BibleProject - The Tale of Two Trees - Tree of Life E3

Episode Date: January 20, 2020

View full show notes from this episode →ResourcesHow to Read the Bible: The Books of SolomonMusicDefender Instrumental by TentsShow produced by Dan Gummel.Powered and distributed by Simplecast.

Hey, this is Cooper at Bible Project. I produce the podcast in Classroom. We've been exploring a theme called the City, and it's a pretty big theme. So we decided to do two separate Q and R episodes about it. We're currently taking questions for the second Q and R and we'd love to hear from you. Just record your question by July 21st

and send it to us at infoatbiboproject.com. Let us know your name and where you're from, try to keep your question to about 20 seconds and please transcribe your question when you email it in, try to keep your question to about 20 seconds, and please transcribe your question when you email it in. That's a huge help to our team. We're excited to hear from you. Here's the episode.

I'm Page 2 of the Bible, God plants humanity in a garden, the garden of the lights, or what we call the garden of Eden. God also plants many trees there, trees that are good for food, trees that are good to look at, and one beautiful cosmic tree in the center of the garden that represents God's own life, the tree of life. And God says to Adam and Eve, eat of any of these trees, except there's one tree they're forbidden to eat from. It's called the tree of knowing good and evil. Eat of that tree and you'll die.

And this has bugged me and a lot of people, why would God put in this good garden such an incredible test? The reason that the tree is there in the garden, it's a powerful image of the nature of all human experience. Every good thing in my life is also matched by an equal or greater number of opportunities to ruin it. So these two trees are intertwined. The tree of life and the tree of knowing good and bad,

how you relate to one determines how you relate to the other. And God doesn't put the tree of knowing good and bad, how you relate to one determines how you relate to the other. And God doesn't put the tree in some obscure place that's hard to find. He puts it right in the middle of the garden, right next to the tree of life. To experience and eat from the tree of life, you have to walk by. The tree of knowing good and bad. And not take from it. Avoid it. It looks good

But God said that will kill me. That's a thing that will kill me and hurt myself and others It looks awesome, but I'm gonna avoid it so that I can keep enjoying Access to life. That's the way these trees relate to each other. It's the tale of two trees So today on the show we'll dive into the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Thanks for joining us. Here we go. Okay, so we're working through a theme in the Bible.

And the theme is trees. I'm pretty sure it's gonna be the tree of life. Yeah, this video will be about the tree of life. Tree of life, theme video. Okay, but in order to talk about the tree of life, we got to just talk about trees. Ah, the meaning of trees in the Bible in general. And in the first episode of this discussion, you brought up that trees are talked about a lot. Yes. Yep. A lot in the Bible. And after God and humans, they're the most talked about organic living thing. Yep, that's right. Yeah.

And they have a particular kind of symbolism and meaning in the biblical story. Yes. And that meaning is introduced in Genesis 1 and 2 where trees are a real focal point. Yeah. in Genesis 1 and 2 were trees or a real focal point. Yeah, and one of the things that trees do in the Bible is become a metaphoric scheme for thinking about what people are like. Yes. People are like trees. Correct. People are trees.

Yeah. People are trees to be a metaphor. That's right. Correct. Yeah. The way trees exist in the world and the way that trees exist in this narrative is very similar. Shares lots of similarities to what people mean. Yeah. And how they are and the role they play in the story. So in Psalm 1, you can be, you could be a tree planted by a stream of water. Yeah, that's right. That is this ideal place of being human.

Yeah, state of being human. Yeah, think of, yeah, someone, which is a part of a package deal, a Psalm 1 and 2 are composed as a literary whole introducing the book of Psalms. And what you get is a human so connected with the will of God that one, Psalm 1, they're like an eternal tree planted in Eden, Psalm 2, ruling over the world, and undoing all the evil and chaos in the world to bring about the new Eden. People are trees. People are trees. So that's the tree of life imagery. The trees are an image of perpetual life, of continually bearing new life from within themselves.

And humans are like that too. They have the next generation within them. So there you go. Trees provide life for the creatures around them. Humans can spread and create more life for the creatures around them. It's another way they're similar. And trees were a big deal because in the place

and time this was written, you're a people that are dependent on the land. I mean, we still are, but I don't farm. And they lived in a place that had a lot of kind of desert-y planes. Yeah, the Bible came into existence within a culture that existed and lived and traveled between the Mediterranean Sea on the eastern end

and the Persian Gulf across the desert. So the ancient near east is what that refers to. So from Egypt down Northern Africa up into the Middle East, the fertile crescent, then all the way down. And if you just look on a satellite image, Google Maps it today. You'll see a big brown stripe. Yeah. Through that section, with occasional spots of green and blue,

that are either mountains, oasis, high places, or river, river deltas. So trees were a big deal. Lots of life around trees. Now, in the next episode we talked about, there's two specific trees in the garden narrative in Genesis 2. God plants a bunch of trees. God plants a garden in the midst of a wilderness. That's Genesis 2. Yeah, yeah. There's wilderness and nothing cultivated, and God plants the garden. God plants the garden. Yeah, there's trees that are good to look at

There's trees that for food and then in the middle of the garden. It's on a sacred high place. Oh the garden is with a river One river flowing out and then flowing down to become the four rivers that you know water all the corners of the earth So to speak So a high mountain high mountains and the river flowing out in the corners of the earth, so to speak. So the high mountain, the trees, and the rivers, at the growing out of it. In the middle of this, which then you would realize is kind of like the top of the mountain.

Correct, yeah. Is the tree of life. The tree of life. Of life. And we talked about that, tree. And we talked about how this picture of a tree of life was a very common image for the imaginative palate as you will. Good, good of the ancient Near East. Yeah, neighboring stories. They would talk about such trees. Yeah, trees,

sacred trees, the top high places where either the gods are the tree, like in Egypt or Canaanite culture, Asura, some of the fertility goddess symbolized by tree, ritual trees on high places, or human kings can be depicted as sacred trees. And then, yeah, in Genesis 2, the tree of life is riffing off of, but also contrasting with both of those ideas. Yes. You're familiar with those ideas?

Yeah. Here's a biblical way. Yeah, a biblical take on the tree of life. On, yes. Yeah. That God planted it. Mm-hmm. It is not a God, but it is a gift of God. It's a gift. Yeah. Yeah. And it's something that we can take and experience eternal life. Because the author can assume that a cultural understanding that

Okay, in biblical faith the God isn't a tree But the tree is a place where humans meet God because it's in the middle of the garden Yes And so a human Meeting personally becoming one with the presence of God in the middle of the garden. And so a human meeting personally becoming one with the presence of God in the middle of the garden is depicted through this image of eating from the tree and the fruit, it is as if the fruit conveys God's life to the human through that proximity and intimacy. Yeah. And where this really landed for me was making the connection between Eden and the temple

Yep, which is a whole no other conversation. Yeah, but there is a parallel direct parallel between Living right Eden and the in the tree in the middle of the garden to the temple and the holy of holies in the middle of the temple And to a god is where it's thrown is right and if you go into the temple You see imagery of of the garden and of a fruit tree and the cherry beam and all that. And so, yeah, it's about living in connection with God. So that was a great conversation. Now, there's another tree. Yes, we're not told that's in the middle of the garden, but we kind of can assume that it's also there in the middle of the garden. Yeah, so the tree of life was in the middle of the garden and the tree of knowing good and bad.

Yes, and the tree of knowing good and bad. And it was there too. Yeah, so two trees. Two trees. So we're going to talk about a second tree and then what happens as a result of that second tree, the tree of knowing good and bad. So in brief, we have had many, many conversations

about the meaning of this tree. Weasley. But so knowing good and bad is a phrase used in the Hebrew Bible like three or four times. It's always connected with children in a state of moral immaturity or just inexperienced in life. Good and bad representing not just good and evil as like philosophical moral categories, but good and bad in terms of... Things that create life and things that break things down.

Beneficial things and harmful, terrible things. Humanity's in an infant state. Things that build up things that... That's right. That's right. God wants to shelter and protect the humans from good and bad. Until presumably, they can learn wisdom from him to become wise rulers over the garden. That's an inference.

Yes, that is an inference. But I think it's one that becomes much more clear as you go throughout the story. God doesn't want to keep humans in an infant state. Yes, because it wants them to rule. They've got to rule with him. And to rule, you need wisdom. Correct. And so the question is, how are you going to get wisdom? How are you going to get the wisdom? So that's one layer

of this. The second layer is when the command about the trees is given in Genesis 2, we're going to look at it here, the Genesis 2 verses 15 and 17, the wording is important here. It says then Yahweh God took human, the human, put him into the Garden of Eden, to work it and to keep it, of Da'ul-Shomra. We've talked about this before. Those two verbs, it's Avad, Hebrew, and Shamar. In combination, there's only one other group of people in the Hebrew Bible given. That instruction. That job description. And it's the Levites who work in the temple pre-synx. Yeah.

Yeah. So we're back to Adam and Eve as royal priests. Yeah. And Eden as a. Eden as a temple. Temple. Yeah. And the middle of the garden as the Holy of Holies.

Yeah. The throne of God. Where this was to go and eat of the tree of life. Meet with God and ingest his divine life. Yes. Verse 16, Yahweh God commanded first divine command, commanded the human saying, from all the trees of the garden,

you may eat, eat, and Hebrew. Don't really? It's surely eat in English. To put emphasis on it. It's an emphatic Hebrew turn of phrase. You just repeat the verb twice. You shall eat, eat. Let us eat, eat.

So that's the first command, actually. This is very important. The first command is to eat of all the trees. The first command is to eat. Yes. I love it. Yeah, eat, eat. Which, okay, so what's all the trees?

That includes the tree of life. Yes. So it's very important. The first command, it doesn't place the Tree of Life off limits. And then if you obey the command, then you get the Tree of Life. Oh, interesting. That's not the storyline. Oh, yeah.

It's very important for especially modern misunderstandings of this story. Yeah, it's not a reward for doing good. No, the reward is given before the humans have done anything. It's because it's not a reward, it's a gift. It's the gift of eternal life is there. So, the first divine command is to enjoy the gift of eternal life. It is yours. So, this reframes what the command about the tree of knowing good and bad is then, right?

What these verses don't say is Yahweh God commanded the human saying you may eat from all the trees of the garden including the tree of life If you don't take from the tree of knowing good and bad. That's I think but that's how many people read it, right? But that's not the tree of life is already theirs So the warning about the tree of knowing good and bad is eating from the tree of knowing good and bad will result in forfeiting the thing that is already yours. That's the setup here. I think that's an important difference. It is. Yeah, I like that. I also like that by putting it, lumping it with all the other trees that you can eat from.

It kind of helps me think about it more as a daily thing. Not as, I guess I've always pictured the tree of life as the prize at the end, you know, like you're just saying, like you beat the game, you get the prize, you follow all the gods commands, now you get the reward. Yeah. But it's with all the trees and it's part of just nourishment. Yeah. That's good. 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1%, 1%, 1 %, 1 %, 1 %, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1%, 1 So again, back to the wording here. So first command is from all the trees of the garden you may eat, but from the tree of knowing good and bad, you shall not eat, because in the day you eat from that tree, you will die, die. Oh, well. It's surely die, but Hebrew, it's die, die. So it begins and ends with a double emphasis.

Eat, eat from all the trees. One tree is going to make it all fall apart. Don't eat from that because you'll die, die. I want you to eat, eat. I don't want you to die, die. So this isn't a warning. It doesn't say if you eat from the tree of no good and bad, I will kill you. Right.

It does not say that. It says it will lead to death. Death will be the consequence. And that's what's going to happen in the narrative. They eat from the tree. The first thing they do is mistrust each other and hide their bodies and then blame each other. Then you watch two brothers divide and then

one kills the other for the first death in the Bible is not from God killing somebody. It's from a human who's taken the knowledge you couldn't bat into their own hands and then you get the outbreak of violence that leads to the flood. So Gary, for sure, is one of my theological mentors. Many years ago, he first pointed this out to me. It doesn't say, if you eat from the tree of the moon about, I will kill you. He says, it will kill you. It's a paraphrase, but that's the idea.

Yeah. So when this hit me, and I realize, like I've been reading a different story into these words and not letting the words say what they actually mean. The different story being that that God's kind of judgment against humans for disobeying was that he would kill them. Correct. I'd always assumed that the nuance that work in you will surely die. Yeah. Instead of a warning that there is a reality in which the humans can live, which will

come into death. That's right. And God plays a role in that He exiles them from the garden so that they can't eat from the tree of life, which means that they'll die. But that's a secondary response to humans taking, and it's the taking that leads them to start killing each other in the next chapter And even that we talked about last episode. I see is like a mercy. It's exactly. Yeah, that's right Keeping up the tree of life while living in a state of death. Correct means that they don't have to live forever in death Yeah, exactly. Yeah, totally. So, okay, so let's pause.

So this tree, think of it this way. This is a way you and I talked this through actually a while ago, but we were saving it for this conversation. Think of these two trees as being next to each other in the garden, right? And the command is eat from all the trees, which includes that one in the middle. The tree of life.

However, to experience and eat from the tree of life, you have to walk by the tree of knowing good and bad and not take from it, avoid it. It looks good, but God said that will kill me. That's a thing that will kill me and hurt myself and others. It looks awesome, but I'm going to avoid it so that I can keep enjoying access to life. That's the way these trees relate to each other. The way to eternal life is by keeping my hands off the tree

of knowing good and bad. I don't have to earn eternal life. It's already a gift to me, but I can forfeit my chance and access to it by choosing my own knowing of good and bad. That's the dynamic I work. It's the tale of two trees. And it's helpful to frame it that way because often the question becomes, why did God, why did God even put this tree with all this? Oh, sure. Yeah, we're trying to blame God for putting a choice in front of the humans. And when you frame it that way, my thought isn't, why did God do that?

My thought is, yeah, that really does help explain the human condition. Yes, that's right. That's what I experience. That's what I experience of the human condition. I can see, oh, that's life. God's pointing me towards life. He's saying, take life. And then all around me, I see these branches and this other fruit.

And it's constantly drawing my eye to it, saying like, well, this is actually looking pretty nice too. This is the way that I could. You could have life this way. I could do the thing. The branches of the tree of knowing good and bad. that I could... You could have life this way. I could do the thing. Ah. The branches of the tree of knowing good and bad. Hang a little lower.

Yeah. In the branches of the tree. Yeah, they often do. It's what looks like the easier way. And then what I'm not seeing is that it's easier for me, but might actually make it harder for others to have access to the Tree of Life. And I guess the other interesting thing is that it's about the knowledge of good and bad,

not like a specific moral choice, right? Like it's not like, oh man, I would really wanna eat of the Tree of Life, but I think I wanna hate my friend. I'm gonna choose hating my friend. Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's actually a step before that. It's a step of going, you know, as it pertains to my relationships with others, I'm going

to know what is good and what is bad, what kind of things will build up and what kind of things will destroy. I'm going to take that power and authority on myself for myself. Yeah, for myself. Yeah. Yeah. So the gift of a tree of life is something that's like the goodness of God in creation. It's the gift of life. It's a wonderful friend that I've had since childhood. And it's just awesome. And then we're such good friends. We start a small business together. Because we are our ideas work well and we love it. Then you start ruling. That's ruling that you're ruled in the world together creating a new value in the world that didn't exist

before. But then you get into situations and you have some choices to make and those choices could affect your friend. Maybe what you do with the money, or you split up resources, or how you apportion vacation time off, or, and then I'll have a sudden, which is how you communicate. Yeah, that's right. And I start to feel like, I deserve some more time off. I work harder than them.

And then I start making decisions that seem good in my eyes. Yes. I start redefining it as good. And I don't even know that I'm beginning to slight another person, and neglect their well-being as much as I care about mine. And then all of a sudden, I'm eating from the wrong tree.

Yes. And it seems like the right thing to do. I think what's good about the way you're talking about that is that it's not like, oh man, am I going to eat of that tree or not? Hmm. Well. Yeah, there is a choice involved. There's a choice involved.

Yeah. But the choice is, am I going to define good and evil? Good and bad. Yeah. Oh, I see. Yeah, that's not how it presents itself to us, right? Yeah, that choice is done almost unconsciously. Yeah.

We take that just naturally. Yeah. It's like, yeah, that's right. That kind of speaks to just the human condition. That's right. We just come into the world just gorging on that just naturally. It's like, that's right. That kind of speaks to just the human condition. We just come into the world just gorging on that for you. The reason that the tree is there in the garden, it's a powerful image of the nature of all human experience. Every good thing in my life is also matched by

an equal or greater number of opportunities to ruin it by taking my own knowledge of good and bad. But I take it often without knowing it. I just make what I think it's the right decision. But I don't recognize it's all, has all these grew-up motives underneath it. So that's all the way back to one of our first videos, the tree of knowing it bad, represents a choice. Yes. That's before us perpetually, that's why it's right next to the tree of life. You've been to Sunday school.

Yeah, you know. That's right. Other signs. Yeah, the good times last two pages. Woo! I'm going to go to the next room. 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc

1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc 1 tbc So we have in other videos and conversations talked about the scene, the first movement of Genesis 3 introduced the snake in a positive way.

He's sharp, he sharp. Shrewd. Yeah, he's crafty. The Shrewd have a negative connotation, but it says, sorry, I think Shrewd is neutral. Is it? So the first sentence of Gentsus III, now the snake or the serpent was more Audrum

than any beast of the field. That's the Hebrew, Audrum. Audrum, which is every other time it appears in the Hebrew Bible, it's a positive. Actually don't quote me on that. In the book of Proverbs, every time it appears in the Hebrew Bible, it's a positive. Actually, don't quote me on that. In the book of Proverbs, every time it appears in Proverbs, it's a positive trait of the righteous and the wise. It's the ability to be able to creatively use wisdom. Yeah, but specifically, in a situation, I can identify all the factors, find the solution forward, and act on it.

Strategic. Strategic. Oh, there you go. Yeah, strategic. Yeah, shrewd. Shrewd. But it's like you're making the best decision with the least amount of unnecessary stuff left over. Yeah, right.

So the point is, the serpent sees, this is an opportunity. We talked about this when we did our question response on the Satan. Yeah yeah that's right. Which I think was a YouTube question response and you used to make the point that the use of word a room here. Yeah yeah is is not negative. It's not negative but it does say this serpent has the capabilities. Remember, just like wisdom, you can be wise to terrible ends, you can be wise towards good ends. That's always a choice.

So I think it's introducing this creature having two possibilities before it. It's interesting, you have humans who are kind of in their infancy. Yeah, that's right. And then you have this serpent who's a room. Yeah, that's right. So the humans, they serpent who's a room. Yeah. So the humans, they still are kind of childish. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. But this creature,

but this creature knows what's up. He's been around the block. Yeah. That's right. He has knowledge of God's words, claims that have privileged knowledge of God's divine counsel decisions. No, you won't die. No, here's what God knows. Let me tell you what God knows, because I've heard him talk about it That kind of thing. Yeah, which starts to make you think this is more than just your average snake Yeah, that's a whole other conversation What I want to focus on is the tree moment which we have focused on that too In other conversations, but the point is that in this conversation between a woman and a snake snake says

Oh, so God said you can't eat from any of these trees. So he inverts the gift, just blatant inversion of God's words. Yeah, because God said you could eat from any of these. God commanded them to eat from all of the trees. That was his command, was enjoying it all. And the snake's like, wait, so God said none of the trees? Yeah, and so the woman's quick on that. She's like, no, this is ridiculous. We can eat from the fruit of the trees of the garden. But there's one tree in the middle where God said, don't eat from that or touch it or you will die, die. You will surely die. And then the servant says, you won't die,

die. In the day, God knows that when you eat of it, your eyes will be opened in enlightenment. Yeah, wisdom. Wisdom. Yeah, yeah, brightening of the eyes. And you'll be like Elohim knowing good and evil. So, excuse me. Thank you. Tovyn Ra. No one can thank you for that correction. Hey, you're helping me be consistent. So, the woman saw that the tree was good for eating. So it's one is, hey, I'm hungry. Yeah. That was satisfying my desire. But it was also beautiful. It's attractive. That's weird that God would say don't eat from that. Because it's having the ability to know good from bad. Yeah. It's an attractive proposition.

Well, yes. Correct. Yeah. It is attractive. It seems like that would be a good thing for me to have. Yeah. And do you remember this is often, this is going to be a motif then that these test moments that biblical characters come before are sometimes between a good choice and a evil choice. But often it's between a good choice and, well, that seems like a good choice too, but... Well, it might hurt somebody or it might, but it's usually between good and, I think that's good too. Yeah.

And that's, once again, true to the human condition. Right, that's totally true. There are times where it's really obvious. Yes. That's the bad thing. And there's a struggle is kind of like, am I gonna let myself get away with the bad thing? Mm-hmm. But more often, it's just, man, there's a struggle is kind of like, am I gonna let myself get away with the bad thing?

But more often, it's just, man, there's two routes. I don't know. Yeah, or I don't know. I don't know, or my intuition is this one. Correct. But my intuition is gonna be clouded by all my biases and self-ashments. But usually that are invisible in the moment.

We've talked about this many times. We both had seasons in our lives where we made significant decisions, which at the moment seemed neutral. But then the, just like the hindsight of a year or two to realize like, oh man, all these other motivations that work that I can see now, but I couldn't in the moment. That's a weird, it's weird to realize. It's like we're tricking ourselves into thinking we can know good from raw.

Right. But yeah, reality, we are unable to shoot. We're gonna shoot it in the dark a lot of times. And so that's the last relevant to the last thing that she sees, which is she sees that it's desirable to make one wise. I'm hungry, it'll give me food. Second thing, it's beautiful.

It doesn't look bad. It looks beautiful. Third, it gives me something that I want. I want to be wise. I desire that and that will give it to me. God said that it will kill me, but I think that it will actually make me wise and I want that. So I will take what I want. That's the image here. So the tree that will destroy the, it'll spoil the gift. The gift is eat from all the trees, but the moment you eat from this one,

it will ruin everything. So just don't do that. And enjoy all the rest. And then there you go. She took from the tree and she ate. And so the eyes are open, all right? Right? So in that sense, the snake was telling the truth. Your eyes will be opened. Meaning? Well, what he says is your eyes will be opened, meaning you'll be like Elohim knowing good and bad. And what actually happens is their eyes are open and they realize that they are

Vulnerable and what am I supposed to be thinking about what actually happened like what in their psyche or they're like Like what flicks on or I see well in a way they do become like Elohim knowing good and evil that is true Because remember at the end and when they're exiled in verse 22 God says oh they become like Elohim knowing good and evil. That is true. Because when they're exiled in verse 22, God says, oh, they become like us, Elohim knowing good and bad. So this snake was telling truth. But what the knowing of good and bad did, especially because they took it in a way that God told them not to take it. The first narrative consequence is they realize their

otherness from each other. They were naked and then they hide their bodies. Such an important, but rich detail worth a lot of pondering. They realize they're no longer one. The two became one. They're different, but in full vulnerability and intimacy, their otherness becomes mutual and one. Now their otherness becomes a sense of alienation and division. So that's a consequence. But indulge me for a second. What actually happened?

I don't know what actually happened. Well, because you think about it like if, um, let's take children who don't know good from bad. So you've got a, uh, three year old, I don't know, I would age works. Yeah. But he's just, he's just living out of impulses. He's just doing his thing. And then you got, let's say, now a 12 year old,old. And what's the difference between a two-year-old and a 12-year-old? Well, it's all of the accumulation of life experiences. Correct. Yeah. And now the ability to understand how the world works more.

So there's this progression in their, in their, like, just mental ability. Yeah. So I kind kinda can understand that. But what is it like for just something to click on all of a sudden? It's like, oh, like I didn't, I don't know good from bad, like a child, and now all of a sudden, oh I'm like Elohim. Well, I ask you a question that I might, it's just to be asking you the story. No, no, I think the reason why it's so ambiguous,

this is biblical narrative in general. These ambiguities are there to make you ponder and reread, and then go read the rest of the Bible, and then bring what you learn back to bear on those ambiguities. Yeah. So you're doing what you're supposed to do. Okay. You're meditating on it.

I'm meditating on it. Oh, good job. Sweet. So, well, so one, and remember, good and bad isn't this why we've shifted from using the word evil to the word bad. Yeah. Because good and bad doesn't just mean philosophical morality. It's also beneficial and harmful, life-giving, catastrophic, harm, death-bringing, like healing. So, to not know good and bad also means I've never had anything bad happen to me.

I only know good, and that's true in this narrative. So, to know is to experience good and life versus death. That's one layer of it. But then another layer of it is we've talked about, I think, in a different series. I think in our wisdom, most recent wisdom series, where it is a state of moral infancy. And so moral, what is moral maturity? It means responsibly making decisions, making moral decisions and being responsible for them, which is a good thing. So then to the moment of God said no, but is it implied in the narrative

that what he means is not yet? He wants to make them know where's a good evil, but on his clock, not by their covetous desire. That's where I'm at. Because it's a good thing to be wise, so that you can know good and bad. That's a good thing. That's a whole point of being wise.

Yeah. Yeah. 1.5% Another thing is there's something very corruptive about eating of this tree, where it's not like God can say, hey guys, bad, bad idea. Let's get that fruit out of your system and then let's like try again. Now, you know. Yeah, okay. Yeah, correct.

This is gonna be illuminated by what happens especially at Mount Sinai. Okay. Where you're gonna have Israel add another hype, Eden High Place where their representative Moses is meeting God up on the top, by a tree, the bush, the burning bush, and he's going to receive the

commands of the Torah, the covenant terms of the Torah. And then Moses and this is analogous to Moses will go on to say in the book of Deuteronomy, these commands are life. Today I set before you life and good, blessing and curse and death, choose life. So Israel at Mount Sinai is a replaying of this moment before the tree. Will they obey? Will they disobey? So to me that gives a helpful retro commentary on the tree. God wants his people to have the knowledge of the right thing and the wrong thing, but it has to do with listening to God's voice first of foremost. The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowing.

We did a whole series on that. So these two trees are intertwined. Now, the tree of life and the tree of knowing good and bad. They're both there. They're both there. They're paired. How you relate to one is determines how you relate to the other kind of thing.

And so they make the wrong decision. God shows up and it's like, oh no, really, you wait from the tree, I commanded you not to. And it all hits the fan. You have chosen to gain wisdom on your own terms. Yeah, that's right. Which means that eternal life for a creature that has coveted wisdom by my own taking,

that would be a curse. It would be a curse to have eternal life for that kind of creature. And so he exiles them from the garden. And once again, the garden narrative in Genesis 3, verse 22, God says the humans become like one of us, knowing good and bad, because of the took from that tree. So let's send them out so they don't take

from the tree of life and eat and live forever. Right, game over. Game over. Well, no, no, actually no. Oh, really? Right, at this point in the narrative, you're kind of like, oh, except God made a promise that a seed, a seed, back to tree and plant imagery,

a seed would come from the woman who would undo all that has just been done in the court. Or come. The snake will, the snake's head will be crushed, but yet this seed will also suffer by the snake's striking in some way. Such a rich, multi-layered, little poetic line. So yeah, I walk out of the garden, which was a high place with the trees at the center

on top. Failure, humanity fails the test of listening to God's voice at the tree on the high place. But I trust that there is a seed coming who will undo what has been done. And true to biblical theology style, the way the biblical authors work, then what they're gonna do is put all the key characters in the stories to follow at moments

where they're at literal and symbolic high places with trees facing their own tests. Welcome to the story of Abraham. Welcome, especially the story of Moses. And I think these will be two good moments for the video to track Moses and Abraham before high trees. We'll be able to compositionally to replay that in pattern.

Okay. And it's pretty cool. The pattern is being in front of a tree and having a choice of how you're going to find wisdom. Yeah, respond to the test, whatever the test is in that character's life. The question will be, will they do what Adam and Eve did? Or will they resist the temptation?

To do whatever their version of taking of the knowledge of good and bad is? I mean, you're going back and forth between referring to it as a test and referring it to as just kind of the human condition, kind of the like, just the reality of being in this situation. I see. Because they have different connotations for me. Oh, interesting.

Like, a test is like, I need you to prove your character. Mm-hmm. Seems like I'm a testie. Oh, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay. Yeah, thank you. The word test in Hebrew, it's verb nasa. There's overlap in that the point of testing in biblical Hebrew

is to expose the truth about what something really is. And for some reason, in English, and it might be just from like grade school on, we think of tests, we often experience tests as... Prove your worth. Prove your worth. Ideally, what tests are is they're showing what needs to be corrected.

They expose the truth of what I really know so that I can make up for it and keep learning. But usually we just highlight the negative nature of the test. But if we put that then construct onto this narrative in just two and three, I don't know, it feels strange to have a test. It's a past fail test. And the consequences are pretty massive. It feels not a test I would want to get in the one. Yeah, well, if the point is to say, can humanity fulfill its calling in its current mode of existence?

No. Right. We need to have a souped up, got an upgraded version of humanity that can truly partner with God to bring about the new Eden. So, okay, so you walk away from Genesis 3 thinking, okay, this makes sense of the human condition. They failed the test. That helps me understand how I keep failing my test. God wants to rule with us. We're incapable of doing it. We fail the test. Though sometimes some people pass the test,

which makes me feel like, oh, I could pass the test too. Yeah, at times. If I was like Abraham that one moment, when he did nothing, but looked up in the sky and just trusted God, that's when he passed the test. But there will be a seed who will somehow deal with evil. But there will be a seed who will somehow deal with evil. But then you also said, which is really interesting, we need some sort of new mode of being human. Yeah, I think that's what the story is reaching out.

The dirt creature isn't in a mode to pass the test. Or the dirt creature as presently, well, you need as a dirt creature who's infused, not just with the life breath of God, but with the very life presence of God himself, a divine human. A human one with the creator, right? People would say that's reading the New Testament back into the old, but I think it's the opposite.

I think the garden narrative is telling you, what we need around here is a human who's one with the creator who can truly become that partner. Yeah. But that's not just from the Garden Narrative, that's actually you read on to the rest of the Hebrew Bible in any way. So a test in Hebrew is the idea of a moment where your true quality is exposed. The truth about you becomes known. The truth about you becomes exposed. So that you can do something about it. Something can be done about it. What could Adam and Eve do about it when there did

the truth about them? That's a great question. There's actually a long standing conversation going back to second-temple Jewish literature about if Adam and Eve blew a chance to repent. Oh, I understand. Because now it's their blame shifting that's highlighted. Oh. When God shows up and says, you know, hey, have you eaten? He asked them a question. Yeah.

Why do you ask questions? It's because it's actually true. To invite a response. So God asked, said, have you eaten from the tree? And what the man says is, he blames a woman. Yeah. It was the woman's fault. She gave it to me. God addresses the woman. He gives the rare chance. What did you do? Are you going to own up to it?

Yeah. Okay. And it was the serpent. He deceived me. Which is true. And it is true, but it's passing the buck. So what nobody does in the story is say, I'm sorry. I did it and I'm sorry. And because the first question God asks is, where are you guys? We usually meet right here. What, you're not here. Where, it's time for our walk. Yeah.

Where are you? But then God doesn't, God says, you can't eat of the tree because now you know good from that, because you are like me. So that's why kicking you out of Eden. Oh, I see. It's not I'm kicking you out because you didn't say sorry. No. Yeah, that's right. This is back to that mercy. Yeah. It's a mercy to them. But is there some sort of then conversation you said about there was a chance for repentance? Yeah. We'll got us three

questions. Where are you? Who told you you were naked and have you eaten? So as people have thought about that, what do they think? Yeah. Why is God coming asking questions? He's inviting a moment. And then they play that forward

and let's say that Adam and Eve responded correctly. Yeah. Would they create a what if possible? Yeah. So what if they had repented? Maybe who knows? It can God just be like, okay, I'll nurse you back to health. We'll start again. Yeah, I see.

There just seems to be, and this comes also from just how I grew up learning about the Bible, this was the fall. There's something that critically broke in the human condition that can't be fixed. I see. That like, wow, and this is where I still... I'm gonna be pondering the story for the rest of my life. Yeah. This story is doing a balance between placing an event before time,

before like normal historical time, saying something happens, something in our roots in how it all began, helps explain why things are the way they are. But also, this narrative is explaining my experience. It's narrating the story in such a way that every human finds their own life experience within these representative characters.

So it's doing both. It's also about me and my failures and how my failures participate in the whole human species failure as far back because we can tell. And that's where the what ifs become unhelpful participate in the whole human species failure as far back as we can tell. And that's where the what ifs become unhelpful because they're interesting. I've never existed in a state of pure moral innocence,

except maybe in my infancy, I guess. But David says, you know, I was, I was, David looks at his life with failure and says, it's like I was born a failure. That's what he says in Psalm 51. Yeah. And I think there's the element of truth. There is.

I think there's a powerful truth to that. Yeah. You're born into a scene where you're already set up to fail. Yeah. Total depravity, yes. Well, yeah, in theological lingo, it'd be told depravity, but in a sociological way, and the way the biblical narrative works,

each generation inherits not of their own asking. They inherit the mess that their parents created, and it predisposes them to fail in the same ways and in more grievous ways. So the degree that the story is about true innocence, coming into wisdom and knowledge by their own terms instead of the way God wanted to. To that degree, yeah, we can't really relate and all the what-ifs kind of become kind of dead ends. Yeah, they're not inheriting somebody else's mess ahead of them. That's right. So that's a way they're different from the other human in history and in the story

But to the degree of this story is illuminating what it's like to be a human and Having a choice between am I gonna listen and obey to the voice of God and what he wants? Yeah, or am I gonna decide what's good in my own eyes? Then it becomes very Yeah, that's right and what's again? we're back to that little shift we made, not shift, but the reframe about the tree in this conversation that we're having. The thing that he asked them to do was to enjoy eternal life. That was the command.

Yeah. It's so important to me. I just as it syncs in over time, the command is to enjoy the good thing I want to give you. And then what happens is what humans take is the is the poultry alternative. It looks good. It meets a need and I want it. That is the good thing for me. And then we're to see us lose this thing of eating mud pies while you sit at the foot of a table full of cherry pies and apple pies and you think it's good and you love it, that's where we're at.

Thank you for listening to this episode of the Bible Project Podcast with us next week. We're gonna continue to talk about trees. We're gonna talk about a couple of the main characters in the Old Testament narrative and their relationship with trees, Noah and Abraham. If you just go through the Abraham stories in Genesis 12 to the end of his life in chapter 25 and get a green marker and a brown marker and highlight trees and mountains, they're everywhere.

This guy's constantly having significant moments of his life in front of trees on top of really tall hills. Today's show is produced by Dan Dumbled, our theme music comes from the band Tense, where crowdfunded nonprofit in Portland, Oregon, and you can find out all that we're up to on our website, thebibletproject.com. Thank you for being a part of this with us. Hi, this is Sysriya Sargalla. I'm from Baldivia, Chile.

And I first heard about the Bible project as a YouTube recommendation, and then I hooked on it. I use the Bible project as a part of my teaching projects, and with the youth conference that I'm also participator now. And my favorite thing about the Bible project is that brings the academic language to the regular people like us. We believe the Bible is a unified story Y mi fe de la cosa sobre el proyecto es que brinque el lenguaje académico para las personas regularmente. Nosotros estamos en el universo de un historiano de la gente.

Estamos en el proyecto de la gente como mío, trajamos fríberes, estacionados, podamos encargar más a el proyecto de la gente. Hola, soy Israel Salgado, soy de Valivia, Chile. Y escuché por primera vez acerca del proyecto Víblia en YouTube, como una recomendación de YouTube. Y meganché y no puedes dejar de de seguir los videos, uso el proyecto Viblia para las enseñanzas que hago en Iglesia y en las conferencias de jóvenes en las que participo y lo que más me gusta acerca de

proyecto Viblia es que trae el lenguaje académico a la gente común y lo hacen en el entendible. Creemos que la Bibles es una historia unificada que nos guiaje a Jesús. Somos un proyecto de colaboración colectiva financiada por gente como yo. En cuantra videogratis notas de estudio podcast y más en The Bible project. you