Blank Check with Griffin & David - Rollerball with Zach Cherry

Episode Date: April 21, 2024

Finally, we arrive at the film that helped put John McTiernan in both “director jail” and “jail jail” - the incoherent nu-metal fart that is 2002’s ROLLERBALL. Zach Cherry continues his trend of appearing on episodes covering movies that led to actual court cases, and we do our best to try to explain what happened (both on-screen and off). Why is this film set in Borat’s Kazakhstan? What was up with the extended nightvision scene? Is Griffin insane for being a Chris Kline apologist? Plus - Ben learns about the World Nomad Games of Central Asia! This episode is sponsored by: Zocdoc (zocdoc.com/check)  FieldOfGreens.com (CODE: CHECK) MUBI (mubi.com/blankcheck) Join our Patreon at patreon.com/blankcheck Follow us @blankcheckpod on Twitter and Instagram! 

Blackjack with Griffin and David Blackjack with Griffin and David Don't know what to say or to expect All you need to know is that the name of the show is Blackjack You see, Edvain knew over there, so full of himself now. He used to work in the post office. I introduced him to the proper financing, and now he owns the mines. Yes, making a fortune, keeps the miners in line, good business. You might wonder why I'm not in it myself.

I don't need to own the mines, Jonathan. Do you know why? Because I own the man who owns the mines. All he has has I have. Same with the supermarkets, the TV station, locomotive plant. I don't need a podcast because I own the men who do. Now I don't remember that happening either. Now here's why I chose that.

I watched the movie maybe 16 hours ago. I don't remember that. That's the longest one. I just want to quickly read through the other quotes on the ago and I don't know. I don't remember that. I don't remember that. That's the longest one. I just want to quickly read through the other quotes on the page because they're not many. I was excited to do a Chris Klein impression. There are no Chris Klein quotes on this page. He's too quotable.

The first quote is attributed to Chinese sports announcer. And the line is, it's simple, about as simple as using a name brand condom. Do not remember that line? I do remember that one. I remember that. Next quote, English sports announcer. And the other rules, well, the other rules are Russian and complicated. Paul Heyman.

That one I remember. Great Paul Heyman. Great Paul Heyman. There's the long John Reno monologue I just did. Yeah. Then the next quote is English sports announcer. Roller ball! Well, that's that I remember in the movie, them yelling that.

And then there's an exchange between John Renau and LL Cool J that is really my man. How are you? And then LL Cool J says, I feel like Freddy Krueger. Don't remember. I don't remember that either. Did he get remember it? But I didn't understand it. Or did he get, you know, was he subjected to mob justice as the great Freddy Krueger was? I'm sorry, Freddy Krueger, victim of the woke mind virus,

the radical left. These public school parents think they can just be judged during executioner just because he killed their children. They think they can throw him in a furnace. There should be like a wicked style re-imagining of the Friday was good. Freddy was not so bad, actually.

I feel like that was the take they tried to have on the Dracula or Haley movie that was, were they wrong? There was definitely that movie tried to do the thing of, which the original movie has of like, are they being punished for killing him outside of the law right right I always love His personal life killed 15 kids, but someone forgot to fucking file a piece of paper So he just walked free he walked free the only other quote on the page is John Reneaux's long Let's let's just rant. I'm not gonna read it the the rant about being on channel 109

Which I do remember quality. That's a little fun. I will kill you myself, I will disappear your whole family. Look, he's doing something. He is. Now, I don't know if you found this, not to jump ahead, but in the dossier that JJ put together, there is a quote from John McTiernan promoting this movie who said, I think he's the best villain I've ever had

in one of my movies. The director of Die Hard and Predator. And Predator. And basic. And you know, yeah, like Medicine Man is a better villain than this movie. A man, yeah, well, the disease, cancer. Cancer. The ultimate villain.

A man whose third best villain is Sean Connery in Hunt for Red October. Even if he- Says that he thinks Sean Renaud is beating Hans Gruber predator, the pret that's called Connery and not a Connery sort of a here. You still got Jeremy Irons or whatever. Right. Yeah, exactly. Like you still have like very good B tier villains. I would even say last action hero has two good villains in it. That's not a problem of that movie. Both ripper and a fucking Charles Dance are great. If John Renau went up against the Predator, he would win. He has the resources, he controls.

He owns the guy who owns the Predator. He would have no problem taking down the Predator. No, you're right. Well, I think it's like, John Renau is really easy to defeat. Just don't move to Central Asia and sign a deal with him. Then he really can't mess with you. The one way he'll get you is he lures you to roller ball. Right. It's reverse vampire rules. Jean Brunot is allowed to murder you as long as you accept his invitation to come to Kazakhstan. This is another thing about this movie. So this film is obviously shot in 2000, supposed to be released in 2001, comes out in 2002. Yeah.

Yeah? Yeah. We'll get into all this, but John McTiernan says, I need the film to take place in a country that no one's ever heard of. So I picked Kazakhstan, a country that only four years later will be forever tied in comedy to one character, like a country that now most people think is fake, but associate exclusively with. So you can't watch this movie and not think like very nice over and over and over again. Every time Kazakhstan comes up. They mostly say central Asia. They try not to say Kazakhstan.

I didn't even clock that. They show you central Asia. They try not to say Kazakhstan. I didn't even clock that. They show you a map. I don't even have wives. Oh, I have a big chick. King in the castle. John Reno says that at one point. My solitary social life. Griffin, what's this podcast? This is Blank Check with Griffin and David.

I'm Griffin. I'm David. It's a podcast about filmography. What is happening? The most dangerous sport in the world. Podcasting about filmography. I see. Dire The most dangerous sport in the world. Podcasting about filmography. I see. Directors who have massive success

early on in their careers and are given a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion projects they want. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they go to the roller ball, baby. Absolutely. This miniseries is called. It's called

HARD with a Vengecast. That's right. And it's discussing the films of John McTiernan. The milk has been left out and has spoiled at this point. We've talked about some bounces in our day. This is the only film that bounced someone straight to federal prison. And I want

to say right up front, it's obviously a big discussion point with this movie, it's a real reason we wanted to do McTiernan for so long, as it's arguably one of the greatest falls from grace. Even if not for incarceration, the drop off on the career is so severe. But I will say, having never seen this movie before last night, and knowing that this film eventually leads to him serving time, I don't think it was worth it. You don't think so? This is my stance. I think if you're going to go to jail for a movie, which I wouldn't time, I don't think it was worth it. You don't think so?

This is my stance. I think if you're gonna go to jail for a movie, which I wouldn't recommend. I would not recommend. This is not the movie that is worth. But the question is, is this the version that he was fighting for? Well... We can dig into it. This is what we need to dig into. No. I mean, no. No one was fighting for this.

I think he ends up in jail indirectly because of him being so terrified by how this movie turned out right I mean the whole backbone of the story is he's so convinced that there was a conspiracy to ruin this movie that leads to him being behind bars I don't think there's any version of this movie that is worth staking your freedom on movie is kneecapped from the beginning Yes from the time you cast its leads no offense to them. This is what's crazy They absolutely fucked with his movie But also in the quotes that JJ has pulled up the four worst decisions in this movie were all seemingly made by John McTernan of his own volition and he explains why and you're like that is the worst idea We're gonna talk about we're gonna talk about it We're gonna talk about it's also never worth going to jail. This is my major take I Want to say it's an overriding take first off. Let's about all prisons. Okay

No, actually I'm interested No, bring roller ball back. Actually, I'm interested in There's a roller ball roller balls the hero of this film Rollerball is problematic and this movie is presenting it to me like it's a good moral decent sport. I think roller ball is empowering Okay, I like this We'll talk about it. There's a version of roller ball. I'm ready to root for I'm not sure It's this version of rollerball this board The sport or the movie? The sport. The movie. Well, this movie I'm not rooting for.

Our guest today returned to the show. I'm going to say it. I'm going to say it. I think one of our finest working character actors. I think you have in the last couple of years elevated to being like one of the ultimate. People are thrilled whenever you show up in anything. I mean, I agree. Hey, I'll take it. You should take it all the way to the bank.

I mean, recent character work on Hollywood handbook. Well, this is the main. I mean, sexy mummy. Outstanding performance. Yeah. Yeah. Certainly my my most well-liked work. This is the second the girls could say it. I feel like you've... People stop you in the street. Hey, you sexy mummy. I feel like you've elevated to the top tier of podcast guests.

I feel like you're one of the guys who's like a Paul F. Tompkins high tide guest. Well, I'll say it again. That stops today. Okay. Well... You're gonna grind this show to a halt? Oh, big time. What I, I have heard from so many people over the last year, specifically calling out how much they love the yesterday episode. It is like seemingly the most well-liked episode we've had in a while.

And I messaged you and said like overdue to have you on again. Uh, I, here's the, here's the exact text exchange. I said, we got to have you on again if you want to do a McTiernan Cannot tell you how many people how often people spotlight the yesterday up as their favorite and then your response is I do think I had Rollerball on DVD possibly yeah. Yeah, I'm I'm now confident I did you do but like did you get it Because like someone put out a cardboard box of garbage and it was in there. So here's my history.

Returning to the show with Rollerball High. And I didn't, when you mentioned McTieran, and I was like, well, I don't want to do like Die Hard. That's too, like, that's such a perfect movie. You know, like. I love almost all of McTieran's movies. And it's true. I love his movies. And I do remember, I love almost all of the Kenan's movies. I love his movies and I do remember,

I don't remember if it was probably DVD because we were kind of post VHS for the most part at this point. This is a peak DVD movie. So I'll be honest, it was in that era of my life where I was fooled by the marketing of this is the unrated version of a film. Zach, that is important with this movie.

I was probably a freshman in high school, so I was like, hey, you know, I hadn't seen the movie, but any chance to get more violence or more nudity, I was like, I gotta at least check it out. And it probably took me $150 worth of my money to realize that it's always basically the same movie and like there's maybe 30 seconds more of footage, but in most cases, yes. Yeah, that's actually a good question. Where are the real unrated editions where it was

a thing versus like the later gimmick of like throwing one random scene? The big thing they started doing was R-rated, already raunchy comedies being released on DVD with the unrated and out of control, which very quickly it became clear, these are not scenes that were cut for extremity of content. This is, they shot a couple extra scenes specifically for the DVD.

It became such a part of the business model. Where someone like, you know, comes on a muffin or whatever. And they're like, Van Wilder is out of control! It would feel like they've literally forced scenes into the development process only for the DVD later. And oftentimes they wouldn't actually... This is another trick they would do. You'd be like, these added scenes aren't dirtier than what made the R-rated cut. And they went, yeah, but we didn't resubmit the new cut to the MPAA.

It is not rated. Right. That was always their argument. The only difference in this cut is a couple alt takes of the same dialogue. Yeah, but we didn't send it to get rated. It is unrated and out of control. Rollerball is a movie though, where this is like one of the things that McTiernan fought over is like, this is designed as a hard R, we'll dig into all of this. It's sort of neutered upon release. And then there's this last minute, like way too late attempt to salvage it by being like, we're putting the extreme shit back on the DVD. That having been said, I dug deep onto the internet last night, I was going through a lot of corners, and there was a detailed testimony I read

from someone who went to one of the early R-rated test screenings, and he was like, what I saw was much more extreme than what is ultimately on the R rated DVD. Yeah at the end of the day they just put in some boobs and what a couple like bloody hits. Yeah. Maybe that's it right. Like there's boobs than there were originally possibly. Is so I don't know what version I even watched yesterday. I watched it on 2B. Okay. So is that the unrated version or is that the theatrical version? I watched it on iTunes. What seems to be on iTunes is the only option is now what was on the unrated DVD.

I believe you probably also saw the big way to tell mostly what's around these days. The locker room scene. Yes. If you see boobs, there was nudity. It's the R rated version. And when it was released in theaters, they CGI tank tops onto them. It is one of those movies where they like painted black tank tops. So that's the one clear tell of which version you're watching. I think the theatrical version basically is no longer in circulation.

I do like who would want it. I mean, I would love to see it. Well, I'm sure you could find it somewhere. At the very least, you could buy a DVD. I have another 47 hours on it. It also was skipping kind of in moments. Like this is poorly edited, right? What are you talking about? What do you mean? Okay, sorry.

There were no technical meddling. This is wet off of McTiernan's own editing table. It's a pure cut. A consistent vision. I try to, you know, look, I don't want to fall into hyperbole with every movie covered on the show. This might be the most incoherent film we've ever discussed. I don't know if it's the worst.

Look, I'll say it's not incoherent in that, like, it follows the formula of films that are coherent. Yes. Guy takes job, sports, turns out to be bad and rigged, rebels. Yes. Okay?

Like, that happens in the film. Agreed. Right? That is the plot of the film. But the only way you understand that that. Like that happens in the film. Agreed. Right. That is the plot of the film. But the only way you understand that that's what's happening in the film is... You're having seen other films. And you're relating and you're like, I guess this must be them attempting to do that kind

of scene. It only works by association of more functional movies. Have you seen the original Rollerball with James Bond? No, I haven't. So in that film, which I have seen, which is, in my opinion, not a masterpiece, but is both the functional film and a fairly influential one in its way. And is on paper the exact perfect kind of movie to remake 30 years later, 25 years later, where you're like, this is a movie with incredible concept, some incredible iconography.

It doesn't totally nail the execution. But in the original movie, the sport of rollerball makes sense. It is. And by the way, those sequences are thrilling to watch. They're really cool. It's way simpler. There's no like ramp and tunnel. No. There's no, none of that like business. It's just like a bicycle track. It's just a ring. A lot of simple master shots where you can... It's basically roller derby with motorcycles.

The game is legible. It's roller derby with motorcycles and like bocce ball. Yeah, I throw a ball at a thing. I mean, like in roller derby, there's no ball, but like it's the same basic concept. You're just trying to knock people over. Jousting roller. It's a combination of all stuff. But you're like, I get it. You watch it immediately.

This movie has a sequence in which Paul Heyman is explaining the rules to you in detail accompanied by a CGI graphics meaning to explaining the rules to you in detail, accompanied by a CGI graphic, meaning to illustrate the rules of the game, and it doesn't make sense as they're taking the time to stop and show it to you. I want to say, I really liked that part. And I'd like to make any sense. I think it's maybe the best scene in the movie. I don't say that.

As I was watching, I was taking notes and I was marking time codes as to when I thought this was still an incredible, brilliant movie. I got to about 38 minutes in before it started to show cracks for me. A couple hairline fractures. Yeah. But the quote we talked about where he says the rest of the rules are in Russian and they're complicated, we're not getting into it. That's all I needed to hear. Cause then I know, I don't need to worry about what the rules are.

I think they may have made a mistake in even trying to give us any rules. I agree. Because what he does, he's like, all right, here are the rules. Then he says 80 rules. And then he's like, the rest of the rules. I'm like, how can there be more rules?

I believe he also does double back. He's like, okay, you got to do two laps. And then he's like, but first. Yes, he does do that. He's like, but first you got to go through the tunnel. Go through the fucking tunnel. Why are these rules out of order? Which we only see the tunnel happen one time,

I think, in the entire film. They do it right away, and then they never talk about the tunnel again. And he makes it sound like, and it is hard to get to the tunnel. Chris Klein goes in that tunnel. He walks into that tunnel. Like, it's the easiest shit in the world

That makes it feel to me like this is a real sport and that someone was like those are the rules We have to include the tunnel because all the fans of real rollerball will be upset If our movie doesn't make it The legacy fans are like where's the tunnel? There's no tunnel in the original But I feel like this is the point you were trying to make The cold open of the original rollerball film is just a game happening that you watch for basically 15 minutes uninterrupted where they do not stop to explain the rules to you. And you're like, I think I get this. It is all just communicated through action. Right. And you're like, I

think I get this. And also, this is really exciting to watch. And this movie like does not drop you dead into the middle of it. It tries to ease you into it and is infinitely more confusing. I love being explained the rules of something fictional. David loves rules. I love fictional sports. When I get an NBA 2K game, one of those games, I don't play basketball on it. I mean, we go to create league and then I'm like, all right, we're moving the rockets to fucking Omaha. I just start messing with it.

The new tutorial just arrived in the mail tutorial. I mean, that's what I call NBA. Like I am all in if this guy is like, okay, this is the Uzbekistan rough riders. You know, they have a clown, a devil, a chain guy. I'm like, yes, that's what I want. Instead, it's just like he starts explaining things 50 times and cuts himself off in the middle being like, I don't know, man, don't worry about it, okay? Like it's, they don't even have the guts to really tell us how it works. They know their audience and their audience is not you.

They're like dumb-dumbs who are like, have an attention span that will last 15 seconds. I think you need to see it as they do have the guts to not explain it. Sure. Because the audience is smart. They can figure it out themselves. If you ask me, this movie is a direct spiritual precursor

to Fury Road. Wow. And essentially lays the groundwork. In that motorcycles aren't where they should be? You mean like that kind of a vibe? Yeah, and there's like some shredding guitar at moments where you weren't expecting it. There's like a guy carrying a little puppet, you know, there's just a lot going on. It's like new metal. Yes. Jerry. Like it's like, what is the movie?

Pink in the movie. Yeah. They must have right away been like if they're not don't sign on, cancel the film. Well, they are the first phone call we make. Executive consultants. I remember Griffin. So I was 16 when this came out. I was about to. I was 15. Yeah, I was 13. And yeah, this was like it was like John McTiernan is remaking Rollerball with Chris

Klein and I was like, those first two things sound good to me. And I probably wasn't anti Chris Klein at this point. I don't know if I was like crazy for him. I think we have to place ourselves in that day, which is at that moment, Chris Klein had a very good comedy career. He had done election and two American Pie movies. And that's basically like a two out of three bad situation. And you're like, it's not like but who walks out of American Pie being like,

you know, who's fucking splitting my side? Just that client fella. I agree. He's great in election. Yes. And look, this is not a totally fair comparison, but you're like, no one thought Bradley Cooper was going to go from the hangover to American Sniper. You could see them just being like, this guy undeniably looks like a leading man. He can hold the camera.

He's given three good comedy performances. Maybe this guy can move lateral. It wasn't until they tried it. No, because he's a face. Yeah, he's like a guy you could be Superman. It wasn't until they tried it that it became so apparent, no, he is good at playing one thing and one thing only. He can play like a hayseed, like a hot hick.

He can play affable doofus. Yeah. This was like his first pivot away from... Yes. His first action film. Right. He did We Were Soldiers in the same year where he's one of the, you know, soldiers. Right.

Not like a lead character. Which is like his first drama. I mean, 202 is him trying to step out of teen comedy, high school comedy for the first time? And face planting, basically. Yeah, because then after that, who is he in Just Friends? Is he like— He's really good in Just Friends. Is he really good in it?

David, he is. I feel the need to defend this because— Because I haven't seen Just Friends, or if I have, I don't remember. No, Just Friends, you're like— Right. That's the Ryan Reynolds movie I remember. He plays the— Ryan Reynolds is so caught up in not seeming like the sensitive friend zoned guy he was in high school and trying to

be an aloof asshole to Amy Smart. And Chris Klein plays the super emotional sweetie pie guy that she starts falling for who Ryan Reynolds hates. And he plays like the parody of a soft boy. I think he's good. And it sounds like something he'd be good at. Right. I'm like American Pie won election. Just Friends.

I'm like, those are three perfectly cast Chris Klein uses. Have you seen Street Fighter, the legend of Chun Chun Chun Li? I have not. Is he in that? So he plays. Have you played Street Fighter games? Yeah. You're familiar. So, you know, that game is... That movie is like, all right, there's less about street fighting, more about, like, cops trying to bust up,

like, a ninja ring. Okay, interesting. And Kristen Kreik... Everyone wants... Everyone's complaint about Street Fighter is that it's too colorful and fun. What if we ground this in hard reality and no one really fights? So Kristen Craig, Lana Lang herself plays Chun-Li

as like a sort of like undercover spy trying to figure out the shady dealings of M. Bison who's like a businessman. And Chris Cline plays Charlie, the Street Fighter character Charlie, as a cop, like an Interpol agent. And it is, I think universally agreed to be the worst performance ever given in. Right. And there was a viral video that went around

that just is a super cut of every line he speaks in the film. And it's, it's devastating to watch. It's so tough. I got to check it out. Cause it's just him being like, well, I guess this is a case for us. Like it's like stuff like that. We're like, no, no, they surely like this isn't from the film Right, like have you seen it the supercut? No, have you seen Chun Li? Street fighter the legend of Chun Li. No Would we watch it Griff if we did Street Fighter is a patreon commentary series We have to wait for there to be a third one

I have referred to this line many times over the course of the show and I want to properly credit and read it properly Cuz watching roll it ball I was like I need to get this line dead to rights correct and give it proper credit Alonso Duralde writing a review for the Today Show at the time on Today Show's website it didn't even air has the line I can't remember the last time I watched an actor fail to walk into a room convincingly, but Klein does it. Look for a YouTube montage of his Street Fighter performance

to pop up any day now, which is what happened. But I just think about that all the time. Last time I watched an actor fail to walk into a room convincingly. Now I will say his Street Fighter performance feels like a years later overcorrection for a feeling that he wasn't tough enough in rollerball. Right. Like it feels like he's like, fuck, I seemed a little too corn fed and rollerball.

I need a chip on my shoulder. I'm going like full Clint Eastwood and that movie is him slick back hair, leather jacket being like, give me the beat. Sounds like Bison's behind this. It's like, what is this? He's Lucas Lee from Scott Pilgrim. Yeah, that's what he's doing the whole time. Whereas, you're right, in this, he barely like, registers as a guy.

No, it is... this is the thing. Street Fighter is such a big swing that I think became such a black mark on his career. And it was like that, followed by the Mamma Mia audition video leaking out, turned him into just like definitive punchline. This you're like, I don't think he did anything wrong. I know. He's not great. I think he was horribly cast. It is astonishing how little he registers as the lead character of the movie.

There's also not much to the character. That's what I was like. Jonathan. Right. Remember at the end when they're like, and now the most famous rollerball player, Jonathan. Jonathan. Jonathan. Jonathan. Yeah. Well, let's properly credit his full name.

Why isn't he called like Ripcorder? So, you know, why didn't they give him a name? Jonathan E. I mean, Jonathan Cross, of course, is the character's name. But like, if you're doing pro wrestling, which is what they're doing, why isn't he called like fucking stars and stripes

or whatever? His character also is like, not really coherent to me in that. Oh, no. He's a man who was almost like NHL level hockey player, but who is also into like X game style. Into like street luge. Right. Which to me, it's like if you're a hockey player, you start so young and you dedicate, you know, like.

And you're from like Saskatchewan. Right. And you like skate on a pond. But he would like also had Triple X. Like, yes, but you gotta go full Triple X. This is the year before Triple X, which is wild, because it basically has the same opening. Yes, yes.

It is wild and it isn't. Like, it's, those movies are tapping into what they sense in the atmosphere. Right. They just didn just did far enough in roller Triple X was a big hit that no one liked right that absolutely Triple X 3 I will stand for all day and all night But we should do all three triple X's with Zack we should just watch I'm into it I like first one. I like to like the third one. I've never seen the second one.

Two is wild. The second one is wild. I will say that. I have seen the second one. The second one is a... It's like an out of breath Ice Cube running from like Bulgarian parking lot to Bulgarian parking lot. It's like a Washington DC political thriller. And it's like the weirdest supporting cast. Ice Cube, it's like he didn't even like really hit a treadmill. He's just like right from are we there yet? Yeah, he's just like yeah, give me a fucking sub machine gun. I'll run around.

And after the first movie is like this is the most extreme guy you've ever met. Right, this guy like snowboards to like get breakfast or whatever. He's got 80 abs. Commutes on a hang glider. The report 3 does the same thing of like, right, this guy is addicted to thrills, he's doing the most extreme shit all the time, but this is the end, like the end all be all for him is living this way.

This movie opens with Chris Klein street loosing for 10 minutes. If you want to break into the NHL, which I think he does, right? This is my point. Like what if I go to my manager and I'm like, yeah, so I need, you know, Ottawa senators get back to me. No, they're thinking about it. Okay, I'm going to do street loosing. Don't get hit by a car, buddy.

Or arrested. The cops are chasing you. This movie has two different character setups happening simultaneously and they can't pick which one it is because one is either he's Xander Cage. This guy lives through the thrill, but the cops are always on his back but Then he would want to play role exactly Because I know there's a foreign country where you can play a sport that's so extreme and they'll pay you for it make you Famous and he's like I'm in the other version of it is guy who's always this close Right and it's like I think this year I'm finally gonna to make it. LL Cool J is like, look,

dude, let's face facts. You're not making it. If you want to be an athlete, there's only one option left. Now the sports a little dangerous. I know you're not a thrill seeker. You wanted to play legit sports, but if you come over here, you'll have a career. You've always wanted to be a goaltender, but how do you feel about roller skating in, in a rejected American gladiator ring while I ride a motorcycle next to you? This movie is doing both at the same time. It tries to argue that this guy is so close. What am I being paid in? You're being paid in a COPEX? You're being paid in fake currency? This movie's trying to argue that he's like one hair away from making the Mighty Docs,

but also he lives for the thrill of death. Let's look up. The Tenge is the Kazakhstan currency. So now you could make this movie and it's like they're on a fucking island in the North Pole and they're being paid in Bitcoin or whatever. Like we're ready for rollerball to be attempted again, I think. I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Here's a thing that's kind of a mind blower. We're now almost at the distance from McTiernan's rollerball that McTiernan's rollerball was from Norman Jewison's rollerball

That makes sense. Yeah, this is ready. This movie is 22 years old. It's like right katas every Ball goes dormant and David yes ants ants aunts They just re-surf. Roller ball ghost dormant and... Ah, David. Yes? Ants. Ants? Ants.

Ants, ants, ants, ants. Ants, ants, ants, ants. Ah, I hate getting cornered by them. We all do. I knew that was going to be a relatable conversation starter. Why aren't you getting married? What's going on with that promotion? Why haven't you moved out of Mom and Dad's basement, Griffin?

Oh, those were directed at me? I thought they were. Apparently. Oh, now I feel attacked. Get out of the basement, Griffin. She doesn't listen. She just judges, judges, judges. You know, you're getting together with your family.

You might have to be in a barrage with these kinds of questions. Stay in there and grin and bear it. I don't want you feeling that way when you talk to your doctor about like a weird rash Or that you eat pizza went too many times a week or something else unfortunately We have read for filth by this head copy right now Unfortunately the twist to this riddle is that the doctor is my aunt But other people might have another I can't treat this patient Yeah

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Then find and book a top rated doctor today. That's zocdoc.com slash check, zocdoc.com slash check. You can get an appointment like 24 to 72 hours. Or in the middle 48 hours in Ulti Murphy, which I accidentally said is Ulti Murray twice. Now I have a question about timeline because I haven't seen the first film, but I looked it up and it was made in what, 70?

75. 75, but it was set in 2005. It was set in the future. Zach. Now this roller ball was set. It was set in the future Zach now this rollerball Was that in 2018 to be clear was set only a few years after it was shot They pulled the in the near future with it Yes, guess whose decision that was John McTiernan the man who claims they sabotaged his movie All right, okay, that was interesting and I also I don't know if it really qualifies as a sci-fi

Like agree the movie that we watch. The first one really is. The first movie is more of a dystopian film. It's set in the future, the world is run by businesses. This is just like, yeah, it's like two years later and it's in Kazakhstan. It's not really science fiction. The first one, and this is the thing, like the first one has a lot of issues, right? But you're like, the actual, the sequences sequences of rollerball are undeniably thrilling.

So same for this one. James Cosh perfectly, so far one to one, perfect leading man, perfectly cast. No comment. Right. Not a one to one there, maybe. Yeah. But it's in like it's ahead of like sort of Robocop. It's it's I would argue very aligned with The Purge, where the argument, the sort of world of the movie is that, like, we have let big business take over society. We have our, like, quote-unquote, benevolent corporate oligarchs who run everything, and they've basically created, like, world peace, they've eradicated war, everything is civil and hermetic and clean, and Roller Ball is basically the purge televised. It's the one place where aggression is let out

in society. It's sort of like the equivalent of public executions where people watch this sport, where people get thrown into this, you know, bloody mash and try to survive. But it's like, this is where the cultural anger, frustration, violence gets released. And when they set out to remake this movie, they were like, look, it's even more, there's a way to evolve this. And McTiernan went, no, no, no, no, no, just put it in a weird country. Yeah, we lost a little bit of that. I crack open this dossier, assuming I'm going to read, MGM refused to pay to set it in the future. Studio said it was less relatable if it was in the future.

They were ready to go with this movie takes place in the future, it's a collapsed society. If I can shout out one of my favorite movies of recent years, Alita Battle Angel. Which does roller ball basically. Basically they, which is a futuristic film obviously. Have you danced with Alita? Yes, yes, I loved Alita.

It rolls. I believe it's called Murderball. No, that's an actual sport. I forget what it is. Whatever the roller ball thing they play, that's awesome. And those sequences are great. Highlight of the movie. Right, and it's like underlining all of the,

here's what's happened to society stuff. Motorball. Motorball, right, right. Murderball, of course, is paraplegic basketball that is played in and is crazier than any of the sports we are discussing. Yes. So, okay. Yes. 1975, Norman Jewison is a follow up to Fiddler on the Roof and Jesus Christ Superstar made a movie called Rollerball. It is so bizarre that he made this. It's information that pops out of my head because it doesn't fit. Back in the day, it was like, do a sci-fi every so often.

Those were hot, especially in the 70s. And it was also a talent sci-fi in a way that was a little rare. James Kahn, like three years after Guy. My father, he was big deal. Pre-Star Wars, it's kind of interesting that this was such a major movie from people at a major point in their career.

And the film does well. JJ could not verify the final growth. It was a success. But it was a success. Yeah. It had sort of a cult following that lingered for a while. Like, that movie's got interesting ideas. That movie's kind of effective.

So this is interesting that MGM at some point owns United Artists, who made the original world. They buy United Artists. They buy it in the 80s. Yeah. And at some point in the 90s, they're like, we should do video games with our properties. GoldenEye, the Nintendo 64 game, is there one unqualified success from that initiative?

But it makes perfect sense. MGM is buying you a, the way we watch all the time now when these companies buy other companies and immediately go what IP to exploit, they go, what are the three properties we have that are best suited for a video game? James Bond? Check. Rocky? Check. Rocky and Rollerball are the other two. And then Rollerball is the third one. And people, I think, went, Rollerball,

that's weird to be included. But you know what? You're right. That movie does feel like it's built to be a video game. But they eventually abandon it and decide, let's do a movie. Right. It seems like the process of them considering it for a video game made them realize, why wouldn't we just make a new movie? John McTiernan had just remade a Norman Jewison United Artists film, The Thomas Crown Affair.

Yes, 13th Warrior comes out after it, but he made that before it. In the timeline of his career, yes. And they liked that movie. Do you like that movie? Pierce Brosnan, Stealing Art? Haven't seen that one liked that movie. Do you like that movie? Pierce Brosnan, Steel and Art? Haven't seen that one. Gentlemen Criminals?

Do you like A Gentlemen Criminal? Sounds right up my alley. You'll like it. It's a wonderful film, but it's classic Hollywood thinking of, we just worked with this director who did a good job remaking a different director's movie. Why wouldn't we rehire him to do a different remake

of that previous director's other film? At that point, yes, he had made two kind of like bizarre flops, Last Action Hero and The Thirteenth Warrior. But neither of them are, I think, fiascos in the way this movie, I mean, nothing is a fiasco in the way this movie is. So they can kind of hand wave it with like, look, man, he did Die Hard with a Vengeance. That rocked. He did Thomas Crown.

That was so successful. I think Last Action Hero is seen as like, classic studio excess. Schwarzenegger, people were sick of him. That's the other thing. I think it gets pinned more on this Schwarzenegger's folly. I think at the time of that movie,

it's pinned on Arnie. I think 13th Warrior, they're like, well that whole thing just went pear shaped. And then, fucking Thomas Crown was one of those movies that like gets someone back in good standing. they were like this shouldn't have worked. He made a solid hit late summer for grownups. And McJernan is like, that's my favorite movie that I've made since Hunfer at October. I wanted to make an adult love story. MGM let me.

And so I love MGM. Like I'll do anything. Says a lot of movies are radio plays with visual aids, the way television used to be. Rollerball is entirely visual, completely different from anything I've done before. You made Die Hard. What are you talking about? All of the quotes that JJ has pulled up. Some fucking black box theater director. They're temporary and he keeps making these statements that are incompatible

with someone who has directed Die Hard and Predator. He says that we've counted the number of shots in the film It's nearly 9,000 clock or garnish only has 470 He said two things about that one Stanley Kubrick does long takes everybody knows that to Am I supposed to be like excited that it has 9,000 shot? That doesn't sound good in terms of dollar per shot These shots are cheap also here's a complaint I have about this movie right off the dome. Too many shots. Yeah definitely would be my first note. Found it disorienting and hard to follow. It's just like I'm like I'm launching a

new restaurant. Oh okay what's your vibe? I'm like so many restaurants only have 50 menu items. I'm doing 5,000 right off the bat. You can't get anything here. There will be like 30 second dialogue scenes in this movie that I swear have 29 cuts. And the cuts are between angles that are two degrees off from each other. Okay, I feel like it works for about the first 30 minutes. Look, I agree with you that for the first 30 minutes, it's not like I'm like, this is great.

But I am following what's going on. I'm having fun. I'm going, okay, I kind of see what they're going for. And then it goes and then I go, oh, they're not going for what I thought they were going for. Basically, the broadcast is great. That's the broadcast version. The best idea. Yes. You know, is like this is pro wrestling plus roller derby plus motorcycles. The graphics and the aesthetics are fantastic.

It also seemed like that was the only part of the movie where they kept the original idea of like, you're getting those sponsored reads in the middle of it, like, oh, this is a capitalism thing. That almost completely goes away, like that specific critique for the rest of the movie. There's this thing of like McTiernan, I mean, we're getting to this, but like McTiernan being like, you don't need to set this in the future. That's like a distancing effect for the audience. We're already close enough to the society where this would happen. Just set it in a country that's less advanced than us in a way that feels weirdly xenophobic.

Yeah, or reductive. Yes. Yes. I mean, I don't. Yes. Reductive. Yes. I mean, I don't think I'll see if this comes up. I don't think McTiernan went to Kazakhstan and spent a month there being like, let me really soak it up here. Like, what's going on here? What is the culture?

His line of thinking was like, he's just like, I don't know, those animals will watch anything. Set it as some lawless country that no one cares about was basically his line of thinking. Which, I mean, is also pretty much what led Borat to be, you know, like. Borat is 100% just them being like, let's just find a country with a funny name. People have no cultural associations with this place. It's just a name that they vaguely heard. They'll believe anything we tell them.

We need to introduce a figure who was important as much as you're going to regret it. Harry Knowles is very important at various steps of the legacy of this movie. This film is also being developed at the peak of his power, of his influence over the movie. You know who Harry Knowles is, obviously. I know none of the context around this movie, to the point where when I told Griffin I wanted to do it, then I texted him like two days later going, Holy shit, I just looked at the Wikipedia. What Pandora's box am I open?

I didn't know there was prison involved. You were thinking like, oh, rollerball. That's like a piece of junk that we can have some fun chatting about. Yeah, I just remember it was some crazy, you know, over the top movie. And then Zach texted me, I just got to the controversy section of the Wikipedia page. So I also know nothing about what we're about to learn here. If you think about it, like 2000, right, post Phantom Menace, Harry Knowles is king of the nerds in the internet 1.0. 98 and 99 are Batman and Robin and Phantom Menace,

which are the two movies where studios start to step back and going, is this guy actually having an effect on the reaction to these movies? Right, is him like bad-mouthing our scripts as he gets limb-linked, bad-mouthing the movies when they come out, like actually depressing interest in these films? Are people actually looking to this guy, Isabelle Weather? Now the answer now, I could go and tell them is,

no, The Phantom Menace was hugely successful and Batman and Robin didn't do well because it wasn't what the culture wanted at the time. Like, you know, I actually enjoy things about that film, but, you know, it was not meeting the culture. Yes. Right. But he basically was a one man Twitter at that point, where it was like the industry looking online and being like, people are making fun of us.

But beyond that, are we not in on the show? So like Rollerball, that's a sci-fi film. That's where he's going to flex his power the most. I mean, he was such a big, like, 70s genre guy, and this is an era where things are getting remade all the time, that I feel like he was a guy where Blank Studios announces remake of Blank starring Blank. He would just do the all caps, fuck you, don't do this, then would write a soliloquy acting like Rollerball was the greatest American film of all time.

There was a lot of that shit of him being like, don't touch my classics. But not with Rollerball. The thing is, he gets his hand on the first script for this remake written by David C. Wilson. And that film was set in a post-apocalyptic future. That film was not doing what this movie, that script was set in the future. There will be potential remakes that are floating around. He'll get the script early.

He will bad mouth the script so hard on his site that they're like, hard reset, back to development, movie canceled. If he gives us a bad review of the first draft, we're done. He says in every single facet, the scripts are an improvement on the original. In every single facet? Well, very different script than what we saw in Star Wars.

Right. And I actually tried to hunt around for it. I have not been able to find it. It doesn't seem to be viewable. No. It sounds like a fairly hard sci-fi script, though. Yes. It's set in this, like, mega corporate, like, post-apocalyptic future. There are no books anymore.

Everything is visual. Like, it books anymore. Everything is visual. Like, it sounds cool. It sounds cool. I mean, Turen comes on and he's like, boring Kazakhstan. Yeah. Like genuinely. Yeah. Right.

And then they're like, well, who do you want, like, for the, like, who's the modern day James Kahn? And his response is, I think it should be some goofy, deeply uncool simpleton. He basically says he picks Chris Klein because Chris Klein feels like Jimmy Stewart Not the guy who would be in an action movie. So you're just like wait a second. They had him a script That's like hey, this is tailor-made for any of the great current action stars and it's set in a cool post-apocalyptic future a Dystopia and he's just like, no, foreign country. He I mean, from American. Like you said, he's like, do you need to go in the future to make it plausible

that people get hurt so that others get rich? Nonsense. All you have to do is get it out of North America or Western Europe. I, you know, I understand like being like, look, these post Soviet republics, like there is a lot of like gangsterism, like you can make a movie about that if you really want to make a movie about that. If that's, you can't just shortcut to like Mad Max is happening over there, essentially, which is what they have done. Yeah. And also like, you know, it's very plausible that that would be happening here. Yes. So that's the thing him saying like, it's just not in America. I'm like,

cause then his point is like also the WWE and you're like, that's in America. Right. And I know that's that's the part of it that I think is rude for him to be like, this could only happen in a less developed country. Yeah. You lose a lot of the teeth of the commentary by being like, well, you know, America is immune to this. Like, but yeah, the thing is whatever Harry Knowles is saying about this original script had like commentary built in this film does not have commentary in it apart from like the rich cheater. There is color commentary. There is color commentary. But it's like rich guys will do anything to make a buck.

But like that's about it. That's like the end of it. There was one point that they really drove home. I'll call it the night crawler effect. Go ahead. Where they have the live global ratings number and they don't say it out loud ever. But if you're a really nuanced film watcher, you will notice that when the violence happens, number goes up.

It is, but it's, it's called like the global rating index or something. Yeah. And it's literally just like 20 and then somebody gets punched into like 21 and Sean Reynolds is like, all right. It like lights a cigar. And when they're just playing like a really good game of roller ball, it's at like seven.

Yeah. So, you know, there's a little commentary in there about they cut to that our appetite for violence. Yes, they cut to that ratings number so many times. I like it's like whatever. Any Given Sunday is a film that came out like a couple of years before. That's a movie that I feel like is trying to thread this need a little bit. Right. Obviously in a American context.

I want to I just want to get this out of the way. A movie that I feel successfully achieves what this movie is kind of trying to do and is also a remake of a beloved 70s genre movie. I think Paul W.S. Anderson's Death Race is very similar to this, where it's like a pretty loose remake that goes like prison state,

we care so little for the incarcerated, we force them to play like Mario Kart to the death. Mario Kart with spikes. For television. Yes, exactly. And it's all about like, you know, Joan Allen as the warden slash mogul There's another trying to get ratings boosters racing film that race

Yeah, that is does this better speed racer, right? Which is also basically set in a dystopia just like a colorful one I just think there's something to and I mean talk about like, you know It may be being time to remake this movie again there was a cross section in terms of of like real life issues of like a the like college sports system, right? That like commodifies these young men and especially football where it's like, are we pushing people into potentially life affecting injuries for the sake of like our own enjoyment and jersey sales and whatever. And also I feel like there's something in the idea of remaking Rollerball of like the pipeline to the military in the United States of like the only way so many people in this

country are given any chance of freedom for their future is like you got to do something really barbaric and dangerous for a couple years. And if you survive it on the other end, you build do something really barbaric and dangerous for a couple years. And if you survive it, on the other end, you build a life for yourself. There's something about shipping people off to rollerball. Well, there's also a version of remaking this one, not the original, where the modern conversation around sports washing and the Saudi wealth fund

is buying up every American sports league. That's all stuff. And all the Americans are going over there and basically lending legitimacy to that effort. It's like stuff that's weirdly in the soul of this version that isn't in the original that's almost ahead of its time. But the movie fucked up. There's a McTiernan quote where he says this is from a movie line interview in August 2001.

So this is when I guess before the movie got pushed back when he was promoting its original release. He said, I might be so far out there on Rollerball that this could be another time I get my head handed to me. He was right, in a sense. Yes. But lack of failure is clear evidence of either being an absolute genius or being a coward. I know Rollerball is exciting for me. I hope it's exciting for the audience. And it is enormously political. Someone said recently, this movie is about your Hollywood bosses. Yeah, look, I, in the nineties, obviously he, he tussled with a lot of CEOs and I think with a lot of big name stars, because he also says like, best thing about making a genre

movie, you don't need a $20 dollar guy genre sells the movie, right? So I don't need to knock on the door of a big star like a Mel Gibson Whatever remakes where he's like two movies where the IP is the star, right? Pierce Brosnan is obviously a big deal and he's bonding someone he's worked with that guy Yeah, right But it's it's very different than working with an Arnold or a Connery or someone like that and he like loves the fact that this Movie he's like I can pluck a guy who's not. It's funny though, but he's like,

I can pluck this yokel to play this moron. Like Chris Klein's like sitting there like, oh, okay. He's like, this fucking guy, you know how cheap he came? He's saying these quotes while promoting the movie. He's paying me to be in the movie basically. Look, have you seen Say It Isn't So, the other film that Chris Klein did? I think he's good in that.

You are clearly the biggest Chris Klein fan in the world. I think Chris Klein's comedy career in its first wave was pretty good. I think he has a charming presence to him. Yes. I'll give you that. Yeah. There's something interesting to him as a character type in the right roles, right? Where he is so guileless, he feels like the type of guy you should hate.

This guy right here. Oh. What? And on Chris Klein's Instagram, here's a picture of him making what I guess you would call a goofy face. A silly face. What do you say, voice? Posting it on a laptop making a goofy face. It's the jer you would call a goofy face

Laptop making a goofy face. It's the jerks would recall This is kind of the thing. I feel like he plays seems guileless to this day Yes Guys, right where it was like incredibly like handsome corn fed sort of jockey types where you're like god I fucking hate this guy. This guy's probably such an asshole. He's like, hey, how's it going? And you're like there's something disarming about how nice and sort of clueless he seems to be. There's something very puppy dog about him. He seems lovely.

He's also, he was 21 years old when he made this movie. Which is insane. He's like a true baby. And this is like his fourth film. It was a hundred million dollar project. He was being directed by the director, Die Hard and Predator. I did my best.

The movie doesn't work. It wasn't for lack of effort on my part. If he's making an effort, you don't really notice it, but it's yes, he's, it's not really his quote unquote fault. No, like election is kind of famously, uh, Alexander Payne spotted him when I think they were scouting the high school. And he's just brilliant in that, but it's like, you know, he's the natural. Right. You're like, is this just the one perfect use of this guy?

Right. And then I think the fact that he replicated a couple of times to lesser degrees. He's terrible in American pie. You keep acting like American. He's look. I think he's good in American pie. One. That's ins... That is actually an opinion you need to think about. You need to go and sit down and think about it. American Pie, okay, so of the four boys are him, Jason Biggs, Thomas E. and Nicholas, and Eddie K. Thomas, right?

Yes, because Stifler's kind of adjunct member. Stifler is obviously the biggest success of American Pie. So let's set him aside. But in the first movie, Stifler's kind of a slimer. He's an antagonist who slowly becomes a friend. Right, and then he drinks come and runs into a wall You've seen American pie. Yeah Spoiler for any of our listeners who haven't seen American pie

Stiffler drinks common So if I'm ranking the boys of American pie, the only thing I know is the client is bottom Finch that's Eddie K Thomas Thomas E and Nicholas Eddie K Thomas is finished. That's Eddie K. Thomas. I thought Thomas and Nicholas. I always mix those two up. Eddie K. Thomas is finished. He's the best. He's the best one. He's the best one. Right. And then I think I bigs is a comfy number two.

And then I'm going to what you think you think Klein over Thomas and Nick. I'll give you that blanket in the world. Yeah. All right. You know what? All right. Rookie of the year goes bottom. Yeah. Klein in American pie is the one of the group. That was the guy. The guy. He's the one who's terror reads Oh, that was the guy from Rookie of the Year. He's the one who's Tara Reads.

Because the dilemmas are like, Biggs has no girlfriend, masturbates into a sock, his dad won't shut up about sex, he fucks up pie. Yes. Eventually he ends up with Alice in Hanigan. Right. Klein... In the second movie. That's when they fall in love. Klein is like the alpha jock, but no one wants to fuck him. I can't remember why.

No, no, this is what I kind of like about it. Klein is like super jock football player, where you're like, why is he hanging out with these nerds? But it's like, he's such a sweet guy. He doesn't think about social strata. He is the one in the group who has had sex. No, he hasn't. No, none of them have had sex. He describes it like Apple pie. No, no, he's talking about blowjobs when he says that Griffin

You clearly don't remember about blowjobs talk about fingering or whatever. Yes Stop fighting talking about non American I had no idea this movie like a year ago in my memory Chris Klein has had sex and that's why they're virgins It's the whole point of the movie. The point is that he's not really part of it. At the end of the movie, he's the one person who doesn't sleep with his girlfriend. That is correct. What you are construing here is that he's the one

who actually is like, I didn't do it and who cares? Like that's what you're. I've always read it as he has had sex before and that's like, he's not part of it. Their whole pact is the four of them, they're all virgins. Okay, like we were. He's patting them on the back. Let's start watching American Pie right now. It's going in the four of them. They're all virgins. Okay. Let's start

watching American pie right now. It's going to keep talking. Eddie K. Thomas is Tara Reed. Who's the fourth? Oh, and then no, Eddie K. Thomas sleeps with Jennifer Coolidge. Obviously pretentious. He's the snob. He's funny. He's got a flask. He's the best. And then Thomas and Nicholas is with Tara Reed. Right. The structures are the ones where you're just like, you're just in a serious relationship. Like you're going to have sex. You don't need to be making any goofy packs. Chris Klein is funny because the whole thing is that he's a joc who's trying to make himself

seem like more of a nerd because Mina Savari is not into him. So he has to join the chorus. Right. He sings. Yeah. Scooby-dooby. He's funny in it. We are not making it sound good.

Scooby-dooby. He's funny in it. We're not making it sound good. Scooby dooby. I think we might also be right for an American Pie reboot. Yeah. We start from the bottom. Starring us. All right, guys, we're a bunch of dudes in our 30s. Let's lose our virginities. I will never forget Spike Lee being like, the guy sticks his dick in a pie.

That's a movie? Like some interview. This is the other thing with that movie. This is why Thomas E. Nicholas' character. To be clear, the film was directed by blank check favorite Chris Weiss. But I can remember the other characters names. I can't even remember Thomas E. and Nichols character. It's Oz.

It's Jim. Jim. Of course, he of Jim's dad. Of course And I forget what the other guy's fucking name is. The Shermanator Stifler. There's all those guys. Nadia. Nadia. Well, I'm happy to tell you that Thomas E. Nichols character is called Kevin. Oh What a guy! It's a clear case like Caddyshq where he was supposed to be the lead of the movie He's the normal guy normal guy right because he's the most stable relationship Yes, yeah, and

The whole thing is that Casey Affleck hands him the book of love Casey Affleck plays Kevin's brother who says there's a book that I've hidden that has all the secrets of how to have sex and The second movie they call up Casey Affleck again Casey Affleck's like the secret is in the summer after your first year of college You have to rent a house with Stifler The secret is your contract said you were obligated to do this in an expanded role. He's now second bill You were obligated to do this in an expanded role. He's now second bill. Oh, boy. But he's clearly supposed to be like the

audience or get central leading man, normal guy. Sure. Rookie of the Year. Right. And then everyone else pops in that movie where he's just kind of the boring guy in the movie. And then they don't bring Klein back for American Wedding, which I think is a combination of he had gotten too big while also bombing. He was not worth the amount of money it would have cost to have him play the fourth guy

when also he was on a bad run. Ahem. What a great noise going on with you. Ahem. Oh boy. Hello. Really David, you're not gonna say anything? What am I supposed to say?

How healthy I look? Oh, you're glowing! Well, it took a while to get that out of you. Uh, why do you look so healthy, Griffin? Why am I glowing green? Yes, bright green. I'll tell you why. It's because of the healthiest thing I do every day. And I want you on this journey with me, David.

Which is? The journey? Here's the journey. I wake up We're cutting past the part where I hit my snooze button 15 times, okay, I wake up Okay scoop Scoop I'm drinking field of green. Oh, it's the healthiest thing you do every day. It is, that's what I said. Alright, listen.

It's completely improved my life, David. It's nutrition the way that nature intended. It gives me more energy throughout the day. It's got me sleeping better throughout the night. Healthier hair and skin. Helps with digestion. And boy, no, Lord knows knows I need help in that the button you do you do your stomach feels better Yeah, yeah, it feels better. I feel better and healthier overall. What flavor do you go for?

And here are some of the choices. There's the original. Yeah, then they got wild berry Strawberry lemonade lemon lime raw if you like to live on the edge Charge want to make it clear that original and raw are two different things Lemon lime. Yeah. Raw. If you like to live on the edge. Charge. Want to make it clear that original and raw are two different things. Insight? Mm-hmm. Yeah, they've got lots of different kinds of options. I think the Insight one, like, you know, is for like helping to increase focus and charge is for like, you know, getting a little energy boost or whatever.

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mind, let me just do something. We should also shout out that, of course, this film has LL Cool J in it. It does. Much like Ice Cube, who I was just being mean about, but is kind of similar to LL Cool J where you're like, they're always going to be fine. Those guys sort of know how to behave somewhat charismatically. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Like Cool J is always compelling. Like they don't usually get much to do in any of these movies. Like the rappers turned actors of the 90s.

Like, but you know, but like they're fine. Yeah. Now he has nothing to do with this film. Like really, he's basically come to roller ball. After this, his work is done. I was watching it, assuming the twist was gonna be that he was in on it. Right, yes. And he was setting Chris Clamp for the fall instead halfway through. He's like, hey man

I got a heart out on this project He's the guy who can you help me escape so I can move on to another screen what's happening? Yes, but like hey, like have you noticed that something's going on? But also you look like those numbers go up when we get punched I cannot like I just want to restate this movie opens with extended street looging sequence that this article I read said was much longer than the original R-rated cut. Cops are chasing him. You think they're going to swarm around him.

LL Cool J pulls up in a luxury sports car, opens the door. He's like, hey man, get in. Pulls him in. You're like, who is this guy? He's like, hey man, I'm pitching it to you one last time. You should do roller ball. He's like, I don't know. I don't know if I want to do roller ball.

He's like, please do roller ball. Hard cut to Kazakhstan. They're both playing roller ball. This all happens within like five minutes where this movie isn't. This is the other thing. You imagine that part of the setup in both versions that I said, the one where it's like this guy lives for the edge. You want to do the most dangerous sport in I said, the one where it's like, this guy lives for the edge.

You want to do the most dangerous sport in the world or the one where he wants to make the NHL and it's like, dude, you're not going to cut it. Your only option is to play roller ball. In both cases, you imagine that scene starts with like, Hey man, I heard about something. It's a little underground. Sure. Yeah. Yeah.

Right. Right. You're not supposed to talk about it, but instead he's pitching it to him. Like it's pickleball. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right. You're not supposed to talk about it. But right. And instead he's pitching it to him like it's pickleball. Yes. This thing is on the verge of breaking out. Right. You know, roller ball. I pitched it to you five times. Are you going to accept it this time? Yes. I guess I will. Do you remember slam ball? Yeah. It's an era of people being like, can we just like plus up a sport a little bit?

Like sell the TV rights. Spike TV version. Yes. Exactly. What the fuck is slam ball? Slam ball was basketball with trampolines and the paint. OK. Yeah. Interesting. And when you watched it like five, if you watch it for five seconds, you were like, they've

invented the perfect sport. And then after five more seconds, you were like, oh, this is on watch. Sort of like rollerball. You had a similar arc. Trying to do this like XFL was the same thing where you were like, fuck, this sounds like it could be really cool. And then 10 minutes in it's Jack Donaghy

standing behind the monitor going, shut it down. It's the thing where like, you think it's a good pitch. And the second you watch it actually happen, when all the money's been spent, you're like, I failed to recognize the fatal flaw. If all of the floor is trampolines, no one can walk. Now it's not all the floor. It's just courts. There's six total trampolines on the floor. But it's true that once they started being on the trampolines, it's, you know, they lose

a little bit of control of their bodies. They're jumping up in the air. But another reason why 2002 is like the perfect time for a rollerball read. It's this era where everyone's like, it's been a while since there was a new sport and the future of sports is extreme. Extreme, yeah. Were you an extreme sports guy in the early 2000s? I was an X Games viewer. I was a Tony Hawk player.

Did you ever do any of that stuff yourself? Oh, no, no, no. Same. Same. No, no. I played so much Tony Hawk player. Yeah. Did you ever do any of that stuff yourself? Oh, no, no, no. Same. Same. No, no. I played so much Tony Hawk. I love my bones. That's good bones.

So I don't want to destroy them. Okay, in this opening scene, I had a brief vision of, so I did have this DVD. I have no memory of the movie from when I owned it. And sorry, just to build off this, because I should have asked this question earlier. Yes. You bought it rather than rented it because of the R-rated thing, which I felt prey to a bunch too.

You're the right age. You see there's an R-rated cut of a movie. I just would buy, yeah. Unrated cut. You go, I'm probably going to see boobs, right? It was probably a grocery store, you know, like, yeah. That thing's on a carousel. This is also an error. I mean, this is why DVDs exploded, is like they went way down in price really quickly, where suddenly it was worth it to just own 40 DVDs. But wait, so you have no memory of-

This is my follow-up question. Did you watch it a lot, or did you watch it one time and then go like, nah, I shouldn't have bought that and put it on a shelf? I think I watched it once and just was like, that wasn't my favorite. Got you. Yeah, you haven wasn't my favorite guy. Yeah Yeah, you had 14 year old since then. Yeah. No, I have definitely not seen it since well

But in watching that opening scene, I was like is this movie about to be good? And also is this movie about to be? fast and furious Because I could see a version of this movie where you slow play it much more. You start with kind of a, you know, indie drama about this street long border. Slowly falls into this world. Then we're cooking with gas. But they really, they went for like fast five, but in the 20th minute of the first movie. I mean, this is jumping way ahead. Oh, oh no. Well, we're going to ruin the

really stiff midsection of the film. This was a movie that among other legal issues led to a lawsuit between studios because they tried to advertise it as from the filmmakers that brought you Fast and the Furious. After this movie was pushed back, it ended up

coming out the year after Fast and the Furious, even though it was supposed to come out. In what ways is it connected to the Fast and the Furious. After this movie was pushed back, it ended up coming out the year after Fast and Furious, even though it was supposed to come out. In what ways is it connected to the Fast and the Furious? John Cogue wrote Rollerball, but only served as an executive producer on Fast and Furious. In response to the ads, Universal sued MGM and federal court

calling for a restraining order that would remove the ads from circulation. Relax guys, come on, who cares? But they were so badly trying to make people think. It makes sense. A movie that's made in a silo separate from Fast and Furious, but after Fast and Furious, they're like, this is the way people want the story told. Now this is my second trailer-based lawsuit film.

That covered a good point. On blank chat. And that case did finally settle? Yesterday? Since we've done the episode? I'm trying to remember what the resolution was. I think so. I think the resolution was the judge was like, go away.

Get our enormous heads, get their justice? Because as I said, I've always been very pro the N and A army. Of course, you don't want them on your bad side. Those guys will sue you into oblivion. Quote, a self-inflicted injury. Judge dismisses lawsuit claiming yesterday trailer tricked on a Dormis fence. A self-inflicted injury. That's cold. He has thrown out the five million dollar lawsuit. Right. And now they tweet about him every day and they're going to like, you know, swat his house or whatever. Uh, okay. Uh, we should also mention this film features Rebecca Romaine, who coming off of X-Men where she played Mystique and had delivered one line. Yes. But is in my

opinion, good in X-Men. I agree. And is very good in X2 where they actually give her shit to do. I think she's great in both of those movies. I think she's better than Jennifer Lawrence. As Mystique, at least. I would agree with that. Like, Jennifer Lawrence is fine as, like, hero. Yes. Well, they just morph that character into such a weird thing in order to suit the fact that they had America's biggest movie star playing that role.

Off of that, she got Rollerball and Femme Fatale. Now, Femme Fatale is actually an awesome movie and she's really good in it. But flopped really hard. Big flop. This film is not awesome and she's not as good in it, I would say. Again, a tough role. Tough role. Tough role.

In 2002, I like all four of these people, right? Sure. You mean including the John Renau. Yes. In 2002, I'm like, I have seen all of these people in movies recently where I enjoyed them I think that's also probably why I bought it. I was like I love LL Cool J I like Rebecca Romaine's name, you know, you know, and then yeah, I just I remember being I think you were saying this David I remember being very excited for this movie when it came out even though the buzz around it was so bad I was excited too because I was like that's a can't miss I was like even the junkiest version of this movie

I will find entertaining and I was also like, you know, what's a great title rollerball? What's better than and I like all four of these people and other shit I don't think I cared about that But I was just kind of like John McTiernan's remaking rollerball How bad could it be and then the reviews were so toxic that I was like I shouldn't go I actually you've talked me out of it So I probably was into this cast on paper. You take half a step back and you're like, those four people in the same movie is not going to work.

That's a bad combination. Let me now read from the dossier for a little bit about the production of the film. OK, number one, calm, no, McTiernan. McTiernan's first thing as it's coming out, as he says, the film is decapitated. The third act was supposed to be Spartacus. They didn't let me shoot. They didn't let me shoot. The big battle.

Because at the end of the film, the uprising in this film is basically just like he roller skates into John Reno's office and shoots him. The end. They chant Jonathan. They chant, which just encourages him to do it by himself. It doesn't really feel like a... Because in the original film, that's what happens. The whole point is that the powers that be are like, James Kahn's getting too famous,

he'll be able to control the audience. Right. We got to take him out. McTiernan in 2023, Griffin. He's still doing interviews about this movie. Says like, Ford versus Ferrari, right? That's a movie that that's what I wanted to do. A movie, you know, a movie that's about racing, but it's really about business

and about the movie business. Right. And like we talked about this in our Ferrari episode, but like that that movie is this incredibly durable metaphor for like being a filmmaker in the studio system, trying to make above average entertainment where what's the line here? He says, a film director is like the racing driver. He isn't the one who makes the engine work or makes the car go fast. It's a whole team of other people, but somewhere in there,

you need this madman who will try to control the whole machine. It's something they say in the movie several times every now and then the driver just doesn't make it out. You wish she could have. I'm pro a movie like that. That's not present in this film. Would you agree? I would agree. But every now and then the baller doesn't make it out.

But like. You could have fly that thing. Zach has already identified the extent to which that's in that film, which is there's a screen that has a number on it. It goes up or down. Like that's the only way this film weighs in on it. And at the end, Chris Klein roller balls

into Jean Reno's face. And Navina Andris' face. Yes. To jump to outcome stuff before we get into the plot of the film, as it were, Harry Knowles reads the script, is like, thumbs up, this is fucking good, I'm excited. He's also like, it's McTiernan. Yeah. With this script and McTiernan yeah this will probably crack record with this script in McTiernan this should work right they

fly Harry Knowles out to a test screening this is the era where the studios are trying to court him knowing that like if he doesn't like it he's gonna write about it you know the other thing in this era is like Sony flies him out for the Godzilla premiere yeah at Mass in Square Garden and he's like this movie rules. It was the best night of my life, this thing's a triumph, the audience was losing their minds, then the movie comes out, people dislike it, a week or two later he goes pays to go see it at a mall, writes a second review and is like I was wrong, the studio kind of like buttered me up, they got me in the spirit of the thing. I was swayed.

So Harry Knowles is already in this zone where the studios are like, we might be able to curry favor with him enough that he'll give us an easy pass on anything. And his audience is starting to question his reliability. They fly him out. They give him VIP treatment. I think they put him up at a nice hotel. He writes about all this shit in his piece because he's a great journalist. And then he's like, this movie sucks so fucking hard. I sat next to McTiernan and everyone was nice to me.

They paid my travel. This thing is dog shit. This movie has two good things going for it. It has tits and blood. Everything else in it is a fucking disaster. And MGM's responses, we should cut the tits and the blood out. He's just doomed this movie with his negative review.

We should make it a PG-13 so it at least can appeal to younger children. So they immediately say like, this review doesn't even apply anymore. Yeah, you can't even. And then we can sell the R rated DVD to Zach at a supermarket a year from now and make the money back. He called it the worst conceived series of nonsensical action I've ever seen. McTiernan, it is so funny to imagine McTiernan, this grizzled, grumpy, Juilliard graduate,

sitting next to fucking Harry Knowles, like at the height of his little nerd king, you know, like... You need to kiss the ring. What do you think? And Knowles is like, "'Eh...' You know, like, what a weird moment in pop culture. Now, internally... To be clear, Harry Knowles is like a bad dude. Like, yes, as much has been written about degenerate. Yes, with bad taste.

Who's also a bad writer. But this is because he's so in the crosshairs. And this is also I think around this time, Revolution Studios announces like a three picture development deal with Harry Knowles. That was the first time a studio was like, well, why don't we let you consult on other films? Why don't we let you develop your own projects? Cause you seem to know what Hollywood should be doing.

And the thought was, oh, they're paying him. And now he's not going to give any revolution movie a bad review. So his like honesty is very much in question. And when he attacks this movie, McTiernan, the studio all say like he's doing this just to prove that he can't be bought. He doesn't actually hate it. We think this movie is good.

They tried to do the double negative. And it's like, you know, you made a shitty movie. The other sign, obviously, apart from the fact that, yes, they recut it to get a PG-13, they delayed the release, all this stuff, is that there was this issue, and we can discuss this more on our basic episode as well, that McTiernan hired private investigator, Anthony Palacano, to conduct an illegal wiretap on the producer of the film.

Yes. So that's definitely a side of like behind the scenes drama. There's a little bit of an interesting narrative, one could argue more interesting than the film itself Where he was convinced that the big corporate powers of the entertainment industry were trying to ruin his movie But I think you have to factor that in when you watch that's the meta movie It is when you watch the movie, you know, he was just on theme about corporate power We've got to get inside every fucking tunnel They're all they're They're trying to mess

with me. The numbers go up and down. It's interesting that this is the movie that happened on. It's so crazy. I mean, we, there's this big conversation between Pelicano McTiernan that is what brings McTiernan down. Correct? Like there's some wiretap. There's like a 20 minute phone call that I believe they played in its entirety in court. By the way, we're doing an entire Patreon episode on Pelicano. We're doing an episode on Sin Eater, the crimes of Anthony Pelicano. Yes. The documentary and that will be the episode because we're obviously touching upon

it here. We'll touch upon it on basic. It's too big a story to fit into episodes on the movies themselves. Especially when we have to talk about roller ball. We have to talk about roller ball. We have to talk about roller ball. So you gotta go into enemy territory, then up through the tunnel, then down, then around again, and then you throw the ball into the gong thing.

And I remember he specifically says you have to throw it hard enough that it sets off the pyrotechnics. Gotta make sparks. Never an issue. Then no one ever just lightly touches it and doesn't score. You can't just go like, you got to go, wow. We wouldn't know if you could. The hard cut from LL Cool J going, come on man, do a little roller ball and Chris Klein

going fine to Kazakhstan, Chris Klein in the ring. I don't know if he's been playing for five years, if this is his third game, but he seems to already be a superstar. The thing is huge. About 40 minutes later, he's called the most famous roller baller ever. Well, they try to immediately like set up like, this long standing rivalry he has with evil Scarface lady.

Everyone thinks they hate each other. I'm like, I'm not getting any of this, but he within the first game you see him play, his friend, what's his friend's name again? Toba. Toba. His friend's helmet comes off and while he's scrambling, looking for his helmet, trying to get it back on, he's like fucking marked. He gets, he gets a ball to that dome. Basically. Why was Toba on the team?

Toba seems bad at rollerball. No, no, we are already in trouble here. I feel like I know so little. I don't even know what people's positions are. The only positions are like roller skates or motorcycle, right? Like, parkour, margarine. If you know a little bit about roller derby, there's, you know, a lot of guys. Yes, exactly.

So I think he's playing that type of position. But it seemed like he couldn't barely skate. Correct. That is the problem with Topa. Yes. Because as soon as his helmet came off... His mask is pretty big too. As soon as his helmet came off, he started doing almost like, you know, in like paid

ads where someone shows that you can't use a thing. Yes. Like it was like he was paid to prove that roller skating is impossible. Is this you? Exactly. He's like, he's trying to make orange shoes and he's covered in orange shoes. Let's be generous here.

Topa is, I think, a fine athlete. He just has one Achilles heel, which is being terrible at roller ball. It's his only problem. It's like when there's the NBA draft and they're like, this guy has got the whole package. Can't dribble. You can't dribble?

Is someone going to teach him? He's got explosiveness. He can't dribble, can't shoot. Has not heard of basketball. He's a bruiser. Like he's got all the tools. Like, I guess that's totally the only thing we see him do is lose a fight. Yes. True.

He gets sucker smacked. The object of the game is to throw the ball at the gong. Yes. You have to get the ball through the tuba, but there are two tubas. You have to go through that to be in scoring mode. If that makes sense. That's like the Super Mario star. I don't know how powerful enough to score.

Right. I don't know how anyone keeps track of that on like television. Yeah. Because like in roller derby, the jammer has a star on their helmet. And so you're like, that's the jammer. I get it. Like, that's the one. But in this is chaos. Like, and they also like they kind of have uniforms, but they're all basically just like in black leather and red plastic.

These sequences are incoherent visually. Which I loved. I kind of loved too. I'm not kidding, I loved. No, because- Be serious, some of the characters are incredible. Yeah, you have your, every team seems to have some sort of masked costume character.

Yeah, like person and, and once he said, the rules are in Russian, we're not gonna get into it, I was like, oh, okay, so I'm not supposed to understand this. I'm just like. You are correct. Cool, motorcycles, and there was one point where someone picked up their friend and used them to knock a guy off a motorcycle.

That stuff I was into. If I were an extra, a background actor on the production of Rollerball, and I was playing an audience member in the stands of the Rollerball arena, and I was watching all of this play out, I think I would be entertained. I'm not even saying in the world of the movie. I'm saying if I were watching these stunt performers do these routines from my own view, I think I would be entertained. When I try to argue for the strength of John McTiernan

at his best at a filmmaker, what made him such a transcendent action filmmaker, I feel like the two things that everyone goes to are unbelievable sense of visual geography. Yeah, like that his action sequences are so coherent. Yeah. And incredible juggling of ensemble cast, right? Where you have like Predator in the jungle and you're constantly keeping

track of where everyone is in relation to every tree or Die Hard, which is dealing with multiple floors of a building and the circuses of people outside on the street and the cops and the helicopter, you constantly know where everyone is, you're constantly keeping track of what everyone's doing. And then you're just like on paper Yes, John McTiernan doing rollerball sequences should be unbelievable This is the 75 rollerball arena. It almost all plays out in master shot. That looks good. That's too easy To be clear. It's a circle. It looks like a roller derby.

And then here is the fucking rollerball court in 2002. Here is the fucking roller ball court in 2002. But like, Zach, I agree with you where like, I like the WWE being like funneled into this. I like the costumes, I like the personas, I like the music. I want more of that. I wanted more of like, who are the costume guys? I literally would have enjoyed a two hour feed

of a roller ball game. I would rather watch that. With no plot. You're sitting next to Jean Reno. Yes. He can occasionally basically tell you some stuff. But once the plot kicked in is when I started to be like, huh? But beyond me not understanding the rules of the game

in the universe of the movie, I think the way this is shot and edited, I cannot figure out what is happening in any single frame of this. Oh yeah. It does not at any point seem like the teammates are working together. They're all sort of, yeah, cool. Jay's just on a motorcycle. Right. It's like Chris Klein gets the ball, throws it at the thing.

But yeah, I don't see how anyone's helping him. No, no, I don't see how the motorcycles are riding around each other and not crashing into each other. Well, it's such a tiny little ring. It's very small. It's very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, ring. It's very small. But this sequence is, that's what it is. Also have the plot twist of like, and now they're like no rules and the referee, and I'm like, there were rules before?

There was a ref? Like, I'm sorry, what? They sort of undercut that moment by having no coherent rules to begin with. Well, now it's anything goes, it seemed to be anything goes from minute zero in this film. How is this movie spatially incoherent when it mostly takes Place in a circle in a small circle. Yes. Well, that's the beauty of the ball

You know what that's the beauty of the ball. You got to get your ass to Kazakhstan You haven't seen rollerball until you've been there You gotta be you know, you've been there with like a shift from the mines, right? Some kind of like aluminum tycoon is next to you lighting cigars with a hundred dollar bill. Yeah. Hall's great. They got a Fuku. Yeah. Right. That's the other thing. They really upgraded on that front. They got a shake. They have a Shake Shack. The film it's these four people we've mentioned with Jean Reno obviously is the evil boss villain. Yeah villain John McTieran's ever put. Naveen Andrews coming off of the English patient and such is his like smarmy assistant.

I think Naveen's got a little juice in this. I'm always in favor of him. He's a great actor. I always like him, but I'm watching this movie take down people I usually find entertaining left and right. And Naveen, every time he comes on screen, I'm like, I'm watching a vaguely legitimate movie for these 15 seconds. He has a clear, like, type to play. Yeah, you know what he is. Yeah. He is playing his role so well, it is not complicated,

but at the end, when he gives his, like, well, you don't attack the head, you always have to attack the arm, I'm like, yeah, this is like the shitty version of this movie I wanted to see when I was 13. Sure. The Weasley Aid, the Green Mill Worm little worm tongue to Jean Reno's Jacques Le Business Man or whatever his name is.

Everyone else in the film is basically like a stunt man, a, you know, Hungarian kickboxer. There's Andrew Brinyarski. Oh. Is one of the big dudes who of course played Leatherface and in the Texas Chainsaw remakes and Zangief in the Street Fighter, the original Street Fighter. Of course, is the man who said cancer is worse than haters? Suck my nuts. We litigated this in the higher learning episode.

He got in a feud with the original Leatherface. Kind of hard. Over whether cancer was worse than haters or not. Uh, I guess it was, Oh, sorry. It was when Gunnar Hansen, the original, died of cancer. Right. Uh, he said boo. Okay. And when a fan yelled at him, he was like, could give zero fucks suck his dead nuts. Okay. Well, he basically, he was mad because they had few did, I guess. I believe the background was that he was still taking pot shots at Conner Nelson after he died.

And then earlier I said, I agree. I didn't. Yeah. I think his defense was why are you getting mad at me? Cancer is worse than haters. Okay. Okay. Right. Right. That front. But he was maybe wrong. And then you do have Paul Heyman, who is a well known WWE figure. I feel like one of the most beloved managers in the history and probably the best cast role in the film. Yeah. They did right there. Yes. And that's an important job. Yeah. Now maybe has the most dialogue of anyone on the dialogue now Could he have done a better job explaining what was going on? Maybe that's on the I don't know not on the performer. Yeah You've also got Janet, right? Who's a British actress as coach Olga who's ever present in the film I never really even knew if she was Chris Klein coach or not. I couldn't figure it out. She's always there. Yes

Going like, ah! He has a couple, yeah, a couple kind of vocalizations. Get over there! Like a lot of that. Now we haven't talked about, so they do roller ball for a bit and then they start to realize like, huh, some of these accidents seem to be staged or whatever.

I did while watching the movie, I kept turning to my wife and saying, I think something's afoot. You made your money. Because there were so many. You made your money? No, okay, she was into it, and for the first 30 minutes,

we were both like, this is kind of fun. Right, right. And we had looked it up and been like, oh, this is like one of the worst reviewed movies ever. And we were both like, I don't know, we're enjoying it. And then she did not finish it. My wife was begging me to watch Rollerball. I didn't even want to watch it.

She signed up. Then there is a sequence where they decide a Aurora Rebecca Romaine's character is almost killed sure I want to go to both for fuck's sake are you backtracking we're forward tracking well cuz they what they fucking review the tape and they realize the cameras were already in place someone cut his strap on his helmet the death was orchestrated to boost the ratings to make it go from a 20 to a 21. Do we know he dies?

Or he's at least wheeled off in a bloody mess or whatever. He's not with them for the rest of the season. He doesn't come back going, I feel great. They decide they need to flee the country. I mean, sequence plays out in night vision. This is one of the more baffling sections of the show. I love Cole J's, like, I know I staked our friendship on you coming and playing rollerball with me, but we gotta stop playing rollerball right now.

So I was not prepared, I had not seen this film. Should I switch the lights off for this part of the podcast? Please, yeah, let's do Night Vision record. Let's also say that at this point we've also had Chris Klein goes into, you see like a very kind of Starship Troopers Rebel Cop for Hoven-esque Oh, the men and women share the locker rooms And there's casual nudity right as we're saying in this R rated version Starship Troopers vibe

And then she goes into like the back room where Fucking Rebecca Romaine is pumping iron shirtless Sure, we're just talking about the boobs Okay, yes, five minutes for boobs They vaguely tried to set up that they're like rivals within the league And then he comes up behind her They immediately start doing it in a steam room

I do do it in a steam room and he's like you got to get me to a bed sometime. Yeah, she's like all in good time I'm French And they also earlier they set up another character on the team was like hey I want to hook up with her and Chris Klein was like, I think she's's playing for the other team. Right. Because they're hiding their relationship for some reason. I don't know. There's also a kind of rivals because there's storied rivals that in the great sport of roller ball. There's like a Broadway Phantom of the Opera thing where she's like, I'm so disgusting. Oh, well, because she has a scar on her face. And this is also there in the press. Yeah, they love to do this. Or McTiernan is like, well, this is a freak. Because she has a scar on her face. And this is also in the press.

They love to do this. Or McTiernan is like, yeah, I gave her a scar. And Rebecca, she really reacted to how she was treated differently. She transformed. I got it. This is a beautiful woman. So she has a scar.

People are throwing eggs at her on the street or whatever. It's like 3 quarters of an inch. You never see it because she's always wearing a helmet. Right. It's like the fucking Broadway Phantom, where it's like she's got one scar that looks cool as hell. And he's like, I noticed the way you always tilt your head

to the right, you're ashamed to be seen. Yes. But no, he was like- She's a supermodel. She didn't want to hide her looks. And I was insistent that we put a scar on her because I had to transform her as an actress. I had to get that bikini beach bunny out of her system. He wants to credit himself for like

this transformative performance where he unlocked an actor that no one saw there. When she had been good and stuff up until this point. Let's also acknowledge Austin Powers to Spy Who's Tag Me, in which she plays herself. A woman who Austin does not want to have sex with. Yeah. Well, he's too busy with, um, Ivana Humphrelot in that scene. But then, yeah, he was like, she liked the scar so much she would wear it out to the clubs at night. So they fuck and she's ashamed by how she looks and then... You know, she eventually...

You set up that they have their thing. Ella Coljic comes to him and says, you gotta help me escape tonight. Now, sorry, not to backtrack, but there's one other thing we've missed. For some reason, there is about five to ten references to whether or not Chris Klein is wearing his spine protector. Which I believe is- That came up a few times. LL Cool J keeps being like, you need to wear that. There are motorcycles on the arena floor. And he says, they can't hurt me if they can't catch me.

But then he does wear it, but then I don't know. But I think spine protector is maybe the only sci-fi element of the building. Because it basically looks like, you know, whatever, like a giant shin guard. You know, like he's kind of like loosely strapped into his back or whatever. But it protects the spine, you know You gotta protect your spine. It's it right and then I don't think it really is ever relevant whether he's wearing it or not No, this is a classic movie that sets up things where you're like, oh wow They're really telegraphing that hard and then you're like, oh no, they weren't right

There's no moment where he is like Tim Riggins or not Tim Riggins. Who's the guy? Jason Street. Yeah, there's no moment where he's like, Oh, damn, I wish I had that spine protector. I like never really factored. One thing pays off beautifully, which is that eventually Roe Hickor remain a sense to bringing Chris Klein to a bed. Yes. And that's the moment of the movie where McJarren is right. Freeze frame. But McJarren is staring at Harry Knowles being like,

why aren't you whooping and cheering at the bed line? Yeah. I assume. Look, the night vision sequence. I had at this point begun to disassociate. Yes. This is where I started to fully check out. And then this sequence plays out.

Now on Wikipedia, a citation needed paragraph says that truly they had just underlit this scene and then didn't have like the time to reshoot it because it's a big complicated action sequence. So instead they were like, let's throw a night vision tint on it. I don't think that's true. I don't, I don't think it is either because that sounds fucking ridiculous. It feels like a choice, but also the feels like a choice, the camera placement in this sequence, it's like they are dashboards. It's like a mounted camera. It becomes security for the Russian.

Right, like it's all, it's not just that it's in night vision, it is filmed as if it's like stolen footage. I will say this, I think it's the one thing in the movie that is interesting and somewhat audacious. You gave this movie half a star on letterbox? I gave it one and a half stars. You gave it one and a half and your log was? I said I gave it an extra star for the night vision.

Wow. I give it one star for night vision. I think this is a half star your your log was an extra star for them. Wow. I'm I I give it one star for Night Vision. I think this is a half star movie without the night vision. I'm taking a star away for the night vision. But you were starting at five, right? You're down to four and a half because I you want to talk about a scene where I couldn't understand what was happening. Like now. So that's my note. I don't know what's happening.

LL Cool J dies in this sequence I did not really realize exactly you only it's depicted from a distance It's like my mom watching force awakens where I'm like, he's just really not in the second half this movie His mom famously went to the bathroom when Kylo Ren killed Han Solo And then she was like, it's weird that they just don't have Harrison Ford do anything in the last She just thought they were keeping him on the bed. He's not even in the final scene when everyone's saying goodbye. And also what was that weird emotional hug that Leia did?

It's not defensible in terms of making a commercial film that makes sense to people. Sure. It is just unusual. Yes, I agree. And so I was kind of like, like you said, like this is a choice. That's my thing. I'm like none of the action sequences are visually I agree. And so I was kind of like, like you said, like this is a choice. That's my thing. I'm like, none of the action sequences are visually coherent. This one feels almost intentionally abstract. It has the most.

It actually has the most like appropriate feeling of like we are in a sort of like semi lawless state. Like you know, like forgetting the whole like did John did John McTernan even, like, Google Kazakhstan before he made this movie? Like, at least you're kind of like, damn, like, it really does feel like they're, like, being smuggled out of somewhere weird. Is that movie, uh, series seven, The Contenders?

Yeah, of course. Right, where it's, like, a brutal, sort of, like, to-the-death reality show, and it's filmed as if it's, like, kind of hidden cameras. Yeah, it's like a DV early Big Brother style. Right style. It's like weirdly, this is the one sequence, action sequence in the movie that is not supposed to be televised. And yet it's filmed as if it's like stolen from multi-camera setup to televised. But yeah,

LL Cool J does die in this sequence and no one ever really acknowledges it or even seems that upset about it. No. And once again, I'm like at this point the movie I'm like the reveal is going to be that LL Cool J is in on it and he set up Chris Klein because they also start saying like there's a John Marnow has some line at the beginning and this is sort of why McTiernan wanted to cast a Chris Klein type is he's in the boardroom with all the other fat cats and they're like this guy's good and're like, he has no idea how angry we're about to make him or something like that. Like, Jean Reno's into the arc of corrupting

this goody two shoes, all American boy, right? But he's like, we're gonna break him and make him violent. There was something interesting to the sort of American obliviousness. You could have gotten into that in the movie of like these two Americans show up and they're just like, yeah, this is pretty sweet. Like, you know.

There's almost like a hostile type thing going on there. But yes, it feels like, especially for how magically LL Cool J just appears, pulls him into a car, and says, hey, join me over in Kazakhstan. You're like, is LL Cool J getting money to like recruit other people? Like, is this the game kind of situation? Right, yeah. There at least, right, be some reveal of like, is it all cool to getting money to recruit other people? Is this a game kind of situation?

Right. There at least be some reveal of like, yeah, he got a fat bonus because he brought over Chris Klein. Instead, it's just like he seems to just genuinely think like, this is a great professional opportunity. And then on a dime one day, he's like, I need to get out now. We gotta go. Bill Simmons, the famed podcast mogul, back in the day was just a sports columnist. Rollerball is one of his favorite movies, the original, not this one.

And he wrote a column about this film and of the night vision sequence, he said, one of the strangest experience I've ever endured in a movie theater. I would say that everyone in the theater was glancing around trying to figure out what was happening, but I was only one of three people. His other incredible line. line is a good one. The other line is really funny. Is Hollywood really this dumb? That's what I kept asking myself Monday as I struggled to remain conscious

during a screening of the reprehensible rollerball. Just so you know, the previous sentence took nearly 20 minutes to write. I wanted to be absolutely certain that reprehensible was the best possible adjective Simmons was in his bag. So I went to my thesaurus buried under a phallus of magazines of pictures and searched for the perfect word to describe one of the worst movies I've ever seen. Dreadful, appalling, putrid, atrocious, heinous, excrucible, odious, abominable, rancid, horrific, gasly, none of them fit.

And then I found it. Reprehensible. Perfect. This movie was reprehensible. The other one I want to read is Roger Ebert's point five star review. That's why I thought you gave it a point five. I gave it a one point five. Um, he said, someday this film may inspire a long thoughtful book by John Wright. It's editor. My guess is that something went dreadfully wrong early in the production, maybe dysentery or mass hypnosis. And the director, John McTiernan, die hard.

A case of making someone's credit almost feel like an insult. John McTiernan, parentheses die hard, was unable to supply right with the shots he needed to make sense of the story. And then this is the real money. I saw a Russian documentary once where half of the shots were blurred and overexposed because the KGB attacked the negative with X-rays. Maybe this movie was put through an MRI scan. Curiously, the signifiers have survived, but not the signified. We've got to bring this back, man.

We got to get meat on the internet again. We've got to revive Roger Ebert. Well, yeah, let's bring him back. You got a byline start, start throwing fucking. I just go to my editors being like, I need to take roller ball to the cleaners. It's been too long. It's going to be 22 years old, but I'm ready. If you put me in the room to your editors, I want to write a looking back 22 years later, roller ball stinks. Look,

the 22 year anniversary is, is in about three weeks. Look, it's coming up. So it might be time. So anyway, yeah. LL Cool J gets wasted, you know, from, you know, two miles away. We watch on a surveillance camera and Chris Klein finally starts to get wise that perhaps dragged back. The company wants people to get injured playing rollerball. Something's up with that number too that goes up or down. Should we check in with it? Something's afoot. If you're paying attention. Look, I watch a classic game of rollerball and I think normal. Yeah. Oh yeah. But the me and six of my friends. The closer I watch, the more I think about rollerball, I do think there's something a

little askew there. Right? I, as a viewer of rollerball, I'm starting to wonder if the reason I watch the show is because I have an unquenchable thirst for blood. Now, see, I'm a purist. I like the sport as it is, but once violence happens, I call my buddy. Because they need to know. Yeah. You know. Yeah.

Right, you like it for the tactics. I'm in for the tunnel and the ball and you know. But once blood is shed, then it becomes a social activity. Oh yeah, I'm like everybody get over here. First turn on your TV so the global ratings number goes up. We gotta get it up. But come over, let's watch. It's so funny that there's not even like a little M

next to the 20. Yeah, we don't know what units that is. Is that a share? Is that a number? Nielsen puts one of those on every show's set. Yes. When they were doing Frasier back then, and then Frasier would like say Sherri Niles,

the number would go up, right? They'd be like, yeah, good. I actually, this makes, I have a logistical question about, obviously Chris Klein isn't in on it, but many of the players have to be because they get a signal from the evil guys of like time to do violence. If it's a player who say,

until recently was toiling in a mine, that guy might be in on it, right? I'm just wondering how much, like, How deep does this go? Yeah, is it 80% of the players know that we're doing WWE give you at least 75% It's like mostly the Americans and like the high-profile hot shot We're left out that we're there is this feeling where it's like this movie part of him one just at a present day in a Less developed country quote unquote, right is the idea of making this like analogous to like sex trafficking or something where you're like, well, in a desperate culture, people get sucked into a field with no better prospects.

You know, is that line in the club early on where his big Chris Klein's big teammate is like, you make way more than me. Yeah, right. Yeah. And that these two Americans are actually being paid well and promoted as the faces of the sport Everyone else is basically in like what indentured servitude right there being paid where with what money and where do they spend it? There's the scene that almost sticks out feels jarring because you're like whoa This is almost like a commentary on something where Chris Klein is like speeding in his sports car And he is like weird no one else on the highways and his like assistant is like yeah weird, no one else on the highways. And his assistant is like, yeah, well, no one else in this country can afford cars. And you're like, oh, there's almost something here to like being big fish in a small pond.

But the pond is like a third world nation and you're the only person getting to live a luxury life. And you're part of the reason why the pond is is fucked up. Which like you talking about like fucking like you know these these like Middle Eastern like rulers investing money into like giant American businesses while they're like citizens you know starve and this weird golf between like crazy skyscraper development and like slums. Yeah this could have been a very interesting movie. All that stuff is weirdly there. I looked up Kazakhstan and their favorite sport is actually soccer.

Oh, okay. Not roller ball. Their second favorite sport is hockey. Okay. There's two sports. Yeah, they would like Jonathan. Their third favorite sport is boxing. Okay.

It's a little closer to roller ball, but that's actually popular globally. Now, something I have brought up on the podcast before is, of course, the world. No mad games. Oh, I'm not familiar. It's been around since 2014

by Captain America when he had given up. Of course, it grows up here. Takes place in central Asia, Asia, Kazakhstan being Kazakhstan, being one of the countries included. Some of the sports include horseback wrestling.

Okay. That is cool. That's fun. Belt wrestling. I'm not sure what that is. Do you wrestle the belt or with a belt? There's a mixed, uh, event, which includes falconry, mounted archery, and a hunt assisted by a dog. So it's, you know, it's sort of, it's like taking these primitive nomadic sort of

activities and then making them into a sport. And this is real? This is real. There's also a sport called, I believe it's called, kukporu, which is like fighting for a goat carcass. Yeah. Hold on. I'm on the Wikipedia page founded six months ago by Ben. This is one of those things where you're like Kyrgyzstan, which is Kazakhstan is

like fucking, you know, Singapore compared to Kyrgyzstan's Jupiter, you know, like Kyrgyzstan's Jupiter or whatever. You know, like Kyrgyzstan is a rural country. Perfect analogy. I was just trying to think of very different, like Kazakhstan is a Petro- That's just the hardest I've seen Ben laugh at anything in a while. I mean, I could not have predicted what was coming. Yeah, what was coming. I was really trying to go far away.

His face is fully red. Like Kazakhstan is like is like people in berets smoking and not to insult Kyrgyzstan. It's just like, that's a super rural country of farmland. Right. And Kyrgyzstan is like the, the most dominant like country by like so much. Like they're so good at the nom man. Yeah, they just crush Russia is like number three Russia is like Junior compared to the Kyrgyz Kyrgyz, you know goat wrestling and all that One of my one of the films I've seen the most in the last few years the film called babies I don't know if you guys have ever heard it's a French documentary. Of course produced by

Alasher back. Yes, and it's a one that that the one that's just like, it's just babies? Correct. You got it, my friend. It's like a nature documentary about four babies. I saw that opening weekend. I was so amped for that fucking movie. It's got four babies. I can, that film has no dialogue because it's just babies.

They are not talking now? No. The babies? No, they're babies. They're like babies. Ben, I'll tell you to look when they're talking. It's from basically zero to one year old, right? Like, and it's an American baby. The Mongolian baby is the one I remember popping. Exactly. There's a Japanese baby. Very cute. They're all very cute,

except for the American baby who you're kind of like. Pony Jow? That's Pony Jow, who I is from a Namibia. I just want to say you, that's a huge pull that you just got the name of the baby. I've not seen that movie since it came out. Me and my friends were so fucking amped for it. I remember pony Joe. Yes. And the Mongolian baby. I just remember that Mongolian baby is like a nomad game ass baby. He's just climbing up like rusty buckets and like, you know, like poking a yak and all that. This movie actually rules. Yes. Babies. I've forgotten about it. Just check it out. I watch it with

my kid all the time because my kid likes it. No, it makes sense. They're our babies. I remember the trailer was set to, it was also like kind of a big hit because it translated in every country. It's got no speaking. And no narration or anything. You're just watching slice of life. You're watching like parallel development. He'll just cut between like now they're all kind of learning to do this. Like you just see the different ways they're learning to do that.

It's a good movie. I like babies. Babies is good. I remember there's a part in the trailer which is set to some Sufjan Stevens song. Where it intercuts. It cuts between all four babies like crawling. And then in big letters, it just says, the babies are coming. Good movie. And I turned to my friend like Emily St. James's dad and went, I'm seeing that.

Ben, should we get you to cover the next World Nomad Games? Fly out to, well, let's see. Man on the Beat? Uh-oh. I was going to say. Where is it happening? Kazakhstan. Oh, fuck.

Now that's in September. Is that where you were teeing up, Ben? Yeah. September 8th to 15th. Yes. In Astana, which is the capital of Kazakhstan. Pretty easy to fly to, I think. We can probably.

Oh, yeah. Maybe probably one layover. Maybe a layover in Istanbul or something, it won't be so bad. We could probably get you press accreditation through this podcast. Any editors that listen to the show, I don't know, Afar,

I'm trying to think of some travel publications. You have been saying, Ben, it's been too long since we've done a quote unquote documentary episode, like going to Six Flags or Atlantic City. And every year you pitch like, is there a fun place we could go to and record? Well, my friend, maybe it's time for you to tape a zoom recorder to your chest and fly solo to Kazakhstan, embed yourself in the Nomad games. They also play like Mancala, you know, that like board game. Like they,

it's like they both play these crazy physical things and interesting mix these like ancient board games. And you have to play like Mancala on the back of a bowl. They strap you to a donkey. Is it like the Olympics where you don't compete in every event or is it like now everyone's got to tell you and there's like one winner. Eighty one gold medal. OK, Kazakhstan is 40. Like that's that's like one winner. Kyrgyzstan has 81 gold medals. And Kazakhstan has 40.

That's a huge drop. Mongolia has got three gold medals in its history. Just a shout out to the Mongolian baby. US Zero Golds. Have they sent anyone to the Nomad Games? I'm seeing here they have

yes, because we have three silvers four bronze.vers for bronze. All right. Good for us. I want to watch babies again. I forgot this existed. Dude, I own it on iTunes. Throw it on.

I think maybe we take babies. Uh oh. We set it in another country. Like a Central Asian sort of post-Soviet. We add some motorcycles. Just a little bit of rollerball. We do even less dialogue explaining what's happening. Rollerball.

Maybe it's not. I think I agree with you. What if the film was just opening credits, rollerball is about to begin, and we just watch this. Which by the way is how the original is coming. I want to re-see. Yes. No, the Jewish Jewish film does that.

Yeah. But then, of course, the Jewish film goes into the bathroom. Then gets into a more interesting story. But the first 10 minutes are just give me noises off. Yes. Give me rollerball the whole game. And then you can show me what's happening behind the scenes during the game. I'm just imagining David. I'm in the pitch as an exec at MGM watching the first cut of rollerball and going John John Give me noises all you see noises off

Seen the deaf Broadway comedy noise one off on stage act two backstage Katie Finneran You know from her John John? Oh, man. Wanna Tony? Do you know what else I think this movie was missing? What? I think it was missing the sports movie style end credits little paragraphs that tell you what the players are up to now.

A hundred percent. Like, tell me what happened to The Assassin or whatever. Yeah, for real. I was like, that would have felt so right in the moment to just see, like, the Black Widow or whatever is now, you know. Yeah, Rekken Tuba or whatever his name is. What happened to that guy? Tuba recovered and is, you know, now unfortunately back working in the mines or whatever. Yeah, right, some of them it's like, mines, mines, mines, this guy's coaching mines. That's another, you brought up that the killer,

hilarious ending of this film is Rebecca Romaine, James Bond style saying, how about we get you to a bed, freeze frame on Chris Klein basically going, what? Oing, oing, oing, oing, oing. Like a reaction shot pulled straight from Satan's castle. You had sex with her, to be clear. A lot of times it seems. But not in the best.

Just always on the cold hard steel of the sauna room. I think in theatrical version, the sex scenes basically cut out, and her quote unquote nudity is so thoroughly obscured by... In shadow. And steam where you can see nothing. Night vision. They put on the night vision. They snap it on again.

Then in the R-rated cut now, you can see her naked, but there is still a lot of shadow. Sure. Right. Apparently when they filmed it, it was just like crazy full fontanel. They screened it that way. The sex scene was far more explicit. Sure. It is insane in 2002 to be like, we have footage of Rebecca remain so naked. We have to get this far away from viewers. Well, save it for the DVD. No, we're going to kind of cloud it in the DVD as well. But apparently the ending, even though McTudden didn't get to shoot his full Spartacus thing, it sounds like at some point the intention of the ending was

supposed to be that like they feel like they've won. They've beaten the game. He shot John Renau and Navina Andrews. They win. And then the sort of like ominous. Didn't he kill John Renau with a table? You're right. Yeah, he tables the Renau. He tables him.

Okay. Tables his ass. And he should have said, let's table this discussion for a later time. But that the ominous note at the end of the movie after that joke was supposed to be like, oh, but him turning on the execs and killing them up the ratings and has now legitimized as a sport. That's more interesting. I like

that. Right. That it's like they kind of like won the battle, lost the war. Right. Roller balls too big to be stopped. Yes. Yes. It's kind of a good ending. You guys are idiots. Stop thinking roller ball can be fixed. Hold on. Hold on. What if we add a third level David? Good. We didn't really talk about the final sequence where Chris Klein skates out of

the rink, kicks through the glass. And then most of that is in slow motion for some reason They try to make it like Chris Klein is having this Mandy-esque breakdown where it's like now He's covered in blood and he's lost his mind. They finally broke in this guy Which was that was McTiernan's intent in casting him is like if you start out with this guy being so goofy and gullible Apple pie fella is narrowed right? Yeah, he yeah. He's gone to the dark side. Yeah. Where's this line? Instead he has like a black eye and he's got like some goo on his face.

Yeah. Chris was perfect for Rollerball because he's an absolute straightforward American boy without an agenda or a cool bone in his body. You rarely hear directors say that about the leading men. Chris clenching next to him. They hired for their own action movies. And then he said he's as earnest as Jimmy Stewart another weird comparison for a sci-fi action movie So that when he finally gets angry you believe it He's right in an abstract sense that if that worked it would be very satisfying and disturbing

I didn't even play feel like he was that angry. No, he's not well He was just kind of like well, here's here's here's the next step of what I got to do. He's doing okay, right? He was on The Flash. Chris Klein? For a season. What did he play? He played a villain, like a big villain.

It was with a really embarrassing name. Let me look it up. Okay. I want only the best for him. Wait a second. What? This is crazy. His name was cicada, which Zach mentioned cicadas. That's pretty fun. That's pretty good. And he's currently on the Netflix show, sweet Magnolias. Okay. Which is one

of those shows where you're like, well, that doesn't exist. Doesn't it? What do you mean? Three seasons worth. Like the biggest show in America. So he's making, making he's he's okay. I just want to be making a living you know Let's also call out the other thing is you know he hits very quickly right election American Pie Yeah, probably best comedic performance of the 1990s in American Pie is Oz a character. We all love sure Uh-huh then starts dating Katie Holmes, and they're kind of this like yeah Teeny bopper power couple where it's like, holy shit, the guy from American Pie is dating the girl from Dawson's Creek.

Shortly after this movie, they are engaged to be married and then she dumps him for Tom Cruise. It is so bizarre to jump from Chris Klein to Tom Cruise. It's kind of like a Kyrgyzstan to Kazakhstan type disparity. It's like being so close to the NHL and then signing up for murder.

I've always liked the flag of Kyrgyzstan because it has a yurt on it. It's a red flag with a yellow yurt in like a sunburst. I'm a big flag nerd. OK. And my friend went to Kyrgyzstan. And recently he mailed me a flag because he knew I was such a Kyrgyzstan flag. My friend went to Kyrgyzstan and recently he mailed me a flag because he knew I was such a Kyrgyzstan flag. Wow. Yep.

My friend went to Kyrgyzstan because Russia, where he lived, declared war on Ukraine. I don't know if you heard about this and he took the only flight he could out of Russia, which was to Kyrgyzstan. Wow. Should we do the box office game? Great friend, not a fun reason

for getting a great gift. Not a fun reason, but you know what, he got out of there. He got out of there. He hopped, you know, he hopped all the way over. Is there anything else in the dossier? No, no, we did the dossier. I promise, I looked, I promise. David?

Yes. Mooby. What? Yup, I mean it. I swear to God. I'm not lying. Whoa, well that's cool, Mooby. It is cool, get a little excitement in your voice, David.

I'm excited. This episode is once again brought to you from the fine folks at MUBI. We love them. They're a curated streaming service dedicated to elevating great cinema from around the globe. They got iconic directors, emerging auteurs. There is always something new to discover. And with MUBI, each and every film is hand selected so you can explore the best of cinema

streaming anytime, anywhere. Now this month on MUBI you can catch their global special program which is Funny Haha. Oh, okay. Yeah. Okay. Not the movie Funny Haha, which is a film I love, the Andrew Bajaskin movie. Maybe it's on there, but it's a series on comedy. Which is a film I love the Andrew Bajasky movie. Maybe it's on there, but it's a series on Comedy which is great laughter knows no bounds David making the art of comedy one that transcends language and culture

From slapstick to screwball to art house subversion sharp satire You can stream the funny ha ha collection featuring some of the best comedies from around the world such as Yannick ah Quentin Depew around the world, such as Yannick. Quentin Depew, Francis King of Comedy. He's navigating the relationship between artists and audiences in his Locarno prize winning movie. That's a guy I don't know that well, but then you've also got Francis Ha. A movie, of course. Yeah.

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Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Griffin, this was an interesting week. I don't know if it was number one at the box office But it was mentioned in the dossier It was spoiled for me one of the movies that opened against it because part of the lawsuit were universal sued MGM for using fast and furious is that they claimed they were deliberately trying to sabotage Universal's big release that same weekend, Which was? Big Fat Liar. Big Fat Liar. A movie that it's one of those things where I all of us in this room a little bit too old for that movie. Right?

I saw and loved it. I'm not saying I didn't see it, but I feel like when I talk to people who are like four to five years younger than us, that movie is so totemic. I'm 25. Yeah, you're 25. I forgot you're 15. My friend Claire, who is similarly like in her late 20s, her letterbox review for the Holdovers was move over Big Fat Liar. There's the best new Paul Giamatti performance just dropped. This is the thing, like the amount of Paul Giamatti memes that have been circulating

post Holdovers feel very tied to people really feeling connected to Giamatti and Big Fat Liar when they were a child and then he was on his incredible episode of WTF I haven't listened to that yet, but he's also obviously doing those like YouTube be you know talks about his whole career talks about being an orangutan But it's one of those things where it went from being like isn't this funny the Paul Giamatti a Couple years away from being accepted as one of our finest actors it went from being like, isn't this funny that Paul Giamatti, a couple of years away from being accepted as one of our finest actors, the Zach Cherry of his moment. Got painted blue by Frankie Dude in his Amanda Bynes. Right, it was in this

like silly kids movie. Right. And he's like, I've accepted that's like kind of one of the totemic works of my career and is like one of the things that will be on my tombstone. And he talks about like in the WTF episode where he's like, I'm starting to come to terms with the fact that like, I occupy a weird place in like a generation psyche. Now I haven't, I'm going to confess,

I haven't seen Big Fat Liar. I was too old for it. I was 16 years old, like I said, or you know, about to be. Is it good? It must have been like one or two when it came out. Right, I forgot, Zach is five. Is it good? Our youngest Zach. I remember her being fun, you know, it's like it's like a kids

Levy movie the man who now of course is our modern Spielberg right and it was written by Dan Schneider normal No, I see here that it's based on What is that true quickly based on the boy who cried wolf. Okay. Oh yeah I guess. My memory of it's like you know Munez and Bines are really big at that moment. G-Bot's character is called Marty Wolf. Okay that makes sense. Ah wow. And he plays. He's the big fat liar. He's a blowhard Hollywood dealmaker. I can't remember if he's a producer or he's supposed to be an exec. He's a, yeah. And he gets the better of them and they proceed to prank him for like, you know, 90 minutes or whatever. It's kind of classic Ben Cinema, Bushwhacked, Home Alone, where Giamatti is in the Daniel Stern position of being tortured and embarrassed in any number of ways. And I just remember watching it on cable some point years later and being like, yeah, Giamatti's giving this a lot.

It is undeniably funny to watch these things happen to Paul Giamatti. We got to get him in a home alone. Now that I think of it. How about you reboot Paul Giamatti, but he's the one stuck in the home alone. Ooh, yeah. And it's a bunch of kids trying to break in. Yeah. So it's just Paul Giamatti like drop kicking seven year old. Causing violence to kids. Yes. So it's just Paul Giamatti like drop kicking seven year old. Yeah. Causing violence to kids. Yeah.

Might be good. That is my pitch. I think there's an opportunity. Add it with these kids. So this is February 8th, 2002. Paul Giamatti's Regis film. But to be clear, Big Fat Liar is opening to a healthy eleven point five million at number two.

OK. So what is number one? It is a delayed film. It was supposed to come out on 9-11. Yes. It was a 9-11 delayed. It was delayed because it's a, you know, the character's fighting terrorists, I think. It's not like a film. Collateral damage. It's Arnold Schwarzenegger in collateral damage. I mean, that's an interesting, you could do sort of screening series of the 9-11 affected movies. Yes. And it's Zoolander. Yes. Oh, that one did come out. It did come out. Yes. Donnie Darko. Big, big trouble. Big trouble. Big trouble is

the one where they're like, oh shit, a plane gets hijacked in our movie that has nothing to do with, you know, terrorism. That's the third act is a couple of dumb. It's Tom Sizeworn, Johnny Knoxville, bring a bomb on a plane and try to hold it hostage. The other insane one but they somehow fixed it. Spider-Man was only the trailer. They had to reshoot or you know they had to get rid of it. Because the trailer was all stuff that was shot just for the trailer not by Sam Raimi. The one that's interesting is Lilo and Stitch. Why? The last act of the movie was supposed to be Hitch hijacks a plane and starts flying it at a low altitude.

Not Hitch. Stitch. You said Hitch. I said Stitch with my voice was caught in my throat. Yes. Stitch hijacks a plane and flies at a low altitude over Hawaii through the city and people are freaking out. Right. And they had animated it that way but had not totally finished. Then he goes to freaking out. Right. Right. And they had animated it that way, but had not. And he goes to the Pentagon.

Right. Yeah. People are freaking out that the like the airplane, he's supposed to be on a commercial airliner that he's hijacked. I understand. And they freaked out and they were like, this is like 15 minutes of the movie. The whole third act is built around this. We've animated it.

We can't start over and make our release date. And some fucking genius who better have gotten the greatest bonus was like make it a spaceship. Right. There you go. And they like re-animated over only the vehicle and cut like two lines of dialogue out and made it that the bad guy lands with his spaceship and Stitch hijacks it and when it's a spaceship no one gives a shit. Very true. So in the original version the bad guy was just landing on a commercial like. I think in the original version, the bad guy was just landing on a commercial. I think in the original version, Stitch is chasing another spaceship with a plane. And in this one, somehow he gets his hands on a different spaceship or something.

But you can watch online the version of it with the plane that's half finished. Have you seen collateral damage? I never have. I think that's the one where he's like a firefighter. Yes, but it turns out to be an inside joke. He is a... I'm not kidding. I think that's...

He's a firefighter who sets charges. I think that's truly why the movie got delayed. He attacks some steel beams. He's a fireman, but there's some conspiracy. I don't remember that. His family dies. A masked man called El Lovoh, the Wolf claims responsibility and says that he is in Columbia. And so because of the red tape, so annoying when there's

red tape, he, and of course he's called Gordy Brewer, real Schwarzenegger name. I'm Gordy Brewer. I'm a blue collar. I'm Irish. I passed the firefighter exam. He just goes to Columbia himself and you know, throws people into trees or I don't know what he throws a fire axe at them. That's like, it's an Andrew Davis movie, which is the reason I've always wanted to see it. But I've never seen it. Do you think John McTarran is like looking across the aisle and being like, if I had just made that movie, that movie was not like successful, but it did. Well, it was pretty, it actually did pretty badly collateral damage, but it made more than roller ball. Yeah. And you

know what else happened? Andrew Davis didn't go to prison. Well, you know, it all comes out in the wash, right? That's true. A roller ball is opening at number three to $9 million. It will end up at 18. So it has a two multiplier. Not very good. Number four, the box office is a big hit. It's total domestic haul was 18. 18 mil.

And it costs over a hundred. Yeah. And like that's not even... There's nothing here telling me what the global rating was though. I don't know what that number actually is. How did it do? Kazakhstan. Yeah. Well, it probably made like one or two

for the first 10 minutes. Right. And then as soon as the violence started, it got up to 18. Yeah. It got up to 18. You know how sometimes like, they were adjusting how many millions of dollars

it was making in real time. Yeah, they track it real time. There's like an Italian villain. And then you learn like, oh, in Italy, that villain's actually Portuguese. Like, right. Like they, right. What is that the thing? Like in Kazakhstan, they're actually like, yeah, we're going to Uzbekistan. Like I don't know. In Toy Story three, where there's the bit, I'm sorry, but you teed it up. I didn't

tee anything up. Toy Story three, where they reset Buzz and he becomes Spanish Buzz, right? Yes, yes. And the question was, how do we translate this joke to Spain? Right. And they made it hyper regional. Right, they made, he's like a basketballs or something. Yes, they made it like a specific dialect

where it's like, we all agree, this type of Spaniard is silly. Number four, The Box Office Griffiths, a big hit from the, you know, sort of leftover from Oscar season. It's a war film. It's a war film. It's a black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, black, a, in my opinion, a very good movie.

One of the simsiest movies of the 20th century. You seen black Hawk down Ridley Scott's black. Oh yeah. I used to love black. Yeah, obviously, you know, used to love Black Hawk Down. 21st century. Yeah, obviously, you know, somewhat problematic movie for some people. I think that's the point of the movie, but it's an argument to be had, because obviously the movie's about them shooting Somalians, essentially. I think it's about, you know, how war turns into, like, video game characters, basically. But it's certainly of an era of war movies that didn't necessarily

interrogate that, you know, I think the interrogation has to happen with you mostly because Ridley Scott's whole thing is like, it's just really as it fucking gets mate. Even though of course my other favorite thing about Black Hawk Down is like 90% of the actors are British where it's like all these Americans being like, yee-haw, let's go get them boys. I'm just like British, British, British, British, British. Australian, Irish.

A couple of Australians, and then Josh Hartnett's like, hey. Scottish. Hey. Right. In the defense, Josh Hartnett was about as American as you could get at that moment. Josh Hartnett, by the way.

He looks like a jarhead. And also is like who McTiernan should have hired for Rollerball. Yeah, yeah. Right? If you're looking in that age range. You know what I kept thinking? I want to see this with Keanu. I mean, that just sounds like a good movie.

Yeah. I mean, make that now. Keanu would probably have to play the genre now. Or he could be like the aging vet. Like who's like, I used to be the king of roller ball, but it ruined me Or just like one last roller ball. He could be an NHL superstar who like can't hack it anymore in the NHL Well, you know what I was thinking?

Because you got to bring the NHL in that's the main part Michael B Jordan very aligned with MGM, right? Because they do the Creed movies with him. Yep, and he did uh without remorse. Correct. Now now MGM and Amazon company or whatever. He for the last 10 years, since Creed hit, about 10 years now, has been trying to remake Thomas Crown Affair, a movie they claim is maybe

close to actually happening. I'm like, if you're gonna remake a McTiernan-Juison movie, Michael B. Jordan would work well in a roller ball. I think he's gotta do both. He's so athletic and he's so angry. I'm not opposed. The only reason I think people won't remake Rollerball is this film. Yes.

Which is not only terrible, but someone went to jail. What if they called it baller rolls and pretended it was original? That sounds bad. That sounds like a spin-off of the HBO show Ballers. Number five at the box office is a family film, Griffin. It's not Big Fat Liar. No. Remake Polar Ball with Paul Giamatti is The Ball.

Yes. And the ball is blue. It's from Disney. It's 2002. It's a family film. It's live action or it's animated? It's live action. It's a live action family film from 2002.

Stars an Oscar winner. Stars an Oscar winner. Stars an Oscar winner in the lead role. The lead role. This film is called Snow Dogs. It stars Cuba Cunin Jr. and James Cobra. It stars two Oscar winners. No obviously, Zach, you were born on the day this film came out, but did you see it in theaters?

Yeah, I think that was one of the first movies I... I went straight from the hospital. You were actually born during a screening of Snow Dogs. I actually don't know if I ever saw that. I remember it being so present as an idea. Yeah. Like, I feel like the trailer was everywhere. Get ready for mush hour. Yeah. But no, I don't know if I saw that one.

I did learn... I learned to speak from watching the trailer though. Did that tagline win the Pulitzer Prize? That tagline is in the Library of Congress. Yes, the rest of the film wasn't let in. They kept it out. No, my favorite thing is that the billing on that film for children about a bunch of huskies doing... What do they do? They raise.

Uh, is Cuba Gooding Jr. and James Coburn. Two Oscar winners above the title Hey Coburn's in this one That movie's a two-hander Coburn is all over. Do you know who Coburn plays? I don't Cuba's father Interesting two very similar men with identical energies cool with identical energies. Cool. Hey, I'm Cuba Cone Jr. Looks like Cisco.

Cisco's also in this film. Cisco, yes. Because I think at the beginning of the movie, Cuba's a dentist. Yeah, he's playing a... And Cisco's his dental hygienist. Dr. Rupert Brooks. And then he's like,

we've discovered you're a long lost father. Here's your lineage. You've inherited a bunch of dogs, but also your dad's still alive, and you need to race together. I think, I think that's what the movie is. That movie is paired with kangaroo Jack, which does the same thing a year later.

And both movies do it to pretty wild success or both hits. Yes. So dogs did, did fine. 81 mil snow dog racing in kangaroo Jack, kangaroo Jack and snow dogs, both do the same thing where the trailers feature a bunch of footage of the animals talking and saying funny things and you're like, oh, this is a funny talking animal movie. And then you see it. And in both movies, there is one scene where the human being is knocked out and has a nightmare where the animals talk to them. Right. Otherwise they

don't talk. Right. So the lawsuit was avoided because they do talk. It was avoided. Right. But like snow dogs has a scene where Kubica and juniors like can cussed and then he sees all the snow dogs like sitting in like bar collangers and they're like, these humans are silly, huh? And they're like toasting cocktails. And I remember seeing the trailer at some movie with Romlee, my little sister, at that point was five and she's like, gotta see that. And then we sit there the whole time, she's like, when the dogs gonna talk? And Kangaroo Jack, same thing. The trailer was all him rapping. That's one nightmare sequence that Jerry O'Connell has.

See, this is why the Ana de Armas fans have a point, and in my opinion, a case. I think it's self-afflicted. Sure. What if you, suddenly I like check your socials and I'm like, Zach's tweeting a lot about Ana de Armas. It's just like a picture of her like getting Dunkin' Donuts and you're like, looking good,

Queen. I mean, look, Zach made some bad real estate investments and he needs to be rewarded $5 million in the yesterday case now. Also in the top 10, you've got The Count of Monte Cristo, the pretty robust Kevin Reynolds. I like that movie, Caviezel and Pierce. Yeah. Just a fun old fashioned sword movie. Swashbuckling. You got A Beautiful Mind, which won the Academy Award for best picture. I like that movie. Caviezel and Pierce. Just a fun old fashioned sword movie.

You got A Beautiful Mind, which won the Academy Award for Best Picture. A big hit. Big hit? Huge hit. I just want you to note the pause I took of self-restraint. Good job, buddy. Number eight, A Walk to Remember, the Mandy Moore, Shane West. Yes.

For a second I thought Chris Klein was in that, but Chris Klein was in a different... He's in a different one. ...Sparksian-esque romantic drama. This side of heaven or something. I think Ben's about to perk up because it's a film about some prophecies involving the Mothman. Interesting. A film Ben has pitched no less than five times for an episode. I think we have to do it on Ben's choice. That is becoming...

It would be delightful. It would. Delightful is the first word I think of when the Mothman prophecies are in front. When that film starts, it's like Richard Gere and Laura Linney, right? It's like a pretty, you know, prestigious. Kind of Tony Actors. And they're like, have you ever heard of the Mothman? And I'm just like leaning forward, like the Mothman and I'm just like leaning forward like the Mothman Number 10 I am Sam maybe one of the more misguided films ever made Yeah, yeah that movie was I believe written and directed

I am Sam. Yes, okay by Molly Gordon's mother Jesse Nelson. Yes. Okay. Yep You're right who also married to Brian Gordon another director. It was a big TV director Justin Nelson's mother. Jesse Nelson? Yes. Okay. Yep. You're right. Who also married to Brian Gordon, another director. Correct. He was a big TV director, I want to say. Yeah. But she also originated.

I went on a rabbit hole of watching bad holiday movies over the holiday season, ones I hadn't seen before that I had avoided. She also directed Karina Karina, which is a pretty good movie. That's a pretty solid movie. She originated the premise for Fred Klaus because it started out as a bedtime story She told now star Molly Gordon and in Fred Claus Molly Gordon is name-checked There's a scene where Fred Claus has been good or bad or whatever and he's like, okay Let's get a bike for Molly go another movie with the big fat liar himself

Giamatti slays in that thing, right? He? He slays in the sleigh in that thing Slays in that thing with bells on Can I just lift that movie features? Academy Award nominee perhaps winner by the time this episode comes out It could happen Paul Giamatti Academy Award nominee Miranda Richardson Absolutely

Academy Award winner Kathy Bates Yep Academy Award winner Rachel Weisz We're getting to a but but Absolutely. Academy Award winner, Kathy Bates. Yep. Academy Award winner, Rachel Weisz. We're getting to a but. But two time Academy Award winner, Kevin Spacey. Yeah. That thing is like fucking loaded.

That's Fred Klaus? Fred Klaus. It was the follow up to Wedding Crashers, right? For David Dobkin. Yes. He had the juice. It's a blank check movie. Never seen.

Have you seen Fred Klaus? I know you were like negative two when that came out. Yeah, I wasn't allowed to watch Fred Claus That movie is a nightmare. Yeah, you're not a fan, right? No, it's a it's a night It's the weirdest combination of like isn't it time to give Vince Vaughn his elf like that was clearly the calculation, right? Jesse Nelson had written that script it sit around for a while sat around for a while and Vince Vaughn They were like we'll pay you 20 million dollars you've reteamed with the wedding crashers guy bring your edgy ratatat dialogue style

fucking asshole energy But they're really trying to go for like this is a Santa Claus this is elf It's gonna start out a little nasty and it's gonna win you over with charm. And the style is so incompatible. They also like 90% of the elves in the movie are played by little people. But then John Michael Higgins is also like shrunk down. Ludicrous.

Ludicrous. There are a couple big actors who they do tiny face replacement on. Oh boy. And the effect is not there. Yeah, also Elizabeth Banks is also an elf, but she's just regular size, normal size. And John Michael Higgins wants a piece and a lot of movies,

Fred Claus trying to teach him how to be more of an aloof asshole. So she falls for him. I have seen that. You're like, wait, that I remember laughing at so strange. Okay. Well, it received negative reviews I'm seeing here, but why are we even talking about it? Because that didn't come out. Yeah. Justin Ellison, director of I Am Sam.

Yeah, and I Am Sam was that Dakota Fanning's? Yeah. Yes, that's the film where Sean Penn is a sort of intellectually disabled person, although they don't really get into it. Who's also a single father. Who is also a single father to an adorable child played by Dakota Fanning. And she's now reaching the age where her mental capacity is exceeding his and it becomes a custody battle and with the state and she is Genuinely like astonishing in it like everything else about the movie is god-awful, right? And she's so natural and cute right that she almost got an Oscar nomination instead. They gave Sean Pan an Oscar nomination

Yeah, which is illegal. I mean, it literally becomes the Tropic Thunder bit. Yes, it's the backbone of the Tropic Thunder bit. Yes. I have heard... Elle Fanning plays baby Dakota in that movie. I have heard their voices so much over the past week because I had COVID, my entire family had COVID, my daughter is obsessed with My

Neighbor Totoro. Which is just Dakota the English dub of the most recent dub. It's just Dakota and Elle the whole time. But it must have been right around that time, right? They're kids. They're both kids. And they're both very good in it. I mean, it's a totally well-executed dub. I thought you were gonna say she's obsessed with Equalizer 3.

And she's just fucking obsessed with Equalizer 3 and who's the great? Yeah, exactly exactly playing them on No, just every every you know Six hours total. I won't watch total. Oh, all right Dakota kind of eats an equalizer three Yeah, you finally watched it closer three rocks So good and the fact that it is a Denzel Dakota man on fire reunion is like sweet. And then you're like, they're not really doing enough with it.

And then the ending kind of gets you back. You're like, yeah, I'm not going to spoil it for the listener, but I told you this and you were skeptical that the twist kind of gets you. Twist is good. The closing. You feel silly for not seeing it coming. But did you see that every one of those movies they make for like seventy five million and they make like 250 million. Clockwork.

And we're definitely gonna get another one better. But it hurts. I will, I want to tell you something, Zach, and then we should wrap the episode. And I know you couldn't see Equalizer 1 and 2 in theaters because you were too young. I only just was allowed to start watching those. So the Equalizer made $101 million domest domestically, just America, on release. How much did it open to, David?

That's a great question. It's also important to what you're about to say. Its opening weekend was 34 million dollars. Okay. 34, 101. Equalizer 2. The equalizer 2 made 102 million dollars. It opened to?

36 mil. OK. OK. Just like the fact that this is a character so committed to equal. Equal. Yeah. That he's like, if I make a two, we add one dollar to the total, essentially. Here's what's frustrating. Equalizer three opens to? Thirty four million dollars. Basically the same opening as all the others.

It splits the difference between the two. It made 92. I just needed to make an extra $9 million. They need to re-release that thing in IMAX now. They need to re-release it on 40,000 screens so that people are just fooled into buying tickets somehow. They need to promise everyone who goes to see it that they will be refunded $100. Just so we can get this thing to 103.

The revenue. It's fine if you, you know, it's fine if you pay it back. Because I need Equalizer 4 to happen. He needs to die making these movies. He needs to make them for four more decades. I think he wants to. I think he's basically the only thing... The only sequel he's ever made, right? Yes. And now he's made three of them.

I think he's like kind of the only thing holding society together at this point. Robert McCall. This man is so good at fucking equalizing shit. Especially in equalizer three, he's like he living in a small Italian town. And it's truly like it feels like he's like, yeah, Home Depot. That was pretty good. Right. Being friends with Orson Bean or whatever equalizer two was was about that was pretty good. This is the most equal way of life. Like living in this town where I go get my fish, go talk to the lady making coffee. Once I finally got equal pill and I was trying to sell you on these movies David I'm like each one

of them features 40 minutes of just Denzel even keel daily routine. And the third one just nails the formula because they're like, you know what this guy does He has a nice espresso every afternoon talks to the coffee lady And then some guy comes in he's like I am a gangster and I'm like if Denzel doesn't rip this guy's throat out right away I'm gonna be so mad. This guy's got to die. I will spoil the vibe the third equalizer Robert McCall Becomes so violent. Yeah that he may be becoming the monster. Well, this is interesting territory for equalizer four.

He's unequal. I think that would be interesting to explore because he starts really working out some issues with his... Look, this man, he's experienced a lot of tragedy, right? I think there's some unresolved emotional issues with him. He's looking for a sense of peace. He cannot find it. Or equality. Right.

Well, this man, he demands equality. I wish, I do feel like they lose the watch thing. I like the watch thing, this feeling that he's like Steven Soderbergh where he's like, I'm in competition with myself. I'm trying to equalize things faster than I did last time. But he's a little older. Maybe, you know, maybe he's like Steven Soderbergh where he's like I'm in competition with myself I'm trying to equalize things faster than I did last time but he's a little older maybe you know maybe he's shuffling yeah more shuffling how old is that so now 60 69 he is 69 my friend I don't forget names like that I was trying to be polite so I said 70.

Yeah, no, no, man. My dude is partying this year. He's trying out some different orientations of his body. We're done. Can I just say one last thing? Because you brought up Dakota and Al Fanning. Do you know they were making an adaptation of, I think it was going to be called The Nightingale, some best-selling book that they were going to star in together the first time being in a movie as adults, that Melanie Laurent was directing

as a big Columbia Pictures production that got halted during the pandemic. I think they maybe filmed a week. It got shut down. It has never resumed filming. Weird. Isn't it? It was like a big announced thing of like,

we bought this bestselling book, we're reteaming them out Mellie Ross quietly been making very good films in France as a director this was sort of her step up and then the movies just they keep delaying it sorry I'll turn the lights back on I know that was kind of weird yeah we did that way too long in the dark to be fair we couldn't afford to keep the mics on in light. So we had to, it was a production workaround. And that's no citations on Wikipedia for that. Yes, citation needed for that fact.

Zach, you're the best in the best. Thank you for watching Rollerball. Oh, I was happy to. I was thrilled. Did you, no, you watched it on Tubi, you said. I was going to ask if thrilled. Did you did you know you watched on to be you said I was gonna ask if you bought digital copy and Honestly the Jarring commercial interruptions somewhat worked for the themes of the I could see that the naked

Commercialism of to be just like in the middle of someone saying a lie being like erectile dysfunction like in the middle of someone saying a line being like erectile dysfunction. Okay, sure. Yeah. Here we go. To be also does the thing where they're like, there's no ads for 45 minutes and then there's eight ads for the next 45 minutes. You can't get a rhythm. You can't figure out how. Yeah. They're also, there's no one like trying to design ad breaks deliberately. They're just like, yeah, just pick a number. It'll happen in the middle of a line. Yes, in the middle of a word. Brief to be aside.

Please. For Christmas, my wife got me a poster of 100, like, essential horror films. It's a scratch off poster. Humblewreck. It's amazing. One of the best gifts I've ever received. That is. We've been going back.

So you scratch it off and then you watch it? You watch it, then scratch it off, because often there's like a reveal that you wouldn't get until you've seen the movie. They're crossing off the list and they're giving you a tidbit you wouldn't. Yes. Now that you're on the other side, you can learn. It might be like the twist is revealed

behind the scratch off whatever. Right. But we've been going back from the beginning chronologically and watching like, what is it? Doctor, Doctor. Testament of Doctor Mabou? No, like Doctor something's cabinet of... It's like, considered the first...

Dr. Caligari. Oh, yeah. Cabinet of Dr. Caligari. It's like, considered the first horror movie. So we've been watching all these 1920s silent movies, but on Tubi. And if you want jarring, you go from Dr. Caligari straight to... Oregon music. Straight to, like, a man and woman being like,

we don't have enough money for groceries. And just like slapping stuff on the table. Are you depressed? Like it's amazing. That is really funny. Have you had, have you watched stuff online that is interrupted by your own ad breaks? Cause you had a robust commercial campaign

where you were popping up regularly on shit. I was getting fed your ad a lot. I watched like the US Open, you know, but not like in a 2B style. I was getting it, I was definitely getting it online because like I don't have cable, I don't watch anything on broadcast anymore, and I definitely remember watching shit online having interrupted by you saying I'm a very big deal. The US Open, yes. But that was like, you know, linear TV. Okay.

If I watch Bosch Legacy on Free V, I've never watched a Free V show. That one, I have to watch ads, right? Like, there's no way to pay the way out of the ads. Free V is Amazon's ad-supported streaming service. Unlike Amazon Prime Video, a streaming service that they've now decided to add ads to. Yeah, but it at least they know it. Right. They're actually placed with some. Yes. Yes. It's designed with intent, with purpose. Right. Right. Right. Zach, you're the best.

Best in the biz. Best in the biz. Ever watch Severance? Whenever that happens. You're so fucking good in You Hurt My Feelings. Oh, thanks You're so fucking good in You Hurt My Feelings. Oh, thanks. You are so good in You Hurt My Feelings. So fucking good. Thank you. Was that fun to make?

Yeah, it was great. Super fun. I love her movies, so it's like super psyched to get to do that. I'm always a fan of Everything You Do. I think you always kill it, but that role is just like, just straight three pointers.

You really hurt Tobias Mendes. Yeah, yeah. You really do is just like straight three pointers. You really hurt Tobias. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You really do. Yeah, it was fun. It was fun. Is there anything else you want to plug? I'm trying to think of what else. When's when's

baking show coming back? Baking show, the celebrity holiday special. The second one of that is already out on Roku Channel. Who are the celebrity contests? There's a bunch. And I could list them off the top of my head, but I'm not allowed.

I'm too young to... It looks like DeAndre Jordan was part of it, NBA center DeAndre Jordan. I only follow roller ball. I don't know other athletes. Eggo Nwadim from Saturday Night Live. Phoebe Robinson, Joel McHale. The Great.

It was a fun bunch. Arturo Casso. It was a lot of fun. And then the main season I think will be out sometime in, I don't know. Casey Wilson this season? Yes, Casey Wilson is co-hosting this season. You were filming while we were doing George Lucas stuff in Edinburgh, so we got to hang out, which was really nice.

Yeah, that was fun. You stopped, you dropped across the pond. Yeah, hopped on the old choo-choo and made my way up to Edinburgh. It was great. Edinburgh. Edinburgh. We'll have you on again soon, Zach. The next time we find a movie whose trailer led to a loss.

There must be trailer-based litigation. Yeah. Maybe that, what was that movie Zach Galifianakis was in right after the hangover? Lumineers or something, or no, not Lumineers. Visioneers. Visioneers. Where he was like in the trailer a lot. Yeah. And that was his only.

Yeah. So I'll sue someone about that. And then we can talk about that. You sue the hell out of what poor indie filmmaker Your next episode happen by starting your own loss. Yeah Thank you. You're the best and and and you know, who else is the best our listeners I would never say an untoward word about them. We love them unabashedly and they've never driven us crazy Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate review and subscribe and they've never driven us crazy. Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate, review, and subscribe. Thank you to Murray Barty, our associate producer on the show,

AJ McKeon production coordinator, Alex Barron for our editing, Lane Montgomery in the Great American Novel for our theme song, Joe Bowen, Pat Reynolds for our artwork, JJ Burch for our research. As we said, more McTiernan crime info coming next week on basic but also if you go to blank check pod.com links some real nerdy shit including our patreon blank check special features where you're doing commentaries on the Terminator franchise but also doing a full episode on Pelicana special episode on Sin Eater

the documentary about this. The crimes of Anthony Pelicano. Yeah. That'll be posting. Oh, you know what? That's already posted. Okay, well then. It just posted. Look, go listen to that.

Yep. Tune next week for Basic. Yep. The finale. That's it. Yeah. Travolta and... Jackson, together again.

Travolta and Jackson, together again. No other things to say about him. And as always, Chris Cline should have gotten a Best Supporting Actor nomination for his role as Oz in American pop. He's good in it!