Blank Check with Griffin & David - College / Steamboat Bill, Jr. with John Hodgman

Episode Date: June 4, 2023

After his “blank check” for THE GENERAL bounced,  Buster Keaton found himself creatively and financially shackled. Thus, 1927’s COLLEGE lands on the lesser end of the quality spectrum (not to mention a very difficult watch with Buster putting on blackface for a scene - yikes). But, his follow-up STEAMBOAT BILL, JR. features some of the most memorable and dangerous stunts of Keaton’s career, and acts as a beautiful send-off to his period as a self-sufficient filmmaker. The wonderful John Hodgman joins us to chat about both films and his life-long love of Buster. Plus - as always with a Hodgman episode - we go down several delightful rabbit holes: Doctor Who, beans, Goofy’s “George Geef” period, large pants, and more! Guest Links:  Get Vacationland: True Stories from Painful Beaches now in Paperback Check out Up Here on Hulu  Watch Dicktown on Hulu Listen to the Judge John Hodgman Podcast This episode is sponsored by:  Double Fine PsychOdyssey (doublefine.com/check) Join our Patreon at patreon.com/blankcheck Follow us @blankcheckpod on Twitter and Instagram! Buy some real nerdy merch at shopblankcheckpod.myshopify.com or at teepublic.com/stores/blank-check

Your speech was ridiculous. Anyone prefers a podcast to a weak-kneed teacher's pet. It's true. If you change your mind about podcasts, then I'll change my mind about you. I forgot there was a second part. I remember the teacher's pet part. Yeah. You know what I like about these?

They're written out? Yeah, and also no one can say that I'm doing a bad impression. But it's probably not what Buster Keaton sounds like. That's not him. That's the girl. I know, but then the retort. That was all her. It's all her?

Yes, she's saying. She's offering the ultimatum. Right. When you change your mind about athletes, I'll change my mind about you. Hmm. Yeah, sure. She's putting the plot into motion. That's all her.

That's all her. No, Buster sounds like this. What? What are you talking about? That's what I think he sounds like, right? Yeah, well, well, he's putting the plot into motion. That's all her. That's all her. No, Buster sounds like this. What? What are you talking about? That's what I think he sounds like, right? Yeah, well, he's like this, kind of. Yeah, right. Yeah.

He's gravelly. He was gravelly. I mean, you know. He probably was less gravelly as a younger man. Yeah, but even still, I think he was always, he had a harsher voice than one would imagine. Have you seen, like, you know, What No Beer or whatever? Like the early talkies. May I come in? Yes.

May I come in? Yes. With Jimmy Durante. Yeah. I just discovered that for the first time in my life. That they like forced him into these movies. Forced him into a two-hander. Three of them. What? No Beer? I kind of like What No Beer. What No Beer is a great title.

It's an incredible title. It's an incredible title for a movie. It's an incredible title. It's three movies with Jimmy Durante that were big hits. Speak Easily, The Passionate Plumber, and What No Beer? What No Beer, though, is the best title. Do they figure it out? Like, do they get beer? Yeah.

It's a prohibition comedy in which they start manufacturing near beer. They do get beer at the end. I will tell you that beer becomes legal at the end of the movie. Yeah. And they start drinking beer and then Jimmy Durante holds a beer aloft to the camera and says,

it's your turn, folks. Cha-cha-cha. So basically saying to the audience like let's all drink you know this shit's over with yes of all the completely random duos that could be imagined it's like they had his prohibition literally end of the year came out two different bingo balls full of yes you know up and coming stars and declining stars yes incredibly jimmy duranty and buster keaton and just completely incompatible sensibilities. Yeah, absolutely.

There's something I find interesting about those movies because you're just like, well, this is just such a horrible comedy team, but the two of them are funny individually. But they just have not much chemistry together. None. Sure. He had, Jimmy Durante had the schnoz, right?

He would always talk about how big his schnoz was. The schnoz is very big. Right. The schnozola. Yeah. He was a talker. He was a. Yeah. He was a talker. He was a gabber. He was a talker.

And you know who wasn't? Buster Keaton. Wasn't much of an actor and he wasn't much of a physical comedian. He wasn't much of a sound actor. He was a great actor. Yes. You know, in his way, obviously. He's a great performer.

Yes. But right. Like, I don't know. He wasn't a very emotional actor. Right. No, he was a character. He was a great performer. He was a character.

Buster Keaton was a great actor and a terrible speaker. There's a... When I heard him speak... It's kind of bizarre. Yeah. It was not merely uncanny and unnerving. Yeah. Because his voice, to me, sounds like this weird, complaining honk.

Interesting. Yeah, there is something bizarre. There's a rasp to it. But there's something kind of sour to it. Interesting. Yeah, there is something bizarre. There's a rasp to it. But there's something kind of sour to it. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and, you know, when I see his face,

Yes. it's full of depth. Yes. And, like, I just think of, like, his voice should sound like the bottom of the ocean. It should sound like Mandy Patinkin singing. Yeah, for example.

Yes. It should sound like Mandy Patinkin singing. It should sound like Mandy Patinkin singing. Yeah, for example. Yes. You should sound like Mandy Patinkin singing. You should sound like Mandy Patinkin singing. Okay. I just didn't, the voice sounds, and this is nothing against, I mean, it was his voice. What could you do? Nothing. Do you know what I mean?

Yeah. But it sounded so pedestrian compared to the depth of emotion that would be conveyed by his face. Yes. Even in those talking pictures, and then in also the talking pictures. Yes. You know, it felt very awkward to me, because his timing still seems to be based on silent films. Yes.

So, like, he'll just sit there and react for a while, and then all of a sudden he'll open his mouth, like, five minutes later and say the line. Well, what's funny is, like no beer has like one incredible sequence, which is basically like a sequence he's reused a couple of times in his career. But there's a bit with him trying to fit into a voting booth with a large guy. Yeah. And it's just him having to share the space with this other guy. And it's a lot of fun,

but you're like, oh, right. It works when the movie splits him up from Durante and puts him in a situation where he doesn't have to talk at all. Despite Marriage, which we'll get to next week when he started with MGM where they were like, come on, these aren't silent anymore. He still was trying to thread this needle of like

can I do like Mr. Bean style comedies? Can I speak at an absolute minimum? Right. People around me can talk. There are sync sound in the movie. We can have sound effects. Right. But my character is not a talker by nature.

But yeah, that's it. It does. It does throw things off. A total genius. But he's not there for verbal repartee. Ha cha cha. No. And Ben made a good point,

which is, like, where you were sort of asking me, you were like, so he, like, did do patter. He, like, comes from Vaudeville. It's not like he didn't know how to sell a joke. He had those skills. He did it for many years,

like, since when he was a little kid. And when he does verbal comedy, you were like, he does understand where the joke is. He is a good performer. Yeah. But it breaks the persona. It's just one of the many humiliations He's a good performer. Yeah. But it breaks the persona. It's just one of the many

humiliations and tragedies Yes. that befell this incredible creator Yes. that he had circumstances were such that he had to speak

in order to make money. And leave the talk into us. That's if we've learned anything here. This is the place to talk on a podcast. Listen, this is Blank Check with Griffin and David. I'm Griffin. I'm David. That's right. They Bounce Baby. Yep. It's a miniseries on the films of Buster Keaton. It's called Podcast Junior.

Today we are talking about one of the two movies that gave this miniseries its title. Okay. Steamboat Bill Jr. Yes. And also talking about college. College! College! Right.

And these are his last two Buster Keaton Productions films. These are the last two films in the original sort of blank check run of Mr. Skank is foot in the bill and you can do anything you want. You have complete creative control and autonomy. No one can reign

you in. And how do you pronounce his name? Mr. Skank? We were corrected on this. I thought it was Schink. That's what I would have thought too but dana said it was skank right mr skank skank yeah i'm sorry motherfucker uh our guest today is himself one skanky motherfucker hello uh he's a dear friend of the podcast and of and of and of mine and of ours oh and of america's uh uh uh uh uh up up, streaming now on Hulu? I'm not available to promote any WGA-contracted productions.

Oh, can I promote? You certainly may. You can talk about whatever you're watching on streaming or television. Dicktown, also on Hulu still? This is a fact. This is a fact, yes. Vacationland is available on paperback? Vacationland is available in paperback? Vacationland is available in paperback.

And of course, a course hosted the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Judge John Hodgman podcast. Gentleman John. How do you do? We were trying to fill this last slot and then I went, wait a second. Why not Gentleman John?

He's a foppy weirdo. Let him come in with his diamond tiptipped cane. He's got radio voice. Anyone with radio voice probably likes Buster Keaton. Yes. Right? I do love Buster Keaton quite a bit. But I'm a fan of the old stuff. Yeah, because I'm very elderly, as we established when we came in.

Simpler times? Simpler times. Ben, you had a question for John. What's the question, Ben? I wanted to ask John just, you know what were steamboats like very smooth ride very smooth ride because very still waters yeah yeah yeah right what were the snacks on board uh snack situation mostly sarsaparilla okay and welsh rarebit welsh pickled eggs pickled eggs pickled eggs? Pickled eggs. All kinds of different pickles.

And then there would be a poker game. And if you got caught cheating, you'd be thrown into the rotors. You'd be thrown right in. So Sprutle is like a... It's kind of like a root beer, right? Like a root beer, yeah. I don't know if I've ever had it.

Is that something that gets sold these days? Surprisingly, there's no artisanal spot in Brooklyn making stars for real. You'd think there would be, right? But here's the thing. Unsurprisingly, you go to any comic convention of a certain size. I don't know if it's one company always, or there are a couple rival companies that all do this, that have like a booth that looks like an old-timey saloon,

and you can buy an old-timey mug and get sarsaparilla refills all day. What? What? Yes. But it's just root beer. Yeah. But it's just, okay. But it tastes like more.

Or like birch beer or whatever. Yeah. Birch beer or root beer? Let's go around the horn. Ben, birch beer or root beer? Hmm, that's tough. I'm going to go with birch beer. Wow.

Okay, go to David next because I should be last. I'm going root beer. I don't drink a lot of birch beer. That's tough. I'm going to go with birch beer. Wow. Okay, go to David next. I should be last. I'm going root beer. I don't drink a lot of birch beer, to be honest. That's a rare confection for me to be... But yeah, no, I like root beer. Root beer's great. And Griffin? Oh, who, me? Yeah. What's the question? Birch beer

or root beer? Neither. What? Both are trash. What is my opinion? I don't like either correct answer is birch beer but why do you dig down you don't care as birch beer absolutely it's spicier spicier but it's like at a certain point i was looking to be refreshed i don't drink a lot of soda i want to be slapped in the face tastes like wood slurry. I don't drink a lot of soda. I want to be slapped in the face. Yeah. See, both of those sodas feel like work to me.

What's that? Sprechers? Sprechers is good. Yeah. Very nice. They're all kinds of strong. What is this, suddenly a Fizzy Boys episode? Bring it back.

Fizzy Boys. Fizzy Boys. I apologize. Yeah. Let's move on. No, it's fine. Sarsaparilla. John, Sarsaparilla.

I feel like when I had Sarsaparilla at some ye olde comic convention sure that's as strange as buster keaton and jimmy duranty being paired together yeah it really is yeah oh yeah comic-con you're always gonna have an old-timey saloon i'm telling people are gonna say i know what he's talking about there's always a fucking booth that looks like a giant oak barrel i believe you because not to speak not to characterize Comic-Con attendees a certain way. Read them for filth. But they are the types who are kind of like, rather than drinking alcohol for recreational pleasure,

like many red-blooded Americans, instead they want to overpay for some kind of like fancy pants, non-alcoholic soda served by a guy in suspenders. Yes. They're going to be like, thank you, sir. And they're also wearing suspenders. They're also wearing in suspenders. Yes. They're going to be like, thank you, sir. And they're also wearing suspenders. They're also wearing fucking suspenders. I don't mean any, you know,

disrespect to suspenders wearers out there. It's suspenders all the way down. Yes. But John, I said, do you like Buster Keaton? And your response was, he is my favorite. He is my favorite.

I love Buster Keaton and your response was he is my favorite he is my favorite I love Buster Keaton and I I bonded very early with Buster Keaton because you were childhood friends uh we we yep we were on the vaudeville stage we're a bit for us to be doing that John Hodgman is 125 years old he said we bonded early on I know it's funny no it's funny. Do the joke. I'm just saying, like, it's funny that there's a motif of our episode. I grew up in a town called Brookline, Massachusetts. Heard of it. Where there is a movie theater called the Coolidge Corner. A lovely, wonderful theater. You always shout it out.

And I worked there for a number of years. I didn't know that I knew that. What'd you do? I did it all. I concessed. I ticket ripped. I took the money. I counted the money. Stole the money.

I didn't project. That's a union job. Yeah. And that, especially back then, that's quite a technical job. Yeah. Absolutely. That was Harry Friedman. Got it, Harry.

Yeah. And there's a number of other projectors. But no, I ran the Hokie Cat over the carpet. That's like a little carpet sweeper. Yeah, and there's a number of other projectors. But no, I ran the Hokie Cat over the carpet. That's like a little carpet sweeper. Yeah, I have one of those to this day. Ran the Hokie Cat over the carpet. Does sound a little naughty.

Well, that was my vaudeville show. Sure. When I come home and run the Hokie Cat over the carpet. When I run the Hokah cap over my back. Okay, so you did it all at the Coolidge Corner. I did it all at the Coolidge Corner, and it is still there on Harvard Street in Brookline, Massachusetts.

You should go. Back in the day, before I worked there, when I was but an affected, pretentious preteen, they had a lot of repertory arthouse movies. And they would do runs. I don't know if you understand the concept of filmographies. But they might show all of the movies of one director. All movies exist in a silo only to themselves.

And I guess they must have had all the Buster Keaton movies in the basement. Because they would do a Buster Keaton run, it felt like, every other month. Sure. Just show them all. Look, he's well-liked. People like Buster Keaton. Dust off, put them all up again. Especially what are we talking about?

What years are we talking? Are we talking the 90s, the 80s? When is this happening? It would have been probably 1928 or so. Who's seeing them first run? Buster retrospectives. The guy's fucking 32 years old. They finally hit Brookline.

No, I mean, this would have been the... So I would have been 11, 12, 13, so the early 80s. You were working in the theater at 11? No, no, no. I worked there later. Oh, okay, no. I worked there later. Oh, okay. Yes.

What happened in the Coolidge Corner? Yeah, no. But, you know, they would show lots and lots of old movies, and they showed a lot of Buster Keaton, and I would go and see them. You'd take the Green Line, I assume. I would take the Green Line. I would take the C train. C! The C! That's right. Just the Coolidge. I love subways everywhere. I understand. I love subways. Near and far. the green line i would take the the sea train yeah that's right that's right that's the coolage yeah

i love subways everywhere i understand i love something i understand you're in far yeah i was just like wait a minute is the new bit that you grew up in brooklyn no but yeah as you may or may not a lot of my family lives in boston gotcha spent a lot of time in boston including a a wonderful summer once where i went interned at the Boston Phoenix, but now fully departed. Much like the Village Voice. Yeah, absolutely. But back in the day. And that was my alt weekly, and I listened to WFNX, their radio station, which was their alt radio station.

Anyway. You're an early convert. Yeah. And so, you know, I would go and see everything there. And I loved Buster Keaton a lot. And what I remember at the time, so this probably was when I was like a fresh person in high school. I went to see it. And my memory is that Valerie Gintis' dad was the one who explained to me the sad trajectory of Buster Keaton. Sure.

He was on top and then, you know, the talkies came in. They put it all in context for me. It's like, you know, Buster Keaton was arguably, you know, as talented and famous, if not more talented, than some of the others. Yes. Charlie Chaplin, not my favorite. Charlie Chaplin has been bodied on almost every episode of this miniseries.

I like him. I do too. I am... I'm sorry, let me clarify. I don't want to... I'm a big fan of his personal life. I'm not crazy about the movies. I also like Charlie Chaplin.

I think there have been some listeners who've been a little like, excuse me, like Charlie Chaplin is a very important canonical director. Of course. Absolutely he is. He has never really been my guy. No, he's not.

No. No. Yes. I'm not surprised that this has been coming up over and over again. Obviously he is the great, you know, whatever. He's the great figure. He's the little tramp. Wait, what?

Yeah. Wait, he was playing that guy the whole time? Yes. No, because my favorite movie star, of course, is Little Tramp. Love that guy. That guy's great. Yeah, no, that's Charlie Chaplin. I thought he was just like Monsieur Verdue and like the great dictator.

That was it. He thought he was the stuffy guy that Little Tramp always fucked with. Charlie Chaplin, you know. I understand why he makes all these movies, casts himself in the most boring role. Yeah, exactly. By the time I was in high school, and readers of Vacationland, now available in paperback, will know this, was that I was a cardigan-wearing weirdo who was bringing a briefcase to school and was intent upon leaping over sexual adolescence. You were just going to barrel right to 55. Just going to skip it to become the gentleman bachelor that I was destined to be forever.

What was in the briefcase? Like your homework? My papers. Like your teacher was like, hey, do you have that paper? You're like, click. You know, like, yeah. Well, I think I have it here in this folio. Yeah.

No, I was a fan. I was a fan of office products. Hey. Sure. And that was what I used instead of a backpack. Instead of a backpack, I brought a briefcase to school It was a leather Soft leather satchel

And your fellow students They respected you for it I was liked by everyone I met I'll say this Brookline was a weird place You did alright I also had very long hair You posted a photo recently.

Yeah. And I wore a Doctor Who scarf. Yes. People didn't know how to get at me. You were too. Do you know what I mean? You were kind of fun at the zone. Like, it was just too much, too much.

Like, just leave him, just leave him alone. See, John, I have always thought about you. Doctor Who is also too niche to be made fun of for in America in the 70s. It's like, no one's going to be like, ah, in america in the 70s it's like no one's gonna be like ah you love that fucking nerd and what is he exactly is it a police box or a phone box i don't understand what is a police box sorry go on john i've always thought of you as a man of of honest eccentricities yeah they do not they do not strike me as it's's not affected. Yes, right. No one goes to school in a Doctor Who scarf as a bit.

When I was about 13, I decided I would sit down and read the plays of Athol Fugard, the South African dramatist, and that was an affectation. At that moment, I'm like, this is not fair. This is what I'm saying. You posted this photo recently, and I always just assumed when you would tell these stories about being an ostentatious teenager,

I'm like, he's being self-deprecating. He probably wore it as well as he wears it now. And then I looked at this photo and I was like, I know exactly who this kid was. Yeah, I think I had long hair in this. I don't remember. Who took that photo? You posted this on Instagram recently.

I want to say. No, I know, but someone else from high school posted it. Okay. Sure. From my high school. I don't remember anything about those photos. It was a year. No, I know, but someone else from high school posted it. Okay. Sure. From my high school. I don't remember anything about it. It's a yearbook photo, I think, or something. Yeah.

Yeah, but I'm wearing a skinny tie and a jacket. That probably was like a school dance outfit. Oh, yeah, look at you. You know, you have a bit of a Doctor Who about you. I was very Whovian. Tom Baker was my guy. Yeah. And he was cool, but, you know, in his way. He was cool

and definitely a gentleman bachelor. Sexless. That's the thing. The Doctor Who's were all sexless until they rebooted. But, you know, then they went to Peter Davison, the next one, who I knew from watching the original All Creatures Great and Small

with my mom and dad because I was an only child and that's all we would do is just sit around and eat dinner on our laps and watch public television. He's the same elsewhere. He's the one with the celery stalk. He had the celery stalk.

He was wearing a cricketing outfit. The celery stalk always struck me as like, we need to put something really silly on him because otherwise this guy's kind of just handsome and normal looking. Yeah, that's when I turned off Doctor Who because I was like, too sexy for me.

Right. But you should have just clung on and gotten to Sylvester McCoy or whatever. Yeah, no, I really lost a lot of Doctor Who. I was like, how drastic, grouchy toad is this guy? And BBC was like, enough! You're cut off! No more Doctor Who's!

So, yeah, no, I would wear a cardigan for an evening and go to the movie house, as it was called then, the Cold Corner Movie House. Sure, the pictures. And see these things.

And maybe it was John Wolfe's father, actually. I think it might have been. Maybe conflating the weird and wonderful dads that I got to know through my friends who talked about how Charlie Chaplin retained creative control.

Okay, yes. And Buster Keaton lost it and kind of lost everything as a result. And I had always heard the story was, what I remember for a long time was that he didn't retain ownership of his films. But it wasn't that. It was that he gave up.

Like, he stopped making films for himself and he started working for money. He signed a deal with MGM, but also, I mean, did we find this in JJ's research from one of the earlier episodes, that he never actually really owned serious stake in Buster Keaton Productions? No, because Skank was... It was a company that was founded for him by Skank.

He got Skanked. He got Skanked pretty hard. Real hard, because... Right, like Skank eventually signs a deal. Initially, they're being distributed by Metro, which is associated with MGM at a certain point. And then Skank signs a deal with UA, United Artists, and it's fledgling Charlie Chaplin, Mary Pickford, those guys.

Please don't mention that name again. Sorry, Charlie Chaplin. Little Tramp. Mary Pickford is fine. She's all right. Yeah, and who was the other one? Douglas Fairbanks. Yes.

And those are the last ones. These ones we're watching were all United Artists. Yes, and same with General Navigator? General Navigator College Steamboat Bill Jr.? Am I wrong about this? Are the four UA ones? I have to look it up.

Badling Butler was not General... Was, so yes, exactly. Right. And then real MGM like he's actually being signed like as a company player by MGM for the And it was a classic

No, we're not, we want you to do your thing. Come aboard! Come aboard! Yeah, we'll play it in the space! Yeah, and he makes I mean, we'll talk about this all next week, but he makes two more films kind of his way and one of them he's already starting to

get bent out of shape. And then they start going, we tell you what you do. You do Jimmy Durante movies. You do a film like this. You do a film like that. And that's when I think he really kind of wallowed into pressure. Whatever the case, John Wolfe's father

or Val Gintis' father framed it as a tragedy. And that was music that was a sad music to the ears. It's so, yeah. It's like, oh, this guy, you know, there was one guy who went straight to the top and this guy was

a flawed and failed, he was failed by others. Underdog. And that was immediately, it's like, oh, that I'll,

I'll, I'll watch him for the rest of my life. And that probably framed all of my intake of Charlie Chaplin, even at the Coolidge, because I was always like that guy won. Buster Keaton lost in this cosmology. And I did. I mean, I do find Charlie Chaplin to be a little bit mawkish and sentimental

whereas Buster Keaton is funnier and I think more deeply emotional and the other thing about Buster Keaton is that he could also play a foppish affected creep incredibly well and in all of his vulnerability which you see it's all over his face the the fact that they call him Stoneface is, I'm sure it's been discussed, it's a crime to say that.

Right. He's one of the best actors of the face of all time. Yes. Incredibly emotive. Totally, totally. vulnerability and the sweetness and the yearning that he can convey in that face he's equally good at conveying disdain condescension yes uh disgust at other people and those those that's all my wheelhouse yeah yes absolutely yearning and condescension both sides of the coin yeah i think also i mean i feel like the coin of the hodgman realm read some quote to this effect but

i think it also pissed him off that as his creative freedom was taken away and Chaplin remains top of the world, Chaplin's output slows down so much. That's the thing. Chaplin only makes a couple more movies. So there's like 20 years of his life where Chaplin's making three

films. And he's like, I'd be making four a year if they'd still let me. Because it's City Lights and Modern Romance that are the ones Chaplin is making in the 30s. Modern Times. Not Modern Romance. Modern Romance is one of the funniest movies of all time. No, those two where he's making them out of step with, he's making silent films for a talky generation. And they are, those are two great films.

And that's exactly what he would have loved to have kept doing. And they obviously made it a very high production scale. And then he does Great Dictator, obviously, which is... Great Dictator... And that's it. And then Months You Ever Do is like years later, and that's after he's fled the country. And then the Branda one.

And Keaton's in Limelight, isn't he? Keaton's in Limelight. Right. Yeah. But he's not in it enough, right? That's how you put it to me. It's like, you almost want it to be a two-hander, but that's not quite the vibe.

You do, and it's also a... I've never seen that. They're old comedy partners, and they reunite for a final performance at the end, and it's a good extended sequence, but it should be the greatest sequence of all time. Yeah. You can study it and go, like,

there are a lot of theories that Chaplin sort of knifed him. A little bit to the detriment of the movie itself. Yeah. Knifed him. Chaplin's a knifer. Yeah. The great Dan Stevens author of Cameraman now available in paperback was saying and I do think this is correct. The last

10-15 years of his life were a bit of an upswing. There's the great tragedy that he did not get to maintain what he was doing for the years of his life were a bit of an upswing. There's the great tragedy that he did not get to maintain what he was doing for the entirety of his career. But the MGM period is really where he's just like fucking depths of despair. But he is making successful films. And we'll talk about this. Many of them are hits.

Yeah, but it's not anything that he's known for and it's not anything that he's created. No, it's the creative authorship. When you see him next to Jimmy Durante, he does not seem like a happy person. No. What? No beer? Sorry.

I just love the idea of going to the picture window. Oh, absolutely. One for what? No beer? And they're like, huh? One for what? No beer? You got to hit the intonation.

Otherwise, at the Coolidge, we would never sell you a ticket unless you did the whole thing. You gotta hit the punctuation. I'm gonna pull it up here, but I feel like in college, there's a scene where he goes to his dorm room and there's a sign behind him that says, what? No beans. Yes, I saw that. I made a note of that. Right, and then I was trying to dig of, like, are both of these riffing on some

phrase of the time? It could be like a Burma shave, like some old piece of advertising or something like that. Was What No Beans a thing and is What No Beer riffing on that? Or both of them riffing on something else? Old college-y signifier, like a straw boater in a fur coat. Yes.

I don't know. What No Beans. Someone look it up. I should have done that. Had you seen both of these films before? Yes. Well, Steamboat Bill Jr. is my favorite. Okay. And I was very, very happy to get that one. Oh, I'm glad you nabbed it. Yeah. Well, Steamboat Bill Jr. is my favorite. Okay. And I was very, very happy to get that one. I'm glad you nabbed it. Yeah.

This has worked out well with our guests kind of getting their favorites. Yes. And College, I had not seen because I would remember having seen it.

I certainly had not seen College. Blah. I think College is the worst of his features. It's terrible. I do have it ranked as the worst buster I have watched thus far. It's got a couple of good things in it.

It's just weirdly formless for this late in his, like, having watched things like The General and The Navigator and fucking, you know, Sherlock Jr., obviously. I'm just sort of like, it's weird that this is just kind of back to very, very sketchy kind of. Well, in your episode with Dana, you talked about how Buster Keaton really prefigured a lot of cartoons. Yes. And as well, specifically Looney Tunes. And this, that, the extended sequence in college where he's trying out all the sports.

Yes. To me, felt like a dull looney tune like you know one of those things where it's like there's just a series of vignettes and each one has a gag built in and you know uh you know porky pig's gonna try all the sports look i'll say this right i made this comment in the day and episode and people were pushing back on it saying that Looney Tunes are more the descendants of Buster Keaton and the early Disney shorts are more the descendants of Charlie Chaplin

I don't know where people are pushing back I said I mean it's the kind of thing that will really start fights there were the goofy shorts of I feel like the 40s the 50s maybe the color shorts where it's goofy like trying out different sports that's maybe that's what i'm thinking of

because really because i laughed at looney tunes right and i didn't laugh at goofy they would kind of never do something this mundane yeah there was that point where goofy sort of becomes like he's your like bumbling kind of like suburban everyman right before they totally domesticated him to george geoff uh a subject conor aleph could talk to you about for hours i i am so historically and contemporarily sure disinterested in disney animation yeah of those characters sure you know what i mean that whole never saw Goofy. I never saw Mickey Mouse. I never saw any of those. That whole section feels like some real goofy shit,

but it also, it's just that moment where you go like, You're absolutely right, and I take back what I said because it is an aspersion against Looney Tunes, which are brilliant. Right. Bugs would be more radical if he were. You place him in the Olympics? I don't like Goofy. He's a kind of a goof. I don't like his vibe. He's weird. What's his deal? I just don't like goofy he's a kind of a goof i don't like his vibe he's weird

what's his deal i just don't like him what do you think of goofy i mean he seems like kind of a dumb ass i wasn't gonna say it i don't know that would be great that would be great if they introduced a new character called dumbass this is for the time, introducing a new character to its core lineup. Dumbass. In 60 years. Totally goofy, but worse. I like Donald Duck. That's it.

Donald Duck's very funny. That's the only one I like of those guys. Donald Duck's got a character. Donald Duck gets frustrated. Donald Duck, you know, is angry at the world. And I grew up with the Duckiverse as well. That was very hot when I was a kid. The Duck Books.

All these guys. I take it back. Of course, of course. Duck Tales. Yeah, Duck Tales. And I played Rocker Duck on Duck Tales, the reboot. The new one. Oh.

Which was an incredible experience. Who? I'm sorry to not know who that is. Rocker Duck? John Jacob. Oh, you're like Rockefeller? Yeah. Were you a rival then?

You're like Scrooge's rival? I just want to make sure I get the character's name right. Rocker Duck. Rocker Duck. Rocker Duck. Yeah, Rocker Duck. Donald's the one I like the most. John D. Rocker Duck.

I played John D. Rocker Duck, who was, yes, who was one of Uncle Scrooge's rivals. Yes, who was one of Uncle Scrooge's rivals. And I was the first person to ever do a voice for that character in the United States. That's exciting. He's never been a character in the books before. What's that? Was the only character in the books before? Yeah, and he disappeared in the American.

Okay. But in Italy and throughout Europe, in the Donald Duck comics, he's still a major foil for Uncle Scrooge McDuck in Italy and throughout Europe. In the Donald Duck comics, he's still a major foil for Uncle Scrooge McDuck in Italy and throughout Europe, but never over here. So that was very exciting for me. So I... That's great. I also take back my aspersions

against Disney. No, there's stuff I like there, but yes. Goofy's just like an asshole. Goofy, look. Goofy's a goof. He's a goof. Yeah, he says he's a goof,

but I think he might just suck. We should call him Sucky. Goofy's kind of like Madonna where every four years there'd be like a radical reinvention and some of them really suck I think they're funny periods of goofy but they'd be like forget it goofy's a different thing now

and then like I'm not what are the phases of goofy that I'm missing here there was truly this period where they were like his name's not goofy anymore his name is George Gief

and he's like fucking Ozzie and Harriet. Just like white picket fence dad. And what period would this have been? 50s? Oh, yeah. I'm seeing this. Sure. Like George Gief sucked. He kind of has like a bow tie and a suit. Right.

He's like a, you know. He's sort of a hapless 50s dad. He becomes like a Fred McMurray character. I obviously watched a Goofy movie when I was a kid. I owned it, I think. Incredibly good. Which I do remember being pretty good, but he is not, like, funny in it

because he's just like an exasperated single parent. Well, his son is like a skateboarder type. Yeah, he wants to be cool and be the rocker. I think what works well in that film is they take the character of Goofy as he exists in the public consciousness and use that as a projection of how embarrassed any teenage boy is of their father.

But then I think I just watched that movie and I was like, I too would be embarrassed of this fucking guy. It is skin-crawling. Right, exactly. It's hard to be cool when your dad is goofy. That's the tagline for a goofy movie. And I can't disagree.

That's pretty good. The opening of that movie, have you seen that film? A Goofy Movie? Yeah. No. The opening of that movie, the titles come up and they say, Walt Disney Pictures Presents. And then in very formal letters, it says, a movie. And you go, okay, I think I know what I'm watching here.

And then, John, you would not believe what happens next oh a big splat of goofy the word goofy splats onto it yeah probably in a different font right it would be cool if the movie was just called a movie i was excited yeah you were like oh and finally now look i think that what's happening here is we're talking around college because it's not that interesting. Listen, there was one thing that really made me laugh in college. And you will understand, given the entire, everything that you know about my biography now, you will know that I really loved him getting up there going, here's my talk, the curse of athletics. Oh, right, right. It opens with that, basically.

Yeah. So he's just graduating from high school and he walks through the rain with his mother. No one likes him. He's a mama's boy. His suit shrinks in the rain. His suit shrinks because he's sitting next to the radiator. Yes.

Because he's all wet from the rain. Oh, I didn't realize that's what happened. The buttons start popping. Yeah. Okay. And then he gets up because he is the valedictorian. Right. And everyone else in the school loves sports because all normal humans love sports so much.

And they give meaning and shape to humans' lives. Right. And they're more important than anything else. Except Buster Keaton gets up and says, I'm going to give a speech on the curse of athletics. And I'm like, I am here for this. I know. I was so all, I was like, why do speech on the curse of athletics. And I'm like, I am here for this. I know. I was so all, I was like, why do I have like no

positive memories of this one? This one's like blanked from my mind. This setup is so fucking good. And I'm like, we're drilling down to the core of the thing, right? That Buster Keaton does not understand the rules of masculinity in society. Right. Shit I could not relate

to harder. And he's doing the fucking smooth criminal lean oh the lean as he's so funny this first 10 minutes are good yeah they are good yeah and they set up such a good dynamic you have also the bit early where like he gets rained on right you know there's all that stuff. We were talking about the rain with the popping in the... Yeah, exactly. He's got some umbrella business. Some umbrella. But here's like the first beat where I start to go like, does this movie have his eye on the ball? Right. To use some sports analogy.

Sure, sure. Sports. Right. Wow. Athletic mind virus. Gotcha. He walks in with his mom, right? And his suit's shrinking.

You get it. This guy under the boot of life. Should have shrunk more. Should have shrunk more. Was it? See, that's my comic. We understand. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I just thought it was a bad suit. Yeah. It get it. This guy under the boot of life. Should have shrunk more. Should have shrunk more. See, Ben didn't even understand. Yeah, I just thought it was a bad suit. Yeah, it wasn't

clear that it shrunk. It was bad, but part of its badness is that it reacts that poorly to the conditions around him. If you're wearing a full woolen suit at that time, come on. But he walks in. His sweetheart, his beloved.

Right. Is. What is the name of this character? Mary. And she's played by Anne Cornwall. All right. Mary. It is my favorite thing about these movies.

And I think I think modern movies should bring back is not this one, but so many of them in the credits. The characters are just credited as a boy. His girl. His sweetheart. Yes. Her father. And he has a boy. His girl. His sweetheart. Yes. Her father. And he has a name.

He does. Yeah. Ronald. His name is Ronald. Ronald. Yes. Yes. But, uh.

Good nerd name. He walks in. She's being chatted up by this, his romantic rival, right? This creep. This sort of blue-blooded jock creep. Yeah. And she seems. Very handsome guy, though, I have to say.

Harold Goodwin. Took him seven years to graduate high school, though. This guy's a handsome guy though i have to say harold goodwin took him seven years to graduate high school this guy's a fucking fool yeah uh she seems disinterested by him yeah buster keaton walks in looking a fool in a shrunken suit and she's so excited to see him of course and you're like this is interesting okay she's like she sees his value right the nerds and he gets up and gives this you think i wasn't mr popular Mr. Popular in my fedora and my Doctor Who hat and my long hair? I was asked out on some dates after choir practice. Go on.

Keep it in your pants, man. I'm just saying. I'm not trying to revise history. I'm trying to tell it. He gets up. He starts giving this monologue. And then she just turns out on him. What a betrayal. I i agree i'm sorry can you

define what you liked about him previously and how that was a betrayal yeah how did this how did you not see the curse of athletic speech not coming so far this guy all of this seems in character with this guy as i've met him you just can't say stuff like that okay especially on campuses you can't you can't you can't say anything on campus but she immediately turns on him disgusted the line i i butchered in the opening where i mean the whole audience turns on him to be clear it's not just her no one is happy with his speech the in the in the world of the film but i get that right yeah but you're like why is she not sticking with what changed in her and then she just like, fuck off until you understand what's good about sports.

And here comes the second big betrayal. Yeah. He decides to be into sports. Yes. He goes back on his speech. All those old men on stage shook his hand. The modern version of this movie, and I just kept watching it going like expecting this to happen. And then I was like, oh, it's 1928.

They haven't developed this trope yet right the modern version of this movie when he gets to college he meets a nice girl who likes him for who he is and he spends the whole movie pining over this asshole lady who told him become a jock or get or go bust she's the red herring he's not gonna stick with that realize so the person who liked him for who he really was exactly right and it's like this character is weirdly both of them at the same time. She just changes her mind a lot.

But then, yes, you go like, oh, okay, this is kind of like fun structure for like a bunch of Buster shorts. Now he has to learn

every sport. And then once it actually starts, in practice, you're like, this is not that engaging. No. You just put him on a new field

and he just does some new silly things. And the things are not silly enough. They're not quite, the bits were just not robust enough for me to really be whatever. I mean, here's what I'm going to say. Yeah. Okay.

Obviously, Buster Keaton is legendary for physical comedy. Mm-hmm. Careful. Kid could take a fall. We're not a college campus, but you might get canceled for what you're about to say. I mean, you're saying some wild stuff so far, but okay. Go on.

Right? Yeah. But to me, that is the broad physical comedy, even though he was incredibly capable of it. Yes. That's the least of the appeal. The behavioral stuff. It's the gentle lean on the stage, you know, where it's very controlled body movement. It's the funniest thing.

Yes. Whereas running time and time again to try to jump over a high jump and just not making the jump. Right. it's stupid right that's the problem i think this setup just becomes like he'll get more laughs with a side eye yes from me and humanity yes then trying to do a pole vault not making the comedy ends that he's bad at this yeah right there's no there's no story like no story or emotion that is justifying any of this other than we established a premise,

which is this guy can't play sports, but he feels like he has to. Right. Like, I think the soda shop sequence is a bit of an uptick. Of course. It's the only other good scene in the film. It's so much more controlled

because, I mean, here's this other part of the film is he does not come from on it. And I'm a big fan of Flair soda jerking. Well, who isn't? Yeah, I mean, a bit of business before I get my sarsaparilla? Yeah. Sure.

I almost thought the fucking senior soda jerk was Humphrey Bogart. When he came on screen, I thought it was him. I know what you mean. I know what you mean. I know what you mean. And also, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Before Bogart becomes Bogart,

he played all these sort of like blue-blooded country club assholes. But he wasn't an adult. I know. This guy looks already like he's in his 30s or whatever. I'm saying at first glance, I was like, is this 22-year-old Bogart?

I will also say, if I'm a Buster fan at the time, and fucking like seven years into his career as a feature maker basically he's like I'm going to college. I would have been like Buster. This is the biggest thing. You're too old for college.

He looks first of all ancient in this film. Yes. He's only 32 but he looks like an old man. Talk about city miles. Also this kid's jacked. This kid's in incredible physical condition. That's the other reason you can't believe it. He's not jacked.

He's not huge. He's got a swimmer's body. He's sinewy. He's obviously very capable. He's probably the most gifted physical human being on that field. Yeah, he probably would be good at athletics. That's true. Well, he's small.

He's slight. He loved baseball. This is the thing that we're talking about. All he did in his downtime was play baseball. Yeah. And I can't remember if it was this movie or Steamboat Bill Jr., but one of them got delayed.

The production got delayed because he was playing baseball like the day before they were supposed to start filming. He broke his nose or something. Yeah. He loved baseball, and his friends were were like he could have been a professional baseball player wow he's too short they have a whole spot for that kind of person on the baseball sure sure sure of course yeah the short stop yeah it's david i know the stops yeah on the baseball

pitch or whatever they have a shortstop area. Yeah. I was in the second basement. I don't know how much... I was in the third basement. That's a very tough position. Yeah, I sat in the stands with the mothers. With the mothers. I did. We caught up on a lot of things.

No, no, I know. There was always that boy. I had a friend, George, in elementary school, and he was that kid who would just hang with the moms, you know? Not even Netflix, just in the playground, just generally. I was very interested in what money they had seen.

I'd make them describe the plots of R-rated films. We're all out here picking our, you know, which Power Ranger we all are in George's, yeah, catching up with the moms. Yeah. But you were saying Soderjerk. Soderjerk. No, that sequence is so good because it's more the um uh buster is best is so good at setting up multiple points of tension and stakes right of ways he can fail and how he can overcome it and all of this and what we're talking about is like these sequences where it's just like,

uh, here he is, uh, track and field. He's going to do it wrong. And the stakes are, he's trying to get good at this. Right. But it doesn't really feel like there's more surrounding.

Right. Right. Uh, and, and I, I don't think much of this woman who's so quick to discard him, where I don't care that much about him impressing her. Damn.

But like, even just the soda jerk sequence, there is it's a job. He's got a boss now who's tisking, right? He's got to do this right. He doesn't want them to know he's working a job because everyone else in this film comes for money. He does not. He has to work his way through college. So he has to also hide when people

he knows come into the soda shop. But even just there's this there's a nuance to uh he's watching this flare soda jerk yeah he wants to be like him yeah but he knows he doesn't have that ability and so he's trying to find the smallest scale tricks he can do yeah it's funny it's funny trying to think about it and work through it um of course the other job he gets is the worst part of this movie right and what i think is so often like you know most of this movie's reputation is like this is the only film in which buster does blackface yes and which he himself wears blackface there's some minor incidents of people wearing blackface in

other movies right supporting roles um but in. And Navigator has the end sequence that's not good. But in the other films, they're pretty short sequences, and they do not, most of the time, feel very racially pointed. You have the Sojourner sequence, which is fun, and you're like, well, this is a fun

track of he needs to keep finding jobs and working jobs. I'm a little more into this than the athletics. And then the second time they cut, and that sequence has this beautiful full circle thing where he at the end just takes the help wanted sign and puts it up himself and walks out, right? And then like

ten minutes later, the movie just like irises in on sign, wanted colored waiter and you just go like, Jesus fucking Christ. You're just sort of like biting your tongue for the next 10 minutes waiting for this thing uh to end um so then when it goes back to the sports from there it's a little bit of a respite but i think i think we're talking around here uh in terms of the context of this movie and like why is he doing a college comedy at 32 right why does this feel so much less

sort of like formally intelligent than the movies leading up to this is that the general was his big fucking blink check movie yeah and it bounces right it hadn't worked yes uh he had to downside the other thing and i'm cracking up the dossier here is that college movies were hot this is because college was hot it was like the safest we were going to college all of a sudden. It was the safest comedy genre he could have done. Subgenre is college comedy. You got, of course, Harold Lloyd's The Freshman. That's sort of the most famous college movie. Which outgrossed

all of Buster films by many multiples. Was so far and away the biggest of that era. The Campus Flirt, I believe that came up on a box office game. Yeah. Brown of Harvard. The campus flirt. I believe that came up on a box office game. Brown of Harvard. The quarterback. These are hot college comedies.

Young Hodgman at Yale. Right. Do you still have a scarf? Of course I do. They let me keep it. I am timeless. I am ageless. I did start a silent comedy in the late 20s. You talk about him looking ancient in this movie.

I was 35. I think more than anything, it's the same thing that you find in the later MGM movies of just, he looks defeated. Yeah. There was this energy to him of him being like, I guess I have to do this. Right. You know, and even though he's still doing silent comedy in that. He put as much heart and thought into the making of this film as he did to titling it. Yes. College.

We'll call it college. I guess this is what they want. Right. And then, like, this movie is a big hit. Right. In a way that's kind of depressing, where it's just like, he just said, like, here, please, you just want this out of me? Yeah. Buster goes to college, and everyone's like, yes, that's exactly what we want.

Buster goes to college. Some context here. yes, that's exactly what we want. Buster goes to college. Some context here. A lot of his writers, his guys, had moved on. Clyde Bruckman, who I believe is specifically, the character in The X-Files is specifically an homage to that guy. The name. Remember? Clyde Bruckman from The X-Files? Peter Boyle?

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And a lot of the other guys had too, so he brings on two writers who he hated in classic Buster style, froze them out, basically wrote this whole movie himself. Right. And also Harry Brand, who is Buster's publicist, was also brought in as a writer. And that made their relationship very tense.

These are all basically, this is all sort of to say like the foundation of Buster's whole operation is sort of going away. Like this guy, lots of people have their hands in. Yeah. And like his classic writers have all moved on because they've experienced success at this point.

He's fucking up his relationship with his publicist. You know, it's all getting a little grim. Yes. And James Horn, James W. Horn, who they hire as the director, to sit in the chair, like, quote-unquote, director. Absolutely useless to me, Buster says.

This is the most dismissive he is of any of the people who co-directed his pictures. Harold Goodwin, who plays handsome Buster's Rival Jeff Also said that Jimmy Horn sucked And didn't do anything

On set And again This is not a well directed film Compared to No it just yeah right Because it doesn't have the sort of flow Of his best films The shots have no real imagination.

It just all feels very obligatory and sad. I kind of like the sequence. I mean, it's got stuff. It's got some stuff.

I kind of like the sort of hip-hip-hooray sequence where they're throwing him up and it looks like he's a peepin' Tom through the window. And then he starts

using the umbrella to try to explain himself. And they slow the film down because the umbrella works just like a parachute. That's got a little bit of the filmmaking ingenuity of him actually having problems. Hundreds of children died trying to emulate that. Yes.

By the way, that's a little thing I got in my dossier. It's nice to see Snits again. I was going to say. It's always nice to see Snits. This man, Snits Edwards. The Dean here. Who is the Dean here. Oh, yeah.

He plays the lawyer in Seven Chances. Yep. And what's the other? Battling Butler is the other one he's in? He is in Battling Butler as his manager or whatever. He's become our MVP of the Buster Repertory Company. He's just got a lot of face. He's got a lot of face.

He's got an incredible face. And you introduced him as dean edwards uh of course former snl cast member dean edwards uh yes dean edwards right at this point i'm sort of hooting and hollering of like oh great we got we got snits in a prime position and i think there's a little juice when he re-enters there's the scene where i mean his dynamic is more fun where he comes in and he's like this place is fucking lousy with athletes. I want this to be a place of academia, of thought. And he thinks

Buster or Ronald is going to come in and make this a slightly more intellectual school. He's against the athletic mind virus. And so he's disappointed that Ronald only wants to do the athletics. And then there's the scene where he finally calls him in kind of Rushmore style and goes,

why are you failing out of every class? And he's like, because I'm signed up for every fucking team. And Snits relates to him. He has this line about like, I understood. I want to be a selective bachelor and it's why I'm still single today. Right, because I was stubborn. Stubborn, right.

Yeah, I was too stubborn, I guess, to choose a bride. I found that whole, I mean, he understands that Buster Keaton is heartsick, and that's why he's doing this. And he's like, I want to set him up for success. I'm going to rig the row team, the rowing team. He's going to become a cockswain. He's small.

He makes sense to me. Yes. Cockswain. Cockswain. Right, Ben? That's okay. Yeah. So you have this final sort of like.

Dumbass cockswain, right, Ben? D dumbass cockswing right ben dumbass cockswing what does he what does he do even just this row just this row and apparently steers the boat no the cockswing you know they they motivate and they know construction they hold the stopwatch uh no they have to wear it oh they wear i think these days also there's better what's your question? Gotta have a megaphone attached to your head, you fucking dumbass cockswain. He gets the name wrong. Don't even get their own seat.

When he shows up to the team, he says, I'm a... It's not, I'm a coaxial or something like that. That would be a little... Let me try and find it. Anachronistic. Yeah. It would be anachronistic if he said, I'm to remember what the work word is yeah it's when he tries to identify himself to the right but they of course they try to give him a sleeping potion and knock

him out to embarrass him the the coach roofies him roofies him right but acts but the teacups get switched and like this is right when jeff is also like basically holding her hostage like you're just fucking we're cutting between these two things that are happening right he gets he gets expelled right jeff jeff gets expelled he shows up to her dorm room which is uh uh no men allowed. Off limits to men. Very uncool in the 1920s to be showing up in a dorm, a women's dorm. It's cool to just show up in the first place. But beyond that, he shows up, locks the door behind him. Yeah.

Goes, I have been expelled and I refuse to leave this room until you also drop out of college. Right. He's like holding her hostage. Or they discover us and she will be expelled. Right. If he is seen there. Right. You're going down with me.

Yes. Yes. This is the most convoluted cover-up for what is obviously supposed to be sexual assault. But it's also, yes, a scene that is, like, upsetting. It's very upsetting. Like, the energy of it is just, like, counteracting the comedy of the movie as we're cross-cutting to, like, sleeping man. Right. Yeah. And at no point

is he aware, is Ronald aware that this is happening. Ronald calls himself the coaxer. I found it. I think that's kind of funny. I was trying to find it.

The coaxer. It's kind of funny, but you know what? Oh, Axel's better. I was hoping for more. Yeah. I was hoping for more. Sorry, you were saying?

The whole sequence is between this boat race that Ronald has to win. Yeah. Or else... Rowing will be done at Clayton or whatever. That's right. The end of the rowing program.

The school's pride is on the line. And they're in like Old Iron Bottom or something. You know, they're in this funny sounding boat. Right. Their hope is that he would pass out so that they could use the actual cockswain, but instead, because the other guys pass out, he has to do it.

Right, because they do a switch of the... There's a switch of the teeth. One of the teeth is spiked. Right. They have cups of tea. And it's a switch that is so unimaginative. It's basically like... I think Buster Keaton accidentally dips his cookie

in the other person's teeth, and then he's like, I guess I better switch these. Yes. It's completely... He just looks the wrong way. Like, of all of the ways you're going to do a tea switcheroo

in a comedy, this was the least. But all of this feels like it has this energy of like, is this what you want? Right. This almost vague contempt for the audience. Absolutely. I felt really contempt. I just spent fucking like a year trying to get every Civil War

uniform stitch perfect. Right. I gave spent fucking like a year trying to get like every Civil War uniform stitch perfect. Right. I gave you the most like technically impressive extended chase movie imaginable. You just want me like. I drove a train off a bridge as it burned. Yes. Yes. You want me to just be a dumbass cockswing?

But he just, yeah, he fucks up the rowing and they still win even though... Right, well, the point is that I was going to say that I was thinking about is like there's this race that he's got to win, right? And he's got to win it

in order to win because I guess that's what sports is. You do have to win the race. Right. But he has no idea that the object of his affection is being held against her will

in a dorm room till long after the race is over. Right. This of his affection is being held against her will in a dorm room. Yeah. Till long after the race is over. Right. This race is ostensibly to impress her. Now, in another version of the movie, like, you know, where, as you were describing, where Mary is two characters, one who's a jerk and one who's nice or whatever. Yes. And the nice one's being held hostage.

Wouldn't it be more compelling if he knows that she's being held hostage or that she's in trouble and he's got to finish the race in order to get to her? He does eventually. I mean, that's not a very good punch up. But instead, they break that into two different things. He wins the race. She's being held hostage simultaneously. Then she gets a phone call to him. She calls him.

Right. And then, and this is. One of the easiest things in the world. Yeah. In 1927. To know where someone was. Was getting someone on the phone. Immediate,

wherever they might be. I happen to have memorized the number over at the boathouse. And I hid this phone underneath my dolly. Well, there are only five numbers in town. She probably spoke to the operator and said, can you connect me to the boathouse? Yeah.

That's how it should be. We need to go back to that. There's just like a bunch of phones and there's one lady. Whoever's closest. Yeah, you're just like, hey, can I talk to the library? Yeah, there's one phone there. Yeah, you can talk to... Back to that. I'd also like to meet a nice switchboard operator. You should run for governor.

That feels like a... I should run for governor? No, he's saying my less phones policy. David's platform is fewer phones, more trains. Sounds great. I think, you know what? I think you could be a big third party. Nobody likes their phone right now.

Trains are great. Very lovable. People are terrified. These insane liberal politicians, they want to come to my house and take my gun out of my hand throw it away right and that's their biggest fear yeah i would vote for anyone who said if you elect me i will come to your door and take your phone out of your phone out of your hand you have my unwavering smash it in front of how much am i legally allowed

to donate to your campaign three thousand dollars,000. I will break your phone in front of you. But you have to write a paper check and mail it to me. I would do that. You have to put a stamp on it. No, I wouldn't say it's funny, but this last sequence is a little bit... Like a pole vault. Exciting, where he finds out that she's being held hostage. And suddenly

he can do all of the things that he couldn't do before. It's just a little bit nice of like, you've set up the whole movie, now everything comes back into play. It is at least a more impressive display of his ability as a physical actor. Yeah, of course. Okay, but then. No, you go ahead. Well, I'm going to say something about the last thing in the movie.

So if you have anything before then. No, I don't have any. Oh, I did want to say that the original, the rowing skull that they're in is like old rock bottom or iron bottom. Old iron bottom. Because he jumps into the other one, which was actually an incredible shot of him jumping off the dock directly into that very narrow rowing boat. Yes. And then drops through the bottom of the boat. But that original boat was called the Damofino. Yeah. Which is the name of the boat ining boat. And then drops through the bottom of the boat. But that original boat was called the Damofino. Yeah.

Which is the name of the boat in the boat. That's all. That was just a thing that I noticed. It's a big, Damofino is a big running buster sort of. The Damofino Society is, I think, the name of the preeminent Buster Keaton fan club in America these days. Yeah.

How I didn't get that printed out Membership card into my leather Satchel back in high school I'll never know No he rescues her She's like great I'll marry you Cut to them With kids cut to them old Cut to their gravestones

The end Kind of just felt like Buster didn't quite have an ending He was like I don't know it's kind of funny Just their gravestone. The end. Kind of just felt like Buster didn't quite have an ending. He was like, I don't know. It's kind of funny. Just their gravestone. It's bizarre. It's kind of interesting. Now, what would be cool is if he actually predicted the future, right? Like if we cut to like them

old, like watching JFK's assassination and like, Jesus, God, this country is really going to hell. Slow down and really go five years at a time and really call everything. Yeah, the reverse of the opening of Up. Right, yeah, yeah. Like them in the 70s being like,

this country is a shithole. You know, like they've gotten really conservative in their old age. Complaining about Charlie Chaplin's later films being maudlin. Yeah. It's actually set at Kent State and they're rooting for the National Guard

Another college film Sherlock Junior Has The joke where he sees in the movie Like they have babies and he's like what And Three Ages has the joke where at the end It's seeing how the three relationships End and it's like

They have a million kids They have five kids they have a million kids, they have five kids, they have a dog. Yes. He likes the ending that is do they end up with some... It's just really on the nose of like that's what happens when you get married. I'm like, yeah, I get the idea that they're going to have kids and grow old together. And they die. You don't have to show it to me.

And none of the sequences are particularly them living in happiness. They just happen to be in the same sequences. I kind of liked it. They're like five seconds long. It's five seconds. Just fading. Right. No.

It was appropriately grim. Where are you going with this? And it's like, oh, into the ground? Yeah, right. The end. Just straight into the ground? Yeah, it's his worst feature. I do think it's the, yes.

If it had been a short, it would have been more forgivable, but probably not. Absolutely. It's also the one movie that like uh from top to bottom feels of its time um let me give you just a little more context in a negative way yeah what no beans um so there's this whole thing where as i said he has um you know harry brand which is like Buster and Skink's Publicity guy And you know why don't you have him write

And so then Brand apparently insisted on a credit It doesn't tell Buster about it Buster sees the movie Projected to an audience for the first time And it says Written by blah directed by blah A separate title supervised by Harry Brand Okay And Buster basically is like written by blah directed by blah a separate title supervised by harry brand okay and buster

basically is like they put this in the prints after i okayed them you know what i mean like they fucked me on this gank did it yeah and the prints were out there was nothing he could do like there was like they'd already been distributed around the country and he uh was so mad about it. So again, a lot of bad feelings, you know, festering. In terms of this movie's production, there's less fun stuff because he's not doing crazy stunts in the same way as the general or whatever.

He's not breaking his neck. Most of the history of this movie is just he needed a safe hit again. He needed to make a smaller, simpler movie that was giving what he thought the public wanted. I've been digging into the taglines. Ben just sent me, no beans on Urban Dictionary. When you have

a lack of beans, hey bro, you got some beans, sorry, no beans. No, sorry, no beans. Okay, so that's apparently the Urban Dictionary definition. Literally, you want beans and someone doesn't have them. You're like, what? No beans? That was submitted by Lean With It on July 10th, 2017. Now, here's what's interesting. literally it's you want beans and someone doesn't have them you're like what no no beans that was submitted by lean with it on july 10th 2017 now here's what's interesting also submitted under

no beans by caroline yixi on april 17 2018 a year later is no beans when you have so many beans well that's that's confusing can you give me an example? Yeah, here's an example. Bro, I have no beans. Just so everyone understands, Griffin just pulled out 500 cans of beans out of his leather satchel. No, here's the best one in Urban Dictionary. Not me with beans. Just beans. That feel when you have beans.

10 comedy points to both of you. This entry is just beans. Just beans. That feel when you have beans. Send comedy points to both of you. This entry is just beans. Okay. And in definition, it says beans. I'm going to cut this right off. David, this was going to pay out so big. All right, fine. Go ahead.

Well, now I need to reset it. Yeah, reset it. How far back should we go back? The Urban Dictionary entry is beans. Sure. Okay. The definition is beans. Okay. And the sample sentence is beans wow he made me reset for that that was funny you got laughs in the room uh i

did a search for what no beans fast x i gotta search how can you tell me that was bad people were laughing i left the room i did a search for What No Beans, and I got something from search.proquest and an academic article called What No Beans? Images of Women and Sexuality in Burlesque Comedy. So there might be something in there. It's like a sex joke.

But the only other hit that I got was someone's blog about this movie yeah no one has ever i don't figure out what the heck what interesting look i mean there's a twitter account called good bean jokes that apparently you know has some great bean jokes if you want to find that i've been googling around as well but no i don't have anything more for you okay look a couple things a couple things college not very well reviewed. Did do financially successful. It was a hit. But not a hit on the level of, say, the freshman or whatever.

Sure. You know, it did good. Yeah. I wanted to shout out Madam Solte Juan. If you remember when... I was going to mention Madam Solte Juan. When Buster is in blackface, he's with a black actress who is playing a cook. In the kitchen.

In the kitchen, which obviously just makes the whole fucking blackface thing all the stranger, as it always does whenever you watch any old movie that has blackface in it, where there are also black performers. And she is saying things to him and there is an interaction going on that is mysterious because you can't get to him.

She was the first African-American actress to sign a film contract and be a feature performer she um was in movies for 50 years uh she's in the birth of a nation she's in intolerance uh she's in the black filmmaker hall of fame um she's just interesting if you look her up she that's a stage name she gave herself it was not actually she was not born madam no her name is nelly crawford she gave herself that name, I think, based on... It's a character she had played in an old movie.

And it meant that she could play any ethnicity, essentially. Because she had this... Any non-white other character. She was putting... This exotic, quote-unquote, name. Yeah. Anyway, just interesting. I found her life to be very interesting, too.

Yes, you can read about her. May I say? Yes. You know, I've been looking up what the taglines were for these movies to see if I could use them in the openings, and they rarely work, but I want to read the three for these ones, for this film college, because I think they're good. You'll graduate with a perpetual smile is one tagline.

Second tagline. Sounds like a curse. It's silent. Technically it should be, you will be graduated with a... Anyway, I'm just saying. Could have used a copy editor. Yale. It's silent, but Buster Keaton makes college a scream.

I mean, sure. I think this is the best tagline for the movie. Well, the other two were bad, so. And this is the best one. Hey! Hey! Hey! That's it? Just two hey's with exclamation points.

That's actually pretty good. Hey, hey. Or it could be like a crusty thing, like, hey, hey. It could be. Look, it's in the eye of the beholder. Let's play the box office game. Okay. We're talking August 1927, baby.

Number one at the box office. This film is opening at number seven. Okay. Not nothing. Number seven. To 1927, baby. Number one at the box office. This film is opening at number seven. Okay. Not nothing. Number seven. To $54,000. But number one at the box office. Oh, it's a comedy directed by William Craft.

Oh, boy. I have no thought information about this movie. It's called what? Some beer? I can tell you that uh i don't know anything it's called it stars glenn tyron and patsy ruth miller and it's called painting the town painting the town painting the town hey hey what do you think of that hey hey no uh you know it's not a doesn't that's not the tagline all right right, number two. Okay. The drama. Starring the legendary John Gilbert,

who's come off on many of these box office games. Yeah, was kind of the king of the box office at the time. You've also got a very... Is it called The Drapes of London? It's not called The Drapes of London, a very specific guess. Is it called London's Drapes? No, it's not called that either.

It's called... Is it called Hey, No London? The Drapery in London Town. No, it's John Gilbert and a it's called is it called hey in london town no it's that no it's john gilbert and a very young joan crawford interesting in a silent drama uh about a bootlegger who um gets a society girl involved in his activities and they fall in love the movie is called whiskey town 12 miles 12 Miles Out Jack Conway film Number 3 at the box office

It's a comedy Is it called Dumbass Coxwayne That's not what it's called It's directed by Richard Wallace This one's boring You guys can say some more funny names Stars Jack Mulhall

Charles Murray Wow who looks like a real Real fun guy Looks like a priest who's mad at me I think it's called a glass for my best gal It's called It's got a pretty good name The poor nut

The porn nut The poor nut you know like that the porn the poor nut i have nothing for you on this movie there's no plot description all right number four is a king vidor epic from two years ago wow it has been in the box office for a hundred weeks starring john gilbert i think we actually have had this on a previous box office game Is it the original Ten Commandments? No It's a war film, a World War I film

Starring John Gilbert And you probably don't remember the title Because it's kind of a boring title It's from director King Vidor It's name is The Big Parade Remember we had this one before What country is he ruler of? Why does he have to be the ruler well he's king

he was the king of the box office king vidor was the king of cinema of course what was king vidor's actual name there's no name there's no way his name was king right good joke ben five comedy points whoa his name was king really good for him yeah you have a baby and you're like... My friend Amy Fusselman, who is a novelist, she has a book out right now called The Means. Her first son is named King. Really? Yeah.

That's a big swing. How's it spelled? How's it spelled? K-O-N-G. M-A-T-T. Steamboat Bill Jr. Your favorite Yes, just the final film of the box office Griffin is a Young Hodgman at Yale Is a historical drama starring Dorothy Gish

And its name is Madame Pompadour Okay Sorry, sorry if that doesn't satisfy you No, no, I heard of that film Yeah? I mean, it rings a bell Sure Sure I think it's a real person No one forgets Madame Bombadour Wife or mistress of Louis

Maybe that's what I remember Alright Steve Bob Bill Jr He goes out Ends his Buster Keaton productions run On a high note A movie that feels like he's putting it all back in He is going for a more than this one.

And he is... Right. He's putting himself in risk again, it feels like, physically. Well, yeah. Yes. Yeah. Look, this film contains Buster Keaton's most iconic gag ever,

which is the house, the side of the house falling and him somehow perfectly landing in the window. The window lands over him. Unaffected, undamaged. Well, and it's not just that. He runs to his mark and then it falls. Yes.

So it's not like he's preset there. Right. And this incredible, he's not looking, he's not glancing, he looks oblivious. And yet if he were an inch off his mark, he would die. He would be crushed instantly and you're watching a big white master. And what I heard is that they took 35 takes. And he died the first day before.

Yeah, right. An early fan of cloning. It kept clipping him. Yes. Yeah, right. He prestiged this one. There is this, by all accounts,

kind of apocryphal sort of narrative that I think was, uh, pushed along a lot by Buster's, uh, ex-wife, uh, that he was.

You mean his, his, his widow? The woman that he ended his life with? The younger woman that he married who became. I think this is, uh, what's her name?

Norma Talmadge. Talmadge. His, his ex-wife at that moment who he had to, uh, was an acrimonious. Acrimonious long-term divorce. So she wasn't saying nice things about him.

She was saying bad things about him. And there are a lot of quotes attributed to her that have perpetuated the narrative that he was so depressed at this point in his life that part of this whole, the end of this film, that stunt, all of that, people saying, hey, do you realize the margin for error is really, really narrow

on this? If you're off by an inch, you die. Was him being like, then I die. That there was this belief that has now existed that he was borderline suicidal making this film, which I don't think is true. Interesting. Like that he's almost trying, he's like, well,

if this gag happens, what a way to go. If this gag had happened. Tom Cruise shooting himself into space vibe. Right's like, well, if this gag happens, what a way to go. If this gag happens. Tom Cruise shooting himself into space vibe. Right. Right. Yeah. Right.

That has become a lot of this movie's legacy. Weird. If the wall fall gag had happened in college, I would believe you. Yeah. Because he looks genuinely suicidal throughout that film. Right. But in this film, he seems at the top of his game. And the film is full of...

I don't even know how to put it. I don't want to say full of life. It's a cliche, but it's alive. This movie is so alive. It's alive, and there's this... And so creative, and so human, and so funny. There's a real emotional... It doesn't feel like it.

...pour to it as well. I mean, he's playing a real character. Yes. What a character, though. Right. What a crazy character mean he's playing a real character yes what a character though right what a crazy what this guy's a real cut up i'll tell you with that with the beret and the ukulele mustache and the incredibly wide pants yeah this guy i mean no what are you gonna say there no i was gonna talk about i have i was gonna interrupt this bit just talk about his suicidal you know sure he was an alcoholic obviously which is a recurring problem for him especially or later you know this is around the really starting to rear its head yeah he had this

disastrous marriage that was costing him money and obviously just causing him anguish in general there's things that would have been weighing on him. And his movies are doing less well, obviously. And he sees this is probably the end of the road of this era of my career. I have to make a move after this. He goes to MGM right after this. So it's easy enough to sort of then extrapolate to like,

well, that's why he's a little more reckless or a little more daring. But like, then you have to do like eight more steps to be like, and you know, honestly, he was kind of trying to drop a house on his head. You know, that's a little right.

But I, I wouldn't do what he, but I do think that there is a, there is a psychological mystery. Yes. As to how you go from college to this movie. Right. Right.

Like, was this going to be the one last big creative swing before he had already decided he was gonna well i can sell out i mean obviously the other thing with keaton of course is when he's asked about these things like you know i just wanted a good gag for the good picture you know like he's not just like yeah i was really fucked up right uh okay here's some here's some context for steboat Bill Jr. originally called The Long Lost Son. Okay. Chuck Reisner. Much better title.

Yeah. Yeah, Steamboat Bill Jr. is just a joke, right? It's just a pun about a song. Steamboat Bill is the da-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na- That song, which is... Let's go steal some apples. Whistled by... By Mickey. Right, because we erroneously said, and it's often repeated, that Steamboat Willie, the first Mickey short, is riffing off of this title. But they're both riffing off the same.

But in fact, they're both riffing off the song. Right, right. Which is very popular. So it's a pre-existing song. Yes. I think that Steamboat Bill Jr. is a fine title. It's fine. The Long Lost Son feels a little banal to me.

Yeah, and the Junior is good. Yeah. It's part of the brand. It's fine. The Long Lost Son feels a little banal to me. And the Junior is good. Yeah. It's part of the brand. A good Buster Junior. So Chuck Reisner, former Vaudeville guy who worked with Chaplin, worked with Sid Chaplin. He had a story

that he pitched to Buster about an old steamboat captain reuniting with his Long Lost Son, right? And that's what it'lluster about an old steamboat captain reuniting with his long-lost son, right? You know, and that's what it'll be about, right? You got the grizzled captain

and the silly son. Yes. Right? A dandy. His idea is, right, I show up, I have a beret,

I'm wearing plus fours, I have a ukulele under my arm and a quote-unquote baseball mustache. Oh my God, you have to now put yourself in the mind of young John Odgman. Oh, you're losing.

At the Coolidge Corner movie theater when he's revealed because he's standing on the other side of the train platform. The train pulls away and he turns around. He's got that little pencil mustache. Oh, I've never felt more seen in my life. For you, this was like seeing James Dean in Rebel without a costume. This is the coolest guy in the history of movies. Can I tell you? I mean, I'm not unselfaware. I in Rebel without a collar. This is the coolest guy in the history of movies. Can I tell you?

I mean, I'm not unselfaware. I was laughing at what a dope he is. It's such an incredible character reveal. You know everything you need to know about him in that one moment. And I watched this movie last night with a person who lives in our house. He's 21 years old. And she laughed hard when she saw him. It is just undeniable.

David, what did you want to say? Well a couple things One apparently the mustache she's wearing Was jokingly at that time called a baseball mustache The joke being there are nine hairs on each side Much like innings in a baseball game Or you know whatever Baseball players Ben plus fours right

Those kind of pants they're like shorts plus four inches right Yeah Big baggy pants Tint're like shorts plus four inches, right? Yeah. Big baggy pants. Tintin famously wears plus fours. Okay. We bring them back? Yeah. They are back. They're kind of back? J.Crew did last season, they did big pants. Really? Yeah.

Big pants are back. But big billowy pants that come up a little short. It's the balance of both. Right. I don't believe that I'm going to reveal this, but I am. Okay. Around the time that I would have seen this movie, it was early days of rap music making its way to Brookline, Massachusetts. Around this time, I wrote my only rap lyric.

Okay. It was a couplet. Uh-huh. I wear white gloves like Bullwinkle moose i feel better when my pants are loose wow i'm a big fan of big pants look you just send a text message to ben if you want to cut that right out it's totally fine no no i want it out there it's in i had to uh audition i have to create a beat to go along maybe one of your listeners will do it for me. I had to. I was forced at gunpoint to audition for Nick Cannon's

Wild and Out. At one point, Wild and Out. One of the reboots and part of it was you had to do a rap in the audition. This was for Nick Cannon in the room. And all I ever came up with was I decided my persona

was MC Cardigan. I love it. You know I'm a fan of Cardigan. I thought it was an okay starting point. Was that all you had, though? No, here's what I had. I had, I'm MC Cardigan. Were you here to say something?

I'm in your yard again. Okay. There we go. Okay. Visiting my cousin up at Bard again. Oh, that's funny. I thought that wasn't bad. Not bad.

I feel like outside of the northeast yeah the bard reference might not score no it's kind of a you know right but like i like it oh ben sending me giant fit chino band yeah currently on j crew but they're not plus fours i'll make it clear this is their their crop there yeah it's giant fit hyphenated Like this is not cowboy fit This is fit for a giant Why am I not on this text thread? I'll send it to you, John Okay, so

Reisner has this pitch And, you know The film was quite expensive This film cost $330,000 Which is about as much as the general So that's a problem obviously um apparently this was a general problem with comedies they were much more expensive to make than dramas i guess just because of the amount of time it took to work all the gags up

and all that yeah maybe when you simulate a hurricane in a in a town that you have these dramas have battle scenes and stuff. They're not without, you know. Maybe when a whole building flies away, revealing a man in a hospital bed. I mean, the last 15 minutes of this movie feel like this might be the last time. I just realized Ben has been sending these links

to our text thread with Marie. And Marie is just getting these links random. Here's our group text It's just Ben Hosley Links to No Beans Urban Dictionary Ben Hosley Giant Fit Chino Pant for Men J.Crew

And then Marie Barty I have so many questions She'll find out She'll find out Okay so Those are big pants I like these big pants The last 15 minutes feel like him going

I'm gonna make this as if This is the last chance I ever get to make something on this scale I'm throwing everything at the wall They shot it all on the Sacramento It doesn't feel desperate No not at all It's like so much work but it all feels effortless They shot showed on the

sacramento river to double as the mississippi the mighty mississippi um and they built like a whole street front they built piers right you know the whole thing costs like 50 grand 150 people are working on it because then they have to fucking flood it you know like it's like all this crazy stuff is going on that's the kind of thing that anyone else would have done with miniatures. But for him, it's like the whole point is me coexisting in these spaces, moving through them. And they had more plans for like dramatic flood sequences that were stopped because there was a terrible flood of the actual Mississippi River that caused loss of life. Sure. And Buster was essentially told like like you can't do too many flood jokes like that's that's too touchy right people don't want it was two things yeah uh and

so that's why they then shift over to cyclone we only actually got clear to make flood jokes two years ago actually right okay um you know so that is when they start to think about okay well what are some like tornado gags we can do? Busters like, while swigging gin, I don't know, drop a house on me. And yeah, so, you know, they had these wind machines and all. I don't know, this whole thing just sounds incredibly complicated and difficult in 1928?

Yeah, he's like trying to run against the wind and he's like jumping up in the air and it's like he's truly flying. And at later points, he's literally getting rigged by wires. But yes,

here's the other thing. I mean, look at this image too where he's like leaning in all the way where the force of the wind is so great. It's bananas. Yes.

In college, there was... Wait, wait, wait. The movie College or when you were in college? When you were in college. Thanks for clarifying. Thanks for clarifying. Dear old Clayton. Yes.

In college, the gag where he is pole vaulting is infamously one of the only gags where he ever used a stunt double in his entire career. Or at least in his full-bodied age. When he goes over the thing and then lands headfirst into the thing. Into the hole. Into the weird pile of sawdust they're all falling into.

I think it was, you know, he had some injuries at this point, and it was like this, like, maybe I don't need to do this one. Maybe I can let someone else do this one, right? Maybe this one is not important for me to show my face. Versus the house gag,

which has less room for error and much greater risks. If it goes wrong, I think that's where I push back on the notion that he was suicidal making this movie of like... He's working too hard to be suicidal. Exactly. And it's like, college is him being like, He's working too hard to be suicidal. Exactly.

And it's like, college is him being like, I'm not willing to die for this fucking gag. It doesn't matter. Versus this, he's like, if I get it on film, this will validate my life. Look, it's this romantic nonsensical concept of like,

I'm going to go out with a bang. You know, like, I'm going to make the biggest movie ever and then the last scene I'll die. No, it's like his passion is back in. he's he's invested in making a really good movie and for him the stakes are i need to be pushing it that far not i i and if i die it's pretty good footage it's like right people want to see that i mean it wasn't the last thing they shot i presume the the house falling down no i don't think it could have been yeah um he wanted to live to shoot the rest of the movie presumably is there other setup david no no talk about the movie talk about the movie i mean all of the stuff in the dossier is mostly

just like this fucking insane you know we'll get that exactly uh i think his father in this film is so good yes and for how much the father relationship is so big in buster's life right right and this is not necessarily... Now, correct me if I'm wrong. He had a father, right? He did. Okay, interesting. Father was also a performer, failed performer, had the son very quickly outshines.

Yes, the guy playing the dad in this, Ernest Torrance. Ernest Torrance. He's really fucking good. Huge, very imposing and large. I mean, when you see his... The thing that made me fucking gasp is the scene where he's walking around in his night, when you see his, the thing that made me fucking gasp is the scene where he's walking around in his nightshirt and you see his feet.

Yes. Those things are like seal flippers. Yes. This thing is as long as this desk that I'm sitting at. Yes. This guy is hugely proportioned. Scottish man, I believe.

This guy was the first man ever to play Captain Hook on film. Yeah, there's a... The first adaptation. Captain Hook on film. Yeah, there's a... The first adaptation. He looks pretty terrified. Yeah, he's a scary looking fella. That guy waving a hook at me? But this is the kind of guy who usually chases Buster in a movie, right?

Right. Or tries to steal Buster's best gal away from him, his sweetheart or whatever. Like a Jeff type. Yeah, yeah. But like a relationship with a dad is not really something he's done before. He'll have parents in movies. And you'll have the disapproving thing, but it's not a major...

Son, you need to go do this. That's really all they usually do. They just set the plot in motion, right? To really go like... And there's always the thing of Buster not being the traditional man in this modern society. He's not traditionally masculine.

He does not get it, right? He needs to be toughened up. He needs to learn these things. He's not traditionally masculine. He does not get it. Right? He needs to be toughened up. He needs to learn these things. He needs to learn a proper trick. He needs a very certain kind of hat. Right. Yeah. Right.

That is not that beret. This is the movie where, like, all of that energy is put into the father. Yeah. Who is never really, like, an asshole to him. No.

As much as he's just, like, disappointed. Doesn't understand him. Doesn't get him. Disappointed. Isn't going to abandon him. No's just like disappointed understand him doesn't get him isn't going to abandon him no but does not understand him and buster wants to really prove himself does he though i mean here's the thing that i like about this he wants father's love i would say i guess i mean i guess you could make an argument that that's a human thing. To want love. I think that Buster Keaton's, I think his character, Willie.

Yes. First of all, he is waltzing in directly from the movie that college should have been. Yes. Do you know what I mean? Silly boy with a beret and a ukulele. One of them baseball mustaches. A classic kid who has gone to college and has remade himself. Come back unbearable.

Exactly. It's like, it's such a perfect thing. He's been there for a semester and you're like, oh, Jesus. And they don't even recognize it. And for that reason, I kind of feel like he is unbearable at the beginning of this movie. Not in a way that ever tests your affection for him. But, you know, like, he's here to... His mother wanted him to visit.

Yes. Like, he's not there to reconnect with his dad. He was told to go. And he traveled from Boston to go see his dad on an errand. And he's in it, but he doesn't want to be a part of this world. He's much more interested in the girl, his college friend. No, you are right. That's what keeps him in.

That's what keeps him around. And the stakes are higher for the father, who's now got this rival, the king. Right. And this is the other thing. The father, a completely different kind of man. Yes. Obviously is not an insider, though. You know what I mean? Yes. He's an underdog, too.

Yes. He's literally being outclassed by a guy named King. Yes. Who's a much more blue-blooded, high-class fellow. M-A-T-T. Great callback. But yes, you start the movie basically with the father as the protagonist. Here I am.

I'm going to be knocked out of business by this asshole. This asshole swell. Well, sons. Aren't sons supposed to help their fathers? Right. Aren't they supposed to carry on the tradition? I need another hand on the ship. He's going to come visit me.

This will be perfect. Here comes this twerp. Right. And here comes this twerp. Right. And so they're stuck with each other. So I don't think, the only reason I push back on you is that i feel that one of the beauties of the movie is it takes time for buster keaton's character to determine i do want to earn my father's love

sure i for a long time he's just along for the ride yes and we'll get to the scene where i feel like that that happens yeah but it scene where I feel like that happens. Yeah. But it's the fact that that happens makes this such a much more powerful film to me. That they grow to care about each other. Absolutely. He writes this letter saying, I'll be wearing away carnation. You can't miss me.

Right? Right. Then you have the father and his partner just looking for anyone, everyone. They're hoping. Clearly a more Smee-looking motherfucker than that little guy who wanders around with that Captain Hook. Yes. And then you get that amazing reveal as he says,

the train pulls away and he's facing the opposite direction. Right. And they're sort of tailing behind him, terrified. Like, they're almost looking for confirmation that it's not him. Is it anyone else? Does it have to be this kid? There's a sequence before that, though, where Buster Keaton has lost the carnation.

The wind blows it away. And he's just terrorizing people at the train station by wandering up to them deadpan and just, like, shoving his lapel in their faces. It makes me laugh every time. Like, mm-hmm, you see this, don't you? He doesn't know that he doesn't have the flower. It's great.

Right. But yes, then they see his name on his luggage yes and then they follow him around and could be anyone else they witness him taking out his old ukulele and serenading a baby yeah while dancing around which to them is like mortifying absolutely right this is the moment where they just go like what the fuck are we going to do what are we witnessing and it is a very foolish act but what i like about it is it speaks to his innate kindness yeah he is doing something that is silly and embarrassing but it is not um stupid no no it's whimsical and cute. Yes. It's not, no, it's not the kind of thing

that's going to get your boat working. It will not. I'll say that. But you're right. He's not like an imbecile. He's just a silly, precious boy. Yes.

And of course, the dad's solution is, well, let's get you right to the barber and get that fucking thing off your face. Right. Which Joe Keaton, his real father, plays the barber. Yes. Oh, I didn face. Right. Which Joe Keaton, his real father, plays the barber.

Yes. Oh, I didn't know that. The baseball mustache bit makes more sense. Take that barnacle off his lip is the line. Right. But they shave him off and then they do the tweezer to remove what I guess is the ninth man on the field. I watched this. What's his name?

Sorry. I watched this, what's his name? Sorry, I was watching the Cohen Media versions of the films. And Carl Davis did scores for those versions. And his score for this one in particular is phenomenal. It uses elements of the real Steamboat Bill song. It has a lot of great original melodies. That's fun.

The other thing I like is into the orchestration. It's a proper full orchestra doing this score. He works in a lot of the fun sort of musical sound effects of the shaving. Yes. Yes. And in a later sequence, I will get to in a second. I wanted to call that out.

His scores are available on iTunes. I do a lot of sound effects for shaving scenes. I do a lot of ADR. That's your side. Yes, they're looking for the outfit to toughen him up. Yes. They're auditioning every hat on him. Right, all the hats.

You have this joke. What a magnificent sequence that hat sequence is to me. And it just speaks to, he could make comedy out of nothing. What's the gag? They're not even funny hats. The worst version of that would be increasingly funny hats. The hats themselves are just normal hats.

But everyone, Buster Keaton is making into a joke. He's vain. He's self-impressed. He's got style and taste of his own. He goes into these weird poses when he gets the Buster Keaton hat. He's immediately like, get that the fuck away from me. That is incredible.

Yeah. It's him acknowledging how humongous the Buster Keaton persona had become. Right. That he needs to like admit, he needs to get the audience on board with, I'm playing a character in this one. Right. Don't hold on too much to the past people I've played. Right, right.

The stock type. The old boater guy. Right. I'm going to fucking throw the pork pie hat. And he sort of looks to the audience and is like, let's not talk about that. Right. Let's not even let them know I put that one on. And it's so swift and subtle.

And, you know, not to disparage the amount of physical danger he puts himself in in the last, you know, quarter of this film or whatever. But this is the funniest as it gets as far as I'm concerned. I mean, it gets as funny throughout the film. But it's like the comedy here is happening through nostril work. Truly. Do you know what I mean? Yes. It's just

beautiful. Yes. It's still very pretty, too. You know, he just has those hands and striking eyes. Right. He looks 10 years younger in this one than he does in college. It's the difference of him having joy. I think that might be, too. I think so. He also had a lot of

procedures done. Yeah, he was fucking addicted to Botox. At that time. It wasn't Botox at that time. You would just inject wood alcohol and bitters. That was all it was. Your skin would just brine.

They'd pickle you. Yeah, it was just patent medicines all the way down. Yeah, exactly. Sarsaparilla and birch beer. You also, he reconnects with his crush at the barbershop. Okay, and what is the name of this character? Not Mary. His crush in this movie, of course, is called

Kitty. Kitty, right. And her name is, the actress's name is Marion Byron. Marion Byron. She, yeah. She's terrific. She was at one point in her life, after this movie, teamed with Anita Garvin, another actress, to form a female Laurel and Hardy.

Okay. Didn't work. They just did three shorts and it never took off. She had more of a comedy background than most of these leading ladies. She was known as a vocal act. I believe she was like

She had the nickname Peanuts. Her name was Peanuts. She was 16 when they filmed this movie which is pretty wild. That is crazy.

She's also very same Peanuts than Pornuts. That is true. Yeah. She's tiny. That's why they called her Peanuts. And she's 16. You're's tiny that's why they called her Peanuts And she's 16 you're telling me

16 years old But it's wild because Buster Looks 10 years younger in this And she plays older than she is You'd guess that both of them were 24 They seem very well matched And instead they're like 16 and 33 Yeah he seems younger

Alright so he's in the He's in the naval uniform now But that's 1933. Yeah. He seems younger. Yeah. I don't love it. Okay. He's in the naval uniform now. But that's, this is, you're right. This is what gets him invested, right?

Is, oh, she's also here. Right. Back from college. Yeah. I can be around her. With her father on their boat.

I don't know about this rivalry. The dad puts the thing together. Having them be star-crossed lovers rather than him needing to fight a romantic rival is a fun flip on the formula. Right. And so his father is occupying more of the role of what is usually the big tough guy who's trying to steal the girl away from him.

Right. But from a sympathetic point of view. Right. The father's got a lot at stake. He needs to make this work. He doesn't want to be put out of business. And he doesn't want his son getting involved with the daughter of his rival.

And that is the only thing he wants to do. It is the number one thing he wants to do. I had said, I think, in our Dana episode that I ranked this one lower on my personal Buster ranking, which is absurd. But I think also I had not rewatched this one in a while. And I had not rewatched The Navigator in a while. And I conflated them a lot in my mind. Both boat films. Boat bits. Right. But Navigator is much more boat bits. It's what are the bits that come out of being on a boat. They're on this vehicle. There's the two

of them as well. So it's not about like working a boat. It's just like these two idiots are on a boat. Right. This movie is much more he wants to fulfill the role of a proper boatsman in terms of dress and demeanor and all that's right yeah he doesn't want to be a dumbass coxswain he wants to be a proper boatsman yeah but outside of that his main objective is get off this fucking boat get onto her boat he just wants to talk to her a bunch and he doesn't pick that outfit out they pick it out together yes like that's so beautiful like they're both so out of touch another bit that is so simple and as much like the hat bit where it's like the comedy is coming out of him positioning the hat 10 degrees in the wrong way right uh that moment when he's

walking up on the deck of the boat and all he's trying to do is just wear his nice little double breasted captain uniform with his little hat and just walk straight on the boat and he he fucks up every element of walking in a straight line right Right? He like walks into the pulley. He almost walks over the edge. And he's just trying to maintain the air of confidence of, I know how to be here. That semen swagger. Yes.

You know what I'm talking about, Ben? Oh, sure. I mean, he's looking sharp. Yeah. He looks good. He looks really good. Yeah. And it's so funny.

And the other thing that the 21-year-old who lives in my house sometimes really laughed at was uh when he comes down and first when he the reveal of the naval uniform and then smee just handing a gun to the father saying no jury in the world would convict you always funny pretty much always a good joke in my opinion yes murder is now legal the idea of a jury being like uh-huh and you say he was annoying uh-huh free to go absolutely just makes me laugh fair enough okay what happens next on steamboat bill jr he's on the boat he tells her basically she gets the note to him saying i will i will be on the deck of my ship right so he's got to he's got to sneak over there right this is such a good bit.

And it's so simple. And isn't like crazy boat bit shit. It's just set up. Right. Right. Buster's been lying in bed all night eating peanuts. There's other dang peanut shells all around the bed, which you think is just kind of an errant detail to make his dad angry.

Right. But instead, they end up being this incredible runner of, anytime anyone is trying to enter or leave the room, they keep forgetting there are these fucking shells all over the place. Yes. Which the Carl Davis score, he does instrumentation of the shell noise over and over again. He does crunchy nuts, David. That's fun. Which is really fun.

But all he wants to do is sneak out. Right. His father wants to make sure he's not... Sneaking out. Because this is my rival's fun. Which is really fun. But all he wants to do is sneak out. Right. His father wants to make sure he's not... Sneaking out. Because this is my rival's daughter. Right. You star-crossed lovers can never get together. And he's fully dressed underneath it in his captain's uniform.

Taking off the big nightgown to reveal his entire uniform is funny. Big nightgowns are funny. Yes. Big nightgowns that go down to the floor are funny. But he can't get out easily because of the nutshells The father finds him, he makes him go into the wardrobe Well, no, he says you get undressed And Buster Keaton won't get undressed in front of his father

Right, right So he goes into the closet Yes To get undressed Right But he just puts on some work clothes, right? I don't remember what happens. No, he puts on a different long nightie.

Right. And he's like, see, are you happy? And he gets back in the bed, and then the second the dad leaves, he gets out, he takes the nightie off. He's got a different uniform on. But he has that look when the father opens the wardrobe of like, are you happy now? Right, yeah. These things where he's able to convey something with like such an incredible. He didn't need to speak.

He did. He didn't need to speak. Um, he didn't need to speak. Uh, and he doesn't speak because it's a silent film. It is. It's a silent picture.

Um, all right. So, all right. There's lots of undressing business. She's waiting on the deck of the steamboat bill. She gets busted too. She gets busted too. She gets busted too.

And her father calls him a river tramp. Uh-huh. Which is not kind. No, it's a good dig. Yeah. Yeah. River tramp. River tramp.

That's you, Ben. Face it. Face it? You're a river tramp. Come on, you know. Yeah, all right. I'll take it. I'll take it. Yeah.

I'll take it. You know, back when I used to go on steamboats. Right. Back in those days. Yeah. When I was a traveling gambler. Yeah. On steamboats.

I knew some river tramps. Oh, yeah? And they were fun guys. Okay, good. You were doing the Mississippi grind? Yeah. Okay, Griff. What else happens in steamboats?

I'll try to remember how we get to the father being arrested Because you have her waiting for him He puts out the plank The ships start moving He ends up beating up Doesn't he assault King Yes they have the big fight Right

There's the whole protracted sequence of Buster Trying to get to her on the boat And then when the father catches him And and then Steamboat Bill's father goes after... Right. But there's another thing, too, which is that the father does... Steamboat Bill Sr. Yes. Gives up on Steamboat Bill Jr.

Yes. And gets him a ticket back to Boston. Yes. And Steamboat Bill Jr. is kind of like, yeah, you know what? This didn't work out. Yeah. And Steamboat Bill Jr. is kind of like, yeah, you know what? This didn't work out. Yeah. And then his father gets thrown in jail. And that's when he changes his mind and he's going to stick around.

That's the moment. Yes. And I was wildly struck, not only by the emotion of this moment, but the framing of that scene. Where, I mean, it was just so gorgeous i mean the the so much of this film is shot beautifully yes it's a very good looking movie you know it's this it's this one scene where he is standing in the road uh and he's looking at camera and and beyond camera is that he's watching his dad get thrown in jail away puttinged away. Put in the slammer. And Kitty is in the background watching him.

And it's like, here, here it is. It's this, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Like,

like he's in the foreground and she's far away. You can't even see her. It's, I mean, it's so like, not that any of these films were rudimentary, but that feels so contemporary, that framing to me,

that feels so emotive. Yeah. to me. That feels so emotive and modern. And I just, there are so many sequences or, you know, just images that are so striking, including him standing in the doorway of the, when he goes to visit his father to break him out, now that he's committed to his dad. I want to talk about that sequence. Plot-wise, just because I untangled it,

there's the earlier bit where Steamboat Bill Sr. tries to train Bill Jr. down in sort of the engine room, and he accidentally crashes the ship into the king. So then when they're back on land after they busted the two of them trying to canoodle, the king, the father, accuses the Canfield,

the ship, of being, like, poorly run. Right. Unsafe. Oh, and he has it condemned. Wants it condemned. Right. So then that's when Steamboat Bill's senior attacks him. Loses control. Right. This is, like, my favorite bit of performance in the entire movie, even more than the hat thing, is Buster has brought

this giant loaf of bread. It's very funny. Filled with tools. And he says, you know, I made it myself. Yes. And then the prison guard turns around and that's when Buster's like saying to his dad, essentially like, you know, I'm going to break you out of here.

Right. Guy turns back around, Buster's hands in the air. It just kind of puts it on the guy and like pats him like, there you are. You know, I just always think that's funny. But you're setting up like so many different things here,

which is his, his dad doesn't want the bread. He doesn't want the bread because he's like, my son's a fuck up. The bread probably tastes awful. This isn't what I want from you. I even didn't,

I didn't even take it as the bread necessarily tasted awful. It's just like, he's a stubborn, mad fuck. i'm just you know what i mean tired of all your bullshit yeah you're coming here with a fucking sourdough loaf or some shit i don't want your business right and all he wants to do is convey to his father the bread's gonna help you escape right right he's trying to find a way to pantomime as you said the

sheriff keeps turning around catching him he has to try there's so much in motion here both sort of As you said, the sheriff keeps turning around, catching him. He has to try to... There's so much in motion here, both sort of plot-wise and then emotionally. Yes. It's like this one scene could be a whole film, basically. But you get just like three minutes of Buster trying to pantomime different ways of conveying,

break out, walk out of jail. I remember laughing so hard at the Coolidge Corner when he sang that little song. The Prisoner's Lament or whatever. And then he's like kind of gesturing to the bread, just like, you know, like, prisoners might want this bread.

He's like sawing off his own thumb to the tune of the song to give the father an idea, and then he does the little thing with the little man with his fingers running away across the bread, and it's all in time to a song that you cannot hear. You cannot hear, which is incredible. But you hear it somehow all the same.

It's magnificent. Right. The funniest thing is he finds a piece of rock or something. He throws it over his shoulder out the window so that it looks like someone threw a window from... It's two rocks. He kicks one rock next to the sheriff's foot, right? Then he takes another rock, he throws it through the window so it looks like someone threw a window from... It's two rocks. Right. He kicks one rock next to the sheriff's foot, right?

Then he takes another rock, he throws it through the window so it looks like the rock by the foot went through the window from the outside. Right. Tells him, look around, someone's yelling, you know, throwing, breaking glass, whatever. Throwing a rock through the window.

And then just rips the butt off the bread, shows his father all the tools inside, puts the butt back on front, and now the dad's like, well, I think maybe I want the bread, shows his father all the tools inside, puts the bread back on front, and now the dad's like, well, I think maybe I want the bread, actually. Right. Are we building to my favorite line? Yes. Okay. He's trying to get him to take the bread. He goes over to hand it to him,

right? He's holding it the wrong way. Everything falls out. This is the line, David? Go ahead. Do you want me to say it? That must have happened when all when the dough fell in the tool chest yeah it's just such a funny idea that he's like well i was making dough and yes it did briefly fall in a tool chest and maybe it accumulated various tools i didn't think much of it i just baked the bread i lifted off the floor i put it in the oven

so is is that a real thing though that happened where someone escaped from prison it had to have had a file inside of it was it was such a trope yeah i like to think that it happened yeah i mean everyone remembers it's it's as common as uh what no beans like everyone right universal reference point oh boy all, so he does... Wait, how does he knock the guy out again? He knocks out the prison guy at some point. Yeah. With the loaf or whatever.

Yeah. Gets him out. But there's a storm of brew. And then the storms of brew, and then we are basically into just a very thrilling, apocalyptic sort of disaster sequence. Mm-hmm.

Which builds to him in the wreckage of an abandoned theater where he starts to do all these meta gags. Oh, right. There's the thing where he pulls the curtain and the shower comes down. He pulls it back up and he's disappeared. Right.

And it's just on a little platform and then his head pops up like his body, like it's disembodied. And then he cuts to the side and you see like like, the mirror. Right. That it's kind of a classic magician's trick. Like a magician, right.

Right. But it's almost like him kind of pulling back the curtain and acknowledging the trickery that goes into sequences. Right. Right. Right. But then also, like, there is, it's almost highlighting that in a lot of the sequence, there is no trickery.

No, he's not doing this type of shit. Right. This is not sleight of hand. Right. This is what my competitors would do. Right. Right. You know, when he leaps into the wind and is blown backwards and falls flat on his back and then gets up, that's really happening.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah, it's uh intense um i mean they have these wind machines i guess that's how they do it but still it's intense were they just really big fans there's like the you know building falling down right the not the one on him but like the big kind of fake town set starting to crumble right the fish palace falls in the water and all that stuff. The library crumbles. The hospital. Everyone running out of the hospital.

Six Liberty motor wind machines is what they were called. The cyclone scene alone cost a third of the movie's total budget. Which was estimated between $300,000 and $400,000. I would have thought it was craft services. That was the other. Oh, right. It's the hospital blows away,

and then you see everyone in the beds, including him. Yeah. And then the bed blows away. Yes. And then the bed blows away. It's a good gag, but it's something like you could only imagine seeing it in a cartoon. It's actually, how did they pull that house away?

Right. It's astonishing. Right. And not only do you feel like I could only imagine seeing that in a cartoon, the cartoons you've seen that in came after this look everything about this

motion picture yeah is perfect as far as I'm concerned yes it's the plot is sound the emotional core

is beyond sound it's visually stunning and it's quiet moments when he shows up at the at the prison with that loaf of bread and he's got that

upturned umbrella yeah and he's standing in the prison with that loaf of bread and he's got that upturned umbrella and he's standing in the doorway. It feels like an Ingmar Bergman scene. Yes. You know what I mean? It's like this omen of death. And then you have this whole sequence which is utterly thrilling.

Right. Utterly astonishing. It's an incredible action sequence. It's a credible feat of technical filmmaking. There are incredible gags within it. It works as special effects, as actual thrilling suspense, as comedy. And it's in service to the core story, ultimately,

because the father is in jail and the jail is flooding. Yes. And he's got to save his father. And so it's not just stuff happening, right? It's a true impediment to the emotional journey of the story. Yes. And it's also bananas and incredible to look at. This film was not a hit?

No, not at all, no. So here's my question. What the fuck is wrong with people? I don't know what the fuck is wrong with people. There's a point where he grabs onto a tree for safety and the wind is so insane that the tree is lifted out of its roots and he flies. Yeah. What is wrong with people

that they did not love this film? He shuts a door and the house just falls apart into pieces of wood. Yeah. Funny.

Yeah. There's really, really good bits. Do you think the house would have killed him? If it happened? Because it was two tons is what I read. Two tons? Yeah. Because it was two tons. If it had fallen, you're saying? That's what I read.

Two tons? Yeah. The facade weighed two tons. Fuck. That is... I think the house would have killed him. Because you look at it and you're sort of like, well, it's a thin wall.

Maybe he could have just kind of broken it or whatever. But Balsa would not have fallen as... Yeah, and also you're like, it's a wall. Like, you know, it's heavy. Maybe it's not too i mean i read that on the internet so who knows internet stars right but i don't think that it would have i don't think he would have loved it you don't think he would have loved it you don't think he would have got off on it no uh i mean and when it falls and it's like yeah it

falls and he doesn't die he also doesn't flinch no No. Like, he's still in character looking around in the befuddled state after the thing works. His mark for that was a nail in the ground. Hell yeah. Yeah, right. That's why whenever I act, I insist,

only nails. Only nails. No marking tape. Yeah. Take that tape away. Did you get my box of nails? Which color would you want to be, John? Nails. Steel. My be, John? Nails.

Steel. My color is steel. Nails. The other thing I love, though, is he becomes heroic at the end of the movie, but in a way that doesn't feel like... People get tired of that. Also, I missed my mark. Can't see it.

It's every time. There are a lot of nails on this floor. House always falls on me. He becomes heroic at the end of the movie in a way that doesn't feel like an unrealistic, oh, suddenly he's become fucking Ethan Hunt. You're like, he just becomes kind of practical. Right. He figures it out.

He saves the two people who mean the most to him. And the scene in which his father teaches him to run the boat and he messes up five times or whatever because he's got that one lever. Yes. pays off because he uses that lever to run the boat properly later on in his own unique college boy way of you know running the boat solo with with lines of rope yeah and so again it's like it's it's it's built in none of it is out of nowhere uh he's a little bit better at it he's not great not great at it but it's enough so that you feel like as you say that it's perfectly believable within the world of the movie. It's just terrific. And I just have to imagine

that people in 1928 were so high on bitters and wood alcohol being injected into their... Drinking too much birch beer. Yeah, being injected into the bags under their eyes. This was a really good movie. Well, let me try and give you some...

Let's see if there's any. Is there any record of the other movies that came out at that time? It cost too much money. Yes, there is a record and we will talk about that. There's also, you know, again, ongoing creative issues happening behind the scenes. A lot of fighting

over this disaster sequence and all that. But basically, early into making the movie also uh joe skank and keaton fight over this idea of supervisors right these super by after the after the credit for brand on college yeah uh and skank is like you're done man like you're not gonna make any more buster keaton movies Without that And basically They split up And Skank says Look maybe you should go to MGM

Maybe shut down Keaton Productions They have the money It'll be a different vibe for you there There's a lot of fighting Within the biographies over To what extent Skank Made money from that To what extent that's an sort of like made money from that you know like to what extent like that's an altruistic suggestion from him

or more of a like you know profit ease you know you get what I'm saying we'll never fully know how skank was how skanky skank was we'll never know the full skank scale of Joe Skank but I do think it's similar to like a dynamic we've covered before on the podcast that's come up with

with different filmmakers, but almost like Zemeckis with like his motion capture shit where people go like, you're done, Robert, you're done. If you want to, if you want to make movies,

you have to drop this shit. Right. And he would come back every time and go like the last 20 minutes of my movie, you're going to be set in the center of a hurricane. And they're like, no, go to college.

You know, all of this sort of like technical complication it's like verhoeven with the nazis yeah he's like steve but bill jr what's it about i get on a boat with my dad we're on a boat okay you're on a boat that sounds fine at the end there's a hurricane we destroy a town i'm just being like buster this is over If you want to be in movies there's a path for you to keep making movies You're not doing shit this way anymore So Buster decides to switch to MGM Which he describes as the worst mistake of his career

And we can obviously talk about that next week But Ultimately the film just didn't do that Well it did okay again It doubled its budget It made about 700 in worldwide rentals. 700 grand. So I don't think that it's like a bomb per se.

I do think that... It should have been an enormous hit. Right. And I also just think that times do be a changing a little bit. I was alive then and I was saying at the time, this should be an enormous hit. That was back when I would record my movie podcast on wax cylinders. Yes. With an old river tramp as my producer.

Oh, hello. Judge John Hodgman here. Send in your questions via message bar. Dateline, Brookline, Massachusetts. Hodgman has seen another impeccable film. You do question that where you're just like was he just like too ahead of the curve yeah did this just not make sense to people what he was doing is this like people are getting freaked out because the because the train's coming towards the camera

like i'm just i'm you know i'm having this play on my ipad as we're talking and i'm looking at this final sequence and you're looking at these like huge vistas of like a town getting flooded and a house just like bobbing along next side it and this woman hanging on for dear life and him swinging like an anchor and were people just like this isn't funny this is just like big right well i mean and the general ends in that huge spectacle of the or it doesn't end on but yeah there's the the very expensive spectacle of the train you know going off the burning bridge or whatever. Which people liked less, too.

They were like, what is this shit? Right, not funny, like, you know, in a traditional sense. Yeah, but people have always gone to film for spectacle, and the hurricane is funny. You have to stop arguing with the ticket goers of 100 years ago. I understand. I've been having this argument for 100 years since I saw it in the theaters. A full century. I understand. I've been having this argument for a hundred years since I saw it in the theaters.

It's just funny that now you cannot make a film comedy without this degree of spectacle, and the spectacle is bad. And back then, he would give you the most artful sort of marriage of the two, and people would be like, get your spectacle out of my comedies.

They would also say, get your spectacle out of my soup! Because the guy had drawn crosses. Well, yes. I might agree with you, Griffin, on this element, which is that, you know, like, young John Hodgman of real life. Which is coming to CBS this fall. Yes, that's what they renamed

young Hodgman at Yale because they didn't find that to be accessible. That's not their audience. Little hoity-toity. That was the name not their audience. Yeah. Little Hoity Toity. Yeah, Little Hoity. That was the name of my character, actually. Little Hoity Toity. It's like, shouldn't it be Hodgman?

I'm like, no, no, no, no. That's the thing. His name is Little Hoity Toity. It's like the Bob Newhart show. We never explain who Young Hodgman is. Right. Yeah, right. His name's not Newhart in the show.

Yeah. They're like, yeah, no. No, thank you. You're not. We're not doing this. And the last third is a hurricane. But the point I'm saying is this. Young Hodgman seeing this, I didn't understand what I was seeing, for sure.

Like, I didn't get how hard it was to make this go. I didn't understand the fragility of the human body the way I do now. The more invincible. Right, exactly. And everyone agreed with me. That kid with the Doctor Who scarf and the fedora, obviously

an Adonis. Like, take off those big pants. I want to see those incredibly well-formed calves. Nothing's breaking him. Yeah, exactly so. But I guess it's, maybe it was too big to take in for a lot of audiences. It took a couple decades for movies to catch up with him.

And now we look at him and we're like, how did he make this 100 years ago? Right. CGI, I guess, is the answer. Right. Early CGI. Buster Keaton. Oh, yeah. So the film just, you know, look, Variety called it a pip of a comedy.

That's good. It's not a pip. But the New York Times called it a gloomy and sorry affair. Jesus. Yeah, well. Bodied. Notoriously on the money again. Mordant Hall is the critic back then.

His name is Mordant? Yes, Mordant Hall. M-O-R-D-A-N-T? Mordant? Correct. Meaning morbid? Yes, Iordant Hall M-O-R-D-A-N-T, Mordant Correct Meaning morbid Yes, I would say so Yeah, maybe look at yourself, Mordant The taglines were very Twister-focused Uh-huh

Hold on, everybody, it's a hurricane of laughs Right This one, the screen's first big Mississippi thriller The Sheik of Muddy Waters Did you say this year's first big Mississippi thriller? Correct The screens, I'm sorry The Sheik of Muddy Waters. Did you say this year's first big Mississippi thriller? Correct. The Screens. I'm sorry.

What a thrill. Worth the price of admission alone to see what happened to Buster when the Twister hits the town. Here are the two most interesting ones. Buster's gayest comedy opus simply bursting with gals, guile, and gales of laughter. And then here's one that... I'm just kind of laying it on a little thick. I agree. Talk about Buster being ahead of his time

in terms of predicting the genres. Fun, fast, and furious. Oh! And I am actually ready to announce we saw Fast X last night, but of course Buster Keaton is in Fast X. That's right. He appears.

It makes him all the more stunning than I thought it was the worst movie I've ever seen. You should have had that role. You should have had the Buster Keaton role. I should have had the Buster Keaton role. We got one more guy

to help us and then the steamboat Bill Jr. or whatever comes in. I'm sitting there with my arms crossed. Still isn't working for me. Don't care.

It's not CGI. They've actually brought him back from the dead. Vin Diesel turns, he's like, he's alive. He's alive.

He's literally alive. I plucked him from the time screen. And Vin Diesel turns to the camera, he's like he's alive he's alive he's literally alive i plucked him from the time and he turns the camera he's like griffin he can hang out with you after this he wants to he heard about your podcast he thinks you're cool he liked draft day yeah he thought he liked your uh gag with the coffee and was mad sorry it was cut out it wasn't in the movie has watched the trailer many times. Anyway, Fast Action sucks. Let's do the, okay.

Yeah, tell me what people were interested in besides this movie. Because Steamboat Bill Jr. is opening at 10. Jesus. Jeez Louise. All right,

number one is a new film this week. So this is a rival new release. Rival new release that is making three times as much money. It's making a searing

128 grand over steampunk bills 43 okay give me a genre it's a silent drama from the great british uh director alexander corda oh grapes of london is it is it a literary adaptation uh don't think so uh it looks like it's a sort of uh you know he's, he's a fancy man and she's a lady. It's Billy Dove and Clive Brooke. Those are the actors? Those are the actors. Clive Brooke, a famous British silent actor of the time.

And the film is called The Yellow Lily. The Yellow Lily. Hard to say. No good. Bad title. All right. Number two at the box office is a silent drama. This one's based on a novel.

Okay. It stars Dolores Del Rio, who I think is a pretty well-known. She's a Mexican actress. Very important figure in Mexican cinema. Also, Warner Baxter. Okay. Who is best known for playing the Cisco kid in Old Arizona, which he won an Oscar for.

And it's directed by Edwin Carew. Okay. Edwin Carew. And it is a literary adaptation. Yes, and it looks like it's a Western, and the lead character, who is the title character of the film, she's half Native American, and there's a whole romantic drama about this. You say the title of this film, She's half Native American and there's a whole romantic

drama about this. Will you be cancelled? No. I don't want to guess. It actually has the title is the name of one of our mutual friends. She's been on this show. Fran Hoffner?

Fran Hoffner. It would be great if that's what it's called. Emily Yoshida The name of the film is Hodgman here Dateline Brooklyn Massachusetts Run don't walk to see Fran Hoffner The film is called Ramona

Okay number three at the box office Also new this week it's a comedy The flapper masquerades as her straight-laced cousin to try and impress a potential suitor. That's a good premise. She's always trying to be flappery, and then she's like, I can't flap.

The straight-laced flapper. Pretend to be a normie. The actress is Lois Moran. Norma the normie. Norma the normie? Lois Moran and Neil Hamilton are the stars of Don't Marry

That's the full title? I think this one sounds fun That sounds like a pip of a comedy That's a pip Now this next film Is a horror film Which is funny because the title of it Kind of sounds like a comedy title

Directed by Frank Tuttle The hilarious murderer uh starring esther ralston death comes a laugh uh let's see it's about a thrill-seeking socialite engaged to a bland proper englishman uh and he wants her to to purge her of her thrill-seeking ways okay so he arranges for her to spend a night in a haunted house to frighten the audacity out of her. Wow. Unknown to him, this mansion's being used as a hideout

for an oriental mastermind of the crime world. Okay. Well, anyway, the film is called Something Always Happens, which I assume is sort of a promise of like, every five minutes, there'll be something new something a real roller coaster hearing that movie described the the genre of criminals using a fake haunted house to hide out in uh occurs all the time and we got to bring that back it's been too long it's been too long yeah that was a good one. Well, you know, we should write it into the hilarious murderer.

Yes. Number five. Right, Ben? Right, River Tramp? Yes. Number five at the box office is. I was trying to think of a River Trampian thing to say, but nothing came to mind. We got time to define the character.

Maybe I'll put in a horn, but I'll make it sound wet. Yeah, that sounds good. Number five is a part-talkie crime film. Part-talkie. Which means it basically has a musical score. It has sound effects. It doesn't have talking. Okay.

So it's more of a soundie. It's more of a soundie. Yes. It's a lost film. Okay. No Prince Known to Exist stars Dolores Costello, more interestingly, directed by Michael Curtis, who of course directed a little film you may have heard of

called Casablanca, along with Angels with Dirty Faces and one billion other films by a Hungarian director. Co-written by Brookline's own the Epstein brothers. No. Oh, well, Casablanca was, yes. But no, this film was not. I'm going to guess. The name of the film is the name of a neighborhood in New York

that doesn't really exist anymore, but sort of a classic name for like... Little Italy. Like, classic name for like the sort of tough neighborhood. Try that. Like that, but no. The film is called... The Gasworks Town. Great guess. Skid Row. the sort of tough neighborhood like that but no the film is the gas works town great skid row

that's a good guess too but no it's called tenderloin oh sure sure sure back when they were kind of like hey this part of town kind of looks like a tenderloin if you draw a map and if you go there you get murdered what Brutal murder They'll take your money and your life Yeah, it's called Tenderloin She's a dancer in the Tenderloin district And then a gang A kid in a gang likes her And they get

Right on the track That's pretty good So, I'm gonna say this right now That's one through nine that's one through five one through five all those movies suck uh some other films so it seems you know what you know that one that's lost good thank god see ya it's lost because you threw it in the fucking garbage um no some other films uh 1928 film called Skyscraper, starring, I'm seeing here, Dwayne the Rock Johnson.

Dwayne the Rock Johnson. It's directed by Russell Marshall Thurber. Suck Scraper is what I call that. Best known for being initially written by Ayn Rand back when she was in Hollywood. And that was,

Buster wanted to make his Skyscraper movie and he's getting beaten at the box office by some fucking also Rand. You also have a reissue of the film the white sister which has come up in prior box office white suckster you have um a film with a great title

that i think we should remake this film immediately called glorious betsy oh that's her story i don't know she sounds pretty good yeah sucky as sucks and then another great title damn I mean this would be a fucking great title to this day a crime drama called Diamond Handcuffs great title no plot details on that one yeah that doesn't suck

no that's pretty fucking cool actually all of this is in the public domain right I mean this is all I hate for yeah I mean it's kind all I hate for... Yeah, we can take this. Yeah, I mean, it's kind of wild how few proper Buster remakes there have been for how many of the premises just feel like, well, that's just like a perfect comedy setup. Yeah.

No, no, 100%. I mean, look, anything with identity switcheroos or I have to pretend to be an ex when I, like, have to pretend to be fancy when I'm poor or the other way around. I'm always like it's pretty good get a good performer in the role he's a real straight laced buzzard

and she's a wild cat you know I'm just like okay the buzzard and the cat um uh yeah you know that doesn't that sound good yeah sounds great all right so that's Steamboat Bill Jr. and it is of course sadly the end of Buster's real independent era.

Yeah. But I do think it is a triumph. I do think it's very, very good. I know that's not like a hot take. I do too. And to prevent people from thinking that the remaining episode is just going to be some downer postscript,

Cameraman, which is his first MGM film, is my personal favorite. Yeah, I have never seen it. And I look forward to watching it and listening along. It is an incredibly simple, straightforward film, but I think it is an absolute triumph. And we're not ending this series on a fucking downer note. No, I mean, you don't love Spite Marriage as much, right?

No, I don't love it as much, but it's fine. It's enjoyable. Yeah, it's better than college. Now, before we end the episode, could we do a quick merch spotlight? Sure. Do you guys, is that okay? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. You want to do it here? So I have this package here that we got delivered kind of a while ago. Now, this isn't a merch... Do you recall what this is, David? This isn't a traditional merch spotlight where we often talk about merchandise

that was manufactured specifically for that movie. Of which it's hard to find. So this is Steamboat Bill Jr. merchandise? This is more general Buster Keaton series merchandise. Ben went down a rabbit hole and decided he needed to own one of these.

Yeah, I mean, I wanted to spend the company's money wisely and get something that really is useful for the show. And is of interest, of course. Let's see if David or John can identify what this is. Is it a bottle of wood alcohol and bitters? It's got to be real bad. Okay.

Okay, I'm going to take my time then. Whoa, it's a thing that makes noise. It's a clapper. Oh. Why did we talk about that again? That does ring a bell. Because the kind of comedy that he performs. Yeah.

Slapstick. Oh, that's right. Oh, it's so annoying. That's a literal slapstick. $500. This cost. It looks like it's pretty well made, you know? It's sturdy. Yeah, but this is actually vintage.

Really? Yeah. To what year? 2022. Wow, I remember when that was new. Look, not to answer my giant merchandise spotlight, but I, John, I bought a present for you. I did tell you this somewhat recently. We got launched with our friend Brendan Hines. I told you,

just make sure I don't forget to... You're going to sign it. Can I try it? Okay. But John, in addition to being a good friend of mine and a friend of the podcast... And of Ben's and David's as well. Of course. There are three times I clocked

in the last two years. I have gone to you and went, John, we came up with a dumb bit. Would you do this? Yes. Will you record an entire alternate audio track for the sunglasses on version of They Live? I was very happy to do that. We came up with this idea.

I'm asking you to do it now, but we've already set it up, right? And like in the Coraline episode, I said, we have this bit where we found a door in the studio and JD went through the door and you're recording an alternate episode. Would you just do this? All three times I didn't go,

hey, do you have any ideas? I went, here's an idea. Can you execute this? And then for our live show at the Brooklyn Opera House, you were the phantom of the opera. Very good. For that.

Thank you, yes. Sort of set a very nice House. You were the phantom of the opera. Very good. Thank you. I had a very nice time. You've been so amenable and you've been so kind every time I throw one of these things out. You go, but of course, and you over-deliver that I felt the need to repay you with something that I know you want and I've known you want and any of our listeners

know dead to rights that you have wanted. You did hint that something was coming, but I don't know what it is. It's not a guess of a gift. Shall I open it? Please. It's here. It's packaged in a has Japanese on the box. This was shipped from Japan.

Shipped from Japan. This was shipped from Japan. Oh my gosh. Very well wrapped. Bubble wrap. Let me make sure to do this on mic because people love this sound.

Sure. Because this is a little bit more of an antique than that little mouth sound as well. I didn't like when he did

the opening of the package. And this is a regular segment by the way. Bubble wrap. What is it? It's the it's a Playmobil set

That I've long had my eye on Of course, I know what this is We talked about this on our Master Builder episode On our Master Builder episode Where we had a 40 minute digression on the Playmobil movie A truly forgotten piece of content Yes, absolutely It's the

The Austrian police officer slash soldier yes from an earlier century arresting a tramp yes oh well you know passed out on a park bench it's eric adams's favorite playmobil yes he's trying to put one on every keeping the streets clean number five five zero eight mint in box mints in box. Straight from Japan. I'm not going to open it up. The box is the real art, I think. The box is beautiful. Number 5508.

If you want to make a tableau. And also, I don't need to open it because as it says right here, contents as shown. Oh. Take their word for it. That's very kind. Thank you very much. I wonder, I have to research what year this is supposed to be because this police officer has a big old Napoleon hat with a big feather on it.

I think it was manufactured in the 70s. I don't know what year the Playmobil set is set in. I'm just wondering when it's supposed to be set. The era of the set. The depiction. Arresting a Vagrant, Playmobil style. Thank you very much. You're very welcome.

Well, I have to say thank you again for inviting me to rewatch one of my favorite movies and also watch now one of my least favorite movies. Now you know. But the favorite one was a real favorite to rewatch. It's been a while and I got to share it

with someone I care about and it was terrific. And I think it holds up and I think it's better than those other fucking movies. I agree. The rest of the box office

was trash. I'm really, really mad still, even a hundred years later. It's terrific. David needs to pee. I do need to pee very badly.

Great. And we gotta go. We're gonna be done. Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate, review, and subscribe. Thank you to Marie Barty for our social media, helping to produce the show. Thank you to Ben for ordering this slapstick. That's going in

the trash! This will be great at the picket line for the WGA. Oh, that's smart. Oh, and they would love that. Oh, they'd love it. Zazz love will go fine. Whatever they want.

To put the fucking slapstick down. You like this, Zazzy? That's what we got to do. We got to razz Zazzy until he gets up. Razz Zaz. We got to razz Zaz. Thank you to AJ McKeon, Alex Barron for our editing, Lee Montgomery and the Great American Novel for

our song. Joe Bowen, Pat Reynolds for our work. JJ Burch for our research. David is storming off in protest. Tune in next week for Cameraman and Spite Marriage. You can go over to Patreon.

You can. We're still journeying through the Planet of the Apes. You a fan of that series? I liked the first one. You should watch the sequels. I've seen the sequels. They're great. I'm a fan. I mean, yes. The answer is yes. I'm a fan. I wasn't sure.

Well, it's been my pleasure to do all those bits for you. And as you say, you do just give me a prompt and then I just do whatever I feel like doing. I hope you've enjoyed it. I've loved it. So also in this box that you gave me with the Playmobil, is my check in here or something? Yes. Yes. A blank check.

Yes. We people pull in Playmobils. Not money. It's a very clear system. I appreciate it. And as always, I think that slapstick is going to be a regular part of every on mic discussion. What was the slapstick used for? So it would simulate getting hit on your bottom. So you swing it, right?

And you don't actually connect with the person's bum right but the the board behind it makes the noise it's a bum paddle yeah nice