Blank Check with Griffin & David - The Angst Of Anakin Skywalker - Attack Of The Podcast

Episode Date: July 6, 2015

Well he’s a teenager now: not in control of his emotions, hormone fueled, and in desperate need of discipline/a good spanking! So what does the Jedi council do? Well they put young Anakin in charge of protecting Padmé! You mean, an important Galactic Senator with multiple attempts on her life being guarded by a Padawan that is recognized as being a bit of a wild card? Sure what could go wrong? In this episode, your hosts Griffin and David metaphorically lock themselves in their bedrooms, blare their stereos and write bad poetry about how no one understands their pain, cause this week is a discussion of Anakin’s character arc. Including, the casting and performance of Hayden Christensen, discovering your mother has been kidnapped by Tuscan Raiders and mass murder.

🎵 Hello! Welcome to another episode of Attack of the Podcast. We're forcing Ben to start the episode. We were just going to stare at each other in silence. We were playing microphone chicken, and now Ben... I stepped up to the challenge. Producer Ben, a.k.a. Purdueer Ben, a.k.a. The Haas, a.k.a. The Poet Laureate, a.k.a. Mr. Positive.

We're adding a new nickname. Every week. I'm David Sim. I'm Griffin Newman. I think I forgot Ben Poet Laureate, a.k.a. Mr. Positive. We're adding a new nickname. Every week. I'm David Simms. I'm Griffin Neumann. I think I forgot Ben Dusser. You did. We're here talking about Attack of the Clones. This is Attack of the Podcast.

Attack of the Podcast. Talking about Attack of the Clones. The second Phantom Menace movie. Yeah, the sequel to Phantom Menace. Yeah. So, we got this movie. Oh, boy. All right, so we talked about clones last week.

We talked about clones. We talked about everything that happened on Kamino. We talked about my main man, Dexter Jatster. Yeah. I almost think, I mean, in retrospect, we maybe should have made that its own episode. We were so into talking about the diner. I listened to the episode today. In I was listening to it and we do spend

yeah it's a there's almost I feel like a palpable disappointment that we when we have to move on you know what I mean we wanted more because we had this idea we realized like kind of each major like theme or element of the movie takes place on a different planet there's a lot of traveling in this movie

so when we were planning out the season we were like oh what if each episode was centered around a planet? And then Ben clearly stuck with that and titled this last episode The Planet Camino. Right. But it takes 40 minutes for us to get to The Planet Camino. And it's weird because The Planet Camino is like this whale clone planet with crazy waves

and we're like, how about this 50s diner Obi-Wan was in for five minutes though. Let's get back to that. We did talk about Kamino that was ostensibly the theme of the episode. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But Dexter Jetster

we were like stuck on the ground for so long. Oh, Dexter Jetster. He should get a spinoff for a TV show or a talk show. Well, I mean he'd do a great talk show

but I know I was going to say why not do a fucking Dexter Jetster sitcom in the traditional like Alice. Yeah. Look, again there's so many opportunities for spinoffs

in the Star Wars universe that we've seen, and it seems like they took none of them. Disney paid fucking billions. Well, maybe that's it. You've got to think this is the value in Dexter Jetster. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you know what the name of the robot waitress is? I can't believe we didn't look this up last week.

No, we didn't. F-L-O. Flo. Oh, that's so cute. But there's there's like a dash somewhere in there it's like f dash low or right well of course yeah um god what let's just talk about dexter jetster again for a whole episode um no no more mention of dexter jetster ever again okay that's not true we're gonna definitely we're definitely gonna talk about you kind of have a dexter jetster mustache right now. I do.

Because your mustache is quite thick. Yeah. And sort of distractingly prominent as a result because it's thicker than the rest of your face hair. Well, and Dexter Jester has that too where he's got stubble on the rest but the mustache is grown up. What is that? He's got a caterpillar on his fucking lips. Yeah. Oh, man.

Dexter Jester. I think part of the reason why we're doing it... Have you watched the DVD special features where there's this sequence where George Lucas is looking at all the possible Dexter Jetsters? No! Oh. We should watch the special features. There's a making of documentary and stuff.

It's been a long time since I watched it. He's looking at various heads that they've created for him. He likes the Dexter with the big sort of bullfrog neck thing. Maybe we should do a whole episode on the special features. Sure. That's kind of a fun idea. Yeah, there's a lot of footage, I think. But what I mostly remember is just there's a lot of footage of poor Obi-Wan.

I mean, poor Ewan McGregor and Natalie Portman. Just green. Oh, yeah. Just running around and it's just green all around them there's like a foam mat for them to fall on and that's it well this this creates a segue to to what our subject is today because i did watch one special feature i watched a little documentary a little featurette i believe they would call it about the casting of hayden christensen as Anakin Skywalker.

That was the one special feature I watched. Right. Because I was- And I think you see footage of his audition. Is it against Natalie Portman? I think they screen tested them for chemistry together, right? Yes. In a real room.

Yeah. With real props. Some. A set. No, the screen test was like in a real environment. Right. Okay. It didn't look super like Phantom Menace-y.

It looked kind of just like a palisade room. Right. And he's much better in the screen test. Interesting. So you think the dialogue or the direction or just the general green screenery that just sort of shut him down? I think that's...

You're a noted Hating Christensen defender. You called his performance in Life is a House as a career moment for all actors to aspire to i do think it's the watershed yeah yeah it's like sort of everything in acting is pre or post uh life is a house for you yeah i mean he's my brando but he's very brando with no i just you know i'm so conflicted because i remember loving that performance so much i was admittedly like 12 or 13. Right, right, right. But I did. I hated that movie.

So I was like smart enough. It's not a good movie. And discerning enough to know that the movie sucked. You knew it was kind of schlocky Oscar bait. Yeah, I hate it. But I was like, I think that's a really good performance. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And he was getting all the nominations.

So it felt like validated by the outside world. And his casting felt fine. Like it wasn't like, oh, God, Lucas misfires again. Like, why is he casting this like, you know, teen model? Yeah. Oh, he got himself a young, professional actor who buzzed. He's going places. Well, and that performance deals with, it feels like he is ostensibly a good kid who is being so overwhelmed by his angst right now that that's getting lost.

The movie, the arc of the character, it's a shitty movie and it's poorly written. I feel like we're also seeing where the problem comes in. Angst is not really what we want in this movie. We don't really want angst. I agree. And that angst in Life is a House is grounded in very real things.

Yeah. Do you know what I'm saying? I think like very real things yeah do you know i'm saying like i i think um you know you know not that not that all of them did a good job i'm not trying to think i had a phrase this point not that all them did a good job but the first star wars movie the first phantom menace movie we uh have um a lot of british actors yes a lot of classically established Yes. A lot of classically trained British stage actors. And I would argue that perhaps actors of that background and training are more equipped to deal with a movie like this than someone like Hayden Christensen.

And also elevate the people around them. Yes. You know? But Hayden Christensen and Natalie Portman, they're like sort of- They're young. They're young. They sort of just had like an innate ability and good instincts as a kid right

but like they're more maybe instinctual no I think I know what you're saying as an actor they didn't have enough to work with and they were too inexperienced maybe to really create anything from nothing which is what they kind of need to do right and to do the fucking homework not just go like how would I feel in this scene right

but to like really have like a well trained imagination to be like, okay, I'm on a fucking planet. I can't wait for the performance review episode. It's going to be so good. Oh, we're going to rip them all apart. But you know what I'm saying. Yeah, I know what you're saying. I think Hayden Christensen, Life is a House, it's a shitty script, but you could read it and go, I know exactly what this arc is.

I saw him on stage in This Is Our Youth with Jake Gyllenhaal and Anna Paquin on the West End stage playing the drug dealer have you seen this is our youth you know not the nice kid it's kind of my favorite play of all time play yeah uh kenneth lenergan's uh this is our youth and uh he was great you know yeah and he was doing the same brando-y kind of thing with the high-pitched voice and i don't know you know like it's like you're it's a little too mannered maybe but you know it worked he was i mean jake gyllenhaal was the star of that. That was before Jake Gyllenhaal was anybody.

We were all like, whoa, this gets crazy. I do think that part of it is all those affectations kind of worked when he was a certain age and he was playing real kids in real situations because it was like this is a guy who has so little sense of who he is that he's putting on this many airs. Right. In something like Attack of the Clones, it just feels like a shitty performance. It's a shitty performance.

I think there are a lot of reasons why it's a shitty performance, but I think all those mannerisms. We should get to the topic of the week. Yeah, okay. Right. So the topic is, we're trying to figure out what the fuck this character arc is. I guess so. I guess it's an Anakin episode, but specifically not the romance, but the character. The anger.

The angst. The anger. Teen angst with Anakin Skywalker. Also known as trouble on Tatooine. A lot of trouble on Tatooine. What the fuck? Okay, so let's just put this in context for a little bit, okay? The first Star Wars movie.

The Phantom Menace. Phantom Menace. We're introduced to young Anakin. Yeah, he's a cherub. He's a cherub. He's got big chubby cheeks. And he's got a rosy smile and he loves saying yippee. Yeah, and he always is looking on the bright side of life,

which is helpful for him because he's in a pretty dire life situation. Mm-hmm. You're a slave to a spare part salesman? Build a robot. You know? Yeah. Not much to do on Tatooine except for race pod racing.

Do pod racing? Do some pod racing. Do some pod racing. Hey! Is it a deadly sport? Who cares? Do some pod racing. Hey, you know, is it a deadly sport? Who cares? You'll be fine. But, and we talk about this a lot on the Phantom Podcast, the Jedi's keep on going like, this kid's too angry.

Yeah, they keep suggesting that there's something boiling away underneath that's going to be a problem. He shouldn't be a Jedi, he's too old. Too old. Which, I mean, look, sounds like the way Hollywood treats women, if you ask me. You're telling...

So do you think that George Lucas is actually just telling a parable of Hollywood's casting problems and that's who the Jedi Council are? They want young ingenues who don't have too many opinions or too many emotions who they can shape in and throw away

by the time they're 26. It's the situation Rose McGowan has faced. It is. Was it an Adam Sandler movie? I can't remember what it was. Yeah, they wanted her to... They wanted her to wear a big bustier. Yeah, all black.

To show up the girls or something. Yeah. Someone did do a great photo shoot, a slideshow of Adam Sandler on the red carpet at his premieres with the leading ladies in his movies and in in the red carpets isn't he always like wearing basically like a new york jets jersey or whatever like he he is like the most dressed down guy like a kmart t-shirt right right shorts like sneakers that are literally covered in shit baggy cargo shorts yeah as well yeah yeah

right and then the women who have played his wives or girlfriends in the last eight movies. Salma Hayek. Who's played his romantic interest? Jessica Biel. Kate Beckinsale. Oh my God. Katie Holmes. It's crazy. Adam Sandler.

Yeah. Who's the love interest in Don't Miss With a Zohan? Emanuel Shikri. There you go. Yeah. Was she like half his age? Yeah.

Yeah. Anyway. Brooklyn Decker. Right. Jennifer Aniston and Nicole Kidman. And who's in Just Go With It?. Brooklyn Decker. Right. Jennifer Aniston and Nicole Kidman. Who's in Just Go With It? And Brooklyn Decker. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Right, right, right. Let's do a Sandler episode sometime. What's the best Sandler movie is Zohan? You think period? Yeah. Over Billy Madison? Yeah. I would put those two neck and neck.

I think, but even forgetting the original, like Billy Madison, Happy Gilmore, wedding singer where's, like, you know, establishing his brand. Those three are really good. I think Zohan is the most audacious film he's made, forgetting funny people. Guys, you overlooked Click. Click is weird. Ben loves Click. You love Click?

Love it. Do you like it when he gets all old because he fast forwarded through life? I didn't see that coming. Yeah. That's great. Twist! You didn't know that Ben loves Click? No.

You haven't been listening to Click and Click? Ah, Click and Click. Ben's secret podcast. He's on episode 30. Yeah. There's just so much you could say about Click. Yeah, like the scene where Terry Crews lip syncs to a song and then Adam Sandler mutes him. He mutes him.

Yep. Great. Because he's got a remote control that controls life. Yep. It's weird. He misses the dragon tail's ears. Anyway, let's get back on to, I don't even know how we got on to this. We're talking about-

What, he rewinds? He goes back in time. No, I know. He does have a remote control. And he also got the remote control of the Beyond section of Bed, Bath, and Beyond. Let's not forget that. And it was given to him by Academy Award winner Christopher Walken. And the movie was nominated for an Academy Award, but it did not win.

For Best Picture. It was one of the weird instances of a film only getting one nomination. No, no, no. It got 14 nominations. It equaled All About Eves, and it nominated four women, just like All About Eves. No, it didn't. Alright, so we're talking about how Anakin, in the first first movie is basically a very cute kid with a fairly guileless kid and yet the film is trying to establish that he is actually like wracked with inner dark emotion

now jake lloyd who um is there an update on jakey he's dead now. No, he's not. He's dead. All right, PJ. You know, maybe it was the fault of his lack of ability as an actor. Sure. That we were supposed to sense that sort of like rustling, building anger within him. Yeah. No, I see what you're saying. Maybe he was. It looks like floppy titties.

Maybe he was supposed to do uh a little more with it and instead he just said yippee and now this is prod racing and what does this button button do and well yeah i watched these two featurettes i watched the one about casting hayden christensen i watched the one about um casting anakin and it got down to three kids for the for the phantom man for the ph Menace. And it was like a 15-minute featurette that had the three kids sitting around a table eating breakfast with Georgie Porgie and Natalie Portman. You wanted to see how they interacted with her, and they did screen tests with her. But it was like they brought the three kids down to his ranch, and we're jumping through all these hoops with them.

One of them was Michael Anirano, which I never knew. He's a great actor. He's a really good actor. He's developed into a terrific actor. I love him. And he wasano, which I never knew. He's a great actor. He's a really good actor. He's developed into a terrific actor. I love him. And he was a good kid actor too.

He was a great kid actor. He's just kept it up. So Michael Anirano, to hit some bullet points, was the younger version of Patrick Fugit's character in Almost Famous. That's right.

So he's better than Patrick Fugit in Almost Famous. I think both of them are great. I think Patrick Fugit is a big old trash fire in that movie. I disagree.

But he has the great scene where he finds out that he was held back three years. He kills it. Him and Zooey Deschanel in that film, like their interactions, so brief but so wonderful. And for perspective, that is shot like- That's 2000, the year 2000. So, I mean, that's only a little older than he would have been in the Phantom Menace process. He was the lead in Sky High high which is one of my great movie underrated yeah superhero academy movie it's a great fucking film that's the one with kurt russell

yeah it's not the one with courtney cox and tim allen which was called zoom and chevy chase that was called zoom academy for superheroes and that one's bad yeah sky high rules it's got two members of kids in the Hall. I remember. Rules. Yeah. And then... Oh, he's been in lots of things. He's on The Nick right now. Yeah, he was in what? Is it Gentleman Broncos? Yeah.

Which is not a great movie, but he gave a decent performance. He's always good. He was on Will and Grace, remember? Yes, he played Jack's son. Yeah. Anyway. He's a great actor. Yeah.

And clearly the guy panned out. Yeah, right. He should have gone with him. Do you know who the third kid was? The third kid I didn't recognize, but he was very dark in a way that was kind of interesting. You mean like he was giving like a darker performance? He had really sad eyes and there was a sort of like simmering anger. Yeah.

Which would make sense. Yeah. Now, I would say watching the three tests, Jake Lloyd, his test was actually kind of okay. Right. He's probably the most professional because he's been in Jingle all the way. He's been in Unhook the Stars. He knows what he's doing. Right.

I think I could see- Talking a lot about Jake Lloyd again. I know. I could see why they picked him from that test. I don't think it was the best one, but I could see why it worked. Michael and Rana was the most natural and the best but he was a little more upbeat. But getting along over to Anakin.

The other kid was very angry. Alright. I'm building to a point here. No, no, no. You're building. The other kid was very angry and dark and watching that test

you're like okay that would have foreshadowed some better groundwork for what's happening in Attack of the Clones. And they were thinking about playing it like that.

That kid just naturally had a sort of dark energy. Should have done it. Yeah. They should have done it. Instead, we just have characters telling us that this kid's angry. He's got an anger problem. No sign of it. In the first movie, in Phantom Menace.

No sign of it whatsoever. No. And then Attack of the Clones starts out and immediately we're introduced to, oh, man, I can skywalk. Oh, boy. Oh, fuck. I'm so angry at the world. But I think, yeah,

it's not just that he's angry. It's that his angst is represented in this way that is hard to engage with. He's a little shit? Is that what you're saying? He's a little shit. He's got this like crappy Bronx accent thing that he's doing.

Oh fuck. Oh God. I hate being a Jedi. I love Padme. We're talking about a character who we know was a slave who was taken from his poor mother. Yeah. And then his mentor was killed and he was thrust into this terrible...

We should be on his side, is what I'm saying. And immediately we're like, oh God, Obi-Wan, will you give this kid a spanking or something? What's the matter with this guy? We do not like him. But part of it is- It's the fundamental failure of the film. You don't like, you don't sympathize with Anakin Skywalker. Because he's-

Because he sucks. He's sullen the whole movie. Yeah. He doesn't have- You don't see what the appeal is. Yeah, there's- To Padme or to anyone, really. Yeah.

And when we say this episode's devoted to the arc of Anakin Skywalker, it's really an arc in relation to the first movie. He doesn't change that much within this one film. No, it's just that he's different compared to Phantom Menace. Right, he's kind of unhappy with everything that happens. Yeah. How old is he supposed to be, like 18, 17, 18? Now, this is the big question.

Watching the movie, when it first came out, I was younger than him. Sure. And I looked at him, and I was like, this is like a fucking adult this is a team this is what i have to look forward to and now i watch the movie and i i he's like a little boy yeah yeah of course in a way that makes me uh not relate to him but like empathize with him a little bit where i'm like well everyone's awful when they're a teenager i guess i guess i get you know what i'm saying yeah yeah sure like it's not a likable, and it's a poor choice for how to frame your protagonist. Go ahead.

But I do watch it, and I'm just like, oh, this is a bad phase. Like, it's like those three uncomfortable years in boyhood where you're like, this kid's really tough to watch. But here's the thing. Why is he talking about it? Like, no one talks about their problems like that when they're a 17-year-old filled with angst. Oh, the hallmark of 17-year-olds filled with angst is that they're incapable of talking about it. They cannot communicate their feelings. They can't communicate anything.

And the first thing he's basically saying to Obi-Wan, who's basically his surrogate father, and he's like, Jesus, you know, Padme won't even look at me like a man. And it's like, he would never say that to him. That is all, you know, buried deep down, those sorts of anxieties and neuroses. Here's a question for you. Ugh, this movie. The fact that that's the opening conversation, and that he keeps on bringing it up. Oh man, Padme, I can't wait to see her again.

And then after he sees her, oh man, Padme didn't even look at me. Oh, Wild Master, I do believe she looked at you. Yeah, but not the way I wanted her to look at me. Do you think that for the last ten years, Anakin just, I do believe she looked at you. Yeah, but not the way I wanted her to look at me. Do you think that, like, for the last ten years, Anakin just... He's just been jerking it. And won't stop talking about it to Obi-Wan. Yeah, and Obi-Wan's like, Jesus Christ.

Jesus fucking Christ. But, like, if that's... You spent one week with her. This is what I don't get. And I think I asked this already. She's five years older than you. I think I asked this already. Why couldn't they just, like, see her once in a while?

Yeah. They both live on Coruscant. Just visit. Well, I know that the whole planet is a city as ben is gesturing yeah the whole planet let's remember ben gave the classic the whole planet whole planet's a city you know the gesture i'm sure you can all imagine so maybe traffic you know it's like oh i'd love to see her but you know she lives on the western hemisphere we're over here on the eastern hemisphere you know who knows weekend trip. I don't know.

And I know the Jedi training, you know, you probably have to go off to the training planet or whatever to do your training. I don't know how the Jedi is trained there. All we know is like Yoda teaches you when you're five. And then by the time you're 18, you're a real pain in the ass with a lightsaber. But you look at, look, thei and their responsibilities still make very little sense right very little sense but in the two films we have to go off of in the star wars that's always saga the only two films we have yep their responsibilities seem deeply tied to the senate right they are i mean even though they keep complaining that they're not they're basically the Senate and the Galactic Republic. Right. They are, I mean,

even though they keep complaining that they're not, they're basically like Senate policemen. Right. They're like doing negotiations quote unquote on behalf of the Galactic Republic.

Yep. They are aiding, you know, protecting. I think it's a simpatico thing. It's like the Jedi would prefer the Senate exist because that is a

democratic method of unifying the galaxy. Right. And the Senate's happy to work with the Jedi because they are a bunch of wizards who have lightsabers. Helpful. If Padme, after, you know, stepping down, finishing her final term as queen, was like, you know what? I really just want to, like.

Just chill out. I want to just move to Kamino, get into cloning. It's always been a hobby of mine. She would clone little bugs when she was a kid. Just casual cloning. God, this is so embarrassing. No, Padme, what is it? Tell me.

I've always wanted to be a cloner. No, you should do that. I could see you'd be a great cloner. You're doing it okay, Anakin. I'm working on it. But you're working on it. I feel like it's too Gosling right now. It's a little too Gosling.

It's almost not Gosling enough in the movie. But we've talked about- We've talked about how Gosling would have been much better for this film. And Hayden Christensen is sort of the poor man's Gosling. It's like you bet on the wrong horse. Oh yeah, totally. He's doing the same sort of Gosling like I'm Canadian and I'm doing this affectation like I'm from New York. Right.

I'm a tough guy. He's so skinny too. He doesn't work. Anyway, what if Natalie Portman, what do you even say? The point is, I don't understand if they never saw her again after that because she just went off. She got away from it. She's a senator.

Right, she's still around. Senate, Jedi. Right. They're bosom buddies. There would have been opportunities for them to see her again yeah it's like 10 years he's flipped out about it he seems to think they had some connection which is like yo kid like she had a nice conversation with you because you're a little boy and you gave her like a little totem right he gave her the little uh the carved thing yeah it told her to look like an angel that's sweet but like i don't think she's thinking about you all the time. She's probably dealing with some other love drama.

We don't really even know. Yeah. And if she has been thinking about you, then she's a pedophile. Because she doesn't know you look like a grown-up now. Well, maybe she looked him up on the old Jedi archives. Oh, yeah. She just snuck in there one day and was like, what does Anakin look like these days?

And then she found out his profile was deleted, and she was like, I guess he never existed. Yeah, right, and I won't pursue this any further. Yeah. But he's, like, all fucking hung up on her, right? Mm-hmm. Presumably Obi-Wan knows about this, because he hasn't been able to stop talking about it.

Yeah. He hasn't been able to get over this. And also, who else has Anakin even talked to? That's the one person. I mean, Obi-Wan probably hears everything. Right. Yep. Don't you think, like, Obi-Wan should hears everything. Right. Yep. Don't you think like Obi-Wan should have,

rather than just like in the elevator, been like, Anakin, like rolling his eyes, should have been like, hey, Anakin, I just want to remind you, you are not allowed to engage in any sort of sexual romantic relationship with anybody. Now here's a question because it's actually been a week since I saw the movie.

Yeah. Is that explicitly stated or is it just Anakin saying kind of offhandedly, like, oh, Jedis aren't allowed to get married? Yeah. It's the latter. There's no point at which, like, the reasons for this are, like, really clearly defined and the rules are clearly defined. It's a monk-like concentration.

It's kind of like the Night's Watch or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. You got to concentrate on your responsibilities, on your training. They don't want you tied down. No, of course, because then your emotions could... I mean, it makes sort of sense. Like, if you had an emotional attachment to someone, then your emotions could be played on,

and your emotional control seems to be so crucial to being a Jedi, right? Well, look, I mean, if the, you know, the Galactic Republic, the Senate is like our Senate. Yeah. The real world analog for the jedi council so we've seen them as kind of like the clergy i mean they are like the vatican right you know right i mean yoda is kind of like the pope uh great yoda pope um but mace windu's the vice pope yeah he's pope too yeah uh junior pope no no i I had a whole point that I was, wait a second. It's, yeah, the emotional thing.

I get it. I get that they're not allowed to have these connections. And I get that what we're being told, and we see the younglings, we see the little kids, is like, if you get these kids really early, you can smooth all that out. Yeah. And with Anakin, they didn't get to do that. And so he's a teenager, which feels very bad if you want to be a Jedi who's in control of your emotions. Because this kid is just a teenager.

He is not in control of his emotions. So if we know anything... But he's also blessed with these incredible force powers. Tangiers are going to be rough for anyone. Yeah. Right? Right. There are a lot of things going on.

Right. You know, a lot of different elements stewing in the pot. Right? Oh, yeah. Okay. Then you add on the hormones. Add some hormones right this is a kid who as we've discussed grew up thinking he would someday be able to find love

sure because he was not adopted by the jedis until he was like i guess so yeah right yeah presumably he thought maybe i can someday find are you an angel yeah maybe that line will work sometime right so now he's going out of control. He's had fantasies about this lady. He sees her again. She looks exactly the same. She has no age at all. She just looks Dolezal. She looks mad Dolezal.

And he secretly, he's really into that. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. For some reason, that's Anakin's thing. He's got fake jungle fever. Exactly. Not his jungle fever is fake. No, no, I get you.

He wants the jungle to be fake. He's into artificial jungles. Anyway, add into that, you know, let's not forget, tragic backstory. Yeah. Hasn't seen his mother in 10 years. Right. Why hasn't he seen his mother? What's the rules with this stuff?

Again, not established. If you're getting these kids when they're little, can they see their family? Yeah. Do we know? Is that a yes or no many of them are recognized and adopted as infants they sense like a lot of force over here force right here the kids never even know their fucking moms or dads you know um and and anakin's so positive in phantom men's this doesn't feel like a deliberate choice but a lot of people who have tumultuous childhoods are sort of high functioning, able to sort of suppress it and make it through.

They're chipper just as a means of dealing with it. And then teenagers, the wall sort of starts crumbling down. It's like then they start actually acknowledging what happened and becoming super overwhelmed by it and unable to function. So there's maybe a little bit of that. But I also think thesis, he's just 17. He's a shitty kid. He's a shitty kid. Everyone's shitty when they're 17. And also. He, he's just 17. He's a shitty kid. He's a shitty kid. Everyone's shitty

when they're 17. And also, he's wearing dark robes. He's trying to stand out. You know, there's a lot of privilege. He's been told like, wow,

you're so special. You're so powerful. And he knows it now. I mean, he can do all kinds of stuff. And if we've learned anything from this fucking generation of parents,

it's as a recipe for shitty kids. Me, me, me. Like me. You get a shitty Griffin-esque kid. Shitty Griffin kid. kid i mean there's that moment when he what does he do he kind of like levitates a pear and chops it up and he's like

obi-wan would kill me for doing this and it's like very clear like he is not allowed to show off yeah like obi-wan is trying to be like yeah you might think you're special but you're like everyone else like you're just an ordinary padawan and don't you go levitating bears around people and but i think you were the one who pointed out, I was talking about how conceptually humorous I thought the opening exchange between Obi-Wan and Anakin was. And that he's like, give him a hard time. And you were like, I think he's a bad dad.

I don't think that's funny. Yeah, he's a crappy dad. He's like not doing what he should do. He's way too loose on him. It's almost like they're more of a duo than a master student kind of thing. Yeah, and it's because Obi-Wan's too young as him. It's almost like they're more of a duo than a master-student kind of thing. Right. And it's because Obi-Wan's too young as well.

It's a young dad. You get that. I had some friends who had young parents who weren't ready, and it's like, oh, that's a friend they drink with, and they have no boundaries in life. So these are all the things we are justifying Anakin's behavior,

but I think we need to again establish the film does a terrible job justifying all of this and just it's like we're now talking around it being like well this is why maybe and this is why

but the film doesn't really tell you these things I'm saying if you look at all the elements on a piece of paper I understand why this kid is unhappy right but in the movie

it's just eh Padme doesn't like me eh you're such a bossy Obi-Wan Obi-Wan yeah and then he's on the romance train

like it's very quickly he separates. Once again, he's a little shit. Also, why did they let him say... He's a... Like, he shouldn't be in charge of something. I know, I know. I'm in charge of security. He says that, remember?

And look, we're doing... Next week's going to be the romance episode. Oh, my God. But that's going to be about, I feel like, the utter failure at crafting a dramatic... Like, you know like our guests might disagree oh my gosh which is what i'm looking forward to oh rachel you're out of your mind yeah um rachel dolezal yeah um but but they're bad for going okay we need someone to

take care of padme we need someone to investigate where this dart is coming from yeah let's send obi-wan the one who's really experienced level-headed yeah emotionally mature yeah to investigate the dart yeah which consists of having one conversation at a diner and then walking into a place where everything is explained to you yeah that's the whole thing and let's have anakin who's a little poop yeah poop. Yeah. And is a boiling cauldron of emotions and has publicly expressed his sexual interest in this woman. Which he's not allowed to act upon. Let's let her be alone with her for an indefinite period of time. And as we'll talk about a little more next week, I bet Padme takes charge of that situation right away.

She just starts bossing him around. Which is probably a fucking turn on for him. He's like, I don't want to go to Naboo. That's a bad idea. And she's like, listen, we're going to Naboo. And then they're like, let's go to Tatooine. And he's like, we should go to... That's an even worse idea. What are you talking about?

She's like, it's going to happen. Okay, dangerous question. Do you think the way that some women who have father issues are then attracted to men who are sort of like distant and dismissive of them and who they have to fight for the attention of. I get the stereotype to which you refer. Do you think that similarly,

Anakin, as someone who was raised as a slave, is attracted to someone who's like... Oh, this is terrible. This is a terrible line of questioning. But you're saying that, but at the same time... Padme's kind of wadowing him. Yeah, but...

She's giving him the old waddle. I guess, but I mean, his mother is so like nurturing and kind so i guess it's yeah he's not after that though i mean well you know bad may's pretty nice she's got a little bit of both yeah she's got a little bit of both padme's not a character so it's tough to talk about this because it's like there's just not enough of padme's personality to really identify what she is exactly she does boss him around but that's just because the plot needs them to go to the next place. The first time they handed Natalie Portman, Academy Award winner Natalie

Portman, the script for Attack of the Clones, George was like, here we go, here's the script. She's like, oh my god, I'm so excited to read this. And she picked it up and turned the first page and it evaporated in her hands. It turned to dust and flew away. I don't even know what you're talking about. There's not a character. There's nothing for her to play.

It's really, she's a series of plot devices. She's the plot device of like, let's solve the mystery. Yeah. And then of let's hang out with Anakin and fall in love with him because that will cause him to have trouble. Yeah. And then I guess let's have a gladiator fight at the end with monsters. We'll get to that. Okay.

So he's on detail with Padme. And what happened to the apprehension that all the other Jedi had for Anakin? Between movie one and movie two, all of a sudden they're just like, well, we kind of sense something is off with this kid, but he's the future. In the first movie, they had a lot of trepidation with nothing apparent to base that off of. In the second movie, the kid totally lot of trepidation with nothing apparent to base that off of. In the second movie, the kid totally seems like he's heading a bad direction.

Yeah. And everyone's like, I think Obi-Wan's got it. Is there no discussion? I feel like there's one conversation between Obi-Wan and Mace Windu and Yoda where they're like, you know, how's Anakin doing? Am I making this up? Maybe. I mean, I know there's a conversation. There's one later conversation. It sounds like a scene in the movie.

Yeah, where they're just chatting and you're zoning out and looking at Twitter. Yeah. Oh, and the other moment is that there's all this fucking pressure on him to bring balance to the force. Yeah, it's a lot of pressure. There's a lot of pressure. Okay, so he's on security detail with Padme.

I forget how they even fucking get... This movie... I've said this before. Remember, they kind of dress up in secret. Remember? Right, right. And they take like a transport to Naboo. Oh, right. Yes.

Remember, they kind of dress up in ordinary people clothes. No, but how they get to Tatooine. I'm just saying. I think they just take her starship. I think at that point... He just says, I want to see my mom. I think he says... I don't know.

No, he's having visions of his mother in danger. Right, yes. He's having the nightmares his mother in danger. Right, yes. He's having the nightmares and the sweats. They spend this romantic weekend on Naboo. Let's not talk about the romance. In the gardens, which we won't talk about in specifics, but that's going on. And then he has these visions of his mother in danger.

Yeah. And I guess he's like, I can't do anything about this. It's just dreams. I don't know what's going on. Yeah, no, you can't do something. And she's like, we're going to go to Tatooine. And he's like, that's a bad idea. And she's like, well, I'm going and you're my bodyguard, so you've got to come with me.

He's like, don't fuck talk to me like I'm a slave. Do that again. Tell me what I've got to do. Fly around. I'm going to resign from this podcast. Be an anti-Semitic stereotype. Come on. And in Tatooine, he does meet Wado.

Oh, boy, I'm so excited. Should we talk about this now? It's probably the best time to talk about it. Yeah. So I just want to point out, this is the least sticky sticky least memorable movie in the world and we already can't remember like how major cannot remember so yeah they go to tatooine they go to tatooine and they land in i guess right and it's like oh remember this and he goes right and he goes to find wado and it's kind of a good idea in the movie actually return to the scene of the first

film which we remember but like everything's a little different. And Anakin is no longer the helpless slave. He's a powerful Jedi. Powerful Jedi. He's a Padawan, but a princess. Whatever, he's got a fucking lightsaber. And he goes to see Watto. Watto looks the same except for a hat.

He's got an unbelievable hat. He's got a, it's kind of like a World War I metal helmet-y kind of thing, but it's very flat. Yeah. With a little indentation for his tiny little bulbous head. An iron cross, right? As well. Yeah, that's right. He's a self-hating Jew.

Yeah. I feel like maybe his vest has more pockets in it. But he's pretty much rocking the same thing, but with this little sun hat. Which is like, without time, you should, I mean, two points. One is, that hat probably

provides some necessary shade from the unrelenting dual sunlight of dual suns of Tatooine. The binary suns. Second point, if you're going to wear

any hat to protect you from the sun, why pick one made of metal? That thing's going to be scalding hot. It's going to get real hot. Scalding hot. He put it on once, and now he can't take it off

because it's seared to his flesh. It's just melted to his flesh, yes. It's like Dr. Doom's mask. He put it on to cover up one little scar and then melted his entire face, and now he's fine. That is, by the way, it is the weirdest thing about Dr. Doom's origin story, that it's like, yeah, he just put that mask on a little too fast.

Oh, no, I love it. He's a genius. No, I know, I get that it's about yeah he just he just put that mask on a little too fast oh no i love it he's a genius no i know i get that it's about his impatience and his and one also his vanity his extreme vanity he had one scar which he felt so self-conscious about he went make me a mask and they were like okay your mask is done he went okay give it to me and he had he just put it on and his whole fell so in in the new movie is it like he goes with them is that the idea to to the which is off of Ultimate Fantastic Four. Yeah, which I don't like. But he doesn't have the... I mean, I think he

becomes a sort of cyber... Dr. Doom's a tough character to do in the modern film world. Tough. Tough character to do. I think I know how to do it. Do you know I spent most of my high school... Yes. I do know. I wrote my college admissions essay on... About the Fantastic Four. Yeah. And about the way you would do it.

There's nothing I would want to do more in the world. Than like a 60s Fantastic Four movie. Let me say it. The second thing I want to do most in the world is make a Fantastic Four movie. The way I think it needs to be made. The number one thing I want to do in the world is fuck TC-14.

But there's just Julian McMahon played him in the Tim Story movies? Yeah. Is he in the second one? He is. Yeah. Yeah. He's awful.

Terrible. He's not a good actor anyway. Sorry, Julian. Chris Evans is the only good piece of casting in those movies. That sounds correct. What about Kerry Washington? No, I'm kidding. Actually, no, wait.

I actually like Michael Chiklis in those movies. Oh, God. I don't know. I think he's overdoing it. He's overdoing it, but I think he's all right. In your parlance, I think it's a real ham sandwich performance. Oh,, I don't know. I think he's overdoing it. He's overdoing it, but I think he's alright. To quote your parlance, I think it's a real ham sandwich performance.

Oh, it's a ham sandwich. Sometimes you want a ham sandwich with butter. I think he's too ham sandwich-y. I mean, maybe he's giving the right tone for the movie. Yeah, the movie has such a hammy tone.

I don't think there's enough pathos in it. I think the core to Ben Grimm is that he's miserable. Yes, that's true. Remember in the first movie how they just take down Doctor Doom by putting like, putting him

in a box and then they, like, wrap it up with, like, flame and stretchy guy and rocks. I hate those movies more than anything. It's really bad. I hate those movies more than anything. It's so bad. The second one's better because Stan Lee is rejected from attending the wedding even though he's Stan Lee. That's the only good part of the second movie. Remember that?

Yeah, the second one's better in the same way that, like, having HIV is better than having AIDS. Anyway, let's move on. How many things are we going to say on this podcast that will get us banned from the UCB for life? I mean, look, if you think this is a fan appeal, wait until Rachel's on next week. Oh, Rachel, she's going to have a lot of things to say. Delejean. Uh-huh.

So, they're on Tatooine. They see Wado, my favorite character. Yeah. And they say, what happened to Shmi? Well, you're missing. You're jumping way ahead. All right, fine. Way ahead.

Beat by beat. Hit by hit. No, but David, this is my favorite character. We've been building up to this point. All right, Wado. What does he do? I don't remember. Well, I think we got to acknowledge the fire in his eyes.

It's true. He looks real sad. Yeah, it's true. His beard's grown out. He's sitting outside like he's not even in his shop. He's sort of at a stall. He's like a vendor. Yeah, it doesn't look good.

No, he looks bad. Most of us, it looks a little rundown. Even though it's already looked pretty rundown. Yeah, it looks like it's on harder times maybe. Yeah, and he just looks like he's selling some pencils looks a little run down. Even though it's already looked pretty run down. It looks like it's on harder times, maybe. Yeah, and he just looks like, he's like selling some pencils in a cup or something. He's got more stubble than even usual. And he takes a second to recognize Anakin. Oh, more than a second.

He's like, yeah, it was me. He's not even like selling it as hard as he used to. Yeah, it was him. And they're like, hi, do you know... Shmi Skywalker? And he's like, yeah, Shmi, I used to be Yeah. He was. And they're like, hi, do you know... Shmi Skywalker? And he's like, yeah, Shmi, I used to be a slave of mine.

I don't have any... Now, I think he says that he sold her to another... Yes. To the Lars family. Yes, he sold her to the Lars family. It's not like he freed her.

But they have... Yeah, oh, he sold her. It's just that she then... Like, one of the Lars family fell for her and they freed her and they got married. No, I think that happened later.

I think the whole idea is that like... All Wado did was sell her. Yeah. I don't think he sold her because he knew she was in love. No, no, that's what I'm saying. I think he just needed money. He sold her and then at the Lars homestead, Owen, which one is it? No. Clegg Lars. Clegg Lars, right.

Fell. And Owen's their kid? Yeah. And Beru's his girlfriend? Oh, yeah. No, no. Owen's like his kid from a previous marriage there's a lot of like complex family shit joel edgerton plays the great joel edgerton owen which is crazy yeah uh wait but i want to hit on this and another australian actor wado does not even recognize anakin no no i mean he has grown and changed into a different person right completely different completely different acting. So, you know. Serious question, has that ever worked? Has there ever been

a case of an actor being switched from one franchise entry to another in which you are able to track that as being the same emotional arc? I always end up unconsciously thinking of it as a different character. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, I do know what you're saying and I can't think of an example of that off the top of my head where it works.

There might be something. Like, Don Cheadle's really good in Iron Man 3. Yeah. But I failed to connect that to Terrence Howard's character in Iron Man 1. I just go, these are two different characters. Right, but, like, Terrence Howard's character in Iron Man 1 is such a ridiculous non-factor that it doesn't matter. You could almost pretend that that was another guy,

even though it's the same guy. Yeah, when they also could not be more different as actors in style and physical appearance don cheadle is not like incredible in those movies but he's pretty good he's solid and i actually liked him a lot in age of ultron i feel like don cheadle just figured out how to be that kind of funny yeah you know after a long and wonderful career in which he's very funny in movies like Boogie Nights. Yeah. But it's a different, like,

it's a much more like actorly kind of fun. And now, The Ocean's Trilogy, terrible accents, great comedic performances. Right. I feel like he's loosened up

later in his career. And I guess there's House of Lies. I don't watch that, but he's on it. Yeah. Anyway. It'd be great if

Don Cheadle had playedakin in the third star wars movie if that ever existed yeah um but it almost feels like meta commentary like they're like oh you wouldn't recognize this kid because it's a different fucking person oh you think so i think it's just uh lazy writing i think so too yeah but so what i was like so he goes and he yeah he's like oh it's been so long but's like, he still even seems sad about it. He's a little melancholy. He misses Anakin. He misses him, and I think he's genuinely happy to see that he's like a Jedi now.

Yeah. Yeah, he's like impressed. But I just think Watto seems real broken down. It's not how I want to see him. I'm sorry. It's fine. And that's all we see of him. I know.

He's really just there to give us a little bit of info, which is, assault me to the Lars homestead, and that's it, man. Okay, so they speed a bike over. They go over to the Lars homestead, and again, I was trying to remember, and I can't even unpack. She married Klieg. They bought her as a slave.

And then he was like, ooh, what a tasty slave. Yeah, he was like, is that a Swedish accent? Yeah. Fell in love with her, and then they just married. And it's presented as a nice thing. I guess it is. It's a tasty slave. Yeah, he was like, is that a Swedish accent? Yeah. Yeah. So he- Fell in love with her and then they just married. And it's presented as a nice thing. I guess it is. It's a little weird.

It's a little weird. Not your average meat cute. No, exactly. How did you know my mom? Well, I purchased her from a two foot Jewish alien who had fallen on hard times and needed the money. And I brought her home and caught a glimpse of her in the shower. No, I don't know.

Yeah, I don't understand how you cross that line from being slave and slave owner to equal lovers. Yeah, well. That's a weird conversation to have. The only way you can justify it is that it was immediate. Yeah. They bought her and they were like, wait a second, you're a wonderful person. Let's free you right away. Right.

If there was any length of time where she was a slave and they were her masters yeah i don't think that's a very uh positive uh relationship it wasn't like one of these colonial guys who's like sleeping with his slave and then fathering a bunch of fathers that fathering a bunch of children who he never acknowledges the existence yeah like stromthermond right uh this is like oh never mind you mind. You're not a slave. Yeah, it's just, oh, wow, you're great. Forget the whole slave thing. Even though, wow, what an investment. But could you take care of the dishes? Oh, by the way, this is a moisture farm.

What a trump card to have any time you got in a fight with her. Be like, remember. 20 years ago. Yeah, I did choose to not keep your services as a slight. Anyway, it's not even clear how long they've been together. It's been at least 10 years, but probably less. Kluglarz, though, seems like a really nice man.

Very nice. He doesn't have legs. He's in a floaty chair. So he had some kind of industrial accident or something. And he's got this kid. I think they mention it and I don't remember why. I think that Owen's like his kid from a previous marriage or something. Oh, it's not his kid with Shmi.

Is that what you're asking? Yeah, no. I know it's not his kid with Shmi. I'm just trying to remember like what he is. Or if he's a nephew or something. No, no, no. It's his kid from a previous marriage. Right.

And Owen's got a girlfriend. He's like Anakin's stepbrother now. It's just. He would be like the uncle. He would be Anakin's. Right. To. It's just he would be like the uncle to any kid that Anakin might have. Hypothetical children. It's just interesting because Joel Edgerton

is playing him and I know Joel Edgerton was not famous then but it's just a suggestion of like oh maybe this character would pick up some thread later on. The same way the Rose Byrne thing. That's totally why they cast Rose Byrne in that crucial crucial role. Yeah. As Dorme, who I have about 20 copies of as a Star Trek training, oh, Star Wars training card. Yeah.

I should check my. But those two characters, because the two of them have gone on to become two of our finest living actors. Joel Edgerton and Rose Byrne? Yeah. Are two of my favorite, most consistent actors working today. Wait, you like Joel Edgerton? What's he been good in recently? You don't like Joel Edgerton? No, I like him fine. I'm trying to

think of what I've seen him in. I mean, if we just fucking look at his filmography, I think everything does. Well, A, he and his brother produce a lot of Australian movies, which he has helped write some of. I know they did along with David Michaud.

He was one of the main forces behind Animal Kingdom, which I think is a great fucking movie. I'm just trying to think of... The Rover I didn't like very much, but I think he co-wrote that. Oh, he's in Warrior. Warrior he's amazing in.

The Rover was okay. I don't like the Rover. I liked him in... Oh, he was in Exodus, which I didn't see as Ramsey's. I heard he was good in that, but the movie is garbage. And I liked him in The Great Gatsby,

and I liked him for 20 seconds in Zero Dark Thirty, although he doesn't have a big role in that. Loved him in both of those. Warrior's the one. Have you seen Warrior? Yeah, Warrior's great. I love Warrior. Yeah, Warrior's a good movie.

Everyone's good in that. Anyway, I feel like he's still an up and coming. I'd love to see him really prove himself. He's got a directorial debut coming out. He did a movie with Rebecca Hall and Jason Bateman that looks really good. Is that the box movie? Yeah.

What's it called? I think it's called The Gift. The Gift, yeah. Which has already been the title of a couple movies, but I'll let Joel off the hook for that. That decent Sam Raimi movie. Yeah, very decent. Very decent. Written by?

Joel Edgerton. Billy Bob Thornton. Oh, that's right. I knew that. I knew that. All right. Anyway, they go to the Lars homestead Bad news Anakin

First of all good news Your mom had a happy life She met me I married her I'm going to tell you that was her own will Not that I forced her to marry me because I owned her And we live on this moisture farm Here's her little family

She's been living her life Oh great can I see her That's the bad news. Oh, darn. You just missed her. She was kidnapped by Tusken Raiders. Yeah. What?

Yeah. Nothing we can do about it. Yeah. Nothing I can do about it. I'm in the old chair. No legs. Yeah. I got a metal rounded off leg cap.

So. All right. Do you want to stay for dinner? We saw the Tusken Raiders briefly in Phantom Menace. They take pot shots at the pod racers. They're watching the pod race. Quite scary. Like mummy types.

They're bandaged and they have these weird eye things and spikes and they make this like terrible noises. They're not a pleasant people. They're not a pleasant people. They're not a pleasant people. They seem like a problem. They're an unfortunate element in Tatooinian society.

So what does Anakin do? Hops on a speeder, gets over there. A speeder bike. A speeder bike. Gets over there, right? Right, there's no, he just like, that's the next step. Yeah. They have a really nice conversation,

and he's like seething with anger about this. Padme's trying to be like, look on the bright side. Right, and I think they're just like, hey, nothing we can do about it. Yeah, it does seem like- Clank feels sort of despondent. He's like, I loved your mother, I don't know. And it's like, what? No, go fucking find her.

It's a weird scene. Yeah. It's a weird scene because it's, again, like so many scenes in this movie, it's just like, well, that gives Anakin the prompting to do this next thing. Yeah. It's just there to let him do another thing. Every scene in which someone talks to Anakin, their final line could be, and that's the information. Do with it what you will.

I've laid out the cards on the table. Now you choose how to respond. Anakin sees by rage. Yeah. Which is not cool for a Jedi. No. But makes sense because his mother has been kidnapped. Yeah.

Goes to the Tuscan camp. Yeah. Sees his mother bound to like a wooden cross. He's really lucky. There are a lot of huts and he walks into one and she's there. Yes. He picks the right one. He like cuts it open with his lightsaber, which almost feels like it's a little too high tech.

It's like where you can just take your fingers and just play. It's like made of paper. It's like a bead door. Anyway, sees his mother. She looks bad. She looks real bad. The movie is rated PG, so we're not really told what's been happening, but we can guess. Yeah, you can guess.

It's a bummer. She's like tied up. Yeah, she's been brutalized. Her face is sort of scratched up. Yeah, and I don't think they were just hitting her for sport. Yeah. It is actually not made clear. What do the Tusken Raiders want?

What do they want? Obviously, they need food and stuff, hence the raiding. Right. But what are they going to do with a person? They said that she was out running errands or something. She got kidnapped when she was out doing something. And they take her back. It's been a little while. It wasn't like, Like, she got kidnapped when she was, like, out doing something. And they, like, take her back. It's been a little while. Like, it wasn't like, oh, she

got taken yesterday. Right. It's been a little while. They just assume she's dead. They get her there. Tatooine's a rough place. Clearly, it's like, Raiders got her. On to wipe three. But it wasn't for a wipe three. Oh, she likes no legs. Yeah, it wasn't for, like, ransom.

Yeah, no. She's just, they're just gonna, they're't for, like, ransom. Yeah, no. She's just, they're just gonna, they're just, I mean, they are very othered, these people, because they are, it's just, they're just monsters. They're just desert monsters that kidnap women and God knows what. Yeah. For God knows what reason. Some misconduct has perhaps been happening on the edges of this PG movie. And anyway, she dies in Anakin's arms. Happy to see him.

She's so happy to see him. It's probably the most successful emotional moment in the movie. It's well acted. Once again, solid as a rock. Hayden Christensen is fine. I mean, he's doing the kind of angry tears, but he's... He's mostly reacting.

It's justified. Yeah. For once in the movie, his emotional overreactions are justified right by the ridiculous overreaction like plot overreactions of the movie but yes so much of the movie someone's like hey anakin how are you doing he's like i'm doing terrible bad fuck you and this one scene it's like oh you get why he's this angry and sad why he's like fucking clenching his teeth and shit right so it's another example of like

oh I mean you got here like just in time to say goodbye she's been there for like months I think

I mean we're gonna now I wanna rewatch it and just see if there's any details given on that but we'll see but the point is

he shows up and she just happens to die two minutes after he shows up well I guess she happens to die two minutes after he shows up. Well, I guess she was holding on, holding out hope. She sees him. That gives her the burst of energy for one last moment with her son, and then it's all gone. Yeah.

And then he- Takes out his lightsaber. He takes out his lightsaber, and it's a nice bit of directing from Lucas. Comes out, he chops off a head in anger, a Tusken Raider head. Yeah. And the, like, the wipe. It's a circle wipe. Yeah, it goes to his head, like, and then away.

Yeah. And as he later tells Padme, he killed them all. Well, so you're saying this is a nice piece of direction. No, I mean, it's not. I mean, I just like, it's a bit of flair. Yeah. I just like the flair. You see him step just like, it's a bit of flair. Yeah. I just like the flair. You see him step out, and it's like, oh, here are all the Tusken Raiders.

Here are the men. Here are the women with their babies. They got the little sort of like backpacks. Little Raider babies, yep. And there's some dogs. There's like some Tusken Raider like dogs. And, oh, it's hunting season. Yeah, and this is a PG-13 movie.

We can't just see him. No, sorry, PG movie. In a PG-13 movie. We can't just see him. I'm sorry, PG movie. In a PG-13 movie, he would have taken them all out on screen. Right. It's a PG movie, so he can't just slice all their heads to pieces. Right, and so even the one you see,

the decapitated, it's more suggested. You see a Tuscarora there, you hear the sound. Okay, so then it goes to Yoda and Mace Windu. Hard cut to Yoda and Mace Windu. I guess I forgot about this. Yeah, see, I rewatched parts of this.

Okay, go ahead. This morning. hard cut and yoda's like oh oh something bad he's got his eyes closed he's like oh boy and mace is like hey what's up and he goes uh a lot of anger yeah yeah oh a lot of anger today he's like a lot of darkness out there in the force world yeah mace is like what are you talking about he's like some bad's of darkness. Out there in the Force world. Yeah, and Mace is like, what are you talking about? And he's like, some bad's happening with Anakin. And they both just go like, okay, well, so where do you,

you want to get lunch at the usual place? Like, they just totally move on. Then they open the blinds. You want to do burritos again? Right. They like acknowledge that he can sense

there's a lot of pain and suffering. That's what he says, pain and suffering. Which, remember, in Phantom Menace, he went like, fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering. It's what he said. Pain and suffering. Which, remember, in Phantom Menace, he went, like, fear leads to anger.

Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering. It's the suffering. Like, that's his big, like. So he goes, a lot of fear, pain, and suffering right now. And then they just kind of look at each other and go, like, well, what's he going to do? Not keeping any tabs on their chosen one. So Anakin gets back.

Gets back. Tells Padme. Putzing around the shop. Like, you know, C-3PO is there. They reconnect. Oh, we forgot C-3PO has silver plates. Yeah. He looks cool, actually. He's all sort of dusty. Yeah, he's no longer open wires. Yeah, so I guess

Shmi kept him and then they used him on the farm. Yeah. And then someone bought coding for him. He looks like a rustier version of TC-14. Once again, you're just like, why is C-3PO in this movie? I don't understand this. You didn't like that character in the first movie. You left no impression.

I actually love the sequence with him later, but we'll get to that later. Yeah, well, we'll get to that later. I actually really enjoy that. Yeah. Even though it's completely unjustified. No, but I love it. It's unjustified why he even came with them. Why he's involved.

Right. But nonetheless, it's good fun. It's a classic Jar Jar in Mos Espa. But it's much better than Jar Jar. Yes. It's much more comically successful. It's another example of like, why would these characters bring that character?

He's a protocol droid. He lives on a moisture farm. Right. Anyway, as he tells Padme. So he's there like tinkering around, like look in the shop, right? That's a great question. Did Kliglars have to buy C-3PO

separately? I don't know maybe while it was like eh take the droid was it two for one or when like Shmi was getting married and they were equaled out and he's a slave now and she's like I do have a half finished robot my nine year old made well this is a good question I think

it technically belongs to her because Anakin built it for her I don't know the rules of slavery we gotta brush up on the rules I think it technically belongs to her because Anakin built it for her. I don't know the rules of slavery. Yeah, we've got to brush up on the rules of slavery. So, okay, so he's there and he's, like, fucking tinkering around in the shop. And Papin's like, what's up? And he's given his real, this is Hayden Christensen's quote-unquote Oscar scene.

Right. This is his, like, emotional breakdown scene. It's probably his worst scene in the movie. It's terrible. He says, they're animals, and I slaughtered them like animals. I killed them. All of them. Not just the men, but the women and children too.

The women and the children. He doesn't do it in the natural way that you're doing it right now. He really hammers home every moment of it. Right. And so the idea is it massacred. Yeah. And, of course course Padme uses this takes this as a moment to like fall more in love with him or something but we'll get to that

next week. Now and that's it. That's basically it. Well then after that he's just sort of normal. Yeah he goes back to kind of Jedi again a bit of a hothead and we'll talk about the climax of the film where he kind of rushes at Dooku too soon you know makes some sort of hothead decisions but that's it now that's just like it's like another seed

being planted for some future like plot line like Anakin struggles with his anger and it's to do with his like twisted childhood well let's let's unpack this you know a little more fully okay so like the Dooku stuff that comes later like his anger at later points it's it's preservation it's like self-preservation he's trying to survive he's in like do or die battle but it's it's also it feels just more along the lines of the first scene the speeder chase where it's like obi-wan's like be careful you know caution and it's like i'm gonna take him out you know right more classic anyone would have these teenage hothead moments. Right. Not, oh, my mother was raped by Tusken Raiders for months

at a Tusken Raider camp. Right, and I flipped out and killed them all. And I literally killed everyone in a blind, white rage. So let's break down the actual nature of this attack, right? Go ahead. Some, I know as Jedi's they are trained not to retaliate

or seek revenge or things like that. Yeah, nothing emotional. Don't use your powers with like an emotional bent, right? Isn't that the idea? Kind of try to keep that out of it. Yeah, but these dudes have been- Or use positive emotions. Sure.

Yeah, right. These dudes have been, it is pretty much implied by the film, raping his mother, tied up in a hut for months, right? Yeah. So if Jedis are defenders of the peace- Sure, why not? Some action needs to be taken but i feel like i'm not saying it's proportionate but you see i think it's not saying it's proportion no no but i'm saying like i think it's like the prime directive in star trek it's like just because tatooine has this problem with all these tuscan raiders doesn't mean the jedi are

allowed to just come and exterminate them well it's a little bit of an elliot rogers thing well but they he like wipes out the entire race because he, like, is angry about... We don't know how many of them were involved. Right. The women and the children. I don't know if this is supposed to be, like, a shocking moment. Like, oh, my God, I didn't know Anakin had it in. Well, the film doesn't really know either.

Right. This is my point. Yeah. He's such a little shit that we just go, I don't care what he fucking... He could do anything. I don't care. And then, the fact that we don't have to see it on screen, that we don't have to live with the brutality

of it visually, doesn't really let it land as a horrific act. And the way he describes it to Padme is so fucking whiny that we're just like, I don't know. I'm not for killing anybody. But it also was like,

we know these guys did something shitty. Yeah, but he killed all the women and the children. It's not good news. He probably should have been like, you know, killed whoever was guarding her and then like, recovered her body and been like, who did this? And dealt with the leader. We need to see a scene like that.

But then the scene would just be like someone going like I don't think it would be very one-sided dialogue. If the point of this scene of this plot thread in the movie is to make us scared and be like,

oh my God, what's happening to Anakin? We need to see something. Like if the one person he decapitated was a woman or a child or something like that. Like what we see is like

he decapitates the one guy who's coming after him. It's almost not transgressive enough in one way. Yeah. If we're supposed to be shocked by this development. I'm a little shocked by it. I think I'm more shocked by it than you are. I think it's shocking that he does this. I don't think it's justifiable. I think it's shocking in the abstract. I think the way

the film presents it is not shocking. We have to step back and go like, oh, I guess that is terrible. I think the other problem is that it's just the film going like see see we told make sure you remember this that he did this thing evidence it's like a 14 year old writing a history paper and like like ham fistedly inserting a quote that's like and that justifies the evidence you know like it's it's too. But this is my question for you. What the fuck is George getting at? What is he trying to do here?

I think it's like there's a tension between the light and the dark side that Yoda talked about in the first movie, and here it is. Could he turn evil? Right? That's where it's going? I mean, that's what the first movie speech is about. If fear turns to anger, anger turns to hate.

That's the path to the dark side. He doesn't feel like a bad guy. He feels like a 17-year-old who had, like... Well, this is where the movie, like, completely flops. Like, there's nothing scary about him, like you said. Yeah. Yeah, totally. He just feels really emotionally unbalanced.

Right. Like, my friend... His emotions could be played. We know Darth Sidious is out there. Yeah. We know he's looking for a new Darth Maul. Yeah. There's... I guess he's got Count Dooku now. We'll is out there. Yeah. We know he's looking for a new Darth Maul. Yeah. I guess he's got Count Dooku now.

We'll get to that. Yeah. But Count Dooku's a little long in the tooth. Yes. R.I.P. Christopher Lee. Oh, God, the great Christopher Lee. Well, he's so good. Best performance in the movie by a million, million miles.

He and his long teeth. Yeah. My friend Scott is a high school guidance counselor therapist. Great. He always says that being a teenager should be legally admissible in court as a defense for insanity. Sure. And I'm not saying like, as a teenager, who cares if he kills someone? No, I don't care if he kills them, really.

Well, because we don't know who they are as characters at all. There's no emotional investment in that. And we don't have to see the death so it doesn't feel horrifying. And the way he describes it. Is so childish. And the performance is so bad that it doesn't register. Like our dominant thought is this guy sucks. Not like that's a horrible thing.

Why does she even like him? It takes a couple scenes to go like, oh wait, he murdered a bunch of like. Children. Children. You killed children. You're going like, that's a bad line reading. He abused his Jedi powers. I guess it's the easiest way to put it.

Yeah. But it's like maybe he shouldn't have been left out on his own. Like, I'm not trying to make excuses for him. I'm not trying. Maybe he was raised poorly. Like, I don't know. If the point is that we're supposed to sense that like, oh, he had this dormant evil in him the whole time. Sure. I don't think it comes off as that.

I think it comes off as like he wasn't raised properly. I think it's more. He reacted poorly in a situation. He abused his power. Yeah. I don't think it's Dormant Evil. I think it's more that he is vulnerable to being played on a little more than the classic monk-like balanced Jedi. It's just here's someone who's very tricky.

Tricky case. This is a movie that is essentially for children, no? Yeah, I guess so. It's kind of for all ages. Anakin is the lead character. Yeah. Like Phantom Menace, we'd argue a lot about how there is a lead character. Anakin's the lead character.

He's supposed to be the audience surrogate. I guess so. He is the guy in this movie. Yeah, because Padme only exists to service his plot. There's not an argument. And Obi-Wan's a subplot. The mystery is a subplot, right? Absolutely.

Anakin is the lead character in this film. The lead character. What is George trying to do by going like, Hey, kids, remember that kid you liked in the last movie? Now he's a really unpleasant teenager. Oh, and now he kills people. But at the end of the movie, he gets the girl and saves the day. Loses an arm, though.

Yeah, okay. Spoils of war. What fucking narrative is this he's telling? Again, it's the same problem Phantom Menace has, and it's something we're going to have to investigate when we listen to the commentary. It is planting seeds for something in the future that never came to fruition. It is absolutely up to that.

Each movie has to be its own movie. It has to make sense with the fucking movie. If you think each movie has to be its own movie, then Attack of the Clones is a failure. It's a failure. As a sequel. As its own movie. As a sequel, it's weird.

That was our dominant question. Is it a good sequel? As a sequel, it's not a total failure. It's yeah but as its own movie no good like you couldn't watch this and really pick up what the fuck is going on you would need to watch the phantom menace to get who the jedi are and who padme is but if our question is is it a good sequel this is directly furthering all the foreshadowing the badlyly, but it's doing it. The pathway for the Anakin character in the first movie. I don't know why that didn't make sense to me in the first movie.

I don't know why that's the thing I had to follow up on. Right, but no, you're right. It is sequelizing that. They laid some groundwork for this, and now they're following up on it poorly. Right. But I think, yeah, if you're making a... Let me just talk in the abstract here.

If you're making a movie, each movie should be a complete story. Yeah. And then if you get a chance to make another one, you go, okay, here's the next story that happens here. You can't just go like, oh, I'm trying to get to this end point, so each movie I'm only going to tell one-tenth of the story. The problem is you can't just want to get to something.

I don't even mind a serialized narrative in a sequel. I don't mind if it doesn't completely stand alone, but there needs to be something interesting happening that's not just 17-year-old has series of temper tantrums. Yes. Yeah. Oh, boy. Well, next week, though.

We can talk about that romance. How are you feeling, Ben? Um... I want to hit rewind and do it all over again. How are you feeling, Ben? I want to hit rewind and do it all over again. Well. The movie? You want to rewatch it?

Is that what you're saying? No, the podcast recording. Really? Yeah. Do you feel that bad about it? That's how good that was. Oh, you're saying you want to listen back to it right now. Yeah, I want to do it again. I thought you were saying you wanted to re-record.

Yeah, I thought you were saying it was so fucking terrible. Yeah. No, it was so great. It's like I want to do it again. I thought you were saying you wanted to re-record. Yeah, I thought you were saying it was so fucking terrible. Yeah. No, it was so great. It's like I want to experience it again. Mr. Positive over here. Thank you, Ben. Positive, positive. You're welcome.

It was a delight seeing you this week because it is every week. Yeah. It's always fun. Thanks, guys. You're welcome. Yeah. So next week,

but no, next week, the romance. Yeah. We're going to have a guest. Perhaps the film's greatest failing. The romance. God, there's so many failings. Probably.

Yeah. I would say this is the film's greatest failing that we talked about this week, but it's very tied to the next thing we're talking about. Yeah. Anakin is the film's greatest failing. Yeah, but next week- And close second is the visual effects of the film second greatest failing next week is

a good friend of ours Rachel Rachel Dolezal we're gonna keep up this bit that it's Rachel Dolezal until next week but anyway

I guess I didn't know that Rachel is an actual fan of the romance well she sent us an email that was like it was intense guys I don't know

what your plan is but if you're doing an episode on the romance please let me appear on and she explained to us that she'd done like... It was intense. Guys, I don't know what your plan is, but if you're doing an episode on the romance, please let me appear on. And she explained to us that she'd done fan art and music videos. Yep. She was very invested in this romance

at the time the movie came out. Right. So this romance... I don't know if she still stands out, but at the time, totally worked for her. Just as a preview, I will talk about... I used to read Empire Magazine, which is a British film magazine

that I was obsessed with. It's a very good magazine and they notoriously gave this film five stars their highest rating they gave Phantom 4 which is bad enough they gave this five and predicted that it would be the most financially successful film ever made beating Titanic which is the

current record holder because in their eyes it was Star Wars plus romance for the girls right if Phantom Mass did that well why wouldn't the sequel do that as Star Wars plus romance for the girls. Right. If Phantom Man's did that well, why wouldn't the sequel do that as well? This has romance for the girls. Yeah. And so, like, obviously it was the most wrongheaded prediction ever made because the romance is a failure. But there must have been some girls of a certain age, a younger, like, sort of our age, 12, 13, at the time it came out.

Yeah. Who were actually invested in this romance. Like our guest next week on the show. Can't wait to talk about it. Yeah. Guess what I was? Not invested. Me't wait to talk about it. Yeah. Guess what I was? Not invested. Me neither.

Boy, oh boy. Yeah. Probably the worst age for our age. Like, you know, worst age when you're 12 or 13, a romance. Yeah. But it does feel like they were trying to replicate the Titanic formula, which is like some crazy shit happening with the boys, tragic romance in front of it. But there's no formula to Titanic.

That movie's a special, special, special thing. Titanic works against all logic. It's so good. All right. Anyway, look forward to that next week. Thank you all for listening. Keep on doing so. And as always,

Anakin's a little shit. Let me try that again. I want a better end, as always.