Blank Check with Griffin & David - Green Card with Esther Zuckerman

Episode Date: May 3, 2026

Most filmmakers dream of making ambitious, big-budget epics once they're able to cash in their "blank check." Peter Weir wanted to make Green Card. Writer and romcom expert Esther Zuckerman joins us to talk about this 1990 oddity, released the same year as Pretty Woman, but centered around the star persona of Gérard Depardieu instead of Julia Roberts. We're talking about the romcom genre, the many attempts to bring international stars to Hollywood, the golden age of Andie MacDowell movies, and the undeniable smokeshow that was early 90s Bebe Neuwirth in this episode. Pardon our French. Literally. Get Esther's Book Falling In Love at the Movies Read FILM VIEW; 'Green Card' Apes 'Pretty Woman' Sign up for Check Book, the Blank Check newsletter featuring even more “real nerdy shit” to feed your pop culture obsession. Dossier excerpts, film biz AND burger reports, and even more exclusive content you won’t want to miss out on. Join our Patreon for franchise commentaries and bonus episodes. Follow us @blankcheckpod on Twitter, Instagram, Threads and Facebook!  Buy some real nerdy merch Connect with other Blankies on our Reddit or Discord For anything else, check out BlankCheckPod.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The story of two friends who got a podcast, did bits, and then fell in love. So true. Now, this movie does have a perfect tagline. It's a really great tagline. Do you know the tagline? No. I'm going to read. Was that it?

That was a riff. It was a riff on it. It's the story of tagline. Two friends who got married. Not two friends. Because we're the two. No, yeah, no, obviously. That's competitive advantage.

Two people? The story of two people who got married met and then fell in love. Yeah, it's good. Kind of gets you. That's how the fucking film industry used to work. If you could walk into a room and say, I will say, I'm at the poster.

The poster does look like Obelix is kidnapping a woman. David, I like this movie a tremendous amount. I had never seen it before. Look at him. I know this is a favorite of yours. She is mine. This is a thing we're going to have to keep talking about in this movie, where this movie is super charming and sweet and exquisitely made.

It really is. it is all this study of, what is the weird charm of this guy? Totally. And part of it is, this guy is, why no, Shrek? Is he emotional terrorist? You know, like... I thought you were going to do something like, I wanted you to do something like in a French accent,

like, I am a beast, or the beast will come out. Right. Or something like that. Right. This movie is trying to present Gerard Depardue as, like, the Walt Disney version of The Beast, who's not actually that bad of a guy, but obviously has this kind of like rough, oafish personality.

And then you're just like, you know, it's really close to like just, we took all the bad things out of Gerardepardetardu and left the baseline. I mean, I'm sure. Sheridan was hot and sexy, guys. I hate to, you know, I hate to break it. That's fine.

We can discuss. We'll discuss that I. But it was not like a shocking proposition in 1990. This is the thing. Times change, or do they? Well, yes, but also... I think times changed for Gerard Deppard Du. This was the real project. This was the...

Do we get... How do we make Americans get Deppardu? And I think this is the one time that Americans really got him. Yeah. I guess so. As like a romantic lead? Yeah.

I mean... I think the other stuff... Not in a... Oh, God. 1492. Right. Like his other stuff later. But like, didn't Americans, it was the same year, but like, didn't Americans get him even though in Serenow?

That was, that was the same. Which is, like, obviously a French film. But gets him an Oscar nomination. That was just a huge crossover. Right. Yeah. But like, here's this guy who's in his third decade of being a movie star in France. Yeah.

Yeah. And had worked with Bertilucci, had sort of, like, touched the membrane of Hollywood without fully crossing over. I mean, he was a French actor. That was the most crossing over international films that existed. Right. Yeah. And he was in like the last, we'll talk about it. And in the 90s, there was this push of like, are you ready to meet France's Robert De Niro?

I've got that bag it for you. Well, he got a fucking handjob next to Robert De Niro. And that's where. In the movie. You know, you should try. He's being me. I wish there was a French Fokker's trilogy with Depardue. There must be something approximating that.

That sounds like there's like. He makes so many crazy. He makes so many movies. Right? Like, he made a bunch of silly comedy. Like, he probably did something. Also, French comedy is this. I know.

I don't want to offend someone who is French. My mother is French, yes. Yes. Are some of the most insane stupid things on the planet. Or isn't it always like, oh, my daughter, she married an immigrant. Oh, Sacrebleu, right? Like, it's like, oh, a lot of that. A lot of that.

A lot of that. Let's also acknowledge that DePardieu's breakout was in the movie going places, which is basically just about a fucking contest. I'm sure a bunch of French listeners are going to explain how I'm not paying proper respects to going places. No, I don't think so. Going places, you know, what in French it's called. Like, you know, that was the American title for going places.

And then we'll introduce our pocket. In France, it's called Le Values, which means the ball. Yeah. Yeah. It's like slang for the balls, but like, that's what it means. That's what it means. Every year, I can, I've been going for three years now, and every year there's some movie that sort of pops up that's like the French pick. And it's like often there's like a French comedy and you're like, oh, wow, this is just playing so much differently here than it would. You see the French response. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Well, you're like, there's French comedies that are like based on very retrograde cultural socioeconomic racial stereotypes. Right. And then. And regional stereotypes as well.

Bonneu Le Chitti, which is like the biggest French comedy of all time. I think it has not been beaten since. But then there's like, you will go to France and there will be giant billboards for a movie that is just like

four firmly middle-aged actors wearing like suits and dresses, making faces. And you're like, what's that? And it's like, it's been number one five weeks in a row. It's called like, you know, the fucking fart fan. family.

And it's just about them all walking into walls and stuff. No, it's called about like, Kerschance. You know? Exactly. And you're like, what's it about? And you're like, it's kind of just about like two couples

have a dinner. Right. But then it finds out that they've all slept with each other. There's a lot of puns. But you wouldn't understand because it's French puns. And so, you know,

there's a lot of, you know, double meanings. But some of them are like these kind of classical, almost like, stagey French farces, just four characters. They haven't really gotten over that. No. I remember when I lived in Paris. there was a movie called Paris made in 2008,

starring Julia Pinoche that I believe was sort of like the, you know, Valentine's Day or New Year's Eve of like French movies because it was like a big ensemble movie with a bunch of stars that was just called Paris and the only thing about it was that it was set in Paris. Oh, yeah. And I was a good movie. Is it? Is it? Have you seen it?

The Cedriclipash film? Correct. Yeah, I've seen it, yeah. And I remember when I was just like looking at that, I was like, is this like the biggest French movie? It's just called Paris. Is this the biggest French movie of all time? Or is everyone...

What if we had, like, New York? Right. Because there was Perry and Don Perry were around the same time. And Don Perry is much better. Don't Paris is Louis Garelle and Romand duress. Yeah, that one's fun. That's about, like, some, you know, shaggy boys. It's about depression.

Yeah, it's about two brothers. That movie rules. And then Perry, I'm trying to remember, but I have seen as well. It's got a huge cast, man. A lot of Frenchies. Romaine Doreen. is in that one too. Yeah.

What's he up to these days? Yeah, I realize, because he's so good in all the money in the world. Oh, yeah, that's right. He's excellent in that film. Sort of a movie I forgot. And I was like, yeah,

he doesn't do enough like American films. And I looked and I think that's literally the only one. Yeah, I guess it's just not. Well, you know what? He was the French voice. This is so fun

when you learn this of the Edward Norton character and I love dogs. I'll tell you that much. There we go. Yeah, but he does a lot of, oh, man, and he did a movie called E. Fell about Gustave E. Fell, like a biopic.

Okay. Where you're like, that doesn't even make it to America. But in France, they're like, please. He was also in that really big three musketeers. They told him, he could not make the tower. Yeah. He's a great actor. Like, I think he's one of the best movie actors working.

And he's, yeah. But it's just interesting. And he's got a hanger. I've seen it. He does. In like 50 movies. But I even feel like his biggest French movies haven't crossed over super wide here. Not since, like, beat at my heart skipped.

But in those early days, he was having some... Yeah. Yeah. What can you do? I'm sure, was he in D.Person or whatever it's called? You know, was he in Call My Agent Ever? Yeah. It just felt like Dupardue was the one male French star.

They really tried to make work. There's a history of, here's the most beautiful woman in France. Sure. And we try to make her convert. And that usually does work but for a period of time. You know, you have your Sophie Marceau. have your Isabella Gianni, you know, I'm certainly Bardot. And like, Marion Coutiard has probably had a better, more sustained,

fully French and American career. Laceda du. Laceda du. I mean, you're forgetting the queen, the number one. Geneet. No, no, Benoche. Obeirobe. Binoche.

The whole thing with Juliette Binoche is any time you see her in a movie, you're like, this is the best movie we've ever seen in my life. I had this experience recently. Also, mothers around the country were captivated by chocolate. Yes. Well, that's true. They wanted a bite. Love her.

Yeah, of course. Right. You just named a bite. The French actors who've crossed over, it is an interesting list because I'm thinking of like Vincent Cassell, right? Yeah. Where it's like he crossed over, but in America, mostly he plays the weasel. I was going to say, with the men, it's usually kind of that where you're like in,

it's a little madman. Jean Reno, he plays The Living Cigarette. But the Mads-Mickleson effect where you're like, Hollywood has accepted this guy doing one kind of thing. Yeah, maybe two. Garel has sort of had a little. But if Garel shows up again, you're just like, who's this molester? Right. I know in little women, he has the, but, you know, that's sort of a dangerous role.

Right. But there was one French actor who accepted an Oscar with pleasure. And what was his name? Jean-D. Jean-Jude. Jean-Judeau-de. Jean-June du vaille. Don't dovet.

Oh, my God. Jean Duverg. Du Jardin. I'm going to help you out here. John Du Jardin. Who did he beat for best actor? George Clooney. I guess he just recently won.

Brad Pitt? Yeah, right. For Moneyball. He beats... I just like, I recently watched his, like, win. And the other four guys, you're like, heavy hitters. One of them is Demi and Bashir, who's a great actor.

Oh, yeah. In our friend Chris's film. And then is the other one, Gary Oldman, Tinker Taylor. Yeah. Pretty good. Pretty good. Pretty good. But that's my example of like, we've talked about too many times.

But Jean du Jardin, a name I know how to say, Wynne's best actor, and you're like, you know what, this is kind of a little ready made for Hollywood. He's making it easy for them to cast him. He's weird cartoon version of a Frenchman. But on the other hand, it's weird that he has an Oscar and a bunch of the guys we just mentioned don't. And he basically does not do any American productions anymore. But also he doesn't speak in the movie.

He doesn't. And he did Monuments Men, right? He's more bilingual now than he was when he was doing the Oscar campaign. Also, that movie, like, doesn't exist. Truly is a memory-hold film. But he has this small collection of, like, I'll do a two-scene role in Wolf of Wall Street. I'll do a couple scenes in Monuments Men. And I feel like there's one other film in that period where it was, like, a supporting ensemble role.

and then he has not made any sort of American film in overtime years. Yeah, I think those might be the only two. Yeah. He's made plenty of other films. He works in France. He's a big star. Biggest star.

Yeah. He's a big star, certainly. And he did another OSS 117 finally. Right. Yeah. And he did Zorro recently. Did you know that? Yes, I did.

A French Zorro. Yes. Jean-Duchardin. Yes. He's like Chris Pratt. He's stealing all the characters. He was already lucky Luke. He of course originated Brise Dunez.

What's that? Brise Dunez. What's that? He's a surfer from Nice. Oh, that guy sounds silly. That was kind of his Wain's World that broke him out. Is that like their version of like a kind of right, like a Venice beach kind of dude? Like, I am from Nice.

This is the Dujardat. I have time. My sunglasses, though, so it's white around my eyes. Anytime I would go to Paris and there'd be a poster for big comedy film and I'd ask someone, what is this? They'd be like, it's a very specific type of person who lives there.

I mean, that's like we have stereotypes too. As a child, I was obsessed with Asterix books, as I've talked about, I'm sure before. And those are all about ethnic stereotypes,

mostly of internal French ones, where I would be like, I don't get the joke, and my dad would be like, people are from Bordeaux are like that. And I'm like, they are. And he's like,

I think so. I think that's the joke. And I'm like, Okay. Like, Bonneu Le Chitty is like, big businessman has to move to small town to like take care of the operations there. And 90% of the jokes in that movie are

the people in this small town say S-H at the end of every word. And it performed like Avatar. Are French people going to be mad at this episode? Probably. What are they not mad about? Probably. Ah, yeah.

I lived in your great country. It was nice. But it is an example of like, right, Depperdue, if American audiences had familiar, with him, it was like, here's this big, like, fucking burly man who's doing historical epics and intensity and playing the great characters. And they're like, but in France, we find him charming. Would you believe in France, he's something.

We wish to kiss him. He's what we call a kiss wisher. What's our podcast? Our podcast is called, blank check, of Eck Griffin at David. Checkblanc. I'm Griffin I'm giving up the French This is a podcast about filmographies, directors

who have Directors Who have massive success Directors Realisateur Realisettor Reillisettor Or cinema

This is the worst episode we've ever done This is a podcast about Filmography's directors Who have massive success Early on in their careers And are given a series of blank checks To make whatever crazy passion projects

They want and sometimes those checks clear, and sometimes those checks get interviewed by the immigration agencies. By Nelix from Star Trek Voyer. Baby. Yes. Ethan Phillips. Today we are talking about a motion picture called Green Card.

It is written, directed, and produced by Peter Weir? Yep. I believe it's got a big hunkin fucking final opening credit card. It's a flex. You're right. And this is kind of his first, in a way, this is his first American blank check. He basically says that he took witness

to figure out how to break through to Hollywood, that this was the dream, his passion project at this moment that he really wanted to make and the success of witness granted him and certainly dead poets as well, granted him the freedom to make this. It's just so funny

if you look at his career, as we will discuss, you don't really see A, I've just been waiting to make green cards. in there. And yet you read that was... He's like exactly how he feels. Right. He's like,

I really liked the script and I wanted to make it. Which I think is correct because it's a great film. But he's just taken like two assignment jobs. Mosquito Coast and Depo Society, Griff, I start to be clear. Well, and witness.

So really three. Yeah, he's taken three assignment jobs. And he's like, have I proved myself enough that at a lower budget with my casting choices, you let me make the one I want to make? And you're right that it is funny

because, and so often in these cases, you're like, now can you let me make the ambitious thing with the scary budget that you wouldn't grant me unless I proved myself in other arenas? And he's like, no, I want to make like a pretty contained... Right, pretty cheap. $20 million. I have to imagine, $20?

The budget is listed at $12.5 million. Okay, so is that USD or Franks? USD. I had to ask. I had to ask. Our guest today returned to the show. to talk about this rom-com and we can discuss

the balance of ROM versus com in this movie which I think is an interesting starting point for conversation. Okay. The great Esther Zuckerman. Hello. Something of an expert on the subject.

Yes. I have never seen this movie. Neither did I. Oh, ha, ha. Guys are crazy. We're not? We're going to do the wide weekend, I think. Okay.

I'm just inspecting the box office choices here. So just establish that tab and then place it two hours from now. Yeah, sure. Esther, you wrote a book on Romcom. I did. Is it now available on paperback? No, it's never going to be available. It's never going to be available on paperback.

It's sort of the form factor is more like a little hardback. Yeah, but yeah, you can still buy it. It's still available. And one should. Yes. But did not watch Green Card. No, it didn't really come up in my research. Like I, because I did try to like fill in a lot of like blind spots.

And somehow Green Card never came up. It's a great film that I was introduced at a young age by my mother because it's a great New York rom-com. But I do feel like it's not part of any particular movement. No. Or like sort of star narrative or anything like that. And certainly it's by a director who never made a rom-com again. Yeah.

So it's just kind of like a funny little thing. It was Oscar-nominated. It was a solid hit like yada-a-get. You know, like it's not like it was a forgotten movie. That's the wildest thing. is sort of forgotten now. I think it is. Well, that's crazy.

I think it's interesting. I'm right here. That's what we're here to do. David is, and you are sort of carrying the torch, I feel like for this movie. My mom showed me this movie when I was a kid. This is just like a Sims family classic.

But I was like, for instance, I was at a, I was watching the Super Bowl with some friends, some very film-oriented friends. Okay. Yeah. My friend Rob was there.

Rob was there. Allison was there. Spike, Marty. France. I mean, and now, our friend Rob is someone who has seen literally everything. The great, Rob, shear. I mean, God bless Rob, who is our friend. He is, you know, certified.

Psychotic. He goes to see movies where I'm like, I've never heard of this. He's like, well, let's do one showtime at, like, the Regal Essex at 11 a.m. He's like a movie going Pac-Man. Yeah. He is like the king of Cinematrix. Like, he sends me his goods every day. And I'm like, are you cheating?

And he's like, not cheating. he just has like an insane memory and he had not seen it and Allison had not seen it and you know I think it is sort of memory hold a little bit I agree I think David's a little right that it might have to do with the fact that this basically becomes just like a blip in the 90s Annie McDowell kind of arc but it's before that's the thing about like which I honestly didn't even like really clock it's before her rom-com art it is We're going to put a pin in this. Yeah.

But I agree with you. That's what I think is fascinating, and I just want to be able to fully zoom out and talk about the Annie McDowell thing. The Deppardue thing is so much what's selling this movie of, like, we're trying to make you like this guy, which worked at the time. But then because it did not last, that also feels like a weird dead end. And then as you said, David, like, we didn't make a movie before this with this kind of vibe, never made a film after this with this kind of vibe.

Not really, yeah. Despite coming from comedy, this is a very joke. comedy is not one hard on laughs, and his movies that have comedic elements tend to be harder comedic elements than this. Yeah, it's, yeah, I'm looking at McDowell again. Very interesting career. I had completely...

Let's just do McDowell now, then. So the film stars Andy McDowell. I had completely flipped in my mind that the reason that she is so bad in four weddings and a funeral is because it was before she kind of figured out her thing through working with better directors after.

It's the exact opposite. No. The whole thing with Andy McDowell in Four Weddings is that it will never be explained. You can, I'm serious. No, truly. I'm just laughing because I thought you were going to explain it. If you look at her career, I will run it for you right now, quick, okay?

She breaks out in Greystroke Tarzan Legend of the Apes where she is Jane. But famously, she's dutch. She's gorgeous. And it's like, okay. Ben, producer Ben, she has castes Jane in a live action Tarzan movie, big Warner Brothers production because of her look. She's very young. So bad in the film that they hire

Glenn Close to re-dub all of her dialogue. Well, it's also because she's like, you know, she's got the southern accent thing. Yeah. But she's landing immediately with this framework of like, well, she's nice to look at. I guess so, sure. She has small Roland St. Elmo's Fire, which is a big

movie for that generation, but it is obviously a stupid movie. In 1989, she's in Sexilize and three years later. Probably, yeah, she did a little TV in between, but not much. Probably kind of her best role. She's amazing in that movie. Yeah. Makes Sodaberg look like a genius. A huge movie. She's so effective in it.

Yeah. Then she's in Green Cart, which she absolutely rocks. Just thunderous, like 82 points, like Kobe. She's just fucking crazy. And then she's in the Object of Beauty, which is... You're skipping right over Hudson Hawk. No, I am not. Okay. That's next. Object of Beauty, which I've never heard of, but it's a rom-com with

Malcovich with the poster looks like this. Yeah. I'm not turned on. Me neither. I don't really know it. It might not be a wrong. It might be a wrong. No, it says it's a romantic comedy about the fine art of thievery.

Okay. Then Hudson Hawk, which is a huge bomb. I've never, I've never seen. I have seen Hudson Hawk. How is it? I think it's pretty fun. That's one of when people are kind of like, that's not so bad.

I think it's not. Is she good? No, I mean, she's barely. Like, I mean, she's, it's a nothing fun. She plays a nun who falls in love with him. Oh, who wouldn't he's Hudson Hawk? He's saying, you know, he and Danny Iiello was saying throughout it.

She's one of the only people in the movie who doesn't get to be fun. Yeah. Like so much of that movie's embarrassing reputation is that everyone's like swinging for the fences and every character is overconceived. And she's kind of playing the straight character. She plays herself in the player little funny cameo. She's in a movie called Deception, pretty forgotten movie with Neeson. Sort of like a thriller, whatever.

She's in Groundhog Day. Phenomenal. Incredible. So charming. You're in love with her. Yeah. She's in shortcuts. really incredible in shortcut.

Agreed. And everyone's good in that, but she's kind of one of my favorite parts of that. And you're like, great. Annie McDowell has totally figured out how to act. She's arrived as a movie star. One of the most important romantic comedies ever made, like where everyone is on fire good.

That is a huge hit and gets nominated for Best Picture. And she's weirdly flattened. Like, it doesn't make a contest winner plucked off the street. I don't think it's entirely her fault. I don't think it's... I mean, my point is it's clearly not her fault. I mean, yeah.

I mean, I love four weddings in the funeral, like, more than any other movie. And I think it's just part of it is that she's up against Kristen Saw Thomas, who is just like, again, you know, like, I don't know, slam dunking the ball. And she's just so out of place in it. What's it about? Four weddings and a funeral. Have you never seen? No. It's about, it's true.

I can tell you. Are you setting us up to say four weddings and a funeral? I sure is. It's about a group of friends. It's about the last. lives of a group of friends set over four weddings and one funeral that they attend. Those are the only events you see. Oh,

yeah. A couple years of their life connected by. And she is an American. And it's like a will-they, won't-day romance that you grant and her have. Yeah, she's an American. I think she works for Vogue and she's very stylish and she shows up at the first wedding and they sort of, they have sex actually that first wedding. I sure do.

I kind of assume they'll never see each other again. And then one of the wedding, yeah, no spoilers. And she's hot. And the whole point is she's this sort of mysterious objective affection. But she and Grant just don't really have much chemistry. Yeah, they don't have the chemistry. And it kind of doesn't matter. The movie rules.

It weirdly doesn't affect the movie that badly. But yet everyone comes out of a calling, why is she so bad? And then she, her career dies. Yeah. Like, she keeps making movies, but like she never was like a big deal again. Yeah. When it should have been like, great, you were just in a huge hit.

Like, get rid. And she's in, of course, Michael, a film we've covered on this podcast. Yes, she's in The Muse. She's in your favorite film of all time, Muppets for Space. Yeah, she's pretty good in it. Can't say I remember. For fault, do you like, do you actually like Michael?

I know, I have a lot of issues with that film. Yeah, it's bad. But she plays a rival local news reporter whom Miss Piggy is trying to beat to the scoop of alien existence. She's never stopped working. Like, she's, you know, working all the time. She has produced, of course, a Hollywood's great knowledge. On Genu now, Margaret Qualey. I thought she was excellent in Magic Mike XXL.

Loved her in that. Did she like her in Goodrich? She had a couple scenes there. We talked about that movie on the show. We did. I do feel like every time I see Annie McDowell show up in that size of role in like a dromedy, I'm like,

she's really kind of aged into something interesting. I remember liking her ready or not. The horror film, very fun. Same. Obviously, she's in beauty shop, your favorite film? Not. Your favorite film? Not my favorite film.

She says for your FYI, or does Alicia Silverstone? I think Alicia Silverstone says that. Yeah. She is quite good in the limited series, which I'm sure you guys didn't watch, Maid, which was it was Margaret's, it was a role for Margaret that she plays her mom in it.

She's very done. I mean, I think the beautiful thing about. Oh, A-I-D. Yes, I remember that. I think the beautiful thing about, you know, I mean, she looks incredible. Yeah, she, and she, And she looks incredible and she has gone totally natural.

Like, she has gray hair. Yes. She, like, if she's had work done, it's like super barely, she is aged incredibly. It is one of the things. She feels, and she now has this, I mean, I guess she always had it, but she feels so earthy now in a way that's very interesting. Is the one of the things I like most about seeing her show up and stuff now? Yeah. It is crazy that it's just a crazy weird career.

She also has the best hair of any human that ever lived. I mean, there's that moment in this movie where he's like, where she puts her hair up to go to dinner and he's like, your hair looks better down. Here's another reason I think this movie is a little forgotten. Yeah. What year did it come out, guys? 1990. What's another movie that came out in 1990? Pretty woman.

There was actually, I was doing a little bit of research. I'm sure that. Which is, in my opinion, far inferior film to this film. I don't really like pretty women that much. But. I appreciate the phenomenon. I'm not here to deny it. I didn't mean to step on JJ's toes, but I did do a little Googling.

I didn't do that. Uh-oh. I'm going to have to fire you? We've been trying to get JJ to Google. We've been asking him for you. No, but there was a story in the New York Times literally about how green card. I can't remember which came first, but like green... I think Pretty Woman came first.

Well, yes, I think Pretty Woman came first because there was a story in the New York Times. It was basically like, oh, this is trying to do the preempts. Pretty Woman thing and it's not working. Like, you know, it's not working as like, well. And it's like, it was almost framed as they were trying to copy it. But it was like... That's so weird. Pretty Woman was March 1990.

Yeah. And was obviously this runaway success for like the whole year. And Green Card comes out Christmas time in 1990. Yeah. Yeah. It's a funny article. I read it sort of confused almost. Like, why would you even compare these two movies, you know?

Well, it's got two people in it. It does have two people. And they're kind of... Green card, the literally... Oh, Karen James wrote this. Oh, Karen James. Karen James. Our colleague at the New York Film Critics Circle,

Green Card Apes Pretty Woman was the headline. Green Card was not conceived as daughter of Pretty Woman, although it seems that way now. Pretty woman, she's walking down the street. You know? Also, they were both Touchstone. They're both Touchstone. They're both Touchstone.

And part of it was that it wasn't that, oh, the movies were the same, but the Touchstone was trying to market it the same way. Sure, they were like, you know, yeah. But I also think there was this codification of what a Touchstone movie was, which was really important to the film ecosystem for a while. I remember a Mad Magazine article in the early 90s.

It's a kid who devoured that. You read it for the articles. I only read it for the articles. Sergei Arragonius, you tore it out. I don't want to see it. Sorry. Those spies are up to no good. Right.

We cannot support the spies. Get out of here, Antonio Prohas. There was an article that was, what if Walt Disney was awakened from Cryosleep. And it was a multi-page illustrated comic story of Walt Disney being shown around the 90s. Right, like how things have changed. Right.

And it's saying, and here we have Touchstone Pictures. And he goes, what's Touchstone Pictures? And he goes, Touchstone Pictures is our label for films with more adult themes. that we could never release under Walt Disney Pictures. Like, for example, pretty woman, a movie about like a financial maven who falls in love with a... Oh, ho. A prostitute.

Right, right. And he goes, oh, and at the end, she's, like, sent back to her life of struggle. And he's like, no, he basically, like, marries her and makes her a princess. Like, the bit that they were sort of found a way to make movies that almost had... A Disney arc to them. Right. Despite being for grown-up. I think of Touchstone films with a lot of war.

warmth. Yeah. Because there was, not just because of the air it represented, but it did feel like Touchstone had a lot of good, mid-budget

kind of gooey, movie star comfort film. I think of the warmth because when lightning strikes. Hot. And that's what Touchstone. You don't want to touch the stone if lightnings hit it.

You don't. I do too. You see that logo and you're like, ah. Yeah. 100%. I think that's sort of maybe what people were

starting to comment on is like, is this just going to be their fucking beat now? And, you know, up until that point, when they found it, Eisner and Katzenberg, their whole strategy was like get diminished value stars. Yeah, sure. Like a sort of a B-level guy. Right.

They were like, Bet Midler, five-picture deal. Richard Reifis, five-picture deal. It would be so easy. No, it was either people who had flopped, they were too afraid to recover from. Yeah, or had just kind of like alienated too much of the end. industry and you could get them at a bargain. Now, Richard Dreyfus wasn't either of those, right? Right? He hadn't had any pops or alien to anybody.

No. It's, I think it's down and out in Beverly Hills is Dreyfus, Nolte and Midler, who were all like fucking bargain basements. Clearance must go movie stars. And that movie opened to number one at the box office. And they were like, see our fucking thing works. The trailer for Green Book, which is very deranged. I assume you mean green card. Thank you.

Yes. Because nobody does an accent in Green Book. That film. No one's doing a kind of like a big ethnic sort of accent. Let me correct myself. That one's eating a pizza. The trailer for Green Book is sensitive, profound. Thank you.

A burrously funny. Right. And it has a beating heart. A beating hard at the center name Linda Cardalini. The trailer for Green Card is insane. I haven't seen the trailer. It's a peak 90s trailer. I don't watch the trailer.

It was on the Blu-ray. It felt like it was 12 minutes long. She's a horticulturalist. He, we actually, it's hard to fucking tell what he does. He's maybe a composer, but maybe he's not. It's a lot of that, but there's so much voiceover talking through every plot. He sleeps in the pie. She needs the apartment.

But this is the part I want to call out. Touchstone Pictures presents France's most acclaimed actor, Girardepardepardue, and America's newest film sensation, Andy McDowell, in the story of two people, yada, yada, yada, yada. Like, the wind up on that fucking trailer. I mean, I guess I get it because it's like neither of them were house hold names, but they are both, you know, you can present them credibly as like, these are new exciting people. We need to explain to you why these are movies stars. She just won the fucking, you know,

in a movie that won the Palm Door. And he is from France, which is cultured. But do you think like the sex lies and videotape was at all of a selling point for her at this point? Okay. I know it was a big hit, but it's interesting, I guess, Sex Lise and Vita Tate, moved more money than Green Card. Like, that... Yeah, no. But it's interesting also, though, to, like, transition from that into sort of, like, sweetheart. Which is also why I think they're not...

That's sort of what I'm... I'm more mean, which is, like, you know... Little sugar to the salt here. But it's not... They're not going... And from Sex Lise and Video... You know that movie. Filming people who fuck.

Right. They're saying America's newest film sensation. And you're like, oh, right. Right. They let you fill in the blank because they're trying to frame her a different way. They did a good job. We love Andy McDowell for about five or six years. And then we kind of get sick of her. I just think the tagline for this title, which I butcher. But it's a great tagline. But is the thing that like 90 studio exec dreams were made of, of like walking in and you're like, here's the poster.

One movie star holding another movie star and you're like, you're promising me two movie stars? And they're like, yes, TBD. And probably. The title is Green Card, and the tagline is the story of two people who got married, met, and then fell in love. And you're like, you've just told me all three acts. I see the movie in my head. And it's like everyone knows what a Green Card marriage is. No one's thought to do the movie yet.

No. I will say, though, I think what's interesting about the movie is the three acts come are more subtle and not exactly what you would expect. from that tagline. Like, I'm expecting, I was watching and I was expecting like, you know, oh, there's one night

when they, you know, they, they, you get drunk on the beach, confess the secrets, and then one of the bills are raft and says, fuck you, Linda.

Sorry. Keep going. Sorry. Was that sent help? Have you sent help yet? Oh, yeah. I sent help with David. Yeah.

I sent help with David. I love send help. But, But yeah, you're expecting, there's that scene where they're, where they each, they each go to bed in her apartment for the first night. And, you know, he's bare-chested and burly. And he asks her what side of the bed she sleeps on and you, and she looks at the door. And you sort of, you know, in a more tropey movie, you know, she walks out the door. She sees him. They, you know, they kiss. They maybe do something else. But it doesn't happen that way And I think that's a good thing about this movie But it also makes it a little bit more of an odd Or Duck than you're expecting

I found this movie odd I loved the ending I had Ending isn't crow The ending is kind of like The ending is so good This whole thing made sense Yeah that any sort of reservations I had

Went away But I still have my problems. I also have problems with Depardue. That's my thing as well. It's a little bit of a hurdle for me to get over. And it's not just because we know now he is a bad person. He is a bad person. He's a bad person. It seems

fairly definitive that he's especially become quite the ogre. Can I now tell my story about my most recent Depp Ardu story was I was in Cannes last year and I got an email from and editor at the New York Times, asking me to write a story on, his conviction had just been announced.

When you say conviction, he has been accused and put on trial several times for various things. But he finally got, but there was one that happened. There was sexual assault conviction, actually. He actually was convicted. There have truly just been decades of stories about Gerard Deppard-Bardtou, and even in this moment, in 1990,

where it's like, Ciro knows getting him in a best actor nomination. He's starring in Green Card. he's doing his American press, like his first real run of, like, is, are we ready for France's biggest movie star? He says, like, seven insanely objectionable things in interviews that were litigated for weeks in the press in a way that, like, feels like our modern discourse cycle. Back then, people would kind of move on for shit. But this, he was found guilty of sexual assault in last Matt. And was he getting a pass because he was foreign?

Well, this is what Esther's about to tell you, though, a little bit. Yeah, so they were like, can you write a story about like canne reacting to it? And obvious, he's the king of can. Like, you know, you walk down the street. There are pictures of him. He's been in like so many movies that were at the festival. And so basically my task was to go around and find people to talk. I got the side.

And I went to a party and I was like, I'll shirt on the beach. It was very fancy. It was very can. Shirley all finds people and I sort of started putting out feelers with American colleagues like do you know any French colleagues that would like be willing to speak and a lot of the thing was like

no no no no like we cannot speak about their art and I finally just sort of was like going around listening and seeing if I heard French accents and going up to people and I... Profiling people Esther. Well yeah and so I found you know

like a publicist who's like you know and the quotes were exactly what you would expect, which is like, he's probably guilty, probably, I found the quote, probably guilty, probably being a very bad man, but he's also been, he has been also more respectful, a man who has achieved an unbelievable work in many demands. And it's just like, it was so, like, walking around. And everyone's blowing cigarette smoke in my face. It was just like the most. But I think there's been a, yeah, years and years and years of this happening and being like, whoa, but he's Gerard. This is, this is what Gerard does. Right. This is, this is fine.

Francis Hull response to me to made America look like fucking Woke Point 10, you know? Like, it's just like, where they're always just like, yes, but he is good actor, you know, and I'm being, I'm doing a dumb accent and I'm being like silly and dismissive about it. But it is true that

when you like, like, artists would just like sign petitions randomly defending people and it's like why. And they're like, well, he is such a celebrate, like how can you attack art? Yeah. This is, you know, you are lynching this man, you know. Former presidents. Right. The tone is very often like, you know, who knows if these things are true?

And even if they are true, such things happen. Boys will be boys, you know, blah, blah, but. But what we cannot deny is that Girard gave us 50 years of film history. Yeah. And how dare you threaten to erase that? Like, the French's response to- They do not care. Like, he was found guilty and they were like, he-

I think it's getting a little more serious. Like, I do feel like there's been genuine cultural, like, And there have been people who have taken like an incredible stand, like Adele Hanel. But it's basically only this current younger generation of French filmmakers and actors who are actually pushing back on the thing. And even so have experienced insane career repercussions. But yeah, no, their attitude is just like it felt like what they saw was, oh, so what? People say a story about Kevin Spacey and now Kevin Spacey movies no longer exist.

They cannot do that to our culture. and they get so defensive about like... Honestly, they feel that way about like Kevin's Basie too. Yeah. He was all over canned last year too. Other thing is that he became this like comical like cube of a man. Yes. Who not only was like credibly accused of basically just being a total creep, you know, for decades.

But also it was like, and I will pay no taxes. Right. And I can piss anywhere on an airplane that I want. And, you know, it's just like, He was just this, like, cartoon villain. Yes. But he was given, like, such cultural indulgence, right? That you're like, this guy is just like...

He randomly, like, wrote a letter about how Putin is good. Like, he was really freelancing out into other areas of evil, like, in the 2010s and 2020s. Like, kind of like the sort of Stephen Seagall approach of, like, I'm flooding the zone. Yeah. Bad in every direction. And also, like, my uncle who's an actor in France, is just like, yeah, it's like one of the open secret. that Gerard has used in earpiece for like 25 years. Even when he's doing like stage, when he's doing TV, when he's doing film,

like he's a lazy piece of shit and he doesn't learn his lines. That is me quoting an angry working actor in France at like how much they let Depardieu get away with. And basically would say like he shows up and he doesn't know what the character is and the audience applauds. Like he just became so deeply tied reputationalally to the idea of French cinema. Like this is our living legend and nothing he could do

would distort the sort of enormity of all of it. So it just made so many fucking movies. A ton of movies. A bunch in Hollywood, but way more in France. Yes. And he sort of successfully morphed from young, you know, interesting actor to leading man to like older comic actor

supporting two obelics. Right, like he even has his big franchise. I mean, when they were making the asterix movie, they were like, There is one obelix, and it is Jared Depress. I remember reading... No one else can play this man. I remember reading an Asterix book in, like, the early 90s,

and in the front page they had a caricature of Gerard Depardieu as Obelix. And I was like, why did they make it Departu? And my mom was like, because they just know he's going to play him in a movie at some point. Because, like, the asterix keeps changing in those movies, and Depp Arjou is Oblix for the first four. Like, he didn't change. Here's how I would put it, Ben, okay? Imagine if the biggest star in Hollywood,

and I know in your head you're probably thinking John Goodman, right? Yes. Was not asked to play live action Fred Flintstone, was basically asked to play live action Barney Rubble. Yeah. He did it like... Obelix is sort of the Barney. Ten times.

Right. And the guy playing live action Barney Rubble had over decades been seen as the nation's greatest heartthrob. Right. Our most intense, dramatic actor. I mean, like, all of it, you know? And you're like, now kids are like, yeah. Oh, Elix.

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Quince.com slash check. All right. I'm going to open the dossier before we can, we can return to this sort of where Deppardier was in his career for green card. But I want to open the dust. Witness. Peter Weir. He's transitioned to Hollywood. He made a massive hits called Witness. Winns 2 Academy Award. John Book.

His name is John Boar. His name is John Bois. And he's got to go to Amish country. He witnessed something. You like Witness? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Witness the Fitness? Witness the Fitness. It's a British song. People will understand.

Oh, my God. His follow up. I thought I was like, what? His follow up the Mosquito Coast. Not successful. I like that movie. I do too. you know, sort of went over a little tepidly at the time,

doesn't really get awards and so on and so forth. Peter, we're very frustrated by this. Thanks about getting out of Hollywood altogether. And, you know, he hasn't written a movie since Year of Living Dangerously. That's the last time he's credited on a screenplay. But so then he's just kind of like, I think I should just write something for myself. It can be something commercial,

but like maybe this is what I'm frustrated about right now. Green Card is kind of, he says, it's like, I got to get back in the game. His movies have been getting more epic too. He was working in extreme landscapes, period, different cultures, yeah. The way he puts it, I was reviving something Frank Capra had perfected, the romantic comedy, a light snack. I do love a light snack. Girl dinner, as they say.

Is our rom-coms now girl dinner? Our rom-coms, girl dinner. Now, of course, romcums have to be about FBI agents who are rumbled, and it turns out they're going to do a spy mission. There was one... Is there another one? There was one announced, I think, yesterday a new Eddie Murphy, and I'm astonished to say this, streaming movie. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, Eddie Murphy wants to make a straight-to-streaming movie?

It won't be anonymous, though. He has some weird medical condition where if they project him onto a big screen... He melts. Yeah. Like Alex Mack. Yeah. A bottle of metal. I'm just waiting for him to start to become the first actor with an exclusive deal with Delta Airlines.

No, he's going to be the first actor who's like, they AI'd me. I'm a fucking AI now. Yeah. They can just put me in anything now. I watched his last one, The Drop, which sucks. Evil Angoria plays his wife in it and is quite good. They've announced that, of course, they now need to re-team. As if the public's demanding another...

Wait, he made a movie called The Drop? Or it's called The Take. There's another movie called The Drop. Yeah, because The Drop is the one with Tom Hardy. Maybe it's called The Pickup. And then there's Drop. Right. Which is the phone one.

Yes. Looks like Pete Davidson's in this one, too. Uh-huh. Kiki Palmer. Was Pete Davidson? Evil Angoria. Was he playing a character that's like really different from like his general vibe? Is it guy?

David, you joke. I would argue the problem with that movie is he is playing a character that is way too different from his general vibe as a guy. Okay, fair enough. It is Pete Davidson as, I can't get late.

I don't know. Talk to girls. And I'm like, are you fucking winking at the cameras? This whole movie... But I feel like Eddie Murphy looks at him as like, is that his deal?

Like, Eddie Murphy's just like, so on planet famous. He's like, what's this nerds deal? That's the energy of the movie. It's like Pete Davidson making Eddie Murphy look at text exchanges. Right. being like, I don't fucking know.

Shut up. So you didn't like it? No, it sucks. Okay. It's a movie for idiots and losers. But he's announced another streaming film, of course. Yv Longoria is kind of good in it. Okay.

And then it's like they got a re-team. The chemistry was so indeniable on Amazon Prime that they're making a new movie and it was called like, a parental attachment style or something like that. I saw, I believe I saw a deadline article or whatever. And I was like, okay, relationship. Attachment parenting. Attachment parenting. And I was like, okay, okay.

That's like, sounds low concept enough. It's like a green card-esque title. Is it just about the two parents empty nesting? No, it's about they get tied into the mob. Right. Relationship has put to the ultimate test when they're forced to counsel a crime boss's family while being held hostage. Great. Sounds like it has a bunch of fucking guns in it.

Probably has a lot of guns. Like the first sentence of that, I was like, is it just going to be evil on gory and Eddie Murphy have to figure out what their marriage is like now that their kids have left the house? Comedy. Right. And just let them talk to each other. A light snack. A light snack. It sounds like a light snack. Can we talk a little sort of like larger rom-com theory here, Esther? Okay. What do you mean? Well, I just, the modes of rom-com and sort of like what we each believe in in terms of like what makes a fruitful rom-com. Okay. There is a thing this movie does that I value greatly and I realize while watching it how few examples I could think of of this. being utilized, which is

I am often frustrated by the rom-com that is predicated on a lie. You know the lie's going to get busted out. They fall in love, and it's just kind of an annoying tension till they get to the conversation and they blow up and someone has to come apologize for being mad

about a thing they should have been mad about in the first place. Yeah. Right? This movie is they're in the same lie. Yeah. Yes, right. They meet each other for different reasons. Forming a lie. Right, right. But they're a 100% on the same page within that, which is so much better as a kind of like pressure cooker for tensions to develop. Yeah. I mean, I think, do you think there are other examples,

though nothing is coming to my, I'm sure if I thought about it harder. But I think the, the situation with the like the rom-com of deception is always hard because then somebody needs to forgive someone. Sure. You gotta buy that. And then, and sometimes it works and sometimes it like absolutely doesn't. And that's like,

but it's been, I mean, and that has been, like, for instance, like the, um, the Doris Day Rock Hudson rom-coms, like two of them, not the last one, but like are all like, he's pretending to be a Texas guy. And she's like a working woman and like literally, you know, at the end

of pillow talk, he literally like, carries her out of bed and, like, you know, bring us her moment. And it's like, okay, she's fallen in love with him, but do we really believe this? The movie has to end, so that's what we have to believe. The movie has to end, so that's what we have to do. And obviously, it always

seems more fair when either the lie is so outrageous or there's so much of a double sort of standard. Like, I think,

like, I think sometimes the lies work when, you know, it's, for instance, a, like, Lady Eve, where she sort of double crosses him and then double crosses him again, and it's like, triple crosses him. I don't know. I don't know numbers. But how many crossing. I'm going to give you some other ones. Yeah.

While you were sleeping. Yes. One of the most insane built-on-a-ligh things ever where you're like, I love this movie except for she will eventually have to reveal, I am a psychopath. path. Like, you know, I have been behaving. I mean, you've got mail. I mean, you've got mail. Both have this. Yeah. I'm trying to think what else. Well, does sleepless in Seattle actually has it, have it outside of the fact that she, it doesn't

really, she's like stalking him, but like, you know, she doesn't really lie to him. No, that's more she's just being insane. That's more she's being insane. You've got male is more the like he actually lies to her for a good portion of the movie. What's interesting to me is Lady Eve, which I think is. as good as any rom-com ever made. Yeah. Does the triple lie at least? And yet, it almost feels like it pushing it that far is a commentary on how many rom-coms

were already built upon lies at that point. Yeah. Like, it feels like the post-modern version of like, they're just going to keep fucking lying to each other. And then spoilers, the end of that movie is the guy being like, I don't even fucking care what reality is anymore. But the thing is, they break up in the first place with that movie because he is mad. He actually is mad at her.

lying to him. And then she gets pissed at him because she actually does fall in love. So then she lies to him again to back. And then he's just so confused. And that's the screwball thing that happens all the time, which is like they just get so confused at the end. Like someone just gets so confused at the end and they're like, whatever, let's fuck. But his takeaway is also like, the energy of you as a person is who I want to be with and who I am in love with. I'll work out whoever the fuck you actually are later. Yeah. Is kind of, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I feel like there's some, you know, I mean, this is a shitty movie. Well, it's not a shitty movie.

But like... This movie? No. Oh, the movie you're about to... The movie I'm about to say. I do think there are some that try to do like double deception. Like, you know, I don't like this movie very much, but like how to lose a guy in ten days. That's a classic.

They're both lying about different things. And so you're sort of like... But, I mean, I just don't think that movie is that good. No. I think the unified lie is an under. used power move. Yeah. And I think it's also because the best rom-coms are,

there is a circumstantial reason these two people need to be together. Yeah. There's a reason they can't leave. This is like forged in fire. And you can have the arc of like they're driving each other crazy and then they start to connect and then they realize their feelings and they hurt each other in a way that doesn't feel like, hey, why wouldn't you walk out the front door? Why are you still bothering with this guy?

Right. I mean, and there have been some more we have to date, you know, to. like more recent ones. It's such a romance novel trope. Yeah, like we have to fake relationship to, in order to but I think what's interesting about this is that also they don't

they don't, getting into it, they don't think they have to spend any time together. Whereas the fake dating thing has is often oh, we have to pretend like we're in love and so then we actually fall in love. This gets there eventually but they literally are like, bye.

We did it. Bye. Once again, it's why the tagline's good because they mean they fucking no I mean they get married they mean they meet they they don't exchange pleasantries until after they marry yeah and it's like so long for the road I guess I should know what your name was Peter Weir great quote I thought green card was a film that should be seen at five o'clock in the afternoon the perfect sort of late matinee I never thought of it as a night out sort of film uh initially he wrote it for an englishman right like that was his that was his concept right uh you know it would happen one night he put it in a bottom drawer

because he said just kind of felt irrelevant, felt like it been done before, like I was writing it for like a Dudley Moore, you know? Jared DeFredge. He's told many different stories of how he sort of first noticed him, but it's basically like I kept seeing this guy in movies. Now, the movie he cites the most often is Dantan,

the great Andre Wadjab movie about the French Revolution, which is mostly, which rocks, especially if you love the French Revolution, like I do, but is a lot of sweaty, hot Depardieu as George D'Artagnan in his final days basically like going like, they are going to execute me.

This is so bad. And then yelling and everyone going to, why would you do that to me? This was part of the riddle for American audiences is they'd be like, they think he's hot? A little bit, but I, look, I'm sorry. Like, I think Jared Depardue is so hot.

I'm like, you know, 90s, 80s and 90s Deppardieu. Yes, absolutely. Like, he, I find him incredibly magnetic. I kind of get it in this movie. I don't get it. I super get it in, like, Last Metro and shit. Like, that, like, all that stuff.

Yeah. Earlier, yeah, part two. I think here he, here he feels inching to... Quasimota. I mean, they have hair is full. Slouching towards Quasimbaugh. He's full, he's full, because he's always got the, like, this, like, cloak on. It just makes him look like...

I know. I just like, it's... We've said this about other actors before, and I just want to say, as a hyperbolic person, I'm about to say it and mean it as the ultimate. He has the most face of any person ever. There's so many crevices and contours. It's insane. And I also just like, there's no way you can point a camera on him and that face not taking up like the full frame. No.

It's like it's like a Frank Gehry building or something. You're trying to figure out how it's like set up. You know, it's interesting his son, you know, Guillaume Departre, who died very young, right? But, like, he, you know, who he had with Elise Vonre, right, his sort of very beautiful wife, was sort of like, what if you kind of programmed a computer to make a sort of more conventionally handsome Departreji, but you don't lose the nose. Like, you still see him in it, but it's kind of like a, this is like the sanded off, Gerard. I think it was let the sunshine in.

Sure. The Claredenie film where he comes in at the very end. A movie about how French men are normal. A movie I love. Great movie. And ends with France's most normal man being her therapist, her like spiritual. Yeah, yeah. It's a good twist.

And he shows up just in a close-up, like jump scare, cut in. He's like a psychic. He's like reading her fortune. Right. Like 80, 90 minutes in, I swear to God for a second, I went like, is this movie in 3D? Just looking at his face in 2015 or whatever. And you saying, like, Peter Weir was like, who's this Frenchman who keeps popping up on my screens? A little bit.

I can't shake this guy. He wasn't buying tickets for Depardieu movies. There were just Deppardue movies playing on the screen next over and his nose slid in. I invade. So he writes this screenplay with Departre d'U mind. Doesn't tell the actor I'm thinking about you or anything like that. He's just kind of like, all right, the Englishman thing is not sparking for me.

What if I wrote it for a Frenchman? He's afraid of calling him up to say that he did this. So instead he, took a picture of him that ran with an interview he gave in the local paper and he kept it on his desk and he would just look at it and I guess probably just go like,

whoa! Every time he looked, oh, there he is again. Danton, he likes the picture. The Frenchman Char de Prejou had never given an English language performance. So it's not even like, you're not even automatically assuming he'd work

in a movie where he has to speak English. Here's how, here's the things that he was interested by. His masculinity, his vulnerability. his mysterious contradictory quality of child and man, beauty and beast. I mean, yeah, sure. Here's the thing I'll throw out that I think

's worth considering as well. He's just done, Peter Weir, three big A-list Hollywood movie star movies in a row. Two Harrison Ford's and then Robin Williams. He gets along with these guys really well, but that's a level of stardom where the plus side is automatic green light, big budget,

give in to you, confidence from studio. The downside is you're kind of, you've got some co-authoring with those guys. And you're on their rails. Yeah. And like obviously he, with Mosquito Coast, he went against type with Ford and Ford's there with him. Yeah. But then the reaction from everyone is like, this doesn't make sense for Harrison.

That's too much for Harrison. At the time, everyone was just like, nah, he's trying to do something he can't do. It does feel like he is strategically here trying to make a movie where it can be his movie and he is selecting actors. And unlike those guys, we're going to command a bit. salary, but also an automatic green light, the alternate way to go about this is to basically bet on movie star futures and get two people who are in a transitional state where you can point to here's what's worked up until now. And if I can get them over this line, suddenly you have a

movie star who's worth more than you paid for them. There's also, but that's such an interesting thing in the case of Departre do, I think, because I think usually when you're betting on movie star futures. It's that people haven't fully figured out their persona yet when you're betting on. And here, the movie does have to be so catered to the Departueness of it all because he's so, like there's no way for him not to be that. So it's just an interesting thing because he's, yes, he's not Harrison Ford, but. Do you ever do like an action movie? Harrison Ford?

No, Sherrod Defarge. Uh, yes. It was, uh, I don't know. I genuinely was wondering. He was him buying a fucking piece of ham. I don't know. No, I don't know. I feel like he never was that.

I guess what I'm saying is that, like, he has such a star persona, you know? Yes, he does. He does. And that's just an interesting sort of, you know. And his, his star persona is like. And obviously it's untested in the United States, but it's also just so, like, you admit, you see, you're like,

okay, I get it, you know? His star persona was inherently a little lascivious. And it starts with him making these like really edgy sex comedies where he's a young man. And it's just sort of like, man, this like young dumb, full of cum guy who's got this life to him. You know, and he's like built like a fucking rugby player. And then, yes, as it goes on, it's like he becomes this more legitimate, like, versatile, heavyweight leading man. But there is always that like sexual charge to him. which is like some of the stuff where I struggle with this movie,

where you're like, this character is not presented in a way that makes me uncomfortable. But the movie is pointing to a character, and I can't stop thinking about how right past that line, real world Gerardepardepardet does. Well, no, and obviously, again, it's, you know, trying to think of where we were then and where we are now. At the same time, I think one of the interesting things and I agree with you, maybe, I wouldn't say troubling,

but one of the things, hurdles you have to get past is people keep talking about how dangerous this man is. Yes, right. And how he's, you know. It's baked into the text that this guy seems like he could be. And obviously we get to the point where it's like, oh, he just did like kid stuff, whatever. And yet you're sort of like, oh, did he do something real bad? Because I feel like this guy could have done something real bad. That's the innate dangerous energy Deppardue has.

And I think Weir was really smart to make a movie that leads with that. Right. You're worried. And then the chips start to, the layers fall away. And he's, I mean, there's that moment where he gets mad and he slams the thing and her picture falls down and breaks glass. And I don't know. There's a weird. It's an interesting thing.

And it's obviously modern opinions versus now. but there's an interesting thing to reckon with too where I don't know if a man ever did that like that freaks me the fuck out like a little bit you know and I think it gives the movie I think this oddness

that you have to reckon with now which also I like this movie a tremendous amount as well but it is kind of predicated on Annie McDowell keeps not being satisfied by these kind of hyper woke liberal

Greg Edelman. New York softball. Get him out of here. Oh, I know, but this movie sets up like a series of like... He's the big one. Indefensible Baxter. And the way she talks about

her past relationships. And you're like, this guy doesn't even eat meat. All of this is not stuff I hold against the movie. No oil, no salt is where Elton loses me. Yeah. Or no butter, no salt, whatever, you know. It does feel like in doing that,

the framework is anything you might find unsavory about Gerard Depardieu is just a byproduct of him being quote unquote a real man. Real men do get angry. Edelman gets the fucking call for this. It's like you're playing a chinless loser. Deppardu's going to throw you through a window.

And also, Deppardu like fucking clocks you for being too sexually pushy. Like that's the worst case scenario as an actor. Is Departredu is like, you are not respecting women's boundaries. Throwing a character, guys. George Farre. Yes. So, Debraeux reads the script, finally. Loves it. It says, for me, this is a great

situation. You can make a comedy with this, but you can also make the truth. He likes the, you know, the setup. He's committed to make two other movies, so he can't shoot Green Carp for a year and a half. We're just like, ah, fuck, like, I want to make this. Katzenberg's like, where is this? We're talking probably like 88 or whatever

because Katzenberg at Disney goes like, it's fine. We'll put the movie on hold. We can start in 18 months. Here's the script, by the way, in the meantime. dead poet society. Goes off and makes Dead Poet Society. And so Katzenberg is, and then Katzenberg is like, you can have final cut on green card. I like

this script. It's not going to be expensive. Like, go for it. You know, which, cool. Like, God bless. Like, they don't do that much anymore. And we're, I think somewhat convinces Disney to basically just be a distributor. Gets a lot of

like independent financing. Like, makes it like an Australian French co-production. There was It's still... It's like a big profit from the movie. Like, we were made like a ton of money off this movie because he had like a genuine cut. Yes. He got the Australian film board to partially finance this movie.

Because he's making it, essentially. No Australians are in it. Right. I guess at that point in time, there was still a lower tier kind of level of support you could get if it is a Australian filmmaker and some number of Australian crew people, even if you don't film in Australia or with any Australian cast. So he really built this movie. in a way that is closer to modern film financing and kind of made out like a bandit. Yeah.

While having the full support of Disney in the United States. DeVridge barely spoke English. They would translate the screenplay into French for him and then translate it back in English so he understood what he was saying. DeVrogey's famously, like, completely lost in 1492, which is the Ridley Scott movie in which he plays Christopher Columbus. It's one of the word,

it's the worst Ridley Scott movie ever made. It sucks so, so hard. And I think part of what happened there was he truly did not know the lines he was saying. is like what you supposedly, you know, and Ridley Scott was probably just like eating cigars and just being like, just get on with it or whatever. I mean, this movie benefits from leaning into his like rough franglese.

Right, exactly. Yeah, it's sort of, it doesn't even, right, it doesn't even matter. No. David? Yes. You look like a man who doesn't know that fast growing trees is America's largest and most trusted online nursery with thousands of trees and plants and over two million.

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Didn't feel like he was ever going to become one based on how he speaks. Right? And like, I do feel like, though he made a lot of Hollywood movies after this, he largely just sort of plays villains or comical oaths. My father of hero is the year after this. That's certainly comical. Oaf, then... Like, what's the Dalmatian?

1492 is the year after that. The Dalmatian? He's in... He's in 102. Oh, he's in 102. Yeah, isn't he the villain in that? He's... He's...

He's... He's... Right. I saw that film in the years. I'm sorry. The French, my father, The hero, is 91. The American remake,

which he also starred in, was three years later. Right, right. And then there, I feel like there's one other big... Well, there's, like, bogus. Which is insane. Never... Never even heard of that one.

Bogus is Norman Jewison's last theatrical film, I believe. Unless, no, no, the hurricane. The big three. Whoopi Goldberg, Jared Dupeture, Haley, Joel Osmond. Exactly. It's, Haley Joel Osman is an orphan boy who's taken in by Wuppius' godmother, and Gerard de Perdue is his drunk French, invisible friend named Bogus. So far, it sounds like a role he's suited for.

But then, right, he's in Branagh, Hamlet, he's in Man in the Iron Mask. Right. Well, he's obviously, right. Man in the Iron Mask, that's kind of where they feel. found him. Correct. That kind of like, yeah, you can play drunk French musketeer. But then also, most importantly, in 1999, he does a film called Asterix and Oblix

versus Caesar. And he's like, I don't need this American bullshit. I got an Asterix movie every three years, no matter what. Yeah. And, like, I mean, Griff, you and I have certainly both seen Le Placard, you know, like that gigantic hit. Like, he made, you know, he made a giant French movies. A movie where you cannot believe Disney didn't remake that in 2005.

Do you know this movie yesterday? I do not. It's Daniel L'Otoe as a man who's going to be fired from his job as an exec at a condom company. It is at a condom company. It's the most French-ass. And his next-door neighbor is like an old, sad, gay French man who was like, I could never come out, but I tried to march and this and that. But the times have changed. And now if I were gay, they wouldn't have been able to fire me.

And it inspires Daniel Otoe, and he tells everyone that he's gay. And he's inspired by discrimination. Well, and it's like because they're a condom company, they cannot. fire a gay man is the implication. But then they basically make him like the spokesperson for the company. They keep traveling, like pushing him around saying like, look at our gay employee. And Gerard DeBerjou plays the boss who has to do the Seinfeldi, like, not that there's anything wrong with that.

And then starts to be like, am I in love with it? Yes. Deppardue is incredibly funny. He's very funny. It's like perfect. It's a really dumb movie. It made like one trillion francs. It was like a giant smash.

It won the Olympics that year. France submitted it in track and field. But yes, like that's the kind of stuff he then gets into where it's like he's playing Obelix. He's playing like funny supporting guy. He'll have like... He does art movies or whatever. Two scenes behind a desk and a cop drama or whatever it is.

It does feel like he kind of never did a movie where he was running around holding a gun. But even like him showing up and like LaVille en Rose was just sort of like, if you're going to make a legitimate French movie, you need three minutes of Depardue. He's like blessing your product. Maybe, but I do feel like he stopped, like, the whole thing with him in the 70s and 80s is he is a true collaborator with, like, a lot of the giant French filmmakers. And that kind of goes away. He's still like a mainstay in French cinema, but he is not being picked up by, like, the newer names in French cinema at all. I think he stops being collaborative, period.

And I think he becomes a shut up and puny guy. He's a evil asshole who's, right, impossible to work with and is the sex offender. There's one I really like called, uh, when I was the single. And it's him and Cecil de France. When I was a singer. It's called something like that. Conchette Chantor by Xavier Giannoli. It's sort of an attempt to do a sort of fabulous Baker Boys thing.

Like he's one of the few remaining dance band singers in France. It's that plus loss in translation. Yeah. It's the sort of like weird. Is this guy's sad stuck in the middle in a loop kind of movie that I thought he was very good in. Yes. But it definitely feels like. Like, the 2000s are the last time where he even kind of gives a shit.

I mean, true, like, if you look at his, yeah, it's like, I just have not heard of many of these movies. And I've not heard of many of these filmmakers. Whereas in the 70s, you know, he worked with Renee. You worked with Bertilucci, obviously. They worked with Truff. Yes. I mean, that last match was incredible. Like, he worked with, you know, Bertrand Blier, you know, Under the Son of Satan is a big movie that is, right?

Marcus Pliat, you know, zillion things. And obviously, Jean de Florette is like kind of a big breakout. Oh, yeah. You know, all the way to America. It's another thing that helps push him to America. But like 2022, which is the last year before his legal troubles completely consume him, he has seven credits. And I think what you're talking about, Esther, of like, the act of trying to introduce a star, right?

Or, like, explode them in that way, getting someone who has the person. and the juice potentially, was so different at this point in time with international stars. Yeah. Because it's like, it is insane. I think it is one of the few things where I feel the need to constantly give Netflix credit. Netflix figured out how to get people over subtitles. Right. It is fascinating.

Right, right, right. Right, that it was just always like even people would struggle with British shows and you'd have to fucking remake them in English, you know, in American English. and Netflix has just made it like, we are an international company. Everything goes on the same site. It catches on with this audience. And you watch it with subtitle.

You watch everything with subtitle. Totally. And so if someone pops in Squid Game, Hollywood isn't like, oh, I watched this weird thing. This guy is good. How do we find a new way to introduce him to a new audience

from Square One as if to them he hasn't done anything? It's like, no, put the Squid Gang guy in Star Wars. Like, there is a kind of open playing field in that way. Even I feel like, like Omar Sae, who was like,

one of the last guys where it's like, this dude's become the biggest star in France. Let's put him in Jurassic World. And you're like, he's in this. He hasn't really make an impact.

He's in a couple other American action films. Then he does Lupin French series and everyone's like, oh, cool. Yeah. Show us the real fucking thing. Yeah.

I mean, I do feel, though, that there are still hurdles for a lot of these people in the sense that what, it was sort of what you were talking about earlier, so I don't want to repeat anything, but it's like, it's the Mads-Micholson thing of what they're getting in the United States is still like third lead in a Star Wars thing or, you know, sort of some villain role, you know, I think it was like,

it was sort of what you were talking about with Li Beient and Hong on your No Other Choice episode, which is that like, you know, the American roles have not been any, and this is, I mean, I guess this is not really post, his is not really post-squit game, but like still, he's still getting better work in South Korea. He's had like six franchisee, big budget movies

in which he played a principal character and all of them are basically exactly the same and did nothing for his career other than normalizing his name above a poster in America. And then you're like, yeah. And then in his fucking homeland, he gets to do whatever the hell he wants.

He's got, like, infinite range of versatility. And, like, I mean, I was just looking up because it was like, what has Omar's I done, like, post? And it's like he's doing a, you know, upcoming. He did the John Wu remake of the killer. And upcoming he has... Some people tell me that was kind of good. Yeah, I never watched it, but I heard it was...

Directed it. He directed himself. He directed himself. Yeah. Yeah, but I mean, John Wu doesn't have a perfect track record these days. No. No. What was that Christmas movie?

That movie was Silent Night. Terrible. Worst should I ever saw. But Omar's next big thing is Shadow Force, a Joe Carnahan like, I think direct to something. Yeah, I think that's been in the can for a while.

I think that came out. Am I wrong? I don't know. No, I mean, it says it's in post. I'll say this. I don't know. Whatever. Maybe that did come out.

It came out. Yeah, it came out last year. I went to see Thunderbolts, and they were holding us. We couldn't leave the theater. because you were so excited. Because the Thunder Force? Shadow Force.

Shadow Force. The Shadow Force premiere was happening at the same time. Right. And they held us in the lobby of the AMC Lincoln Square so that Omar Sy could get to his. Right. Like, oh, the Shadow Force is here. Lupin, Lupin.

I don't know. It still feels very hard for that true, like, crossover. It does. Yeah, it tells you. It does. In a leading role. I think the only thing that's changed is it used to be like, Girard uperdou has been one of France's biggest stars since 1975.

And now we are going to present them to you and explain to you how historic they are and ask you to just buy in here in his third decade. Right? And that's like what would sometimes feel like a sciop of like the way there was so much energy behind trying to get Robbie Williams to conduct. to America. Well, you make him a monkey. Yeah, it took him too long to figure that out.

But everyone's response to that was just sort of like, why do you keep telling me how big this guy is? Let me form my own opinion. I think that tends to fuck people a little bit. And when Jar Deppardu's whole thing is so strange to begin with, you're like, are you tricking me? The hair is just, I don't know. You don't like my hair?

I don't like. He's too mushroomy. He's too much. So Annie McDowellowell, he took a year to find. mind her. Not that she was nobody, but like, he auditioned people for a long time, but he liked her. I assume he saw sex lies, or was it?

Yeah. And Gerard loved sex lies and videotape. Weird. Which parts of that title do you think he liked? He was like, he was like, he was like, I too film. I love to lie. He might have added like five more words to that title. So Peter Weir really enjoyed making the film. It had final cut.

He had a great, you know, incredible amount of control. Katzenberg did want the ending to change. And was basically like, if you reshoot it, if they don't separate, if they humiliate the record-shid immigration officer, I think you're going to make like double your money.

And Weir was just like, I thought about it, but I was just like, no way. Like, the ending is the ending. Like, which I also think Katzenberg's kind of wrong. I agree. I mean, maybe. Jeffrey Katzenberg is wrong. Jeffrey Katsenberg make the sort of wrong decision?

Has he? I mean, what about if he had, if he comes up with an idea for vertical short form. It's crazy you say that, Esther. I'm reading here in the dossier. He also pitched to Peter Weir, what if the ending is five minutes long, doesn't play at the end of the movie. It plays as the final installment of a quibby original

you can only watch after sundown. He was right about many things, obviously. He was once a very savvy executive. I mean, I guess he's just kind of going for the, like, you need a happy ending for good word of mouth. but I think the green card ending leaves you feeling pretty satisfied. It's very satisfying.

They're gonna figure it out. For all my quibbles with Depardue and how I couldn't. I was just like, oh, I love it. Like, I love the ending so much, you know? And it's perfect. I mean, I think that's another rom-com thing that we like talk about a lot.

It's the perfect sort of like bittersweet ending that I think some of my favorite rom-coms do, that it's like, you know. And you're watching the whole movie thinking, all right, so what are they going to pick here for the end? Like, you know, because, like, you know, the sort of roads this movie can take. And they pick the right one. Like, that's how I feel watching. I'm like, good, good job, guys. Because it's because I think, and again, this is sort of the thing that I like about the movie.

It's all of these beats that don't happen exactly the way you would expect them and don't feel perfectly tied up in a bow. They don't have like some amazing sex and then I're like, oh, I have to be. with you and they aren't like, and they don't get their happy, their perfect happy ending, but they do find that they're in love with each other and he does have to go back to France. Like, it's just like, it's the, it's sort of. The big moment is he gets it wrong. Yes. You know, in the interview.

And that's when he realizes like, oh, but there are actually a million things I do love about her and who cares that I'm obsessed. I would love to call up Bob right now and ask him if he could name the face cream that I use. I'm serious. I feel like, I don't know. It's like in a blue container. I don't know what. fucking name of it.

Yeah, I mean, it's funny that, like, that is the one it hinges on where, like, an obvious and then, I mean, his bigger fuck up is that he says that he, I memorized all of them. That's how he messes up. If he had just not remembered it, he would have been fine. But it is funny that it's like, I guarantee you, Bob would not be able to name the face cream that I use. Hans Zimmer did the score. Young Hans Zimmer in his sort of more synthy days.

Very good score, in my opinion. But the composer does have a little bit of that Hans Zimmer. sort of exoticism that people sometimes get that of them. His early scores are very world music. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Do you revisit this score? Yeah, absolutely.

Really? Those early Zimmer scores are really good. Rain Man, this, there's a third one. Like, I'm a big fan of Lion King. It's just visualizing you. Throwing this on? Remember when Jeffrey Katzenberg almost got bit by a lion?

Yes. I mean, no. But yes. Do you know this? Do you know this video? I do. Yeah. Wait. I want Ben to finish his thought.

And then, oh, I just find it very weird to be like, what did I do today? I listened to Green Card soundtrack. That's why we love David, though. There is a video of a promotional event for the Lion King where they brought out a real lion. Or maybe it was like the illustrator. I can't remember exactly what it was. Somebody can correct me. But basically, the long story short of this is that, uh, if,

it seems like Jeffrey Katzenberg might get eaten by a lion in this video. Right. The lion gets aggressive and the line gets aggressive, like towards Jeffrey Katzenberg. So when this film I want to say begins with RIP to her, we love her and we miss her, the nine train. A little shot of a nine train disappearing. Yeah, you need to tell us about the nine train. You don't know about the nine train.

I don't know about the nine train. Back in the day, Ben. I was born in 1990. Yeah, the nine train was still existing then, but it was on its way out. Back in the day, Ben, you know, on the 7th Avenue line, the red lines of the subway, right? There's the one, two, and the three, right? The two and the three are express. In Manhattan, the one is the local.

There used to be a nine train on that line, too. And it was a local as well. It was the same as the one in every way, except... There's no eight train. There used to be an eight train, Ben, long ago. Yes, there used to be an eight train as well in the Bronx. Let's not talk about that right now. But the nine was skipstop with the one north of...

96th Street. So, like, when the one is on its own. And the idea was just like, oh, at rush hour, like just to speed things along. These trains kind of like hopped. And it was too annoying. And I think people who lived in Upper Manhattan in the Bronx didn't even like it that much.

For me, who lived on that line, but not in the skip stop area, it did nothing different from a one train. But I was just still always, if we got a nine, I was like, look, a night train. It was also, it was so funny to get to the platform and be like, what's here? One, two, three.

Okay, cool. I bet I can guess with the fourth. train is. Nine. Skipping all the way over. Yes. So when Peter Weir, this movie has great New York, I would say energy in general. I would agree.

Is navigating a subway station. He hears a chorus of voices led by the unhoused singer Harry Stewart and the Erasmus group, sorry, the Emmis group singers named after Harlem's Emma's house for the unhoused. And he was like, I love this. I want this to be in the film. So that's why those guys are in the movie. For the opening. Yeah. I do want to call out because I know what happened.

while I was in the bathroom. Uh-oh. I do think Hans Zimmer's score and this is great. I agree. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I just wanted to second.

Did you hear us or did you just think? I heard David saying this was an early Han Zimmer school. It's a great score. I think a lot of the early Hans Zimmer comedy scores have aged to varying degrees. Yes. Some of them age better than others. I was just talking with Esther about his kind of early, like, world music crime. But also, like, since how the stuff is Dune.

Right. I think this is like, Kind of one of the better comedy era Zimmer scores. I like that era of his career. It's interesting to hear it now, obviously, knowing what he, like, turned into. Correct. Which has turned in something interesting as well.

It's just, like, completely different. But this is like, it's so much my problem of the modern rom-com, which barely exists, but what does exist feels like it is just trying to be one step elevated above the, like, Hallmark Christmas movie churn, which is this could have been shot anyway, and we're pretending it's anywhere else.

And rom-coms benefit so much from, like, a place of specificity, from the feeling of, like, neighborhood haunts and, like, the rhythm of whatever the fucking city or the town is. And, like, just the fact that I put this movie on and immediately, it's, like, subway drummer, people getting on and off the trains. No, I mean, I'm like, this is set in a place. And it speaks to very quickly what is kind of actually the biggest, point this movie is making. We talk a lot about the cinema of men will literally blank to avoid going to therapy.

One of your favorite, right, tropes. Yeah. This is, and I think this movie's dead on the money. Can I say it? Yeah. Women will literally get married to get a great apartment. I think it's women will literally do anything to get the right apartment. Amen.

Women in New York City. Yeah, I was going to ask, would you get green card married to get that apartment? Oh, fucking, I would marry DeVardt you now. Same. Same. Same. But that's,

that has to be specified. That's a thing this movie gets so right that has only aged better with every successive year, the opposite of Gerard DeBard-Bardue, who ages worse every year. Is you're just like, yeah. Yeah. So now, you could justify almost anything in the reality of the movie if there's an apartment this good on the market. Now, I did look it up, and it is, they did.

It's a shout. It's a soundstage. I'll tell you. I'll tell you. But imagine if that happened. Can I tell you? Is there a greenhouse in an apartment?

I mean, maybe somewhere. Yeah. Like, so I'll tell you. The first garden that they used that's a community plot, that's a real place.

That, you know, there was another garden that's like a tree garden. The one that in the, and B. Newark's parents. Correct. That they basically moved a bunch

of crabapple trees in Central Parks Conservatory Garden, which is on 5th and 105th, over to like a sort of terrorist to create that kind of like fakey. It's sort of like the frick or whatever,

like this weird kind of... Yeah, it looks... It looks like, yeah. The main apartment... It looks like the part of MoMA outside of the modern. Right, yes. Yes, like that too, exactly. And the main apartment, yes, they built it on a soundstage because they were like, we are

building paradise here. Like we... Like, it's such a specific vibe. It's supposed to be basically out of her dreams with the arch and the wall fountain and the tiles and all this stuff. But very cool. I'm sure there are places in New York. Yes.

Like weird, don't you think so? I'm sure. I'm sure. Pre-war buildings that are like, oh yeah, there's the weird conservatory apartment. I love that it's also not just man, there's a great apartment. She wants it really badly. That it's so specifically tied to her interest.

To her interest, yeah, to her. And I love the fucking co-op board, by the way, being like the one lady who's like, well, I like the couple from the bank. Because she's a horticulturalist. She'll probably be good for this place. I mean, my best friends often mentioned on this podcast, Sophie Fader and Hawken Lenzie. He is a ceramicist. Cool.

And it's like living in a kiln? Living in New York City, he's constantly having to like calculate everything based on what kind of work he could legally do within a New York living space. Right. Right. Am I allowed to have X in this house? Right. Right. Sorry.

I literally just Googled greenhouse, New York greenhouse apartments. And there was, there's a street easy thing. And honestly, this is like... It looks like a dream apartment? Yeah. And like, I mean, it's very expensive,

but it's not as expensive as I thought it was going to be. Okay. Can I ask a couple of questions? Because you're trying to figure out why it's so cheap. Upper West Side. Upper West Side. You're trying to figure out why it's so cheap. Washer dryer included?

Yeah. Walk up? Yes. In unit depressive? Bardue? No. Because that would drive the price down. Yeah, I was going to say that knocks about $200,000 off your list.

If there is a non-negotiable... Unfortunately, a French ogre lives here. In Unit DePardieu, they might pay you to live there. Yes, he's just there being like, oh, your coffee is bad, and I like butter. I don't want to keep going back to the same joke well, but it is crazy how much he looks like Shrek. He is Shrek. He is Shrek. And he only becomes more and more Shrek.

Do you know who voiced Shrek in France? Was it a Jared Defer? No, Al-A-Shaba, because they were like, that's too fucking on the nose. It's too on the bulbous nose if we hire a drug. Does the French guy voicing Shrek do a regional accent? You know, like I show a bit. He says he does.

Like, what's the French version of a Scottish accent? We're back to French stereotypes. Yeah. I believe he does. You know Al-A-Shaba. Sure, I mean, yeah. I mean, sure. I mean, I don't know him personally.

be funny. Really? You should meet how long? Be funny if I did. Yeah. Let me see if I can find what kind of accent. Keep going through the dossier. One of my favorite films that Alan Chababat made where he was, because he would direct and star,

is just called this. Not kidding. That's what it's called. It's called rur? What's it about? I don't know. Sort of looks like holes. Okay.

Rur. He also made a movie called DDA about a dog. Sounds great. It's a dog who turns into a person. He plays the dog. Sounds like good shit. Made one trillion dollars in France. DDA is on their money.

Shrek 5 got moved. Yes. To summer of 27. I think they had to redo some of the voices or something, or maybe redo like... People thought they were redoing the animation because people didn't like the new character designs. Oh, interesting.

I think it also might be script things. They're taking some big swings on this one. Was it that people figured out what Shrek 5 is about, didn't like it, and so now they're scrambling? It's maybe. Interesting. I don't know. I heard what track five was about a couple of years ago.

What you described to me didn't sound great. It was a big swing. It was wild. Well, off mic, you got to tell me. I could, I will. I could see them either panicking and going, do we have to rethink this, or saying if we're going to do this, we have to get it right.

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The world needs more Canada. Together, let's give it to them. Visit edc.ca to learn more. So the plot of green card, which is a tidy, you know, hour 45, this film. And it's a really, it's a film with, you know, some, It's got a great cast, but like pretty much all of the supporting players, it's like a couple scenes. But Proski comes in, just knocks it out of the fucking heart. He must have had more.

He must have had more scenes. I'm sorry. I can't believe you broke the law. His character's name is Bronte's lawyer. We should mention. Her name is Bronte Parrott. Because all of her, because her dad named all of her siblings after authors. So it's Bronte, Austin.

Austin. Elliot. Elliot, right. Colette. Colette. Yeah. And then who's the fifth one? I don't remember him.

Oh, Coontz. King Coont. Yeah, there you go. My name's Coontz. Coons Parish. Like to pick up a trashy airport paper paper. Nothing wrong with it. It's fun read.

Yeah, Robert Prosky crushes, I would say, in his one scene. You've got the great John Spencer. It's like a nice horticulturalist. Louis Smith is Bronte's mother. Like when she bad. As you mentioned before, Neelix, Dr. Neelix. Ethan Fythin-Dowlis. Eddowd is Peggy.

Quick and-Dow. Young End-Dow, not a bald one. Nope. Quite a head of hair on this one. What if, and I'm sure that bald and down, who I know. Friend of the show. Yes. Has interacted with End-Down in some way at some, right?

At this point, I'm not actually sure. But what if one day End-Dow does take it all off for a role? just to kind of complete the circle. Yeah. You know, it shows, like, does a THX remake or something, like, something where she's bald. I don't know. I mean, my favorite performance in this movie. Yes.

B.B. Newworth. Oh, my God. Just. And it's just, like, illegally hot. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. Can we talk about how B.B. Newark is the hottest person that ever. And I just want to, like, throw me into, like, a sewer and just, like, spit on it. Also, she has these little.

like rat earrings. Did you clock her, I clerked everything that was going on here. What she's, so like, what she, because she's, this is her second film role. Period. Period. Period. Her first film role is say anything, which she has a small role. Yes, very small. Obviously, she'd been on cheers for years in that kind of like quasi-supporting role. You know, like sort of quasi-guess quasi-supporting, you know. She went from, she's got like two standalone guest appearances, then they decide to bring her back. Then she becomes a recurring, then she becomes a regular, and then she goes back down to recurring.

Right. She wins two Emmys? Two Emmys. Does she have both of them by the time she does this movie? She has won. And she's got another one to come. And she has one more the next year. That's what's crazy.

But she had already won a Tony for Sweet Charity. I mean, she's a big theater actor. But she won a second Emmy for the final season when she demoted herself to recurring. But she did enough episodes to count. Back then, they were very. They were very, like, fungible about it, I think. She has two Tonys, of course. Can you tell me her second, Tony's for Chicago?

Of course. Chicago. I recently saw a clip from the current, like, a current production of Chicago. Yeah, because it's the secret. It is the secret life of a Mormon wife. Oh, I see. Yeah. I was kind of getting the vibe where I was like, if I paid for this, I think I would call it

a better business bureau. No. It looked pretty shocking. Yeah. Because, like, she's obviously doing nothing. And the other ones are like, the other ones are like, the ossehs just sort of around or like flapping their arms around.

They were on track or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. What's going on over this? Is it time to wrap it up with Chicago? I think it's time to wrap it up. But I think they keep making money by like, like, by throwing all these like reality TV stars in there.

I also feel like all of their runs are pretty short where they're like, if one of them sucks, they're out in 10 days and maybe the next one's better. And then the other thing about Chicago is there are like standbys like who are. have done it for years. I believe, like, Charlotte Dambois does it, who's, like, a legendary dancer and does it all the time. Like, there are people that can always do it and Bianca Marrake. Like, there are people that can always do it

and they always just throw them back in. But also, like, do twice a year, do they pick up the red phone and go, Wayne Brady, we need you back? Yes, I believe so. We should get Wayne Brady on this show. At the King of Podcasts. Remember when he crushed it on Comedy Bang Bang? Yeah.

He was so good. Wayne Brady's awesome. I love one. I love one show that no one listened to. But he was so good on everybody. His WTF is amazing. Back to BB. Yeah, BB.

It's not like this is her best work ever, but it is such a great time capsule of BB at kind of peak power. It's like when they go over to dinner at her parents' house and she shows up and she's just like, like, Lager days. And it is so. And you're just like, well, everyone should just like fuck BB because she's the hottest person that has ever lived. She's like two foot negative five.

Yeah. Yeah. She's a small woman. She's so cool. And yet she appears in anything and you're like, this is the funniest, smartest, coolest and hottest person who has ever lived. Very like debonair, very funny, very, very, very, very cool.

Also, you just want to hang out with her. She's so fun. Like, this character, you're sort of, you sort of expect like, oh, is she going to be sort of like a villain? And she's like, no, she's just like a fun hang. Esther, that's exactly what I like about it. going to cause trouble. Right.

You're like, is she going to make a pass to Depardieu and it's going to cause all kinds of problems? She started just like, no, she just likes to party. She's got rich parents

and she's an artist and she just likes to party. I think there's a really, another real positive function of her character, which is you're set up to think, oh, she's going to stir some shit or she's going to try to steal Depardue

and she's going to make a bigger mess or any of this stuff. No, it's like, you understand that this is, Annie McDowell's closer friend, that this is someone who can call Annie McDowellwell out on her shit, knows her well, cares about her.

And also is like, this guy's interesting. The co-sign of, I don't know, there's something kind of going on there, it's less about that she's going to make a move on Depardue and more that it forces Annie McDowell to reconsider. Wait, you're interested in him? Like, maybe I should take a second look at this. Yeah. And I also feel like, I mean, it's another way in which the movie sort of subverts the

tropes that you're expecting, which is, you know, hot, brassy lady comes along. and steals the guy, and then he realizes that's not right for her, you know, like that's not right for him. And it's like, no, she's just, again, she's hot and fun and having a great time. Do you know what this movie feels like to me? It's like eating a birthday cake and then being told after the fact, this cake is entirely vegan. There were no eggs, right?

Like it's soybean frosting. And you're just like, huh, it tasted good. I didn't question it at all. And the more I study how you were able to make this without doing the usual things, the more I have to like applaud you. Right, without doing, as Esther said, like, the tropey things, you would imagine if I told you it's about a green card marriage and then they have to pretend to like each other. And then they do like. It removes all the unhealthy ingredients in a way that is so unshoey that you're taking it for granted of like, yeah, it's like doing a rom-com thing. And you're like, no, it's actually like harder.

I also think the other thing is when they're studying. You know, when they're doing sort of the part where they're studying each other and studying up on, there's something very earnest about it. Like, especially, there's something very, you know, they do the montage of them taking photos, but there's something so sort of like the genuine facts of like, how do you get to know a person? As opposed to the sort of Hollywoodized version of like, let's just blast through this and like make it all a joke. There's something very genuine about like the way. you know, though I did,

I don't know if that is Gerard Deppard's actual handwriting but it looks like a serial killers. Interesting. His personally doesn't suggest anything like that and his sort of backstory way behaves. I think you're right though, Esther, that like

this movie deprives its characters of kind of like snappy, small talk get to know you banter because of the language divide. So it's so often them communicating through actions or struggling to get the other one to understand their meaning, or then like basically leapfrogging to deeper, more direct questions because the formality of needing to study for

this test means that you're just like asking things you would never ask on a date. But I will say that's also the thing that unsettles me a little bit about it too, which is like there's something unnerving about it to. Like what's the deal with this guy? Yeah, like what's the deal with this guy? it's also just his presence. He's so, in addition to being like, you know, his face is sort of funny

and his hair is insane. Like, he's so looming. He's so sort of terrifying and... Seems kind of quick to anger, even though he doesn't explode that many times. And he's got some level of criminal history that he explains as like boyish shenanigans. Yeah.

But also this series of tattoos that are all these kind of like impactful moments of his life that he can't really unpack. There is a thing that like doesn't never, resolved, which is, you know, which is sort of scary where he has the knife and it's like, you draw the knife on one side if it's like

the knife is drawn and then you put it back in its shaft once you've gotten your regent. Did I say? You said shaft. Okay. I think sorry. John's shaft, of course. Yeah, you put it back in its hilt, no? It's sheath.

Sheath. Once you've gotten the revenge and he hasn't gotten the revenge. So it's like, Kind of giving you a Sean Connery Chicago Way monologue here. Think about it. It's just like there is a sense of danger to him. And I am not opposed to like rom-com leading men having that sense of danger. Yes.

But maybe it's just the Departue of it all. You guys are getting hung up on the real guy, which I understand. Yeah. But it's not just the real guy in his real actions. It is like what is his energy on. screen. And I do think, Esther, there's something to perhaps, in this type of character, often you cast a charming person and have them as an actor work to affect a layer of edge on top of that that can then melt away. And Deppardue is the opposite side of the equation, which is,

here's a guy who feels a little dangerous and he's working to, like, show you the charm inside of it. But so the edge never melts away. But it's not. really like, you know, it's not like a Heathcliff thing of like, this is a monster that she must hang. It doesn't hang out with the Calico Cats or anything. That's so true. I mean, and here's the thing about that joke, which every person I know has made, or at least just three men that I know have made with the new weathering high. It's the joke of the season. It's the joke of the season.

I think we maybe have to have a moratorium on that joke. Wow, you're calling for a end to Heathcliff joke. You're saying specifically Calico? No, I think you did a good job with it. I'm just saying that like... Okay, okay, all right, all right, right. Because I'm saying, the other men you're talking about, were they just making jokes about Heathcliff, the cat,

or did they go for a specific... No, I have not heard the Calico angle yet. No, I haven't heard the cat. And so I'm fine with it. I just think everyone thinks they're so fucking clever making a joke about the fucking cat. But, you know... Sorry, Bob.

What if Emily Bronte was hearing about this? How do you think Emily Bronte would feel about... Heathcliff's the cat. Oh, the cat, I think she would be bemused. I don't think she'd mind the cat. Guys, what's up? I'm sorry. What's going on?

I need to... They're not called the calico cats, are they? Retire Bip myself. It's not Calico. You're wasting yourself in the ceiling? He's not Calico, he's orange. No, no, no. But there's...

The calico critters, the line of toys, the little fuzzy animal. Yeah. I was confusing them with who Heathcliff hangs out with, who are the Cat-A-Lack cat. Catalach cats. This is from the Heathcliff, like, animated series. Yeah, the one that was recorded while Mel Blank was dying. Right. They kind of, like, flew a drone into his hospital room.

And we're like, I don't know, say some shit into the safe recorder. What's up, Doc here. Wow, he really was on his way out. The Cadillac cats. Anyway, sorry to... Okay, no, you're right. Everyone is banned for making this joke now. You're right.

You're right. I do think there is. a thing where if I had seen this movie when I was younger prior to knowing the whole Depardue of it all, I think I might have been more purely charmed and just been able to get over my shit with that,

you know? And now, and it's again, like, I think I'm pretty good as a, you know, watcher of things to be like, to separate myself from, to put myself in the time period in which it was made and to like, I mean, like, it's something you have to do for your job and like

all this stuff. But obviously, I do think if I had seen this when I was just before I knew all about, maybe if I was just an American moviegoer in 1990 who was like, I want to see this in Serenow and I'm just like, charmed. I think he's like, he's just

different. It's just like there's nobody like him. There's nobody like him. And it's so weird. And it is, I, I do you think that is a thing to the movie's credit, which is like you can't imagine, you can't like recast it with someone else. You can't, and like the movie, but also that the movie is not like,

this is a stunning, no, like fucking babe. It's more like, this is, what is this? Yeah, I got to look at this from 10 angles.

Like, what's going on with this guy? Yeah. But it's just the whole thing is that like, but there is a whole thing where his energy is so off. In a strange way. where like when he goes and plays, when he's asked to play the piano

and he just like bangs on the keys and then plays like a lovely thing. Kind of rocks. It rocks, but it's so weird. Like, the first scene where they go to, was that a real restaurant? I meant to look that up, the All Nations restaurant.

I couldn't, I didn't think so. I couldn't quite tell what the vibe was. Where it's like, you just are like, hey, we have the Swiss dish and we have the, you know. But let's even zoom out here for a second, right? The piano scene. We can dig into the piano scene. seen as kind of emblematic of the whole thing.

This movie set up on the idea that he wants to become an American citizen because of the opportunities that could provide him in his career as a composer. And whenever she sort of asks him about it because his English is so broken, he responds strangely. And I watched the movie the first time and like, is the composer thing a lie? Right. Is he truly making this up? Right.

Is he making it up? Is he making it up? have a husband so she can get this apartment. This board won't approve. The modern woman living single. Right, right. That doorman. What a, what a fucking rat.

I'll go for this women's live. Hey. I hate it. The guy. Yeah. Also, that is what's sort of so strange about it is that like, is he a composer? Is he not?

Is he actually, you know, they talk about how he's, you know, he's got stuff in his past. Like, is he actually trying to be in America? On the run. Because he's on the run. Like, he is a composer, but there's no sort of,

sort of, he gets fired from his restaurant job and he's like, well, that's fine. You know, he says I quit. Yeah, and he says I quit. Everything's a little. Everything feels a little like he's lying to you just in his persona. And then that never fully, he is a composer. Right. Some impression.

Can we unpack this scene for a moment? So, like, Bibi Newworth takes a liking to him, brings him to the party, right? When you're meeting Bibi and she's so big, part of you's going like, is she doing this to make her friend jealous? Yeah. Or is she just sort of such a like wild pre-rolling that she's like, I don't know, this guy's weird. Let me figure out what his fucking thing is.

Everyone at the party is kind of a little confused, but like, oh, wow, a Frenchman. How interesting. Comes up that he's a composer. They ask him to sit at the piano. He sits there very intensely. And then just starts, like, mashing the keys with his fist. To the point that you're like, he's been rumbled. Like, you know, he's baking something up because he doesn't know how to do this.

Initially, that's your fear. That's what it feels like. And then you're like, it's just like there are moments of tonality within it. I still don't know if that was supposed to be a real piece. I don't either. I think it is. But you don't totally know. Is it, is it, this is the kind of composing I do?

You don't know. And you wonder, like, is this him revealing that he's never touched a piano before in his fucking life? And then he, like, comes around and, like, plays this beautiful piece and does this spoken word poetry over. that is like translated in real time, and it's Deppardieu in close up while playing a piano, basically looking down the barrel of the lens with tears in his eyes. And I'm like, this is undeniably affected. Right.

Like, yes, this is his power. The whole movie is built around this, which is you're just like, why am I drawn into this? Right? This guy has not made sense to me up until this moment, and something is happening to you that's emotionally affecting. And B.B. Newworth goes, I think you just got your flowers.

And that's what happens. He fucking, she got the trees, because whatever Girard Deppardot just did, charmed the shit out of everybody. Then, like, 30 minutes later, when they're going through the studying for the test, he brings up, or she repeats, they've filled in this information at some point,

that he stopped playing music because he was in love with a woman. They got married. She died, and he couldn't hear the music anymore. And he realizes the way to explain in this interview why they fell in love to make the case in the most ecstatic way without overly explaining that their love is real is to say,

when I met her, I heard the music again, which is so kind of beautiful and poetic that you see her get charmed by that even if it's only a strategic lie. The notion that he could think that way starts to open her up to him a little bit. It is the rom-com leap that I think you have to make with a lot of rom-coms,

which is like, if this were real life, how would I react to this? And there's something for me that is Still, I don't, by the end I get there, but for a lot of it, I don't know if I fully, there's something still like that creeps me out about. This movie. The mystery that is written into the character. And the fact that even at the end, it still feels like I don't fully know this guy. And she is willing, and she has fallen for him and he's written her this thing and she's willing to do it.

But like... But we don't even know what she's totally willing to do. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Well, and that's the thing. They know something's going on that they can't ignore anymore, like in the last scene. To make a very dumb comparison point. Make sure this is very dumb, please. If you were to try to watch the Cosby show and apply...

Let me say this. Let me say this. Let me say this. Go ahead. And try to apply cognitive dissonance and go look at just this show. History. Nostalgia for me reminds me, right? you are in an episode of the Cosby show

pretty unlikely to butt up against something that directly reminds you of everything you now know about Bill Cosby. I'm not even, at this point, I'm not even talking about the Departu of it all. Genuinely, I'm genuinely talking about the way this character is written. This is my problem.

Yes. Is that there is still something that feels odd about him and off about him in a way that feels either potentially dangerous or potentially David's shaking as I'm not with you on this sadly

let me finish my bridge here because I think Esther and I are feeling the same thing right which is like if Cosby Show episodes Oh my God stop. I'm not I don't want to talk about Bill Cosby I appreciate you defending me but also I don't want to hear about the Cosby like stop it because it's not defending me or you

this is me just like how I think about it right Okay. If Cosby episodes had him regularly going like, I'm going on a date tonight, I'd be like, well, now I can't stop thinking about what would happen on that date, right? And I think similarly... No, no, no. That's not what I'm doing. No, I just think the fact that there is mystery to this character and the mystery is coded as

being a little bit dark, it's hard not to let your brain go to darker things because of the guy who's playing it. I don't even think that's it. I just think there is... I understand what you're saying. Yeah, I don't think I have to say it again because I'm just like, yeah, and we can just agree to disagree. I just, I think there is something in the writing of the character

that leaves me at arm's length. Ben, you gotta decide, you gotta weigh in your take on green card, which we haven't heard yet. Anyway, and still marry him for the apartment. Yeah. I mean, did you like this movie? I mean, you haven't, you haven't weighed in. It was okay.

Fair enough. I don't, I'm not a huge rom-com guy. Yeah, what's your favorite rom-com? I have no idea. What? I guess I never thought about this, do it yet. Yeah. You never really talk up a rom-com.

No, nothing comes to mind. Nothing comes to mind. Nothing. Not a single thing. No. Very, fair enough. I'll look. Maybe there's one.

It's got to be one. But here, this is what I'll say. I watch Daypardu, and I'm like, there's definitely Momast 3 is effective. No question. For sure. Yeah. He's got a great face, great nose, big old nose. I don't see.

the Riz. I just, it's not popping for me. This is the question of society, really. At the time and now. It's the hair. The hair is such a problem. He looks like a old-ass

painting come to life. What you just described is to me is the Riz. Really? Well, yeah, because how many people look like that? I know, but it's like he should be wearing

one of those like Shakespearean weird collars. Well, he didn't want to find a movie or two where he's done that. Right. Right. I mean, if you want to see him period dress, certainly.

Allow me to speed around a couple things. Yes, please. One, this is kind of... You're allowed. Thank you. I appreciate it. No, Cosby. That's true. With one car, Larry.

Okay, allow me to speed around one thing. Yes, go ahead. No, I'm joking. First of all, this is a really strong invisible craft movie. Weir has done so much at this point that he knows exactly how to service, whatever type of film he's making,

that having been said, there are two camera moves in this movie that I thought were so fucking classy. Yes. Is it the, what are those things called in the door? Oh, well, that's good. Yes, the kind of peephole in the door and the click. Yeah.

That's a great shot. No, it's two moves. Classy camera moves. Yeah, where I was like, this is using the movement of the camera for storytelling and for emotional connection in a way that is so unshowy. One of them is when he's talking to Annie McDowell's dad, her parents show up, unexpected, and he takes on the role of the handyman to justify why he's there. And her dad, you feel like, is sniffing him out as a fake.

Annie McDowell is saying, go, you're done, and he wants to stay, because clearly he's interested to her enough that he's kind of curious to secure her parents to eavesdrop in on this. And the dad goes into the kitchen after him, and he's going in, you worry, motivated by suspicion of who is this fake? when in fact what's motivating him is I kind of sense the heart of an artist inside you. I sense an artistic spirit inside you.

I used to work jobs like this when I was writing poetry. What are you really? I'm a composer. They're having this whole talk. They're having this male bonding thing. He notices that her dad has his arm on a table

atop a bunch of papers including their marriage license. And Deppardu's like, I got to get that fucking away from him. so that he doesn't see, and this whole thing doesn't explode. And he tries to grab it, and it kind of is too aggressive, the dad freaks out a little bit, or is a little shaken, falls to the ground, they both go to pick it up,

and it's a Polaroid from their faked honeymoon. They stand on the roof of this apartment that is absolutely worth marrying Girard-Depard-Dupor-Due to get with skis, and they fake like three different vacations they've taken together, put in the scrapbook. and the camera move is these two men are both holding the Polaroid on opposite sides

and it's basically the POV of her dad and the camera just like dollies up with Deppard do of the two of them, the feeling of maintaining eye contact as they're holding this object that they know says a tremendous

amount that now needs to be acknowledged in some way. And Deppardu holds that close up really fucking well and it's that feeling of you are stuck in a moment, as you two would say that you can't get out of. Right. And then there's another one which is when...

It's a beautiful day. He basically drops Annie McDowell off with a fuckhead boyfriend. Yeah, Greg, what's his fans? Phil. Edelman. Debris, like, halfway down the block with envy, realizing for the first time he's jealous he is, and rather than walk the opposite way as he should,

he walks towards them. To basically challenge her, are you going to break reality? on this, or are you going to treat me like a stranger? Either way, I get a closer view at whatever's going on with you. And the camera tracking with him as he does that is like really, really. I think you're speaking to what Weir brings to so many of the movies we've discussed so far, and we'll continue to discuss, which is that kind of like quiet, classy, non-showy,

but stylish, like visual storytelling. It is like, what does this moment need to convey? Right. And what is the best technique to get that? feeling across in the story. And it's like not as slick and over the top or like whatever. You know, like it's not going to pop in the way that certain big stylish filmmakers do. Here's another thing I like about this movie that I feel like doesn't happen often enough.

It's like a rom-com that isn't very funny. No. It would be. It's a good point. It would be false to categorize it as a rom-dram. Right. But it's certainly not like a screwball movie with a bunch of lines. It is funny.

It has jokes. More than anything, it has a sustained. like comedic wavelength to it. But I think it's very concerned with... It's not over the top. It doesn't want to break its own reality.

Well, and the reality of it is something interesting that I wanted to bring up, which is that it is very rooted in like 1990, in 1990 New York. And some of that, some of that feels a little creaky now. You know, the, I think the talk about... I mean, obviously some of it's just the time periods,

but like the garden argument and like the, the, the under, oh, the underprivileged kids, we just bring such joy to their lives of chaos. I mean, it's also funny, that's the Lower Side and, you know. Even just this energy of, you know, some people don't eat meat. Right. And also some, there's this moment.

You will have fish, of course. No, I don't eat that either. There's also, there's also a moment where she tells him he's being very right wing right now. Yes. Because I am no wing. You are wing. Yeah. And I don't want to pay taxes.

clear. And I pee. Any airplane I want. And not in the bathroom. No, no. In fact, I avoid it. A cockpit. Your cup of coffee.

But it is. It does. It is a version of New York that is very rooted in the real world of the time. As opposed to even, you know. Pretty woman. Yeah. Well, pretty woman, of course. But like, you know, even the Nora, New York, which is its own form of.

She's got the sort of snow globe. She's got a snow globe of New York. I mean, even just down to like starting with like fucking subway musicians and shit. It's like this is like real New York. We're not doing your kind of. And some of it feels a little clunky. I think. But I think it's interesting.

I think the weird thing about rom-coms is there are a good number that have this feeling of, you know, you know, David put it, I believe this. his letterbox, which I saw, but like the gentleness. And like, I do think there are, there are a couple that, you know, get this. Like, it's not really that funny, but they get the romanticness right. And they're really tied into the characters. They are well observed. Yeah.

My letterbox review refers to a list of gentle movies that I curated for my wife after our first child was born. Oh, interesting. Which she was basically like, I cannot watch any movies with a lot of. lot of like peril or stress and certainly no like danger for two children. And so I like kind of like I was like, all right, let's really narrow the focus to movies where it's like pretty low like stakes. A lot of rom-coms, obviously. But you know, some other stuff too. Yeah. 27 dresses. Uh-huh. Where you're just like, who gives a shit the whole time? But I'm a little worried if she's

going to hit it 28 or not. Morning glory. At the best. Yeah. Serendipity. The paper. I hate serendipity. It sucks. You hate serendipity. I hate serendipity. The paper I do think kind of fucking roll. The paper is so good. The only issue with the paper is that you're like, why isn't this a master? Agree. Because it's like, it's totally good. Everyone ends having fun. You have fun. Papers. But you're like, the ingredients are incredible. It's a three star general. The whole time you're watching it, you're like, shouldn't this just be perfect? What is it not pulling together? David, did you only rate Working Girl three and a half stars? I don't like that movie. That's silly. Fucked up. I think that movie has huge flaws. I would say there are things about it I love. I would say

working girl is kind of the patron saint of the thing we're talking about. Where it's like a rom-com mostly with dramatic actors who have comedic chops. But it's not that funny. The comedy is more tonally. I mean, the funny stuff is like Jonkiewset going, wah! Right. And it is kind of doing character stuff.

What? No, Bose? Kate and Leopold, one of my favorites. Someone like you, a movie for nobody that I have seen like five times. Made Manhattan, terrible. Forces of Nature, hugely underrated. leap year two weeks notice fever pitch the British leap year definitely was a modern semi-modern attempt to do the same kind of thing

yeah it's not back good there's no room at the end which we always love you know what's another one you know it's another one that I was thinking only you is another one that sort of does this that's the Norman Jewison Marissa Tumet Robert Downey's in

is that good I mean it is it is one of those you have to like get over the hurdle that she seems fucking insane. Because it's like she's gonna get married. She's gonna get. She's gonna get. She's gonna get.

She's gonna get. I am trying to remember the exact thing, but it's like the night before her wet. There's like a fortune teller who's like, you're definitely gonna marry Robert Duny. You're gonna, no, you're gonna marry somebody with this name. Oh yeah, that's right.

And so then she goes to like. Robert Downey Jr. She goes to Italy and he thinks trying to find this guy and then Robert Downey Jr. lies to her that that's his name and then it's like, you know. Right. It sounds pretty good. It's like, it's pretty good. And by good, I mean, it sounds kind of insane. Yeah, it's very insane and you have to get over the fact that it's like insane and they lie to each other.

You know, all that. I want to. No, no, no, you finish your thought because I'm pivoting often. My thing is a little bit of a pivot as well. It's a mini pivot. I want to shout out Mary Louise Paulson. The only actor in this, we haven't cast a true legend. Like a face you guys all know, has a Tony, great theater actor. She's so good. Lois Smith.

As Danny McDowell's. Mom. Yeah, we showed everyone else out, I think. Praski, of course, we've always, but we must give him many flowers. It is crazy that he doesn't have one more scene, but whatever. It is. Yeah. They're probably, I don't know, it's a pretty economical movie. It is. But the billing on it is also weird. Like, Praskey's, like,

high billing. John Spencer's, like, single card. And he's in, like, one scene, but he was sort of a name, I guess. He's a great actor. I have great John Spencer's. story. I'm going to tell you guys off, Mike. Is there anything else we want to talk about? I just want to do this soft... Yes, yes. What's your stuff about? Off of what we were talking about of this kind of modality of rom-com. That is one that's really hard to execute.

And especially now we live in a fucking desert where we're only getting like the dumbest, most synthetic rom-coms or they have to also be gun movies, right? Like either they're like $2 movies. Our buddy Amanda Dobbins on Big Picture was making this case recently where

I think they were talking about the people we meet on vacation. Ugh, that movie. And was saying how, like, Hallmark and Netflix have made people think that rom-coms are designed to be really cheap programmers, right? And she was like, you know, there are entire Instagram accounts now with millions and millions of followers based off of travel and based off of, look at how nice the sweater I bought was and this face cream I'm using was, right? if it's just about the access to the luxury events, locations, items, like people can get that. They don't need it delivered to them in a movie. And yet, if you're not actually putting that level of, like, production value on screen,

and those things are production value tantamount to, like, a Marvel movie not investing enough in CGI, then you're like, then what the fuck am I doing here? I mean, I think the other issue, though, is that, For me, the appeal of the rom-com location is not the same as the appeal of someone's Instagram or TikTok. You just want a rom-com to feel like it exists in the real world. I think it needs to exist in a specific place. Yeah. For the fantasy to work, at least for me, the fantasy has to be rooted in the reality of a place

and has to be rooted in the tangibility of that place. And then I can forgive some of the rom-com tropes, some of the rom-com ridiculousness that you have to get over, because I feel like it's in the real world. I was talking about this with somebody another day where it's like, I always have trouble. Like, I love rom-coms and I have trouble reading romance. I've tried rom-com novels. And I have trouble with them. They seem to be very tropey. Because they're so tropey and also because the writing's just not good enough for me to like, like,

glom onto. But also not to dismiss a genre that I know people enjoy. Yeah, again, not to dismiss a genre that I know people enjoy. I just don't feel like I can latch on in the way. And I feel like when I latch on to a rom-com, it's because the fizziness is in the dialogue, is in the writing, and the reality is in the world. I think it even goes beyond that, which is just like, for me, it's the magic act of the chemistry that two people are creating.

And then when that's working in tandem with the writing, with the location, with the supporting cast, all that stuff, when it feels like you've created an ecosystem. But I do agree with you. It needs to feel like it is grounded in the specific. And the specific can't just be the tropes of the characters or the plot beats. It also needs to be like a sense of place, even if that place is made up or heightened. And I feel like we're stuck in a lot of like streaming movies that are based around vacations where the characters, where the characters have no relationship to the place they're in and the place is being rendered very artificially, which is like the worst of all worlds. We're in a fake Maui,

and they just happen to meet here, you know? And it's like, great, so now you get a fucking surfing sequence? The fuck is this? It doesn't mean anything. And I think, like, you know, it's, you want some level of, like, tactility. You want a level of, like, time and place in that specificity. A movie I love, which I will continue defending for the rest of my fucking life,

is materialist, which I think has been so wildly misunderstood. David is making the rudest face a person could possibly make. I don't like that move. I know you don't. You've made that very, very clear to me. But I think materialist is... I like materials. I don't love it, but I don't.

David is now making... No, I know. I was in a face. We sat next to each other. Yeah, we did. We sure did. And David is making a face that says, don't talk to me ever again. But I feel materialist is with like a pitch black heart and a real cynicism, more attempting a movie on this kind of wavelength than a proper rom-com.

It is. I think so much of the hyper-negative response to materialists, which I fully understand is a very acquired taste movie that's not going to work for most people, is that it felt like 824 successfully marketed to people were bringing the rom-com back. And people were so ready to just see a fun love triangle movie. and then it was this kind of movie digging into is all of dating bullshit which then made people feel like you offered me a cookie and then like threw acid in my face.

They made the money. Yeah, no, I was proud of them making their money. I was happy I made money. I like movies making money. I want to hear Ben's rom-com. Yes. Well, you know, I look up this list. I don't know.

There's a bunch. I just went to Indie Wire like 100 top rom-coms. And it's a reminder that this subgenre What comes to mind is the stuff I remember as a kid that were very, like, very much leaning into the tropes. Okay. And that's like all of the McConaughey movies.

Yep. So I forget when I look and I'm like seeing stuff like breakfast at Tiffany's. I'm like, yeah, I guess. McConaughey did a lot of damage. The McConaughey run was quite bad and kept getting worse. And he knows it. No. And that era was the death of it.

It was, and it felt very cynical. And the, like, the Maconnescence was all about him being like, yeah, I agree. Those movies sucked. Which kind of left those movies even further in the dirt without anyone stepping up to try to reclaim or re-contextualized. There's also just the big thing, which is basically, like, knocked up skewed everything. When knocked up hit, people went, oh, can you make a rom-com that's dude perspective first and has this kind of like hard-worked? comedy edge in it, and women will be more willing to see a dude rom-com than dudes are to see a more female perspective-driven rom-com, which I think had always been seen as a bit of a hurdle.

And then that leaves you with, like, nothing. When that goes down... They started to lose respect for their audience. They did. Yeah, and they felt like they had contempt for themselves. We're, like, embarrassed to be rom-coms and had to be like, but it's not really a rom-com. Okay, but I'll say 500 days of summer... Moonstruck.

Well, yes. Harold and Maud. Yeah. And then Roman holiday, which I just saw recently. I watched with my wife because we were going to Italy, and it was great. You had a bit of a Roman holiday. We did. That's true.

I mean, for the first 60, 70 years of cinema, a wild percentage of the greatest movies ever made could be classified as rom-coms. And it's really when they start to nail the formula down to the wall in the 80s. in the 80s. And then like kind of 90s, Touchstone just fucking goes like, here it is. It's math. Yeah, it's a little bit of a like,

take actor A, actor B, you know, add situation C. There are wildly successful movies that come out of that era and ones that have stood the test of time and even the middling ones

are fun to watch now. But it does feel like, you know, it's like what fucking happens to Marvel where people go like, oh my God, I get it. I know what's going to happen.

I've seen 20 of these. They never change. I get frustrated. like what I was in the process of writing this, that, like, rom-com fans have this idea of the rom-com sometimes as being only this, like, 2000s sort of, you know. There's a lack of history. Oh, sure.

Like, they think 27 dresses is the apex. Right. She did have 27. She did have 27. And that, I find very frustrating. And I think the problem with reviving the rom-com a little bit is that that stuff still maybe looms a little bit. too large. Did you see your Christmas or mine?

What was that? No one's seen it. Your Christmas or mine? They made a sequel as well. You know, even thinking about movies that we've covered on the show that came up, broadcast news, all of the Nora movies. Nancy. Nancy. Nancy. Totally. Did we like classify them as rom-coms during those series? Were we like hammering? Yeah. I think you did. Yeah. Because I don't, I don't know. I don't even think of them as really that. Maybe the Nancy's. Well, and, And look.

No, I mean, Nora is the queen of it. Like, Nora is the, like... And she's always at the top of the list. Yeah. Yeah. But I don't know why. I just, I'm like, those are funny movies. Whereas rom-coms, I also equate kind of in my head as being like a little bit schlockier.

But I think that's the problem. I think that's like the inherent like... That's what I talk about is that it used to be like these have to be high thread count movies. Like, people want to see movie stars looking incredible. Yeah. You know, they want to see... And I think this is how the... This is a huge problem with materialist.

nice homes and outfits. You think that's a huge problem with materials. I think every actor is so wrong for it. And then it's styled wrong, is like just like they're not locked into whatever character she wants. Like, that's the biggest thing with that movie. Yeah, I have some issues with the casting in that movie.

But I will say it. But I think that's the thing that like bothers me, which is that rom-com got... No, wait, let me... Okay. The Pedro Pascal and Dakota... I have a point to make... Stop it.

I have a point to me. Go ahead, Esther. Rom-coms got equated with chick flicks. Yes. And that is the big and honestly, I don't think, it's a 90s thing into the

2000s thing. And I think it's a problem on multiple levels because I also don't think, like, the term chick flick should not exist because... It's in and of itself reductive. And then you factor into

now that rom-com has been like so inundated with the Netflix shock and the Netflix, you know, and then a lot of, The Hallmark Schlock is ripping off the Hallmark Schlock. And that is the problem. And it's all been denigrated.

And I mean, I think it all comes from like a sexist place, which is that like at a certain point, they stopped realizing that everyone likes these movies and they thought that only women like these movies. But it's like a very frustrating thing. Well, that's also just right that we don't have to make an effort. As long as it's your Christmas or mine and their Christmases gets lost. That's the problem with the Hallmark and the Netflix stuff is people go, oh, if they'll watch it and we put $2 into the budget and it stars Joe. fuck and Alice who gives a shit. Yeah, right. Then right. Then no one fucking matters. I also think you're right that it's one of those genres that

in the 90s and the 2000s where it was financially very, very lucrative. It was never treated with a lot of respect by the industry itself. It was like, this is one of those things we have to fucking make. We thank Julia for keeping our industry afloat, but we're not going to take her seriously until she does Aaron Brockovich, right? Right. Whatever it is. Even that arc between like 90 and 2000,

where it's like, they cannot ignore her in pretty woman. They have to give her a best actress nomination. They do, because it's such a phenomenon. It's seismic. But by 10 years later, they're like, you're not getting one again until you actually break the genre. And it was always just, well, if they keep making money, we'll keep making them, even if we don't really respect them.

The second the fucking obsession with overseas grosses blew up, it fucked everything up because these movies are super culturally specific. And it's like in the same. way that we don't fucking want to watch the French movie called Calcuchance about like four people drinking wine and finger banging each other. They don't want to see our movies. Even if they are our stories. They don't want to see our movies?

It's rare. Those aren't the movies they want us to export as much, right? And they rarely would connect. Griffin really brought it around to Coucherance. Unless the premise is like so gold. But even then, you look at the best rom-coms and they tend to be remade in every country where they're like, we'll do our version of that premise. Like what?

Well, there's so many French comedies that were remade as American comedies, like three men and a baby and stuff like that. But even like, what was the, Olivia Wilde's new movie. The invite, yeah, it's a remake. It's Sundance. It was a Spanish film originally.

Coda. Coda. Sure. But that movie is a Spanish film, and I believe it's the fourth remake. Like three other countries remade it before we did? It's called The People Upstairs. I am excited.

Olivia Wilde, though. She's made a film. Directed it? No, no, she's an actor. Oh, okay, right. That makes more sense. Yeah. Then she's in the film.

Yeah, of course. If she was directing movie, I would have heard about it. The story ends there. I would have heard about it. I pay attention to such a question. Green card! Was released limited Christmas.

We're done. We're wrapping up. I'm wrapping us up, guys. Do you have something you want to say? This has been a spirited conversation. It's a good reminder, though. I need to revisit how I think about the rom-com. And you know what I'm going to do?

What are you going to do? I'm going to pick up Esther's book. Oh, my God. She's got some great wrecks in that book. Seriously, if you just like watch along with her, like, I highly recommend. Thank you. Her other books are trash, though. Not true.

Garbage. But falling in love at the movies. Yes. Well, yes, but we're not, I mean, we're not at the plugs. I mean, we should plug Esther's book. Plug away. But, I mean, also. We kept talking about it and not naming it.

I thought it was good to name it. Oh, that's a good point. Yeah. David, box office. Yeah, it comes out Christmas, expands wide-ish February 1st. Okay. Made $30 million domestic. I think more worldwide.

So, like, we are made some good movies. It gets the best screenplay nomination. So that I wanted to point out. Golden Globe, it wins Best Musical or Comedy. I have all this queued up. Do you want to say it? Yeah. So it wins Best Musical or Comedy at the Golden Globes,

which is shocking because the other nominees were, this is crazy that it won. I don't know. They must have paid someone off. Or maybe it was the class of your movie. I'm going to give you the nominees for Best Comedy and Musical. You're right. But listen.

Because Girard also wins best action. He does. He does. But at least he's sort of, you know, listen to this. Yeah. Dick Tracy. Okay, fine. That wasn't going to win. Pretty funny, though.

Pretty fun. Yeah. Ghost? Yeah. I mean, Ghosts feels like it's slam dunk. Home alone. Yeah. But they, home alone was.

They maybe stop me about it, but it had made a billion dollars. I know. And Pretty Woman. Yeah. It beat all of those out. Like, was there almost like a weird, like the bigger movies were sort of splitting votes or something? It's crazy. I think it's a Euro thing.

And I think Pretty Woman being released at the beginning of the year and Green Card at the end of the year, I think it was probably positioned as this is the headier pretty woman. This is the rarefied, the upper class. And I think it's the Euro thing. Jeff Rju beats out McCauley Culkin, Richard Gear, Patrick's. Swayze. Again, you'd think the Gloves might be going for these guys. Yeah. And Johnny Depp and Edward Cisher Hands. It was the Hollywood foreign press.

So they were like, I guess so. But like, you know, Andy I think was nominated, but she lost to Julia Roberts. They at least for that one were like, I think Julia Roberts maybe should win the Golden Globe. And what were the other screenplay nominees? I'm going to tell you, because it is quite a bunch. Now, the winner is

Bruce Joel Rubin's screenplay for Ghost, which is a stupid winner, but obviously that movie was such a phenomenon. And I think there was that Hollywood of like, you know, you wrote the movie that was sort of out of fashion. Yeah. And it worked. It's also like he invented silly putty where you're like, I don't know if we needed this, but certainly it caused a sensation. And no one else was going to think to write this.

The other reason he won is you look at the other nominees and none of them really feel like winners. It's Woody Allen for Alice, which is like a weird fucking movie. It doesn't exist. It's a really interesting movie, but certainly not going to win an Oscar. Barry Levinson's Avalon, which is I feel like. like a movie that everyone thought was going to be like his big, like, next Oscar-E epic and everyone was a little tepid on it.

It's a pretty good movie. It's a pretty good. It's a pretty good movie. Yeah. It's made, though, with this kind of like, it's, you know, lushness where you're like, it's like his fablemans or whatever. Exactly.

Yeah, it is. Yeah. And then Whit Stillman for Metropolitan, which is a feat of writing. Yeah, should win. Thank God he got in there, but like, but that feels like we're lucky to be nominated. Totally.

We're giving you that level of respect. Yeah. It's a weird one because it's the 90s. Oscar, so it's Dances with Wolves and Goodfellas are like the big, you know, sort of awards contenders and then shit like, you know, fucking Bugsy. Is shit like fucking Bugsy? Is it, is it? No, it's not the Bugsy year.

It's, no, Dick Tracy is the baby movie. Yeah, yeah. So it's the following year is shit like fucking Bugsy. I guess, I mean, Misery wins Best Actress, Best Actor, Jeremy Irons for Reversal of Fortune. You know, they, all the comedies we just noted, which are like memorable smashes. Yeah. Ghost, homal and pretty woman. It's like, yeah, take your nombs.

I mean, Ghosts got some wins, right? But, like, at the end of the day, this wasn't Oscars that, right, that tended to ignore that stuff. I don't know how much of it's the 10, but I've just been thinking a lot about, are we a little past the era of, like, the Oscar-winning performances

are the only nomination for the movie. Yeah, it doesn't happen much anymore, partly because, right, 10 Best Picture Nominee. I mean, were there any this year? I mean, weapons. weapons, yes, could quite possibly pull off that exact trick. But like, you know, I feel like

a historic one is that Michael Douglas was the only nomination that Wall Street got. Yeah, it's a weird. Reversal of Fortune didn't get a ton of nominations, did it? Or am I wrong? I might have gotten a few, though, let's see. Great movie. Because Misery, I think, similarly, was just the one.

Reversal of Fortune got weirdly got three numbs. Did they nominate Glenn? Did they nominate? Well, Glenn is truly in a coma for most of it. I mean, she is. I mean, he fucking put her there. Let me ask you, though. Or did he? Did you see her blink once?

It's a pretty good performance. Made a choice and stuck to it. Misery, I think, just got the one not. Misery is the rare, truly. Which is a little rude because, like, it's actually really good adaptation. Exactly. But I think it's a very crowded field. And Khan's great. Yeah.

Con is great. Con is great. Con is great. It sounds insane right now. He is. He's great. He's great. Yeah.

Box office. So I'm giving you the February 1st expansion. It's still only number six. It was a slow grower, this one. Number one at the box office, we've mentioned it a few times already. It's a phenomenon. A Christmas phenomenon. It's been number one for three months.

Home along. It's called Home Alone. RIP Catherine O'Hara. That's absolutely right. Yeah. But it was one of the ten highest grossing films. And yet the wet band, it's still at large. They're still at large, unfortunately.

One of the ten highest grossing films of all time upon release. It may. $285 million domestic. Insane. He's home-al-off. I mean, they've tried so many shitty versions of

sequels and remakes and reboots and like it never, it's, nobody cares anymore. Also, isn't there like a John Hughes thing? Like, he is very specific. Like, the... No, because they've done other ones. I mean, I think... No, sorry, Esther.

I was not saying that in a dismissive way. Just that they've done shitty runoff home-alone stuff in a way that I think maybe because he didn't direct it the contracts weren't as tight. Maybe, yeah. Because I know he wouldn't let

something like Ferris or... Right. Although they were about to make a fucking Ferris Bueller spin-off at Paramount Plus and it got shut down at the last second. Thank God. Thank God.

The fucking Super Bowl ads obviously are horrendous now. Yeah. I hate all this shit. Yeah, they're so bad. The one with Broderick where he's like, I love AI because it helps me like do spreadsheets and shit. I'm just watching it.

I'm like, Broderick, you've never tried a spreadsheet. What is this? You don't work. in office. The only good Super Bowl ad was the one with the toilets thing. I didn't even see that, but it sounds like my kind of thing. I saw that one and I mean, it was okay.

I laughed. But there wasn't like a, you know, it was bad. A single tier, like, you know, kind of Super Bowl ad that you were looking for. There's like the two to three shitty post McCauley, Home Alone, the sequels and then the reboot attempt.

And I feel like McCauley more recently started being like, what if we did like a legitimate one and it was me as the dad? Right. I think Catherine O'Hara dying kills that. That kills it even harder. I think it kills it really fucking hard.

In the weird way, of course, like her later in life, like fifth wave of success probably would have made it easier. Totally. And now it's sort of like, oh, forget it. Right.

People wanting to see the two of them together if it's just him. Griff, you just know if they do a home loan now. It's like he'll have an app. He'll like, you know, swing the cans with like an app. Yeah. He'll do, he'll like put a TikTok filter

on his face to, order the pizza. And he's not even swinging cans. He's taping older iPhone models and then he's using an app to it's all the apps. Number two of the box office is the best picture winner. Dancers with Wolves. That's right. So these are just like fucking juggernauts running the box office that are going to... I mean, just three months. Month long campaigns. Yeah. Number three is a film I didn't see in theaters, but definitely saw as a boy. I'd say an adventure

film for, you know, for young people. So, a special film for young people. It's not Homeward Bound. No, it's more like grown up and dramatic than that. But it's definitely still like, for, you know, kids and teenagers, it's a Disney film. It's a major, great actor as a

young man, you know, young... Newsie is? Nope. I don't know. But kind of, you know, that level of prestige. I don't know. It's not the Cusack one. It's not the Ethan Hawk one. It sure is an Ethan Hawk one. It's the Ethan Hawke one. Oh, what's the name of this movie?

I get all these titles can use. It's not... Something with a G. Never cry wolf? No, but it doesn't involve a wolf. It doesn't involve a wolf. White Fang. White Fang.

There we go. I got that before him. Yeah. You nailed it, Esther. Esther. And I say this, look at me. I say this from the bottom of my heart. Points.

Thank you. Based on Jacqueline's novel. You know, he's in Alaska or wherever the fuck he is. There's a wolf dog. They go on an advantage. I saw it as a kid. I can't say I remember it very well. Ethan Hawth.

Yeah. Randall Klyzer film. Yeah. Who made Honey I blew up the kid. Mm. And Greece. Did you know there's a new TV show where... Blue Lagoon.

Big Top Peewee. Yeah. Weird movie. What's shrink? There's like a honey I shrunk the kids. Well, it's not... It's not honey I shrunk the kids, but it's called a miniature wife. And Matthew McFaddy shrinks.

Elizabeth Banks. I just think it's funny. I'm going to say this from the bottom of my... Oh my God, this is coming up. Yeah, it's coming out. He made her tiny. He made her small. It's literally honey.

I shunk the kids, but it's a list of things. But you can just imagine McFedding going like, oh. Which platform is this on? I believe peacock. I can say this from the bottom of my heart. I think we need to create SkyNet and use it to destroy the servers that all of these streaming platforms use. I think we need to wipe this shit out.

Enough is enough. Whatever the algorithms are that are. thinking that, like, they've got to go. Yes. We need to do a movie about your mission to, like, tear out, like, servers in, like, Hollywood basements or whatever. I'm like, I'll just, I'll get a sledgehammer right now and just start. We fucking ran the number.

McFadden, Elizabeth Banks, see, shrinks her, it's enough. It gets, you know, like the profit loss. It gets us there. And I don't know. We have to create an entity. We have to find a Podcova. I don't know what we have to fucking do. Man, remember how often that.

they say Podkova in that movie. Yeah. Yeah. We saw that film together. I still have so many questions. Yeah. Number four. I've tried to work through I've gotten somewhere. Still waiting on Christopher McCuary's remaining 800 hours of explaining why it's good. He tapped out after four. He did.

I would love him to come aboard. I wonder. I truly wonder how he feels about it. I genuinely want him to go through a couple years of therapy. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe write like a book. Even make another movie and then like be like, okay, you know what? Fine. In retrospect, I'd a couple. Right. I'm opening

the final reckoning files. Right. Three million will remain redacted, but three million will be released to the public. Maybe I didn't mean to do that many flashbacks. Number four is a Best Picture nominee from a director who we will cover on this podcast one day.

You're always saying we're going to cover her. I'm always saying we're going to cover her. Penny Marshall. It's the motion picture Awakening. Awakens. Wake up! Kind of just like ultimate, sturdy Oscar bait movie. Why is Penny Marshall a joke? Like, I genuinely

think you should do it. No, great question. And I'm glad you're saying me up for this because I think the longer it's been a joke, the more people think... You're making fun of Pennymore. We would never do it and we don't think she's worthy of a series. But like she is. Absolutely. 100% and I actually want to do her as a series. Yeah, I need to do a penny episode. Which penny

would you want to do? A penny for your thoughts. I mean... You can't just call League of Her Own, so come on. You can... I'm not asking her to call one. I'm saying which one would you want to do in your heart of hearts? You can say whatever you want. I would want to do a league of their own. Noted. But you get someone more famous to do that.

Sorry, you guys are big time now. Well, just A-Rod had told us he was interested. A-Rod. A-Rod's become a blankie and a checkmate. I mean, obviously, I mean, look, riding in cars with boys would be fucked up to do. That's fun. Yeah.

It's more fun than League of Their own, dude. League of their own is kind of like, yeah, it rocks. You know, I mean, it would be fun. but like the weird ones are funer. Also, Arod has like a lot of takes on that one. He said he has some personal stories that he thinks would be a good place to share. No, the actual answer is

it was a bit very early into our run when we had been covering kind of like more obvious people and landed on that as the joke answer to throw people off our scent. It's a Griffith. And then now it has circled back to just, I can always say we're doing Penny Marshall next

to divert people's attention from what we're actually doing. But to be clear... Which is Roman Polansky. And Lester, you're on every episode. To be clear, I would very much like to do... Depan Du Polanski, just people who have... Other people have signed petitions and supportive.

I would very much like to do Penny Marshall. And I'd like to do it sooner rather than later. How's next week for you, David? Yeah, let's do it. Number five of the box office is a romantic comedy drama. Uh-oh. About a young woman who falls forward eventually marries an overbearing older man. who proceeds to rub her close-knit family the wrong way.

Would you believe that this film stars Richard Dreyfuss? This is what about Bob? No, this is not a movie I really know. It's a Lasse Halsstrom movie. It's his first English-language film, the great Swedish director, Lassa-Hollstrom, who became a very mediocre Hollywood director. Mediocre Hollywood director is almost, yeah, too kind.

He did make chocolate. Well, he made a couple of good American. We're coming back around. Everything's a little circle. I watched chokola for the first time, like, two or three years ago after mostly knowing it as, like, ultimate Oscar villain. You took a bite. And I'm like, this shit rules. Yeah, Chocolat's pretty good.

Obviously, being nominated for Best Pictures, the worst thing that ever could have happened to it. I wish we had three chokolas a year. I think that, like, what is Chocola about? Dude, what is it about? Dude, it is about, what if you were a stuffy French town and Julia Pinoche, like, at her peak performance? Yeah. Showed up and started making chocolate and everyone just got so horny. And Johnny Depp showed up.

And Johnny Depp is there too, but he's on, you know. Johnny Depp is like a Romani drifter who like steals her heart and then returns it to her. Alfred Molina is seemingly coming straight from the set of Dudley Doerite. He's just like, this chocolate is bad! He's got the mustache and the cape and everything. Her daughter's Ponette, the saddest girl in the history of movies. Right, right. All right.

It's a pretty silly movie. Judy Dent is an old lady who's like, give me chocolate. The judge makes them horny. I will report back. I think that like Gilbert Grape Chocolat are the sort of, I guess, the two best Hallstrom Hollywood movies. I've never seen something to talk about. No.

The Julia Roberts movie he made. Is there another 90s one? Cider House. Cider House. It's a movie that is like, again, it's like if you remove the Oscar nominations, like the unjust wins that it got. Yeah. You're kind of like, oh, this is interesting.

There's things about this that work. Like it's just. My princes of New England. Personally, I think Sider House rules. I had to do it. I liked it. I liked it. Cedor House rules.

But, you know, my life is a dog is like incredible. Like, he made great movies. Anyway, this movie I've never heard of. I'll tell you the stars, Richard Dreyfus, Holly Hunter, Danny Iiello, Laura San Giacomo. So, Andy McDowell's co-star. Also, in Pretty Woman. There's a, like, a lot.

General Rolins is in it. Roxanne Hart, Tim Gany. I don't know this movie. Do you not guys know this movie? Is the title a sentence? No. It's like a very generic sounding title. It's called...

Broken Hearts? No. It's called Once Around. Produced by Griffin Dunn. I wonder if he ever considered directing or something. I have no idea. He was producing a lot in that era, though. He produced running on empty.

Griffin being pretty... I'm telling the scenes a winter. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the top five. Number six is green card. Number seven is... It's Nolatuma!

Kindergarten cop. Number eight is a movie called popcorn. What is that? That's a horror film. Isn't it about a haunted movie theater? Yeah. I've always wanted to see it. Oh, I've seen this poster.

I've never seen this movie. Yeah. College students hosting a film festival stalked and murdered by a serial killer. Sounds fun. Number nine is the Gryfters. Another Oscar holdover. Great film.

Great film. And number 10 is Hamlet. I think the Mel Gibson Hamlet. Sure. Which is a very solid kind of like. I think I remember what Mel Gibson said. What do you say? It's clueless.

She's terrific. Oh, Oh, got it. Uh, you got a lot of the, the kings of the 90s in that 10. True.

For, for being. Trifist, you mean? But you got, you got Macaulay and Arnie and Costner and Gibson. Uh, totally.

It is like, it's a snapshot of a movie star era. Definitely. Yeah. Um, I mean, hell, number 11 is Godfather part three.

Well, look at that. Pacino's there. Garcia. There's Jacob's Ladder. Tim Robbins. The biggest. Tallest.

Tallest. He is tall. One of our tallest actors. I just saw Howard the Duck for the first time recently. You know what? I know this because you liked Ross Loopold's review of it. I thought it was funny. During, and it was he got that notification during our Super Bowl watch.

He was like, well, no, because you liked it and then a bunch of people started liking it. If I like a review, I don't mean to do this, but because I have a big following a letterbox. Right. He was like, he was like, what the fuck is happening? I mean, his review. To me nailed, I know you've discussed Howard the Duck many times on the George Lucas talk show, I'm sure. Yes. Yes. Duck tits.

Yes, duck tits. Right. But his review nailed the whole thing to me. He's like, what bugs him is the duck is not funny. He's not trying and failing. He's not even intended to be funny. He's just grumpy about being a duck in the real world. The whole movie. Where's the point of the comic character is he's like, eh, my wife's cracking duck?

In this one, he's just like, what the fuck's up with me not being in my duck world? It feels like real Lucas influence. that if he had been like, I read the comic book and I liked it and I hired funny filmmakers and I let them do whatever they wanted to do. I'm not sure the movie works, but it's probably more of an out-and-out comedy. I kind of went into it because of its weird status now thinking like, this is going to be interesting. And then I put it on and I was like, this is like sludgy.

Like this is really slow and boring. Yeah. I prefer Garbageville Kids movie to Howard the Duck. I mean, and it fucking has Leah Thompson in it who I would like run a thousand miles for. She looks great. It also has a duck in it. Howard. The duck.

And Tim Robbins is in it. I just remember. And Jeffrey Jones? He's really good. Yeah. Legally. In a movie. What am I supposed to do about the fact that half of Hollywood or sex

criminal scryffin? What do you want me to do about this? Stop inviting your birthday party. That's all I'm asking. I am asking. a birthday party. Well, I had one last year. What should I do this year?

Invite Jeffrey Jones. Or just text him and ask what he's up to. Oh, my God. 1,800, Jeffrey. Um, yeah. Cosby, Jeffrey Jones. Yeah, we got to. Who else?

We already invoked Kevin Spacey. Oh, sure. We did mention him. Cosby runs maybe cut out. Palanski. We mentioned Palantzzi. Uh, I was thinking, it is kind of nice that they got

Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice made while Catherine Harrow was still alive, not knowing that we were going to lose her. so soon. Yes. Like that that movie ends with her being reconnected

with her dead husband whose top half has been bitten off so you don't have to look at Jeffrey Jones anymore but the movie ends with you being like she seems happy. Yeah, totally.

She rocks in that movie. She's really fun in that movie. Not a movie I like remember that well otherwise. Watch it again and it grew from you a little. It's a fun. It's fun. It's pretty fun.

It's fun. I definitely was not like, like watching that movie. I was like, eh. No, you know what movie rules? What? Beetle juice. Sure.

Well, a little. little bit less. Esther, anything you want to plug? My writing is... You're writing everywhere. Well, obviously my book has been a plugged rom-com, so falling in love with the movies. Rom-com's most girl-ball era to today. I write

many places, including the New York Times and Los Angeles Times, so you can read my writing around there. I'm working on a new book that won't be out by this time, but... Are you allowed to say what it's about? Yeah, it's about the television show. girls.

Hey. People are talking about it. People are talking about it. It will not be out by the time this is done and it may be not out by the time I come back on this show. So we will see. You're doing great. Thank you.

You're the best. I appreciate you guys. In fact, I would say, you are the best. Oh, never forget. You can do anything. Thank you. Esther, I've rewatched Aloha in the last year and do you know that it's secretly rips now?

Okay, I should, I should rewatch it. I've been trying to get David to rewatch it, but if you get around to rewatching Aloha, please touch base with me. I will. I would rewatch. Should we do a reunion pod? That's not go crazy. It's only an hour 45.

It's not like a big task. Let's say aloha to our previous episode on Aloha. And meanwhile, say aloha to our new episode on Aloha. Here's another thing. I bought the Blu-Rey and it dug into the special features. There's a 20-minute alternate opening with Jay Baruchel as Bradley Cooper's brother

who is entirely cut out of the movie and has multiple scenes. Sounds like they really had a handle on that movie. There's also like a 50- minute alternate ending. It's insane. Sounds like they definitely knew what was going on in that movie. Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate review and subscribe.

Thank you, Esther Zuckerman, for being here. Tune in next week for... We have our episode on Fearless with guest, Timothy Simons. Hitmaker, you mean? Hitmaker. And over on the Patreon, just a few days ago, we released a special Ben's Choice episode on the film, Edge of Tomorrow.

slash live, die, repeat. Yep. Slash all you need is kill. Love that movie, excited. Well, I mean, we haven't recorded yet. But I'm sure it went great. Or have we recorded it like 150 times? There's going to be so many bits.

So many bits. Let's have like two. But anyway, if you're interested, you can sign up for Blank Check special features over at patreon.com slash blank check. Hell yeah. Esther, you could just get in front of David's mic, for one second here. I'm just trying to remember the movie Aloha.

It's about the sky. Where is a SMR again? Blank Check with Griffin and David is hosted by Griffin, Newman, and David Sims. Our executive producer is me, Ben Hossley. Our creative producer is Marie Barty Salinas, and our associate producer is AJ McKeon. This show is mixed and edited by AJ McKeon and Alan Smithy. Research by J.J. Burch.

Our theme song is by Lamey, Montgomery and the Great American novel, with additional music by Alex Mitchell, artwork by Joe Bowen, Ollie Moss, and Pat Reynolds. Our production assistant is Minnick. Special thanks to David Cho, Jordan Fish, and Nate Patterson for their production help. Head over to blankcheckpod.com for links to all of the real nerdy shit. Join our Patreon, Blankcheck special features for exclusive franchise commentaries and bonus episodes. Follow us on social at Blank CheckPod.

Subscribe to our weekly newsletter. book on Substack. This podcast is created and produced by Blank Check Productions. Well, then I'm going to start rolling. Are you going to do a French accent? Better push that nose up. Get a little hunch, hunch. Push it up, but then push it down, kind of. We can discuss. We can discuss. All this is going at the end of the episode.

Sort of the contours of that nose. Okay. Ready?