Blank Check with Griffin & David - Charlie and the Chocolate Factory with Pilot Viruet

Episode Date: March 17, 2019

Writer, Pilot Viruet returns to Blank Check to discuss 2005's remake, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. But, at one point, were Al Pacino and Robert De Niro considering doing a Willy Wonka picture? What are the gang's Peter Farrelly rankings? What do you call a doctor’s jacket? Together they examine the four grandparents in bed, the trained squirrels and more! 

Who wants a beard? Well, beatniks for one, folk singers and motorbike riders. You know, all those hip, jazzy, super cool, neat, keen, and groovy cats. It's in the fridge, daddy-o. Are you hip to the jive? Can you dig what I'm laying down? I knew that you could. Slide me some skin, soul podcast.

Wow. Is that a good part of the movie? I think that's a funny part. You don't think that's funny? I think it's engrossing. Like, I'm interested that he's doing it. Here's another one. Oh, boy.

Everything in this room is eatable. Even I'm eatable. But that is called cannibalism, my dear children, and is, in fact, frowned upon in most podcasts. That moment's pretty funny. I think that's the funniest line in the movie. No, no, no. No.

No. What? The funniest moment in the movie. No, no, no. No. No. What? The funniest moment in the movie is indisputable. Funniest line. Okay, well, it comes with a line. Okay. Which is when they're in the elevator and he's like, this is like the doll treatment ward. You know, like where all the-

Oh, recent. And he's like, that one's recent. That is so good. When they're on the gummy Viking boat- The whole movie should be that. Go on, yeah. When they're on the gummy Viking boat and they go past the door that says hair cream, Missy Paul's like, what's that for?

And he's like, for shine and volition. Yeah, that's funny. This movie's got jokes. That shit's funny. That shit's funny. This movie's got jokes. Sure. I just had forgotten how many jokes it has.

I mean, apart from that, introduce the movie, introduce the podcast, introduce the guests. Let's talk about it. Hello, everybody. My name is Griffin Newman. I'm David Sims. This is Blank Check with Griffin and David

and the Chocolate Factory. It's a podcast about filmographies, directors who have massive success early on in their career giving a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion projects they want. Sometimes those checks clear. Sometimes they bounce baby. And sometimes the directors

just spend a decade readapting other people's properties. Pretty much. Yeah. Kind of the opposite of the blank check. Although this one feels like they really let him do whatever he wanted with this. Sure. Bull gets that in a second. We're talking about the films

of Tim Burton. This main series is called Podward Scissorcast. And we have a great guest today who has not spoken yet, so I'm not going to introduce them. I'm going to wait until they feel like they're compelled to

butt in. Hi. Hey everybody, Pilot Verowitz here. Hi. Hey. Hey, everybody. Pilot Vero is here. They're back. War Horse. When was War Horse? It's a while ago. It's too long ago. You've had people at screenings quote,

I want to fuck that horse to you, right? Yeah, it's really uncomfortable. Because it's sans context. They just go, hey, Pilot, wanna fuck that horse? And I think it was a screening for like a really sad movie too or something. Right. It was like Son of Saul and someone came up to you and said, Pilot, wanna fuck

that horse, huh? Oh boy. April 2017. A couple years ago. A couple years ago. Wow. Too long. Too long. Beginning of this main series, which started I don't know, 1987? An eon ago. Yes, right.

Yeah, during the Eisenhower administration. I threw out to you, are there any you'd want to talk about? Before we had really booked any of them, I wanted to make sure we got you on this miniseries. And you said, I'm a pretty big defender of Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. And I said, thank God, because at this point in the miniseries, I'm really going to be working to build defenses for these movies. David's going to be so tapped out. Right. That's not exactly how it's played out.

No, I'm tapped out. Ben is fully tapped out. I'll say this. I feel pretty worn out. By Burton? Yeah, just by so exclusively existing in this realm for a long time. But this was your dream to discuss Timothy Burton. I don't dislike it, and I'm not saying that I regret it,

but I do feel a little tired. Sure. It's maybe like you eat too much candy and your tummy starts hurting. Well, at this point, we only have two more Burtons to do, and they're both kind of good ones. One of them we think is probably his best of this decade. Yes. And the other one we haven't seen yet. Interesting. Oh no no no. If you're including

the Dumbo that's three we have to do. What's the other one I'm forgetting? Big Eyes I think. Oh yes. Okay so two films. His two more interesting. His two ones that aren't him taking some fucking property. At this time we've been recording all out of order. We have left to do Sweeney and Big Eyes

and then Dumbo will come out. This is one of the ones that I feel like people hand wave. They just kind of go like, it's easy to hand wave because they go like, it's not the original. And the original is such a lightning in a bottle movie. See, I don't like the original. I don't like the original.

I don't like the original. I don't like it at all. I think that's why I like this one so much. So I'll say this. Pilot and I are aligned. Or at least I was not like, when this was coming out, it wasn't like-

It wasn't a sacred text. The book was very sacred. I'd read it over and over again. This feels a little more like the book than the original does. A little more. That's why I like it because I thought the original

wasn't at all like the book. It was kind of too happy and not creepy enough. I mean, this is very much filtered through the Tim Burton thing. It's not just a didactic adaptation of the Roald Dahl book. This feels closer in tone to Roald Dahl than any other adaptation of his work I've seen.

James and the Giant Peach is pretty good. It's pretty good. I'd put that number two. The BFG is okay. I'm sorry, you mean the BFJ? Come on, where's the BFG? What does he think of Charlie and the Chocolate Factory? It's an awful chocolate scrumptious fish's waffles. BFJ!

Matilda's kind of weird. Matilda's good. There are some good dolls. Witches is good. The Nicholas Roeg Witches movie that is so bizarre that it exists. Yeah, that one's weird. That movie frightened me as a child. Which now Robert Zeme that it exists? Yeah, that one's weird. Oh, that movie frightened me as a child. Yeah, which now

Robert Zemeckis, Bobby Z, is doing his weird Creole witches. Don't do that. His, like, Southern Gothic. Yeah.

Netflix is doing a bunch of Roald Dahl. Are they? Yeah, I think they're doing it as, like, a series where, like, each episode is going to be a different Roald Dahl book or something.

There are a lot of those good ones that you can't really adapt fully. But, like, the Twitches, is that what they were called? The Twits. The Twits. Are they adapting that?

They should. I always fucking love that. I really liked it. It was also short so I could read it. But like that one's kind of like horrifying. They just hate each other. Well, all of them are horrifying. But that one's like pretty naked.

Like it's not really a plot. They just are trying to kill each other. That's where I think it was the funniest fucking thing when I was a kid. Did you read The Swan? Yes. Yeah, that was my favorite because it's so fucked up. I think I read all of them. The Twits is in here. All of us must have been Roald Dahl kids, like big Roald Dahl kids, because we all have

that sensibility, and when you're a kid and you're reading children's books and you're like, give me the thing that's got the anger I feel inside my child's stomach, you know? Give me the thing that has as terrified a view of the world as I have. And yeah, I liked

all the Roald Dahl movies growing up, and I was a big fan of The Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, or really Wonka and the Chocolate Factory, but it's not a movie I place on Mount Olympus. I do think it's one of those things. He's a jerk. I could never get over it. He's so mean in that movie. I love that performance. I think Gene Wilder is incredible in it. I do think it's one of those things. He's a jerk. I could never get over it. He's so mean in that movie.

I love that performance. I think Gene Wilder's incredible in it. I love Gene Wilder. I've got no beef with Gene. I think this movie's more interesting because they do not for a second try to make him even slightly cute. Right.

Because they just so fully own the fact that Willy Wonka's a creep and an asshole. Yeah, I guess so. Which I feel like turned off a lot of people and I think you watch it today and it's a pretty daring choice. Especially at a time when everyone still loved Johnny Depp. When he had not turned into Grindelwald.

We can talk about this. I think they make him a creep. I don't think they make him an asshole. I think he's an asshole in this movie. He's kind of an asshole. Yeah. He's not very nice, I suppose. He's an asshole. But there's no nuance to the performance. I think there's a lot of nuance. No.

I think it's just this cold, stiff, tired performance. Ben, are you into the Tim Burton movies? No. The recovery? I'm done with him. Can I ask which is your favorite? Movie of Tim Burton's? Yeah.

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dirt bike Benny just graduate to certain titles over the course of different mayors such as Kylo Ben producer Ben Kenobi Ben I. Chonwan Ben Sate

say Ben anything dot dot dot Ailey Benz with the dollar sign Warhaz Ben 19 the fennel maker. Benglish, Mr. Incredible. Eat, Drink, Ben Hosley. Am I forgetting any?

Probably. Probably. What's the Nancy one? Oh, the Hosley day. There you go. What's his Burton one? Who knows? Who can say?

Yeah. But didn't someone have... Ben... Wait, no. Dumbo. Hasbo. Hasbo. I'm trying to remember.

I feel like... Bold. I'm calling it. The one I like the most, and it's a little untraditional because it doesn't include your name in it. It's more describing you is Beetle Vape Juice. Ooh, yeah. That's it.

That's a good one. Beetle Vape Juice. You got it. That one is good, and it doesn't have Ben or Haas in it, which is sort of like- It mixes it up. Exactly. We need a little bit of variety. Because that's stretch where I go, Mr. Incredible.

Right, right. Benglish. Eat, drink Ben Haasly. Very funny, but his name's in it. Right. His whole name. Right. I like Beetle Vape Juice.

Mm-hmm. I'm calling my shot now. I think that's good. on my shot now. I think that's good. So, in the early 90s, Warner Brothers,

who had purchased the rights to Willy Wonka from Paramount. In like the 70s and 80s, Warner Brothers started buying other companies' films for home video, which ended up being

a really smart decision for them. Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory is Paramount, right? It was Paramount. The Wilder movie. Now, Paramount released it,

but how did the movie get made? Mel Stewart, who was like a British TV film director, his daughter read the book, said, can you please make a movie out of this? And asked like Uncle George or whatever his name was, who was his producing partner. And he called up his producing partner. And the producing partner went, ooh, good timing. I've been talking to Quaker Oats. I've got this Chocolate Factory on my hands.

No, do you know what it was, truly? Oh, boy. All right. He been talking to Quaker Oats. I've got this chocolate factory on my hands. No, do you know what it was, Truly? Oh, boy. All right. He was talking to Quaker Oats, and Quaker Oats was like, we want to go into candy bars. Okay. And they pitched to Quaker Oats, if you put up $3 million, Quaker Oats fully financed the movie. Okay.

If you put up $3 million, this is the perfect opportunity to launch a candy bar. Oh, and so they, did they have like the Wonka brand? They bought it. Right. They bought the rights so that they could make the film and make the candy bar. Right. Quaker Oats fully funded and produced this film. Paramount got distribution rights, but it was a movie made by not a studio, but by a

food company. That's bizarre. Very bizarre. And Roald Dahl hated it? Didn't like it. He wrote the script. They took it away from him. They rewrote it.

They added songs that were not his songs. Because the book has songs. The book has songs. They're weird, but they're in it. He thought it was too treacly. And the film does okay when it comes out, but it sort of grows and grows and grows. No, it doesn't do well, yeah.

$4 million. Especially over home video, it becomes a huge, huge thing. And cable TV replaying, a lot of this is Warners and Ted Turner playing on TNT all the time. All these fucking things, right? This is one of those movies like

The Wizard of Oz, like Citizen Kane that Warner Brothers acquired over a period of time when Warner Brothers' home video library and TV Library just became so fucking robust. So it's the early 90s. And Willy Wonka has officially become like this like family classic movie that everyone loves. And it's like one of the most parodied things in pop culture.

Sure. And like the Candyman and these songs. All that shit. And the notion of the golden ticket. I mean, think about how many TV shows have done their Willy Wonka parody episode. Sure. The 30-lock one. It's always, like, stuck in my head.

Right. It's just, like, one of those things that's, like, in the tapestry. I feel like every two years there's a Willy Wonka sketch on SNL. We're saying there's recently been two Grandpa Joe sketches without Willy Wonka, which is weird. The one that sticks in my head. This is Griffin's pop culture obsession. His SNL's unconnected, which is weird. This is Griffin's pop culture obsession. He's SNL's unconnected Charlie. I'm trying to figure out

if these sketches take place in the same timeline. Because they've had two Pete Davidson Grandpa Joe sketches and they don't seem to shake hands with each other. Do you remember when Al Gore hosted and they did this sketch that was Al Gore as like Steven Wonka who was Willy Wonka's brotherhood

to take care of the books for the chocolate factory. No, but that sounds like a perfect Al Gore sketch. It was a perfect Al Gore sketch. And it was just Al Gore being like... Was that the one he hosted where the opening monologue is where he's president and everything is nice? Yes. Yeah, I've seen that.

Right. And then that was like the best sketch they had was him like in the wig and the suit and everything. Right. Being like, Wilbur, this is unsustainable. We can't have a chocolate river running all the time. Right, right, right.

Really good sketch. I see him. Yeah. Yeah. He looks funny. He looks like Gene Wilder. Yeah. And that's a man who almost was president.

There he is. Yeah. So they try to reacquire the remake rights because I think they just had distribution in the original movie and not the rights. So they go to the doll estate and the doll estate is like, we didn't like that last movie.

We'll give you the rights, but condition on us signing off on the actor and the director. And so the movie's in development hell throughout the entirety of the 90s. And there are always these rumors coming out of whoever the biggest star is at the time. And usually the director they'd pair him up with was whoever had directed the most recent family comedy.

Okay. They were always going like family movie. Gary Ross. Gary Ross. Tried to make it with Nicolas Cage. Is that right? Yes. Rob Minkoff, who directed.

Adam Sandler is the one that destroyed me, just thinking of him being Willy Wonka. They tried to do a... He would just yell. He would just be yelling. And I would love it so much. That sounds good. Jim Carrey. Wait a second.

Jim Carrey and Tom Shadiac. Right. I mean, Carrey does seem like it's almost crazy that didn't happen. Warner Brothers was pushing for it really hard. And they were not into it. And the dollar state would not have it. And they were like, here's Tom Shadiac. He just did Liar Liar.

Right. But they were like, he's a hack. Like, fuck it. Right. They were like, we want someone who's got an actual vision. And they kept on picking, like, whoever made a big comedy or whoever made a big family movie and pairing up with either that moment's hottest dramatic star or comedic star. And packaging as an obvious kind of thing.

Rob Minkoff is the guy who made Stuart Little, right? Right. And he had directed The Lion King. And then Stuart Little was his first real, right. Yeah. It's a real movie. Stuart Little is so good. Stuart Little is fucked. He. And he had directed The Lion King and then Stuart Little was his first real, right? Yeah, it's a real movie. Stuart Little is so good. Stuart Little is adorable. He fucks.

He doesn't fuck. He does fuck. He has that car. He fucks. Wow. You don't remember that scene where Stuart Little takes his car out

and goes clubbing? Pussy magnet. Yeah. His little car. And he fucks a couple people in the bathroom. Isn't that movie like 78 minutes long?

It's like one of those. I think that's Stuart Little 2. Oh really? Stuart Little 1 has a pretty robust narrative. Stuart Little 2 is 77 minutes long. Thank you, I knew it. That's a perfect length for a movie. Stuart Little 1 is a whole 84 minutes long. Right, robust.

Do you like Stuart Little 2 more? Because that feels a little more like a pilot movie. I can't remember anything about Stuart Little 2 it's heavy on the board James Woods is like an evil falcon and the whole movie is like Stuart Little hanging ten he's like tubular the poster's him with like a helmet

like catching some air so it's like Stuart Little X Games I'd probably love that I should watch it it's one of those movies that only happened in like a one month window, you know what I mean? Right. Like everything that they were trying to appeal to about kids like is gone.

Stuart Little was a hit and then they were like, you know what else is a hit? Tony Hawk for N64. It's just funny that he has a helmet where they're like, that mouse better wear a helmet though because kids need to learn safety. Right. And he's doing the, what's the hand gesture called? The shocker? He's doing, yeah. because kids need to learn safety. Right. And he's doing the, what's the hand gesture called? The shocker? He's doing, yeah.

Yeah, he's doing, you know. Yeah, he's like the hanging ten. Yeah. Totally tubular. But these are the kinds of directors they want, and they never, ever get the doll estate approval. Sure. And I think, you know, Brillstein Gray has been on this movie forever. At this point, Brillstein Gray has been on this movie forever at this point Brillstein Gray

has become plan B so Brad Pitt and Jennifer Aniston are with Brad Gray trying to develop this thing and Pirates of the Caribbean

comes out and it's humongous fucking hit and suddenly they go like oh what about Tim Burton

and Johnny Depp because now Johnny Depp is a viable leading man for a big blockbuster. His weirdness has been approved by the American public. It's cool. And Tim Burton had made most of his film to help Warner Brothers. Now, I distinctly remember, because over the years you'd hear all these rumors, the weirdest one was that De Niro and Scorsese were going to do it,

which they apparently considered it for a moment. Hey, you want my fucking chocolate or not? That would also be great. Yeah, exactly. The De Niro face throughout the entire movie. It's just casino, but Charlie and the Chocolate. I used to do that as one of my stand-up bits when I was 11. When I was 11 and I did stand-up for kids, that was my stand-up bit,

was I would do my impression of Robert De Niro doing Charlie and the Chocolate. Please? I heard the boy, the oompa loompa do Factory. Please. I mean, whatever the fuck I said. This is like some Green Book bullshit. Would Joe Pesci play the all the, like, DeBruy style? Yeah, and then I probably did a Pesci voice, right, yeah. I did a bit that was, like, weird remakes.

I forget what the rest of them were. You remember every single word of that bit. I did a Sam Mendes ET, which was just ET American Beauty, which was really weird. That was sweaty. That sounds more than sweaty. That sounds like malarial. It was. It's like you're about to die.

It was drenched. You're right. It was flop sweat. But I had always said they should let Tim Burton and Johnny Depp make it because I was the weird Tim Burton and Johnny Depp kid so when they announced that they were doing it my dad I remember

held up the it was like Dewey defeats Truman he walks into your room with the paper because of course it was front page news I was dipping nurses in the street and kissing them how old you been in 2003 Of course it was front bench news. Right. I was dipping nurses in the street and kissing them. How old you been in 2003 when this was announced? When this was announced, I was 14.

But I'd been saying I wanted this movie since I was 11. Sure. You know, I was like, here's the smart idea. Why don't they give it to the two weirdest guys in Hollywood? Whoa. Because if you're going to make another Chocolate Factory movie, it's got to be twisted. So it felt very vindicating. And I was super hyped up for this movie.

And I liked it a lot. But it is incredibly strange. And I feel like at the time, people who hold the original as this sort of immaculate work were very against this movie. Gene Wilder publicly was like, this movie sucks.

It was money-grubbing money-grubbers. There's no reason to remake it. Right. I think was like, this movie sucks. Money grubbing money grubbers. There's no reason to remake it. Right. I think it had two hits on it. One was like, you just remade Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, but now the lead has no charisma, so what's up with that? And then two was the more widespread, like, this thing has so much CGI,

what's going on there? I think that's the valid argument to make about this movie. This movie does not look great the cgi age is very poorly the sets look great the sets are good anytime they're in a practical environment it's so good the cgi looks really bad in this movie um but uh i it made a lot of money it was fairly well reviewed but then i feel like it's now like had this sort of legacy of just like you know like Charlie and the Chocolate Factory but the original

not that Johnny Depp bullshit I don't like either of them I mean that's not true I like this one more than the Wilder one the Wilder one's like he's so mean so what are your problems

with the original Pilot I don't know I don't like Gene Wilder in it that much and I also just find most of it boring and it's just like

I thought the book was super dark when I was a kid. And so I wanted to have a super dark like adaptation and that was not it. Aside from like the one tunnel scene like everything else is just like bland to me. Right. Which I feel like people talk about that movie as like oh that's one of those kids movies that's like actually fucked up because the tunnel scene is scary. Like it's the only scene. That's the only bit.

And the rest of it. That bit's good. Yeah. I mean it is good. Yeah I like that movie i just think this willie wonka makes more sense as a character neither is quite right to me but sure um i think this one's closer aside from the daddy issues the daddy stuff uh we're gonna talk about i like the daddy yeah you like the daddy stuff. Yeah, you like the daddy stuff. I'll say this. A very weird movie to watch, and this was a mistake on my part, the day after you watch all four hours of Leaving Neverland. Oh, boy.

Not a good double feature, which I accidentally did. Even though Depp, on the record, and I literally texted Pilot this week being like, it's so weird that he's doing a Michael Jackson thing. And then Depp, on the record record was like, I wasn't. Right. I was doing some other shit. It's Anna Wintour meets Captain Kangaroo.

Okay, buddy. That was his defense. Whatever, right. He's doing Michael Jackson. I think so. Not exclusively. Even if he's not trying to, like he is,

kind of. Like the paleness and the sort of weird hair. I think it's very subconscious for him. And then his big defense he would use is, it's not like Michael Jackson at all because Michael Jackson loves

kids, and Willy Wonka, my character, hates kids. Great defense. Case closed. After watching Leaving Neverland, you're like, I wish Michael Jackson hated kids more. Oh my God. I wish he hated them. Okay, so the Wilder. Yeah. I don't like that he yells at them

at the end. I just hate that. Yeah. I just think it sucks and it's stupid and it ruins like the whole movie for me. Interesting. Those kids suck. The final scene when he like yells at Charlie in the office. The whole like test. The fake it.

You know. Oh, okay. The other kids suck too. Yeah. I mean, except for Viola Beauregard who's a fucking legend and should have won. Best scoring actress? Sure. Or the competition. The competition. Okay. She should win the competition. Well, she's a fucking legend and should have won. Best scoring actress? Sure. Or the competition.

The competition. She should win the competition. Well, she's a champion. Yeah, exactly. She's good. What does she do? She chews gum? Yeah.

And Dahl's like, send her straight to hell. Hell. That's where she goes. Blow her up. Yeah, exactly. She's too competitive. Okay.

Isn't it a competition? Yeah, you're right. I get his beef where it's like you know Augustus is like a glutton like

and Veruca's spoiled and Mike TV that's he's American I guess is sort of the beef with Mike TV well it all hated television right

watches too much TV and then the other idea is that he's like he's too violent might be right yeah because in the book he's obsessed with

gangster films in the Gene Wilder film it's westerns and in this it's video games but either way he's too violent mind them. Right. Because in the book he's obsessed with gangster films. In the Gene Wilder film it's westerns and in this it's video games. But either way he's constantly like pew pew pew.

Right. Fine. American to me. Sort of grinding an axe against Americans. Right. And then what is Violet Chews Gum

which is a filthy habit I guess. She's too driven. Yeah. Considering it's a Roald Dahl book I'm a little surprised that one of the kids

isn't a Jew. Oh God. I had to a Jew. Oh, God. I had to say it. You did not. He's an anti-Semite. He had some problems. The book has some problems. Well, Johnny, Depp is a freaking creep. We should say that, too. Yeah, we said it a thousand times.

I'm saying it again. Do you know how many times we have to bring that up? We'll say it again. Yeah. He's, what's he, like two more movies after this one. Okay. So hot takes in this episode. We're calling out Roald Dahl. Johnny Depp.

No good. Michael Jackson. Jackson. We don't like you. Willy Wonka. An asshole. Well, I call him out. Willy Wonka taking a stance.

I'm taking stances. Here's my thing on Wonka. Yeah. I don't like the dad thing. I know that's a regular opinion that lots of people have. I've never gotten that. I like the dad thing. He should be like an elemental creature that you just don't understand.

That's what I like about Willy Wonka. He just doesn't make any sense. Nothing about him makes sense. I don't want him to have parents who have sex. I like them. And be like, yeah, Willy Wonka. That's his name. I like them doing the math on Wonka and I like, I like them. Give birth to him and be like, yeah, Willy Wonka, that's his name. I like them doing the math

on Wonka and being like, this is why he's fucked up and this is how it manifests. I get it. And making him such a prickly character. I'd rather like not know

why he's fucked up. Well, I think the, the thought, the thought is, that's what they did in the Gene Wilder movie, so why not do something

different here? You've already made this sort of, and I get, neither of you like the Wilder performance, but for a lot of people here? You've already made this sort of... And I get neither of you like the Wilder performance, but for a lot of people, they view that as this is the elemental. He's just sort of a magical force performance. I don't mind the Wilder performance.

He's very arresting. The opening bit, it's great. It's a great bit where he's like got the cane. Great bit. Right. One of the better bits. Which he said... 10 out of 10 bit.

Wasn't his whole pitch like i want to do that he pitched on that bit and he said i'll do the movie if i can do this because from that moment on you don't know whether the character's lying or telling the truth now i think as you said the problem with the performance if you want to get technical about it and what it does to the movie is it then implies that he is a nice guy pretending to be an asshole right which is very weird right that every time he's acting like an asshole. Right. Which is very weird. Right. That every time he's acting like an asshole, it's a test. I know how I'll suss these children out.

I'll be an asshole. Right. Why? Right, which is... Also, his system is bad. Five tickets? Yeah. That's your sample size?

You have four asshole kids and one kid who's boring. Like, he wins by default. Also, none of it, like, just getting a ticket doesn't prepare you to own a factory. No. I feel like there's a lot more training you need to go through. Just with the algorithm. What if we're going to talk about. What if the back of the ticket had instructions on how to own a factory and really tiny print.

Listen, I got, I got, I got a sound off on Grandpa Joe. Okay. Okay. Here we go. Oh, whoa. Oh, all the sudden. Hold on, hold on. I'm just going to earmuff Pete Davidson quickly. Okay. Here we go. Oh, whoa. Oh, all of a sudden. Hold on, hold on. I'm just going to earmuff Pete Davidson quickly.

Okay, go on. All of a sudden, somebody can dance? Mm-hmm. He's been sitting in bed getting cabbage soup fed to him? You know why? He's doing a sort of stripper dollar bill symbol for cabbage soup. As soon as that gold shines, somebody conveniently can dance. Yeah, because he's got a golden ticket.

How do they go to the bathroom, too? In the bed. What are you talking about? They probably have like a... There are buckets under them. No, I think... That's why they're the bucket family. That's why they're the bucket family.

You guys are being ridiculous. There aren't buckets in the bed. They piss and shit on each other's legs. Oh, jeez. That's what they do. Come on, let's not be silly here. No jokes. They piss and shit on each other's legs.

It is weird how hungry they are, but they live a long time. There is something good. That's that's the buckets have that going for us. We should just walk in and be like, my grandpa is like a thousand years old. He only eats cabbage soup. And look at him. He's fine. He hasn't got out of bed for months.

And now he's dancing. I mean, I like to now he's dancing. Months? Years? Dancing. I mean, I like to think he's just faking it. Like, once everyone's sleeping, he just goes and, like, hangs out. Yeah, he, like, goes to the bar. Yeah. I do like that. I mean, we'll get to it.

But in the original, it's, like, what's his name? Jack Albertson? You mean the actor? Yeah. I don't fucking know. Yeah, that guy. Who's, like, very wonderful, gets up and does this, like, really, like, elegant musical number. Right.

And then in this one, Grandpa gets up and does, like, a kind of disturbing dance. Yeah. Where he seems like he's possessed. Like, I like that in this one, the Grandpa's health is better. All of them are kind of creeped out. Sure. Like, they're like, what the fuck is going on with Grandpa? They're not charmed by it.

No. This movie doesn't want to charm you. No, and casting Jack Kelly is a choice too. David Kelly. David Kelly, sorry. Why do you think that's a choice? Because he's a very weird actor. Sure. Like he's got an odd, offbeat

energy. He seems not into it. Like, I don't mean the actor, but like Grandpa Joe. Yeah. He's just like not that into it. I mean, he's too old. He doesn't care about anything. That's how I want to be with this movie. Like he's going to have a factory just like not that into it. I mean, he's too old. He doesn't care about anything. The biggest thing with this movie. That's how I want to be when I'm older. Like he's going to have a factory for like two days and then die. Sorry.

I feel like also with this movie, once they get into the chocolate factory, they're kind of less interested in Grandpa Joe and Charlie until the end of the movie. The original like checks in with them a lot. The original is more about them being in the factory. Right. It's like always through their eyes they constantly have these side conversations about like isn't this amazing charlie yeah um this one is very much more just like they're kind of just standing there but a lot of things in this movie feel that way about like where they're sort of like now we have to do this bit let's do it you know like it feels sometimes feels a little

perfunctory it does yeah like not and And then Burton comes alive with the weird shit like Christopher leaves his dad in. It's a dentist. And then you're like, oh, he likes this. Do I like this? Look, the movie's not totally cohesive, but he does feel alive in this. I mean, he's making like exciting choices.

You feel like... Much more so than like Alice in Wonderland. This movie has comic energy to it. You know, in a way that Alice doesn't, in a way that Dark Shadows can't sustain. Sure. The Oompa Loompa backstory, I really liked. There's so much stuff that's so weird.

It's so weird, but I kind of liked it. Yeah, I liked it too. I thought it was just silly to add to the like, is it in the book? I think it is. It's sort of in the book. It's a little different. I mean, they're always from like, Roald Dahl is canceled. You know, like darkest Africa.

They're always like from a mysterious far off place. There's a lot of tribalism. Initially, they were literally black in the book. And someone pointed it out to Roald Dahl that it was like so racist. And he was like, it is racist. I'm going to change it. And like everyone was like, see, he changed it. It's like, okay racist I'm gonna change it and like everyone was like

see he changed it it's like okay I'm glad he learned right he was never racist again exactly so it's like well he did change it

uh okay yeah but to make them like an identical pygmy species right where they're just you know whatever yeah

they're different they're from far away but I do like that scene I like the backstory of like Willy Wonka with the chocolate palace. That was good. I like the way they sort of build up the character. I mean, they do a really good job of just like all those things, not showing his face for the first like 30 or 40 minutes and building up the mythology of this guy. Because I'll say the original maybe like sells you harder on the magic of candy.

Like you can't discredit how effective that Candyman song is. And just like as a starting point being like, okay, I guess chocolate fucking rules, you know, from the starting of the movie. This movie- Dahl's good at that too, just in general. He really makes you want that fucking candy.

I remember seeing this movie with my friend Daniel and when they get to the factory, he just went like, wait, why does everyone care this much about candy? The movie doesn't make as strong of a case for candy as it does for Willy Wonka as this crazy mythic figure. It is weird that

what if Nestle was like, come to the Nestle factory. I'd be like, no thanks. Why? What am I i gonna see there right right right it would first of all you think like it would just be a boring sterile like robot plant i mean i'm assuming the nestle factory doesn't have like oompa loompas who sing when children basically die right they actually do have that but it's also they actually do it's also sterile and automated like amish people amish amish would be good if they were a bunch of amish

amish boy yeah that's so much better than just like an angry dentist dad he'd been like i want to be both an industrialist and a chocolatier. And they're like, those are not Amish things. We're not into those things. That was one of the cleanest ad reads we've had so far, right? I'm fucking dead. Fucking dead. All right. You know what I love about that damn Candyman guy?

It's so easy to get on the same page as him. I feel like he walks in and everyone immediately gets what's going on. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, we were talking about Charlie and the chocolate factory. Right. Right.

Right. Well, let's start at the beginning of this movie. Sure. I think the first 30 minutes of this movie are perfect. I think all the Charlie Bucket family stuff in this movie is perfect. Pilot, can you weigh in on this? I love Freddie Highmore. Freddie Highmore rules. The good

doctor himself, he's a good doctor. He's such a good doctor. And I'll say this, he's a really good kid. Can I tell you my favorite good doctor episode? What? It's a two-parter. Have you watched every episode? I watched most of the first season. The premise of the good doctor is that he's a good doctor. Is there anything else going on there? Sometimes he's a great doctor, but mostly he's a good doctor. But that's only during on there? Sometimes he's a great doctor. Yeah. But mostly he's a good doctor.

But that's only during Sweet Sweets. Sweet Sweets, he becomes great. In the first part of this episode, they're conjoined twins that they separate.

And in the second part, they put them back together. And that's the show. Excuse me? Can I ask? They get separated and they're like, what the fuck?

I think one was going to die if they didn't reattach. How old are they? I have no idea. Are they like infants or are they played by like speaking names? No, no, no. They're probably like 20s, 30s. Okay.

Yeah. Kind of like, you know, Stuck on You from Academy Award winner Peter Farrelly. Exactly. Like Stuck on You. Two-time Academy Award winner. You know what's a game I've been playing recently to myself? Watching Green Book just every day. Yeah.

Well, I constantly, I can't stop opening the book. No, here's a game I'm playing, and I'd be curious to see where the two of you weigh in on this. Where do you rank Green Book in the Farrelly canon? Because I think it's probably the seventh best movie

Peter Farrelly has made, and I only really like three Peter Farrelly movies. Wait, did they do Shallow Hell? Yes. Okay, so it's definitely below that. That's the only movie I can think of right now. Here's some Farrelly movies. Wait, did they do Shallow Howl? Yes. Okay, so it's definitely below that. That's the only movie I can think of right now. Here's some Farrelly's.

You got Dumb and Dumber. You got Kingpin. Good one. There's Something About Mary. So far, all these are over Green Book. All three, those are my top three. You got Me, Myself, and Irene. That one's going over Green Book. You got Osmosis Jones. Now, they only did the live action,

which is the worst part of that movie. Bill Murray farting. Osmosis Jones is so good, though, overall. The animated sections, which I believe the Farrelly's had

very little involvement with, are fantastic. I still put it above Green Book, but we can disqualify it if we want. That was a very big substitute teacher movie

in my school. Really? Because it's sort of like vaguely science-y? It's like educational-esque. It was that and the Decalogue. I forgot you went to Catholic school. What grade were you?

Because that's what it was, high school. Either that you were too old to be watching Osmosis Jones or too young to be watching the Decalogue. Nope. I just love that the pitch of Osmosis Jones is like, what if a white blood cell and a cold pill a cold medicine pill we're like buddy cops like that's the pitch yeah it's a great pitch it's a good pitch my dad and i were amped for that movie i remember when they announced it we were like first of all osmosis jones is a

great name for a movie it's a good name for a movie i think it has that bit where it's like you want osmosis you've got osmosis and they're like this is this is the killer moment and also the fact that they were like we're making like a mismatched buddy cop movie except instead of the divide being racial the divide is one guy one is artificial and one is blood and they're fighting the flu right lawrence fishburne plays like a new virus in the movie. This is all true. The other pitch on that movie is incredible, which is, here's the pitch for the movie. It takes place inside

Bill Murray. Right. You like Bill Murray? Huge movie star. And also, he's like a zookeeper or something? He's a zookeeper and he gets sick because he eats a hot dog that falls in the gorilla cage. I believe that's... Do they explain why he does that?

Because he sucks. Because he's such a slob. He takes a bite of the hot dog, and then it falls into the cage, and it gets all the gorilla germs on it. And his daughter's like, don't, Daddy. And he's like, oh, come on, honey. It's still good.

Five-second rule. Then he eats it. And then you see, like, Laurence Fishburne tear out of... Right. And you mostly, I think, just see, when you're cutting to him, just him going like, I feel so good.

He farts a lot. He's got sort of a weird love subplot with Molly Shannon, who plays his daughter's teacher. Chris Elliott plays his even grosser friend. Wow. You remember this better than I do. I only remember the cartoon parts.

This movie rules. I was so in favor of doing a Fairly Brothers series someday until Green Book happened. I was like, I'd love to talk about the a Fairly Brothers series someday until Green Book happened. I was like, I'd love to talk about the bad Fairly Brothers comedies. We could be like brothers only. But then you also have to exclude Dumb and Dumber, which is technically only credited to Peter. Oh, interesting.

No, that's both. All right, so we got Shallow How, which I have never seen. It is so bad and I love it. I rank it below Green Book, but maybe it is the only one I would rank below Green Book. I saw that on a junior high date or something. Did you make out? No. It's like a trash cinema masterpiece.

I mean, it's one of those confounding movies. Jason Alexander's great in it. He's got a tail on it. He's got like a vestigial tail. It's stuck on you as you know we were talking about uh definitely above green book yeah unquestionably Frankie Muniz is in it Meryl Streep is in it Meryl Streep has several scenes in that movie there's fever pitch which I have not seen because definitely above green book uh there's the heartbreak kid which I have

not seen James used to watch seen. James used to watch, my brother James used to watch Fever Pitch so much on cable, and we'd be like, you love this movie. He's like, yeah, I don't love it. It's just like on TV, so I'm just like watching it. But anytime we walked in the room, he'd be watching Fever Pitch. So one year for James' birthday, maybe his 13th birthday, four separate members

of our family bought him Fever Pitch independently. Because we were like, you know we should get him his Fever Pitch. He loves it. No one talked about it with anyone else. He never opened one copy. I don't like it that much. I wouldn't watch it. I'm not going to go through the effort of taking it out of the DVD case.

So our family owns four copies of Fever Pitch on DVD. We should put them in the front hall. Framed. All four copies. That's the vestibule. The Heartbreak Kid, haven't seenbreak kid and i haven't seen hall pass haven't seen i rank hall pass above i maybe rank hall passes owen wilson and sudeikis trying to fuck pass is fine jenna fisher it's got some good stuff in it richard richard jenkins giving an academy award worthy performance in the film as

a pickup artist when doesn't he plays an old creepy pickup artist. He plays like mystery but old? Yes. He's phenomenal. The Three Stooges. Never forget. I haven't seen that. I do not like that movie. I've never seen that. Some people stand for it. The middle section. Do you know the movie's separated into like three shorts? Uh-huh. With their own like title cards? Okay. For each of the stages? No.

It's just like three episodes of the Stooges. They're just like three Stooges films are always 30 minutes long so let's just make it three 30-minute films. But they're three different narratives. They don't focus on one or the other Stooges more. The middle one is Moe is in the Jersey Shore. And it's Moe with Snooki and the situation. Snooki? Your friend?

My friend Nicole is... All of them are in it, playing themselves. It's just they do another season of the Jersey Shore. That's like Stuart Little too, where there's only a month where that's the idea no they've been trying to be sure i still popular jersey shore is still popular but where the studio is like we should cross this movie over with jersey shore i mean if i knew about that i would have watched you would i can't believe i'm gonna go watch that section already renting it on their phone? The villain of that film is also Stephen Collins. Okay.

Noted child abuser. All right. We're canceling him, too. Yeah, he's canceled. Hot takes. We don't like him. But the Jersey Shore section, they announced that movie in, like, 2003. The Farrelly brothers were like, here's our blank check project.

We always wanted to make a Three Stooges movie. It was going to be Carrie and the other one. So it went through every single reality show like Boone where they would rewrite the script every year and be like, I guess Moe has to be

on Survivor Island now. I guess Moe has to be on American Idol. I guess Moe has to do the real world. And like the wheel landed on Jersey Shore when they got the pickup

but by the time it came out like they had sort of stopped doing Jersey Shore right weird movie rank it below Green Book everything else I pretty much put above Green Book

what about Dumb and Dumber 2 maybe below Green Book Dumb and Dumber-er is not good or no it's called Dumb and Dumber 2 there's also Dumb and Dumber-er when Harry met Lloyd

that's a prequel that they are not involved but that film was better than Green Book cool that's been our official Green Book ranking that's a Troy Miller joint right who used to direct Cool. That's been our official Green Book ranking.

It's a Troy Miller joint. Right. Who used to direct all the MTV Movie Awards sketches. Yeah, and he did a lot of stand-up. Okay, so Charlie Bucket's House. Oh, yeah. Okay, so let's talk about this for 30 minutes. Charlie Bucket's House is a great design. I like how it looks all melty like a candle.

I do too. Freddie Highmore, good doctor, great kid. Yeah. Here's the thing about Freddie Highmore. What? He had been in, he's in, what's it called? Finding Neverland. Finding Neverland, the year before.

They couldn't find Charlie and Johnny Depp was like, I just worked with this kid. I just worked with this kid. And I remember him in this movie and in that movie where he's the cute kid. Right. And then I stopped thinking about Freddie Highmore for a while. And then he came back as norman bates yeah and i watched some of that show because it was so fucking weird uh-huh and he successfully fully became like a creep to me sure you know or like it wasn't a thing where i'm like god he used to be a child actor how weird like if i see hailey jolosman I cannot not think about him in the other movies. Of course.

With Freddie Highmore, banished the other movies. When I turned this on, I forgot it was Freddie Highmore, and I was like, Bates, he's here, Bates. I think it's also because of the accent. He doesn't have the accent. Right. But he's a good doctor now. I haven't seen the good doctor. He's America's biggest TV star.

I know. It's weird. It makes I know. It's weird. It makes no sense. It's weird. And also the poster is literally just like him in like a doctor's jacket. What if a doctor was good? What do they wear? Lab coat.

A doctor's jacket. A doctor's jacket. Oh my God. I'm losing my mind. Ben, you should wear doctor's jackets into your fashion line. That's a great idea. But call them doctor's jackets. Here's one question. I know this is like Roald Dahl world, but like they're English.

They're very English. Helena and Noah are English. But do they live in America? They're talking about dollars. It's supposed to be like not like either or. Sure. Like the cars are in the middle of the road instead of picking one side. But I mean their money looks European. I guess so.

It certainly doesn't look American. But when he gets the ticket, they're like, I'll give you $50 for that. You know, and the other person, I'll give you $500. But when you see the actual money notes, I think that was... It's got like a queen on it. I'm not really objecting. I just sort of... I think they're all supposed to be British.

Because I mean, the original, they're all American. You seem like you're really nitpicky about this, David. For some reason. I don't know why. Shut up. Oh, you're all American. You seem like you're really nitpicky about this, David. For some reason. I don't know why. Shut up. Oh, you're trying to do that. Okay. I saw this in England where I lived.

What? In 2005. Did you know this pilot? I had no idea. Wait, tell me more. Did you win like a golden ticket where you got to live in a queen's house for a little while? But it was just for a little while.

They were testing out if you got to take over the palace and then you lost because you were a bad egg that would be a good movie the queen's like hello who shall be the next ruler I'm leaving

five golden tea bags the first five to find them will be the first to walk into Buckingham Palace in over

50 years and she does a bit where she she is old but then it turns out she's young. You know, I lived in England. I had been living in England for 10 years at this point. When you saw this, how much national pride

was there in this movie? There was definitely a lot of interest, but I think it was more just the general kind of like, Johnny Depp is in a movie interest. Because Johnny Depp was just such a big deal at that point right because he was he does play a lot of English people because he played J.M. Barrie the year before right he's in that horrible fucking movie he's got an Irish accent what a weird movie horrible movie weird how everyone very Michael Jackson-y

too where he's like I love you children yes that was a movie that for some reason my dad gave me a bootleg of that he sent for my back. It was a very strange time. Your father was serving overseas. Yep. He bought Flying Neverland and Senses. Yep. That's incredible. Scottish.

He was Scottish. Okay, I just remember him having a bit of a brogue. He has a bit of a brogue. Anything's possible if you just imagine Peter. God, that movie's so boring. He's very sleepy in that movie. And he got an Oscar nomination. But the lady is just like,

coughs into a handkerchief and is like, she's dead. Yeah. 30 minutes from now, she is dead. That lady being an insanely overqualified Kate Winslet.

Doing nothing. Right. Was she nominated for an Oscar? She was not, which was weird. She got nominated for a lead for Eternal Sunshine, was that scene? Oh, right, right. But that was one of those She was not, which was weird. She got nominated for lead for Eternal Sunshine. Was that same year?

Oh, right, right. But that was one of those years where, like, yeah, Johnny Depp got in and, like, Paul Giamatti didn't. Right. Right. Yeah. Yep. You're correct. Which I don't even like sideways, but, like, you don't not nominate Paul Giamatti for sideways if you like sideways.

You know who'd be a good Willy Wonka? Paul Giamatti. Giamatti. That'd be good. He does scare me a lot. Yeah, exactly. And he's worked with Burton. Yeah.

Paul Giamatti in the orangutan makeup from Planet of the Apes as Willy Wonka. Limbo? No explanation. I can't. But right off, he's just like,

yeah, this factor is stressful. Why don't you kids take it? I don't know. It's kind of surprising that Giamatti and Burton haven't worked together again. He seems like someone

who'd become one of Burton's guys. Like in the way that he just like clearly is all in a Missy Pyle at this point. Right. Well, a good thing to be all in on. Missy Pyle's great. Yeah. She wants to date Willy Wonka. Yes. Right? That's sort of like a very quiet subplot. I would watch

that rom-com. Right. Like Wonka and Mrs. Beauregard. Yeah. No, she would play herself. She would like Wonka and Mrs. Beauregard. No, she would play herself. She would play herself, of course. Okay, the beginning is cute. You think it's perfect? I don't know what to say to this. I think it's perfect. I think it's like perfect like sort of

fairy tale, like sort of, it's equally parts kind of like whimsical and sad. Sure. I think in the Gene Wilder version it's a's equally parts kind of like whimsical and sad sure i i think in the gina wilder version it's a little too like lifted in this i actually like i feel the struggle of the family i feel like carter and noah taylor are overqualified as well and they're good and they're really good they're sad and i like the thing that this movie is doing from the get-go which feels very roald dahl to, is like going down these corridors

of like his father at the toothpaste factory, Grandpa Joe when he was younger. Like Roald Dahl will go into little side tangents with great detail. Loves it. And so from the moment that's happening in the movie, I'm like, this feels like a Roald Dahl book more than the Gene Wilder film does.

This has the structure and the flow of like that. The chocolate palace, all that sort of stuff. I'm just like, these are like a lot of detours to be making early on. But they're building the world out well. You're getting the sense of Wonka

as this like mythical figure who no one can get their head around. Yeah. It's not that he's beloved, which I like, but they're just like, who the fuck is this guy? What's his deal?

He behaves in a weird way. And why haven't we seen him in so long have you seen anyone go in or out of that factory your entire life what happened who works there right like all these sort of mysteries surrounding it and i like the the noah taylor like helen bonham carter stuff is just like they're they're trying really hard to give this kid a good childhood like they, they're not sad sack. Couple of flaws. One, four grandparents in your living room sleeping in a bed, pooping and peeing, apparently.

A tiny bit depressive. That they should maybe address. And a large bit stinky. Too much cabbage. Too much cabbage. Heavy on the cabbage. Can you imagine? The farts.

I've also never had cabbage. I've never had cabbage. Can you imagine? The farts. I've also never had cabbage. I've never had cabbage. What? Wait, I mean, not surprising at all. You've never had cabbage either? There's so many things I've never eaten. Interesting. But I feel like cabbage is often sort of like, you know, they'll sneak it into a salad.

It's coleslaw, it's cabbage. Can you remember sauerkraut? Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's cabbage. It's like pickled cabbage. Okay, never mind. All right. You like sauerkraut?

I like sauerkraut. Sauerkraut on a dog with some mustard? Yeah, I like that. Ooh, baby. Yeah. Okay. I've never had like cabbage, though. You've never taken a whole cabbage? You've never been into it?

I have cracked into a cabbage. I love cabbage. It's good. Roast it. It's good roasted. Oh, yeah. Like some purple cabbage. Yeah, it's not so great if you like steam it.

You know, it would be a little sad. Maybe you should get in that bed with them. Farting and pooping and eating your cabbage soup. That sounds fine. I love bed. I love to be in bed. I mean, it's nice that they at least are able to buy cabbage. They're not eating like stone soup.

Do you remember like in old like kids books when you read about people making stone soup yeah sounds great some boiling stones and hoping there's flavor on them so i'd be the saddest concept the ticket stuff is fine i i i guess it's just to me i'm like you gotta do the ticket stuff now and they do the ticket stuff see this is where i think they excel i think they pulled this off better i think all the vignettes of the kids being introduced one by one are so funny. They're good kids. I mean, they're bad kids, but like, they're good characters.

I think they're good characters and he leans into what's weird about them immediately. Like, he identifies a fun, comedic game and style. And you're getting so much good characterization here of just like, the bit of Vruka Salt walking up to her parents with a ticket with no appreciation.

Right. Just like, I want a pony as well. Like the business as usual. Augustus can't stop eating chocolate even when he's trying to like... Yeah, he's pretty cool actually. Augustus is kind of a cool guy. I would have given a factory to Augustus. Exactly. He likes chocolate a lot. He seems like way more into it than Charlie. Right. And his mom is kind of a cool guy. I would have given a factory to Augustus. He likes chocolate a lot.

He seems like way more into it than Charlie. Right, and his mom is kind of nice. She has like a normal reaction. And his dad is cool. He's a sausage man. The cut to the dad is so well done. And then Violet, who I love, is played by

young Carrie from the Carrie Diaries. Well, young, young Carrie. Val, can I tell you my favorite Carrie from the Carrie Diaries right young young Carrie now can I tell you my favorite thing about the Carrie Diaries please in the pilot episode one girl is describing

losing her virginity and she says it was like shoving a hot dog through a keyhole and I have thought about that weekly since

and it is so upsetting that show's on the the CW yep I auditioned for that show and I had to be in the scene where someone says that line of dialogue for my audition.

I have never watched the show, and that line has rang in my head for six years. I forgot it was from that until just now, because I think about that all the time. Hot dog through a keyhole. It's such a terrible image. Putting the sleeping bag back in the case. Well, you know what's gross

about that image? Is it a raw hot dog or a cooked hot dog? Either way. Either way. I think it's raw. I think it's raw. I feel like I've heard

when people try to talk about bad sex them using the analogy of like, it was like trying to put wet spaghetti through a keyhole. That's like if you're soft.

Hymns. Hymns. Back to hymns. No, but that one makes sense to me. And the hot dog through a keyhole is just like that. It sounds like it would just rip the hot dog into shreds. That's what I was saying. Make me think of a vagina dentata. Right.

I get a visceral revulsion because I just immediately picture a hot dog. It's sort of stupid because the human anatomy is not key-like. It's not made of metal. It sort of moves and shifts. Right. Not to break this line down more, but I think it deserves it. I guess the implication is that the peen was too big, right? I guess.

It sounds violent. Hot dog through a keel. Smash. Smash a hot dog through. No, this wasn't on Smash. This wasn't a line on Smash. Oh, fuck. I forgot.

I thought that was from my Smash audition. Didn't you do, like, 18 million Smash auditions? I did. They almost cast me on smash after they had started filming smash smash a famously well-run tv show that had no problems right they they were maybe gonna restart the show and I was gonna play Debra Messing's part uh yeah you were gonna be you had all your scarves what if the scarves could talk Griffin can you jump around Debra Messing's neck and do this read for us? Alright. Keep talking about Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. I just think all this stuff is... It's good. It's fine. It's good.

And it's got a light touch. It feels sort of magical without feeling like... Ben's just shaking his head. Saccharine? I guess so. And I think there are a couple really good moments of Charlie characterization. I mean, Freddie Highmore is so preternaturally talented he's cute

he's just Charlie has always bothered me because he has no personality except that he's nice okay because he has the thing

where they're like we bought you a chocolate bar yeah and he's like no you should use the money to do what I pay the rent

okay you saying it that way maybe pick some shingles on this house. It sounds shitty. Sure. The Warner brothers apparently push Burton really hard that they wanted Charlie to be some kind of savant or whiz kid. Really?

Like a Mercury rising situation. Here are the two big notes that Warner brothers had them just applying like modern studio notes to a story that everyone loves exactly the way it is. Right. They were like, first of all, Charlie shouldn't have a dad. Because the movie should be about Willy Wonka becoming his father

figure. You mean kind of like a Harry Potter like the classic sort of, yeah, the kid. They want Willy Wonka to adopt him at the end of the movie and be like, you're the father I never had. So they're notes where we want more daddy issues. Right. Right, right. We've only got one layer. We want to resolve the daddy issues. We're going to make this guy a creep

and he's going to adopt a child. Well, I think at that point Warner Bros. was like, and of course he won't be a creep, right? Johnny Depp won't be playing him like Michael Jackson. He'll be a nice normal person. Sure.

And he'll become a nice dad at the end. Like, I think they wanted like liar, liar mode Jim Carrey at the end to be like, maybe I should focus more on family. I think I would have liked it if Willy Wonka broke up his parents' marriage and then became his dad. That would be good.

If Noah Taylor walked in there instead of the grandpa, Willy Wonka is like, I'm going to cuck you. Willy Wonka at the cuck factory. Like my chocolate? Try my cuck-a-lit. I was just, I know that word has been co-opted by maniacs on

the internet and not that it was a word before that it was invented by maniacs on the internet who are bad but what movie did i just see where someone got cheated on and i was like this guy only gets cheated on in movies i have to think about this uh two notes uh one i find it funny that it's been co-opted by maniacs on the internet because all those maniacs are by using the casual term. It's Jason Clark, a.k.a. Jason Clark. Oh, Conklin gets cocked. Yes, right. Serenity and then the aftermath.

Great Gatsby. Yes, Gatsby. The original cucking. The great cucking. I don't know. Shut up. Tom Buchanan, the original cuck. That's what that book said.

That's the pull quote, right? From Richard Lawson. I just got Fitzgerald's notes it was like this guy is a beta male Gatsby is a total alpha wow we're getting very literary

on the episode today I was going to say I like it the maniacs who have co-opted cuck which is such a casual

like friendly nickname term for cuckolding, are also like, you're such a fucking cuck, which is a gross thing. It's certainly not something I watch videos of all the time. Oh, God. Is that a thing? Like a porn thing? Yes. Okay. That's when it went to cuck, because they were like, cuck porn.

And then all those guys started watching cuck porn and then dissing people and being like, you're a cuck. Let's get out of this. No, let's go deeper. I'm driving this duck boat. The wheels just popped out and now we're going into the water. So they go to the chocolate factory. Wait, I want to say this. So they wanted Charlie to be a whiz kid.

I want to say a couple things about cuck. They want Charlie to be a whiz kid. They want Willy Wonka to be normal. They want the movie to become about a father-son relationship. And Tim Burton was like, fuck that. Wonka's a weirdo. It's weird for anyone to behave this way. Right.

I want the character to follow suit. If he's a man who hasn't talked to anyone else for 10 years. He's a recluse. He'd be weird. He'd be weird. Right? And he was like, the whole key has to be that Charlie's just a normal kid. Sure.

Now, in the original, I think it's a little too like he's too pure. Yeah. He's got that blonde hair too. The thing that was kind of incredible about Freddie Highmore at this age was he just seemed like an old man in a little child's body. And he doesn't, while being a cute kid, he doesn't play cute at all. He's very serious. Yeah. So I think when all that stuff comes up of him going like

no it's my birthday and I want to share the chocolate bar with all of you. You really kind of like I feel for this kid. I would be like Jesus. I think he's such a good kid.

But I think I appreciate that through the performance and the tone of the movie they don't make the kid overly earnest. He's just kind of logical. Sure. And he's got priorities straight.

Does he like chocolate? He does. He likes chocolate a lot. He gets one bar a year for his birthday. Yeah, okay. Weird. And he makes a little model. His father collects all the misshapen toothpaste caps.

All this stuff I'm like really into. You're into this. And you're getting the backstory. I mean, a great temper. How many times have you seen this movie? I saw it a lot when it came out. I haven't seen it probably in 12 years. Interesting. Yeah. You saw it multiple times in theaters?

I saw it multiple times in theaters, and Romilly really liked it when she was little. We'd watch it a lot at home. But, um, a couple really good gags he does early on, and some fun, like, film rhythm things. One, when Grandpa Joe tells the story

about when he used to work at Willy Wonka's factory. I was much younger then and you hard cut to 20 years earlier. He looks the same. And he looks exactly the same. Right.

Like you're like, he's exploring joke potential in this movie. Sure. Which the later films he gets away from. Right. Like you feel him

actively working to like what's the funniest choice we could make? This one has lots of funny jokes. The Burn Ward. The Burn Ward's really funny. Grandpa Joe, when he gives Charlie the extra money he's been saving. I like there are two false attempts at the bar before he finally gets it.

When he gives him the money and then falls asleep. I think that's a fun film rhythm cut of Grandpa Joe falling asleep and then waking up with the candy bar in front of his face. All this stuff is... They get to the factory. I want to talk about this. He gets the bar. Yeah, he gets the bar.

Wants to sell it. And his other grandpa gives the speech that's like they print more money every day. There'll only ever be five of these. Which honestly is really stupid. Take the money. They clearly need the money. They're quite broke. But I also think-

Well, it's sort of a one in five shot at getting a factory. Which they didn't know they were going to get a factory. That's a good point. They just thought they were going to get lifetime chocolate. That's the weirdest thing about this movie is they never present it as a competition. And when people parody Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, I think they make that up front part of the parody. Should we talk about Pete Davidson again?

We should. Why has he played Grandpa Joe twice? He's young. He's no grandpa. But in both the book and the film adaptations, it's just like he's going to let five people tour and only at the very end after

the thing's been determined. He's like, actually, I've been looking for an heir. That's true. So basically they gave up a bunch of money they needed so he could look at a factory for a few hours. Maybe get a little tour. And also you have to imagine, they can't know that the factory is as magical as it is. Although Grandpa Joe

did have a chocolate bird. Nestle, a company with a lot of problems, has factory tours. You can book one. Of course. 800 Nest. They bought the Wonka brand and have since shut it down. Do you know there aren't Wonka bars in production anymore? Because when the musical opened, they couldn't sell Wonka bars. Sure.

Nestle's just sitting on it. I believe we've talked about this. Yeah. Factory tours. Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays. Yeah. Just go. We're the closest factory.

Great question. And you have to sign an NDA. And the factory, by the way, looks magnificent. Look at that. It's a white building. It looks like a Costco. It looks like a Costco. And weirdly enough, children are murdered there as well.

That's the only similarity it has with... None of the children die. I do like that this film, they have it has with none of the children die. I do like that this film they have that weird like walk out of the factory. Yeah. Mike TV is my favorite

part of that. Yes. It has factories in 80 different countries. Hey. The headquarters in Switzerland headquarters.

We could go. Let's go. I think all this stuff the beginning is good. I really want good. This is what I want to get. It's good. More subtle sort of save the cat stuff of like this is good Willy Wonka this is what I want to get to it's good more subtle sort of save the cat stuff

of like this is why you care about this kid sure I like that David Kelly's kind of demented yes has a weird anarchic energy

as like I don't know if this man is like losing his mind or not and then they get into the factory everyone's like huddled outside

right and everyone remembers in the original that Gene Wilder did a whole bit. Right. So instead they just do a creepy Chuck E. Cheese

Willy Wonka song. I love it. That catches on fire. This is the best thing in the movie apart from the burn ward. I guess it's linked to the burn ward though

so it's really like that's my favorite thing in the movie. Because the courtyard is like so gray and bleak. It's so cold outside. The music becomes very ominous

whereas like he's been doing sort of twinkly maniacal Danny Elfman. Now it just becomes very serious. It's so cold outside. The music becomes very ominous, whereas he's been doing sort of twinkly, maniacal Danny Elfman. Now it just becomes very serious. There's so much wind-up to them going through the gates, the gates closing behind them, them all walking in line. They're all meeting each other. Everyone's competitive. Violet and

Veruca Salt have that best friends for everything, and they cross their fingers. You're like, where's this going? And they step up, and the thing just opens up. This shitty thing. And it's this horrible, like the puppets are discolored. They're like, where's this going? And then they step up and the thing just opens up. This shitty thing. And it's this horrible, like the puppets are discolored. They're clearly like sun bleached. It made me think of you

because it's the kind of futuristic design you like. Yes. Like 50s throwback kind of thing. Right. And then with the shitty wax figures too. It's like a World's Fair, like a bad, it's a small world.

I like thinking about Willy Wonka like designing that. Right. Like being like, this is good. Well, I like him also thinking, like, I don't know. This is what kids like, right? Right. Like, he has such disdain for the people who would want to come to his factory.

I highly recommend watching just, like, Chuck E. Cheese animatronic videos where they're all failing on YouTube. They're really funny and they're so terrifying. Here's the thing. There's just, like, stuff melting. Here's the thing I was thinking about recently. Chuck E. Cheese has taken out all the robot bands. They don't have robot shows anymore. Why'd they do that?

Kids don't like robot shows. It's frightening. That's their pitch. That makes sense. They had Bowling for Soup write a bunch of new Chuck E. Cheese songs and they tried to make Chuck E. Cheese like more like punk pop and then they just took out all the robots. So they have a walk around still sometimes. Sure And then they just took out all the robots.

So they have a walk around still sometimes. Sure. But they don't have the shows anymore. Okay. And Rockafire Explosion has built this online cult following, which was the original Chuck E. Cheese because there was a documentary made about it. And there are people who have bought the machines and they program them to modern songs, right? Sure. Program them to modern songs. Right.

Sure. What a smart investment it would be to buy one of those robot bands. Okay. And get a bar in Brooklyn and be like, here's our gimmick. It's like, yeah, it's like a fake turkey cheese for hipsters. Like for how many like bar cade places there are. No one's in all the major cities, which is so popular. Right. Which is just like, here you go.

It's like a club bar not a bar a club but like a bar where we play popular songs and we program the robot band to do them

and you can just sit and watch the robot band do like Adele or whatever I don't want that I want that so badly two opinions don't want it want it so badly

weigh in email us or tweet at us please you call it like professor PT drink a lot or something and it's like you have your own robot band you've re-skinned them right the robots are there but you come with i'm learning the irs is after you for this idea the amount you've sunk into it

already you're pitching this because you're already doing it right it doesn't sound like a good idea anyway if you want to go to gofundme.com backslash Griffin needs your money alright I think that the video is funny I mean not the video the robot show is so funny and it goes on for so long it goes on for too long catches on fire becomes even more disturbing right because the chair lifts up

the fireworks are there Willy Wonka's not there you're like where the fuck is he then they slowly burn then the camera pans across all of their terrified faces and he's just there clapping right it's such a good entrance it is and he's got his weird glasses on and he's like

oh yeah I don't know trying to do like what does he sound like in this I the whole time I was watching it I was trying to figure out who he sounds like because he's doing that sort of weird children's entertainer thing where his diction is too clean and too upbeat

and he sounds demented and maniacal. And this part, he's trying to feel appealing to kids. But he's reading off of note cards and everything. Right. He like doesn't know their names. Right. He's like

practice all this. They set up the gag immediately that anytime Mike TV says anything. Mumbler! Really funny. That is funny. There are a lot of funny fucking things in this movie. That's not in anything else, right? Like that's not in the book or anything. No. He just decided not to hear what that kid said.

But the gimmick of mike tv this time is that he's like a genius yeah he like has a algorithm right he like cracked the code yeah he figured out the shipping strategies and like wind variation so mike should almost certainly actually be the winner or maybe like a mike violet like duo and like if mike won he would just sell the factory immediately right he would be like he would run the numbers he'd be like chocolate no come on get out of here yeah I'm not doing this I think the weird thing with his characterization this movie

is your it feels like okay so we know later on he had this moment of like mortality kicking in right his his hair which made him realize he should get in there so he's like I don't know what do you do find some kids but he hates kids so much and he has nothing

other than his factory that he like wants the plan to fail. Like it feels like a producer's scheme. Like he wants them all to die. I think so. He can be like,

well, too bad. No one else can run it. Because the whole point is like whenever they fall in and then the Oompa Loompas do a song. Like everyone's like, that seemed planned.

And he's like, what are you talking about? And there's that moment with Veruca Salt where he can't find the key. Right that's that's my favorite a good gag is always someone lifting up a giant ring of keys and there's too many keys that is always funny they do a couple very pointed cuts where like after she falls you see his very calm face and then suddenly he finds the perfect key and opens it yes so i do think his plan is like i want to

prove them all or at least dispose of them all. Right. You want to prove they're right. No one is up to the task. Right. But like, I mean, we can go through this one by one.

The first thing, very quickly, they go. He wants to kill those kids. Yeah. Very quickly, they go into the main area with the river, right?

A gloop is just taken down by wanting to eat chocolate all day. Classic. So, easy. We get that. A kid going to a chocolate factory, that's going to be an issue. There's that weird probe that they keep on cutting to, hovering above them. And every time they do it, it just kind of has ambient noise.

Is it all CGI? This set's real. The set is real, but the river must be fake or at least embellished. No, the river is real because they ruined several incredibly expensive camera lenses because they fell in the river. That was a big story when they were filming the movie. Stop dropping cameras in a chocolate river? They lost like $350,000 worth of camera lenses.

Because it's very special, handmade. But it looks great. A chocolate river? They lost like $350,000 worth of camera lenses. Because it's like very special, like, you know, handmade. But it looks great. It looks great. Yeah, I mean, this is like the best stuff in the factory because it's still practical. But the Veruca set is good. Yeah. That's a good set. Oh, you're right.

Every room when one of the kids gets thrown off. The TV room is good. The Veruca room with the nuts is great. The squirrels. The squirrels. I love the squirrels room with the nuts squirrels are real too really yeah they train them good they look good they were like squirrels are super smart they train them from birth they were like we have to get 40 squirrels and train them from birth so all they know how to do is this gesture that's really funny aren't it that yeah isn't the thing is like squirrels are totally smart their only problem is that they are obsessed with nuts and food and like all of their intellect is devoted to it like we could probably get the like they could do other things no the squirrel when it throws

the nut away that's cgi and when they all crawl on her that's cgi but every time they're checking the nuts that's real squirrel real fucking squirrel which is demented like i like timber having the money to make this movie and being like i I'm going to do weird Willy Wonka shit. I like to think that he trained himself. I'm going to say, like, train the squirrels. Yes. I like to think that Tim Burton is just like a master squirrel trainer. He's got like a whip.

The squirrels are like running in a circle. But like if Tim Burton had a mansion like this and all the money in the world, he would lock himself in and be like, I don't know, let's train some squirrels today. In the same way that Willy Wonka wants to create cotton candy sheep. A squirrel once broke into my mom's house. Fuck, it's retired. Bleep it out, man. Bleep it out. Bleep it out.

By tearing through the screen on her window, right? Took a whole jar of Skippy, closed. A closed jar of Skippy. Didn't know what to do. I guess panicked or something. Ran into her bedroom. Ripped the jar open somehow, which is impossible.

I don't know how a squirrel would, you know, didn't unscrew it, just ripped it open. Ate whatever it could and then ran out and left the Skippy jar in her bedroom. Rather than rely on CGI,

Burton wanted the 40 squirrels in the nut room to be real. The animals were trained every day for 10 weeks before filming commenced. They began their coaching while newborns fed by bottles to form relationships with human trainers. The squirrels were each taught how to sit upon a little blue bar stool, tap, and then open a walnut and deposit its meat near a conveyor belt. That's incredible. What a waste of everyone's time and money.

But that's like the meta-narrative to this movie. What happens to those squirrels now? They don't know how to do anything else. What do they do? I don't know. They were signed for multi-picture deals. They had sequel clauses. I'm sure Tim Barron just adopted them all.

Yeah. He probably does just have a squirrel room. I just, I love, it's like, it's like fucking Fitzcarraldo stuff where it's like, Werner Herzog drove himself crazy trying to make a movie about someone driving themselves crazy. The Chocolate River has 200,000 gallons of faux melted chocolate in it. And they had to get the right concoction where it was like loose enough that they could paddle through it because when it was thicker, then the paddle wouldn't go through the chocolate. They lost camera lenses. Like, all this shit I love. And then anytime they're in the elevator, I'm like, or in the boat.

When they're just in, like, CGI goop land. Yeah. The CGI chocolate looks terrible. Yeah. Like, whenever they're floating in it, it looks, like, CGI water, they've only kind of cracked, I feel like, in the last five years. And at this point, it just looks like diarrhea water. They've only kind of cracked, I feel like in the last five years. And at this point, it just looks like, uh,

uh, diarrhea. Yeah. The color is kind of weird too. Maybe it's from the bed. Maybe it's from the bed. There's a pipe at the bottom of the bed that goes all the way to the factory. Um,

anyway, what my point was gloop taken down by his own greed. Then they sing a song The best song of the Oompa Loompa songs? I think all of them are bangers I like Mike TV's the best Mike TV's is the other competitor to me Those are the best two

I think the Violet and Veruca songs are just okay The Mike TV one is the rock one? Yeah I think, no The Veruca Salt one's my favorite. The weird like hippy dippy one. Yeah. I like it when it's like high energy.

Like I like them to be running around. Well, what about the Violet one? It's the chewing, chewing, chewing gum. Yeah, that's pretty good actually. I just think I'm so mad about Violet. Like they fuck her over so hard. Yeah. She's great.

Yeah, she rolls. And she's played by young Carrie as we pointed out. I'm sorry, young, young fuck her over so hard. You love Violet, yeah. She's great. Yeah, she rules. And she's played by young Carrie, as we pointed out. I'm sorry, young, young Carrie. Young, young Carrie. And Ben looks like he's in a coma right now. Uh-huh. And what happens, they take her to see some chewing gum. Yeah.

She's like, I want to eat the chewing gum. I love chewing gum. She's a champion chewer. And rather than him being like, definitely, you're not allowed to do it. Yeah. He's just like, oh, don't do that. Like, you're presenting her with chewing gum. I like that.

And it's poison. I like that they make Violet this, like, example of, like, the American obsession with exceptionalism. Yeah. And Missy Paul's her weird robotic stage mom who, like, clearly wishes she had been a star. Like, she tries to point out her own baton photo. That's the joke, right?

She's like a pageant girl. Right, right. Who's now, like, forced it onto her daughter. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's even She's like a pageant girl. Right, right. Who's now like forced it on to her daughter. But it's even funnier when the pageant she has is just chewing gum. But like, Augustus Gloop wants to eat too much chocolate, okay? I'll admit it.

He could maybe stop eating the chocolate. You're like, Violet hasn't done anything wrong. One handful of the river is enough to get that it's a river of chocolate. Right, Mike TV's an asshole. Veruca salts a brat. Mike TV we're going to get to. Violet has no sense.

Veruca sucks. She's bad. Like, I mean, you know, Veruca's a bad nut. We all agree. Violet has no sense. Violet. I think Violet has poor impulse control. But it's one stick of gum.

It's the same. It's one time. I mean, you go, like, the first real mistake she makes is not listening to Willy Wonka when he tells her to spit out the gum. But you've also said in the movie that. It's gum, movie that she would want to get back to her main gum anyway. Exactly. But like, Augustus falls in a river. Yeah.

You would know, be safe around rivers. Dangerous. Someone which should be very explicit, like gum. I know that gum normally is just gum. This one will swell you into a blueberry. He says everything but that. He does say there's a thing we haven't worked on. You know what I mean?

The other things are like Veruca is like, yeah, don't like challenge squirrels and they're like squirrel primacy. Mike TV asked to be teleported. Like these are things children should not want. Right. She just wants gum. She eats candy. Yeah.

You're saying. She went to a candy factory. Right. But he told her not to eat it. The songs here are all the Roald Dahl songs. She eats candy. Yeah. You're saying. She went to Candy Factory. Right, but he told her not to eat it. He did. The songs here are all the Roald Dahl songs. They're the lyrics. Are they?

Yes, they are. Yeah, they are. Yes, they are. Yeah, Roald Dahl gets lyrics by credit for this entire movie. They're all his songs, which I don't know how you folks dealt with this when you were a child, but I would always find it very... Yeah, you were there. I'd feel a lot of stress when I got to a song portion of a book like this.

You mean when it's in italics all of a sudden and it's line breaks? And you're like, what's the tune for this? Do I sing this? What do I do? I'm no learner in low. How do I... What's the jam here? What's the beat? Basically, in my head, they, you know, what's the sort of, what's the jam here? What's the beat? Basically, in my head, they were all just, like, Gregorian chants.

That's what I would always think. That would be good. Oh, they, like, come out like that. That'd be good. Or I just always, like, imagine, like, shanties in my head. Like, they'd just be kind of, like, shaggy shanties. And then they make this announcement, like, Danny Elfman is going to take the Roald Dahl lyrics. They're not going to use the songs for the Gene Wilder film. They're going to use the original

song. And it was like, oh cool. And then he just made the weirdest choice with every set of lyrics. Go on. Well, he just decided to reinterpret each one through a different, very specific genre that was not the genre those lyrics were written to be sung in by any

stretch of imagination. He also... He turns them into like Oingo Boingo songs and does all the vocals himself. That's what I was going to say. The weird thing is that he sings them all himself

in different voices. Right. The only thing that really bothers me about the songs is that the voice keeps changing. I don't like that.

That is what Oingo Boingo's like. Like his voice changes a lot. That's not like the greatest defense I've ever heard mounted of something. I'm not saying defense of the songs.'m saying it one of the weird aspects of this movie i think i just struggle with all the deep roys being identical except that their voices sometimes are high pitched or low the narrator jeffrey holder one of them sounds like jeffrey holder

um no it's one of those things where like, you know, Burton and Elfman, very close collaborators. The one falling out they had was over Nightmare Before Christmas because he felt Burton didn't fight hard enough for him to be the voice of Jack. So it's his singing, but not his speaking. And this feels like him being like, so you'll let me do whatever the fuck I want with these songs. And Burton's like, yeah, sure, whatever. Right. And they're working on Corpse Bride at the same time. I think Elfman was really busy.

Those songs you can tell are like the work of someone who's putting more focus on something else. Yeah. Ding dong. Deep Roy's great in this movie. He's so good. Paid one million dollars. He was paid one million dollars. Do you know this pilot?

I love Deep Roy. One of the best salaries of all time. I mean, he worked for it. That's what I'm saying. But like so often a guy like this, you're like, and they paid him like $5,000. Like you hear the horrible story of how little they got paid. And Tim Burton was like, fuck you. You're paying him $1 million.

Deep Roy also wanted the Augustus Gloop song to be like a Bollywood number. He suggested that himself. Yeah. And then, yes, we've got a Veruca Salt, kind of like a 60s pop thing. Yeah. And Violet's like a funk song, I guess. What's going on with the violins?

I can't even remember Violet. Say it, do it again. Chewing, chewing, chewing gum. And they're up in the rafters. And Mike TV's like a, you know, a hair metal kind of thing. Yes. That's my favorite one.

Right. There's no Beatles. Yep. His performances are so good in this movie. Yes. Yes. Like anytime it's a bunch of Oompa Loompas on the screen, you can choose to focus on any one.

Sure. And he's giving a distinct, specific performance on that Oompa Loompa. You think about how much time he had to spend in like a green screen space. But imagine the parents leaving the factory yes going to the press being like what happened in there yeah and then being like well our children were won by systematically right attacked exactly and then every time it happened rather than them dealing with it the factory workers assembled and sang joyously of what had just happened this is why charlotte chocolate factory became so big culturally and in the willy wonka movie world all's crazy but also like it birthed a thousand sketches and

stand-up routines and even barroom conversations like here's my fucking question why didn't they just do this right but here's the other thing I think it's also like every kid's like first horror movie yeah where it's like you're learning

that sort of thing of like every death is inventive and different and all of that and it does sort of have that slasher movie structure in that way

where it's like their sins are directly leading to their deaths it's like probably the 13th where it's like oh the kids are fucking someone's gonna to get murdered. Right.

And how's he going to murder them this time? You know? I do think that's a thing that kids like about it. He leans into it hard here. Of course. They directly imply

that Wonka has planned all of this. Totally. When they say, how did they know to put his name in the songs that seemed rehearsed and choreographed?

And he's like, improv, it's a parlor trick. Yeah. Which is funny. It's funny that he roasts improv. Yeah, that is funny.

He roasts improv. Here, I gotta put you guys talking. You know, Willy Wonka never made Lloyd Knight. Nice callback.

I had to make that joke before David went to the bathroom. So where do you stand at this point in the movie? Like, what are you liking? What are you disliking?

I enjoy basically the entire thing in the factory. I like the way the factory looks and I also hate the children so it's great to watch bad things happen to them. The only thing I don't like too much is Johnny Depp's performance for all the obvious Michael Jackson reasons because he does just remind me of him

and it's so weird. So that's the main thing for you? Yeah. Have you watched Leaving Neverland yet? Okay. So I watched it, and then I went down a really ill-informed rabbit hole of watching old Michael Jackson interviews, which now just feel so fucking creepy.

Yeah. They feel like Freddy Krueger doing Letterman or something and making jokes about, like, why would I murder kids? I love it when they show up in my nightmares. Yeah, I don't ever want to watch this. No, they're terrible. So I definitely got like creeped out watching Depp in this. Relieved that he hates children.

Like feeling a real palpable sense of physical relief every time he pushed a kid away. Yeah. But this kind of makes more. I don't even know if I want to open this box. I would say no. Yeah. There was like the public like defense of Jackson that was accepted where it's like,

well, he never had a childhood. So all this weird stuff is just because he never had a childhood. Like he didn't develop properly. And I watched this movie, and I'm like, this movie's bug nuts, banana shit, but I am more readily believe

that someone would turn out this way if they didn't have a childhood. Well, yeah. Like, the way they set up Willy Wonka makes sense. Right, that he would, like, surround himself with the thing he didn't get to do as a kid

but be a total misanthrope. Yeah. As opposed to, like... And also, like, the way that he distrusts other kids because, like, he didn't have, like, surround himself with the thing he didn't get to do as a kid, but be a total misanthrope. Yeah. As opposed to, like— And also, like, the way that he distrusts other kids because, like, he didn't have, like, childhood friends. He distrusts kids and parents. Yeah. Right. Well, who doesn't distrust parents?

See, I also see it as, like, yes, Michael Jackson didn't have a childhood. It's the genius rule. Right. Where I feel like when people, like, ascend to a certain level— Right. where I feel like when people ascend to a certain level and we consider them geniuses, they have mastered their works of art, they get away with being bad to their family,

like cheating on their significant other. I feel like that. So Michael Jackson, I feel like it was just more like we just all accepted it as a society. Well, and John, I was about to say Johnny Depp. Michael Jackson has the same, like, Roman Polanski, like, full flush where it's like, oh, he did really fucked up things and also really fucked up things happened to him. And he made great art.

Right. So people are like, well, I don't know. What can you say? How would you process these things? What are we talking about right now? All the bad stuff. Willy Wonka fucked over the town. Right. Like, that's what I like. Where are we? This right now? Willy Wonka buffed over the town. Right.

Like, that's what I like. Where are we? This is what I like. I'm sorry. Which town? He closed a factory. Everyone lost their jobs. And he replaced them with Oompa Loompas.

I like that they don't treat them. He created some jobs. He did. Yeah. And he saved, like, a whole jungle colony that's being besieged by monsters. He basically just, like, fired, like, the town and gave jobs to immigrants, which like I support. Okay. Tables just got turned on you guys.

Turned hard. So I guess what I'm trying to say in a very messy way. Should we do hymns? What? Come on. You said hard, I think. Oh, I got it. Okay, now Ben's going to the bathroom.

Or no, he's just doing a victory lap. Oh, the door's open. What I like about this movie is we're talking about the genius exception kind of thing, right? That all this Michael Jackson conversation is circling around. That he was a genius. Where it was like, oh, well, he's right. There's a reason for this, and that's why he wants to do it with the kids. Right, so it's like a two-pronged thing where it's like,

A, I think people don't want to believe that someone's capable of doing such awful things. Sure. Such as sending kids down a squirrel shoot. I think these are four attempted murders. Right. No, I know none of the kids die.

Right. But I think you could go to court and be like four attempted murders. But then he's not tying a murder with a Mr. Factory. That is. Technically he's like queen. It's that kind of Rube Goldberg thing where he's like, I didn't do anything. Right.

It's like, didn't you plan this? And didn't you have full musical numbers in the chamber ready to go? Not at all. My point is. And someone finds sheet music and he's like, fuck. God damn it. I'm going down.

I find his demos on his iPod. These are clearly like scratch tracks. You've been working these out. I don't know what those are. You brought Phil Spector in to produce them? I've never working these out. I don't know what those are. You brought Phil Spector in to produce them? It's like, I've never met the guy. Do you try, like, all the Oompa Loompas as, like, a class action kind of play? Or is it just one?

They didn't do anything. I think the Oompa Loompas are more to blame if they have the songs. They do the songs. Willy Wonka can claim ignorance. He can claim ignorance. Maybe he's kind of smart in that way that he passed the law. Right, he just layers of protection. He didn't do anything except struggle to find his keys.

Right. The point I'm making is. You should send them to the Hague. The point I'm making is... You should send him to the Hague. The point I'm making is, I like this movie because... You like this movie? I do. But because this movie doesn't try to build a genius rule around Willy Wonka, there's this sense of like, Charlie's really sort of intrigued by him because he lives so close.

Because his grandpa worked there. Because it's this mystery. The other kids don't seem to give a shit about willie wonka they like the idea of winning and they like the idea of the factory sure and it doesn't feel like anyone's excusing wonka the only person in the world who seems to like idolize wonka other than charlie is his father keeps all the clippings right in the gene water version there's this mythology even though they haven't seen him in so long, of like, this is the greatest man in the world. The Candyman can.

Right. He exists just to make children happy, which is the Michael Jackson bullshit. Right, right. He couldn't have hurt us. He loves peace on earth. And this movie's like, this is this weird guy.

No one knows what's going on with him. And then when they meet him, he's an asshole to them. Right. And he tries to kill them all. And the whole time they're like, I don't know what the fuck is up with this guy like they are not charmed by him at all he is not charmed by them yeah it feels like he wants the tour to be over i also just think it's good to add the thing where like at the end of the book it's like you

won you get the factory now charlie's like great and it's like great let's get in the elevator right here charlie's like fuck this, you don't seem so good. Yeah. Like, you seem five out of ten, six. You seem fucked up, right. And he's like, you can't bring your family with you.

And he's like, well, then what? I end up like you? Yeah, right. You weirdo with a Prince Valiant haircut? Good. Like, I like that this movie

is like a guy who's like, look at me, I turned out fine. I'm eccentric. And everyone's like, no, you're not okay. We don't like you. When it's also sort of like, no at me, I turned out fine. I'm eccentric. And everyone's like, no, you're not okay. We don't like you. Well, it's also sort of like-

No chocolate justifies this behavior. Charlie's only accomplishment is being the last one alive. Right. You could keep taking him into rooms and seeing if they kill him. I mean, you could do this forever. But this movie's like a weird rebuke to the genius exemption. Okay. Exemption.

All the stuff he's made recently is crazy bad crazy bad right they're like it's convoluted he's wasting tons of money and like r and d like time and energy on shit that no one wants to fucking eat gone i like all of that i think this is a good take and i think people didn't like it when it came out because they were like oh they've ruined've ruined Willy Wonka. The original was so pure. And it's like, but it's fucked up if you look at it. That's why everyone always did comedy routines about it. And this movie is like, yeah, we're going to make a movie about how it's fucked up. Yeah, except but then this movie is like, but really, if his dad just like gave him a pat on the back, he'd be fine.

Yeah, I mean, look, it's a little easy. It's a little neat. I'm just saying if you wanted to be wrestling with this little like, hey, these geniuses are not so great. And then Charlie's like, what's up with you?

And he's like, I don't know. My dad was like kind of a jerk. There's a whole stretch of like, Charlie. His dad was even that much of a jerk. He was like, don't eat candy. Don't eat candy all the time. You have crazy braces.

Go on, go on. No, I agree with all that. Look, they tie the bow up too quickly but it's the idea that it's like he needed to connect to other people

which they make that leap and it's a pretty big leap he's connected to the Oompa Loompas yeah but I mean they're not great conversationalists they're great

great performers they're quiet I do love the jungle exploration scene I just like this idea of like Willy Wonka like traveling around the world with a machete. Yeah. That could be the prequel.

Willy Wonka Origins with a machete. Okay, so Violet, you're upset that she gets taken down. She gets screwed over. So she should win. She's good. She's good? Yeah, like Violet. They tried to do this practically.

Apparently it looked terrifying, so they did the CGI last minute. Right. Because the CGI looks a little wonky. Yeah, it doesn't look good. And not wonka. Oh, I just remember, we never pointed out the TV kid's dad is like perfect. Yeah. Oh, he plays it so perfectly.

Adam Godley. One of my favorite performances. He's like got that terrible comb over. Great British theater. He's just like, he just is is so the dad who is not disciplining his kid. I believe he is one of the giants in BFG. He is? Yeah, he is. But out of all the parents, he's the one that

stays in my mind. Him and Missy Pyle are really strong. What's his name? Fox? James Fox. He's classic. He's a classic English guy. English stick-up-his-buck guy. Augustus Gloop's mom is a similar classic English guy. Right. English stick-up-his-buck guy. And Augustus Gloop's mom is like a similar, just sort of classic German woman. Franziska Tregner.

Yeah. But I like they found a real German kid. Yeah. The German kid did his own dubbing for the German version of this movie. That's great. English was his second language. But this feels like an area, especially if you're Tim Burton, you get to make a $150 million Charlie and the Chocolate Factory movie after Johnny Depp's become a big movie star.

Where like, if you go on the Wikipedia, they have all these like other actors who are considered for the part, for every part. Because you can see that Warner Brothers would have been like, why isn't Anthony Hopkins Grandpa Joe? Sure. Like why isn't all of, why aren't all the parents big movie stars? And I like that he just, like, hired, like, good actors. That's fair. Like, he got good theater actors. He got, like, you know, not very famous people

to play all the grown-ups in the film. They shot it all in England. Right. Yeah. I mean, Helena Bonham Carter is the other big name in this movie, and it's because she is the mother to his children at this time. It took six months to shoot. Yeah. Because the British Child Act was lost. Yeah.

Yeah. She's always the mother of his children. Yes. You're right. She will forever be the mother of his children. That's a good point. I misspoke. They have two children. They have two children. Yeah. But they're not together anymore. They're not together anymore.

When they were together, there were all those things where it's like, oh, their houses are separate, but there's a tunnel underneath connecting them. Which I love. I think that's an ideal situation. I've been thinking about that a lot, too. I'm like, maybe that's how I want to get my... Are there bats in the tunnel? Just like a unispan?

Yeah. And you're like, we live together, but also, like, we're weird people and we probably need our own space, right? Maybe they could have, like, you know, there's, like, chutes where they communicate. Like, what do they call those oh yeah all-timey shoes oh yes yes yeah it just sounds nice like them living in the english countryside you two are nuts he has this weird little gothic manor and she's got her quaint crooked charlie bucket house they didn't live in the countryside they lived in hampstead i remember

where they live really yeah you ever go there? no my friend's mom was her agent what? yeah yeah so I knew I knew of their place but no I never went

do you think at like this period of time Helen Bonham Carter's agent like calls her and is like hey so good news we got an offer for a film for you

it's Charlie and the Chocolate Factory so Tim Burton's attached to her like do you think every time there's a new tim burton film she calls her formal uh they want you to read for this uh dark shadow yeah yeah right no because i could imagine tim burton being too uncomfortable to like ask his like common wife to you mean common law wife yeah that's what i meant to say you don't mean his common law wife.

I left out his exceptional wife. Famously married a commoner, yes. His exceptional common law wife. I left out the worst word to leave out. I can imagine him not having the courage to be like, honey, would you be in this movie? It'd be funny if you called her his law wife. Thinking of all the words you could draw.

Yeah, law wife would make more sense. That's kind of like your doctor jacket. Hey, HBC, it's Fran calling. So we got an offer for you to go on tape for, what is it, Mrs. Lovett and Sweeney Todd. This is a really hot project. Tim Burton is attached. Like, I just think that's probably how it happened for her.

That sounds funny. I don't know. Did they really have a tunnel? They had a tunnel. It was like some kind of connection. There was, yeah, because they were separate properties on the same land. What if that is how relationships always work? That was just the social norm.

They should. You guys are together, but you live all the way across town. This is going to be a big tunnel. Like, you know, where it's like, wow. Yeah. Like the poor development guys have to be like, yeah, we'll figure it out. I mean, I don't know what. That's how it should work.

Good. Personal space. Uh-huh. You know? Veruca Salt with the squirrels. I mean, we talked about this a lot, but this rules. I love Veruca Salt. Yeah, the nuts are great.

You love Veruca Salt. Like, not as like a captive, but like, I love that she's. Yeah, the nuts are great. You love Veruca Salt? Not as a captive, but I love that she's such a psycho bitch, basically. She's pretty bad. It's great. This one, I mean, she looks maniacal. She looks really good. Whereas the wilder Veruca Salt is

kind of more of a brat. This child feels like a sociopath. Right, because she won't listen. I like it whenever he tries to reason with her. He's like, you already have all this stuff. And she like, you know, she dials up to like full psycho mode. Right, she feels like she's going to murder her parents.

Yeah, I think it feels like she's going to like murder the squirrel. Like she doesn't want to squirrel for a pet. Just like, I'm going to do an experiment on it. Yes. Maybe she's Elvira. Uh-huh. She's like Joan Cusack in The Addams Family. Addams Family Values.

It's like if you cross her once, she sets the whole house on fire. But I do like... Imagine having a kid and it turned out to be a good son situation. That would be rough. No one talks about that enough. Well, that's... You worry about your kid having asthma

or an allergy or something but what if they were Macaulay Culkin and the Good Sons? David, it sounds like you need to talk about Kevin. What if it's a Kevin? The doctor's like, we've run some tests, everything's fine except a 47% chance of a Kevin situation.

Keep them away from the bows and arrows. My parents were very upset with me flying a kite at night here's Ben and I learned that that's not the time you do that but I like night kites

isn't that in the movie he flies a kite at night am I thinking of the right thing what is happening flying a kite at night night k thinking of the right thing where I'm just like what is happening night kite I like it okay but here's the problem with this it's creepy apparently Ben here's the problem with this bit you have told much worse

stories about things you did as a child I was like did Ben actually fly a kite at night we cannot suspend our disbelief enough to imagine that that's the thing that concerned your parents Jesus Mike TV there's a 2001 gag yeah also a imagine that that's the thing that concerned your parents? Jesus. Mike TV. There's a 2001 gag?

Yeah. Also a psycho gag. Oh yeah, of course. They go through multiple movies and TV shows. The Oompa Loompas do their little news program. I know, and you see like Deep Roy's calves. Yeah. Like they really go all in on the psycho. Kind of swole. Deep Roy kind of swole. I mean, is there any, the Veruca Salt thing is good. I mean is there any the Veruca Salt thing is good

the set's really cool we talked about the squirrels the songs are fun the other thing I like is that by not making the movie a musical it makes it creates the comedic game of the people being like why are they singing that

because when you already have like three musical numbers before they get to the factor It creates the comedic game of the people being like, why are they singing now? Right. Sure. Because when you already have, like, three musical numbers before they get to the factory, you're like, well, the Oompa Loompas are singing because it's a musical. That's, like, the device of the movie. But in this, every single time, the reaction shots are so good. Right. So I'm being like, what the fuck am I watching? It's like a funereal march thing. Every time a kid gets sucked into the hole or falls down the chute or gets rolled away or whatever, they all play this very ominous Danny Elfman sleepy hollow music. Why didn't anyone just leave after Augustus?

That's a great question. I probably would have bailed. Right. Your policy with this kid is to suck him into a tube? Yeah. Can we go? It's mostly because I hate singing. I would be like, no, I can't deal with this pilot you like singing i hate singing movies so much in movies okay we've established i hate it you don't think like the the chocolate factory is

kind of like fest it's different it's a little like fest all these oompa loompa acts it's a little like fest i don't know i don't think many children have died at Fest. Oh, well. I mean, if you told me a kid drowned in a motel pool or something, I'd be like, sure, sounds like something that might happen at Fest. If you told me that a kid at Fest got attacked by squirrels,

I would believe it. Those things are on bath salts. If you told me a kid at Fest turned into a blueberry and got rolled away by Deep Roy, I would believe it. Yeah, I would love that, actually. It was just, I don't know. The singing, I just can't deal with. Deep Roy does sound like the name of a band that would play at

Fest. Yeah. Deep Roy. It's weird there's not a band called Deep Roy. Right. And their logo is like a guy falling into a pit. He's Deep Roy. What else has Deep Roy been up to recently? I guess just Star Trek. That's really it. Oh, he's Keenster. Keenzer. up to recently I guess just Star Trek that's really it oh he's Keenster Keenzer

Keenzer that was very close yeah you're looking at a computer let's make it clear you're correcting me I know Keenzer's name excuse me

Keenster's kind what if that's my nickname for him though the Keenster yes he's great in Star Trek Keenzer especially in the first one

when he goes like this like remember he's a great physical comedian. Keenzer. Especially in the first one when he goes like this. Remember? He's a great physical comedian. Yeah. Yeah, when Scotty beams away. I just think people don't comprehend the quantity of acting he had to do.

In this. He had to do every single one. Right. They're not doubling it up or anything. Right. No, because they're distinct performances. There's so much he has to do. And that's he was interacting with other people the least right in a movie that otherwise everyone's in scenes with other people whether in a practical set or in green screen elevator land you're actually like with other people and

he probably just had to spend like weeks with tim burton where he's like cool and now this is medic oompa loompa number 12 this one is checking the charts you know great this is medic 13 he's like flicking his finger against the syringe that fucking bit is so good the puppet burn ward my favorite joke I also like that the gray glass elevator

is in this I don't like that it has rockets though don't like that in the books they're like how is this thing outside and he's like skyhooks and you're like what you think it's fair. In the books, they're like, how is this thing outside? And he's like, skyhooks. And you're like, what? You know, it's like one of those great Willy Wonka moments where he just says some crazy stuff. I think it should have propellers. Propellers would be fine.

That'd be a little more Burton-y. The rockets feel a little too 2005 to me. Yes. Mike TV gets turned into media. He gets turned into content, as we all do. Willy Wonka's big ploy to turn chocolate into content. There are a lot of good gags in that whole sequence,

like Deep Roy sort of like leaning over to look at the TV because they're blocking and stuff like that. Yeah, and I like that weird hermetic room. The Oompa Loompas are so weird. So weird. But that's what I like. Like, I like the unease of them being like,

who are these robots? Are they malevolent? Right. He's like, no, of course, they're from the Oompa Loompa tribe. Yeah, yeah. And Mike TV's dad is like,

I teach geography. And Willy Wonka just interrupts him and he's like, so then you know very well what I'm talking about. Right. I just like how sinister all of this is. And it doesn't's like, so then you know very well what I'm talking about. Right. I just like how sinister all of this is.

And it doesn't feel like twisted for twisted's sake. It feels like he's digging into all the things that people make jokes about. Sure. And being like, let's own how fucked up this entire premise is. Sure. And then the movie ends. Charlie rejects him. And he's like, that's really about my dad.

And you meet Christopher. Well, you get the flashbacks throughout the movie. I'm nodding. Little Wilbur Wonka. Nodding in agreeance. What's his father's name? Wilbur. Oh, the father's name is Wilbur.

I actually think it's William Wonka. Yeah. Young William Wonka, who loves nothing more than candy. Maybe my favorite joke in the movie is when he runs away from home to see the sights of the world, and he does his little march in front of all the flags. That's a good gag. That's a good gag.

I mean, that's like, you're like fucking Burton coming up with jokes and gags again. Well, John August wrote this. We should also give him credit. This is an August script. And August had never seen the movie, loved the book. Freddie Highmore, never seen the movie, loved the book. Freddie Highmore, never seen the movie, loved the book. Burton didn't like the movie. And he said to them, like, don't watch the movie.

We're making our own thing. We're going off the book, which I think you feel in this movie less of an effort to be like, we have to make this different from the original. I guess the plot is so prescribed, like, in the book. And it's the same in all of them. It's, you know, it's very episodic. Let's meet the kids. Right right let's do all their deaths no i like that's the plot burton tends to work best in a somewhat episodic realm this is a thing i've sort of been realizing while re-watching his movies no i read an interview with uh daniel waters uh screenwriter batman

returns and uh burton had asked for him, so he went in to pitch Warner Brothers, and he read the script that Sam Hamm had written. And he said, this makes no sense. This is so plotty, and if you've seen a Tim Burton movie, and you're smart,

you should be able to tell at this point that he doesn't give a shit about plot. So I want to put a bunch of stuff in there. Because he likes events, he likes ideas, he likes set pieces, you know? Right. Like, you can have the thing thematically all tied together. I think that all makes sense, what you're saying. Right.

And so he wrote Batman Returns as, like, a series of concepts, which, like, Emily argued is, like, that movie's disjointed, and I argue the film works because all those concepts are all tied together thematically. Willy Wonka is like a cousin of the penguin. To adopt. Yes. There's a little overlap. But if he's going to take in

someone else's source material. And the penguins are cousins of the Oompa Loompas. It would be funny if this movie ended with the penguins marching a dead Willy Wonka into the chocolate river yes that would be good what's the failing

of Alice in Wonderland that he was like so many that's also episodic though but what I'm saying is he said in all his interviews I wanted to make it less episodic

I always felt like Alice in Wonderland should have a stronger narrative and the narrative is a bowl of dog diarrhea that you don't give a fuck about and you wonder why they keep asking

if she's the one right right right you're right. You hate this. We're going to get into it in a week or two. Did he make anything in between? Sleepy Hawk. Not Sleepy Hawk. Sweetie. Sweetie.

But he's best when it's like Mars Attacks cutting between different things. Beale Juice does not have a super propulsive plot. Pee Wee is like a road trip movie. Like when he's in this zone of just like events. So Wonka is a good fit. It's in his wheelhouse in that sense. Even Ed Wood is

like episodic. Yeah. The only thing the only mistake I think he makes is that you kind of lose sight of Charlie and Grandpa Joe in this film. I don't think they have to be as centralized as the Gene Walder movie. But I like that though. I like that he's just always in the background. So that's why he doesn't get into any trouble. That's kind of cool.

That's the lesson of this movie for children. Just take it easy. Yeah. If you don't do anything, you'll be fine. Right. Like he's the only one who's not like trying to. For lazy children everywhere. I'm like, I support being lazy.

The Wilder movie adds in the bubble soda where they float. Yeah, fuck that Roald Dahl hated sucks but they're also like every time they go into a room like Charlie and Grandpa Joe go off into a corner

and like do color commentary on everything else that's happening and this once Wonka enters it like becomes Wonka's movie where you're just

on this weird tour with this guy you don't understand right who makes so little sense and is so prickly except for these little flashbacks, which are filling in what's pretty obvious. From the first time, the first flashback.

We get it. Yeah, I know. When you see the headgear, you get it. Christopher Lee as the dad is really good casting. Of course. No objection there. Love Chris Lee. Bring him in.

Anytime. Tim Burton loves Chris Lee and Vincent Price, right? He cast Vincent Price in his early movies. Right, and then Christopher Lee he puts in Sleepy Hollow. Christopher Lee's old at that point in time. I bet he's probably like well this is the one chance I'll get to work with Christopher Lee.

And then Christopher Lee out of nowhere becomes like America's favorite 90 year old movie star. And suddenly becomes a name that he can put in all his movies. In between Sleepy Hollow and this, he made two Star Warses. Yeah, two Star Warses and three Lords of Ranks. And everyone's all in on Christopher Lee now.

So now it's like, and Christopher Lee as Wilbur Wonka, DDS. Did you know that Dwayne Johnson was Burton's second choice for this? Which would have been great. For depth, to be clear, not for the dad. He wasn't as big in 2005.

No, it's sort of the beginning of his like, startup. Well, I meant just like, physically. Right. That's true. He also was actually

less insane looking. Like, 2019 Dwayne Johnson would be so terrifying to children. But that was always... Hey, kids! You read all of Burton's weird casting ideas and it was either the actors he's worked with before and loved, but that was always hey kids you read all of Burton's weird

casting ideas and it was either the actors he's worked with before and loved people who are obviously in his wheelhouse

and then his second choice would always be a weird energy choice like him wanting Sammy Davis Jr. for Beetlejuice where he's like

I don't know he's kind of like a wheeler dealer showman my pick is Henry Rollins he's tortured he can do good monologues.

He's intense. He doesn't like kids. He would rule. He would rule. You guys have all seen that video where Henry Rollins is like, what was it? It was for like his IFC show or something where he's at the record store. Is that on DVD for some reason? The Henry Rollins show?

Not for some reason. Not surprised. I know exactly why you own that on DVD for some reason? The Henry Rollins show? Not for some reason. I'm not even a big Henry Rollins fan. But you're a big Henry Rollins show fan. Very clearly. Also, he was on Paul Reiser's show, right? Was he on the Paul Reiser show? Wow. And he's in Bad Boys too.

Yes, my favorite show. How many episodes did the Paul Reiser show is that wait I think it aired like three or four right when when when

um the Mad About You revival airs on Spectrum Originals is the Paul Reiser show gonna air with it or next after they're also reviving

the Paul Reiser show it was like everyone wanted the Mad About You revival but Reiser insisted that it was packaged with the Paul Riser show. Yes. Which also had, like, Andy Daly

and Omid Jalili in it. Yes. Yeah. What I was gonna say was there's, I believe it's a Henry Rollins show clip in which he goes to a record store with, like, a humanitarian writer

and he's, like, showing her what America's like. And some kids in the record store yell, hey, get in the van! And he turns his head to shoot them daggers, and then walks up to them and is like, what's the idea? You make fun of the old guy? What, because you're so turned on?

You're so hip? What, you make fun of the old guy? You trust fun babies and he just eviscerates these like two kids but his head turn to hey man get in the van is the funniest thing on the entire internet

I recommend that everyone go find this video it doesn't even sound like they were being mean just like oh I recognize him that's the name of his books like when he was traveling with Black Flag. And then he's very condescending. Oh, I know you. He's very condescending to this woman he's with where he's like, you have to understand.

That's the title of a book I wrote. It's very popular. People are big fans of it. I actually won several awards for it. So if someone says that to me, they're mocking me. they're mocking me. So he like he like brags about how well known

the thing is and then gets like violently angry at someone for calling him that. He rules. I was sort of zoning out during all of that.

Yeah. Cool. No objection. I was just thinking about stuff. I was looking at The Rock's filmography. Pre-Southland Tales

The Rock makes sense for him. This year is Be Cool and Doom. But you get the sense of that thing of just like All movies I saw in theaters. Of course. There's something kind of creepy is his Be Cool and Doom. But you get the sense of that thing of just like All movies I saw in theaters.

Of course. There's something kind of creepy this point in time with how big The Rock is and how hard he's trying to be like friendly and approachable. Right.

Like this was before he had like figured his thing out. Right. And he was sort of moving out of action films into family movies. And it was like

this big guy who's like trying to be very like accessible. He's now at the size, the Schwarzenegger's type size, where it's like, if he's in a movie, it has to be addressed.

Yeah. Yeah. Or you just don't address it, but then it's weird. Right. Right. Yes, I agree with that. Now he is that size.

Now he's that size. Where you're like, you can't pretend this is a normal looking person. This man, right, was in the military for a long time. Like needs to be said. Right. Or else people would just be like, what's this is a normal looking person. This man was in the military for a long time. It needs to be said. Or else people would just be like, what's this guy's deal?

The width of your body shoulder to shoulder is more than your height. Once you have that sort of axis fight going on. He probably has to have specially designed showers specially designed like, showers and, right? Like, things like in his house now. Right. Right, and he can't, like, clear a door frame without like, turning sideways. No, every doorway in Dwayne Johnson's house is shaped like Dwayne Johnson. It looks like

he just, like, bugs bunnied through a wall. How tall do you think he is? Dwayne's toilet is like the squirrel thing. He's 6'5". Wow. He's so tall. Wait, I missed Ben's joke. His toilet is what? Like the squirrel thing in this movie 6'5". Wow. He's so tall. Wait, I missed Ben's joke. His toilet is what? Like the squirrel thing in this movie.

Yes, three comedy points. And he does have squirrels to evaluate his poops. Right, and he does those like big, like, his cheat day is like 80 pancakes and tequila. Is that what he does?

You've been talking about his tequila social media. He suddenly, I mean, you follow The Rock very closely. His Instagram is really great pancakes and tequila. Is that what he does? You've been talking about his tequila social media. You follow The Rock very closely. His Instagram is really great when he's on his cheat days. It's so intimidating. But also he's all about tequila now because he's clearly launching a tequila brand. He wants to make that

George Clooney money. So now he's like only my closest collaborators are invited into the tequila circle. And it'll be like a picture of him and like, you know, San Andreas director Brad Payton doing tequila circle. And it'll be like a picture of him and San Andreas director Brad Payton doing tequila shots. I mean, if The Rock had a tequila factory and he got five kids to tour it,

it would be amazing. That would be a pretty good movie. Pilot, fuck. We figured it out. God damn it. That would probably be a Gentleman's Six. Well, Pilot, congratulations. it out god damn it that would probably be a gentleman six oh well pilot congratulations you just made three million dollars with that pitch god i was gonna make a joke about you know

if the rock asked brad payton to drink poison would he do it but like now i can't even you have like 15 days to pitch this before this episode comes out and it's a feeding frenzy. This will be the biggest spec sale in history. It'll tie in with the launch of his brand. Are you fucking kidding me? I mean, this is killer. But it would also result in so many drunk children. Yeah.

Well, that's where we're headed. As a society. Seven bucks productions will pay you seven billion dollars for this concept because it'll be like Quaker Oats financing the movie

to launch the candy bar. Right. He's like taking out patents for his tequila but he hasn't launched it yet. He needs a good movie to launch his tequila. He needs right.

He needs some sort of shape that the bottle can be in and he's trying to find that. Right. Yeah. It should definitely be in the shape of his body. Yeah definitely.

Well it's a lot of tequila. I don't know. Not to scale. It'd be good if it was to scale, though. Just one big peck. Yeah, one peck. One peck. It's just a peck.

Yeah. A crystal peck. It would be great if, like, Michael Jordan cologne, it was, like, the silhouette of his head. Yeah, right? Because his head and his neck are distinctive enough now, you know? I would agree

he's bald yeah did you see fighting we were talking about fighting with my family but you didn't see i didn't see it yeah no i can't believe you haven't seen that it's not like pilot's not a page fan you're not a page i'm not a page okay um because i was i was asking pilot like about page because the movie kind of fails to tell you what Paige's ring persona was like. Sure. But, uh... She had, like, a very quick

sort of rise and then several injuries and is now retired, right? Sort of. It was pretty fast. Yeah. Her ring persona was mostly just, like,

being British and yelling, this is my house and wearing, like, awesome outfits, which is actually pretty good. Which, to me, sounds good.

This is my house, English, like, I'm, pretty good. To me, sounds good. This is my house, English. I'm like signed, sealed, and delivered. Why would you care about that? Let's play the box office game. Unless there's anything else you want to say. No, I think the end of the movie is nice. I mean, it is a little too pat in terms of solving everything.

Yeah, that's my problem. I do like that he is still kind of standoffish when he comes into the house, but is like trying to remember to say nice things. They're like, oh, I like it. It's weird that they move the house into the factory. I like that. I like that.

It's cool that the salt shakers are cool. It's just, you know what? I'm nicer now. And the final deep Roy reveal is great. Yes. Yes. That is amazing. Jeffrey Holder, a great voice.

That I love. I don't like when Charlie's shining his shoes. That upsets me for some reason. That he's got to work that job. Yeah. Yeah, it's a little weird. The only other thing that I hated about watching it is that I gave up candy for Lent. And then I watched this right after.

And it was so bad. I can't believe you did that, Pilot. That's a bold move. I made a huge mistake. Considering that you don't eat a lot of foods, it's crazy that you gave up one of the foods. I know. Your food pyramid is only like three squares and one of them is candy. And I also don't drink caffeine anymore.

Fuck. What are you consuming right now? What are you eating and drinking these days? Water. Yeah, you have two water bottles in front of you. I do, yeah. You've killed two bottles of water. I do often put sugar in the water.

Okay. So it's basically like Kool-Aid. Sugar. And water. That's about it. Great. You're just drinking sugar water? Yep.

Pilot is looking a little cockroachy these days. I don't know how to phrase this. You kind of look like there's a cockroach shoved in your skin. I've tweeted about this. And it's not fitting perfectly. But the greatest moment in my favorite movie is Men in Black. I mean, I don't know. Top ten. You've referred to five movies as your

favorite movie. It's in the top ten. And my favorite moment in the perfect movie Men in Black is when Tommy Lee Jones says, let her go shit eater while he's pointing a gun at Vincent D'Onofrio and Will Smith just gives him this look of like Jesus like and it's not brought up again.

It's so good. I think I can let her go shit eater. I can tell the story because he told it publicly. Okay. George Lucas show show I do on a monthly basis at the UCB theater in New York City. Wado does that show. I don't know what you're talking about. I'm sorry. A show that my good friend Wado

does with his good friend George Lucas that neither I nor Connor Ratliff have no involvement in. Ed Solomon. The writer of Men in Black. Co-writer of Men in Black and Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure was on the show recently.

And he said that when Tommy Lee Jones signed on to make the film and Will Smith came on much later, they were struggling to find someone to play the film and Will Smith came on much later, they were struggling to find someone to play the Will Smith part. They wanted David Schwimmer and then it was like

Ethan Hawke. That is crazy. Crazy, right? Wow. Like no one wanted Will Smith and then it was What? It was one of those things

where like then They were like talk me into Will Smith because Schwimmer is still at the top of the pyramid here. And then, like, Independence Day came out when they were, like, about to start filming. And they wanted to convince Will Smith to do it.

I think Will Smith was kind of like another alien movie. Like, I don't know. Right. But Tommy Lee Jones had been on board for a while, and they were like, oh, this is great. Like, he's a perfect casting. He must love the script. Yeah.

And he asked Ed Sullivan, and I'm forgetting his writing partner's name, to go out to dinner with him and they were like, great, he's going to want to talk script with us. And he sits down and he's like, so the script doesn't work. And they were like, what are you talking about?

And he's like, either it's a comedy or it's a sci-fi film. It can't be both. You have to choose one, asshole. And Tommy Lee Jones very early said to him, you have to choose asshole. They're like,y lee jones very only said to him you have to choose asshole they're like what are you doing like we didn't choose right and they were like so what did tommy lee jones do and they were like he was really angry for like the first month of filming and then he finally kind of conceded that maybe it was working as a comedy it's a great comedy

but his total seriousness is crucial and we talk about this all the time that tommy lee jones can't give a bad performance because if he's locked in he's giving a really smart performance of a grumpy man. And if he hates the movie, then he's just naturally being grumpy. Right. And that's on our, I believe, our Captain America Patreon episode. We talk about this. He's rocking the house. But he can't be bad.

He rocks the house. I rocked my entire couch to show how much he rocked the house in that movie. But he hates Captain America. And we're like, he seems so locked in right i agree no in real life he hits the performance he hates the oh he hates the movie he's like you know how could he hate it when he's this good and it's like because his like open contempt for the project he's working on reeds has it's good right exactly where he's like fuck this yeah but in min and buck he has so many one-liners such as let her go shit eater but also like the thing where he's like fuck this yeah but in men in buck he has so many one-liners such as let her go shit eater but also like the thing where he's like see this this is gonna be the

new cds i'm gonna have to buy the white album again which is like a really weird funny line like he just tosses off totally flat like you know very much he's like joking around with the the worms at the coffee counter yeah and he yeah. And he's just like totally, totally like, what's the word? It's not monotonal. It's, keep talking. He's sort of like off the cuff. Yeah.

Like he's very loose with it. Off hand, I guess. Right, yeah. Matter of fact. Matter of fact. Right, that sort of stuff. But I wonder if it was just like the first three weeks were a wash

where they could only get him delivering perfunctory dialogue. Sure. And thankfully those things added across the film so that they don't seem weird. The thing where he always calls him either Mr. White or Mr. Black. This is my partner, Mr. Black.

And Will Smith always just gives him a look. That movie's perfect. Oh, it's a perfect film. It's a perfect movie. Do you like Men in Black, by the way? I do, I love it. I love most Will Smith movies. Also, Will Smith would have been

a great Willy Wonka. Oh. He would have been a great Willy Wonka. Not a bad idea. Because this is like his era. This is the senior's head. That would have been a great Willy Wonka. Oh. He would have been a great Willy Wonka. Not a bad idea. Because this is like Hitch era. Because he would have been rapping about most of it. This is the same year as Hitch. That would have been good.

This is the same year as Hitch. Hitch is like a Valentine's Day movie. Hitch is so good. Haven't seen Hitch in a while. Hitch is really good. Mendez? Eva Mendez? Yep.

Yeah. Is Hitch the best romantic comedy of that decade? It'd be funny if you were like, is Hitch the best film of all time? Absolutely. I don't think Hitch is the best romantic comedy of that decade. I'm going to pump the brakes on that. Okay. Well, I think it is.

I think it is. All right. Well, we'll do Battle at Dawn. It's my favorite Will Smith movie of that year. Of 2005? I think Pursuit of Happiness might also be a 2005-er. So bad. Gets an Oscar nom for that.

What about the fact that he does the Rubik's Cube really fast in the car and that's why he gets the job or whatever they play the Christina Aguilera

song in that one it's 2006 I'm pretty sure it was the following year pretty sure they give you

a Rubik's Cube because he was one of those once a year event guys and it would always make 100 million

he was like in that sort of Tom Cruise he had like 20 100 million films in a row or something

no Tom Hanks had the longest run. Because he was interrupted by the Ali-Bagger Vance back-to-back, which those two bombed. Ali didn't bomb. Bagger Vance bombed. Ali just like underwhelmed relative to budget. A lot of money.

Money. We're never going to talk about it on this podcast, so whatever. Who cares? Hitch rules. I remember when I was in high school and uh a couple of us were writing different top 10 of the year lists for the the movies of the year sure uh a guy told me that he was putting hitch at his number one and i was like wow i respect that like that's like actually like you had hitch number one no another guy who was doing the top 10 my number one was the

fucking new world sure right. Hitch is so much better. Not true. But Hitch is very close. Hitch is not so much better. It's a little better. I love the New World, but he was like, I'm putting Hitch as my number one movie. And I was like, wow, I

kind of like, I respect that. And then he was like, I was joking. But I had really thought through it and I was like, you know what? Not a conventional pick. No one's putting it on their list. But you do have to kind of game recognize game like Hitch fucks. Hitch is charming. We'll talk about that when we do our Andy Tennant miniseries.

Exactly. Well, good pull. All right. Number one at the box office. It's July 15, 2005. It's Charlie. And it makes like $55 million? $56 at the box office. It's July 15, 2005. It's Charlie. And it makes like $55 million?

$56. Yeah. Unbelievable. It's a big hit. Yeah. And I remember this very vividly because it dethroned my most hated movie of this year. Go ahead. It's number three.

It's number three? So it dipped all the way down? Well, there was another big opener this week. Okay. So number three is The Fantastic Four, which had inexplicably opened to over $50 million the weekend before. I was convinced

that movie was going to bomb and it did weirdly fucking well. It's made $100 million in two weeks. I hate that movie. You don't like it. No, it's my least favorite

of the four Fantastic Four movies. Number two is the other big release. Yeah. It's a comedy. It's a comedy. Oh. Is it Wedding Crashers? Yes. Right. Because is the other big release uh yeah it's a comedy it's a comedy oh is it wedding crashers yes right because oh right i was trying to describe wedding crashers no because charlie outgrosses it uh the first weekend and then wedding crashers moves up to number one in the following weekend no it doesn't

weekend three it becomes number one maybe let's see i believe we can yes weekend three it does it creeps up there and it ends up making more in total than Charlie. That's insane. Insane. That movie was such a big hit. And that movie sucks farts. How do you feel about winning Crashers Pilot? I have only seen it the once which I assume

was like when it came out and I'm sure I loved it and I'm sure if I watched it now I'd hate it. That sounds right. It is. Just most movies in 2005 I think. I remember I saw it in theaters whenever it came out because that's what I did and I was like that was funny and I really liked Rachel McAdam. Yes. She's very good. So charming in it. She's very good.

Where it was that sort of moment where you're like is she the next Julia Roberts? Like wait a second like have we been sitting on something here? This was her crazy like. Because it was a year after Mean Girls where you're like whoa. And no because it was Mean Girls and Notebook where you're like whoa and no because it was Mean Girls and Notebook

or 2004 in 2005 she has Wedding Crashers Red Eye Love Red Eye and Family Stone she's really good in as well I know you love Family Stone

she's really good in that of course but Family Stone is a movie I've seen at least 15 times it's very watchable it's very watchable I don't think I've ever enjoyed it

but I've seen it I mean I enjoy the scene where Sarah Jessica Parker points at her skin to indicate a black person and the whole family basically puts her on trial I mean that's a good scene it's one of the most hostile movies ever mate oh sorry for spiking that movie is like Mississippi burning except at Christmas time it's also a wife swapping movie there's a lot going on in the family. Everyone's just so casual about it too. Just like,

okay, fine. We'll just accept this now. Yeah. But Ridgemick rules in that. Right. Everyone thought she was going to become Julia Roberts. And then she like disappears for two years and comes back with the lucky ones.

And, um, time travelers wife, which is like one of those endlessly reshooted. Yeah. No, she takes her a while. She failed to capitalize, it's true.

It felt like, did she miss her moment? And I feel like she's gotten back into a good pocket the last five years. She got her Oscar nomination. Thank God. She's so good. Love her. She rules. Should have been nominated for The Hot Chick. She's really good in that. Sure, yeah, right. It's a Shiner movie.

She's really good in that. Number four is a film we talked about on this podcast. Number four is a film we talked about on this podcast. Is it War of the Worlds? Every time, you're getting them. War of the Worlds. This summer, vividly. Me too. I've seen so many of these in theaters. That's all I did in 2005. We were all like in that

where it's like, what else are you gonna do? You know? Well, it's also own on bootleg from my back. There you go. When you're at this level of like... Slightly better movie to get from a war. It has war in the title than Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. Anyway, what was the other one?

Did your dad like autograph it? Oh, Finding Neverland. Finding Neverland. Did your dad autograph the DVD and say like, from one war to another. No. All the rest. That'd be weird. Yeah. That'd be a weird movie. You think that'd be weird? autograph the DVD and say like from one war to another No. All the best. That'd be weird.

Yeah. That'd be a weird move. You think that'd be weird? You think that would be a weird thing to do? War of the Worlds. Another movie with an unsatisfying ending. Yeah, which J.D. loves.

Yeah. Yeah. Number five is another movie we've talked about on this podcast that I saw many times in theaters.

The Department Begins? It's a big summer. You've also got Mr. and Mrs. Smith. I saw that in theaters. Yeah. You've got Dark Water. Darkest Water There Is. It's a wet horror movie.

Is that Jennifer Connelly? That's right. Jennifer Connelly and a haunted water tower. Is that like also on bootleg? Let's keep going. How many of these did you boot? Herbie Fully Loaded? I don't think so.

Basically most from 2005, 2007. I just love thinking about the Disney pitch meeting Fully loaded? I don't think so. Basically most from 2005, 2007 I got. I just love thinking about the Disney pitch meeting where they're like, it's a reference to her boobs and the guy's like, yeah. But then they digitally trim them down. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because the parents were freaking out of the advertising.

I almost watched that yesterday because it came up on Hulu after talking about it. Keaton's in it. Keaton's in it. He's really good in that. That movie's not bad. Have you seen Documentary Now this year? Yes. Keaton's really good inaton's in it he's really good that movie's not have you seen documentary now

this year yes Keaton's really good in the Bat Shit Valley episode I haven't watched those two I've watched

the co-op and I've watched the Marina Brown what was I gonna say I'm gonna tell a story that would probably embarrass her but

Angela Robinson who directed Herbie Fully Loaded did you embarrass Angela Robinson no the director of Professor Marston and the Wonder Woman right and she also directed Robinson, who directed Herbie Fully Loaded. Did you embarrass Angela Robinson? No. The director of Professor Marston and the Wonder Woman. Right, and she also directed

Debs, which is a very fun movie. Ooh, Debs is so good. Debs rules. Seminal. She got Herbie Fully Loaded off of Debs because she started getting general meetings and she's like, I want to make a Disney movie. Like, what I'd love to do is make a Herbie movie. Herbie would have been so much better if it was so much gayer.

Yes. Yes. So Debs is very gay. It's a very fun movie. She was an NYU graduate. My father works at NYU. So she was like a big like point of pride student at that point in time where it's like, look, she made this like indie gay comedy and now she's making a huge Disney film.

Right. This episode is so long. Sorry. It's fine. No, no. Keep going. I like it. I like it. I like it.

Romley is like, you know, six or seven at this point in time. Oh, this is embarrassing Romley. Yes. Okay, here we go. So my dad takes her to see Herbie Fully Loaded, which she's amped to see

because she's all in on Lohan at this point. Sure. But they end up missing the first 10 minutes of the movie, if not more, because it was the Day of the Gay Pride Parade.

Okay. So you mean just a traffic issue? My parents lived right on Fifth Avenue, so it was hard to get around, even just walking, crossing the street to get to the theater. My family's not very punctual. You might not believe that.

So they were late and they missed the beginning of the movie. And Romley, at a young age trying to process things right announced i hate gay people for costing her the first 10 minutes of herbie fully loaded like a very serious like six or seven year old like i hate gay people and we had to sit her down and be like like I hate gay people and we had to sit her down and be like no no actually the director of the film is gay so you would not even have

this movie wow that's how you just sort of taught her like to bring it full circle that's how we taught her tolerance and Peter Farrelly has optioned the rights to make that into his next movie oh my god that's kind of a good story kind of that's one of the better stories you've ever told

because i saw her actually doing the math in her head right right i think they stopped me from seeing her be fully loaded but there wouldn't even be a her be fully loaded i can't i miss my movie i want to see winzie wohan uh yes and then and then we were like you know director of the film we we we got it we're we're done and at the end of the movie romley invites angela robinson over for dinner right and the whole family cheers on christmas eve uh green book um anything else in the box office bewitched oh wait Madagascar. I'm looking for bootlegs here. March of the Penguins. I did have Madagascar.

I did not. Rebound with Martin Lawrence. Yeah. Where he's like a basketball coach. Yeah. Yeah. Don't say no. I did have a bootleg,

but I love that movie. I love all Martin Lawrence movies. Yes. Longest Yard. Yes. Crash. Hmm. Hmm.

Me and you and everyone we know, that must have been bootleg. God. Monster in Law. We're individualized there. Oh boy. You know, I spent I just got back from like a

week in LA. You were in La. I was in La La Land. And here's the thing. I just had this thought. I was in the. You were in La. I was in La La Land. And here's the thing. I just had this thought. I was in the back of a Lyft and I thought to myself, you know, all the people in this city, they're in their little metal boxes

so separated. Sometimes it feels like they crashed into each other just to feel something. Good point. I made that joke to my girlfriend 12 times. Interesting. And she married me just so that something. Good point. I made that joke to my girlfriend 12 times. Interesting.

And she married me just so that she could divorce me. You had to go to Nevada? I kept setting it up earnestly like it was an actual realization I'd had. And I've now been divorced five times.

Congratulations. Thank you. On your five marriage. It is weird though that in LA it feels like the people are so distant and separate from each other that sometimes they have to crash into each other

just to feel fun. Ben, final thoughts? Final thoughts on this movie. I think that the fact that it sort of is setting up that the candy is growing like it's a tree that grows a candy tree that grows a granny apple

yeah that's cool alright good I mean this is a big like pep in a step movie and he's got the juice of Johnny Depp being an A-list movie star now because this is only the fourth time they've worked together. And then they do four more movies together.

You know? Yeah, I guess if you count Corpse Bride, it's four more. Right, because you go across the 90s, it's three. Yeah, no, I know, I know. And it's sporadic. Then they're all like. Then it's just right. He's in everything.

He's in everything. And then Dark Shadows is the last one. Right. Yeah. But this is the movie like you go like mars attacks underperforms big fish does okay plan of the apes makes a lot of money but everyone hates it right this is like his first sort of like okay he's like safely on third movie if not a total home run it's a big grosser one last thought um i don't usually like nerds but but I like nerds. The candy.

That's a great thought. I loved nerds when I was a kid. You know what nerds are? Sugar. That's it. But they're in little compartments. I know, but nothing like that. What's that candy?

What's the candy? Sugar? Pebbles? Just pellets of sugar? Right, right. We need something. Okay, there's two kinds and it's divided. Isn't that weird that Nestle dropped all the Wonka branding?

They still have the rights and they've just taken it away. I don't know. Maybe they're waiting for like an ideal moment to relaunch. Oh, well we should mention this. Warner Brothers is threatening to make another movie. Yes. They have a script I believe Simon Rich wrote that's a Wonka prequel about young Wonka and how he built the factory.

A movie that I think no one wants to see. I would rather see The Glass Elevator. 100%. Right. That book is crazy. Has aliens that look like turnips called Vermicious Nids. Has like the president in it and like the president's nurse is like the secret president. There's a lot going on in that one.

I think Paramount back in the day tried to make the sequel with Gene Wilder. Doll Estate wouldn't give it. And then Warner Brothers also also, they were like, we won't let you do that. You'd have to prove to us that you can make a good Charlie first. It's kind of surprising they never

made it. I'm guessing just Depp and Burton weren't interested and that they wouldn't do it without them. The Wonka prequel feels like a weird idea. They're saying they want Ryan Gosling or Don Glover to do it, which I'm sure everyone's saying they want Ryan Gosling or Don Glover to do anything. I'm sure everyone's saying they want Ryan Gosling or Don Glover to do anything

Ryan Gosling would be a bizarre choice he'd be very creepy Donald Glover sure I would love Donald I love the idea of Donald Glover

growing up to become Johnny Depp me too and explaining it exactly like being like we're gonna explain how I'm gonna turn

the movie should end with him coming out of surgery with like ghastly Johnny Depp prosthetics and he's like I'm ready for my factory. That would make the Michael Jackson thing work. I was going to say, Teddy Perkins, baby.

But there is one other adaptation of this material. Do you know this? That Warner Brothers has released another film based on this book. Is it like the Hero of Color City or something? No, Warner Brothers has released. And I think it was probably an Ashcan thing just to retain the rights. That's my guess. Uh,

Tom and Jerry go to Charlie and the chocolate factory, or it's like Tom and Jerry meet Willy Wonka and the chocolate factory. They made an 86 minute film. That is a direct remake of the Gene Wilder film. The designs of the kids, the costumes, the factory, exactly the same.

The cartoon character of Gene Wilder looks like him. This one's 79 minutes long, so two minutes longer than Stuart Little, too. It has all the songs in it. And the premise is that Tom and Jerry are fighting over a chocolate bar. Then Charlie saves them, and then they just follow him along into the factory. And then once they get into the factory, they meet a small Oompa Loompa mouse. Have you seen this film? I read the full Wikipedia entry last night.

It is nightmarish. It is so weird. Look up any clips of it. It's a fucking nightmare. I am all but certain they made this to retain rights. Because they've had this weird direct-to-video series of Tom and Jerry films in which Tom and Jerry don't fight with each other and they invade other IP. So they did like Tom and Jerry Wizard of Oz and Tom and Jerry Sherlock Holmes. And in all of them, they don't play the roles.

It's not like Muppet Treasure Island. It's like Tom and Jerry just happen to be the Rosencrantz and Guildenstern off to the side of some other literary work. This is literally just the Gene Wilder one. There's the Bubble Room. The exact same songs. Yeah. Okay. Except Slugworth is apparently like the third lead.

Slugworth has two songs in it. We have to be done. How long is this episode for? Two and a half hours. Jesus Christ. Two and a half hours, man. I didn't know we were going for that long. How could I know? We need to give you a big clock. Oh, shit. I gotta to get out of here. Thank you all for listening.

Please remember to rate, review, subscribe. Thanks as always to Andrew Guto for social media, Joe Bone and Pat Reynolds for our artwork, Lee Montgomery for our theme song. Go to blankies.reddit.com for some real nerdy shit. Go to T-Public for some real nerdy shirts. Go to the fucking patreon and subscribe to that you'll get more content like uh tommy lee jones rock in the house uh

pilot any final thoughts anything to plug no uh pilot rules uh follow pilot on uh everything uh follow all the pilots work uh thank you you for making David and I better friends. And as always, I just realized I have a job in five minutes. You're the one who moved the time. I know, because I thought we'd be done by now.