Bill Meyer Show Podcast - Sponsored by Clouser Drilling www.ClouserDrilling.com - 06-08-26_MONDAY_7AM

Episode Date: June 9, 2026

Open phones and emails of the day then great talks with Joshua Lisec, his forthcoming book is STAY OFF MY KITCHEN TABLE, Later the AI Data Center agenda w/Steve Goreham, Green Breakdown: The Coming Renewable Energy Failure.

This hour of the Bill Myers Show podcast is proudly sponsored by Klauser Drilling. They've been leading the way in Southern Oregon well drilling for more than 50 years. Find out more about them at Klausor drilling.com. That's 770 KMED. I think that was interesting at support for same-sex marriage, transgender, all of the LGBTQ2S plus plus. I forget all the letters and the numbers that are involved there in various symbols. but dropping and dropping fast over the last couple of years. I think that's interesting that talked with Joshua.

Anyway, we got Phil from Rogue River. Hello, Phil. What's on your mind this morning, huh? Morning. Good morning, Bill. I don't know where you find some of these guys you interview, but they're incredible. And I was so looking forward to Mills, Mavinius?

Yeah, well, yeah, he, oh, yeah, the guy who sounds like a James Bond villain, right? Mills Gravilius. That's his name. Yeah, yes, Mr. Maya. Mr. Maya, yes. Well, I'm really looking forward to him last week. What happened? Well, for some reason, he was just missing in action.

You know, we had something set up. I forget if it was Thursday or Friday. I think maybe it was yesterday, Friday we were going to talk with him. And you call him up, and it just went to message. And sometimes you have something come up. You know, he is a detective. So there is a possibility that the day job may have gotten in the way, and maybe a client showed up.

I don't know. I ended up reaching out to his people and seeing if we can get him rescheduled because I find him such an interesting cat, you know, to talk to. He's incredible. He's great. He's just awesome to listen to. Yeah.

And so I'm going to see if we can get him back on maybe 8, 10 tomorrow. I just haven't had a chance to reconfirm for it yet. But we will have him back on, and I'll just see if he's stroking that cat on his lap as he talks about. By the way, what do you think about that? Speaking of L.A. since he's an L.A. area detective here. What do you think about Spencer Pratt? You know, here it is.

You know, we're at nine, ten days counting, and then all of a sudden, the second place Democrat ends up popping into second place in that mayor's race. It's just so incredible that Pratt had such a very good lead in the second place. And then the last nine days, all of the votes are for the third place lady that was already virtually conceded. Yeah. Crying. Yeah.

And now she's overtaking him. I know. It's so legit, right? And then all the, or at least I should say that most of the votes coming in and all the late counts, therefore this one particular person, it's not boosting up bass, you know, the incumbent mayor, as not doing anything with Pratt. Just the third place one. you know and that's when you just know what a racket what a corrupt racket we have to get back to

actually having election day not election month or not an election season that sort of stuff because that's what happens it's just human nature if you know that you can just stuff a few ballots in there maybe you have a friend in the postal service it's able to mess with the uh those postmark how do you know there's just no way to know well i'm sure that you've heard that you know you know It doesn't even have to be postmarked. It can be handwritten on the envelope. Yeah, that's in the state of Oregon. The postmark does not matter.

They ended up changing that rule. What could go wrong with such a corrupt system? And yet, you know, you have the Secretary of State going and talking about all the amazing vote by mail, the incredible amount of security. There is absolutely no security in such nonsense. But I appreciate the call. Okay. It's absolutely a legitimate process as long as it goes toward the Democrats.

Yeah. And any time that most people are asking for a change in voting, it's because it would help Democrats. It's never to help the other side of the aisle for the most part. Appreciate the call there, Phil. Good hearing from you. Okay, 770KMED. Some emails of the day, and that's sponsored by Dr. Steve Nelson, Central Point Family Dentistry.com. If you don't have dental insurance, they have a dental plan there. Works a lot like dental insurance, but lower costs, better benefits. Find out more. Central Point Family Dentistry. And Francine weighs in here a short comment regarding the late incoming ballots in the L.A. Mayoral race. In real life, all late incoming ballots would consist of the same basic mix as the first count. Yeah, you're right about that, Francine. Absolutely. No problem there. I get it.

Corey writes me over the weekend, says, Bill, I went to urgent care with my wife this weekend. They asked for ID. Really? Was it insurance or something? I asked him. I said, well, are they using insurance? Interesting. wondering why. And then Corey said, with insurance, I would suppose insurance fraud. Maybe they care about fraud. I didn't ask. I was only thinking at the time, one more thing that you have to have ID for.

And then what Corey, of course, is implying is saying that, you know, you need ID to go to urgent care, but you shouldn't have to have ID to vote. You shouldn't have to prove anything, right? Point well taken, all right. and we have Randy from Ashland who says, no, Bill, some practices don't make sense. According to medical science, the human brain is not fully developed until the age of 25. Fact is part of California law influencing sentencing of convicted of crimes committed at the ages of under 25.

The last part of the brain to develop is reasoning. If you remember being a teenager like I do, we thought we were smarter than her parents, only to learn later in life we teenagers were morons. Yeah, boy, got that right, Randy. With that in mind, what is the rationale behind lowering the voting age to 18? What would think that given the understanding that the people that age are not rational thinkers, that voting should be 25?

But no, at 18, we are legally adults responsible for our actions. Somehow authority finds ways to pass laws that fly in the face of common sense, like allowing people with underdeveloped brains to vote. Whereas the agenda more sinister than that, teens are easily swayed by property. Agenda. Right then, Randy, I'm just going to stop you. Ding, ding, ding. All right.

Email bill at Philmeyer's show.com. News is coming up on KMED and KMEDHD1 Eagle Point Medford. KBXG grants pass. IP28, no meat, no hunting, no aminals. Got to let all the aminals go. Could have actually hurt public health. The guest I have coming up says, you betcha. From phone repair to keep your.

throbs to car battery testing and installation. Batteries Plus has music to your ears, baby. Now more with Bill Meyer. Continuing the conversation this morning with Joshua Lysick, first things first though, I need to change my music bed. Yeah, we're going to turn it to an animal bed, okay? Well, we're talking about initiative petition 28th. And now it's being framed as an animal welfare issue, but Joshua

Well, Lysak joins me right now. And he's written a book, and he's concerned more about the public health aspects of this. And the name of his forthcoming book coming out in July, it's Stay Off My Kitchen Table. Joshua, good day on. Welcome to the show. Please be here. Thank you so much having me on. Tell us a little bit about your background, because you've actually been, you're an acclaimed ghost writer.

So you write books for more famous people. Is that normally what you have done in your career? Yes, that's correct. Fortune 500 and Inc. 1,000 CEOs and other C-suite individuals. I've written their books, so they'll interview with me, and I will basically write the more interesting version of their experiences and their stories, rather than the Wikipedia version of what happened because nobody really wants to read something that's boring like that. Rather, it's dramatized, and there's a focus that makes the book useful, and it allows the author to, to, let's say, realize that their entire life's work has meant something, and it's meant something

meaningful that can be a legacy work for their industry. And I've done that also for clinicians, surgeons, lawyers, and other business professionals over the years. Yeah, so you have people that could have an interesting story, but if they were going to write their own story, it wouldn't be very interesting, in other words. And that's why you're there to spice it up, spice up reality. Yes. And for the particular, let's say, bona fide celebrities, I've ghostwritten for. They more so want to write the novelization of their life story, right? For personal branding, public relations purposes.

So we'll just leave it at that. Okay. Yeah, I can kind of read between the lines. You don't mind. All right. Let's talk about this initiative petition 28, because this is one which has really been stirring the imagination here at the state of Oregon, and it would essentially shut down animal husbandry.

You know, no more milking the cow, no more inseminating. the cows so that you have more cows or beef. I mean, no slaughtering of animals, nothing like that. And, and, of course, it would cause all sorts of issues. And people are saying, well, it may make the ballot, but it still wouldn't pass. And they're probably right. But Oregon has gone for some crazy stuff here in the past. You're approaching initiative petition 28, though, from a public health concern.

Why is that? Yes, that's right. a couple of things point out here. The first of which is I understand that it's being called the Peace Act. Is that right? The Peace Act, I'm not sure that exactly what he is. We just call it IP28. I'm just hoping that the Peace Act goes away in peace. But that's just me. Yes, yes. So, yeah, people for the elimination of animal cruelty exemption. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's it. So I'm looking at, I've looked at the language of this. And basically what it does, and this is the first issue here, is that it erases the line between animals and people. And some of the language stipulates that human beings ought to work to prevent the, and then it begins to use anthropomorphizing language to describe animals,

that they shouldn't feel fear, that they should feel safe, that they should not feel any kind of suffering and whatnot. And this is the language that we might use to describe human beings. Here's what's interesting, though. I had previously been a vegan for 10 years. So you live the lifestyle then that the IP 28 people are hoping would be all Oregonians, right? Yes, yes. The IP 28 is explicitly the vegan agenda.

Okay. Now, I ate the vegan diet for 10 years. As I now like to say, I suffered from chronic veganism for a decade. Okay. In any case, on that particular diet, of course, there's no animal products, not even extensions of animal products, like even honey is forbidden. And a way that I think would be helpful for people to understand the radical extent to which the religious vegans, the so-called ethical vegans, will go, is that their practice of veganism is similar to how devout Jews might practice kosher or keep kosher or the way that devout practicing Muslims. might practice halal in which there's specific, let's say, extent to which you must go to prevent any type of, let's say,

even coming into contact with animal products. It's rather bizarre. I didn't necessarily hold any of those beliefs because I thought that was weird. I had thought that the plant-based diet was generally healthy, if not one of the healthiest diet. Well, it turns out I developed a number of issues, like I developed an autoimmune issue with my thyroid. I became anemic and became dizzy from simply standing up. You know, it was awful.

I had high estrogen and low testosterone. I could not put on muscle despite strength training three to four times a week. It was a rather unpleasant experience that, of course, all of those went away as soon as I began eating real food, starting with eggs and collagen powder, of course. And I learned about nutrient absorption. I learned about bioavailable food. So, for example, even if a brick of tofu and ground beef, suppose that the serving you get has the same amount of protein, why is the beef more bioavailable? Why is beef better absorbed the nutrients in it, specifically the macronutrients of protein and fat?

Why are those better absorbed than the brick of tofu? And that, let's say, personal learning adventure, I then teamed up with a physician who has authored a number of books and papers, including bestseller that has done very, very well before. We teamed up, and then we wrote this book that helped people choose the most bioavailable foods that improve nutrient absorption. And it turns out that a lot of so-called healthy foods, which are, by the way, vegan, tend to be the foods with the most anti-nutrients and the least bioavailable nutrients. And it's those foods that ought to actually be eliminated from the vast majority of people's diet, particularly people who have any type of digestive issues. There are a lot of people who have autoimmune issues.

It turns out that by a strategic elimination diet of specific plant-based foods, people can experience quite a turnaround in their health, just as I did when I left the vegan diet. Hence the title, stay off my kitchen table. Stay off my kitchen table, yeah, which initiative petition 28 is looking to do. Joshua Lysick once again, and like I said, you've done all these, this ghost writing now, and now you're writing your own. along with Dr. Philip O'Vadia. You talked about antinutrients. What's an example of anti-nutrients in the vegan diet, which, of course, Initiative Petition 28 is hoping we'll all go for.

Yes, so a lot of people will think that, oh, you know, foods like chrysiferous vegetables or leafy greens, let's take spinach or kale, oh, broccoli, all these are very super healthy foods, right? If you talk to any ethical, so-called ethical vegan, what they believe is healthy food, they will probably start mentioning these green vegetables. Well, here's the thing about vegetables, okay, versus animals. So all life wants to defend itself. Okay, that's just part and parcel of nature. Okay, we live in nature.

We are often so far removed from the wilderness, from other nature that we kind of forget how it works. This is why hunters, fishers, trappers, farmers, cattle ranchers, they're so close to nature that they understand these things very well in ways that often your cosmopolitan, urbanized, overeducated vegans don't quite understand how nature works. So all animals have things to defend themselves, like teeth, claws, legs, the run away, okay? Sure. Plants, the vast majority of which just sit there, they have to use something different. They have to use poison. So, for example, there are a number of plants, the vast majority of plants that we will consume, that have what are called oxalids in them.

And in order to make plants safe, we have to bake them, we have to ferment them. And there's an entire snack. I believe it's chapter four on the anti-nutrients that are found throughout all vegan foods, basically, that people who eat them can experience what I did, which is basically an autoimmune issue with their thyroid. They will experience a high estrogen, which throws everything off, and particularly if you're a man. Yeah, and something tells me that was that because of you eating a lot of soy, you know, the estrogen-like chemicals that come through? through a lot of soy consumption today. Yes, that's correct.

They're called phytoestrogens. They're basically the plant-based, they're kind of the plant version of estrogen. So you might say I was quasi-transing myself by being vegan. Okay. Yeah, and well, I've only half-joked about this in which I talked about, you know, in the processed, industrial processed food chain, there's a lot of soy in it these days and a lot of processed food.

and you can't help but notice the growth of the man boob movement, so to speak. Did that have some effect of it, you know, anti-nutrients, as it were? Yes, yes. And there's so many more than just simply the opposite. There's also called lexins. Those are often found in your beans and your lentils. Those can over time damage the gut lining. There's phytate that are found also in,

in lagoons, you know, beans, but also in seeds are found in the grain. Is that why that seed oils are such a problem? And there's been a talk about that in the nutrition world of trying to get away from the seed oil use out there? Or is it something different that we're talking about here? I think that's a good way of putting it. So seed oils, those would be like your kernel oil, your soybean oil, your sunflower oil. those are, by the way, those are found in almost every single vegan processed food. If there's like, oh, this is a vegan product.

It comes out of any kind of a package where there's like a so-called vegan pizza or if they, you know, a non-chicken tender type of ultra-processed food product or we like to call them near food products. Near food. We might call them. Near food. I love that term. That's great.

We all have seed oils in them. Seed oils are industrially. process. They're easily oxidized, meaning they're very much damaged by exposure to the environment, to cooking. And they're rich in omega-6 fatty acids, which out of proper balance can fuel inflammation. And of course, these are considered, quote, and healthy food. And you go to any vegan restaurant, you go to any vegan eatery, you go to any vegan grocery store. And, of course, I've been to Portland. Oregon is, let's say, has a high density of all of these places. The recommendation for plant-based people will ultimately result in consuming what, for lack of a better term, are simply poison.

And I want to warn people with this book to avoid the vegan agenda, protect yourself, eat real whole food that largely comes from animals. And when you do eat vegetables, ensure that they're fermented or baked because that helps eliminate a significant density of the anti-nutrients that are otherwise not good for you. That way you can still get your fiber because the body doesn't need fiber. Yeah, yeah. It turns out that the fiber we have access to now is so different than what our ancestors ate in the wild together with their bone braw, you know, and their animal organs. for animal organs and when not that they ate.

All right. So, by the way, the name of the book is coming out in July, by the way. When is it coming out in July? Again. Thursday, Tuesday, July 28. Okay, all right. So we got a couple of months, about a month and a half or so. It's stay off my kitchen table.

And so you essentially coming from the position of having been a reformed vegan then. What made you change or get away from it? What made you think, okay, hey, I have to go back to the animal protein? seen here, Joshua? Well, ironically, it was Dr. Evadia, who was a friend by that time, and I'd worked with him on his previous book. I asked him some question about some blood work that I got back recently, because I began to notice a number of symptoms I was experiencing, like the anemic experiences of you're sitting down and then you stand up and you see stars, and that happens every single time you stand up. I began to have this bizarre short-term memory loss where simple

vocabulary words were escaping me. Yeah, and you're a writer by trade. That doesn't work real well, does it? Yes, that's right. And I remember at one point, there was a, there was a, there was a meeting that I was on, and I was talking to the client that was on the call with me, and I struggled. I could not remember what the word for calendar was. I forgot the word calendar, and it just simply escaped me. That together with an inability to build muscle, with another formal issues I was observing, and there was so much more that I was experiencing at all linked back to veganism. A headside described it as chronic veganism, because many of these issues I'd had for years, I just hadn't simply put it together. And when I did, okay, we're going to be eating

salmon. Let's go get our salt and eggs. For some collagen powder and some weight protein. I followed Dr. Evadia's advice, and of course also including beef liver is one of the highest density nutrients and also most bioavailable nutrition. Our wilderness ancestors approximately 300,000 years ago, they most often ate when they ate animal products, they ate the organs, by the way,

because of the richness of vitamins, nutrients, and micronutrients. Yeah. So you have, we're probably advocate, I would imagine, then, that we go back to eating more of the entire animal of the animal protein and not just the tasty higher cost cuts. Is that kind of where you're coming from on this? Yes, that's right. These are the zones that have the, if you look at what is, quote unquote, what is the healthiest? Okay, well, what does it mean for food to be healthy? Well, as we lay out in the book, there's a low density of antinutrients and a high density of nutrients and a profile of those macronutrients and also micronutrients that our body

needs to function. Think like what are the vitamins that food have, right? And largely, there are going to be those that come from cattle, but it's also going to be bone braw. It's going to be beef heart. It's going to be beef liver. It's going to be these things that you might not generally see at like your local fast food joint, right? So just because you're not vegan doesn't mean you need to go to the local roadhouse, you know, and spend 50 bucks on a meal, and that's going to be quote unquote healthy. Yeah, and I don't think we're going to see liver. I don't think we're going to see liver tots anytime soon over at McDonald's,

but point we'll take it, though, on the rest of it, although you couldn't be a bad idea. What do you think then, you know, taking from stay off my kitchen, what you know now, having been a really devout vegan and then switching around because of health concerns, what do you think would happen if voters in Oregon were crazy enough to actually go for Initiative Petition 28, the Peace Act? The fewer nutrients, dense animal products people eat, the more deleterious effects there are on their mental health. This is a massive issue.

Vegans, if you look at the data, chronic veganism. as I call it, is correlated with a sharp rise in mental illness. And so when you talk to vegans about any of the food choices or nutrition, they act bizarre, irrational, like you're insulting their religion because that's what it is. But frankly, the sad part about the religious devotion to, I'm simply going to call it animal worship. I haven't really figured out a better descriptor for it. Why do vegans believe what they believe?

It's because they worship animals. I don't know what else to tell you. They elevate animals to a higher level than humans. And this is very common, by the way. Vegans have told me that even if eating a fish will add 10 to 20 years to your life, it's still morally wrong to do so. So the long-term effects on Oregonians would be by eating vegan food, you begin to think like vegans. That's an interesting way looking at it.

It's Stay Off My Kitchen Table. Stay Off My Kitchen Table by Joshua Lysick, the former vegan co-author of this upcoming nutrition book. Some people want to ask a question or two here, Joshua. Let me go to Matt. Matt's here. Matt, you're on with Joshua Lysak. Go ahead.

Hey, Joshua, man. I appreciate this interview. It's been very eye-opening. Bill, it's Matt. My pleasure. Yes. I remember watching a documentary, and I want to say it had to be 20, to 30 years ago, and it was a doctor who had found an Indian tribe that had a real obesity

problem. And he got this idea that if you went, because his tribe actually was fairly pure-blooded, he went in there and said, you know, I wonder if we're going to things. We wonder what, now your phone cut out there. What did you say there? We wonder what. We wonder if we went back to the original diet that your tribe may have eaten from the beginning if that would change your body.

reaction to food. So enough of the people were game to try it. They were dropping weight like they were on GLP. I mean, over the course of a year, people were losing 100, 150 pounds just from changing their diet to what their bloodline would have eaten, you know, going back 100 years. It was really amazing. That is an interesting call. Thank you for making it, Matt. What do you think about that story, Josh? The fellow we got to contribute the forward to the book, and we also interviewed him for the book, as a highly awarded and credentialed anthropologist by the name of Dr. Bill Schindler, he's author of Eat Like a Human. And over the year, his archaeological and anthropological work has been into the earliest human nutritional sources. Going back to prehistory, going back hundreds

of thousands of years, what were the types of grains? What were the types of grains? that people were eating because our bodies were obviously omnivores, so we weren't just eating meat. We weren't just eating plants. Well, what were we eating and how were we eating them? So he has gone to various local Indian tribes around North and South America and done the work of interviewing them how they prepare their meals and what proportion do they're, what sort of processing do they do in order to maximize nutrition and minimize anti-nutrition. And that adjustment of of going back to, okay, if we're eating grains, what kind of grains are eating? Okay, we're eating sourdough bread because of the fermentation process.

Once again, yeah. Oh, isn't that interesting? Yeah. You know, something else I would add to, and thank you for the call on that, by the way. It kind of reminds me how if you eat pasta in the United States, you bloat and you get fat. If you eat pasta in Italy, where they're still using the older grains and they don't use glyphosate to do the, harvesting, it seems to work out differently for them. It's kind of what you're, what you're getting to then, right? Not just the grains, but the type of grains. Yeah. Where can people find out

more about the book, too? Maybe you've got a website for this, anything else going on. It's coming out late July, but at least you can get on a pre-order. Nothing else. Yes, that's right, available from Amazon, Barnes & Noble Bookshop.org. There's a number of website people can get copies of it. All right. And once again, it's stay off my kitchen table. He says not only vote no on IP 28 if it ends up getting on the ballot, but also just to keep out of your, well, have a healthier kitchen table, I guess is really where you're going to. Ever since you changed back to animal protein then, have you been able to build muscle? What has changed since that time? Oh, yes. So what I first noticed is I had, as a vegan for a number of years, I had,

a sort of, let's say, persistent, low-intensity anxiety. You know, this is, I'm kind of sounding almost like a college suit at this point. Like, oh, I have my anxiety, my anxiety. Yeah, yeah, you needed a weighted blanket, right, to be able to go to sleep at night. Yeah, yes. And that was an experience that I had regularly where you're just sort of on edge all the time. Well, after a couple of weeks of eating the nutrient-dense animal-based foods at Dr. Evadia, personally recommended to me, and that ultimately is what beget the book, that completely went away.

And then I realized, as a vegan, I had prey physiology. I'm eating like an herbivore. Herbivores are literally prey animals, the vast majority of them. So I had prey physiology of being on edge all the time because the predator is going to come along, a carnivore, lion's going to come along any moment now. Yeah. Interesting. That is absolutely to be avoided. So there was a psychiatric then reaction to the diet, what was going into you. That's really interesting. Okay. And I think that explains why there is such a strong correlation, a persistent correlation, extreme correlation, between chronic veganism and all a myriad of mental illnesses that people experience. Because you're literally turning your body into a prey animal. Joshua Lysick once again, and his forthcoming book is

stay off my kitchen table. And he has co-written it with noted heart surgeon, Dr. Philip Obedia. Tell you what, I'm going to have you back. I appreciate it. It's very thought-provoking. Good to have you on the show. Thank you very much, Joshua. It's my pleasure.

Thank you. Joshua Lysick. This is the Bill Myers show, and you're on KMED. We've heard it all. Loose gravel is not much different than black ice. Don't park anywhere near a chipping green. That gust of wind literally blew me into the opposite lane. With the reason you need auto body repair doesn't matter to us as much as making your car look new again and the process easy for you.

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Kurt, good to have you on. What are you thinking this morning, huh? Joshua was an excellent guest. He's spot on about his thoughts about plants. There's also an excellent podcast by Dr. Anthony Chafee, talking all about plants. And I know she can be a bit controversial for you, but Lucretia could fill your show with all the information you'd ever want to know about Glyphys Fates, plants, etc. So, excellent show. Good luck.

Hey, well, thank you very much. I appreciate you checking in on that. Hi, good morning. This is Angie. Hello, Angie. Good to hear from you, Iris, Angie. What was going on your world? Welcome.

I just wanted to ask that guy about liver. He was talking about liver. I freeze-dry liver, and I put it into my burgers. You do? And you can't taste liver in burgers. So with all the seasoning and stuff. So I just wanted to ask him about cholesterol. You know, it's supposed to be very high in cholesterol liver is,

and how dangerous is it as far as cholesterol. Yeah, well, I'll tell you what I'll do, Angie. Like I said, Joshua's gone right now, but I'll try to get him back on for a revisit. I think when he gets closer to the book dropping. It's very early in the process. It's like end of July. It's when it comes out. But then maybe we can a little talk more of a talk there.

I also want to say that I had two friends that became vegans because he got Alzheimer's, and both of them died within a couple of years of being vegans. both of them got really sick and died. So I don't recommend the vegan diet. I do find it interesting that he's talking about the lectins and the various other aspects of the plants defending themselves. And Lucretia and others have brought that up on my show too. So it's just kind of confirming what many other people know, but he experienced it the first time. Appreciate the call. Good hearing from you, okay?

20 before 8. We'll catch up on the rest of the news here in just a moment. And then Steve Gorham's going to join me. He's another author. he wrote a book talking about the coming, see, what is it to call? I want to make sure that I get it right. He's the executive director of the climate science coalition, but he says the green breakdown, coming renewable energy failure.

And given that Oregon is all in on this issue, I thought it would be worth talking with him about this because everything about Oregon is just more renewable. Where can we go wrong? Millet Construction has been a general contractor for 40 years. For the last 20 years, they've specialized in foundation repair. and replacement. If you have sloping floors, cracks and walls, and windows and doors that are hard to open, you have a foundation problem that's only getting worse. At Millet Construction, they not only fix your foundation and level your house, they solve the water problem that's causing the damage.

Get on solid ground. Call Millet Construction for a free estimate. Visit Millet Construction.com. CCB number 32787. News brought to you by Millette Construction, specializing in foundation repair and replacement. Get on solid ground. Visit nalette construction.com. KMED News, here's what's going on. Former U.S. Senator from Oregon, Bob Packwood died over the weekend at a Southern California care facility. He was 93.

Packwood styled himself as a maverick. His voting record was that of a moderate Republican. He championed gun control, environmentalism and women's issues, and he resigned in 1995. After allegations of sexual misconduct with female staffers, he was replaced by current U.S. Senator Ron Wyden. 101 days into the Iran conflict in Israel and Iran have been lobbing missiles at one another. Oil prices spiking over the weekend because of rising tensions, but gasoline and diesel prices in Oregon continue to drop. A gallon of regular is just under $5 in Medford, $492 per gallon in Grants Pass.

Those prices are around 35 cents a gallon lower than a month ago. A woman accused of striking and killing a pedestrian near Selma and then fleeing will go to prison for nearly three years. According to the Daily Courier, 30-year-old Brianna Vineyard of O'Brien will also face three years of post-prison supervision after she pleaded guilty to felony hit and run. And tourism is once again on the rise in the Ashland area. A Rogue Valley Times report says a travel Ashland study indicating visits are up 9%. It used to be that San Francisco residents were the number one visitors, but Portland tourists are coming to the area more often and spending the most per trip.

Bill Meyer, KMED News. This hour of the Bill Myers Show is sponsored by Glacier Heating and Air, making sense of the heating and air business. What's your comfort level? At Glacier Heating and Air, your independent train dealer, our question is twofold. First, are you able to maintain a comfortable desire temperature in each room without a high energy bill? Second, are you comfortable with our estimate. Situations are unique, so repairs to an older system may be the best for you. Or a replacement with an affordable high-efficiency train system might be the answer. It's hard to start. It's hard to stay. Stop a train. Be comfortable calling Glacier Heating and Air. Call 664-0942. Your smile is the key to your health and confidence. Do you know that one out of two adults do not regularly see their dentist due to fear or anxiety? Hi, I'm Dr. Robert Johnson from Dental Excellence and I'm here to change

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Gentle back some dance Changing lives One smile at a time This is News Talk 1063 KMED And you're waking up with the Bill Myers-show It's a growing pushback Against artificial intelligence

Data Centers No Oregon has been kind of all in on this Especially with Well green energy and so much more And you think about it But they've also passed laws To force the data centers to get their own power as much as possible

in trying to protect us from spiking power rates. That hasn't worked so far. At least looking at my Pacific Power bill. But I wanted to talk with Steve Gorham about it. He's executive director of the Climate Science Coalition of America. And he's written a number of books on energy, climate change, sustainable development, all the rest of it, all those agenda is attacking us. Over 100,000 copies in print.

His latest one is Green Breakdown, the coming. renewable energy failure. Steve, pleasure having you on. Morning. Hey, Bill. Great to join you again. Why just break down here the basic tenets of your book here about the coming renewable energy failure because renewable energy in the state of Oregon and many other, well, many

other Western nations and continents have even gone all in on this. China is even all going in on a lot of this. In fact, they're making the solar power and the wind. turbines and all the rest of it. How can we be actually looking in your opinion at an energy failure rather than a wonderful utopia filled with a utopia, rather filled with carbon-free power? What do you think? Well, there's a lot of press about renewable energy, of course. But if you look at the overall statistics, it hasn't made a lot of headway. We still have more than 80% of the world's energy that comes from coal oil and gas, hydrocarbons.

and that's despite the world spending over $10 trillion in the last 20 years on wind and solar and biofuels. But there still are a lot of people pushing it. Regarding China, I think it's to be a little bit careful. I still get about 60% of their electricity from coal. And I have a feeling they build all these wind and solar devices so they can ship them all over the world. But they do have the largest installed wind turbine base in the world, but it's still kind of small compared to the rest of things going on. Yeah, I do understand, though, why China would be more in on that because China does not really have a lot of petroleum within their own nation, within their own border. Is that right? They have to import most of it.

Yeah, that's right. But anyway, we're now in the midst of an artificial intelligence revolution, as you mentioned. And this is something that promises to be bigger than the Internet. that for the last two decades, the U.S. power grid has been worried about putting in renewables and closing. We've closed more than 200 coal plants. But within about the last two years, they said, wow, where are we going to get enough power to power all these data centers are being built? So their focus has really shifted. And this is since November 22, to when OpenAI released chat GPT, their AI chat bot, which showed that it mastered the complexities of human language. It could talk to people just like a person.

And AI is pretty remarkable now. It can generate pose and poetry and videos. AI models score better on the bar exam than humans. and they just had an AI system that got 100% on the U.S. medical exam. We've also had Nvidia that supplies the graphics processing units become the most valuable company in the world over about four years. And now we have these hyperscalerscalers, as they're called, the big tech companies, Amazon, Microsoft, Google, Meta, Oracle,

spending about $750 billion this year. The numbers keep going up. In fact, if you total it all up, we're talking trillions really in this. And you're making the point, though, that your concern with artificial intelligence is not necessarily what can AI do for the people. I mean, there's certain tools that have some very valuable features. You're more concerned, I think, though, about the big government aspect of this. And I'm wondering if you could make your case on that. you don't mind state. Yeah, there's a lot of aspects to this. AIA promises all kinds of great

things that can do for medical and science and other things. There's a lot of downsides with fishing sort of things, with copyright issues with, I think we have about 60,000 of the kids are now doing their homework with AI instead of doing it themselves, so the schools have to change. But we also have this rising opposition, and much of it is political. We just had Senator Bernie Sanders and Representative Ocasio-Cortez introduced a bill into Congress called the Artificial Intelligence Data Center Moratorium Act, and they would basically like to stop the building of all data centers across the U.S. until we get a handle on AI, as they call it, and they say that AI is earning a lot of money for the wealthy and not much for regular citizens.

Do you think they may have a case to make that it may be? be a valid case, especially when every time, usually when you hear about AI being brought into a company, it's about how can we replace those pesky humans with them? Well, yeah, there's a number of concerns. So one of these is the amount of power that they use, of course. And I think the solution for states and for cities is for the big data centers, have them build their own power plants. And we see that going on across the world, across the country, I should say, President Trump has encouraged it also. It's called BYOP, bring your own power.

A second thing is water usage. There are many states that don't have a lot of extra water. And if data centers do evaporative cooling to cool the servers and the AI boards, that can put a lot of water, use a lot of water. You know, to your point, I was reading a story the other day, a listener sent me, that a typical chat, GPT, just one question, just one question. and of course billions of questions a day come in, but that just one question, typical question,

prompted on the chat GPT takes a bottle of water, like a bottle of drinking water, in a way, just one in cooling. Well, that's not, that's, well, it depends on the cooling type. So I was in a data center down in Houston, they were using air cooling. It was a small one, water at all. The other thing is now many of these are putting in contained systems. So they use water for cooling.

evaporates, but then it condenses within the system, and it's recirculated again. And that's what communities and states should be forcing data centers to do, do water recirculation. Then you fill the system initially, but after that you don't use much. And then the very big systems are starting to use non-conducting fluids. They're actually using oils to cool boards, and that doesn't use any water at all. So it really depends on what you're using. States and communities should say no evaporative cooling. That's not what we want, that used a lot of water. So that can be solved as well.

But then you talked about the job losses as well, which is a big concern. But so far we really don't see that. I think AI is going to be more of a tool that will enhance productivity. An example is a software engineer I know, works for a large bank. A year ago, he told me he thought AI wasn't going to amount to anything. I talked to him recently, and he says he's ahead of six sons. software teams. And he says, now all my engineers are using AI, both to write code and to test code. So it's a productivity tool, and it really is changing society, software, and a lot of other things.

But I don't think we've seen any evidence yet of a lot of people losing their jobs, but it's certainly going to change society. Yeah. Well, there is talk that a lot of people coming out of schools right now are saying, hey, maybe I should be getting into the trades right now because if AI is writing code, how many top code writers are they going to? Well, it could be. We'll just have to see. Productivity is going to go up. I think these are going to be tools for people to use. But again, there's a lot of people opposing this. Senator Elizabeth Warren just proposed a federal tax on artificial intelligence companies because she wants to redistribute the wealth. Well, you know, it's going further. You know, all I'm saying is that I've noticed that it's Democrats that are looking to tax this,

but of course, you know, traditionally that's the way we would always tend to look through the political lens at this, Steve. By the way, Steve Gorham, by the way, is his latest book is Green Breakdown, The Coming Renewable Energy Failure. The thing is, though, I guess when you have Elon Musk himself talking about a 60 to 70% reduction in workplaces

or work people needed, and he's big brain on this kind of stuff here, are the Elizabeth, I hate to say this, are the Elizabeth Warrens and the AOCs of the will possibly write that artificial intelligence will be the economy to a certain extent, and hence it should be tapped and not just part of the tech bro world here. What do you think? Well, I don't know.

I think it's sort of an excuse for big government again, and Bernie Sanders has also called for the federal government to take a 50% ownership in all big AI companies. So, I mean, there's a lot of reasons why AI is bad, people say, but but yes yes i want i want the government to be with the billion is that's what he wants right steve that's what he's looking for but these data centers are amazing what's going in my own in Oregon um since in the last two years you've built 16 new data centers according and i think i'm getting my data from u.s. data centers which i use and there are different estimates but some

of these states are going crazy indiana's built 84 new data centers iowa 73 new data centers Texas has built over 200 new data centers in the last two years. So they're building these things all over the place. And, you know, they're not like big warehouses. And I'm not sure I'd want one of these data centers next to my house. But if you have the land, these things return millions of dollars in tax revenue and other things to communities. So we do have some bans going on. Moderate, California has now banned all new data centers.

They're doing it in New Jersey. But then these AI companies just go to different states, and they build the data centers there. And so this is a – you know, I have an image that I show when I speak to groups, and it's an image of a 100-foot-tall tidal wave. And I call it the artificial intelligence revolution. And then down at the bottom is this little sailboat about 20 feet high, and I call that net zero energy policies. So do you think that ultimately the way –

Okay, pardon me, Steve, do you think that ultimately the AI wave, the gigantic tidal way that you're talking about at the top, that is net zero dead then? And is that why the renewable energy agenda is dead, or it will just be repurposed to be able to feed the beast of the AI wave? I mean, how do you see this plane? That's a big part of it. Yeah? Yeah, I'll give you another example. Larry Fink, who's the head of Black Rock, four years ago, encouraged all his companies that they were, you know, investors to get the net zero by 2050. And then three years later, he said, well, we can't use wind and solar for data centers.

They need 100 percent seven-day-a-week, 24-hour power, and women's solar are intermittent. They just can't provide it. You can't get away from that, no matter how hard. and if you were to replace or put a big renewable battery at every wind or solar generator, I mean, that's nice, but that would be cost prohibitive, or am I wrong about that? Yeah, it would be. Actually, though, we're starting to use some of these batteries for data centers because they have power fluctuations. So some of these AI companies are using batteries in that case.

But another example is Google. Google and all the big tech companies have these net zero targets. Google has net zero target of 2030, but they admitted a year ago that their emissions were up 51% in the last five years. And that's because of the only data centers, so they're not getting anywhere close. Wow, that just kind of blows me away. All of these big corporate companies that you've been talking about here had these big net zero things.

They've been doing the press releases for years now, talking about reducing carbon because we're killing the planet. and they've been part of the increase in emissions then. Ultimately, let me see where you're going on this, because I don't know if we, and I know the president's all big on drill, baby drill, where do you think our renewable energy failure could be turning into a proper energy future?

Where should we be going, in your opinion? I don't really think that is the case. I do, I think net zero is going to fail. You know, but if you're in Hawaii, and it's sunny and windy all the time, I mean, your own pipelines out there, then wind and solar is greater. If you're down in the desert somewhere, it can be effective. But the idea that we ought to force wind and solar on everybody to stop the oceans from rising,

that's modern superstition. That is not going to happen. So we're going to get back to sensible energy policy, and the AI revolution is accelerating that. Do you think that the AI revolution will break the back of resistance to nuclear? Maybe that's where I'll redirect the question here, Steve Gorham. Well, nuclear certainly has gotten a big impetus, a big push. The Trump administration has called for quadrupling our nuclear by 2050.

And they've also put a bunch of money out for all these small modular reactor plants. But nuclear still has a long, long way to go. It takes like 10 years to put in a nuclear plant. They're very expensive compared to gas. And all these data centers want to build this stuff within. two and three years. They want to put up all these. Elon Musk, even, down in Tennessee, he went and got all these gas generators that were used for disasters.

They were mobile generators. He brought him in to start up his data center. He got a data center started up in less than a year. But all the residents are complaining because these portable gas generators, it sound like jet engines. Sure, they made a lot of noise. Yeah, you bet. Yeah, they're not quiet like usual gas generators. So they've been after him.

He's fixing the problem now, but. but there's a time frame on all these things and waiting for a nuclear plant. You know, I think the small modular reactors can do some good things. We just have to see, though. They're still experimental. So where do you think this energy is going to be coming from, in your opinion, then, if it's not going to be renewable because of the problems, the intermittent and chaotic aspect of it, you can't really fix that aspect of it.

You don't have all the resources to be able to put a battery next to everyone, you know, to have it to store it. Well, most of it's natural gas right now. There's more than 200 natural gas power plants being built across the country. Texas has plans by itself for 140 new gas plants that are in construction or in planning. And by the way, Oregon still gets about 50% of your electricity from gas and most of the rest from hydro. So that's what's happening all over the country. We're building gas plants because they're faster and they're always on.

And by the way, you know, wind and solar, they cover such huge areas. You've got to go out and build transmission out to all these remote ridges and farmland and everything else. And that takes a long time. It's expensive. So right now the big winter is gas. We'll see. Maybe nuclear can ship in there as we go forward. Do you think that the oil industry here that we have in the United States?

You know, a lot of this has been the fracking revolution. The challenge with fracking, though, and I have to be honest about this, is that the fields tend to play out much more quickly than the older traditional. wells in which you would do deep drills, and most of those have played out. And so you're always having to go out and find a new place to do the fracking. Do you think that's where we're going to be turning since the renewable energy is not going to work out, in your opinion? Or, you know, what? How do you see it? We'll see. A lot of people will say we're going to run out. I think they keep finding more and more fields and ways to frack these. You know, we're now the biggest biggest producer, biggest exporter of liquefied natural gas in the world.

We're shipping it to Europe like crazy, and they're building more and more plants. So, I mean, you're right. At some point that they have to keep finding new fields to frack because they do run out of energy. Maybe geothermal might be. I think nuclear and geothermal are possibly good future bets. Looking at longer term, right? They may use fracking to get geothermal, which is. which is one of the technologies that it's going to be deployed, I think.

But we'll just have to see. Steve Gorham, the executive director of the Climate Science Coalition, and his latest book is Green Breakdown, The Coming Renewable Energy Failure. How long before you think that the powers that be, whether it's data center boys or just government officials in general, will realize that it's actually broken and you can't put up enough solar and windmills too?

Well, we're already seeing some of that, the, for example, B oil industry, BP, was beyond petroleum four years ago. Now they're getting rid of all the renewable projects. They said they're going to build all those renewables. They find they can't make any money on it. Net Zero Banking Alliance was a big net zero outfit with all the banks of the U.S. and around the world. That has totally collapsed in the last three years.

That's a group that was only four years old. But anyway, folks, you'd get my book, Green Breakdown, the Coming Renewable Energy Failure. They can get it at Steve Gorham, G-O-R-E-H-A-M.com. If they buy one, I'll send them a signed copy of that or my other books. And they're a lot of fun. They're color paperbacks, and they have about 150 color sidebars. Here's one that's in Green Breakdown. New York Times essay says you should mate with short people to save the planet.

Oh, I remember that story. Yeah. That's a real headline, and there's a whole bunch of those. We're in such a wacky world of energy right now. But anyway, the books are great reads. I guess we're going to have to start looking at what the big tech pros, not what they're saying, but what they're doing. Wouldn't that be a fair way of looking at this, Steve? That would be the case.

And by the way, Microsoft just suspended purchases of carbon renewable allowance. They paused them. They're like the biggest purchaser of carbon dioxide capture projects in the world. And now they've said, well, we're going to put this on a problem. paused. Well, Elon Musk got out of the renewable energy grift just in time, didn't he? Now it's going to be getting us on a IPO for the rockets. We'll see. All right. Steve, I appreciate that. And what's your website again? I just want to make sure people can find that. Steve Gorham, G-O-R-E-H-A-M dot com. All right. Someone may want to ask a quick question here. We'll get you on with him. Hi, who's this? Good

morning. Sure. Hey, this is great Scott from Grants Pass. Yes, Scott, go ahead. You've got a question for Steve Gorham? Yeah, I do. Steve, there's a lot of conversation online about these data centers, and one of the concerns that keeps coming up is, in China, they've got the control of your money, if you post stuff wrongly online, and they shut you down. Are we looking at that with these data centers? Is that really their purpose, an eventual purpose, to control everybody? Have you looked at that at all? Interesting question. Thank you very much, Scott? I don't think that is the case with data centers. But one of the problems with AI is that artificial intelligence is going to be a lot more effective for scams and other sorts of things.

I don't know about some of your folks, but I get five or really five fishing emails a day that if I click on them, they would capture my computer. So we're going to have a bunch of stuff with AI. You know, you can't believe a video anymore. They can stimulate voices on phone calls of your kids and everything else. AI is going to be able to do that. And I would also imagine then that your really hard password, your secure password to get into your banking account probably isn't so secure in this world. Yeah, people are going to have to be very, very careful, very careful. So AI is going to just add to the scams that are out there.

Unfortunately, it's one of the downsides, and we're going to have to find a way to try and stop that. But you were just saying a little earlier in our talk that a big thing with the AI, was also going to be the growth of government, or were you just looking at the government wanting to control AI as part of the big government? Right. I think that's just a progressive party now. Hopefully that won't cause the government to grow. And let's all these proposals are accepted by the rest of the Congress

to own parts of the AI companies and all that. I hope that doesn't happen. All right. Steve Gorham once again, Climate Science Coalition of America, and Green Breakdown, the coming renewable energy failure. I appreciate your take.

I'll always have you back. Thank you very much, too. Thank you, Bill. Be well. This is KMED and KMEDD HD1, Eagle Point, Metford, KBXG Grants Pass, translator K-294AAS, Ashland, and also K290AF Rogue River. Now, we're live from the Army Navy Marine Store, and you know there are stores that you run into.

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