Blank Check with Griffin & David - Following

Episode Date: June 25, 2017

In the first episode of a new mini series focusing on the filmography of Christopher Nolan, Griffin and David discuss the 1998 debut feature, Following. But how have conmen or “confidence men” influenced the director’s later work? How was the burgeoning filmmaker received by festivals? Is the uncensored director’s cut of Nutty Professor II: The Klumps worth viewing? Together they examine the extended Nolan family, Kevin Bacon getting Bernie Madoff’d, Griffin’s auteur video rental store and David’s recent dance moves. Also, BRAAAMS.

That's what it's all about, interrupting someone's life, making them see all the things they took for granted. When they go back and buy all this stuff from the shelves with the insurance money, they'll have to think for the first time in a long time why they wanted all this stuff, what it's for. You take it away, and you show them

what they podcasted. That was a great impression of Alex Haw. That wasn't bad, right? It was excellent. A great impression of someone no one's ever heard. Yeah. Griffin finally did a good impression, guys. And it has no application outside of what I just did.

Hello, ladies, gentlemen, germs, burglars, mind thieves, anarchists, TARS robots, magicians, Joey Pants. Spoiler alert, we're going to put some pants on in this miniseries. My name's Griffin Newman. I'm David Sims. Yep. Spoiler alert, we're going to put some pants on in this miniseries. We are. My name's Griffin Newman. I'm David Sims. This is a podcast called Blank Check with... Griffin and David. Two people we just mentioned. We're not going to do some crazy Nolan-esque fractured narrative where you don't find out

who is hosting the show. Blank Check with Griffin and Griffin? Yeah, what? Oh no, it was David all along. This is a podcast about filmmakers. Autors, one could argue. Sure. Filmmakers who had massive success early on in their career

and then were given a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion projects they wanted. Sometimes those checks clear. They do. Sometimes. Once in a while. Every once in a while they do. But this guy, more often than not.

This guy, I would argue pulled one of the craziest moves of all time which is what seems like his big blank check movie ended up being so big that it's the kind of

movie that would have given someone else a blank check you're right you're right checks on checks yeah it's a check within a check he's got some check

style stacked up I got him I got him with that one checking I got my boy with that one your boy yeah my boy Benny oh hey your boy yeah my boy benny producer ben yeah ben ducer you were we haven't even finished the introduction but yeah we were ben the poet laureate finance film critic the tiebreaker birthday benny the haas all those things mr positive mr positive yeah dirt bike benny oh for sure the meat lover the fart detective

oh my god they keep going on. It's not Professor Crispy. No. He is the peeper. Yeah. You see him in the streets, wish him a hearty hello fennel. Please. And of course, he's graduated to certain titles over certain miniseries, a concept I still haven't established within the body of this episode.

Good. Such as producer Ben Kenobi, Ky Ben Ben Night Shyamalan Ben's 8 Say Benny Thing Ailey Ben's with a dollar sign and Warhaz that's a good one

I like Warhaz it slides right in there I think yep I moved my microphone so we do miniseries we pick a director

and we go through their films one episode per movie to track their career you never said sometimes they bounce baby said sometimes they bounce, baby.

Oh, sometimes they bounce, baby. Just FYI. Just wanted you to get that out there. That's our favorite boy, Benny. And this is a new miniseries on the films of Christopher Nolan. And it is called... I didn't even check the poll. I assume you did.

With a smashing 52%, I believe, was the final outcome. It was close. It was neck and neck the whole time. It was fun watching it happen. The Pod Knight casts. That's right. The Pod Knight casts. I think the right one won.

The right Knight won. I think so, too. Just looking at him, I was like, you know, why play it safe? Why not sound like a bad Batman podcast? Sure. And I also think this is our first miniseries title. Miniseries title?

This is our first miniseries title that I think kind of almost sounds like it's establishing a new character. The Pod Knight? Yeah, who's the Pod Knight? It's this English guy. Well, we don't know yet. We're going to figure that out. No spoilers.

Today we're covering the first film that Christopher Nolan made in 1998. It was a film he wrote, directed, shot, I believe edited as well himself. Yes, he did all those things. Very much a one-man production. Made for $6,000. Released on one screen. Sure. Well, released at festivals, various festivals.

Sure. It was sort of a calling card film. Came out in Britain, I think, in some tiny way as well. And only three films later, he'd be making Batman. Crazy. Crazy. Absolutely crazy. Not only that that but just like

seven years later like yeah it wasn't even you know yeah he went from 6,000 to like 175 million in six years

little Englishman little Englishman and this is Scrappy Film you know Christopher Nolan has been on the record is saying

that he doesn't really believe in film school he thinks the best film school is making a movie and this is very much a movie that feels like him teaching himself how to make a movie. Yeah, it's a film school movie

and I don't mean like it feels like it was made by somebody in film school. I feel like it, yeah, like you say, it feels like someone who's like, oh yeah, oh I could put the camera here maybe. Right, and I guess what's kind of interesting about Christopher Nolan is just how quick that learning curve seemed to be. For sure, but what's that movie called?

The movie's called Following. This is also a movie that to me is a really good example of why you want professional actors in your movies. No beef with the movie, but you watch this,

then you watch Memento. Sure. You know, you're like, wow, wow, look at these actors. I mean, I got a lot of things to say about the acting in this movie,

but we'll get to it. Good and bad. I had a lot of interesting thoughts watching the performances in this movie. I had a lot of interesting thoughts say about the acting in this movie, but we'll get to it. Good and bad. I had a lot of interesting thoughts watching the performances in this movie. I had a lot of interesting thoughts watching this movie, which I was happy about considering Yoey's Worry with the Wide Awakes. Well, not Wide Awakes. Praying with

Angers, you know. With the Piranha 2s. Right. Your Lost World Jurassic Park, the first film. These amateurish first films by directors. These little test tube babies. Have you seen the film before? I had.

When I was in university in Britain. Wait, no, but you're American. I know, but I lived in Britain for a great period of time. Wait, what? I would have heard about this.

I would have heard about this if it happened. I would have heard about this. We should Should we have an Inception noise drop that we just do every time? Anyway, yes. Living in Britain, I believe I had already seen Memento, Insomnia, and Batman Begins. Humblebrag. I was like, you know what I should check out, though, is that dude's first movie.

It was on DVD. I got it on Love Film, which was the early competitor to Netflix, which has now been crushed and subsumed by it in Britain. And I watched it. And you know what I remembered? None of it. Yeah, same here. So I remember.

I remember that it was was black and white. That's about it. My local video store was called TLA, great video store. Is it gone now? Yep. Rip. I think it's a chain that still exists in maybe San Francisco. Maybe. Maybe. Carry on. And sometimes they

bounce. Maybe. But the thing I loved especially when I was like a nerdy teenager preteen boy were you

really really was really getting into movies was they would organize their movies by director sure rather than by genre so you could just be like

let me get the next one right cause I'd be like Altman let me crack open Altman and it was like all the Altman was just kind of there and I can even sort of

strategize like reading the boxes and going like what do I want to watch next you know but I would always I was really into Christopher Nolan it's funny that you've never said this before about the video store because that's

probably one reason you like the director focused approach of this podcast it was drilled into you from a young age. Because I would do that. You went to an auteur video store. Yes, I did. I kind of consume

media in general that way. People go like, oh, any new bands you're listening to? Essentially, I will get into a band and then try to listen to everything they've ever done before I get into a new band. I have this sensation. get into a band and then try to listen to everything they've ever done before I get into a new band. I get you. I have this sensation.

For these four months, I'm all about Fleetwood Mac. I'll admit that the TV's changing of TV has kind of made me feel different. That's changed. I just can't watch everything anymore. But you're connoisseurs of context. We know this.

We love context. And you're also collectors. Very much so. So you have to collect the whole disaggregation that's true and i remember like you know i i would go do you remember all music i mean it's still a website i used to go to all music all the time did you ever use all music i like swore by that yeah that fucking website where it would be like yeah well the best two you know albums by X or Wild Gift and Los Angeles like those are the five stars and then you know here's your interesting ones

you know you'd look at the discography it was kind of like IMDB for albums I guess it still exists but no one uses it anymore I think it just was one of those things that did not keep up it's like format and now it just looks like garbage it was like IMDB but for albums but there were also reviews in there like I guess albums also just became less of a thing.

Yeah. But if I was getting into Cheap Trick, I'd look up Cheap Trick's page, and there you have in order all of their albums. Sure. There's an official review and a star rating for each one. I'm looking at it now. Sometimes star ratings were contested, you know? Yeah.

And then also re-releases, different versions, so you understood what tracks existed out there and stuff like that. But like sometimes I get in a band like Cheap Trick and be like, okay, they really only had like 10 years there where they were really in the pocket. I'm only going to buy these six albums. And sometimes it would be this sense of like completing everything. And what's weird is that at the time I got really into Nolan, like I was, I flipped out

over Batman Begins. Yes, yes. And then I went back and watched Memento and Insomnia and it was like, he only had four films at that point. I remember seeing

following there on the shelf and being like, oh, this movie looks really small. This was like his real early thing and never watching it until five years ago when they remastered for the Criterion Collection.

They did a screening at the IFC. Right. I went with Sam Rogal, past and future guest of this podcast. Past. And. As you know, he's banned.

I can't even remember what the opinion was, but he's banned. He'll be very happy to hear that you can't remember what the opinion is. No, I do. I'm listening back through the back catalog again. I'll get to it again. Whatever it was. He's genuinely miffed. Oh, I'm sorry.

He's going to launch a whole campaign, a retrial. God, no. No more campaigns. Just FYI, all listeners. Oh, yeah. By the He's going to launch a whole campaign, a retrial. God, no. No more campaigns. Just FYI, all listeners. Oh, yeah. By the way. Do not campaign to be on this podcast. Yeah, we don't believe in campaigning in the abstract.

That worked once. We went to see if they remastered the film and Nolan presented it. Right. Actually, I found some article that's a report of that very screening or the Q&A or whatever. Yeah. But like, so I saw it in a theater with Nolan presenting. It's like a night I remember vividly and also remembered none of this movie.

Look, it's not that memorable a movie. It's a good calling card film. I actually liked it more watching it this time, I think. It's a good calling card film. I feel like once in a while, especially now that I'm a critic and I see a lot of movies, you see these movies where you're like, this guy is going to be big.

I just know it. This director, there's a lot of panache here like I mean I guess Crescia was a movie like that Crescia was a better movie than following that was that felt like it but you know same kind of vibe right where you're like a lot of talent on display. Van Wilder the same thing you could tell the Walt Baker had

Walt Baker I fucked it up. I fucked up my one bit. I mean you should give this movie a little bit of credit it went on to become like a syndicated show on like broadcast TV. Hey, Ben. What? I can't tell if you're kidding or not.

What do you mean? The Kevin Bacon show? It's like about this movie, right? Is this a joke? No. I mean, I've never watched the show, but it's called Following. It's called The Following. You should watch The Following because, boy, what a stinker. I think we even talked about it on this podcast once. I think we did.

My sister on the tick was on The Following. Yes, Valerie Curry. A murder lady. Yeah, it was about a man who ran a serial killer cult based around the work of Edgar Allen Poe. Oh, that's totally different. And his acolytes would go around wearing Edgar Allan Poe masks, like lighting people on fire and shit. So it's based on The Raven?

The Cusack movie? I mean, The Raven was based on it. Isn't The Raven about Edgar Allan Poe himself solving a murder? But it's copycat murder. Right, right. It's like someone's been killing people in the style of Edgar Allan Poe and they're like, only one man can solve this. Edgar Allan Poe! What a premise. That's can solve this Edgar Allen Poe what a premise that's terrible I mean

I thought it was every episode they would break into someone's house and then go on a little adventure I mean that's a good show I mean you could probably pitch that show anyone out there what is it ABC it was Fox it was Fox Rebooted with my version you know what the thing about that show was though Kevin Bacon only did it because he'd lost all his money to Bernie Madoff. Correct, he got Madoffed. Because, like, everyone was like, why are you in this? Like, surely you don't have to be in this serial killer show.

And he was like, no, like, you know, it's good. I want to be in it. And, like, it's, like, revealed. Like, he's, you know, he's struggling right now. He got Madoffed really hard. I love Kevin Bacon. You've often referred to him as your favorite actor. He's my favorite actor, along with Colin.

But he was a guy who, like, I'd say past a certain point, like maybe late 90s, early 2000s, started, like, not doing big studio films, doing sort of more interesting stuff, smaller parts of bigger things, you know, whatever it was. More independent projects. He's had a weird career.

But it makes sense that, like, he had money from when he was sort of more of a capital A movie star. And then he got made off. And then he was like, fuck, I gotta do some money thing. A lot of... That way he loves dick. He loves dick. Yes, he does. As do I. Anyway.

I was gonna say. Love his dick. Well, it is a great penis. Sure. No disagreement there. A lot of crew people on the tech worked on Following. The Following. Worked on The Following. Not on this film. And they say, well, maybe.

You don't speak for them. This film didn't seem to have much of a crew. I think it was mostly Mr. Christopher Nolan. I mean, I did crafty on it, but you've never asked. How old would you have been, like? I was nine. Nine years old? Making grilled cheese sandwiches. If you asked me how my life for once, you would have like? I was nine. Nine years old? If you actually asked me. Making grilled cheese sandwiches.

If you asked me about my life for once, you would have found that out. Yeah. Uh-huh. I definitely don't know much about your life. Nothing. I am a steel box. You're a man of mystery. Right.

Exactly. Old brick wall Newman over here. All right. Come on. What are you going to say? Are you still talking about the following? It's a very quick anecdote. I was just going to say, people worked on the following,

and they said that Kevin Bacon had this amazing power to any time they'd be like, okay, we're ready for Kevin on set. Can you grab Kevin? He would be there. Wow. It was like he had... That's what you call a veteran.

What one could call a sixth sense. You mean a stir of echoes. He had a stir of echoes. Because that was the thing with poor stir of echoes. He did have a stir of echoes. Got had a stir of echoes. Because that was the thing with poor stir of echoes. He did have a stir of echoes. Got crushed by the Sixth Sense. Same year. Yeah.

If only they had a Sixth Sense for moving their release date. They should have. Anyway, Danny kept film. Released around the same time as Following. Oh, Following. Following. So, do you guys want some Nolan backstory? Love some.

Let's do some Nolan backstory. I'm going to dig into something. 69 minutes long. Yeah. Yeah. Our episode will definitely be longer than the movie. Considering we just talked about a TV show that doesn't have anything to do with it for five minutes.

Yes. Christopher Nolan. Middle name. Edward. Oh boy. I'm really digging in. We're connoisseurs of context. Born in London.

Father an ad executive. He grew up in London? Yes. David, did you know him? I didn't, unfortunately. His mother was a flight attendant and English teacher. Okay. He has dual citizenship.

I think you mean British teacher, but go on. Dual citizenship and also spent some time in Chicago. Ben's giving me a thumbs up. Now, we all know that he has a younger brother, Jonathan. Jonathan Nolan. Okay, so you're going to get into the thing that I want to talk about. Yes, we're going to talk about it. Because I wasn't sure if this was going to be a Marsha Lucas thing.

No, no, no. I know about this too. But first, just to mention Jonathan Nolan, who worked with him, has worked with him on writing several, co-writing several of his movies. Most of his films. Memento is based on a short story that Jonathan Nolan who worked with him has worked with him on writing several co-writing several of his movies Memento was based on a short story that Jonathan Nolan wrote

and he worked on the not the first not the first oh you're right second and third Batman he wrote the script for Interstellar which I believe

Christopher then rewrote rewrote that was originally a spec script that he sold that Spielberg was going to direct

we'll get to that Inception was I think Chris and Chris alone but anyway and also he made the show Person of Interest which is a great TV show that was highly underrated

and now he's making Westworld with his wife Lisa Joy so we know about Jonathan the Nolan brothers there's an older brother ooh Ben do you know about this? Matthew Francis Nolan Ben you're gonna

fucking flip who went to as the English call it what the hell is a hilarious word that the English use for jail? The clink. Christopher Nolan's oldest brother is

a con artist. Oh shit. Matthew Nolan a Chicago resident so I think he went to jail in America. Yeah because Christopher Nolan's father

an American. Christopher Nolan, I believe, was mostly raised by his mother in England. But Jonathan Nolan, I believe, was mostly raised by his father in Chicago. I think you're right. Because Jonathan Nolan speaks with an American accent. I think they kind of grew up apart. And I've heard people freak out about this because Jonathan Nolan will give

interviews about Westworld and he has this sort of like, yeah, it's an American accent. It's kind of a somewhat muted American accent. And everyone is like, is this like some Nolan game? What's he doing?

Is he a Jeffrey Wright robot? Spoilers for Westworld. Sorry. But I believe they were mostly raised apart. And the sense I've always sort of gotten is that the, what's the oldest brother's name again? Sorry. Jesus.

I already forgot it. What the fuck is his name? Matthew. Yeah. Matthew Nolan, who was a, he, you know, he like ran bad checks and stuff. He was like a con artist. And the sense is that he kind of was the one who fell between the cracks.

It was like, okay, Chris landed in London. Sure. You know, Jonathan landed in Chicago. Sure. Chicago, we call it. Right. A windy city. But not Big Chicago.

That's, of course, our good friend, two-time Academy Award nominee, Michael Shannon. Of course. Big Chicago. Big Chicago himself. Thank you for referencing that. Anytime. Okay. Hey. Oh, just right now. Can you reference, what's his nickname again? Matthew Shannon? Michael Shannon? Big Chicago Big Chicago himself Thank you for referencing that Anytime Okay hey

Oh just right now Can you reference What's his nickname again Matthew Shannon Michael Shannon Two time Academy Award nominee Michael Shannon Big Chicago

Thanks for referencing that Anytime Anytime Yeah Right What happened to Matthew The oldest Nolan Yes

Arrested in 09 By the FBI At the peak of his Success I mean we're talking A year after Dark Knight At the peak of his Brother's success arrested in 2009 by the FBI. At the peak of his success. I mean, we're talking a year after Dark Knight. At the peak of his brother's success, to be clear. At the peak of his success.

I mean, if he was arrested, it means he was doing some big shit. By the FBI, too. It's not even local police. It's Federal Bureau. I mean, you've heard the joke. He can't even get arrested in this town. Matt Nolan could, and he did.

According to this, Matt Nolan. I keep thinking it's Michael. Matt Nolan arrested in February 2009 as he left bankruptcy court in Chicago, was charged by the FBI with the kidnapping and murder of a Florida accountant in

Costa Rica. He was extradited to Costa Rica and then later he escaped from prison. Nice. And was arrested again and sent back to prison. He was also being investigated by the Chicago police for a check-kiting scam, whatever that means, where he made a million dollars

by cozying up to local banks. Another charge says that he was using his, claiming to use his military skills, quote unquote, which I doubt existed, to run an international bank collection service. That's how he was trying to get a loan from someone in Costa Rica. So he's like, exactly, he's a confidence man. Right. Wait a second.

I mean, this is all alleged, and I'm reading it from a Chicago Tribune article in 2010. Maybe he made up the story. Maybe it's part of his grift. Maybe he wrote his own Wikipedia page. It's all about the long game. He has a wife and children, and I feel like this is something that nobody fucking acknowledges about Inception They all think it's about Christopher Nolan

Anyway We'll get to that on Inception I'm looking at Matt Nolan's Wikipedia page here It also says in 2008 there was an incident where he placed a bomb one bomb each on two different ferries but gave each ferry the opposite No, but Tiny Lister, he intervened

and everything was fine. No, yeah. All right. That was sweaty. Griffin did a good job holding up his, is that a Kindle? It's an iPad. It's an iPad. What?

You have an iPad now? I got an iPad now. Congrats. Holding up his iPad as if reading from a legal document. Yes. My Amazon Kindle Fire Bro. Probably that shoddy workmanship. Well, no, they're a great company.

I probably did something wrong. It was my fault. You jerked off on the Funko page too many times or whatever. Okay, well, you gentlemen are right. I like a good scam. He's trying to get me back on track. Yeah, which brings us to, we should maybe discuss the plot, unless you want to give a little bit more background.

I'm doing more context, Ben. I do not know what you're trying to do. Get me, David Sims, Mr. Back on Track, back on track. We're on track. How do you feel? I just, I feel great. I just saw a movie about train, a train that's on tracks. Unstoppable?

No, it's called In Transit. It's a documentary by Albert, you know, documentary by Albert How do you say his name? So it wasn't unstoppable Good I want to back up for a second In the years as the earth's crust Cooled around its molten core During the formation

Of the solar system. Picture me stroking a mustache with the cape, grabbing that little, that lever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Diverting the train off the tracks. Because, baby, I want to focus in on a word that you threw away like it was nothing. What? Confidence, man.

Sure. People talk about con man conning. It gets abbreviated so much people don't think about the origins of the word. But the idea of a con artist is the fact they're trafficking in confidence. Yes. They instill confidence in people. They exude so much confidence in themselves that people trust them. They can get away with things.

I think it is. All the great confidence men it was true of. Charles Ponzi. Yes. Bernie Madoff, who did such a great job taking Kevin Bacon's money. Sawyer from Lost. The Joker. Carry on.

Why so serious himself? Richard T. Joker. Yes. But I think that is the main thing that Christopher Nolan movies are interested in, is the concept of confidence. Can I tell you some more context before we get to the movie itself? Sure, but you understand why I want to lay that seed in the ground? I think it's important to a lot of his storytelling. Right.

And I think it's important to, yeah, I think you're totally right. This is the part of the magic trick where I go, oh, look, confidence. Yes. Oh, okay. All right. Now I see. Is this going to be the worst miniseries ever? I feel like we're making so many jokes about

like the structure of his movies well they're famed for their structure yeah no no this is gonna be a great miniseries it's going great so far you don't think so I think it's a great episode and also I think it's how do you think this is going Ben it's going alright um but uh what I think is appropriate

for kind of how we've been jumping around is I feel like Christopher Nolan he's like sort of a master of time right that's like his wheelhouse is like all of his movies are sort of just

he's a time lord is what you're saying he's definitely a time lord he is English right right he is no you're right you're right Ben he loves to play with time

much like yeah what if they because we're waiting to hear who the new doctor is going to be on Doctor Who what if they just announced it was Christopher Nolan and he was like

well I've always wanted to act yes doctor is going to be on Doctor Who. What if they just announced it was Christopher Nolan? And he was like, well, I've always wanted to act. Yes, it's going to be nice. All right. His uncle worked at NASA. Okay. He loved Star Wars. At eight, he made a stop motion animation homage named Space Wars. What a dork.

Only nerds like Star Wars. Always wanted to be. Yeah, exactly. What an asshole. Yeah. Fucking dipshit. Always wanted to be exactly what an asshole. Yeah. Fucking dipshit. Always wanted to be a filmmaker from a young age.

He moved to Chicago when he was a teen so I think everyone was in Chicago at some point. Uses Chicago a lot in his films. Right.

But then he moved back to England at some point as well because he was educated at UCL for university which is in England probably the best place to go if you want

to study film. Okay. And I think he did a lot of film stuff there. He met Emma Thomas there. Not Thompson. No, not Emma Thompson. Emma Thomas, who is his wife and producing partner. And he made some tiny little short films

which I've never seen. One of them screened before following when I saw it. They probably showed Doodlelebug. Yes. Which was sort of his first, he made two before then, but in 97 he made Doodlebug. Right. Which is a three minute little movie about someone chasing an insect around the room or something. Okay, so here's what the movie

is. Jeremy Theobald star of Following. Yep. Is in like a run down flat. Yep. He's trying to catch a bug with a shoe. Sure. And then he finally hits it. And then you see that he's a bug and there's a giant shoe in a hand and they're trying to squish him. Sounds great. That's like the whole

thing. Sounds like Men in Black. It's like a Farside cartoon. It's like one visual concept. It's three minutes long. It's three minutes long, probably 90 seconds if those are credits. It's really short. I remember being like, oh fuck, Rogal, we're going to get to see a Nolan short. And it was just like,

really fast. Nolan short, more like a Nolan chart. But that's too, it feels like that's too critical. I thought it was fine. I thought it was well crafted. It was just small. That's great. Short and length.

The thing is, he doesn't really like the British film scene. British film scene is pretty insular. Most British films are only funded with lottery money. There's not a lot of money to take. There's like working title. There's the guys who make the Richard Curtis movies and stuff. But there's not a lot of money.

No Batman. Literally zero Batman. That's true. So instead, he just scrapes together his own money and from family and friends and shit, makes this movie following. Shoots it in London over the course of a year on 16 millimeter film. Because he would like have the money to buy one roll of film.

Right. And they would shoot it. They would like rehearse a scene to death. So they didn't have to do multiple takes. They do like one or two takes tops. It was all available lighting. All available lighting. It was all like scouting out locations where he knew there was enough light, you know? Yes. Yeah, but it was like

they'd shoot a roll. It had been rehearsed for a while. They'd get there. They'd knock a couple takes out. He'd wait for it to develop. He'd watch it. He'd cut it together with what he had before. And then maybe like a month later, they'd shoot another roll. You know, it was very segmented. It was very piecemeal. Everyone kept their day jobs.

Right. Emma Thomas and Jeremy Theobald, who's the star, they helped produce it. Yeah. He did most everything else. Yeah. David Julian did the score. Okay. Who does the score for Memento and for Insomnia. Oh, interesting. The guy who does the kind of like nice haunted little weird organ

scores. Yeah. For all those movies, which I like those scores a lot. Yeah, this one's a little synthy for my taste, but that's more the resources he had. Yeah, I mean, sometimes it's like there's a chase scene and the score is just like some crackling. Right. I feel like the theme's pretty strong. It sounds pretty like Casio keyboard-y. Yeah. Yeah, sure.

It sounds pretty like Casio keyboard-y. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. And the movie does well at the Toronto Film Festival, gets some good little reviews, like the Times writes it up, you know, and then he's off to the races, basically.

He's off to the races. We'll cover Memento next week. Next week. You know, that's his real calling card, but this was his calling card to get a calling card. Yeah. Right? I don't know. This was him writing a letter calling card to get a calling card. Yeah. Right? I don't know. This was him writing a letter of intent

to acquire a calling card. Right, right. He's like, I would like to formally request a calling card. Christopher Nolan impressions are going to get really boring. Yeah, he's not... He's hard to do.

One of the problems with him is he's... Because the bits, he's very dry. He's so dry. He's so dry. He doesn't play into it either. He doesn't, like, make fun of himself. No, not at all.

No, no. Can I throw my two complaints for the week? Sure, yeah. Once again, no one should ever make a TV show. Right. You know, asterisk, tick is going to be great. It's a great show. I'm really happy.

No one should ever make it. Number two, too hot. Things shouldn't be this hot. It's quite hot today. Ben, do I think it's hot? Yeah, just looking for you to weigh in. Too hot. Things shouldn't be this hot. It's quite hot today. Ben? Do I think it's hot? Yeah, just looking for you to weigh in. Too hot. Hmm.

Well, personally, I'm not that much of a temperature queen. I don't mind. So you're saying we can't call you the temperature queen? No. No. Okay. That was a great Ben moment. But we could say, much like you're not Professor Crispy,

that you're not the temperature queen. I suppose I set myself up for that, didn't I? How did you not see that coming? I don't know. Well, yeah, I'm not that bothered by the heat. Hey, I think it sucks. Cancel it. I'm like Ice Age 2.

Baby, I want the meltdown. Isn't the meltdown when it gets hot, though? Oh, you're right. I guess it's the end of the Ice Age. You want Ice Age 1 when it's just an Ice Age. No, I want Ice Age 4. Continental trip. That's 5.

It doesn't matter. Collision? No, that's 5. That's 3. 3's Collision Course. 3's Age of That's three. Three is... Three's Collision Course. No, because three's Age of the Dinosaurs. Dawn of the Dinosaurs? It's probably Dawn of the Dinosaurs.

Four is Continental Drift. Five is Collision Course. I want that. Ice Age, three, baby. I think you're right. Dawn of the Dinosaurs. Okay, great. That's established.

Balaway. Yeah, so not part of the Ice Age franchise. Not yet. Not yet. Not yet. Maybe Ice Age 6 will tease following somehow. It'll be like Tokyo Drift. What if this movie just had Scrat in it? What if it was the exact movie you saw in the middle

and it was just a little Scrat short? Okay. Here's the premise of following. He wants that acorn. He does. He wants it. Sometimes he puts it in the wrong place, though. 15 years later.

I guess. He still hasn't gotten it. I haven't seen. I saw the first Ice Age. You know why I saw the first Ice Age? Everyone saw it. Because you were a kid. Is that the joke you're going to make?

No. Why? Because in Britain, the Attack of the Clones trailer was attached to it. Oh, interesting. And we were told, like, you want to see the trailer, like, you got to go see Ice Age. So I took my brother, who was still young enough to give a shit about Ice Age. Well, I think, you know, if you're young at heart, you're the right age to give a shit about Ice Age.

I was 16, so I was not the right age to give a shit about Ice Age. Sounds like you weren't young at heart. I saw that one, but I have not seen the next four. I saw two and I tapped out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a four. I saw two and I tapped out. That's a real mark of quality on the Ice Age franchise. You tapped out. I couldn't stick with it. The premise of following is this.

There's a little shithead called the young man. He doesn't have a name. No one in this has a name. Played by Jeremy Theobald. Excuse me, one character has a name. You're right. Sorry. Of course he does. He's an aspiring writer. Feels like a, you know, half of a self-portrait, I guess.

Yeah, he's sort of like a, you know, David Thewlis in Naked minus the methamphetamines. Right. He's just a shithead. Right. With like floppy hair. Yeah, he's got floppy hair. And he lives in like a dirty flat in London. He fancies himself a writer.

So he's been following people around like so that he can like observe them and maybe write about them or something. Which of course, you know, cinema is an art form of voyeurism. You're sure? Yes. He's also looking real good with that long leather jacket. He's got a long, I'm all about the fashion. This movie,

let me tell you. Really? I love it. There's leather jacket. There's a lot of suits. Great. Nice. Like ill fitting,

but sort of like, like skinny tie. Like, I don't know. There's some, yeah, there's some vibe there. I'm just into,

I actually, it made me want to get a skinny tie and get a new suit, see you in this movie. I'd love to see you in both. I'm working on it. Griffin and I were just at David Ehrlich's wedding. Oh, yeah. Last weekend. Big, big shout out to David Ehrlich.

Two-time guest, yes. Congratulations on his wedding. Here's a hot scoop for you, Ben. I was in a suit, that's why I thought of it. Yeah. As were you. David Sims at David Relic's wedding

I swear this is true I swear this is true and I wish I had footage some sort of documentation so people would believe me but you just have to take my word for it

our friend David over here raised the roof oh I did raise the roof that's right he raised the roof now on the dance floor multiple times multiple times one could argue it was maybe I did raise the roof. That's right. He raised the roof. Now, on the dance floor?

Multiple times. Multiple times. One could argue it was maybe one of only two moves he had. Excuse me, I have three moves. Okay, can I tell you what the three moves were? Yeah. One was palms flat. Paws, I call them.

Paws, hands above ear level, like a right around ear level. And then he sticks the finger out and does a little bit of like... No, no, I don't really... It's mostly paws. The fingers rarely stuck out. But then there's some pointing comes in. No, the pointing is if you pull your arms in, you know? It was a little like how Killer Croc swims in Suicide Squad. It was a little like this. Cool. That's a good look. Yeah, I know. It's a great look. Okay, then dance move

number two. Flip those hands over. Uh-oh. What's happening to the roof? Lift them up, you're raising the roof. Wait, what's happening to the roof? That's up, you're raising the roof. What's happening to the roof? That's a unique way of raising the roof. It's almost like you're lifting the roof. He was raising it. Working hard. Yeah, I mean, you could flip him this way, too.

Look, he had range, okay? Sure. Move number three. Yeah. You flip those hands back down. Okay, palms facing the floor, but then you push. Ooh, you got to lower the floor. I think I only did that once.

At one point, David said the floor was getting too high, and he had gotta lower the floor. I think I only did that once. At one point, David said the floor was getting too high and he had to lower the floor. Oh boy. It was great. We were all dancing like David. I'm a great dancer, guys. I don't know what to tell you. But I swear to God, he raised the roof. I did raise the roof.

And it was high. It was a high roof. It was a barn. We were in a barn. We were in a barn. And honestly, what we should do is, fans, if you want to see a picture of David or a video, just bother him on Twitter. Please do. I will definitely not mute you. He loves that. If you do that.

He loves it. So we've got this young man. Or invite David to your wedding. Yeah, he'll do it there if you have a wedding David can we make this deal here if you go to a wedding you will raise the roof

oh I guess so you don't have to accept every invitation but I will raise the roof if I go right if you go the gift you will bring to be fair

as long as there is dancing I don't want to be at like some solemn church service okay well wait a second I don't think that's fair. Raising, all right, fine. But I might quietly raise the roof. That's fine.

But I think if someone has gone out of their way, if someone has gone out of their way to invite you to their wedding, I don't think the onus should be on them to have to like pay a DJ, rent a dance floor. I think you should raise the roof regardless of what kind of structure you're in. One more question.

One more question. What if it's an outdoor wedding with no structure at all? No structure. No structure. No roof to be raised. Now, when you, let me just clarify,

when you say no structure, do you mean there is both a lack of physical structure that the wedding is housed with? Yes. Is this a lawless, chaotic wedding? Sure, sure. It's just chaos.

Is this Richard T. Joker's wedding? Exactly. What is this? The Joker. Richard T. Joker. No, I know. For Christ's sake. You don't know his first name is Richard.

Just let's get out of this bit. Richard T. Joker. Oh, just one last question. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If a Mennonite or an Amish person invites you to a barn raising. I feel, oh, to an actual barn raising. Yeah, yeah. And then they finish it off

and they're going to put the roof on. Would you be into raising the roof with them? You think that's disrespectful? I think that's disrespectful. I think that's a case in which he has to lower the floor. Fine. Okay, well, then we've decided. In that case, I will lower the floor.

David, here's my final ruling. Sure. Okay? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If the wedding is unstructured in terms of planning. Sure. And physical.

Well, this is what I'm saying. Jesus Christ. If the wedding is well organized, but outdoors. Oh my God. Yeah. You don't have to raise the roof. Fine. If the wedding is disorganized and outdoors, you got to build a roof and raise it.

Makes sense. Makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. I got to lead by example. Okay. That's what you're saying. Please invite David to your wedding. David L. Sims on Twitter. Great. Yeah. Yeah. I gotta lead by example. Okay. That's what you're saying. Please invite David to your wedding.

David L. Sims on Twitter. Great. Yeah, I won't come. I don't like... Brother fallout on Reddit. That's right. Yes. I believe my flair is back in the rack. I finally figured out how to have flair. Back in the old spice rack. Exactly. So

this young man, Jeremy Theobald's character. Non actor no but uh he was friend of nolan's yeah he's in other nolan movies but in tiny room a couple things but i went to his wikipedia page he works in like government yeah this this is it they were just buds yeah i think he works in like social uh city planning or something like that that's great great he's giving back i think he's good in this i think he's not bad at all especially for someone who's like not an actor i think he's pretty good yeah i think we might be on the same page regarding the ensemble yeah i think there's some weak links but i i was very

impressed with him he's just got a very engaging screen presence he's got a great voice he's got a good voice he does have just like a really good character voice sort of quasi playing two characters or two modes of the character because he's playing him as this sort of shitty guy. And then you're cutting in between to like a later story. Right. But later part of the story where he's sort of in his suit and he's more dressed up. Yeah, he's good. I'm forgetting her name now, but the woman who directed Mustang.

Who is that person's name? She's got a three-part name and I totally forget it. In her mailbag episode we were asked what directors we want to see make more films.

Denise Gamze-Erguven. I mean, you know. I'm not sure how to pronounce. Love Mustang. Very excited to see whatever she makes next. I think she just announced something.

But I heard this really interesting interview with her where she was talking about the six girls in that movie that she had to cast and all of them were not actors really before that.

And she said like some of them were kind of wanted to be actors, came to an audition. Some of them she like spotted in airports, you know? Yeah. But she said her first round audition was she always had the woman, the young woman come in and would like hide an object in a room

and be like, can you find the key? And it was because she wanted to see if their physical behavior changed at all in terms of self-consciousness once the camera was rolling. That's interesting. Like, here's a very basic task. I'm not asking you to read anything. I'm not asking you to play anything out. I want to see if I notice any imperceptible or perceptible change

in your physical comfort level if there's a camera rolling on you while you do this. It would be for me. Right. For sure. Jeremy Theobald is a guy where it's just like a lot of this movie is him looking at stuff, going around rooms, following people around and he does have like a really steady

physical presence which sounds like faint praise. I'm interested in your praise. I'm interested in your praise. I was very impressed with him watching that, because that's the stuff that's especially hard to do, I think, for someone who has no experience acting, no experience on camera. But still, imagine your Guy Pearce.

I agree. I agree. Okay, all right. So I think I'm into that in general, into your praise. Cool. He meets, he follows another man named Cobb. Right. Because the beginning scene, he's talking to this older man, who I believe is Nolan's father?

Nolan's uncle. Uncle, okay. Who is an actual British actor. You can tell. His name is John Nolan, and he is like a guy. Right. He's in a lot of Nolan movies, but he's also in... He's got British character actor voice. He's got the... he's in plenty of stuff he was actually in

27 episodes of Person of Interest he was like a sort of minor villain in that movie in that show a little nepotism yeah a little nepotism a little nepotism

I mean one could say it was a bit of nepotism yeah you know that joke in School of Rock where Jack Black is claiming that he

like almost got hired to be part of Yo-Yo Yama's orchestra and he goes like got hired to be part of Yo-Yo Ma's orchestra and he goes like got it nailed the odd dish instead the job goes to Yo-Yo Ma's

nephew Lil Nepotiz right and for years I thought he was saying Yo-Yo Ma's nephew was Lil Nepotiz Lil Nepotiz Ma

sure like for 10 years and then I was like remember when he's like cello cello you got a bass that's funny i might have laughed for four straight scenes at that that's a good movie yeah have you seen school of rock benny pen knows i want to talk to him he's lowering his mic yeah no i haven't seen it really oh man you'd love it do you like jack black i do do you like schools i um like school movies, here's the thing.

I was a band kid, and I sort of- It's about band. I know, but I sort of have this weird relationship to band because I think it was a thing that was good for me, but it also made me feel like somewhat of an outcast because band kids don't fit in with the cool kids. This is what School of Rock's about. He goes to these band kids or these nerds and goes like,

you're next door neighbors with rock stars. You're so close to being a fucking rock star. Cholo, you got a bass. All right. I'll check it out. What was your instrument? I played trumpet.

Nice. Also trombone. Also tuba. Also French horn. The brass. I also was able to play tenor saxophone, clarinet.

You could play clarinet? Jesus Christ. How could you do all this? Why aren't you a musician? I can read music. That's great. And you can work those reeds. I could. I could get the reeds real wet. What do you call

a brass? You don't call it a reed, right? What do you call it on a trumpet? Mouthpiece. Mouthpiece, right. I had a good embouchure. That's the positioning of your mouth when you play the different brass instruments. Stop turning this podcast into some fucking dirty fuckfest. I'll bring the trumpet in one time.

You let me know when, I'll bring my trumpet in. That sounds great. Would you say that in your high school- Do you want to do a new theme song? Like, Ben on the trumpet? Yeah. But wait, David, this is very important what I'm about to say. Shoot.

Ben, would you say that back in your high school days you got down to brass tacks? Would you say that? I think this was very important. Got down to brass tacks. Ben, did you ever get down to brass tacks? Jesus Christ. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Sure. Sure. Okay. So, he meets this guy called Cobb. Ooh. Yeah. Sure. Sure. Okay. So he meets this guy called Cobb. Ooh, interesting. Like the salad. And also like.

The main character of Inception. The Inceptionator himself. And a similar character, one might say. Richard T. Inception himself. Who plums into people's dreams. Yes. This character does it more literally by plumbing their apartment. Yes.

But what is an apartment if not the place where dreams are made? True. And as he learns, everyone has a box. Yes. And he opens it. Yes. And what's in it? Stuff. Secrets. Things you can steal. So I would say your problem with following,

the problem with following, I guess, is Cobb. Uh-huh. Because he should be this like insanely charismatic character. Right. Because one, he does something that makes no sense, which is he breaks into apartments, doesn't steal a lot of stuff, mostly just kind of like rifles things around

and like to freak people out. Yeah. And he's like, it's fine. one's gonna care uh right that's the movie's about i guess as a currency sure but he's he should be super conf i mean super charismatic sure and uh also uh he's you know uh he's a liar he is a liar and uh you liar. And he's pulling a fast one on our main character in some ways. Shades of Trump. Not to get too political here. You're saying that Cobb believes in fake news? Yes. There is that scene where he holds up a newspaper and yells, sad.

And I think that this guy, Alex Hall, who never made another movie, it's his only credited role. He's not like the worst. No, I think he's fine. He's fine. He's got an affect.

Your point is, imagine if this role was played by Tom Hardy. Sure. Imagine if you had someone with a lot of... I totally get why you would get sucked into this guy's world.

Because the whole point is this guy is getting sucked into Cobb's world. Because the whole point is this guy is getting sucked into Cobb's world. And of course that's what Cobb's trying to do. He's trying to suck him into his world so he can play him as a patsy. Spoiler alert. There's a twist. He wants to be the

producer Ben to that guy's reed instrument. Exactly. And then apart from John Nolan, who's the cop, the only other actor in this movie is Lucy Russell, who's a real actress. She's in stuff. She was in Tony Erdman.

Exactly, I was going to say. And she was, yeah, she's great. She's been around. She's the girl. Yes. And she's, you know, That is her character's name. The guy's got his eye on her. What? You don't think she's, you know, oh. That is her character's name. The guy's got his eye on her.

What? You don't think she's well-rounded? You don't think it's a well-rounded performance by her character? But, you know, I mean, this gets to something that is, you know, Nolan's detractors will throw this out as the first sort of strike, which is his movies are very exposition heavy. And part of it is because he likes these sort of Labyrinthian plots, these complicated plots where he needs people to explain the structure so that he's able to upend it. He has a lot of explaining. He's got a lot of explaining.

A lot. A lot. Here's the other element to that, though. I do think it's not just like, oh, well, sloppy. This is the only way he knows how to convey this information. I do think there's an element, too, where, like, Christopher

Nolan likes hearing people explain stuff. I think he does. I think he's also pretty good at shooting and writing it. Right. But I don't think it's just like, well, I got to set all this up. The only way to get it out of the way is to

have one scene where a character explains everything. Right. I think he finds people who know what they're talking about very dramatically engaging.

Right. Whether or not you do as well probably will dictate your mileage on how much you enjoy Christopher Nolan movies. I agree. But this is certainly

a movie where a lot of the movie is Cobb either explaining how they're going to execute the thing they're about to do next or explaining his theories on how people work. You know? Yes. He's Cobb-splaining humanity.

A lot of Cobb-splaining. And I think the guy does a solid workman-like job. But what you're saying is if you had someone who was a real kind of movie star. The way Nolan works with, I mean, you know. Well, here are your splainers in the Nolan if you think about it, right? Like Guy Pearce does a lot of splain and a memento. Michael Caine. Michael Caine is Mr. Splain.

One of the best. In the prestige, in the Batman movies. Like a guy who can make any dialogue sound natural and organic and emotional. Totally agreed. Obviously, Leonardo DiCaprio does just a heroic amount of explaining in Inception. Yeah. I mean, he's basically

a walking manual in those movies. Yes. But everyone does a lot of explaining in that movie. In those movies, the Inception trilogy. In that movie, sorry.

And, you know, even Insomnia, Al Pacino does a lot of explaining, although that's kind of the point is that he's supposed to be this, like, old dog

and he's like, he'd be a cop, you know, but, like like anyway, he does do a fair amount of explaining. Interstellar, he kind of divvies it up. It's kind of an ensemble explainer movie. Because David Gaiassi does the big scene that everyone always talks about. He's so good. So good. That scene's also like peak Nolan doing explaining really well.

And you remember his character's name in that movie. Jesus, I should know his character's name Romilly you're right It's like the only character in a movie with my sister's name Anyway Following we'll get to all these movies Yeah We're gonna get to all of those movies

We'll get there eventually We're not gonna do Interstellar No I'm kidding we totally are But in following Cobb's explaining How he likes to break into apartments and look at people's shit. Right. Do you take it, something, and they know why it's gone? Or what's his line?

He has his mantra that he repeats. That's the thing I said at the beginning. I mean, you take it away from them so they realize why they wanted it in the first place. Whatever the fucking thing is. Look, the point of the movie is the structure's wacky. He's playing with a wacky structure. It's the beginning of the film. We got him with John Nolan.

He's talking to him. He's sort of clean cut looking, you know? You take it away and you show them what they had. Exactly. And this sort of scene where you can't tell what the dynamic is between the two of them, you know? Is this a therapist situation? Is this an interview?

What's going on here? And then there are a lot of little pieces at the beginning that are all out of order, but you're seeing our main hero with a couple different looks. Uh-huh. We're seeing him with long, ratty hair. Yes. And with a close crop in the suit. A suit.

One of those Hosley babes. Leather jackets. Or you're seeing him talk to this woman. You're seeing him talk to Cobb. one of those Hosley babes. You're seeing him talk to this woman. You're seeing him talk to Cobb. You're getting a sense immediately of, oh, we're just being shown stuff. Later, this is all going to tie together for us.

So what's the plot? The plot is like he, while doing this, develops a crush on this blonde woman because they break into her apartment. There's pictures of her everywhere and he like steals her underwear and stuff. He's a very like kind of isolated, introverted, aspiring author who's trying to live vicariously through other people and trying to do this vague sort of research,

which is also just kind of like procrastination from doing anything. Exactly, because I mean, I feel like Nolan kind of hates this guy. Yeah. Like he's like, fuck this guy. He's not a real writer. You know, he's self-loathing. I think., he's like, fuck this guy. He's not a real writer. You know, he's self-loathing. I think... Like, he's like,

this guy's just a creep. This guy feels to me like who Nolan feels like he would have been if he wasn't smart. Sure. You know what I'm saying? Like, this is like

the shittier path he could have gone down. Yeah. Where Nolan's like, what an idiot. I observed con artists from a distance. You know,

this guy has to follow them. What a fucking dunce. Right. I don't like your Nolan impression. What a fucking dance. All right, I like it again. Right. I like it if you go,

Christopher Nolan. Hey, Ben. How you doing? Are you okay? I'm great. Ben, how are you doing? I'm great. Christopher.

Yes. I disagree with you. I think that that character is immersing himself into his art and I think that from a distance being all snooty tooty about it is like sort of obnoxious to me so I just want to say that to you wait who's being oh you're talking to

Christopher no David let me have the floor for a second well Bruce Ben aka Ben Dusser, a.k.a. No, no, no, no, no. Okay, get out of here. But I think that

the thing that comes up several times in the film is he doesn't seem to actually be writing anything. No, no. He's kind of immersing himself into this lifestyle, which I think is,

because he'd rather be someone like that. He'd rather be someone who's actually actualizing living in the world. And he sees Cobb. He'd rather be someone who's actually actualizing living in the world. And he sees Cobb. Cobb is this guy who's presented as being a man of ultimate confidence. He is so in control of

his own domain. He's an assured man. Right. Even if he does something weird. He's proactive. He's becoming a convert. Yes. I like the scene probably like a third of the way through the movie, whatever it is, you know, where they go to someone's apartment and the guy is like, he's a writer, you know, like this guy's like a writer.

He works in a bank, you know, and Cobb's like, no, this is like the apartment of a loser. Like this guy's on the dole. He doesn't even have a word processor. He just says typewriter. But he never writes. And you realize. This guy's a fucking amateur. Of course, it's that the guy's apartment.

Like it's never said at that moment but it is obviously that's what's happening he's trying to get Cobb to evaluate his life right and Cobb's whole thing is

everyone wants me to do this they want someone to look at their shit right which I mean sure fine it's a take it's a take

exactly at least he's got one in this takeless world. God, I wish we had some more takes going on these days. None of them takes! But of course, there's a fast one being pulled. We should acknowledge. What starts as just a following,

a sort of shadowing of this man into his world, very quickly leads to the young man kind of getting involved more and more. His hand's getting a little bit dirtier and dirtier in these incidents. I guess so. He's touching stuff. He's moving stuff. He's lifting stuff. Panties David.

They do talk about pawning stuff at some point. They are probably making a little bit of money. It's small scale but I'm saying he no longer has you know he's no longer a witness. He's an active participant. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And the reason for that is. What, you want to get to the twist? Yeah. Okay, it's a sequel to Unbreakable. It's been dead the whole time. It's a sequel to Unbreakable that's been dead the whole time. The entire time the movie's been dead. The movie's dead.

At the end, you zoom out and you realize that the film itself is in a coffin. Yes, and they go... As they always do at funerals. No, it's that Cobb wants the guy to start doing Cobb stuff all by himself. Wait a second. So we can frame him. David. Yeah.

If someone invited you to a funeral, would you get conflicted? Would you accidentally raise the coffin? Oh no! It's supposed to go down. Funerals are very serious occasions. I would never behave badly at a funeral. I take them very seriously.

You could always dig the ground. I mean, if I were a grave digger. Hard to do with flat palms though You're right David's a flat palms man Sorry about that Griffin made so much fun of my dancing It was so good

I was just watching so charmed Yeah I'm a great dancer Great dancer The twist is right He believes No go ahead sorry He believes he's taking the initiative This guy's starting to copy cop Great dancer. The twist is, right, he believes... No, go ahead, sorry. Well, he believes he's taking the initiative.

This boy who they steal stuff from... Right, this guy's starting to copy Cobb. Right, he gets... He's like, yeah. Sort of develops a crush on the idea of her, the photos of her, starts seeing her, realizes she's a former... She's sort of a model,

but was maybe also a call girl. Yeah, and is sort of wrapped up with some kind of a gangster who's like a bald guy. Some gross bald dude. I hate bald men! And you see some story she tells about this time that the bald guy murdered a man in front

of her with a hammer. Right. And you see that. She's a witness. And he's like, ah, hitting this guy with a hammer. Out. The movie's a little creepy. A little creepy. She says to him at a certain point that he is blackmailing her with photos

that he has of her. They're in a safe. Yes. And if someone were able to steal those photos from the safe She'd be free.

She'd be free. And he the white knight that he is decides with the techniques that he's sort of learned from his old pal Cobb

he's gonna rope Cobb into it and say, look, here's the deal. You help me get in there. Help me break the safe. I take the photos. You take the money. Yep.

Well, what's going on? Ooh, grift within a grift. Yes, there's a grift within a grift. What it really is, is they just need this guy to be the patsy for a frame job.

Yes, because Cobb and the lady are together having fucks they've had a few they've had a fuck or two and the bald guy is involved in some way as well I guess they're trying to get out from under the bald guy but they're going to use the Jeremy Theobald character to do that. Right. Maybe they killed the bald guy? Maybe. See, I've already forgotten. I watched it two hours ago. I just remembered the plot.

What it is is right. It's Cobb. The blonde is blackmailing the bald guy. Cobb's working for the bald guy and fucking the blonde. He frames Theobald's character, murders the blonde with a hammer, and makes it look like Theobald murdered the blonde. Right. And then he gets out with the money.

But what originally, so he thinks that he's doing this all of his own volition to help her. Yeah. Then he finds out that, oh. It sucks that the main characters have a name, FYI. Yeah. This is why this is all confusing. Very confusing.

He finds out, oh, Cobb and the lady are in cahoots. They are having all the fucks. Right. I'm upgrading it. We said they had a couple. I think they're having all of them. They've had a few. And Cobb broke into a home, saw a dead body.

Right. And was seen walking out of it. That's the thread we were missing. So he needs someone to be presumed as the possible murderer. The cops know Cobb. They know Cobb. He's up to no good. There was a witness at the scene of the crime.

She saw him walking away. He didn't kill that woman, but how is he going to be able to defend himself from that accusation? Sure. So he trains the young man to grift. And to behave like Cobb. And wear suits. Yes.

And get a haircut so that he looks enough like Cobb that they can frame him with a crime. And the woman reveals this to Theobald. Now he feels like, ooh, I got the upper hand. I was going to get fucked, but now I figured it out. I figured out how to fuck. Right. My fuck style. Right. hand I was going to get fucked but now I figured it out I figured out how to fuck right style right although when he was breaking in and stealing the photos which were not of her were random photos

in the safe he also attacked a man with a hammer right so he's now implicated in two hammer right crimes I got away before hammer crime stop hammer crime do you like that crimes. I got away before. Hammer crime. Stop. Hammer crime. Did you like that? Hey Ben, did you like

that? Yeah. Thank you. Ben was shaking his head. Ben was not interested in that. Ben Hosley is not a fan of that. It wasn't a good bit. No, it was not a good bit at all. It was terrible.

Exactly. And Hosley didn't like it. Let's do this all day. One man, one producer. A critic, if you will. Didn't like a bit. The finest critic. Oh, boy.

In a world where Ben Hosley disliked bits, but it's this world. All right. I'm seeing Landline. Because he didn't like that bit. What are you saying? While we were doing all that, I booked a screening to Landline, the new Jillian Robespierre joint. Oh, cool. Is it about old school phones?

I believe it is set in the 90s. Oh, shit. You guys heard of this decade? You guys heard of this shit? It's set inside. The 1990s? It's set inside a phone cord. It's like Wreck-It Ralph.

Yeah. Except on the inside of a phone. You know the Emoji Movie is set in a phone, right? Yeah. Yeah, you know about that, right? The Emoji Movie? Express Yourself? You know it's about a guy who wants to be a meh emoji?

Yeah, but he's got too many emotions to be a meh. He's not just a meh. Do you think he's going to learn that it's okay to have more than one emoji face? Well, yeah, with his friend's jailbreak played by Anna Faris and the high-five emoji played by James Corden, but the high-five's got a band-aid, so they're outcasts. They're misfits. They don't belong on the phone.

I swear to God, it's one of those things where I'm like, I never, ever say this. I never think this. But I could have written this movie. Yeah. You know what I mean? When you're looking at it, you're like, fuck, that's all it took to pitch? Was just this emojis that are outcasts? And they got to figure out, I could have written this.

You know what else is crazy? What? Emojis have no copyright. Right. There's nothing to repatriate. They're not owned by a company. They're a language. They're a term. They're a unicode. crazy what emojis have no copyright right there's nothing there are language code yeah term their unicode that's why there's

so much emoji merchandise now why everyone because anyone can do them right it's just a basic set of aesthetics right it would be like having a letter G balloon right Griffin yeah right right they're not

owned by anyone uh-huh but this whoever this fuckhead is who wrote the emoji movie and I'm probably gonna find out stop or a friend of mine or something. It was me. It was David Sooms.

It was me. I just hate myself. Also, congrats to David Ehrlich on writing the Emoji movie in addition to getting married this weekend. No, it was three different people. Oh, Mike White is credited. I'm sure he did punch up. Yeah.

Tony Leondis is the writer and director. Okay. And then Eric Siegel is the other credited writer based on Emoji So I think it was either Siegel or Leondis but like there was a deadline story that was like hottest pitch in town the Emoji movie

and it was like they have no copyright so there's nothing like proprietary about what they're selling they just claimed we cracked Emojis as a narrative. Well that's the the thing. It's like they were just the first year to be like, we're doing the emoji movie. No one else do it. It's us. But it was apparently this thing. They went around to every studio

and were like, gotta ask fast because everyone else wants it. If you want the emoji movie, you gotta bid fast. And people were like fighting over it. Yeah. It's gonna make a lot of money. I think it's gonna do you? I do. It's not. It's gonna do well. I think this is a moment where everything collapses this is it this

is the locust point in American history it's the end of movies it's like opening against like fucking what's it opening against oh no it's got it all it's got that whole weekend to itself it's

opening against atomic blonde oh boy yeah that is similar audiences that's the thing that is their movie and it's a week after Dunkirk by Christopher Nolan. Spoiler alert.

Spoiler alert. It's Dunkirk. Maybe we should do the emoji movie as our bonus episode. Yeah, let's do that. Alright, so following. So yeah, at the end he gets in trouble. The cops get him. Can we just quickly mention that Patrick Stewart plays Poop? Yeah, he plays Poop. He's being advertised. I've seen some billboards. Yep. Smelvin Patrick Stewart plays Poop? Yeah, he plays Poop. He's being advertised.

Yep. I've seen some billboards. Yep. Yep. Smelvin himself. The poop emoji. All right. So you know a lot about it.

No, I just, there was, there's a company. No, I just, boy. There's a company that makes emoji toys and they sell one of the poop emoji. It's literally an action figure of just a pile of poop in a box with a smile on it. And it's named Smelvin. And I've been trying to figure out whether Smelvin as a name is canonical across all of emojis, or if it's just this one company. Boy,

how are you feeling about this episode? I'm going to keep asking you, Ben, I can see him. That's why right now. And it's, it's freaking me out. Uh,

well, cause I'm in the room now with you guys. Uh, and what do I think about this episode you know I might actually have to cut it out the whole episode no no just the stuff no no I think you gotta

make it longer yeah put some stuff in you want me to add stuff extra stuff double it yeah double the episode interesting

double the whole episode out of order what if you cut this But out of order. What if you cut this episode out of order? I could do that. Okay, so here, I'm going to give you a piece right here that you can cut into the beginning. Okay, not the very beginning, but like five minutes in. Sure.

Okay, this is the sound of me spitting a latex glove out of my mouth. Why is this necessary? It's in, Remember this early on? Out of... Oh, it's out of order. Here's him spitting out a latex glove. And then an hour later, you realize the glove ended up in his mouth because someone put it there. The mystery of the glove solved.

Right. When he gets in the fight with Cobb, because Cobb's like, you fucking... That lady who doesn't have a name? The blonde. At the end of the fight, he puts the glove in his mouth. And you're like, you fucking, that lady who doesn't have a name. The blonde. At the end of the fight, he puts the glove in his mouth. And you're like, oh, I guess that's where the glove came from. The stuff with the lady is tough kind of film bro stuff.

Definitely. Her monologues are not that well written. No. I mean, this is him trying to do like a femme fatale character. But in a more modern, less stylized setting in which her transparency as, in terms of characterization, is more glaring. Well, also, yeah, when someone says to her, like, were you a call girl for that guy?

She doesn't go like, ha ha, maybe. She's like, shut up. Yeah. So that's how it's modern. Right. She's like, every bad thing, every bad assumption you could make about me based on my gender is true.

You know, he made three noir movies in a row. He makes this, he makes Memento, he makes Insomnia. Those are all noir movies. It seemed like he was a noir guy. It seemed like that was his thing. Neo-noir. He's bringing it back. Like he was fucking, what's his name? The Red Rock West guy. You know, the Last Temptation, Last Seduction guy.

Why am I getting all these titles wrong? John Dahl. John Dahl is his name. Last Seduction is a good movie. I haven't seen it. It seemed like Christopher Nolan was maybe going to be a better John Dahl. No, for sure. And then he makes Batman Begins, which I guess it has some noir elements in that a lot of it takes place at night. The suit is black.

But then he becomes. Black noir. After Insomnia, he becomes Hollywood's last widesc He becomes like Hollywood's like last, like widescreen director, right? Like he's the guy who was holding on to this, right? Well,

we've like talked about these kind of like handshakes we try to set up sometimes between our mini series for the listener. Griffin is holding his hands together. Yeah. Like handshake. Uh, Nolan kind of is weirdly the heir apparent to Spielberg in terms of status, even though in terms of style,

he's very different, but I feel like the place he holds within the film culture is very equivalent to Spielberg at his peak Agreed He's definitely the closest we've got to that He becomes this weird clinical version

of Spielberg After Lord of the Rings the rap was here it is finally Peter Jackson is the first director probably since Spielberg maybe James Cameron probably since Spielberg who like a lot of people know his name art and commerce combined and then he

you know he kind of fucked it up which we could talk about one day maybe but whereas now I think Nolan he's the one guy you can be like from director Christopher Nolan and that's the star of the movie yeah I mean look at Dunkirk yep you know you got Tom Hardy's your biggest star in the movie but it's very much ensemble piece

it's not being advertised with any no because it stars an unknown and all that right and that's a big expensive movie that's being released and we talked about our Saving Private Ryan episode how crazy was that movie came out in July was a blockbuster and we were like there's never going to be another thing like that again.

And Dunkirk is like that. It's like a sober adult war drama coming out in the middle of the summer that everyone's expecting is going to do crackerjack business. And it doesn't even have a Tom Hanks in it. It doesn't even have an Edward Burns in it. Maybe it does. We don't know. Ed Burns is

unfamous enough that he could have a small role in Dunkirk. What if Ed Burns is just playing another one of the, like, 21-year-old British kids next to Harry Styles? Hey, guys. Hey. To Ed Burns. Hey, look, I'm definitely from London, not Brooklyn. Brooklyn. How do you do it, Edward Burns?

Edward Burns just kind of constantly sounds like his laryngitis, right? It's like, yeah, come on. Yeah, it's kind of like that, except I just cannot. Like, what the fuck? I can't remember an Ed Burns line. I can't believe we can't do good ed burns impressions he's so distinctive yeah so following oh yeah the movie following yeah you want to hear some some other things about following yes he was burgled nolan burgled and that was one of his reasons for writing this movie interesting uh He realized that there was nothing keeping this burglar out.

He'd smashed open his like plywood door. And he was like, it's just the veneer of social grace is all that's keeping us in our little hamster wheels. And one man dared break through and steal my TV. A language of voyeurism. Can I tell a quick story? Please. You burgled Christopher Nolan. It was you!

It was me the whole time! 1998. You caught me. At the end of following, it turns out that in fact, who was conning who? With layers, so many,

like a dip for chips. Well, Cobb was conning the guy. Right. But also the woman, because he murdered her. He conned her right out of her life. He's top of con list. Woman's in the middle of con list.

Guys at the bottom of con list. Right. Top of con is, is Cobb. Middle con is lady. Bottom Cobb is, uh, Con,

Con, Bottom Con is Cobb. Cobb's top con. Jesus fucking Christ. Chaka Con. All right. Enough. Hey, could you, uh, could you satirize this movie and make it about Twitter? Cobb's Top Con Chaka Khan enough could you satirize this movie and make it about

Twitter because you're following it's called a Twitter following don't at me so this film he makes it we've established the fact that Cobb steals her life. Yeah, he kills her with a hammer.

The ultimate theft. Yeah, he kills her with a hammer. Because at the end scene, which is the one scene where I think Jeremy Theobald's maybe out of his depth as an actor. Yeah, he's out of his depth. That's the one scene. That's the one where John Nolan, the cop, is like, hello, governor, you've gone and killed a bird haven't you this whole kind of conversation they've been having has seemed pretty

civil yeah he's like oh and then I was following people because of Cobb and this is why I'm confessing Cobb's murder and they were like well we've never heard of this Cobb guy no murder matches what you just said no open cases like that but interesting that woman

you've been talking about was murdered by the hammer that had your fingerprints over it, which you've already admitted you used to hit someone else. We know you were there all of this. It had two kinds of blood on it. One was hers. So this all lines up. Off to the pokey with you. The pokey is what they call prison. That's the word I was

looking for earlier. And the final shot is Cobb in slow motion. He looks towards the camera and then someone sort of passes in front. And he vanishes into the crowd. What? Where'd he go? But this scene that is kind of complicated in terms of what they're asking out of Theobald as an actor is that he realizes the level, the depth of con that he's about to. All of the cons crash upon him. The cons crash upon him.

But that there is, I think, this moment what Nolan's trying to get at is that he almost is more impressed than anything else by the artistry of what happened around him. There's this weird, perverse sense of, like, God, it's beautiful. Like, it all lined up. I get that. And, of course, that's Nolan's whole thing in his movies is to do that well. Right. Is that, essentially, he, like, lays, lays like out this whole Rube Goldberg machine and then the final act of the movie

is he just like you know he hits the car and you watch it like loop the loop and it you know does all this bullshit and this is the movie

where Nolan sort of tries to like call his own shot right he tries to call his own shot but his Rube Goldberg machine is mostly him just like pushing

a Hot Wheels down the road right and it just like comes to a stop yeah sure yeah it's fine but it's a little where you're like yeah it's a stop. There are a couple crazy loops. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. It's fine. But it's a little.

Well, you're like. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little candy box of a movie. It's one of those movies where like these movies I see sometimes. Like, you know, if I saw it at a festival, if I saw it at a slam dance, which is where it premiered. The slammiest of dances.

I would probably be like, oh, this is pretty well made. Like. Yeah. I get it. Neat little Hitchcock movie. Great. Like, good job. Like that would be my reaction to it.

Yeah. I'll say. I also, I just love. It's that would be my reaction to it. Yeah. I'll say I also, I just love, uh, it's better than praying with anger by a long shot. Definitely. It's better than Jurassic world.

It's better than Jurassic world. Sure. By a long shot. Uh, it's better than like, but is it as good as, um, I feel like there's,

Oh, is it as good as pie? No, no. Pie is an excellent movie made on a similar budget. And I was talking about this. And it has a lot more mood and atmosphere. Right.

When were you talking about this? Well, David, much like Christopher Nolan, I've thrown a bit of a twist into this episode. Remember earlier when Ben made his joke about this show being adapted into the television series The Following and I acted like I couldn't tell if Ben was joking or not and then laughed heartily? Okay. Well, in fact, I had heard that joke before, David, because yesterday I was walking around this very neighborhood and happened to be passing by. There's a band on a smoke break outside of this very building where we're recording right now. Okay.

Almost seemed too perfect. The fuck is going on? Are we doing this for every episode? And Ben and I talked a little bit about following, which we had both just rewatched. And he made that joke. And I said, Ben, that joke's really funny. Well, well first i said i can't tell if you're joking or not that's really unclear if you're joking it's kind of funny okay okay if you're not joking it just seems like a misunderstanding like on auditions yesterday well my audition was very close by

so i walked by ben he told me the joke and i said said, here's the grift. I'm going to pretend that I haven't heard that joke before. Wait, that was the entirety of the grift? Tell me the joke again on air tomorrow, and I'll act like I never heard it before. And you were none the wiser. We need to put the noise in again there. It was almost too perfect. What does that mean, it was almost too perfect? In this context.

It means that the quality of the setup was almost too perfect. You know, though. The circumstances were near perfect. This is so inconsequential. You literally could be making this up right now. But I'm not. And that's why it was almost too perfect because if it seemed more consequential you would doubt the veracity but it's so banal and uninteresting that you would

never second guess it which means i got away with the perfect crowd great greatiding a bit. The perfect crime. I pretended to laugh at a joke that I had already heard. A crime of perjury. Laugh perjury. If you rewind the tape, you'll remember. I said, Ben, I can't tell if you're joking now or not. I knew he was joking because I had heard the joke already. This is, I would argue, our worst bit since Europa. Since the debates over Europa.

I don't even remember what episode that's on. All right. I love that moon way more than you do. Actually, this is related. Did you see today that NASA found two new moons of Jupiter? Well, yes, I heard that immediately because I'm the biggest fan of moons. But do you know how many moons Jupiter has now?

69. It just got bumped to 69, baby. Yeah, and Uranus must be jealous. And Uranus must be jealous. And Uranus must be jealous. Yeah, okay. Alright, thank you. Do you know how many drops of Jupiter? How many drops Jupiter has?

You mentioned Train earlier. Yes, and let's get this train back on the tracks. I saw the Train movie. It was good. The movie about Train the band? No, I would not see such a movie. I'm tweeting this to you right now, Ben. Okay, great. About Jupiter's moon. 69 moons, right?

Ben and I ran into each other on the street yesterday. Yeah, yeah, what's up? We talked about Darren Aronofsky, and Ben was saying that he prefers pie to this, and I ran into each other on the street yesterday yeah yeah what's up we talked about Darren Aronofsky and Ben was saying that he prefers Pi to this and I was saying I feel like the difference

between the two of them is Darren Aronofsky knew exactly what kind of filmmaker he wanted to be and he knew he had limited resources and he designed a movie

at the full powers of what kind of film he wanted to make to those limited resources yeah for sure Christopher Nolan used a movie to figure out what kind of filmmaker he was that make to those limited resources. Yeah, for sure. Christopher Nolan used a movie to figure out what kind of filmmaker he was. That's probably true.

I mean, the other difference is Pi is not Darren Aronofsky's worst film. In fact, it's one of his best films. Yes. Whereas this is Christopher Nolan's worst film. And if I was a film director, I'd probably be happier with the latter, not the former being true.

Sure. I disagree. But we'll get to those rankings. Do you think Pi is one of his worst films? No, no, no. On this being Nolan's worst film. You think he's made a film worse than this? There's only one candidate. Yep. And we'll get to it.

I mean, to me, no. That movie's interesting. This movie's not interesting. It's fine, though. It's fine. Fine little movie. We'll talk about that later. Looking ahead. That is following. Don't you want to play the box office game? find a little movie I think that movie's well we'll talk about that later look looking ahead that is following uh

don't you want to play the box office game I do I'm not saying the scene of the movie I'm saying the scene of the proper conversation yeah box office game

now you said this is it came out in one theater yes in New York City in New York City only and you said that this is we've covered this weekend a weekend we've covered already

so now now the challenge is can I remember what weekend it was and can I recall the information that's already been revealed to me at some previous point in time? Well, I'm going to tell you the date. Okay. And you'll probably know.

Give me the date. April 2nd, 1999. Oh, so it was May 98th, didn't come out until 1999. Correct. April 2nd. It debuted at the Toronto International Film Festival in September 98. Okay. So April 1999, we're like a month away from when Phantom Menace drops.

True. The first film in the Phantom Menace trilogy. True. Number one is a new movie. Number one is a new movie. We have discussed this very list. We have discussed it. In a one-off

or a mini-series? Mini-series. Okay, so it is not a James Cameron film. It is not a film by Cameron Crowe. No. It is a film by Stevie Spielberg. No. It is not a film by M. Night Shyamalan. No. It is a film

by the Wachowskis. Correct. It's called The Matrix. Yes, you did it. There you go. It's the first weekend of The Matrix. Okay. So, $27 million. That's why we've covered this weekend before because it's The Matrix weekend. And I remember... Number two is another new movie which you wanted

to see more than The Matrix. And I thought it was going to outgross The Matrix and it was called 10 Things I Hate About You. Right. And number three is a remake of a comedy called... A remake of a comedy called. A remake of a comedy called. A remake of an old comedy, oldish comedy. The Outer Towners? Correct.

I also saw that weekend opening weekend. Yes. And then number four is a mob comedy called. Analyze This. And number five is the one that you really took a long time to guess last time we did this. Oh, jeez. It's a sort of dramedy starring Ben Affleck. Oh, Forces of Nature yes

now so with that out of the way yeah done I want to take you to the weekend that for some reason Box Office Mojo

links me to because it actually has following like it actually has it listed okay but it's the incorrect weekend but we're going to

play it it has it's gross listed on this weekend for some reason which is two weekends later April 16th this film grossed a total of $65,000 weekend, but we're going to play it. It has its gross listed on this weekend for some reason, which is two weekends later, April 16th. This film grossed a total of $65,000.

I mean, look, tidy profit. When your movie only cost $6,000. But you had to take it to... Oh no, I'm sorry, it made more than that. It made $240,000 worldwide. But you gotta pay for all those festival entry fees. You gotta pay to submit it to Slamdance. You know, those

Slamdance fees are hefty. So he probably lost two million dollars. I don't know. I doubt. I think because he did it all mostly himself I think, but at some point, I think someone snapped it up. Some tiny distributor. It is interesting, this movie is a lot less kind of visually precise than his later

films are. I mean, he becomes known as sort of this Kubrickian control guy, but he allocates those responsibilities to a lot of people. You know? Yeah, but I mean, but that's the thing with this, obviously, you know, they literally can only shoot one or two takes, so. I love, I mean, I don't know if it's

all handheld, the movie, too. I don't know if it's just because, like, I used to make, like, 16mm black and white short films, but it is, like, I get nostalgic watching this movie for how because I used to make 16mm black and white short films. But it is like I get nostalgic watching this movie for how tactile it is and how much you can tell the angles are dictated by literally how much room they had. A lot of the scenes that take place inside the apartment are just like, oh, this is a tiny apartment. They didn't have wide angle lenses. There's no lighting.

He just had to hang out in the corner. This is the angle they chose out of necessity. Yeah. It's not very pretty looking. It's just kind of like getting the job done. I also just like black and white 60mm because you just get all these shadows and it's just like those accidental pockets

where like, oh, there's not enough light here and the movie becomes like just totally black for a second. Right. I always think it adds like cool. I don't know. That's my little. I mean, he says that's why he shot in black and white

because essentially you can make your cheat movie look a lot less cheap. Yeah. And people disappear accidentally. Like there's cool little accidents that happen. Number one. Number one.

At this weekend, just to give people a real box office game. Is it still The Matrix? No. The Matrix drops to number two. And then I think it comes back the following weekend? It might, but I'm not talking about that. Okay. In its third weekend, The Matrix drops to number two. And I think it comes back the following weekend? It might, but we're not talking about that. In its third weekend, The Matrix

drops to number two. It makes $17.9 million in its third weekend, which is very nice. But it's displaced by an R-rated epic comedy that no one remembers exists and is mostly the reason I wanted to bring this movie.

I can't imagine someone making this movie now. It is crazy that they made this movie. I believe I know what movie it is. What is it? Epic. Epic. You're choosing the word epic in terms of the scope of the narrative? Yeah, exactly.

In terms of the time told. The film is Life with Eddie Murphy and Martin Lawrence, right? Correct. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. They made a movie about two guys going to prison in like the 50s. Yeah. It might even be

like the 30s. I forget when it's set. I think it's like the 30s or the 40s. And it's like an R rated movie. Just missing the jazz age. Yeah, it's a dirty movie. It's also very sad. It's really sad. Because they sold it as like Eddie and Martin together for the first time. Yes. And in the trailers they had like clips of them

in the old age makeup that was like a big selling point they were trying to sell it like a Nutty Professor movie right they were trying really hard being like because mostly

Eddie Murphy mostly was making your Dr. Dolittle's your Nutty Professor's right so they're like yeah look at them in old age makeup

like which is the end that's the code of the film of look they still haven't gotten out of jail but the trailer was mostly the last scene

because that stuff felt goofier. Because the film is about, and it was directed by Ted Demme, who went on to make Blow. Jonathan Demme's nephew, I believe. I think you're right. You know, he made Beautiful Girls, he made The Ref, which is a great movie. Right, right. You know, and he died young, which was sad. But it's like pretty much a drama.

It's absolutely a drama. it's about two men who are wrongfully convicted of murder and they're given a life sentence in a mississippi prison right and uh yeah they're stuck in jail what are the hijinks there's some hijinks uh they try and there's something with baseball yeah right you know they go to like probation hearings and they're like nope you're still going to be in jail. They spend 65 years in prison trying to escape while making friends

played by Bernie Mac. Fizz on Love, I think is one of them. I haven't seen him forever. Bernie Mac's really fucking good. Yeah.

Miguel Nunez Jr. Okay. Do you want a man himself? Yes, exactly. Anthony Anderson. Bobby, Barry Shabaka Henley, Barry Shabaka Henley. Barry Shabaka Henley. You know, and then you've got some white guys

played by, say, Arlie Ernie or Ned Beatty or Nick Cassavetes, these sort of wardens. Some of our finest actors who look like racists. Sure, exactly. And it was made for $80 million. That was a big money. That's crazy. And he was made for $80 million. That's a big money. That's crazy. Eddie was like on a big upswing at that point.

He was. And this is the last basically movie I can think of where he makes like an R-rated filthy comedy. Yeah, this is like. Bowfinger. Bowfinger's PG-13. It is the same year. 99 was the last year where Eddie got his hands dirty. Damn.

Well, he made Metro, but that's like 97 or 98, right? Yeah. That's like another filthy R-rated movie. By the time you get to like 2001, it's like, it's Shrek and Doolittle. Yeah, because after life, right,

there's Bowfinger, then Nutty Professor 2, which is of course an absolutely filthy movie. It just happens to be rated PG-13. But a giant hamster rapes Larry Miller in that movie. Correct, that happens.

Anally. Yes. That happens in the movie on screen. That was also one of the first movies I remember to have a DVD release of like an unrated cut. Uh-huh. Because like American Pie kind of popularized that. But what's your point? Here's an R-rated movie and then here's a slightly dirtier cut.

Yeah, right. And Nutty Professor, they were like, here's the R-rated cut. Here's the shit we cut out because it was so god-awful and disgusting. But you have an R-rated cut of a movie you know in advance was designed to be a family movie?

That wasn't supposed to be dirty. I know, it got so dirty. But that was the beginning of that. I know, I know. The cover of the box was Sherman Clump holding his hand up

to his mouth in shock and then he was yellow tape around his family and it said R-rated cut. That was the thing they would do. They would always put the yellow tape around his family and it said like r-rated cut that was the thing they would do they would always put the yellow tape on the dvd so naughty what a naughty cut you know what we're talking about man like the unrated edition oh yeah all right i'm gonna pull up this picture all right so number two is the matrix life's a good movie though that's an underrated movie i think so too i think it's a good little movie but it is kind of

sad and it is kind of long there's that amazing fantasy sequence where they all talk about what they're going to do when they get out of jail. The sad point being, of course, that none of them are going to get out of jail. Bernie Mac talks about starting a club where everyone knows his name and it's a place where everyone feels happy. Right. Yeah, it's a good movie. I like it. I like Eddie Murphy.

I like it, too. And I like Eddie Murphy, too. Number two is The Matrix. Number three is a rom-com that opened the week before. It's pretty cute. Pretty cute. It's about a journalist. About a journalist.

But it's also a high school movie. Superman Returns? Well done. Thank you. About a journalist. It's also a high school movie. It is called Never Been Kissed. And who's it directed by?

You made one of your favorite movies. Yes. Give me one second. Give me one second. His name is, he directed the film called Scooby-Doo. He did. And his name one of your favorite movies. Yes. Give me one second. Give me one second. His name is... He directed the film called Scooby-Doo. He did. And his name is Raja Ghazna.

Correct. Well done. Thank you. That I did not remember. Thank you. He also directed Big Mama's House. Tying everything back together. Martin Lawrence, baby.

Which I saw Big Mama's House in theaters. I saw it three times in theaters. That's a terrible movie. My dad demanded I go see it again with my grandfather. It was my dad's favorite movie. My grandfather loved it too. He liked the part when the lady poops. Don't remember that. Have you seen

Big Mama's House, Benny? I haven't. I'm actually surprised. I'm surprised too. Big Mama's House is one of the sweatiest like, sequelization premises ever. Because the first movie is like, oh, there's an estranged husband who's like following and stalking this woman you have to go undercover as her great aunt big mama in order to get close

to her and at the end of the movie everyone finds out tootsie style oh my god it wasn't the big mama it was martin lawrence he but he stopped the crime and now they fall in love big mama's house too they're like you're back on the case. New case, you still have to go undercover as that woman's great aunt. Like, he now has to, like, infiltrate the news. We need someone to pretend

to be a babysitter. Why don't we stick with that very physically prohibitive costume from the previous... Three movies where they keep on making him dress up as this woman's great aunt even though he's no longer...

He's married to her now. He's not having to trick her. But he poops. He doesn't poop. She poops. having to trick her but he poops he doesn't poop she poops the real big mama poops my dad loved it you're right never been kissed also starring David Arquette Michael Vartan Molly Shannon

Gary Marshall's in it anyway so there you go number three or number four and number five are movies we've already discussed Anyway so there you go Number three Number four and number five Are movies we've already discussed On the show Just like literally you know just a few seconds ago

Uh But that's number five What is staying put At number four No three weeks later staying put Very excited staying put It's a comedy R rated comedy Forces of Nature? No. Three weeks later. Staying put. Very excited. Staying put. It's a comedy.

R-rated comedy. But it's not. Why am I just freaking. We just talked about this. We just mentioned it. But it's not life? No. Right. It's number one.

So then what's the other R-rated comedy? I don't know, man. You tell me. The DVD release of Night Professor 2. No, it wasn't that. That wasn't it. What? Fucking what's the other?

It was number four in two weeks ago. Still number four now. It's sticking around. Doing a great job. I'm really hyping up the fact that it's still number four. What's the final domestic number? The final domestic? 106.

Oh, analyze this. Right. That's all he needed. Yeah, you got go in there. There they are All tied up He's shocked Oh damn he is shocked

He's shocked I'm showing them the cover of The Nutty Professor 2 The clumps Uncensored director's cut Who directed that? I think it was Pete Seagal Uh huh

You've got Twin Dragons Okay That was the one where Jean-Claude Van Damme played twins or was it Jackie Chan played twins? it's the one where Jackie Chan played twins I should have guessed that from Dragon there's also one where I believe Jean-Claude Van Damme played twins

and then there's Double Dragon which is a movie based off a video game but then also what's the one with Jean-Claude Van Damme and Dennis Rodman called? Double Team see I knew it was that. It is called Double Team, right? I thought I was making it dirtier, but that is what that movie's called. It's called Double Team.

With Denise Richards? With Mickey Rourke. I'm not seeing Denise Richards. Cindy Crawford? Who's the... Natasha Lindinger. I don't know. Anyway, they don't play by the rules is the tagline for double team.

Double team. So that's the box office game. There we go. Following up into one theater and made a few grand. Yeah. But then Christopher Nolan would make another film. And then more. Boy, no spoilers.

You'll find out when we- No spoilers. He made more than one movie. He made more than one movie. But from this He gets a nine million dollar budget To make his next movie It's pretty good

It's pretty good And he gets Two movie stars Hot off the Matrix He does And one movie star Hot off LA Confidential

Yeah Hot off his David Sims award For best actor Yeah In that movie One Joey Pants is hot off My best supporting actor win.

That's right. Look, in short, he gets to put on a finely made pair of Italian pants. Sorry, 4.5 million. I don't know where I got 9 million from. That's how much Memento cost. Pretty good on that budget. Okay. Hey, look, we got going on the Pod Night cast.

This is the first time we've done a miniseries episode. We've recorded a miniseries episode since February. That's right. Isn't that crazy to think about? It is crazy. It's fucking June. You're hearing this without breaks, but the mailbag episode and the Wonder Woman episode, which were both recorded over the last six weeks for us.

Right. We're recording this in the middle of June. We haven't had like a proper episode since then. Well, that's nice. Well, now I'm going to go back to filming the Tick for 12 more years. Please don't. And we'll record

sometime after that, I guess. Yeah, what do you mean? Of course we will. Jeez, it's going to be great. God, you're freaking me out. I'm joking. Yeah, I know. Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate, review, subscribe. You can check out our Reddit, which I've It's blowing up. Yeah, I know. Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate, review, subscribe. You can check out our Reddit, which I've... It's blowing up. It's blowing up.

Sometimes it gets a little too hot in there. I agree. I've been told you can actually just reddit.blankies.com will get you there instead of having to do the backslash R, backslash whatever. So just do that. Do that. Just do that. Let me try it.

Reddit.blankies.com. Follow us on Twitter at Blank Check Pod. Check us out on Facebook at Blank Check Podcast. Big thanks to Ang for Gudo, for running our social media account, Pat Reynolds and Joe Bowen for doing our artwork, Lane Montgomery for the theme song. Yep. Thanks to all those fine folks.

Great people. Great people keep this show afloat. And as always, Mm-hmm. If you invite David to your wedding, he will raise

the roof. Thanks. Great. Hey, Ben. How are we doing? We're done.