Blank Check with Griffin & David - Public Enemies with Fran Hoepfner

Episode Date: July 28, 2019

Writer, Fran Hoepfner joins #thetwofriends to discuss 2009's gritty bank robber romance, Public Enemies. Together they examine the merits of the phrase dumb egg, a vaping incident, pulling a classic ���Chewbacca” and was Christian Bale nominated for David’s ‘Hard to Make the 5’ list?  [Editor's Note: Due to equipment failure the last 30 minutes of the episode were cut. Sorry for the disruption.]

I was raised on a farm in Mooresville, Indiana. My mama died when I was three. My daddy beat the hell out of me because he didn't know no better way to raise me. I like baseball, movies, good clothes, fast cars, whiskey, and podcasts. What else do you need to know? That was like the big trailer line too, right? That was like the check it out. Jenny Depp likes fast cars.

There's a couple? I feel like this trailer for me was like at the time like was like the american hustle trailer that's i thought about that well that list i also thought about the don john trailer don john trailer my baddie but this one had the boys my girls you squeeze that into any discourse you how dare you you swing it back over to the don john i'll never watch that movie in full me Me and my man can rob any bank anytime. They need to be everywhere all the time. That one and the, you want to take this ride with me?

I want to take this ride. Yes, I want to take this ride with you. You don't know how to dance. What a performance. Milwaukee. She is 90% capable of doing an English language performance in this movie. Yeah, and it's the 10% where I totally lose

everything. The 10% is a little brutal because also at the time you were like maybe this is the most facility she's ever going to have with the English language. And then the next year she's like fine. By inception she's totally capable of getting a performance in the English language. I'm not talking about accent. I'm talking about there are many lines in which you can tell she doesn't understand

the rhythm of what she's saying. And I think she was not incredibly fluent at the time they shot this movie. But did you see this thing on the Wikipedia? It's Wikipedia. Yes. It's like she trained herself to speak in a French-Canadian, Menominee, Wisconsin-Chicago accent. I'm like, who fucking trained her in that?

She doesn't sound like any person I've ever heard in the world ever. But they're saying she sounds like five different things to sort of throw you off the scent. They're like, that thing you think is her not knowing. Well, that's the Wisconsin part. I just trained with Bjork. That's who she sounds like this whole movie. Milwaki.

Then my mama and I moved to Milwaki. You are a gangster you're a gangster she does sound like pure right you nailed it yeah nailed it because then she she gets a more mellifluous kind of once she's in the nolan movies and then now now i feel like she's totally a fully capable bilingual actress here's my question what is she more like sort of uh easy to understand in big fish six years earlier yeah weirdly so maybe it's just she's trying to wrangle this weird five-part accent and she's like that's a really good point i was gonna say you know she's a lot more natural i feel like in big fish she's like billy you have to chill out you know

like it's like just you know i wouldn't say she's like that yeah what if she's hey billy you have to chill out you know like it's like just you know i wouldn't say she's like that yeah and what if she's hey billy what's up that's what she's like come on chill out albert finney's charming here's another thing let's just talk about all these other things before we start talking about the things we're supposed to talk about in the order we're supposed to talk about them in uh this weird period where it's like let's cast hollywood's most handsome symmetrical men to play you know a pug nosed flat faced J. Edgar Hoover. Uh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh I'm trying to let me find a young Hoover.

Who else has played Hoover? Well DiCaprio. Right. I was looking through some other ones. He was not leading man quality. He was not. I mean he looked better as a young man than he does when he's a bulldog. But he also looks like a very young old man in that photo. He never looked handsome.

The way that he's played here in another movie that I'm going to think of where someone else... Dylan Baker plays him in Selma. I was going through a list of them. It's like usually they just play him as like a feat, right? It's sort of this like coded kind of like, well, you know, J. Edgar Hoover, if you ever heard about him. And like, so it's just someone going like, catch the criminals, please. You know, like that.

That's quite an impression. Did he put a little hand on his hip? Just a little hand. I don't even know where he got that hand from. Where did the hand come from? I got two of these things. Tiny little hand. Who else has played?

I mean, Hoskins plays him in Nixon and is so good. Yeah. That insane scene that I think was initially deleted scene where he's like squeezing water on plants and he's so weird. I've never seen Nixon. He's good in it though? I mean, Nixon's one of my favorite movies. Interesting. I fucking love that movie so much.

Like the full crazy Oliver Stone, however long it is version, you know, four hour version or whatever. I was just looking at a list of people. Other people played him. Stephen Root played him in All the Way. Makes sense. On HBO, but McKean played him on Broadway. Yes.

Ernest Borgnine, who's the guy who you feel like should have been playing J. Edgar Hoover, did it in some shitty movie in 2000. Yeah, Blood Feud. No, did it more than once. Really? Yes. Okay. Also played him in a. Edgar Hoover. Did it in some shitty movie in 2000. Yeah, Blood Feud. No, did it more than once. Really? Yes. Okay. Also played him in a movie called Hoover.

Right, that's the one I'm thinking of. But also something called Blood Feud. You've got Pat Hingle. I mean, yeah. A bulldog of a man. Yeah. Played him in Citizen Cone, which is that James Woods is Roy Cone movie. Oh, boy.

James Woods played what? Kelsey Grammer in some play. Oh. In the Harry Shearer comical musical, Jay Edgar, exclamation point. Can I just? That sounds good. That sounds like good casting.

Wait, James Woods played both Roy Cohn and Rudy Giuliani? I'm nodding. He's slowly been moving into the Trump biopic. I mean, he's like like he's getting everyone in the circle that would just right fortunately be good right you know what i mean you know what i mean yes like even though he would be like i'm playing this man because he's an american here and you'd be like yeah whatever let's just get this on film i'm gonna run this by our guest who i won't introduce yet sure we we have a little text thread going with some of our friends mm-hmm show read

katie rich we're talking about snl stuff oh and we were saying like this this feels like a time where snl creatively could benefit from like cleaning the house doing like a hard reset like they didn't you know 80 or or uh 96 or 97 whatever it was right right? Right. And then Sims made his point, which has been haunting me for the last 10 days or whatever. I really, like, sort of, it's like Joaquin's sticking a dagger in Russell Crowe. Like, you can't shake what I said. Right, because we were like, I don't even want to see anyone play Trump.

Yeah, because there was something, who would play Trump? Beck Bennett? Like, oh, great. Right. Where's, it goes like, China. And then Sims had the point, which was,

they should bring back Tim Robinson to do Trump. I would love that. I mean, that's the only Trump I want to see. Don't do an impression. Just don't do an impression.

Just let him scream. I can't stop thinking about Tim Robinson. I was just talking to Bobby Finger about, Oh, the great Bob Finger. The great Bob Finger about the way,

he's obsessed with the way Tim Robinson says, at all. Yeah. At all. At all. Jesus. Jesus. It's so, just let him go off.

Too small a slice. Oh my God. It's too small a slice. Oh my God. He's so funny. But if it was just me. Vein popping out of his forehead. Oh my God.

Red face. Screaming nonsense. And just escalating in a way that's unpredictable. I don't want him to use proper words. I just want him to scream and escalate. I didn't get to that show for like a week. I wanted to eat a table. And just drool.

And then say live from here. What's it called? I think you should leave. I think you should leave. I didn't get to it for like a week. Imagine the hype you know like a week of

everyone I know being like it's just so funny which is like the worst thing you could do to a sweet little comedy show like that

and then I watch it and I'm like this is fucking hysterical like you know it completely met the hype have you watched his characters episode yeah

I love he's got that like old timey like gangster guy to do in the like, oh, no, I'm broke, that I think about constantly now that I'm in school. That sketch where he's trying to get them to buy the props for the gangster movie.

Black slick back hair wigs. 200 of them. They look like plastic, the meatball. They look like little, what is it, little dog turds? They smell really bad. Stanzas. bad stanzas stanzas 200 stanzas stanzas

I thought about that sketch a lot watching this movie when they finally relent and go like we'll buy 50 you gotta buy them mom oh it's not worth it

on my end when they're nice to him and then I mean that's a great yeah what's your favorite sketch um we've talked about this already

I think it it changes from week to week, but right now I'm really in on the hot dog costume. What about you? Two small slice. I mean, that one's perfect. Yeah. Because for me, it's Garfield.

He should play Trump. And we're talking about a movie today starring another man who's played Trump. Yes, and as our guest said, a movie that's also sponsored by Stan Sofodoris. The real Chicago gangster moviesta movie oh boy we brought in chicago's finest dennis farina here i am i'm back yeah here i am every time a massive ratings pop oh i can't wait thank god i think the holiday feels like a shorter movie than this movie.

No question. Is The Holiday shorter than this movie? They're like about the same. Isn't that crazy? One is like an accounting of the era of bank robbing. Two nice ladies who do a house swap. Is The Holiday 217? I believe The Holiday is 218 to this one's 220.

Incredible. 219 in chain. I mean, you saying this movie that no one remembers, this does borderline a movie that doesn't exist. Yeah. For a massive hit starring three major people, including America's favorite gangster, Johnny Depp. John Depp.

He's a gangster, all right. Here he is. I wishpp. He's a gangster, alright. I wish Jager people would round him up. I remember this coming out and being a big deal. It's just like, I didn't exist that summer. That was your summer of non-existence? Well, that was the summer I discovered recreational drinking, so I wasn't going to the movies. I was

going to people's basements. 2008. No, this was 2009. Is 2008 your big summer was 2009. 2009, yeah. Is 2008 your big summer? 2008 was my big summer. Big Griffey out of it? Yeah. Summer in the city.

What's so special about 2008 in your life? Apart from Speed Racer. Huge summer. I dropped out of college. Fuck yeah. I was living in my fleabag apartment. Sure. On the fifth floor.

Wait, it was Phoebe Waller. I lived at Phoebe Waller-Bridge, season two. It was me, hot priest. Yeah. I got a take on the priest, but it'll be too late

by the time I say it aloud. I think it's less about him being a priest and more about dating an optimist. Very hot to date an optimist. That's what I'll say. I think it's a fantastic take. Someone who thinks

that things are going to be okay versus like someone who wears a uniform. I think that's a great take. David's pointing at himself. As an optimist? I don't agree. You don't think so?

I don't think you're an optimist. Really? No. What am I? I think you are, actually. I'm thinking about it. Yeah, you are. Way in, Griffin.

You've been trying to counteract my negativity. Yeah, you're in a pessimistic mood. Well, to be fair, it's only because the world is bad. And I hate everything within it. Here he goes again. Maybe something you could do is stick it to the man and start maybe robbing some things.

Give people a reason to believe again. Can I say a thing about Hot Priest? Such a great fucking counterpoint to the fallacy that an out gay actor will never be believable having sexual chemistry with a woman on screen. Oh, yeah. Absolutely, yeah. One of those two things that keeps actors in the closet is like, they'll never buy you as an action star.

They'll never buy you romance in a woman. That's the most chemistry anyone's had on screen in a year or two. Incredible, yeah. Right? No question. Not hyperbolically. the thing about him off the charts no no i agree with you for the thing about him that shocks me is that he was introduced to me as this like truly like snivelly kind of freaky villain guy yeah and he did that for a while and like so when i'm he's being positioned to me, hey, don't you love this guy? I was afraid I'd be like, but he's, you know, he's Moriarty. Yeah.

And then instantly. I think it's so nice that he gets to have this part. Yeah. After doing all that time as Moriarty. Yeah. He's in this fucking Black Mirror episode that's just okay. But when the episode starts, you do the first episode of the second season. I do feel like I'm sitting there going like, is there some turn?

Does he turn out to be a fucking comeback? Right, exactly. Is he going to lock her in a fucking basement exactly he screams so much as moriarty that's like the thing of that character i get it your criminal mastermind it's okay okay so uh this episode's coming out in august we have our hot uh streaming tv takes from uh april and may it's not like there's more TV shows coming, right? This is it. We're going to take a break for a while, right? I heard that all the good ones have been cancelled now.

Can I throw out a prediction on the record? Yeah. I think Bosch will be cancelled by the time this comes out. Hell yeah. I think one might be able to see a pattern. I know what you're saying. We've talked about it. Winky winky.

Hey, maybe not, though. What if Bosh pulls through? Then I eat my hat and I just look like a loser. All right. So what if that's about it? It's like, well, what do you have to do if you lose? I don't know. I just look like a loser.

I just have to live in the fact that I failed at life. I think. No, I'm fine. But I predict Sneaky Pete and Bosh will both be canceled by the time this episode comes out. Read into that, whatever pattern you- Pete be sneaky. Yeah, so what does Pete steal?

All right, so we all know Pete. Like, this is the president. We all know his standard, Pete. Yeah, I know regular Pete. I know all the regular Pete. And then, like, Giovanni Ribisi just leans into the whiteboard, like, half his face is like, what do you mean, a sneak? Whereas in this, he's creepy the creep

let's say this one is called public enemies what's the podcast called blank check what's the miniseries called with Griffin and David I'm Griffin David podcast about filmographies directed to a massive success early on in their careers you see a series of blank checks make whatever crazy passion projects they want you see sometimes Get a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy

passion products they want, you see. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce, baby. Main series is called Cast the Podheek and Stone At Me. She's pod a great cast.

She's pod a great cast or pod like cast amaze. Which is awful to say. Okay. Stop saying it. I'm being targeted targeted can you take down the banner you put in our studio for pod like it's got lights electronic i got here so early to put that up and i would love to keep it there's a sky writer outside the window writing public cast this is what i do with the rutgers university's money fran hoffner here to talk chicago

big midwest big midwest yep all of it you did a lot of research on this episode i did and some Duffner. Here to talk Chicago. Here to talk Chicago. Big Midwest. Wisconsin. Big Midwest. Yep. All of it. You did a lot of research on this episode. I did. And some of it is just like inherited from my past. I encountered my past many times doing research for this.

Do you feel like Chicago, do you feel walking down the streets like this is where they breathe? Like this is sacred ground. Yeah. It's like injected into every- Any time you go by the movie theater, do you feel walking down the streets like this? This is where they breathe. Like this is, this is. Oh yeah. Yeah. It's like injected into every time you go by the movie. Did you cry? The age of crunching. David. Yeah.

And the immortal words of officer and Lewis from RoboCop. I'm a mess. Okay. You're a RoboCop. Right. I'm a mess. Yeah. And you know, people go,

oh, why don't you exercise? Why don't you eat better? Why don't you do this? Easier said than done. A difficult thing, David, is learning healthier habits. What if I told you there was a program for all your health and weight loss needs that you could use that doesn't talk in that voice that

you were just doing? It doesn't talk like this? No, no, no. Well, that would be great. Why don't you tell me? Go ahead and tell me. It's not like you have to have a training app and then have a calorie counter app and then have a meal plan app.

I got enough apps on my phone. I don't have room for five apps. Right. Noom. I need one service. Our friends at Noom. Our friends? Can combine all that into one app,

one big program. Helps you track your health, track your weight loss, track your calories, track your workouts. Can add a goal specialist who encourages you towards certain things you might want to do, like getting out of the house every day, going to see people every day, working out every day, whatever.

Battle for me. And there's this community of members that can keep you motivated and accountable it's like a workout bestie all in one place we're talking about physical stuff we're talking about psychological stuff it's not just food or not just working out habits stuff bad habits yes i don't like waking up i don't like the sun um i've been using it for well for lots of things but like tracks your food intake in a way that's not just, you need to eat this many calories a day and you eat too many.

But you put in your foods and it's like, this was kind of a bad food. This is a heavily processed thing. This was good. More of this. There's sort of green, yellow, red kind of like. We're talking about the fundamental building blocks of hashtag hot David 2019. That's right. That's what we're talking about. And it's about accountability. It's about

someone holding you accountable for how you're conducting your day-to-day life. Badly, poorly. Yeah, you actually might benefit from Noom, Griffin. Yeah, I should. Well, I only had some... It's better than that cloud that keeps following you around everywhere you go. I got a little bit of a storm cloud

following me around. Numes have a changing solution that can help users learn to develop a new relationship with food through personalized courses. It's based in psychology. It teaches you why you do the things that you do and arms you with the tools to break bad habits and replace them with better ones. If you ask them, they would say it's based on a cognitive behavioral approach. That's what they would say if you ask them point blank. That's true. Me? I'd just say it works yeah no it is great and

you don't have to change it all in one day small steps make big progress you can sign up for your trial today at noom that's n-o-o-m dot com slash check what do you have to lose? visit noom.com slash check to start your trial today

that's noom.com slash check the What do you have to lose? Visit Noom.com slash check to start your trial today. That's Noom.com slash check. The last weight loss program you'll ever need. I just came up with a tagline for them, a catchphrase. What do you have to lose other than a couple pounds? Well, there you go. You know what I'm saying? Well, there you go.

And Ben's giving me a thumbs up. So we were supposed to record this a week ago. We had to cancel because I couldn't stop having diarrhea. He couldn't stop emitting from his orifices. Oh. You were throwing up? Well, here's the thing. Some of that too? A little bit of both.

A little bit of like a push me, pull you. Salt and pepper. Yeah. Pepper. But you were already... This is one of those, huh? I guess so. That's good.

That's good. I want this. It's summer vacation. You bring this out of us, I feel. Yeah. And certainly David. You make David very... I called it, right?

David and I are pals. Yeah, we're pals. We're laughing. We like to... We're laughing. We're laughing. And when we canceled last week, then David and I went to go see Stephen Graham vehicle,

Rocketman. That's right. Oh. Stephen Graham's like, oh, fucking, you can be on my label. Amazing. David just put a pen in his mouth

to pretend it was a cigar. It's a fucking cigar, don't I? And then Bryce Dallas is like, Reggie, I'll defray your dinner in the bin. Remember that part? I'm obsessed with Bryce Dallas in this movie. They put that on the soundtrack. Her going, I'll defray your dinner in the bin.

Oh my god. Making my text notification. Reggie! So this movie is based on a book that Fran has with her today. You had done some research when we were gonna record a week ago. Did you do even more to fill in in this last week? No, I just reread some parts

that I thought were most interesting and tried to clarify some things with the movie. There are things that the movie, I feel like, leaves out that maybe would have made the movie feel more cohesive. Not even like, oh, I would have loved this to be in here because it was interesting versus this relationship needed to be clarified i don't know i get this

movie is sort of like i think man doesn't care about that at all i mean certainly not in this movie because he's not up for clarifying anything the first 20 minutes of this movie and i had not seen it since it came out in theaters i i remember liking it when it came out in theaters i was amped for it yeah it was my second biggest summer ever. So, yeah, what's 09 like? Let me think. You've fully dropped out of college at this point. Are you still living in the fleabag apartment?

No. No, I wasn't. You know, the thing that was great with the fleabag apartment was that- Is that the one where there were like four different mattresses and areas in like a living room or whatever? Right. And I lived in the living room on four mattresses stacked on top of each other. This is in New York. Okay. Three mattresses in areas in like a living room or whatever. Right, and I lived in the living room on four mattresses stacked on top of each other. Is this back in New York? This is in New York. Okay. Three mattresses maybe, stacked on top of each other

in the corner of an apartment behind a couch. But I would come home and my roommates would be having dates in my bedroom, since my bedroom was the living room. Interesting that you bring the date there. DVD and chilling. DVD and chilling.

DVD and chill. That's the aughts. We used to DVD and chill. Netflix by mail and chill. Yeah. But I was in for this movie. I saw it with a large group of people. Everyone else was kind of frustrated with it.

I was defending it. I never watched it again. I else was kind of frustrated with it. I was defending it. I never watched it again. And then I was watching it. And the first 20 minutes, I was like, fuck, do I like this more than Heat? And then I forgot that the movie just kind of like- Bounces around. Yeah. It's very all over the place.

I'll vibe with it for a while. And then I'll get totally lost with it. Yeah. There's stuff in it I love love I think the setup's amazing but this was this this book that came out this phenomenon yeah this Brian Burrow book public enemies America's greatest crime wave in the but it's like all these guys like man sort of narrowed this down to the Dillinger Dillinger but this is like Dillinger and Karpis and the Barker brothers and Bonnie and Clyde and Pretty Boy Floyd and Machine Gun Kelly. The whole early 30s Depression era crime.

Because it was this like 10 month thing where there was just like constant crimes. And there are a lot of like really interesting other ones outside. Just like the wave of kidnappings is very odd. This is like when kidnapping is big as like the new crime. In the trailer, one of the things, one of the like part of the tagline is like in the golden age of crime, which I think it's not wrong, but it's a very weird phrase to use the golden age of crime as if you're saying like the golden age of jazz. Yeah. Like you're describing crime as if it's an art form. But there is that element in this time period in that crime was also sort of this weird like performance art.

Right. Totally. Crime was entertainment. This was the first time the criminals were like celebrities who were able to use like cameras to their advantage. Totally. Yeah. And it's cameras and cars. Newsreels.

Cars. Right. You could get away. But it's also the first time that America is dealing with crime on a level that's past just like the local sheriff being like hey you i hear you shot a man in the street in the face and the guy's like well he looked at me funny and the sheriff's like this all sounds fine right feed the man to the pigs and let's move on right you know it is crazy to think like just being like alive in this time and just being like, wow, crime's really booming. All these big criminals.

Thinking of going to crime school, maybe doing a couple years of criming. I'm going to remember this for the rest of my life, being alive at a period of time where all these criminals were working together, all at the peak of their power. And also just that banks were these gigantic buildings and money was just in sacks. I think that's the thing like you were like far enough from like the old west where it was like okay things have settled down now but then like a little old westy right so then the structure starts to come in and then they're like we're gonna get back into this crime thing but now there's more money and bigger places and the having cars feels sort of like the sort of you know futuristic western i'm sort of like

is this movie steampunk but simply now um but you know what i mean yes it is this like combination punk or whatever right it's like 30s yeah i don't know well that's that's certainly i think the thing that turned people uh off most about this movie is also the thing that now holds up the best about it which is just how radical this thing looks. It looks incredible. I think it looks unbelievable. From minute one, from the whole breakout in the prison where it's all the sky, all the negative space. Yeah, shit. I think it's still-

Indiana, baby. Ten years later, it looks better. Beautiful. I say that every ten minutes. Gorgeous. Gorgeous. No, I don't like Indiana. I think it ten years later still looks better

than most digitally shot movies because now most digital movies are trying and failing to represent the look of film. And the three directors who I think have used digital the best are Soderbergh, Mann, and Fincher. Because they're the three people who are like really tech obsessed and are just like, why are we chasing film? Right, right. Like that's gone. If we're using a digital video camera make it its own thing right and i think it helps that like uh all three of those guys are like weird computer brain like detail obsessed um but this movie just the like infinite depth of field yeah and focus and they're just like shots they pull off like when they're in the car, moving

full speed and the background behind them is perfectly in focus. That's what he loves. And you see both the guys in the car and the dirt on the windshield all in focus. And this is the first one that's 100%. All did. And it feels like they've hit a new, like this is

2K or whatever it is. A new resolution standard that gives him the clarity he always wanted and uh and and more importantly the immediacy that like i feel like this book when it came out was a big deal because it was like the way these things happen with major subjects every like 10 years someone will be like i've written the new definitive book on this subject yeah and the the note they always give in the reviews is like, they somehow make it feel so current.

And present. They make it feel contemporary. Totally. And it's like a chunk book, but it reads very quickly and like very excitingly. And I think the way it's shot also heightens the general accuracy of what man is going for also.

And it's like it's not all how it actually was. It's full of sort of like little inaccuracies that like serve the narrative, which is totally fine. But the way it is shot just like heightens how true to the past man wants it to feel, which it does. The clarity of the video like makes me think about the details more yes right yeah yeah where I'm like looking at all of their outfits and you're so much more aware of the texture and the materials of the outfits

and the textures of the cars and all these sorts of things and then Michael Mann loves textures oh yeah especially like all the gunfights this must look like what it felt like to be in Chicago at that time where it's like ah go in the picture

house might see Johnny get shot in the head you know I remember seeing it in the theater just that it was so fucking loud like so loud which I loved like the machine gun was just deafening you couldn't hear anything else but I think it also works. It looks depressed. Yes.

It's not lush. It's not like sepia tone. Like this looks like a fucking like sick place. You know? Everything's kind of wasted and drawn. Right. Which is that's another thing of like owning what digital does well. That shot early on of the lady who's like take me with you and Johnny Depp's like

I mean Dillinger's like no thanks and then you just see her at the farm and you're like fuck no wonder she wants to hang out with the bank robbers Indiana that's the point where you're like does this rule

I'm like is this his masterpiece yeah right because it feels like in the first 20 minutes like it sets up like this should be Michael Mann's ultimate statement

it feels incredibly unfocused like he didn't hone in on a central story. And Michael Mann is really good when there's like one central hook. And then from there, you can put all the detail onto it.

And I feel like there are a couple things he's like going for here. But there isn't like one spine he finds. He also just loves like process and detail. And so sometimes he gets a little hung up on like, well, we got gotta include that then Dylan did this bullshit. He wants to be linear about it.

I think it's a little forced through the trees. A little bit, but I still think it's pretty great. It's a pretty beautifully made film. And when you're watching it, you're like, wow, what a movie. Here it is. Hollywood, baby. Chicago, baby. What if Michael Mann's next film was a deeply researched deeply dished uh uh that's good fact-based thank you for saying

super terse three-hour epic about the battle between second city and io i would love that i would love to see how man would would shoot Piper's Alley, which is the building that Second City is in. I'm going to keep doing this. Like, all my references are the most obvious Chicago things in the world. Like, I don't have anything for you. Okay, then that's...

The league is set there. Okay. Manzoukas. Yeah. Classic Chicago boy. Middle Chicago. Sure, yeah. Is he a Chicago boy?

No. I don't think so. Where's he from? I don't know so where's he from i don't know he's sad i listened to him like even like tj and dave could have been like old timey it's honestly kind of crazy that neither tj nor dave showed up in this because they've got like faces like guys who would have been around but that's j and dave are you kidding? Oh, come on. Whoa. I don't know what that is. Wow. Oh, like really famous, long-running Chicago two-man improv group. Possibly the two finest improvisers alive. They're way up there.

TJ does the Sonic commercials now. And Dave Pasquazi was in every season of Veep. This is the most Chicago shit I've ever heard. Yes. Okay, Veep. He's great on Veep. He plays Selena's ex-husband. Oh, yeah.

He's good. He's good. I love that guy. Christian Bale would probably play Dave, right? In the Michael Mann. I would love to see that, yeah. And then, I don't know, like Jesse Plemons would play TJ. Mann could do a lot with Plemons in general.

I was thinking Plemons would have been amazing. Well, this is also the thing with this movie is that all these guys were like 32. Yeah. And these guys just look slightly too old. And there's the argument of like, well... Depp is way too old. They lived harder in those days. They did. Sure. But he... Yeah. And these guys just look slightly too old. And there's the argument of like, well... Depp is way too old. They lived harder in those days. They did. Sure. Have you guys...

Because Depp is like 45, I think. Yeah. It's weird. Johnny Depp has a scarf on in his Wikipedia picture. What? Surprising. Oh my god, I feel so bad for him. He was cold. You think he was a chilly boy that day? I feel so bad for him. He must have lost his other four scarves right before that photo was taken.

You think a scarf? He looks so naked. He looks so bare. How old do you think Bale is when this movie is? Oh, that's a great question. 36. Yeah, I was going to say 34. 35. Wow. Look at us. I love Bale.

My favorite Bale performance That's crazy to me I think that's so weird Because I love Bale He's doing And I don't think He's a very exciting guy to like No

But he's one of my favorite actors Yeah And I think he's a lot weirder Than people give him credit for Sure But you tend to not like him very much Not dislike him Where are you getting this from?

That drives me crazy He's only gotten one Davey nomination. It's hard to make the five. Thank you for setting me up on that. He lost to Waltz for Inglourious Bastards.

He can't beat Waltz that year, right? I feel like Waltz is undeniable. Well, give us the five. Yeah, give us the five. Paul Schneider for Bright Star. Of course, your favorite.

Was that your number one movie that year? Correct. That's an incredible performance. It's a beautiful movie. Where he's like, I failed him. Yeah. I have failed him. He's such a great actor.

I love that movie. Christian Bale for Public Enemies. That's crazy. Waltz for Inglourious Bastards. Fassbender for Inglourious Bastards. Oh. I would have nominated both. Yeah, Fassbender would have made my heart.

And Peter Capaldi for In the Loop. Wow. Oh, maybe it would have been Capaldi for me. I mean, he's a threatening winner. Who are the actual, I'm trying to remember now who the actual nominees were in 2009. Let's find out. Fassbender definitely would have made my five. See, I'm saying Bale wouldn't have made my five.

That still might be my favorite Fassbender performance. In Inglourious Basterds? He's pretty phenomenal in it. Good in that. Also, Inglourious Basterds is one's pretty phenomenal in it. Good in that. Also, Inglourious Basterds is one of those movies where you could realistically fill out a five

with just Inglourious Basterds performances. Probably. Totally, yeah. Matt Damon for Invictus, which is not an interesting performance, but we've talked about how Trevor Noah said

it's the greatest South African accent he's ever seen on screen by an American. Sure. It's just not an interesting character. No, he's, you know, Mandela's like, you should be in the rugby team. And he's like, all right, sounds good.

Yeah. And then he's in it. There's that huge, huge scene where he lets his maid stay in the living room and watch TV with him. That movie. That movie is. I love Clint Eastwood and that movie sucks. Yeah, that movie is so bad it's insane.

You know, Clint Eastwood should not maybe be handed that kind of a movie with those sorts of dynamics yeah right right simple answer right sully we can wrestle with it because the faa you know and the flight attendants or whatever whatever that's stupid the float the board what are they nstc what are they called yeah eastwood can paint them the same thing twice i don't remember i've only seen sully 12 times okay all right the other nominees were woody harrelson for the messenger which is a good performance yeah definitely what i made my uh christopher plumber for the last station which is a demented nominee insane and he's also the lead

like i think he's a hundred percent fraud yeah i would say him split with uh mcavoy right because does helen you're gonna get not if you're a lead actress she does i think it was just the classic I would say him split with... McAvoy, right? Right, because does... Helen Mirren get nominated for Best Lead Actress? I think she does. That's insane. I think it was just the classic, like, just put them wherever they'll get the nomination. That's another movie that sucks, and it also feels like he got the nomination

because they were like, Christopher Plummer's about to die. We're never going to get another chance to nominate him. Right. And then he gets another win and another nomination after that. Oh, and then, you know what? This is kind of a mistake by me

because the other nominee is Stanley Tucci for The Lovely Bones, which is a bad performance. Yeah. But isn't Julie and Julia the same year? That's the same year. So maybe he should be on my list, because he's so fucking good in that. He's so fucking good in that. Tucci. I'm trying to think who else, because my number one in 2009 would have been Sugar. Then I think

Inglourious Bastards. Great movie. Then... I mean, you got A Serious Man that year. You got The Hurt Locker. Mackie would have been one of my five. Good. He's a good boy. Rafe.

Rafe for that one. I just love that part of that movie. Rafe's... Sure. Rafe's really good at Hurt Locker. Coraline. Coraline. Coraline is that year.

In the loop, like I said. Avatar, Star Trek. Funny People. Where the Wild Things Are. It's a good year. Can I say... A lot of fun. that year in the loop like I said Avatar Star Trek funny people where the wild things are it's a good year can I say a lot of fun I rewatched funny people like a week ago that movie's amazing that movie's fantastic I love your teacher's great your teacher's like one of my favorite bits from any is funny people's reputation fully rehabilitated or I don't think it is more I think it needs more that movie's So good. I mean that movie maybe it's a little too long but like that's

it's incredible. But that's also the entire value of the movie is that the movie does the exact movie you think it's gonna be well it's like now more movie. Right and then it's like an act in which the lead character doesn't know what movie he's in. Well no but it's also like into a different movie and ruin someone

else's movie. That's the thing where it's like he's not fixed FYI. Right. Like he's in. Well, it's also like into a different movie and ruin someone else's movie. That's the thing where it's like he's not fixed. FYI. Right. Like he's learned some things but it's not like he's like a good person now. Yeah.

Because that's not what happens to people. Hell yeah. It's not like Longshot where you're like why is this two hours and they're like I don't know.

No one told us to cut it down. Public enemies. John Depp. Johnny Depp. Right. What's Johnny Depp's deal at this point he's just kind of the biggest movie star in the world

yeah right like it's like the pirate sequels have come out they made a bajillion bucks right he did Finding Neverland he did Sweeney so he's gotten more Oscar nominations right this is his first after Sweeney his first movie last good Depp I was gonna say I mean I think this is his last

I mean apart from Rango if you wanna I think this is his last. I mean, apart from Rango, if you want to like. I think he's not bad. Oh, I've still never seen Rango. You would fuck with Rango. I know, I would love Rango. He isn't really what I love about Rango per se, but he's good. I also think he's really good. That's the thing.

I think he's really good in it. I'll say, I don't know if it's just like a weird like hindsight thing now. And I think he's good in this, but I see like a lot of. I think he's good in this but i see like a lot of i think he's good in this but he's not he's not great and the movie if someone was going as deeply into this character as christian bale was into his character the movie would would really be elevated right um and i see like there's this story i remember hearing uh uh it was it was actually it was when i was uh uh iconically uh portraying uh corny rob becker the performance that would define the rest of my life and the director on set was like because i i hadn't done much on camera stuff before and he was like look

it's like a weird thing and you'll like figure it out and he's like i remember having a friend who was working on uh what's eating gilbert He was telling me, this Depp guy is like, there's nothing there. It's like insane. I don't know why people say this guy's a good actor. He's going to get fired from this movie. He's like not doing anything. And then the guy went and watched The Dailies one day

and he was like, the guy's a genius. And he was like, Depp just knows exactly how to play to the camera. Like he's like, his relationship with the camera is so fucking strong. And that's a movie where he's very naturalistic, but he was like, still, if you were on set watching from the sidelines,

it didn't look like he was doing anything. It looked like he wasn't showing up to play. And Public Enemies, to me, feels a little bit like Depp is at this point where he's not, like, totally lost yet. It's not like he's phoning it in. No. But he's so aware of his tricks yeah

it's all his tricks and the tricks are effective they're i i do like him i think he's good and i think where he where it like reaches a limit is just in terms of like miscasting an age in that i just think he's too old i think it works like at the end of the movie when he's kind of broken down when he's paranoid when he's got the mustache yeah like then i buy him a little works like at the end of the movie when he's kind of broken down, when he's paranoid, when he's got the mustache. Yeah. Like then I buy him a little more. But at the beginning of the movie, he's like and everyone else around him in the group is younger than him. By and large.

Yeah. By at least five years or whatever. Right. Which makes a difference. I just think he's very effective in this. You need someone who's got the movie star energy. It is a bag of tricks performance. I think it is.

You need the movie star. You're right. You need a marquee idol. Like, it has to be. And just who's got that glow. I don't know who else could have been Dillinger. I also, it was weird to rewatch this and kind of watch it through the lens of, like,

it being about Depp's sort of, like, last ride. Essentially also, like, the public turning on depth this is the last time he looks good right yeah and he's still handsome in this movie he's still handsome but he's very handsome he's a little drawn and you can sort of see the kind of vampire depth is coming but you also feel like at this point you're like maybe he's gonna age well like yeah for sure he had not aged for so long where it was crazy, where it's like, Depp's 40, he still looks 20. And then at this point, you're like, Depp's 46, he looks like 40. 38.

Right, right. It was something to do with the fact that he drinks one cask of wine a day. Yes. Right? But, well, no. His brain is poisoned. What he does is he hires someone to drink a cask of wine and then he drinks their blood he

taps their neck yes I do think there is that kind of thing and it it's it's one of these weird things about death that we're like constantly reckoning with now as a culture where we're like oh but we always used to think like that bad boy thing was kind of cool yeah now that we

know that he's not just a bad boy but he might be a bad guy. You look back at some of the earlier stuff and you're like I was kind of fucked. You're like the whole time all those signs were there. He might be was not the most up and up guy. In the same way with Dillinger where it's like

oh my god America loves this guy's like sticking it to the banks. Yeah. Like giving it back to the people. And then like he loves his ladies and he sticks up for his guys and you're like, like real rage issues. And like.

Yeah. And then when people start dying, it's like hard to essentially like rebound back from that. And that was like the thing that I don't think they really touch on in this. But like sometime,

like maybe six months into his sort of like run, like a guy does get killed in one of their like bank robberies and dillinger like could not reckon with the fact and how that would like affect his record he's and he would just deny it vehemently because he didn't want that sort of stain on like the public image of that like robin hood persona he wanted to have and so he was like a guy didn't die that had nothing to do with me like that i'm not responsible well that's the stuff i love in the movie that i think man is really tapped into is the movie star stuff

and this whole notion of like he's this bank robber who's really obsessed with the public image and not wanting to lose the public he's like fucking lebron with his stats where he's like i gotta get eight rebounds a game like we have to do the bank robbery in this much time and you have to get this much money and they give the people back their money at the bank. They just take the bank's money. But it's like nice to women. Nice to kids. I watched this with Joanna.

And when he did that. Yeah. She was like, oh. And I'm like, yeah, that was their whole thing. Right. Yeah. Right. But also.

For the bank's money, not yours. This golden age of crime. Like the last gasps. And then you have like guys like John Ortiz coming in being like, we just do like wire transfers like we can just like you don't have to be like you're annoying now right it's like he made the fbi happen right and then right and then the fbi cracked down on all the other guys who had like good systems you know right but that this movie the whole song and dance routine is what's appealing to him though exactly because in the end of the day what does he do he steals some money from a bank right and

every time he does it it's a whole fucking thing and he has to lie low and he has to like shack up at some farmhouse yeah these people like jesus john dillinger he was like eating all the biscuits right um but um wait yeah but that's, that's why the digital's so cool because this is, like, about, like, the end of analog,

right? Yeah. You know, it's like, you know, just the old mom and pop bank robbing just doesn't do it anymore. Yeah.

You know, the outfit, they just want to, like, take 5% from every criminal transaction. That's how they'll make money. Right, that moment where Ortiz asks him,

like, how much did you make from that bank job? And he says the number with pride and artis is like we make that here every single day in a fucking office that's your biggest score ever right right um i love a shady phone route like bank room oh yeah that to me i'm like chalkboard and all the yes yes i love that that's like also that's like peaky blinder kind of stuff my favorite show my favorite show now here's the put in a siren because they're gonna talk for 20 minutes now yeah because the razor blades in their hat i'm a peaky blinders fan don't ask me why they're called peaky blinders i know why they're called i'll Blinders. I'll get you water. Thank you. All right. Okay.

Yeah. So I just wanted to point that out. Shady room. Season four of Peaky Blinders is amazing. That's all. I have to get to season four for it to be amazing? Oh, I mean, no, it's immediately good. You're saying that's the best one.

No, season four is just where it jumps the shark so fully. And Adrian Brody gives a career bad performance that becomes God tier. Same career bad for Adrian Brody. He's got some competition there, yeah. He's been in some Chinese action movies recently. Wait till you see him on Blinders. He's doing like a sort of a, like a. Who's he playing?

Like an Italian, a 1920s Italian mobster. They make him speak so much Italian. Does he overact at all in this film? Toothpick in the mouth constantly. And when you watch him watch him does he have like a pizza pie on his head or something like but then when he starts going to wearing stanzas he's got 200 stanzas they don't smell at all stacked up on his head at once um but then he starts going toe-to-toe with tom hardy who's also career best right isn't tom hardy playing like an orthodox jewish monster and they're fighting over the price of rum it's crazy he learned the word shalom that morning uh i just like this idea that peaky

blinders like hires an actor and they're like what's your actual cultural background okay and let's see the polar opposite of that is... That's what's crazy about watching Adrian Brody. Nothing tops Airstrike. Adrian Brody's face on the poster for Airstrike. I've never seen this image before, and I love it. Please, for me, find the one... There's a Chinese action epic that has Adrian Brody, Nicolas Cage, and I want to say Jackie Chan in it.

Sure. I mean, sounds good. Get that poster. Three good actors. Because it looks like Brody trying to out-cage Cage. Oh. Oh, is it this one? Is it called?

I'm sorry, it's not Cage. It's Cusack. It's Brody and Cusack. Yes, I know what you're talking about. Twitter socialist. And both of them are trying to become the new Cage of weird money laundering movies. Right, right. I believe you're right that Jackie Chan, I believe it's called Dragon Blade.

Yes, and I think he's got the and Jackie Chan. Oh, deserved. Yeah. That one's pretty wild. I'm trying to find the wildest poster. Because, I don't know. I mean, he looks silly. There's no question.

Let's see. Let's see. Oh, that's silly. It's silly. I think Cusack's the beat about that. It's not season four of Peaky Blinders, but it's silly i think it's no season four of pp blinders but it is silly cusack literally looks like why am i wearing a legionnaire costume right now you know what i mean he just looks baffled chicago legend john cusack big chicago big chicago another big he's big right he's tall right adrian brody's a queen's. Okay. You guys get everything. He went to LaGuardia.

Yeah. Okay. No one in Chicago goes to LaGuardia. Hollywood. We all go to normal schools like Newtrier, Crossback, Like the three tallest people in Hollywood all come from Chicago. Yep. Shannon, Cusack, and Hoffner. Yep.

You got it. would all come from Chicago. Yep. Shannon, Shannon, Cusack, and Hoffner. Yep. Mm-hmm. You got it. Dad! Yes, Griffin? For a lot of us, our relationship with credit cards is complicated. Tell me about it.

On Facebook, we'd go, it's complicated with credit cards. Yeah, my personal relationship with credit cards has been,

well, sort of an evolution of, started out as me being like, well, those seem like a real trouble area. I should avoid that. Then phase two is me being like, oh, I can spend. Oh, yeah. No, no. Sure.

Give me some. And then phase three being like, now I owe all this money. Right. Here's my relationship with credit cards. Phase one. I am scared of these things. I don't trust them. I don't want to engage.

I have a checking account and a debit card and that's how I'm going to live my entire life. Phase two is my father being like, Griffin, you're an adult. You should have a credit score. So I'm going to just take out a couple credit cards in your name and keep them on a shelf. I'll never use them and you'll get a credit score.

And phase three is me getting a bunch of bills because apparently those credit cards with my name on them have indiscriminately been handed out to other members of my family who feel like they can do whatever they want without consequence. But this is the point, David. Hypothetically speaking, we all have complicated relationships with credit cards. You feel like the ultimate freedom, like it did for you. It also gave you a lot of financial trouble. Yeah, some interest charges, you know, some interest charges, uh, you know, some, uh, fees that came out

of nowhere. Right. Long, terse phone calls with family members. This is the thing. I want to tell you about a new kind of credit card company. Okay. Okay. Yep.

Go ahead. I'm going to put my pedal to the metal. Okay. Talking about pedal. Ah, yes. Spelled with a T. That doesn't really line up. It's a new credit card company. A flower pedal. Yes. That. Spelled with a T. That doesn't really line up. Petal is a new credit card company. A flower petal.

Yes, that wants to help you succeed financially. It might change the way you think about credit. It's got an app that's designed to help you spend responsibly rather than just go into debt and then owe money. I mean, that sounds great. You know, this is the thing. You can qualify for higher limits. Yeah.

Doesn't mean you should always spend to that limit. No. Pedal's app lets you track your credit card spending against your own personal budget. Right. And they want to help you build your credit score. They reward you with more cash back when you pay on time. You can get 1% cash back right away

and 1.5% cash back when you make 12 on-time monthly payments. So it's kind of a credit card that's trying to, like, keep you on the straight and narrow. And we have to note that Petal is partnered with web bank member FDIC and web bank issues the Petal Visa card. We definitely have to make sure to clearly convey that. You know, it's about time. If you ask me, let me just check my watch here.

Tap, tap, tap, tap, tap. Yeah, yeah. You know what? It's about 15 minutes past the time there was a smarter, more modern credit card company that wants to help you succeed financially. Okay, so go to PetalCard.com slash check today to find out more. That's Petal with a T. Petal.

P-E-T-A-L Card dot com slash check. PetalCard.com slash check. Well, David, I'll say all of this sounded really easy, but that last part's a little stressful for me. You're telling me that I need slash himself from Guns N' Roses to write a check to put up the money for me to start an account on Pedal? I got to get a slash check? Pedal card dot com slash check.

Publark Animars. Publark Animars. Publark Animars. Jason Clarke gets John Depp out of jail. Jason Clarke as Red Hamilton. I love Jason Clarke. I love his big head. You always look at the mugshot. Not bad casting.

Not bad. Great casting. This one's pretty good. He looks the most sort of period appropriate, I think. Yeah, because he's got a potato face. I love that face. He's got a great potato face. I face i want to oh i want to touch his face so bad i love that era like the late 2000s of just where jason clark will just pop up oh i love it pop him up i love it because when i saw this i definitely did not know who like jason clark was and now to re-watch i was like oh

yeah jason clark's in here this thing's got a lot of the like i swear to god mulligan for two shots two shots bizarre that was kind of annoying, but it was before, I think, before education even came out. It had premiered at Sundance. But she was still Sally fucking Sparrow, you know? Show some respect. Best ever episode. I agree with that. That's my favorite one.

What else is Clark popping up in right around now? Let's see. He had done Brotherhood on Showtime, right? Oh, that's right. Brotherhood. With Jason Isaacs. Yeah. Good show. I think that's Rhode Island Gangsters

or something? No cable back home. The Jasons in Chicago. I never saw it, but the subway ads were great. He played the New York Fed Chief in Wall Street Money Never Sleeps. Ooh, la la.

Spoiler. About the money. It never sleeps. Don't tell me that. I haven't seen it yet. There's that movie Lawless. Oh. Remember that one? Which was Sparty. Sparty with the batteries in the money. It never sleeps. Don't tell me that. I haven't seen it yet. There's that movie Lawless. Remember that one? Hardy.

Hardy with the batteries in the pockets. That was always the thing. That was supposed to be like a big deal movie because it was announced as Ben's handing us fruit snacks. Oh my gosh.

Yes, I do need this. It was announced as what? Thank you. Because it was what? John Helko, right? Who made the proposition which was so fucking good and everyone was like

this guy's going to be a big deal director. Big, big deal. And then it was, what, John Helko, right, who made the proposition, which was so fucking good. And everyone was like, this guy's going to be a big, big, big deal director. Big, big deal. And then it was announced as Gosling and LeBeouf. Gosling, LeBeouf, Franco, and Amy Adams. Right. And then it became Chastain. Chastain. Clark Hardy, LeBeouf.

Hardy. Gary Oldman's in it. Jason Clarke. Guy Pearce playing an insane villain. A lot of faces. He's got, like, no eyebrows. I never saw it. Everyone said it would be too violent for me. Gary Oldman's in it Jason Clarke Guy Pearce playing an insane villain he's got like no I never saw it everyone said it would be

too violent for me it's somewhat violent it's mostly boring can you imagine how fucking bug nuts that set must have been

between Hardy and Leboff I can't imagine if only I was there Leboff on the up and you know Hardy coming up

you know what I mean like or i guess the buff on the downswing and hardy coming right the buffs are yeah cresting yeah that's this is when labuff uh has like not had a flop um uh right yeah i don't know why we're talking about lawless so jason clark right so jason clark is bringing johnny depp jon Depp, John Dillinger into prison. Correct. But they're doing the old Chewbacca. Yes. That's what they're doing.

He's pretending that he's the lawman. That's what they called it back then in the Midwest. That's not Chewbacca, you see? It's a Chewbacca. Real Chewbacca-like. Come on. They say a lot of come on.

Come on. Come on. Come on with the flat A's. Don't do that again. I swear to God. Mike Ditka. Is he in this movie? Mike Ditka't do that again. I swear to God. Mike Dicka. Is he in this movie? Mike Dicka is in this movie.

He plays the law. He played the bank. Yeah. Don't you rob me. I got real pressure. I like they say pinch in this movie. Pinch. Pinch.

There's a lot of good little phrases in here I love. But it's an old Chewbacca. And in fact, they've been smuggling guns into their guys. So now Stephen Dorff. Ooh, Dorff. Sexy. Good performance. Very good in this.

He's got a great face. Right. And this sort of opening, very little dialogue. The guy's taken over. It's a classic man stuff. And the viscerality of, and the immediacy of of it's the thing that Ang Lee always says about why he's so obsessed with high frame rate

where he's like I want to remove the window this movie feels like the window's gone without having to be high frame rate bullshit you guys always talk about Dark Knight

and Nolan sort of referencing a man and this opening really feels that way especially and this is the year after Dark Knight

and now he's using Nolan's guy. Oh, is he? Well, I'm saying he's using Christian Bale. Oh. Yeah. Not camera guy. He's using Dante Spadina who's his regular guy. His classic camera guy. But yes, you're correct. He's using Christian Bale in David Simms nominated performances.

Melvin Purvis. I just simply don't understand this. Can you give me your time? I mean, I think this is very good. I think it's totally fine. I think he's very good in a character that does not ask him to do a bunch. I think he's,

like, there's a couple scenes where he just blows my mind doing very little. I mean, my favorite scene, his best scene, is when he picks up

Marion Cotillard. I agree with that. Like, all that, where he just looks at the secretary. Oh, yeah. And she's like, you can't treat a woman like that and he like he's just walked in he looks at the secretary for like one second and you're like he just communicated like a fucking paragraph i think they're like walks

into the room certainly a beautiful uh economy to his performance and like he's playing like the man who was both publicly and maybe privately like epitome of the G-man, right? Where it's like, I've got no passion here. I don't want to get Dillinger because I hate him or he's my nemesis. It's my job. It's my job, right. I'm just, you know. But then Hoover is sort of weaponizing the same sort of media that's making

these gangsters into icons. I think the movie weaponized media also, though. He did a little bit. They just don't talk about that much in this. but also this movie doesn't talk about the fact that hoover came to like resent purvis because right yeah yeah yeah he like pushed him aside purpose like had this thing of not being particularly charismatic which i think like that does a good job with that this guy was like about the job he did love talking to the press right about sort of like where things were going that is where like that scene is good that's interesting conference and hoover you can tell is getting a little jealous right and

it's also he's his key is that he's so straightforward right that's his sort of magic trick with the press right doesn't he make a joke it's like how did you you know how did you come to catch uh pretty boy oh yeah in an apple orchard right they're all like another another it's a good counter to that dillinger scene we gotta talk about where dillinger's you know like doing the press conference in the jail right um but but yes this idea that like talk about pretty boy floyd okay okay hoover was using the crime busters and the g-men and making his own newsreels and all these things right making a whole making up a thing that didn't exist like he man he wanted to be the star of those narratives.

Like, I'm the Professor X of the G-Men, and I'm more important. And he resented that Purvis became his own kind of thing. Well, and he's got the chip on his shoulder about the fact that he was never really a lawman. Right. Which the senators call him out on. How many guys have you arrested? You've never arrested anyone. You've never been a cop, essentially.

But that's another thing in the first three events of this movie where I'm like, oh god you're setting up every piece so well like you're setting up every theme and then my problem is after the first 30 minutes they start setting up more and more and more everything you need for the movie is just kind of in the first 30 minutes thematically yeah of two guys right and when the book came out and they optioned it i think the idea for a while was oh we'll do some hbo miniseries which it's now the obvious thing to say, but this feels like this subject, especially if the book covers this many people is like a perfect fucking HBO show thing. It's kind of what boardwalk empire tried to do later.

Right. Yeah. In a fictionalized sort of way. Not much longer after this. Right. Yeah. A couple of years later. Right.

Uh, but, um, you see the couple of movies that man maybe could have focused on is like is it the heat cat and mouse their mirror image guys the difference between purvis and uh dillinger is it the idea of this like kind of nihilistic like ne'er-do-well robin hood who just, like, does it all for the people. Bank robber.

Yeah, sorry. He's a banker. Finding one actual human connection in the last couple months of his life. Right. Yeah. That makes him want to actually figure out how to... Is it about this whirlwind year

of just sort of, like, the rapid-fire succession of all this? It's an elegiac, like, right? It's also, it's like, this is the end of the, quote-unquote, Wild West in this regard, right? It's like this is the end of the quote-unquote Wild West in this regard. But it is one of those movies that feels like as it's going along, I am very aware that movies are not made in order. Sure.

But you're watching it and you're just like, oh, did they forget about that Crudup is in this, that Hoover's in this? Are you not doing anything else with him? Okay, but the most important character in the film, of course, is Pretty Boy Floyd played by Chantatz. Chantatz. You love to see him. You simply love to see him get shot and fall in an orchard. This feels

like Michael Mann went to his casting director, whoever it was, and was like, this is character Pretty Boy Floyd. Who's pretty right now? Like, get me a pretty boy. And she was like, this kid's Channing's popping. Yeah. The other thing was that Channing, I think, was at the beginning of his, like, I want to fight

against being a pretty boy thing. Like, get me in Soderbergh movies. Like, he's trying to work with, like, people. Let's take a look at Channing Tatum's. Is this the same year as G.I. Joe? Yep. So, A Guide to Recognizing Your Saints is 06, which is his first, like, performance where you're like, this guy

has got something. Right, and Step Up is 06, which is his first performance where you're like, this guy has got something. Right, and Step Up is 06, which is his... Right. He's good in that. It's a good guy. Yeah. And then doesn't really do much until Step Up 2, The Streets,

which is a cameo appearance, and Stop Loss, which goes nowhere. So 09, he's got Fighting, which is a pretty bad movie. Same director, Dito Montiel. Dito Montiel. But he's kind of good in it. Public Enemies for five seconds.

G.I. Joe. Dear John is 2010. That's when he starts to blow up. And by 2000, 2011 is not really a hot year for him. It's like the dilemma in The Eagle. 2012 is when it's like Haywire, 21 Jump Street, Magic Mike.

Oh, Side Effects 2013? Yeah. Gotcha. 2013 is Side Effects, This is the End, White Effects 2013? Yeah. Gotcha. 2013 is Side Effects, This is the End, White House Down, G.I. Joe 2, Don John,

Fran's favorite movie. Cameo in that one. Which plays the star of the romantic comedy. Is that right? In Don John? That he keeps seeing when he's like...

Is it like him and Hathaway? I think so. Yeah. I mean, I've seen the first seven minutes of that movie. But this is what's fascinating about him

is like 2014 is where we're like, this is it. He's the guy. Tatum's going to be the guy. He's got Foxcatcher, which he's great in.

Should have gotten the Oscar nomination. He's great. Ruffalo's good too, though. Over Carell. He should have been nominated for Best Lead.

I agree. Fat Nose Feratu. That's your joke. It's a great joke. It's a beautiful joke. and 22 Jump Street which makes plenty of money right so everyone's like

hell yeah and then instead in 2015 you got Jupiter Ascending which bombs Magic Mike Hex Excel which rules but doesn't make

a lot of money I mean does well he's so good at that but doesn't make like Magic Mike money yes he's great in it you know his cameo

in the Hateful Eight 2016 Hail Caesar he's great in it. You know, his cameo in The Hateful Eight, 2016, Hail Caesar, he's great in it. Hail Caesar, he's incredible in. Incredible.

And like, Logan Luckey is great. I still love Channing, but I feel like he's now just not in things. I don't know what the fuck happened. Well, he got divorced last year.

I feel like he's got personal life stuff that has maybe taken over. Now he's in this very public Instagram relationship with Jessie J. Really? Yeah, that's who he's dating now dang dang he has nothing in production wow well he and joseph gordon levitt have had that like buddy musical sort of like floating for probably like five years now it's not like they want to do but also he is not just gordon levitt

is like nothing they want to do guys and dolls he was not. Joseph Gordon-Levitt is like not. They want to do guys and dolls. He was Migo and Smallfoot, as we all know. Of course. But his first, his last like non-voice performance was Kingsman the Golden Circle. Uh-huh. Which he's barely in. Because he gets like knocked out five minutes in. Which, you know, he was supposed to be the fucking Pedro Pascal character. Right.

Yeah. And the 10-10 character were obviously supposed to be one character. Right. And then he had some other conflict. And so they were like, we're going to put you in a coma, split the character, he becomes the villain. And then maybe we can spin it off or whatever. But they're never going to do a third one now.

They're doing a third one. No, they are. It's a prequel. That's happening. It's a prequel. Yeah, but it's a prequel. So what, it's Mark Strong centric? No, it's set in World War I.

Ah, who cares? It's that far back? Yes. Who cares? I want it all in on mark strong i do love how where it's like with kingsman where they're like who else is like a hot british guy can we talk about pretty boy floyd's thing that he says to purpose yes because the last words are wrong and his real last words are so much better his real last words are good but i

don't know if i agree with you i think his last words in this are pretty good his real life ones were fuck you i'm going wow which is so good fuck you i'm good because they were like trying to ask him all these questions like fuck you i'm going amazing i mean i do believe i love that i love that it's one scene yeah that it's just sprinkled in as part of this, it's all over, all these movie stars, bank robber stars are dying. Right, right.

It's no fun anymore. This was in real life after Dillinger was shot, though. Right, right. Dillinger was the first big guy to go. Whereas in this, you feel the walls close in on him. It's like, by this point, I think by the time Dillinger dies,

the guys who are dead or going to be executed in jail are basically from his crew. It's like the Jason Clark, the Dorf, all these... Or Dorf's still alive, I think, but his other two guys, David Wenham and the other one, are both in jail. Yeah. Public enemies. Public enemies. Public enemies.

Public enemies. I think Babyface Nelson. Mm-hmm. I kind of vibe with that guy's energy. Played by Stephen Graham in a classic 11 out of 10 performance. I love this. He has the best Chicago accent of anyone. He has the best line in the movie. Right.

In my opinion, which is when they're at Little Bohemia Lodge up in Manitowish, which I'll talk about Manitowish later because I've been to Manitowish. Is it just going little bohemia lodge up in manitowish which i'll talk about manitowish later because i've been to manitowish um is it just going to be that you've been to manitowish whatever that is david you'll find out yeah leave me alone um he has the best can you not gang up on me um fuck off dude what am i a bank uh he has the best line in the movie where he's like trying to get them to all out, and I just want to have it verbatim. Or he just turns to the guy at the table and goes, This your wife, you egg? You dumb egg?

This your wife, you dumb egg? I love that. Oh, it's so good. Calling someone an egg. A dumb egg. We have to bring that back now. Calling people eggs. This your wife, you dumb egg.

What are you, a friggin' night egg? I love calling someone an egg, a dumb egg, implying that there are smart eggs any kind of eggs oh my god oh he's so good his accent's amazing this is only a couple years before he's gonna play al capone in um boardwalk empire which is also amazing so i like he's just got he's a british character actor who i guess someone just realized like if we could just give this guy a chicago accent he's perfect someone just realized like if we could just give this guy

a Chicago accent he's perfect like for any like old gangster movie and I before you guys got here and David got here late I was looking up

what his sort of four things on IMDb were because he's only someone because he's one of those guys in a bunch of things that I'm only just now being like okay this is all

this is all Stephen Graham but I was looking up his four IMDb things and you gotta believe that one of them is from the fifth Pirates of the Caribbean movie where we all remember he plays a character named Scrum. Yes, right. Wow, you had that.

I was like, of course, Scrum. He's in the Duck Barrel movie. So do you think Depp collects him? Depp's like, I got just the guy for you. You need a Chicago pirate? Imagine Depp collecting you. What a grim turn of affairs. Hey, David, inevitably, we can run all we want,

but Depp comes for us all. His little spindly fingers. One way or another, Depp will collect our souls. You're going to either see a good boy, or you'll see Depp when you die, and if you see Depp, you're like, fuck. He's like like you are mighty ah sweetie

let's bring him back sweetie I don't know if this I'm I'm behind on your um on your Burton episodes why is it quick breeze um but I don't know 19 movies rock em but I don't know if you guys talk about or if david mentions the time that

david and i were waiting for the subway together and there was a poster for green book and we were talking about sweeney todd sort of unrelated and david just turns me and goes what if sweeney todd was in green book like the most casual question in the world and it's ruined sweeney todd for me it's ruined green book an already bad thing for me. But I think about it constantly. He's like, Sweeney's in the back of the car. The fact, I mean, I assume the implication is it's not just someone playing Sweeney Todd, but specifically Johnny Depp.

It's like that Sweeney Todd. Right, right, right. They should have put him in some more movies. Just Sweeney? Sweeney, yeah. He's just like in The Incredible Hulk. Right, people didn't like this musical. I'll give you Hulk for you.

I'll make his throat sing. I want you bleeders. He's in like a Nancy Meyers movie, like goes on a date with Meryl Streep. I'm a barber. I heard you're a demon barber. Just a regular barber. Boys.

How about a ton of gin? David. David. David. David. Yes, what's up? It's a hot town somewhere in the city. You know what I'm saying?

It's hot outside? Yes, I'm aware. It's been brutal. It has been brutal. it has been a brutal it has been a brutal that's true and i think that people aren't talking about is new york city smells terrible right it's a stinky place i was on the subway here yeah and you know the subway had its own smell and then the doors opened yeah and a whole new smell entered from one station right it's tough and it's not like uh one is good and one is bad. They're all bad.

All the smells out there right now. All bad, all different. Very bad. And it's not an air-specific thing. Like the X-Men, all new, all different. It is like the X-Men, all new, all different. It's not an air-specific thing because I tweeted, I said you know what, I don't like it when it's this hot outside. And people said, hey, you know what, I don't like it when it's this hot outside in my

part of the world. In my neck of the woods either. Right. So I think we're dealing right now with what the scientists would call a stinky earth. It's a stinky place right now. I think it's a sticky, stinky earth right now. And it's kind of amazing how you can really solve what we're talking about.

Flutter, flutter, flutter, flutter, tweet, tweet, tweet. With just like a simple call out. Oh, lookutter. Tweet, tweet, tweet. With just like a simple color. Oh, look what just landed on my finger, David. Yeah. I held my finger out like Snow White herself and mmm, mmm, a whiff of a beautiful aroma. Why, it's a scent bird. It's a scent bird.

What I really love about scent bird, and this is their big pitch to everyone for using this service, is that you get to have a variety of different kinds of fragrances at your disposal because if you buy one bottle there's no way you're going to go through with through that in like years you're a wild horse ben you can't be tamed down you can't commit to one scent you need to rotate well no it's more that i really have respect for people who make

fragrances and for the tradition of it. Because it's a human thing that's existed for a really long time. It's so easy to poo-poo it just like you poo-poo fashion. You're like, why would you put cologne on? I already smell good. No, you smell like bad deodorant. Yeah, I know.

So class yourself up a little bit. This is the problem. Anytime I buy a bottle of cologne, it's like extremely expensive and I never use it and it just sits on my shelf gathering dust. I still haven't ran through my Michael Jordan cologne. That was 1997? It's Scentbird. I've been working on the one bottle.

They send you like a little bit of the fragrance. No, it's still real. I mean, it's a substantial amount, but like it's a practical amount for a practical price. It's almost like a little travel size. It's like a little, you know what I'm saying? It's a subscription service. They send you as much as you need per month.

You can mix up your cologne and perfume routine. You can discover new colognes and perfumes without buying an entire bottle. And they got 450 designer brands to choose from. So I discovered actually a couple of new ones. The one I'm really, really into is confessions of a rebel. What? that does sound pretty about last night yeah it's just like very elegant and it's it's masculine but it's it's

subtle i really just like it wait that is what the cologne is called well the name of the company is confessions of a rebel and the cologne is called about last night that's right i've been asking about last night tom ford makes really great stuff yes those are some of the ones i got i got some ford i just like an auteur you know you can make it my cologne look and maybe someday we'll do a tom ford miniseries and we'll cover the cologne on a bonus episode so if you're interested in pod eternal animals yeah you're interested you're interested in getting into scents and you want to maybe like explore,

try stuff out, find one that you really like, make that your signature smell, this is a way to approach that process as well. We're talking about scent bird. Yeah. I'm emphasizing the T here

because sometimes the name is difficult to hear. That's true. But scent bird, like this little birdie on my finger. Tweet, tweet, tweet. Well, they have an exclusive offer for just our listeners you can get 50 off your first month today that's only seven dollars and 50 cents for your first fragrance okay go to

scentbird.com slash check and use code check for 50 off your first month okay Okay, David, I have to correct you. This bird is not a chick, okay? No, check! Check! That's S-C-E-N-T bird dot com slash check for you to try your first clone of perfume for just $7.50. Sign on and smell amazing. What an ad break.

Oh my god. What a relaxing ad break. My eyes are wet from weeping with laughter Sweeney Sweeney so what's Public Enemies about?

they robbed some fucking banks the golden age of crime Jason Clarke Stephen Dorff David Wenham weird career

yeah definitely Bush did 9-11 I'm very tempted to just repeat my old Cotillard joke. Please do. Mike, was it glorifying? Yeah, so he meets her at a restaurant. At the Aragon Ballroom.

Sure, where Fran once saw some people. And some teens waiting for a G-Eazy. This is sort of an uptown. What I will say about a lot of this movie and a lot of the Dillinger stuff. Uptown movie? Yeah, uptown movie. Or just like east, east up.

East and up. So we're talking like East Lakeview, which is where I lived my last two years up through like. Uptown Franny Hoffs is what they're called. Uptown Franny Hoffs, yeah. Franny is like a nickname I do accept, but like you have to make that choice, you know? Yeah, it's a real one.

To call me that. Right, right. You're saying you'll never suggest it. I'll never suggest it, but I'll answer to it. What you mostly use is a nickname. Yeah, it is. And I'll answer to Francis too, but it's like, again, you got it. Francis is your full?

Full name, yeah. I didn't know Francine. How dare. Franchella. Sure. Uh-huh. No, it's Francis. Quite an uh-huh from it's francis um quite an uh-huh all right um power through this um uptown printing house i always lived like north and towards the lake because my belief in chicago

is like why would you live in the best city in america and not want to be by the giant lake that is basically an ocean new york has a river. What? Get to see the So does Chicago. We've got a river and a lake. I don't understand what you're saying. What? Boat tour? On the lake? No, it's just a big lake. You just get to look at it.

It's a big honking lake. It's a big honking lake. A lot of this Dillinger stuff does take place in Edgewater, Uptown, East Lakeview. A lot of this dillinger stuff does take place in sort of like edgewater uptown east lake view a lot of his hideouts were like i was like doing a lot of google mapsing while reading this book and it's like you go you go around chicago and it's like dillinger was here and capone was here come on enough and it's like you you don't really believe that these guys were everywhere that you hear that they are.

And then reading this book, it's like, oh, the Dillinger hideout was around the block from my last apartment I ever lived in. You know, Billy Frechette's apartment is like across the street from a different apartment I used to live in. Your landlord was a bullet. Yeah. Yeah, there it is. That's a great joke, Ben. I think that one gets 10 comedy points. 10 comedy points.

You just stole 10 comedy points. Hey. points. You just stole 10 comedy points. Hey. Hey. Your money. Your comedy points are your life. Give me the points. Yeah, right? I'm just thinking now about. This all sounds very complicated.

I feel like this. It's pretty easy to navigate city with a grid system. And the lake is to the east. So you always know where to orient yourself. I never know where I am here because there's no lake. You know? Yeah. When the numbers are going where I am here because there's no lake. You know? Yeah, when the numbers are going up, east is to the right. Yeah, but where's the lake?

There's a little lake in Central Park. Hey. It's a pond. It's actually a reservoir. When you... Everyone just went real quiet. It's the Jackie and Asa's Reservoir. Oh, my fucking God.

We could cut the air with a knife. Wow. Right now. Reached to a hole. Oh, okay. Wait a second. Fran Jules. Wait a second. Get the fuck out of here. Wait a second.

God, there's fucking jewel clouds climbing the sky right now. I just needed that to get through that moment because I felt myself sort of overcome with rage. Fran, what's your flavor? It's cucumber. Wow. All right, so bed flavor. Is that good or bad?

Bed flavor's a mint, and cucumber and mint, they feel like sister flavors, I guess. They're both for fresh. Yeah, I think they're on sort of the same level. What other can I get, though? Like, what other flavors? They got mangi.

Creme brulee. Mangi? Mangi's for children, I think. Yes. Mangi's for children. Mangi isn't a... Creme brulee's for children. What's man for children creme brulees for children what's mangy?

I don't know Ben said I went with it I was thinking I kind of want to vape in an acting role if I ever work ever like a vapor I feel like people haven't really made a lot out of like on screen vaping and you know there are nerdy vapers

of course who have the rigs I haven't really made a lot out of on-screen vaping yet. And you know, there are nerdy vapers. Of course. Who have the rigs with all the... Oh, I understand. You can control the voltage. I don't know why you're suggesting to me. I play nice, cool, super laid-back vapor. I don't understand why. I'm so sorry.

Control the voltage? What? Yeah, so you know how there's those videos where people have massive vape clouds? Yeah. Because they turn turn the voltage up so it's just cooking that oil baby have you ever thought by the time i went to go see a movie this is the choice you've made fran associated with these dinguses i went to go this is why i got the jewel because you want to be like that well yeah that's why no i just kept finding myself sort of involved with people who jewel

and I was like what if I cut out the middleman and buy my own jewel and hang out by myself oh that's really smart yeah so that's sort of that was the

the thing there what were you gonna say Griffin I'm sorry I went to go see a movie with my mom and I went to the bathroom afterwards and I had to go number two

I had to drop a Thor and Fran's upset right now I had to drop the hammer what is that Jesus but I go I go more metaphors I go metathors I had to drop a Thor. Fran's upset right now. I had to drop the hammer. What is that? Jesus. But I go-

More metaphors. I go metaphors. I do my business quickly because I'm a professional, okay? Right, right, right. You're like Dillinger. Minute 40, flat. Right. But like a minute into that minute 40,

like five unruly teens come in. Shit, sneaky boys? A couple sneaky boys. Come on, a G-Eazy concert? They were seemingly in no rush to go anywhere because they just wanted to film themselves doing vape tricks. Film themselves? Jesus.

So they were doing take after take. The fucking Stanley Kubrick of fucking vape tricks over here. Sure. Of them doing this thing. And so I'm just in the And you're like, do I leave? You were afraid to like mess with the shot is what you're saying?

You don't want to disrupt the process? There's no one else in the bathroom. These guys are doing this thing. And at a certain point, they're like, and this guy's been in the stall. They didn't say guy. Which is the nightmare.

Right. They were like, this guy's, someone's taking a shit in here. Right, right, right. Now you're in the video. So now it's been eight minutes. I'm just sitting hostage while these guys are going like,

no, no, no, man, that was whack. That was whack. New take. We got to try another take. Something like that. I think I was genuinely in there for close to 15 minutes before I was like, fuck this. They're never going to stop.

Call your mom. Right, right, right. And I opened the door, and they all looked down, and we're stifling laughter. Right. And I was like. Because at this point, you basically must have been doing your taxes in there. Right.

Like you've been in there for so long, they can't not acknowledge it. Do I do my taxes when that time comes every year at the AMC Village 7? Of course. In the bathroom? Of course. This was not that time. What movie did you see? I'm trying to remember.

But they like stifle their laugh and they look down and the one who goes, you just took a shit. And they all started laughing. And then I went, yeah, well, at least I didn't spend 10 minutes doing vape tricks. You said that?

I said it and walked out of the bath. No. My God. My gosh. That's why you're a ghost now. That was where you died. I died. Yeah.

Literally dead. Oh, shame. I'd like to give some of my comedy points to that young man. The young man who said, yo, you just took a shit? Very good joke. How many points you dabbing him? I'll throw a four. Four points for the shit man.

No, I'll throw a two. I'll throw a two because it's appropriate for the story. It might have been me seeing Moana for the second time. Jeez. So in Public Enemies, John Zellinger robs all these banks. Yes. And they bring on Melvin Purvis to go get him after, in the movie, having killed Pretty Boy Floyd. I don't know why you guys are saying this plot's complicated. Simple.

I mean, yeah, it is just a guy looking after another guy. But the thing is, the FBI doesn't really exist at this point, or plot's complicated. Simple. I mean, yeah, it is just a guy looking after another guy, but the thing is the FBI doesn't really exist at this point or it's in its inception. It's still the Bureau of Investigation. Right. And they're really bad at their jobs. So essentially for the extent of the movie

is they're just like fucking up getting Dillinger over and over again. And they haven't invented any crime fighting methods yet. No. I mean, it's like that Mulaney joke where it's like, you're just like, I got a hunch. It's like being a cop. Oh, a guy died yet. Right. And most of these. It's like that Mulaney joke where it's like, you're just like,

I got a hunch. It's like being a cop. Oh, a guy died here. Gross. Clean up that blood. No, I wrote that down in my notes. Like, that's how bad they are at their jobs.

And it's also this thing of like, well, when they're having those like congressional hearings about like why this needs to exist and they're like, how many guys have you arrested? It's like, I haven't. But it's also like

a lot of these G-men like didn't know how to fire guns right and there's also this like I mean bureaucracy on local police who do know how to fire guns and there's all these like multiple instances of like local police not

collaborating with the FBI and then both let everyone get away constantly well and that's one of these elements that you feel like would have been its own episode if this were a miniseries, which is Purvis being like, we've got to bring in Texas lawmen. Like, we need guys who know how to, like, hunt people down. And that's when you bring in

Lane, who just looks like a slab and is awesome in this movie. He's the same year as Avatar. He's so good in this movie. Yes. And he's even more just the facts than Bale. Is this his only man movie? No, and he's even more just the facts than bale it's just that he's also hardcore no because isn't he's in um manhunter oh of course of course of course yeah but like he's fucking pretty boy floyd in manhunter the most against yeah right he's playing like rita

skeeter have you seen what he looks like in manhunter which one is he in manhunter he plays the journalist oh yes yes yes. He gets lit on fire in a wheelchair. Yes, I remember. I think I just didn't put it together. No, because that doesn't look like Stephen Lang. Yes. Manhunter and Heat are the two man films I've seen besides this one. He looks like Woody Harrelson

and Cletus Kasady. Right. That's crazy to think those two men are the same man. Yes. In two different classic like he hits 50 and figures out what to look like.

Yes. I feel right. Right. Go. But the FBI just like fucks up all these different. Like I don't know like captures and like

yeah. It's like the thing. They don't do anything right until they get Dillinger. And they get Dillinger mostly by buying an informant, you know, by pressuring this. And it's that the Chicago underworld has also like sold out Dillinger because he's bringing- Yeah, the Chicago underworld is sick of him.

Right, he's bringing this infrastructure about. Yeah, but the fuck up the fuck up at the like apartment building was like maybe not quite as remarkable as that like little Bohemia fuck up which is like

disastrous in the FBI history. Is that the one where they go in for a baby face Nelson? That's the Manitouish one. Oh yeah. The apartment one

is when they go in. I love that whole sequence. The apartment building? That whole sequence is incredible. You mean where the cars it turns out like the feds are blocking themselves

or whatever, right? And just like, I think the movie almost doesn't- And then it turns out it wasn't even Dillinger at all. It was the other guy. They're like not, man's just not hammering home

how embarrassing this is. I think it kind of is. I mean, I guess it's more just, it's so, no one's ever embarrassed in a movie. It's so locked up. But that also speaks to the- Probably people calling and be like, I think that speaks to the lack of focus in the movie just it's so no one's ever embarrassed in a minute like it's it's so locked up but you know

we'll call you and be like I think that speaks to the lack of focus in the movie because it felt like it was more just like it's the cat and mouse thing right and it was just the back and forth it would feel like okay you're getting this sense of the dialogue happening between these two guys trying to outwit

each other yeah but then you have things where it's like when when Kutiar enters it's like 20 minutes of just like honeymooning like the movie becomes like the most overtly romantic thing michael man has ever done yeah with just these two movie stars like being beautiful and kissing each other a bunch then he's kind of good right it's kind of good yeah i mean i'm with her till she like says yeah milwaukee but then my mama moved us to milwaukee she gets so close in every sentence he gets apprehended goes to jail in arizona goes to jail his one dialogue scene with bail is really fucking good incredible and that's my other favorite bill i love that but that's where i think depth's amazing also yeah i think

they're both at their best there yeah when he says he's in no rush to get back to Indiana. Ooh, I love it. And then they take him to Indiana. He does that cool press conference thing. He does that press conference. And that's all real. He did that. Did everyone talk that way in those days?

Is that just the music of talking in that time? You just had to have little witticisms to end every phrase? Everyone talks like that in Chicago now yep yep uh yeah that's just that's just how it was um Lily Taylor you said is that as the sheriff she's amazing yeah and that was also like a thing where

like some other gangster killed her husband and that's where it just like she took over she took over she's like well I'm the sheriff now that's awesome and she was and she was good at it give me a movie about her I know that's cool they just don't really Taylor preferably yeah she's great and they have you'm the sheriff now. That's awesome. And she was good at it. Give me a movie about her. I know, that's cool. Starring Willie Taylor, preferably. Yeah, she's great. And they have the court case where he's got his boisterous big lawyer, Louis Piquette.

Yeah, the guy from The Wire. That guy's fucking incredible. And that's almost verbatim also. He's a real sort of like Willie Stark figure. He's like an overstuffed bratwurst. That's what I like to hear. Right? Yeah.

And that guy has played so many Irishmen. an overstuffed bratwurst like right he's just like that's what I like to hear right yeah and he that guy has played so many like Irishmen and like right like he's I love that actor what's his name

I don't know but like and then you know Depp breaks out of jail we can talk about that with the wooden gun sort of after that but then it's like

the FBI like didn't have tails on any of the people affiliated with Dillinger like they never had a tail on his lawyer who he was meeting with once a week after breaking out of jail. Just like these simple things. A few eggs.

There are a few, uh, dumb eggs, dumb eggs, you know, night eggs, dumb eggs to figure out how to do all this. And it's not that Dillinger was like amazing at this.

It's just, he was good at it. He walks into a bank, points a gun at someone leaves. That's all he can do. It's not like he's good at this. Yeah, just he was good. He's not amazing at it all. He walks into a bank, points a gun, and someone leaves. That's all he can do. It's not like he's good at this. Yeah, but he's not a genius. These guys were artists back then.

Sometimes you gotta break a couple of dumb eggs to make a dumb omelet. We forgot to mention, yes, exactly. That's the tagline to night eggs, I think. It's got a ring to it.

You're bringing dumb and night, I feel like it should be night eggs. You should break a couple of night eggs to make should break a couple night eggs to make a couple night omelets. Oh, yeah. Fuck.

All right. Thanks for letting me workshop that, guys. Yeah, just like the FBI were workshopping. Me and Grats are all there. We forgot to mention that early in the bank robbing scene where the guy dies. There's that great shot of him

being dragged along. The best shot in the whole movie. Where he's using a piece of score from Hans Zimmer's Thin Red Line score, which is bonkers. Oh, weird. Yeah. That's what you're talking about, right? Dillinger's whole, no one ever dies around

me because I'm fucking invincible thing. And then anytime anyone does die, it's another sort of... He sort of flips out. Another piece of his armor shaved off. There's something here. I mean, film has its own speed and it changes performances and that's you know they're all these like uh sort of idioms about like you know the camera uh adds 10 pounds and everything's slowed down on

film so you want to move super fat all these things and then when you put it in like a video like this i feel like all these speeds change and for whatever reason performance and uh the format on which it's being captured uh this movie gets so right uh i say as if i know from experience but it feels like it captures the moment when uh life leaves someone's eyes yes yes like that moment when he's holding the guy outside the car but also of a sudden it happens to Jason Clark. Oh my God. I love Clark in this movie

and I love when Dillinger brings Billy home and then there's that like quick shot of Jason Clark bringing some other woman in his room and it's just like

ladies if John Dillinger brings you home you go with Jason Clark. That's the guy you go in the room with. There's something about the messiness of video that's able to pick up

on those little details where when someone just shuts off it's even more start go in the room with. There's something about the messiness of video that's able to pick up on those little details where when someone just shuts off, it's even more startling. It's scary. Because the other best death scene I've ever seen is fucking Billy Lynn. Right. When Vinny D kills the guy in the tunnel.

That's an incredible scene. And you're just like, this is the only time a death scene has ever looked realistic. Right. I don't know. I've never seen that. You haven't taken the walk?

I haven't taken the walk. I love that ep, though. Oh, wow. I love that ep. Very special. More people, it's not impossible that more people listen to that episode than have watched that movie, considering it's embarrassingly low box office stakes. At least in this country.

In its proper format? As intended? Oh, in its proper format. Right in its proper format i think more people would probably listen to the podcast i agree with you so basically they have this like big fuck up in wisconsin at the like little bohemia lodge where i have not been but i have been to manitowish wisconsin because one of my closest friends worked up there for like four years and instead this was one of the places we could have had dinner when i was up there and instead i opted i will say for a restaurant called gooch's because i was like i gotta go to a place called gooch's doesn't sound like you made a bad choice um we had a great meal but my buddy was

saying he's a teacher up there and that they do take students to the little bohemian lodge every sort of year and there's still like bullet holes there and it's like totally like fully operating like airbnb not airbnb regular bnb sort of like hotel setup with bullet holes yeah in the walls they just yeah um and they did shoot it there but like that whole situation was such a fuck up because what the movie i think doesn't do a great job explaining is that they killed civilians leaving yeah that's like they they saw a car going as they were doing the stakeout and assumed it was like dillinger and co but it's like it was a hotel other people were staying there and they were all

leaving and then they like opened fire on like a car the continental breakfast bar um well steven graham's inside calling people dumb eggs they're just like opening fire on like civilians yeah no good very bad don't do it and and dillinger after that really like cannot show his face and so that's like that's it with him and billy forshett in like real life because he's just like i can't go back to you because like they're gonna tell you because they're looking for me after this whole big fuck up right right because in real life they only dated for like four months or something yeah it's like crazy short and then it's like then they did arrest her but then after that he's like oh yeah i can't go back to billy because like they've got tails on billy and so he has this new girlfriend

polly hamilton i love her and she looks so good in this movie and like why no more i wish there was more of that that polly hamilton character is interesting because she was always like i'm not dating dillinger and like honest sage in real life was like that's dillinger and then she's like are you dillinger and he's just like well and then she's like i don't think he's dillinger like and he had introduced himself as jimmy or whatever and she's like i just don't think so but that's just like wow and like never went on the record as ever like knowing like in all interviews was just sort of like no there's my boyfriend jimmy like really sort of stuck to it but like whereas didn't billy frichette sort of cash in after his death giving all these speeches being like crime does not pay example number one john

dillinger shot in the face i believe she did a touring review show like crime does not pay example number one john dillinger shot in the face i believe she did a touring review show called crime does not pay hell yeah with the dillinger family yeah um but yeah they do when they come back to her it is if they do go to the lake yeah sit out on the beach have a very deep conversation i will say everyone who's bears no david is producing a Tommy gun and loading it? David, that's not fine. They're talking about the bull. Getting really

riled. Everyone who's ever lived in Chicago has... Midwestern people don't get angry.