Blank Check with Griffin & David - Stop Making Sense with Demi Adejuyigbe

Episode Date: December 8, 2019

Everyone wants to get to the pod with guest Demi Adejuyigbe, where The Blank Check Boys talk about Demme's Concert Film with the Talking Heads. What shows should get gritty reboots? Why did concert films stop existing?  What is the song Heaven about (what isn't it about?) Have you seen DJ Khaled's Slack channel? And what would David Byrne sound like ordering a Bacon, Egg, and Cheese? One of the great things is that there's no talking heads about the Talking Heads, it's just a great show.   SFX: "Lock: Unlock" by cemagar. Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License.

Hi! I've got a podcast I want to play. Everyone is trying to get to the pod. The name of the pod. The pod is called Blank Check. Oh, Blank Check. Blank Check is a place. A place where nothing, nothing ever happens. I didn't change any of the words for that part.

No, but it's true. Yeah. On target. Very, words for that part. No, but it's true. Yeah. On target. Very, very point of criticism. I also said it's a place. Yes. I thought you were going to go for it. Thank you for sending me a podcast.

Blank check is a pot. I was like, nah, I can't do pot again. I can't do podcast. You know what? Of course, we all know. As Thor told us. Oh, blank check is a people, not a podcast. I don't even know what you're setting up. Oh, Blank Check is a people, not a podcast? I don't even know

what you're setting up. Well, Asgard is a people, not a place. I was like, too many Thor quotes. Blank Check is a place, not a podcast. That's my fuzzy math. Yeah. I think that's stupid. I think Blank Check is a feeling. I think it's a feeling. Yeah, yeah. Okay, okay. I'm on you with that.

Yes. For me, Blank Check is a feeling. I think it's a feeling. Yeah, yeah. Okay, okay. I'm on you with that. Yes. Yes. For me, blank check is a question posed at the listener. How much of this shit can you take? And you answer right now, I couldn't disagree more. Well, you know, it's funny you bring that up because we threw open to our listeners a challenge, a vote. Did you? To name this miniseries. Yeah. We're discussing the films of Jonathan Demme. Right, this of course is Blank Check. It's a podcast about filmography. It's directed by a master of success

earlier on in their career. You seem so exhausted of this. Blank Check's to make whatever crazy passion projects they want and sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce. Baby. This is a miniseries on the films of Jonathan Demme. Of course. And we're whimsical fellows and we like to take one on the films of Jonathan Demme. Of course, and we're whimsical fellows and we like to take one of the movies the director made

and then change the title so it has the word podcast in it. Oh, how whimsical. And we said, which of these should we pick? And with a resounding... Yeah, it was a majority. Yes. Stop making podcasts, which felt a little bit... A little pointed.

A little pointed. Oh, great. So this is the tit little bit. A little pointed. A little pointed. Oh, great. So this is the titular episode. That's true. I'm surprised it's not pod making cast. Would have been nicer. Kind of would have been nicer. Less rude.

Pod making checks. Right. I mean, to be fair, we did give them the option. Okay. Yes. Right. We gave them a lot of options. You should never give your audience an option to stop making podcasts.

No. Right. And also, I mean, like the silence of the podcast would have been mean in its own way, I suppose. Right. That's why you did the smart thing, which was just decide to stop making podcasts. Yeah, I kind of went, there's no end to this. What if I just choose it? Yeah.

Yeah. Well, too bad, because now you're a permanent guest on this podcast. All right. Ben, hit, yeah, lock the doors. Hit the button. Lock the gates. Lock the gates. Hit the button. Lock the gates. That's fair.

This is a mystery on the films of Jonathan Deming. It's called Stop Making Podcasts. And today we're talking about Stop Making Sense, a movie which spurred me to text David at 1130 last night and say,

is this the most perfect movie ever made? It's so good. There's kind of an argument. It's a pretty unambiguously perfect movie. Right. Or perfect thing. Perfect anything. Are you guys covering all of his documentaries? We are not. No. Okay. Because that would take a very long time. Yes, it would. He made

five Neil Young movies alone. Sure. Today. Today. And he's not even alive anymore. No, he's not. It's just him going to concerts and being, I gotta do something with all this footage I took from the audience yeah no because he made one two three four

five six seven eight nine documentaries total including this one this is and a ten if you include Swimming to Cambodia which is sort of like and I don't

there you go fine that's why we put it behind the paywall yeah so this is I suppose this is us acknowledging his nonfiction work.

Yes. Which, unfortunately, we just do not have the time to completely cover. Yes. You should cover his TV work as well. The Pilot of a Gifted Man. Yeah, that Patrick Wilson show. Is that him? Yeah.

Three episodes of SNL. Right. The Killing. What else we got? He directed an episode of The Killing. Oh, that one. Seven Seconds on Netflix, which was released after he died. Oh, Right. The Killing. What else we got? He directed an episode of The Killing. Oh, that one. Seven Seconds on Netflix, which was released

after he died. Oh, weird. That's right. Oh my God. Even weirder, it's a show about the death of Jonathan Demme. No one knows

if I'm telling the truth or not, because I don't think anyone's ever heard of that show. Roy Scheider plays Jonathan Demme? Yeah, what if Netflix

just starts announcing, like, yeah, we're, I don't know, we're rebooting Jaws and Zazie Beetz is in it. Call us on it. Try and find it. You know what I would love? It's up there right now.

Try and find it. You know the way that Netflix just bought You from Lifetime and then was like, it's a Netflix original. They bought David Sims, of course, in an overall deal. But they also bought the Penn Badgley star You. You've spoken about this on the podcast. It's like your bugbear. This is a new joke I'm going to make. Aired on Lifetime in its totality.

Four people watched it. Nine months later, Netflix stamps an original on the title, and it becomes their fourth most watched show in history or whatever. Eight trillion people watch it, according to the recent data. Right, right, right. What if they just started doing that with other pre-existing things? Yeah, Grey's Anatomy.

They took 75's Jaws and were like, it's a Netflix original. Yeah, right. They could very well do that. They could do that. We made this, yeah. Steven Spielberg, he's what? Call him.

Perfect Strangers? That was us. Netflix original. They'd buy anything with strange in the title Tony also directed a Columbo episode did he? well that must have been early

right? quite early well you mean early it was just a fake idea he was like I know it's done but I have an idea

for Columbo you guys don't remember Columbo 2017? I would genuinely watch no I wouldn't I was gonna say I genuinely an idea for Columbo. You guys don't remember Columbo 2017? I would genuinely watch No, I wouldn't. I was going to say I'd genuinely watch a new Columbo, but I'm like, I don't have the time. I would love for someone else

to make a Columbo and for me to go damn, this sounds pretty nice. Do you know what's the one I saw floated on Netflix? You just described TV development in this decade. Netflix, please get in contact. I have an idea. Skip the thing you just heard. I'll tell you about it in person.

The thing I saw float on Netflix. On Netflix. Sorry. Netflix on the brain. The thing I saw people float on Twitter that is a genuinely good idea is Mark Ruffalo doing Columbo. Yeah. Yeah. Right?

That's good. Yeah. Yeah. You need like a squinty guy like that. A rumpled man. Yeah. You need That's good. Yeah. Yeah. You need like a squinty guy like that. A rumpled man. Yeah, you need a rumple. If we can't get Mark Ruffalo, and it's got to be a squinty guy, I think French Stewart is available.

Come on, French Stewart. One last question. Gilbert Gottfried is going to be the new Columbo? I think he did it. He is rumpled. Has any man looked more like Laundrie than Gilbert Gottfried? That's what I'm saying. It looks like you just unrolled him.

Just a small bag of Laundrie. Yeah. A little pint-sized bag of Laundrie. Interesting. I guess we've got a mystery on our hands. What's he doing right now? Gilbert Gottfried? Yeah, Gil.

Having a nice sandwich in the park. That sounds nice. He's like touring like a fiend. Guys, I realized this. I realized this today, just shortly before coming here. Today, the day we're recording this, is the 35th anniversary of Stop Making Sense.

This is the day. Gilbert Gottfried. Gilbert Gottfried Stop Making Sense. Yeah. He's sitting in a park to commemorate. You are absolutely right. This film came out 35 years ago. Yeah. He's sitting in a park to commemorate. You are absolutely right. This film came out 35 years ago. Crazy. This very night.

On this very October 18th in the United States. The release date that matters. Yes. Yeah. It got a theatrical release.

100%. It did? Yeah. They raised the budget for it which was 1.22 million by themselves, and it made $5.1 million. Holy shit. Yeah. And also played in

West Germany, the Netherlands. It won a bunch of awards. It came in third place in the National Board of Review's Best Film of the Year, along with winning Best Documentary. I know they say Jonathan Demme got Best Director for Silence of the Lambs,

but that's right. That was for this, right? Yeah, it was to make a movie. I mean, this film is just like... I mean... Well, I mean, we're gonna dig into it. When Demme was... So, Jonathan Demme. I'm David Simms. We shouldn't shoot us our guesses. Griffin Newman, our guest today, of course, by fan demand. Returning. Yes. Returning. Hashtag Demme on Demme. I kind of

did also demand myself. I was just like, hey, I'll do this. It was a fine demand. Yes. Returning. Hashtag Demi on Demi. I kind of did also demand myself. I was just like, hey, I'll do this. It was a fine demand. But look, we were very surprised by Demi winning. He was in our bracket, as you know, and he was, you know, plowing through big names. He was knocking them aside. But I think a lot of the reason was a couple friends of the show, such as yourself, vouching for him and saying, I would cover this.

We saw a big Adige Webe bump. We did. Well, it's a famous bump. It's a big bump. I start talking, people are like, I guess we got to do that Columbo series now. But Emily Vanderwerf coming up on this miniseries. Bobby Finger, Lindsay Weber coming up on this miniseries.

People who said like, here's my case for Demi. This is the episode I would want to do. And people got excited at the prospect of those episodes. And this was a big, we've had people for the last nine months saying Demi is coming on. Right? People, yeah, people have asked me like, are you still going to do Stop Making Sense? I'm like, yes.

That's nice. You sort of booked a trip around this. I did. We've been talking for like nine months and we were like, let's just figure out roughly the time that it makes sense for you to come to New York. I was like, look, I like New York. I'll probably have something to do around there later. And I didn't.

But then I was like, I'd like to take a vacation around New England and just. Sure. You were in upstate New York I saw on your Instagram. Yeah, a very nice time. Went to Albany and drove around. That's not important here. Well, I don't know. You've been going through something of a creative reset that I have very much envied.

Sure. It's like at the end of Mad Men. Yes. When he invents the coke ad. I'm hoping I drive around New England and then I just get, ding, interior. I don't have it yet,

but it's going to be Columbo. It's definitely going gonna start indoors though yeah shit could be outdoors fuck fuck the only way you could pitch

the best way to pitch Columbo to Netflix or whatever would be to go in pitch like six just bullshit ideas and they're like what we thought we

you're like okay I mean it was nice to meet you and you're like great nice to meet you too you walk out and then you're like

one more thing though yeah you turn around you're like whoa wait one Nice to meet you, too. You walk out and then you're like, one more thing, though. Yeah. You turn around and you're like, whoa, wait, one more thing. And then you open your long coat to reveal a full pitch deck for Columbo. And it's like, wait, this was the thing the whole time? One more thing. Correct. And they're like, well, universalize the rights to those.

And you're like, oh, okay, I'll see you later. One more thing. And then you plug your USB drive into their projector. One second, one second. It's one of these folders. Oh, God. One more thing, and then you plug your USB drive into the projector. One second, one second. It's one of these folders. Oh, God. Windows. Oh, boy.

Wait, but you Photoshopped a deck for perfecter strangers for nothing? Perfecter strangers. They should make perfect stranger things. Yeah. They should. Right? That's a thing. I don't know.

I could probably sell that. They're both in the 80s. That's it. That's all you need. Sounds good. I mean, isn't this, now it's just Stranger Things? Like, they're like, we all love Clueless. And I'm like, we do.

And they're like, what if? And I'm like, I don't know. And they're like, it's like a drama. And it's like, you know, there's weird mystery and like maybe something supernatural. And I'm like, oh, cool. The opposite of what I like about Clueless. Literally the upside down to the Clueless I like. Now, the Breakfast Club.

What if we're actually having breakfast? Okay. Here's the thing. Okay. We're having breakfast. I love breakfast. Sounds good. And then one of them gets murdered.

What? Yeah. No, but you love the Breakfast Club, right? You kids ain't leaving attention until you figure out who murdered this one. Yeah. Can Columbo be on the case? Okay. Let's just every single popcorn.

Yeah, all of it. It's like that Games Master Anthony guy, but reference for no one in the room. That's fine. So the thing about Stop Making Sense, I have a confession to make. Okay. This is the only Jonathan Demme movie I've ever seen.

You've never seen The Silence of Yon Lambs? I have not seen The Silence of Yon Lam? I have not seen The Silence of Lam or Philadelphia or even, despite being me, Ricky, and The Flash. It's got both

for the price of one. I know. I've seen one. Yeah. I've not seen The Flash. That's crazy. You never saw Rachel Get Married?

No. I was invited, but couldn't make it. I never saw... Did you get a plus one? You never swam to Cambodia? No, that's why I didn't go Did you get a plus one? You never swam to Cambodia. No, that's why I didn't go. Gotcha.

Right, right. You never heard the truth about Charlie. I'm running out of it. You are still unmarried to the mob, right? Correct. I know Melvin. Don't know Howard very well. What else?

Seven seconds. Well, you watched that, obviously. I went through his Wikipedia, and I was like, I've got it. I've seen some. Oh, nothing. that, obviously. I went through his Wikipedia and I was like, I've got to have seen some. Oh, nothing. None of it. Well, one, I would say, check him out. He's good.

He's a cool dude. He made a movie you like. Yeah, well, a lot of people made movies I like. Right, but I'm going to watch their work. But number two, as Demi was sort of, you know, gaining steam in the bracket and some people were sort of like, oh, Demi, like steam in the bracket and some people were sort of like, oh, Demi, does he have a thing? He's kind of

a everyman or a motley, weird filmography. And it's like, yeah, but one, Silence of the Lambs, obviously hugely influential. One of the most important movies ever made. Right. And two, he basically invented and perfected the concert movie and has never been beaten with it.

Here's what's interesting. So there's – on the Blu-ray they have – they did like an hour-long press conference at the San Francisco Film Festival maybe. It was the 15th anniversary. I believe that's where this debuted. It was the 15th anniversary of where the film had premiered originally. Yeah, it was San Francisco. Yeah, they had done a remaster of the soundtrack. Sure.

This was the first digital audio film? Is that correct? Yes, that's right. Ever? Yes, yes, yes. Yes. So they had remastered the soundtrack and re-released it in 1999. And they did this hour-long press conference that was the first time the band had been reunited in a decade, maybe a little less, and was until they did the Hall of Fame induction in 2002.

Because they were one of those bands that like had a somewhat acrimonious split but also weren't assholes to each other. Yeah. Like that thing where they all seemed to be fairly civil with each other and when there was a reason to come together, didn't let their egos overrun that. Yeah. Yeah. But they did this press conference together and they were talking about how – because I think of it as, oh, right, this is the movie that like crystallizes the concert film, perfects

it, what have you. And they were like, it kind of feels like this was the last concert film. Like they go a little out of vogue after this. And a reason they said was they financed this film themselves, 1.7 million. But after this, the music video really takes off. Right.

This is right around the same time that MTV is launching. And they would rather spend that money per music video and make multiple music videos. Right. Where no one wants to do this. And Demi continues to make a lot of concert films. Yeah.

But they become nicher things. His last movie ever is him doing a Justin Timberlake concert movie for You guessed it. Some say that's what killed him.

Netflix. Yes. It's true. Can I call a timeout real quick? Please. This is going to get very confusing

if we keep going. I know, I know. Can I change my name for the sake of this pod? A hundred percent. What would you like to be called? I don't know. Please. Sure. This is going to get very confusing. We keep going. I know. I know. Can I change my name for the sake of this pod? A hundred percent. What would you like to be called? I don't know. Dave. Cool.

Well, wait a second. Oh, Dave is David. Let's do David. It's cleaner. Okay. But what do you, cause he's David. You're David, right? Yeah.

What do you want to go by? Maybe Demi? Yeah. Right. I'll go by a Jonathan. Great. Okay. Oh, there we go. Jonathan.

Okay, perfect. Oh, boy. So we were talking about Demi. Yes. Music videos, concert movies. I guess that makes sense. But also doesn't it feel like... You should stop making sense.

Huh? You should stop making sense. If it's making sense, you should stop that. Some say I never started. It also feels like the concert film doesn't have a profitable avenue in theaters much anymore. Yes, no. That's a big difference. What are hit concert movies, apart from Stop Making Sense?

Well, there was. You like music? Beyonce's Homecoming is truly like. That's what I was going to say. Yes. Right, but that becomes, right, like an HBO thing. Or like Never Say Never, the Bieber one. That was a genuine hit, right?

It was like Katy Perry's part of me. There was that 3D thing that was the Gwar's put out a bunch those are great real crowd pleasers I love Gwar

there's the period that starts with the Hannah Montana 3D concert which because that tour was selling out so crazy

they were like we should film it so people who can't get into the tour can see it it was supposed to be like a one week theatrical run

and it ended up grossing like $80 million. And then that became like Bieber does it twice, Katy Perry does it, the Jonas Brothers do it, One Direction does it. Like it becomes like big pop acts do it. Here are the top 10 music, top 10 highest grossing music concert films of all time. Number one, Michael Jackson, this is it? No. That is number two. Bieber has him

beat by about a million dollars. For Never Say Never? Yes, exactly. Which is? Finally, children get their revenge. Never Say Never is a great film. Have you folks seen it? No, I have not. I had it on DVD for a period of time. And I don't remember why, but I also did not watch it.

Never Say Never. I will never say never. But this is the other distinction it Never Say Never I will never say never but this is the other distinction Never Say Never is half documentary about the Justin Bieber phenomenon half concert film right and the stuff about the phenomenon

is incredible like it's actually pretty sort of cutting John Chu Crazy Rich Asians director is the filmmaker behind Never Say Never

yeah so it's about Bieber mania as much as it's a concert film. Yeah. And there was, yes, there was This Is It, which came out after he died. Is that right? Holds up perfectly, a thing we'll definitely be discussing soon.

Yes, it came out after he died. That was the tour he was supposed to do. Right. Yes. It's the behind-the-scenes footage of the rehearsals for the concert. Right. And then no one ever talked about that dude again, right? Everyone was like, great. Michael Jackson, book closed, done, put it back up on the shelf, keep it there concert. Right. And then no one ever talked about that dude again. Right. Everyone was like, great.

Michael Jackson, book closed, done. Put it back up on the shelf. Keep it there forever. Number. This Is It is really weird and really morbid. And it's also like they, they, right. They post converted it to 3D because some of the concert was going to be in 3D or whatever. But it's so like they hyped up so much.

It's like, this is his final statement. And then you watch it and you're like, this is two hours of a sick man doing half-energy rehearsals. Right, right, right. I forgot I had all that, like, footage of him getting ready for it. But it is, it's just him, like, running shit in, like,

a unfinished stage. Yeah, it's gross. Number three, the Hannah Montana, Miley Cyrus Best of Both Worlds concert tour. So I guess she like switches wigs, right? She does. She does Hannah half Miley. How far down the list is Bohemian Rhapsody?

Because that really feels like I was there. Wait, is that not a documentary? It is, right? It's got to be. That thing was fact for fact, line for line. It was just pure realism. You know what? I love all the real singing in that thing was fact for fact line for line pure realism you know what I love all the real

singing in that thing too you're just watching a man open his mouth and that voice coming out the wildest thing and I may have brought this up before

is the scene where he is just at the piano and I think just singing happy birthday and even that is like like they've just taken Freddie Mercury singing and like dubbed it over

it's like it sounds like he's in like a recording booth when he's just like at his family home going like happy birthday that's how good it over it's like it sounds like he's in like a recording booth when he's just like at his family home going like happy birthday that's how good he was

it's true it's true he was always professional number four One Direction number five Katy Perry One Direction

directed by I don't know fucking Jonathan Demme John Chu Morgan Spurlock what? oh of course oh boy

how weird is everything? as we go down this list, isn't everything strange? One for him, one for the studios. So you got Katy Perry. You got the Jonas Brothers. These are all in the same like five years. The Katy Perry one's kind of fascinating because it's half about her divorce to Russell Brand. Right, right.

And then you have 91's Madonna, Truth or Dare, which was more of a classic concert movie, right? But also a little more of a, like, on the road with Madonna movie. Yeah, yeah, right, right, right. And, like, the posters, like, her in bed. Yeah. It's, you know, ooh. It's going to be intimate. The fact that this movie has nothing but the concert.

Well, that's why one of the billion reasons it's so perfect is that there's not some fucking behind the scenes like handheld camera and like David Burns like ooh we're getting ready talking heads there's no pretense of like this is what they're really like it's like okay we know this is like fake and constructed this is a performance

they're going to give you a fucking show of your life and it's right just to finish this up G, the 3D concert movie. Oh, right. Which I directed, actually. Of course. Good job. Number nine is U2 3D, which I think was pretty recent.

I forgot about that. Yeah. And the number 10 is Rattle and Hum, the old YouTube movie that kind of tanked their careers for a second, where Bono is like- The devil? Yeah. Yes. No, no, no.

That's later. Where Bono's like, Charles Manson took Helter Skelter from the Beatles and we're taking it back. He's like just full ego mode. What a guy. Where he's like, play the blues, Edge. Play the blues. Yeah.

No? No one? No, yeah. I'm not seeing it. I said yeah. So yeah, the concert movie boom really was just for a few years there. That 3D run for like six or seven years. Apart from that, I mean, there's the clown.

Yeah, there was a Prince, the Sign of the Times. Right. There's some Neil Young ones. Last Waltz. I mean, Woodstock. You have a lot of festival, Monterey Pop. Right. Yeah, sure. One that stuck out to me, Monterey Pop. Right. Yeah, sure.

One that stuck out to me, I remember The Carter. It was about Lil Wayne. He tried fighting it because the filmmakers left in scenes of when he's all messed up on Liquid Cody. In front of his daughter, right? It's really not a good look. It's super dark. Yeah. But it's also that thing of read your contract.

Wasn't there a Ron Howard Jay-Z movie what? I swear to god there was a movie called Fade to Black that was when Jay-Z said he was retired directed by Ron Howard it's called Made in America actually but yes

is there not a movie called Fade to Black? I don't fucking know I think Ron Howard directed it the one that Ron Howard directed is called Made in America. Okay. You definitely just made some execs go like, wait a minute. And they're calling both Jay-Z and Ron Howard tonight. The one you're talking about is a different director.

It's a different director. Not Ron Howard. Yes. Okay. So there are two different Jay-Z movies. Yes. This fucking movie. Well, here's the thing.

Okay, so you're saying, like, it's weird that this is the only Demi I've seen. Yeah. In many directors' careers, that would be like, well, then you haven't really seen their movies. I mean, the concert documentary they're directing, that's not, like, really one of their films.

Right. Whereas this is one of his major films. 100%. It's also, like, one of the first times I've seen a performance thing directed in a way where I can tell, like, the director's influence. Right. They didn't just, like one of the first times I've seen a performance thing directed in a way where I can tell like the director's influence. Right.

They didn't just like turn the cameras on and point it at the stage. Or just go like, okay, well we'll edit this. Like it feels like there are times where he's like, well, this one's going to be presented entirely in closeups. We're going to like shoot just on David Byrne for this like dancing sequence and things. And I'm like, how much, I wonder how much input he had just even into like choreography or in the being like well we want to

follow like the crew coming onto stage with them like it's also yes I mean this is this is one of the few documentaries by a largely fiction filmmaker

where you can observe everything that makes them important as a filmmaker within this film yes you know this can be the only Jonathan Demme

film you've seen and you have a sense of who he was as a person and as a filmmaker within this film. You know, this can be the only Jonathan Demme film you've seen and you have a sense of who he was as a person and as a filmmaker. Everyone is screaming, no! Watch others! I mean, you should watch others. You should! Good movies. I can't believe we never saw Sons of Lambs. I just feel like that's a movie people just are forced to see at some point. Yeah, that's so crazy, David. I mean, I went to

film school. I really should. I don't know. It's one of those things that like, I don't know, there's so many big movies where it's like, I can't believe I haven't seen that yet. Silence should be near top of that list. Although that's because we just recently re-watched it and are jamming on it so fucking hard. We are jamming on it hard. That episode's coming up soon.

But it is great. It is one of those movies I worry that if you see it for the first time now, you're like... Because it's so invented that sort of like crime, sort of the master psychopath type, right? Like it will feel like, oh, well, I've seen this, right? I think it is so absorbing that you're like, oh, this is why everyone else does this because this is the time it was done perfectly. The Talking Heads wanted to do a concert film. By all accounts, they thought it was like the next step.

They were obviously a very conceptual band. I mean if we want to go back further, Talking Heads are that fascinating like subgenre of like art projects that become legitimate bands. like art projects that become legitimate bands. You know, groups that start like Devo and GWAR as sort of more like conceptual, like performance pieces or projects and then end up becoming like actual hit bands. They were a RISD group, right? They came out of Rhode Island School of Design.

I did not know that. Bunch of buds doing weird stuff. Except for Jerry Harrison. Right, he comes in a little later, right? Who was in The Modern Lovers. Yes. It's a Harvard band with Jonathan Richman, which is a great, great band. But it's a band that everyone in it went on to do something else amazing, but they broke

up before they even released their first album. And their first album is perfect. Yep. Yeah. Their only album. But they go from being a RISD band to then being one of the bands in like the first major CBGB's wave. Right, right, right. And where everyone else in CBGB's is like—

Their first gig was opening for the Ramones. Yeah. Yeah. Like the crazy—the juxtaposition of who they were performing against and the fact that they held their own when their reputation at the time was they are the only band that is not very performancy. Like everyone else is making such a theatrical experience in terms of energy or dancing or aggression or whatever it is. Or a look or a sound.

Totally. And the Talking Heads, their reputation in the CBGB's days was they just get up on stage and they do really good music. Like they captivate people because the music is so good they let it speak for themselves. But they kind of had like a clean cut sort of look, right? Like they weren't, you know, punky. They look kind of like dorks. But they're also not making it

a sort of like, this is our brand, we're dorks. Sure. They look like art school kids. Right. And they would just get up and perform like pretty perfectly crafted songs immaculately. Well, the songwriting was dark. Yes. And like of the time. Yeah. Yeah. That first album

I mean, as a debut is so fucking good. Tell me what do you think of the Talking Heads? I love them. I am like so unfamiliar with like earlier aspects of their like work, but I distinctly remember getting to Talking Heads because I was friends with someone in college and they had, there's this song by this band Friendly Fire, it's called In the Hospital, and I played it for a friend once. She was like, seems like a rip off of that song Cross-Eyed and Painless, which I never

heard, but I listened to it. And I was like, oh, I guess it is a ripoff. And then like, she introduced me to Radiohead and then told me that Radiohead got their name from the talking head song Radiohead. And I was just kind of like, oh, weird. This band's coming up a lot. And then we watched Stop Making Sense. And I was like, this is really fucking cool.

And like, I think Speaking in Tong tongues is one of my favorite albums ever. And I just like, I love them so much. And they, they have this, like, I don't know. It's very weird that they like started as not a very performance.

The band, because to me, like they're so intrinsically linked with like this sort of like visual weirdness and like, even right. Yeah. Like true stories and the fucking like music video for once in a lifetime.

It's just David Byrne being, I'm just like true stories and the fucking music video for once in a lifetime. It's just David Byrne being, I'm just like. True stories, which is basically like the blank check he gets to cash off of this. Right, which Demi produces, right? I mean, that thing is so special in its own way. We should do true stories. Yoshida would kill us if we did it without her. We're getting increasingly into this idea of one movie blank check directors. Oh, yeah.

Just like weird little projects that happened. Yeah. Robert De Niro's He did two. Oh. He's got two. Bronx Tale Good Shepherd. I'd do it. I like both those movies. I know you do. Who else has directed one movie? Tom Green. We recently were on a real like

run about this. Yeah. There's a lot of weird ones. Is that Night of the Hunter? Yeah. Which is the best. We did text her with her friend Alex Ross Perry's a lot of weird ones. Is that Night of the Hunter? Yeah. Night of the Hunter. Which is the best. We did text her with our friend Alex Ross Perry. A lot of actors who only did one. Right.

Like, Leo Schreiber doing Everything is Illuminated. Still so weird. Remember Everything is Illuminated, that book? Didn't know he directed that.

Sure. Okay. Didn't know, yep, but, Elijah Wood, right. Mr. Vin Diesel

only directed one feature film. He did the feature? Multifacial? Yeah, right. Multifacial was the short. Right, right. Strays. It's so, like, I remember watching Multifacial in college.

I mean, like, the Fast and Furious guy did this? Yeah. So weird. And it played a con, and Steven Spielberg discovered it. Yeah. Yeah. And he's the greatest movie star. End of story.

So going back to your point about Radiohead, I thought watching this again, and he's the greatest movie star. End of story. So going back to your point about Radiohead, I thought watching this again, and I've seen Radiohead a bunch of times, I mean, this feels like such an influence on their live act. With the video screens and just sort of like really showing, just like even like thinking about Johnny Greenwood plugging in all these analog plugs into a big synth. I love how this movie really shows you how these musicians contribute to the sound. With having them come in in different layers, it's so effective.

It makes you really concentrate with the introduction of every person on what they're bringing musically to the song. It's beautiful. It's fucking beautiful. Whereas as, and this is a band with an extremely dynamic showman who is putting on this incredibly athletic sort of like involving performance. I was worried for him. When you're like,

Jesus, he's shaking. He just starts doing laps around. You're doing this now. He's in a suit. Like he's not like an athletic wear. And, and at the same time, he's like around him like, but you're doing this now just to show. And he's in a suit. He's not like in athletic wear. Yeah. And at the same time, he's like just like – I feel like there's so much care in highlighting everyone else who's performing.

Totally. Yeah. Totally. I mean, and that is the beauty of the way – to fill in these blanks a little here. I read this – I went on a rabbit hole last night and this morning of reading things about the Talking Heads. on a rabbit hole last night and this morning of reading things about the Talking Heads, and there was a New Yorker piece about fear of music that has this little graph that I found really, really spot on.

In the late 1970s in primordial downtown Manhattan, the band sonified not just longing and regret, most great musicians do that, but also dread, some do that, and then, this is what made them really special. Mingled the feelings

into single songs, sounds, and even couplets while never letting listeners forget they knew what they were doing. That is like the weird magic trick

of them. Something about them feels very light but also very haunted. They're very earnest but there's also something very sarcastic about them. And the actual

craftsmanship is pretty perfect while feeling mostly emotional. I mean, the thing about their songs is, unlike a lot of conceptual bands, almost all their songs work on some pure emotional level. It's just a pop song. Right, the emotionality of the music and

of the lyrics, you know? And like Heaven, which is one of my ten favorite songs of all time, if not one of my five favorite songs of all time, people have endlessly debated what that song is about. He sometimes offers explanations. Well, but that's—sometimes there are like legends that's like, oh, it's about a gay bar he went to one time that he felt was this safe haven and it was called Heaven. And sometimes it's not about a specific place. It's about a feeling. And sometimes it's about, you know, a specific time in his life that then he relates called Heaven. And sometimes it's not about a specific place. It's about a feeling. And sometimes it's about, you know, a specific time in his life

that then he relates to heaven. And sometimes it's people saying that that's what they heard. And sometimes it's him saying a thing but then denying another thing. But it is just like, the song is so simple. Yeah.

But feels so honest and deeply felt that it can mean any of those things. I feel like, like I have a weird, usually when I listen to music, it feels like it's been weird for me to focus so much on the lyrics that I sort of let the meaning ruin the music for me.

But with Talking Heads, I've always just kind of been like, I don't know what so many of these songs mean. I'm just kind of like, whatever. This music rules. Interesting thing is David Byrne a lot of times improvised lyrics. Like he didn't write songs sometimes.

They would just go in the studio, kind of have like a sense of like kind of the structure of a song. And he would just make up lyrics. That's what it feels like a lot of the time. But I don't know. There are certain songs where it's like this must be the place. I'm like, well, I can tell this is clearly like a love song, but I couldn't tell you like distinct things about the words he's saying or anything.

But like, it's also impressive. I feel like their music also just, if things had gone differently, I could see them being like a very good, like children's band. Totally. Just like the instrumentation is so like specific and strange.

And like, he's got this, he's this weird front man where I'm just like, if they were just like we just really want money they could very well be like on a show with puppets or some shit

and just I don't know it's so true your introduction was watching this film after people bringing Talking Heads up to you

you watched this movie before you were really listening to the album yes but I had also I think in the same like span of time I had also heard Burning Down the House

and This Must Be the Place a lot around but I wasn't super into Talking Heads. I pretty much had the same thing. I saw this young because my dad was obsessed with this movie. I also saw it fairly young the first time. I was about to say this is a movie that's relatively appealing to a kid.

There's even the part at the end where you see the kid on his dad's shoulders and the unicorn and I'm like, of course. My dad had the albums and the covers and the titles of the albums were so striking and so different that I would ask him about them a lot and then he finally like I think they

when they re-released it with that remaster in 99 he took me to see it at the film forum and it is one of those things where like I was sort of anytime my parents tried to take me to a documentary, it felt like vegetables. Sure. You know, and they were, like, once every couple of years in New York City, there'd be one where it's like, this is a documentary that's good for kids.

Right. My parents would try to sell me on being excited, and I'd be like, where's the narrative, baby? Right, right, right, right. You know? I like acts, three of them. Right. And so I was, like, such a story kid that I was like, I don't know about a concert documentary, but there are these things. I mean, there is, without it

being a Broadway musical, which I feel like a lot of concerts turn into these days. Yeah. There is this sort of narrative build to it, not just with the introduction of each band member one at a time, which I could really latch onto and go like, okay, there's a progression

here. There's something happening. It's not just a series of songs, but that each song has its own little kind of universe to it. Demi said that that's what he responded to. I mean, they, right. So they do this weird, like, reverse arc of, like, conceptual project, RISD band, people actually like

the music, they come to New York, they are in the sort of punk scene. New Wave, though. They're in their own lane. But, you know, I feel like initially, right, they're more playing with the Ramones, the punky guys. They're doing their New Wave in punk clubs and they're sort of bridging the two.

But then as they become bigger and they start producing albums, then the sort of conceptual art brains of four RISD students, or three RISD students, or three RISD students, and a member of the Modern Romance. Lovers. Sorry. Okay, carry on, carry on.

I apologize, Jonathan. That starts coming back in, and then it starts to be that intentionality of what are we wearing, what are we projecting behind us, and how do we sort of make an arc to a show. Similarly, though, also to the Clash, if you think about later Clash stuff,

when they started to incorporate world music sounds, electronic sounds, I see a similar trajectory with the talking heads of really expanding their sound, bringing in more elements. I feel like that was so hot in the 80s. Well, yeah. Simon as well. You know, all of that. But of those three examples— World music. They're not the only ones.

Well, I remember David Byrne wrote a piece that was like the front page of the Arts and Leisure section in The New York Times like 20 years ago. That was Why I Hate World Music. Sure. And it was the purposefully incendiary headline that was him saying. But he meant like the genre. It is gross that we consider everything that is not American to be world and was just sort of breaking down how distinct and different you know these different regions

and the genres within each region and all of that and as opposed to the other examples you're throwing out the way the talking heads use the music

of other cultures feels the least like appropriation to me because whereas something like Graceland is like a great album

in which Paul Simon was just like oh ladies make that Black Mambazo roll if I just put him on an album, that will sound great. Which is correct. He was proven correct. This feels more like

them actually digging into the elements of what makes different cultural musics resonate and reusing those pieces in their own way that doesn't sound like anything else. Yeah, it doesn't sound like they're just going like, oh, we should use this instrument from a different culture. Totally.

Yeah. It really feels like, you know, or the way that the Clash used Brege or anything. It really feels like they're making something entirely new just with a broader reference base. Even look at Tom Tom Club. Yeah. Right. Totally. Out of Tina and Chris's like side project, that's all like dance hall music.

But it's – Out of Tina and Chris's side project, that's all dance hall music. It's named after a dance hall in the Bahamas where they were practicing once before a concert. I think that's what the Tom and Tom's named after. And they would record in the Bahamas a lot. But there's something playful about it. It's not—I feel like it's also just the success of that song. I think it's been one of the most sampled songs of all time. Which is so weird that that's like the spin-off concept within a

concept band. But it gets that thing of like right, why it appeals to people as a child. Why this movie works for people who wouldn't necessarily even enter as Talking Heads fans is that, aside from them being like consummate performers

with great music, directed perfectly by a really smart filmmaker, there is something so playful about them, and they have this weird balance of being incredibly conceptual and unpretentious. There is something very unpretentious about them despite them on their face doing the most pretentious shit in the world. Which is a wild thing to say because they do seem so pretentious. They seem so pretentious. And like that interlude in the middle

where it's like, you know, like, salad, pig. I forget what the words are. You know what I mean? Fax machine. That should be so easy to satirize. That's like a parody of an installation piece. I don't know. You're right. It does feel like this incredibly

sincere and lovely performance. And goofy. There's something about them owning their goofiness. I was thinking a lot about, because I knew you were coming in here, but you and your work and how much you've talked about that you have all these sort of very sincere ambitions and what you want to do in different mediums. sincere ambitions and what you want to do in different mediums and you've become

this kind of comedy person and you're always trying to figure out how to also be able to make your non-comedic works and not have the two contrast

and like Talking Heads are an example of a band with a really good sense of humor that never feel like a joke band

yeah totally I think they I think one of the things that really makes that come across in the performance went on is how so much of it is clearly choreographed, but the moments that you feel like, oh, holy shit, this band loves each other

and is great collaborators are the parts where it's like they're dancing on stage in a way that seems like it's clearly just of the moment. That's the Demi shit, too, that he caught all of that stuff. I mean, he's a very empathetic filmmaker. He's very good at making a person feel like a human on screen in like five seconds. So they wanted to do a concert film because they felt like, you know, in their constant expansion of let's find new ways to express ourself,

it seemed like the move. This is the one that comes out right before Speaking in Tongues? Right after Speaking in Tongues. Right after. Oh, yeah, because this is them on that tour. Right,

right. But they, David Byrne just liked Demi's movies a lot, which at this point is the Demi comedies. But it makes sense. I mean, you have not seen them yet, but like Something Wild feels like a talking head song. Right. Which is. Visually. Something Wild comes right after this.

Right. So this is in between Mob and Something Wild? This comes out between Mob and Something Wild. Okay. No, no, no, no. It's been between Melvin and Howard and Something Wild. Mob is post Something Wild. That's late 80s.

So those are the two that feel very talking heads-y. So there's some act maybe. There's a little bit of a handoff between the two groups. Between Demi and the talking heads. Taking his hands and sort of having them crisscross. It's the opposite of a handoff actually. It's hands passing each other. I also feel like in terms of concerts,

we're still at this stage where the sort of expensive arena show is nascent. That hasn't happened yet. I love U2. Even though Bono sang the blues. This is pre-U2 evolving into the, right, our shows are like

these incredibly expensive, loud, with like lots of video screens and you can like show it to like 60,000 people. And it's not their fault, but they kind of break something. They do. Once they do that, that becomes a thing that other people go like, well, if we're not doing that, we look like pieces of shit. It's also just like the money you can make doing something like that if you're big enough is just sort of incomparable. What was that tour called? Something TV? Well, there's Zoo TV.

That's that. Come on. He calls the president and orders a pizza. He has like six bits that he does. He has all these characters. Does he have a character reel? Yeah. Great.

You don't know this? Demi, come over to my house. We'll watch the Zoo TV tour. It's fun. It's great. You'll love it. Ben is shaking his head no. No, no, no.

You'll like it. Bono, he has all these characters. He's got like an American preacher character. You don't want to see that? I do want to see Bono do an American accent. It is Bono's Mad TV audition. To use my oft-used phrase for a certain type of character performance. Him going like, if this YouTube thing doesn't work out,

I could do something with Ms. Swan. Yeah, yeah. It feels like it's very Miss Swan adjacent in terms of energy. He's tiptoeing around Stewart, that whole concert. Zoo TV was the first one, and then there's, I believe,

it's the Pop Mart tour is the one where U2 descended on stage in a giant lemon. Yeah. You know about that? Yes. And sometimes it would break, and it would sort of stall, and they'd have to be like

you know just sort of standing there in the lemon and then the lemon would keep moving. I mean like these things that cost. Anyway this does is not that. This is so stripped down. It's so simple and it's like you know we're not yet at that thing where they're just trying to overwhelm you with production value. But at the time this must have seemed like oh wow

they're doing more than most people do in concerts. Yeah yeah. Right right. But it's mostly just the intentionality of it. There's nothing crazy happening. There's no crazy pyrotechnics. That's what I mean. There are no huge routines in a sort of like... Although I do wonder, because I'm like,

in like 1983, is it crazy to go to a concert where they're like projecting stuff on the walls? Maybe a little bit. That's the most. It feels modest. They went through some lamps. The lamp budget on this thing is in the hundreds. There was that tradition of the guys who would put

colored oil and project like this. The kaleidoscope. I love a kaleidoscope guy. Who's that guy? That was a separate member of the band. This is ouridoscope guy. An operator. Who's that guy? But that was a separate member of the band. This is our spin art guy. I do miss that era.

I wish we'd grown up where we're like, see these colors? There's like five of them. You know what I mean? And people are like, that's pretty cool. I could live in that for an hour. I was watching this being like, fuck, this is the thing that makes it seem so fun

to be in a band before on stage one. Their chemistry with each other. And I was like, what would this looks like it, like, this is the thing that makes it so, seems so fun to, like, be in a band and perform on stage when, like, their chemistry with each other. And I was like, what would I be in the band? I'm like, I'm gonna be the art guy. Yeah. I'm gonna be like, wait, you wanna see some blue for this one? Bam. Everyone in the back is feeling this. You're the gels guy, right? Yeah. We're taking requests. Orange!

Well, by all accounts, Demi went to see this show. Okay. And said, this makes sense to me. There's like an arc built into this. I see the way it kind of plays like a story. Right. And started planning out with him.

He shot four or five different concerts. I think five, yeah. Because he didn't want the cameras to be obtrusive. Right. So he would shoot one night and it would just be back of the venue, wide shots only. And then the next night he would only shoot one side of the stage, and the next night he would only

shoot the other side of the stage, and the following night he would get close-ups or whatever. Which is crazy because it does not feel stitched together. No, it really doesn't. Which I think is just a note on how good the choreography is for a lot of this, but considering how even in the moments where it's clearly not choreographed, it goes from like wide to not wider. Like it just cuts between different angles and whatnot.

And you're like, well, they're still doing these things. Like it's so a lot of this film does feel like it's made in the editing in a very strange way where it's like, oh, he wants you to see this thing. But he knows that if he cuts to this different angle at this right time, you won't see that thing that just happened naturally on night number one. Right. So he's going to show you this other fun thing that's also happening on this side of the stage. And it's like so many of like the other, like Bernie Worrell and Alex Weir and Steve, like all of the members that sort of joined the band for this performance are clearly having the fucking time of their life. There's the two backup singers. There's so many moments.

Where he catches them. It's a shot that is like, you know, burn in the foreground, sweating his eyes out, whatever. And then you see still in focus over his shoulder, the two of them. And in the middle of singing backup, they'll like look at each other and giggle. And it's like one of the only

performance films I've ever seen that does capture that exuberance of performance. So many performance films, it's more like it's trying to communicate like this is fucking hard. They're sweating this out. This is like they are like sort of men at work, right? Like there's kind of that vibe. And this is like Bernie Worrell especially. He's just so happy.

Yeah. And it's that difference between like, oh, this makes me wish I could be a rock star versus this makes me wish I was in a band. Yeah. And it's that difference between like, oh, this makes me wish I could be a rock star versus this makes me wish I was in a band. Yeah. Because this movie makes being in a band look so satisfying. Like the chemistry and the energy being exchanged between everyone on that stage. It makes the collaboration aspect of performance seem like just the best thing in the world where it's like, yeah, you can perform. That's fun and whatnot. performance seem like just the best thing in the world where it's like yeah you can perform that's fun and whatnot but like there's one moment during burning down the house when uh he and out like

david burn and alex we start doing this like sort of just like weird like like running in place thing and it feels so like both nap like i'm like i can't tell if it's natural or choreographed but they're like both doing it and like beaming and it feels like david burn's not supposed to be smiling but he's like i can't not and they're just like strumming and like running in place and it feels like David Byrne's not supposed to be smiling, but he's like, I can't not. And they're just like strumming and like running in place. And it's clearly just, it's one of those things that felt iconic to me. Like the first time I watched it even where I'm just kind of like, this is an incredible thing to see at a concert.

Like it feels like they're having fun and just it's so electric. Like you feel that sort of like feeling of like doing something. I think it's also the same way I felt when like I started hearing This Must Be the Place a lot where you're just like in a room where it comes on and everyone's just like it's fucking, it's time and you're just hanging out with friends and it's like this is the most fun thing in the world, but it's that on a stage. I don't know. Yeah, I mean Burn talks a lot about how like, you know,

I think when they started performing they were sort of in more egghead mode. I mean, when they were in the New York scene, and they felt like they couldn't compete with these other bands that had obvious rock star energy, or some sense of aggression, like badass edginess. A root toot. You're talking about a root toot.

A root toot and a sour lemon face. But then what he ended up embracing was sort of just his genuine feeling. Right. You know? Because the thing that watching this kept reminding me of, and it's like the only other thing that seems to kind of capture this energy, the best film of the 2010s, which is Future Islands on David Letterman. Oh, yeah. Sure.

This like perfect object that is just what's going on here? These people are jamming on something and feeling it so deeply with so little self-awareness. The best performance on Letterman in the 2010s is when the Green Goblin guy

sang his song. A Freak Like Me. A Freak Like Me. A Freak Like Me. Are we forgetting Joaquin going on Letterman? Okay, these are the three best performances.

Those are the top three. Right, right, right. Take your pick. Letterman kind of killed the 2010s. Well, especially because Letterman in all of those is like, what's going on? Like, he's just kind of like leading on his gen. But that's one of the things about the Future Island performance. As he comes out at the end, it goes like, whoa, Nelly.

Like, whatever weird expression he uses. I'll never forget him asking, are those your drums? Yes. His two best jokes post-music performance are, are those your drums? You know, picking any piece of equipment, is that your xylophone? And also the, I'll take as much of that as you got. And he goes, Paul, I'll take as much of that as they got. It's wild that Letterman is now basically on a constant press tour where he's like,

I literally did that show 10 years too long. I know. Because, like, that's kind of true. And at the same time, it's like, I literally did that show 10 years too long. I know. Because like, that's kind of true and at the same time it's like, I don't know. It's kind of weird

having your, it was nice, like a grand old dad. Yeah, right. It was so consistent but it also felt like there was a time at which he stopped caring

and because of that the show changed but still was good in a way where it's like. Yeah, right. It became this sort of very cynical show in a funny way.

what's your fucking thing and you're like, I like this guy. Paul Rudd on Hot Ones I've just watched it I have not seen it great episode but he talks about Letterman even big cauliflowers

I didn't realize Paul Rudd was a vegetarian yeah yeah he was eating he was eating big collies hot sauce cauliflower but he said

like it is the weird thing where there's the point you can tell that David Letterman's over it and the show weirdly becomes better and he becomes funny. Occasionally, like, Regis would show up or whatever and Letterman would be like, you're a piece of shit. And Regis would be like, I know, ha ha ha. And you'd be like, this is kind of edgy.

Like, they're kind of knifing each other. They would do the bit where Regis would come dressed up as a character from a currently running Broadway musical. And Regis was like, I'm working with the show I'm doing the bit and Letterman would just be like this is so fucking embarrassing what are we doing? And there's the one night he came on dressed as Shrek from the musical so he's in like two hours of makeup

in the suit and Letterman just dunks on for 30 seconds and Regis is like I don't need this and he walks off and it's one of the best things a genuinely pissed Regis Philbin in Trek makeup going like, I don't need to be here. I'm doing you a favor. I have to wake up at 5 a.m.

Do you know I host a morning show? Okay, since we're talking about Regis, one of my favorite Ramones appearances is they go on Regis and Kathy. And Regis loves Dee Dee Ramone. Just look this up. He loves Dee Dee. He thinks he's so funny and cool. Like they just connect in such a great way. It's amazing.

That's so great. I got to watch that. I will queue up that video is available if you Google Regis Dee Dee Ramone. I just think that was like because that era where it's like Letterman and then you cut to Craig Ferguson who was basically playing who I loved so much

and I used to like watch every night playing to like a tiny audience doing weird bits and like I don't know no one gave a shit

about that show so he was kind of just doing whatever he wanted like it's an underrated era well it feels like Letterman grandfathered himself in as like this guy that everyone loved

and depended on so when he started doing whatever he wanted it was just kind of like the audience going, well, I love this man, so I'll change. And it's like he basically like Trojan horse himself as being like, I'm the late night guy that you love. And then he's just kind of, I fucking hate this. And he's like, well, you got to love me, but I'm still fucking over this. You got to love that I hate this. Yeah, because he created so much of the comedy vernacular, the modern comedy vernacular to begin with, that everyone's contract with Letterman was like, I'll go where you're going.

Like if you're a Letterman fan, he was always kind of uncharted territory in some way or another. Anyway, that future eyelids thing, there is that feeling, that thing that was like hard to bottle of like every movement this guy is making is so specific, yet it doesn't feel like anything someone would consciously choreograph. Yeah. And it is clearly like there's intentionality behind it, but it also just feels like he is somehow finding some physical expression of how this song makes him feel. Yeah. And David Byrne talks about that where he's like, people ask me if it's hard to get into the emotion of each song, and it's the opposite for me. Like, if I'm singing a song, then I feel the emotions of it. It, like, very quickly unlocks for me, and my breakthrough in performing on stage was

just not holding back, was just letting my body do what the music made me feel. And, you know, I think with larger concepts, like, what if I'm in a big suit? What if I dance with a light? I think with larger concepts like what if I'm in a big suit? What if I dance with a light? Obviously, this stuff isn't improvised. But I think it's honed out of him sort of organically finding the movement that matches each thing. And then he would sort of perfect it.

But it doesn't feel like – like you're saying. I mean it's like it's all very controlled, but it also doesn't feel like, oh, this is a routine. Right. Yeah. It's playful. It routine. Right. Yeah. It's playful. It's so playful. Yeah. It's such a hard balance to strike because it would be easy to be like,

all right, you know, like I guess, right? Like that could, that's, that's what he's fighting against. But like, look at like juxtaposition between this and zoo TV.

He ostensibly does do. I'll stick up for zoo TV. God damn it. They called someone rushed. It was, it was hot shit. You know, come on guys. He ostensibly does shit, you know? Come on, guys.

He ostensibly does ten different characters in this. Yes, right. Except they're very subtle shifts. Yeah. You know, when he goes into Once in a Lifetime and he puts on the glasses, he's kind of doing some, like, preacher character, right? I mean, he's sort of sermonizing the Clark Kent thing. And then you told me you watched this movie twice yesterday. Yeah, I did.

I watched it in the morning, had a great time. And then Joanna came home and I was like, I'm putting this on. You haven't seen it. I'm just going to put it on. And she's like tired. She's like, okay, whatever. And I'm like, it's a concert movie. You don't have to think about the plot.

Just I'm putting it on. And like three songs in, she's like, this is kind of great yeah and i was just like visible one very happy what two very moved i was just like yeah this is like so universally appealing and it's i could watch that movie every day i'm trying to find where how you phrased it last night you said uh i literally uh griffin i genuinely watched it twice today, literally just because I enjoy being happy and watching good things. Like, why not? Yeah.

So I, after I watched it last night, I woke up, I wanted to watch some of the special features, and then I was like, let me watch a little more of the movie again. So I restarted the movie again. And having recently watched it, and then going back to the beginning he is so sweaty right and he is so like it does feel like he's been sermonizing for two hours like the shifts he's gone through by the end of the concert and then resetting back to the beginning when he comes out and is like his hair is parted in the middle he looks like buddy holly he's doing this like weird like neck jutting thing.

You know, it feels so much more like consciously goofy. But Ernest, it's like he goes through this whole character arc over the course of the movie. It's just funny to think of what I think of Talking Heads as a fairly cerebral band. That was weirdly hard to say. And yet he is like basically like doing like Jim Carrey shit like he's like using the human body in a thousand funny ways right and like

I don't know I love that I think I also the very first song where he does Psycho Killer alone and has like the recording of the 808 right the drum machine almost every concert movie ever starts with the person backstage getting ready to go on stage or the audience lining up or people getting their seats. Yeah. Or some sort of preamble like that.

And this is like, okay, you start on a white background but with some weird details, some weird texture. And the titles are happening over that. Cool font. Right. Great. Men in black font. Really good title design. Love it. Right. Great. Men in black font. Really good title design. Love it.

Awesome. And then you realize that the white you've been looking at is actually the beam of light on the black stage. His shoes walking out, the crowd. It's already this weird disorienting thing of like you're watching a very intimate thing of just like a man's clean white sneakers on a completely empty black stage with the audience applauding feels odd because he is bringing you in to such an intimate point. Right. Not showing you the audience. He so rarely shows you the audience. He doesn't really show you the audience until right at the end.

And then it's like this joyous explosion of he keeps cutting to the audience. Yeah. I love that so much. Just feeling like the audience is sort of invisible and all this stuff for certain moments where you can kind of see them like the back of their heads through like he doesn't do that thing where you're cutting to like someone just going like no because at the end it feels like there's this sort of like mix of

these people are exhausted but still like having the time of their lives and you can see like the different like walks of life that everyone in the audience is from mostly dorky white guys but yes yes but I was like oh yep no this is what I thought the audience would look like for. Yeah. But it's also like black women who are having the time of their life.

There's this one shot of like a woman just like doing some weird moves. And I was just kind of like, this feels like I didn't expect to see that. And then like the shot of the kid and then even like of the like sound guys sort of like hugging it out at like, we did a good job, but still kind of feeling the music. And I'm like,

yeah, this is a exuberant expression of joy it feels like people were just at like a three hour like River Tent revival you know

like that's what's crazy about it the sound guys killed this like this sounds so good for live music it's crazy

it sounds so good I have the live album of Stop Being Sense downloaded and I listen to it more often than like any other album

especially because their version of What A Day That Was is one of my favorite talking head songs of the live album of Stop Being Sense downloaded, and I listen to it more often than any other album, especially because their version of What a Day That Was is one of my favorite Talking Heads songs. And I didn't know that it was like, oh, just a thing he wrote for a movie or like some art project or something. Because I'm just like, it's an incredible song, and it feels like a Talking Heads thing. But no, they just turn it into greatness.

But that opening, which feels like a joke of him like placing the boombox down and saying like I want to play a tape for you the only thing they faked

what do you mean that shot oh that shot was shot later yeah okay that was everything Demi said he wanted to do some soundstage

recreation stuff so he could get specific shots they just literally couldn't figure out a way to shoot that opening shot live. So that's the only thing that's done later.

But they shut down the rest of it because they were like, we're so much running off the energy of the audience, we're not going to be able to do it without a crowd there. Right, yeah. We're not sort of that type of performer. Whereas The Last Waltz has half soundstage stuff because Scorsese wanted to do crazy camera movements. Even Harry Nielsen

or Nelson, whatever, he did a really famous BBC live concert but had no audience. Right. I think for him, he just doesn't like

performing live, right? He's the opposite. He's like incredibly, he was self-conscious. Guys, what do you do, like say you're David Byrne. Yeah. It's like 3 p.m., right?

You're going to go on stage at 8, right? What do you do? Do you like eat bananas? Like what? The whole time, I just sort of get worried. I'm like, does he going to go on stage at 8 what do you do? Do you eat bananas? the whole time I just sort of get worried does he need to go to the bathroom? is he sleepy? I'm backstage yelling the suit must be bigger what's your routine before you do it?

because I assume then you're done at 12 you're the most amped you've ever been he sits in a white room eating cottage cheese that's what I envision is that the vibe? I imagine he's got some sort of, like, energy drip, and he's like,

if I don't move, like, you are literally, like, recharging your batteries, and then, like, as soon as 8 o'clock strikes, he gets up and walks out, and, like, he's, like, in full power.

There's that weird robot quality to David Byrne. Yeah. Like, something about him feels like very, very advanced AI, and part of it is the weird calm he has always. But even his way of speaking sounds like

Siri or something, you know? It's hard to imagine being like, I'm going to go get some bagels. Like, David, what do you want? And he'd be like, can I get a bacon egg and cheese? Like, you know, it just doesn't... I'd like a bacon egg and cheese. Yeah, right, exactly. And I'd be like, okay, sure. You'd sort of stop me in my tracks, right?

I'd like a coffee with two sugars. Do they still do the shamrock shake? I love those rainbow bagels. Right. Like there's that weird thing to where it's like you don't feel like, I don't know, it's odd. You feel like this guy needs to perform. Sure. Because this is all the stuff inside of him that he can't really express otherwise.

Otherwise, it's this very sort of still water. When I was 11, for some reason, I owned the solo album Feelings by David Byrne. I don't know if you guys know. The cover is an action figure. I know this cover very well for that reason. And my brain, thus,

from a young age, always sort of thought of him as like a weird sort of plastic man. That was his kind of, you know. I often, I mean, not anymore, but like for the longest time I confused David Byrne and David Lynch. And I feel like they. Same era, same crowd in a weird sort of way. And then David Lynch.

Cultural soup. Yeah. And then David Lynch doing music really fucked up the whole thing for me. But like they both have this sort of weird sense about them where I'm like you are a very serious

man and your work is like enjoyed by all these like people who think of you as a very specific type of person. But then it's like they're weirdly goofy

sometimes. Yeah. In a way that sometimes feels like disarming but also just feels like no that's because they're geniuses in this

like specific craft and you like it's no fun because they're geniuses in this specific craft, and it's no fun to be a genius if you're just like, I'm very serious about what I do. Leave me alone. Don't look at me. And there's nothing like metropolitan or urban about either one of them, which is rare with artists like that. Especially very heady, fringy

artists. But think about the medium that they're working in, whereas with visual art, you have to be so self-serious. I think there's something about the medium that they're working in, whereas in visual art, you have to be so self-serious. I think there's something about the fact that they came up as RISD students but then put all that energy into music. Yes. But like pop music, right? But it's also – it's one of those things where you're like, well, of course their music was successful. You listen to it.

Like anyone could jam on this. Right. But also, it feels like music that they never expected would cross over. You know, there is nothing strategic about these songs in terms of like... You know, it's weird that they were a huge deal. Yeah. If you just sort of remove any context. Like, they're played on classic

rock radio. Yeah. 100%. Like, right now. Yeah. Sure. That's a weird band. They're weird. They're very weird. Something about the tape thing at the beginning also makes it feel so intimate

like this guy is sharing something private with you, you know? Which plays into his weird character of like the blankness of

David Byrne. It feels like he's showing you something that's a little too personal and potentially a little bit embarrassing. Well, I mean, the vulnerability of walking out on this gigantic stage, empty alone. Right. Is just...

Acoustically. And then playing your first hit by yourself. By yourself. Right, just tapping your foot. Just that idea of, and he's so compelling, but like it's right, like, people literally have nothing else to concentrate on right now. Like, literally everyone is looking right

at you right now. But he's got that weird thing. I always think about, I forget who wrote it, but it was the New York Magazine review of You Don't Mess With the Zohan. And they're talking about how weird that movie is. And the last- That was Jerry Saltz, right? Probably. Yeah, because it wasn't a film review.

It was an art review. Well, it's fucking art. Maybe it was Edelstein. Probably. But the final paragraph, I'll see if you can find it because I maybe don't want to paraphrase it.

It was David Edelstein. Okay. And this is, wow, a long review. Go to the final paragraph. Much to think about. Dennis Dugan knows his way around shin-whacking slapstick.

That's true. And Sandler is mesmerizing. Some performers become stars because we can read them instantly, right? And I know what he's saying. Others, like Sandler, because we never tire of trying to get a fix on them. We can only be sure that with Sandler's fan base, there will be many more mad, narcissistic fantasies to come. That has stuck in my craw for the last decade.

Trying to get a fix on them. It's that David Byrne thing where some people become stars in any medium because there is a thing that is so clear and so accessible. Yes. And some people, like Adam Sandler or David Byrne, the reason why he can totally captivate when he walks on stage with white tennis shoes and a guitar and sings his biggest song by himself, Acoustic, is because you go, what's going on here? Yeah.

I can tell there's a lot and there's a lot of feeling to latch on to, but I can't decipher it and you never can. It's very interesting that you draw this comparison as well because obviously this is sort of what Demi is seeing in Burn and then that's what Paul Thomas Anderson, Demi's greatest sort of acolyte, is seeing in Adam Sandler. Yes.

Which that's his movie that feels most like a Demi movie too. Yes. But that weird right? Yeah, sure. That weird quality that some people just have this ineffable thing of there's

there's a a whole storm going on inside there yeah and I can't crack it have I said my favorite joke from murder mystery on air?

I told it to you but I didn't say it on air you can say it on air did you see Adam Sandler's murder mystery? I have not I'm just gonna watch it tonight apparently you're the only

person on the globe because it was watched by let me check this I know they greenlit murder mystery too four gazillion on the globe because it was watched by, let me check this. I know, they greenlit Murder Mystery 2. Four gazillion Martians have watched it apparently. It makes it hard for me to pitch my murder mystery ideas. All right, well, here's. What if you think, but like what if Columbo, what if we don't see?

I mean. At the beginning. I mean. It was Columbo who did it. Oh, Columbo did it. Oh, it was the murderer? Yes. Oh, that's like where it's like... No, it's nothing like...

Okay, fine. I'm sorry. We have to bleep that out. We have to bleep that out. It's a retired bit. At the end of Columbo, you see that his two friends become roommates and it's perfect strange.

And one more thing. I'm guilty. Lock me up and throw away the key. It was me. I did it. Throw me out. It's the knife. I'm guilty. Lock me up and throw away the key. It was me. I did it. Throw me in. It's the knife. I did it.

No. In Murder Mystery, Adam Sandler plays an ordinary schlub from New Jersey who gets wrapped up in a murder mystery. Ooh. Good movie. Or whatever. I enjoyed watching it. I mean, your big line was it is the first movie that you can quote unquote watch while never looking up from your phone and get every single detail.

There's not a joke. There's not a plot point. There's not an element you don't miss. It is chemically. It's a murder mystery. Who cares? And one of the. You never have to look at the screen.

All kinds of actors are playing the sort of colorful characters that maybe did the murder mystery. Murder. Murder. Did the murder in the mystery. One of them is Luke Evans, handsome man, right? And throughout the movie, Sandler's kind of obsessed with Luke Evans because he's like this masculine, ideal. Good looking guy. Exactly, exactly.

And then late in the movie, Sandler's character is wearing Luke Evans' tuxedo, the character's tuxedo. I'm laughing at anticipation of this. This is like at the end of the movie. It's a big showdown scene. He's in this tuxedo and they're like, where'd you get this tuxedo? He's like, I got it from Luke Evans. He doesn't say Luke Evans. I wish he did.

And then he goes like, it's a little loose in the crotch. I'm just kidding. He's got me beat. I'm just kidding he's got me beat it's so perfectly worth it tight in the crotch not loose in the crotch

yeah yeah yeah he makes the dick joke and then immediately he's like nah he's got me beat it's such good Sandler where you're like you know what

Sandler is only obsessed with how big everyone's penis is yeah there are those weird right for as much people say like Sandler

is like crass and obvious there's weird subtext that always gets danced say that Sandler is crass and obvious, there's weird subtext that always gets danced around with Sandler's persona. Because there's that Apatow story, too, where Apatow, he kept saying to Apatow, like, let me see your dick. Come on, I just want to see it. Which he puts in funny people. And then finally, one day, Apatow

was in a urinal, and then he saw that Sandler was just next to the urinal looking, and he was like, alright, alright. He's just looking at it. He's like, alright. What? right. He's just looking at it. He's like, all right. What? Now I know. It's a story. Yes.

So Adam Sandler is the David Byrne of our time. How did we get on this? You're not the first to say it. No, why he's captivating as one person alone on stage. It's the same thing as that Sandler thing where you're like, what's going on with this guy? Yeah. And have you guys seen that video that's the David Byrne interviews, David Byrne, which was done to promote this? No.

A must view. It is on the Blu-ray, but it's also on YouTube. It's an incredible thing. But it was this weird promo video they made for Stop Making Sense that is David Byrne being interviewed by a rotating group of characters played by David Byrne. And it's full Zoo TV, him in costume, him with voices. And he plays like an old southern man and a lady and all these different, you know, whatever. It sounds a lot like Zoo TV. It's very Zoo TV, but his characters are very bizarre.

And the bit is that it's not about the characters being weird. It's that he is constantly weirder than the characters. Yeah. So his answers, they go like, David, how did you come up with the giant suit? And he goes, well, I wanted to come up with a way to make my head look smaller and making my body bigger seemed like the best approach. Like everything is like these weirdly oblique sort of like overly glib answers

delivered by a rubbit man but there is that thing of just like you watch him play all these characters and you're like oh he like he had it in him this like weird theatricality like totally removed from himself I was just about to say it's so weird to imagine him playing characters

because like I just can't imagine him like even getting into a headspace of someone but I guess it's also like, is he constantly so blank that he's able to very easily be like, all right, I'm a different person. Is he Peter Sellers? Right. Because you watch him and he's not like a sketch comedian, but he makes distinct different characters with different voices and different physicality, and you believe each one is a separate person.

But whatever he's doing on stage is just something that's kind of like unsolvable. And then, yeah, right. You go from Psycho Killer to Heaven, right? Which is when I just text you with tears in my eyes and say like I think this is the most perfect movie ever made. I mean the only reason – the only thing you could hold against this movie is if you don't like their music. If that was just a stumbling block to getting into the film. Sure. And even then you'd be like,

I can't argue. This is the best anyone could direct a concert. Right. Um, but, but something about the heaven number with bringing in Tina Weymouth, like the introduction of, we're going to build a band one by one,

really spotlight each person. But also the fact that he has the backup singers harmonizing with him off stage, not to be like a literal dummy about it, but there was something I found so emotional about it feeling like it is literally like the heavens singing with him. That they are unseen. It's spooky. It's spooky. Yeah.

It's spooky. It's these angelic voices. But also I feel like I'm paying attention to the bass in ways that like, you know, the bass line. You might not if you're just watching a band perform. Right. And it's still, like, just, like, crushingly intimate, just the two of them up there. And it's a very naked and emotional song, and it's weird. It forces you to recognize that Tina is an amazing bass player. Oh, cool.

And that heaven is a place. Sorry, carry on. A place where nothing ever happens. Ever happens. I also love that during that performance, start like setting up like they bring out like is it Jerry on the drums or Chris I think Chris they bring out Chris on the drums like on that platform

and like he chooses to sort of like let you see the stage hands like moving it which I love right yeah I love it so much and I feel like it's such a I keep thinking of it as a strange choice given the song and how intimate

that feels with just two people but it's like I don't know it's weirdly cool to just have it be like this is an intimate performance but you should get

the same experience that they're getting of like having this sort of almost interrupted by stagehands or like they cut away from that

just to follow stagehands and they're all in black and I'm like well can you see them if you're in the audience like how does the lighting work but it's just all the fact that the

the stage is coming together as well as the band coming together that you start with it being just like a completely vacant like warehouse-y space the weird like guts

of a theater that you never see where you're like oh it's just like a poorly painted brick wall and like ladders and stuff and then you slowly like bring on the it's just like a poorly painted brick wall and like ladders and stuff. And then you slowly like bring on the separate band members and

you bring down the backdrop. You know, you bring in the drum platform. I love that when he walks out, you can see all the marks, you know, for what's going to happen. Like there's this weird blueprint for like what's, you know, going to happen. Whereas an audience member wouldn't get, because I like the idea of a concert film that's

giving you something a little different than what you would have experienced as an audience member wouldn't get – because I like the idea of a concert film that's giving you something a little different than what you would have experienced as an audience member. This is a concert film that certainly makes you feel like you're at this concert. Right. But it also has that kind of magic quality that a lot of them don't. It makes you feel like how it would feel to watch this concert, not what watching the concert looks like. It is not didactic in terms of sort of like all those 3D concert documentaries we were talking about, which is just like get the cleanest coverage and you do it in 3D and it feels like you're there in the audience. And this is giving you like intimacy that replaces the energy you would feel from being in that room. You know, he's making strong choices to try to capture in a sort of subjective way the feeling of a live performance.

And all those captured moments of just the people jamming together. You know? Feeling each other. I mean, I was like thinking after sort of like looking and just like reminding myself of all these people's backgrounds. It's crazy to think once you get everyone on stage

the influence on culture of all of these people like Modern Lovers, Tom Tom Club, Bernie Worrell who we haven't talked about, organist, founding member of Parliament, Funkadelic. I mean, that is, I mean, it's just

it's amazing to think of how much influence all of these different people have had. It's just great to see them then on stage together playing together. And it feels like they don't, like maybe it's just because it's so early in, not early in their career, but like it's so

maybe not far enough that they just have like a jaded sense about who they are like the music they make, but it does feel like that's why the moments where they like break and are smiling at each other, like you see Jerry Harrison trying to play and like dance along with the backup singers. He's kind of off. And you're like, this seems so fun and how like unpretentious and like just sort of like truly.

I don't even know. It's like it's you can tell that they're the enjoyment they have for each other is real. And it's like they're not just like, yeah, we're all just getting together. We're really good. We're going to do a job. It's like we all fucking enjoy this still and like are truly experiencing it every night like voltron yes it's exactly like voltron noel gallagher to bring up hot ones again was recently on hot ones great great fucking appearance noel gallagher one of the great

people to give interviews and he talks about how like he has a great line where he says my youngest son who's either seven or nine he's incredible and Sean Evans goes he's not eight and he goes definitely not well maybe eight

and there's a bunch of things he talks about one thing he talks about is like you know Sean Evans brings up the Nebworth concert which is this very famous you know

British concert where he plays this to like 130,000 people and it's just insane and he's like yeah that was crazy and also I remember and this sounds like such an old man yells the British concert where Oasis played to like 130,000 people. And it's just insane. And he's like, yeah, that was crazy. And also I remember, and this sounds like such an old man yells at cloud thing, but like no cell phones, like no one was holding up a cell phone,

which now is like this ubiquitous concert experience, which you sort of think about with this too. But then the other thing he brings up is like, right, I could have stayed with Oasis and like so many bands like that that have been doing it for a long time, we would have shown up, we would have done the concert, we would have left and not talked to each other and gone our separate ways. And he's like so many of the bands that are still touring, that's

what they do. They don't hang out. Like, they're not really friends anymore. How could you be? It's so many years. And they all feel like friends in the talking heads. Totally. And even though they split up and everything, they seem to be on fairly good terms of the rare occasions they are together. And they never made an embarrassing album.

Well, Tina, that is true. Tina Weymouth does talk about how she's like close with Chris and obviously Chris and Jerry, but says that like David Byrne is like incapable of friendship and like has never loved them, which it's like,

that's heartbreaking to hear. It is. Yeah. I mean, it also, it's not the most shocking thing in the world. Cause he seems like a weird guy. He's yeah.

He's eating cottage cheese in a room somewhere. Right. As I speak. He's actually right over there. I'm sorry. I bet. Didn't mean to point him out. I imagine him with like a coffee IV drip.

Interesting. It's what should we talk about? Anytime that David leaves the room, I want to talk about something we can't talk about drip. Interesting. What should we talk about? Anytime that David leaves the room, I want to talk about something we can't talk about with him here. What does he hate talking about? Oh, God. What does he hate talking about? He hates bits. He hates bits?

He hates planes. Did you take a plane here? I did. Well, yes. I saw you taking some trains as well, right? Yeah. Okay. I took a plane, a train, and an automobile just to get in this damn room.

You did the full Hughes? Full Hughes. Wow. A lot of people, they'll do one or train, and an automobile just to get in this damn room. You did the full Hughes? Full Hughes. A lot of people will do one or two, plane and automobile. No, I had to get a train in there. Almost took a boat, but wasn't feeling it. I was like, it's the three.

U2 sucks, right? We can just say that with David out of the room. U2 is one of the worst bands ever right come on man this is a controversial it was great Demi it's a retired bit you haven't heard the episode

yet but it's a retired bit we have to bleep that out what's the retired bit I'm not gonna say it cause it's retired okay I was saying the Demi oh okay well I'm sorry that I'm making a lot of work for you. He's too twisted. We have to... Look up there in the rafters. Yeah, you don't want

to get a bullseye on your back. I don't. I get that. I don't want to get smacked in the face with a fish and the fish is wearing makeup. Fish is wearing makeup? It's the kind of thing he would do! He's done before and he'll do it again! And I don't even want to say who! I'll say it. I'm not afraid of him. Now I am. I was gonna say it and then I thought about the fish again and I don't even want to say who I'll say it I'm not afraid of him now I am I was going to say it and then I thought about

the fish again and I don't want to I feel like Bono made people think like when celebrities take on like causes I feel like he made it where people were like this dumb idiot with the sunglasses is trying to do something I feel like there's something about the trajectory

of people feeling like, oh my God. Oh, cool. Another Hollywood elite trying to help the world out. It's the glasses. It's a double-edged sword. It's the sunglasses. And the sanctimoniousness of it. And the iPods. How dare you?

The iPod thing. Deliver your album. I didn't ask for it. Oh, that too. I just meant the fact that he's like, it's a red iPod and. The iPod thing. Deliver your album. I didn't ask for it. Oh, that too. I just meant the fact that he was like, well, it's a red iPod and that's charity. Yeah. What, like, remember when that was the thing where it's like, and now the iPod is in red

and the money is like, we'll give like $1 to a charity. And it was the only other color for the first 10 years of the iPod's existence. If you wanted anything other than the white iPod, you had to be like, it's the Bono one. You know? I kept on being like, aesthetically, I would want a non-white

iPod. I want the red one. I'm very fascinated. The article that was written, now I'm forgetting what outlet it was, but about you a couple months ago. Me? Yes. When you were talking about leaving Punch Up the Jam and going to New Zealand. Yes, the Ringer piece, which is incredible.

Thank you. I wrote it. About yourself. You're an even better writer than I thought you were. No, but I have long been a fan of yours. Thank you. And I yours. Our friendship has come out of me just being a massive fan of yours for years and years and years.

I think you're one of the best comedy brains on the planet among other things. But you in that article talked about this feeling of unease in a way. Is that fair to say? With like sort of this career you've made for yourself doing things that aren't what you thought you were ultimately working towards doing as much as you enjoy them? Yeah, I feel like it's sort of like I do so many different things and then get known as the the blank guy. And it's like that's not the fault of anyone. And it's like obviously if someone was like familiar with my work through like Gilmore guys, they'd be like, it's the Gilmore guy guy. Right.

Like it's not wrong in any way. But then I start feeling like what if I'm not ever able to do the things that I set out to do what if I get pegged what if one of these sticks and I become the novelty of that

and not even necessarily that it's like one of these sticks and because of that I become this guy but it's just like what if I'm never able to do the things

that I'm like well these are my goals and then it's like well these things that I kind of do just for fun or because they like come up as ideas in my head are like the only thing I'm like well these are my goals and then it's like well these things that I kind of do just for fun or because they like come up as ideas in my head or like the only thing I'm ever able to create

and they're like not super creatively fulfilling although they are like very fun and often come out of me just being like oh that's funny or like having an idea that sticks in my head over and over and just like being like I'm going to do it and it's like sometimes they also feel like distractions from like real work like finishing something I'm supposed to be writing or like

and I just kind of get the sense of like these are so much easier for me than the things I feel like are my real goals and like the like outlet where I'm like, no, this is what I when I've done it. I will be like I am is like good or successful or whatever people want to call me as I like as people want to say. But then I'm just kind of like if these are easier and I only end up doing this, then what am I? Well, right. You're a person with very broad creative aspirations. Yeah. And I feel like if you're someone who has in your head the things that you've been like, I want to do this someday. I want to make a thing that feels like this or something with this kind of shape since you were like a child.

You don't feel like you're doing what you were meant to be doing until you're doing that work even if you are making a career for yourself or getting attention or getting positive notice for doing other things even if you enjoy those things and they've been helpful in getting me closer and closer but I just keep being like I'm not doing the

thing yet which is like such I think it's just a damaging way to think about anything but it's also like kind of I feel like also it doesn't help that I sort of get described in ways that like people who like are almost unanimously like hated on the internet or it's like people are like this content creator, like Vine star. And I'm just kind of like, I don't write any of those things that are sort of reductive. Right. Well, yeah, because I mean, I became a fan of yours through Vine. And the thing that was so infectious about your stuff on Vine was just, like, this feels like this guy's making it because he thinks it's funny.

Hmm. Without any thought towards whether or not this will be funny to anyone else. Right. I'm not going to lie to you. It was all for the money. Okay, never mind. It was all for those sweet, sweet Vine dollars. But there was that sort of, like, it felt like very earnest expression

of, like, weird things you think to yourself that make yourself laugh. Yeah. Combined with always the knowledge of how much work you were putting into everything. There was always an unnecessary amount of technical complication to any seven-minute video you did that made it funnier. I feel like that's always for me been like one of the things I'm like, that's kind of the joke. Right. Like when people are just kind of like, you have too much time on your hands. I'm like, yeah.

That's, yeah. That's the gag here. You're supposed to be just kind of like, you have too much time on your hands. I'm like, yeah, that's, yeah. This is supposed to be like, why the fuck did he do this? But even like the succession song that you did, that's like your most recent at the time of our recording thing to sort of like. Yeah, two months from now, I got, what's out this Christmas? Frozen. I wrote a Frozen musical that's not the one that you saw on Broadway. A whole three hour musical. Yes. I got, what else is happening?

Oh, you know, Star Wars. What else we got going on? Spies in Disguise? Spies in Disguise? You're going to do a Spies in Disguise. No, I can't. Old hat. Will Smith shit?

Old hat. But DJ Khaled is in the cast. I don't care. Old hat. He was in Aladdin, too. He's a bird, not a hat. I just want to make this clear. Old bird? He was in Aladdin too. He's a bird, not a hat. I just want to make this clear. Old bird?

He's an old pigeon. Okay. I just feel like this Succession video, for example, right? A lot of people, if they had that idea and know that Succession is on the tip of everyone's tongue right now, it's the it thing, would try to figure out how to put together the best quality production so they could make it, in theory, totally primed for virality, right? We hired a good crew, and I spent $20,000 to do a two-day shoot for a thing that might just fucking disappear on the internet.

And you do neither, which is you don't just record yourself singing and put it out there, but you don't spend too much money and too much energy doing it. You spend the weirdest amount of energy doing it, which is each separate voice being in its own box. Yeah. As separate video and audio tracks. Well, for that I had originally done it as like

one of my credits videos and been like, it had lyrics and then the Pusha T thing happened and I was just kind of like what's another way to do this? And I'd been like singing that song just to my girlfriend and to friends for ages and they were just like, do something with this happened and I was just kind of like, what's another way to do this? And I'd been like singing that song just to my girlfriend and to friends for ages and they were just like, do something with this. And I was like, I'll eventually do it.

And then the finale was happening. I was like, I guess I got to do it now before everyone's like, what the fuck is Succession? And then I was just kind of like, I don't know, it's got this weird like, feel like those acapella videos you see of people like filming themselves singing.

I was like, I just went to my balcony and just started recording it. Yeah. But yeah. So I mean, do you feel that conflict? I mean, I'm singing. I was like, I just went to my balcony and just started recording it. Yeah. But, yeah. So, I mean, do you feel that conflict? I mean, I'm trying to sort of like, this is also sort of all the stuff we're talking about with the ineffable like power of the talking heads.

Sure. Nice segue. Thank you. But do you feel like there's the conflict of like when you have an idea like that, do you go like, should I really do this one? Does it have to be something like really special for me to commit to doing it rather than trying to focus my time on writing my screenplay or whatever the bigger project is? So the thing with me is like there's always something where I'm like, oh, that's funny, and I'll like take notes on it. And if I keep coming back to it, I'm like, okay, shit, maybe I should do this.

that's funny. And I'll like take notes on it. And if I keep coming back to him, like, okay, shit, maybe I should do this. But then there are also times where it's like,

I fully written a thing and then just been like, ah, the time has passed. Like, I really like, it's irresponsible of me to like focus on this right now. Sure. So it's like, if I have something that like is an active project that I'm like,

I need to be on a deadline for this. And I'm, I have this other idea. I'm just kind of like, I guess it'll fall by the wayside. There's an entire, uh, Lion King song I wrote as Donald Glover that I'm like, I just didn't put. I'm just kind of like, I guess it'll fall by the wayside. There's an entire Lion King song I wrote as Donald Glover that I'm like,

I just didn't put it out because I was like, well, it went away. Yeah. I keep thinking like, when's the DVD coming out? Maybe then. Ben went to the bathroom, so now we have to talk about something we can only talk about when Ben is gone. Oh, sure. Quar is weird.

Quar is weird. Fucking weird. Quar is weird. Fucking strange. And Bono's oh wait no that's you. Yeah. How can you not like Bono? All my chips are on him. The iPods were red?

They were red? For Africa? David you fucked it up. Jonathan knows. Okay well that's what we talked about when you and you know what one thing I didn't say

why don't they do the charity songs anymore with the superstars? Oh, you mean like, do they know it's Christmas? Yeah. That would be fun. Like, get them all in a room, film it. One of them's like trying too hard.

One of them's clearly hung over and has like sunglasses on. One of them is like trying to get into every single shot. I mean, it seems like something DJ Khaled would organize now, right? That's like his job, right? He's basically a wedding planner. Like, you know, he has like a clipboard. He has everyone's phone number. He gets a producer credit on songs.

And it's just kind of like, what'd you do? It's like, I put them in a group chat. Yeah. I mean, he is so good at threading people together in one app. He is. This guy is a master of WhatsApp. Have you seen his Slack? It is insane.

Here's the thing I want to go back to. Have you seen his Slack? It is insane. Here's the thing I want to go back to. What you were talking about. When you didn't have phones everywhere. Yeah. When we could just have a conversation with each other. You wanted to poke someone, you had to do it with your finger. Yeah, and the cops would look the other way. Yeah, Zuckerberg

wasn't giving you a thumbs up. Only tweeting you heard of a robin up in a tree. Back to Robin, are we? That's what he wanted to go back to, maybe. Yeah, maybe. I think that conversation was off mic. Yeah, whatever.

It'll make no sense to people. We were talking about Robin, okay? We lost track of everything. This is what I wanted to say. Yeah? Jonathan, you were talking about... Yeah.

I'm sorry the amazing Jonathan the amazing Jonathan documentary yes that's my name the amazing Jonathan documentary Sims wait can I do something that I know Ben will hate

please no he won't like that alright you were saying I I'm I have a lot of respect

for you for doing that you were talking David god damn it for fuck's sake Jonathan yes All right. You were saying. I have a lot of respect for you for doing that. You were talking, David. God damn it. For fuck's sake. Jonathan. Yes. Amazing Jonathan, Documentary Sims.

You were talking about. I can't wait to go to the bathroom when he gets back. I'm not going to. You were talking about how the shift to concerts being that looks difficult. Sure. Right, right, right. Where it becomes. This is crazy. Right. This is right, right, right. This isn't crazy. The one-optimism of how much money

are you spending on the thing? How many people are on stage? How much technology is there? How much physically... Costume changes, are there? Obviously, talking, you know, it's not making sense as one of the most famous costume changes of all time, but it's just one. Just one. And otherwise, he's removing items of clothing because he's too hot.

Well, there are times where it's like you see his hair like it's suddenly slicked back and I at first I'm just kind of like

oh is it because they shot across four different nights and then it's like no these are like conscious decisions to be like well this is a

different persona right he has the glasses that he puts on at one point he has the red hat he's got the full he straight up

looks like Trump he does it's crazy with the oversized slacks and the red hat it's hilarious to see now.

It's so insane that Trump ruined red baseball caps. You never would have seen that coming. I was sitting on the subway on the way here and I was just kind of like,

oh, red hat. And then I'm like, I was like, I got to get a look at the front. I was like, oh no, some gold logo. And I just felt weird about like,

why has he done this? Ben forwarded me this website that was selling reproductions of the production hats, the crew hats for Midnight Run, and I was like, oh, I want one of these. And I ordered the Midnight Run hat, and it arrived, and it is red with Midnight Run and white

font, and I just looked at it, and I went, oh, I can never wear this. I can't wear this. Even though it's like the graffiti logo, I was like, it's, he's wearing a red hat with nothing on it. That color of that hat is so ruined. He looks more like, well, does Ness have a red hat with nothing on it. That color of that hat is so ruined. He looks more like, well, does Ness have a red hat?

No way to know. Anyway. Ness? I think he does. Is it blue or is it red? I think it's blue. I feel like it's a two-toned. It's red.

Go with a blue. Yeah, blue bill. Blue bill. That's what, I knew there was a blue bill. Yeah, that's what keeps him from being a MAGA stan. You know the other person who had a famous. This guy fucks. Oh, Bill. That's what... I knew there was a Blue Bill. Yeah, that's what keeps him from being a MAGA stan. You know, the other person who had a famous... This guy fucks. Oh, please.

That is a child, Jonathan. He fucks, Jonathan. Oh, boy. Is there anything less surprising and more on brand that Ness is my go-to in Smash Brothers? God, it's so annoying. Because it's like, oh, what if I was in this fight? Right. What about you, Demi?

Do you play Smash Brothers? Oh, I do. Are you a gamer? I'm a Toon Link man. Which is also, you're like, yeah, what if I was in this fight? Right. What about you, Demi? Do you play Smash Brothers? Oh, I do. Are you a gamer? I'm a Toon Link man. Which is also, you're like, yeah, that's not surprising. Makes a ton of sense. Love Toon Link. Yeah, because I'm tiny and I run around and go, yeah!

Got a lot of heart, though. Got a lot of heart. Got a lot of heart. At least three. I need them to live. Who do you play as? Jonathan. Regular Link is a fave of mine.

I like the sword boys. Give me a pit. You are a regular version of me. Yeah, you play as? Jonathan. Regular Link is a fave of mine. I like the sword boys. Give me a pit. You are a regular version of me. Yeah, I'd say. I have like a slightly more deep-throated. Yeah, I like Link. I like Marth. Give me some Marth. Marth?

Yeah, Marth. I Marth it up. Who's Marth? I don't know if I unlock Marth. He's got a sword. He's one of the Fire Emblem boys. We don't know Marth. I'm Marth it up. Who's Marth? I don't know if I've unlocked Marth. He's got a sword. He's one of the Fire Emblem boys. We don't know Marth. And then I love Roy. Yeah, Roy's another one. The thing is, I know that these are real characters.

It just sounds insane. I love Roy. Roy rules! Ah, Logan. Yeah, I went to school with Logan and now he's in a game. It's so great to see his camera. Lawrence Thompson. He's from the HR department at Nintendo. You can unlock him, and he just. It is weird when they started being like, I don't know, the Wii Fit trainer, and people were like, the what?

And they're like, yeah, sure. The Game & Watch stick figure? That could be a character, right? But they were in early. I feel like they were in the first. Yeah, Wii Fit's a funny one. They got weird with it early enough that they could be like okay well you like that weird

so you can handle literally anything yeah I like Mega Man I like Mega Man do you know what I'm waiting for in Smash Brothers I want them to make

the physical consoles playable I want you to be able to play as an N64 give me a virtual boy and the N64 just kind of waddles around like Hugsworth

give people epilepsy yeah oh god my friend Pat who will be on the show at some point, Pat May, one of the best people I know, one of the finest people I know, we did a road trip to Toronto, and we went to a vintage video game store,

and he bought a Virtual Boy. And they were like, we have to warn you. People think this is a cute thing to do. Legally, if you want to buy it, we cannot refuse to sell it to you but it will make you sick right we don't want you to buy this and he was like i got it and they were like we really advise are you gonna put it in the case and he was like no i'm gonna play it and they're like we really don't don't play it and then he proceeded to play it in the car ride back the

virtual boy which has like a little C-stand is supposed to be placed on a desk. He put on his lap with headphones and was playing it in the back of a moving vehicle. Did he barf? He's dead. How's it gonna be on the pod? Someday when we do a seance episode.

No, he's a great man and his brain is broken because he played virtual boy in the back of a car. It is just crazy to imagine that Nintendo was like, okay, look, we spent a lot of money on this thing. And everyone's like, uh-huh. Games are cool. It's crazy. There's one issue. If you play it at all, you throw up and have a headache.

Like, fuck, how do we get around? They wait all the way to making it, and then they were like, we can't get around this. It is the worst thing to do problem. they were like, we can't get around this. It is the worst thing to do problem. There was more vetting at a vintage game store trying to buy a Virtual Boy 20 years later than people have buying a gun in the United States of America. There was like, they need to improve paper, show responsibility. It feels like there was a guy who was in charge of like just checking the systems and he got

blind at one point. He's like, I can't lose this job. I'm not going to. It's like, it works great. It works great. I love the games. Perfect. The difficulty of

concerts, right? People need to do this sort of like one-off design shit. Yeah, but I remember when the Ashley Simpson thing happened on SNL and a bunch of people came to their defense, to her defense and said like, well, I mean, look, that's what the industry is now. Like, people want these big concerts

where someone does 18,000 costume changes and they're flying on the stage. So the last thing they can worry about is actually singing. It's physically impossible to hit those notes when you're that out of breath and you're doing that much night after night. So I'm sorry,

this is what you've asked for. And now, of course, Ashley Simpson is going to lip sync even when she goes on SNL because that's what people get used to with a live performance. And like this is like, this is, watching this film, you're like, this is why you would want to go see a concert. 100%. The most a concert could be while still feeling truthful

to the idea of seeing live music. This is when rock music was still mainstream music. Yeah. I would argue, I mean, obviously there is like some popular bands that I don't pay attention to that are out there. But I don't think there's like very many cool mainstream rock bands, I would argue. Greta Van Fleet? No, you know who to argue? What?

I'm like, yeah. Yeah, that's a a person and or band what's the three sisters Haim Haim the band I would argue oh that's what I meant

yeah yeah the band I would argue just in type of thing I'm not talking in terms of quality although I do like them but the band who I think comes closest to doing the type of thing

Talking Heads used to do in terms of the energy of their concerts, their actual size in terms of like record sales and everything, and the sort of like conceptual aspect to their other works is Arcade Fire. Like Arcade Fire does a little bit of that where it's like we're going to perform at a church. We're going to do a music video that's interactive. We're going to do this. We're going to do that. That dance album was pretty rough.

It's not very good. Oh, yeah, the new – yeah, that sucked. And right, that was... They released that single and everyone was like, cool! New direction! Oh, this is fun! And then the album came out and it blew. Was not good. I don't know what album you're talking about. It's called Everything Now. Oh, yeah.

Because, you know, we got everything now. But the song's called Chemistry. Wait, you're not into this? The single is good. we got everything now but the song is called chemistry wait you're not into this no the yeah sorry the single is good it is that thing though of like you're watching

this man on stage like everything short of bleeding for you by the end of it he is sweating so much right it does feel like

someone just like performed an exorcism on him when you look at like the husk of his like tired body at the end of it but it doesn't feel like someone just like performed an exorcism on him when you look at like the husk of his like tired body at the end of it. But it doesn't feel like he's doing that for the sake of look how hard he's working. It feels like he is just so committed to what he's doing.

That he is feeling it so deeply, you know, that it's taking everything out of him. And I don't know. out of him. And I don't know. I just feel like it's gotten replaced by that other type of showmanship that is more, you know, how you like me now, kind of. I feel like there are so many smaller bands who have to rely on the showmanship because they don't, or not, or not. Actually, yeah, the showmanship because they don't really have like the money to like put

on like incredible performances with like technological set changes or whatever. And that's where so much of that energy lives but it's also just like the crowd is giving you the same energy as the people on stage so it's like i don't know it just feels like this sort of feedback loop of like that's when they're still enjoying it but then i wonder if like those bands as they slowly get bigger start to have to rely on other things where it's like oh the energy of that performance doesn't like no one gives a shit when you're like like, performing on, I was going to say Leno, and then I was like, let's pretend we're not 75.

Sure. Who's on TV now? You got it. On Logan Paul. You got it. Right. Yeah. A hundred percent.

On Late Night with Jacob Sartorius. Yes, of course. And it's like like I think that like they start thinking about what's more important in performance and how you have to like plan for it

as a visual thing past just being in like this one room right with this concert film you can sort of feel that it's like they were caring about both

but in a way where they could kind of just focus on what works in the room and like just work on like the angles and how to like sort of make each thing feel works in the room and just work on the angles and how to sort of make each thing feel different in a way

so they don't have to just go, well, if this is going to be a visual medium, we've got to think of it in a different way and we've got to have David Byrne talking backstage about what the thing's going to do or show him getting into the big screen. It's so great that they don't explain anything. Now, maybe that type of live performance, though, too,

is it comes down to most people are seeing them on a big screen because they're playing these huge venues. So it's like it's got to have more than just a band playing music in order for you to stay engaged because you're basically you just see ants. So it's like there's got to be visuals there's got to be gimmicks. Right but when things

get that complex A they have to be so carefully and tightly worked out that they start to become a little sort of hermetic. Yeah. You know? And like airless because it's very specific. The cables have to be in this moment at this whatever. And also people are going to be watching them on a giant screen.

So you have to be hitting very specific marks for framing. Yeah. And that makes it so that any concert you were seeing in any city would 95% be the same. And any filmed performance of it would be 95% the same as watching any live performance. And this feels like, despite it being

stitched together from a couple different shows, this feels like you're watching something very unique being captured in a bottle. You know? It feels like there is sort of this through line of how the concert's supposed to go, and it's just kind of like, we have things planned at every point,

but there's small moments where it goes a little to the left and they lean back into the middle, and it's like those small moments where it just, I mean, I've said this like 20 times now, but it just feels real, and they're enjoying each other's company that make it feel like this is why this documentary works so well. Totally.

He words things differently in some of the songs. Yeah. And you can't tell if he's getting the words wrong or if he's just feeling different that night or whatever. Yeah. It's strange. There's – I forget one. But there's a line in Heaven where he totally swaps out three words in a row. Sure.

Yeah. Where he says blank check instead of Heaven. He does. It was very much like the opening of this episode. Just as good. He talked about Robin too. He like the opening of this episode. Just as good. He talked about Robin, too. He did talk about Robin off mic. I keep thinking about the Beyonce documentary, Homecoming, and how there's one moment that feels so impressive where they cut between the nights and it's so tightly choreographed that everyone is in yellow and they have this wide shot and they cut to the other night and they're all in pink and you're just kind of like,

holy shit, everything is like right on the money. And that's so impressive. But at the same time, there is this sort of like realness and like, sort of like relatability and enjoyment that you are missing from this performance. Cause it's so clearly like,

right. That's more like, right. This is perfectly choreographed piece it's not a living thing in the same way I mean that's what I texted David

it's athletic the Beyonce and it's like super like I'm not trying to knock it or anything it's super impressive but I think like the lack of that

is why so many concert films now will just have to be like we need like a backstage moment where you can feel the realness and it's like the ones in the Beyonce documentary don't feel more real

but I mean we're never going to get that with Beyonce we just kind of have to accept that but it is just like it's still an impressive thing but you can't

like exchange it fully for the things that you get in a performance that it almost just feels like they kind of were just like

oh we're just happening to capture this concert yeah the thing I texted Amazing Jonathan documentary Sims last night. Still Sims. Yeah, of course.

Okay. Yes. Family name. No disrespect. But when I was like, there's an argument for this being the most perfect movie ever made. I was like, it's just pure creativity. Right. Like you were just watching pure creativity and craft on stage.

And you kind of can't argue with that. You know, there's nothing in it that you could find objectionable. What kind of jerk would you be if you're like, what's this thing with the glasses? What is a nerd now? I don't like that part. Everything's sort of just the right amount and also just ambiguous

enough that you can sort of find your own meaning in it. Your own feeling in it. What's your guys' favorite bit? Favorite song? From this? From this, yeah. You had to pick. I love in This Must Be the Place where he's dancing with the lamp.

He has this weird smile where he's falling over the lamp and then picks it back up. He's like, I wasn't supposed to go that far. It lands back into place and he's like, is it gonna, I don't know. Anytime David Byrne smiles I feel like it's this weird thing he's just like right he it like lands back in place and he's like uh is it gonna is it gonna i know it's just so like anytime david burn smiles i feel like it's this weird thing he's not supposed to do because he again just like he's been eating cottage cheese and had no emotions for years that like it's like oh he's real and right there's a spontaneity to it yeah and also you think of yourself and like what if i was fucking around with a lamp yeah

and also just the kind of thing that if I were, had watched this when I was a kid, I'd do it in my living room and just shatter the fucking lamp. Right. He, in that video,

that's him interviewing himself. One of the characters asked him, will you ever write a love song, David? And he goes like, I don't know. Love is pretty big. I tend to prefer songs about little things

like animals or food or buildings. I did write one love song, though, but it's about a lamp. And that's his explanation. Yeah, well, that's cool. I like just the idea of like you're watching a lamp dance. And a lamp is not a human thing and it can't dance. And like that he's showing you like this sort of like. You ever seen any Pixar opening?

It's true. I'm sorry. you ever seen that brave little toaster there's a lamp in that one fucking lampist you know right like that he's he's bringing personality

to something inanimate and and it does feel like like he's you know doing a Fred Astaire routine with a lamp but that thing also

with like most sort of like on the edge I'm saying he wants to fuck a lamp of course a hot lamp The hot lamp. The hot lamp. 2019.

Most like really sort of cutting new wave artists always incorporate things, very classical things from the past. So there's something about watching this new wave rocker sort of doing a Fred Astaire routine. So sort of earnestly on stage. And then with the big suit, he's being inspired by like ancient Japanese performance, right? Right. You know, like that was on his mind when he's coming up with this tour. He was talking about the theatricality of Japanese theater

and how big everything was and how he wanted to apply that to sort of all the weird emptiness of like American culture that their songs are about. It looks so like very like Klaus Nomi with the big shoulder pads and whatnot, too. And it's this incredible- It's got that weird expression. I mean, you can project so many metaphors onto the big suit, but you write that idea

of sort of getting lost in superstardom and performance and you're on performance. Yeah, I think he's trying to talk about Trump's America and the clowns in Congress. It's not coming. Yeah, exactly. You know, big fashion or bigness in fashion was like a thing, I would say, like last year. There was a few

designers where they were making those giant ass puffy jackets. Lenny Kravitz with the scarf. Well, I mean, that's just a really cool look. Lenny Kravitz with his penis. Oversized. Saw a guy in an inflatable Minions costume last year. Big.

Fashion. Yeah. Big. I love Minions. Bidu bidu. Ben has decided that he's You know what I'm saying? Ben has decided that he's

now gonna get into Minions. With absolutely like sincere and ironic appreciations of Minions He announced to us that he's gonna start

watching the movies and getting into Minions memes. My dad is an earnest fan of the movies and getting into Minions memes. My dad is an earnest fan of the Minions. Of course he is. Dads love animated films more than they should. But is that mostly, like, does he like the Minions on Facebook or does he like the films or both? Oh, the films.

I don't think he has Facebook. But, like, I remember we went to Universal Studios and they had, like, the Minions singing YMCA. He's like, oh, that's Stewart singing YMCA. And I was just like, he knew it was by voice. He didn had the Minions singing YMCA. He's like, ah, that's Stewart singing YMCA. And I was just like, he knew it was a Bible. He didn't say Minions. He said, that's Stewart singing YMCA. Your dad and Nick Weiger should host

a Minion podcast. Oh, my dad would hate the podcast thing, but he's like, yeah, I'll talk to your friend about Minions. Just tell him it's a series of phone calls that you're recording. Once a week, you're going to talk to this guy for 45 minutes about Minions. Oh, and I get money? Yeah.

Well, we'll see about that. He will probably believe Weiger is his own age. This is a contemporary of yours. He is also a man who has settled down. I'm going to have to catfish him and be like,

I need to hire an older guy to pretend to be Nick Weiger for my time. I'll hold up a photo. Yeah. Nick's voice will match that. What a great podcast Ben produced. David Byrne?

David Byrne? Is that what we're talking about? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stop making sense. There's this sort of meme now of like, oh, David Byrne predicted everything where people take elements from like his work or lyrics from songs or whatever. That line where he said, our president's crazy. Sure.

Like, how could he know? Right. That line where he said, hashtag dump Trump. He did say it. Let's call? Sure. Like, how could he know? Right. That line where he said, hashtag dump Trump. He did say it. Let's call him Trump. He said it early. He said that too.

Maybe this should be your next concept album. It's just David Parsons about the Trump administration. There was this interview I was trying to find again. I kept on finding other quotes like adjacent to it but like from him in the 80s talking

about technology and the early days of like computers and automation like he was freaked out by ATMs and was like I can see where this is going people want to avoid interaction with other humans everything's going to be convenient which he was pretty on the money about

but there's this one quote ATMs you should put him on the money about. But there's this one quote. On the money? ATMs. You should put him on the money. That'd be fine. That'd be weird. Yeah, it would be weird. In the big boxy suit.

Of all the people? I'm a $6 bill. There's this one interview I found with him a couple months ago that I couldn't find to read today where he talked about how he perceived the future was going to be our personal information would be the ultimate currency. That we would be given almost everything we wanted at great convenience if we were willing to give up some of

our privacy. He fucking hit it on the head. Now I'm just imagining someone being like, please, I'll show you my dick. Just give me the fucking... I just need $2 off this coffee. I'll give you one ball. You want both balls?

And you go, fine, Adam Sandler. Here you go. My penis. All right. I know what you're working with. I'll update the charts. Should we play the box office game? I think we should, yeah.

Are there any final thoughts? I mean, I hope this encourages you to watch some more Jonathan Demme films. I'll watch some more of this Jonathan Demme film. Okay. I'm going to move on to Philadelphia. I hear that's a fun one. It's set in Philadelphia. It is.

It's a great city. Philadelphia? Set in Philadelphia? Mm-hmm. Well, shit. You guys should have told me that. I don't know. I was like, no.

They're trying to get to Philadelphia. For sure. Right, yeah, it's a road to movie. Yeah. I know this is a stand-up joke that everyone made in the 90s, but it is kind of crazy that movie's called Philadelphia. Of course, right.

Because it's like if you made a cancer movie and called it New York. It's very, I don't know why. It's a brotherly love thing. Sure. I think that's the reasoning and it is where it's set. Yes. But it's also- It'd it is where it's set. Yes.

It'd be weird if it wasn't set there. Right. Maybe it's just like they eat cream cheese at one point. They're like, mmm. Although, we recently learned on Doughboys, Philadelphia cream cheese is not for Philadelphia. Sure. Everything I know is a lie. I know.

Where's it from? I think like Delaware. I don't know. Jesus Christ. Somewhere. This is a sham. Yeah. Anyway, box office game.

Oh, okay. Sure. Okay. So this movie came out on October, as we already said, 18th, 1984. The very day we're recording today. Yeah, yes. 35 years ago. It opened in seven theaters.

It made $40,000. It's going to go on to make a few million dollars, as you say, but. Yeah, big success. Yeah. Ben's yawning. Sorry. Avatar levels. Avatar levels.

Just for inflation, this would make $700 million to master? That's right. Yeah. Ben Dion. Sorry. Avatar levels. Avatar levels. Right, right, right. Just for inflation, this would make $700 million to master? That's right. Okay. Number one at the box office, and this is a 1984 box office, so there are some movies here where I'm like, eh? Some real 84s. Wait, this is October 94? October 84.

That's right. 1984 box office. Sounds like an Orwellian nightmare. Oh! Oh! Do you know what I'm saying like an Orwellian nightmare. Oh! Oh! Do you know what I'm saying? I do. Not really.

Johnny! Number one. Has been number one. This is its third week. Okay. It appears to be quite a hit. It's a comedy drama. Oh, not what I thought.

How to describe it? It's a profession. The title is a profession? Yes, a relatively normal profession. Like a... Ghostbusters. No, no, not that one. What?

Ten comedy points. 100%. The answer, of course, is Gremlins. No. I've never seen this film. I know nothing about it it except that it's about being this it's singular or plural

it's plural it's a no definite article it's an occupation that's been mistreated for many years sure underpaid, undervalued did they make a s*** movie in 1984? what'd you say?

I said Jews. He just said Jews. Retired people. Demi had a good joke. I know, but he's retired. He's got to bleep it out. Ah, okay. He's too twisted.

King of comedy? Kind of the same joke. Yeah. Sure. No. Tell me about the stars of this picture. We've got... Wait, is it a the? Nope. Nope. One word. Plural. We've got... Wait, is it a the?

Nope. Nope. One word. Plural. We've got one of these... I mean, at the time, I would imagine it's kind of young in his, you know, earlier in his career. A grizzled man now.

You love doing an impression of him. You do a great impression of him. Nolte. That's right. Okay. So it's a Nolte. Angels. Then we have a guy who, you know, you said Jews.

He's a famous Jew. Really? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, boy. Big time. Yeah. Think about it.

Dreyfus. No. Hmm. In 1984. Big old Jew. Just a honking Jew. He's still around. He's still booking Jew rolls to this day. It's not Hoffman.

It's Elie Wiesel. Gold? But now you're close. I'm in that sort of territory. You're in that sort of just like hairy character actor. I was going to say shoulder hair. Richard Kind. You're swerving over there. It's one of the Kind Nolte comedies, right?

Yeah. Now come on, come on, come on. Now I want you to just get this Jew. Oh, no. Why is that being isolated? I'm Jewish, to be clear. I was literally like, I need someone to say that they're Jewish. I'm Jewish. Very Jewish.

There's some Jews in here. Come on, come on. Okay. One of your favorite sitcoms he's in. Judd Hirsch. That's right. There you go, Judd Hirsch. So he's in it.

Nolte. Judd and Nolte. One of the younger people in this movie is played by Ralph Macchio. I must not know this movie. I never respected these people, the titles. Is it called Cops? It's the movie of the... Teachers. There we go.

Teachers. Two of least favorite groups cops and teachers cops and teachers teachers for the city man from the second Ben said that I knew I had a 50-50 chance of getting the title

it's cops or teachers yeah it's from Arthur Hiller the director of many movies is the poster like an apple it's an apple with a wick that's sparking it's gonna go off if I made a movie called Teacher Cop,

would you hate it a lot or kind of like it because it's both? Is he busting teachers? I haven't figured it out yet. I gotta, you know. If it was like a horror film in which that was the slasher, then I would probably love it because it would replicate his inner workings. Well, I'm not saying I'm trying

to murder anybody. No, I'm saying they were trying to murder you. Oh, okay. You would be like, finally, people understand how dangerous these cop teachers are. well I'm not saying I'm trying to murder anybody no I'm saying they were trying to murder you oh okay you would like you'd be like finally people understand how dangerous these cop teachers are yeah

Joe Beth Williams is also in there that time the cops go after a white man for once uh yeah commentary now

uh teachers apparently Morgan Freeman in a minor role young Morgan Freeman and it was number one three weeks in a row yeah

made 27 million dollars domestic okay number two is the best actress minor role, a young Morgan Freeman. These are all famous teachers. Made $27 million domestic. Number two is the best actress winner. I had no idea who was in that movie. Best actress winner of the year. Sort of a notorious Oscar win. Because of the speech.

My cousin Vinny. It's not Marlee Matlin. Oh wait, Sally Field? In? Norma Rae. It's not Marlee Matlin. Oh, wait. Sally Field. In? Norma Rae. That's the first one. What's the second one? That's right.

You really like me. That's what it is. Sally Field, her first Oscar for Norma Rae, in my opinion, highly deserved. It's a wonderful movie and she's incredible. And then a few years later, she wins for Places in the Heart, which is a Robert Benton movie. It's sort of like a family drama set in the, what, depression? Right. Yeah.

Right? And that's when she goes on stage and she says, you really like me. I didn't realize that was her second Oscar. That was the whole point where she was like, the first time I thought, okay, but this time now I realize you like me. You really like me. That was the sort of sentiment. You have proven your love to me by giving me the second Oscar, which is really truly

the only way to prove your love to anyone. Give him two. Okay, number three. So that was a big box office hit. Yeah, solid. Solid, solid hit. Can't beat a teacher. No, that's true. Number three is a movie. I'm gonna have to look up. I'm gonna have to look

this one up. So you have no knowledge of what this is. It rings a very vague bell. Now this is an occupation. It's not technically an occupation, but I do think it's very cool. Ben probably thinks this title is cool. It's illegal. I think that's cool.

I like little stuff. One, two inches? Is it like miniature? I'll give you the tagline. I think that's cool. I like little stuff. One, two inches? I'll give you the tagline. Okay. Ben thinks it's cool and it's illegal. And it's illegal? Ben thinks it's cool and it's illegal.

I'm going to actually have to zoom in to see this. The tagline. Wait, and it's an occupation? No. It could be if you're good at it. Here we go. Here we go. Here's the tagline. Okay.

He stole her diaries, broke into her dreams, and became her desires. Is there a movie based on El Scorcho? It's a movie about a burglar who steals a diary and gets infatuated with the woman who's like whose diary it was and begins to like sort of stalk her to like

isn't that fucking Phil Collins movie? no Tarzan? there's a romcom starring Phil Collins where he plays a burglar and I'm forgetting

what it's called this is no romcom this is an erotic drama wow it's produced by Bruckheimer and Simpson early in their careers. I've never heard of it. It was nominated for a couple of Razzie Awards.

It stars Stephen Bauer. I'm just going to give you the title. Yeah, give me the title. Thief of Hearts. Yeah, would never have gotten that. Not a bad title. Correct. It sounds like the kind of thing Ben would like.

Ben just flashed a peace sign. I like that premise so much that I'm like, ooh, pretty good. I kind of want to watch that. But now I'm like, damn it. It sounds like the kind of thing Ben would like. Ben just flashed a peace sign. I like that premise so much that I'm like, ooh, pretty good. I kind of want to watch that. But now I'm like, damn it. It's bad. It does sound great. We'll buy the remake. So that is new this week. It made $3 million this week. Hot IP.

Number four. Now I want to make sure about this. Yes, okay. Alright, so it's based on a novel. And it was recently remade again as a miniseries. Recently? Recently. But this is right when the novel's come out. It's got a big

female star. Flowers in the Attic? No. Good guess. Okay. Castle Rock. Yeah, yeah. It's about a castle on a rock. No, it's like again, it's sort of like Ben's saying, like, Thief of Hearts. Not actually an occupation, but sort of a title. No, it's like, again, it's sort of like Ben saying, like, thief of hearts. Not actually an occupation, but sort of a title.

Two Broke Girls? Big fat liar. Two Broke Girls was a long miniseries. Very long. No, it's like describing what she is. I don't know how to do this. Okay, wait. The Sinner.

These are all TV shows from now. It's a famous holiday song. That's true. Like a... That's true. Like a Christian... Simply having a wonderful Christmas song. So it's a Christmas song.

It was a book. This is a George Roy Hill picture. An Oscar winner at this point. She was already... She'd already won. A famous lady. Yes. Fonda?

Yes, yes, yes. No. No. Think kookier. You're not fond of her. Think kookier. Keaton? I she'd already won. Famous lady, yes. Fonda? Yes, yes, yes. No, no. Think kookier. Think kookier. Keaton? I am fond of her. Keaton. Diane.

Diane. But one of those Diane Keaton movies, lost to memory, I feel like. And this, is this a darker one for her? Yes, yes.

This is like a serious sort of spy drama. Diane Keaton spy thriller? These all, You're describing them all in ways where I'm like good movie. Sounds good. Apparently,

according to Wikipedia, divided reviews. Klaus Kinski is apparently in this. What? Sounds cool. How big was the TV adaptation recently?

Not that big, but pretty well reviewed. It was from like a cool foreign director. Seven seconds. Goddammit, you won't convince me that thing is real. Seven Seconds. God damn it. You won't convince me that thing is real. All right.

It's seven pounds. All right. I'm going to give it to you. Okay. The Little Drummer Girl. That's right. I did not know there was a previous film. Who made the- Park Chan-wook.

Yeah. The director of Old Boy and lots of cool things. A really nightmare. Number five, and this is the only one you guys might get, is a great comedy starring one of the great comedy stars that we all probably love. I know you love him. I guess you might also love him. He's like a comedian.

Airheads. You know, the big comedy stars of the decade. It's not Ghostbusters. No. It's not Ghostbusters. No, it's not Ghostbusters. Ghostbusters number eight. Is this person still alive? Okay, so it's not always. Is he still making movies?

I mean, he'll show up in a movie these days, but he's ramped down. It's not Steve Martin. It is Steve Martin. It is Steve Martin. It's 1984. Oh, no. Is it Roxanne? No, that's later.

Curly Sue. Curly Sue Comedy Curly Sue Is he not in that? That's John Beluche Steve Martin 1984 The Jerk is

80 or 81 Sure I love this movie Don't you like this movie Ben? I've never seen it It's not The Lonely Guy Life? Nope

Is it All of Me? Correct There we go All of Me All of Me is Correct. There we go. All of Me. All of Me is, yeah, Lily Tomlin dies and ends up in Steve Martin's body. Yes. Oh.

And he has, he. So it's like RIPD kind of. But he's got both inside of him. It's very much like RIPD. It's pretty much identical to RIPD. You know, he won, he won like the New York Film Critics Circle Best Actor. It's an incredible performance. This is a great actor as well as a great comic book. It's an incredible performance.

It's a pretty good movie. The performance is amazing. I like that movie. She's amazing too. She rules. Some other movies, you've got The Razor's Edge, the Bill Murray drama. Who is someone who would be the kind of star where it's like, I'll do it for like an hour. Someone where it's like you can get rid of them early.

Sure. Bruce Willis in Tiffany Haddish's body. Yeah, right. So Tiffany Haddish just turns into a stone-faced grump for half the movie? Yeah. Tiffany Haddish just doesn't want to act for the rest of the film. Who keeps asking for more money and a bigger trailer. Just keeps saying, I've done enough takes.

You got what you need. You want me to put on makeup to look, he should put on makeup to look like me. Yeah. You've also got Soldier's Story. Okay. Great drama. You got Ghostbusters. So Ghostbusters is number eight and Razor's Edge is where? Six. Wow. So you got a lot of you got this movie Purple Rain.

Yeah. I don't know if you guys have heard of it. Because I think that's the story. Yeah, it's called A Name of Prince. The story with Razor's Edge is that he had made it. No one wanted to release it. They wanted him for Ghostbusters. He agreed to do Ghostbusters if they released Razor's Edge. Sure, right.

And Ghostbusters was still whooping ass. Sure. At this point, six months after its release. That's right. Ghostbusters has been in theaters for 20 weeks and has made $211 million. Crazy. And now like months in, the Bill Murray drama comes out and people are like, no, collective pass. And Bill Murray runs away to France and doesn't make another movie for five years.

That's what you do. Weird guy. Study at the Sorbonne. Is Gremlins still up there? No, no Gremlins. Really? I wonder if Gremlins got re-released for Christmas. No, you've got the Karate Kid still in there.

Ninja 3. Ninja 3? Ninja 3, The Domination. The third Ninja film. Oh, yeah. That year you have that year's Best Picture winner, Amadeus. And previously there was Ninja 2. Yeah.

And I think it was Ninja 1. They were calling their shot. No, I think they said Ninja 1. I would love to make a movie with the title having a 1 and I'd just be like, fucking call me on my bluff. That's Pokemon the first movie. Which was like a threat.

Doug's first movie was the same thing. That one didn't work out. I'm gonna pitch Columbo season 1. David, you said earlier in this episode that you had something you wanted to reveal about Zero Dark Thirty. Oh, no. That was just a bad joke. I stumbled over me saying that.

Oh, that you hadn't seen it. Yeah. But that is actually funny because last time you were on, Zero Dark Thirty was the only Bigelow movie. Yeah. You said you were going to be in town for these days. I said, we're doing Bigelow. You said the only one I've seen is Zero Dark Thirty was the only Bigelow movie. Yeah, you said you were going to be in town for these days. I said, we're doing Bigelow. You said the only one I've seen is Zero Dark. I keep coming back to the pod for the only movie I've ever seen of a person's filmography.

Yeah. So what should we do next? Oh, I've only seen one Hugh Grant movie. Interesting. My favorite auteur. Which is it? He is. Of course.

Is that the only film? I was looking through his filmography and I was just like this is upsetting that's crazy you've literally never seen another Hugh Grant performance not one which is also crazy

because I'm like I know him so of course he's a type onto himself I think that there's so many people who've like

permeated the public consciousness that I'm just kind of like well I know them and I just never like there was a time up until when did The Force Awakens

come out? 2015? yeah I'd never seen another Star Wars movie before that. Wow. Yeah. I also didn't get into movies until college.

Sure. So I was just like, my parents didn't show me movies as a kid. I didn't have any. Other than Click. Well, yeah. They didn't show me that. I saw the poster and I was like, well, this is the film I watch. Father, take me to the cinema.

And I left that theater a man. Speaking of Sandler. That was your bar mitzvah. That was my bar mitzvah. That was my bar mitzvah. Not Jewish. Still got a dick cut that day. That's not how bar mitzvahs work. Hey, buddy, let me cut your dick.

As soon as I said it, I was like... Is anyone going to call me on this? No, I was like, everything I just said should be cut. Let me cut your penis, buddy. Not intentional. Boy, I'd love to see Sandler make a mole movie. Because Zohan was the same thing where they wrote Zohan in like 97. And the studios were like, get the fuck out of here.

What are you talking about? And it took like 10 hits in a row for them to be like, Jesus Christ, make your Middle East conflict hairdresser movie. It was a hit, right? Yeah, it made $100 million. I don't think it made quite that. Christ, make your Middle East conflict hairdresser movie. It was a hit, right? Yeah, it made $100 million. I don't think it made quite that. It made $100. I'm looking it up. Because his 100 track record of Happy Madison comedies only got disrupted by Jack and Jill.

Just made $100, right? That's so funny. But it made $100. Jack and Jill was the one that slipped. Very quickly, could I just add to something? I don't know if you guys know, David Byrne is putting on a show. Yeah. American Utopia.

I really wanted to go and see it because I was just like, well, I love David Byrne. And he's been doing the show for a while. And apparently it's great. And he took it to festivals and whatnot. But there's got to be something different about seeing it on Broadway that I'm like but it's got a similar vibe to this

like they're all sort of wearing like just grey suits they're not wearing shoes it's like a 12 piece sort of like band but they're moving around on stage

and it's like choreographed in ways where it's like they'll be all in a line and some of them will step forward and some will step backwards and then like move to this

it's all just like seems very theatrical that seems cool wasn't he doing like what's it called not Color Force and then some of them will step forward and some will step backwards and then like move to this. It's all just like seems very theatrical. That seems cool. Wasn't he doing like, what's it called? Not Color Force? Yeah, the,

I know it's your, where it's like a flag sort of, it's like a, not Color Guard, but, yes, Color Guard. That's what it was. He was doing Color Guard shows.

He had a name for it that had color in it as well and now I'm just, yeah. But it was out of that tradition. I believe it was called Contemporary Color. That's it. There we go. And this Vogue article, yeah. But it was out of that tradition. I believe it was called contemporary color. That's it. There we go.

But in this Vogue article, it's quoted here. It's part rock concert, part theatrical spectacle, and part intimate exploration of a major artist's career. Wow. So,

I don't know. Can we say one? Check it out. One final thing about David Byrne. Man, has that guy worn his hair going white well. Yeah.

Like he makes me want to lose all the color in my hair. I can't wait. Another thing that just makes the fucking David Lynch thing harder. Totally. He's so hot. It's true. He's actually gotten more Lynchian, right? Yeah, because they both have that.

The hair swoop. Yeah, the swoop. Demi DiGioia, we're giving you back your name. Thank you. I thought it was fine. Okay. I thought it was fine. We didn't need to comment on it. It was fine. Okay. I thought it was fine. We didn't need to comment on it.

It was fine. Okay, fine. Kind of fine. I don't know if you have anything you want to plug. You're in a transitional period. By the time this comes out, I might have done nothing. Cool. Or.

Or. Might have done something fucking wild. Great. This is coming out December 8th. Yeah. To be clear. That's nothing notable to me. We should mention you did direct The Goldfinch, which should be out on most platforms.

I think you don't want to tell people. I'll cut that out. Sorry. Cut that out. No, leave it in. No. I think it's time people know. Some other guys get in credit and I just, I don't know.

Yeah. Goldfinch. You were the one behind the camera being more boring. No, no, boring-er. I did, I did stop and say,

Ansel, you are a little too captivating right now. I want you to fucking less engaging. I'm interested right now. Not working for me. Less juice.

Take your foot off the pedal. And somehow you like went into the editing room with a two hour cut and you're like, can we stretch this out somehow?

You beefed it up. It is the first movie that has just played at half speed. Yeah, I did some reshoots, and we were kind of like, no, the people in this test screening are still awake. Right, exactly. It's experimental. I'm doing like a reverse Ang Lee. Yeah. So Goldfinch available now on Prime Video probably.

Sure. If we're lucky. Yeah. Crackle. Crackle. Yeah. You're thech available now on Prime Video probably. Sure. If we're lucky. Jack Crackle. Yeah. You're the best in the biz. Thank you. Electra Lemon. You are. You are. We always talk about when the September video came out it came out when we were recording here and we just watched it and we went

he's the funniest person on the planet. Thank you. Truly. I'll hit a cap with that at some point where I'm just like, I can't do anymore. It's done. But I don't know what that'll be. For the time being.

I mean, anytime you release anything, I am constantly in awe of your brain. Well, thank you. You should put up, you should make it a theatrical experience. The September? Ooh.

A pop-up shop where people come and experience me dancing around and then another group of people comes in and I'm just fucking tired by the end of the day. You should reach out to David Brang. Oh, I should. Maybe he's seen him. I could get a big suit.

You could get a big—you would wear a big suit well. You've messed with suits before. I have messed with suits before. For those videos. Yeah. I ended up in Between Two Friends because Zach Galifianakis had seen those videos. There you go. Oh, right.

And he told me that he has talked to Maurice Bailey. You show up as one of the viral people in the beginning. Or no, I'm at the end as the DJ. Of course. I haven't even seen the movie, so I'm just like, this is what people have told me. Yes, yes. You are his DJ when he gets his big time Hollywood talk show. Yeah.

Yeah. So you can. Watch that. Is I, Tonya Stone Hulu? Sure. Watch that. Big I, Tonya fan. You really are the biggest I, Tonya. still on Hulu? Sure. Watch that. Big I, Tonya fan. You really are the biggest I, Tonya fan.

Eight times. In theaters or in total? Maybe four in theaters? We're Letterboxd friends. Every year you have the movie where you're like, yep, this is my year. Parasite for me this year. Well, good choice. Yeah.

But I also, speaking of Letterboxd, let's not, I don't. Danny, there's some mean people don't, I'm not, I'm trying to, There's some mean people in your comments. Well, sure. I watch that happen. But I'm also just,

I think a lot of people think of me as someone where it's like, this guy knows movies. Sure. I, I don't, I haven't seen any of the other

Jonathan Demme movies. Sure. I don't know a goddamn thing about anything. But you know what you like. I know what I like. Yeah. And I like I,

Tanya. I know what I like, and it's I, Tanya. She does three spins in the sky at ice skates. Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate, review, subscribe. Thanks to Andrew for our social media. Lane Montgomery for our theme song.

Especially today. Joe Bowen and Pat Rounds for our artwork. Go to Tee Public for some nerdy shirts. Go to Patreon where we're closing out. Are we coming up on that performance review uh yeah in a couple days we're gonna have oh swimming to cambodia oh perfect timing special guest peter newman my father uh seriously watch out for that one it's an amazing episode it's burn burner yeah uh and as always i i like lucy in the. I haven't seen it. That's my crazy opinion this year.

I've got to have some crazy opinion about a movie this year. I can't think of one. I think it's low-key kind of good. I just am sitting on a Matt Lauer joke, so of course, today, I'm sitting on it! I didn't say it. You said that you had it, and that's bad. It's just as bad. I didn't say I had it.

I said I was sitting on it. Okay, well. I didn't place it on this chair. It was placed like a whoopee cushion, this joke. I sat on it to suppress it. That's not what you do with a whoopee cushion. You do. No, you sit on it to let it out.

If you're sitting on the joke, this analogy doesn't work. You're suppressing the whoopee cushion, which releases the fart. What? No, no. If you sat on the chair and there was a whoopee cushion on it, then, you know, the whoopee cushion is going to do its thing. What you do is you stand up and you avoid sitting on it. Right. Or maybe you could sort of perch.

Yeah. Okay. So maybe what I'm doing is closer to like Steve Rogers jumping on the grenade, you know? Okay. Where it's like, I'm going to sit on it so that no one else has to. And then we didn't know the grenade was there, but you're like, guys, just want you to know, I have a grenade. That was a terrible five minute digression. I want a little credit. I want a little credit. I'm a hero. Fair.

I'm a hero. I'm a very stable genius.