Betrayal - Dr. Kerry, Part 1 | Betrayal Weekly

Episode Date: October 3, 2024

Grieving widow Dr. Kerry McAvoy struggles to find love after loss. But then, she meets Caesar. If you would like to reach out to the Betrayal Team, email us at [e-mail] and follow us on Instagram at @betrayalpod See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey, it's Joel and Matt from How to Money. If your New Year's resolution is to finally get your finances in shape, we've got your back. Prices, they're still high. And the economy is all over the place. But 2026 is the year for you to get intentional and make real progress. That's right.

Yeah, each week we break down what's happening with your money, the most important issues to focus on. And the small moves that make a big difference. Kick off the year with confidence. Listen to How to Money on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm John Polk. For years, I was the poster boy of the conversion therapy movement. The ex-gay who married an ex-lesbian and traveled the world telling my story of how I changed my sexuality from gay to straight. You might have heard my story, but you've never heard the real story. John has never been anything that gay, but he really tried hard not.

to be. Listen to Atonement, the John Polk story on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Dr. Priyanko Wally. And I'm Hurricane de Bolo. It's a new year. And on the podcast's health stuff, we're resetting the way we talk about our health. Which means being honest about what we know, what we don't know, and how messy it can all be. I like to sleep in late and sleep early. Is there a chronotype for that, or am I just depressed? Health stuff is about learning, laughing, and feeling a little less alone. Listen on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A new year doesn't ask us to become someone new.

It invites us back home to ourselves. I'm Mike Delarocha, a host of sacred lessons, a space for men to pause, reflect, and heal. This year, we're talking honestly about mental health, relationships, and the patterns we're ready to release. If you're looking for clarity, connection, and healthier ways to show, up in your life. Sacred Lessons is here for you. Listen to Sacred Lessons with Mike Delaroach on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. One of the other things he did in that first date that was odd, as he said to me, I'd been researching widows. And my thought was, oh, he saw that about my profile. He's been going out to understand my particular issues. Now,

looking back, I think it means something else. But I didn't know that at the time. I'm Andrea Gunning, and this is betrayal, a show about the people we trust the most, and the deceptions that change everything. Carrie McAvoy is a clinical psychologist based in Michigan. I saw clients in private practice for nearly 20 years. What was exciting about working with clients was that I could see really dramatic shifts in a relatively short time when there was a lot of motivation and effort. And to me, it felt like a sacred privilege to work with them.

Even though she studies human behavior for a living, she found herself caught in a web of lies and manipulation. Everyone somehow assumes a psychologist are above human, superhuman. We should know we should be excellent reads of people. Yeah, I'm good reads of people. But when it comes to myself, I'm not always so good because then my personal perceptions get involved. Anyone can fall for something like this.

You just haven't met the sophisticated enough predator. And when Carrie was at her most vulnerable, she met a predator who would derail her own life. Carrie grew up on a dairy farm in Michigan. I think it had an active herd of 60 cows, and we were expected to be a part of the milking process. So my three sisters and I went to work and started farming along with my dad. She was the oldest of her three sisters. We were supposed to be good girls. And out of the good girls.

I was known as the best, the goodest, the one that did everything right, the teacher's favorite. On the outside, they were an idyllic American farming family. But there was abuse and neglect going on in the family. There was secrets that we were keeping. Carrie and her little sister were being abused by a family member. Her and I had shared a room and the abuse was going on in the room and either it would be she was hurt or I was hurt. It was a trauma that she was. shaped Carrie's worldview.

She retreated into herself, and her safe space was school. She channeled all of her energy into becoming a straight-Aid student. When she was 14, she read a magazine article about psychology. I thought, that's it. That's what I want to be. I want to be a psychologist. I really wanted to sort of decode a person. She knew it would take years of school to earn a PhD in psychology, and that became her singular goal. So I did college in three years.

I probably could have done it in two and a half years because I was moving so fast and getting credit so fast. Between my freshman and sophomore year, I worked up north at a tourist town in northern Michigan, City of Maconaw Island, and that's where I met Brad. She hadn't dated much before college. High school guys just didn't understand her.

But Brad seemed different. He and I started talking. And sure enough, we just clicked. By the end of the night, we were around a bonfire telling ghost stories, and I was really tired, so I laid my head on his knee. He put his hand on my shoulder, and I felt like I came home. It was an amazing feeling. After that night, they were inseparable.

He was really loyal. He was the kind of guy. If he told you, I'm going to help you move, which he did do that. He would tell people, even people he didn't know very well. I'm going to help you move. If he woke up that morning with the stomach flu, he would still go to help you move. So you could just count on him. He was a man of his word.

When she got into a PhD program in California, Brad went with her. Brad had a big belief in me. He was like a cheerleader, champion of me. If I wanted to do something, he supported that. And in graduate school, she needed his support. I would literally fall into bed at night, almost in tears. because I'd work the whole day, get up, do it again, while you're trying to get ready for exams and have papers written, and you have, of course, reading lists that are impossible to get through.

It was so hard. And Brad created space for that. He never once complained about my lack availability. He just was super supportive. She earned her PhD in clinical psychology, and she got her first job in the field, working at a psychiatric hospital. I got to see psychopathology class on display. What did a borderline personality look like? What did bipolar disorder? What do the different subtypes that schizophrenia look like? What does it look like when someone has a psychotic break?

She was getting a lot of experience. And in the meantime, she and Brad decided to start a family. Over the next few years, they had three sons. But pregnancy took a toll on her body, one that she was not expected. I had a massive hair shed where I lost most of my hair from that pregnancy. It was a shock, so here I am, weaning my two-year-old, and my hair is falling out, which was devastating. Just devastating. I mean, we literally evaluate women on the quality of their hair.

For me to know this is not changeable, I'm not ever going to get this back. I'm going to have to face the world like this. It took me over 10 years to deal with it. Even though she had wigs, the hair loss took away her self-confidence and her sense of self. I became suicidal for a while, not actively, but just like what's the point? You know, I felt trapped by it, struggled to go out into the public. I mean, it was bothering me enough that I had literal nightmares over being found out or having people discover this. I just felt terribly exposed.

But Brad wasn't bothered by it at all. He and their three boys became her refuge. We got a little old camper up on northern Michigan and sat on the lake every summer, and it was fun. It was just a really, really good period of life for us. Busy, but really good. Carrie built her own practice as a clinical psychologist, and Brad worked as a civil engineer. The degree that we had this partnership really shined. We agreed on how we spent money.

We were making good decisions, trying to pay off debt, get rid of my student. allowing those types of things, get in a good financial position. Their priority was saving for an early retirement. Our plan was, once the last child's out of the home, he was going to quit working when we were going to focus more on the last part of our lives. I thought we'd have a second honeymoon. And so that was our plan. When they were both 50, they started working with an architect to design their dream home.

The house, they'd grow old in. And he and I spent an enormous amount of time with an architect designing this really gorgeous, Farm-style house with even part of it with a metal roof so I could listen to the rain. They were about to start construction when Brad got sick. Brad started vomiting just unexpectedly. At first, they didn't think much of it. He kept thinking he knew what it was, you know. He thought he had problems with milk, so he stopped drinking milk.

And then he thought maybe he's gluten sensitive, so he started watching gluten. But the symptoms only got worse. So they decided to see a specialist. They said that we found a tumor, and I knew the news was bad while we were waiting for the biopsy to come back. It was a rare form of stomach cancer. Carrie immediately started researching, preparing a list of questions for the doctors. It was extremely pessimistic, like less than 5% make it five years. So this is terminal.

But no one had seen. said this to them yet. So she asked the doctor directly. I remember going in and sitting across from him in the desk and I said, tell me the truth. Did you just tell me last night that Brad was dying? And he said, yes. I collapsed. And I started weeping. And then, you know, we had this really practical talk about what does that mean? I said, so if he does chemotherapy, how much time will he gain. He said he might live 12 months. And I said, if we don't do chemotherapy, how long will he live? And he said, maybe six. So we walked out and he said, I'm not doing chemotherapy. It just doesn't make sense. I don't want to be sicker. So we then decided we're going to make the best of that time

that we had left. They wanted to go on one last vacation together, just the two of them. They went to Jamaica where they hired a driver to take them to the most beautiful beaches on the island. The chauffeur took us up up on a cliff and let us get out and walk up to the edge. And Brad stood there with Manny. He said, you know, you could do this, don't you? You know you could travel, live abroad, and start again. He wanted her to live life to the fullest after he was gone, to pursue her wildest dreams. That vacation in Jamaica would be one of their last good memories together before his cancer

progressed. I stopped working and just focused on him. And he would say, the taxes are too high. They're too high. We can't afford the tax. He'd like in his stumbling way, he would say that. And it hit me. He's saying it's taxing me too much. This is costing me too much. And then I would look at him and I'd say, if this is Mount Everest, I would carry you up to the top on my back. I can do this. I have it in me to do this. And he's like, okay, okay, okay. And he'd quiet back down again. Five and a half months after the diagnosis, Brad died at home with Carrie by his side.

A former client of mine sent me a note of a Welch word that's heareth. I'd never heard of it before. And it stands for a home that's lost that can never be found again. A homesickness. a home that you're looking for that you can't find. And that's what it felt like. I cried every single day. I didn't know if I would survive the pain.

My chest ached, my heart ached. Her youngest son was a senior in high school. And that Christmas, they were lost without Brad. I didn't know this until we lost him. He was the glue that held us together. We had so little energy that Christmas, we basically handed each other the boxes that they came in from whatever company we bought it from. We couldn't even wrap it. There's just no energy to do that. Before he got sick, the couple had made smart financial decisions to protect their future.

Between Brad's pension, retirement, as well as the life insurance policy, I was set comfortably for the rest of my life. I would never have to work again. But the money was little comfort. She would trade it all just. just to have Brad back. How do you find that again in your 50s? And how do you replace this life that you build? I wanted it back. That's what I wanted. I wanted her life that I had back.

So in her grief, Carrie made a snap decision. And I'm ashamed of it, honestly. But I wanted out of this pain so bad, I started dating really fast, thinking that maybe I could just find someone and put that person in the slot, and this would fix all of this. New year, new goals, and in this economy, a better money plan is more necessary than ever. I am Matt and I'm Joel. We are from the How to Money podcast and every week we help you to spend smarter, save more,

and make sense of what's going on out there. If you want 2026 to be the year you finally feel in control of your money, we're here to give you the tools and advice to help you make it happen. Listen to How to Money on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A decade ago, I was on the trail of one of the country's most elusive serial killers, but it wasn't until 2023 when he was finally caught. The answers were there, hidden in plain sight.

So why did it take so long to catch him? I'm Josh Zeman, and this is Monster, hunting the Long Island serial killer, the investigation into the most notorious killer in New York, since the son of Sam, available now. Listen for free on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Dr. Priyankawali.

And I'm Hurricane de Bolu. It's a new year. And on the podcast's health stuff, we're resetting the way we talk about our health. Which means being honest about what we know, what we don't know, and how messy it can all be. I like to sleep in late and sleep early. Is there a chronotype for that or am I just depressed? We talk to experts who share real experiences and insight. You just really need to find where it is that you can have an impact in your own.

life and just start doing that. We break down the topics you want to know more about. Sleep, stress, mental health, and how the world around us affects our overall health. We talk about all the ways to keep your body in mind, inside and out, healthy. We human beings, all we want is connection. We just want to connect with each other. Health stuff is about learning, laughing, and feeling a little less alone. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Every January, we're encouraged to start over. But what if this year is about slowing down and learning how to understand ourselves more deeply? What if this year is about giving ourselves permission to feel what we've been holding and knowing that it's okay to ask for help? I'm Mike Delocho, host of Sacred Lessons. This is a podcast for men navigating stress, emotional health, fatherhood, identity, and the unspoken pressures were taught to carry a lot. alone. We talk honestly about mental health, about healing generational wounds, and about learning

how to show up with more presence and care. If you want a healthier relationship with yourself and the people you love, then Sacred Lessons is the podcast for you. Listen to Sacred Lessons with Mike Dolorotcha on America's number one podcast network, IHeart. Follow Sacred Lessons with Mike Delarocha and start listening on the free IHeart radio app today. After Carrie McAvoy's husband passed away, she retired early from her clinical psychology practice. Without him, she felt lost and wanted desperately to find love again. It was maybe four to five months after Brad passed away I had my first date. Her first date was with another widower, someone who would understand what she'd been through.

It was a weird date because we just talked about how painful it was being widowed and how much that person had left a hole in our life. It was sweet, I appreciate meeting him, but it was just sort of like I get your pain, but we're not really a match, but thank you for that. It went out with a few other men,

and then I started taking it more seriously. You know, once I got my feet underneath me and figured out what this was like. It was a good distraction. Carrie threw herself into a series of first dates. And so much so that I was getting exhausted. I thought it would be simple to find somebody. I also thought it would be easier

that there would be more compatibility with more people. Brad was always her biggest supporter, not just in her career, but emotionally. And without him, her self-esteem faltered. I'm not a thin woman. I'm highly educated. I actually went out with somebody from my practice for dinner, and she said, you're going to have a hard time finding love again.

You're too smart, you're too educated, and you're too old. And I added in my head, and I'm too fat. Dating again was more difficult than she anticipated. It was becoming too much. I started to become really discouraged. So I decided I needed to take a break, and that I was going to close my dating apps and just stop. But her dating app subscription had just renewed for another three months, and she couldn't get a refund.

So she took it as a sign. So it was literally within a few days of that, that a handsome man's profile passed my preview. His name was Caesar. In his profile picture, he's standing at the top of the Sears Tower. It felt like I was seeing a GQ shoot. He's wearing a knit shirt with slacks. It's almost like he's missing the... coat slung over his shoulder. My first thought of Caesar was he's really good looking,

and he had a look on his face like, I can't wait to meet you. He even listed his deal breakers, right on his profile. No tattoos, no piercings besides earrings, no atheist, and no pet owners. And they even wrote, after going out with a few dates and finding out there's these big discrepancies, I thought it would be more helpful if I just come out and say these are my deal breakers. A little arrogant, But on the other hand, at least use more up front than those who say, I have a super fit lifestyle and want someone who values that, which is code for I want a slim woman. She was amused and attracted to his profile.

But ultimately she decided, this is the person who's out of my league. I felt like I was a solid six next to this nine, and I just passed on by. I didn't swipe left. I just didn't do anything with the profile. But the next day, this was, one of those apps that let you view who viewed your profile. And it said he looked. And I thought,

you know what, why not? Reach out and say something. So I just said, what a nice profile. Seems like you and I had some things in common. They both lived in the Midwest a few hours apart and both had adult children. So she asked him, would you like to see if we have more in common? And he wrote back and he said, yeah, that would be nice. That's how. our connections started. They started talking every day. After a few weeks, it's going great and it's sweet.

He and I both agreed it was time to meet. We decide that we're going to go out to Lake Michigan for the day and just kind of enjoy the beach. I'll pack a picnic for the two of us. That Sunday, they met in person for the first time. He looked just like his photos, handsome, kind eyes, huge smile. She was surprised by his enthusiasm.

He's a very loud person, very charismatic, dynamic person. The introvert in me was like, that's a lot. I felt overwhelmed. My first inclination was like, ooh, wow. I mean, he's gesturing and his voice is booming. Brad, by the way, he was extremely quiet. Our first date, I had to say, if you don't start talking, this relationship's going to go nowhere.

So picture the differences between that. He was a gentleman. He wanted to unload all the picnic supplies she brought. He's swinging something away from me to not let me help. No, no, it's your turn to be taken care of. It's your turn. Okay. So I walked down to the edge of the water with him.

We find a spot and we sit there and we just start to talk. And one of the first things he wanted to talk about was what it was like to be a widow. He said, I'd been researching widows. And my thought was, oh, this is something I would do. I would research widows to understand my partner. I thought, oh, he saw that about my profile. He's been going out to understand my particular issues. Just like his dating profile suggested, he was direct.

He didn't want to waste their time. So he said there were a few things she should know right up front. I need to let you know that I've been married more than once, and I want to do this differently. I want a forever relationship. They talked about how and why his earlier marriage has failed. His explanations weren't very in-depth, but they all seemed reasonable enough. And then he stopped and he said, I came from a really rough home.

And he began to describe some of the dynamics that was happening in the house. He began divulging dark details about his childhood, stories of family secrets and abuse. And I'm thinking, this is a first date. I wouldn't get into this with another person. This is kind of uncomfortable. and I end up thinking, so how much of my history should I be saying? Because he's exposed so much of himself. Will he think I'm being secretive if I don't share that back?

So instead, she turned to the picnic she packed. And to her surprise, I forgot all the cold items in the refrigerator. So here I have this picnic, no meat, no tomatoes, just has bread, lettuce, chips, and fruit. Everything else is missing. So much for their picnic lunch. Because I was feeling one of those moments like, oh, no, I blew this date. And he's like, no, no, this is no big deal.

And then he suggested at the end, let's go out to eat and see a movie because we were starving by that point. She liked that he was flexible. He was going with the flow. After dinner and a movie, he handed her a gift. It was a dozen wild rose blossoms without stems. He said, now you can kick them home and dry them and create some. popery, so we have a memory of our first date together. So it was just this really romantic over the top sort of experience that was fabulous. And with that, he kissed me on the cheek and said, you know,

I hope you sleep well. It's so nice to meet you and then left. They immediately started making plans for another date. He was really good at planning things. He took me to Mall America, went through the aquarium. We did like a little amusement park ride and he took me to one of his favorite. restaurants. So every weekend felt planned. Another weekend he took me to this national park, the waterfalls, to show me one of his favorite places. And it just was romantic. As the dates went on, it was clear there was an elephant in the room. The fact that Carrie didn't work. He started to like, do you have like financial issues? Are you in trouble? Do you need a loan? Are you all right? I said, no. No, I'm okay. Actually, the opposite is true. I don't need to work. I,

came into a lot of money when Brad died. And then, without thinking, she said the number. And the minute I did that, I had this deep shame flood over me. It's like you've made a really grave error here. You've divulged something super private. Now you'll never know why this person's in a relationship with you. Is it for the money or is it for you? She watched him to see if he'd change, if he'd suddenly become overly affectionate

or expect her to start paying for more. And he didn't. He stayed the same easygoing guy. But on some level, she knew she needed to be more cautious. Little things started worrying her. He wasn't a big caller, so we weren't having constant phone calls. They were rare. And we might have a fantastic phone call,

but then I might not hear from him again. I just felt he was hard to reach. Even if I texted him, he wasn't really quick to get back to me. They lived a few hours apart, so when she couldn't reach him for a couple days, her mind would race. It was bothering me so bad that I reached out to a private investigator that I'd hired before, a professional PI. I contacted him and said, I'm dating someone, but I have a question, is he really divorced? The PI ran a background check, and he found that Caesar was single, living alone.

The records also pulled up an old DUI and a string of short-lived jobs. Other than that, nothing particularly alarming. So I'm seeing him shortly after that, and my big conundrum is, do I tell him I did this? Because I just don't like secrets. I just hate them. I just feel like they fester and ruin relationships for you to have something that you know on somebody else. And so I said to him, I've done a background check on you. And I'll never forget, he got really still, like frozen.

And I thought, oh, no, this is going to go really bad. And he said, so what did you learn? And then I started listing. You've had a lot of jobs. You've moved quite a bit. And you have a DUI. And he said, yeah, I did have a DUI and this is what happened. And yeah, I have made some job changes in trying to find the right job.

But I could tell the tension, you could cut it with a knife. It was so tense. And then he called me over to sit beside me. And he started saying, next time you have these types of doubts, come to me first. I started crying and he hugged me. And he said, it's going to be okay. But I want you to come to me first. She was immediately ashamed that she'd gone behind his back.

We got through it, and I really thought that was sweet, and that I was shocked that he wasn't more angry. A few weeks later, he asked her to go steady. That was his word. He asked me in September, can we go study? And I said, yeah, I thought that was really sweet and kind of reminiscent of the past. So they both deleted their online dating profiles

and started seeing each other exclusively. He pushed her to try new things. He took me salsa dancing, actually taught me how to salsa dance, and there was a childishness to him, like a playfulness. His eyes would sparkle, and he'd be so excited when we would do the salsa dancing as I'm trying to struggle with the steps at this big restaurant with everybody learning, and they're all twirling around us. And he just made me feel like it was the most beautiful woman in the world.

One weekend, she'd travel to him, and the next, he'd traveled to her. her. And it started to feel like life in between these dates were really dull and flat. Like I was surviving. And then when I was with Caesar, it felt like the life became colorful and just really rich. Carrie started daydreaming about starting fresh and moving somewhere closer to Caesar, but her 20-year-old son was still living at home. I called my middle son who had been living with me and I said, you know, I'm thinking of moving. What do you think if we were to move? You and I were to move together. and he said, Mom, I'm really depressed. I'm not doing well.

It sounds great. Let's move. She rented out her place, and they made the move. Caesar had this policy. You don't get to see the kids until we're engaged. But once she moved closer, they decided to break that rule. Their first week in town, Caesar took her and her son out to dinner. And then Caesar just became part of our life.

You know, he would come over after work and hang out with the two of us. got to know the two of us, and it felt good. It felt like a new normal. Caesar would even invite me up for lunch in the middle of his day. Brad would never have done that, which I even thought, wow, he's stopping his day, and then he comes over at night, hangs out and watch TV until he falls asleep, and then he heads home. It just really felt great. Caesar grew up in Mexico and shared his culture with Carrie.

Teaching me how to buy tortillas, teaching me even what a carnita is, and how much fat do you want to have. in it and then introducing chitturons, you know, that I've never had before. Just having this whole new side of things being introduced. It was so, so exciting. Cesar, Carrie, and her son started a tradition of Sunday dinners. He would take me out to a little Mexican grocery store, buy carnitas, buy the tortillas. He would make all the prep, and then we had this little buffet of carnitas together. We would laugh and the three of us would watch movies.

In one of the most tender scenes, the three of us were on the couch and the basement. And in fact, Caesar made sure I noticed this. My son was leaning up against him. And he looked over at me. I just felt like we're family. See? We're a family. Even my own son loves him.

New goals. And in this economy, a better money plan is more necessary than ever. I am Matt. And I'm Joel. We are from the How to Money podcast. And every week, we help you to spend smarter, save more, and make sense of what's going on out there. If you want 2026 to be the year you finally feel in control of your money,

we're here to give you the tools and advice to help you make it happen. Listen to How to Money on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A decade ago, I was on the trail of one of the country's most elusive serial killers, but it wasn't until 2023 when he was finally caught. The answers were there, hidden in plain sight. So why did it take so long to catch him? I'm Josh Zeman, and this is Monster, hunting the Long Island serial killer, the investigation into the most notorious killer in New York, since the son of Sam, available now.

Listen for free on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Dr. Priyanko Wally. And I'm Hurricane de Bolu. It's a new year, and on the podcast's health stuff, we're resetting the way we talk about our health. Which means being honest about what we know, what we don't know, and how messy it can all be. I like to sleep in late and sleep early. Is there a chronotype for that, or am I just depressed? We talk to experts who share real experiences and insight.

You just really need to find where it is that you can have an impact in your own life and to start doing that. We break down the topics you want to know more about. Sleep, stress, mental health, and how the world around us affects our overall health. We talk about all the ways to keep your body in mind, inside and out, healthy. We human beings, all we want is connection. We just want to connect with each other.

Health stuff is about learning, laughing, and feeling a little less alone. Listen on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Every January, we're encouraged to start over. But what if this year is about slowing down and learning how to understand ourselves more deeply? What if this year is about giving ourselves permission to feel what we've been holding? and knowing that it's okay to ask for help. I'm Mike Delarocha, host of Sacred Lessons. This is a podcast for men navigating stress, emotional health, fatherhood, identity,

and the unspoken pressures were taught to carry alone. We talk honestly about mental health, about healing generational wounds, and about learning how to show up with more presence and care. If you want a healthier relationship with yourself and the people you love, then Sacred Lessons is the podcast for you. Listen to Sacred Lessons with Mike Dolorotcha on America's number one podcast network, IHeart. Follow Sacred Lessons with Mike DeLocha and start listening on the free IHeart Radio app today. After almost a year of dating, Carrie and Caesar planned their first vacation together.

So we plan a trip over the middle of February to go out to California. And his favorite movie is The Godfather. We found out that Copulas have a winery out there. So we make this reservation that we're going to have a dinner at the winery. And I can tell that he's decided it's going to be something extra special. On the scenic drive to the winery, Caesar seemed almost nervous. Driving up to this long dirt road with the trees beside it, and you come up, it's, you know, dusk, and the lights are on the trees, and it's just beautiful.

And then we're out on the back deck looking up at the moon. and next thing I know I turn around and he's on one knee with an engagement ring held out and said, will you marry me? She said yes. As she looked closer at the ring, she noticed something was off about it. And it was really kind of odd that the ring seemed cheap. And I feel really even bad saying this, but like it's like really cheap. Like I can tell that it's not real metal. It actually started tarnishing my finger.

It was green. It was cheap. and I came out of the bathroom and he happened to be standing there and he bent low and he goes, I know it's not much. I just didn't have much to spend. I didn't want to hold that up

and asking you to marry me, but I will buy you a much better one in a few years. Ultimately, she didn't really care how much the ring cost. She wanted a partnership like the one she had with Brad. And this time around, she wanted to do it differently. With her kids grown,

she could go on adventures, live life to the fullest. I mean, I had this dream that Brad sort of painted for me in Jamaica. That's when she got an idea. Caesar was a Mexican citizen, so marrying him meant she could apply to be a permanent resident of Mexico if they moved there. A really great way to make income last a really long time is to live in a less expensive place. And I thought, I'd already been a landlord. Maybe I can do something similar. So, she approached him with a business plan.

I said to him, have you ever thought about moving back to Mexico? What about vacation rentals? Why don't we do that? And I remember Caesar got super silent, like deathly silent. And he paused for a long second. And then he said, are you serious? You're not making a joke here, are you? I said, no, I'm very serious.

That would be a dream of mine. I would love to do that. They started with a trip to one of Mexico's most popular tourist destinations. We visit outside of Marita, and then we go to Playa, and when we fly into Cancun and drive into Playa, he and I looked each other and thought, this is it. This is where we want to build this company. The entire trip, they did research for their new vacation rental business.

United States of citizens can't own property near the shore. The only way that you can do that is either you buy a lifelong lease as a word for, a Fido Camiso, or you start a Mexican corporation. It had to be two owners, and one had to be a, a citizen of Mexico. So we agreed that we would do that and that we'd open this and run this rental business together. So Caesar helped incorporate the business and Carrie started making offers on rental properties. We find that one property really fell in love with. We made an offer on it. It just starts to feel like it's falling into place. We visit another property. We make a second offer.

And then I even find one more that I want. So we have three houses that we're going to purchase and then we're going to start running them. And my thought was, this is going to be enough income that will become self-sustaining. Carrie supplied all the capital, but she wanted the business to be a real partnership. Here I am starting this new relationship, used to a partnership with Brad, used to having everything work really great, used to being a team. I didn't want to start out with saying, I'm 99% owner, you're 1%. It just felt mean.

Like, how do you start a marriage on that foot? Like, I want to share my life with you, but you're not. don't get to own this company because I'm contributing to the company and you're not. So I made him 50-50 owner. She felt comfortable with this decision, especially because Caesar encouraged her to get a pre-nup. He's saying, you know, I would really feel more comfortable while we're getting married, that you go speak to an attorney and get a prenuptial agreement. I'm thinking, wow, that's really, wow, okay.

So that in my mind said, you're invested in the relationship. You're not so invested in the money. you're invested in the relationship because you want me to protect myself. So she made an appointment with an attorney. The guy sits down with me and he explains prenuptials, how they work. This corporation in Mexico is not governed by U.S. law. It's governed by Mexico. It says that in the corporate paperwork.

All U.S. law, it has no power in the country of Mexico. So I'm going to make a pre-nup on what? It seemed to me like a useless measure. She decided against a pre-up. But for me to have him think of saying that really made me feel like, oh, look, you know, just like on that picnic when we had on that first date, he carried all the stuff, he's thinking of me, he cares about me, this is so sweet. After all, she believed Caesar had the best intentions, and there was so much to look forward to. The rental property company was often running. So the value of Brad's life insurance is now been spent on properties.

She really believed in what they were building together. The last step was getting married, so she could officially become a permanent resident of Mexico. After a trip to the U.S. to tie up Lucenz and finalize the sale of her home, Kerry returned to Mexico. She and Caesar planned to get married the following week. I come back from that trip and Caesar picks me up. He's holding flowers and he's rocking back and forth and he's white.

He's pale. He's jittery. My first question was, does somebody die? That's what it looks like. Like he's going to tell me very, very bad news. And he starts to cry and he says, it just hit me because we're going to get married five days. That I'm still married. And I said, what? On the next episode of betrayal.

I used to think that you were a good guy who sometimes wore a monster man. mask. But what I realize that you're actually a monster who sometimes wears a good guy mask. And they whispers, I'm glad you know. If you would like to reach out to the betrayal team or want to tell us your betrayal story, email us at Betrayalpod at gmail.com. That's Betrayal P-O-D at Gmail.com. We're grateful for your support. One way to show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review Betrayal. Five-star reviews go a long way.

A big thank you to all of our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass Entertainment Group and partnership with IHeart Podcasts. The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fasin. Hosted and produced by me, Andrea Gunning. Written and produced by Monique Laborde.

Also produced by Ben Federman. Associate producers are Kristen Mulcuri and Caitlin Golden. Our I-Hart team is Ali Perry and Jessica Crinecheck. Audio editing and mixing by Matt Delvecchio. Additional editing support from Nico Aruka and Tanner Robbins. Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided by Mib Music.

And for more podcasts from IHart, visit the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Joel and Matt from How To Money. If your New Year's resolution is to finally get to get you. your finances in shape. We've got your back. Prices, they're still high, and the economy is all over the place. But 2026 is the year for you to get intentional and make real progress. That's right. Each week we break down what's happening with your money, the most important issues to focus on, and the small moves that make a big difference. Kick off the year with confidence, listen to How to Money on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm John Polk. For years, I was the poster boy of the conversion therapy movement, the ex-gay who married an ex-lesbian and traveled the world telling my story of how I changed my sexuality from gay to straight. You might have heard my story, but you've never heard the real story. John has never been anything but gay, but he really tried hard not to be. Listen to Atonement, the John Polk story on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu. It's a new year.

And on the podcast, Health Stuff, we're resetting the way we talk about our health. Which means being honest about what we know, what we don't know, and how messy it can all be. I like to sleep in late and sleep early. Is there a chronotype for that, or am I just depressed? Health stuff is about learning, laughing, and feeling a little less alone. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A new year doesn't ask us to become someone new. It invites us back home to ourselves.

I'm Mike Delarocha, a host of Sacred Lessons, a space for men to pause, reflect, and heal. This year, we're talking honestly about mental health, relationships, and the patterns we're ready to release. If you're looking for clarity, connection, and healthier ways to show up in your life, Sacred Lessons is here for you. Listen to Sacred Lessons with Mike Deloach on the IHartRadio app,

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