Betwixt The Sheets: The History of Sex, Scandal & Society - Sex & Scandal in 1920s Soho

Episode Date: February 25, 2025

When and why did Soho become a hedonistic hotspot, the home of sex, drugs and music?Kate is Betwixt the Sheets with Dan Snow to talk about post-WW1 London - when a dark underworld of shady characters are soundtracked by an exploding jazz scene, fuelled by a roaring drugs trade.At the heart of it are the so-called 'dope girls'. Women who fascinated and appalled society in equal measure. How did a post war mindset influence the 1920s? How did the press react to all the scandal?  And, who were some of the major players involved?Historic Soho has been brought to life in the new BBC show Dope Girls, which tells the story of Soho when female gangs ran the nightclubs after the First World War. You can watch it on BBC iPlayer now.You can listen to Dan's podcast, Dan Snow's History Hit here. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Do you want even more shocking and scandalous history? Like why the ancient Greek statues had such small manhoods? Or what went on behind closed doors in the Georgian era? We'll sign up to History Hit, where you can see me discover the scandalous side of history, as well as hundreds of hours of original documentaries, plus new releases every week, covering everything from prehistoric Scotland to the Treaty of Versailles.

Sign up to join me in locations around the world and explore the past. Just visit historyhit.com forward slash subscribe. Hello, my lovely betwixters. It's me, Kate Lister. You are listening to Bertwifster sheets. But because we care about you and we don't want you to get shocked and offended and have your sensibilities rattled,

I have to tell you that this is an adult podcast spoken by adults to other adults about adulty things and an adulty way covering a range of adult subjects and you should be an adult too. And now we've got that little lot out of the way. Bring on the smut! Walking down the narrow streets of social, in the days following the Great War is an eye-opening experience.

In these tough post-war years, which ended on Armistice Day, November 11th, 1918, this central part of London, with its labyrinth of bars and clubs, has become the epicentre of hedonism, where a dark underworld of shady characters are soundtracked by an exploding jazz scene, fuelled by a roaring drugs trade. At the heart of it are the so-called dope girls, women who entertained and supplied in equal measure. It's as murky as it is fascinating, and I can't wait to explore.

What do you look for a man? Oh, money, of course. You're supposed to rise when an adult speaks to you. I make perfect confidence of whatever my boss needs by just turning it up and pushing the funny. Yes, social courtesy does make a difference. Goodness, I feel for time. Goodness has nothing to do with it, Derry. Hello, and welcome back to Betwixtas Sheet,

the history of sex scandal in society with me, Kate Lister. The years after the First World War were a tough time for most people here in the UK. And as history shows us, when things go low, people get high and will do anything that they can to kick up their heels and forget their troubles, regardless of how legal it may or may not have been. And so it was in 1920s London, specifically in Soho, where the sex industry met a nightlife of jazz, music and drug, all of which thrived in spite of hard times.

It was epitomised as all that was decadent and dangerous. So, inspired by the new BBC show Dope Girls, which is set in this world, I have joined History Hits' very own Dan Snow to find out more about 1920's Soho and the fascinating people at the heart of it. And by the time you're listening to this, Dope Girls will be out,

so check it out on the IPlayer if you can. How did a post-war mindset influenced the hedonism of the 1920s? How did the press react to so much scandal and who was some of the major players involved? And how successful was the government in cracking down on it? Answer, not very.

But without further ado, let's find out more. Hi, Kate, good to see you here in the heart of Swingly Soho. Thank you very much for asking me here. We're all watching Dope Girls. And what I like about this is two great passions of mine. One is I scout and so all the time. felt like an exciting place to go out when I was younger. And two, I'm fascinated by that post-war generation, how wild it was.

It was like the 60s before the 60s, wasn't it? And we've just forgotten about that. It has been called the first sexual revolution. You know, scholars of that period get very angry when people try and say it was the 1960s. And they go, no, no, I think you'll find it was the 1920s. And for good reason, as well. And then the 1890s lads join the chat. And then the 18th century get involved.

And then we go all the way back until we're just amoebas in a pond somewhere. Can we start with Soho? Because there's something about Soho. I remember the streets are narrow. It feels like, if not medieval, but sort of Georgian London. There's not many cars on the streets. The street life there, isn't there? Even though it's in the heart of some extremely expensive real estate now. There is and there always has been. It's got a really, really long history to Soho. And even though it's been extensively gentrified since the 1980s, it still has that slightly risque, slightly naughty feel about it. But in its earliest, earliest days, it wasn't naughty at all. It was quite a posh area. It was where aristocrats lived and they're the ones that sort of built all of the big houses. And the word Soho comes from an old hunting cry where you'd go, Soho. Because it was, once upon a time, obviously, it wasn't in central London.

It was just sort of on the outskirts. Okay, so it was a greenfield site. It was greenfield kind of an area. And then it starts to be developed and it becomes the playground of aristocrats and rich people. but eventually, sort of about the 18th century, they start to move out. They keep going west. Yeah, they keep going west. And it starts to become that kind of shabby, boho chic.

The properties are a little bit cheaper to buy. So people of a less high quality start moving into the area. And the thing that really does for it is it starts becoming a theatre district. And the theatre has long been associated with all kinds of naughtiness. And where there's theatres, there's drinking dens. Where there's drinking dens, there will be drunk people. and where there's drunk people, there will be brothels as well. So it just all kind of grew up in this area.

And then the area became notorious for it. And then it starts to sort of feed on itself as this is the destination. This is where you go. So in the 1920s, you've got this generation who've survived what they think is the greatest war in history. They're traumatized by it. They've lost their mates. They've lost family members. And they're still very young.

They're coming back from the trenches like 21, 20 years old. So they want to go out and party and live life. and I suppose to certain extent, sort of drown their sorrow. They do. It's kind of difficult, I think, for us to try and imagine what they went through and what life must have been like, not just post-World War I, but post-Spanish flu as well. And like the trauma of the war and you've got a generation that's just sort of like, okay, so, well, now what do we do? The entire world is different. Everything's different. And in particular, women's roles are different because one thing that the war did that had never happened before

is it allowed women to go into the workplace. because obviously the men had to go and fight in the trenches. So the home, London and everywhere back home became largely dominated by women. They were the ones driving the buses. They were the ones running the services in the shops. They were going out to work. And then the war is over. The men come back and the women are like, we just go back home now, then, do we?

And that was always a really difficult thing. And it was never going to happen. So you've got a new generation of women who have seen what it's like to earn your own money, to have a career, to go out and do the things that you want to do. and they're not going to go back into the kitchen willingly. Did they enjoy not just more personal autonomy, economic autonomy, but also sexual autonomy? Is that something that went alongside that? Definitely. The 1920s, and in fact, the First World War is notorious for it.

There's nothing that will change your mind faster on sexual morality than impending death. I think bombs falling from the sky makes everyone go, oh, maybe, maybe I'm not quite so uptight about this. So things are changing, and they were changing before that. You've got the first kind of reliable contraception coming through. People are talking about it in ways that have never been spoken about it before. Sex is much more mainstream. But everyone in the war did things differently. People are having sex differently.

It changed attitudes. As you said, the sort of the overwhelming feeling when they came out the other side of it is, well, let's party. Reliable contraception is? It's reliable-ish contraception. So they were using cervical caps at that point. You could have gone down to Maristope's clinic and got yourself fitted. for a cervical cap, which is they weren't nice and they weren't 100% effective, but there were contraceptive clinics that you could go to if you were a married woman.

Surprising that it involved really invasive, unpleasant things put in women rather than just men. Of course it did. I mean, you could get condoms. You could, but they had a reputation as being slightly seedy, something that you'd only used for promiscuous sex. And the birth control advocates were very, very keen on trying to be like, well, this isn't about promiscuous sex. This is about married life and controlling.

the population. Condoms had a reputation for, this is just for shits and giggles. The kind of thing the French used? The French use it, yes, except they called them English raincoats. Oh, really? Yeah, yeah. And it when they called French something on this other? French letters. French letters? Yeah. Apparently Britain made really, really good condoms at this period. We exported them all around the world. So proud. So take Mad So in the 1920s, what can I expect I expect, I'll walk down the street? You can expect fun if you know where to

look for it. I suspect if you walk down and you had no idea where you were going or what you were doing, it would not be immediately obvious, apart from the theatres. This is very relatable to my life. Because drinking culture and pubs were really, really strictly controlled during the First World War and after it with the Defence of the Realm's Act. They were the ones that said pubs can only open for two hours in the day and then for four hours at night. You and I are probably odd enough to remember when there were drinking restrictions still on...

Sunday afternoon, they closed pubs, you get to leave the pub. Exactly. And that was because of the Defence of the Realm Act. It stayed in place all that time. But there were really strict rules around where you could drink, who could have a license, because basically they didn't want the soldiers being pissed up during the war. Or munitions workers. Or munitions workers.

You know, it wasn't so much that they desperately cared about the health of the populace. So what springs up around that is a lot of speakeas, a lot of drinking dens places where if you know someone who knows somebody, they can take you there. So there's that culture. And if you know where to go, then you can have. a really good time. Brothels are always as discreet as they can be because they're dodging the police. They don't want to attract attention to themselves. So they were mostly in residential spaces above shops, and somebody's working out of a flat. And then, of course, there'd be women

on the street if you knew who you were looking for. It's there, but you need to know what you're looking for. And Soho was, you don't think of it in those terms anymore, maybe naively, but Soho definitely, when I was growing up, starting it was sex work and adult stories. That was a big part of Soho's mystique. Yeah, and it has been since the 18th century, really. When you start to get sex workers moving into the area, then the area becomes notorious for it. Then you get things like Harris's list of Covent Garden Ladies,

which is given out the addresses of where women work, and some of them are in what we'd now call Soho. So it becomes an area that's known for it. And then as you get into the 20th century, you've got theatres opening up, which are on the racier side of things like the windmill theatre. So it's a couple of decades after the 20s. but the first theatre to allow women nude on stage,

as long as they were stood completely still and pretending to be statues. But you've got sort of like strip clubs start moving in after that. So it's definitely an area that's had that reputation for a good few hundred years. And you've got the heady sound of jazz. Yeah, jazz came over with the Americans in the First World War when they were stationed here.

They exported a lot of American culture. I mean, it must have arrived like an absolute bullet to the brain. If you're, imagine like, you know, you're a housewife in 19, 20s, London, and you've just listened to big band music, and all of a sudden jazz has arrived, and it's fun, and it's fast, and it's naughty, and people are really worried about it. Like, you know, like, oh, it's, oh, don't be listened to that. It's terrible. And Nazis hated jazz. Well, yeah.

Except when they're in private and they all listen to it, I'm sure. But, like, yeah, in public, yeah, I hated it. It's a disease. Well, and they did. In its earliest, when it starts to get exported, and even in America, people thought of it like that. It's this moral degenerate. And, of course, because it's associated with.

black culture. There's a racism that goes with it of like, oh my God, these black people coming over and infecting our decent white girls. That narrative runs through it the whole time, but it absolutely electrified the entire world. And so it becomes a centre of jazz clubs. Yeah, it does. Yeah, jazz. And you would go and dance. We don't really go and dance anymore. I mean, I don't even go to a club and dance, but like dancing at this point in history was a really, really big thing. And if not everyone was going dancing in underground jazz dens, you'd go to your local village hall and have a dance. You'd go, that's the thing that you did for fun. And it's where you met your partner, right? You met at a dance. Yeah, it was like the social

event that you'd go to. But along with jazz, the style of dancing starts to change. You get the flappers coming through with the Charleston. The hemlines are going up. The dances getting a bit more raucous. It must have felt really dangerous and exciting that particular period. And again, just come back to that first point. This is a generation of men and women who've, especially the elite, the officer class suffered disproportionate, casualties. So the people with money, the people with aristocratic connection, they'd have known reams of people that weren't there anymore. So they must just thought, we're lucky to be alive. Let's just party. Let's just do it. Yeah, the roaring 20s. I think everyone was aware that

they'd come through something absolutely horrific and that the world was different. I think it was a lot of anxiety as well though, you know, a sort of a sense of what happens now, what do we do now? And there was this moral panic around young girls and around jazz clubs and around drink and drugs and about how society is crumbling and decaying all around us. And Soho was an epicenter for that. Talk about drugs, because again, you associate that with a later cultural and sexual revolution, but so people are taking drugs? They've always taken drugs.

They've people have always. What are you saying? As long as there have been drugs, there have been people that take them. But things start to change in the 1920s because the law starts to get involved. And you get this creation of this image of the drug fiend, the drug addict. Up until that point, it was well known that people could abuse drugs, like in the 18th century Thomas De Quincey writes Confessions of an English opiometer, but there was a sort of a sense of almost like, oh, you silly goose, getting all messed up with that.

It wasn't this idea that a dope fiend was an actual thing. Like there wasn't this understanding of addiction that we have today. But that starts to change in the 1920s. And one of the reasons for that is because the government has to crack down on drugs because their soldiers are getting stowned. That's what they're worried about, is it's not so much that they are desperately concerned about the welfare of their citizens.

It's that they can't afford to have soldiers off their face on opium or unbridled cocaine. There was also lots of reports coming to the police about how young men had been fed cocaine by nefarious sex workers in Soho and they just couldn't remember anything afterwards. And this kind of narrative, yeah, of course. That's what you tell there.

you tell the wife when you get home. Exactly. So the first drug laws start to be passed under the Defense of the Realm Act, which was basically that stopped taking drugs was the sort of the big one. And the police could start to raid places. They could start to confiscate it. And then you get this weird legal landscape because doctors could still prescribe it for pretty much anything. Toothache, headache, flatulents, have some opium.

Opioids, yeah. And cocaine as well. Cocaine as well. Yeah, cocaine becomes really, really big. And it's, you know, when they first start using it, it was this sort of medical miracle drug of it's going to fix everything. Because it peps you up and it makes, you know, things seem a bit more exciting. And so it's touted as this medical panacea.

And then eventually people start to realize, oh, oh, hang on a minute. It's not quite as good as we thought it was. But it's still prescribed for loads of stuff. I'll be back with Dan after this short break. Does opium cure flattrants asking for a friend? There were medicines containing opium that were marketed. to do that. I'm not a medical person, but I think it would probably take everyone into the room's point where they didn't care. So would that help? If you all take opium, it would cure my, say,

all my friends' fashion. Yes, yes, exactly, because no one would care anymore. But you get opium dens cropping up all over the place and they're in this kind of weird legal limbo of, well, can we arrest and can we not? Is it medicinal? Is it not? This thing comes into force where if you're poor and you're caught with drugs, you'll be arrested. If you're rich, then you have a medical issue. Drugs rise, opium, some cocaine and cannabis? Cannabis was around, but it wasn't as prominent. You don't get the first tightening of UK laws around cannabis until it's like 1928. And then that becomes this sort of marijuana menace idea that comes in a little bit later. So it was in the mix, but it wasn't as much cause for concern.

It's always a good sign. If they're tightening up laws, you know that in the years preceding it, there's something going on. Yes, somebody has been doing something that they shouldn't have been That's always the red flag for historian. Were there any famous bars and clubs? Oh yeah. If you were in 1920 Soho, you would want to go at the 43 club, which was run by the queen of nightclub life, Kate Merrick, who was born in Dublin, so she's an Irish woman. And she marries a doctor, she's separated from when she ends up in London with eight kids that she has to support at the age of 43, which is not a great situation to be in. And she sees an advertisement that somebody, needs some help running like a tea party or a tea dance or something. So she gives that a go and then

she thinks sod this and she decides that she's going to open the 43 club on Gerard Street in Soho. But that wasn't an easy thing to do because of the Defence Against the Realm Act saying we can only sell alcohol for two hours a day and until 8pm. So Kate goes sod that and she just did it anyway. She did it without a licence. She did it without a venue licence. She just opened it. She spent loads of money building this club and then it became the go-to place like toulula bankhead went there evelyn war went there the sort of the bright young things beautiful set and it was raided repeatedly like constantly just bam bam and she went to jail several times and she becomes this like celebrity in her own right and the public can't get enough of her because every time she's in the dock she's there

like draped in furs and diamonds and just coming up with things like well if you were in a nightclub this is what you have to expect. It's like people just adored her and the worse she got, the more they loved her for it. I think one of the worst things that she bribed police officers in the end to tell her when there was going to be a raid. And she got caught doing that and sent to jail again. But yeah, she became London's nightclub queen and made a ton of money doing it, sent all of their kids to private schools, but just was repeatedly arrested, raided, and then her health suffered. I think she was like 59 when she finally died. But she was legendary. for it. Tell me about the real life dope girls. The real life dope girls. It was probably a case that the

media spoke about them and made them into more of a thing than they actually were, but it was symptomatic of a panic of drug abuse, basically, of drug addiction. And you have to remember the 1920s, no one's really spoken about addiction and drugs in this level of a prominent way before. Now we're so used to people talking about drugs and addiction. It can still shockers, but it doesn't have that novelty that every single paper will be running stories for months and months and months, months. The dope girls did that. They became symptomatic of post-war crisis. And really what it is, is it's young women come into London to try and make their name and getting caught up in drugs and wanting to take loads and loads of drugs. And they were centred around Soho. Some of them

were working in some of the nightclub. Some of them were dancing. Soho also attracted the aristocrats. So you get some people from quite wealthy backgrounds. Drugs are absolutely everywhere. And you do start to get stories emerging in the press of overdoses, of deaths occurring, and then every single time that happens, it blows up again of like dope scared, dope girl fiend, degenerate.

And you can imagine, like, everybody, you know, who isn't in Soho and off their face, just little housewives and their husbands just sat reading the papers, going, oh God, absolutely terrible. And they're kind of like living vicariously through that. So they were definitely there, and it was

how can you say it in any more succinct way? It was young women who were off their faces in the 1920s. The flapper age, the fast set jazz. It Girls before It Girls. It Girls. And they really were. They could dominate newspaper columns. People were fascinated by them.

One of the first It Girls to be known more for her addiction than anything else was Brenda Dean Paul. And she started out as an actress. She kept trying to act all throughout her life. But she was basically more famous for being an addict than anything else. because the police would keep arrest in her, and then it would be in the press, and then she'd get taken to court, and then it would be in the press, and she fed on it. She published an autobiography, which is just basically how much drugs she takes.

Do you remember, like, the press were at its worst when Amy Winehouse was clearly very ill, and they were obsessed with that, and just everyday running stories about her? That was exactly what was happening with Bremendom in the 1920s. So recognizable. So recognizable. So recognizable. That same level of obsession, and, oh, my God, what's she doing to us? half. It's absolutely terrible. That same obsession about this excessive life that she's living,

but also the papers can't stop writing about it and we can't stop reading about it. And presumably all young, glamorous, socially in the Richmond Palf, you can see why it's a great story. Yeah, you can. It's got everything in it. And Brenda Dean Paul was, she was very beautiful as well. She had that real chiseled look and she never lost a look. She was always beautiful. So you have super glamorous. She comes from not quite an aristocratic background, but her mother was a composer, I think, so quite a well-known background. And then there's this young woman's been attracted to booze and jazz and drugs and men, and isn't it terrible? Yeah, that was her story.

Sounds terrible. She had a great time. One of the first stories of the dope girls to really capture the press's attention and horrify the nation was of a young actress called Billy Carlton, who died in 1918 just as the war is drawing to a close. She was only 22 years old. And Billy was quite a successful actress. She was the darling of the stage. She was really popular.

The press were already writing stories about her. She dies of a suspected cocaine overdose. A bodies found. And then the inquest for that, it comes out about the lifestyle that she had been living and the people around her had been living. And how much of it is true and how much of it was press hysteria. But by the time they were done telling the stories,

They'd been cocaine-fueled orgies and absolutely a wash with drugs. And there was a link made with the Chinese immigrant community in London. Just one guy who was married to the woman who might have given Billy the drugs. And that was enough to create this image of the Chinese immigrant opium den, always a man preying on young, innocent white women, which was how Billy was portrayed, being seduced, being force-fed these. drugs and then meet in a terrible, terrible end. And it becomes this image that the media absolutely runs with of these Chinese opium dens drawing in innocent white girls. And that was all linked to

the Billy Carlin case. So it's a story about celebrity, but also drugs, race and migration as well. Yeah. Yeah. And you get the Fumanchu novels that were written by Saks Roma were based in part and what was happening in Soho, presenting Chinese men as these sort of evil. degenerates who are preying on unsuspecting young women. It became a real, a real thing. It was completely mad. It just sounds like a classic moral panic in a way, doesn't it? So nice white women, young women from good families disappearing into that London, into a den of iniquity where they're preyed upon by foreigners, experiments with new drugs. I mean, it just feels like it's got all the elements that now are very recognisable. It does. And it was for the first time. So this is all

very new. The novelty of it keeps it going for years and years. And of course, unchecked racism kept it going as well. The threat of Chinese opium was known as the yellow peril in the press at the time. And yes, it was a story that they ran and ran with. It was a moral panic. Yeah, it's just a classic moral panic. It is. And they had characters in and around Soho that they used to fuel that. So one of the most notorious characters in the drug trade was a guy known as Brilliant Chang. He'd come from Canton originally, I think he was born in like 1885 or something like that. He comes to Britain and originally starts working in restaurants. He owns restaurants and quite quickly realizes that you can make a lot more money selling drugs instead of food.

So he starts selling drugs cocaine predominantly to his customers. Some accounts say that he would only sell to pretty, white women, how accurate that is, I'm not entirely sure, but he becomes this enfonteurieble in the British press of like every time he gets mentioned, it gets worse and worse. There's some dispute about how involved in drugs he actually was and how much the British press, because by the time the British press were done, they were calling him Britain's dope king. And it's like, he might have been Britain's dope king or he might have been dealing out of his restaurant. But he became the focal point for the British press. He became everything

that they hated. And he had a very colourful love life. Women loved him, it would seem. He was very charming. And he was implicated in a few deaths from overdoses, but nothing was proven. It sounds like sometimes these people enjoyed the press tension,

almost leaned into it. It does bid. For someone like Brilliant Chang, the press intrusion, so it gets put on trial because he's implicated in a case involving a woman called Violet Pain, where she's,

He's caught with drugs and the police say that he's the one that gave them to her. He's found not guilty of it, but the press focus on him makes it almost impossible for him to live his life in London. It certainly makes it very difficult from to deal any drugs in London because now everybody knows who he is. Everyone knows his restaurant. He's got this awful reputation. And eventually he is arrested for drug possession, slightly not jumped up stradges, but it's almost like the police went, oh my God, there's some cocaine. Quick arrest him. And then he gets put in and then he gets deported.

And we don't know what happens to him. Really? Yeah. And he was the supposed dope king of Soho. Does the government act? The government acts eventually. So they're using this defence against the Realm Act, which covers an awful lot. It was basically brought into the government can go, if anything might be upset in the war effort, we can do something about it.

But eventually that gets crystallized into the Dangerous Drugs Act of 1920, which then makes possession of cocaine and opium illegal. But also, you are still allowed it for medical use. So it's a slightly grey, weird area and the British way that was slang for the fact that your doctor could just prescribe anything to you. So that was still how most people could get hold of it quite easily. And do you see, is there an attempt to clean up Soho?

There's always attempts to clean up Soho. There's always attempts. And it becomes, like Soho becomes this repository of everything that's wrong in the country, everything's been projected onto it. So there's constant efforts to shut down the nightclubs. the MPs, politicians are always trying to say, we're going to clean up this menace.

But of course, people really like going to the nightclubs. So it was always going to be an uphill struggle for them. But, yeah, there's always attempts to clean it up, and they usually fail. One of the amazing things about the modern day is that now people talk with nostalgia about nightclubs. They're closing because everyone's just sitting at home on their devices. And all the politicians are like,

we should be out, dancing and drinking like we were when I was young. Yeah, the MPs that from the 1920s would love that. If only they'd known, they just had to give people iPods, pads. That was all out to happen and they could have fixed it all. So Soho survives. The government cannot shut it down. It remains exciting and seedy and fun all the way through to the late 20th century. It does. But the thing that does for it eventually, because if you walk around Soho today, it become immediately obvious. There aren't any opium dens or illegal nightclubs or the flappers have long since moved out and it's quite gentrified. The thing that did for it in the end wasn't

the repeated police crackdowns or it wasn't them trying to change. the laws or bringing drugs, it was money. It became the trendy area to be so people start buying up the property. This is what happens. You see this replicated all over the place. An area becomes like super cool because it's kind of edgy. It's kind of like cool. And, you know, this is where the naughty stuff happens.

So then it becomes a popular area to buy in. And then people start buying it. You see that in Notting Hill. That's happened there as well. That used to be quite a sort of edgy, like sort of urban area. And then until the yummy mummies moved in. And so what happened in Soho is it gets gentrified. And then because there's more money in the area, more people are living there, it's easier to pass laws about, you know, residential committees and people saying, well, you can't have that and you can't have that.

And Soho was forced to clean up its act. It hasn't completely clean. It's still got that twinkle in its eye. Thank goodness. It's got twinkle in its eye. Yeah. And I guess the population collapsed in 19th century to the mid-20th, like 17,000 people used to live there. It got down to 3,000 people living there.

Are people moving in again? Or is it all cool artistic studios? I don't think. I mean, I think you can still buy property if you wanted to, but it would set you back a lot. This is a long time since you could just afford some dives above an opium den for a bag of raspberries and a shilling. You're thinking about the big move south. I see you as a Soho guy. I would love to live in Soho.

But you need so much money to do it. But I think now it's mostly businesses. I don't think it is mostly residential Soho anymore. Well, thanks, Kate. You give me all the context I need now to enjoy my binge watch. I'm going to check out Dope Girls on BBC IPLA. Thank you for listening and thanks so much to Dan for joining me.

And if you like what you heard, don't go take in heroin, but you can like, review and subscribe wherever it is that you get your podcast. So that will give you just as much of a high. If you'd like us to explore a subject or maybe you just wanted to say hello, then you can email us at betwixt at historyhit.com. Coming up, we've got episodes on the history of fat phobia and the second part of our dope girl special. This podcast was edited by Tom Delagie and produced by Stuart Beckwith. The senior producer was Charlotte Long, none of whom are dope girls.

Join me again, Betwixt the Sheets, the History of Sex Scandal in Society, a podcast by History Hit. This podcast contains music from Epidemic Sound.