Bittersweet Infamy - #79 - The Empress of Canada

Episode Date: August 27, 2023

In the final episode of our special British Columbia-centric Bittersweet 604 series, guest host The Established, Shanda Leer tells Josie and Taylor about legendary Vancouver drag queen and activist ted northe, the Imperial Court System, and the Dogwood Monarchist Society. Plus: the real story of professional wrestling's Fake Razor Ramon, BC's own Rick Bognar.

The episode you're about to listen to is the final installment of our series called Bittersweet 604, a celebration of the beautiful province of British Columbia. Right now, many communities in the province are enduring aggressive wildfires. If you'd like to help, the BC wildfire service recommends donating to the Red Cross at redcross.ca or by calling 1-800-418-1111. Stay safe and stay sweet. Welcome to Bittersweet 604. That book in 1957 and here is our de-exploitation funded to torture and the unspeakable vulgarity of a self-proclaimed Messiah.

I even looked at the bike for a while and said, it was a bum-mom. I thought if it was over, pull those sleeping. I don't want to be here. Vizdi, say here, swimmer and breath deeper. You are about to enter downtown East Side. You dig in now, a browser around Mo. Not all of a sudden we went in. Bang, oh, talk about it, sense. I couldn't say no to her.

And ten north, Empress of Canada! From Wazi, Swatwazi, Satin, Preserve Youth, Preserve Youth of Rutherford. It's been a lot lately for us here on Bitter Sweden for me. It's been a lot of great stuff. It's been a lot of great stuff. We've got one more episode left in August. We've got one more BC based episode.

You may notice that for the fourth consecutive time the acoustic is slightly different. That is because we are joined in my living room by the one the only chandelier of our sibling podcast network show where the big boys game. Woo, woo, woo! Yes, that's me, officially. The official. The official. Chanda, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself? Sure, my legal name is the established chandha layer. Okay. Oh, yes. Okay. Yeah, established when Established well when a lot of people were turning to digital drag in

2020 from home and they were doing their own Talk shows I'm doing air quotes for the people listening at home. So this is scathing. Yes My friend thanks gem who is the queen of the rodeo Orville Peck wrote the song about her. She's the star of the music video. Wow. And the three of us used to work together way back in the day.

Let me pick up those names you're driving out. Yeah, get ready. Get ready for the ride. Oh, baby. Oh, baby. But we did a talk show at a bar that is no longer existing in Chinatown called the Emerald and it was a live talk show but we also cast it on Google Meet because I have friends across the contiguous United States who we want to see your drag show.

So anyway, I had to let the kids know that I'm established. I've been doing this a lot longer than they have. Okay. And where are they now? We're at those bedroom than they have. Okay. And what are they now? We're at this bedroom queen's at now. Wow. Wow. It's an established.

Wow. We are anti-disestablishmentarianism here on the guys here. Yeah, I'm a great student here. It's one of our Triter things. But yeah, I'm a drag performer, and I'm a comedian, and a writer, and you know, philanthropist. For sure. And for sure. And, and functioning primarily though, I'm sure not exclusively here out of beautiful Vancouver.

Yeah, based here, but hoping to do some touring. The birth of EverTour has been Victoria with an Amy Winehouse cover band. What was called? We actually didn't have an official name. They were just like, hey, here is all these people from these bands and also a drag queen. Okay. It was like a super group. There was a couple local bands and we played the Victoria's Okay. It was like a super group. There was a couple local bands

and we played the Victoria Skull Fest two years in a row. Wow! That's fun. Back to back Victoria Skull Fest before, right? Yeah, sugar ballroom or whatever it's called over there. Okay, okay. Over there. Yeah.

Very cool. Well, if you ever make it down to Houston, let me know. I, you know what, there's a great drag. Great drag in Houston. Yeah. Very cool. Well, if you ever make it down to Houston, let me know. I, you know what, there's a great drag. Great drag in Houston. Yeah. Yeah, Houston, all of the, no, Houston's down on the coast and then DFW was further up, right?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, one of these days Texas is a big state. It's a huge, huge, huge ass. They have several cities. Yeah. So we have a small guest room for you. We're back. I've enjoyed the guest room.

I've enjoyed the fruits of the guest room. It's a lovely time when Josie and I went to Royal Rumble 2020 together. I stayed in the guest room. Yeah. That's all. Wow. And spent time with their little small dog Batman

who's very cute. The guest room is really Batman's office. Yeah. If I can intrude on Batman's space. Yes. It's where he does his correspondence. The guest room is really Batman's office. Yeah. If I can intrude on Batman's space. Yes. It's where he does his first bonus. Yeah.

Yeah. So, we've all had separate lives. We've been living separately. Josie and I recently, you know, last time you heard from us, we were in a camper van, a VW bus, in a place with many names names but we're settling on Jordan River. Yeah, I think Jordan River. Let's go Jordan River. Yeah. How's your life been since then? When we parted ways I took the ferry back to the mainland. You went up to Powell River and BC's beautiful sunshine coast to spend time with some friends.

Yeah. How's that? Got on a boat. Got in the ocean. Got to see friends that haven't seen it really long time. Met a baby. I mean, it all sounds great. Yeah, how was your stand-up paddle boarding? We didn't end up in that. I knew it. I was like, that sounds very hard.

And if you've had one beer in a day, you're not going stand-up paddle boarding. He was either go on the sailboat or do the stand-up paddle boarding. Oh, you go on the sailboat. We went on the sale boat name method. Yeah. So it was a good choice. Boat names are fantastic. Well, apparently to change a boat name takes like really? There's like a process. You need a rabbi and a priest. Yeah. It's a Bolshevine. Yeah. It's a deep, deep process. But they got the boat and it came with a name muffin and they're like, well, you know To change from like, well, I've already answered to muffin. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She already know it when we call her

Yeah, how's your trip? It was really interesting. I took the ferry to the Swanson ferry terminal And on the bus back the 620 which was quite packed. I ended up sitting next to somebody who I had like The most intimate conversation with for the entire bus ride back. Were you pressured to have this conversation because you're a chatty person in general. So did you just strike it up or was it thrust upon you? It was thrust upon me. I was actually I had said to Josie. I can't wait to kind of sleep the whole way back. I was I had my headphones in. I was looking forward to kind of zoning out because it's a long, it's like a decent trip from Swasson back to Bridgeport Station,

which is then I kind of, yeah, absolutely. It was a lady who noticed my squid hat in my bag and asked if I was a performer and so I was like, oh, yes, but probably not the type you're thinking of. And we ended up talking, we ended up swapping notes. Her name was Bethany. She was really into her walk with Jesus and she was going to work a mission up in Alaska. Oh. And what did you do?

She told me about the book she wanted to write about Jesus. She asked, she was very inquisitive about the podcast. She was very inquisitive about like what I was up to. It got very intimate, very quickly. This is my nightmare. I was gonna, I had the thought as I was doing it that this is the nightmare of everybody I know but me. I was delighted. I felt the conversation. She was sowing whatever her original wild oats were before she went up and did the missions so she was kind of traveling around I gather, meeting up with friends

and I think she just like felt the need to feel seen in that moment And I'm like the perfect person for that you know when you're trying not to scare a bird away I was very that that conversation So we were just I was a stale bread. I was very I was offered all the stale bread I had I was very supportive but like the conversation went some like very sweet and unexpected places it I really enjoyed it. She ended the conversation by like saying God bless you and I really enjoyed it. She ended the conversation by like saying God bless you and and that it really got to the bottom of it with each other. Wow. Yeah. Really enjoyed it. Really nice check. Really nice check. How about you, Shandou? How's it been going with you? Well, I've been cross-dressing a lot lately. So that's good. That's new. That's new. That's new for me. Yeah.

You know, I've had a lot of regular shows this year. I've amongfully, I say brunch because it's in the daytime, but it's like, you know, an afternoon drag show at the mall in Burnaby. Yes, real Tiffany kind of fantasy. And I have been producing a lot of shows at breweries around town and other spaces, but I'm pulling back from that. I've been focusing more on doing a stand-up, which I really enjoy. So yeah, I've done a couple comedy shows recently, I've been doing some open mics. If you're so funny, tell us a joke. Okay. Why did the hand cross the road? Why? Why are you inserting yourself into a woman's business? They make you laugh and then they make you think folks. That one's for intermediate audiences.

That's us. Do you ever tell that one in the whole room goes, like we just did? Well, feminism, yes. I have to follow a bit to that where people, if they're quiet, I can say like you won't believe how much time I spend googling our all chickens girls Because I actually had to check that No, some of the marries do this baby. Yeah, so that's why it's hands, but anyway, that is that's one of my favorites for sure and so this monthly show that you're hosting at the mall in Bernabese that you're

Is that your rec room gig? Yes, that's the rec room. And I, I'm the host and I'm the producer and I perform in it as well. When can we go and see you do your show? What are we doing? What are we wearing? I'm taking August off because post-priides. Yeah. We do in, for those who don't know,

we have our pride in BC in August. Yes. And I'm gonna tell you why later in the episode I was just asking about this. I didn't know that was related to what you were okay perfect. Perfect. I absolutely. This up because Pride in San Diego is in July. Yes. And it's in June and a lot of other places but evidently not everywhere. It's in September in some places too. Yeah.

In Calgary it's in September without any spoilers. June is only recently recognized as like international pride month. Because the Stonewall Rites were at the end of June in 1969. But a lot of places before that or, you know, subsequent, before it was international pride month, organized according to their own community milestones. Yeah. And it just makes sense for me. Or when is it reasonable to get Dick and Pussy out?

Also, you want to think about the weather. There's weather is important. You don't want that, that frostbite kills. Yeah. Before we get into all that though, where can these fine folks fall? If they're not able to make it to the rec room in person because they are from another country or Are lazy what where can they follow you online? It's chandelier. I'll spell it out

It's it's and then sh a and d a l e er And I got the drag name when I was 19, okay, and I didn't start doing drag until I think I was. Well, I've been doing it for 12 years now, so I didn't start until I was about 25. So what's the gap there? Mine the gap. The Cole's notes version of this or Sparks Notes version for the US audience.

Thanks. Is that I lived in Halifax when I was going to university and I wasn't out at the closet, but I was really compelled to go to a gay bar one night on a weeknight So there's nobody there and there are a couple dry queens and they noticed me because they're like, oh yeah, fresh meat So they come over and talk to me and yeah, and they're like hey, you know trying to chat with me and then one of them says like You know like oh like do you like drag or do you like drag queens or something like that and I said like well yeah like no not really like I was like we mean like RuPaul the only drag queen people knew yeah yeah and they gave me a pretty like you know quick rundown and one of them said one of them asked me if I was

would be ever interested in doing drag and I said absolutely not and she leaned in and she said well when you do drag. She's like you should use the name chandelier and I never forgot that. Wow. Wow. I love I love this person who was like very consciously being your fairy godmother like listen I know that what I'm about to say to you is significant. I've said it to like five other 19 year old closet cases today. I'm gonna be chandelier. I like how many other people that she was trying to hook up with as she suggested that. Yeah! Yeah!

Yeah, so I guess that's me in the nutshell. Follow me online and you can see my outputs. Don't even have to subscribe to OnlyFans to see the output. No, we... Before we move on, you got caught up in this 604 podcast network scam too, huh? Yes, yes. Our mutual friend Mike Noble recruited me into this multi-level marketing scheme. Multi-level marketing opportunity.

Yes, yes. You're on where the big boys game with Mike Noble, why don't you tell us a little bit about that and what kind of stuff you guys cover on there. Yeah it's a podcast about gaming and anime and he wanted to start a podcast and it was you know 2020 when that was a lot of time and a mutual friend of ours Josh from Wrestling Brain which is not a podcast but a really good twitch stream about wrestling. Okay. And Brains. Brains, yeah. This is on the Canadian.

Yeah. Oh, oh. He introduced us, and we had a hang in, I think, John Rogers Park and just like... Love Johnny Rogers. Absolutely. And we hung there many a time. Absolutely.

We hit like all the same talking points and interests, and we're like, yeah, we might as well just start doing this. And, yeah, you know, I he's signed he's a signed musician very successful musician hotel Mira so had the label connection and we just happened to get on there which was great because it was primarily comedy podcasts but we pitched it as a comedy because I was on the show and Mike's not following me. Yeah. Oh, delicious. Sweet, well, since you know all might knowable, and everybody give Mike and Chandelas and we're the big boys game.

For today's min-famous, and I've explained what a min-famous is, Chandel, so don't worry. But to all of you, small infamous story. Because BC has many rich histories to its credit and among those histories is the history of professional wrestling. Oh, hello! So rich. Very rich.

And Shanda, as you I know you know because we spoke about it before, Josie got here. I am originally from a beautiful, idyllic little hamlet of Vancouver called Surrey. And population like 400,000. And they're... So you know what? We've got industrial, we've got grow-up, we've got stab, we've got truck steal, we've got it all. And there are two big names that I know of to come from Surrey and achieve international fame in the people's opera

Let's house out your wrestling knowledge here. I think I know one of them for sure. Who's that? I think it's John Tenta boom earthquake He's a legitimate former sumo wrestler. Okay, who achieved the I guess the level he got to the heights of Makashita, which was his like Yokozuna, you know what I mean distinct from the WWE wrestler Yokozuna who was a small and dude pretending to be Japanese Yeah, also John Tenta was white. Oh, yeah, white dude white sumo wrestler in Japan in the 70s and 80s Which is really fascinating. Yeah, that is really fascinating Yeah, and he had like a tattoo that he needed to cover I think yeah through much of this And then he came to WWF which was called at the time as like the Canadian earthquake and he had a little Canada flag on his singlet

And then he just became earthquake and then he did a few other things He was you was avalanche was gold guy. You did a few things Yeah, earthquake is good for coastal BC though It is and he would his his thing is he would like jump around and the person and they'd be like, whoa, I'm all off, you know. Good shit, good shit. The other big name, however, which is who I'm really here to talk to you about. Okay.

He's not a big name, especially if you're only familiar with his WWF work. And when I say WWF, it's no called the WWE, I might use them interchangeably. Okay. Is a guy named Rick Bogner? Does that ring any bells to you? Distant bells? No.

Uh, closer bells. Bells of middle distance. I cannot hear the bells. No bells. Let me check in here too. No. Okay. Josie, Josie, who is,

Josie, who is our other wrestling expert here. Yeah. It's not not also now. Let me tell you a story about Rick Bogner. Okay. He's born in 1970 in Surrey, which is where I'm from. Oh my gosh. I already said that. I know, but the tie-ins.

The tie-ins. The connections. He grows up an athlete proficient in diverse track and field events and styles of martial arts. When he's 16, he watches a match between Rick Flair and Ronnie Garvin that makes him wanna wrestle. As a teen, he's already 6'6", 250, a big old tree of a teen. And so he gets into working out

and he's able to get started in the Western Canada Indies. His first exposure to local wrestling is via ASW, all-star wrestling. still doing shows still doing shows And how would you just have you do you know you've been to an all-star wrestling show? I went to one three months ago at the Maritime Center Maritime Labor Center in Eastbound tell me about it It was I'll say an intimate community experience. I I'll say an intimate community experience. I meet a CCC and do you want to translate that? It was, I would say, 50 to 60 people in an event hall

with fluorescent lights. Love it. That's the spirit wrestling right there. Yeah. It was. And there was a lot of kids who they definitely thought it was 100% real. And it was very fun.

Yeah, when you look around at some of the venues that you're in, you're like, you know what, this is a real legion. Yeah, like a legion, like this is a real community experience. I can relate because, you know, doing drag, like when I first started doing drag, before I started to get like, you know, real gigs, like you do it anywhere, anytime, just to get your name out there. It's what Rick Bogner describes when he first sees it as very hokey doe wrestling. Yeah. But Rick also gets an eye on Stampede wrestling out of Canada, run by the famous slash infamous heart family of Canada.

I'm in the shit with them for running my mouth at an Indy Show because my brother was wearing his Bret Hart shirt and this chick that we walk by, he's like, oh, you like Bret Hart? And my brother was like, yeah, he's the best in the world. And I chime in. Yeah, and you'll tell you about it too. Of course, it's his fucking niece. Yeah. And so I started apologize and like, don, you like Brett Hart and my brother was like, yeah, he's the best in the world. And I chime in. Yeah, and you'll tell you about it too. Of course, it's his fucking niece. Yeah.

And so I started apologize and like, don't stretch me in the dungeon. Yeah. Please. Anyway, so Rick Bogner is really into stampede wrestling. And it's a small world. Rick has a friend of a friend whose wife works at the bank with someone who is friends with someone

at stampede wrestling. That's urine. Absolutely. As somebody who picks up random performance contracts on demand, that's the end, right? 100%. And so that's his connects. He moves out to Calgary at 18 years old, to go to school at Mount Royal College and pick up wrestling on the side. Eventually, wrestling gets to be the full-time gig when it gets too tough for such a big guy to sit in those tiny little vests.

This goes well until Stampede folds, but using his Stampede connects he's able to get his tape seen by Japanese wrestling legend at Shi Onita, who introduced Deathmatch Wrestling to Japan, and who runs an outfit called FMW Frontier Martialites Wrestling. Deathmatch Wrestling for Josie is pizza cutters and glass like tubes and shit And barbed wire and exploding rings and fire and they really go for that. Yeah, they that's a good way to put it They really go for the pizza cutter. That's the one that got you oh baby Forks Flaming everything That's the one that gets me. It is. Very, very, very, very classic.

It is talking. Yeah. Our boy Rick Bogner, he makes it big in FMW as big Rick Titan, and he's even able to capture the FMW heavyweight title for 15 whole days. Okay. So probably one of the more inauspicious reigns in their storied history, but you can't unwrite that piece of history. From there, that's Rick's life working as what's called a journeyman wrestler, kind of just a good guy to have around.

He's tall, he knows how to work. He's probably not specifically putting any butts in any seats, but he's good to have on the card. He cuts a... He's a Cookem guy, Cookem guy, cuts a presence. Yeah. He's working in Japan, Europe, Canada, and eventually in summer 1996 he ends up working a show in Alentang, Pennsylvania for extreme

championship wrestling ECW. And so the where we are now, 1996 is like a very particular time in the history of American wrestling because you've got like three specifically big operations. You've got what's still called the WWF and they're in what's called the new generation. Do you know? Tell Josie about the new generation. It was a gimmicky time, so a lot of people their gimmick was an occupation. Yes. So it would be like this guy, his character is a dumpster, he's the character is a garbage man or a character is a plumber or like a dentist clown. Sounds like porn. A little bit. Yeah, looked a bit like a two at times.

Not too much of the clown. Yeah. Well, it depends on the porn. It definitely panned more to kids under the age of 13. Is this Saturday morning like like in between cartoons, there'd be a wrestling show. OK. OK.

Two of the big guys who have just left WWF to go to WCW. WWF's mean rival, owned by Ted Turner, are Scott Hall and Kevin Nash, or as their characters are known, Razor Ramone and Diesel. Diesel we don't need to worry about so much here but all you need to know about him is he's a truck. Yeah he's a big truck driver, Razor Ramon. So I have a question sorry wait before we move on to that. Is he a truck driver or is he a truck? I thought he was supposed to be the truck driver. I thought he was just truck themed. Yeah it might just be like fossil fuel themed.

Essence of semi-truck. Yeah, yeah, yeah. His theme music is her. Her. Her. Cute. Okay. But as you were about to say, razor-rimon is a little bit of a different character.

Razor-mones, Tony Montana. Yes, specifically Tony Montana from the movie Scarface. So to note, Tony Montana Tony Montana Cuban guy Al Pacino not as Cuban. Slightly last Cuban. You're her PN Cuban. Yes. Scott Hall less Cuban than Al Pacino. But he's out there. He's got his like kind of slick back hair. He's got his teeth pick. He's got his little vests and he, hey yo! And so Diesel and Razor Ramon have both had some success in the new generation of the WWF. Diesel was kind of an infamously bad champion and infamously like didn't make much money champion. And Razor Ramon has been the intercontinental champion

which is sort of the mid card title. He's had that a million times but it doesn't seem like they're really all that interested in moving him up into the championship spot. Okay. And so they both get wooed by big money from WCW and they fuck off and they go over and they start to be the outsiders. And the deal with the outsiders is, and this is actually like a very pivotal moment, a very pivotal storyline in wrestling history. Okay. Because the outsiders are coming in and pretending that they are their characters, kind of from WWF without saying it, without like directly alluding to it, but he's got the fucking toothpick and the Cuban accent and Kevin Ashes still call, and they're doing great.

And they're kind of coming over to like allude that like maybe there's some sort of WWF invasion going on of WCW maybe the two sides are gonna fight but of course all of this is there is not gonna be that this is without the WWF's say so this is just some people who've jumped ship on the WWF right they had no room to grow yes so they've come over and over and they're looking for the rob as they say. And Vince McMahon, he's not happy about this. So he sues the WCW saying that like they're infringing on our intellectual property by having these characters show up with the implication that they are razor-rimonan diesel, which belong to us. No worries says WCW. Holland Nash end up teaming up with Hulk Hogan in a

faction called the NWO in probably the biggest wrestling storyline in the 90s maybe ever depending who you ask. Back at that ECW show that I mentioned in Allen's Town, Pennsylvania. Rick Bogner is there. He's backstage and he happens to have a flawless razor Ramremone impersonation. And he busts it out and this happens to get overheard by Paul Heyman, the guy who's running ECW. Bognor gets sent out to the ring with slick back hair, a vest, a teeth pick, under the name Slice and Dice Remures. So obviously a take on razor-rem Yes, yes. The appearance is a big hit, and where it gets back to WWF headhunt show Vince McMahon,

the Wagner can do a pretty solid Razor Ramon, which is great because Vince has supposedly recently decided without running it by the creative team that it's time to bring back Diesel and Razor Ramon. We still own these characters, even if Kevin Nash and Scott Hall are gone. We still own these characters, and soap operas do this all the time. This idea of like recasting a character with another person is not actually all that common and wrestling,

at least not in the way that you might expect. Please feel free to chip in if you can remember this. I can't remember any other instance of this really ever happening. Not doing a direct carbon copy of somebody. No, no. One day Rick Bogner returns home from the gym to hear an answering machine from Vince McMahon offering him the job of his dreams. Ish. Rick is a bit conflicted to hear that he's gonna be the new ways to Ramon. This has always been a massive dream of his to get into WWF. Quote, I had mixed emotions because I was excited to get into the WWE and that had been a 10-year goal for me by that time and I had finally gotten an opportunity

to do it. And if I say no to this, I may never get in there because Vince might be spited by it and that's it for me in the US. So I said yes to it and asked him if we could transform it into something else and if we can evolve it into something else maybe change the character's name a bit, put long pants on them and make it like an Antonio Vandera Mexican type character, note Antonio Vandera is to Spanish, and make it a little bit more evil. I tried to think of different ways to make it my own character. These ways did not seem to advance because he and another wrestler, Glen Jacobs, who at this point Glen Jacobs passed, is do you remember that wrestling dentist?

Isaac Yankeum, that was Glen Jacobs, and he was also the Christmas creature, briefly. I'm nodding. Yeah, he was the Christmas creature. He came out just like a Christmas tree and wrestled. Okay. It wasn't. Okay. And these two get, these very hooky dokey, these two get paired up as the new diesel and the new razor remote. They get trained. They get told to like mimic the old wrestlers as exactly as they can. And the WWF also gets beloved baby face announcer Jim Ross to repeatedly hype the return of razor-rimon and diesel

who are understood by omission to beat Kevin Nash and Scott Hall. Like, we got the guys back, kind of thing. Gotcha. And they do not have the guys back. Instead, they're using this as bait to kind of like call our pay by the minute hotline, tune in on Saturday mornings, you need to get the latest.

And finally, on September 23rd, 1996, happy birthday mom, on a special Friday edition of RAW, J.R. formerly turns heel in a scathing promo, highlighting his real life gripes with the WWF and with Vince McMahon. He talks about how they fired him after he got Bell's palsy. He talks about, oh, they made me wear a fucking toga at WrestleMania. Like, really deep shit. And then he introduces everybody he's back. Razer Ramone. Yeah.

Play Razer Ramone's theme song, Oh, Comes Rick Bogner. And for as much as this guy actually does do a pretty solid Razer Ramone, it might as well be me out there. Yeah. Like legit. The way the fans, it might as well be me out there. Yeah. Like legit. The way the fans, it looks like somebody in like a Halloween costume. Rick is catching a lot of strays. He's getting a lot of like, we want Scott. Get out of here, we hate you.

He's not his fault. It's not his fault. And again, by common consensus, his razor-remone. Not bad. It's also like, I think I'm very interested in like the levels of, I guess, refracted whiteness here because we've got Rick Bogner doing Scott Hall, doing Al Pacino, doing Tony Montana. Yeah. So we've really lost Cuba here. Yeah. In the next. Yeah. As the United States would intend. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And there's a very, there's a very what's it called.

There's a very long history I feel in wrestling of people playing other than their ethnicity. Very rich. Oh yeah. So Razor, of course, is instantly set upon by Beloved Puerto Rican Baby of Face, Saviovega, a friend of the podcast. A match is set next week for Raw,

which ends in a DQ where the debuting fake diesel interferes. The angle, as might be expected, never goes anywhere. The fraudulent duo peeking their relevance with a shot at the tag belt set a pay-per-view event, which they lose, but the audience does not give a shit, could not give a shit, will not give a shit. Fake Razor's last appearance in the WWF is the 1997 Royal Rumble when he comes out third and is eliminated after 15 seconds. Quickly forgotten.

And now that you've been to the Royal Rumble, you know how bad that is. Yeah. 15 seconds. They're trying to milk stuff. Yeah. Exactly. I pay a lot of money to get in that stadium. After that, they get sent to kind of kill the rest of their contracts in

Chippellay in Mexico, in the USWA, where they continue the fake razor and diesel storyline, they end up turning against each other. A lot of five year olds in the crowd who think that this is the same guy as the old razor, and that's really the audience you want to target here with this. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

That one's without any memory. Yeah. I don't know about you, but when they would switch like when someone would switch gimmicks, I didn't know it was the same guy. I didn't know a repo man was smashed. No, I mean, no, when I found out that they would kind of cycle through different personas, I think maybe when I was in my 20s, my blowing shit. Absolutely. Spent hours reading Wikipedia pages. Being like, he did that.

The godfather was Papa Shongo the whole time. It is mine blowing. Yeah. Yes. The USWA thing ends with a fight between fake razor and fake diesel in which my favorite promo fake diesel says, you're not the bad guy. You're the stupid guy.

Got him. They have a loser leaves townmatch. That is, it's the one we want, you're the stupid guy. Got him. They have a loser leaves townmatch. That is, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's the one we call the stupid guy. They have a loser leaves townmatch, diesel leaves town, goes back to the WF in 1997 where he becomes, a cane. Becomes cane.

Who's able? Exactly. The undertaker is able. Yeah. A cane would be the undertakers, Pondtid brother, become like the ultimate WWE company guy for like the next 20 years. He's currently the mayor of Knox, he owns Tennessee. Yeah, that's right.

Wow. He's like a libertarian wrestler of many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many years in the WWF who went on to seek election. The Jesse Ventura of Knox County, if you like. Right, yeah, yeah. It's a long name recognition and so on and so on. So, yeah, yeah. You've been on TV, yeah, you should be a politician. Did you host that game?

So I don't watch anymore. You should be president. In any case, from there, it's kind of back to the Indies in Puerto Rico and Japan for Rick Bogner. Unlike Kane, he doesn't go on to have this story to American career. Right. The fake razor thing I think kind of killed him. Okay.

Yeah. The story goes that at the end of his contract when Bogner called Vince McMahon to check on the status of things Vince told him never call this number again. Yeah. He ends up working in Japan where he becomes a member of the NWO Japan. All right. So technically both real razor and fake razor made it to the big time. Yeah.

He never achieves the level of American fame again and he finds that he doesn't like how badly he needs to harden himself in order to make it in the wrestling biz. He ends up going back to the working world, doing non-restling gigs, studies, Buddhism, and incorporates it into a spiritual lock, becomes a motivational speaker. Unfortunately, Rick Bogner died suddenly of a heart attack on September 20th, 2019 in Calgary. No, reasons. Yeah, pretty recent death, and an unfortunate death because all of the reviews, all of the reviews, it's not a review, all of the obituaries. We're to the effect of like RIP. We're to read you for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Y'all do you what I'm talking about. Yeah, but all of the obituaries start. What have you done better? I'm really trying my hardest. The other one is just say, how three stars is the worst? You were saying that. You said it. I'm okay, great.

Yeah, it was fun. But you give them five. And then one is like you Yeah, I did say that person didn't eat that day. They like I need a granola bar before they Yeah, right the review, but the three is like Yeah, we thought about what you could have done better. Yeah, that's how Taylor don't write. Thank you I'll try to nut up or shut up before that as they say Some of the comments that I saw, for example,

on Ulrich Bogner videos, the disposable razor says 1,44 church. And asking. Says Matthias Platz 5,919, when your favorite characters aren't included in your new wrestling game and you're forced to go to create a wrestler route. Oh. For a pack daddy says, when you get the diesel and razor

action figures from Dollar Tree, the Wrestling Observer Newsletter, a popular wrestling rag that does yearly awards, gave Fake Razor Ramone. But outside of being Fakerazor, seemed like a pretty decent dude, pretty decent wrestler, who just got, uh, got Vince's, I think he got Vince's pretty hard. Oh, damn. Well, I'll take the reins now. It's more fun time. You wanted somebody who is infamous and somebody who was from BC and that was the brief. The first person I thought of was Ted North the Empress of Canada. Good. Ted North all stylized all lowercase and North with an E at the end of it.

Yes. Silent E. Which I recognize from a street name plaque art. There's a Ted North street avenue boulevard somewhere in the city Well, yeah It's there's a lot of alleyways in the West End now that have been officially named after locally famous people and so Ted is one of them awesome. Yeah, it's really cool stylized all lowercase still like bell hooks if anybody was like a another contemporary

Okay, so Ted North is a prairie boy who became one of Canada's leading gay and queer civil rights activists. He was born in 1939 in Alberta. It was, I believe in Edmonton, raised in the Fraser Valley. And when he was of age, traveled extensively on the west coast of the United States.

Fraser Valley for those who don't know is in BC. Yes, yeah. Like, what is that, know is in BC. Yes. Yeah. Like what is that Abbotsfordish? Yeah. Out there. Yeah. Yeah. We talked a little bit about Abbotsford in another episode that we recently did about a sort of queer pioneer in James Chamberlain. He was from Abbotsford. That's Fraser Valley. Yeah. Yeah. All the fruits come from the valley. Oh, yeah. That's so cute. So, how could I describe Ted North? Ted North is a drag queen activist, community leader, mentor,

and from anecdotes of people that I've talked to personally, I had a wicked sense of humor. I don't think he get to be the Empress of Canada without having a pretty decent sense of humor. Yeah, I never spoke to Ted directly, but I had seen him at many events for I moved here in 2011 and so I had seen him at events and he was just like, you know, everybody be like, oh yeah, that's Ted North, but then you learn about this guy's history and like everything that he's done.

You're like, that is fucking Ted North. That is crazy. Yeah. So I'll tell you what he did. I think Ted's most famous piece of activism on August 18th, 1958, Ted and four friends stood on the steps of the Vancouver Courthouse, which is now the art gallery. Yep. And if you go the art gallery on the, I think on the house street side, you can see where

it says like courthouse entrance. Yeah. Yes. Uh, stood on the steps of the courthouse to protest the persecution of homosexuals and call for an end to the criminalization of homosexuality in Canada. Yeah. Yeah. So in the 50s, at this time, homosexuals are legally defined as deviance under the criminal

code and could be arrested for engaging in anything perceived to be homosexual activity perceived to me That's some interpretation. Yeah, absolutely, you know, and this is something that was in Canada like as it was you know as it's known now was in the criminal code like before Confederation oh wow like when it was the Dominion of Canada. Wow. And we, and there was something- They got around to that early.

That was top tier priority. Absolutely. They had that in there. And I think Debian was still the word that they use. So like held over from the 1800s into the 50s. Oh. Yeah. Acts of Debiancy.

Which is, you know, it's like, the criminal code of Canada is really fascinating history because it's obviously dark, but I'll explain later, like also has some odd bright spots to it as well. Okay. Bittersweet? Yeah, a little bittersweet if you will. Okay, top glowyment. Yes. So Ted, at this protest, it's notable because he protested in full drag. Tight. Which was also very illegal at the time. Probably literally tight too. Yeah, it's uncomfortable.

Yeah, I said tired. Um, he anecdotally he was styled to look like Gina Lola Brigida. Ooh, exotic. Yes, if anybody knows, very famous Italian actress. And it like also became a politician later in life too. But this is really interesting because it ties into why there have always been police raids of gay bars and why eventually it led to the Stonewall riots is because you had to be wearing at least three articles of clothing assigned to your gender at birth to, you

know, basically be like, okay, you gotta be wearing like a vest. This is exhausting work. So Ted, this is how Ted got around being arrested because obviously You can imagine they protested that day and they were arrested, right? Yeah, like and he was holding a sign that day that just said I am human or we are human. I'm mixing it up whether it was the singular or like the the collective Yeah, because I've seen photos of people reenacting it. Where it says we are human, right? But it's it was just that really simple message. Man and drag. Yeah. For sure. Obviously like police came ready to arrest them. But he got around the arrest because he stuffed his bra with two separate pairs of men socks and more men's

underwear. So that's three articles of men's smiles find that loophole and separate through yes so from the jump this is a clever bitch yes we we have a knowledge of shenanigans to draw upon yeah this event was covered in the Vancouver Sun and at the time there's a column that's named Jack Wasserman and from what I've read people people refer to this as like, he rudely referred to them as the Lavender Mob. In 2023, kind of sick. I don't think that that's an insult.

No, absolutely. It's the best one they give you your branding. Uh-huh. Yeah, like, you know, also like the market ability behind Lavender Mob. Right. You've got a color assigned. I was just going to say. You've got a color assignment. I was just gonna say.

You got color and fragrance. And exactly. More recently, a flavor. Yeah. No, I love that. The ice cream social. I like a little gentle Lavender ice cream. Oh, super fuming.

Fair, fair, fuxx, fair, fuxx. Fair, fair, fair, fuxx. I, you know, for like this story in itself is fascinating He doesn't have a much longer story to tell he has this quote where you know people are asking him afterwards Like why dress and drag like why not just go and protest the thing and he said and I quote People need it to hear our message. They wouldn't listen to a young rural boy But they would listen to mr. Ted North a man in a dress Interesting that I can easily relate to. Oh. Doing stand-up comedy and drag people are like, why are you doing it in drag?

And I'm sitting there like, well I think what comedy really needs is another white cis male perspective. I got to change it up just a little bit. It sort of gives you the beginning of a conversation even if the conversation isn't necessarily immediately in good faith. Yeah, you know, I mean, I've definitely had hecklers that shows for sure and you can have fun with them, but I know where you're going with that absolutely. I mean, I can only imagine people would assume that he was probably at the time they would have called him transexual right? Because he's wearing women's clothing and he's like, well, right, he's like, it's a performance, you know?

And for listeners who might not know this, what is the difference? Because we have an expert. What is the difference between being transgender and being a drag queen, for example? Oh, well, just a drag is a performance. And if you are trans, then that is your gender identity. Right, right.

So you can be assigned a gender at birth but gender is a social construct, obviously. And yeah lots of people you know transition to the I don't like using the word expression but it's one that comes to mind most often because it's just been overused so much but you transition into like the place that you need to be in life to be comfortable. Right. I've had people ask me if I was, you know, trans, if I was thinking about transitioning, and I always say like, no, because I just, I, that's never been a question for me. Yeah.

I've never questioned that. I just like to do drag because I like the performance aspect of it. Right. Yeah. That makes sense. And of course, they're like, as much as RuPaul's Drag Race as this monolithic thing has all of these issues and highs and lows and whatever, I think it's kind of maybe opened up that conversation of like,

there isn't any particular kind of person who does drag. There's people who do drag, who go by he and him. There's people who do drag, who go by they then. There's people who do drag, who go by he-hem, there's people who do drag, who go by they-them, there's people who do drag, who are biologically women, but like love the performance aspect, there's gender drag queens. There's a performer that's been on drag race, and I can't remember who it is, but they summed up really well, is that drag is what I do with transists who I am. Interesting, yeah, that is sort of a good way to put it.

Yeah. It's real simple, and then you can build off that conversation. Yeah. Yeah, that's that is sort of a good way to know. Yeah, it's it's it's real simple and then you can build off that Conversation yeah, yeah, yeah, that's it. That's well expressed. Yeah so with this man in a dress who's causing a stirr he's getting lots of press coverage and he You know from other people that I've talked to and like anecdotes that I've heard He is one of those people that thought, well, if there has to be change made, like, I'm gonna have to do it. And so he has lots of different notes of activism. So

I'll run through a couple here. He started a letter writing campaign to MPs of Canada's Parliament to remove homosexuality from the criminal code. He would pick at bars in Vancouver that would not admit gay people, which I think is fantastic. That's so annoying. Imagine trying to, you know, the worst. There's no TV to watch the game, but like, imagine trying to watch the game out of bar, and there's a bunch of, like, you know, gays outside screaming to let us in.

For sure, and like, yeah, yeah, come on, please stop, stop, yeah. I think they're in a dress, so all the normies inside are being like, there's a man in a dress causing a, he has a sign. And now you've got to have that individual conversation with 15 diners. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no that. There's a nuance. If you were on the show more, you would be a wrecking mess. So you would pick a bars that would not admit gay people. He founded a gay businessman's league here in Vancouver.

JVL. Yeah, and one of the first gay sports leagues. Cool. I played in, I don't think he founded this one, but I played in Out For Kicks, which was my friend Sam plays in Out For Kicks., queer sports league as a queer soccer league. I played in that for Well, I moved to 2011. I played in that for seven years. Wow How do you rank yourself out of ten? I saw it seven

Modest yeah room for improvement a seven is what someone gives themselves who think they're actually an eight by the way I was I was a goalie and I was also a captain for three years. Oh, okay Well, so you're probably actually and then you shouldn't or a nine even haven't played on a while look at those legs You could either kick a ball through decide you'll be fine. It's only the people at home could see Follow me on Instagram. You'll see it's Oh, this is something, briefly before we started recording, I mentioned Vancouver Pride. So Ted was part of the first gay Pride celebration here in Vancouver, which took place in August 1973.

And it was a picnic in separately park, which is at second beach there's a park that's like, now it's like the family park There's like sweet time. I know they're not you're talking about yeah, and they have a little like gazebo with picnic tables and so held by a group called gay alliance towards equity or gate They used to have a newsletter too, and I think it was called like gay tide or something like I feel like every Organization around that time was called gate and had a newsletter. Yeah yeah you know what I mean very that like it's very much like the Zine time right yes so yeah it just it started as a picnic it wasn't

it wasn't anything official I think in later years it's it's developed into maybe like a little march or something like that in 1981 is when it was municipally recognized as like this is celebration. We're going to have a parade. Cool. Cool. Cool. This is not in my notes, but if I'm remembering correctly, there's an amazing documentary called Hookers on Davy, which talks about the sex workers of the West End from the 60s and 70s. And also in the West End, you know where there's always a weird turn. You can't drive through a street. There's a forced turn. Yeah, those are like hooker stoppers

So that you couldn't just like constantly like park your car or like being like a secluded area Like you always had to like keep moving in the West End. There was no discrete place Interesting god so much of our city planning and architecture is just to marginalize undesirable people. Yeah, there's a sex workers memorial at Jervis and I think Pendrel Street it's the church that's right behind the Superstore. I'm the one. Yeah and it's the I think it's the first sex workers memorial in the entire world. Really? The West End was just like, absolutely filled with sex workers. At the culmination of that documentary hookers on Davy,

they're organizing essentially a Pride parade. It's like a march, like a protest march to protest, like police involvement and criminal code you know amendments to like really crack down on sex work and so that happens in the 70s around the same time that these marches are happening and so I do feel like 1981 where kind of culminates until like a this official pride parade is good but also was like a alright give them right, give them the parades so that they stop having the marches. Yeah. You know, so it's a real, like, picnic vibes versus the, like, more hardcore march. Yeah, exactly. I find that, like, anything to do with, like,

legislation around queer culture is like that two-sided coin. Yeah. You can have this one thing, but like, you're not going to do this other thing. That is the reason the picnic in August of 1973 is why we still have Pride in Vancouver in August. Because it's just always been the tradition. We've always done it. Yeah. We've always done it.

Why would we change it now? Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, International Pride Month being June, and because of the Stonewall Rights being at the end of June in 69, a lot of people consider June to be like, this is Pride Month for everybody. So in some ways it's like, you kind of get two official celebrations. Yeah, especially in the internet age I find that you get multiple waves of like,

Hi gay, it's nice. Yeah, it's nice. Yeah, it is nice. I mean, in some practical aspects, you could argue that the weather is better in August here in Vancouver. That's what I always took it to be. Yeah. And or, and or I was like, I bet Jim David did something in August. That was my second pick. Oh, I mean, that's another infamous person. Oh, yeah, we'll get to that someday. One of these days. Okay, so Ted and his activism, all of these things already, enough to, I would say build a reputation where people think, oh, what a community leader. Yeah.

Two pair of men's socks. Two pairs of men's socks and underwear. Yeah. Come on. Really smart. But I mentioned the letter writing campaign and so this was organized, you know, very grassroots of course, and writing letters to, you know, any MP that will listen, you get a list of them, you enlist all of your friends and I believe it was, you know, through connections

like a cross-country effort. Okay. But Ted was definitely the leader of this and this put him in contact With an MP from Quebec who was ready to listen who would become prime minister in 1968 Pirellion Pierre Trudeau dang so Yes Trudeau G. Yeah, so Ted and Pierre began a correspondence and so he worked really closely with Trudeau on the amendments that he was requesting and that he thought would be fair for homosexuals in Canada.

So, when Trudeau becomes the Prime Minister in 1968, he intend to start working on, and if you look on Wikipedia it's called a historic Omnus bill and it's C150 which is the Criminal Law Amendment Act and so it as an omnibus there's so many things that are covered underneath it a couple of them are to allow abortion under certain conditions so like you know I guess for like a 5050 thing give me give me back to take some back yeah but I'll decriminalize the sale of contraceptives. So we'll take that. Regulated lotteries, which is interesting.

Sure. Sure. Tighten rules for gun possession. Come on now. I don't like that. Introduced new offenses for drunk driving, harassing phone calls, misleading advertising and cruelty to animals. Wooo!

It's a whole... Man, man, man! Yeah! Yeah! Nice! But, and then, of course, decriminalized homosexuality to an extent. Okay. The give and take on that is it was, um, if you are an adult and it's behind closed doors.

So this is kind of where Pierce quote comes from where it's like the state has no business in the bedrooms of Canadians Right, I'm thinking kind of keep it to yourself is a little bit embedded in there Don't ask don't tell don't tell and also like if we don't know about it like yeah, it's the same thing But like also we're not going to investigate because that's the important part of it is A lot of gay people at this time were like well they weren't they weren't cracking down on us before but now that there's a rule they can right but I think it was very important for like for Ted and Ted's work to actually have it decriminalized in the code of the criminal code of Canada yeah because

otherwise like we could still be deviance today. For sure, it's the obvious first step in any kind of similar thing. Yeah, you got to make the biggest laugh. Yeah, but I feel like that happens often where in any kind of change of the law, people are like, well, if we don't say anything, then it doesn't become an issue.

It's not on the table at all. Yeah. But once we say it, then we might't say anything, then it doesn't become an issue. It's not on the table at all. Yeah. But once we say it, then we might lose some of our rights or some of our privacy or some whatever it is. But it has, like, you got to move it off. You got to get deviant out of there. It's too gross. So that in the future, something else can take its place.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, law is a lot about setting precedent, you know? Yeah. So we do have a law school for a better suite than for me. That's true. Yeah, this is this is basically it. And this is the gist of it. Welcome, I guess lecture. Yeah, $30 for your certificate if you want it. Oh, perfect. It's like $35. I'm a man with $30. I should mention by the way, there's a lady that we met via WinJosie with ship and Submo via UPS and she sells hats out of the UPS, Stortz, her own brand called French Boyfriend.

They're very cute. I'm into that. First up, go to Olympic Village, say Taylor and Josie, send your go get your friends boy friend. Thank you. Well, as I put my friends boy friend hat on, the C150 bill, Omnibus Criminal Law Amendment Act, it passes in 1969. So one year into Trudeau being Prime Minister, which pretty fast. All of this. And you can see online like the records of like how many people you know voted for

and I think it was over a hundred liberals voted for this. I believe like 42 almost 50 considered voted against it. Okay. So like overwhelmingly like it was passed which is encouraging. Yeah. That's very encouraging. So after the bill passes in 1969, premier to a prime minister to Trudeau pardon me, calls Ted to tell him the news and started the phone call with your majesty. Stop it, you charmer. I see how he got his dick so wet, that one.

Honestly, that kind of recognition, that kind of charm. To acknowledge a grassroots title, that's pretty impressive. Yeah, even if it's true, and he's most likely just playing the game, hung up the phone, it's like, that'll make the old queen happy. Yeah, but that's not on record. Exactly. I'll tap fake it, blush on the other end of the line. Yeah, I'll be glad to hear.

So he gets your majesty. And you're probably wondering, because I've already called Ted the Empress of Canada how you get such a title Yeah, true. Don't call you exactly. Well, no you name yourself the I assume listen, but I Know perhaps perhaps this was cynical. I assumed this was a self-style. Yeah, well, okay, but it does have a bit of a history to it. Okay, well, we'll accept a history. So Ted among all the other things that he's done, founded the Dogwood Monarchist Society. Still going.

Still going. Still going. Friend of mine is the current Empress, which is the new non-binary title. Stop it, man. Instead of Empress and Emperor, yes. We love Empress. Tight. So the Dog War monarchy society, like that stems from something

that is currently called the International Court System. Okay. And so that starts, 1965 in San Francisco, Jose Sarria was, you know, person in the community who was also doing drag and recognized that you know People in the queer community needed support and then we're gonna get it from other places And so what do we all do now? Who we do like go fund me's and fundraisers? Yeah, yeah, and so the court system started as you know a fundraising event Empress Jose I believe You know a fundraising event Empress Jose I believe

Colloquial mama Jose Just yeah, yeah, yeah raise just a whole bunch of money to give to people in need and good works It's really it's really wonderful because it just it's snowballed from there and because San Francisco is kind of Optimally placed right like northern California, so Southern California can easily see what they're doing, but it's spread to Portland and Seattle as well. And so Ted having traveled the west coast of the US extensively, the best coast, exactly, was in Oregon and was in Portland for, I think it was, let's see, the 1971 coronation for Portland's court is called the Imperial sovereign Rose court Because he had lots of connections there and I like the rose and head yeah, right? Rose is the city's flower. Yeah, I mean

Oh, cuz and the same way that we're the dogwoods Uh, of course. I'm I'm coming on mine folks. It's all fallen into place. Okay, okay Because the dogwood is the flower of BC to make that clear. Yes, I might be getting it wrong, but I think Seattle's is like the Emerald City Court. Ooh! Yeah, like is there known as the Emerald City? Oh, the other bit bro. How'd they get that?

I don't know. What do they do to deserve Emerald City? I know, it's really nice, but I would love to look in that water. No disrespect, don't look at me. I wasn't. You didn't even from Seattle. I know. What are you doing to your shit? I'm a No disrespect. Don't look at me. I wasn't. Yeah, from Seattle. I know That's a big fan

Seattle cracking I Was trying to think of why it's cuz I knew that it was called the world city But I can't I don't really cuz it's just very green would be my guess. Yeah, I would argue we're greener might be Okay, so 1971 Ted's in Portland and then at this coronation he gets invested as the Empress of Canada. Okay, so he does get a title from an existing court. Right, but then you come back. It's a dignitary.

But then you come back to Vancouver and you're just telling people that you're the Empress of Canada. It takes a specific sort. Exactly. It takes the Ted North. Yes, a Ted North type to do this. So then a specific sort. Exactly. It takes the Ted North. Yes. A Ted North type to do this. So then that's 1971. So he starts planning and he tells a local writer, local columnist. I believe one of the first openly gay columnists in

Canada's name is Dale McEwan. I know him. Yeah he's writing for the Georgia Straight in the 70s. Kevin Domecon? Kevin, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, we used to work together at the Alliance. Whoa! I know him. So you can corroborate this with him. Absolutely. I think his columnist name back then was QQ. He did under a pseudonym.

Stop it. I do not know this name. I'm going to bust his balls over here. Yeah, yes. And so he has an anecdote that I've read online. And Ted told him, oh, I went to this thing in Portland and we're gonna Do it here in Vancouver but bigger and better and in 1972 he booked the Commodore Ballroom The local gem yeah to have the first

Coronation celebration and the first Empress of Vancouver Crown was charity the first. Okay. Very, very people. Yeah. I like that. 1972, to present the DMS Dogwood Monarchist Society is still having coronations, still electing monarchs and is known as the mother court of Canada because it didn't exist in Canada until Ted did this so so question did they have a zoom coronation during the Demi oh good question my friend Carmella bars the current Empress and I think last year oh my gosh this would be within living memory ask Carmella bars the current empress. And I think last year, oh my gosh. This would be within living memory ask Carmella.

Yeah, I'll just ask her. But I don't know if there was a Zoom coronation or not. It has to be. There probably was some sort of recognition. There's been one or two years where there's been gap years. Okay, so that might have been a gap year then. Yes. And so.

That's when you find yourself and I'll be there. Yeah. And so from there, like the DMS is born, and then in 1976, it's constituted officially on the Provincial Society's Act. So it's an official, legitimate, not-for-profit organization recognized by the Province of BC. Eudie? Very cool.

Which is wonderful. I mean, you know, of course, like the tragic side of this is that that's 1976, when you get into the 80s and then there's the HIV AIDS crisis. Yeah. Yeah, but the DMS becomes a lifeline for the community because they raise money, they do community care, they visit people, they take care of people. Yeah.

And to the Lord's work truly, because that was a time when like, like, like, people were straight up, you wouldn't touch you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's like, perides. They wouldn't bury you, if you had AIDS. Yeah. And so to like, kind of, be, I guess, a landline and a resource and a rock for people in

that situation to me is just like, the highest calling anybody has ever had on Earth. Yeah. It's truly astounding. All of the work that they still continue to do. And it's estimated that in Ted's lifetime of activism, he's raised over $10 million for dozens of causes. Because in the constitution of the DMS, and I'm not part of the DMS, I've always been like a fan of the story. It was just gonna say, you're just like in the fandom.

Yeah, yeah, like I never want to run for Empress or Emperor because it is honestly so much work. Yeah, it sounds like a pretty serious gig. I mean, $2 million, yeah. Yeah, so there are courts now, like it's international, right? And there are so many of them in the United States and we have There's one there's at least two in Ontario. Okay, there's a court here in Vancouver. There's one in Surrey there is

one in Alberta or there's one in Calgary there might be one in Edmonton Definitely in Saskatchewan and Winnipeg and there's one in Halifax for sure But I think it might be like the Maritimes in general. Yes. Because I remember when I was going to university there they were having these things. That's where I first got exposed to it and was like who the hell is the Empress? Like how do you get that title? Yeah. And then I just found it so fascinating. But when you're the reigning monarch, you're expected to travel to other coronations. So, yeah, and to just, you know, kind of show up, especially if you're a Vancouver and you're the mother court of Canada, you're really

expected to show up and, you know, kind of keep the traditional life. And so Carmella has been to Reno. Has been, yeah, you can talk about Reno a lot. Has been down to Arizona. I think they're going to Texas somewhere. I mean, there's a lot in Texas, if you can imagine. Because it ties into pageantry systems too. Oh, yeah. We've been talking about that too. Oh, yeah, that's good. Texas is pageant.

Yeah, that's good. Texas is pageant ground zero. Oh my god, 100%. Yeah. And so, yeah, like, it's just, I mean, what a body of work for somebody to have found it all of this And I still think it's wild that you know, I like when Ted passed in 2014 I lived here for three years and I would just see him out. You'd see him at Melvich's down on Demonstrate

He would show up to stars. They're just like us exactly They shop He would show up to... Stars, they're just like us. Exactly. They shot. He would show up to events and he would wear Canadian Red Military Garb, which was adorned with metals. But the metals were legitimate because he received... Well first of all, he's in the first class of the Q Hall of Fame inductees in Canada, which is our queer Hall of Fame. He got a Canadian Red Cross Humanitarian Award. He got a fundraising award from the BC Cancer Society, a special service award from the

Governor General, and he got the Queen Elizabeth Diamond Jubilee medal. The Diamond Jubilee! Is it a diamond? Yes, and the Jubilee. It's very ornate. Okay. The Queen! Let me tell you some about the queen.

She doesn't fuck around with her little trinkets. Yeah. Hands out. Oh, okay. They are something to be seen. And so, yeah, he's just, you know, like, accolades, reputations. I mean, that's awesome.

It's really awesome. And I have always just found it really Interesting and like affirming to see an icon of queer culture alive in my time and in the community Yeah, and elder and elder. Yeah, so there's this like queer history. There's so little of it actually recorded Yeah, which we know and there's so much of it out there that is like Which we know and there's so much of it out there that is like As rich and impactful as this and it doesn't have to be as as impactful as Ted's right It could just be like a person living their life But like who knows those stories so

Yeah, the current monarchs are Carmella Barr and Pregs and Scottie V. Box, Emperor 51. Pee-ee. Both friends of mine from way back in the day. Pick up those names for you too. Yeah, thank you. It's probably. And so there's two, I guess there's two follow-up pieces of mentions. So Ted Past and you can easily find obituaries in the Globe and Mail, like a national post. Like, yeah, this is a diamond Jubilee recipient.

Yeah. Like huge, you know, huge recognition of his life and accomplishments. Right. And it's like right here in Vancouver, which is fascinating. All started just in drag protesting on the steps of the now art gallery. Sometimes it just takes a person who wants to speak up.

Yeah. So there is a documentary that was released last year called Emperous of Vancouver and Ted's kind of features in it, but it's about the 10th Empress of Vancouver. Her name is O'Leave, O-L-I-V. Okay. And you might say it stylizes like O'Leave X for 10. I like this papal shit.

I really, really think. Yeah. I know the whole like pomp and circumstance of it. So fun. It's very, so fun. Yeah. I've been to several coronations and, you know, I've worn a suit and like, people go all out with their own.

If not now, when? Yeah. I'm waiting for my invite to the Met. Galadon, no, we're dressing up for the thing where people are getting handed their Roman numerals. They do like they even do like a full protocol so if you have a title you submit your title protocol and when you show up they'll announce you at the door. So they'll be like anywhere. There's also this is a dumb side story but there's a protocol of like so

tipping a drag shows like an old tradition not expected appreciated But at the at the coronations, you know, the the current monarchs will pick people to perform, right and there's a huge lineup of people like going up to like respectfully tip the person or there's a tip jar and I was Extremely drunk at the last coronation before the pandemic and I went to the restroom and a friend of mine Amy Grindhouse Who was a crown princess that year she's performing on stage fantastic name great performer and I saw her performing and I was like oh And it's also is at the old warehouse like the old

Eastside studios warehouse So a space I'm intimately familiar with and I just pull money out of my pocket and like march to the side of the stage. And I was like, hey, like, wait, meanwhile, there is a line of like 30 people deep from all across the United States who have crowns, who have sceptres, who have capes,

and they're all staring at me. And I was like, what are these, why are these stuffy people being so weird? I'm like shoving an Amy just because there is protocol. There's protocol. She came over and she snatched it out of my hand. And she was like, okay, thank you. By embarrassing me.

That's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, shewing me away. And a lady who was a guest of one of the monarchs definitely let it known that I had violated some sort of code. I took it all in stride because my sense of humor is very much like, I can't believe I'm getting in trouble for this right now.

Yeah. Yeah. Nobody explained it. I was not. You need to set. If there's a code, you need to send it to me at least a week before the event. Yes.

There was not in the email. No, no. Those events, coronations are open because they are also fundraisers. Yeah, the ticket that they seem to take their charitable Arms very very seriously. I mean the tickets are like upwards of $50 depending on when you buy them If you buy them late, you know close to the event. Yeah, and yeah, so I mean those are essentially donations Did you as a say did your friend have to empty her bra into the into the collection plate on the way? I took it from me and put it into the,

like, really beautiful chrome, like, of course it was. It was very ornate. Of course it is. It was the whole thing. But, okay, so let's document through the Empress of Vancouver, Oliv, she's the 10th Empress and up until that point, if you see photos of Ted and Drag, it's very, like, pageant-y, right?

Okay. You know, it's like a nice dress and like an up-do wig and everything's put together and matched. Yes. And O'Leave also very glamorous with up-dos but was really the first like punk rock kind of Empress. Really approached it very differently. Thought that the established way of doing things was fine but that you could loosen up and have some fun with it You could tip people at the gallows. Yeah Yeah, or you could do acid before you like go to the coronation It's screened at a couple film festivals. I believe you can find it online now at this point

But Google Empress of Vancouver documentary and it is even if you can only watch the trailer the trailer is just Fantastic beauty and it is even if you can only watch the trailer, the trailer is just fantastic. Beauty. How would you define 81? The beginning of possibilities. Part of the evolution of queer rights in this city, in this country, on this continent, in the world, because some people stood up and said, fuck you. The last thing that I'll mention is it's kind of self-promote because last month I recorded an audio book. Oh!

Oh! Three-swither spoon over here! The book is titled, PS Burnless Letter Please. And so this guy who works, his name is Craig, he works in Entertainment in Los Angeles, and he had a mentor, and the mentor passed in mid-2010s, and Craig's husband was a lawyer.

So he was like the executor of the state, and the will and everything. And so one of the last things that they have to do is go to this guy's garage and basically clean it out. And there are boxes and boxes of things. And in the book, Craig says, you know, kind of the adventure of this is you expect, like, what will I find?

Like, what photographs will I find? And he finds a treasure trove of letters from the 50s and 60s in New York, written as correspondence between friends who are drag queens and trans women. Wow. And so he's collected like some of the standout letters of this. What a cool piece of history to be in prison.

It was really. It was amazing. It was amazing to read and to know that it's all their capture. That is also a documentary, now the hard copy, so that you can have the letters and read them. And you know, get Craig's take on it and he talks about his own life because he grew up, you know, in kind of like a evangelical household, moved to Los Angeles, and just be an actor, also started to do drag as well. So it's a really interesting like intersection of history and like culture at the time and

That the book is coming out in mid-August and I think the recording is open out then as well Yeah, I'm very proud of that one and I just am happy to be part of like that kind of cataloging Project good for you and others are the writing and letters is always so fast. Oh, I mean because it's so raw Yeah, how did it feel same? You know your audience, right? So you're writing just like, fum. Yeah, it's really too detailed. Personal and yeah.

How did it feel to read that kind of material out loud? It felt very affirming, because it's very much like, now I'm connected to the history, but at the beginning of the book, they have a glossary of slang. And so much of it they're like hey here's the pronunciation notes I'm like oh I already know how this is pronounced because we still I still say some of this I have friends who still say some things there like I mean just calling like men girl like you know like that kind of stuff or um talking about

like hookups or like the word trade or like trade. How you just describe like everyday events, you know? Yeah, I wish it's a dialect that is sort of like consciously endured in a lot of ways. Well, I mean there is a coded language that barely exists anymore called Polari. Are you familiar? No, but I want to know everything. Oh, so it was mostly used in Europe and it's kind of based on Italian. Yeah, it was a coded language for essentially gay men to talk to each other. Cool.

So if you wanted to say it's lovely to see your face. If you're like, we're seeing a friend, haven't seen them in a long time. You'd say bona to Vada your dolly old-eak So bona good. Vada to look. Yeah your dolly your dolly old-eak your dolly pretty eak face Okay, yeah, it is so it's very dense, but a lot of it still like, you know, will pull from today like some gainer Really really made a meal of that when I It's there was a very famous at the time English comedy duo called

Julian and Sandy and One of the guys is Kenneth Williams and he was like extremely feminine extremely gay And one of the guys is Kenneth Williams and he was like extremely feminine, extremely gay. You know, just everybody knew. So we never talked about it. In interviews, he spoke incredibly fast. He had a really nasal voice. Hyper-intelligent. And they would do these radio plays of Julian and Sandy where they ran an antique shop. And so, straight customers would come in and then they would talk to each other in Prolar, right? And got it.

It viscerated the customer. God, I got it. If you see on YouTube interviews of Kenneth Williams from the 70s on any talk show, I recommend subtitles. Oh, okay. Yeah. I spent a lot of time in the UK growing up, so even I need some of the subtitles, but I feel I understand a lot of him, but I've showed him to friends and they're like what language is he speaking right now? There's what is coming out of this English

It is English, yeah Funny Yeah So that's the history of Ted North and you know because he lived you know so recently There's so many people in the community who have more stories about him We can tell you like real anecdotes. Like there's a local drag queen. She doesn't really perform anymore, but her name is Peekaboo.

And she was a really close confidante of Ted's in the last couple of years. And so now she's Peekaboo North. And so she has a title. And then Jaylene Time is the Time drag family is across BC and Alberta and she is, she's very much up there in the, it's the College of Monarchs, you know, because she was an Empress and mean, yours was whispered to you by a drag queen who wanted to jump your bones when you were 19, right? So how do you feel like As a boat, like as someone who's not part of that, as far as I'm wearing, maybe you are, I don't know. No, I'm not.

What is the perception, I guess, that you have of that as someone who's not part of that world? Um, when I first started doing drag, I definitely felt a little left out, but I got over really quickly because, you know, I was very fortunate, well, I was very talented to work a lot, but like very fortunate that people would book me for show. And so I just really, the talent is no guarantee of the success. Exactly. So I really ingratiated myself into the community

and I got that sense of community without having to be part of the more ritualized kind of. And like at times, you know, if I'm speaking candidly, like rigid kind of approach to things. You want to be able to just hand the money right to the A exactly right. I got it. You don't have to wait in the procession.

Yes. And do the dance and kiss the ring and move four steps to the left in twirl. I've met O'Leave, the punk rock Empress. I've met her and she, and I feel are very much aligned on our approach the whole thing. Can you just hear it?

Yeah, it's like the history is important. First, not all of the, like, let's say, yeah, ritual, less than tradition. Ceremony. It's all of the, yeah. say yeah ritual less than tradition ceremony yeah the ceremony is less important than the history and the good work yes but yeah and like the community work of course all of it is intertwined and I do love the ceremony but I would hate for anybody to think that you know that is the main approach and that's the main outcome of everything. Because I mean, the money that they raise, it's tens of thousands of dollars every year.

Like if it's a really good year, they can crack $100,000. For sure. For like any charity that they choose, I think it's mandated that one of them has to support HIV, like support or research. Right, right. But yeah, the DMS is recently,

I believe they were acknowledged in the legislature. I think because it was there maybe 50th anniversary. I have a separate question, an entirely separate question, yeah. And I hope this isn't too, like I don't mean to yucky or yama, I don't mean to kill the buzz. What do you make?

Cause I think this is a story about the power of community, but specifically the power of the community united under the banner of drag, to just really affect good change, do charitable works, raise important issues. What do you, I guess, make of that history and contrast with the way that, like now in the States But that shit like creeps up the way that like kind of drag queens are being villainized in the way that queer people have through time in memorial as like Yeah, a drag story hour is like a child molester thing or something. You know what I mean?

Oh, and it's all just a distraction the master thing or something. You know what I mean? Oh, it's all just a distraction. One, it always has been just a distraction and the drag queens are the easiest targets because they're so visible. Yeah. And because, you know, I think for a lot of queens, whether they're, you know, Edward Persona, Lens itself to it or not, want to support queer youth because we all know where we came from. And so, like, I, for my shows, the ones at the Mueller All Ages, because it's an All Ages space, I don't advertise it that way, because I particularly, you know, don't want to always be doing kids shows.

Yeah. But the second somebody asks me if I want to volunteer for a kids show or perform at one, if I don't have a conflict, it is always an automatic guess. Yeah, because it's just like, this is, this is just kind of baked into the whole thing is that you got to give back and you got to nurture the up and coming kids. Whether or not they want to be drag or not, like they just want to go to like, like a fun, normal space, the way that I've approached it actually for the last several years, I know a lot of queer parents and they were like, where did they take their kids?

And so I'm giving the space to the parents, which is like so that they can bring their kids and just feel normal and kind of safe. Yeah. For sure. That's nice too. Absolutely. I don't know. I think it's just one of the things of any kind of performance where you're performing

to an audience that's not exclusively comprised of people that you know. You don't know who you're going to be reaching with what you do, right? You never know how important this show that was just another show for you was to somebody who is in the audience. Every drawing performer in this city and any other city has at least one story after they've done a number where they didn't think twice about it. Somebody comes up to them afterwards and like maybe overstep boundaries and just like drama dumps on you.

Yeah. But like shares this thing of like this meant so much to me and like you know it's it like hmm at times I'm like wow I'm really doing something and at other times I'm like okay so glad that you shared that but like I don't wow you're really doing so I don't want Thank you I'm pretty on a drag queen in that particular way because other than maybe the motherly trappings of certain drag queens There's not anything in there that really says like a drag queen is where I would go if I wanted to get roasted for my shoes Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's the wildest thing that people take away from like a live performance So it's always enriching but sometimes I'm like, okay, we gotta go.

Yeah, we gotta shut it down. Yeah. What would you say to Ted North if you can sit down, have a drink? We've got the Ouija board out. Yeah, I think, I mean the most basic thing, because I'm polite, is I would say, Hi. Thank you. Yeah. I'd say mean the most basic thing because I'm polite is I would say Thank you. Yeah, I'd say hi. Thank you. I'm Shanda established But um, I would love to get somebody like him his thoughts on The internal schism right now of the queer community Because there are a lot of people who are,

and it's a product of like, especially in the United States, where they're like, you know, probably scared of being persecuted, where they're like the trans-exclusive queer people, which is bananas, or like the loss of like lesbian spaces, like I think there's maybe literally two lesbian bars in the United States.

And I, you know, I'd love to see because he worked really hard and I would say in the mid 2000s to 2010s, I don't want to romanticize that time because it was still like very homophobic and queer phobic. But that is when I feel it became really mainstream to have, like you've had like shows like Will and Grace, you've got the Island, the square is kind of coming. Queer I like you've had like shows like Will and Grace You've got the atmosphere is kind of coming queer. I you've got drag race Which is now like now drag is a mainstream art form, right?

You know it's not like in every house of America, but it's in a lot of them It's one Emmys like it has international franchises. Yeah, so I would just love to get his take on Like where he where he envisions, you know, things should go because he was such a visionary, right? Yeah. And he definitely like wasn't, um, wasn't just a like a gay male focused kind of guy. He also had fundraisers for lesbians in need and like was conscious of how broad the community is. The movement. Yeah, the movement. in need and like was conscious of how broad the community is. The movement.

Yeah, the movement. The movement, exactly. Yeah, I mean, he was very much like an activist and a mover and a shaker. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. No, yeah. Getting that perspective from somebody who has like lived through it, much of somebody who like moved and shook it as he lived, you know?

And like, how to do stuff like that. But yeah, I guess, you know, that's all of it. I'm very, I'm grateful to share the story of Ted. Weird, because I think he's fascinating. Yeah, we're grateful that you told the story and we agree that that was a very, very interesting and important and we're excited to share it with the massive, these two mics over here.

I wanna go down and see the street. We'll take a picture of the street sign in our French boyfriend house. Yeah, it's beautiful. Yeah, there's so many little things in the West End. So yeah, you can see Ted North Lane. You can see the sex workers memorial. I like Jervis and Pendrel.

And I believe down on the seawall, around where where the big engagement ring is there's the AIDS Memorial too. Cool. It's like yeah Yeah, I know the one you're talking about that carved into yeah, yeah Yeah, and we have a big engagement ring as well for you to take Instagram photos under so we really do have every day But we're gonna be leaving beautiful BC Behind thematically at least for the next little bit. We'll be coming back for sure But we're gonna be leaving beautiful BC behind thematically, at least for the next little bit. We'll be coming back for sure. I do physically leave tomorrow.

Yeah, well thank you so much for being here. So thank you to Josie for coming and sharing and playing and thank you to Shanda for coming and sharing and playing. Thanks Taylor for coming and sharing and playing. Yeah, thanks all of us for coming and sharing and playing. Yeah, I'm hosting us. Yes, my pleasure. You can find Shanda on Instagram.

You can hit up the rec room in Burnaby once a month. Yeah. And you can also... All ages. All ages. You can also listen to Shanda, Mike Mason, over on where the big boys game on the 604 podcast network. So lots of ways to pursue that pair of social media.

And look for PS Burnless Letter, please, because I think the book is unbelievable. You should listen to the audio book. Yes, yes, listen to me. If you liked my voice this entire time. And if you didn't, you can read it off the page. Will you say stay sweet at the microphone to end the show? Yeah stay sweet. There you go. All right all right all right thank you so much.

Thanks for listening. If you want more infamy, we've got plenty more episodes at www.bittersweetinfamy.com or wherever you listen to podcasts. If you want to support the podcast, shoot us a few bucks via our coffee account. at KO-F-I-D-I-D-C-M-F-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W-W- pressure. Bitter Sweet Enthmi's Free Baby. You can always support us by liking, rating, subscribing, leaving a review, following us on Instagram at Bitter Sweet Enthmi. Or just pass the podcast long to a friend who you think would do it. Stay Sweet.

Much of my information for this week's Memphis just sort of came from my general bank of wrestling knowledge, so much so that I can't even particularly source it, I'm the source. But I also listened to a clip from the podcast Something to Restalith, where's Pritchard shoots on Faker Azerimone. I read, a PW podcast started a cult published by Andrew Sus, September 2nd, 2017. Quick quotes, Rick Bogner, on being us to play the fake Razer remote, being paired with Canaan the Fake Diesel, working with the Hale Jam Ross and Howe Shum, Michael Street at him. This was drawn from an

episode of the two-man power trip of Wrestling Podcast. Rick Razer Ramone Titan, posted August 31st, 2017. I also watched an episode of the original wrestling documentary series The Darker Side of the Ring on YouTube is entitled Rick Bogner, The Real Man Behind the Fake Razor. And I read the Wikipedia page for Rick Bogner. The established chandelier sources for this episode were an article from BC An Unknown Story from knowledge.ca entitled Homosexuality De-Criminalized. An article from The Star entitled It Was Saying Enough Is Enough. Vancouver LGBTQ Community marks 60th anniversary of groundbreaking protest by Sherice Shersharen, an article in Extra

Magazine, X-T-R-A-X-R-A Magazine, entitled Gay Rights Pioneer Ted North dies at 74. Written by Kevin Dale McEwan, published March 31st, 2014. An article from the Daily Hive, Vancouver's hidden history, a drag queen spite for decriminalization, published July 6, 2019. Ted Norse obituary in the Globe and Mail, activist in address, dogedly sought change. Written by Rod Nickelberg, published May 8, 2014, The Dogwood Monarchist Society website, the Mother Court of Canada. The excerpt that you heard from the documentary, Empress of Vancouver, was posted to YouTube

August 15, 2022 by ZIF, the Vancouver International Film Festival. Shand also looked at the Wikipedia websites for Criminal Law Amendment Act 1968, the Vancouver Pride Parade, and Ted North. Bitter Sweet Infamy is a proud member of the 604 podcast network. It owes thanks to our coffee subscriber Jonathan Mott. YouTube can be a coffee subscriber or simply donate.

Just go to coffee.com-b-slash-bittersweet-info. That's k-o-f-i-i-dot-com-forward-slash-bittersweet-info. The interstitial music you heard earlier is by Mitchell Collins, and the song you're listening to now is T Street by Brian Stable. you