BILFPOD - One Mistake That’s Costing You Every Career Opportunity – Laura Camacho

Episode Date: November 13, 2025

BILFPod x Laura CamachoLaura Camacho isn’t just a communication coach—she’s a leadership expert, author, and voice strategist helping professionals turn their words into influence. From coaching Fortune 500 executives to guiding ambitious women toward stronger leadership, Laura’s mission is simple: empower people to speak with confidence, clarity, and courage. 🎙✨Her story is about finding your voice, owning your power, and communicating with intention—even in the toughest rooms. In this episode, Laura shares how mastering communication can open doors, build authority, and transform your career from the inside out.In this episode:• How to speak with confidence and authority• Building leadership through effective communication• Overcoming imposter syndrome with your voice• The art of storytelling that inspires action• Turning your message into your greatest professional assetThis episode is a must-listen for anyone ready to lead, influence, and make their message matter. Because real power starts when you find your voice — and use it.🎧 Catch the full episode now—streaming on all platforms.Get Connected:Follow Laura Camacho → @speakupwithlauraFollow Mara Dorne → @maradorneFollow the Podcast → @bilfpod#BILFPod #BossIdLikeToFollow #LauraCamacho #WomenInLeadership #CommunicationCoach #PublicSpeaking #LeadershipPodcast #ConfidenceCoach #PurposeToProfit #EntrepreneurMindset #BILFCommunity #UnfilteredSuccess #CareerGrowth #SpeakWithImpact #leadwithconfidence

I love to follow a boss who has a vision that's even bigger than what I have for myself or for the company. I find that so inspiring when somebody can see the possibilities. And that's what I look for. A boss who can see that what I think is not feasible or maybe I'm thinking, oh, I don't even know if we can do that. But the boss says, yeah, we can. That to me is like, I will follow them. Welcome back to the BILF pod. We're Authenticity Trump's Authority.

Now, my name is Marr Dorn. If you are tuning in for the very first time, and I have a very special guest today. Her name is Laura Camacho. But first, before we even get started, I have to ask you, do you know what a BILF is? Is the leader I'd like to follow? A boss I'd like to follow.

Oh, very close, though. Close though. Very close. Well, welcome to the Bilton. Thanks for coming out. Drove all the way from South Carolina. Yes, from Charleston. It is such a delight to be here and to be on your beautiful studio.

I'm really honored. I am so excited. Now, you have many accolades. You're the founder of Mixonian Institute, right? Helping where you help executives master communication and presence. Yes. Which is very interesting because we spoke a little bit about your background. You're a former university professor, which is really exciting.

And executive coached to leaders at Lego, Nestle, Comcast, ABI, in much, much more. Yes. So what an extensive background. You also have your own podcast, where you're the host of Speak Up with Laura Camacho, and you have a beautiful book that you've written, so you're an author on top of all of these amazing accolades.

What can I say? Is there anything you don't do? I don't, so. There's a lot of things I don't do, but I do like to keep busy, and I always have. And over the years, it accumulates. Well, kudos to you. I love that.

Thank you. Thank you. You. All that you are doing and you've done. So let's just dive. Are you ready? You're ready? You look like you're ready. I know you have your own pot, so you can probably do better than me. So let's talk. So now you lived in, I found out you lived in Venezuela. Yeah, I lived in Venezuela 10 years, and Germany and Spain. So that, you know, when you live and move to a country where you speak the language, but you're not from there, you get, you learn a different aspect of communication. And I remember my first day in Spain, walking in. to this bar, which I haven't been to Spain lately, but back in the day, a bar was the same as a coffee shop and just asking for a glass of water. They didn't understand what I was saying. And, you know, it's because I was missing, like, you know, saying buenos tardes or Buenos Aires. You know, the Latin culture has some niceties that we sometimes, or especially me, younger

me, would just like get to the point. And that doesn't always fly. Yeah. Well, now do you speak fluent Spanish? I do. I do speak fluent Spanish, some French and German, Latin. I've always been fascinated with languages, yes. Nice. So let's talk about how does one get into your profession? Like did you know that you were going to, did you know like what you were going to do in life? Did you kind of have a trajectory? Well, at my ninth birthday party, the theme was to come dressed as what you want to be when you grow up. And I wanted to be an international business woman, but I didn't know how to. to portray that as a nine-year-old. So I wore, you know, like one of my mom's cocktail dresses or something and nobody knew, like, you know, it wasn't like a princess and it wasn't like a cowgirl and it wasn't a cheerleader. But my, I was so blessed, you know, a lot of times family members have an impact on our lives. And my mom's mom had a very hard life. She was widowed at age

28 with three children, no college degree. Well, she ended up putting herself through college and became a teacher. And to make some extra money, she worked with Stanley Home products selling, I think, cleaning products. And she became really good friends with two women in Texas named Mary. They're both named Mary. And they both started multi-million dollar companies. This is in the 50s ladies and gentlemen back when supposedly women didn't do that, right? And one was Mary Crowley who started a home interiors business and the other was Mary Kay Ash who started the makeup company. So I didn't have any ideas exactly what I wanted to do and I wasn't thinking, oh, nobody's going to let me do what I want to do. That never crossed my mind. That was not part

of my world. It was how do I become this international business woman? And I wanted to have a family, which I do have and, you know, how to merge that. And without, you know, my dad was a dentist, my mom, a homemaker. Like, I didn't know, like, how to do it, but I knew what I wanted to do. So you go to college and your degree is in business. And economics and Spanish and French. Like, I am, communication is not on my radar. Like that in my mind, young Laura, like, that's for lame people.

That's for, you know, people that are not. not as smart. Smart people, they study things like economics. And it turns out that there's different kinds of intelligence. And just being able to do well on a test doesn't mean you're going to do well in a business. Yeah, and now you told me that you're actually an introvert, which I find really ironic because you're very friendly.

As soon as I walked in the room, you're very, very energetic. You can feel your energy. So I guess my first question I'll start with is, can an introvert become an extrovert? We can, but what you want to do is it's the energy, Mara. It's the energy. It takes, like, I am having so much fun, and this is going to be great, and I am, like, have my energy on.

But when it's over at the end of this day, when I'm driving back to Charleston, I will be in silence, and I will be tired because it takes, I get energy. I mean, there may be some from being with other. people, but I really need to recharge, whereas a flaming extrovert is the kind of person that always wants to be with people who gets energized by speaking with people. So it's the difference. But there's so many misperceptions about introverts that we, you know, don't like people or we're snobs or we think we're better than or we don't want to. So I have found this, there's just different ways, being strategic about your energy, when to like turn it up,

when to reach out to people. And I teach my clients how to maximize the conversations they're already having. So they don't have to have like lots more conversations. Like an extra might be like, oh, I'll just go talk to more people, right? And an introvert's like, no, that's too much. But, you know, does add more value to the meetings and the conversations you're already having? That's my philosophy. So now I know you work with pretty high profile companies.

Like you work with Nestle, you've worked with, Lego, you've worked with Apple. Comcast, a ton of them. So what would you say, what did top leaders tend to go wrong about communication? Oh, wow. Well, first of all, is getting to the top leadership is that what I work with

people who deliver incredible results at their company, like they are like the A plus students. If you were to use the classroom analogy, they get things done. And their immediate teams like adore them. But the thing is, because

they're so focused on the results, they don't carry other people with them on their vision and they fail to state their vision. And they think in terms of, you know, solving day-to-day problems or shorter-term problems and not what the top leader needs to do is set the direction for the company. Like, this is who we serve. This is where we're going. And I want all of you to come with me. That's the piece that a lot of times, introverts, because they've been incentivized since pre-K, be a good kid, behave yourself, turn in those good results, and you get like that habit in your mind. Yeah, that's really interesting because I also lead a team.

So for like one of the big, I would say I'm a very good communicator. Yeah. I would say that I'm very clear. So you would say that the goal, if you have a goal, which most people have goals, the goal has to be clear. Yes. It has to be clearly stated. Right.

It has to be spoken. Would you, and I'm asking you, I guess, if you would agree, because this is what I teach. And you're really the expert. I'm not. So I would say that the goal always has to be clear. Very, very clear. It has to be consistently spoken about. Yes.

It can't just be stated once because you know most people don't hear things once. So I always laugh. I'm like, I'm so annoying because I'm in chats with all of my team. And I know they get annoyed with me. But I also know that if I don't clearly state the goal, continuously daily, sometimes three to four times a day, then the goal's not going to happen. Right, because people are distracted and there's fires to put out and things happen. You're absolutely right. And that, a clearly stated goal is what motivates a high performer.

Telling them exactly how to do their job is not. No, that's not going to work. And then I would also say, correct me if I'm wrong, that the goal, that whatever you want to happen, so for instance, like in my business, I would want higher sales. Let's just say higher sales, right? you got to speak about it all the time. Whatever the focus is, if it's culture, then you have to talk about the culture all the time.

If it's about recruiting, then the recruiting, whatever's at the forefront of what you're trying to accomplish, would you agree that you have to speak about it consistently, constantly, and clearly? Absolutely. Yeah, alliteration, look at you. And so true. And so an introvert can fall into the trap of thinking,

well, I already said it, and they're smart. so I shouldn't have to say it seven times, but you do. You have to repeat it. Minimum seven times, I would say. Yes, minimum, right? Yes, exactly. But the research is that we don't even hear something until we've heard it seven times. So you have to repeat it until you're just sick of it.

And I think it sounds like you've got it on autopilot in a way that you know they have to hear it again because of the distractions and the nature of work, right? We have to get back to because everybody has to do that, right? get back on track. Yeah, and I think people constantly with everything in the world today, and there are so many distractions, you have to consistently and constantly and clearly state what you're trying to do, otherwise the mission won't be accomplished. Exactly.

Sorry. Yeah, I was going to say one more thing that a mistake that top leaders make, that's kind of the opposite of that is just rambling too much. Yeah. And that's going to keep you out of the top, top leaders. because people lose attention, takes you too long to land a plane. And so learning to speak up to sell the value of what you're about to say. I call it, sell it before you tell it.

And then speaking with structure are things that top communicators do like you just did with your three Cs. Yeah, I just made that up on the top of my head. Yeah, but it comes, it came to you because you're a skilled communicator. Yeah. What would you say, you know, there's two types of people. people, right? There's followers and their leaders. So what would you say would define a true leader versus somebody that wants to follow? Oh, that's such a good question. I think a leader is the person

who's setting the vision who sees the bigger picture. And that is, you know, like, it's a great differentiator. And that's what sometimes high performing introverts miss out is the bigger picture. they're, it's like I tell them is imagine you're in a helicopter and, you know, your helicopter's on the ground and you're seeing everything in detail. But the higher up, the org chart you are, your helicopter has to go up higher so that you see how the pieces fit together and how what you're doing in sales and needs to be backed up by marketing, needs to be backed up by other parts of the company. And that's, that's hard for some people. Yeah. And I think people sometimes, I think they use follower as a negative connotation, but I think you have to have leaders and there

can't be too many chiefs, right? Right. They just can't be. Right. So if you're a follower, I don't think that that's a negative. That's just your, that's just the role that you play, which is vital in a lot of organizations. Exactly. Plus, I mean, work is not all there is to life, you know?

Like we, we work and work is where we are transformed. It's where we develop ourselves. But we also have a life outside of work and maybe by being a full. follower, you're able to be a better captain or coach, say, for a child's soccer team or have more energy for something besides work. Can a follower become a leader? If he or she wants to, absolutely. But sometimes it's a heavy, it's like the price do you want to pay it? Because what your recipe for success that's brought you to be this successful follower, you know, paying attention into the details, thinking ahead, focusing on whatever the problem is that you solve and getting

it done. Now you need to think and talk about where are we going as a company. I need to win over this CFO who I don't really like and he or she seems annoying and do I want to invest the time and energy to win them over and to win over, say somebody in HR because I need all the leaders in the company to be aligned with my vision. And it's just, just it's a different thing to do right it doesn't yeah it's not negative it's not no it's just the position that you that you pay right you that you uh play another question for you do you think that people are born natural because they there's the term natural born leaders do you think that that is an accurate term i think in in a way yes it's like some people are born with perfect pitch

my my husband's a musician and some people learn to sing well And it's harder. And just like with any skill, some people are probably born surfers and gymnast and tennis players. And so, yes, you can be like the kind, you have that model. Maybe one of your parents is an amazing leader. If you're the first born of your siblings, you're going to be a little bit more of a leader than the one who's the born last. So there's different factors at play.

But you can definitely have more facilities. towards leadership. But if you want to become a leader, if you have that vision that you want to bring to people, to share with people, you will become a leader. Yeah, that's, it's very interesting what you're saying, because I think that people are born, natural born leaders. In Jewish, we say you have chutzpah. Like, it's just something, it's just something you're born with. Like, you know, like usually when I'm in a room, I can cast a good leader. I can tell you who's going to be a good leader just from the way that they their chutzpah is you know what they talk the way they walk the way they carry themselves not to say that you can't go into being but i think a natural born leader is

completely different from a leader okay so let me ask you a question about chutzpah so is that is that related would you say it's similar to um ability to take on risk because that the the the fear of looking stupid or looking silly or looking incompetent holds back some high performers from having the hutspah so does that so if you have that does that mean like you you've overcome that fear or that's a good question i think it's a trait that you're i think you're just born with it right it's just a trait that you see but i think that that fear of what other people think i think that comes with age as you get older because I feel like I have the chutzpah but I was always worried about what other people were thinking so it wasn't until I became seasoned yes that I stopped caring and started to just come

into myself so I think it's part of it but I don't think it's natural or brought out right away I think that definitely has to do with like an age some people don't care I do think some people really just don't care um for me personally it just came with a little bit of age and coaching in life experience Yeah, that's interesting. I want you to know that I went, my late mother put me in a Jewish kindergarten, and I must have learned hutspah there. You learned chutzpah. All the Jewish kids are giving you the chutzpah. And I got specially recognized at the graduation.

That was like my highlight academic year. So maybe that's where I learned my hutzpah. Now you can go to all the Jewish dinners. You're like the token non-Jew that can come. Yeah. But that's probably where you got it, which is so funny. So you lead a top podcast right now. Now, let's talk about some of the most rewarding conversations you've had and some things that you've learned through key communicators.

Oh, my gosh. I have learned so much. And it is such a thrill to get to talk to brilliant people. And like for a good introvert, we get to skip all the small talk and just go straight to it. Straight to it. And I want to mention that my podcast started in a long time. ago in the Bronze Age of podcasting. That was 2018.

Oh, for a while. Yes. And I was reading my blog post into an AirPods, recording on Zoom at the time or SoundCloud. So it had very humble beginnings. And then it really, then I started interviewing my friends. And then I somehow hit the algorithms and all the PR people that, represent business writers and consultants and communication people somehow discovered me. And so that just opened up this entire new world. And I have gotten to talk to people about

communication. I've learned like it's just these little tricks, right? These little things like connect before content was something I learned recently. Just the way they stated that. Connect before content. And that's such a, you know, is that obvious? Maybe to someone like you or to some people, but it is not always obvious. But I had a guy who was CTO and maybe CEO also of different startups. And he laid out for my audience, if you want to move up, this is what you need to do. You need to solve bigger problems than what you need to get out of your lane. You need to, you know, look for this.

You need to talk to these people. This is how you're going to do it. And I was like, wow. I mean, like, so anybody listening got the blueprint, the inside intel that you don't learn in business school. I went to business school. They teach you a lot of valuable content, but you do not get like the 2025 version. This is what you need to do. And people, you know, more creative.

Fred Dust, I remember was one of the early people. He was with Edeo, that creative, is a firm that teaches creative. design and he had been with them and he had such a uh he talked about how the ambiance where you have communication is so important and just like this beautiful studio it the um atmosphere where communication takes place see that's something that introverts can nail because we're analytical overthinkers and that's something we can control so just making your office more attractive or the meeting room adding natural light is the way of you having more control over the conversation without having to say anything.

So I've learned things like that. I remember this woman who was a previous C something C Suite at Microsoft, and she talked about how you can be nice and firm, nice and hold people accountable. A lot of people think it's one or the other. No, no, no. You need to be nice and friendly and kind. But you also need to hold people's, you know, you need to hold them accountable. Yeah, absolutely.

Is that both and, not either or? Yeah, I love that. That's just a sample. There's so many, but they're always like little details that you learn, like you learn from a master that you, that even if you read 100 books, you wouldn't pick that up. Yeah, I think it comes with experience. And I'll tell you, sales is definitely a school of hard knocks. You learn a lot. And believe it or not, you know, I have to attribute a lot of.

my understanding of communication and skill through my ex-husband. He taught me a lot about connecting with people, understanding people, even nonverbal communication. Like you were saying, nonverbal communication is communication. Yes, it is. Yes. You know, the way people look, the way they carry themselves, looking at somebody's shoes tells a lot their watch, the way they wear their hair, you can tell by body language. And oddly enough, I don't know if you know.

I'm a criminal justice major, too. No, I didn't know that. Is that crazy? I know, it's so crazy. I am. a master's degree and an undergrad in it. So body language tells a lot about people in their communication, whether it's nonverbal. So what do you look at when you're like first meeting a person?

What do you first notice body language was? Body language, I can see if they're open or not by the way their hands are. So typically if like their hands are crossed and you can kind of tell that they're, you know, that they're not as interested or outgoing or forthcoming. They don't, something is nervous. I can tell usually by somebody's shoes or belts. Like you can tell a lot by that. You know, I know it sounds so superficial, but there's just so many different ways.

You can tell, like, there was, I don't remember now, but I know if your eyes look left, you can tell if somebody's kind of lying or right. You can tell just by people's demeanor overall what's going on with them without even having a whole conversation. So, you can tell. People hold strong presence. You know, when people walk in the room, you can tell right away if somebody is a strong, fierce presence or not. Right.

Which I'm sure you know. Well, you know, I've interviewed body language experts. And, of course, I always want to pull out their wisdom for my audience, but for me, too. And what I learned is that your posture is the number one bankable body language thing that's, for heaven, say, sit up straight. Yeah. Maybe I should sit up straight. I know.

Now you're getting me nervous. I'm like, I can't be slumped over. Exactly. So everybody, make sure you're sitting or standing up straight today. Yeah. I mean, it's absolutely true. I tell my agents who are over there, if they're slumped over and they come to work and they're like this. They're not intentional.

They're just going through the motions. And the person can hear it on the phone. They can definitely hear it on the, if I love that, you said that. People don't realize that that the way that you're sitting and like if you're not smiling, then people can feel it on the other. They can feel it. Yes. And for my high stakes phone conversations, which, you know, most of my work is done on video,

but if it's a phone conversation, I'm standing up because I want that energy. And if it's a webinar, you know, one to many, stand up because you're you're going to come across is more relaxed and more confident. Yeah, Tony, that's funny that you say that I went to this conference, right, by Patrick Bet, David, and Tony Robbins was a guest speaker. Oh. And he was like, get up. Everybody get up.

So he has like, everybody get up. Everyone's hands are going crazy. And he's like, that's energy. When people could feel your energy in the room, people tend to do better. And in sales, what is sales? It's synergy and energy, which equals production. and productivity. Yes.

So what you're saying is like it's spot on. Energy standing up. I speak, I talk with my hands. Like if somebody ever told me to sit on my hands, I think I'd be a mute. Same. Same.

But see, even if you're on the phone and they can't see you, they can somehow they sense the energy. Just like when somebody that you know, call, say, you know,

calls you on the phone and they say, hey, like you know from the way they said hello that it's not good. Yeah. You know, one syllable, One syllable.

It's so true. I mean, you have so many good points. Have you done sales before? Well, just selling my own stuff. That's really how I... I mean, the PhD, that was nothing compared to... Because I started off saying, So, Mara, I have a company that teaches communication skills.

Would you be interested? Now what's your pitch? Now I'm sure it's so different. Oh, yes. It's like, oh, well, did you know that 80% of high performers do not make it to senior leadership. Ooh, why? Because they don't know how to execute executive presence.

They don't know how to talk to people. And it's a totally skill that you can learn. But if you don't make an effort to learn it, you're probably not going to make it to senior leadership, which is fine, you know. Interesting. That's very interesting. So you would say that people that can't get to the next level,

it's usually, maybe not all the time. Would you say it's attributed to poor communication? Yes. And it was not even poor. It's just because communication is always like purpose. So it's good for whatever they're doing. Right. But people don't, here's an example.

So imagine I have a team of, say, five direct reports, but all total 30. And I'm, you know, crushing it, doing great. But you, my boss, you just, you have a hard time envisioning me handling 300 people. Like you just don't see it, you know, Laura, she's just a little. She's a little introverted, and she does great when her comfort zone, but I don't see her stretching. I just have a hard time envisioning that. And, you know, I've never had lunch or dinner with her, so I really don't know her that well, even though, you know, I'm her boss or boss's boss. And so it's that it's not that you're a bad communicator, but you're not communicating like an executive.

And you all know that you have to act like you have the job before you get it. Assume the sale. Yeah, assume the sale. I love that. Yeah. Okay, so now I'm really going to come with my own questions because I like this better. All right. So a question for you.

And I think this would be very helpful. So I lead a lot of sales teams. I have 10 offices across the U.S. I have different leaders of all different calibers. Some people are great communicators. Some people are whatever. They all have their strength. Right.

So how would you, if you have a failing team, let's just say you have a team of salespeople that are failing. The leader is doing everything they need to do. on paper to be a leader. What would you say, in your opinion, could help this sales team perform better if the leader could make the sales team? Like if we could put everything on the leader in order for the sales team to get better, what would be some advice that you'd give to that leader for the sales team to perform better? Well, first of all, my question would be, I've had this question, variations of this

question many times. And the one thing you need to ascertain is as just you can be successful in role A, whatever that is. And then you get, because you did so well in role A, you get promoted to role B and you don't do as well. Right. Which happens all the time in the business. Yes. Or in a startup, a company had a sales team that was doing fine. And then they added a bunch of AI features to the process.

products, so they needed to sell it at a higher price. And that same team could not all of them could adapt to that, right? They were really good at selling, say, $100,000 software, but not at a million dollar software. So, you know, that's something that you need to look at. And I think, you know, listening to their calls, I know that's a standard practice. People don't believe it or not. A lot of people don't do it. We do. We listen to their calls. We pull their calls. But not all the leaders do it. Yeah, you need, and you have to listen, it's painful to listen to your own calls. It is, I mean, that's hard. But I think that is indispensable in this situation, because there's blind spots. There has got to be blind spots either with the leader and the people following that leader.

And they need an outside voice, an outside set of eyes to come in and say, you know, you're missing this. and finally I would say a willingness to experiment. It's a tricky situation. So for the next 30 days, we're going to wear red shirts on Fridays. We're going to all do our calls standing up. We're going to, I don't know, just experiment with different things. I love that. I mean, I love exactly what you said.

It's basically inspect what you expect. Yes. Check the blind spots. And then change it up. Be innovative. And it's hard. I think for a lot of people, it's really hard to kind of get out of that comfort zone. It is.

the older we get. Yes. The more I don't like older, I feel like the more seasoned. No, the thing is though, but you've been, I'm sure they've been rewarded. They've been, it did, you know, whatever they were doing was a great recipe. It was a great formula. It delivered results. So that's when it's hard to change when you have actually had great results from this old way of doing it.

But, you know, the world is changing and people are changing. We're all more distracted. Yeah. There's, you know, some people, their anxiety is very high. I mean, it's just what worked two or three years ago, five years ago, might not work today. But if you have 20 years doing business a certain way, it is hard to like, oh, that's not good enough anymore. Yeah, I agree with you. I think that people, their personalities are so different from years ago.

I think that we have to be more sensitive. I don't know if that's good or bad because sometimes I want to be like, stop, crying. I have crying leaders. I feel like there should be no crying in insurance ever. I don't know how you feel about crying, but it makes me uncomfortable. And I think it loses. I think sometimes it's appropriate. I do. If you're a constant crying leader, I think it takes, and correct me if I'm wrong, I think it takes away from your leadership ability because it makes you look emotionally unhinged It does, but it could be, no, no, but so you're not, I mean, maybe this role isn't good for you, even though, you know, before it was, maybe something is going on in their personal life.

You know, we all have like a cushion of, you know, sleep, certain hours of sleep and levels of stress. And, you know, people can have family members that are sick or their own medical issues or financial issues that can erode that cushion. And that can make them more emotional. And maybe they need a sabbatical or something. I don't know. But something. It's not good. Yeah.

I mean, to me, crying is a symptom that something is. Delection. I agree. There's some kind of deflection going on there. Yes. Yes. And that person just can't stay in the role that they're in. How do you know, I have a question, how do you know when it's time to retire that

leader? Because that's hard. That's a hard one. You've been working with somebody, and I struggle with this. I'm very, this is a big, big, big thing for me. I work with people for a really long time. And then I don't know when to finally, in the business is going down. The productivity is going down.

But I have a big problem cutting that person. How do you know when it's time? Well, when they're not being successful, Mara, you want all of your people to be successful. That's part of who you are. And it's not good to be in a job where you're failing. I mean, that's not good. And if you can't pull it together, as you know, a change of scenery does wonders.

Maybe in a different company, a different product, the person would be like on fire. But I think you have to look at, is this person, if they're not successful, then why are we pretending that it is? Right. And I, you know, that's why we have the traditional, the, what is it called the PIP, you know,

like a 30-day, 90-day thing. Like person, you know, this doesn't seem. to be working out. I want you to be successful. It doesn't seem like you're experiencing success. And I know that's not good for you. And I know you're capable of being massively successful. You know, if we're going to give it one more go. But otherwise, I think we need to find you a different place so that you can be successful. Yeah, we use the PIP, the performance plan. We use it too. I just feel like for me sometimes it's a really hard. It is because you care about the person. But Mara, you have to go deeper.

It's like I care about you enough to go through this pain of letting you go and having this hard conversation because I want you to be successful and I know you're capable of a much greater level of success than what I'm seeing here now. Absolutely. And I think that's important to exercise because sometimes, and I'm guilty of it, sometimes you got to put the we before the me and look at everybody. Like the performance, you can't keep people around that are just not performing at the caliber because the only people. it really affects. And I know this, and I'm saying this, I know this and I keep these people around. And it's because you feel so, you know,

you feel for them, but sometimes in sales you can't, or just in business in general, you have to be able to separate. Well, but see, that's also the flip side of your strength of connecting with people and, you know, like you sense them and you want them to be happy that you are so aware, you have a hyper awareness of their emotional state and you don't want, you don't want the T.

and you don't want more chaos. So you have a lot of awareness that not all leaders have. Yeah. So that's. How do you control the chaos within an organization when there's disruption? How do you control that? That is a great question. Well, you have to, I think, put a pause on what you can and really, like, take a look at

what's going on. It has to be analyzed to me. Like you can't pretend. I think the mistake is to pretend that it's not how. happening to pretend that everything is fine when it's not. I think that all the people involved should in some way have a voice. You know, that doesn't mean that you're going to have anarchy or a mutiny, but you want, like, for one example would be, you know, giving everybody a note card and saying, what do you think is the number one problem that we have that's causing

this chaos and this you know reading them to the group where it's not a you know you're not just having people rail and rant and go on and on like whatever can fit on a small index card and that way you're getting the input maybe and somewhat anonymously and you're able to you know again go back to the vision where do we want to be what are we trying to achieve here what do we need to do differently yeah i love that i and i especially like it's very i i know about about giving like the survey to be anonymous survey but I especially like what you said a note card so this way gives just let's be concise about the problem yes state what it is let's not go on about it exactly you list one or two things on a note card yes I just and I want to like just really pull that

out for a second the note card versus like a blank sheet of a document or whatever people tend to like they just like have word vomit yes and then you're like what are they even like what's problem what do I so just identify with the problem I love that you say that is a key thing thing that you said is the note card. I'm going to try that. I love that. Because that's putting a limit. You know, and that's sometimes what's missing is a limit on the time to prepare, the time to deliver, you know, creativity flourishes when you have constraints. Typically, what do you think the problem is if a team is imploding? I think it's leadership, you know.

But it could be market disruption. It, you know, it can always be that the product isn't working anymore that it doesn't let's just say you have a good product but the team is imploding what do you think it is i i would i would look at the leadership of the team i think that's you know fish rots from the head you have to start there and again what for me one of the big learnings with my work coaching these brilliant executives is that someone can be very successful have a great run and get into a place where they're not as successful and you know there's a lot of of different directions you can take that, but you have to recognize that just because you're successful in role A with this product, with this combo, that you're going to, that that's like

this magic secret sauce that just no matter what you do, you're just going to be killing it. Yeah. No, it's true. I, I believe that. I think when a team starts to implode you how to look at the leadership. There's usually distension within the leadership team. And that's when everything is starting to like. Yeah, like if we put you in a role to go research bacteria, I mean, I can, I mean, I'm not going to, that's horrible. That'd be horrible. I would never, I would never succeed in that role. Don't believe that. Yeah. I mean, that's a crazy example, but, you know, that happens. If somebody listening wants to grow into a boss, others admire, what's the first communication skill you think that they should work on immediately? Oh, thank you for asking that question. And I want, this is

something to do right now. The next time you have to speak that's not, you know, past the salt, but, you know, in a meeting and a presentation, instead of thinking about, oh, do I know my stuff, oh, do I look good? Oh, do they think I'm smart enough to say that? I want you to just throw that away. And I want you to focus on how am I helping these people, how am I helping the message, the agenda, like, why am I speaking, and how can I take what I want to say and make it more attractive, more interesting, actionable? And that is all called being strategic about how you communicate. So it's, you just, you lose that self-consciousness because you're putting on your hat of trusted advisor and whether you're the assistant to the janitor or assistant to the CEO or any role in

between, you have some expertise to advise the company on and they need, they will be better off with your expertise. But everybody's distracted and tired and exhausted and thinking about their Amazon packages. So how can you be your own marketing manager for that message and just make it, like Mary Poppins said, you know, with a little bit of sugar, lets the medicine go down? So just thinking strategically. If you start doing that right now, you will automatically get get ahead. So when you say thinking strategically, you mean like something innovative? Do you mean like starting the, maybe starting your sales meeting a little differently? Oh, that could be, but thinking, no, but it's even going deeper than that. Like you're going to have a sales meeting

and you think, what do they need for me the most? Do they need encouragement? Do they need me to wake them up? But you're making your, before you talk, you're thinking, what do they need from me? How can I help them the most? right now with this conversation, with this meeting, and that's your strategy. So yeah, it could be mixing it up, but it also could be, hey, Mara, as my assistant, I don't know what, this little thing that you're doing is not helping us. I need you to do it differently. I need you to, you know, do it this way instead of that way. Or Amara, I have great confidence in you. I see you have so much potential, but I see that your lack of preparation for these meetings is holding you back. And I really hate to see that. So I would encourage you

to prepare better for the meetings. I love that. So be a sort of coach. Yes. Be the coach, be a mentor. We all need that. Yeah. Be the person that's guiding. Sometimes you can't take control, but maybe you're on the side a little bit, just kind of holding your hand. So just knowing

the love language of your team and what they need. And that's being the leader. That's leading without authority. Leading just doing it, right? What kind of leadership style do you think works? Like an authoritative type? Do you think like a dictatorship? Do you think leading with love? If you have lots of guns, I think the dictatorship works. My thesis in PhD school was about Ugo Chavez. That's why that makes me laugh.

I think situational, like you have to adapt to the situation, but you have to, and you have to be who you are. And you have to care about the people. But I really, you know, I guess it's my, we all kind of project. But to me, it's looking for what do people need and giving it to them. And my personal form of leadership is like seeing the skill or the thing that's missing and trying to help people to find it. Yeah. I would say that I'm the same way. I think I like to lead with love and with purpose and attention and just make sure I'm not very, like I'm not an authoritative.

I am authoritative and I do like that. And I am controlling. But I also know one to kind of move back to the side. I like things done my way for sure, but I also know when to like look in and I know that leading with love is going to be the number one way every single time. And you come in as a dictator, it doesn't work or lead with fear.

It's not going to work. You're not going to render the results. No, you'll get a short-term win, but that's it. Exactly. Outside of coaching and podcasting, what something people might be surprised to learn about you. Oh, my goodness. That I sing in a Latin choir

without any musical skill, a talent. I've developed some skill very hard. But my husband's a professional musician. And for some reason, for years, he was encouraging me to sing in this choir. I was singing these like 10th century songs that monks used to sing. It's very cool. But that is something that's like a very niche hobby. Yeah, I was not ready for that.

I didn't know that you were going to say that. Yeah, I didn't. Yeah. How many years have you been married? I've been married for the second time. It will be 16 years in July. And it's been, you know, it's been great. I love being married.

Is your husband an introvert or extrovert? He's an extrovert. He's not a flaming, flaming extrovert, but he's pretty extrovert. He's the one, you know, his name is Ruben. Everybody loves Ruben. He's the people person. But he asked me for questions about strategy. How should I handle this?

or why should we, because he knows that this is my daily bread, but he's definitely the people person, loves to socialize, loves, you know, really, he has to, he talks with people all day long. I love that. So looking ahead, what excites you most about the future of leadership in workplace culture? I think that the world is just kind of, you know, we've shifted since post-COVID with AI, with social media. You know, it's not all pretty.

But I think every time we have these shifts, we have new opportunities. And so the people who, you know, just to put a shortcut on it, the people that didn't go to Harvard and the people who don't come from privilege, the people that maybe had some disadvantages, that there is opportunity for those who are looking for it

because precisely because there's a little bit of confusion about investing, about business, I think that, you know, our country, the world is changing, and every time there's change, there are opportunities. So that's what I'm excited to see, you know, how that develops. Yeah, our world is definitely changing. And AI for sure is taking over so you better understand that. So if you can sum up in your own words, what would be boss I'd like to follow in your own words. Well, I love to follow a boss who has a vision that's even bigger than what I have for myself or for the company. I find that so inspiring when somebody can see the possibilities. And that's what I look for. A boss who can see that what I think is not feasible or maybe I'm thinking,

oh, I don't even know if we can do that. But the boss says, yeah, we can. That to me is like, I will follow that boss. I like like a rebel boss. A rebel boss. Yes. So I want to highlight your book real quick. Oh, yes. Let's talk about that wonderful, beautiful book. Tell me a little bit about your book and what inspired you. Okay. Well, it is a repository of my knowledge of communication after teaching and coaching all these years. It is not like a book that you just sit down and read. It's I wanted people to have a reference book. There's a chapter on having great presentations. There's a chapter on networking. There's a chapter on emotionally intelligent conversations. So, oh, yeah, but chapter 11, it turns out, who knew? Chapter 11 is the best chapter.

It's the chapter that most of the people, the aspiring senior leaders need. It's about points of view. And that's what people, you know, circling way back to our first question, our first question, what do the leaders need? They need to be able to articulate their point of view about where we're going and what we're going to find when we get there. So it's a gold mine of help that's based on situations I think people are fine useful. I love that. It's called the practical guide to effective communication.

And every leader, they always say that the best kept secrets are in books. So I would strongly suggest us from talking to you that any leader or aspiring leader should take a gander at your beautifully written book. And if anybody wants to find you, where would they find? I would love for you to visit my lovely, website, which is called www. Speak Up Withlora.com. And there you'll find podcast episodes.

You'll find what a description of the executive presence work I do. And all kinds of goodies are waiting for you at www. Speak Upwithlora.com. How about any Instagram? I, you know. Not into it.

Not into it. Not into it. Yeah. Yeah, just go to my website. I'm not, not doing too much on Instagram. I mean, some, but I'm not happy with it. I love that.

But, well, you know what? You are a wealth of knowledge. I mean, just talking to you today, I am thoroughly impressed. I don't get impressed by many people, but you are very, very impressive. And for any leader or aspiring leader, I would say, you know, one of the biggest thing is clear communication and being very concise and clear and competent as well. Yes, that helps. And just having those goals out there.

So if you are a leader out there, I urge you to really read Laura's book. I'm sure there's a world of wealth in there and knowledge and a whole bunch of cool cheat hacks and all kinds of different stuff going on in your book. But more importantly, you know, leadership is a role that I think people, most people take for granted. But it is a calling, I think, in life. Yes. Right? It's a calling in life.

And it's really putting the we before the me and being that servant type of person. So I just want to thank you for being on stage. Oh, it's an honor. It was such a blast. I loved everything you had to say. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. It's my pleasure.