Blank Check with Griffin & David - Michael with Kevin Porter

Episode Date: July 5, 2020

This week, Blank Check tackles one of film’s greatest mysteries, John Travolta’s career in the 90s. In Michael (1996), he plays an angel who visits earth to bring people together, but get this…he’ a bad boy! With the cast rounded out with Andie MacDowell, William Hurt, Bob Hoskins and of course, Sparky the dog, it did well at the box office but where does it land in the scope of Nora’s career? Kevin Porter (Good Christian Fun, Gilmore Guys) joins!

This is the quote I'm going to do. Okay. Just because I think it's the funniest one to modify. It's podcast. He smells like podcast and the smell gets stronger when he's in heat. Oh my God. Right? Because I was looking at other options and I was like,

you got to remember Sparky, no matter what they tell you, you can never have too much podcast. But that's not as funny as implying that Michael the Angel smells like podcasts and it gets worse. The hornier he is. Also, though, this is weirdly a movie lacking in punchline-y kind of humor, wouldn't you say? I was looking up, I was trying to find as much context on this movie as I could. It was very hard. So I mostly was just reading reviews from the time, because I was trying to find, like, where did this movie come from?

How did it come into existence? Everything about it is strange. And there was one review, review not that's exclusive to this movie but it really applies here that described it as uh nora efron's new wafer thin comedy oh bam bam and there are things that i like about this movie but the comedy itself is certainly wafer thin like the best the biggest joke in this movie is a it is it's weird it's weird is it do you think she was trying like that's the thing also there's no context on this movie and i feel like it just mostly got forgotten any but like do you think it's like she's trying to do like kind of a 40s b Crosby you know what I mean like that more gentle sort of

you know road trippy comedy that's just like pals and then there's a weird supernatural element I'm giving her this it feels entirely intentional it's not like this movie is going for laughs it doesn't get and it has a very different tone and vibe than any of her other films so also have you guys watched Everything is Copy, the documentary on HBO? I need to watch it. You're making me feel dumb and unprepared. Oh, no, no, no, no, please don't.

I wanted to be a good guest, so I did watch that. And I will say that during the montage, when they're like, and she had a few clunkers along the way, they do show things like mixed nuts. They show hanging up, which she co-wrote with her sister i want to say they show zero clips of michael so michael was not good enough

to make the clunker montage and everything is fucking weird about this most of her career it was a hit that's the thing most of her career was this alternation between hit flop hit flop hit flop like almost perfectly calibrated like she makes a perfect norafram rom-com then she makes a movie that's a little caustic that one flops and she goes back to the well like whatever it is this is the weird one in the middle right where it's not big not well received and not remembered right bad reviews no cultural tale it made almost 100 million dollars was that just Pulp Fiction runoff, you think? Okay, this is the context we have to talk about here.

Because I don't think we've ever talked about Johnny Trav's on this show. Have we? I am looking through his filmography to think of when he would have crossed paths with us. There's so much to talk about with Johnny Trav. Exactly. So I think that's our context for this episode. Because Johnny T has not come up. Introdu podcast introduce our guests while i comb through the filmography just to make sure we've never had it i guess we haven't right wow hello everybody this is a podcast

entitled blank check with griffin and david i am griffin i'm david david looks resigned as he scrolls through well scrolling through's IMDb page. Scrolling through his IMDb page might make you look a little resigned. I'm sorry to say it. There are some heavy sighs within there. It's a podcast about filmographies. Directors who have massive success early on in their career and are given a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion projects they want. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce. Baby, this is a mini

series on the films of Nora Ephron. It is called You've Got Podcast. And today we're talking about Michael, inexplicably one of our highest grossing films. And our guest today is doing such a great job, not only speaking before he was introduced, but also he was miming along with every part of the introduction. He rocked a baby. I'm a listener. He's a bouncer. Oh, you have to do visual bits on Zoom. They're for us.

That's just for us. Well, actually, it's being recorded, so it could be for everybody. He's one of the best in the biz. Podcasting luminary. But not for luminary, famously. Not for no famous not yet shut up luminaries coming up yeah everyone has a price they're gonna come a knocking uh you know i'm from good christian fun and inside voices and gilmore guys and mazel goys yeah that's right nailed it kevin t porter hey guys thank you so much for having me what a fun time the great tevin kevin t porter i almost said tevin key

quarter that's absolutely fine now here's a fun fact you and i had followed each other on twitter and had been friendly we finally i feel like broke the threshold and became friends like a week before the pandemic. COVID Eve, I would say, yes. It was like the last time I was in New York, which was beginning of March, and Griffin was so nice to come on Inside Voices, and we met up and had a nice time and had a nice little walk afterwards.

And then two weeks later, everything ended forever. But it felt like a nice last hurrah it was a really nice time you literally flew out of new york on march 11th march 12th well i i was i was i traveled a lot on the east coast during that time unfortunately so i was in new york went to philly came back to new york went down to washington dc then flew out of there on march like 9th and then came back to los angeles so I could have should have maybe had something I did not yeah you got very lucky I got I got you got mail and I got very lucky yeah but then since then we've been like talking more uh during this yeah uh you've been a nice distant friend to have uh socially distant friend to have uh and it's it's exciting that we could get you

on this episode this felt like a really I was looking at the schedule and I was like, this feels like a good fit. Oh, I'm so honored by it. I mean, this show has meant so much to me personally. I've listened to this show for a very long time. I'm a big fan. I hope you guys always feel flattered when like the guests you have on the show are actually listeners and are fans.

I feel like that's kind of rare for a show. I resent it. I feel like that happens a lot with Blank Check. I deeply resent it. You resent it? Oh no. I resent oh i resent it i resent it no i'm kidding i'm flattered but i did i did your podcast good christian fun uh and we talked about left behind the nicholas cage remake of a uh biblical um i've never seen that um it's bad oh yeah he's caging a lot of it or is cage kind of sprinkled in like how much well yes and no he's a little bit like bob hoskins and michael where he's got a number of scenes but they all take place with him sitting in the exact same chair yeah okay okay right

nick it's it's a week of your life life and you won't have to do anything. But, right. Right. He's pretty much just in a cockpit the entire movie and he only interacts with three other actors. Except for one scene he has in the food court of an airport that is definitely JFK. It's so clearly JFK. They clearly shot in New York for real. And you know it because there's a little placard on his table that says,

Welcome to JFK, New York for real and you know it because there's a little placard on his table that says welcome to JFK New York City yeah it was I think it's Louisiana that they shot in for real yes um because Nicolas Cage lives in Louisiana and I think he has some sort of tax break there but the point is was was talking that movie with you on on your show where you talk about films that are like explicitly Christian like sort of faith-based film faith-based entertainment which i think is uh is one of the more fascinating genres of film going right now and well this is this will be fun for all you box office mojo heads out there there was one faith-based movie that the weekend right before or like right during lockdown did extraordinarily well. I Still Believe? I Still Believe did extraordinarily well, which is like almost a very damning box office statistic

because it means like the Venn diagram overlap of people who want to see I Still Believe and also believe that COVID was fake news was kind of one for one. I appreciate you saying that because I can't say it as a Jew. You can say whatever you want, bud. That's the one with... KJ Apa, I believe. Yes.

I know Archie is in it. Archie Hufa. And he's playing What's His Pants, the singer who has this tragic story or whatever, right? What's his name? Jeremy Camp is his name. His wife passed away. And Shania Twain is in the movie.

But also Britt Robertson had gone to Alison Lohman path where I'm like, is she just gone? Like, no. Did, did Hollywood just rule? Like now that you can't play 16 year olds anymore, you're out.

Like, you know, which is what happened to Alison Lohman. Alison Lohman played teenagers until she was like 28 or whatever, and then Hollywood was like, wait, the charade is over, and you're out. Wow. Just bringing up Alison Lohman's name. I mean, White Oleander, Get At Me.

I love Alison Lohman. She got a raw deal, you know. But I feel like Britt Robertson. Was it Neville Dean or Taylor? She married one of the crank guys and the only movie she's appeared in in the last 10 years are a couple cameos in their movies neville dean she married neville and she had kids and maybe you know she she partly had this sort of like you know what fuck it i'm gonna semi-retire and you know do something else the the other one

who falls into that category although she has continued working but the how long has she been a teenager exactly and i was looking this one up last night britney snow who like by the time that she appears at pitch perfect and i'm like you're going on your second decade of playing a high school or college age person right right but the thing that blew my mind is she's 34 now she's like my age right she was 15 in american dreams there's some of those right because of the kieran idly thing where she's like technically 31 now so she was like 15 and love actually or whatever it is bennett like beckham she's really young like you're right love actually she's playing older like that's the weird thing with her. So it fucks with you.

Claire Danes. Yes. When American Dreams was on TV, I was like, this must be a 27-year-old playing a 15-year-old. So by the time she gets to pitch perfect, I'm like, shouldn't she be 40 now? But in fact, she was still like 25. Some people are like that.

Anyway, here's a man who has never aged, who has looked exactly the same his entire career john travolta he's got my good classic youthful glow goodness gracious i know i mean john travolta i don't know go ahead kevin but it's just like five comebacks yeah yeah that's the thing and i feel like i'm only that familiar with like post pulp stuff i don't feel like i've really dove into like any of the saturday night fever or blow up or any of like what the 70s was for travolta well let's let's take a little tour through travolta i think we must okay so i'm gonna try griffin can you let me at least get like and and then but i'm

gonna try and lay it out every peak and valley very quickly. Obviously, becomes well known on the TV show, Welcome Back, Cotter, right? That's his original. And then from there, you've got, you know, right during Welcome Back, Cotter, he's in Carrie. He's in Saturday Night Fever.

He's in Grease. His hair looks normal. Okay. And like, you know, he's a good dancer. He's a good singer. He's like, you know, kind of like, he's an attractive guy. Like he's sort of a style icon. Like, I mean, talk like you know he he's a good dancer he's a good singer he's like you know kind of like he's an attractive guy like he's sort of a style icon like i mean talk you know right out of the gate huge star oscar nomination while he's still on a sitcom but let's just say also incredibly fast transition from sitcom star to doing tv movies to legitimate movie star with

an oscar nomination like a rapid right it's all happening right at the same time and then right in the 80s the rap on him is ah he blew it even though he's in blowout which is a great movie but that's seen as a bomb right and then he's in you know actual bombs like staying alive and two of a kind and perfect that are all kind of like well-known bombs like early razzy faves right would you say griffin especially staying alive absolutely and also in 1978 he makes the straightest film of all time moment by moment where he and lily tomlin love each other where he plays strip harrison yes and also looking at the filmography on wikipedia because there are so many multiple films that he's done per year,

it does look like, it looks like the Bruce Willis is making movies for Russians that you've never heard of phase of someone's career because there's so many already. Kevin, we will get there. It will get there and it'll hit us hard. I forgot to mention Urban Cowboy in the early, which was a huge movie of that.

That's 1980. So it's really after 1980 he hits a fallow period exactly and then so and he barely makes movies honestly and then in 1989 he makes look who's talking and everyone is like travolta's back the comeback baby he made it he's back people love it it's a hit i appreciate you saying this because i feel like people talk about pulp fiction as if it rescued him from no total obscurity now maybe look who's talking wasn't respected but those first two movies are humongous hits they were huge and it was definitely at the time seen as a comeback but because of he barely makes other stuff except for look who's talking sequels quickly i think it's

another dip it's like no all right no that i guess that didn't take totally i'm looking at this filmography how do you do look who's talking in 89 and then look who's talking to in 90 what is that production they were just like they were just like get to the you need to give me a script in three days there better be another talking baby in it but like wayne's world is like that too like you look at certain comedy sequels they used to just be like we cannot let this thing rest like scary movie 2 comes out nine months after the first scary movie wow it's crazy but yes he pumps out three look who's talking the first two are big hits the third one is not he looks like he blew it again uh exactly all right all right so then

Pulp Fiction obviously you know obviously a huge comeback Oscar Nam he's cool again like who would have thought and there's just that whole narrative of like Tarantino saw this in him and no one else do you know what I mean they had to talk him into it and he didn't want to do it um and then he really has a run because it's like get short even next year michael and phenomenon in 96 not well reviewed but are both big box office hits he also has an arrow in 96 broken arrow which was not as huge of a box office hit but like did well and then face off in 97 which obviously rules surrounded by two kind of semi-flops mad city and she's so lovely

but like you can survive those if you're doing a hit a year and then you have a face off yes i would say in 98 i mean gets great reviews for primary colors which is not a hit but is well received and also for a civil action which kind of gets ignored but is a good like solid you know cable kind of kind of movie and was a on base hit, not a blockbuster, but a hit. I would also like to point out A Civil Action is about my hometown.

Is it? Oh, yes, it is. I love that movie. I'm a huge fan of A Civil Action. Much in the way that Mad Max Fury Road is about Ben's hometown. Exactly.

And this movie is about my hometown, Heaven. As Randy sings in the opening credits. the place that you only you will get to go okay that's right out of the five of us but then he does he does his little pop in in uh in red line and and then in 99 honestly general's daughter was also a huge hit like people just it's just that those movies are mostly forgotten because they're not very good but they were hits made a $100 million.

Yes. And then 2000, Battlefield Earth, Lucky Numbers. It's like, that's when it starts. And then like Swordfish does okay. But like that movie, think of Travolta and Swordfish. That's where it's like, what is, what does he think his screen image is? What is he doing to manage his appearance here? Because it's just getting weirder. He's first build in that movie, but that movie becomes a hit

and helps Hugh Jackman and Halle Berry. It does not help him. Everyone walks out of that being like, one, Halle Berry, obviously. And then I would say, right, two is like that Jackman guy is, you know, he's charming. Right. Travolta's getting leapfrogged.

The beat, no, it's beyond that though. The beat on Travolta, I think walking out of swordfish is like what's going on with him what's this now right because like you still have like i think ladder 49 would was sort of an on-base hit right yeah yeah love song for bobby long not so much punisher villain feels like a downgrade. I was going to say, he's sort of playing support for younger movie stars. Like I feel like a ladder 49 is a hit, but people are more like Joaquin,

you know, and then him playing the Punisher villain in like the artisan Marvel movie, rather than like a big studio Marvel movie. Like all of this is weird. Basic is a bomb. You said, be cool. Yeah.

Basic is a bomb. Be cool. It it's like you're going back to the get shorty well 10 years later and like and those two movies are fascinating because it's like if you didn't if he wasn't called chili palmer and you didn't tell me he was this was a sequel to get shorty you could watch both those movies and not really know they're related right totally kevin's having some virtual background i'm sorry i just wanted a not a nice lady on screen as kevin changed his background to margo martindale i also just want to say david's background is a photo of michael standing in

the field with the dog but because of the positioning of his head it looks like there are wings coming out of david's head like which i kind of appreciate that's kind of fun you should do be cool we could do that franchise griffin for the patreon i mean who else is in be cool is robert pastorelli yes his final film michael his final movie travolta brought him back but that's this is where things get kind of wild because you go okay be cool 2005 he's trying to make a sequel to get shorty but also evoke pulp fiction by bringing uma into the fold everyone rejects it you go travolta's cooked he's never coming back right and then you hear vroom vroom vroom vroom i was born born to be wild. And so we're calling Wild Hogs comeback number three, right? Would you agree?

Four? Four? Four, maybe. Yeah. And it's funny because it definitely is a comeback because after that you have Hairspray, Bolt, Taking a Pile of One, Two, Three, Old Dogs, right? Those are all big studio releases. Wild Hogs and hair

spray both come out within same year right like six months of each other four months of each other and both make hundreds of millions of dollars right right um and then i feel like it's just sort of at that point it's like obviously he's he's too old you know and right well because then it's like right showing up and you're from paris from loves and you're savages where you're like what's what are you doing that's the weird thing good and bolt i never saw bolt he's not particularly good in bolt i'm not a big fan of right he's a dog i think savages falls a little john travolta i think savages falls into the path he should have taken, which is like, take the smaller role, be more of a character actor. He's pretty good in Savages,

and also, he's not wearing a wig. Mm-hmm. I mean, the hair stuff. How much do you think the hair changed the trajectory of his career? I think it's that thing where it's like, it's not just the hair, but he starts adjusting everything around it where his eyebrows are dyed

and he's like pancaked in makeup, even when you see him like on talk show appearances and he just stops looking like a human being. He just did the thing where he couldn't accept it, but instead of just sort of like, I don't know, doing the Bruce Willis thing of like, all right, I'm mostly bald now, or, you know, like, he's just like, I don't know.

He like turned to ever more radical and confusing efforts to sort of like it only just gets and i mean his main issue is that he didn't do what he should have done which is just like i'm going to transition to being a full-time character actor supporting savages i think it's not a great movie but he's good and that's the model of what he should have kept on okay can i can I nominate like a low key, maybe fifth comeback role? It's not low key. And I'm sure I know what you're about to say.

Robert Shapiro on people versus AJ. Another window in which he should have ran with the ball. Yeah. It's exactly it though. You're like, great here. He's figured it out. He's going to be like big popping characters,

supporting roles. And you're going to be like, man, Travol supporting roles and you're gonna be like man travolta what a wild man you know like yeah you know kind of do the cage thing you know right right his former co-star here are the titles of his immediate follow-ups to american crime story what should have been his final comeback performance to take him into the final stage of his career his follow-ups are i am wrath gaudy speed kills are trading it does griffin it does kill it is true it speed does kill trading paint the poison rose a pitbull music video and fred durst film the fanatic in which he plays the character moose which i got a screener fyc screener dvd for and i was like travolta paid for me to get this right like you know it was one of those things

where i'm like oh jesus um and he got the rossi nomination speed does kill i will say i i know someone who worked on a film with him around this time and i asked about the hair and it was a a a bald director okay who worked with travolta showing up on set or showing up for rehearsals with the wig and he was like i just knew the wig was so bad like it's so low quality he's got that one wig he uses all the time that looks like a Pomeranian. You know what I'm saying? Yes, I do. With the little fringe on the side.

And he was like, Kevin has now changed his background to Moose from the fanatic choking somebody. Love that line. Oh, it looks great. Oh, gracious. But he was like, my thing was, we will pay from the budget to get you a better wig we will get you a wig that suits your character more we understand it if you don't want to be bald and he wouldn't acknowledge the conversation like it was like my one goal was trying to get him to agree to can we make you a good character wig and he kept on saying like i don't know we were talking about

this is my real hair right so there's just it's just like a locked room and there's just no way inside or something right like he's barricaded it and it's just like right there is one aspect to his career we have not um touched upon which is his uh musical output uh he did put out a christmas album with olivia noon john in 2012 called this christmas and it's him and olivia noon john from greece fame back together again doing baby it's cold outside this christmas deck the halls and there's a pretty wild music video for at least one of those songs i i remember that video it's incredible the other video i suggest people watch uh of course in this period of time uh john travolta makes my favorite cursed film old dogs which is currently my zoom background

and there's a music video for that he does a cover of bobby brown's every little step with his daughter ella blue travolta and that video is absurd wait is old dogs that was supposed to be rated r and then it was recut to PG? There are many rumors about what went wrong with Old Dogs and none of them fully make sense, but all of them kind of make sense. Hogs and Dogs, man. Hogs and Dogs. He should have gone on that lane. It was the reteam. He was supposed to do Wild Hogs 2 after Old Dogs.

And Old Dogs was such a disaster, they canceled Wild Hogs 2. such a disaster they canceled wild hogs too um but there's one other element of travolta we have not talked about here which is his faith on subject with this film that he was for so long hollywood's second most prominent scientologist he and cruz were like the two pillars and despite cruz having like a rockier period of like just real turmoil he has been able to sort of stabilize more whereas travolta never really recovers and everything that's weird about him now does feel like that oh he's in a scientology bubble do you think that's because travolta made a film explicitly inflected by scientology like battlefield earth and Cruise never really did one. I think that's part of it. I think Cruise was for a very long time, very savvy about not bringing his religion to the forefront. And then it was that one disastrous War of the Worlds press tour

where it kept on coming up, where the videos leaked out, where he called Matt Lauer glib. Glib. You're being glib matt right and like travolta always kind of like was a little too horny for scientology on main you know yes right right and nick kroll has a bit i've seen him do where he talks about like it's crazy you look at tom cruise and he talks about how like scientology helped him unlock himself and he is the most high functioning person in the world and then you look at john travolta it's so weird with travolta because i feel like you do always kind of have to talk around so much like innuendo with him like and it's not like i know things that i can't reveal it's more just like there's so many different kinds of innuendo with him like you definitely hear that

he's kind of a weird guy to work with but then also he's worked with like a lot of great directors um many of whom have employed him multiple times it's not like you know he's one and done with these people like he works with nora efron again i will say this about people i know who have worked with him consummate professional like what i have heard is that guy he comes on set he treats everyone so nicely he works so hard you understand why he's a movie star which is what you hear about cruz as well he's very nice to everybody cruz is like a politician like i mean cruz that guy feels like an app no i mean i've interacted i mean he is like an a-list politician type where it's like

you just feel like you could say anything to him and it would just bounce off of him and he'd smile at you and ask you a question that made you feel like included or whatever but travolta it makes sense because he's been in the biz his whole life based his whole adult life he's a dancer and singer which requires a lot of professionalism like you know that requires you being able to like practice and work and hit your marks and all that and i but and i feel like he does have an eye for scripts but then you do hear the stuff like the pulp fiction thing where he's like well i can't do that because he takes heroin and he has to be talked into it whereas like you'd think anyone would read that script and be like he wants me for this i i'm in like this is a good script like i'll do it yeah it's also one of those things where like so many movie stars, when they're in their crappiest films, their I Am Wraths, their Trading Paints, their Speed Killses, when they're doing press for them, you're like, God, this is like gun to their head.

They're clearly embarrassed about this movie. They're lying through their teeth. And every time Travolta promotes a movie, I'm like, I believe he thinks this is the best film he's been in right i and well it's just interesting oh this movie is very very interesting in the travolta arc it's basically how many how many noir movies have you guys recorded thus far by the way we've recorded everything up until this point we've done this yes oh chronological okay yeah for for producer ben have we thrown out the name ben and women can be friends oh fuck no we have not and i love that we haven't yeah it's pretty great that might be the winner kevin damn hey terrific happy to help the. It was either that or lucky numb bends.

Ooh. Ah, it's neck and neck between the two. I can feel it already. It's going to be a squeaker. I mean, I'm looking, this is, all right, okay. It's not exactly halfway in his career because he's made way more movies on the back half of his career because he makes so much shit now.

But don't you, I'm right, right? In terms of years, this is really a midpoint. And it's like he's still being used in this movie as a sex symbol but he is the more older broad kind of john travolta who's kind of stocky looking now not like the live you know young fit john travolta this is weirdly him playing against type by stretching to play what travolta becomes 10 years later, if that makes sense. Well, and it is interesting to think of him as an object of desire, sexuality in the movie.

Yeah. Especially maybe the era that he comes from. And you do wonder how much of that is informed by, oh yeah, back when Nora Ephron was growing up, kind of weird looking guys were the sex symbols and kind of like thicker guys and people with more than 2% body fat. So you do wonder if that's part of the calculation.

I was trying to like frame this in my head, but the scene where he appears for the first time and you see him shirtless and his boxers walk through the kitchen. He's really doughy in that. And I accepted it because that's what travolta kind of looks like now right but then i realized he probably gained weight for this role like he was more lithe in the films before and after this he always was a slightly stockier guy he was never a rail

thin guy but like i think he gained a little weight for this i think they specifically wanted the reveal of look at it this guy's kind of a slob you know like he was sort of pushing himself out of the sex symbol zone even though everyone wants to fuck michael part of the joke of this movie is he looks like kind of shitty well i i thought he was already kind of looking like that by pulp already so i feel like pope was almost him announcing himself as like oh don't worry i can look like shit now and it's fine so i feel like michael's an extension of that in some ways i will say i'm just i'm mainly thinking of pulp fiction where there's like they have to strip down remember him and sam jackson and they

get sprayed or whatever you know he has the same basic build he had the big okay fair enough fair enough right right i always think about my mom uh dislikes john travolta would never want to go see john travolta movies and she whenever i was like that movie looks good she'd be like i don't like john travolta he's so he's so bovine oh my god that is a human I know right on fucking Travolta man that is tough doesn't he actually play a cow in a movie though and he fights a cow in this movie first cow it just came out it's a cow in this movie no the animated cow movie no he's not in home on the range if that's what you're asking oh doesn't he just like look like that cow yes oh even worse i want to make it clear i'm not making a size joke here

i there's something about his face that is weirdly cow like to me yeah i think it might be the his lips maybe his lips have always been i mean this is bordering on i feel bad but i'm also just not getting over what a brutal hit bovine is oh my mom like body john travolta she folded him like laundry no one says that it's not like he she said like oh he's ugly all right yeah he's you know like no i was she had such a specific word her explanation for like not taking us to go see Michael. I remember wanting to see this movie and she was like, I can't stand him. He's so bovine. I'm realizing the movie I was thinking of was called Barnyard

and Otis the Cow is in fact voiced by Kevin James. The cast also includes Courtney Cox, Sam Elliott, and Danny Glover. Yeah, and that's the one best picture. That's awesome. The one best picture. We all awesome. The one best picture. We all remember that.

Barnyard, the original party animals. Brokeback Mountain. Yeah. It's more like Barnback Mountain. Terrific. I don't know. Now, with Nora Ephron context, I know there's so little to go on for this specific movie,

but what's our take on her thus far? Because I'll say for me, I've seen the big boys. I've seen Sleepless in Seattle, When Harry Met Sally, You've Got Mail. I did watch Julie and Julia for the first time ever, because it was on Netflix. And I watched that a couple of nights ago just to kind of get a kind of a more clear vision of who she is and what she's about. But it does seem like apart from those that her career is very spotty. Okay, her first movie Rules, which we discovered

Silkwood? It does. Her first film she directed This Is My Life. Oh, okay. Which is about a single mother stand-up starring Marge Simpson. That one, Rules. But it does feel like there's this thing, because she started as a humorist,

and a lot of her pieces were more caustic and had a harder edge to them, that she will try to make films with that sort of sense of humor, and the public rejects them, and then she goes back to her souffle movies, and she kind of does that better than anyone else. I do think watching these movies has made me appreciate her more as a technical filmmaker because it is so easy to focus on her writing because her voice is so specific.

And her voice was so specific as a screenwriter before she even was directing films. But like, I think this is a fairly well-directed movie. I like the aesthetics of Michael a lot. There's one scene in terms of like, I generally agree with both of you, but I do think there's one scene early on in the movie where the three of them are on the road and there's like these very strange cuts

to the exterior of the car and very loud blaring country music. And not one of Andy McGowell songs. It's when they're explaining the history of Sparky, the dog, right? Yeah. That's the one that was like,

whoa, what is going on? But I will say like from the documentary, uh, and not to make this more about me in any way, but like I was, I was so struck by parallels to Amy Sherman Palladino for some of this stuff in terms of like a, a very kind

of like brash unapologetic woman who idolizes Dorothy Parker and cares more about, um, you know, the work than people's feelings and people like going on record in the documentary. Like, yeah, she was pretty mean, you know, and she like softened out over time and with age and stuff but sure but i was struck by that in in terms of like some of the similarities with female actors when the darker stuff comes into her career it is honest like it is a reflection of her personality it's part of what's there for her and i feel like she kept on trying to find the way to make that connect with an audience and it didn't and then this movie is like square in the middle between everything she does right yes while not being wildly successful at any of those things right where but not a total failure but definitely it kind of just like

lands weird this movie i don't know how else to put it right would you agree with that i mean is this a rewrite of someone else's script? Because there's four things on it. This is the other weird thing about her. Most of her films are that. Like, despite the fact that she gets her film career started by, like, adapting her own novel, doing When Harry Met Sally,

which is, like, you know, Rob Reiner hiring her off of his premise, Silkwood, which is an adaptation, you know? Most of her films that she directs are she takes a script from someone else and like Nora-izes it. So even Sleepless in Seattle was like that, was developed by two other writers before she comes on and makes it her own.

Michael's like that too. She usually comes on with her sister, Delia Efron, who I realized in a previous episode, I erroneously said was an original writer for SNL because she was part of that scene. And she's in all those books about SNL. She dated Michael O'Donohue for a long time, but she was part of like the edgy seventies comedy scene, the groundlings and all of that sort of shit. Um, but her and her sister come on and like, take a pass at, so I don't know where this script comes from, but I presume it was not incubated by them that it was the first two writers who were credited. And then her and Delia came on and like take a pass at so i don't know where this script comes from but i presume it was not incubated by them that it was the first two writers who were credited and then her and delia

came on and and rewrote it it's made by turner pictures in the brief period of time where ted turner was like fully financing his own movies and then having new line release them the megan allison of his time yes but like most of what he made at this time was like gettysburg right because that was and then like cats don't for his interests right right right like the i like cats don't dance i thought that movie's terrific they don't dance though conclusively uh and we needed that movie to teach us that but this movie is like a weird sort of like outlier in that and it's the most successful one and then warner brothers acquires turner very shortly after and folds in and like so you're like so did he read this script and

love it yeah did nor read this script and bring it to turner like i can't find any answers about how this movie comes to be but it does feel like very specifically a 90s movie like peak movie star where if john travolta wants to do it it's getting greenlit that's the most 90s thing about it making over a hundred mil at the box office like you could just slap from sleepless in seattle person and travolta's in it i'll see it's about a weird angel i don't care travolta was just in the pocket for like four years there were people pretty much went to see anything he did and having the poster be like john travolta is michael having the the tv ads be like him at the bar dancing like that's all people needed to see also the dog doesn't hurt either the dog always certainly doesn't hurt what obviously the dog is central to the movie but

the fact that have you seen that demented poster that's just yes his travolta's face and then there's my dog in the corner right and then some feathers yeah but like clearly they were just like the dog needs to be somewhere like i'm sorry we're just we're not putting this poster out but it's weird that the dog is like so centralized in the marketing campaign and then the movie is about this dog that they use as a marketing hook there's this weird meta element to how like forefront of the dog is and everything but i remember yes i remember this being a big movie where like like as good as it gets like frazier where it was just like the dog is all over the marketing we're pushing the dog hard we're pushing the relationship. He's an angel, but he's not a saint.

I mean, that was the other thing. It was one of those one-sentence pitches, in a way, that was like, John Travolta is an archangel, but he drinks beer and he smokes cigarettes. He's a bad boy. Which is not really. Which is like a fine premise. Yeah, but that's not really what the movie is no no and yeah i i i turned this on expecting it to not be a road trip one

expecting him to have a more romantic uh sort of part to play like obviously he is romantic in the movie he's as we say in heat and smells like cookies but like he has no he explicitly has no part you know and no part to play in like a love triangle or anything like that well and the billing is also the billing's weird on this movie because it's like above the title huge john travolvolta, then William Hurt, Andy McDowell, a rung down from him, and then the title Michael, and then, and Bob Hoskins. So I was like, that's a weird billing block. And it's also weird for Andy McDowell and William Hurt at this point in their careers to be playing sidekicks to John Travolta in a movie. And then I watched this movie and it's, oh, sidekicks to John Travolta in a movie.

And then I watched this movie and it's, Oh, Travolta's the sidekick. Like Annie McDowell and William Hurt are absolutely the protagonists of the story. And like, this is a time when Hurt is really at a career low, right? Would you say?

He's hurting to really dry up. He's hurting for sure. He's hurting. I mean, I feel like we talk about this in our Lost in Space episode. That movie's a couple years later. Yes. Um that's oh his whole 90s basically his leading man collapsing slowly yes yeah and they they can't figure out what he's supposed to be now right because he's like aged a little bit he's still handsome guy but he kind of has like

how would you describe it like he has this sort of like boardroom feel, you know, he's always hot. I can't tell if he's hot or not. I mean, in broadcast news, absolutely. I think this is the last time he's sort of conventionally hot in a movie,

but he does have that thing. The older he gets, the more the asshole qualities come to the forefront. Like you look at broadcast news a decade earlier, and it's like, okay, here's a guy who's secretly a piece of shit, but he's so charming that everyone falls for it. And then this movie is the opposite,

where it's like, this guy is such an asshole, I don't believe anyone would fall for him. There is something so off-putting about him. Unfortunately. Right, right, 100%. I don't get him. Also, the Andydowell conversation guys i'm not sure about andy mcdowell i've never been sure about her she is so weird

this is right after four weddings right or it's two years later yeah so you have groundhog day in between that's the important step wait is groundhog day in between yes groundhog day is 93 that's 93 Michael wow is 96 because four weddings is the one that she's objectively bad in haven't seen it only watch the wedding version is is the weird thing about four weddings is it's an explicitly good movie it's basically like a genre-changingly good movie. Agreed. With Mr. Bean!

Classic rom-com, Mr. Bean's in it. A side of Bean. Well, and you love the setting, David. Wait, what's the setting? David loves weddings, but that's weird because... I believe it's in... Is it in London? Just have your fun all right i am wondering how the bit is strained via

uh oh no they do it i guess it tends to happen quicker i feel like it tends to just sort of like happen yeah my point about i'm grub in Britain. What? Oh my God. Wow. My point, although actually I thought on F1 we were doing the reverse bit where you knew I grew up in Britain. Well, I'm sorry. Yeah.

I forgot about it too. No reason to apologize. But wait, what would that be? We can cut that out, right? David, what would that bit be? You know I grew up in Britain, but you forgot that for my first nine years I lived on the Upper West Side,

uptown Davie Sims. That's the new bit it's uptown davis sims and i keep forgetting oh no that actually is news to me yeah that's great a lot of people forget that part um so is she is she good but is she good i just want to finish my four weddings thought it's like yes it's crazy how successful that movie is considering that she is really bad in it. Really bad. She's like a grossly bad. It's one of those bizarre films. It's like the opposite of Hairspray where it's a great movie that somehow even overcomes the central bad performance. In a way where Hairspray I think is great other than Travolta being misguided. But like every time he's on screen screen it sticks out if that makes sense

like four days in a funeral you're watching scenes that hinge on the romantic chemistry between her and Hugh Grant she is dropping the ball and the movie still works that had been said I think she's very good in Groundhog Day uh yes she's great in Groundhog Day

I don't know I don't know guys I don't know, guys. I find her charming in this sort of Southern mode, which she's in here, but I just feel like this movie does not know what her character is at all. Can we say what she is? Can we say what she is?

Oh, Miss Margaret Qualley's mommy? Well, she is, but I was going to say. That's true. When you're talking about her specific charm, she's a bargain store, Mary Steenburgen. Oh, oh,

oh, bargain store. Oh, bargain store. Could you at least say generic brand? Like bargain store feels like a real. Wait, is Steenburgen second tier?

Is she a Southern belle as well? I feel like that's not. Steenburgen? I feel like, I don't think about that feel like that's not steenburgen i feel like i don't think about that what i think of steenburgen uh really mary i now i need to look up where mary's texas am i wrong about this i mean you're probably right i just i don't think about that oh interesting she's an ark arkansan how do you arkans Arkansan? Arkannian. Arkannian. I think of her sweet, but I don't think of her southern.

That's so interesting. She's generic. Annie McDowell's generic brand. Mary Steenburgen. Whereas I think Steenburgen never misses, Annie McDowell's really hit or miss. She is very hit or miss. She definitely... I mean, I haven't seen...

I mean, I think she's great in Sex, Lies, and Videotape. Muppets from Space, we all love that one. Perfect performance. I think she's great. Does she have an affair with Pepe in that movie? I don't recall. It's been a few years. Some human being, I think,

is implied to have slept with Pepe the King Prawn in that film. I need to rewatch Muppets from Space. The only movie, what's that? Kathy Griffin makes out with Pepe. That's what it is. Kathy Griffin makes out with Pepe. I know my Muppets. Two redheads. Wow, that really is life on the D-list. You gotta make

out with Pepe. I can't even make out with Rolf. I feel like I've only loved her, loved her in Magic Mike XXL. She's great in that. I think she's fully great in that movie she's great in that she's sort of doing a better version of she tried that a few other times like in beauty shop griffin's movie my favorite um beauty shop beauty shop uh beauty shop does

rule that's accurate uh in isn't she in the footloose remake right she is yes she plays the diane weist role yeah yeah um i'm just looking because like sex lives and videotape She is. Yes. She plays the Diane Wiest role. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just looking, because like, Sex, Lies, and Videotype, she's great. I think she's pretty great in Green Card. Yeah.

See, she's got some good ones there. Who does she play in Short Cuts? I totally forget her being in Short Cuts. I haven't seen Short Cuts since I was like a teenager. Okay. She plays Mrs. Short Cuts.

That's the best one. The owner of a beauty shop. Josephine Cut. Yeah. It's a beauty shop which was a prequel yeah it's a pre it's a beauty shop prequel um so unless we forget yeah right gee her career is all over the place right and then her first film is gray stoke the legend of tarzan in which she is sure dubbed by glenn close is that right why is that true her performance i believe is fully dubbed in that movie because they didn't like her accent let me double check this she does have that southern

accent so that's correct i just didn't know it was glenn close guys wikipedia says the dialogue of andy mcdowell who played jane was dubbed and posed by glenn close according to hudson this was due to mcdowell's southern u.s accent which he did not want for the film and that she was not at the time a trained actor um that's crazy her is all fucking over the place I feel like her voice is like a huge asset like totally

you know that's something she's bringing to the table the accent and the and as we found out in this movie also her singing voice I think she's kind of charming in this. Pumpkin. I don't dislike her in this. Apple.

Cherry. I don't dislike any of them in this. Yeah. I do think everyone's a little undercooked. I agree. Like everyone's roles, right? Like it's like. Right.

I don't know if this movie was edited to death or something. It just feels like there's something missing from it. I don't know what it movie was edited to death or something it just feels like there's something missing from it I don't know what it is because I started watching it and it kind of jumps from plot to plot kind of rapidly and then we'll just stop

and sit in something that's only somewhat interesting I started watching this movie can we all agree I'm sorry Griffin no no what were you going to say Kevin I was going to say

I would love if we could agree that the cut of Gene Stapleton dropping an egg into a frying pan to a funeral is an I think you should leave sketch. Absolutely. I think it is. Canonically. I was very disappointed reading the cast list when I saw Gene Stapleton's name and for five minutes thought it was Gene Smart, but it wasn't.

It's Edith. I forgot. She would also be good enough. Yeah. What were you saying, David? I'm sorry. I had a question about the egg thing. Because, you know, that's early in the movie, obviously.

Jean Stapleton's making them all breakfast, and she keeps asking what their eggs should be, yada, yada, yada. And they say over easy. She's clearly handing them scrambled eggs. They're not over easy eggs. It is a pile of yellow scrambled eggs they're not over easy eggs like it is a pile of yellow scrambled and like and what what is this just some a fuck up like did they decide over easy sounded funnier later i just i couldn't get over it i cannot wait on this because i was covering you don't care about this entire scene no i'm revolted i know wait do you not like eggs griffin i hate them they're

disgusting they're the devil's food oh my god i was singing in the shower this morning about how much i love eggs devils well true and if you ask me all eggs are deviled eggs oh my god they've all been smooched by satan himself very savage um it is a weird moment. I was going to say, like, I started watching this movie and I was looking at the Wikipedia and I saw that it had 30% on Rotten Tomatoes. And I was like, this movie feels kind of charming. Like, I know this doesn't have a reputation for being great, but 30% is really low. And then you get to the end of the movie and you're like, nothing catastrophic has happened here. But it's very hard to say that this movie works.

Yeah. I like it to the end. I'm like, what is this movie about? Right. It was hard to say anything about the movie. I want it to be kind of a pleasant watch, but I can't really wrap my head around it. But at the end of the first act, when it sort of finally has settled down. And when Michael says to Annie McDowell, I i'm gonna want you to sing and to william

i'm gonna need you to apologize and there's like a master plan in place that we don't really know about right like and it's a road trip i'm like okay okay i think this movie's gonna start zooming i think this movie's set up yeah i think i'm on board a bit of a slow start but that's cool and then even though that is you know basically happens, it never like felt like it like gathered a lot of momentum. It's just, I don't know. They like get to that pretty quickly and then it's a lot of just space to fill. No. Right.

And then also, I don't know if you guys felt this. I mean, jumping around, but I felt very disappointed when it became clear. Oh, the point of this movie is Michael was sent to earth specifically and exclusively to make annie mcdowell and william hurt fall in love yes which is weird i would say which is weird and i'm fine with the two of them ending up together but it's weird that that was his mission it's weird that he like used his last you know whatever miracle chip right his last like earth pass yeah to get two fairly annoying people together who don't right have a lot of chemistry and don't really have fully drawn characters it feels like a rube goldberg device too because if

the idea is like you guys need to fall in love it's just like well just do the street running thing like in chicago and don't even deal with iowa and the road and the twine and stuff absolutely just turn your tv on god damn it you know don't don't have a mouse like run to a baseball bat and knock over a teacup is this evidence of like a script that was written and then rewritten? Like, is it like it had this and then Nora came in and was like, I want it to be like a road trip and they go to the Big Ball of Twine. Like, is that what happened? I don't know. We can't find any answers.

I mean, this is why. Why is this movie? Congress, release the files. What is Nora's touch though? What's her signature where it's like, oh, there's this in this movie, like all of her movies. The newspaper. She loves journalism, right?

She loves a newsroom, an editor, a writer. Even if it's for the Daily Mirror, is that what it's called? I believe it's called the National Mirror. The National Mirror. Because the Daily Mirror is an English newspaper. I swear you know that, but okay. Oh, I find it smashing simply also just

side note robert pastorelli for the first 20 minutes of this movie i'm like did steven van zant say no thanks to this is steven van zant a market correction to robert pastorelli are we just somebody everyone no i don't i love steven van zandt i've i know i own guitar picks from steven van zandt we'll see we do love little steve we love a gangster in norway we stand lily hammer we do love a lily hammer this is sort of pastorelli's like last great moment right i mean he's last early's last dance right i mean he's last release last dance right i mean because four years later he gets mired in scandal and five years after that he kills himself not to be bleak here so sad to be bleak treasure planet well eraser right but this is like his last sort of window of like he's coming

off of what he was on uh uh suddenly susan or murphy brown he was on murphy brown yes right and then had his own sitcom for one season um it's interesting i mean he's you know he's he's a big part of this movie this is what i thought this movie was going to be at the halfway point i thought it was going to be these cynical journalists are in a car with Michael, accompanying him on his journey to solve whatever he was sent on Earth to do. And along the way, he changes them just by proximity. They start to fall in love, their hearts open up, and there's some big reveal at the end of what Michael was sent to do and the ultimate sacrifice he makes. Yeah, instead, this functions as lost right where the end of loss is like the point was that you guys met and love each other the point was was you guys which i don't like it feels way too small and i also just like she's had such

a bad run of relationships and he is such an asshole that I'm not convinced this is an ultimate victory for the two of them to be together. No, and especially and this gets shaded in a different way when it is a woman directing it. But the kind of wild gender and sexual politics of ending your movie with a woman saying no five times and then saying yes and it's a yes is uh bananas and i don't know how to unpack it and that's like that's almost a nora touch like that feels like like putting the key lime pie in jack nicholson's face in harper you know sure like that feels like when you're asking what the touch is it's like it's this weird combination of like bitter and sweet it's this person who knows how to like make a souffle with some tabasco sauce in it you know i like that you love a souffle griff

yeah or a sour cream raisin pie as they alluded to at some point in the movie yeah no thank you by the way at her most successful she was sort of the preeminent souffle filmmaker of her time and then she tries to like expand out to these other things to varying levels of success as sort of the preeminent souffle filmmaker of her time. And then she tries to like expand out to these other things to varying levels of success. But this movie has this like really interesting, it's got this like autumnal color palette. It's all very brown. And the sky is usually just like dead white.

And it's very much framed around these big open landscapes as they're just like driving through like the empty terrain of america it has a very different look and feel to most studio comedies of the it all feels very intentional right like no question completely and i think it looks good i think all this is well done i do too i think it's a nice and there's like these nice little cinematic touches um i like the barn collapsing at the beginning or the bank whatever it is you know i like um i don't know some of the stuff with his feet and like you can feel like feel the air moving around him like

the way that it tries to communicate that there's like something about this guy when they introduce him and you see the floorboards from the ceiling that he's stepping on and the dust coming from them. Which I wasn't even sure if that was supposed to be when they first get to the milk bottle motel or whatever it's called. And you see the floorboards creaking. I wasn't sure if I was supposed to be reading that as like, is that a size joke?

Where it's like, look how much they're creaking. Here comes trouble. I think, I mean, because so much of this is up, this movie is, hey, you'll never expect an angel not to be ripped. You'll never expect an angel to smoke Marlboros. You'll never expect an angel to fuck. Like all of those sort of subversions.

Yeah. Speaking of aesthetics though, one man who was working overtime on this movie, Randy freaking Newman. Okay. Kevin with a perfectly timed Zoom background change. For the listener. Just so we all know who I'm talking about. I wouldn't have known otherwise.

I wouldn't have known. He's got a beautiful picture of Randy smiling, and he clicked it right as he said Randy Newman. It's Randy at the Oscars, I think i think right that looks like an oscar shot i think for this most recent year i like the randy score here now i have to admit i'm just sort of like this strain of randy score tickles such a nostalgia spot for me just because of toy story like anything that feels like mid 90s randy newman is just immediately hitting the heartstrings for me he is like and you do notice how much of like what i associate is like oh it's the toy story sound it's just like that's just randy yes that's randy being randy man and just like the kind of very um melodically sophisticated Americana stuff. And he was doing on the natural and stuff too,

but he's like so heartfelt about it. There is something. It does raise the question though with Randy, like who his influences are. Like honestly, who are his guys? Okay. Okay.

All right. We got, we got our, Kevin obviously came to play. I'm trying to be a good guest listeners when kevin said who are his guys and that i gotta say he played that that t up real straight real dry i did not think he was setting up a funny a funny thing we like to say on the show like what on its own funny enough absolutely but at the moment he said it makes you wonder click who are his guys he activated a photo of mark maron and randy newman together i assume at the cat ranch and

randy's eyes are looking uh in two wildly different directions i know i don't want to be mean i hope he's okay uh he looks great i love yeah i don't like putin putin he's trying to hack our votes uh i do think though all this is like part and parcel i keep on using that term here but it's like this weird sort of approach to Americana this movie has. Like, I kept on thinking, like, there's some painter this movie looks like. Like, it's almost got, like, the color palette of, like, American Gothic, you know? And you have Randy doing his sort of, like, weird, like, postmodern Neo-Americana thing. And it is so much like this movie is driving through parts of the country that are never in movies. Yeah.

I mean, literally just the landscapes. And I think about, like, it feels like Efron wants us to be, like, really beholding the natural beauty of, like, it's kind of funny, but isn't the challenge or whatever he says, what is it? Battle, battle, he says to like the bowl. Is that supposed to be like, this is real America? It's just like a kind of out of his mind guy in the middle of a field running at a bowl. And like Randy's going ham on the score and it's very gorgeous.

And it's supposed to be like building up to this epic conclusion. It was confusing. It was confusing to watch. But that was another moment where moment where i was like okay so is this what this movie is this is where you reveal that he has visited earth like whatever he says 28 times but this is his last there's some there's some time limit or there's some right finite amount of visits after this after this mission whatever he was sent here to do he has to go back permanently never comes to earth again so this road trip is him trying to get his final his last licks in but then it feels like the sort of bucket list element of the movie which could be really fun because you're like what's on the bucket list of an angel who can't be hurt you know

uh that stuff isn't really uh a through line that follows through. He just likes to put sugar on everything and fuck a bunch of women in front of their boyfriends. That shit was disgusting. Yeah, that is disgusting. Oh my God. But he is smoking and drinking like it don't matter. That is true. There's that.

But I want like, I don't know. I want more incidents like the bullfighting. You get it. I mean, you're rocking a very michael lifestyle yeah if i was an angel and i had a only a little bit of time left i would be doing the same kind of shit you'd buy a sand sugar and well you know what it would be a sugar cube with lsd on it like that kind of stuff oh baby right you'd be a trippier angel but i mean like i don't look i'm not a liturgical expert, but Michael the archangel, he's famous for doing battle, right?

He fights Satan, he's in the Book of Revelation, he's sort of like an action angel. So it's the idea like, you know, the guy likes sugar, he likes fucking, but also he's spoiling for a fight, like he loves to throw down whenever he can right i don't know this is like stunts yeah it has like a bar fight where like people are flipping and stuff okay the bit though of that he has invented stuff yeah i like that it's kind of good yeah it's kind of i think that's a funny bit the standing in line uh joke

is also just a that's like a good nora effron line where he's like you should have seen it before everyone's just milling around yeah like and then people say how standing in line for what and he says to get in which is another good nora joke the cut i watched that was on my itunes rental he does have a weird line where he says i'm deep throat and they're like what do you mean michael and he's like no no it was me so here's what happened and they he explains it for like 25 minutes this is a wild thing we haven't talked about it all in this miniseries was no but let's establish it now yes who uh obviously helped break the watergate case

right their toxic marriage was the basis for heartburn right they cheated on her and they got divorced and she wrote a book about it and a movie was made about it you know obviously right their relationship fell apart and for the rest of her life before the revelation that mark felt was deep throat she would routinely at dinner parties whatever just be like oh it's mark felt just fyi telling people and like i don't think she said it in terms of like, I know because he told me. She was just like, I know because I lived with him. And like, it's obvious. She saw his initials. She saw his initials in his notes.

MF, which they always said stood for my friend. That was the Woodward Burns name. My friend. She's like, yeah, my friend, Mark Felt. That's who it stands for. But she was like, Nora Ephron doesn't get enough credit for being the original Mr. Policeman

I gave you all the clues. Like, she was just telling us. She was telling us, but maybe it just felt, I mean, it's not like, she wasn't the only person.

Like, Mark Felt was considered a candidate for Deep Throat in the days of, you know, it's just fun. So maybe people were just like, well,

that's her guess. But it is funny that she was just saying it partly as a fuck you to carl bernstein i also think that she wasn't saying it like it was a big announcement so people assumed like that can't be real if this was the truth she would be making some grand proclamation it would be an exclusive you know to some outlet instead she was just like oh yeah yeah no it's mark felt like she just kept saying it over and over again and i do love for like a certain you know part of culture and for that time period the bernstein efron marriage is there like britney k fed in terms of like it was short but red hot it affected culture forever it's tied to so many things both of them equally accomplished in different ways public like i was talking about harper and with my sister and i was like you

don't understand like the movie tames down the fact that this was like national headlines like it was like the guy who breaks watergate cheats on one of america's most beloved humorists with the daughter of the prime minister. Like, all three names involved were so juicy. Daughter of James Callahan's, yeah, former British prime minister. How do you know that? Again, very weird. Very weird history.

And then the other crazy thing we haven't talked about is Nora then marries the man she's with until her death, Nicholas Pelleggi, who writes Wise Guys, the book that became Goodfellas. Yeah, and he wrote Goodfellas with Scorsese, and I believe he wrote Casino, right? Correct, but Nora writes and does not direct

a movie called My Blue Heaven, which is the sequel to Goodfellas. Yes, that's right. That's right. She writes a comedy with Rick Moranis and Steve Martin, Steve Martin playing the Henry Hill character, that is a studio comedy based off of Nicholas Pelleggi's findings from Henry Hill once he moved into witness protection in the suburbs. Oh, very strange.

And it's Nebushi Rick Moranis lives next door to former mob guy played by Steve Martin with a flat top. I just think that's so bizarre. A thing we don't talk about

is like she writes a movie that is in all but name the sequel to Goodfellas. Yeah. Except in a different genre. They didn't market it like that though, right? No, absolutely not.

Okay. Absolutely not. Very strange. Look up the poster for this movie. I'm looking at it. It's an aggressive poster. It's like, can you believe these two talking to each other? I guess he's a cop in it?

Is he the... Yeah. he's got a gun on the poster and it's called my blue heaven because blue heavens matter um blue heavens do matter that is very true it's very actually very very true um okay let's talk about the setup for this movie because we've talked around a lot of other stuff but the setup for this movie, because we've talked around a lot of other stuff, but the setup for this movie is so weirdly complex. They work, Robert Pastorelli and William Hurt, work for a sort of World Weekly News, National Enquirer-type paper that both covers, like a supermarket tabloid that both covers fake stories, like Santa Claus discovered living in North Pole, but also seems to do celebrity gossip and stuff. Yeah, I think it's supposed to be kind of like the British tabloid Hello.

It's like a higher end, not like a supermarket tabloid that's just on really cheap paper and is just gobbledygook. But how would you know that? A glossy, a glossy, really kind of big and very photo-heavy magazine that would be like 30% celebs, 30% royal family, like Princess Di and all that shit, and then 30% nonsense.

So this paper is owned and run by Bob Hoskins, who seems to be like a billionaire. Sure. He's a mogul of some sort. Right. But they have very ritzy offices. They fly in the world's largest Christmas tree. This seems to be a very, very popular publication,

but not respected. And William Hurt used to be a respected journalist, and now he's stuck here with his best friend, Robert Pastorelli, their partners. Now he's slumming it but the weirdest thing and the thing that is hardest to figure out and like i didn't even grasp early is that the dog is like central to the editorial mission of this whole publication the dog the paper absolutely falls apart the dog is not only the mascot but it's like they have this wall of photos that. Without the dog, the paper absolutely falls apart. The dog is not only the mascot, but it's like they have this wall of photos

that's like the dog meeting Queen Elizabeth and the Dalai Lama and the Pope and shit. And I saw that and initially I was just like, yeah, it's a celebrity. And then like they're saying, you need that dog. And I'm like, they need the dog?

Yes, David. They need the dog. I love the dog. dog i love the dog the dog is the central conflict of the movie and let me explain it as concisely as i possibly can it's a stray dog who is very taken with robert pastorelli who's usually a grump but had a dog like this as a child and the dog senses that on him the dog then starts getting photographed with all these celebrities which is key to the popularity of the paper. So the dog is integral but the dog only listens to Pastorelli.

So Pastorelli has job security as long as the dog is still alive. But Bob Hoskins doesn't want to keep Pastorelli on staff. So he hires Andy McDowell who is a dog trainer to pretend to be a journalist and in the process, an angel expert,

an angel expert. That is not a thing. But, but, but the thing is 80 to 90% of what you're describing is laid out initially. Right. Right. And then I had to,

the last couple of pieces get put in like an hour and 20 minutes into the movie. Like they, they then basically drop it until right near the end when andy mcdowell's like i'm not an angel expert this is a whole ruse we're trying to it's like you know like it's so complicated she says that she's a dog trainer in response in defense of her killing a dog on accident and you have the one scene where she's saying goodbye to the dogs but it's like he is meeting with uh Hoskins is meeting with McDowell explaining to

her what he wants which isn't even really clear to the audience at that point meanwhile Hurt and Pastorelli are getting the letter about the angel or is it a phone call they get the tip off on Michael they get a man they get a letter with a picture inside of it yes so then they storm Hoskins office to be like, we found an angel. You have to let us go down there. And that's the moment where Hoskins says, take this angel expert with you.

So she has had no prep time to fake this personality. She goes like, Oh, I'm I am. I'm hired. She finds out she's hired and finds out what ruse she's going to have to sell at the same moment. This is the thing that makes no sense. She says it like she barely understands what she's supposed to be pretending to be, right?

Like she's like an angel expert. What? And Pastorelli and Hurt, supposedly journalists, like, you know, are just like, I guess we got saddled with this angel expert who's definitely an expert on angels and knows everything about angels. Like, I guess there's no further questions on this one. Three people definitely need to do this.

I happen to be interviewing at this moment, right when you stormed through and said, I got a letter about an angel. Right. It's, it's bizarre and it doesn't make sense. So then the movie becomes Pastorelli and Hurt, who sense that their careers are in danger.

Even though Hurt says to him, as long as you got the dog, you're safe. The dog sells papers. Decide to go find Michael because they think this story is so big, it will solidify their standing within the paper. McDowell is with them, supposedly as an expert, but secretly to try to train Sparky to respond to her instead. So they can fire Pastorelli, who is a photographer. And also, why do they need to fire him? What's the problem here? Is it that he's costing too much money?

I don't know. And then he just quits anyway. They want control of the dog. The dog rules it all, okay? If you've got the dog, then you're in. Yeah. You're still just making the dog inextricably tied to a different person are dogs nora effron's thing is there like a cute little doggy and

bewitched as well i know you've got male ends with the dog jumping on hanks as he's switching with meg yeah but i don't think of her as dog heavy okay but there's also just like there's no sort of real world equivalent for this where you're like oh yes that publication whose identity is tied to the dog being in photos with every famous person yeah i'm just like racking my brain i mean this is again what made me think that she was inspired by like 40s bing crosby going my way you know like you know bob because it's like that's the kind of insanely specific hollywood-y kind of prez premise that i can buy in those kinds of movies where it's like well i mean everybody loves jim the wonder dog like if what are you gonna do he's the talk of the town but it's like it's the 90s i don't think

people are still like i just gotta get my fix of pics of a celebrity with that specific dog every month. As we said, like, tonally, the movie is not, it does not feel like a pastiche. It is very much of the 90s, but you have to think in terms of storytelling, that's the kind of vibe she was going for. And this weird, subtle, magically realist comedy,

because then it's like they get to the milk bottle motel, they meet Edith Bunker, and then Michael comes in, upends all their expectations. Oh, Michael, you're here! Boy, the way Glenn Miller played!

Aw, can't you help me with banks? Which I will say, I thought it was weird for them to give her A 15 minute musical number in the middle I thought that was cool cause that's a throwback as well Like you were describing with the genre It is a throwback So she's in this and then she's in You've Got Mail

As well So there's this weird like It's almost like a baton toss of like She works with Rob Reiner On All in the Family Then he works with rob reiner on on the family yeah then he works with nora on harry met sally then she works with nor on michael and you've got mail yeah and then michael kills her and then michael michael the call okay her first coughing fit is something i would like to discuss yeah me too because so the movie has this she honestly when

the movie starts you're like this is a four-hander this is going to be trivulz and mcdell hurt and um stapleton like it just sort of feels like they're like get ready because stapleton's going to be all over this they might leave pastorelli behind stapleton might have to go yeah um but then she has this coughing fit and i was like oh i get the joke's gonna be that she dies like the second they meet him her yes and then she says no i'm contemplating my death right is that what she says it's something like that it's this wild physical bit though where it sounds it looks like she's hamming it up but she's not but she kind of is because she's being dramatic about it and like slouched over until they ask her what's wrong and yeah it

is it is a very strange energy but then i don't know what 10 minutes later if that yeah the same thing happens to her and she dies she cracks an egg and she dies yeah it's not even they don't even do a rule of three it's two no it's two and then hard cut from egg to funeral that was the hardest i've laughed since lockdown started i'll be honest i will say this i think a hard cut to a funeral is usually gonna work like that's usually pretty funny right like i mean like especially if it's like it should be like outside maybe the coffin lowering right like that's always a good cut like i think of like grimes right in the simpsons when he's like you know i can touch these exposed power wires i'm homer simpson cut to his funeral just like like the harder the cut the better and and they even like they like put a cherry on top of the cut, which is Annie McDowell sobbing hysterically.

And William Hurt says, you knew her for like three hours. Yeah. Yeah. That's the thing is like, they stick around town for the funeral. Yeah. For the ceremony of it all. And then, and then the movie does just become like, okay, so I guess come back to, okay, did they want to come back to Chicago so they could take a picture of him in Chicago? Was that the, I was very confused about why they need to be in Chicago.

They want him to meet Bob Hoskins, but also he refuses to have his photo taken before they get to Chicago. But he doesn't like planes and he needs more time so they have to drive they are now in a car the four of them the four amigos and sparky the dog driving to chicago it feels rain manny though and it's conceit of like here's this man who's like weird and we have to like bend to all his not weird i'm sorry i don't mean that effectively but just so many no but in this case it applies it is like the premise is what if there's a weird guy on the road trip with you yeah and because of the weird guy you have to drive like rain man is that

midnight run is that right like the specific subgenre of like this guy is weird and won't get on a plane for some reason. He makes everything more complicated. I would like us to reimagine all the scenes in this movie with Dustin Hoffman as Rain Man, smelling like cookies and taking women back to his hotel room. Can I say, I fundamentally think Travolta is bad casting for this movie. Okay, okay. So we're talking about it.

I think we have to. I think he is weird in all of the wrong ways for this role. And even you just saying Dustin Hoffman right now, I'm like, that would work better for me. I think Travolta is a weird combination of like, the ways in which he's weird feel like he's not aware. He's not self-aware. And in this pocket,

especially now that he's like back to being a major movie star he's like always a little too concerned with being charming and sweet yeah yeah well in the charming sweet stuff i do find comes off as strange very right he seems weird yeah when he's like dancing in the field and doing his stuff and like dancing with the ladies on the dance floor. I'm like, no, no, no. Right. And you're like, this probably needs to be a movie star who was known for being a charming cat. Like it needs to be Hoffman or Bill Murray or Jack Nicholson.

You know? Murray, I could see. Obviously Nicholson. I mean, Nicholson, it would almost be too cute because he like plays a devil. Like, right. Like, you know, now it's like, well, what if there was an angel? And they're like, wait up. It's Jack Nicholson, it would almost be too cute because he plays a devil. Now it's like, well, what if there was an angel? And they're like, wait up, it's Jack Nicholson. Murray was the one I kept thinking of,

especially in this time period. Murray would be interesting. It'd be a very different movie. Very different movie. Because Murray is not a guy, not that he's not romantically intriguing, but he's not like a sex appeal guy, right? Like in the same way. No, but don't you also think that- He's not horny, appeal guy right like in the same way no but don't you also he's not horny i guess is the best way to put it travolta has a horniness don't well hey

and i'm not saying that's a good thing i think dana barrett would disagree he charmed the pants off of her he made her levitate i have to google that now okay Sleeps above the covers. I believe it's Sigourney Weaver's character. Oh, that's right. Excuse me. Three feet above the covers. Okay. No, but Griffin, do you know what I mean? Yes.

Travolta's dirty, but I'm not saying that's a good thing. I think we are agreed that that's not quite the right energy. Well, I think that's a problem with this movie is like Travolta still is borderline enough of a regular sex symbol that when women constantly turn their heads and are drawn to him inexplicably in this movie it isn't as funny as if it were like slovenly bill murray chain smoking pouring sugar in his coffee and suddenly everyone was going like who who is that? I think that's accurate, right? Like a Brian Dennehy.

I mean, Dennehy, look. Dennehy in this movie? I'd watch it. John Goodman is Michael. I'd watch it. That's the problem is I think he's weird in all the wrong ways and he's charming in all the wrong ways. This is what's complicated about it,

Griffin. And you're right. It's like, yes, John Travolta has at this point aged beyond Marky Idol romantically. Like it's not like Pulp Fiction gets shorty. Like in these movies, these movies are not,

he's, you know, a romantic lead. He still gets the leading lady in his films, but they're not romances first and foremost. Exactly. But right. He's still a little too in that for it to be weird that he yeah i don't know right it has to be a guy like nicholson i'm not saying it should be nicholson but that nicholson power of like this guy inexplicably became a sex symbol nicholas cage we're talking you know maybe they

got the wrong face off. Okay. It's better because, because you need that contrast for like, I would not go for it. Well, it's like, well, him in Moonstruck is kind of like the chaotic energy,

but he's still somehow very charming. Yeah. I want to hear what David's going to say, but I just want to quickly work it off of what you said, and pitch a clean face off you have nicholas cage do michael you have john travolta do city of angels is that not better for both is that not better for both for both should this be a new thing like face-offs where we like let's take two movies from the same year ish yes and like that

didn't work and see if switching the leads does anything i think this is a fun segment who are you going to propose david i think an internal face off travolta should play the magazine editor and hoskins should play the angel i think that's i think that's a great pitch because i think travolta could have fun with, you know, 10, 15 minutes of, you know, newspaper jerk, right? Like, you know, weirdo. Like, truly, DeVito as Michael. Like, someone where it's like, ooh. The weirdest thing about Get Shorty, a movie I really like, is that DeVito plays someone who is basically the biggest movie star in the world.

And I love Danny DeVito. Because, like, the joke in the book is that he's short. Sure. But that's a joke about Tom Cruise. Like they're not saying that he's five feet tall, even on a good day in sneakers. Like it's just a crazy overcorrection where they're like, what's the deal?

He's short. Call Danny DeVito. But you know, David, even like an internal face off, I'm not saying he's the ideal casting but i think this movie works better if william hurt plays michael and travolta plays the editor i considered that you talk about what's wrong with the casting of both of these guys yeah travolta's

a little too conventionally charming and not self-aware of how he's weird william hurt is a guy where anytime a woman ends up with William Hurt in a movie, you're like, that feels like a prison sentence. Like, I can tell this guy's difficult. You're never gonna fully melt that heart, right? No, it's awful. Right. It's absolutely awful.

There's something about him that is just like very, very thorny. Yeah, yeah. And I think you can't pin the movie on you want to see them break each other down yeah because again with travolta it just feels like movie star bullshit where it's like uh put in the script everyone loves me where it's like that actually is the script and what's supposed to be genuinely funny about it right that they shouldn't love him it's almost there but he has to be like put in the script

that I specifically am not letting Andy McDowell love me. I blocked her. I put a block on you. I put a block on you. I blocked you. Oh my God.

Oh, speaking of casting what ifs, for Groundhog Day, who did Andy McDowell's role almost go to? Tori Amos. Really? Tori Amos. Really? Tori Amos. That is fucking wild.

That is some wild shit. Now, imagine this movie with Tori Amos instead. Yeah, I can't do that. You're saying, what if Tori Amos, it was a sliding door scenario? Yeah, Tori Amos

and Magic Mike XXL. She would have ended up getting every Annie McDowell role. Now, Tori Amos as Magic Mike XXL. She would have ended up getting every Annie McDowell role. Now, Tori Amos as a country-western singer-songwriter, that's interesting. And to me, this is my favorite part of this movie, is Annie McDowell's subplot, excuse me, her hobby. Yes. Writing country-western songs, specifically that genre, is her hobby. She is a dog trainer who wants to get hired as a decoy

by a tabloid but secretly it's too much business so much a lot of business kevin i'm with you i think the country writer thing is cute like or like there's there's a version of that that you could make really really cute i love it but i i'm just too like tripped up by like trying to figure out like, wait, the dog trainer thing. And like, how did she even get wrapped up in a, in a tabloid?

Like, like I'm just, I can't even get to when she takes out her fucking notebook and I expect her to be like, well, I'm a reporter. Like she doesn't even have treats in her pockets. Like she's no expert dog training doesn't know from dog training.

That's a great point. This is the most scathing thing I can say about this movie. A movie that I probably give a gentleman six. I gave it a six. I waived it between five and six, but I think I gave it a six. The middle kind of was enough. The things I like in it,

I like enough to give it a six. The most scathing thing I can say about this movie is this should not be a movie where i need to consult the wikipedia page while i'm watching it to figure out the plot and yeah this is not tinker taylor soldier that is how i felt and that is a great reference kevin because that is the ultimate movie where you're like did i miss 20 minutes like i love that movie that's the thing with tinker taylor soldier spy you can't

hold it against the movie you're like you're supposed to be in that car totally right yeah but i should not have to reopen the michael tab four times to go like okay so that was in the first scene okay good well that's the thing there's that one scene where she's talking to the dogs that feels kind of just cute and tossed off i didn't think it was like this is a plot lynchpin like this isn't a point this is the biggest breadcrumb even the pie runner i thought i missed a scene where they're like hunting for pie all the time which i i do relate to a lot we did do big little pies uh the watch party last summer uh back back when HBO had original programming coming out. And I've gotten familiar with pie and hunting for the best ones,

but I didn't understand why the characters in this movie were. But was I delighted when Andy McDowell did write and sing a song about pie, apple, pumpkin, cherry, banana cream. This is my favorite part of the movie. But then it's also disappointing when you're like, oh, that's a runner merely to set up William Hurt and Andy McDowell fucking. But the pie stuff?

Right? Because it was like he was hunting for pie so that he could get her in the place to sing a song about pies. But, ah, yeah, I guess. Because that's the thing. He makes the two promises. He's like, you promised me that you'll apologize to William Hurt,

and you promised me that you'll sing to Andy McDowell. And that's the moment when he calls out when they're eating the pies. And he says, you have to sing now. Yeah. I just, I don't, I'm not crazy for saying this, right? They don't have any chemistry. Andy and Will. There is one scene, if I can even call it in that movie

there's one scene of this movie where i give all credit to nora affron that i think is borderline transcendent in in just her direction and it is the scene that mostly plays as an unbroken two-minute one oh on the stairwell at the motel. Yes. That seems good. I think they fundamentally do not have a lot of chemistry. They don't have a lot of chemistry even in that scene. It's a well done scene.

That scene is a masterpiece of blocking and of camera movement. Yes, 100%. And I like the dialogue about like, oh, your room's directly above my room. The way he says that, like, it's a flirt, even though you're like, what? But like, you know what I mean? It's incredibly well written. And it's like, they come out of the Honky Tonk bar, which is right next to the motel they're staying at.

There's a little bit of shot, reverse shot, as they're saying goodnight to each other. And then it moves to this shot from like behind William Hurt's head as like, he starts to walk up the stairs. Then he grabs her hand and kisses her on the cheek or it's the other way around right he's on the ground and she's walking up the stairs i believe that's right yes they kiss on the cheek and then she continues walking up the stairs but she doesn't

let go of his hand yes which is really it's it's like good fucking lube it's touch shit and then she walks back down they kiss again that she keeps. And it's just like this tension of it until they start going up the stairs together. And that I was like, this is a very good depiction of two people in a weird circumstance, making a spur of the moment decision to sleep together. It is not the scene that shells me on them being together for the rest of their lives.

Lubitsch is a good, uh, reference. That's what, that's who i'm maybe thinking of even more than like you know hope and crosby like that twist of supernatural to like a sort of battle of the sexes type movie like i get that right but when people talk about the lubitsch touch they talk about like that sort of like incredibly concise characterization that also functions as moving the story forward that also is charming and humorous and that usually is entirely visual or behavioral

right it's not the characters explaining themselves and that scene is like a perfect distillation of that and a thing that i think she was good at doing but i was more into like oh look they're falling backwards into this weird affair this might sort of change both of them a little bit and i felt so deflated the moment i find out no this is his heaven sent mission that's the problem it it kills the chemistry not that it really exists anyway right because then the movie is just about like well this has been ordained by god or michael or whoever right like so that's why it's happening because it's like some divine command we love a god-ordained romance that's my favorite kind of love story is when god wants two people to come together when i hear that at weddings i'm like yes

this will work he has some line nothing hotter He has some line. I can think of nothing hotter. He has some line where he's like, the toughest challenge melting the world's iciest heart. You know? Like the man who no longer knew how to love. Like he frames it like it was like he was the Grinch. As if he was like an iconic Scrooge level. Like, and I don't think William Hurt is playing the level of asshole where you're like no there's no way this guy could ever fall in love i think he's playing

classic mild asshole william hurt or it's very mild asshole yeah and the crucial so when early on michael is like i'm gonna need you to apologize and you're going to have to do it. Right. Like he, he makes that like sort of compact. Another kind of nice in prison. I like that scene. I really like that scene. But right then in the prison scene, like, I don't know,

like there's something about the energies. Like she's suddenly upset in a way where I'm like, I guess I get why. And he's suddenly being really jerky in a way that I'm like, this hasn't really been his vibe up until now he's more over it than an asshole yeah it just even though so even though i like the choreography of that scene and i like the like the idea of like yeah there's gonna be a moment a pivotal moment where you're gonna need to stop being such a jerk i just feel like she doesn't lay the groundwork

for it right or something i don't i don't know no and as you said i got excited when he says at some point i'm gonna ask you to apologize like that is a move that gives me a lot of confidence in a movie because i go like oh my god the writer is calling their shot they're setting up they're setting up the fucking rube goldberg machine in a good way to later pay off beautifully right i'm leaning in i'm like oh what's that what's that right how is that going to be recontextualized right right and it's a it's a good little mystery for a rom-com like rather than i don't know like we have to figure out who's behind the chemical spills like it's just like oh right oh oh she's gonna need to he's gonna need to apologize but like kevin you've gone back to your uh john travolta as moose in the fanatic zoom background i have yes but on your real wall you have a framed

illustration of paddington the bear uh and we're talking about setups and payoffs well but also also certainly that's a perfect set of payoff movie but also paddington is like a perfect example of a genre of film i love a lot, which is one character quietly changes everything and everyone they come into contact with. Yes. But it feels organic. It doesn't feel like manipulated. And that's true in both Paddington's,

but really true in the first one. Like, like the whole block is changing because of him. And right. Right. But that's what you want out of Michael. Like that's the promise this movie is making is here is this guy who seems like a slob who seems like no conventional angel we've ever seen oh man i don't know how many comparisons i want to make i mean like his marmalade his frosted flakes with

sugar and more sugar like he puts it in ketchup at one point he puts sugar on french fries at one point it's overdoing the bit right you want it to be this guy seems like he's a piece of shit like this guy is like a drunk you know he's smoking he's like uh you know a horn dog but slowly but surely he he quietly touches everyone every life that he encounters upon the way and instead it's just like something about how a tunnel vision this movie becomes at the end to the extent that like when when sparky gets hit by the truck and then andy mcdowell divulges all the decisions by the way yes right and then william hurt demands that michael uh saves sparky and he says that's not my area and hurt in with all the emotional passion and intensity of i love you wife says no you have

to bring him back to life do it do it it's true he's he's just not into it what is this about her 90s hurt and then michael michael does it but it it takes so much power out of him that it he starts shedding his little feathers from his wings and he just wants to see the sears tower which i think is a line i missed or something because like it becomes very important and i was like wait i didn't realize he was bad focused on this tower well he wants to see big stuff and that's the biggest moment. I support it. That's the part Ben really connected with in the movie. Him going to the Big Ball of Twine. Ben's just at home like... But then they get to Chicago.

They get to Chicago. The biggest non-stick pan. That one was a weird one. That one's very niche. I've heard of the biggest ball of twine. Non-stick? Yeah. Alright. Also those old guys are really in it for it at that moment where he's just like going off about the battle of hell oh he's talking about throwing satan out of heaven and the old guys are like oh okay

i love that i think that's great no it's fun stuff but once once he's in the field and is like i don't have much longer it takes three minutes to get to Chicago. Suddenly they're like rapid speed. In Chicago, he's dying outside the Sears Tower. Yeah. And then the movie, and I'm like, okay, is the movie over? Have they all learned a lesson?

And the movie's like, no, no. Like 10 more minutes. And I'm like, I don't need them. Before we get to my second favorite part of the movie, my first favorite part is the song in which Annie McDowell does sing about all her 16 ex-husbands or however many,

which I thought that was going to be the thing is that, oh, they're fake and she's being a con lady in a different way with all these like outlandish stories about his tires was bald and so was he, but it's actually all true and she put them in the song. My second favorite scene, of course course is when william hurt goes out for a nice pasta dinner by himself

and who should be his waiter in the restaurant yes pasta mr toby ziegler himself who maybe like should be like uh i don't know like indicted by the like anti-italian disparagement committee or whatever you know what i mean like whatever the sort of right like where i'm just like richard i i get the joke but why are you the one doing this i love richard schiff he is playing the illustration on the pizza box. It is outrageous. And Beardless Richard Schiff. A weird look. We've come to find out with people with beards and non-beards

during quarantine, myself included, Beardless Richard Schiff is about 49% smarmier than Bearded Richard Schiff. So you almost feel the contempt he might have for the man on the italian pizza box when he's doing an impression of him i also just think schiff is one of those guys who is so thoroughly jewish you can't suddenly put a different group on him the man played toby ziegler for a reason like that character is not called you know toby jones

it'll be funny to play toby he's not named tony linguine toby benigni can i just say something about the sugar before i forgot i just want to complain about that sure okay please griffin yeah michael he likes to smoke cigarettes he likes to get his rocks off okay come on yeah He likes to indulge in food pie, you know, French fries. I don't know what, whatever. So the bit is,

yeah, he's, he's an indulgent guy. He's sort of hedonistic. He enjoys pleasure, right? No one enjoys frosted flakes with a whole, like a cup of sugar added.

It's not like I'm every day. Like, you know, what I really want is a cup of sugar added. It's not like I'm every day like, you know, what I really want is a cup of Frosted Freaks with sugar piled on top. It's a hat on a hat, my friend. It's like four hats on a hat. Absolutely. And he is also-

It's like a sombrero on a hat. It's lids. It's the lid store on a hat. But here's the fix. If it was pixie sticks and he was pouring it all over, then I'm on board. Absolutely. Here's what you do, guys, gang.

I mean, for all of us doing cereal during this time, grape nuts with honey drizzled and a nice unsweetened vanilla almond milk. Terrific. Sounds classy. Sounds very classy. I love it. No, I agree with you. This is what I was going to say.

He is putting so much sugar on that cereal that he is essentially eating spoonfuls of sugar, which I think all of us learned as a child is not fun. Like it has a bad texture. It doesn't taste good. Right, exactly. You're like,

why don't I just cut out the middleman? Why don't I just eat sugar? And then you're like, Oh, I get this. When he's introduced eating that much sugar like essentially just fucking mainlining sugar i was like it's gonna be revealed that it's part of like something of his physiology like he needs it to survive there's some weird chemical reaction

because of his wings or whatever and instead it's just supposed to be if you were an angel wouldn't you do that which i don't relate to or maybe they cut out a scene where he was diagnosed with diabetes well maybe they cut out a scene where he's like my fucking powers come from sugar like i need to recharge well gang i want to be clear i want to be clear and especially is this movie rated pg or pg-13 it is pg or pg-13 i can't pg or pg 13 it is pg or pg 13 okay pg so okay it is a pg movie and right before um little sparky does get run over by a truck in the movie michael and then he's dead he absolutely does uh but him and michael do have a tender moment sitting on like a bench or something in a field and he turns to sparky and at one point he does say well you can never have too much sugar which as a

message in a pg movie i can't sign off on no i don't think that's great absolutely the film should be rated r and if you look at the diabetes trends nationally in comparison to the year that the movie michael came out there was a huge spike. Michael might have doomed a generation. In the same way that Babe made kids go vegan, Michael made kids. But you know how movies now, it's like PG-13 contains violence, smoking, you know, cigarette use.

What if it was rated R, excessive sugar consumption? I can tell you one person who'd love this movie. Michelle Obama would love that. No, look, Kevin, you're being sarcastic. She would hate this. You know who'd love this movie. Michelle Obama would love that. No, look, Kevin, you're being sarcastic. She would hate this. You know who would love this movie?

Edgar. Well, that's the other thing. That's the other thing. And that movie is after this, so I can't hold this movie responsible. Men in Black, the following year, he's all about sugar water. It's the only thing I can think about

when he's piling that sugar on. I'm like, this is Edgar's bit. And when he does it, it's menacing. And it works way better. The other thing it makes me think of is Elf, where the bit is, he's a lunatic from a children's book. Like, who would eat maple syrup on pasta? Right. Right.

But combining, like, I love smoking and bon boning down with i also love spoonfuls of sugar i was gonna say like smoking drinking boning are all sort of in the same pyramid and then sugar is something in left field like if it was just he's eating a lot like the guy orders a lot of food he's a glutton that tracks for me exactly but he wants to fight in water that's the vibe with the early scenes you're like is he not even gonna be charming like is he just gonna be completely bizarre right and then after two weird scenes then he sort of starts to be charming i kept waiting for them to be like oh his wings run on sugar that would have been cool like one of them breaks off and someone's like oh oh it tastes like like sugar

but they also explain that he smells like cookies but to different people they think he smells like different things like i guess he smells like whatever you like you know whatever the woman desires is what he smells like yeah i do think there is kind of uh in in the interminable last 10 or 12 minutes of this movie interminable interminable there's that thing we're like pasta william angel hair pasta and then annie mcdowell's asking for angel food cake and they're like this is a dunkin donuts we don't have angel food cake i think it's a starbucks it's an early starbucks you're right it is an early starbucks yes you can see the logo yes yeah but then there's that thing where pastorelli and hurt meet at the bar and and pastorelli is like that was wild right and

hurts like didn't happen didn't hurts like didn't happen didn't happen fundamentally didn't happen didn't happen i love that and pastor is like how do you explain it what happened to your jacket where were we for two weeks hurts like absolutely not didn't happen i love you wife and then he says the planet core but then he says that thing of like look if angels exist i'm gonna step outside and you see the sneak preview of what he's describing that he steps off the l train oh that's so strange that he has the sudden instinct to turn the other way then a car gets a flat tire and it's the woman of his dreams and then the rest of the scene plays out at the bar then he gets on the train you also have that moment

where he's at the train station and there's the michelangelo exhibit and it looks like michael angel you get it but i didn't wait i didn't get it actually can you explain it to me sure so the film is called michael okay michael is an angel oh the words michael and angel are both contained in the name michelangelo but what does this have to do with turtles that like pizza i just don't get it spelled very differently i always did because andy mcdowell does like hold her little fingies up to the fingies of the angel yeah and i was waiting for more like for her to say michael angel and i want i did want her to say oh i did oh oh just like griffin in the box office game oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh it's just weird but but then he gets off the train he turned

he turns the other way the flat tire hits it's two bearded men he He scoffs at the universe. How silly for me to believe. But then he sees Michael doing a little Travolta dance, chain smoking with the jacket. Yes. His classic semi-mullet hairdo. What a hairdo. He's got the Richard Lewis.

Kevin has changed his background to Ricky Schiff at the Italian restaurant but it's like it's like a minute and a half of him following Michael until he literally bumps into Andy McDowell and then they fully admit that they're in love with each other and they want to get married they want to get married and then you see Michael with Edith Bunker being like, this was my toughest assignment. Yeah, look at me. I pulled it off.

Right. And then they do a dance. They do a dance in the street, but is she supposed to also have been an angel or is he just hanging out with the ghost? Here's how I take it. And it's not like this is explained. Sure.

His angel chits or whatever have been used up but she is so great or whatever like was part of his assignment in some way that she is now like an angel in training and he's like only along for the ride as like her mentor her like you know her like driving teacher, essentially. Okay. I mean, that's kind of a sweet idea. But also, it is weird for how much this movie is specifically about Michael, a very specific archangel who has such an epic story. How he essentially is revealed to just sort of be Clarabelle from like, it's a wonderful life. And he's just dealing with like very small human concerns. And like, I like that line.

I don't know, Kevin, if you want to speak. There's that line where he's like, you can't mess with the fundamental nature of the world. There's some line where he kind of does some world building where he's like, you can do little miracles. You can't do big stuff. It's basically like Jesus logic with some of it where it's like well jesus can do water to wine he can do fishes and loaves but listen if you want to like turn back time or something or like genie rules in aladdin i can't make someone fall in love i can just set up the pieces he's he's like you know mostly i try and lead by example sure i can do a little magic yeah it's just but the movie i maybe because efron thinks it shouldn't

be too like i don't know fantasy heavy or whatever but like it doesn't really want to get into it no no what do you what is the most interesting thing about this to nora what is what does she love about this yeah i don't know i don't know i can't i can't figure it out i mean as you said she loves journalists and i think maybe just the hook of it is people who write fake stories for a sensational tabloid who come across a real miracle but it is not how they would imagine it to be i think if you if you hear it described that way, you go, that sounds like a Nora Ephron movie. Sure.

Okay. I have found an article by the great Rachel Handler on Vulture titled, Andy McDowell answers every question we have about Michael. Thank fucking God. I'm going to see if, as we wrap up, I'm just going to see if there are any weird tidbits that she has about making michael the largely

dismissed uh nora effron film um all right and uh let's see uh i was a fan of nora effron loved the script thought it was magical she was cast really early she sang in her audition which was crucial now they didn't dub over her voice she does sing and she has an okay she has an emma stone and lala land quality voice she has a pretty good voice she says like i don't think of myself as a singer but i think i did a good job singing in the audition pumpkin cherry apple uh travolta a huge person takes up the room very generous had his own cook and would always be offering to feed you so it seems like kind of like i don't know big boisterous energy type right like i don't know um uh do you remember if he was really eating the sugar probably sounds like

something he would have done he's that kind of of actor. I love that's his version of Tom Cruise being like, I really hung off an airplane is Travolta's like, I really ate that much sugar for Michael. Gang, we got to the most important question though. Sorry to scoop you, David. It does say, do you remember the lyrics to the pie song? And she does say, I can sing the pie song, but I'm not going to do it, but I can do it.

I've had people ask me to sing the pie song, but I'm not going to do it, but I can do it. I've had people ask me to sing the pie song and I will sing the pie song. If someone asked me on the street to sing the pie song, but I'm not going to stay here on the phone and sing the pie song, but I promise you I can. That does sound, I can imagine exactly Annie McDowell answering that question. Oh, we did talk about Carla Gugino showing up for a hot second too. She looking great. Looking great. Joey lauren adams the same yes joey lauren adams yes she carla giugino giugino i always start with her last name she's someone who really is unchanged

like in a sort of frightening way like here's another thing it's it's scary i feel like people are always surprised by this but when I'm asked this question, Carla Gugino is the actor career I would most want. Oh, yeah. Has worked with all kinds of great directors, memorable, well-liked. Has just done everything. Has been in every type of genre,

every size role, every size budget. Worked with so many great people. She's always fucking good. She can be be a family comedy or an action film or a drama do tv do stage do movies and i also just feel like she is at the perfect level of like established but not famous enough where she becomes a celebrity over an actor right right right she's got the perfect career if you ask me some other yeah no i agree with you i love her i'd love to see her in something right now she rolls um andy says nora at the time she

was directing was forced to be in touch with her masculine side was kind of intimidating she's sort of talking about how meryl said she was sort of an intimidating person to work with and andy's like i think it's sort of like a reverse sexism thing of like she had to be tough because you know there was such a spotlight on a female director at that point makes a lot of sense makes a lot of sense uh she um i don't know she doesn't really the pie answers the big she's not answering our big questions which is why why does this movie exist okay we have a break here i have scrolled down and she does sing the pie song in the interview wow but like she does but like in general her take seems to

be like i think it's a sweet movie and i think that's great like you know she's definitely not like it's a weird one you know like she's not like just yeah yeah well how can you even tell i mean if you're if you're an actor and that stuff like how objective is andy mcdowell about like no i think groundhog day worked because of these x factors and i think michael was a little off because of the cast that like right like it's impossible to be objective um why wouldn't you be now let's play the box office game for this movie that was a big hit all right so this movie came out christmas time 96 and that makes sense because sleepless in seattle had been such a huge hit it was a summer movie yeah but this is an angel movie right like it's a it's a pg movie so it makes sense that the studio which

is what new line i think uh well it's turner and new line released it right yeah right um that they're like uh christmas this is a christmas family movie and it's travolta's having this blockbuster year so it's number one good on him it opened to number one on december 27th Very impressive. That's very impressive. Yeah. And it grosses $27 million over the holiday weekend. It makes $95 million total. Yeah.

Unreal. Good. I can't imagine. What do you think it costs? Like $40 million? $40 million? Yeah. Yeah.

Right. Like, you know, I think it was like a very robust hit for them. Yes. Number two, Griffin, it's a movie we've discussed on the podcast.

We've covered it with an episode we have think christmas 96 baby what's jerry mcguire it's jerry mcguire just trucking jerry mcfucking guire so scientology is just owning the box office that's a fair point yeah do you think they're just like rubbing their hands together in the christ of 96? They're like, we are everywhere. Number three is for richer or poorer with Kirstie Alley. Number four is a Beck biopic. I'm trying to think of Scientologists.

Giovanni Ribisi. Swim fan with Eliza Deschke. Oh, yes. No, Erica Christensen, right? Erica Christensen. Yes. Is she a Scientologist? The other way around. Oh, yes. No, Erica Christensen, right? Erica Christensen, yes. Is she a Scientologist? The other way around. Yes, she is.

Christensen is. Dashku is not. Yeah. Fair enough. That we know of. Number three, Griffin. It's a Thanksgiving release, so it's been out for five weeks.

It's made $104 million. It's another family movie. So you'd say it's a grower, not a shower oh my god yeah that's what i usually say about family movies we usually say about family films it's a grower now you know what now i want to check its multiplier to see if it was a grower or a shower i mean it opened to 33 it's at 104 after five weeks i'd say it was a bit of a shower what is it enough at what's the final total what's the final uh the final domestic total for

this film was 136 304 million dollars worldwide wow is it live action or animated live action oh but with an asterisk there's a tone to the way i said that yeah okay what was the other thing you were about to say about it it was one of those things where i remember even as i was what 10 when it came out i saw it in theaters with my family even as a kid i knew like oh well this casting is a fucking grand slam like was it jumanji of course no although believe me i was very excited for jumanji yeah so it really it was like this actor playing this role was just money in the bank. Interesting.

Correct. Actress. Oh, is it 101 Dalmatians? That's right. Yeah. See, this is what's weird.

You're saying, this is like the difference of like three years between our ages? At this age, it's a big deal. Have you guys seen the cut of 101 Dalmatians where Andy McDowell dubs over Glenn Close as Cruella DeVille it's weird I gotta get those dogs I want those don't have that skin puppies

furry puppy slobber see the difference for me David is you were like that slam dunk Glenn Close as Cruella DeVille and for me in the following years i was like oh it's nice to see cruella deville working like this was my first impression of glenn close but like don't you think it's funny that me at 10 years old and obviously i was a little nerd about movies but even i knew through cultural osmosis like oh well glenn close famously great at playing like kind of scary people like scary ladies like she's that's funny fatal attraction dangerous liaison like she is the lady for like to play like an iron lady i remember feeling that way when i was like five years old and i saw the vhs cover for popeye i was like they're two for

two robin and devol oh my god it's fair it's fair yeah what a weird we gotta talk about that movie all right we got him a popeye okay yeah 101 one question griff you've seen 101 dalmatians i have the remake does she die at the end what happens to her at the end because in the animated film it's really scary when she's driving remember and then the car goes over the bridge and that is scary oh very scary no she goes to jail because there's a sequel. 102 Dalmatians. Of course, right. I forgot there's a sequel, which I also saw.

I believe it starts with a jailbreak. Yeah, well, there you go. I remember that Gerard Depardieu is in it. Absolutely, he is. In 101, does she at some point fall in, not tar, but I feel like she kind of gets tarred and feathered in a way. There's a sliming, which I feel like was just absolutely paramount in the 90s for a kid's movie.

It's like someone's got to get slimed. Some gross substance has to fall out of a bucket and onto the movie. You got to get gooped. You got to get gooped. Paul Giamatti in Big Little, what's it called? Big Fat Liar. Big Fat Liar. Big Fat Liar. Oh, yeah.

He's blue. Frankie Muniz. No, you're thinking of Bride Wars, Griffin. No, I'm joking. I'm combining the two. I'm combining the two. He's going off the Bride Wars. Hell yeah.

Ben, number four, The Box Office. And I feel like for some reason griffin we've discussed a lot of movies in this range because bar's attack is number eight wow uh obviously we've talked about jerry mcguire i feel like there's another movie coming up maybe like we've been in this area a lot 96 holidays big time for a tourist it had been number one the previous week ben i'm sure you were there in theaters if not big drop i mean it's actually only a 50 drop but definitely front loaded is it a steven seagal film no i mean i just think that even at this age ben you were like i'm there i don't know maybe you

caught this on video action or comedy animated oh animated oh we've talked about this because it's so weird that this came out at this time of year it's so weird that it's a christmas movie beavis and butthead take america oh yeah of course comes out the weekend before christmas so weird yeah jerry mcguire i get it mich I get it. 101 Dalmatians. Absolutely. And then Beavis and Butthead do America, which is... Right, it's do America. Yeah. And the number five movie, which has been out for two weeks, has made $21 million, but is going to hold so extraordinarily well that it will make $103 million, despite opening

to only six. Is it a best picture play is an oscar play no but it's such a huge hit that there's a sequel the next year even though it came out in december whoa it's one of those rare films with the sequel came out less than one year after the original it's not a we were discussing it's not a jim carrey no it's the revival of a genre it's a crucial moment for a genre coming back oh it's scream oh scream oh right where scream 2 comes out like 11 months later scream Scream 2 came out 11 months later. Yeah, it's crazy. Legendary performance from fellow Pasadena, California resident Shaggy.

Oh. You like zoinks. I'm the killer. Man, them choosing Will Forte and Scoob over him is. It's rude. It's actually rude. I was about to say like, this will come out later, but are we all pumped for Scoob? It's Scoob's opening day.

Oh, yeah. Oh, is that today? Oh, I got to do the Scoob, the TikTok dance. That's a real thing that's trending right now for some reason. Here's what I'll say about Scoob. I am very excited for the fact that the existence of Scoob does not feel like it will prevent me from being able to sell my Scooby-Doo pitch

one day. Hey, Griffin, you're right. This thing is going to come and go. Yes. I have a Scooby-Doo pitch that I will tell you, Kevin, when we stop recording, that David got angry at how good it is. It's so good. It's also just so, it's just devastatingly

obvious. It's just devastatingly obvious. I'm not even saying i'm some brilliant artist you are brilliant but it is also commercial obvious pitch of all time wait is it they take down harvey wine scene yeah god damn it's called hashtag me scoob damn it kevin yes that's my pitch it's called me i don't know i will say grift i don't know if you know this but i assume you do i'm told that the movie is heavy on like world building and universe hannah barbara universe shit that like dick dastardly is in it and the fucking dynamo blue falcon captain caveman yeah yeah like the and the great like the blue falcon guy is like the lead character played by mark

walberg i once again i think all of this works in my favor yeah yeah what because i just feel like people are going to be like absolutely no thanks please try again they were like we want to do an animated cinematic universe we want to treat it like marvel and work as many different hannah barbara characters into scoob and then from there be able to make eight more films with different properties. Shared universes don't work. It's an origin story, but it's also a team-up movie. Don't try and cram a shared universe down my throat in the first movie when I don't even know if I like them yet.

And it's like, get out of here. My Scooby-Doo pitch is clean. And you know who else is clean? Kevin T. Porter, the cleanest guest. t porter the cleanest i try to have good hygiene i shower every day even during this time uh you look great you sound great you're one of the best in the biz hey and people should listen all your podcasts sure oh if they want to they can they're allowed they should i insist wait they're allowed i am sad that i never got david on uh gilmore guys i didn't know that she you were such a big gilmore head i feel sad about it whenever i hear you're passing

references to asp you should have put me on this show more guys and the world is worse off for it obviously but uh i don't know we'll figure it out i know it sucks i do feel like that like all those shows did become a blank check about amy sherman paladino but except for like whatever 15 episodes about 15 movies it's like 300 something about all her my favorite thing because i am my favorite thing about gilmore guys um was that the atlantic and when i was working the like wrote an article about you guys i don't know if you remember that i think they talked to you yes kevin o'keefe kevin o'keefe yes the headline was the guys who love gilmore girls fine headline and something went wrong with social and so the atlantic's social account twitter account just tweeted the guys who love gilmore

girls with no link and no further explanation and everyone was like all right it was such a weird moment it was that's incredible that feels like yeah like a text bot or something it's just we just like go on that's amazing though i'm listening no photo uh and that's and that's you with past guest friend of the show, Demi Adesawibes. So people should listen to that if they haven't already. Oh, that's right. I know. What a great man he is. One of the greats.

And you're one of the greats. And thank you so much for being on the show, Kevin. Oh, my pleasure. I truly love you guys, love the show. I think all four of you are terrific. I'm very happy you and I got to hang out in person one time before that became illegal. I know. And the work you guys are doing on this podcast for people listening right now looking for a sense of normalcy and comfort, it is essential to some people. So

I'll be an audience surrogate and encourage you in that sense. It's good stuff. Well, thank you very much. And I do plan to file my taxes this year as an essential worker because you in that sense it's good well thank you very much and i i i do plan to file my taxes this year as an essential worker because you said that good now i want all the blankies to go out to their balconies wherever they are and the day that this comes out 8 15 eastern standard time clang together pots and pans and then shout out your favorite kinds of pie in honor of the blank check podcast. And don't finish until you've had 25 pies. Kevin, that's very nice of you. I personally will be flying a jumbo jet.

I'll just be buzzing Cincinnati that day, I've decided. Just going to give Cincinnati a fucking haircut in a dreamliner. But you're also going to be skywriting yeah but like it'll immediately just start to dissolve into the air so it'll just look like mush like that happened in front over my neighborhood you know someone sky wrote like thank you health care workers just immediately it looked like you know just i don't whatever yeah i mean skywriting is one of the most laborious things for the least payoff that we can do. Absolutely. No,

it says the text. It says who Barb? I, I love it. Uh, well, that's been our episode on Michael, a movie that very much exists.

Uh, tune in for next week when Nora does what she always does. She rebounds so fucking hard with You've Got Mail. She rebounds right back. Absolutely insane. And now Kevin has changed his background to a picture of Laura Dern crying. He's a speed rounding different Laura Dern cry face photos. It's a cavalcade.

Oh, there's Lady Gaga. She wants to get a look at us. Giving the smile. Mario Maker and Sonic. Oh, I like that. Vin Diesel, Tom Hanks Mr. Bean Kevin's rolling deep on good Zoom backgrounds

Here's another plug Why don't you Zoom Kevin You get a lot of really good visual comedy This is good because it looks like Thoreau is hugging you Oh It's actually hand down He's actually This is a super size.

I've seen that picture before. Oh, of course. Bradley Cooper is the elephant man where he just makes a funny face. You have the picture where they give the... I guess Scientology gave Tom Cruise like a medal or something and he gives this speech.

It looks like he's running for president of the Olympics. Like, it's so weird. He has this comically large medal around his neck this yes guys i need to pee so badly so thank you all for listening please remember to rate view subscribe thanks to ant for gouda for co-producing this show rachel jacobs for editing help thanks to layman coming for our theme song joe bowen pat rounds for artwork go to blankies.red.com for some real nerdy shit. Patreon.com. It's Kendall Roy. Rapping is

now the background. Patreon.com backstats blank check for blank check special features. And as always, I'm going to describe the next background. It is Ellen DeGeneres. What better way to end the episode? Famous fictional character, Nice Ellen.

Nice Ellen, my favorite fictional character, Nice Ellen. Nice Ellen, my favorite fictional character. And the quote underneath it is the message we should all take with us, because we should live how Ellen lives. Be kind to one another. Thank you. Griffin, go pee. I just want to say one thing to you, Kevin. As the CEO of Quibi, I'm going to order you just switching up

Zoom backgrounds for six minutes as a new show on Quibi. Go for Kevin. Okay. You guys ready for this? Oh, that's my girlfriend. Ben's girlfriend. Oh, I thought it was like, I don't know,

like a cosplay thing or something. Humble brand. Yeah. Could be. What if Ben's girlfriend oh i thought it was like i don't know like a cosplay thing or something yeah could be um what if ben's girlfriend was actually like a mrs doubtfire i would love that hold on one second i'm gonna go get wait can i can i tell you a fun good gossip celebrity thing please because you said mrs doubtfire and now that we're recording yeah well yeah i'm sorry make it into the episode this will make this will be real quick but my my friend nick is dating karen gillen and we were playing uh code names over zoom the other night she was she only played for a little bit and then she went into the other room to watch x factor and the whole time she was watching it she laughed like Mrs. Doubtfire

she's like and all the funny contestants on X Factor it was very sweet