BiggerPockets Money Podcast - 437: Wedding Costs Are WILD: Is Your Dream Day Worth Going Into Debt?

Episode Date: August 2, 2023

Wedding costs have been slowly growing over the past few decades. But recently, after a wild 2020, 2021, and 2022 wedding season, the average wedding cost has hit heights that most Americans simply can’t afford. But what can you do? Cancel your wedding and go straight to the courthouse? While this isn’t a bad option for some, most couples tying the knot want something their friends and family will remember for years. So, here’s how to do it on a budget! We brought expert event planner and fundraiser AJ Williams on the show to go over what’s worth it, what’s not, and what couples should spend the MOST money on when planning their special day. Whether you’re getting married at home, stateside, or abroad, there are a few specific expenses of a wedding that you should never skip out on and some that could put you in a tough financial bind. With flowers, DJs, photography, and catering, which deserves a spot in your ceremony? AJ will also go over how much a wedding costs on average, what the elite pay for their ceremonies and parties (you won’t believe the number), and the top wedding myths that could cost you.  In This Episode We Cover The average wedding cost in America and why prices have recently been rising What to cut and what to keep during your wedding day Budgeting for your wedding and how much of a buffer you REALLY need Common wedding cost myths and tips to save you THOUSANDS  Non-negotiables when planning your wedding and what is worth paying extra for  And So Much More! Links from the Show BiggerPockets Money Facebook Group BiggerPockets Forums Finance Review Guest Onboarding Join BiggerPockets for FREE Scott's Instagram Amanda's Instagram Grab Scott’s Book, “Set for Life” Listen to All Your Favorite BiggerPockets Podcasts in One Place Apply to Be a Guest on The Money Show Podcast Talent Search! Listen to The Real Estate InvestHER Show Join The Real Estate InvestHER Community on Facebook Register for an Upcoming InvestHER Event Money Moment How to Financially Thrive in Marriage (Even if You or Your Partner is In Debt! AJ's Website Click here to check the full show notes: https://www.biggerpockets.com/blog/money-437   Interested in learning more about today's sponsors or becoming a BiggerPockets partner yourself? Email us: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to the Bigger Pockets Money podcast where we interview A.J. Williams and talk about the actual cost of weddings. Hello, hello, hello. My name is Scott Trench. And with me today is my also married co-host, Amanda Woff. How you doing today, Amanda? Doing great. Awesome. Amanda and I are here to make financial independence less scary, less just for somebody else. To introduce you to every money story, because we truly believe financial freedom is attainable for everyone, no matter when or where you're starting. Whether you want to retire early and travel the world, go on to make big time investments, and assets like real estate or throw your dream wedding, will help you reach your financial goals and get money out of the way so you can launch yourself toward your dreams.

All right, we have a new segment of the show called the Money Moment, where we share a money hack, tip, or trick to help you on your financial journey. And today's Money Moment is have a spending buddy. If you are an impulsive spender or are having trouble justifying a large purchase, have a friend, family member, or partner you check in with prior to making those large purchases. This sounds silly, but it may help you take a moment of reflection to determine if the purchase is actually worth it. Do you have a money tip for us? Email money moment at biggerpockets.com. All right. Before we bring in, AJ, you know, I thought it would be fun to just kind of quickly

talk about at a high level. Our weddings, Amanda. I know you recently got married. When was that? So I got married last June. So we just had our one year anniversary like two weeks ago, June 26th. And oh my gosh, I've just been daydreaming about that day. It was one of the best, most favorite days of my life ever. Awesome. And where'd you do it? What was it like? It was incredible. So we did it in Lake Como, Italy. So we both are, you know, very into traveling and outdoors. And we're at a point in our life where we're like, you know, we want to go somewhere really beautiful, somewhere with mountains and a lake. We started exploring and found Lake Como Italy. And, you know, we, like I said, it was honestly like a dream come true. We just made sure that

all of our non-negotiables, our best friends and, you know, family members could make it. And then we just went from there, pulled the trigger, and best time of our entire lives. Yeah, just at the one-year anniversary. Awesome. Yeah. How long have you been married, Scott? I've been married almost three years coming up on, two and a half years, coming up on three years in November. We got married during COVID, and so we got engaged in late 2019, and we're planning kind of that 150-ish-odd person wedding here in Colorado, nearby where we live. And then, of course, the pandemic strikes. So we had to move our wedding back, change venues, and get a place where we could do kind of a streaming reception. And we had to narrow it to, I think it was close to 20 people. So we had a very intimate small

wedding locally here with largely a lot of friends. A couple of folks flew in. A lot of folks that we were in a community that we were still kind of interacting with to a degree here in Denver during that time. So small intimate wedding, it ended up being beautiful and wonderful. But we definitely were one of those folks that got the plans changed because of the pandemic. environment there. Yeah. And so I feel like a lot of people who had COVID weddings ended up having an intimate ceremony like you just mentioned, but then also ended up having a second one post-COVID, where they had the all-out one. Did you guys decide, you know what? No, we're done. We're going to take all that money we saved and invest in some real estate or stocks or what have you. Or did you

plan to have another one? Or how did that conversation go? Well, so we went with a wedding planning company. And so we were probably going to be in that like median range for weddings. But we ended up being a little cheaper because of the whole, uh, uh, guest list shrinking from 150 to like 25, 20, 20 to 30 or something like that. So that definitely made things more affordable. We because we got married in 2020, I feel like a lot of our friends who did like the, what you just described, they were more like 2021, 2022, um, weddings where they, where they were doing those kinds of things because there were still more of that.

But there was just no line of sight. if you're a call in 2020 to when that was going to happen. So we never ended up doing the, the bigger one. I think we were, we were delighted with how our smaller intimate one turned out, although it would have been great to have, you know, more, more of the extended family there. Yeah. And I think it's so interesting, too, because after COVID, everyone had the small intimate weddings. And then once we could start going outside again, I feel like the weddings that took place, everybody came. So I know for us, we invited. I think it was like 105 people and 92 came to Italy. That was, I mean, it was incredible. Everybody

who we wanted there basically ended up getting to come. But I thought that was like really like surprising because most people, you know, you always hear like, oh, like 75% of people come. So I think that's really interesting. So I feel like you probably saved yourself a ton by stripping it down, doing the virtual and just keeping it there because probably everybody would have come. Yeah. I bet you it's a combination with everyone showing up to these weddings of two things. One, people wanting to just get out because they've been cooped up for a couple years because of the pandemic. And two, nobody had any plans, right? So you're probably planning your wedding long enough in advance. Nobody has any plans at that point a year out or whatever so everyone can

come. So I think it's been that that's probably a wonderful thing to have everybody, everybody showing up who's invited to a lot of these weddings. Yeah, it was amazing. It was incredible. All right, Amanda, well, should we go ahead and bring AJ in and talk more in depth about weddings? Tax season is one of the only times all year when most people actually look at their full financial picture, including income, spending, savings, investments, the whole thing. And if you're like most folks, it can be a little eye-opening. That's why I like Monarch. It helps you see exactly where your money is going, and more importantly, where your tax refund can make the biggest impact. Because the goal isn't just to look backward, it's to actually make progress. Simplify your

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30-day trial at audible.com slash BP money. Let's do it. Let's get some insider info. AJ Williams was named a BizBash 500 most influential event pro in the U.S. AJ has built a strong track record and has worked with celebrities including John Bon Jovi, President Clinton, Queen Latifah, and the Eagles. That's probably the band, not my Philadelphia eagles and birds. In addition, she has raised $76 million for nonprofits through her event business. AJ, welcome to Bigger Pockets Money podcast. We are so excited to have you here. Hi, thank you for having me. AJ, to kick things off, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and how you get started

in planning events and weddings? Sure, sure. So I've been in the wedding and event business for over 30 years. I basically started planning events when I was in high school for those of you that are, you know, in my age group or older. My high school yearbook deptomy is Julie McCoy from the Love Boat. So planning is definitely in my, in my DNA. And I got started planning events for the Miss USA and the Miss Teen USA pageants for four New England states for many years before I started my business. That is incredible. That is a really long time. I have a question. So, But generally speaking, since you've just been an event planner, your entire life, basically, how have weddings and events, how have they changed in the past 10 to like 15ish years?

Are you seeing couples like waiting to get married? So they're a little more financially secure or what does that look like? So there are a lot of dynamics that have changed in weddings and events because of social media. And then recently with COVID, you know, because of COVID, people are just thinking a little bit more closely about what they want to do and what's more important to them rather than rushing through the experience and taking more time in their budgets, you know, to plan and planning more intimate events. But over the course of the last 10 years with social media and the help of Instagram, it has really taken events to the next level.

And a lot of people want the all the extras, the extra flowers or the Instagramable moments that really make their event just very fun and exciting and a little bit, you know, over the top for what, you know, they like. Yeah. And so, and what about the actual like wedding season? Because, you know, we all want those Pinterest worthy weddings, those Instagramable weddings. Do you feel like the wedding season has changed? Because I think it used to really be like summertime, right?

I actually got married last summer. And, you know, for me, I'm like, oh, I can't imagine not having a warm. nice, sunny day. But do you feel like the wedding season has changed? Are people getting married more throughout the year? Or is it still primarily summertime? I mean, depending on where you are geographically, you have your two focused months. I'm here in New England. So June and September are hot months. But because of COVID and because people are just getting a little bit more savvy, they're planning their events all throughout the year now. They're going overseas or they're going to destinations where they can have, you know, their events in March in a cool destination that has low peak time

that they can, you know, celebrate their wedding nuptials there, or they're going to the Caribbean or Mexico or Italy in October as opposed to going to the Caribbean in March when the weather is really, really great. Or they're just going to their family destinations. I could do a lot of events in Nantucket. So between the months of June and October, this is really our wedding season here. But we've seen more weddings outside of the peak season happen because everybody just wants to plan their event whenever they want to. Yeah. And I love, I love that. you, I love that you mentioned the destination wedding too, because I got married last summer in Italy. So when you called that destination, I was like, that's where I got married. And I believe,

didn't you just get married as well internationally? I did. Yeah. Yay, congrats. After three years through COVID and building a house, we, I basically said, listen, honey, if we don't get married in March, I'm going to have three weddings, one on Nantucket, one in Boston and one in the Caribbean. So he gave me the go ahead to plan the wedding. Let's go forward. And let me ask you then, since you are the wedding planner, I felt like when I was looking around at planning my wedding, so I live in Chicago, I actually felt like it was more affordable overseas. Do you think that weddings are more affordable internationally versus, you know, having them in the United States? So some aspects of planning events internationally are more affordable, especially when you're working with local vendors. But in a case of like my wedding, I wanted certain things. So I had a 40-foot container with, you know, the brandable items and the custom items that I wanted for my event. And it was expensive to ship.

And then it was expensive because of customs. But I got exactly what I want. wanted for my wedding while using local vendors. And, you know, that helped bring the cost down overall for the wedding. But, yeah, there was a little give and take there. So, you know, I, I've been, I'll, this will take me a second to frame here. But when I graduated from high school in 2009, we were the largest graduating class of that time period. A lot of my friends and peers got married around the same time I did in 2020, 2020, 2021, 2022. the pandemic years. And we did not do this, but some of them did something to the following effect,

like just what you said, AJ, where they would have, they would basically elope, then they would have a small, intimate wedding. And then later, after kind of things eased up a little bit, they had a big wedding. Did you see a lot of that? And how is that impacting kind of the demand and the need to plan relentlessly years in advance? Is that pressure sort of relenting to some degree? Are you seeing that? That trend is very popular and it was extremely popular last year. And it almost killed, like we, it almost killed us like everybody in the event industry, whether you were a rental company or you were an audiovisual company and a planner, a florist. Uh, 2020 was a, you know, you hear about great Gatsby and everyone was, you know, wanting to have all of their events. it was everybody and their mother and daughter and their friend. I mean, everybody wanted to have an event in 2022.

But Scott, to your point, there were a lot of weddings where they had small, intimate weddings or virtual weddings, or they just wanted to elope and have that bigger wedding when it was time, and that was in 2022, where everyone was like, okay, this is the year we're going to have our wedding, our big wedding. like everybody else. And so 2020 was a very, very challenging year for our event industry. We went from 0% to like, I think, 400%. And it really maxed us out. I'm really happy that 2023 is more manageable. But I do love that trend. I love the idea of having an intimate ceremony with, you know, close friends, your besties, or just family, and then, you know, just having a more

full reception event with, you know, everybody that you love. Do you think that trend will continue in 2024 will be easier again? 2025 will be easier still, so on and so forth, because of that long-term demographic tale I mentioned where I think the generate, like, it's just, I think millennials got married older, but that's probably starting to wind down a little bit, and Gen Z is not quite as big. Or do you think that the pressure is going to be there for a long time and weddings are going to continue to increase in cost and complexity here? Well, weddings are definitely going to increase in complexity and cost. You know, the supply and demand has definitely gotten better.

But I do feel that more people are thinking more closely about how they want to marry and what they want their events to look like. So we are seeing more people going back to what weddings used to be just with a lot more flair and fun and customization. So in 2022, we see all the data that says the average cost of a wedding was $30,000. But whenever I see that, I'm like, what is average? What is an average wedding? What does that entail? What is the average guest count?

What is the venue? Where are these averages coming from? I think when you're thinking about averages, the average really has to do with the entire United States. So if you go to one state, that average might be $8,000 or $10,000, but if you go to another one other one might be $75. So that's where the average $30,000 takes into account. So it may not make sense to someone that's living in New York, you know, in New York City, I should say, as opposed to upstate New York. So if that makes, you know, sense. But I think average weddings, if you want to look at what an average wedding gets you, it just

really gets you a really nice wedding without the customization, without the additional flowers and a pretty focused budget. So, you know, you, so first of all, we're talking about average is $30,000. The likely events like the ones that you put on, AJ, are bringing that average up. median cost, right, the one that typical wedding may actually be even less expensive than that $30,000. We're going to have to look up that stat and see if we can find it. But what is the average, quote unquote, cost of a wedding with an elite wedding and event planner, such as yourself, in a Nantucket or similar setting? I would say the average upscale wedding could run you anywhere

We're from 200,000 to half a million dollars and more. And who pays for this wedding? Is your client typically the bride and groom, or are there parents that are involved in these kind of elite weddings that you see that fill up Instagram and social media and these kinds of things? So it depends. A lot of my clients are the bride and groom. And sometimes they have assistance from parents.

Or it is, you know, the parents that are paying for everything. So it's a little bit of a mix. It depends on where the bride and groom are in their careers and financially. And I think a lot of brides and grooms couples are choosing the independence route when it comes to paying their wedding. They're being more financially responsible for their event with a little bit of assistance. I think that that number you just said will shock probably a lot of people. It shocked me. That's for sure.

So where is the majority of that money being spent? And I know it can vary, but like majority, where is the $200 to half a million dollars being spent? Well, what I usually tell my couples is when we start talking about budgets and what their number is, I always tell them you should plan on 30% higher than that because there might be something that they may want, you know, later past this point in time in our conversation. that may add to the budget or, you know, when you're dealing with destination events, there are things that may be more costly because you have to ship them over to the island.

Or you may need to have a backup plan in regards to weather. So there are a lot of factors that come into play other than just a nice nicety that they may want to add on, like a large floral installation with orchids over the dance floor or a dance floor wrap or a stage fronts that are that are infused with beautiful flowers and lighting or they want a headline band to now come and perform at their their event. So sometimes they think, okay, I want this band, that's $30,000, but they didn't think that the band would cost another $30,000 because of the cost of the instruments, which is backline and the cost of shipping it over or the audiovisual or setup. And, you know, it's those type of expenses that sometimes are not accounted for.

But that's how planners guide their couples alongside with them with the budget. Right, because you don't know what you don't know, right? So what percent of couples actually stay within the budget that they set during that initial conversation with you? I would say most people, they usually stay within that budget plus 30 percent. Plus 30 percent. So all of you out there, whatever you have budgeted at 30 percent because you don't know what you don't know.

Okay. Interesting. Tax season is one of the only times all year when most people actually look at their full financial picture, including income, spending, savings, investments, the whole thing. And if you're like most folks, it can be a little eye-opening. That's why I like Monarch. It helps you see exactly where your money is going, and more importantly, where your tax refund can make the biggest impact. Because the goal isn't just to look backward. It's to actually make progress. Simplify your finances with Monarch. Monarch is the all-in-one personal finance tool designed to make your life easier. It brings your entire financial life, including budgeting, accounts and future planning together in one dashboard on your phone or your laptop. Feel aware and in control of your finances this tax season and get 50% off your Monarch subscription with the code pockets. What I personally like is that Monarch, keeps you focused on achieving, not just tracking. You can see your budgets, debt payoff, savings goals, and net worth all in one place. So every decision actually moves the needle.

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Visit Northwest Registeredagent.com slash money-free and start building something amazing. Get more with Northwest Registered Agent at Northwest Registeredagent.com slash money-free. At Desjardin, our business is helping me. yours. We're here to support your business through every stage of growth, from your first pitch to your first acquisition. Whether it's improving cash flow or exploring investment banking solutions, with Desjardin business, it's all under one roof. So join the more than 400,000 Canadian entrepreneurs who already count on us and contact Desjardin today. We'd love to talk, business. Okay, so my budget is 30,000 making this up, right, which is,

still it seems incredibly expensive. But my budget is $30,000 and that's after the 30%. So I've come into you with a $20,000 budget and you said, bump up to $30 for contingencies. What are some of the things that you feel are must-haves at these events that would give you the best bang for your buck at that level of spend? How would you prioritize the big ticket items there? Entertainment, great sound during your ceremony because you want everyone to hear you. And that's usually something that is missed and not thought of. That's one of the things we usually have to add on to the budget at the beginning of the process because it's not normally thought of.

But I would say you want to spend your dollars on great entertainment and surprise elements because those are conversational pieces that will last long after the event and what people will remember from your wedding. And honestly, the couples take away from the wedding. as well. You want to spend more of your dollars where your guests are going to spend the most amount of time at. So that's really dinner and dancing, right? So making sure that they're entertained and they're having fun as much as possible during the event. So it's like the accents and the little surprise elements. Maybe it's adding on three horns that come into the dance floor

that add elements of surprise and wild people while they're dancing. So it's it's it's it's those elements that really I think that are important, um, you know, to, uh, you know, add on to the budget. Then on the flip side, we have to say what would you cut? So say somebody was a little more budget conscious or there were some of those little extra entertainment pieces that you mentioned that they really want to go all in on. Where would you recommend people cut their budget? I would say flowers. So we recently had a wedding and we had to cut dollars to make our contingency plan may work. So we just adjusted the ceiling treatments to make sure that they were all greenery instead of, you know, basically orchids and roses and different flowers and hydrangees hanging

from the ceiling. So we just went with greenery instead. And it was honestly just as beautiful. We just, we added lighting. We basically removed lighting from an area and made the lighting shine onto the hanging centerpiece over the dance floor. And it was just as beautiful. I love that. Okay, do you have any other like suggestions or tips like that where substituting greenery versus flowers since flowers? Those can get out of control. When I saw the cost of flowers and I was planning my wedding, I was like, what?

So are there any other tips like you just mentioned with the greenery and the lights that, that you could offer up to people? I would say if you really had to cut an item, think about your bar and perhaps a wine service, you know, upon during the cocktail hour and keep it instead of doing a full bar during your cocktail hour, that can save you a lot of dollars. And it can also help to keep, if you have a really high energy crowd as well, it can also keep your attendees a little bit more grounded. before they get on the dance floor because, you know, during dinner, people are still drinking. And you can focus that on wine as well. But once they hit the dance floor, you can go back to, you know, your full bar. I think you'll be fine there. People are pretty understanding when it comes to the cocktail hour and not having full bar.

So I mentioned earlier how some friends had the multiple weddings. We opt, we, you know, we were planning to have a larger wedding with, you know, many, extended family members, those kinds of things. And then we got, my wife and I got married in November 2020. So we decided to have a very small intimate wedding with just friends that we were, you know, and parents and immediate siblings and those kinds of things. But are you seeing that the guest lists are compressing to a certain degree in weddings at all as a result maybe of the pandemic and the aftermath of those things?

are other folks kind of following suit even in the absence of the full full fledged pandemic here? I think people are just going all out right now. I would say the year right after, I would say in 2022, maybe 2021 when weddings were starting to come back, people thought about their weddings a little bit more intimately. I mean, even for our wedding a few months ago, we only thought 40 people were going to come to our wedding. And we had just over 80. And, you know, people just wanted to come. They wanted to go. They wanted to be there and, and enjoy that special moment with you. I do feel that people just, you know, really just want to be with the people that they love and have a great time and party. So I don't really see that congestive.

list anymore. We're, we're actually having a lot of trouble finding, it's challenging, finding venues that can hold our guest counts because it feels like most of them are 250 to 350 now. Oh, my gosh. How do you even know that many people? Wow. Well, it's, it's not necessarily always the couples, but it's, it's the parents, too, that want to invite their friends so they can see how amazing, you know, their children are getting in, and this, this beautiful couple is coming together. So it's like they're entertaining their friends as well, watching them, watching their children get married. Okay. So does that mean that the weddings that are paid for by parents typically have the bigger guess counts? Is that, is that accurate? Yes, absolutely. And those that don't,

when the couple is involved more financially in their wedding budgets and their parents want to invite, like 20 or 30 people, then, you know, that's when I say, well, are they contributing to the dinner? You know, are they, so that's how you get, you know, the, the parents involved financially. I want to ask about inflation as well on just like a per person basis. Are we seeing that that is affecting the wedding industry kind of along with all the other things in the last couple of years? Are people getting less for more, basically? I wouldn't say that they're getting less for more, but they're definitely getting, the budgets are definitely higher. Flowers are more expensive.

Rentals are more, everything is more expensive. I mean, the cost of a linen that was pre-2020 is not the same now. Shipping has increased because a lot of people have left the event industry, it has gotten a lot, harder and it's been very, very challenging for our industry to keep really good people involved. And to do that, you have to pay your staff, you know, higher fees. And that's also the reason why there's inflation in our industry. So speaking of inflation, speaking of cost and just everything is getting more expensive, What are some of the most expensive big ticket items at weddings? And what are the non-negotiables, would you consider?

I mean, no matter what event I do, whether it's a fundraiser, a corporate event or wedding, my non-negotiables are always A-V. You have to have really good audiovisual and great sound. That's always my non-negotiable entertainment for sure. And depending on the couple, it's always the food for me as well. You know, everything else as far as, you know, event flow is important to me, but that's, you know, not really budget related, not necessarily anyway. But audiovisual, making sure that you have really good sound lighting and great entertainment are, I think, really the non-negotiables. So that more so than the, I guess, DJ or band that would be under entertainment, right?

More so than the actual location or the bride's dress and all over all of that type of stuff. Absolutely. Okay. Then I want to kind of take us a little bit of a different direction. And let's debunk some myths that we hear out there. So is it true that booking your wedding super far in advance or really, I guess any event can help you save the most money? In some situations, a lot of situations, absolutely. If you're booking an event at a location far in advance, sometimes you can negotiate concessions

early on and different perks when you're booking early. And as supply and demand get harder, that's when venues can add on a higher rental fee. and have less concessions available to you. So I would definitely say the first thing that you should do really is book your event planner because they're the ones that are going to negotiate your contract. And sometimes when you're working with a great event planner that can negotiate your venue in the most proper way, that actually pays for the wedding planner in many cases. I mean, you can save $20, $30, $40,000 on your room rentals, your venue fees, especially if the planner is savvy enough to negotiate what your plate is going to be per person.

And you will be able to do that in advance, especially if something is booked early on. I mean, I think that makes sense, right? Hiring your event planner because you don't know what you don't. know, just like I hire an accountant because I am not the tax expert, right? Like, hire the person who knows more than you. Okay. So that is good to know. The other myth that I want busted to see, is it true or false, are there certain seasons or days of the week that are more cost effective to get married on? Like, I feel like with flights you hear, you know, look at prices on Wednesdays. Those are better. Does that translate to the wedding and or event industry? Are there certain days of the

week that are more cost effective? Well, weekdays are always more cost effective than a Saturday, of course, a Friday or Saturday. But, you know, there are there are also days like Columbus weekend. I feel like those are also good weekends to get married. So not all holidays are the same. But, you know, if you're getting married on a Tuesday, Wednesday, of course, you're going to get a really good bang for your buck there. You may have the same floral fees on a Wednesday than you would on a Saturday, but your room rental, you probably may not, you could probably waive your room rental at a venue if you have it on a weekday.

But then again, there are, there's always variables there because if you're booking on a Tuesday, Wednesday in the height of September or October during convention. season, then that might not be the best, you know, venue for you in order to, to receive a good, you know, decreased budget. Thinking through, you know, I think this has been really helpful discussion on thinking through kind of that traditional wedding, which, again, is average or maybe even, you know, closer to median for what most people are going to do. But I wonder if there's a population of folks that are listening to bigger pockets money,

for example, who would love to kind of think through, how do I get, you know, much far, much cheaper than the costs and budgets that we've been talking about here. Have you, have you thought about or heard of or can you point anybody to resources on how to do it in order of magnitude cheaper? Maybe a baby getting married in your backyard or at a friend's house or any tips for those types of weddings? I would definitely say still hire an event planner and you can hire an event planner not to fully plan your event, but as a consultancy relationship instead, where we work with some couples where we are just there, you know, basically go-to for advice and, you know, for vendors or contracts or any piece of advice that they want during the planning process. And then we're

involved in the execution the month prior to the wedding. That alone can save the couple a lot of dollars because to Amanda's point, you know, we know our industry like the back of our hands and we can pass up that information along to the couple. There are also other ways you can do, you know, the do it yourself kind of planning where if you want to spend the time and do it yourself, you could do your own centerpieces and that will save you, you know, a good amount of dollars. You could handle some of the decor and, you know, and do it yourself and, you know, save yourself some dollars. But, you know, again, I would definitely make sure that you put your dollars to best use with audiovisual and entertainment.

And how would I go about interviewing one of these wedding planners? Like, what are some things to look for? How do I know I'm going to get good when I, uh, when I go looking and shopping for for someone to help me but plan this event. Sure. So you can look at reviews and look at their Instagram pages because you can see what their execution is like. That's really a really great way to show.

You can look at Pinterest, Instagram, you know, for that. So you can see basically, you know, the history of the events and the type of events that they plan. It's also a great way to see which planner has a same. kind of style that you like, the type of events that you like to execute. So that's a really great way. And you could also, you know, I don't like this, but you can also, you know, take a lot of ideas from, you know, Instagram and Pinterest as well.

But the best way to find the best planner is it's all about chemistry. So interviewing the planners and seeing which better, which, which planner, you know, feels the most connected to you and then make your decision based off of your interview and off of your interview and all this time you've never had a problem the events always run smoothly there's never like an issue that comes up at the last minute with any of the guests or the bride or the room or the parents or anything like that there's always issues you know sometimes our our couples never know about it but you know this past june we've had a really crazy weather-filled month of June on Nantucket.

Every weekend we had the first weekend was like a windstorm. I thought I was in the Wizard of Oz and, you know, all the ceiling treatments kept going back and forth like this all night underneath, you know, basically 100 people on the dance floor. And I was, I was like scared and praying at the same time. So, you know, you have situations like that and then you have rain. We had the week after we were watching the rain forecast like hourly. And we were holding on to our ceremony, which was outside.

And, you know, one of the one person in the wedding party said, I think we should just have the party in the restaurant. Mind you, the restaurant was really, really small. There's no way we could have fit everybody into that restaurant because that would have already been our backup plan. right? So I looked at the radar again and I basically made an announcement. I said, okay, everybody, we're going to load up the shuttles. We're going to go to the wedding ceremony site really fast. We're going to get this beautiful couple married and we're going to miss the rain. And I called over the efficient and I said, we're going to do this super fast. No half an hour. Let's try to get it done in like 15 minutes. And he was all on board.

We're basically in the shuttles, no lie. The fire truck shuttle that we were in with the bridal party, minus the bride who was in the Mercedes, thank goodness, basically broke down. Oh, my gosh. Yeah, on top of that. And it was starting to drizzle, you know, and we were very close to the ceremony site.

So we just walked up this, like, slight hill to the ceremony site. And everybody was like huddled underneath this big, huge tree and everyone was still in disbelief that the wedding, the ceremony was going to go through. And I was like, okay, everybody, let's go to the seats. Go to your seats. And my other planners, you know, guided everybody to their seats. And we all had our umbrellas for everybody. So the ceremony starts.

And I kid you not, the sky just started to open. And we had the most gorgeous photos because some of the raindrops as the wedding party was going down. the aisle looked like little crystals coming down in the photos, in the photos because of the way the light was hitting it was beautiful. But no rain. So get yourself a wedding planner who can control the weather is what I'm hearing. Exactly.

They actually called me the wedding whisperer. So I love it. Awesome. Well, where can people find out more about you, AJ Wedding Whisperer Williams? Thank you very much. They can find me online at AJW Events.com. My Instagram also has the same handle, AJW Events.

Facebook and Pinterest also. My handle is AJW Events. And you can feel free to give me a call or contact me through my website. Well, we really enjoyed having you on the show today. Thank you for sharing all this knowledge about weddings, costs, what to prioritize, what to potentially cut if you're on a budget and how to think about a lot of the big ticket items here. My last tip since you mentioned the what to cut, I would say another thing that you could cut to is when you're doing a tented wedding, if you really needed to, the big budget cost for tents would be the flooring. So you could save anywhere from $20,000 to $30,000 just on the flooring. That's a pro tip right there.

Yeah. Well, we really appreciate having you on the show. Thanks for that extra tip. And we hope you have a wonderful rest of your week and I'm sure a busy weekend. up. Yes. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. All right. That was A.J. Williams. Amanda, what did you think? Oh, my gosh. I loved it. That was so interesting. All the, like I said, all the insider tips and tricks that she had, I feel like is so beneficial to everyone because you don't know what you don't know. Yeah. I mean, you know, even having been been through it all, you know, there's tons of stuff to

learn here. So I hope that helps a lot of people who are planning their wedding or have friends who were going to plan their weddings. We did have our wonderful team pull a couple of stats for us that I thought were interesting and might be fun to share. A couple of them, you know, and I'll read off a couple of them here and we can kind of react to them. But these are stats from the knot and the biggest items to budget for when it comes to the total cost of wedding are first the venue, which is 37% of the total cost. After that, it's the catering at 29% of the cost. Then it's the band or music at 13% of the cost and everything else falls under 10%, which includes the rings, flowers, decoration, photography, so on and so forth.

Does that surprise you? What do you think of that? I feel like that sounds pretty spot on. I'm like sitting here trying to remember the like specific details of mine. And I think that sounds pretty right. The venue, especially if you have to, you know, pay for the actual space. For us, we did it at a boutique hotel. So as long as we rented out all of the.

the rooms, we didn't actually have to pay a venue fee. So I think that's one way you could get around a really huge cost as having people pay for their rooms doing it someplace like that. But the catering, yeah, absolutely like that ate up a lot of the budget. Food and drink can be expensive. What about you? Yeah, you know, I guess I guess it makes sense. And I think it also highlights just an opportunity, you know, to what AJ was saying, you know, the, I wonder if, you know, the things that you remember aren't exactly what she said. The little surprises and wrinkles you pull in, the, you know, instead of spending, you know, X amount on the catering or the venue, if you bring in the bagpipes, you know, in the middle of the dance for, whatever, or whatever

that fun thing is, maybe those are ways if you're really trying to make a memorable wedding on a budget to, remember that you can cut out, come of the 80, 20 there and invest more in the 20, and maybe, maybe folks will remember more of it. How about this one? Twenty, 28 percent of couples take on debt to pay for their weddings. from according to Business Insider. What do you think about that one? I find it not surprising, but I find it really sad, too, because I think your friends and family would not want you going into debt for that day, right? It's like people say, oh, it's one day. No, it is one very special day, but there, you don't need the nicest of everything. I think it's sitting down with your

partner, getting really clear on what your most important things to each of you are and like stick into your guns because it can like get totally out of control, but it does not surprise me. What about you. I don't think it surprises me either. And I think, like, you know, I think, you know, Scott from, you know, 26-year-old Scott would have said, this is atrocious. What's going on here? But, you know, I recently read a die with zero. And, you know, while I still wouldn't go into debt for a wedding personally and think that that's really sad and I agree with you, you shouldn't do it, you know, for friends and families' sake. Some people may prioritize this so much that they want to make sure that this day is as a memory that they have burned into their, you know, burn into them for life. So I, I think it's

going to be a tough call. And I certainly wouldn't recommend it and hope people, more people avoid that. But I can see it for some folks who really, you know, who really make this, want this moment in particular to be that, that perfect memory for the rest of their lives. Yeah. I think it just comes down to intentional spending, right? So if you have been dreaming about your wedding since you've been five years old and you want to go all out, no judgment. You do you boo, right? Like, you go all out. But I think rather than taking on debt, I would rather you wait one more year and save for it appropriately. Because, you know, that type of debt, it's just, I don't think it's worth it. It can really like snowball you backwards and derail other plans. And, you know, it's one day of

your life. So just make it next year. Yeah. I completely agree. That's exactly what I would do. I just am not surprised by the stat and can maybe empathize with it in a few cases, but certainly not recommend it. This is not the type of debt you want to be carrying in for the next couple of years. And it may even sour the memory of that wedding if you're still paying off that debt in a few months or years after it happens. Yeah. All righty. Well, thank you so much for being my co-host today, Amanda.

It was great to catch up and really, really appreciate it. Should we get out of here? Yeah, let's do it. Thanks for having me. All right. She is Amanda Wolf and I am Scott Schult. Trench saying hit the road, happy toad. If you enjoyed today's episode, please give us a five-star review on Spotify or Apple. And if you're looking for even more money content, feel free to visit

our YouTube channel at YouTube.com slash BiggerPockets Money. Bigger Pockets Money was created by Mindy Jensen and Scott Trench, produced by Kailen Bennett, editing by Exodus Media, copywriting by Nate Weintraub. Lastly, a big thank you to the Bigger Pockets team for making this show possible.