Betrayal - Jill | Betrayal Weekly

Episode Date: September 18, 2025

Jill’s youngest brother was one of her favorite people, until the FBI exposed the dark truth about him. To find more information about Jill’s work and her podcast, visit https://jillstoddard.com/ If you would like to reach out to the Betrayal Team, email us at [e-mail] and follow us on Instagram at @betrayalpod To access our newsletter and additional content and to connect with the Betrayal community, join our Substack at betrayal.substack.com.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hey, everybody. This is Matt Rogers. And Bowen-Yang. And you're never going to guess who's our guest on Las Culturistas. It is Elle Woods, Tracy Flick, herself. Reese Witherspoon. It must go in a girl's trip.

I have to have a tequila. We must. Oh. Whoever said orange is the new pink. We seriously disturbs. Listen to Los Angeles. Chris Coltrista on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Liz went from being interested in true crime to living true crime.

My husband said, your dad's been killed. This is Hands Tide, a true crime podcast exploring the murder of Jim Milgar. I was just completely in shock. Liz's father murdered, and her mother found locked in a closet, her hands and feet bound. I didn't feel real at all. more than a decade on, she's still searching for answers. We're still fighting.

Listen to Hands Tide on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Hunter, host of Hunting for Answers on the Black Effect Podcast Network. Join me every weekday as I share bite-sized stories of missing and murdered black women and girls in America. Stories like Erica Hunt. A young mother vanished without a trace. after a family gathering on 4th of July weekend, 2016.

No goodbyes, no clues, just gone. Listen to hunting for answers every weekday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Cheryl McCollum, host of the podcast Zone 7. Zone 7 ain't a place. It's a way of life.

Now, this ain't just any old podcast, honey. we're going to be talking to family members of victims, detectives, prosecutors, and some nationally recognized experts that I have called on over the years to help me work these difficult cases. I've worked hundreds of cold cases you've heard of and thousands you haven't. We started this podcast to teach the importance of teamwork and solving these crazy crimes. Come join us in learning from detectives, prosecutors, authors, canine handlers, forensic experts, and most importantly, victims' family members. Come be a part of my zone 7 while building yours. Listen to Zone 7 with Cheryl McCollum on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, Betrayal fans, I have exciting news to share.

Season 3 of betrayal is now a docu-series on Hulu. It's the gripping story of Stacey Tyler and the doctor who betrayed them. See the voices you've come to know in betrayal under his eye, streaming now on Hulu. It was just my daughter and me, the TV and the laundry, and I just remember being on the ground, totally hyperventilating. Having the only panic attack I've ever had in my life. If this could be true and I could have no idea, how on earth would I ever know who the monsters were? I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal. A show about the people. we trust the most and the deceptions that change everything.

Today we have a story about family, about what it means to love someone and to lose them, not to death, but to something much harder to talk about. In some ways it feels harder to grieve for a person who isn't dead. That's Dr. Jill Stoddard. She's a clinical psychologist, a mother, a woman with a close-knit family, and what she always thought was a safe, ordinary childhood. So I grew up in a suburb of Boston, stereotypical middle-class waspy kind of upbringing.

Mom was always home when we got home from school, and even though dad worked hard, he was always home by 6 o'clock for dinner, so it felt like a very normal, intact family. Jill is the oldest. then came her brother John, who was two years younger. And then, when Jill was seven, her youngest brother was born. When my little brother was born, my mom would always say, well, we can't very well name you Jill, John, and Bob.

It just doesn't sound good. And so she named him Jim. And then all of our, you know, holiday cards, everything from that point on whenever my parents signed it, it was their first names and the three Js. From the time he was a baby, Jimmy stood out in the best way. We were all very average-looking brunettes, brown hair, brown eyes. And he had this bright orange hair and bright blue eyes and freckles. And, you know, he was so just stunning looking and adorable.

I feel like he kind of always had a little bit of drool on his face for some reason when he was little. And people would stop us on the street to comment on his hair and how cute he was. Jill adored her little brother. He wasn't just a cute baby. He was a happy baby. He was just this like very lovable, goofy, funny little guy. And one of his favorite things that he would do on command is we would say, happy face. And he would make this like very big, bright, smiley happy face.

and then we'd say mad face, and then he'd make this very mad face. And it just cracked us up. As he got older, Jimmy clearly looked up to Jill and John. They would lovingly tease him. And he played along too. We would yell the word servant, like servant, and then you would hear pitter, pitter, pitter, pitter, pitter, pitter, and he would just come running. And he'd say, go make me some chocolate milk. and he would, like, happily go run and make chocolate milk

because he was, like, just happy to be included, you know? When the family got a camcorder, the kids filmed skits in commercials. One of the skits we would do was Mr. Rogers, and he would play Mr. McPhile and ring the doorbell and say speedy delivery, speedy delivery, and was just, like, always up for anything. Having Jimmy and Tell made everything more fun. Besides his red hair, Jimmy's most defining feature was his laugh.

Not only was he hilarious, but he laughed really easily. And that just always felt so good that even if you're not a person that everyone thinks of as being really funny, when you were with him, you felt really funny. Despite their seven-year age difference, Jill loved his company. I don't ever remember there being a time. where I was like, you're annoying, get away from me. I think even as we both got older, he was still my baby brother. And we were very, very close.

And he was always just sweet and fun and funny. And I'm sure that there were probably times that, you know, I closed my door and was like, get away from me. But those moments aren't the ones she remembers. When Jill thinks back on her childhood, there's Jimmy in the frame. every time, with his messy red hair and his huge smile. Because Jimmy was the baby, Jill says he got away with a lot.

Our parents were a fair amount more permissive with him, which I think is pretty typical of third children, maybe because you're tired by the time you have a third child coming along. You're older. Kind of like been there, done that. You're like less worried, less anxious. As Jimmy got older, he got in trouble more often than we did. And a lot of the things he got in trouble for were not things that my middle brother and I weren't also doing.

He just got caught more frequently than we did. Their mom had a hypothesis about why Jimmy always seemed to get in trouble at school. The teacher's writing on the chalkboard and all the little kids in class are chit-chatting and she turns around to see who the culprit is and you're looking at a sea of brown and blonde heads. You know, your eyes are naturally drawn

to the bright orange-haired kid. There was some sense in it, but it didn't explain why Jimmy was falling behind in school. At some point, my mom told me that she had all three of us IQ tested. She never told us the results or the scores, but she did tell us that Jimmy had the highest IQ, which is not surprising. Like, he was very naturally intelligent,

but he probably did the worst in school, which I would guess, is probably because he had untreated ADHD until he was in high school. And then by then, you know, I think when you have a history of like kind of always doing the wrong thing because you have untreated ADHD, you sort of stop trying to do the right thing. By high school, Jimmy developed a pattern of making excuses. It was hard to tell what was just Jimmy being Jimmy and what was cause for concern. But Jill was hardly around for those years

because she left for college when Jimmy was 11. She studied psychology because she wanted to know how people tick. She called her parents every week and they would give her updates about Jimmy. She remembers one story in particular that gave her pause. He got in a fight with a classmate in high school, I don't remember why. And we like smashed a tennis racket.

I think he might have physically assaulted. did the kid because I remember my dad saying that the family was threatening to sue. So it was more than just an angry outburst that ruined a tennis racket. And so that kind of thing was like the start of us seeing there's something going on with him. At the time, Jill was focused on getting her master's degree. And despite being a troublemaker in high school, Jimmy ended up getting accepted to the same college as his two older siblings. I think I thought of it at the time as like, I'm not his mom. I'm his sister.

Like, it's not my job to figure out how to get him in line. When Jill was accepted into a PhD program, it meant she would need to move back to Boston. So she packed up to move across the country. On the way, she planned to stop at her parents' house for the night. I had driven cross-country with my boyfriend at the time, and we ended up arriving one day ahead of schedule. and we arrived at night to my parents' house and my parents must have been out of town for some reason and Jimmy was having a party

and I walked into the kitchen and there was cocaine on the table. You know, there's a rolled-up dollar bill. She'd never seen cocaine in real life. Jimmy told her to relax. He was 20 at the time. It's not like he was a child, but to me, no matter how old we got, he was always my baby brother.

and so it just felt very shocking. As Jill started her Ph.D. program, Jimmy was in college. This was a time where I was working 12 hours a day, seven days a week. There was always some 35-page paper due. But as busy as she was, she wouldn't miss Jimmy's college graduation. When the time came, she bought a plane ticket and traveled a few states north. I have no time and no money. But this was a really big deal that he was graduating.

And so my entire family flew out and got up early and were sitting in the auditorium waiting for him to cross the stage. They're reading the names alphabetically and they go right past where he should have been. And we waited and were very confused and he never walked across the stage. The family got in their rental car and drove to Jimmy's apartment, concerned. So we knocked on the door. He answered the door looking very sleepy. All the lights were off. And he started ranting about his stupid effing roommate who must have turned off his alarm.

And we were so upset. We spent all this time and money and effort to get out to this big event. And like he couldn't even be responsible enough to show up to the graduation. You know, it turned into a fight, and we decided to go home early. It just felt like it was an escalation of irresponsibility and unreliability. Their family wondered if Jimmy actually graduated at all. Her parents asked him directly. And he said, no, no, I definitely graduated.

And they had no way of proving it. They're paying for his school, but they don't have access to his school records. So there was nothing they could really do to confirm whether this was the truth. And I think ultimately they just opted to believe him. But Jill still had her suspicions about what really happened that weekend. It was years later and we were having fun and having drinks. And I asked him, I said, tell me the truth. Like, what was the real story?

Did you graduate? And he was like, well, don't tell mom and dad. But no, I didn't graduate. So the whole thing was actually premeditated. And the lie about the alarm clock and his ire that how dare we leave him when this wasn't his fault, it was all an act. All along, he knew that he wasn't graduating. That conversation made Jill see her brother a little differently.

Before this moment, she knew he could be irresponsible. But she didn't know he had the capacity to lie like this. I had a pretty complicated emotional reaction to that. I was really angry. It was sort of like, how dare you? Like, how can you do this to us? You know, I think the anger was the thing that was covering the harder emotion, which was like fear, fear of who her brother really was and what he was capable of.

So after his fake graduation from college, I remember him kind of like job jumping a fair amount because he always had a terrible boss, you know, that kind of thing. And that was kind of the extent that my middle brother and I knew, Jimmy became an arborist, a tree expert, and he started his own landscaping business. He ended up moving back to New England and lived in the same town as my middle brother and his family. And so they started to see more of him and to see some behaviors that were concerning. He was going to go out and get his truck washed and he'd be gone for hours

and then he would come back and his truck wouldn't be washed. But he would never explain where he was or what he was doing. Every year there'd be one good visit with Jimmy and one visit where Jimmy was clearly up to something. Despite the irresponsibility and the frustration, I still adored him and we were still very close. Like I was frustrated by his behavior, but pretty quick to forgive him. And partly that's because he's my baby brother and he wasn't always like that.

And that cute little sweet and enthusiastic and happy little boy, like he was still that in so many ways. I even remember while I was in graduate school, having a conversation with one of my friends, that classic question of like if you were going to be stranded on a desert island with five people who would be on your island. And he was at the top of my list. Jimmy was there when Jill got married in Vegas. It was an intimate wedding, a house party. But the next morning, Jimmy was taking someone to the airport and he disappeared for hours. And when he finally came back, he was like,

like sweaty and anxious and claimed it was because he was lost. I just remember my brother, my sister-in-law, my husband and I all being like, something is going on here. No idea what it is, but it's got to be drugs, right? Hey, everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And Bowen-Yang. And you're never going to guess who's our guest on Lost Cultureistas. It is Bradley Jackson, Elle Woods, Tracy Flick, herself.

Reese Witherspoon. It must go in a girls' trip. I have to have a tequila. We must. Oh! The Q rating. When they run diagnostic on you guys. I'd be scared.

I'll run the Q-Rater. No, on the Q-Rating. I get it. My resiliency score is down to adequate because we were on a red eye. My resiliency score. My grit. I got to get my grit score up. Now, don't think that you're going to come out Los Culturistas, the podcast,

and we're not going to at least bring up Big Little Lies season three. Whoever said orange is the new pink. We seriously disturbs. Listen to Las Culturistas on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Cheryl McCollum, host of the podcast Zone 7. Zone 7 ain't a place. It's a way of life.

I've worked hundreds of cold cases you've heard of and thousands you haven't. We started this podcast to teach the importance of teamwork and solving these crazy crimes. Come join us in learning from detectives, prosecutors, authors, canine handlers, forensic experts, and most importantly, victims' family members.

Listen to Zone 7 with Cheryl McCollum on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. It was an unimaginable crime. It's four consecutive live terms for Brian Koeberger who killed the four University of Idaho students. The defense are on a sinking ship. It was clear at that point. He was out of options.

Nearly 30 months of silence. until bombshell development Brian Coburger appearing set to accept a plea deal just five weeks before his

quadruple murder trial was set to start no trial no testimony he has pleaded guilty to five criminal counts one of burglary and then four counts

of murder in this final season we returned to Moscow with interviews from those still searching for answers why did the prosecution take this

they were holding all the cars how on earth could you make a deal. What message does that send? Listen to season three of the Idaho massacre on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Hunter, host of Hunting for Answers on the Black Effect Podcast Network. Join me every weekday as I share bite-sized stories of missing and murdered black women and girls in America. There are several ways we can all do better at protecting black women. My contribution is shining a light on our missing sisters in

amplifying their disregarded stories. Stories like Tamika Anderson. As she drove toward Galvez, she was in contact with several people, talking on the phone as she made her way to what should have been a routine transaction. But Tamika never bought the car, and she never returned home that day. One podcast, one mission, save our girls. Join the search as we explore the chilling. cases of missing and murdered black women and girls. Listen to hunting for answers every weekday

on the Black Effect Podcast Network, IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. After years of Jimmy's strange behavior, Jill and her other brother John assumed that he must be secretly using drugs. It was the only logical explanation. By 2013, Jill had achieved some big life milestones. I was working as a professor in a graduate school for psychology. My daughter had just turned one, and I was working on my very first book. One day, she was home alone with her infant daughter. I was in my family room, TV on, daughters playing on the floor, and I was folding laundry.

And I got a text message from John that said he was on his way to go bail Jimmy out of jail. Of course, we're speculating back and forth. What do you think this is? It's got to be drugs because this was on the heels of some of this bizarre, suspicious behavior. So we thought, okay, this is our confirmation. He's using drugs. I was like, all right, just keep me posted. And so he started texting me with updates as he got them.

I don't remember what all the texts said, but I do remember the one that came through that said it's a classy felony. A felony, either he has like a large amount or he was distributing or selling. But then Jill got the text that changed her life. The police had confiscated Jimmy's computer.

And they'd found photos of underage girls. What made it a felony was that the children in the images were clearly under the age of 12. They were prepubescent. And I remember, like, falling to the ground, having the only panic attack I've ever had in my life. My husband wasn't home. And it was just my daughter and me, the TV and the laundry. And I just remember being on the ground. totally hyperventilating.

Oh, this to this day, so it's been 12 years, I just remember feeling so panicked that if this could be true about my brother and I could have no idea, how on earth was I ever going to keep my daughter safe? How on earth would I ever know? who the monsters were. Jimmy insisted that he'd been framed.

Just like he told us he graduated and his alarm didn't go off, we didn't believe anything he was saying. Jill formed an alliance with her sister-in-law, John's wife. And so she and I, we would get on the phone for hours and hours and hours and talk about all of this ad nauseum because we were on the same page

and we were both new moms. All we cared about was making sure that our kids were safe. Nothing else mattered. So my sister-in-law ended up actually going to the courthouse to get access to whatever records were public. And so she was able to see what the arrest was for. It listed the file names of the content that they found on his computer. It wasn't a lot of information,

but it was enough. These were photos of girls as young as six. Jimmy had photoshopped himself into some of the images. But when it came to his sentencing, the consequences were not significant. I think he may be spent a couple weeks incarcerated, and then he was on the sex offender registry. To Jill, it seemed like a slap on the wrist,

but the interpersonal cost was immeasurable. Because after Jimmy's arrest, our family kind of fell apart. A stark divide formed in the family. Jill, her husband, and her sister-in-law wanted to cut Jimmy out of their lives. But her parents weren't on the same page. And I remember them saying things like, well, I mean, isn't it not as bad because it's only pictures? They wanted to find a way to explain it a way that wasn't as horrific as what the reality was. A lot of just mental gymnastics and denial and what resulted from that,

I think it was pretty clear to Jimmy that he could fairly successfully manipulate my parents. He told them that his addiction to Adderall is, is what caused him to do this. And I had several conversations with them, you know, as a clinical psychologist, saying being high on Adderall very likely led him to feel disinhibited so that he was more likely to engage in these behaviors. But the drug itself did not cause him to be attracted to little girls.

Jill and her sister-in-law drew a firm boundary that they would not interact with Jimmy. They both had young daughters to protect. And in response, Jimmy lashed out. And so he sent me and my sister-in-law very nasty messages. He told me I should go kill myself. Cruel, lashing out emails. The likes of which we had never seen,

we had not seen this side of him. That year, their parents invited Jimmy to the family reunion. And we were like, What? No, there were going to be children there. He can't be there. And I remember saying, finally, like, I will tell everyone. I am not allowing him to be around children without the parents knowing. My parents didn't want anyone to know. They wanted to keep this a secret. So I think they ultimately just told him he couldn't come. Jill didn't talk to her little brother for four years. That was until their mom got sick. When it became clear that she was near the end of her life, Of course, my little brother also wanted to say goodbye to his dying mother,

and we were all there together, and so my dad asked our permission, basically, to let him come. Honestly, it was a hard decision, but it wasn't, you know? It was like, of course he has the right to see his mom and say goodbye to his mom and there were no children present for any of that so we let him come and this was the first time we saw him when jimmy walked in the door he looked like his old self he seemed clear-eyed and genuine he assured us that he was clean his behavior was quite different he apologized for the mean emails that he sent to my sister-in-law and me he apologized for the terrible way that he had treated

all of us. He was very sincere and we believed him. We believed that even if he still had this sexual proclivity, he wasn't acting on it. After that, Jill and Jimmy were on speaking terms again. We agreed to try to repair the rupture in our relationship, but of course with like gigantic boundaries that he would not be ever unsupervised around kids or anything like that.

And that lasted for a year, exactly one year. It was their grandmother's 99th birthday party. He was there, and it became instantly obvious that something was wrong. He's acting super cagey. He's being weird. He's sleeping a lot. He's being very aggressive and hostile. You got in a fight with someone in a bar.

I mean, just kind of back to a lot of the old stuff. And I remember leaving the weekend and my sister-in-law and I talking and just saying, like, the other shoe's going to drop. We're just waiting for the call. The call's going to come. And then, sure enough, shortly after that, we got the call. A few months earlier, the police had received another tip about Jimmy. They executed a search warrant at his house. They confiscated his computer. They also found several thumb drives in various pockets of his clothing. He wasn't home during the search. His roommate called to tell him that the police were looking for him.

But Jimmy was nowhere to be found. So the police tracked his cell phone to try and make the arrest. When they finally found him, he had climbed up a very high tree. He was a tree guy, an arborist, so he had equipment to climb trees. and the police all came and he was demanding a letter that he would not be held responsible for what they found

and if they didn't give him that letter that he was going to jump and kill himself. They ultimately talk him down out of the tree and they arrest him. This time, the FBI was involved. Jimmy insisted again that he had been framed. Jill knew it was a lie, but she didn't.

have the FBI report. She didn't know exactly what he'd done. And she was determined to find out. We had a close family friend that was friends with my middle brother since like third grade, and he's a private investigator, actually. This family friend was able to get access to this very detailed FBI report. He emailed it to me, and my husband begged me not to read it. He begged me.

What was in this report would determine the future of her family. The four years that she'd been estranged from Jimmy tore her family apart. They'd just gone back to speaking terms. If Jill was going to put her father through that again, she needed to see it with her own eyes. So she opened the FBI report. And I knew I shouldn't. I knew.

I knew. I knew it was the worst. idea and I couldn't not read it. I mean, we had just been sitting in so much uncertainty and bewilderment that it felt intolerable. I was just compelled like I just had to know. And of course he was right. It was the worst thing I could have done. Hey, everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And you're never going to guess who's our guest on Los Culturistas. It is Bradley Jackson, L. Woods, Tracy Flick herself.

Reese Witherspoon. It must go in a girl's trip. I have to have a tequila. We must. Oh! The Q rating. When they run diagnostic in here. We can run it on you guys.

I'd be scared. I'll run the Q rating. No, on the Q rating as I get it. My resiliency score is down to adequate because we were on a red eye. My resiliency score. My grit. I got to get my grit score up. Now, don't think.

that you're going to come out Los Culturistas to the podcast and we're not going to at least bring up Big Little Lies Season 3. Whoever said orange is the new pink. We seriously disturbs. Listen to Las Culturistas on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Cheryl McCollum, host of the podcast Zone 7. Zone 7 ain't a place. It's a way of life. I've worked hundreds of cold cases you've heard of and thousands you haven't. We started this podcast to teach the importance of teamwork and solving these crazy crimes. Come join us in learning from detectives, prosecutors, authors, canine handlers, forensic experts, and most importantly, victims' family members.

Listen to Zone 7 with Cheryl McCollum on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. It was an unimaginable crime. It's four consecutive live terms for Brian Koberger who killed the four University of Idaho students. The defense are on a sinking ship. It was clear at that point. He was out of options. Nearly 30 months of silence until... Bombshell development, Brian Koberger, appearing set to accept a plea deal just five weeks before his quadruple murder trial was set to start. No trial, no testimony.

He has pleaded guilty to five criminal counsel. It's one of burglary and then four counts of murder. In this final season, we returned to Moscow with interviews from those still searching for answers. Why did the prosecution take this? They were holding all the cars. How on earth could you make a deal? What message does that send? Listen to season three of the Idaho Massacre on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Hunter, host of Hunting for Answers on the Black Effect. Podcast Network. Join me every weekday as I share bite-sized stories of missing and murdered black women and girls in America. There are several ways we can all do better at protecting black women. My contribution is shining a light on our missing sisters and amplifying their disregarded stories. Stories like Tamika Anderson. As she drove toward Galvez, she was in contact with several people, talking on the phone as she made her way to what should have been a routine transaction. But Tamika never bought the car,

and she never returned home that day. One podcast, one mission, save our girls. Join the searches we explore the chilling cases of missing and murdered black women and girls. Listen to hunting for answers every weekday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Jill was in the car with her husband when she received a copy of the FBI report on Jimmy, and despite her husband's pleas, she read it. The report started by describing not pictures, but videos, and objects found in Jimmy's house. It was sickening. The detail in this report will be burned on my brain forever. There were things happening in these... videos that I couldn't have even imagined in my worst nightmare. Jimmy had clearly escalated.

He was not only downloading material, he was also uploading material. In his home, the police seized a child-sized sex doll and multiple pairs of children's underwear. That was really the moment. I was like, oh my God. He's a monster. Jill spoke to him one last time,

and on that phone call, he wasn't remorseful. He was defiant. He said to me, well, at least I'm not part of a ring or anything. She's often wondered if he was telling on himself in that moment. And it was like what a little kid would do, you know?

It's got chocolate all over the face. Did you eat a cookie? No. It's important to note that in crimes like this, where perpetrators are seeking to consume CSAM, there's often a limit to how much someone can download before they're required to create and upload their own content. Knowing the depths of what these perpetrators are capable of doing

really sent me into a spiral as a mom. A switch flipped in Jill's reality. After the first arrest, I could still see both sides of him. Like he was still my little baby brother who I always loved and was very close to who had this sickness, this horrible proclivity. I even had some compassion for him because I recognized that he wouldn't want this or wouldn't choose this.

But I think after the second time, my capacity for compassion largely disappeared once I read that report. All I could think about was what happened to those little girls. And when he got caught the second time, the girls in those images were the exact same age as my daughter. And that's all I could think about. That's all I could think about, was like if he had had access to her. That was really the point of no return for me. This time, it wasn't a slap on the wrist for Jimmy.

Because he'd been trading videos and the FBI got involved, he was charged with a federal crime. Because they have these federal minimums, the penalty for this is 10 years. So he was ultimately sentenced to 10 years. years in a federal correctional facility. She'd seen the darkest parts of humanity in her own brother. And so after this happened, all of us were just how, why, what possibly could have caused

this? How could the same family, you know, raise my middle brother and me to be who we are, but also have this person be a pediment? file. It just did not make any sense. She began obsessively researching and studying perpetrators like her brother. If I could just understand this enough, then I would have the tools to protect my children. As an anxiety expert, what I know about what fuels anxiety is uncertainty, a lack of perceived control, and a high sense of responsibility. And those three things were so present for me as a mom when this happened. She learned how perpetrators often groomed the parents first and how

they select their targets. Perpetrators groom children by connecting with little kids over things that they like. They test them by sharing secret, you know, saying to a a kid telling them or doing something that their parents wouldn't approve of and saying this will be our secret to then see did the kid tell the parents it was a secret and if not that might make them a good victim but no matter how much she learned the anxiety didn't go away all the research in the world didn't give her an answer about how or why her own little brother became this person she's had to accept that her brother's actions have fundamentally changed her I think it's made me hard.

And I was not that way before this. Ooh, that just got me choked up. It was just the most painful experience of letting yourself love someone so deeply. And to have that backfire. What hurts the most is thinking back to the happy little boy. Boy, she loved so much. It feels impossible that those people are the same person. It just feels impossible.

That human body is still walking around on the earth, but I lost my brother that I knew years, years ago. There's a word for this kind of experience. It's called disenfranchised grief. And so I feel like I have never really been able to properly grieve any of this because I don't feel like I'm allowed to feel grief for someone who's a pedophile.

Jimmy's now out of prison. Jill isn't in touch with him and doesn't plan to be. Just knowing he's out there brings all these emotions to the surface once again. But Jill is committed to finding meaning in the wreckage. Today, she writes and speaks publicly about her story, including the darkest parts. Jill co-hosts a podcast of her own, psychologist off the clock. It's a place where clinicians talk about real life, grief, shame, and what actually helps.

In psychology, there's a concept of post-traumatic growth. Some people experience trauma and they kind of rebound back to baseline, some never really rebound, and some actually end up doing better than they were. at baseline. I don't know exactly where I fall on that spectrum, but I do think there has been sort of examples of growth or good or purpose through this. We end all of our weekly episodes with the same question. Why do you want to share your story? I think as much as this feels scary and uncomfortable, we have to be willing to say the hard thing. Treating this like a dirty little secret. Like this is not my crime. This is not my family's crime. Like none of us

did anything wrong. He, Jimmy is the only one who did anything wrong. And keeping it a secret is just protecting him and he doesn't deserve protection. Kids deserve protection. And so I just feel compelled to start having more of these honest conversations even if they're not popular. Like, sunlight is the best disinfectant. And I have to be part of the sunlight. On the next episode of Betrayal Weekly. I get a call and it's a detective. He said, Jacqueline, we got an anonymous call from a gentleman stating that you were being scammed and they felt sorry for you.

My head exploded, thinking, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. Before we end the episode, I have some exciting news. Betrayal will be doing our first ever live show as part of the Virgin Voyages's true crime crews. We'll be answering listener questions and discussing them live on stage with Stacey and Tyler from Betrayal Season 3, as well as Caroline from season 4. So if you have a question for us, please email us at Betrayalpod at gmail.com with the subject line listener question. And if you want to join us on the Caribbean cruise, there are still spots available. Search Virgin Voyages.com slash true crime. If you would like to reach out to the Betrayal team or want to tell us your betrayal story, email us at Betrayalpod at gmail.com.

That's Betrayal P-O-D at Gmail.com. or follow us on Instagram at BetrayalPod. You can also connect with me on Instagram at It's Andre Gunning. To access our newsletter, view additional content, and connect with the Betrayal community, join our substack at Betrayal.substack.com. We're grateful for your support. One way to show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review Betrayal.

Five-star reviews go a long way. A big thank you to all of our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass Entertainment Group and partnership with IHeart podcasts. The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fasin, hosted and produced by me, Andrea Gunning. Written and produced by Monique Laborde. Also produced by Ben Federman. Associate producers are Caitlin Golden, Olivia Hewitt, and Kristen Malkuri. Casting support from Curry Richmond. Our IHard team is Ali Perry and Jessica Kreincheck.

editing and mixing by Matt Dalvecchio. Additional audio editing by Tanner Robbins. Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided by Mib Music. And for more podcasts from IHeart, visit the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey everybody, this is Matt Rogers.

And Bowen Yang. And you're never going to guess who's our guest on Las Culturistas. It is Elwood. Tracy Flick herself. Reese Witherspoon. Louise, it must go in a girl's trip. I have to have a tequila. We must.

Oh. Whoever said orange is the new pink. We seriously disturbs. Listen to Las Culturistas on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Liz went from being interested in true crime to living true crime. My husband said, your dad's been killed.

This is Hands Tide, a true crime podcast exploring the murder of Jim Milgar. I was just completely in shock. Liz's father murdered, and her mother found locked in a closet, her hands and feet bound. I didn't feel real at all. More than a decade on, she's still searching for answers. We're still fighting. Listen to Hands Tide on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get Podcasts.

I'm Hunter, host of Hunting for Answers on the Black Effect Podcast Network. Join me every weekday as I share bite-sized stories of missing and murdered black women and girls in America. Stories like Erica Hunt. A young mother vanished without a trace after a family gathering on 4th of July weekend, 2016. No goodbyes, no clues, just gone. Listen to Hunting for Amherst,

answers every weekday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Cheryl McCollum, host of the podcast Zone 7. Zone 7 ain't a place. It's a way of life. Now, this ain't just any old podcast, honey. We're going to be talking to family members of victims, detectives, prosecutors, and some nationally recognized experts that I have called on over the years to help me work these difficult cases. I've worked hundreds of cold cases you've heard of and thousands you haven't. We started this podcast to teach the importance of teamwork and solving these crazy crimes. Come join us in learning from detectives, prosecutors, authors, canine handlers, forensic experts, and most importantly, victims family members. Come be a part of My Zone 7 while building yours.

Listen to Zone 7 with Cheryl McCollum on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. This is an IHeart podcast.