BibleProject - Intro to Wisdom Literature

Episode Date: May 26, 2016

In this episode, the guys give an overview of wisdom literature in the Bible. Proverbs, Job, and Ecclesiastes are considered wisdom literature. Each book has unique ideas and ancient wisdom about the ...world, but all of the books are trying to teach the audience what it means to live a good life. In the first part of the episode (01:31-05:28), Tim and Jon discuss the purpose of wisdom literature. These books are full of ancient wisdom that has been passed down for centuries. They’re the insights of wise, God-fearing people accumulated throughout the generations to become God’s word to his people. There is a specific context in which the books were written, but they are universal and still totally applicable to us today. In the next part of the episode (05:40-12:22), the guys talk about the differences among the wisdom books of the Bible. The books come from distinct time periods in Israel’s history, and each one offers a unique perspective that we need to interpret as a whole. In the final part of the episode (12:34-31:52), the guys talk about how these books stand out against the rest of the Old Testament. The wisdom authors express doubts and questions about other parts of the Bible. These doubts are not to discredit the rest of Scripture––it’s about compelling the readers toward an honest faith. We have to be willing to acknowledge and wrestle with doubts and questions, and the wisdom books can guide us in this. Video: This episode is designed to accompany our wisdom series of videos. You can view all of the videos in this series on our youtube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLH0Szn1yYNeeKPNIy7YXjO3MGD8h8ifhr Scripture References: Proverbs Job Ecclesiastes Show Music: Defender Instrumental by Rosasharn Music Blue Skies by Unwritten Stories Flooded Meadows by Unwritten Stories

Transcript
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Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey, this is Cooper at Bible Project. I produce the podcast in Classroom. We've been exploring a theme called the City, and it's a pretty big theme. So we decided to do two separate Q and R episodes about it. We're currently taking questions for the second Q and R and we'd love to hear from you. Just record your question by July 21st
Starting point is 00:00:17 and send it to us at infoatbiboproject.com. Let us know your name and where you're from, try to keep your question to about 20 seconds and please transcribe your question when you email it in, try to keep your question to about 20 seconds, and please transcribe your question when you email it in. That's a huge help to our team. We're excited to hear from you. Here's the episode.
Starting point is 00:00:42 There are three books in the Hebrew Bible that we're going to explore in detail, collectively they're known as the Wisdom literature, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Job. All of these books are wrestling with a particular set of questions. How should I live in the world? What's the good life? If I try to live wisely, what should I expect? What will God do for me if I really try and do the right thing? We'll talk about how we got these wisdom books in our holy scriptures. So in the wisdom books,
Starting point is 00:01:12 the wise council of God-fearing people and all of the insight accumulated throughout the generations becomes God's word to His people. And we'll discuss why there are three different books with three very different perspectives on why they're suffering in the world and how we should fundamentally think about this world that we live in. Together, they give a sophisticated account of human experience. But if you read only one of them in isolation from each other, you're being too narrow. And you're not hearing the whole of what the scriptures say about life here under the sun. So thanks for joining us for this conversation.
Starting point is 00:01:55 Let's go. Wisdom literature. Yeah. Let's start there. Let's start there. Yeah. There's a group of books in the book. Wisdom literature. Yeah. Let's start there.
Starting point is 00:02:06 Let's start there. Yeah, there's a group of books in the Hebrew Bible that have been traditionally called the Wisdom literature because they're unified by a set of unique features and themes and ideas and so on. And traditionally these are the books of Proverbs, Job, and Ecclesiastes. And then in a unique way, the song of songs is also connected to these. Solomon is a figure connected to three of these books, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, the song of songs, which is of Solomon. Job isn't connected to Solomon, but its main themes are connected to it. So there's
Starting point is 00:02:46 something unique about these four books in the Hebrew Bible, and that's by something that they're missing. When you read these four books, it's like you've completely stepped out of the main storyline that unifies the whole Hebrew Bible of like the family of Abraham and the promised land and the covenant and obeying the laws of the Torah to experience the blessing and God wanting to reach all nations, the temple, the misceanic king, Mount Sinai, priests, sacrifice worship. You know, there's all these main... That's all missing. That's all like the staple of Old Testament story and he is being potato. And there's just none of that. It's just like you dropped out of the story. And these
Starting point is 00:03:29 four books are just exploring a different set of issues and questions. They do so within the world view provided by that story. Right. But they're applying it to a different set of questions. So they believe in this story. They believe they're part of that story, but they don't really discuss it. No, and really what they believe is that the God referred to and whose character and how God works in the world, that's, we're talking about the God of Israel. Yeah. The God revealed in the story of Israel and the rest of the Scriptures. But the questions are different. The questions are all about, what does it mean to live well in God's world? Yeah.
Starting point is 00:04:11 What does it mean to live wisely? And what can I hope for? Just on a personal level. So yeah, okay, Israel and the nations and the final battle and the defeat of evil and never, but okay, but what about me? Right now. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:04:24 That's my family. How do I raise my family? Yeah. How do I go about building, you know, a set of job skills and career goals and how do I deal with difficult people in a very practical way? It's extremely practical. And then just what do you do when life doesn't work out and horrible things happen to you?
Starting point is 00:04:43 Where's God in all of that? it's just like these set of books tune out of the big drama of God and the nations and tune in to practical everyday life and the everyday stories that we wonder about and have questioned about. Yeah. Very interesting. Very unique set of books in the Hebrew Bible. And so when you say Hebrew Bible, you mean the Old Testament. The Old Testament. Yeah. So the rest of the Old Testament is either the narrative of the Israelite people. Yep. And they're covenant with God. Yeah. Or prophetic reflections
Starting point is 00:05:17 upon that story and what, why things are happening the way they're happening now. Yes. Yeah. And so this is, this, these books are unique because it's not, it's stepping out of that. It's kind of regardless of where you live, this is a great way to think about life. Yeah, yeah, they have a universal quality to them. They explore issues and realities and questions of anybody, anywhere.
Starting point is 00:05:40 But from within the worldview of the covenant people of God, with a view of God, the God of Abraham, the God of Sinai, the God of David, is that God that we're talking about, but we're talking about how that God relates to me and my own story of my developing life. So the wisdom books come from different time periods in Israel's history, it's interesting. So Proverbs and Ecclesiastes and Song of Songs are connected to Solomon in some way, but that doesn't necessarily mean Solomon was the author of these books, at least in their final form. The book of Proverbs, actually, there's material from lots of different authors.
Starting point is 00:06:31 It tells you that within the book itself. The book of Job is anonymous. It doesn't make its authorship clear, and it actually doesn't make its time period clear. The book's entirely made up of non-Israelite characters. People say it's the oldest book. Yeah, mostly the reasons for that are the implied cultural setting of the story of Joe, but there's no explicit indicators of when these events took place. Actually, I think the way the book
Starting point is 00:06:58 of Joe begins is the equivalent of Star Wars long time ago in a galaxy. Because it's just long time ago in the Land of Oos, which is a really obscure, we're not really sure where it is, but it's far. It was a man named Job, and he's not in his relied, and none of his friends are Israelites. And then somehow this becomes sacred Hebrew scripture. Yeah, yeah, so it's a Israelite book about a non-Israelite character. I mean, Job is every man.
Starting point is 00:07:28 He's an individual figure, but his experience is meant to invite every person who reads the book to compare their life experience to his. So he's an archetypal character of sorts, which is why he's put in a land far away long, long ago. So Job's interesting in that way. Yeah, these books have so many unique things. Another feature about the Wisdom books is that the kind of authority with which they speak to you, the reader is different, you know.
Starting point is 00:07:55 When Moses is up on Mount Sinai, he comes down and it's Yahweh, the God of Israel, spoke from Mount Sinai through Moses saying, they'll see it the Lord. They'll see it the Lord shalt do this, Thou shalt not do that. The prophets come speaking on behalf of God, thus saith the Lord. So that kind of thing. Yeah, but the wisdom books contain human words. The first nine chapters of Proverbs are words from a father to a son, and the key line
Starting point is 00:08:23 from Proverbs is, listen my child to your parents' instruction. So in the wisdom book, the wise counsel of God-fearing people and all of the insight accumulated throughout the generations becomes God's word to his people in these books. And that I was really profound that there's a whole set of books that validate there's a divine wisdom in the council and the wisdom of the elders and of collective... And the fathers.
Starting point is 00:08:54 Yeah, fathers and mothers who have seen a lot and that God can speak to his people through the wisdom of our elders. It's not really intuitive to 21st century Western culture. We think like the newest is the best. Not the old, what the old people are saying. Yeah, and in this culture, it's exactly the opposite. If it's new, you're suspicious.
Starting point is 00:09:16 Yeah. It's like, if it's old, then you know you can trust it. Right, interesting. I'm reading a book and it's like an on fiction book from 2009. I'm like, mm, that's right. Maybe this is outdated. Yeah, I need to go read some George Orwell because that's clearly going to be better.
Starting point is 00:09:31 No, I'm just saying the opposite. Like, if I'm reading it and it's like, wow, this guy's, let's get rid of this in 2009. The world's changed a lot. Oh, that's seven years. You're saying that 2009 seems old. And I'm like, why would I read that?
Starting point is 00:09:44 Yeah, yeah, that's right. That's totally right. I've noticed that in biblical scholarship too, you know, in my own reading, all favor newer research. Right. Even though. Because we're digging more stuff out of the ground and stuff.
Starting point is 00:09:55 Sometimes. But sometimes it's just, you know, the study or conversation about that topic is progressed. And I want to know with the cutting edge. I want to know what newer people are saying. want to know what the newer people are saying. And that's a cultural value in our culture. Oh totally, it's crazy. And even on the internet, it's worse
Starting point is 00:10:11 where if I'm reading an article on like, how to use Facebook or something for the Bible project and I'm looking into it. And I find an article and it seems legit. And it's from last year. I'm like, oh, well, that's outdated. My Facebook's changed. The way like, so this is useless. Yes. The wisdom, the whole Bible, but especially the wisdom literature has a precisely the opposite view of authority and wisdom and trust. Because things have changed very fast.
Starting point is 00:10:39 Yeah, that's true. We're talking about it. Yeah, time period of history where you could be born, yeah. And die and not see any progression at all. No new inventions, no, I mean, you might see a kingdom take over another kingdom or something, but it'd be rare to live through the Bronze Age turning over something. So although, I just read this the other day, there was a Jewish study scholar named James Davila.
Starting point is 00:11:06 He has a great blog named Paleo Judeca. If you're into archeology and developments and biblical and Jewish studies, you should subscribe to this blog. It's really interesting. And there were just recently discovered these ancient Babylonian texts that are all about astronomical predictions
Starting point is 00:11:23 of the movement of the stars. And it's just last week, I read this, this is what February 2016. And they discovered the math underneath these astronomical texts is a highly sophisticated form of advanced calculus. And it's a form of calculus that up until a week ago was thought to have been invented by mass scholars in Oxford 200 years ago. I'm not joking. That's incredible. It's totally incredible. Yeah, I thought that was so like we're so like the Babylonians were using a fancy calculus 3000 years ago. Yeah, then it got buried in the ground. Yeah. And humans forgot about how to do it. Yes. Four thousands of years.
Starting point is 00:12:06 Exactly. And then a couple of bloaks in Oxford were like, hey, we discovered something. Yeah, don't. And it's what they were doing. Three thousand years ago. Yes. Yeah. Anyhow.
Starting point is 00:12:16 So maybe there were advances back then. Oh, they're for sure. It was a technological advance. Yeah. But not at the rate. But not the rate. And yes. But, but so, yeah, all that to say though,
Starting point is 00:12:26 is we're talking about cultures where even those advances fit within a tradition along centuries, millennia, along the old tradition of astronomy and so on. And the value is the older it is, the older the pedigree, the more trustworthy. And that's the whole world view of wisdom literature. Is this an ancient wisdom, a kind of like through hundreds of generations, I'd be an idiot to not listen to the book of Proverbs. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, in terms of like where, where proverbs come from, proverbs by nature are these sayings that have been passed down and they gain their authority by repetition and common value.
Starting point is 00:13:16 So I'll notice something like, hey every single time I, what's the one about the dog? Or like, yeah, no, this is my favorite example. Yeah, Proverbs, I pulled it up for you. Proverbs 26, 17. Like one who grabs a stray dog by the ears is someone who rushes into a coral that is not their own. Yeah, that's great. Yeah, so somebody, you know, pet a stray dog once
Starting point is 00:13:43 and grabbed its ear a little too rough and right right right and then nothing they got involved in their neighbors like dispute over Who owns this side of the yard right of the rock pile? Yeah, and that didn't go well and they was like, you know what that's like? Mm-hmm. I noticed a similarity between my experience with that dog and my experience with my neighbor. And so he's- I'm gonna write that down. Yeah, and so he tells it to his kids, and his kids grow up and they're like, yeah, so true.
Starting point is 00:14:13 That makes a lot of sense. And then it just spreads, it's like goes viral. And everybody's like, yeah, that's so good. Yeah, those are viral things. Yeah. These are the first memes. Hahaha. Proverbs, the first memes.
Starting point is 00:14:24 Hahaha. Great. And then, the first memes. Hahaha. Great. And then that's how they gain a story. So it wasn't like a guy goes, gets bit by a dog and then he sat down, he's like, you know, I'm gonna prayerfully ask God to give me wisdom that will be for his people and brought into,
Starting point is 00:14:42 in our sacred scriptures. Yes. And then, okay, cool. And then God's like, well, what about dogs and, you know, and helping him craft that? There is an important moment though, where the God's word element becomes significant. And that's, it's not in the origin of the proverb so much. It's when the proverb gets collected into a book. The collector is doing that, is
Starting point is 00:15:06 being. And the connection of Solomon is significant to the foundation story of Solomon, because he's put before a mammoth task of guiding and leading a whole people group in justice and wisdom and so on, and he knows that he can't do it. So he asked God for wisdom, and there's a famous dream first King's chapter three. And so God gives him wisdom. And then he goes on throughout his career to become known for his wisdom and crafting poetry and proverbs and math and ancient botany. And he's really, he was a renaissance man before his time. So that's significant that Solomon's story is of, he received, he saw his wisdom in the inside he had as a divine gift. And then this book comes into existence over time, and this book gets collected as an
Starting point is 00:16:00 embodiment of that divine gift of wisdom. Now not just a Solomon, but to all of God's people. So the book is God's gift to His people, God's word, but the content of that divine word came from all over. Is human wisdom. Yeah. It's very unique. It's really unique that way.
Starting point is 00:16:19 It's cool. And so we're talking about Proverbs specifically. I might be jumping the gun, because we were just talking about the wisdom that are turned general. Proverbs specifically, I might be jumping the gun because we were just talking about the wisdom Their turn general. Proverbs, real bannacles, yes. Well, so that brings up the last interesting thing about this collection of books before we dive into Proverbs and that's the relationship that these books have to each other
Starting point is 00:16:37 because there's a tension, a creative tension between these books and their message that they each have. So the main questions are about, how should I live in the world? What's the good life? If I try to live wisely, what should I expect? What will God do for me if I really try and do the right thing? And they offer a different perspective. So Proverbs says, you know, be wise, if you're God, things will work out for you. Yeah. And if you're stupid and evil, things will go bad for you. And you'll die young, you know. So for example, you know, Proverbs 13, 9, the light of the righteous rejoices. It's like the righteous person whose lies has a light and it shines and they live in happiness and with the light of their lamp.
Starting point is 00:17:25 But the proverb finishes, but the lamp of the wicked snuffed out. So you're righteous and wise? You light, prosperity, happiness. And you're wicked and stupid, you're all die young. And then Job, of course, is about as righteous and wise of man as they come. And horrible things happen to him for reasons
Starting point is 00:17:46 that he never discovers why. You the reader, discover why, we'll talk about that later, but Job never discovers why. And so later on in the book, he actually uses the same line as that proverb, and he asks in Job 2117, how often is the lamp of the wicked put out? Right. Or does there calamity really ever come? Yeah. Because I'm looking around and some wicked people have it pretty good. Wicked people have it and I've been doing the right thing and look at my live right now. Yeah. So he's questioning the message of Proverbs.
Starting point is 00:18:16 The message of Proverbs. Yeah. And that's part of his wrestling match in the book. Well, not only is he wrestling with it, but Proverbs isn't working for him. The book of Proverbs didn't work out for Joe. Which is a weird thing to think of like, okay, so we've got this divinely given wisdom book that tells you Do this and it's gonna be great. Mm-hmm. And then you have another book that says, hey, this guy did it and it didn't work out at all. Yeah, that's right. And both of those books are in the same Bible.
Starting point is 00:18:45 In the Bible. Yeah. They're both Scripture. And then you get Ecclesiastes who has seen sometimes it work out for Joe Black people, but then other times not. So Ecclesiastes 7, the speaker, teacher in Ecclesiastes, says, I've seen a righteous man who dies
Starting point is 00:19:03 despite his righteousness and a wicked man who has a long life despite his wickedness. And then he says, this is absurd. So for him, it's not just that the book of Proverbs doesn't work, but that sometimes it does, but sometimes it doesn't. And so if it's not a guaranteed system, what's the point? It really frustrates him. It drives Job to pray and to be angry and wrestle with God, and it drives the speaker and ecclesiastes to despair. Again, all three of these viewpoints are in the same Bible. I don't think they're contradicting each other. It's not going to help us to say that, because sometimes Proverbs is true to our life experience, but not always. Sometimes Job and Ecclesiastes are true. The wrestling match in different seasons of the same person's life can be spoken to by these different
Starting point is 00:19:56 books at different times. It's interesting. Is there traditions, Jewish traditions, and how they view that tension, how they answer, whether it's a contradiction, they contradict each other or not. Yeah, the history of Jewish theology and tradition, it's very much what's called a dialogical view of truth and reality. Yeah, if you ever read the classic Jewish text,
Starting point is 00:20:20 the mission in the Talmud, there'll be a section on the Sabbath or what it means to rest on the Sabbath. And it'll give you 50 rabbis points of view. And then it's over. That's what I hear. It's like, wait, so you know, Rabbi Yohranan said this and Rabbi Lykeem said that and Rabbi Jose made fun of Rabbi Lykeem and said he was wrong.
Starting point is 00:20:43 And then, and he's finished me like, wait, so there's something in Jewish tradition. I think that takes its cue from the Hebrew Bible that it contains within itself a message that is sometimes doubted and then you come out the other side still believing the main message but knowing that it's probably more complex than what you first thought. Yeah, and that's so hard for me to understand that that's scripture because from the tradition I grew up in, it's a little more simplistic. It's the, you know, God said it, I believe it, that settles it kind of mentality.
Starting point is 00:21:20 And so Proverbs is a favorite book because it's very straightforward. Yeah, yeah. Like, this is how book because it's very straightforward. Yeah. Like, this is how you do it. Follow it. That settles it. It really fits into that paradigm. Then you get to a book like Cleasy Ashes and Job, and it kind of are these, they're the
Starting point is 00:21:35 enigmas that everyone, you know, like, you just kind of leave them alone. Yeah, sure. Yeah, and some traditions that kind of an embarrassment. A little bit of an embarrassment. Yeah. So we don't spend a lot of time with them. I mean, there are answers to them that kind of smooth over the edges. But so, yeah, it's just really interesting to wrestle with the fact that in our scripture, we have books that require you to hold them in tension and to kind of have this conversation between them and they nuance
Starting point is 00:22:06 each other. Yeah. The point is, is that together they give a sophisticated account of human experience. But if you read only one of them in isolation from each other, you're being too narrow. And you're not hearing the whole of what the scriptures say about life here under the sun. So, yeah, we could, this point's been summarized by one of my favorite Old Testament scholars, a guy named Christopher Wright, and he put it this way. He says, the most challenging difference between the wisdom writings and the rest of the Old Testament
Starting point is 00:22:46 arises when wisdom authors express doubts about or question the validity of some of the main line affirmations of other parts of the Bible. And yet, this is precisely the purpose of this material in the canon of Scripture. To compel us towards an honest faith that's willing to acknowledge the presence of doubts we cannot dismiss and questions we can't always fully answer given our human limitations. So here he's thinking about how the book of Ecclesiastes would look, say, at Moses' speech in Deuteronomy and say, obedience to God's word will always lead to blessing and abundance in the land, but disobedience will bring ruin and destruction. And that's carried over into the book of Proverbs, too.
Starting point is 00:23:35 And Ecclesiastes forces you the reader of the whole Bible to recognize life's complex and sometimes things happen that don't fit into our grid. And it doesn't mean that God's not real or faithful, it just means, oh, life's more complex than I first thought. I need to take that into account. To me, that's very helpful. More than anything, it forces you to have a bigger category for what the Bible is, than just, you know, golden tablets falling from heaven, telling you what to believe and what not to do, then just golden tablets, falling from heaven, telling you what to believe and what not to do, something like that. Yeah, like built into our scriptures
Starting point is 00:24:11 is an opportunity to wrestle and question scripture. Especially around the topics of suffering and disappointment and things going well, but then not going well. Like that's what the wisdom books are about. It's like practical everyday life circumstances. So there's like a very authoritative, here's what God's doing in history to save the world. That's what the big story is about. But in our individual stories, where things seem more complicated sometimes, the wisdom books are very sophisticated. They're not simplistic. Yeah. They don't offer simple answers. And that's especially true for ecclesiastes.
Starting point is 00:24:51 And Job. Yep, that's right. Where, probably, it doesn't question those things as much. No, no. It's trying to paint a picture of the world that says there are some things that are true and reliable and pretty common to the whole of humanity's experience here. It actually does recognize there's some complexity to how we live and how we can think about cause and effect and stuff. But for the most part, it's focusing on the general rule and Ecclesiastes and Job focus on the exceptions to rule. You brought up as a thought experiment, you said, imagine three guys in a bar.
Starting point is 00:25:43 I don't know if you said in a bar. I don't know if you said it in a bar. I don't know if I said that. Imagine three guys. I like that addition though. Yeah, so. After some reason I was three people in a bar. Three people hanging out. Three people hanging out and you went up
Starting point is 00:25:54 to this group of three and you had like a question for them. And they're all gonna answer you differently. They have three different perspectives. And they're all friends and they all talk to each other. And it's probably because oflesiastes and Joe, but the three people, I just thought that was such a cool picture. And so we just started talking about, well what are, what are these people like?
Starting point is 00:26:11 Mm-hmm. Yeah. And we really ran with that idea. Yeah, yeah. We're gonna make videos about it. We're gonna make videos that, yeah. Structured on this. So Proverbs is the young teacher, idealistic, very optimistic, and super smart.
Starting point is 00:26:29 She really is smart about everything. Yeah. Like she has expert advice to give to you about your business decisions, how you raise your kids, how you have a great marriage, good friends, and live in your neighborhood. Right. Actually, this really couldn't do. It gets it. And we're using the feminine pronoun. Yes, yeah, yeah.
Starting point is 00:26:52 We wanted to make Proverbs a feminine character because, as we'll talk about, the wisdom in the book of Proverbs is personified as a brilliant, smart, elegant woman. Yeah, lady wisdom. Lady wisdom, yeah. So we'll talk about that, but. Yeah, there's a lot of femininity.
Starting point is 00:27:10 And actually, it begins with a set of poems near the beginning of the book about lady wisdom. And then the last chapter, 31, is the whole long poem dedicated to depicting the ideal wise woman. Yeah, rad woman. Yeah, so yeah, so it was no brainer. We just, let's make Proverbs a woman. Yeah. Rad woman. Yeah, so yeah, so we just, it was no brainer. We just, let's make, let's make Proverbs a woman.
Starting point is 00:27:28 Proverbs a woman. Now, there is, in Proverbs, a lot of masculine stuff. Yes, yeah. Proverbs of Solomon, there's a lot of father figures speaking, talk to their sons. Yep, but wisdom, the idea of what wisdom is, is personified as a woman to which fathers and sons and mothers and daughters all should pay attention. So we didn't want three dudes in this thought experiment,
Starting point is 00:27:50 so promise is the natural candidate. That's great. So, as Proverbs, as Proverbs ecclesiastes, is sitting next to Proverbs and he's kind of more middle-aged, He's a critic, and he's brilliant, and he can just cut through anyone's argument, just like destroy, see the other side of things. He could argue with you about anything. That's right. And he said, yeah, he's cynical, a little disenchanted because he's seen a lot and done a lot,
Starting point is 00:28:21 and some things have worked out well for him, but a lot of things haven't. Yeah, he's done a lot of projects. Yeah. Like he's built businesses. Yeah. He's built things. He partied in his 20s.
Starting point is 00:28:31 He partied his 20s. He had kids, his kids grew up. They're now in empty nesters. Yeah. Like he's seen a lot of things, and he's seen some things go well, and some things just go off the rails. Yeah. And he's come to the conclusion that things
Starting point is 00:28:47 aren't as simplistic as he used to think in his 20s. Well he can't tolerate his people with black and white simplistic thinking or people who are building their lives on a false meaning and unreliable hopes. Right. So he's just being naive. Yeah, he takes great pleasure in dismantling people's, the meaning of people's lives, especially by talking about death all the time. So up till now, you go to these two people and you go to you go to Proverbs and you're going to get this really rad
Starting point is 00:29:20 like lesson of like, well, here's what you should do. And here's what you should do and it's's gonna be warm, it's gonna be optimistic. And then you're gonna turn to ecclesiastically and be like, okay, what about you? And he's just gonna like, so that's the, there's a big difference there. And then there's Job, who you might forget to talk to because he's like, yeah.
Starting point is 00:29:38 Why at least sitting there next to them, just listening. And just kind of chuckling to himself. Wisely observing. Yeah. Letting the young bucks fight it out. But he's an older man. He's seen a lot in his life. He's been put through the ringer.
Starting point is 00:29:53 Mm-hmm. He's lost his family, he's lost his wife. Yeah. He's got a new family, a new wife. And he used to be kind of cynical and bitter, like the Cliziaz days, but he worked through it. He worked through it. And he has a piece about him.
Starting point is 00:30:08 Yeah. He can trust God in spite of all that. Deep faith and trusting God. It's not simplistic, sophisticated, because of his experience. But he really believes that God's trust worthy, precisely because of the hardship that he's been through. So he's very warm and pastoral and has a different kind of wisdom to offer. It's not answers.
Starting point is 00:30:31 He's a kind of a Yoda figure in some way than he was like a... So we've built each of these characters based on the content and message of the books themselves. Yeah, if we were going to turn a book into a character. And then we are creating a three-part video series where we have each of them at the table and let each character have their say. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Bible Project podcast. I'm John Collins and I've been talking with Tim Mackey. We're the co-creators of the Bible Project podcast. I'm John Collins and I've been talking with Tim Mackey, where the co-creators of the Bible Project, you can watch our
Starting point is 00:31:08 videos. They're on YouTube for free. YouTube.com slash the Bible Project. We're really proud of them. The videos in the Wisdom series are coming out this year 2016. The Book of Proverbs has just released and you'll find that on our YouTube channel. And Ecclesiastes and Job will also be out this summer 2016 into the fall. I think Job will be done in the fall. You can follow us on Twitter at join Bible Proj. You can say hi to us on Facebook, Facebook.com slash the Bible project and if you like this podcast, you can help us by putting a review on iTunes that helps with our exposure or you can just share it with friends or you can just enjoy it yourself as you
Starting point is 00:31:49 fall asleep at night or ride your bike home from work or roll your lawn however you're enjoying this podcast. Thanks for listening and again thanks for all the supporters who help us make these videos and podcasts possible thanks for being a part of this with us. you

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