BiggerPockets Money Podcast - 8: From Financially Perfect to Rock Bottom (and back again) with Tiffany “The Budgetnista” Aliche

Episode Date: February 19, 2018

Tiffany Aliche grew up talking about money. Her dad was an accountant,  her mother actively  engaged the children in grocery  shopping and other areas of finance. She was a teacher at a private school and had just bought her first house. Then she met a “friend” who convinced her to invest in his get-rich-quick scheme. Promised future returns led to foolish spending. The economic downturn led to a lost job, and in turn a lost home. Bouncing between family members, Tiffany had a revelation: “I need to take responsibility for my past actions, and turn my life around.” Tiffany took the necessary steps to repair her finances, and then started teaching others how they could fix their finances, too. She’s turned her financial courses into a network of financial resources - including a 350,000+ member facebook group where you can ask and answer questions or get support during your journey. This show is for anyone who is sick of making bad financial choices, and wants to turn their life around. Links from the Show BiggerPockets Forums BiggerPockets Podcast Facebook Group Dream Catchers Live Richer Challenge Full show notes here: https://www.biggerpockets.com/moneyshow08 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Bigger Pockets Money. Show number eight. This is the thing I say, that your money should be aligned with your values. If you pull up your debit card statement, your bank statement, do you recognize that person? Are you like, who's this? So that's all that matters. If you look at and you pull up your debit and your credit card statement and that person is familiar to you because you love to read and you see Amazon all in your statement and you love to travel and you see flights, well, then you are in alignment. So, but a lot of people are not.

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This show is for anyone who has money. or wants more. This is the Bigger Pockets Money Podcast. I'm Scott Trench here with my co-host, Miss Mindy Jensen. How you doing, Mindy? I am doing so fantastic today. Scott, how are you? I am great. I was so excited to hear from Tiffany today. I thought she was fantastic. Oh, my goodness. I have been a fan of Tiffany Leachay since I saw her speak in, I think, 2015 at a conference that I go to every year. She told her life story about how she grew up with a dad who's financially savvy. She made some pretty big money mistake. compounded by the life circumstances that happened around 2008, 2009 with the housing crash.

The school that she was working for as a preschool teacher went out of business and she kind of lost everything. She hit rock bottom and then decided, you know what, this isn't going to define me. I'm going to go and figure out another way to make money. Yeah, I think it's fantastic. And one of my passions and things that I do with my volunteer efforts is I work with people that have made money mistakes, maybe like Tiffany's. Sometimes, you know, and many people who might benefit from the Live Richer Challenge that Tiffany's created a program that helps folks get their financial house in order and get back on their feet, you know, get to the point where they can begin actually building wealth instead of just kind of trying to get by. And this program, what she does is just so

wonderful. And, you know, I've been looking for a way to help these people at scale, a site to recommend, a challenge to recommend for so long. And this is really it. Yes, I've taken the Live Richer Challenge. see, I was so inspired by how passionate she was about it and how easy she made it seem and how non-judgmental. So I went and I signed up for the Liverture Challenge, even though I'm in a different financial place than most people who go through it. And it's very matter of fact and easy and inspirational and inspirational. And there's an air of you can do this. And here's how. And it doesn't matter about your past mistakes. We're just going to go forward from now on. Yeah, I love it. And one thing that you guys, the list,

that you should know about this is I think that Tiffany's program, the 30 DeLiverature Challenge, is typically targeted towards women. And I think that she said 15% of her audience makes over $70,000 or more per year. So I understand that that is the audience that we're talking about here. We're talking about how to help people get in, you know, improve their financial lives that are kind of maybe in those areas. Right. But it isn't like how to save money on bras and tampons. It is actionable for men as well. But the way that she explained it is, in the talk that I saw her give was that, you know, there's not a lot of financial information directed towards women.

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challenges and create systems and processes that help other people achieve financial freedom and improve their lives. Is that right? This is right. I've been fortunate enough to make every single financial mistake you can possibly think of. And so as I learned to dig my way out of my own financial ditch, I have taken people with me. That's awesome. So can we start from beginning? What kind of position did you find yourself in and how did you get there? Well, first, I was fortunate enough to grow up in a household where money was talked about all the time. My father, who is at was, he's retired now, a CFO and an accountant. So he taught my four sisters and I, the basics of financial education, like how to budget, how to save, that kind of stuff. And my mom really taught us, like, the application, like,

this is how you grocery shop. This is how you negotiate. And so up until about the age of 25, 26, I was what I called financially perfect. I'd saved a lot of money. I was a schoolteacher. I'd saved a lot of money. I'd bought a condo. The car that I drove, I bought cash. It was like $5,000. And so I'd done all the right things. I had an 802 credit score. And then at 26, 27, I met an air quote's friend who was like, you should invest. And I said, okay. And he said, well, the first rule of investing is to invest with other people's money. And I didn't know what that meant. I didn't even have credit card yet, although I did have a credit card. He said, well, you should take money off of your credit card and we'll use it to invest. And I said, sure, I'm stupid. So I don't love that word.

Well, I'm foolish. And I said, you know what's even better? I'm not even going to ask my financially savvy father. This is a good idea because I'm going to surprise him with these choices I'm making all of my own. And so I did. Yay. I took the money off of. So I actually opened up an additional credit card because the one I had didn't have enough of a balance for him to steal from. And so I opened it up, took the money out. He promptly took it. But it took me a while to realize because once I opened up the second credit card, I was like, ooh, credit cards, I can use them.

And since I'm going to be rich soon with this new investment that I'm doing, I should use them. And so I did. And I quickly went from like $10 to $15,000 in credit card debt to about $35,000 in credit card debt. And then that's when everything really started to crumble because the recession hit. And here I was a school teacher thinking, you know, my job is secure and safe because teachers don't lose their jobs. But my school was nonprofit-based. And they lost their funding because corporations didn't have any money or at least not enough money to give like they used to. And so I had this debt.

I just bought a house. I lost my job. And everything just went downhill. My credit score went from a 802 to a 540. I ended up moving back home with my parents first. And then I just couldn't live with them too long because even though at the time I was 30, they still acted like I was 12. So I still had a curfew, which I thought was crazy.

And so I moved in with my sister on her couch. I told her three months, nine months later. She said, yeah, this one bedroom is not big enough for the two of us. So yeah, it was the hardest time I've had as an adult. It was from age 29 to about 32, 32, 33, when I had nothing. I actually had less money when I was 32. I'm talking about across the board because I'd taken money out of my 401k to try to save my home. I had about $125 left to my name.

I mean, anywhere, you know, and when I was 16, I had maybe $2,000 or $3,000 saved from babysitting. So I had less money at 32 than I did when I was 16. And that's when I just decided, okay, this is probably rock bottom. You know, let's climb our way out. So let's go into this real quick. You had this friend who told you to invest. This is around 26, 27. And was it all at once or did you kind of gradually lose this money over the course of a few years up to the age of 29?

What was that like? All at once. So the investment was supposed to be, we're going to take this money off of your cards. And he lived half of his time in France and half his time in the United States. And we're going to go to New York, buy goods and services. He had stores in France and chip them because, you know, people want Levi's and all these kind of like American goods and products. And I live in Newark and Newark and Newark is right next to a port, which is Elizabeth. So they have the seat port and we shipped it.

And at the time, it was stopped by customs and held. I won't say that it was a total scheme because we did buy the things. We did ship it, but it was held up by customs. And they would not relinquish it for months. And so I had all this money tied up. And he basically walked away from it because, you know, for him, it wasn't his money. And so by the time they released it, he had already walked away and it was already too late. But in that time frame, so it was probably a lot of time.

So it's probably like a few months. I started using those cards irresponsibly because I thought money was going to be coming to me soon. So now I had all of this credit card debt but no additional income to pay it down. What I love about this is that you are clearly a very smart person. You're, you know, you're very successful. You're very articulate. You're able to do all these things really well. Yet you weren't even hoodwinked.

You made a decision that you thought was based on intelligent business practices. Yet you financed it with a credit card debt with high interest debt. And because you weren't investing maybe from the strongest financial position going into this, that's why you were unable to basically recoup that money and went through this horrible struggle for the next several years. Is that right? Yes. And also, too, is because I didn't want to take responsibility for the mistake that I've made. Because the truth of the matter is when this happened, I had not lost my job yet.

And I was really good at living below my means and being frugal. And the truth is, for what I owed, not use the credit cards, I could have that. year paid them off. But the truth is that first year, I refused to acknowledge the role that I played. And I said, no, I was tricked. He lied. I'm not going to pay down this debt. I'm just going to pay the minimum because he's going to pay me back. It's his fault. It's him, not me. And so that whole year that I could have used to solve my own problem because I refused to, then the next year is the year that I lost my job. I didn't anticipate that happening. And so now, even though I said, okay, I will take responsibility and pay this debt off, I didn't have the income to do so. Since then, I have never allowed myself to not take

responsibility for the choices that I've made. That devastated me because it was like you're ready to take responsibility and now you don't have the means to. Awesome. I love it. I think that's a philosophy that sets you up for success and it turns you away from being the victim to being in control of the situation, which I think is fantastic. So you got into this hole, now you're 32. So this whole, the same is lasted from around the age of 26, 27 until all the way up through the age of 32. What happened then when you kind of adopted this new mindset? What did you do to take back control of your finances and improve your position? Well, I would say the mindset really shifted around 30 when I said, okay, I thought because I'd made financial mistakes and meant I knew nothing

about finance. And I said, that's not true, Tiffany. Like, you know, you're a good saver, you're a good budgeter. Like, that hasn't gone away because you made a bad investment. So I started showing family and friends, which I had done before, like, had a budget, had a save. And then one day my best friend said, you're really good at this, Tiffany, you should charge. And I thought, well, who would pay? You know, I'd never run a business before. And so I started asking folks, you know, would you pay $50? Would you pay $150? And here and there, people would pay. And at this time, although I had not quite lost my house yet, but I wasn't living in it. And the bank that owned my house wouldn't take my payment because I back owed. So it was good for me because I said, fine, I'm running it out.

I guess I live off this rent that the bank refuses to take for me. And so that's what I was living off of. I said, okay, it was about $1,200 a month. That's how much I was renting my condo. And my mortgage was like $1,600. So I was living off that $1,200. And I said, I think I don't want to go back to a place and a space that can be taken away for me, not because I wasn't a good teacher, but because of whatever, you know, economic crisis that the world is in.

I just didn't like the feeling of not being in control of my life. So I said I instead want to do something myself. So that way I can anticipate changes or I can anticipate, well, I can be in control of the money that I make. And so the budget needs to start growing. Everyone who knew me previously knew that I was good at budgeting. But the one-on-ones were not making enough money. And a mentor of mine told me that I should look into getting a contract.

And so I reached out to everyone that I knew. And I met a woman at the United Way in Newark. And she said, you know, we're actually looking for a financial instructor, but let me test you out. Come and teach our staff. And so I did. I did a good job. And the staff that actually missed it said, can she come back? Because we heard good things.

I came back. And then from there, they gave me a year-long contract to teach financial education in the community. And that's what I started doing. And by then, the bank had taken my house. But the contract with the United Way supplemented. So that was my income. And I did that for a while. And what year was this?

That was, I was 31, so what, I'm 38 now. I'm always the worst at like, what was that, 2011, 2012? Yeah, that sounds about right. And so it was like, okay, I think I have an almost business. You know, like I'm not making a whole lot. And that was around the year I was about 31, 32, where my sister said, you've been here nine months. You told me three months. I love you, but it's time for you to go.

And she knew I wasn't going to be. homeless because I could always move back home with my parents who gave me a 12 o'clock curfew. But I'm like, I might as well be homeless. I don't want to go back there. And plus, you know, you tell your parents like all the lies in the world. Like, oh, everything's fine. I'm doing really good. They didn't know that I was sleeping on her couch.

Oh, they didn't even know you were sleeping on your sister's couch? I mean, I did you were quote unquote roommates, you know, like, oh, that's nice. Sisters are roommates, you know, but they didn't realize like, no, I kind of just like live off of her because I don't have anybody. And so I didn't want to admit and go back home again. And so I remember a bunch of friends who were also kind of like young and broken and trying to figure out how to start their own business. One of my friends found a house in Newark and the woman was willing to rent it out by the room.

So it was about four of us. And each room was $500. And I said, and that included all utilities. And I was like, I'll take it. So it was like because Newark is a college town. And so you've got a lot of universities. And so you'll find that oftentimes that you'll find really cheap housing. And so we ended up living like college students for a year, year and a half for 500 bucks a month.

And that's where I really started to build my business. And the United Way, one of the things they tasked me with was we'll pay you to teach, but we want you to fill the classroom. So that's when I started to learn how to use social media. Like, hey, I've got this free class. Come on in using Twitter and Instagram and Facebook. Instagram wasn't out then really. But Facebook to fill the classroom, and that's how I started building my brand online, really by trying to fill my United Way class so I could be paid. Okay.

I want to go back. You just gave us a bunch of information. That's all awesome. But I want to go back and reiterate a point that I think is really, really important. You said since you realized that you were not active participant in this, like losing all this money, but you weren't like totally swindled. Like you were, you know, you participated in it. Since you've realized that and you've allowed your. yourself to take responsibility. You've never gone back and not allowed yourself to dismiss the

responsibility. And I think taking financial responsibility for whatever situation you're in is so very important to keep in mind. You know, I have a lot of friends who are perhaps have made foolish decisions with their, their money and oh, it's his debt. Or I let him use my name to get a car and then he didn't pay it or whatever. That's all fine and good. Yeah, you didn't actively participate, but you passively participate it. And it doesn't really matter that it's not your debt. It's still your debt because it's in your name. So taking financial responsibility kind of like Scott said, takes away the victim mentality.

It really focuses on the fact that this is mine. I'm going to do this. I love that. I love that so much. Every part of your story I love. Thank you. And I'll chime in here and say that it seems to extend it to other areas of your life because you took this job at United Way.

And you mentioned, hey, it's a job. contract, yet you have to develop and employ kind of entrepreneurial skills in order to make that work by filling up these classrooms, learning social media. Am I right? Was that kind of like a training ground for your entrepreneurial pursuits that later followed? Certainly because I knew that if no one came, because I think the first class, the United Way, put the word out and said, hey, we're having this free class, come and take it and five people showed up. And then the next class, maybe like three. And I thought, okay, they're not going to pay me to speak to no one. You know? And so it was that I was like, no, I have to have people. If I have to get my friends and family to sit here and

look busy, people have to be here because I can't believe I finally landed a contract. And so I asked them, I said, you know, can I, you know, I wasn't sure how open they were because the United Way had something called the IDA program. It's called the individual development account where you took the class, you saved money and then the United Way had a partner bank that matched your savings. And so I wasn't sure if people who weren't part of that program could join. And they said, sure, we don't mind. And so I got really good at marketing. This was free, you know, that you received all of these tools.

I convinced the United Way to use my book, the one week budget at the time that I'd written and self-published as the tool for the class. So I could make additional income. and so I would take a lot of pictures and really illustrate how fun and engaging the class was and how it was really shifting the minds and the money of the people in it and before we knew it it was consistently 10 people,

then 20, then 50, then 80 to the point where we couldn't have it at the United Way office anymore, we had to look for larger venues because we would have maybe 100 people. The class was a six-week course, and so for six weeks, people would come. People are still friends.

One of the women from the class just wrote she just got married to somebody she met in one of my classes. Oh, wow. So I did that for about, I don't know, maybe like 16 cohorts. So 16 of those six week courses. And so it taught me, one, how to be a better speaker. So being a teacher, you learn how to be a speaker, but I taught preschool, so it's different. So teaching preschool, you know, well, teaching preschool teaches you how to be engaging

and how to take someone from no knowledge to knowledge. But teaching at the United Way really taught me how to speak in front of an audience. and I thought this would be my business model. So my first business model was one-on-one, but that didn't work because you're limited to how many people you can help. And my second business model was one to a few. So like, okay, I'll stand in front of this classroom.

I'm physically here. And the third business model came to me accidentally. Because I kept sharing the United Way, people outside of New Jersey, because social media was growing, started saying, hey, I wish I lived in Newark or why can't you bring that to Oklahoma? And then I thought, well, why can't I bring it to them online? You know, is there a way to do that?

And so that's what I did. I took my six-week course. That six-week course, the one, I wrote it for the United Way. So it was mine to do whatever I wanted to do with it. And I took it online and I created something called the Live Richer Challenge. And it is our signature service. It's free, but it grew my audience from a few hundred to 500,000 in like three years. Your numbers are amazing.

And I am a member of the Live Richer Challenge. I'm a member of the Facebook group. And those women are rabid fans of yours. They love what you have done. They love what you've shown them. They love that it's like a no judgment zone. So they can ask questions about, hey, I'm having this problem. Oh, well, you should cut that out.

There's like 100 people that'll give them advice instantly. It's such a wonderful program. I'd like to know more about that. I know about the program. I'd like you to share with the people listening about the program. So it was my way of giving back. I didn't think of it as a way to make money. Because honestly, the first challenge was 2014.

And my goal was 10,000 women. I wanted 10,000 women to sign up with the United Way course, but online. So at the time, it was five weeks, set of six, I shortened it. And the way the challenge worked. And I said, well, how do I, my preschool teacher brain kicked on. And I said, well, how do I breadcrumb these women to success? And so I decided that the challenge was going to be a daily task sent to you. you via email. And then you would, because I'm not super techie. So I was trying to figure out,

what does this look like? You sign up for the challenge. You get a daily email. They each email sends you to a blog post fully explaining that day's task. So, you know, day one is always setting your goals. And I give you everything you need. You need a goal sheet. You can download it. You need a script. So if day three was call your credit, your debt collectors, I give you a script. I give you everything that you need during the challenge. And I was really excited. We got to 10,000. It took almost eight months to sign up 10,000 women. That was it. I thought it was going to be done. And then I decided to automate it because some women missed it because I always launch a new challenge every January. And so I automated it so they could do it throughout the year. And then

the next year they were like, well, what are we doing next year? And so I created a second version, which was a savings edition. And I shortened it to three weeks because I found that people couldn't hold on for the full 10. And the same thing, daily tasks. And the overarching thing was savings. Every day, a task to get you closer to your savings goal. And the most recent challenge from last year was the credit edition. And the one that we've launched for 2018 is the net worth edition. And so it's really exciting to see how many people over. My audience is about 500,000 large, but about 400,000 women have gone through one or more of the challenges.

And to see people go from, you know, a 403 credit score to a 700-something credit score. A woman wrote me about two years ago, and she said, I'm homeless. I'm recently homeless, but I do have a cell phone in a shelter right now. Should I do the challenge? And so I gave her some resources, but I said, yes, because the challenge is going to help you set you up for the life that you want. She wrote me late last year and said, Tiffany, I just want to know, I just wanted to thank you.

I just closed on a home. So she went from home with the homeowner. That's fantastic. And it's just, I couldn't believe it. And I said, what? And she was like, I did everything you said step by step. I raised my credit score. I did the savings edition. And so, yeah, the challenge. And I never thought about the challenge as kind of a business, but it opened up this other business model, which was that I serve my community and they get it for free, but there's affiliate programs that I can connect with. I've had people who sponsored the challenge. So that was a way to make income. And as a result of my audience growing so large, now I get spokesperson working gigs. So I did not anticipate that. I didn't even know that these things were available. But, As your community starts to grow, it really opened up different ways to expand my business model.

This is awesome. This sounds like a fantastic business that is just helping improve thousands, hundreds of thousands of lives. And it's just really cool that you've been able to build all this. I'd love to ask a quick question here. Can you talk a little bit about the specific things that these folks that are kind of maybe entering this challenge or doing that? Where are they starting from? And what are the specific things that they need to do to, you know, complete the challenge or improve their financial positions? Who's the ideal person to go through the challenge? And then what are the struggles that they deal with? Why do people drop off? Why do people fail and not able to improve their financial positions?

So I've identified three things that really hold people back. So it's knowledge, it's access, and community. So knowledge, I just don't know how. I don't know what I'm doing. And so the challenge takes that excuse away. Day one, open up your notebook or here's the goal sheet. Here's exactly how to fit. it out. Maybe there's a video. So we take away that component. So people usually come,

they come from all walks of life. I mean, we have women that make, you know, $10,000 a year to women that make, you know, $100,000 a year doing the challenge. What I find is that the overarching kind of, I guess, characteristic is they want a change. They don't like where they are. They want to be someplace different as it relates to their finances. And so knowledge. I can teach you by giving you knowledge and then access. And so sometimes there are tools that you don't even know that are out there. And so that's what I try to do. I really curate awesome tools and I share them with you through the challenge.

So that's the access that I give to this community. And then community, so knowledge access community. We have an online Facebook group. So when you do the challenge, you don't do it alone. The group has about 300,000 members as of right now. So as you're doing the challenge and you're going through and creating your budget or a savings plan or whatever that day's task is, you can go to the community at any time

and ask a question 24 hours a day and know that there are hundreds of thousands of women there who are going to support you, help you, and just make sure that you have all the resources you need to succeed. As someone who has gone through this, I don't have financial hardship right now. I'm in a different place in my life, but as somebody who's gone through this course,

just to see what it was about, this is, it's so easy. Like Tiffany gives you everything you need. Like she said before, she gives you everything you need. And the first task isn't, you know, go build a house by tomorrow. The first task is, you know, find a location or, you know, whatever the task. I think the very first task is, like, get a copy of your credit report. That was the first task when I took the Leverager Challenge. And that's not a difficult thing. Not only does she say that, she actually tells

you how to do that. So you're not looking. You're not, oh, I don't even know. Like everything. If you don't follow through with this, it's because you didn't do it. It's not. not because the information wasn't there. And the community, I didn't take advantage of all the tools that you had. Again, I'm in a different place in my life. I actually knew about a lot of those tools. But the community is amazing. It is judgment-free zone.

And they have moderators in there. If somebody comes in and is nasty, they kick them off instantly. These are women who are having problems with money in their life. It's an awful thing to talk about. Nobody talks about it. Nobody teaches you about it. So you've made a mistake. Everybody out there is bad with money.

I mean, not everybody, but like there's so many people that are in your situation, but nobody talks about it. So you don't know that your neighbor is also struggling, but you go on this website or you go on Facebook, the Facebook group, you say, hey, I'm really struggling. Here's a thousand people that'll tell you what they did. And they're actionable tips. It's not just these little, you know, oh, well, you should change. Thanks.

You know, they're really, really helpful. And they are either in the same place and can give you just a word of encouragement. I mean, sometimes that's just all you need. to get you over the edge. So I've got a question here about the knowledge and access piece. What specific knowledge are you talking about here? One of the things you said is the first step was get your copy of your credit report. Are you saying you would provide a tool or link to a tool like credit karma or something

like that? And then you would provide information that would teach people about what their credit scores like. Is that what you're talking about here? So literally the first step might be go get your credit report. And then I might explain what a credit report is. here's the link, here's the different ways that you can get it, you know, you can get it mail to you. So all the ways, so it's just that simple.

That's day one. And you're like, that's it. Then the next day might be now that you have it, here are the components we're looking at. You know, your utilization. So now I break down those components and what percentage of your credit report those components make up. And that's literally day, too, just acquiring something new. So let's just say there's a debt part of the challenge. Then I might say today's day, you just have to list everybody that you owe.

and how much you owe. And then the next day, I'm going to show you a step-by-step guide of how do I systematically pay this off and automate that process. So everything, it's handholding to the 10th power. Like I said, the preschool teacher in me is literally teaching you the way I used to teach my three and four-year-olds. Like, okay. But that's perfect.

Yes. They have the knowledge of three- and four-year-olds. They have the financial knowledge of three- and four-year-olds because nobody's ever taught them before. If you've not been taught, how do you know? Exactly. And then on top of that, like I said, you've got this wonderful community that you can lean into. And we've given ourselves a fun name, dream catchers.

And so I will literally be at the airport somewhere and a woman will say, but Janice, I'm a dream catcher. You know? Or I remember one of my, a woman who was scared to call the IRS because she's a dream catcher. She was in the group and saying I'm scared to call the IRS because I know I owe taxes. But today, Tiffany's task was to call your debt collectors. And she gave us a script about what to say. And even like if they say this, then you say this. And if they say this, I give you everything.

And so she called the IRS. She was speaking to the agent and she told her, I'm only calling because my friends and my dream catcher group. And the agent said, wait a minute. Are you a dream catcher out of the budget? She was too. And all of a sudden, it was like, oh, a sign of, you know, so you just never know.

And that's what I want. I want to take away this fear and this taboo when it comes to money that you don't have to be financially perfect. to be financially viable as it relates to where you are and where you want to be, that it's okay to make mistakes, but here are the solutions to make your life better. Yes, and every task is doable. It's doable in one day. And I want to say they're not overwhelming.

If I was in super debt and had to list out everybody that I owed, I think that concept would be super overwhelming to actually see it all written out. But the task is easily done. And every single task is the same thing. It's easy and it builds on the day before. So if you miss the day before, go back to your email, read it, do it, and then catch up. Because they sit in your email. You could just do it whenever you feel like it.

You just, it's important to do it. You know, it's important to keep up because it's easy to get like too far behind. But even if you get too far behind, you can still catch up. It's not like, I mean, you're not giving them these overwhelming tasks. Exactly. I have a lot of people who are like, they'll write me or they'll say, you know what? I'm actually going to stop the emails. I'm on day 10.

I'm just not in a good space. And then six months later, restart it up again. We always encourage that, like, you should do it. It's an accountability partner. Someone that's going to that. So we even create a space in the group where you can find your one partner in the dream catcher group to say, okay, this is Maria from Florida and I'm Tiffany from Jersey. But every day, we text each other and say, did you do today's task and keep up with each other?

That idea of accountability has grown so much. that they started Splinter Group. So now we have official dream catcher chapters where they take what we do online and they meet offline quarterly or sometimes as much as monthly. Like the New York chapter is rock and around. They have a few hundred members and they meet every single month. They go bowling together. They do like, you know, parties together. But then they also meet every month to go over their finances together. So it's really become a movement. It's more than money. It's a movement. And it's a safe place to discuss your finances. That's just, I think, I can't impress upon you enough.

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All eight episodes now streaming, only on Disney Plus. Do you have like a specific person that you think about, like, wow, this person really came in with a lot of debt to bad position and look where they are now? Do you have like anyone that comes to mind when with that, like a case study maybe? Well, of course, the woman that went from a homeless to homeowner, but just some simple ones. I remember a woman, she had never gone on vacation, and she did the savings edition, and her daughter graduated high school that year. And she was decided that she had enough to pay for her and her daughter to go on vacation as a present for graduating. And she paid for it up front. And she said, Tiffany, I never thought I would like see the inside of a plane, let alone to pay for it and to take my daughter.

And so I thought that was beautiful. another woman, she was like 35, she said, since I've been an adult, 21 years old, paying my bills, I have never paid all of my bills on time, ever. She's like, it seems like such a small accomplishment, but all of my bills are paid on time. And not having bill collectors calling you, not having that like guilt that, oh, I need,

I still have to write a check. And that's so freeing. Exactly. A woman actually just wrote today, Camille, she was sharing in the group how she had cancer and survived it. And she was like, it wasn't the cancer that almost took her out. It was the financial repercussions as a result of the cancer.

And that she, that her employer forced her to Social Security disability. And she just had such a hard way to go. And she said that she tried to come across resources and she wasn't able to find something that was going to help her. And she said, but the way that I create the resources, the challenges that, one, they're free. But two, what they do is they allow you to help yourself at your own pace. And she said, I took the challenges. and I was slowly able to, at my own pace, rebuild my financial life. And she's like, I don't have a big bank account.

I don't have a big investment account. And she doesn't have a super high credit score. I'm literally reading right now. She said, I'm not in a race with anyone. I'm in a race with me. Where I am today is better than where I was yesterday. I'm blessed to be in this group. And so that's the overwhelming feeling in this group is that I did it.

I could do it. I could do it because all I had to do is read, write, add, subtract, in that I didn't have to wait for someone to pull me one way or the other. And it's really important to me that the women in the group feel like that they can do it as long as they have the knowledge, the access, on the community. Absolutely. That is the best thing about these courses is that you give them everything. I'm such a big fan of yours, Tiffany.

I love this actual challenge and all the challenges. Like I saw Tiffany speak at this conference that I go to every year called FinCon. And you were like halfway through your speech. And I grabbed my phone and I started texting the guy who runs the conference, PT. And I said, you have to have her as a keynote speaker. I've never learned more than I learned here. And I already know everything about finance. Like your story is so amazing on so many different levels.

I have a question, though, about the past challenges. Because the one that I participated in was, I think 2015 or 2016. Can you go back and take some of the other challenges? Like take the original one, take the same. savings one. Yep, you can. It's planned that way too. So it's great. If you go to live richerchallenge.com and click sign up, literally they're all listed. So you can take the current net worth edition there. You can take the credit challenge. You can take the savings edition or the fundamentals. The fundamentals when someone says, I'm not really sure. I'm just a financial mess.

I tell them, start with the first one because it kind of touches on all of them the basic financial kind of friction points. So debt, credit, budget, savings, mindset, a little bit of investing and insurance. But if you know savings is my issue, take the savings edition or take all of them, not at the same time, or you'll be overwhelmed. But yes, one at a time. They're always free and they always will be free. And I'm excited that I'm trying to figure out what the 2019 challenge will be. You've covered a lot of stuff. The investment challenge. I was thinking now, or maybe even the small business challenge or something like that. I don't know. Definitely, I want to progress forward. Like we started with fundamentals, then a little savings, then credit, and now network.

it's really progressing forward. Yes, that investment, then small business. You got the next two years. Yeah. So about that, you know, you talk about these things, but who is your target? Who is your kind of the typical person that would enroll in this? Is it someone that's in debt? Is, you know, what does that person look like?

Who are they? So my target is women, honestly. So I am one of five girls, and each one of my sisters kind of represents the type of woman that I'm thinking of my sister. Lisa, the baby is a millennial. And so I'm definitely coming after like millennials to start strong, you know, as they enter into financial adulthood. My older sister is a couple years older than me and she and her husband are really established. She's a scientist.

He's a doctor. They make great money. But she is loving the net worth addition because it doesn't speak to. I mean, it talks about debt somewhat, but not really. It's really more about growing wealth. So it's not necessarily a woman that's making a certain amount of money. It's just a woman that is tired of where she is financially, and she can find her space. So if you're a beginner and you don't even know how to budget, you start with the fundamentals.

But if you're someone who is maybe in your 30s and you want to buy a house, you do the credit edition. Would you say that perhaps your site targets women that maybe have less than $100,000 in investable liquidity, for example? So you're not targeting billionaires. Is that correct? Yeah, I would say that. I mean, the truth of the matter, I thought was, so every challenge, one of the things we do is I do a big registration survey. So you sign up and you get the survey. And I asked basically how much do you make? And I was actually

surprised to see for the net worth edition, about 15% of our audience for the net worth edition made over $70,000 a year. Oh, wow. And so, because what I'm finding is that I guess depending on which challenge it is, so I found with the savings edition, they made significantly less. So it depends on the subject matter. So, you know, we're finding that the net worth edition is really bringing out women with who have the money, they just want to figure out, well, how do I build upon this and really start to grow wealth? Awesome. I love it.

And how are you advertising? Are you still on the social media and are you still connected with the United Way? Is it just word of mouth? 500,000 people is a lot. Yeah. So honestly, we've gotten really good at social media advertising. And so the first 10,000, I didn't know what an ad was. That was just word of mouth and me posting organically on social media.

And the last two years, I said, oh, wait, so you can do an ad on Facebook. So once I learned that, I'm really good at writing ad copy and really just engaging people. And so I write a good copy. I make a good video or maybe a really great picture. And then I invite people to the challenge. I'll give you an example. I just did an ad. It wasn't even going to be, but it was my husband and I recently got married.

And we decided that we weren't going to buy each other Christmas gifts because we're buying a home. we're closing really soon and we decided instead because we're purchasing the home cash. It's a foreclosure. Because honestly, I'm not really one for stuff. Not really. And so he said, well, let's not exchange gifts. Let's just put the money toward the house because I want to put a new kitchen and a new bathroom.

So as I was typing it up and I said, you know what? I was just using it as an example because I like to use my life as a teachable moment. And I thought this will be a great space to say, hey, if you want to learn how to increase your net worth, join the net worth challenge. And it exploded. And so it did really well. And I put some ad money behind it. And I think we signed up in like a few days, an additional 10,000 people as a result of that.

Yeah. So authentic ads are everything. You know, so what's really happening? Because people can sense the truth in you because they sense the truth in themselves. And so all of my ads always ring from a place of this is what's actually happening. If you'd like for this to happen for you too, here's a resource. Okay. Now, doesn't it mean since you didn't buy your husband a Christmas gift, does that mean that you don't love him anymore? I get so frustrated with these people. They're like, oh, look at all the things I got. Well, yeah, but you're $1,000 million in debt. I love that you didn't buy a gift because you want to buy a house. That's the better gift.

And also, too, I feel like there's no shame. Some people who are angry, like, oh, you're shaming me because I bought a gift. I'm like, I don't even know you. So I'm not shaming. I have a bonus daughter. He has an 11-year-old. Guess what? She got. Christmas gifts. It's not like no one in our, you know, our network received any gifts. We just decided it doesn't make sense for me to buy you another sweater and some perfume. I mean, I honestly want a really nice kitchen, you know? And so I don't want to skip on that. So it's an extra $300. I much rather put it toward a really beautiful kitchen. And so it's not a sense of judgment. This is the thing I say, that your money should be aligned with your values. If you pull up your debit card statement, your bank statement, do you recognize that person? Are you like, who's this? So that's all that matters. If you look at and you pull up your debit and your credit card

statement and that person is familiar to you because you love to read and you see Amazon all in your statement and you love to travel and you see flights, well, then you are in alignment. But a lot of people are not. They look at their statement. They say, who's Wendy's? You know? So that's the key is that I'm not here to tell you how to live your life. I just want you to be in alignment what you actually say you want. Yes, yes, perfect. I do want to give a shameless plug to biggerpockets.com. If you do have any questions about buying a foreclosure, please don't hesitate to ask.

If I don't know the answer, I know a lot of people who do. And if you're looking into investing in real estate, biggerpockets.com can help you along the way. I just want to, you know, we're getting ready to move on to our famous floor, but I just want to comment that it is fantastic what you're doing here. You're helping people, you know, you're targeting people that maybe had some financial difficulties. and they're growing, they're succeeding, they're building wealth, they're improving their credit scores, they're able to begin accumulating wealth. And now the transition begins to looking at that net worth and how do I increase that and maybe go on to buy a home and then achieve down the line

financial freedom. And I think that's what all this is about. And the people you're helping are sometimes overlooked and it's just so powerful what you're doing. And it's such a great place, a great resource for people that are in those positions to begin their journey. Yeah. Tiffany's program gives you. Tiffany's program gives you. the steps you need to take action when you don't even know where to start. I always knew that I wanted to be a teacher. You know, when you're a little girl, everybody wants to be a teacher, but I knew. And because I want my legacy to be that people are better as a result of me being here.

They are. Awesome. Awesome. Well, with that, let's move on to our famous four. These are the same four questions that we ask every guest comes on to this podcast. And, Dumbin, do you want to handle the first question here? I will. What is your favorite?

finance book, Tiffany? My favorite finance book is actually David Box, the automatic millionaire. He is like my financial crush if I had to have one. When he funded me on Facebook, I almost died. And I was so mad I missed him at FinCon. I was just going to say he was at FinCon this year. Yes, I love him. That's okay. We're Facebook friends. So, hey, David. What's the key takeaway from that book? The key takeaway is that you can actually become a millionaire. That was the biggest, like, and there's an automated process. I'm a process this person. So I was really surprised.

I read it when I was maybe like 20, 21. And I was like, wow, I don't have to like make, you know, $200,000 a year to achieve millionaire status that there is a systematic way if I set aside, spend less than I make, set aside some, save some and invest some, I can be a millionaire. So that was a big takeaway that it's possible. Awesome. Nice, nice. Question number two here is what was your biggest money mistake?

well, you already know, my biggest money mistake was trusting my air quote's friend. And, well, you know what? No, I would say this. My biggest money mistake was not doing my due diligence because, you know, no one can trick you if you are knowledgeable. And so I always say now a wealthy investor is a knowledgeable investor. So it was making an investment decision based upon just emotions and not knowledge and not work on my end. Awesome. Awesome.

What is your best piece of advice for people who are just starting out? To start. Everyone always has an excuse. So, you know, you meet those people. And you're like, well, you know, you have to spend less than you make. Well, I can't because. Well, you know, you have to invest them. Well, I can't because.

And what they're looking for you to do is pull out like the magic wand from your back pocket and make it all go away. And there is no magic wand, right? I'm sorry to tell you. But, you know, it's like the bad news is it's you. You know, but the good news is it's you. you because if it's you, you have choices. And if you make different choices now, you start something small, simple and soon, then the life that you live later will be significantly different.

So just start. You don't have to know all of the steps. Just start with the next best step. It might be clicking a website link. It might be signing up for the Liverture Challenge. It might be going to better pockets, bigger pockets, you know, so just start. Awesome. I love it. Now, this is the toughest financial question of the famous for. What is your favorite joke to tell at parties? Uh, I always think I'm funnier than I am because I'm always the one laughing. Um, let's see. I don't know that I have a favorite joke.

Like, I'm more of a storyteller. Oh, oh. Honestly, I don't, I don't, I'm sorry, I don't have a favorite joke. I more so tell funny stories about, you know, something that's happened to me. But typically not as funny as I think. So maybe the joke's on me. All right. Well, then I'll fill in with one. This is the best one I've heard ever.

You're going to love it, Tiffany. A termite walks into a bar and he says, where is the bar tender? Ugh. Dude, that's it. That's like the whole. That's it. That's all I got. Wait, but I get it.

I get it. That's not a joke I'll be sharing, but that's a great one. That's a good one. That's an awful one. Don't encourage him, Tiffany. Okay, Tiffany, where can people find out more about you and the Livered your challenge? So the good thing is, is that, and this is for any business person out there, really try to secure your name the same way, every place.

I am the budgetista. So the budgetneista.com and the budgetneesda on Snapchat, Instagram, Twitter, every single social media platform you can think of. It's just the word budget. and Nista altogether, the budget Nista. And if you want to sign up for any of the challenges, just go to LiveRichorchallenge.com and they're all listed there. Yeah, that's where you can find me.

Okay. That's the budget Nista and Nista is spelled N-I-S-T-A. Correct. Yes, and we'll put links in the show notes to this show at biggerpockets.com slash money show eight. So all of these links will be ready. All you have to do is click them. Awesome.

Tiffany, thank you. So much for your time today. I know you're really busy jetting all over the world, spreading your message of frugality and financial betterness. I really appreciate your time today. Thank you. No, thank you for having it. It's always awesome to be able to share with folks. And, you know, I'm always blessed when someone's like, hey, we'd like you to share some more. And so because, like I said, this is my purpose and my passion is to help women live better lives and to leave this world better than I met it. Well, you have. Well, thank you so much. I love what you're doing. I'm so grateful for what you're doing and I'm so grateful that you took the time today to talk to us

about what you're doing. Thank you. Okay, we'll see you later. All right. Bye-bye. Bye. Okay, that was Tiffany Aliche, the Budget Nista, the founder of the Live Richer Challenge. I am so excited, just talking to her always makes me feel better. Scott, what did you learn from the show? I just learned a tremendous amount. It was fantastic to hear her take on the things that people need in order to get out of these situations. You know, I think she had three things. She had knowledge. She had access and she had community.

And those three concepts really resonated with me because I've seen that, those concepts maybe worded differently, but those three areas, those are the things that people need when they're struggling with finance. They need to know the basic correct sources of action. They need to know who to call and what resources to use. And then, of course, they need that support from the community. They need the encouragement. And then, you know, one thing that the Leverichichick,

challenge community seems to give is advice and perspective, you know, which may be at odds. There's a lot of areas in finance where you're going to have intelligent debate. And that community aspect can really bring that in where you can get good intelligent perspectives that are maybe different from various people that are going through the same things that you're going through. Yes. And I think it's really important to point out a couple of things. First of all, the community of the Live Richer Challenge group is very non-judgmental.

there's a lot of shame involved in having financial issues, which is funny because everybody has financial issues. I mean, not everybody, but a lot of people, most people in your life, even if you don't know it, they're struggling in some aspect of their finances. And this is a safe place where you can go. It's a closed group. So not all of your friends are going to see this unless they're in the group, but it's a closed group where you can say, hey, I'm having a problem. I need help. I need just encouragement even. I'm so distraught. I don't know what to do. And there's 97 people that'll come in and give you some support. So yeah, I hope I didn't fan girl too much over Tiffany because I think she's amazing. The other thing I want to point out is that she went out and did this. She didn't just sit around

and wait for something to happen. She didn't sit around and wait for somebody to call her up and say, hey, do you want to teach 500,000 people how to be better with their money? She went out and made it happen. And if you want to make changes in your finances, you have to go out and make it happen. And if you want to make changes in the world, you've got to go out and make it happen. You know, use that as inspiration not only for your personal finances, but also think about how much good she's done for people's lives. And how can you leverage the improvement in your financial position to help other people as well? I think that's a really important takeaway as well. That's a great point, Scott. Great point.

Now, on a later note, Mindy, what's going on in your personal life? Any updates? Your daughter had won an award recently. Is that right? Today's kind of a crazy day. At 8 o'clock in the morning, my youngest daughter won the Citizenship Award. for exemplary behavior at school. And I am going to wrap this up in a minute so I can go see my older daughter make the honor roll

for the first semester of fifth grade. So I'm having a good day. And talking to Tiffany just made it better. Oh, hey, what's today? We're recording this in January on the day that my new book was released. How to sell your home. I totally forgot about that.

So if you are looking to for information on how to sell a house, you're getting ready to move. While Bigger Pockets is an investment real estate site, the book has tips for selling a rental property as well as selling a residence, primary residence, and moving on and moving out. And if you've never sold a house before, you've no idea what you're doing. And that's okay. That doesn't make you a bad person.

But you can make a lot of mistakes and cost yourself a lot of money if you don't do it right. So my book is the book that will give you the steps that you're really. estate agent may not tell you. They might have forgotten. They might have just thought you knew it. It's everything you need to know to sell your house for the most profit and the most just free sale. Wow, what a plug. I'm going to give you an A plus for that plug, an A plus for the content in the book and just comment that there seems to be a lot of A pluses going around in Mindy's family today and the Jensen family. The Jensen family is an A plus family. Wow, that's kind of snotty.

But yeah, you know what? Today's a good day. Awesome. Well, thanks. Scott. Should we wrap this up? Let's wrap it up, Minnie. Okay. For episode eight of the Bigger Pockets Money podcast, this is Mindy Jensen, over and out.