Bittersweet Infamy - #77 - The Right Side of the Tracks

Episode Date: August 13, 2023

In this road trip special recorded in the forests of Jordan River, BC, Josie tells Taylor about the Militant Mothers of Raymur, who stood in front of speeding trains to make a better world for their children. Plus: a blurry glimpse of two of British Columbia's most elusive residents—the serpentine marine monsters, Cadborosaurus and Ogopogo.

What was that honk, Josie? What was that room, Josie? We're getting on the ferry. Where are we going on the ferry to? We're going to go short-space. How are you feeling about that? Feeling good. Feeling relieved because we pulled up to the kiosk and the BC ferry attendant's like you're late but it's okay because they're still in the ferry. Yeah you're late but it's fine but like wanted us to know that we were three minutes late. Yeah. Oh be careful when you're ferrying folks. These BC ferry's they don't fuck around.

They're tight, just getting to wolf. Mm-hmm. tight schedule. I have this potato fry. You can have that potato fry. What's she eating there? Potato fry? Where's that potato fry from? I think it's the potato fry. The potato is light,

which she got from the white spot on the fairy. What is it in your opinion about the fairy that makes the white spot taste so much better? A little bit of the views. What are you looking at? What's your V right now? I'm seeing some beautiful green hills rise out of some lovely cold specific waters. There's like a little lighthouse over there. Some rocky shores. What's the name of the ferry?

Right now, the ferry that we're on is called the Spirit of British Columbia. I prefer when it's like the one that we take up the coast is usually like queen of Syria, queen in an Imo, queen of something. I prefer to be on queens of things. I'm the king of queens, some might say. Look over there, that's a nice view too. For those who don't know, let me tell you a little bit about what white spot is. Back to the most important thing. Back to the basics. So every place has like a

I guess like a local fast food favorite, dining favorite that is favored by the locals and a source of local pride I understand yours is water burger yeah yeah that's a Texas yeah in in BC we have a place called white spot and white spot was first launched by an entrepreneur named Nat Bailey in the 1920s the first one was in Marpol on Granville in I think 67. The original one ended up burning down in the 80s. So he made this place called White Spot and it became most famous in the 50s as a drive in where everyone would wear white to show you that, look how clean we are, look how, which is, to me, that's a joke. Like, you can't, like, that's a bad idea.

Yeah. You'll get, what's it called, your period. It's just no good. Ice cream sandwich. Ice cream sandwich, baby. You can sit at a restaurant. These are real these are real concerns. They kind of changed it up to more of a diner like drive in, dinin, fast casual and then they kind of turned it into more of like a come here and look at pictures of BC on the wall and it's on all the fairies and when you get on the ferry, eat your white spot.

That's what you do. See you in the gift shop. Mmm. They sell all kinds of things at the ferry gift store. Jewelry. Oh, that's a good question. Is that who we're shopping for? They sell all kinds of things at the fairy gift store. Jewelry. Wish, oh, that's a good question, is that who we're shopping for? Yeah, let's get him something. There is, uh, now we're into the stuff.

Oh, an otter, I got an otter friend on the fairy, and you can get toy fairies that have... toy horns. Pretty good. Blacks, we got some Waldo. Life of a cowachan woman, life of a hida elder. The Canadian Business Owners Guide to Reconciliation. Mmm, my stream is in British Columbia. Now we're talking.

I don't know if they, ooh, cute. Mmm, mushrooms of British Columbia. Now we're talking. I don't know if they... Mmm, cute. Okay, but how much is too much for a Frenché person? Five bucks? It's four. I'm gonna buy you one, though. Oh, that's cute.

I'm sure you want one. I'll get you one, then, too. I like these colors. These are very like... I like these colors. BC. Matchy match, do you want to get matched ones? Let's do it. Sweet, let's do it.

So when our bodies are found in the water, they'll know that we were friends. That's true. Or that we were killed by the same person with like a ceremonial bracelet that they put on their victims. Damn it. A little kimono situation.

It says love and truth. Friends little kimono situation. It says, a lot of intruders. Friendship love and truth. Let's teach the friendship bracelet. It's gonna match in friendship kimonos. Absolutely. How much is too much for kimono? That's for a matching friendship kimono.

I mean, price. They don't really match. Well, no, we get the same money.ono. I mean price they don't really match Okay, I would say like 50 that's gonna be more 148 oh my god, I'm not that good friends with you sorry But what a what a what did investment in our friendship? Do you want to Bug out?

Yeah, okay No, those are both for her. She's Thank you for the 10, and I want to buy. Thank you, guys. You too. Take care. You see the shirt with like a cloth on it and said, here comes travel. All right.

Hey, everyone. This is me, Katherine. We have now run the platform. Alright. It's not a bad stretch of land, is it? No, it's absolutely gorgeous. Alright, here we are. Let's go make some magic. Go, move. Welcome to Bittersweet 604. That group can 1927 and hear it poverty, exploitation, bondage, torture, and the unspeakable vulgarities of a self-proclaimed Messiah. I even looked at the mic fucking to sleep, it was a bum. I thought if it was over, hold on sleeping, I don't want to be here.

Vizding, say here, Swindler and Brad Beaver murder. You are about to enter downtown East Side. You think you're a nut of brazer around Maul? Not all of a sudden we went in on Bangalow. Talks about it, since. I couldn't say no to Hela. Hay cunce, en Noco, Hela. En 10 Norge, en Prisa, Canada. Who was he? What was he?

That is the search use, the search use of brother files. Welcome. I hope it's not too loud. I do. I hope it's so loud that you can't even hear us. I'm going to the podcast. Welcome to episode 77 live out of beautiful river Jordan. The... Is it capital? We don't know. We have not seen any signs for a town called capital, but the map says capital. The map says sometimes. This is also known as DTEDA and it is the ancestral home of the Pachita First Nation to whom it was resold from

BC Hydro and... How do you mean resold? The Hydro on the land. Oh wow. Yeah, but it's been returned to them. It has been, okay, wow. Yeah, but recently. That's rad.

It's been a nice day. We're in a cute little... Yeah. Glamping set up with a 1970 VW van bug that we're sleeping in. It's lovely. There's hot water. There is hot water. And a little outdoor kitchen. A little outdoor shower.

It's a real glamping situation on Sal shooting star last night. Didn't wish. I forgot. Oh well. You were struck by the beauty of nature. the end of the best of us. We're talking a little quiet because it's late. Uh huh. It voices Carrie. It's true, especially in the forest. Too true. But that's enough talk about River Jordan. It's time to talk about what we're

really here to talk about. Before we left yesterday, we watched a movie. And it was the crash starring Alicia Silverstone in Carrie L.A.S. and I wanted to talk about before we left yesterday we watched a movie. And it was the crash starring Alicia Silverstone in Carrielwez and I wanted to talk about it, but the entire drive here. But I figured we should save it for the show. What did you think of the crash? Oh man. Problematic. Oh my god so many issues going on.

Lots of panning shots of Alicia Silverstone's 15 year old titties. Uh huh. Not exposed, but like lots of long pans of her wearing like swimsuits. She was actually 15 for the filming, the character's 14. Yeah. A lot of like evil conniving woman slash girl. Yeah, a little girl. Yeah, evil conniving little girl.

Evil conniving little girl. You down innocent man. Carry on as you innocent for Stereot prepubesant boobs. He kind of gets a happy ending with that journalist lady character that does not feel earned No, and she ends up I mean Watch the crush, but she ends up getting institutionalized. It's pretty rough But the real The real surprising thing of course, the whole thing was fucking shot in Vancouver. Naturally, I knew too. I was looking and I was like, is that Green

College? And I was like, Taylor, you think every fancy building looks like Green College at UBC? It's not. And then later they made it a lighthouse. I was like, is that Stanley Park? And so I googled it and sure enough, Vancouver, you know? Yeah, yeah. And we selected that movie without knowing that at all. No, I didn't know that. We're here for just Bittersweet 604 and Waxion movies, Set and BC, without even knowing it. Of course, you already know that because you listened to last week's awesome episode

about James Chamberlain, our friend, our kindergarten teacher friend, and then maybe you've listened to some of our other previous Vancouver episodes before. Yeah. Vindy Joe Hall. Uh, sex killer. Sex killer, Mick Barge.

The Mick Barge. We've talked about several infamous Vancouver Barges on the show. Mm-hmm. What was the other barge? There was like a barge. The Breiden Lit Barge. There was a barge that just, I don't know if it really had a name. You dabbed in front of it? I did dabbed in front of it.

I've dabbed in front of a Monet. I have a picture on my Instagram with me dabbing in front of a Monet. I went out of my way to take it. I look her down in history, my dude. I'll post it on the ground. It's what's it called, the sacred and the profane, you know? Yeah, yeah. I like the squid hat.

Like the squid, I'm also wearing a rainbow squid hat with big, googly eyes. It's very cute. It is cute. It is really cute. Yeah, it's keeping me warm. This is a chilly night. You gotta be careful in these woods.

If you're coming to the VW bug, dress up. It's gets a bit chilly chilly night. You gotta be careful in these woods. If you're coming to the VW bug dress up It gets a bit chilly at night. Yeah, we should write some, I don't know more fleece perhaps I was thinking when I packed a boat I'd read some reviews that it was on the colder side But we've got a little heater if it gets too bad. Yeah, don't worry about us. We'll be fine. Yeah, we're gonna make it We've dealt with worse than this. Yes. My mom packed me really nice for this. It's real cute We have little lights on the table, little flickering, because there's a campfire ban right now because everything is so dry.

Real dry. And so we've got some little twinkle lights just kind of on the table out here as we do everything. Big up to Annamaria. Big up Sanrio always. And just the loveliest packaging? Yeah, it was very efficiently packed too. I'm gonna talk about these little

Twinkle lights here because we opened them and they say batteries are required and it needs a screw to get the backing off to put the batteries in. I'm like oh man because in a marine packed batteries. I thought oh we're not gonna be able to do that. That's okay. Put them in the box again. I look later in the evening. The box is a light, a warm, delicious glow in the meeting. Yeah, and then I ate all the lights is a light, a warm, delicious glow in the meeting. And then you ate them all. Yeah, and then I ate all the lights in real. And I can see a low glowing, and it's tummy-like ET, it's nice.

It's keeping me warm, it's good, it's really nice. No, but thank you, you know, Rhea, that's the... Yeah, for sure. Much too sweet, much too sweet, I love it. You want them infamous? I do. Sweet, I can't wait to finally get this out. It's been a long day of reading books and writing and...

Big, big shovel check this before. Barely. Barely done. Taylor's full of me, Josie. This uh... Just this round. It's not for me. This van life, it's making me miss my deadlines

So uh Jozy when we were on maybe the ferry over or The scenic drive around the southern point of Vancouver Island, which for those of you who don't know Big old island right off the coast of uh bc in the Pacific oh wow, it's that bad huh the Pacific Ocean Uh and uh our our provincial capital Victoria is there along with a bunch of other cool, very beautiful communities with big trees and lots of green leafery. Yeah. And so while we were riding, did you get the chance to stare out of that ocean?

Did you see anything? I mean, we were driving. I guess you should probably keep your eyes on the road. Though it's certainly on the ferry over, we had a lovely ferry ride and watched in the beautiful water, beautiful scenery go by. Did you spot any maritime and or marine marine? We settled on marine. Did you spot any marine creatures? I saw some perhaps marine birds.

I did not spot any whales or dolphins. Well, we're not spot any whales or dolphins. Well, we're not talking about whales. And we're not talking about dolphins because Josie, where there is water, there is what? Water monsters. Known bat. Some call them cryptids, others water spirits. Still others say that they are usually fish or logs that have simply been misinterpreted. Whatever the case. So misunderstood.

So who can say? Whatever the case, as early as the 1790s, European colonists spotted seamhaunsters in the coastal waters of what settlers call British Columbia. Okay. Of course indigenous communities have their own accounts of snake-like spirits, submerged giantuses,

and all manners of water-based supernatural figures from Madhose to Seashot to Komax to Belacula or Lervet, Parksville, Euclula. The list goes around the province. And certainly anywhere with water, be it a river, lake, or ocean. Listen to that wind. Ooh, the trees are moving.

I'm really trying to take you here, folks. There are trees they are moving. They're moving and moving. They're tall too. They're having that wind way up there. They're high-fiving God. But perhaps no Pacific Ocean sea monster is more well-known or well-loved than Cad Borosaurus. A Cad Borosaurus. Cad Borosaurus. C-A-D, B-O-R-O, Saurus. Like, like, Broncosaurus. A real dinosaur.

Is this, is this like funded by Cadbury eggs? Is this not that? Cadbury chocolates. It's the reason that it gets its name. It's also, it's also a-k-a-caddy. So I'm gonna be calling it caddy. It's a little, it's, it's, it's messy, you know? Okay, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Most associated with Cadboro Bay, which is where it gets its name. Tittity. It's an inlet near Oak Bay in Sanwich, which is the ancestral home of the song he's First Nation. We drove through Sanwich on the way up here. Yeah.

Caddy is said to have a horse or camel shaped head, a serpentine body that unilates through the water. Lockness-esque. Lockness-esque, and it may be furry, hairy, scaled, or wrinkled, depending on who's seeing it. Get it all in there. Don't miss one description.

Not worth missing. So while there were sightings of various serpentine mysteries in the Pacific, it wasn't until 1933, the same year that lockness monster sightings saw an explosion of popularity in Scotland. Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. The sightings of Cadbury Soros across the pond, continent and pond started in earnest.

Over the past century there's been all kinds of spectral sightings and salvaged marine remains that have been attributed to Caddy. In 1934 they found the 30-foot long remains of what was purported to be Caddy in Prince Rupert andt ended up being a basking sharp. In 1936 there was some remains were found on camp fircom which I love because I was a camp counselor there so I felt very and I wrote that story. Remember that story I wrote about that mermaid that washed up on the shore? Yeah I remember that. That was happening at camp fircom in my head. So local boy. Local boy. Local boy. Local boy. Local boy. Local color. Local flavor. It's all happening. The boy made good local boy continues to make good Where's quit hat? That's what makes it good

So it makes it so good man life is good. There's a little rock over this his life is good Now you agree I got this hat the camp for come remains what happened there was somebody made Probably a fake kind of so there's like a there's a bit of there's a lot of staged caddy remains apparently it's like it became a little bit of like a local pastime in and around the time that caddy was kind of exploding in popularity. Weird art let's go. Let's go. In 1937 a similar creature was flanced from the stomach of a sperm whale in Naden Harbor in Hyde Gwai, ended up being a fetal baleen whale. Oh, rough.

In 1941, a carcass washed up on Kitsalon O'Beach in walking distance from my home back in Vancouver. Yeah. The popular name for the carcass was Sarah the Sea Hag, but it was neither Sarah nor Cadi, but a humble shark. There are many other examples. I gave you a bunch from the 30s, but there's many other examples of Cadi sightings.

All of which ended up being a hagfish, a shark, a seal, a whale, falsified remains, etc. Yeah, and it's throughout different eras. It's not just like a 30s phenomenon kind of thing. Yeah, it experiences a re-boom in popularity in the 90s, and I'll talk a bit about that. Okay. To devoted Cadbury Hallics, man. But... You two can chase the world. Absolutely, be the change you want to see.

So of course, Caddy, like all spooky monsters, did reader ratings in the newspapers and so unscrupulous journalists and fame seekers made a little cottage industry of falsifying Caddy's sightings, Caddy remains. Yeah. Cause it'll make the paper, I'll get attention, or I'll, I found the writer.

I'll get, yeah. Isn't this an episode of Losers Boocies? It sounds like it. They get hired to create a sea monster to bring tourism to the small community. This is basically it. Yeah. It was journalist Archie H. Willis who popularized the name Cad Brosaurus with a series of articles he wrote documenting the creature in the Victoria Daily Times based on a name suggested in the letter by reader I Vassedom Later on a pair of researchers the caddiemaniacs that I was Telling you about there Paul LeBlanc who's a marine biologist and Edward Boosefield who's a retired University of BC

Oceanography professor. Oh Would Carrie Archie's torched Archie Willis the the newspaper reporter as they helped generate an explosion of press around Cadbury source in the 90s by publishing Research as well as photos sourced from archives of anything that might be Cadbury source various remains and and skeleton salvaged throughout the years Wait, they falsified research and published it. No, they don't falsify research. They believe it. Oh, they're very into Caddie And so basically what they would do is they are all the modern by the way. Oh yeah, go go go pods. Um, our motto is 2Mass which is Latin for go pods. But they they believed it, so that they were just like kind of trolley archives for like old photos of like here's a mysterious thing that washed up and we don't know what it is and they're like,

Caddy, I know what that is. I can see what that is. With my no-nice. Yeah, with my professionally trained eyes. I went to grad school. So of course, all of these photos typically have some sort of more rational explanation attached. This is the 90s? Yeah. A crest in this knee-found relevance came in 1992 when boosts field and LeBlanc delivered a talk about Cadbury's source at the American Society of Zoologists' annual meeting. Oh damn! They told the gathered academics about all their caddy theories, including that the creature may be a relative of Loch Ness and OgoPogo. Okay, so just going on going on those as other factual beings in the world. Now Josie, it's time for a hard

pivot because the difference between these two figures is that while Cadbury Saurus is fake, Ogopogo is real. He's the OG. Okay. O-P-O-G-O. So Josie, da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da da and then then, secret second minifimus. I have been noticing that postcard. All we have on. All we have on. All we have on. Okay, so what we're seeing here is a cartoon rendering of a very, he's just a little guy. He's just a little guy.

He's a guest song glasses. He's at the beach. He's having a day at the beach. He's got a little bucket in the pale. He's, he's living the life. Mm-hmm. He's at the water's edge. There's some lovely yellow sand, sandcastle,

frisbee, beach ball. Is that, I think that might be suntan lotion? You're describing everything but ogo poke. Well, and okay, above Ogo poke, it dragon, and then no wings, the rest of it is like maybe a curly slug. A snake, a snake. A snake. A sea serpent. A sea serpent, a sea serpent, a snake. A sea serpent, a snake.

A sea serpent. Yeah, and he's having a great time. Love him life. He's having a little, he's having a little drink with him too. Oh, he's turning up. I'm just, it might be some water. You might be drinking Okay, I wanted to

Do a little extra infamous, but I've already had so much work on my plate So the way that I rationalized it is Uh, yeah, anything that I can fit on the back of this postcard Tight all your notes right there. So here's what's up. Oh wait, wait, also polluted, Josie, you write notes on some street. Straight notes.

The Morph is in progress. Basically, Okenoggin Lake is a large freshwater lake. It's a region called Pompson, Okenoggin, but noncoastal BC for you, it's your soul. It's a region called Pompson, Okanagan, but non-coastal BC for your soul. It's a valiant in the interior. Yeah. Grow wine there. Yeah, they share too. There's a lot of wine tours, wine, wine, everything. Never been. I went once. As we stayed on Okanagan Lake, no sightings of Ogo Pogo, sadly. He is said to be an undulating serpent-like creature thicker than a telephone pole

Oh up to 50 feet in length moving at incredible speeds and you called him Ogo apparently the diminutive for him is Ogi is the calm Ogi, okay, okay. Excuse me pardon me. I'm bad with names. It's okay. You haven't been introduced yet the sikhwemk and Siylch nations have a water serpent called the Naitaka. And this is believed to be, he's more malevolent than the one that appears on the postcard. Yeah, that guy's pretty friendly. Yeah, he's just chilling.

Well, once he's done that vodka, look out. He switches. He's one of those. A lot of them can turn people very aggressive. Crazy. There was a visiting chief who was said to have like disparaged the Naitaka and said oh that's not real that's fake bullshit and then of course when he took his boat to the water Naitaka got it right? Yeah.

One member of the SEAL Pat Raphael says that their concept of the Naitaka wasn't actually malevolent and that was the result of like a mis-translation between those people and white people. And they actually had Ha-ha-e-ku, who was a benevolent water spirit. Okay, yeah. There's a difference. But either way, I said that he kind of had like these environmental effects. He could create storms and shit. The name, Ogo Pogo, might have come from an English musical hall song about

creature whose mother is an earwag and whose father is a whale and try not to think too hard about the mechanics of that sexual encounter. Susan Allison was the first white settler to see Yogo Pogo in 1872 and there have been sightings ever since a Nat Geo channel did a special investigating in 1969 sighting and afterwards they were like it was probably an otter or a beaver. So the penultimate thing that I will tell you about Yogo Pogo is it's a big in 1969, citing. Oh. And afterwards, they were like, it was probably an otter or a beaver. Yeah. So, the penultimate thing that I will tell you about OgoPogo is it's a big tourism draw in the 1980s, a cash reward was given, but it had to be alive because green piece,

that's from Vancouver, you know. So they waved in, they're like, no, no, no, the reward only comes if you can get him alive. Like a video footage of him alive. And so, of course, all of these videos have poured in and people have come and there are ogopogo statues that look a lot more like this friendly guy. Yeah, the scary one. The other thing is that they declared the ogopogo

in endangered species as a publicity stunt. Oh. Kind of bring attention. He was said, the Naitaka version, was said to live on an island in Okanagan Lake called Rattlesnake Island. The very last thing I did when I was doing this research was just kind of click on that.

If you like, I wonder if anything interesting, it like happened on Rattlesnake Island. Yeah. And there was a story about a guy who built an Egyptian themed golf course on Rattlesnake Island. I was like, I'm sure the logo indigenous folks fucking love that. Yeah, that's what you do. It turns out that story has everything

Including a documentary. Oh So you can expect that in season four Or five or six whenever I get around to it, but I am gonna do it for the show It sounds really fucking interesting. I had no idea it happened. So there you go I'll say I know that one when you share it. You know it. No Do you share it again? I know you can be like they film that one in the open it. You know it? No. Now I do. So when you share it again, I will know. You can be like they film that one in an open hug and I heard. You'll have to stay tuned for that, but for now, stay sweet. And as Holt Skado says in the ninth Nancy Drew PC adventure

game, danger underception island, which takes place in the sandwands. Watch out for Caddy. My story. We're gonna get back in the car, get back on the ferry. Okay, go back. Head back to East Vans. So glad we came all the way up to the bush for this. Well, I only got one full story. That's true, and you want it to be this one. And yeah, I wanted it to be this one.

It is kind of funny though, because where we were recording, it's like so for our studios, East Cordova, extreme and the close to the epicenter of this story. Oh wow, okay. But you know what, it's so for our studios, East Cordova, extreme and the close to the epicenter of this story. Oh wow, okay. But you know what? It's good. It's good. Because our Magginations are nimble. Mine's pretty good. We can... Slander and... Potty?

Svelte? Yeah. Yeah. We can do this. This is how it goes. The boat is capable of this. Yeah. I forgot about that. I don't remember that one always. Imagine Vancouver you said, here we are. You are standing on the railway tracks.

And a train is barreling at you. What the fuck? The train horn is sounding. The ground is shaking because this big bad boy is so heavy and it's moving so fast that wet Vancouver air is hugging you close. As this train comes straight for you down the tracks, you're reminded of just how god-awful big trains actually are once you see them up close and how incredibly fast they can move. If it doesn't come to a complete stop, even just a slow little roll, it will squash you

as matherines. Where are you? I'm watching. Oh, don't the story. I mean, interesting because I think the real question here is why in the world are you standing on the real rich? You're standing there because this is where your kid has to walk every single morning To get to school this train track. There's no signal. There's no arm that comes down usually at a railway stop. Yeah. There's no safety crossing guard to help your kid get across. It is just straight railroad that gravel, the wooden beams. I know what a railway traffic light. Okay well I'm painting a picture okay. There's a happy cloud in the sky, okay? Oh, maybe, the last happy cloud all I ever see. Yeah, if this train does not stop, you live not far away

in a housing project. It's called Raymer. Okay. And it's in the Strathcona neighborhood, kind of on the edge of the downtown east side, consider the downtown east side, I'd say. But Strathcona is maybe a little bit further south of at least East Hastings.

Sure. And this is in Vancouver, the city. British Columbia, Canada, the world. Mm-hmm. The school that your kid is zoned to is Admiral Seymour Elementary School. It's only a few blocks away from where you live in Raymer. It's an extremely short walk, which is great,

but your kid has to cross these tracks to get to it. The trains can barely through or if they're not speeding through this area, they stop completely right on the tracks. Blocking the way. Blocking the way. Yeah. That's because this neighborhood is between downtown Vancouver and the Barard in lit shipping container depots. And the trains often slow down to a stop here and they almost it's almost like they're idling right across this crossing to wait and be called into the train depot. So they sit there and sit there sometimes for hours. So when your kid is crossing to get to school early in the morning, maybe they come home

for lunch, maybe it's after school, the school is so close that in the morning at least they can hear the lightbell sound on the other side of the train tracks. Yeah, and as you can imagine, your kid is a fucking kid, your kid is your kid. What's that? I guess I'm not here standing in the railroad tracks, that's true. So they're gonna climb up on the railway car and jump between the two connected cars to get down onto the other side or they'll take off their backpacks, throw it through a gap between the wheels of the train and crawl under the train. Tons of very bad idea. Yes, exactly.

You have seen your kid do this before from your apartment window, and it has freaked the goddamn shit out of you. It is fear of God. It is so incredibly dangerous because all reasons the train could get started again. They could just slip and follow their own accord. And even if a kid just fell on the other side, they'd be kind of scary, but the idea of the train

moving, perhaps sucking them under, it could be a very disastrous encounter. So you decided to do something about it. Evidently. You stand on the tracks and you demand that the train stop. Taylor, this is the story of the militant mothers of Raymer. And how, in 1971, a group of single moms decided to stand up to the, at best, the himming and haing of the railway companies and the city of Vancouver officials, or at worst it was their willful negligence to protect a marginalized community. And this story is about how a group of mums stood up to these Goliaths to ensure that their kids could safely cross the tracks to school. Awesome, I'm in. Can't wait. Their hard work created a solution that is still being used by Admiral Seymour Elementary School

students and Vancouver pedestrians at large today. I don't know this. Tight. I haven't heard of it. Cool. Awesome. So let me tell you a little bit about the Ramer Housing Project. Sure.

The official address, 400 Campbell Avenue, it consists of two separate towers with 350 rental units between the two of them. One tower is designed for elderly and the other is for families. In between them? How do I live there? I have a son in the story. Or a good daughter. You said son, didn't you? I said kid.

Oh my. Telling, I'm telling on myself. In between there's some still multi-story but it's like a lower row housing units that are between. It's now currently called Stamps Place. So if you're playing the Vancouver game, that's what you would go and look for instead of the name Raymer. Okay. But at the time, in the 1960s, Raymer was built at the tail end of the post-World War II social housing boom in Vancouver. Vancouver has always, at least through its modern history, has been a liberal-leaning city.

And the intention to have every citizen's basic needs met has been an important part of city politics. Notice I mention intentional because the actual execution is not always proof of this. Sure, sure, especially depending who you are and what part of town you live in. Exactly. Yeah. And we're talking about a part of town that, well, the downtown east side. Infamous. Totally totally it's actually one of the city's oldest neighborhoods Because it's built just east of what is now the downtown core. It's home to some complex Social issues the downtown east side is that so you don't say Disproportionately high levels of drug use

Homelessness poverty crime. How do you know the downtown east side to be? I think of the downtown east side as something that rich people like to avoid. Yeah. The reputation that like, you're not safe there, you're not safe there. And it's very well known for its poverty, it's well known for its sex work. I guess it's sort of seen as emblematic of like a lot of the injustices that indigenous people face in Canada because like you say it's a place where the marginalized end up and Canada is built on the marginalization of indigenous people. Right, yeah totally.

It's a neighborhood that when I signed up as a UBC student to do like outreach work. I was an everybody who signed up for this was assigned to the Downtown East Side, some type of soup kitchen or social programming. I was at the YWCA Crab Tree, which was like specifically for women, typically young mothers who were getting over drug addictions. It's the part of town that tourists

are told like don't go down there. Yeah, it's not scenic and it's somewhere that we talked about I think in another episode, Helen the Olympics happened. They kind of tried to put a fresh coat of paint on it and push the people kind of to the side and you know don't look over here, it's not important. Yeah, gentrification is a big issue in the downtown east side because there's such a huge population that needs help or is suffering from poverty or crime or drug addiction and then the idea of like gentrification where you get pushed and pushed and pushed out is so antithetical to what the community actually needs and what the community can actually do because that's the other thing is like,

there's a high proportion of drug use and all these things we've talked about, but it's also a really tight knit community. And people work really hard to make connections there. Keep people safe. Yeah, because nobody else is gonna do it for you. Exactly. You've got to help each other.

Yeah, and in a lot of ways, it's a really beautiful community because of that and this story takes place kind of like I was mentioning on the edge of it it's not on East Hastings which is the main thoroughfare of the downtown east side but there is definitely a reason that public housing was placed on Raymer Avenue where the Ramer housing project is. Right. So this housing project was built in the late 1960s and it's right alongside Railway Tracks, which run parallel to Ramer Avenue. Those tracks run under the Hastings Street viaduct,

ending in the Campbell Avenue docks at the southern end of the Broad inlet. And as we've mentioned in other episodes, like Mick Barge and the Barge and Max Taylor dabbed in front of. The first barge I dabbed in front of. The rest is still under it and as Natasha Beddingfield says.

Nanguvers is a huge shipping port. And specifically for shipping containers, for boats. Oh yeah. Oh huge, huge, massive, massive shipping out of the ports. And so those shipping containers get offloaded from boats from huge barges, and they get put on to trains to be dispersed in London elsewhere. When we talk about a railway system that's transporting stuff, we're talking about a lot of industry, a lot of port action that they're seeing. So the railway tracks that are right next to Ramer housing are used by the Canadian National Railway, which leases the tracks from another

railway company called Burlington Northern Railway, and they also lease it from both civic and federal governments. It's kind of a big messy glob of private-slash public-slash-leash-wanted land. Sure. And right next to it is this public housing. Raymer was built in a location that early in the city's planning, local officials and railway management understood that there would be a considerable need for pedestrian infrastructure. Like a lot of railway tracks laid through what

would become city, right? And these spots, these crossing spots were earmarked. Only a few were actually constructed, though. One being the Hastings Street Viaduct, which I mentioned earlier, which for me, that that like land bridge is essentially what it is. It kind of marks like an entry or an exit into the downtown east side for me. Like once I know I'm on that, it's like I'm going into the downtown east side for me. Like once I know I'm on that, it's like I'm going into the downtown east side or I'm going to like hasting sunrise.

I don't mean this but it is perceived this way. It's what marks the wrong side of the tracks. Exactly. Yeah and we're going to talk a little bit about that too. And that viaduct is a land bridge over the tracks. That specific viaduct was built in 1914 between the wars when there was still pretty much the money available for it. But the responsibility to create other safe crossing points was bandied about between real-world companies and the city that kind of you pay it for, no you pay for it, no you pay for it, no you pay for it. Yeah, that's good. Yeah. All the while, nothing is being built. Nope. And the infrastructure surrounding housing projects like Raymer or surrounding the downtown east side is just being neglected.

Right. So, you mentioned just now the wrong side of the tracks. Metaphorically? Mm-hmm. That phrase comes from exactly what it sounds like, railway tracks. Yeah. Typically, and this is true for a lot of North American cities, the east side of cities, downtown east side, east Houston, where I live, are known as the less desirable places in town.

What's that about? That has to do with the way that the planet turns Which is kind of weird. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, tell me the real reason please No, don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Not always of course because I have weather patterns, but typically wind blows Typically wind blows eastern Lee if you have any kind of smoke smog Smelling rendering plants oil refineries. Yeah, yeah, it's gonna blow to the east got it railway pollution railroad pollution It I think a really good visual is like

Imagine that firebane is lifted and there's a group of people sitting around this campfire right next to us here that is cool and sad, yeah. But if it were crackling with fire and wonderfully warm, there would be smoke blowing. Yeah. Where that smoke blows would be eased and whoever gets to sit there has to endure that smoke. True, this is fucked. I just thought when wherever it wanted,

I took a great, like many times. I mean, we're talking like in a very general sense, right? Of course, of course. The wind patterns change, et cetera, but like predominantly because of the way the Earth turns, uh, look at the fucking sky. Yeah, dude. Wow. That's the big dipper right there.

Mm-hmm. I like putting out the big dipper because I know the big dipper and I know Orion. That's the only ones I know. That's why you need campfire. So that's generally why the eastern sides of cities and towns are known as the wrong side of the tracks. Because it's undesirable geographically, and so who gets to live there, or who is forced to live there, rather are marginalized people. Right, people who are impoverishedished or otherwise socially unsupported, which often leads to poverty. Yes. In February, 1967, just as the construction on the

Ramer Housing Project was being completed, there's reports of a 12 year old boy who fell from a train and lost six of his toes. Geez, porrecito. Jesus, perrecito! Yes, little baby. Poor guy. So the Chesa cona neighborhood council wrote a petition to the city to build a safety crossing over this railway track for the neighborhood.

This was happening, like I said, right at the completion of Raymer's Housing Project. So there was also gonna be this big influx of kids moving to the area who would use this specific site where this kid lost his toes to cross to get to school. So there was precedent for a request to have some type of safety crossing. For sure, and there was a precedent of the consequences of not having the safety crossing, it wasn't hypothetical, something bad had happened to a child. Yes, exactly. In response to this initial petition, the city commissioned a committee to inspect

the feasibility of building an overpass. Not a fucking feasibility committee. That's like five steps removed from where you want to be. Especially after a 12 year old boy loses some toes. Some toes, a majority of toes, more than some. That's true. He's only got four little biggies left to port out. Yeah. The city also chatted with railway companies who said that they would build a fence

at this particular juncture, so that all pedestrians would be forced to walk to Union Street to cross where there's actually a signal arm. How far away is that? Probably like two blocks up. OK. At the time, it was still a pretty busy street. So it's not really a worthy option. It's kind of like a band-aid to this to the situation. In the late 60s, after

Raymar is built, there's this influx of young families who come. It's also this time of great social people. Drink at home. Increasingly, there's more robust social protest for civil rights, for women's rights, the anti-war movement, and this is across North America. BC is certainly in the mix with this. There's all types of protests happening, bus strikes, from Vancouver, of special note I think I want to earmark this. The abortion caravan rolled out of Vancouver headed towards Ottawa to protest safe and equal access to abortion and birth control for all women, which I'd never heard of this. The abokava? Yeah. I didn't hear it either. But I've knated it. The abokava.

I noticed that was nice. So generally there's just lots of social movement going on. The air is like crackling with change. Yeah. Change is gonna come. That's what I've seen in those, you know, here's picket signs, here's wood stock. Here's Jimmy Hendrix. He's from Vancouver, you know?

Hey, yeah, there's that little shrine over on Union Street. Yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, Union to Maine. Raymers built influx of young families. Many of them are headed by young single moms, which we don't even know. Milletin's mother is someone's egg.

Some might say. Young single moms who you could easily argue are some of the most overworked and unrecognized members of society. Oh, baby, and how? Mm-hmm. So the early 70s in the family tower, the Raymer tower that was designated for your families,

the majority of the families living there were single moms with their kids. And they lived there for various reasons, right? But to give you some anecdotal evidence, there was one militant mom, her name's Carolyn Jerome. She had two daughters at the time, one aged three and one age six, and they were repeatedly evicted from different apartments throughout the city. And sometimes it was like their lease was up and didn't get renewed. Other times it was a little bit more nefarious. She's a black Canadian, and a single mom, she didn't know what could be the reason for all these evictions. She surmised as perhaps both the color of her skin and the fact that she was a single

mom. But she applied for public housing because it meant that it would be stable for her two daughters. For sure. She could not be evicted they didn't have to move four times a year. They could stay in the same school district. That's tough. You even imagine?

Moving socks, I hate moving. Taylor really hates. I fucking hate, I've, I've, I lose my mind when I have to move. It's not okay. Try moving like two little ones. Oh my God, four times a year and into some other shitty place

that you don't really wanna be, that breaks my heart. Yeah, exactly. Or are you getting to a good place and then you get to get out, yeah. Living at Raymer wasn't always easy. The applications or the bureaucracy of getting in is a lot to go through and once you get in there's some pretty draconian regulations enforced for one. At this time in the late 60s early 70s there were no guests allowed after a certain time of

night. This was enforced by a housing commissioner office that was stationed right next to the elevators. So they were like keeping an eye on everybody who entered and didn't. Which, you know, at a certain level, like safety first, good good. But also are you being like surveilled and if so why? Yeah, and these are grown-ass women raising humans.

Like if they want a friend to come over. They're allowed. They're allowed. Even more than a friend perhaps, who cares? Yeah, that's fine. And because, I think probably because the housing commissioner office was right next to the elevators, they were constantly reminded of it, these young mothers. So when they entered the elevators, they'd start chatting and kind of complaining about, like, oh gosh, this guy. Yeah. And the elevators became this kind of social space for them.

Interesting. Yeah. They would talk about their kids, they talk about the annoying regulations, whatever you can fit in between the stops on the second and fourth floor. Yeah. And then eventually the discussions turned to talking about the trains. Yeah, I got it. And the train tracks and how all the kids had to cross these train tracks to get to school and that didn't seem very safe at all. If you hear occasional wishing it's because my gay squids tentacles

are banging against my face while I shake my head. It's beautiful. It's a natural wonder, who really is? Ooh, look at me, a natural wonder, thank you. There were moms who lived on one side of the building that had a view of their kids who could walk to school, which you'd think, oh, that's wonderful. Like I can walk,

send them down, pack their lungs, send them down. Make sure they get their safe. Yeah, done, done, done. But then they would have to watch them. Check their bag through the carts and clamber over and be like, I hope it doesn't fucking start moving and it'll sever her toes. Yes. So that created a lot of talk in the elevators and eventually they decided to do something about it. Together a few of the moms planned out a calling campaign. They called the railway companies, Canadian National Railway and the Burlington... Co-factory? Yes.

Burlington Northern Railway. Which who knows their connection to Burlington Co-factory? Um, prequel. Let's get rid of these trains and just focus on the code size. We're going in two different directions. It's old. They also called the city of Vancouver itself to explain the situation and get something resolved. Yeah, I would think this would be their purview.

Right, totally. And remember, this is not the first time that somebody has made these requests the silicone and apron console yeah yeah it's just that this housing was brand new so everybody in there was new to the neighborhood more less right so they don't know the full history of complaints about it right yeah yeah but certainly the city would have on record what these were even if they didn't yeah even if they didn't. Yeah, even if they didn't. Look at a map. It makes sense. You put social housing, fill out kids, and then put a elementary school on the other side of the railway tracks. It's no fucking sense. Very basic city planning. Maybe we should provide a safe way. But if that had happened in a more wealthy and desirable neighborhood, they

probably would have fixed it. Yeah, or it maybe would have happened at all. It would have been a problem. Yeah. Because at some point, at some city council meeting, a rich white lady would have stood up and wagged her finger about it and something would have been done. Exactly.

But certainly the request from Raymer is more than reasonable. It's kind of a very easy go to. Kids are unsafe. Please make them safe. People don't like that. Yeah. Historically. like that. Yeah. Historically.

Most people. What can you guess, though, Taylor? The concerns of single moms living in public housing. How do you think they were received? They probably went on the conveyor belt that goes right into the furnace. I think that might be it. Yeah.

They even went to the housing commissioner, right? There's an office right there by the elevator going chat with them. Yeah, true. Right. It's actually quite convenient. Yeah. Yeah. All they got was the same cold shoulder.

Yeah. And they were told that's out of our jurisdiction. Right. That is city and federal and railway land. When everyone you talk to says it's out of their jurisdiction, what are you to do? Well, stand in front of it. Yeah, I got it. I don't remember. No. The ones don't quite get there right away.

Well, no, you've got to go through a few phases before you get to stand in front of the train. You start meeting in each other's apartments, drinking tea and talking about swapping recipes and shit. Right. Yeah. Yeah. How you possibly could unnormalize this train schedule and these profits, right? Because that's part of it. If you're trying, these companies are trying to get goods across the city.

Right, so I didn't think anything that reroute certain delays that cost money. Exactly, yeah. Or jobs or both. Or whatever, yeah. So they start putting together petitions. Petitions are being signed. The phone calls are still coming in to the city, to the railway companies, to the housing

commissioner. And they ask very specifically, here's a solution you can do. Restrict train traffic in the mornings so that no trains are running when kids need to get to school between 8.39 Restricted for kids who return home for lunch give us 12.30 to 1 and Then at the end of the school day go ahead and just don't run trains from 3.30 to 4 or whatever it is Okay, so take these half hour blocks and just don't run trains during those times Yeah, and it's the schools's honest to honest strict schedule. The kids can be honest strict schedule.

That is fine. Here are the times when we were requesting that you do not run the train. Okay, I think that's, I mean, I'm sure that there are all kinds of like logistical slash scheduling reasons that the relevant people will respond with. But like, at least on paper, that seems like we're not asking you to reroute an entire train. We're just asking you to stop

running it when her kids are going to school. Yeah, considering that like kids' lives are on the line. And toes. And toes. Lots of them. Six toes. Oh god, that was a rough day at the cleanup. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah. Or so when there are phone calls and weren't being answered, when their letters weren't being responded to. These moms and Raymer had to do something. The initial group was probably about 12 women and they gathered on the tracks in the early morning of January 6th a cold winter day and the train was coming from the waterfront so it was heading south toward Broadway. These moms in their coats, maybe some from Burlington Go Factory. Oh wow, I mean, why support the enemy? I don't know.

Yeah, who knows. They link arms and like I mentioned before, they could feel the ground moving under them. Scary, scary, and I love this. I love this. I'm sure weight of this train, barreling at them. So we've got the unstoppable force, a train barreling at full speed versus the movable object, a group pissed off moms. Yeah. Interesting.

Yeah. The moms are a little worried. Well no, Shes. I was worried when you were talking about that. They hope and hope and hope that it will stop. They hope that it will stop in time as well. Yeah, because you know if they pulled the thing to stop it, it could, yeah.

And then if you're lucky, maybe you're missing some toes at the end. Exactly. Luckily enough, it did stop. It came to a complete stop before it got to the mums. Off-popped the railway workers, all men, who get on to the gravel and start yelling at them. At the mums, you could have been killed. Go home, be wives.

To who? They're single asshole. I know. Well, then kind of comes into play this stereotype of the lazy welfare mom. Yeah. Right? And apparently some of the mothers reported that they had been yelled at and told, and I quote, get out of bed and take your kids to school.

Yeah. I made an appalled face bed and take your kids to school. Yeah. I made an appalled face. Yes, it was super awesome. I said, by that turn over. Yeah. And then the mom's very calmly explained, this is where our kids need to cross to get to school. And this is unsafe. And we've made all the requests, the polite requests that we can. And now we're taking action.

The railway bigwigs come down and they yell at the mom's son too. Yep, yep, yep. City hall officials even make it appearance that day and they come down and- Oh that's so nice that they can have such a quick turnaround. Right, yeah, all of a sudden. And they say you need to come to City Hall and explain yourselves. What is going on? This is ridiculous, they say. But there's a bus strike going on at this time. Oh yeah, the bus. So the moms are like, how in the world are we gonna get there? Yeah, City Hall for references

nowhere near the downtown east side. It's almost near where I live. You go up towards Broadway. It's on a candy and Broadway. Yeah. One of the militant mothers, her name's Carolyn Jerome. You mentioned you're before? up towards Broadway. It's on a candy and Broadway. Yeah. Yeah. One of the militant mothers, her name is Carolyn Jerome. You mentioned you're before?

Yeah. Apparently she made a request to the mayor for the mayoral limousine to be sent down to take them to City Hall. Fucking riot. I love that she did that. Yes. Send a limo bitch. You want me there?

Carry me in style. My chariot awaits. It was a me in style, my chariot awaits. It was a no-go, no chariot arrived. You don't get what you don't ask for, she had to take the shot. Yeah, exactly, exactly. So none of them have cars. The buses aren't running, they're like,

how are you ending up there? Finally, they find a friend who has a VW bug. Synergy, brand Synergy. Well, it's not a bus like this one, it's one of the little one. Oh, baby. They stuff college students into those as a gag. Telephone booths too. We don't have those anywhere but they used to do that. Well, a few of the moms stuff into this VW bag and climb up the hill to City Hall. And once they got got there they were told that they had not met the procedure,

the proper procedure, to appear before civil council and so they had to go home. I have an objection. I think so. Yeah, they were asked to come. Yes, yeah, but they like didn't fill out the proper paperwork and come at the time. Gotcha, got you. I'm sure there was some idea of maybe if we can just get these women off the tracks. It was pretty defeating.

I bet. This little adventure, but it galvanized them even more to be like where we're going to be heard is not in the halls of City Hall. They made them more militant. It's going to be on the tracks. Hi, Omiya. I love, I guess, because of that popular cliche of the wrong side of the tracks. I love the symbolic weight of this battle occurring like right on the railroad tracks.

So they leave City Hall and they go back to the railway tracks. The Canadian National Railway and the Burlington Northern Railway officials, they said, you know what, we hear you. This is unsafe and we will not run the trains during the times that you have asked. That's good. Anybody can find their way to deac their way out of anything, the bigger they are, but like the second a kid gets splattered on those railroad tracks, they're fucked. They don't want that. That's terrible PR. Yeah. No, exactly. Exactly. Much less. The legal battle of it. the legal battle of it. The legal battle of it, yeah.

And so some higher ups in the railway companies say, totally understood, and it's a whole civil exchange. Good, everybody's using their professional email voices. Yeah. Got it. Got it. Paired my last request. Yes.

It's all going to be OK. We're just not going to run the trains at the time that you've kindly laid out for us. Does the problem is solved the story is over? Yes. Until two weeks later. Well. The trains are running at any old time, just as they had before. Mynthetus.

The agreement was apparently forgotten or... Somebody didn't pass the memo on. Or just willfully neglected. Yeah. So January 25th they get back on the tracks. Oh baby. We're back on track. And this time it's it's not just to do the initial protest, it's to tell the railway companies you have violated your agreement. Absolutely. Our agreement that we all made together. He was a small group who was on the tracks and when the train stopped again, workers got off, but this time they apologized. Officials came down and they said, oh my goodness, this is all just

a misunderstanding. This is so embarrassing. We almost had you over again. Man, Mo didn't get through to everybody. One of the workers bought the mom's a case of beer. They said, so sorry. Yeah. I don't want a case of beer. I want my child not to die. The mom is pretty happy with the beer. Well, yeah, I think maybe I'm projecting here.

I want my child not to die. They can have the beer. I mean, the beer and saying, we'll keep to the agreement and we won't run the train. So then the moms were like and beer fantastic. So the railway officials confirmed the agreement would hold. They admitted their mistake. Interesting and the moms were happy that got off the tracks went home went to bed and it's over. I'm on the half. Hi Mita.

The trains just are rolling. As I always did, whenever they fucking wanted, kids are having to wait, or they're getting to school late, or they're trying to- The moment you're just over under the- Can I get back on the track? I know. I think the city and railway officials kind of underestimated them though a little bit. They'll get tired of this.

They don't really care about their kids that much if they did they'd have husbands. Yeah, exactly. They wouldn't be in social house. Yeah, they cared about their kids. Yeah, yeah. No, exactly. I think that's totally it. Especially given the time period too, there was I feel like a lot more of a stigma. And now there is still a stigma on being a single mom. Yeah. Back then and like the kind of can only get divorced if someone deserts or cheats on you kind of eras. So, this is obviously not a misunderstanding when this train start rolling again. No, it's like a, it's flagrant.

Not only a flagrant violation of the promise they made, but it's just a huge slap in the face in terms of these kids safety. They really don't give a shit. And so the moms, now they realize that they really need to escalate their efforts. Standing on the track, they need to get their own change. To get their own change. You need to get their own train and run it in the opposite direction. Chicken bitch, whoever wins wins.

Who knows, I could have been bandied around. That was probably really early, I mean. The media. That didn't happen, they didn't get there, they didn't get their own train. But what they decided to do was to go ahead and put a blockade on the track. Oh, okay, okay.

At this point, the mums did have some community backing. The real-ways promise had been publicized in the media. I was gonna ask it in the papers. If this had been picked up. Mm-hmm. And there was some good press about it. The moms were kind of an easy hero in this. Easy to like, single moms trying to not have their kids

die makes perfect sense. Yeah. My right to rent a train between 8.30 and 9 o'clock AM, I care less about. Yes, yes, exactly, exactly. And you consider the time period with all the social of people happening. There's a real sense of people kind of coming online

when it comes to marginalized communities. Sure. Women's rights and civil rights. They'd go back offline in the 80s, but then they'd come back again now they're currently offline, but they will come back. The AOL. Listen, it's not great.

Just dial up internet man, it's not great. Just dial up internet, man. It's not so good. The internet was bad in the late 60s, early 70s. They had still been trying to reach out to City Hall and trying to go and talk to somebody, trying to write letters, trying to make phone calls. But instead they just got lectures from Council about the proper way to quote get results at city hall. No, you're not, you're doing it all wrong. You can't, you have to, you can't raise your voice, you have to fill out a form if you want to raise your voice at city hall. And yeah, they were told,

you know, you need to go through legal means, you need to be nicer about it. Don't disrupt public infrastructure. We could have you arrested. There were discussions among the moms about perhaps they needed to pick it city hall, but they quickly realized they had a lot more power being on the tracks. The tracks is the big winner. Someone would come down immediately and then start giving them beer.

Or give them a beer, yeah. Yeah. I know, the real way really like shot themselves on the foot with that one. Now we want beer every time we stop the train and we're gonna make you stop the train a few times. According to Carolyn Jerome, who I quote a lot because she's in a few kind of documentaries and she wrote an article. So she's sort of one of the public faces of it in a surviving way kind of thing.

Yes, she's pretty vocal about the historical aspect so. Good, rightly so. Yeah. She says, and I quote, the railways are upset because we are interfering with the economy of Canada. So that's where they focused their efforts. Was interfering with the economy of Canada. Bring that bitch down, listen,

let's get that dollar down to 30 cents a minute again. It will take that much work. So they were gonna have to settle in on those tracks, not just stand there for the day, but stage a blockade, which is essentially a non-violent protest strategy that is not uncommon in BC's history, especially with indigenous communities, to draw attention to land disputes. So for the militant mums, I should say that name, militant moms, actually came from the media. Really? It wasn't theirs.

It wasn't exactly theirs, but they quickly adopted it. Okay. They were happy to take it up. Oh, we got it in branding, baby. Yeah. We don't even need to make a Zazzle story. A little, a little iteration. Yeah, love it. Thank you. Yeah. I'll do that. For the moms, the blockade that they constructed

was a tent. One of the moms had a big old tent that had it a hole in it, but they didn't care. It didn't need to be a functional tent. I mean, when are we? Because I know we started in January. It's late March. Okay, cold, but we're getting into spring.

A lot of the recounts remember it being pretty cold and rainy. Dude, when you told me that they were doing this in January, I'm like, that's how you know that these are tough mothers, man. Yeah, cold, yeah. I mean, there's way worse January's in Canada, but I'd were doing this in January, I'm like, that's how you know that these are tough mothers, man. Yeah. Oh yeah. I mean, there's way worse January's in Canada, but I'd rather do this in June. Yeah, yeah. If you have the option to do the June Vancouver,

or you do the June Vancouver. Although I guess you wouldn't be doing that because the kids are in ten school. Oh, I know, they still aren't June. They put up the tent and the train again, rolls to a stop, again, the workers get off. Again, they yell at them. The whole thing.

Damn, them on us shaking hands. You know what it is, moms? And they roll the train back to the waterfront and the railway officials say, oh no, we're so sorry. Wow, oh my god, I can't believe we keep forgetting this. We're gonna put it on a post-it, yeah? The moms are so upset, they're not gonna take the beer. In retrospect, isn't that such an insulting thing to try to buy off this group of like low-income single moms with a case of

beer? Yeah. As much as I like beer, I am offended by that. This time the moms weren't going to take it anymore. They were not leaving. They knew that one time is a mistake, second time, okay, maybe, third time... That's a pattern. The rabbi companies themselves stopped being so civil. They no longer said, oh, this is a mistake. Which really is just a lip service to civility. For sure. They underestimate these women and say, oh, if we just play nice, look all the way. Yeah.

I don't know why they think that given how it has continuously not happened. But. There's an essay written by Meg Stansby, who wrote an essay for the BC review, whose own mother Judith Stansby was a militant mother. Cool. Yeah, and she writes two CNR officials, the Canadian National Railway,

two CNR officials interviewed on the second day of the March blockade raised the prospect that the mother's actions would force the layoff of dock workers, hardworking men. These witches. By preventing grain and pulp shipments from being processed, thereby denying men their right to make a living. This is gonna go so bad when a fucking kid dies.

Exactly. And then all the pulp in the world can't put that kid back together. No. Can't make a child out of pulp. I mean, that's for you to ask your parents, but tune in for our next episode. Where we explain that, contrary to what we've been told for so long, it's not pulp. It's sex. I'm sorry, spoilers. It's horrible. It's sex. Disgusting shit. Put your pee thing in her, I guess like it's different. We're moving right away. Taylor is this sexhead educator?

I am, yeah, actually I did it for a living for a while. It's a while ago. I have lost my touch. So the Ruebae companies, they send the women a telegram claiming that the mothers are trespassing on private property and that they had better be in court to explain these trespassing charges. I'm surprised they haven't been arrested yet. I know.

A lot of current day blockades, for example, and in arrests or begin with arrests, honestly. Yeah, yeah. That's a good point. Maybe he was newer this time. I'm not sure. The civility of the railway companies had certainly eroded when one Canadian national railway official is quoted in the Vancouver Sun as remarking to the mother's quote, I hope you'll have protection after dark for your own safety. You... people have such bad souls. So honestly, I was gonna go on a longer diet ride, but it kind of comes down to some people who are just kind of rotten. And society has a big part in making a lot of people that way too.

That's true. Yes. Yes. The moms are not deterred, and they keep the tent up overnight. At this point, there's a community bus that is in the Vancouver area. It's called the Nau bus. The bus is looking around in the background of the story. I know. Yeah, transportation at the heart over here. So the Nau bus is just like a big kidded out school bus that has like a coffee maker

and blankets. And it's meant to be like support for community action. So the now bus gets parked right near the tracks and it becomes a place for the mums to get in out of the rain, in out of the cold, have some coffee, not the kids, but the mums. Have a bit of a nap, that kind of thing. Love a nap.

It's just a safe haven for them. I took a nap in the bus moments ago. Like a couple hours back. Yeah, yeah. During this time when the railway company was being very uncivil, apparently a lot of the mums and their kids reported that train whistles were used in retaliation.

So like all throughout the day, trains would come by and just lean on the horn. That's fucked and horrible, but it did make me laugh in terms of like, what do we got at our disposal? We've got a train with a horn. Carolyn Jerome is quoted as saying, they're getting back at us with their whistles. Every half hour all day, they blow those whistles long and loud. The guy who comes through here at 4 a.m. really hates us. He leans on that thing for a good 60 seconds

They're hoping we'll apologize and ask them to please stop blowing the whistles The things that must have been said about these women at those union meetings. Oh man just rough Just in foul shit. So because the railway companies have sent the moms a telegram saying hey, you better show up in court now We're not gonna be Mr. Nice guy anymore. So some of the moms get into a couple of cars and they go down to the courts and they also prepare to not come back. They have some honest conversations with their kids. Oh, that's awful.

Saying, you know what, this is an important thing for your safety in our community and we need to go do this, but in the event that we are not home, if we don't come home, you need, you know, here's here's your aunt's number. Yeah, I dinner's in the freezer. Jesus. Yeah.

Oh, that's awful. That makes me so sad. The Canadian National Railway and the Burlington Northern Railway, they bring seven lawyers to represent them. The mothers, it's just them. It's just a handful of them. David and Glyath. Exactly. And the first round in the court with the judge, each side explains their respective perspectives. It's private property, wage loss, etc., etc. says the railway companies. The mums explain yet again that it's their

children's lives on the line. Yeah fuck the pope. If something happens to make kid I'll pop you. Sorry good. Good you're getting into character like this. Yeah the squid's making me crazy. So there's a break in the court proceedings and the mums kind of gather outside in the court lobby and they're just trying to strategize when a young lawyer approaches them. His name is Bruce McCall. Pro bono. Yes. And he approaches them and he says, hello, I would like to help if I may. Yep. What I have noticed is that the railway companies have not served your papers properly. Yes, yes, oh my god, dry bureaucratic shit is what actually gets resolved.

It's terrible, but it's true. There's no legal requirement for you to listen to what they're saying right. On the... A telegram is not the way to go. If you would like, I can come into the courtroom with you. School. And act on your behalf. Pro Bono, as you mentioned. Yes, yes, yes.

I want them to clown these railway people so bad. So Bruce McCall, he goes into the court and he explains to the judge that the injunction was not properly served. Oh, that's so funny. They just came back in with a lawyer. Yeah, they like you found this guy. Yeah, we found someone out in the hall and he's got some to say. Yeah, and the judge says, that's correct.

You are right. There's no reason for us to meet right now in this court because there is no legal precedent for anyone to be here. This is only just a request to show up. It's not a summon. Cool, interesting. And so the blockade can go on and tell the papers are properly served, which is wonderful.

A small victory. They get to leave. They get to go home to their kids tonight, yeah, even though they had said, maybe camping out there overnight in jail or dead. Yes. So a wonderful that Bruce McCall was able to help, but of course the jugs take special

notes and he gives the one dude in the situation, all the kudos. Yeah, true one. And he says, and I quote, this young man is acting in the finest tradition of a young lawyer. Okay. The moms are doing a lot of work. I was gonna say, it feels like, it feels, you can't just give all the props, the guy who literally just walked into the room from the hallway like

Five minutes ago. You gotta give some credit to these fucking women who went out in January to stand in front of a fucking speeding train Exactly the moms are the they're fine They're like look there you see it and I and we got a lawyer. Yeah, yeah, and now we can get back on the tracks and we got a laugh. Yeah, yeah. And now we can get back on the tracks. We're back on track. So the mums are kind of taking shifts to man the tent or they're in the now bus.

Woman the tent. Excuse me, woman the tent. Yeah, that's a lie. Exactly. Of course they're doing this while they're still doing the full-time job of mothering. Yeah, and whatever other job they might have. Exactly. Now, at this other job they might have. Exactly.

Now, at this point, they knew that the railway was gonna try to serve them their injunction papers in the proper way. Yeah. So the plan was that the two women who were in court previously and who they knew would be named on the injunction, these two women were gonna make themselves scarce for a few days.

Yeah. They were gonna stay in their apartments They were just gonna lay low. Can't serve me papers if my hands not outstretched towards you, right? Actually, the way that papers are properly served is that they just have to touch you in some like your back Yeah, you have to touch you You have to physically touch you. The reason is well not the reason is but like this is very like you have to say you're a cop shit Right, it's just one of those kind of common misconceptions that if I don't take the papers then I don't get the papers But right and the real housewives of Vancouver reunion

Jody was handing some people some papers and they're like not just letting it fall off my chest Now I know that they have been served per your any quarter-anxion flash counts Yes, yes anywhere So one of these women who is meant to lay low and not get touched by paper was Carolyn Jerome. Yeah, I figured maybe she seems like she would want to do the court shit herself. Yes, exactly. She does want to be involved in everything.

So unfortunately, she went down to the tracks that day. So she's down there and this is a quote from her. I saw this guy in a very stiffy suit walking towards me. Bad news, he doesn't love his jath kona. So I started running down the track and he ran behind me and he threw the injunction papers at me and they hit my shoulder. Shit! Damn it. Now you're infected.

Exactly! Tag or something. That's so funny. You're the image. Yeah. So with that. You're the image. Yeah. So, with that chucking of the papers, a literal penistere of the papers.

They had been served in the injection papers properly, and so they did have to impure a court. Once that had happened, the mothers convened and they decided that they did want to keep things legal. They wanted to make sure that everything was above board. Right, don't let them get us on anything. Exactly. So they did take down the tent, they ended the blockade, they got off the tracks.

For now, obviously, you know. They're not opposed to going back to the tracks, historically. They've done it before and they'll do it again. They opted to take down the blockade and fight this in the courts. There was a few weeks in there when there was a lot of back and forth between Council and Council tried to put them off for a certain amount of time, saying, well, we'll see about maybe doing some safety measures. Yeah, do you want a case of beer?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Perhaps another feasibility committee. We can read one of those. Oh, wow. Why don't we get an ancillary feasibility committee? A second one, that'll make you feel better. And the mother's countered by saying that unless they had a solid answer within a week, then they would wait for council's decision,

quote, right in the middle of the track. Fuck yes. If it's not now, then it means no. Ffff. Interesting. That was said by Judy Stanspeed, the mother of the author. Cool, interesting. So finally, finally, finally. Which actually in like the grand scheme of things, it was... In terms of like the heat of the universe? Yeah. It was actually quite a short amount of time, but in terms of having to go out and fucking stand in a railroad track in the winter every day, it was pretty long. Yeah, it was pretty long. It's probably like late spring early summer.

Sure, sure. When the courts agreed that an overpass would be built by the city. Good. And the Canadian National Railway. Good. The Burlington Colt factory. Yes. Got it. Got it. Canadian National Railway and the Brilliant and Carrey. I don't think you can pull that green.

Got it. The city would need to expropriate land from an owner to construct an overpass. So the breakdown of the costs, the city pays 15%, the railway companies 35, and then the rest is federal government funds. Yeah. To make the thing happen. It was, again, that late spring that the overpass was confirmed and it was completed by the start of the school year in September. Look how easy that was. Exactly, right?

Yeah, I bet all the moms were just like, are you like fantastic? This is wonderful, wonderful, but also like, what the fucking fuck? This could have been solved so long ago. And fucking, you would have made all your fucking coat deliveries via the train because nobody would have been in the fucking trance. Exactly, yeah.

And to the real ways, I don't know. Cradid? Yeah, I don't know, that one out. In the meantime, the real way did not skating In the meantime, the real way did not run the trains when the kids would be crossing okay and in All of this it was a flat-out success

Good these women are remembered for their beat for their bravery and bad assery To commemorate them a play from theater in the raw. I knew theater in the raw. 2014 they had a play called The Milligent Mothers. Interesting. Yes. I love play. In 2022, which was a year delayed because of COVID, there was a public celebration to commemorate the 50th year anniversary of the overpass construction. Yeah, it was originally called the Kiefer Street overpass because that's... Carolyn Jerome overpass. No, now it's the militant mothers overpass. The militant mothers of Raymer. Cool. So not all the mums were in attendance as not all of them are still living or...

Living in Vancouver or exactly, but it was certainly a moment to celebrate and many of them went on to serve their communities with other successful public projects including the first and second grade portals on Union Street. There were updates that they demanded and got done. They set up a food co-op, you know, I say they, but like it could be individuals or groups from this group. People who were involved.

Some of them worked to get a pedestrian light put up at prior and Campbell, so the kids could get to their longshoreman baseball games. And most notably, I'd say from this group of moms, there were people who went on to found the Raycam Community Center, which currently serves low-income housing folks. Good.

As we speak. Good. That's nice that they found from this kind of really shitty thing that collectively happened to them that a lot of them were able to kind of like, I guess, find a greater purpose that animated them and being of service to their communities. And not only did it animate them, but also their kids. Yeah, a BC Review, baby. There's another child of a militant mother

who has gone on to be a local politician in the downtown east side. Sick, don't lose your soul upon a tissue. Yeah, it's tough. It's tough. But, you know, fight the fight, do the thing. Yeah, absolutely. Which I think is just a really cool thing

because always this idea that like the kids are caring it on because there's always this idea with single moms that if you don't spend all your time with your kids you're a bad mother. That you're a bad mother. Yeah. And why aren't you walking them to school? That will somehow like you can chuck them through the gap in the trains like I don't understand. Yeah. Yeah. Serving your community and serving yourself is also serving your kids. For sure. And it's a value and it the world would be better off if there were more people who were so motivated to do that.

And I think not even just for single moms, but the idea that like any mom needs to kind of give her whole self for her kids, everyone else, and you have an identity independent of your child, always, everybody. Exactly. And keeping or expanding that identity is important for your kids too. For sure, absolutely. I have a single mom, so I feel strongly about this. Oh, the single kids too. For sure, absolutely. I have a single mom, so I feel strongly about that.

All the single ladies. All the single ladies. All the single ladies. All the single ladies. All the single ladies. So the group that consisted of the militant mothers of Raymar, it ranged between 15 to 25 names and at various points and, I mean, they went back to the tracks quite a lot.

For sure, and maybe some people were like, I can went back to the tracks quite a lot. For sure and maybe some people were like I can't go to the tracks this month but they were there in January or maybe they came along the way. Yeah, yeah, come over to my house for a cup of tea after the warm up. So I have the names of about 18 women for my research that I'm going to read out for us. And I want to apologize to everybody on the list for what I'm about meet out for us. And I wanna apologize to everybody on the list for what I'm about to do with their names. No, I know that's general.

I was gonna say to any mother who I have left out, but. Any bad mother out there who I've missed. That's like bad complimentary, not bad like unfit. Bad ass, yeah. But Taylor's right, I also apologize for potentially mangling your name. Ella, shouldn't it become famous if you I also apologize for potentially mangling your name. Ella, shouldn't it become famous if you didn't want us to mangle your name on this podcast? That's what I think.

All right, the militant mother's a ramer, consisted of Jean Amos. Good job, Jean. I'm not going to do that. Please hold your pause. Yeah, I told you. Okay. Okay. That's okay. Okay, that's fair. Joan Morelli, Diana Saunders, Mugs Sigurd Gerson, V Smith, Judith Stansby, Helena States, Oli Strahmann, and Sheila Turgianne. Round of applause the 18 best chicks

I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, Josie, thank you. I like them. They're the most relevant chicks I know right now. Yeah, and those are the militant mothers of Raymer. Very cool, so glad you told that story. I thought it was really interesting. Oh, tight. I really enjoyed that, and I was of perpetually rooting for them, so I'm glad to see that they got their militant mom over pass. They're MMO.

So, Lucian and I took a little trip down to the militant mom overpass. They're MMO. So, Luciana, I took a little trip down to the militant mother's overpass. Luciana Mish of episode 68, the cult of the clitoris, go listen now, it has some of the best and worst storytelling ever heard in your life. Yeah, Taylor really called me out again to tell me. To get my thing is to randomly rip a strip out of Josie about every three months for how bad she shit the bad on that

man. But she really killed it on this fucking railroad story. Probably Josie. So anyway, sorry, you and Lucio went down. Really surprising. When we were up there, some people were coming up the ramp to use the overpass. And I was like, okay, let me like, because I had like, that's the mom's. All my shit was everywhere. And it was a mom. It was a mom and her kid and they were playing what I think was probably Pokemon Go. How cute. What an apt moment. I know, right?

Yeah. I'm here with Lucia. Hello. And we're standing on the pedestrian bridge. And what time is it, Luke? 11, 39. P.M. You wanna describe what you see, Luke?

Yeah. We are standing probably about 30 or 40 feet above the train tracks, running underneath us on a narrow overhead walkway, underneath us, on a narrow overhead walkway, sort of enclosed by chain link fence with railings. There's a couple of folding chairs that someone has brought up and set up where you can I guess sit and watch the trains go by, but it's just us up here right now. On either side there's buildings like some light industrial kind of stuff to the west. Some trucks with looks like construction cranes. And then on the other side residential houses very typical of Strathcona,

these sort of pseudo-victorian, like sort of beautiful shingle houses in various stages of ramshackle-tude. Wow, what else do you see, Josie? The color of the chain link and the railings and everything is like, it's really lovely green blue. Look at really light. Beautiful color. Yeah, sort of a Robin's egg or Robin's egg adjacent. There's a fair amount of like tagging.

I'm really good tags Yeah, it's it's a very visually beautiful spot. If I look to my right right now. I'm facing south So if I look to my right down the ramp towards I guess Raymar Avenue The yeah the tunnel kind of narrows in this like incredible one point perspective All these repeating shapes going down to this little portal at the end, which is where we came in maybe Yeah, the tunnel kind of narrows in this like incredible one point perspective. All these repeating shapes going down to this little portal at the end, which is where we came in maybe 20, 30 minutes ago. You can see the mountains to the north, or you can see the lights of the ski slopes. You can see the sugar.

The Roger's Sugar plant. It's the... The Grim Willy Wonka. It does have a yeah. Yeah, better move my stuff because people are coming and using the brig. Hi. Hi. Hi.

I'm here right this year. Okay. I'm battling. What a cool thing to do. Oh, here, right, just here. What a cool thing to have done, right? To get this built. Yeah, no kidding. And I've never, like, I've walked over this overpass. I've, like, biked over it too,

which I'm not supposed to do. But I've, I've, I've gently carried my bike over. Um, but yeah, I have occasionally been like encounter to train when walking on fish through Shrathkona, and I can't remember how I first discovered this was here because it's kind of tucked away. I might have just been kind of wandering around and been like, what's this? But yeah, I've walked over it a few times. I've never like hung out on it like this though. Did you describe the tunnel of the chain link too? Going down the right. Yeah, it was overhead all the way.

Oh yeah, totally. Yeah, so it's like super safe. It's very safe. Yeah, and it's quite reinforced. Very held. Yeah, it's really kind of comforting. held. Yeah, it's really, it's kind of comforting. It's pretty rough. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's just wild to think of there being this like industrial, commercial, infrastructure like running through a residential neighborhood and this not being here.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, completely wild. Yeah. Oh yeah, completely wild. Yeah. Hey, last player. There's not even. Oh my gosh. This guy's getting a game.

I am just like the player who's playing here. Sure, sure. I'm just going to play over here. Thanks for listening. If you want more in for me, we've got plenty more episodes and bittersweetinforme.com. Or wherever you listen to podcasts. If you want to support the podcast, shoot us a few bucks by our coffee account. And KO-F-I-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D You can always support us by liking, rating, subscribing, leaving a review following us on Instagram at BittersweetInfmy or just past podcasts long to a friend who you think would dig in. Stay sweet! The sources I used for this infamous were the page C. Serpent's Off Vancouver Island on the website of Mysteries of Canada, as well as an article called The Cadbury Source Wars by Darren Mace for Tetrapod Zoology on April 16, 2012, and a postcard

full of information about Ovo Pogo, John from the Wikipedia page for Ovo Pogo. I lost that damn postcard and pissed about it when my mother gave that to me. The sources that I used for this week's episode were an article from the Georgia Strait entitled East Vans Militant Mother Celebrate 50th Anniversary of Victory to Keep Kids Safe, published January 4, 2021 by Carolyn Jerome. I looked at the website for the Art of the City Festival, which hosted a community stories podcast, where kids at the Raycam Community Center interviewed a militant mom, Carolyn Jerome, and had her share her story for the podcast. You can find that episode at artofthecityfestival.com. How

they recommended it. I read an article from the Vancouver Sun entitled Militant Mother's of Rainmer Celebrate 50th Inversory in Activism in Vancouver, published May 5th, 2022, written by John Mackie. I watched a short film entitled Militant Mother, which came out in 2021 directed by Carmen Polak and was hosted on HotDocs.ca. I watched a TED talk was Steven DeBerry, why the wrong side of the tracks is usually the east side of cities. It was posted to the Ted Talk website

September 12, 2018. And lastly, I read an essay out of the BC Review written by Meg Stainesby, daughter of Judy Stainesby, the noteant mother's civil disobedience in Rainware Housing Project, published April 11th, 2021. Clips from the intro come from videos hosted on YouTube by Neil Parsix, Andre Tardif, Global News, Hall 1185, Brainwave Entertainment HQ,

and relaxing day, as well as the documentary The Five Cent War written and directed by Philip Daniels. And the First Nations Language Resource, firstvoices.com. As always, a huge shout out to our subscriber, Jonathan Mountain, YouTube can be a subscriber. Just go to caughti.com. K-O-F-I-.com forward slash bittersweet imping. This podcast is a proud member of the 604 podcast network. The interstitial music you heard earlier is by Mitchell Collins and the song you're going to see to you now is T Street byream, that Brian's deal. [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ Can you do a train horn for me?

I have to do it quietly, but I'll do it close to the mic. Also a whale noise.