Bigfoot Society - Pennsylvania Bigfoot Encounters and the Chestnut Ridge | Sasquatch Experience | Sean Forker

Episode Date: August 27, 2022

#145For nearly 28 years, Sean “The Forkchop” Forker has been involved in the Search for Bigfoot. Growing up, Sean was exposed to shows such as In Search Of, Unsolved Mysteries, and Arthur C. Clarke’s Mysterious World, which ignited a passion for investigating these unexplained creatures. While maintaining active investigating presence, Forker took the the airwaves with The Sasquatch Experience Radio Show from 2005-2010, where he and an assortment of cohost interviews the biggest names in the research field. Taking a hiatus, the show relaunched in 2020.Forker has appeared on many podcasts, and featured in a number of Small Town Monsters Documentaries, most recently Sasquatch Unearthed: The Ridge. He is also currently writing a book, Elusive Truth, based on his investigations and experiences over the years. Episode Resources:Sasquatch Experience website - https://www.sasquatchexperience.comSean's Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/sean.forkerWatch Sean in Small Town Monster's new documentary series "Sasquatch Unearthed: The Ridge" - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZRduNhjs0MSeans's Recommended Books (affiliate links)The Locals by Thom Powell - https://amzn.to/3pLP3VhFOR MORE INFO ON THE VAN METER VISITOR FESTIVAL:https://www.facebook.com/vanmetervisitorfestival/_____________________________Join us over on Patreon! Get access to more in the After Show, a whole library of extended shows, exclusive merch like a membership card and stickers, watch me interview guests weekly live on video, a Patron-only Discord and more.https://www.patreon.com/thebigfootsocietyPick up a Bigfoot Society shirt to rep the podcast!https://www.etsy.com/shop/BigfootSocietyTune in every Saturday at 5 pm Central for new episodes of Bigfoot Society!https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8Qq45W6iaTU8FE9kelxT7QIG: https://www.instagram.com/bigfootsociety/Full links: https://bit.ly/bigfootlinksSupport the show

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They looked up and there was a monkey man. And the monkey man jumped down out of the tree. It started running away. And suddenly they're right in front of the car. He slams on the brakes and manages to stop. He's skidding because it was at that point, you know, and gravelling. And literally for about a second and a half,

they just stood there because they don't know where to go and you tell them panicking. They're like, through nothing. their faces like switching. Welcome back to Bigfoot Society. This is your host, Jeremiah Byron. Every week I talk to different people in the cryptozoology field. You never know who's going to be on next week.

If you'd like to sponsor the show, head on over to patreon.com forward slash the Bigfoot Society. You get access to a ton of things there, including a close-knit cryptic community on Discord, where you can connect with like-minded cryptid researchers and enthusiasts, weekly bonus content, the ability to hang out with each week's guest after the main show, exclusive merch, and much, much more. In this episode of Bigfoot Society, I get to talk to a new friend, Sean Forker. You may have seen him in such things such as Sasquatch Experience podcast. That new awesome STM documentary about the Chestnut Ridge, you know the one I'm talking about. All sorts of cool stuff.

And he's got some wild Pennsylvania Bigfoot research stories. You're not going to want to miss this episode. I'm not going to edit any of that stuff out because let's keep this legit. So thanks for listening. Sit back, relax. If you're jogging around, make sure that you're watching where you're jogging. And enjoy this episode of Bigfoot Society. All right, Bigfoot Society.

we're back for another episode this time with a new friend Sean Forker or as some people may know him as the Fork Chop, which is a pretty rocking, rocking nickname, my dude. I never had a guest who has such an amazing nickname. So where did you get that nickname from? Actually, I had a boss that was a little mean-spirited. And because my last name was Forker and I was a little portly, he didn't call me Portchop. He called me Fork Chop. So I'm like, you know what, man, I'm going to do. do something with this and it became a nickname. So most people don't call me Sean. Most people call me forker or they call me fork chop. And it's just been a thing. So we spiked the ball back at them and we've turned into a nickname. Who's laughing now, boss?

That's right. He's not my boss anymore either. That's right. Now, what's up? Going on in your bio here. So growing up, and this is cool because usually I have to ask stuff like this. you're just throwing it right out there. So growing up, Sean was exposed to shows such as in search of unsolved mysteries

in Arthur C. Clark's Mysterious World, which ignited a passion for investigating these unexplained creatures. While maintaining active investigating presence, while maintaining active investigating presence, Forker took the airwaves with the Sasquatch Experience Radio Show from 2005 to 2010, where he in an assortment of co-host interviews the biggest names and the research. Search Field, taking a hiatus, the show relaunched in 2020. Forker has appeared on many podcasts and featured in a number of small-tile monsters documentaries. Awesome. Most recently, Sasquatch unearthed the Ridge, which is just fantastic.

He's also currently writing a book, Elusive Truth, based on his investigations and experiences over the years. What a bio. Very cool. Thank you again, Sean, for coming on. Man, so you were telling me before the show started that you've been doing this for quite a long time. Yeah, it'll be 28 years this year. Actually, yeah, I'll be 37. So I've been in this a long time.

You know, it started Jeremiah when I was a kid. As you read in the bio, I just grew up in a house where this stuff was always on TV. My dad was an enthusiast of the paranormal. my grandfather. Actually, my dad grew up in a haunted house in midstate New York. And I had some stories from my dad, my uncle, my aunt, my grandfather. So I've always grown up around the paranormal, right? And we were on a vacation and I wouldn't shut up in the car. My dad kind of got tired of me talking. So he got me this book. And the book happened to be Sasquatch the Abes Among Us by John Green. I'm nine years old. Okay. And that's a pretty heavy book. And I spent my time at the beach, you know, when other people are playing, I read this book and I got really captivated by the fact that these things weren't just, you know, known to be in the Pacific Northwest, but they're in my own backyard of Pennsylvania. Chapter 4 Eastern Action is the name of the chapter that really drove me into kind of, I don't

want to say mania, but, you know, it became my thing. And when I got to be a little older, we got the internet, I was kind of in that generation of, you know, you had the school computer labs, the library, and then finally you get your own computer at home. And then I found some researchers online, which wasn't as creepy back then as it is today. So I'm sure any of those researchers that were talking to a young kid probably might have been a little trepidious back then.

But I talked to Cliff Bairkman. He and I were together in Ohio this year. And at the bar, we were talking about, you know, he remembered me from the late 90s online when you joined the message boards. and facilitate conversation. And then I met Eric Altman and the Pennsylvania Bigfoot Society and became an active investigator in that group. And it just kind of went off from there, man. Here we are 28, you know, we'll be 28 years this year.

And I love every minute of it. It's been a tremendous experience. You bring up a lot of really good points there, Sean. And that's true. So a little behind the scenes, Sean and I are pretty much. around the same age. And Sean, you're right. It's weird because we were the generation that grew up and saw the internet come into the house.

It's a very weird experience thinking back on that. Like, you know, you know, oh, what's the thing making all the beeping noises? The modem. Like, half the listeners of this have probably have no idea what we're talking about. Like, what, oh, modems used to be like, yeah, totally, dude. Like, but I want to, I want to go into how you were talking. about you were able to connect with Bigfoot researchers in the early days of the internet. That was, that's really cool.

Like, do you have any, besides Cliff Berrickman, like any other ones that you were able to chat with from the early days? Well, there was Henry Franzoni. Oh, wow. Dennis Fenton, who ran the Forrest Giants Yahoo Group. And there's another thing, a Yahoo group. I don't know that. And then at the time, you know, AOL and semester was around, but so was Yahoo Messenger.

And then I met researchers online through the Forest Giants group. And actually, Sasquatch experienced the podcast came from those Yahoo chats. We would get together and talk about these subjects in these Yahoo groups. And then finally, the technology came around where you could record that and share that, you know, with a lot of people. So like you said, it's interesting because I was fortunate to be a part of that early infancy of kind of podcasting. And it was a lot more primitive back then than it is now. I mean, the audio quality is terrible. It sounded like you were literally recording a phone call,

which you were essentially just using voice over internet protocol, right? And it was just, you know, not a great experience. But, you know, compare that to everything we have today. I mean, you look at some of these, our podcasting friends and hell, even ourselves, you know, we look like little radio stations in our offices or whatnot, right? That wasn't like that back. in 2005. There weren't very many podcasts back then either. You know, I can, for, Monster Central that was hosted by Lauren Coleman and M.K. Davis,

squatched detective, yeah, not together separately. But there was a time, yeah, there was a time that there was a internet radio show, Monster Central. And there was a gentleman named Don Monroe who hosted that with M.K. Davis. And I don't know if you know the name, Monroe, but he was kind of an outdoorsy kind of, you know, trepid, you know, intrepid researcher back then. Like some of these guys go back way, way back to the field.

Coleman in the 50s, of course, you know, he grew up. And I think Don Monroe might be a contemporary at that point. Like this guy, you know, probably flossed with barbed wire. You know, he kind of came across as that rugged outdoors type. And then, of course, M.K. Davis came on the scene much later when he did that, you know, the analysis of the Patterson film. And regardless of what people think of M.K. Now, in his initial onslaught into the community, his onslaught, his introduction to the

community, you know, he was really, you know, one of the few people that had that ability to dial in on the Patterson film and pull out some detail. And that, and let me tell you, the people that have dove into that, I think there's something about that film that drives you mad. And it's probably the most contentious piece of evidence we have. It's probably caused the most rifts of in the community. You know, and here we are 60 years later. And, you know, we still don't know if it's real or fake.

We'd like to think it's real, but we don't know. It's the craziest thing ever because it's like, I mean, and we could go, we could just chat for that. But I really, you saw my reaction. If you're watching on YouTube, you saw the reaction. So, so Lauren Coleman used to have like a. way back in the day, like a podcast or like, tell me more about that. It was like a streaming internet radio show.

Really? And I don't know how many episodes he's done off the top of my head. But I might have a couple of them on a CD around here somewhere. Oh my goodness. Because you probably can't find it anywhere, right? No, I don't think it's any. Oh, you know, I think the only person that would probably be able to, Henry May would be one that might have copies of it line around. Or maybe Todd Prescott from the Sasquatch Archive might have it.

yeah of course Todd would have it because he's got like every amazing thing known to man and someday I'm going to talk to you Todd if you're listening the offer is always open my dude I love I met Todd a few times in person a very nice guy yeah I tried to get him on too to talk he I think he's more of a behind the scenes player kind of like me I believe it or not I like to stay behind the scenes man like I this is not about me this whole journey I've done the 28 years I spent doing this is about trying to uncover this mystery, that the mystery that it seems to be always evolving. And as soon as you think you get close to something, it deepens a little more. And there's so many other elements that flow into this. And especially in Pennsylvania,

and if you watch the episodes of Sasquatch on Earth, I kind of get a little, I came across a little, I don't know, too skeptical, I think. You know, the problem is with interviews like they, I don't get to hear the questions that are being asked, just the answers that you give, right? And depending on my mood, it's depending on the answer you're going to get. But Pennsylvania is a very abnormally influenced place when it comes to the Bigfoot research, especially down in the Chestnut Ridge area. And I can't explain why, but I can tell you, Jeremiah, that people experience strange things down there. And a lot of times they're in conjunction with one another. But the point I was trying to emphasize is that just because they run concurrent doesn't mean they're part of the same phenomena.

And it's hard enough to prove Bigfoot scientifically to the scientific community without lumping these other paranormal elements on top of it. I'm not saying throw it away. What I'm saying is notate it. But keep in mind, when you're trying to present this as a true phenomenon, the eyes that are on you are going to start looking away when you start compounding these things with a lot of, you know, what still a lot of people consider to be goofy, goofy subjects, right?

Portals and though we're learning more about the world that we live in with physics and, you know, quantum physics and all this other things, like the general consensus with the scientific community is Bigfoot's not even real. But let's go ahead and throw UFOs and portals and orbs on top of it. And that's really going to lend you a scientific credence, you know. So don't throw it away, collect it, accept the evidence, you know, notate it, but at the same time, be very critical so that you're also not buying into your own hype at the same time. And you're not feeding yourself the, you know, you're not feeding the feelings you have because you want these things to be connected.

You have to really be objective with it. And that was, I guess, the point I was trying to convey that I didn't do very well in the moment. And I only bring that up because I did the one thing I never do. I read the comments. Don't do that. And I just had one guy that's like, he's just trying to find his seat at the big boy table. Let me tell you something. Come on, dude.

I don't want to sit at that table. I know the people at that table. First of all, there's not even a table, okay? They're just people that have put in the time that have gotten a certain level of exposure. And even they would tell you that they're no different or any more special that most of them would tell you. They're no more special than anyone else. So I felt it was a little derogatory from somebody who doesn't even know me. to make that assumption, but they didn't listen to what I was really trying to say.

And over the years, man, that's, that's created some contention. We stopped listening at some point and just react. And I've learned that, even going back to 05, if you listen to early episodes of Sasquatch experience from 05 to like 010. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot Society. We'll be right back after these messages. Man, I was young and militant about what I believed. And as I took a break and went and learned and listened to people and then had an experience of my own,

I really changed my own viewpoint and my own methodology and mentality about how we approach the subject, particularly witnesses. And I'm a lot more, I want to say calm and accepting, but I have my core beliefs, you know, and I still believe Bigfoot to be flesh and blood. It doesn't mean I'm right. It's just what I believe. And it's what the evidence has shown me, Sean Forger, so far. Doesn't mean I'm right. Talking about the early days of Sasquatch experience, how, and you're involved with these early days of Bigfoot podcasting, how is it, how is it different back than compared to what it's like now with there's a lot, dude, like, there's a lot out there. Like, what is that like being able to live in both worlds?

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And I think that's why I honestly got tired of it because I would no longer talk to Dr. Meldrum and somebody else would have him on the show where Steve Coles would have somebody. And then, you know, at the time, there were only so many people. and the field has grown so much as a community. It's really expanded. Part of that is because Bigfoot's become this real pop culture icon now. Back then, people made funny and really crucified you if they found out you believe them. Even in the early 2000s, it didn't start becoming okay until like the mid-2010s that it was cool.

I think finding Bigfoot in shows like that, as much as people in the community may have a problem because all they're just for entertainment. and they may be, but they also present to the public what we do out there when we're looking for Bigfoot. And I think because they see that there's an effort, it's not, you know, it's not so ha-ha anymore. You know, it's not so paranormal. And even shows like ghost hunters changed how ghost hunting, you know, was perceived. So we should be thankful in a way that these shows have come out. And like you said, how's it different? I came back in 2020 to do the show because I felt like a perspective needed to be shared.

And that was like from being back a part of this community when it really became an online community to how it's grown and changed. Like to me, it's amazing. And the other part of it that's really amazing man is how supportive everybody is of one another. And there was a core of us back then, you know, Mike Killen and Bob coined from Bigfoot Quest and Billy Willard from Sasquatch Watch, Steve Coles from Squatch Detective. We were all a good core group, and nobody buried one another. But all of a sudden, two shows became four shows, four shows became eight shows, and they just grew and grew and grew.

Bigfoot Tonight was actually one of my favorite podcasts back of the day. And there's some archive episodes of that coming out. And just being part of it back then and seeing how different it is now, it's tremendous. And everybody's different. And that's what I love. It's right because like, you know, back then you didn't have a, you know, let's say you didn't have like a Moth Boys type podcast or you didn't have, you know, like cryptonauts or like you didn't have like the crazy comedy type dudes, right?

Like it's just a different world, different what. Where can where can people hear the early days of Sasquatch experience? Is there anywhere that you can hear that stuff? So if you go to Sasquatch experience. Experience.com now or and go to Spotify and subscribe wherever you listen. Cheap plug. We have Sasquatch Experience classic episodes mixed in. And the reason why they're being, my plan was to do a live show one week and then

an archive show the next week to kind of keep it flowing. But one, I have a career. Okay. I have a very successful career that, you know, keeps me busy during my, you know, in my day life. But because of the audio quality, those old. episodes are so hard that you almost have to remaster an entire episode. And, you know, to be honest, in the world we live in now, you know, there were some things I said back in the day that weren't

very complimentary of some people that probably don't need to be rehashed. So there's some editing that goes on in it. Like I said, man, back in the day, I was a wild card and I'm sure I ticked some people off. I really did. But it was passion. It was passion around it. And it doesn't fly in today's world, but I still mean some of those things I said. I'm not going to deny that. But I, you know, some of those people aren't even with us anymore. And that's just kind of rude. You know, there are people don't understand. Like, there have been people that have been in this field since the 50s and before that. And they're, they're now passed away. And I was fortunate to be able to, you know, rub the proverbial elbows with some of them before they, they've passed on.

There's only one person that, you know, you talked about. You talked about. some of the early people that I interfaced with in the early days of the community, John Eric Beckyard was somebody that I had a very tumultuous, tumultuous and antagonistical relationship with. I'm also the only person that ever got him to hang up. So I take great pride in that. But that man, he would call you at two, three o'clock in the morning and harass you. He was a nut job. And he was not a very pleasant person. He wasn't always wrong sometimes. about the things he said, but his approach was very, you know, just turned people off. And he had theories that he was unabashedly proud about.

And he stuck to those theories. But he also had this very nasty habit. I had Dr. John Bendernoggle on the show, which is actually, you can go back and listen to it. It's the roundtable with Dr. John Bindernoggle is the name of the episode. And he calls in and he starts harassing Dr. Bendernoggle on the show because we could do call-ins. That was the one nice feature about it. I'm sure figure out how to do it again. And he would do that to people.

He would just call in and hijack the show. And it just wasn't an enjoyable experience. And he's not with us anymore. He passed away. But for every John Eric Beckier, there's also like two Dr. Bendernoggles who were just incredibly gracious and wonderful to have on. I think Bobby Short is somebody that Henry May and I interviewed.

Yeah. And she was actually one of the first, again, one of the first people I reached out to when I started. She had a Bigfoot Encouners website, which is still out there, a fantastic website. A little that information's old and dated, but, you know, nobody's updating it anymore. You know, it's that sad part about, you know, the legacy of this research. And I guess that's where I kind of also want to, you know, make sure that we're connecting the dots back to the past. Like sometimes people ask, they come up with these. new theories like their brand these grand new theories and I'm just like hey pal read a book like this stuff has been already talked about and hashed out if you go back it's why I can't do reddit anymore either like I had to stop the bigfoot Reddit and like as much as I you know I encourage people to get involved in this if you're serious about it and you're not trying to make a joke about it but also be respectful to the people that came before you and did a lot of the legwork so you don't have to repeat the same stuff a lot of the theories and stuff that

are out there have already been either disproven or are still in the works, right? So, you know, I challenge people to read a lot. Like, there's always something to reach back in and grab and study. I think you were the one that were, were you reading like a chapter of Sasquatch, The Apes Among Us? I was and I failed miserably. But no, it was actually legend meets science. It's very cool. work got crazy. But the cool thing is with the Patreon right now, my members were like, let's start a book club. And I was like, okay, this will make me read. So we all read through Valley of the Apes by Michael Mays.

And it was one of the best experience. It made me read and enjoy reading again and be like, okay, I've got to get this done. So we're reading Ken Gerhard's Bigfoot book right now. I have to pick up Michael May. Shameless, I do want to read it. You got to. Oh, my goodness. It's the one book that's in my card I haven't checked yet.

You really need. So once you hit like the whole book is good, but the second part when it talks about like what goes on area X, it'll blow your mind. You'll read it all in a day. So talk about books. So I got two book questions. Let's go. Number one is so you're talking about it's important for, you know, the current generation of big footers to not, you know, to be aware of what has gone on in books. So what kind of books are you saying they should probably be familiar with?

What are the classics? It's going to be hard, but you've got to read Sasquatch the Abes Among Us. Tom Pals, the Locals is one of my favorite Bigfoot books. And he talks about some of the paranormal elements in it. Then there is Bigfoot, The True Story of Apes in America by Lauren Coleman, which I think is a great overview of the subject. The Bigfoot Case book is one. Oh, God, I'd have to take us through my life.

I have more books. And, you know, I would say a lot of the books by the academics, but they can be hard to read. Like, they're just, you know, anything by Grover Krantz is great, but it's written by an academic, and you've got to be driven to it. If you're somebody who doesn't like to read,

that book's probably not going to strike your fancy. You know, Sasquatch Legend Meat Science, again, written by Dr. Meldrum. I was with Eric Altman at the Ohio Bigfoot Conference this year and talked to Dr. Meldrum. And Dr. Meldrum said he really wished people would focus more on regional books and write within their own area and where they've been working on. And if you think about it, he's got a point because all the Bigfoot books, and this is where I struggled in writing mine, which is why I had it almost done and deleted it and started over. you're rehashing the stuff that everybody knows about.

You know, what is my opinion on the Patterson Gimlin film going to mean 60 years later? Like, who, I don't even care about that, but I felt like I needed to write something on it. Why? So, and,

you know, having a conversation with Dr. Meldrum, like, you know, that makes a lot of sense. So let's do this book. Oh,

I'm jumping ahead probably on you. I'm sorry. So back to books you should read. Those ones I, listed so far. There's also one by Al Berry, and I can never remember the title of it. I think it's Bigfoot in the East Coast, which is really good. And it's written in a way that just keeps your attention. And anything by Thomas Steenberg, I think every one of his books I've read has been phenomenal. I haven't been disappointed by a single thing he's put out. And he's kind of like

a researcher's researcher, too. You know, they don't, in my opinion, I don't think it gets better than Tom Steenberg. I really don't. He's got definitely has quite the impressive bibliography for sure. I believe that's the word. But that's an impressive list. A few of those are ones that are not brought up often. So thank you for bringing those up. But I'm curious, you know, in your bio you mentioned that you're getting, you're currently writing elusive truth. What can you tell us about that book? I'm really curious about that. Well, I was talking with my friends, Eric and Carrie Fargeogio, which you're familiar with the Fargeos. When we were at Cryptid Bash a couple weekends ago?

And they were talking about the book. When are you going to release the book? And as I said, I had it mostly done and I deleted it because when I was reading it, it wasn't coming out in my voice. So when you're reading this book, I want you to hear it in my voice. I want you to understand it's coming from my perspective and my journey. And it's also notes on cases I've investigated. and also situations I found myself in in the Bigfoot community, the Georgia Bigfoot hoax.

Nine out of ten people have no idea how involved I was behind the scenes on that monster of a situation and really hurt some friendships over that one. So there's a lot of behind the scene stuff that a lot of people don't know that just haven't been talked about because the only person that really knows about it are me and the people involved. So it's not a tell-all. It's just kind of a cases I've invested. investigated and my experiences.

And I think it's important that we do share those things. It's a very important part of our history to understand where the mistakes have been made, too. Not just the wins, but the mistakes. Like we talk about the Georgia Bigfoot hoax and the people involved in that. And, you know, I was one of the first people that broke the story that it was a hoax before it became a Fox News broadcast. Way back in the day. And we can say that way back in the day. And it's again, like it sounds like I'm self-promoting.

I'm really not. I'm just trying to articulate what's going to make the book a little different. And a lot of Pennsylvania research is fixated on the Chestnut Ridge area and southwestern Pennsylvania. But I live in the expanse of north-central part of the state where it's a very conservative part of the state. And people here are hunters for 20-plus-year hunters. and outdoors folks, that if they had an experience, probably wouldn't tell anybody. And some of these folks have confided in me through the years because they finally realized there was somebody up here that was investigating that took them seriously and wasn't going to

laugh and wasn't going to spill the beans. And, you know, I keep them all anonymous or I make up names for them. A farmer in Millville, Pennsylvania, who caught something on his game cam, who never released the pictures. He and I. head back and forth for a while and he just disappeared out the face of the earth. Couldn't be stopped responding to the email and I couldn't get him. But I was so close to getting the pictures that was on his game cam. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot Society. We'll be right back after these messages.

And some, you know, some other folks that, you know, I can't reveal what he does, but he worked for the state, had a private hunting lease in an area of northern Pennsylvania, 6,000 private acres and had an experience himself. one morning and he worked for a state agency that was involved in the wildlife. And it's witnesses like that and stories like that you're going to hear in the book that you may not get from a lot of other folks because they didn't investigate it. I investigated it. Right. And so I want it to be All right, quick quiz for the hiring managers out there. What's worse? Being understaffed or being poorly staffed? Well, that's a trick question because both are recipes for chaos. Either

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which to this day I still have, I still have problems with it. Like to give you the Cliff Notes version, because we could talk for hours on this, we had been investigating this area of Clearfield, Pennsylvania. We call it Rockton Mountain. We call the area the meadow, because it's this open area,

probably about four miles off the interstate. It's in a very wooded area. nothing really around it. And so when you drive in, you get back in there. You can drive in about two miles and you have to hike the rest of the way in. And we have been going out there since 2000, the beginning of 2012, it was what precipitated. That's always been a very active area of Pennsylvania.

But in 2012, two sets of witnesses had a siting about 45 minutes apart from one another on the same road, roadside crossing. but they both pointed out the same distinguishing feature was the whites on the feet of the creature as it crossed the road. So not only do you have one witness talking about this distinct feature on this creature, right? You have two sets of witnesses, an hour, almost an hour apart from each other on the same road that never met each other before. We actually brought them together to meet for the first time, and they couldn't believe that there was somebody else that experienced what they did that same night. And think about that. You probably have a better chance

getting struck by lightning or winning the lottery than finding two sets of witnesses on the same night, on the same road, having this, you know, having a,

which was probably the same creature. So we've been going out and investigating this area several times throughout the year. And a few weeks before we went out for the, you know, outing that we had,

we were out with a few of us. And there were some vocalizations that happened. And it scared, one of the guys that was with me so hard, out of like fright and he punched me so hard I thought his fist went right through me like uh so that was a very interesting night it's the only thing that happened that night was the

vocalizations and we were like well we have to come back here like at some point this was interesting we have to come back so a couple weeks later maybe a couple a few weeks later we came back at the end of September and it was uh david rupert Ryan cavaline Eric Altman my brother Ray and one of my good friend Dustin Kenley Dustin was in the National Guard so he had military training right so Dustin Ray and I decided we were going to stay out there the first night by ourselves because we were going to get up early in the morning to get up at like a three or four o'clock in the morning go do research so we're going to turn in earlier that night so at about a little before nine it's starting to get a little dark we're sitting out there and this we have a fire going and the three of us are kind of sitting next to the fire.

Ray's back is to the tree line. Dustin's kind of looking at me. I can kind of see him in the tree line. And as we're talking, something runs right through the peripheral of my vision. And it ran. And Dustin also saw it. So Dustin and I get up and we run off to the forest, you know, the wood line. As we hear this thing taken off through the woods, right?

So this thing wasn't overly tall. It was probably maybe about six and a half feet tall. built like an NBA player. It moved so gracefully. I've never seen anything move so fluidly. I liken it to like a sloth. It just kind of glided through the area so fast. And it was fast enough, but that Ray never saw it.

He just saw us get up and run after whatever we've seen. So we sat there for a little bit. We're like, you know what? This is, you know, never expected this. You'd go out there, you know, thinking you're looking for, you know, big foot. but you don't ever think anything's going to happen, at least in my estimation. I think it's that skeptical part of me that part of me is like, yeah, this is all bullcrap, right?

But you're going to go out there and do it anyhow. So we're sitting there like, okay, well, this is getting really interesting, but we want to get up early. So nothing came back, you know, was bothering us. We couldn't hear anything else. So we put the fire out, we go into bed, and we start, we're laying in the tent, right? Put an hour and a half later, we start hearing something moving through our campsite. and moving bipedally moving.

You can know the difference between something on two feet and like a prancing deer or something. It's kind of got some heavy footfalls. We kind of hear it walking around the middle. I see Dustin's little cell phone light pop on in his sleeping bag and he goes, you hear that. Yeah, I hear it. Let's just see what's going on. So we're there a little longer.

And all of a sudden we start seeing this orangish glow out of the outside of our tent. So Dustin throws his boots on, goes out of the tent, and we're both sitting there kind of shocked. I'm still in the tent that something had put the logs back on the fire. And the fire must have been hot enough still where it rekindled itself, right? And we were sure we put that out, but something had put the logs back on the fire. And as I go to get out, Dustin yells, fork or throw me my gun. So me like an idiot, I literally threw him as gun. And as I go to get out, that thing that ran through our campsite earlier runs up this little hillside.

And you can hear it just kind of running around the perimeter of this, of this meadow that we're in. I run to the center of the meadow and I have like one bar service out there. So I'm trying to call Dave to see if he was still in the area, see if he could come back because we have some activity going on. And there's only three of us out there. We don't want to be out there alone anymore, right? Ray rouses up. He finally realizes something's going on. So he comes out of the tent.

And I can't get Dave. So I called Dave's home. And his wife, Carrie, to this day, I'll tell you it's the scared she's ever heard me. You know, I asked her, she could get a hold of Dave and see if you could come back out

and to go out there with us. Because, you know, we ran through our campsite earlier in the night, right? Now it came back and it put the logs back on the fire. And that freaked me out. Okay. To this day, that's probably one of the scarier parts about it.

Because to me, that shows an intelligence, right? That it shows that it was probably watching us or it has watched somebody else before do that. And so Dave and Ryan come out finally back to us. It takes them a little bit to get back out there. And, you know, they build us up. Come on, guys. We're out here for this reason. You know, they get us all our confidence built.

They hang out there with us a little while longer. Nothing's going on. we go on the tent they sit out there a little longer he radios to us hey we're going to leave for the night we'll be back tomorrow i'm like all right i think we're going to be fine nothing's going on he leaves while later here comes the footfalls again coming we get out run to the you know center of the meadow you can still hear this thing kind of moving around then you hear it stop so dustin gets the great idea of throat take getting a glow stick that he has in his back and he throws it into the woods.

And I get, this is the part that gives me, I'm literally getting goosebumps again. Something picks the glow stick up, right? And I yell, hey, you know, if you're out here messing with us, you know, we're going to shoot you. Like, you need to identify yourself now. The glow stick bounces to the ground and you still don't hear anything. You see something kind of moving from behind a tree watching at us, right?

So Dustin, I said, Dustin, point your gun. I said, shoot it. So Dustin's there in his mode, ready to shoot. And I, have you ever seen Jaws where he's like on the boat? He's like, shoot it, Quinn, shoot it now. That was me. And Dustin's like, I can't. I don't know what it is.

It could be, I don't want to shoot them. Like I'm like, well, I want you to. And after we got done arguing, right, so the three of us get this idea. Well, let's bluff charge it. Right. So the three of us in solidarity run towards this tree line. And you could hear it take off. And we're just petrified.

at this point, okay? If it was a person, they really took a chance by not responding to us. But just, I don't want to say I ever felt threatened, Jeremiah, but I felt unnerved and I felt uncomfortable to the point where I didn't feel like I was in control and that really bothered me. Also to the point, I was still kind of skeptical on the existence of Bigfoot at that point. Like I didn't, after all these years of investigating, you never think, at least in my mind, And maybe I never thought in my mind that you have an encounter, right? And to have an encounter that was so remarkable like that really unnerved me. So we stay up the rest of the night.

It starts to rain a little bit. There's this flash of light. And then nothing happens after that. It starts to get the daylight. We wake up, we get up. We throw everything into this rubber made tote we had there. and we haul ass back to my van and we drive out of there. I stopped at the at the sheet station, called my wife.

I said, listen, I'm coming home. She goes, you're supposed to be going on a weekend. I said, I know I don't want to talk about it. I'm coming home. I really don't want to be out here anymore. I get home. I don't say hardly anything to anybody. I didn't even really tell my wife.

I called Eric Altman and told him what happened. I said, listen, I'm done with this. I, you know, something happened out there. I don't know how to reconcile it. I just don't know if I want to do this anymore. like I felt so I don't maybe vulnerable is the word I don't know I didn't feel very confident in my abilities

to deal with this anymore if I did have another encounter and I think it really messed me up because I never expected to have an encounter right like we knew this was an area that was active going into it but that skeptical part of you is like yeah come on it's it's you know it's big foot like is it really real and then like you have something like that

And it just shakes your whole viewpoint on it, right? I quit doing podcasting for a little bit after that because I was doing other shows when I wasn't doing Sasquatch experience. I had done some paranormal talk radio programs and try to diversify a little bit. But I kind of kept Bigfoot out of my mind for a little while. And then a few months later, I started probably about six months later, I started getting back into it again. Because I felt like, you know, you can let fear drive. you and drive you away from what you love and be unhappy, or you can really just embrace what happened and grow with it and get back into it. And that's what I did. And in the process of that,

man, I found, you know, I can relate to a witness better. And when I'm talking to a witness, I really have this new level of empathy with them and understanding because I don't think people understand how traumatic it is. And I know it seems silly because we talk about Bigfoot and you think of trauma. But you think you just experienced something that didn't exist. It wasn't supposed to exist. In this world of ours, it doesn't exist. And yeah, you read these books and you hear these stories, but there's always that part of your mind. We're like, what a bunch of crap. Until it happens. And you're like, my God, I've been so wrong. And maybe I've wronged some people over the years in my skepticism. And it really just changed my viewpoint on a lot of things.

And I've been a lot more empathetic and understanding that, you know, you're really dealing with people with trauma. And the things you say could be really hurtful if you're really not careful. So even though I may not fully believe somebody, I don't know if in front of them I would be hypercritical. I might be a little skeptical, but I don't know if I'd be critical. And I think that's where I learned to change my attitude. And it's led me to be a much better researcher in the process, investigator. It's also opened up my mind, even people who have the paranormal persuasion that even though I might not believe it to be, they believe it to be that way. So let's take what we can get from it, reconcile that with, you know, and maybe pull some, you know, actuality out of it.

And I don't know. Like that experience I had, man, it's the only real tremendous experience I've ever had. I've had vocalizations in the past. I've had a rock thrown at my head. But, you know, that wasn't even that spectacular. I was with Billy Willard when that happened out at Gray Station, a very active part of Pennsylvania on the Chestnut Ridge. And probably a softball-sized rock went right between us. But we never saw what did it.

You know what I mean? So, yeah, we had a rock thrown us. That was pretty cool. I had an encounter with something that I visually saw. But, you know, I never saw the face of it. Or I never saw the face of it. I only ever saw kind of the profile and the silhouette. but I never saw.

And I'm kind of glad I didn't because it kind of leaves that still a little mysterious to me. And there's a vagueness to it and I can't identify with it fully, which makes me happy. Because I've had dreams, man. And in these dreams, these things have looked like the most frightening chimpanzee-esque kind of creatures. I've ever seen. And if I saw something like that in person, I think I would quit. I don't know if I could handle,

you know, when you see something in a dream and then you see it in reality, I just don't know if I could handle that mental shock. Like, holy shit, that's what I'm done. I don't like chimpanzees much to begin with, right? I'm not a big fan of chimpanzee. Planet of the Apes is real. And I,

they're just so smart. I just don't want to have that image in my head that, you know, these Bigfoot are giant chimpanzees. That would frighten the crap out of me. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot Society. We'll be right back after these messages. First off, thank you. So I can tell that encounter was very traumatic for you. And thank you for sharing that with the listeners.

You know, it's talking to witnesses. You can tell the ones where it's like they experienced and it has affected the. them. But then you were, you know, you were able to get back into it. Was there, you know, kind of going into that as well, were, was there a certain thing that made you get back, bring Sasquatch experience back in 2020? Was that related at all to you kind of, you know, being more empathetic or, or was that totally unrelated? I think so. And even moments now, I feel like there are times I pull a little bit more towards the militant things, just a secondhand when you're, you know, I think when you're podcast, there's always part of you that's a character,

right? If you get to know me as a person, yeah, if you get to know me as a person, I'm different. I'm not the same person that's, I'm more reserved and private. I'm a little funnier, but I'm a little bit more quieter than I am doing a radio show, right? That's just me as a person, but a lot more analytical, a lot more self-deprecating. but when you're a part of the, I guess, formula of a podcast is the character, right? But then seeing how you evolve as a character in your own podcast and like as part of you want to pull back to that, you just know in your heart of hearts that you can't because you've been changed.

And it's gotten to the point where I don't, I was just talking to Vance Nesbitt, one of my co-hosts. Sure. Like part of the reason why we haven't really talked to witnesses so much. And I actually had Ray and Dustin come on the show. And they've only ever talked about it publicly once. And that was on the episode we did called, Oh, I can't remember the name of the episode. And it's my own episode for crying out loud.

Yeah, whatever. I can't even remember the name of the episode off the top of my head. And it's episode 16. I know that. Okay. And they came on and talked about it. Only because after all these years, I wanted to know if we experienced something different.

Right. And we never really sat down and talked about it afterwards. man like it was an experience we all felt really awful afterwards i think we were a little embarrassed because we're supposed to be bigfoot researchers and we left uh because it frightened us all so bad we're grown men i think the little masculine part of us was a little affected too but the feeling of helplessness we all had like i think we shared but even the own experience i remember ray telling me as he was sleeping in the tent he felt like something had touched him several times from the outside of the tent oh uh and i don't recall that i

don't recall anything ever being that close, but that doesn't mean that didn't happen. That just means from my perspective, I didn't experience that. But also didn't mean that we weren't visited by more than one or whatever was going on out there, right? And that flash of light I mentioned freaked me out because there was no thunderstorm. And I've experienced that flash light up there again with other folks. I thought the flash of light might have been a game camera that Dave Rupert and Ryan had put up earlier in the evening. So I had called Dave Rupert probably a couple days after the event, just to recap. And, you know, kind of said, you know, you're a great friend.

Thanks for doing this, but I'm done. And in the conversation, I said, hey, but you might want to go check your game cameras because I think the camera got something because there was a flash out there. And he goes, Sean, he goes, those cameras don't have flashes on them. And I'm like, well, go figure. That's just one more thing. And then I've had a ton of other people tell me, well, you didn't experience a big foot. You experienced an ultra-terrestrial. Are you experienced?

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And listeners of this show will get a $75-sponsored job credit to help your job get the premium status it deserves at Indeed.com slash podcast. Just go to Indeed.com slash podcast right now. Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need to hire? This is a job for Indeed's sponsored jobs. The Starbucks iced torchata shaken espresso is back for the summer. Crafted with cinnamon, vanilla, and nutty notes of toasted rice. Handshaking was smooth blonde espresso and finished with oat milk for a creamy touch. Made for summer. Only at Starbucks. If you've been following the news, you know the world is dealing with a level of uncertainty that isn't going away anytime soon. inflation pressures, global tensions, and the highest U.S. debt levels on record continue to influence

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For your free wealth protection guide, text IHeart to 50505. And with a qualified purchase, you could receive up to $15,000 in free gold or silver. Don't wait. Text Iheart to 50505. Pardon me an extra. Listen, I don't know, okay, what we experience. All I know is for a physical description. It matched by what we thought to be a Bigfoot.

The behavior was very Bigfoot-esque, right? But at the end of the day, it was three guys that had an experience with something unique in the woods that we've never had again. And we've been out in the woods together since. Like they all, in 2016, we went back to that area with Dave Rupert and members of the PA Bigfoot Society. Brian Siech is another guy you should talk to, really. I've had multiple people tell me that I, you know, to talk to him. And after watching Small Town Monsters documentary, I was like, I absolutely have to talk to him.

Yeah, he's a good dude, a good friend from a long, you know, a long time. And even Eric Goldman, like, you know, who's my mentor in the field would tell you that it really changed me. And, you know, you talk to those guys. Nobody knows what this is. But we were out there in 2016, we camped at Parker Dam, which was a decent ways away from where we had our experience at the meadow. But we all went back to the me.

And I had my son with me. My son, I think, was 10 at the time. And, like, even at 10, he could notice that the area made me feel a little different. And my son's 16 now. He actually investigates with me. We were just out a couple weekends ago at an investigation. And he's got a really good mind for this, which, you know, pat myself in the back a little bit.

But he's his own scientific kid, right? And like, even he noticed it was different for me. And now I could go back there. I think I would be fine to go back. The area is a lot different now. It's been forested. Marcella's shale gas in Pennsylvania. You know, these wells have popped up everywhere.

So a lot of what were old, old forests have been cut down or manipulated to get the resource out of it. It's not the same layout, sadly. But I think that's also caused some of these creatures to move on and go to different areas as well. Maybe not a migration, but just because of deforestation, they're moving on to areas. Like the ANF, Allegheny National Forest, which is not far away from the area where we had our encounter,

is exploding with Bigfoot activity right now. And to me, it's no coincidence probably because that area is being tapped by, you know, gas companies and being exploited. They're probably moving on to a protected area. Amy Boo, a great friend of mine, she does a lot of research out there. Matt Arner, another name dropping some people here for you that you should really talk to because they're all good researchers. There are ones I haven't talked to yet. I need to, yeah.

Really should because they're the people that are out there that are doing this work probably even more frequently than I am, man, to be honest with you. And Matt Arner is also a law enforcement officer. So Matt is, you know, there's Tom Steenberg and there's probably Matt Arner right underneath for me, who's just a tremendous, a tremendous researcher and a nice guy. You don't make them nicer than Matt Arner. So, and I've taken them to these places. And so out in the A&F now is probably where it's going. Matt and I are starting to explore more areas of the northern tier of PA. Again, you don't hear a lot about because up until recently and up until I came on that,

nobody was talking about it, right? Nobody was up here investigating it. So it's going to take time. Chestnut Ridge area, that area has had 50, 60 years of investigators tromping around getting stories. We haven't had that up here. So it's going to take a little time to catch up. Oh, my goodness. We have just a few minutes left.

But if possible to fit it in a few minutes, what is the strangest thing you've encountered in the chestnut ridge? Oh, well. I know that's a loaded question. The strangest things I encountered on the chestnut ridge, I recorded a vocalization there that I don't know what it is. I call it the Keystone Mone. And it's actually, I just gave it to Seth Breedlove not too long ago.

And it sounds like there's a cow in the woods. It sounds like a damn cow. And I'm communicating back and forth with this thing. Like it moans and I moaned back to it. Like there's a few moments of it. That was weird. But I've also, the light in the tree, and I talk about it in Sasquatch on Earth briefly. I don't think they got the video from Rick Cherby and Rick's fiancee.

But there's this light that's moving throughout the trees. they have it on video. They recorded it with a cell phone. That was really interesting, and I was right there with them when it happened, and we couldn't identify the lights, the localized source for it. It's just kind of free flowing through the trees.

So that was probably the weirdest thing I've experienced, which is funny, because if you go to the end of that episode, I'm talking about, like I said, at the beginning of the episode, we're recording here, I come across a little bit more skeptical than I'd like. I can't explain that.

It doesn't mean it's Bigfoot related, but I can't explain that. Phenomeno. But people have seen a dragon out there for crying out loud, man. Like, I, I don't know what to believe from that place. It's nuts out there. It's nuts. Do you think you guys have a dog man in Pennsylvania? I don't buy into dog man. Okay. I think it's misidentified Bigfoot. I do. I think, and this is, I'm always going to hurt somebody's feelings when I say this. And I don't mean to. I just think that we get these ideas in our head. head and no matter what we see, if we see it, it's going to be what we want it to be. We want it to be. So if, you know, somebody maybe had a Bigfoot siding and they might not be inclined to Bigfoot, well, hey, now I had a dogman siding, you know. Listen, Barton Nunley's had some really incredible things happen to him down in, you know, down in his area, in Kentucky, if I can remember off top

my head right. And I'm not detesting anything he said because he had some weird stuff. But I think what people are seeing maybe up here is misidentified Bigfoot. I don't know. I don't know. I again, I think dog man's a fantastic thing, but like all of a sudden, why now? It's a good point because why the sudden, why the sudden, uh, surgeons in every, like, dog man here, there, is it because everyone's thinking of it so that we're, we're bringing it to, we're manifesting it?

that's a weird thing to think about. But like if you get a Volvo and then you're going to see all the Volvos driving around you, you know, it's like. Absolutely. I just, it's very weird, Sean. Like, I don't know. I don't know. But it's, it's dog man is definitely, it's the hotness right now for sure. It is.

And why? I guess that's my thing. When I go to it, man, it's like why, why all of a sudden since like, you know, again, the mid-2010s has it been really popular? But for years, you don't hear about anything. Bigfoot, you have stories that go back forever, right? And Dogman, now it's starting to get a history. But how much of that history is a legitimate history? Let's take Louisiana out of the equation, right?

Because that's its own thing down there. Oh, that's a roo is different. Yeah. Or even the Beast of Bray Road. Like there's some history there. But now all of a sudden, why everywhere? I don't know. That's where I have kind of the skeptic in me still comes out and says,

why now and why? Like Chupacabra. Another thing, right? Come on. I don't know. It's weird, man. And, you know, someone who's who's been in the field, you know, interviewing, going out and looking for stuff. Do you have any advice for researchers that are just getting into Bigfoot researchers?

Any advice off the top of your head? Be reserved when it's spending money. right? You could spend a lot of money on gears that aren't going to do crap for you. You know, I take a flashlight out with me and my mental faculties, and half the time I don't use a flashlight. I don't think any equipment we have is ever going to give us the answers we need, and a voice recorder of some sort, right? But people are going out there buying these $7,800 recorders, unless you know what you're doing with them, they're garbage for you. You need to really have like a master's degree to operate those things. They're really involved. And sometimes the more complicated they are, the more filters they have and the more stuff they leave out, right?

Unintentionally sabotage yourself. But so be frugal with equipment. I think one of the things that I think even even though thermal gear is great, right? It's very expensive. If you're married, don't do that. Your spouse would be very angry with you. If my wife ever found out how much I spent, I'd probably be living on your couch. Like it's probably.

And I don't do the thermals. My friends have them. I don't have them. But again, I've moved past this idea of needing to have the gear because I don't think it tells us anything. Like it, we've been using the same gear for 50 years in one way, shape, or form, right? And Ron Moore had got better quality stuff on on tape than we've had at a digital recorders for the money. That is a statement. My goodness.

Oh, I love it. I love it. I love it, dude. Yeah. Let's keep best. Well, let's keep best buying business, you know, like, let's go. Let's buy it. But it just doesn't add up to anything.

It hasn't amounted to much. And others will disagree, but the proofs in the pudding. And Stan Courtney, you know, has a website, and he's got a page on there dedicated to sound files. This man has recorded over the years. And some of them are really interesting. And we can send, oh, pardon me, we can send sound files to David Ellis and everybody else. but until we get something that proves what's making that sound, it's all conjecture. What do you think it's going to take to prove once and for all that Bigfoot's the real deal?

What do you think? Someone's got to kill one, and I don't want it to be on purpose. I'm very comfortable with the fact that some little gray-haired old lady is going to come down a mountain road and bag one with her station wagon. I'm okay with that concept. And I know there's people out there that are of the pro-kill persuasion, and that's your prerogative. You know, if that's what you need, okay. I'm not crazy about the idea. I'm never going to kill one.

But I'm not going to begrudge somebody who, you know, pulls one in for science. And I know that's kind of, I don't know, hypocritical, but I agree with you. And after reading, you know, in Valley of the Apes, Michael Mays lays it out really well about the necessity. for having a specimen for science and for having one and how that plays in the conservation and it really makes sense after you read it that's my personal opinion but sean it's been so fun talking to you it's crazy an hour has gone by already but um i want you to definitely take a few minutes you know um share again how people can keep up to date with what you're doing with your book that you're working on right now elusive truth all that good stuff Yes. Facebook.com for it slash Sean Forker. I don't hide behind a pseudonym. I'm me.

I don't mind talking to people. I enjoy it. I post a lot of stuff on there. Family and Bigfoot. My family is very important to me. Mike, I have three kids. They've joined me in adventures here and there. My wife, you know, didn't believe in any of this.

I think until I had my own experience. And I still think she doubts that a little bit because she always thought the concept the Bigfoot was, you know, I don't want to say silly, but, you know, not, you know, it was not real. But even she's changed her tune over the years because of what happened to me. But that and Sasquatchexperience.com, follow that, takes you to the website, gets you to all our social media links, and, you know, you can go from there. It's, is it, it's four guys talking about Bigfoot. and most of us that are on that have been investigators.

So it's a little different. I love it. I love it. And there's some really, some really cool episodes that you got to check out. But, yeah, Sean, thank you so much for coming on. Definitely add Sasquatch experience onto your,

your weekly playlist. But thanks so much for coming on, Sean. Thank you, man. I appreciate it. It was a great time. Thanks for listening to the Bigfoot Society podcast. please take a few minutes to review the show on iTunes five stars as it does help us get into the eyes and ears of more listeners on iTunes. That will help us just get bigger and bigger and get even better quality guests for future shows.

Also, if you have any Bigfoot encounters or cryptid encounters, please send your stories and audio and photos whatever you've got over to Bigfoot Society at gmail.com. If you'd like to become more involved with Bigfoot Society and get some extra content, we do have a Patreon where you can get all sorts of cool things. For example, for $7 a month, you get extra Bigfoot Society content, usually interviews, but other things as well. You get a sweet membership card and a vinyl sticker that I send to you in the mail. You get access to the Bigfoot Society after show, which is an extra interview after the main interview with the weekly guest. and usually they are up for Patreon members to be in that extra show segment with them and me and you get to ask your question live to them and get an answer from the guest, which as you've seen what guest we've had in the past, this could be a really big deal.

There's also a private discord where you can get involved with talking to me one-on-one and the community there, and that's always a great time. You can find the Patreon at www.patechreon.com forward slash the Bigfoot Society. We're very thankful for all our supporters that we have in so many different ways and appreciate all our listeners coming back week after week to listen to more cryptozoology-based interviews. Thanks so much for listening, and we'll see you next time. The views and opinions expressed are those of the guest and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Bigfoot society.

Any content provided by our guests are not intended to malign any religion, ethnic group, club organization, company, individual, or anyone. Thank you. Really quick last minute announcements. You have a month, about a month to get to Van Meter, Iowa, to listen to me speak live at the festival. $924, $2 to get in. I'll be talking about the Iowa Bigfoot Information Center and some other cool stuff as well. Wink, wink, wink. To kind of share in my research from around the state.

Also, a big thank you to Paranormality Magazine. And to all the listeners who nominated me for two categories for the Paranomality Magazine Podcast Awards. So voting is now open for that. if you could go over to paranormalitemag.com and vote for Bigfoot Society in the best Cryptozoology podcast category and the best interview podcast category. Now's your time to get over to Paranomalitymag.com. I'm going to have it in the show notes as well. And vote for Bigfoot Society. Because a vote for Bigfoot society is a vote for Bigfoot himself.

or, you know, this podcast that you listen to. Again, thank you so much for listening. I appreciate each and every one of you and have a fantastic day or night or however you are listening to this. Whatever time. Okay, I'm out. All right, quick quiz for the hiring managers out there. What's worse? Being understaffed or being poorly staffed?

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