't need to be strong to like get a drop shot. But they need to look good though right now now you're doing it for the look. Yeah but then if you get obsessed about doing things for looks

you'll drive yourself crazy. That's a fact yeah that's true. Um final question when was the last time you lusted over someone. I don't last one lusted over someone. I try to keep lust in like the confines of like relationships so it keeps me focused on

the other person. So I'm not really not really I think I try as much as possible to not look outside of my relationships to find to find anything.

Let me think on that. I want to come up with it. Who is your celebrity crush? A celebrity crush? Don't get shy with me. I think everyone's beautiful. So I'm trying to think of like, I'm trying to think of like.

The little devils who are listening who want to know if they should slide in your DMs or not want to know what is your type? I like, I mean, Georgia Smith, I think, is beautiful, if I can think off the top of my head. Do you know what Georgia Smith is? No. Singer. Who else?

What kind of singer is she? She's like, I would say solo R&B, British. Oh, yeah, she's gorgeous. Yeah, I just think her vibes, I'm more, I'm kind of, anyone who has talent and intellect, I think, is kind of who I'm trying to be around. Talent and intellect, I find supremely attractive. Have you heard that there shouldn't be two headshots in a relationship? Do you agree or disagree? There shouldn't be two headshots?

someone was like, has told me before if you have two headshots as in two people who are like two entertainers that it won't work well I that's why even to answer the question I was kind of like I don't really have a celebrity

because I never thought I would be in the space of like dating entertainers or dating someone who you know I date people who I think stoke an intellectual file. People I can talk to people who are like dope family members, you know, to their family.

Like I pay attention to stuff like that. Like, how do you fit into your overall family? Oh, you don't talk to any of your cousins or any of your sisters or any of your brothers? They're all crazy. Okay. You know, that's like a red flag for me. I know how close I am to my family, my cousins,

and like the people who help. You're so right. Because when I was, I was like, this guy's hot. Who cares? Who cares, right? Yeah, no, no. Family just owned him. Who cares?

And then I was like, oh, there's a reason. There's a reason. And you find out in the most unfortunate ways. Like, it manifests itself in the most terrible ways. Oh, my God. Yeah, it matters. Like, people go make sure they have a good family. I was like, I don't care if his mom's a good person.

It's like, no, this shit all is little pieces. into the puzzle that makes the person who they are. It makes them who they are, right? And they owe a great deal to those people. So if they don't really have them in their life, I don't, ah. Now they're extenuating circumstances. Like, not everyone.

Yeah, there are toxic people you should. Yeah, there are toxic people. But it's also, like, we all have fucked up situation to some extent. I like to say it's finding someone whose parents fuck them up in a compatible way to how your parents. In a way that kind of messes with what you are. It's just two beautiful, imperfect love stories. Yeah.

But Rote Timmy, to wrap this up, I ask everyone this final question. What do you do to cope with your hell? What advice would you give to your hell? My own hell. I got to be honest. I pray. I pray a lot because I feel like, for me, me finding finding ways to strengthen my perspective that I need to release what I perceive

to be weighing me down and submit that to the feet of someone greater and more equipped to handle those those trials and tribulations that that really does something for me personally. So prayer, taking moments of silence and just being, being prayerful, I find to help creating. I think if you can create something when you're struggling, when you're feeling the worst about your prospects, your life, your job, your relationship, whatever, if you create anything. I think you have that innate sort of truism of I'm adding something beautiful to the world, whether that be a song, a sonnet, a painting, a short film, you know, whatever, whatever that is, when you feel that true, oh, kinetic energy of I'm doing this and it's adding something

a little bit more positive to the world and will otherwise be there, I think that changes your outlook on on everything and it kind of gives you a perspective of your ability to contribute i think that's i agree with that's what i find i mean a thousand times a thousand times over even if it's just a fucking tweet it makes you feel yeah that you've given something i will tell you that truth right now i like i have looked at some of the things that you you know tweet and Instagram and laughed out loud, you know, like not like LOL like people say in a text message when something's like amusing, you know what I mean? Or like makes them smile. Like I'm telling like I had an audible response to something that you wrote. I think having that means

that that that transaction was complete, right? But you put something out to the world. It elicited a human response. I think that's that's important. It's valuable. and I think it adds to society. So I would say for you, keep on, keep on doing more of that. And also keep on using more like not just your comedic voice, but your humanitarian voice. Like your voice that sees humanity as like something worth fighting for. I think I want to continue to encourage you to do that.

Thank you. I do think I always felt like I wanted my voice to be heard. and the first way I've done it is through making people laugh and now I realize like during this movement I'm like I have a voice that does need to be heard in other ways too and it's funny though with the tweeting I don't tweet unless I get called to

at least I don't have I literally will tweet it the most random fucking times I will not be called to work out but I will be sitting in bed and be like I have some shit to say it'll be taking weeks I don't like, anyway, so you'll go on Twitter and you'll see me have like 20 tweets in a row and people will message you and be like, are you good? Like, are you okay? And I literally spiring them all in the best I've ever been. Like it's like depression, anxiety. And I'm like, I'm creating. I'm the happiest I ever am. People think I'm like spiraling and I'm like,

no, no, no. No, no. This is a manic creative moment. And it's the biggest high I could have in life is creating, and then someone like you being like, I fucking laughed out loud. Yeah, no, I mean, I need to hit you up more and like let you know exactly, like, you know, kind of those. Give me an L-O-L, Jesus. Yeah, no, I need to be better about that. I'm engaging more socially as far as social media. Don't, don't worry.

I'm doing a slightly better job. But I'm better about texting, so I'll do that. Yeah, hit me up. Where can people follow you to follow. your career, any projects that you think they should watch that you've done that's available? Follow me, Instagram, wrote to me Paul, R-O-T-I-M-I-P-A-U-L on Instagram. And then on Twitter, it's wrote to me A-P-A-P-A-U-L. So that's, I think the social, I think, I don't know what the Facebook is, but if you put my name

it, I'm sure it'll come up. They're creepy. And they're creepers. They're creepers. Like, we can find anything if we want. We are in fact of reporters. Do you have any shorts or anything on YouTube that people can watch?

I think the last short that I did is out on, it's on Amazon Prime. It's on Amazon Prime. It's called Brooklyn Park. I'm really proud of that particular film. It was a departure, obviously, from, like, the Skeletor and that. sort of the fresh. It's a different...

The scalatory state under the Brooklyn Bridge. Yeah, yeah. It's a completely different, I think, challenge to be intimate and reserved and hold on to emotion instead of dispel emotion at other characters in the world. So I think, you know, for people who have seen the first bird, I think that that short would be a cool departure from that and to see something a little different. other than that I'm creating you know I think right now I'm writing a friend a friend of mine is coming together with me on writing a show we have the concept for a show kind of

about our life experiences in a weird way that we're working on and that's been super inspiring throughout you know so quarantine time that and that and and working on a documentary about my dad. So other than that, you know, when Newsef comes out, I'll put it on the socials and go from there. Hell yeah, well, this was one of the longest podcasts I've probably ever done, but my thing is, when it's going, I keep going.

When the vibes are, you gotta keep vibe in. And we covered everything and more. Rottimi was scared to go on. Do you regret it or are you okay? It wasn't that bad. You know, we talk about taking a trip to hell. It's like, all right, this can go so many ways. But thank you for being kind, I guess.

Thank you for walking me through hell. Like, you held my hand. That was important. We took a stroll. Yeah, it was cool. You know, I felt like it didn't get too hot. It wasn't unbearable. I don't know if I want to camp out in hell, but it was so difficult to visit.

And no, thanks for having you, man. It was dope. And I appreciate you as a human. And, you know, I look forward to actually being able to hang out in person and not, like, the virtual Zoom thing. I know. Well, good news. Summer House just got announced.

We got renewed. So maybe you'll have to roll through to the Hamptons and hang out with me and Lou. You told me you guys are going to be back at it. So I can't wait. No, maybe I'll see you before in Minnesota. I'll start looking about maybe heading out for a little bit, depending on how things they're up and if travel is possible. Let's discuss, because I don't know yet if I want to or can go, but we'll see.

Maybe the drive is the better way, like renting a car or something like that. I don't know. I know. It's difficult, but also that sounds like a pandas too, but we could stop for so much ice cream. There we go. So now you're thinking. We can find the best place in each state. Okay, I'm not a bad influence, though.

Everyone gains weight when they hang out with me. But anyway, everyone to follow Roe Timmy. Thank you so much for coming on. I'm going to put this on YouTube. We've got so many great interviews coming up. Stay tuned. Thanks for coming to hell. I'll talk to you guys later.

Bye. Bye. Thank you.