Blank Check with Griffin & David - The Iron Giant

Episode Date: May 13, 2018

This week Blank Check begins a new mini series reviewing the filmography of director Brad Bird with a discussion of 1999’s critically acclaimed animated feature, The Iron Giant. But does the Iron Giant wear a shirt? Did the studio request this movie be set in present day and have a hip hop soundtrack? Should Griffin and David fight more? Together, in their worst episode ever, they examine Brad Bird’s origin story, the hotness of Harry Connick Jr. as beatnik industrial artist Dean McCoppin, the upcoming Blank Check Pictures slate and booger stores.

I know you feel bad about the deer, but it's not your fault. Things die. That's part of life. It's bad to kill, but it's not your fault. Things die. That's part of life. It's bad to kill, but it's not bad to die. You die? Well, yes, someday. I die? I don't know. You're made of metal, but you have feelings and think about things,

and that means you have a podcast. And podcasts don't die. Never. They never die. Podcasts never die, baby. They just start new miniseries. Boom. It's landed on our planet like a meteor. What is this?

Oh, is this, is it a space rock? Oh, the smoke's clearing. Oh, what is this? No. It's a new miniseries. I appreciate the energy you brought to the studio today. Hello everybody, my name is Griffin Newman. I'm David Sims.

We are hashtag the two friends, a competitive advantage, no other podcast has it going for it. And today we're going to talk about a movie that has two friends in it. And they'd almost be stepping on our territory, but thankfully they've kept their friendship to one medium and that is the silver screen uh-huh uh-huh that's that's what happened yes it's a podcast called blank check oh i see so like if we did a movie we would not have our friend competitive advantage you're saying there've been tons of fucking friends and movies that's why we got to stick to the podcast hope and crosby true they were the original two friends which one am i i'm hope you're yes right yes yeah what are some other faves like uh abbott and costello uh sure which one am i uh which one are you uh i'm costello right yeah i think so like laurel and hardy i'm the question is always which one is more annoyed

and you're that yeah no right that's what i. Like, I do feel like there is a common dynamic. What's another? Come on. Give me another hot team. Heinz and Crystal. I'm Crystal. You're Heinz. Yes, that's true.

Yeah. The Marx Brothers, but there's too many of them. Well, but then we could work Ben in. Like, if it's the Marx Brothers. We could work producer Ben in. Yes, exactly. You now give me the opportunity to introduce Ben before. Like if it's the Marx Brothers. We could work producer Ben in. Yes, exactly. You now give me the opportunity to introduce Ben before we said the name of the podcast. To introduce the Ben-ducer.

Purdue or Ben, the poet laureate, the Haas, the tiebreaker, the peeper, the fuckmaster. You don't know what you've done. Birthday Benny. You started it, David. Not Professor Crispy. No. He is. Cheech and Chong.

A meat lover a fart detective these are all true things I think I'm wishing a Hello Fennel he's a close personal friend of Dan Lewis yes

graduates of different tells of the course of different researches like Hello Ben producer Brent Kenobi Ben say Ben I chum Lon say Benny

think that that that A-L-O Ben's with the dollar sign Warhouse with a Rubain Robohus and Ben 19 a filmmaker I said them out of order.

You did, and you also are missing one. Which one? The James L. Brooks one. Oh, fuck. This is why I said you don't know what you were doing to yourself. Oh, fuck. Yeah. Okay, we'll get back to this later.

Uh-huh. This podcast called Blink Shack. Uh-huh. This is a great entry episode for new listeners, I think. Love it. We talk about filmographies, directors who have massive success early on in their career and are given a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion projects they want. Right.

Sometimes they clear, and sometimes they bounce baby. Right. And I think that your Groucho, I'm Chico, and you're Harpo? Yes. I think that's right, right? Yes.ico. And you're Harpo? Yes. I think that's right, right? Yes. Right. Oh, I just realized.

I mean, I guess I'm Buzz and you're Woody, but I think Ben is Buzz, you're Woody, I'm Jesse. I'm Woody. You're definitely Woody. There's no question about that. I think you're Buzz. I don't think I'm Buzz. No, you're not quite.

That's a hard one no because ben's got that buzz like i just landed here sure sure i to go always riding hot wheels to go british i am morcombe and your wife jesus fucking christ i'm of course moroc you are mindy ben is our child played by jonathan winters all true i take that. John Winters funny. Uh, um, yeah, I'm Saunders. You're French. Sure.

You're ginger. I'm Rocky. Okay. I'm chicken run. Uh, I'm sunny. Your share. What are some,

I feel like there's a really blowfish. No, I'm Hootie. I'm a Hootie. Take that back. Um, why are we starting this? It's a little late.

This is a new miniseries. All right. Okay. It's a bright tomorrow. Yeah. We just spent, I would say, 20 minutes discussing the title of this miniseries, and we haven't even gotten it out yet. A bright tomorrow land.

Right. Because we're talking about the films of Brad Bird. That's right. Our first animator we've discussed. That's right. He's done live action, too. Yeah. But we're going to discuss four animated Bird. That's right. Our first animator we've discussed. That's right. He's done live action too. Yeah. But we're going to discuss

four animated movies. Ba-boom! We've never, well, I guess the Clone Wars, but apart from that. Tintin. Sure. But more so than ever,

we're going to be talking tunes, baby. Oh, boy. Wait, but how do you direct animation? What do you mean, Ben? Like, what does he go in the room? He's like,

you draw faster. Hey, more green there. Wow, Ben? Like, what does he go in the room? He's like, you draw faster. Hey, more green there. Wow, Ben, I think Disney's interested in bringing you into the Magic Kingdom. You really spoke to authority there, Ben. Hey, that guy, make his arm move a little bit faster or something. This is great stuff.

Am I like, is this right? Is this what he does? We'll get into this. Sure? We'll get into this. Sure, we'll get into this. It's definitely- More trees there. It's a different kind of job. Yes. Obviously, there's crossover because many animators have crossed over into live action,

much like Brad Bird, but often not successfully. But this film, Brad Bird took some different approaches to how animation had been directed. Which film? Oh, the film is called The Iron Giant. As the movie we're discussing today, we've done everything out of order. And what is the name of the miniseries? The name of the miniseries, of course,

I'm sure you all have guessed it, is Potatooie Ghost Protocol. That is not what it's called. It's called Potatooie, colon, Ghost Protocol. No, you know what the title is. The Podcastables. And we can't do the bit again too many series in a row where you disagree because the podcastables was your title yeah

my title was uh the pod credit casts right which is great and a little sweaty mine is cast land which i liked which i would think everyone liked i everyone liked went over well in the room tested more of a 10% or well this movie tested through the roof it did but still bounced

but we're calling it the podcastables that is the name of the main series and this is one of those main series we love it when we get to do this

where you get to sync up with a new film that's right yes this miniseries with a topical release that's right that was. We get to end this miniseries with a topical release. That's right. That was part of the idea.

We've talked about doing birds since practically the beginning of this podcast. And we're always like, should we wait for Incredibles? Should we wait for Incredibles 2? Right. It was far off. The movie got pushed up a year.

It did. It was first going to happen in 2019, yes. Yeah. Which rarely happens in animation. Very rare. It's a show of confidence that they pushed up a year, which is also what happened with the original Incredibles. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. So, excited to see that. We are, of course, recording this miniseries in advance, so it is currently 1935. That's right. Hello! We're on the wireless. But you will hear it straight through, and we'll be watching them in the weeks leading up to right incredible

even though we're making like references to den of thieves yes or whatever and they've only just announced the voice cast for incredibles 2 today yeah so though i felt like that was all already known i guess they just made it official odin kirk and keno were known the rest were not well like sophia bush and and a big one jon Jonathan Banks. Replacing Bud Lucky. Who is he? Animation legend. No. Maybe it's just more of a part. I don't know. I don't know. We'll get to that. He also chuckles the clown and T.S. Twa.

Have you heard of it? T.S. Twa? Thankfully we're not going to be talking Toy Story on this podcast. Ever. It's not going to come up. I'm going to just spit my orange juice out in your face. How dare you. Glad you didn in your face. How dare you. Glad you didn't do that. How dare you.

The most existential of the American film trilogies. I would literally, if we did that episode, I would hit record and just leave. For the night and then come back

and you guys would still be in here just sweating, yelling at each other. He would be in here. I would be like dead by my own hands. Also, we'd have to do three of them three oh god it would just be like there'd be like feces on the wall or whatever if it started a new society this sounds great i don't know why you guys are ragging on me. Oh, boy. Sounds lovely. Okay, so Brad Bird.

Uh-huh. Bit of an interesting story, because it takes him a while to make his first film. This film? This film? This film, this film... The Iron Giant? The Iron Giant. It was one of the guys who kept on coming close to making a feature for a very long period of time. I asked you right before we recorded if you had watched The Giant's Dream, which is a documentary on the Blu-ray for The Iron Giant.

If I have, I don't remember it. I have the Blu-ray, though, so I will go watch it. It is fascinating. I believe it is directed by Michael Giacchino's son. What's his name? Jason Giacchino. I also always get that name. It's not Giacchino's son. What's his name? Jason Giacchino. I also always get that name. It's not Giacchino, right?

I always get it wrong. Well, I mean, that's how I would say it. But is that wrong? I don't know. I feel like I'm always corrected every time I bring him up. Giacchino. Yeah, probably. Okay, whatever.

It is a fascinating documentary because it is so honest with the frustration that many people had working with Bradford. He seems to be a very demanding man with very particular ideas. Skills to make him a nightmare for people like him. Rigid, right? He has rigid ideas of what he wants out of his movie uh-huh uh but unfortunately he's making animated movie which requires more than one person to make it right and sometimes those two things can come into conflict and sometimes they bounce baby and uh but but he's not one of these guys who then feels the need to like control

his legacy and try not at all he's's pretty upfront about how intense he is. I don't think he has this problem as much in live action filmmaking. I think it's more in the animation world. I think that has to do with production differences, which we will get into. We will, but I mean, like, Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol, you never heard a peep out of anyone

being like, oh, wow, what a tortured shoot. No, but Tom Cruise is kind of the Brad Bird of actors. True. But hey they collaborated beautifully. Yes. Brad Bird has this line that I repeat a lot when I'm like on difficult sets.

Okay. And people go like how are you holding up? I always repeat this Brad Bird mantra which is pain is temporary film is forever. Sure. Which is super aggro. Right, but I get that, where it's like, look, this might be horrible now, but if we make a great movie, people can

watch it anytime, forever. And also, if you compromise on something, because it was difficult, are you then going to, like, go to every screening of that movie ever and say, like, hey, look, it was kind of cold that day, we only want to do two takes do two takes sure right like you got to live with that film for the rest of your life yeah and and it's better to unless you're george lucas yeah right yeah better to

have that thing be as good as it can be and so as good as it gets you want to be as good as it gets as positive as ben as it has we're to try things out over the course of this episode. We're recording like seven miniseries in advance. And so we don't have time to even field test things with our listeners. Yep.

We're sorry guys but it's all for you. Yeah. It is literally all for you. Yeah. Otherwise you can have fun not having a podcast. Yeah.

This is all for you guys. But that's like his big sort of adage so here's here's the brad bird like kind of origin story okay oh i love this origin story i've written about it on the atlantic.com right grows up fairly large family montana uh goes to see uh jungle book sure i've been a fan of amy movies right prior to that he was born in 1957 sure i've been a fan of any movies right prior to that he was born in 1957 sure i think pretty traditional suburban upbringing well in montana though yes so you know it's out there dry sure yes but if he yeah he goes to see jungle book which came out in 67 so my guess is he was about 10 years old which is also my first movie i saw in theaters i'm not saying this was his first movie

but just i want to restate that was your first? Like one of those re-releases? I saw that re-release. At the Quad. At the Quad. I was one and a half years old. Oh, so you don't remember that. I remember it vividly. Full of shit.

We've already thought about this on the show. Did we? I don't remember which episode. Because it came up in the box office game. And I said that was the first movie I saw. And you said you were a year and a half years old. You wouldn't have remembered that. And then I went to see Margaret at the quad with my mother.

And she said, you know, this was where I took you to your first movie. And I said, memory confirmed. Okay. Anyway, he sees the Jungle Book. Loves it. And someone clicks on him and he goes, how do they do that? His parents go, well, they draw and each rung's a little different. Sure.

Animation. He goes, no, how do I get to the point where I can do that? parents go well they draw and he strungs a little different sure animation he goes no how do i get to the point where i can do that buy some paper starts animating he's 10 years old 12 years old well i do want i i'm gonna look up the exact end of it because i replicated it in my story so when he was 11 he went to walt World in Florida. Okay. Right? And he said, I want to be an animator. Uh-huh.

And the Milt Kahl is one, I believe, one of the nine old men who are the legendary old Disney animators, right? Yeah. And who he routinely makes homage to in his movies. Met him when he was 11 and was like, sure, okay, you want to be an animator. Like patted him on the head or whatever. Yeah, you'll grow out of it. You're not going to have the stamina to do it. Right, and he was like, no, you don't understand. I want to be an animator.

He seemingly was the most intense kid. I think he actually talked about this in one of his Oscar speeches. But anyway. Yes. And then he came back two years later with a completed animated film. Called The Taurus and the Hare.

He did a retelling of The Taurus and the Hare which you see large sections of on this thing. And it's pretty like it's pretty impressive.

It's like very much drawn by a 12 year old but there's like a prodigious sense of character animation within it. And Milk Call was so impressed

that he like decided to properly mentor this kid. Give him notes and teach him how to animate. Walt Disney Animation gave him an internship. He was 14 years old. They had never given an internship to a high school student before. But they kind of

went, oh, this is the kid. This is going to be the guy. So they kind of anoint him, bring him in. he interns there under the nine old men and they all are these very exact thing right it's they they came up in in when disney was like a factory and you had to like get shit right like well you know you have to work with decision right and they're not like, you know. Have you heard of the nine old men, Ben? No. They were like the nine classic Disney animators who worked on all the great films.

Okay. Frank and Ollie are the two most famous ones. Yes. They had been around forever, basically. They refined the 12 basic principles of animation. Yes. Squash and stretch. Anticipation.

Staging. Straight ahead action and pose to pose. Follow through overlapping action slow in and slow out arcs secondary action timing exaggeration solid drawing and appeal i don't know what any of that means when does goofy come into the picture okay so goofy's off to the side he's the 10th nine old men and one like dog man what is goofy he's a dog right have i got into my dark thing no i think i talked about this at disney world Nine old men and one dog man? What is Goofy? He's a dog, right? Have I gotten into my dark thing? No, I think I talked about this at Disney World with my friends.

Man, I don't know. Let's go off on a Goofy tangent. I'm going to talk about this, and you're probably going to want to cut this out. Great, great. Can it be short? Hold on, I'll just mark it. Yes. Yeah, mark it right now. Yep.

We're almost definitely going to cut this out. Okay. But keep in the part rice. All right. Jesus, just say it. We will return to your scheduled programming shortly, but we are experiencing technical difficulties. So Brad Bird, when he's 18.

We cut that out. Brad Bird, when he's 18, gets a scholarship from Disney to attend CalArts. My alma mater that I dropped out of. How quickly? One semester and change. Okay, mater that I dropped out of. How quickly? One semester and change. Okay, so you did do one semester. I did one full semester.

Right. And then you go back for semester two and you're like, that's that? There was a big negotiation with my parents. I wanted to leave after the first semester. And they were like, go back. And I went back and I was like, yeah, I held no hard pass on this. But he was one of the reasons I went there. Interesting. Interesting.

Sure. And Tim Burton. Do you know who he meets at CalArts and becomes long-time friends with? Who doesn't he meet at CalArts? Well, one person who definitely

never got in any kind of like troublesome or problematic situation. Someone who greeted him with a hug and a hand on the leg and a kiss on the lips. It was John Lasseter.

Who, of course, is going to play a part in Brad Bird's future career. But also Tim Burton is a classmate. Sure, sure. Also, what's his name? Ron Musker. Yeah, of Disney, who directed Little Mermaid and other things. I mean, his classmates are the Pixar guys. The guys behind the Disney restaurants.

John Musker and Ron Clements. Yes. You turned them into one person. I'm sorry. The Disney Renaissance guys. Tim Burton is in the class. Sure. I was there. You were not there. Oh, it's true. I wasn't. I was there. I had a class in A113, the famed A113. Sure. It was bad. I dropped

out. What was the class? I think it was like a snow and art or something like that. Were you studying to be an animator in particular or to be like a filmmaker? I was studying to be a live action filmmaker, which I think was a mistake. I went to this school because of all the filmmakers I loved who went there,

almost all of whom came out of animation. Right, yeah. And I think it's probably still the best animation school in the world. Sure, but it's maybe like UCLA is to me or USC those are the film schools in California. Yeah, I also didn't want to be in college. I really hated it there.

It's also, you know, the school was founded by Walt Disney. Sure. The original idea was to create a strong animation school so that there would be a pipeline for Disney, but then it also would have all the other concentrations and it's this very 60s like a strong animation school so that there would be a pipeline for Disney but then it also would have all the other concentrations

and it's this very 60s like kind of art deco-y building. But it's a very small school and the whole school is in one building. Sure. Every class, every concentration.

Only 951 undergraduates. It's so small. Yes. You got into this school. I did. It's impressive. It's a prestigious school to get into. You dropped right the fuck out. Yes. You got into this school. I did. It's impressive. It's a prestigious school to get into. You dropped right the fuck out.

Yeah. I'll say this though. My class from my year. Okay. Who was in that? CalArts Live Action Filmmaking. Oh, you know, everyone. Danny Boyle. Uh-huh. Barry Jenkins. Sure. Walt Becker. Barry Jenkins definitely went to NYU, right? No.

I'm telling you who the class was. Believe me. Danny Boyle. Uh-huh. Walt Becker. Barry Jenkins definitely went to NYU, right? No, I'm telling you who the class was. Believe me. Danny Boyle. Walt Becker. Barry Jenkins. Griffey Nooms. Roger Gosnell, director of Beverly Hills Chihuahua. No, he didn't go to NYU.

I take it back. Come on. Yeah, yeah, no, it's funny. Comedy bits. Yeah, Roger Gosnell. It was hilarious. Okay, listen. The point is, school's very tiny.

It's all in one building, so it's very claustrophobic. And he wanted all the different concentrations to be melding together. But it ends up feeling like you're living in a hermetically sealed bubble. I can see that. Where is it? Valencia, California, which is essentially a series of closed-off housing communities and shopping malls, like strip malls. Not a griffey place not a griffey place the valencia's town center is what they call the main mall which has like a street and a neighborhood constructed around it like the entrance of disney world where it's like oh uncle jeffy's chocolate shop right it's like

wait that's sponsored by nestle there's no uncle jeffy and then literally you were waking people up to the bullshit yeah you're like guys there's no such thing as Uncle Jeffy. What? I've always known about Uncle Jeffy. He's not even an uncle. I was surrounded by sheeple. They literally had speakers in the grates underneath the sidewalk that would play music. Don't you want some Uncle Jeffy's chocolate right now?

There were bronze statues of families playing together on the street. Sounds great. Walt Disney's a wacko. Yeah, he didn't build the town center no he did he did he built it with his own two bare hands anyway let's get back to the history of brad burr before we start the discussion of his film the iron giant let's talk more about why i dropped that college all right let's talk about just when colleges start in general just when any college start like name a Harvard. Okay. Ben really had to reach for that.

Ben, the thing you have to know is that at Harvard, they have the statue of the three lies. Do you know about this, Ben? No. Harvard was founded in 1636. That's a long time to be a college. A long time. They have a statue. When you go on the tour, which I did, and I don't want to brag, I did not apply to Harvard because I knew I would not get in.

Sure. But my parents thought I was smart. They were wrong. But I went on the tour and there was the statue. The three lies. All right. Can you please tell this quickly? Jesus.

They got this statue and they're like, this is John Harvard. Here's the Harvard statue. The statue has three lies. Do you know why? And it's like, one, they list the wrong year. Two, John Harvard wasn't the founder. Three, that's not John Harvard. Yes.

This is mentioned in an episode of Gilmore Girls. That's how I know that. And here's the point. Yeah. This is supposed to be the fucking smartest school in the country. They're feeding me bullshit. Wake up, you fucking sheeple. College is a joke.

One thing you should know, remember, Harvard, great school for everything except statue making. Terrible statue making school. One of the most dishonest statue making programs in the country. Terrible statue making program. So this is our worst episode ever. Welcome to our worst ever episode. We've done it.

No, it's good. I think this is great. I think we're going to pull it around. Ding dong. Ding dong. Whoa. Ding dong. Our bell sounds different. Weird.

Okay. Can you get the door, Ben? Yeah. Hey. Who's this? Sir, you're soaking up the carpet here in the studio. I'm wet. All my sheets are wet.

Ben, relax. Relax. Yes, it's exciting. It's a wet man. There's a very wet man who's into the studio wet yeah all my sheets are wet ben relax relax yes it's exciting it's a wet man there's a very wet man who's into the studio hey i need help all right all my linens that i sell at the brook okay the brook like a bubbling brook like a body of water i thought it was a good place to sell all right okay i mean they got wet i drop them in the brook i dropped my linens your linens and wares in the brook so you had some linens you were just they were dry they looked nice you were by the business was good it was good there's a lot of people like coming down the brook yeah okay all right fair enough yeah but then linens went in the brook. Yeah. Okay. All right. Fair enough. Yeah. But then Lennon's went in the brook.

All right. Well, buddy, let me talk to you about, coincidentally, there's a little homophone going on here, but we've got a sponsor on the show, brooklennon.com. Oh, my God. brooklennon.com. Get out of here. Well, you are going to need to get out of here because you are quite wet. I should introduce myself, too.

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i want some dry sheets and just totally totally this is an unrelated question but it's about your brooks i mean your your Linens, not your Brooks. Thanks. Do you mix and match the patterns and stuff? I'd like to. Well, they do that at Brooklinen. What? Yes.

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all right we're gonna give you some extra coaching off mic but you are so wet sir you must leave all right fine all right wow that guy was so cool you think so just it was just the wetness i like vaping too so brad bird goes to cal arts graduates within two years yes gets hired onto disney and everyone's like this is the kid everyone's saying it jimmy carter right uh i couldn't think of anyone else from 1980 brad burge the kid is that carter don't, Carter's a hard one to do an impression of. No, you basically had it there. A crisis of confidence. You know, he has this-

That only Brad Bird can rectify. Everyone's like, you're putting a lot on this 20-year-old drawer. Anyway, he works on The Fox and the Hound. Which is a weird Rosetta Stone movie where, like, all the people who go on to revolutionize animation all worked on that movie and were miserable. Yeah, well, it's also when Disney animation is just in the dumps. They haven't even made a movie for four years.

Nine old men have been pushed out the door. We're all being forced to retirement. Brad Bird shows up and he's like, this isn't the Disney I spent my entire life wanting to work for. It's a real low point. And Disney is sort of on the brink of, you know, shutting down totally. And animation is like very low on their list of priorities. Yeah. And he is very outspoken because he was taught by these exacting men who trusted in him that he had to uphold a standard of quality.

Yeah. So some of the people who worked on this movie, John Lasseter, John Musker, Ron Clements, Glenn Keane, Tim Burton, Henry Selick, Mark Dindal, who directed The Great Empress New Groove, and Brad Burp. Right. So it's like literally it's a murderer's row of guys who are all miserable working on this movie. And Chris Buck, who made Surf's Up. So yeah, suck on that. So yeah, he quits. He tells the story very dramatically about how he goes into the office of his bosses and goes like, this is bullshit.

This is how it can be better. Why aren't we pushing ourselves? Right. And they were like, what are you, 19? Yeah, what the fuck? Go away. Get out of here. We don't care.

He was probably like 22. Right. Then he works. And they, yeah, they fire him. Yes. For standing up to them, for being so difficult, for being a cog in the wheel so now he's kind of disgraced he says they literally mind ripping the stripes off his shoulder like

it was like you were sure sure the kid and now get the fuck out the door um and and he tells the story about how he's walking out and he turns to them and he goes well this has been and he pauses because he can't think of the right word to say, and they look at him and they go, a disappointment. Wow. So it's like, kick to the door. You were supposed to be the guy, and now you're too difficult to make it in this industry. And he's trying to find a place to land. Sure.

And around this same time, his sister is murdered. Oh, I didn't know that. This is a huge part of the story that I didn't know before watching this documentary. His sister is shot by her husband. That sucks. Yeah. He's very close. He has many siblings, three siblings.

Yes. Very close with the sister, and it really kind of destroys him. Maybe this is before or after. The one thing that kind of comes to this is Spielberg kind of takes note of him. Spielberg, he worked on Amazing Stories, which was Spielberg's 80s show. He directs an episode called Family Dog. That show was kind of a disappointment, but that episode was one of the highlights.

It's a good show. I used to watch it when I was a kid. At the time, though, it was very hyped. Yeah, because it was Spielberg. It was a disappointment. Family Dog is one of the few fully animated episodes, if not the only one and it was a big hit and they actually released it in theaters before Land Before Time

because Land Before Time was so short It is very short, very good though Sharp Tooth though Sharp Tooth though Ducky though They kind of Proudfoot though Isn't it Bigfoot? I think it's Proudfoot

Is it Littlefoot? I don't know It's Proudfoot. Is it Littlefoot? I don't know. Whatever. It's the worst episode, David. We can do whatever we want. This is a great movie. We've already decided it's the worst episode,

so nothing matters anymore. True. Littlefoot. Okay, great. Congratulations. Five dinosaur points. So Family Dog was like a bit of an upswing.

Yeah, and then he writes Batteries Not Included, which is an Amblin movie. Which was supposed to be an episode of Amazing Stories, got expanded to feature length. But he's not really finding a place. He starts getting thrown into these rooms,

but every time he gets close to something, they go, he's too difficult. He's too difficult. Maybe, yeah. I mean, he's in the TV world. Yes. He works for Klaski, Kuspo. So before that,

he tries to make a feature film off of The Spirit, the Will Eisner comic. I'd love to see him make that. But he wanted to make it like a PG-13 action movie. Right. And every studio he goes to goes, look, you can't deny it. Good script, cool, but we can't give you this money. Animated movies have a cap. Adults don't go see them.

You can't do this. Right. And he always felt very frustrated about what he perceived as the limitations of what studios think animation can be he gets so mad about it he hates the idea that there's animation is like a subcategory or a genre it's like it's a film right it's a medium i made a film he gets very fussy about this on every director's commentary but he's kind of made a lot of enemies around town just from like look brad bird not worth it yeah not worth it you're never gonna get it done if you hire brad bird so he gets this job at class k supo where he's kind of like taking his lumps and he's like i mean he's an animator on the rugrats pilot you know

then he's sort of like a director and a what's the word I'm looking for advisor but Simpsons is the big one that he says in the depression after his sister's death which I guess comes

after Family Dog that was the one thing that kind of kept him afloat was for eight years he was a consultant executive consultant on the Simpsons directs Crusty Got Busted

which I think is the first great episode of the show the one that really holds up in season one Like Father Like Clown which is the one with the rabbi, which is great. And then he also directs the most important film of the 1990s. Yeah, I enjoy it.

The Bartman music video. Yes, he does. He solely directs the Bartman music video. Right. But he's rebuilt it a little bit. Now, during the 90s, he's also trying to get other films off the ground. He comes very close to directing Curious George movie. Yeah.

Doesn't happen. Live action, anime and stuff, keeps on getting close to stuff. Doesn't happen. Well, are you going to talk about Ray Gunn? Yes. So, Turner Animation. Ted Turner decides that he wants to get into the animation biz. Because it's the 90s.

Disney's had this huge renaissance. They're the most profitable movies around. Everyone suddenly thinks that they can do animation. Yeah. And none of these other studios' attempts at doing animation really work. Fox comes the closest with the Bluth run, but that dries up really fast. Sure. But Turner's getting into the game.

They make a movie called Cats Don't Dance. Which I have never seen. I saw it in theaters. I'm probably one of ten. Yeah. It's a Scott Bakula picture. Sure. Kids love Scott Bakula picture. Sure. Kids love Scott Bakula pictures.

Yeah. But they bring Brad Bird in as like kind of, he said that for a long time when these animation studios were starting up, they bring him on because they wanted to brag about we have Brad Bird. Cats Don't Dance won the Annie for best animated feature. It's pretty solid. Mark Dindle directed it. It's a Dindle picture.

Yep. But they would want to go like, look, look at our roster. We have Brad Bird in our bench. Sure, sure. But they wouldn't actually let him do anything. Right. He has a script that he wrote with Mark Robbins. Yep.

Matthew Robbins. Matthew Robbins, sorry, who's the same guy who he wrote, whatchamacallit with, Batters Not Included. Yep. And it's called Ray Gunn, and it's a sci-fi noir set in the future ben it's a future noir i'm listening sci-fi noir about a detective named ray gun cool yeah it's a good good name but it's kind of a hard-edged not not really a kid's movie he has talked about wanting to make this movie even now like He brings it up. It keeps on getting close, but they're not pulling the trigger. And then

Warner buys Turner. And suddenly Ray Gunn is gone. And he has 30 days left on his Turner contract that are about to expire. Warner Brothers now has their own animation studio. They put all their money into Quest for Camelot, a movie that everyone remembers, which they think is going to put them on the map. you see that one i did how is it not good yeah

saw that in theaters opening weekend as well i'm yeah this is so that came out in 98 yeah i'm an iron man iron giant comes out 99 obviously so i'm 13 when this movie comes out okay so i am no longer at the stage where if there's an animated movie in theaters like i'm there right i would you know right i would see every one and then at the age where i was starting to become embarrassed about it romley was all dumb to see movies so you could take her oh i'm just taking her it's not like i want to check out the character animation in home on the range i don't care about the craft of this thing brother bear uh brother bear is weirdly the one i didn't see okay fair enough like maybe the only disney I've never seen. We talked about this in some other episode, I think. That's great.

Anyway. Anyway, anyway. He's got 30 days left. They're trying to pick what their next movie is going to be. Uh-huh. And one of the things they have that they're really bullish on, because they go to Bradbury and they go, look, any of these you're interested in is The Iron Giant.

Right. A Ted Hughes short story that he wrote to console his children after his wife Sylvia Plath committed suicide. It's called The Iron Man. It. A Ted Hughes short story that he wrote to console his children after his wife, Sylvia Plath, committed suicide. It's called The Iron Man. It's a great book. I used to read it all the time. Excellent. And it's kind of classic in England.

It's a fable. It's a huge classic in England, as is the sequel, The Iron Woman. I swear that you read it growing up, though. I did, because he was the Poet Laureate of Britain. And that's a country in which I spent a lot of my adolescence. What? Bong. Ben rolled his eyes at me.

Ted Hughes is kind of problematic. Yeah. Bit of a dickhead. Yeah. Decent poet though. Yeah, he was. Yeah. But

he was awful to Sylvia. Not nice. And I think it had a big part in her committing suicide. I think so, too. It's a fun thing to talk about in this episode. Well, it's the worst one, so I just figured why not. I don't know. You know who else is problematic?

Oven in the head, right? Yeah. Or head in the oven. Sorry. Well, yeah. Yeah. Wow. Do you know who else is problematic?

Who? Almost everyone. True. Yeah. I mean, mean it's i don't say that to excuse no no no it's especially getting all those like beloved authors if you go back in time no come on ernest hemingway cool guy so cool clean slate raw doll famously chill especially towards jews um ted hughes it's just funny because i was very into the the iron man the book when i was a kid when i moved to england okay i read it and so i saw the iron giant because specifically i was interested in an adaptation of the hughes book it was like and then i went

when captain underpants came out exactly yeah and then when and i also read the iron woman which is uh not as good but still kind of good which is more about like environmentalism whereas like the iron man is more of like a very basic like monster from outer space like industrialism versus naturalism you know whatever but i did read a lot of his poetry when i was in high school just it was assigned to me um the book is very different book's very different but one person liked the book a lot pete townsend of the who who post tommy goes i need to come up with a subject for my next right i want to make another rock opera and it's gonna be about the iron man not uh tony stark no

no no no definite article in front of this title the iron man so he wrote a rock musical which has been staged and has been released, although it's not widely available. The soundtrack's available, but it was never mounted in a real production. They did a lot of tryouts and workshops and things like that, limited runs. Des McAknuff, however you say his name.

McAknuff. McAknuff, Broadway legend, most famously directed The Adventures of Rocky and Bullwinkle was sort of directing it because he did the Broadway production of Tommy as well Warner Brothers

acquires the rights they're looking for their own kind of big musical yes so they work on this with him right

Disney's got all the fairy tales so they want to find other children's stories that they can turn into musicals so they adapt this they've been trying to

work on it as a CGI feature Brad Bird comes in and goes look I'm not crazy about this music right I don't like the music children's stories that they can turn to musicals. So they adapt this. They've been trying to work on as a CGI feature. Brad Bird comes in and goes, look, I'm not crazy about this music. Right. I don't like the music. I don't want it to be 3d.

I don't like the design you got going on. I'm not particularly interested in the story. I want to set it in the fifties instead. There's something here. And he goes, he still likes the weekend. He, and he has his pitch.

Do you want to say the pitch? His pitch is because it's very tied to the sister. He had spent years. I'm violence as an issue in this country. Having lost someone he cared about deeply to a senseless act. A violence that would not have been possible as such a hair-trigger decision of a man going through a crisis. Where guns do not exist. And he says, what if an object had a soul and it knew what it was? What if a gun had a soul?

And what if a gun knew it was a gun and didn't want to be a gun? And he goes into the room and says that to them, and they all go, ooh. And then he gives them this whole pitch, and he goes, look, I don't want to be Disney. I don't think we should be trying to fight Disney. I think we should own what we are and be our own thing. So here's my pitch. It's the 1950s. It's the Cold War. It's like Norman Rockwell.

We have spies. We have robots. We have rock and roll. We have hippies. We have beatniks. Sure. Gives them this whole pitch, the military, guns, and it's all about what if a gun chose not to be a gun? It's all great.

And they go. Cool, go for it. Yeah, sure. Here you go. Here's a green light. You have one third of the time and half the budget. Big budget, though. 40 plus 30 for marketing is what I heard.

I think it was maybe closer to 50 at the end of that. Box Office Mojo lists the budget at 70. 30 for marketing is what I heard I think it was maybe closer to 50 at the end of that box office mojo lists the budget at 70 which by accounts that was factoring in the marketing

but they never well whatever okay that's what everyone says third of the budget Pete Townsend how do you feel about Pete Townsend

love the who said when they told him we're sorry we're not gonna do the rock musical thing and like we're not gonna use your the rock musical thing and we're not going to use your songs, said, whatever, I got paid.

Yeah. Nice. That was his reaction. And then he later saw the movie and said, it's really good. I read some interview with him when I was looking around. He was like, great movie.

As did Dez, who has a producer credit on this movie and did jack shit. They both just got paid to not have their work adapted. Yeah. And Ted Hughes died, but he read the script and liked it a lot. And his daughter, Frida Hughes,

Sylvia Plath's daughter, loved the movie and has spoken very fondly of it. And Tim McCandley's was hired to write the script. Yes, which they. Very limited time. He wrote it in three weeks off of Brad Bird's outline.

Brad Bird was reticent to let on another writer. He was, but Brad Bird's outline ends with the world being engulfed in nuclear war. Yes. So McCandley sort of smoothed some of that out. I can see that ending. Sure. And like,

I think in the end of brad bird's treatment like the iron giant is dead like that is that you know and tim mccandley is just like you can't that's you can't do that that's crazy and when he read the script and he he saw it's such a huge bummer right and that's also the best moment of the film is the ending i think the ending is is is important yeah i don't think a bleaker ending serves the movie. Yeah. No, and it's set up really well, and we'll get to the ending in a moment. So now let's talk about the movie, and then we'll talk about the reception to the movie.

Great. After that. Okay, great. Okay. So the movie's called The Iron Giant. Yes. It starts with... Oh, it's the best movie, and I love it.

You love it. I've seen it one million times, and I cry every time. It's a great film. Yes. It's a great American film. Ben, you had not seen it before. I've not seen it before until last night

and it's good. The verdict is in, folks. What were your thoughts vis-a-vis size of the giant? Perfect. Now, he's not small. He's quite large. Huge.

Very big. It's great. You know how there's like a tree? That's like his foot. He's way taller than a tree. I mean, I went into this. I'm like, the name I'm already in. But you thought maybe what? 10? 10 foot 6? I'm like, let's see

how giant we're talking. And it beat out all the expectations. I see Ben like tapping his fingers, you know, on the desk. Hey, hey, hey, come on. Whoa! Yeah. Giant! It was like kind of like wide shots of him walking, you know?

Like, that's what we need. Yes. Mora. This movie has a great sense of scale. It really does. Yes. And important to note, a thing he did on this, and this was kind of revolutionary, was giant is totally CGI. Interesting, sure.

100% CGI. Whereas everything else, and you can tell the difference. Yes. Because the animation's lovely, but it's very traditional. Right. And hand-drawn animation is difficult to convey solid mechanical objects in that same kind of way. See, this is what we have written for. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That makes sense.

So they use kind of cel-shaded animation, CGI, painted over it to make it look like 2D. But they also, animation, I don't know if you know about the concept of ones versus twos, threes, fours. No. But it's about the fluidity of your animation. The fullest animation is shot on ones, which means for 24 frames per second, you have one image per frame. Yes. 24 images a second, essentially.

Right. But a lot of animation gets away with doing twos or threes so that's like two is to like twelve frames per second or whatever you shoot each

David are you following this I don't know math man I don't know I've like I lost about twenty four or whatever fuck he's talking

alright anyway if you're shooting in twos yeah yeah oh yeah what's up if you're shooting in twos you're filming each drawing twice which cuts the

budget in half because it cuts the amount of drawings you have to do can i just say as an aside it is so crazy that there's a kind of movie where people just take a big piece of paper and draw something and then they have to do that like one million more times and every time the thing's just moving a little bit like and if i did that, I would lose my mind in a day. And I would kill myself. And I'm very afraid of dying. I want to be clear. I originally want.

I would commit suicide. I originally want to be an animator, which is, I think, why I went to Cal-Ops. Because I had already picked that as the school for me. Yeah, you mentioned. Right. And I did animation. I did like a summer intensive program at NYU. And I wanted to kill myself. just seems so so i i immediately realized i did not have the stamina

to do it demanding and like the endurance required concentration right does not seem like things you would be able to deal with like knowing you i think i was pretty good at it but it drove me insane yeah yeah absolutely insane and the other thing you have to understand is, I know this is obvious, but I'll just state this, with computer animation, you build the models of all the characters and the sets in the computer. So that exists, and then you're sort of animating

that model. Much like stop-motion animation, you have a physical puppet that you're animating. With hand-drawn animation, you have to do the drawing from scratch every time. You know? Right, yeah, that's just crazyrawn animation, you have to do the drawing from scratch every time. You know? Yeah, that's what, that's just crazy! Right, you have to draw a full Hogarth just to get his fingers to move a little bit.

Now, like, Hanna-Barbera would cut corners by being like, we're gonna use a still image of Shaggy and only animate his mouth. But that's why Hanna-Barbera cartoons look terrible. Right. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But Brad Bird was always an advocate of full animation, which is a very tedious, very obsessive

process. What were you saying about ones and twos or whatever? They shot the Iron Giant on twos, which isn't really a thing with CGI, but they wanted to make the CGI look rougher so that it would blend in better with

the animation, which I think is kind of interesting. Sure. It also works because he's so large that his mass is different. He moves slowly. Right, but he also just seems to occupy space in a different way. Right. He really does. Which helps.

Now, here's the other thing Brad Bird did in this movie that's big. It was not unprecedented, but was very much against the norm at the time and now has become the norm on all films. Okay. For a very long period of time, it would be you are an animator assigned to a character. Yes, right. Yes, that's what I think of as animation.

Classic animation. Right. So like you're Disney, your job... You're doing the chipmunk. Right, right. You're Miko and Pocahontas. And your job is to do Miko throughout the film. And the better animators,

the more high-ranking senior animators, you get to do Pocahontas or whoever. Brad Bird on this movie said, I want each animator to take on a scene. Oh, interesting. You are assigned a scene, and you are responsible for all the

character animation in that scene. Okay. You are directing that scene in its entirety. Right. Because I think, especially when you get to the rockier Disney films, you see like, this feels like seven different movies. Sure. You know,

like the funny supporting animal is in a different film than the crazy over-the-top villain and the bland generic square-jawed hero. Right. You know? This is like, I want each animator

to have a sense of ownership over each scene. So you're putting the whole scene together, and we're revising that over and over and over again. Right. So he's really directing the fuck out of it. And a big thing he does on this movie is open critiques, which weren't a thing.

We're going to screen the rough animation or your storyboards or whatever in front of everyone else onto a whiteboard, and I'm going to get up there with a marker and show you what you should be doing differently differently the head should be 15 degrees this way we need more of a joke in this so you're saying that he took a process that i just described is very stressful and he made it much more stressful for these people right but the other thing he said to them was we don't have the time we don't have the money we don't have the reputation okay all the best animators are at other studios. DreamWorks was starting up at this point.

Katzenberg had a chip on his shoulder being ousted from Disney, wanted to prove that he was better than them. They had stolen almost everyone good from Disney. Disney had the remains. Then you still had Fox and Bluth and TV and all these other places. So they were getting people who either essentially had been pushed into retirement, old guys who he was pulling out of retirement to do favors to help on this movie. Or young guys who had not been given a shot before or were too green in experience.

Or people who were just insane. People who were like, she's good, but she's just an asshole. Right, right. Or he's good, but he's crazy. And he just picked up all the latchkey kids. Okay. And said, I don't want us to make any excuses.

I think we can fucking own Disney. And how badass are we going to feel if we come out and we're like, we're Warner Brothers Animation. This studio doesn't have an identity. We can fucking define it. We can push the boundaries of what animation is. And what I want to do is not feel incentivized to outdo them in terms of bombast. Because I see these movies, there are too many jokes. There are too many songs.

True. The emotions are too wild. I. There are too many songs. True. The emotions are too wild. I mean, this is all fair. Yeah. He's criticizing later Disney. I want us to leave nothing on the table in terms of creativity. Sure.

But I want us to make a film with restraint. And then held everyone to insane, insane standards. Right. So now we've accurately described Brad Bird's creative process. Right. And here's, I'll tell you, emblematic of this. The very opening of this movie is the Warner Brothers logo, but he does it as.

So good. Like a radio sonar signal. Yes. He refused to have the traditional Warner Brothers animation intro. Which has Bugs Bunny leaning against the thing, eating a carrot with a tuxedo. Didn't want that because this was a different kind of movie. Right. So he designed that very cool

opening logo which you never see again which is the only way they would compromise with him right yeah and then we go straight into M.M. Walsh

on a boat yeah good voice acting in this movie yeah yeah a sailor it's a storm yeah

something crashes into we see from the space something crash into a hurricane and it's a storm yeah something crashes into we see from the space something crash into a hurricane and it's dark like it's dark and ominous sure and it is completely devoid of jokes true in a way that would feel weird in a disney movie i guess you're right disney movies often have an atmospheric opening sure like your beauty and the beast or even you know whatever yeah fair enough uh man on the sea weird waves sonar pinging what is that in the distance he thinks it's a lighthouse no no no no well we've seen again from space we've seen this thing crash oh right yeah yes right that's the very beginning yeah so he you know yeah he smashes into the iron giant yeah well we'll see more of him later but here's the idea like you know like a person one iron yeah instead of you know blood

and stuff to real tall now i have a very important question for you yep and he's also wet at this point we should mention that ben he's very big he's very wet that's true yes this movie's set in maine coastal maine i have a very important question for you. I can't remember. I watched this movie last night, but for some reason it's escaping my memory. David, is the Iron Giant wearing a shirt in this sequence? No, no shirt. Oh, interesting.

So the Iron Giant took his shirt off because the Iron Giant only takes his shirt off for Vin Diesel movies and baby this is a fucking Vin Diesel movie. It's a Vin Diesel vehicle. He's the title character. We did it! We did it! Thank you for turning away. I got a fucking Vin Diesel movie.

We covered him in little supporting parts but baby this is a vehicle. Vin Diesel, above the title, number one movie star, greatest of all time, shirtless. This is his third credit on a feature film. St. Prevost Ryan. Strays, his weird little. Yeah. St. Prevost Ryan, the Iron Giant.

Yeah. He was like a friend who was recommended. Because Brebber was like, oh, they wanted, you know, Brad Pitt. They wanted Schwarzenegger to play Manly. Like, they were asking for all these big names. He said the only one he took was Jennifer Aniston as the mom. He thought she was good. And the rest of them, he hired the character actors that he wanted. And I believe an animator on the film was like, I got this buddy who just got cast in Spielberg's movies, starting to get big. Got a great voice. He's got a great fucking voice. And it was literally just like that. They didn't think they were betting on someone

who was going to turn out to be him. He's got a great voice. I mean, you hear the Groot in it. It's not as synthesized as I even remembered. He's doing his thing. Yes. Groot. And they have clips of him in 1997 98.

Superman. Right. Doing the voice while wearing sunglasses even back then he wore sunglasses in the recording studio. My man Vin. Can't be stopped. Yeah. He casts Eli Marenthal who we all know is Stifler's brother in American Pie.

100 percent. Lil Stifler. He casts Christopher McDonald who's like you I mean, he's the guy from Happy Gilmore, right? True McGavin. But like, he's like a guy. You know that guy. He's the villain.

He's a great asshole. You want to know the weirdest thing? He's so good. I think Christopher McDonald's incredible vocal performer. And they wanted Schwarzenegger. Warner Brothers was trying to convince him to cast Schwarzenegger. Why would you have... He's supposed to be like a square-drawn American, like, you know, G-Man.

Brad, listen to us, okay? We just got the dailies back from Batman and Robin, and I think this guy's range is going to blow you away. We're seeing new sides of Arnold we never knew. Also, what do you have to pay him? Money? Carrie Connick Jr., who I think is amazing. I think that's where they wanted Brad Pitt,

or there was another big person they wanted to. As Dean, the beatnik. Phenomenalness. So good. Aniston, who I think is really good. Really fucking solid. Pitt or there was another big person they wanted to as Dean the beatnik phenomenalness so good and just well yeah Aniston who I think is really good really fucking solid although there are a couple times where you're like it's Rachel like you know like sometimes she just sort of says a word and you're like oh my god

Ross but this was like very much John Mahoney James Gammon Klaas Leachman is in this for a second. She's the teacher. Did you mention Vin Diesel? Vinny D. Vinny D.

Diesel. Yeah. Ollie and Frank, the nine of the old men, play the train engineer. Sure. This is very much the time, though, when even when you had someone as big as Jennifer Aniston was at this present moment. You don't put it over the title. And it also, you don't play to their star persona.

She's just showing up doing her job. She's playing the character. Right. You title. Yeah. And it also, you don't play to their star persona. She's just showing up doing her job. She's playing the character. Right. You know? Yeah. You get to like something like fucking Rubbits,

the Blue Sky movie and everyone's like, you know what I'm saying? Uh-huh. I totally know what you're saying. It's like, I remember when you

were talking about the one and two thing. Yeah. I actually had no idea what that was. It was like, my mind was blank. I also have arthritis in my hands.

I'm not really made for that field because my hands hurt very easily. You have arthritis in your hands? Yes, it's never come up. No. I have arthritis in my hands. How? Do you have like an autoimmune condition? No, my body's just bad.

Yeah, interesting. Yeah, I got one when I was 15 years old. I'm going to be so much fun when I'm 35. You're not 35 right now? No, I turn 35 next week. I'm 28 right now. Next week, I'm turning 35. Oh, no, wait.

We're recording this in 2011, so you're like 19 or whatever. Yeah, okay. I mean, this is the worst episode we've ever recorded, right? It's awful. There's literally no way for this episode to get any worse or any more frustrating to you. Ding dong. Oh, I didn't like how you were setting that up. Get the door, Griffin.

I wasn't setting anything up. I can't control when people show up. Oh, you're right. Yeah. Okay. Oh, my God, David. What? Oh, my God.

It's what? It's our friend from wide awake. Look at him. Are you talking about that movie? The tie tie boy. He's on sleep. The Shyamalan movie. Oh no, he looks like he's falling over.

Oh God, we can't let him just fall on the floor. You're right. We should get him something to land on like a Casper mattress probably. Yeah, do we have one? I mean, all I see in the studio is a mini fridge and then a box roughly the same size right next to it. Listen to me, my friend. Casper's a sleep brand that makes expertly designed products

to help you get your best rest one night at a time. And that'll go for this weird kid. Look at him in his mid-toothbrush. Well, I mean, you know, this is the kind of product that's designed to mimic you know the human body uh it provides supportive comfort for all kinds of people like even funny i mean i was gonna say that usually when we're talking about casper i mentioned that you spend a third of your life sleeping but he spends about three thirds three thirds it's funny because the title's wide awake um okay he's asleep well the original

casper mattress which we got right here combines multiple supportive memory phones for quality sleep surface with just the right amount to sink and bounce baby yeah and it has 20 000 reviews and an average of 4.8 stars across casper amazon Google. Casper's becoming the internet's favorite mattress. Wait a second. He's waking up to say something? Amazon's a good company. That's never done anything wrong. Get out of here.

Get out of here. Here's the cool thing about Casper. It offers the Wave and the Essential. The Wave features a patent-pending premium support system to mirror the natural shape of your body, whereas the Essential has a streamlined design at a price that won't keep you up at night. Yeah, well, I don't at a price that won't keep you up at night yeah well i don't think anything is going to keep this kid up at night he's so fast asleep and look if this fast asleep kid ever does wake up not completely satisfied there's a hassle-free return

system well that's great but look at him right now look how funny he is there's free shipping and returns in the us and canada yeah look you'll never send it back he's never going to wake up again he probably has a medical problem right and i i yeah he probably does have a medical problem i have a casper i don't have a medical problem but i do get a good night's sleep on it oh great so you can like lie on your casper and watch uh uh masterpieces like wide awake sophomore film that we're referencing a lot yeah well all right you can be sure of your purchase with Casper's 100-night risk-free sleep bonnet trial. So you can get $50 towards select mattresses by visiting casper.com slash check

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at checkout for select mattresses terms and conditions apply it's gonna be hard for him to do because he's asleep let's get him out of here so you stop laughing bye all right so iron giant crashes yeah hogarth hogarth hughes Hughes. Great name. Great name. Hog hug. Hog hug! Hog hug! It's really funny when he says that. Yeah. He's a latchkey kid.

His mom's a waitress. He lives in this little town. He likes horror movies. What else does he like? He likes comic books. He likes Mad Magazine. He likes his Kobos. Hogarth is right from the Ted hughes book dude what a name yeah uh what else uh he likes uh landslides sprinkling chocolate into his milkshake sure

he likes twinkies yeah uh he seems like a cool kid he's a great kid he's playing in the woods by himself he he has fun he's got like a imagination. He also likes to take in stray animals and stuff. Oh yeah, that's right. Because his first thing is when he has the chipmunk or the squirrel or whatever it is. He wants to pet very badly. And he lets it loose in his mom's diner and it goes up Dean's pants. And that's how we meet Dean. He's really funny in that scene.

The economy of this movie of just like- It's a short movie, 90 minutes. With credits. Yeah. 87 minutes with credits yeah you know 87 minutes with credits actually yes yeah i think the film ends up coming in at like 80 sure yeah 82 right um uh he that was another thing at the time was because animation was so expensive and because it rarely played to adults everyone was like ma movies 80 minutes tops yeah sure we need to pack

in the kids. 90 with credits. Right. You don't get longer than that. There's an efficiency to these movies. But this is just like, he could have had the squirrel scene happen to anybody.

It could have just been squirrel running wild, but it's like, why not use this to introduce the other main players? Agreed. This is also- All the pieces on the board,

ASAP. This is also the one sequence that feels like a little more Disney, right? Sure. Because it's a sort of wild slightly exaggerated sequence he has to undo his pants to let

the squirrel out, which I think is funny because he says I apologize. That's even like a little bit of a... You're saying a little risque? Yeah. Sure. Yeah, and I think, you know... I also like that there's like the fifth plot in this movie which is never remarked upon and barely just,

just sort of weird. We just sort of find out about the end. Is that like Aniston and Connick are like, Oh yeah. They, they, they, they want to fuck and then they start fucking.

Oh yeah. Get married. Yeah. Oh God. He's dead. Ben. Oh no. That was Pacino.

Somebody say my name. I've been bleeding out in this corner for months. Oh no that was Pacino Somebody say my name I've been bleeding out in this corner For months Somebody get me a mattress Erica Erica Oh my god Hey guys I missing

Yeah you're alright But anyway yeah That's that opening sequence Hogarth Mischievous Mom frustrated Anyway, yeah. That's that. That opening sequence sort of laying everything out. Hogarth, mischievous. Mom, frustrated. Dean, caught in the middle. I don't know.

And let's say, the setup of this movie, and the movie as a whole, very Spielberg-y. Yeah. He was a guy who was in the Spielberg circuit for a long time. No, it's very Amblin, that idea of you play in in the woods and like you sort of, you know, have this rich inner sort of, you know, life. And I think Brad Bird kind of is a cynical Steven Spielberg. Sure. He is a Steven Spielberg with a far more complicated view of humanity. Right. Some might call him Randian.

We'll get into that. I'm going to fight that. We'll get into it. I have a far more complicated view on it. I do too, but we'll get into that in I'm going to fight that. We'll get into it. I have a far more complicated. We're going to get into that. I do too, but we'll get into that in the next episode. Cause that's that doesn't touch this one.

But I watched this Spielberg documentary. I had not seen it. I've seen that twice. I watched it twice. Great. Congratulations. I guess you're twice as good as me. Finally,

I'm getting credit for watching that documentary twice. Yeah, there you go. How many times have you seen it, Ben? I wasn't listening. See, that's a brave stance.

You want to see a real hero who's not looking for law? And they say that a hero can save us. Not going to stay here. Wow, Jack Kroger. What a great get for this episode. And Josie Wells. We're just featuring him. I think it's Kathy Kennedy has a line where she talks about how like

they're talking about the period where everyone was slamming on spielberg for being too uh optimistic and too um sentimental and she went like look it's not a craven thing that's who he is right i think steven genuinely sees the best in people and i think he can genuinely he believes that he can will the world into being the place he wants it to be and brad bird has a far more complicated relationship but on a on a semiotic level brad world bird sees the world as a prison that is constraining him a great artist that is my take on him more than like he's a randy and i agree but uh i do i cannot deny that after making two movies in a row where people are like you kind of have this like

objectivist sort of strain to you he was like no no no no anyway here's my passion project it's about this a secret world where all the world's geniuses go because earth uh is like too bad for them but they're too good for her but here's here's because I'll tie right into this movie, okay? Yeah. People tag him with objectivism, which I think is wrong. I think he is obsessed with exceptionalism. Sure. And I think because of his difficult struggle finding a footing in animation for years after people had told him he was the guy.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. When he knew he had the right instincts, but people were telling him to settle for less. Yeah, or like, this isn't commercial or whatever. Right, or who cares? We don't have to work this hard. Yeah. I think he's very obsessed

with the idea of responsibility and the people who are capable of doing power, powerful things, having responsibility to do the right thing with that power, which is what this movie

is really about. Cool. That's a fine read. I wrote a whole really long article about his Randianism. Again, I want to plug it. On the Atlantic. You want a fucking, what, a trophy? I mean, in which I was saying,

I was arguing against the idea that he's Randian in political belief or whatever. Yeah. Cool. So, Dean lets a squirrel out of his pee peepee hole and runs around and the mom gets upset yes that's right and uh but you know there's i again i like the economy of the storytelling like i like that we just sort of get his relationship with his mother immediately without any sort of like sad stories of like a lost dad or whatever. And that's another thing that Spielberg,

he too, is the missing dad, no dad. And he, he just gave me a thumbs up cause he's, he's eaten his cheese. My cheese dick. Yeah.

Um, cheese dick. That's a six cents, right? Okay. Yeah. Um, and so the next,

because when he meets the giant is he's at home alone watching scary movies, eating Twinkies cause his mom's working like a double shift or whatever he has whipped cream mirror and he sprays it into the Twinkie it's really it's pretty cool yeah how do you feel about that Ben are you Twinkie guy yeah it's a little gross I don't like Twinkies I kind of like Twinkies I don't like whipped cream so like it's

like too much like you know yeah but it's like a childish you know when you were a kid where you're like what if I like do this is that like where you're like, what if I do this? Is that like food? Do whippets, you're saying? No. I mean, like when you're a kid and you're like, what if I just like put mayonnaise on bread and ate it? Like, is that food?

Like, no one would ever let me do that. And then you do it and you're like, I think this is bad. And he's home alone like most nights. Yes. So he's got to experiment. He's got to try different things. Right. But then he, the giant, he meets the giant, right?

Right. How does he, what leads him to the woods in the first place? Well, it's the, his antenna is broken. So he goes out to fix it and then he sees like something in the distance. Right, right, right. He loses his TV reception. So he takes his bike and his BB gun and his helmet with his goggles. He's ready for adventure.

He goes and meets this giant iron man who's at the electrical substation. He gets caught up. He eats metal. He loves metal. Sure. It's like his food. He gets tangled

in the powers and Hogarth saves him and that's you know yes Hogarth flips the switch lets him out goes

oh you look a lot like Vin Diesel oh and also right and then that's when he then no or is it the next time they hang out that he eats the railroad tracks or is it all in one

no that's the next time yeah because first is the power station and then like the giant comes back to him and says, you saved my life. But he eats half the BB gun.

Yes. The remnants there are left on the ground. Hog hug. Now it says hog hug. Yeah. Oh, no, she is widowed. Interesting. I don't really pick up on that.

I think it's more inferred. Yeah. Yeah. Right, but the giant likes him now. Saved his life. Yes. He goes home. He's terrified. Yeah. Right, but like, the giant likes him now. Saved his life. Yes. He goes home. He's terrified.

Sure. And then we're interested in Manly around this point. Well, yeah, because Manly's been called in to investigate. Well, there's the M.M. at Walsh

is the sailor being like, oh, giant middle man. And then there's that scene I fucking love right before the squirrel crawls up Dean's leg where they're making fun of him. Sure. And I'm at Walsh.

Yeah. And he goes, hey, he's not crazy. I saw him too. Yeah. Dean's like, right. Yeah. Trying to stick up for him. And Hogarth's like, you saw him too?

And he's like, no, but come on. I mean, if we don't stand up for the crazy people, who will? Right. Which is great. Yeah. He rules. Yeah. He's a cool beatnik.

He wears all black. He wears all black. He has like cool little boots, you know, like healed boots. A perfect soul patch. He's got cool beatnik. He wears all black. He has cool little boots. Healed boots. A perfect soul patch. He's got a soul patch. He's got black sunglasses. He drinks espresso.

Which is very cool for 1957 or whatever. He's so handsome. He's hot. Can we talk about it? He's a very hot animated character. He's really hot. I just kept thinking- He's hotter than Harry Connick Jr.

Oh, yeah. If I was Harry Connick Jr. Oh, yeah. Like, if I was Harry Connick Jr., I'd be like, oh, blah, blah, ooh. Yeah, yeah. Who are you? And Harry's like, me. And I'm like, no, that guy you're voicing. Ooh, blah, blah.

I think in general, obviously the animation of this movie is beautiful, but I think that the faces are so good. Help me with this. Yes, I think. There's something about the faces. I'll tell you the thing that I think pushes this are so good. Help me with this. Yes, I think- There's something about the faces. I'll tell you the thing that I think pushes this movie over the top.

I think the performances in it are incredible. I think it's some of the best- Yes, great voice acting. Animation acting. No, but I'm saying- But you're saying, right, the animation itself, the performances. Yes, yes.

They're so expressive, the faces, even though the animation's very simple. Right. But I also think that has to do with the fact that he was giving the animators scenes rather than characters because so much of it is the interplay between the characters together. Right. The way people say that acting is reacting.

Right. It's about how all the different characters are behaving in one scene together that scene is now under one person's purview. Sure. It's a beautifully designed movie and really great performances but it's also a movie of a lot of restraint.

Sure. It's not symphonic. It's actually a pretty small story and it's comfortable with long stretches of silence. That's true. It's a very small story the characters don't over explain themselves it's a boy and his brother they don't and also

they become friends sort of without us even seeing it like you know he just sort of assumes that we'll get like that their relationships are deepening yes like it's like you know we go from Dean not knowing about the giant to Dean seeing the giant to him the three of them just sort of hanging out all the time.

Right. You know, like without any fuss. Right. So there have been called in reports about this Iron Man. Sure. And Manning is then sent to investigate. They're all from Ozzy Osbourne. Right?

Ben's like good he goes to the site I was looking up Darger you know that artist yeah I was just wondering if yeah his manuscript could be turned into an animated film.

Cool. Are you going to buy the rights, Ben? Why did that occur to you? For our nascent Blank Check Pictures single? Yeah, totally. Why did that occur to me? Yeah. I don't mean this in an aggressive way.

I'm just asking. Ben's getting into the acquisition business. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm always like looking for my next hustle. IP. Ben wants to collect IP. This is the moment. Get Roger Daltrey next hustle. R&D. IP. Everyone wants to collect IP. This is the moment.

Get Roger Daltrey on board. Okay. Okay. Okay. And so, the Iron Giant is in this movie. Yeah. So, what happens then? Manning goes to the site.

Well, we have Manning. He finds the gun. A hilarious character. Yeah. Please, can we talk about him for a second? You want to know the best thing about Christopher McDonald? Sure. a hilarious character yeah please can we talk about him for a second you want to know the best thing about Christopher McDonald sure do you know that there were three

made for TV sequels to Midnight Run okay that were only about the Jack character the Robert De Niro character oh sure right

in which Christopher McDonald replaced Robert De Niro I did not know that just him as a sad bounty hunter were they on they were made for tv yeah I think USA or TNT another midnight run uh-huh midnight run around and midnight run for

your life those were the names of those uh made for tv movies that's a weird replacement for De Niro though right sure yes yeah Jack Walsh definitely a weird replacement for De Niro, though, right? Sure. Yes. Yeah, Jack Walsh. Yes. Definitely a weird replacement for De Niro. Was he doing it like De Niro, though? I don't know. He just looks like, I mean, I think he was just doing Christopher McDonald. Catching bailjumpers, Jack Walsh is the fastest in the business. Holding on to them is another story. There's nothing really wrong with a bail bondsman TV show or whatever.

There'd be plenty of stories you could do there. Or a bounty hunter or whatever. It's not like, oh, he has to team up with the Duke again. It's like, no, he's just a, once again, a bounty hunter collecting people. Well, so in The Iron Giant, his character is like

how would you... He's a pencil. Yeah, he looks like a pencil. He's got this crazy long chin. He's got John Carey head. Sure. He's Frankenstein yeah he looks like a pencil he's got this like crazy long chin he's got John Kerry head sure uh he's a parody of like a g-man he's got like a pipe and he talks and he's got a raincoat talks in this like really slick way he's got such a good voice such a good voice I also just a wonderful performance like almost all the ways he delivers his line you know when he's being like mean at first where he's like making fun of the yokels. And then his car has been like bitten in half.

So he believes in it all of a sudden. Now needs the people he was just mocking to back him up. And then the whole thing where he's visiting Hogarth's home. He's like, hey, what's Kent Mansley? We're for the government. You know, like his. Hug, hug. Yeah.

How are you doing, sport? How are you doing? Like that, like montage of him calling him for the government, you know, like his hug. Yeah. Uh, how are you doing sport? How are you doing? Like that? Like montage of him calling him all the names slick slugger. It's good acting, acting like he gives a great performance as someone who is trying to sell himself as something different than what he is. It is also,

it's one of, uh, many red haired characters in Brad Bird's movies. And I've always wanted to dig into what that's about. One of many red haired villains and such a good villain in general because like the whole movie the the crux of the ending of the movie is that he's a he makes this like sort of arrogant cowardly thing where he grabs the mic and he says blow him up like that's it he thinks it's a hero moment he dooms us all right and it's like what what a funny hero like a funny

weird not funny haha to like center your kids animated movie around yeah you know because like at the end of the movie it's basically like everyone settles down and it's like no i get it he's fine we don't have to do anything like i get I get it now. The Iron Giant's cool. And he just, like, flips out. And he's like, no! Like, he's not cool! And, like, it's just vanity and, like, closed-mindedness. Like, this, you know, the things he's trying to talk about in 50s America. When they started working on the movie, he was getting pitches all the time from Warner executives being like,

can there be a dog? The dog is the funniest part. They wanted, like, a, you know, like, a funny dog to, like, you know, be, like, a cartoon sidekick. That makes me laugh. I mean, Ben's laughing. Ben's into it.

I like that. Ben's laughing at the notion of a funny dog. Hey Ben, like what if there was like a dog? Just think about that. No, wait a second, Ben.

The dog's a little funny. It has jokes and stuff. Yeah. It's like Rover Dangerfield. I love that. They also wanted the film to be set in the present day, which is bonkers. And they wanted a hip hop soundtrack, which is hilarious. Yes, they did.

Okay. What else? Were you thinking of anything else? Those are the big ones. But a couple things happened. Okay. Sure. One is that with animation, a lot of the time spent is cracking story and making it perfect

because it's very expensive to reanimate you don't have time to figure stuff out on the fly the way you kind of can on set so animation films

usually take three or four years and the first half of that at least is just cracking the story before you even start animating and in the time

that they were working on the storyboards Quest for Camelot came out right did really badly really badly. Really badly.

And Warners were sort of going like, oh, maybe we don't want to be in the animation game. And so they shorter shut everything down and there wasn't really oversight. So they were like, look, we're going to be the last movie made under Warner Brothers Animation. We get to just do whatever we want. Right.

The struggle is we don't have time or money, but they... But no one's going to bug us. So they stopped bugging him and that is why I think this Manning character exists in such a pure form without becoming more villainous or more comical. Or more. Yes. Yes.

He is funny, but yes. In another movie, he would be a total klutz and an idiot. Yes. Or he would be a psychopath. Right. And instead he's a weak man.

You know what I mean? Like he is. Yes. You know what? We agree. He's more villainous than that. Exactly. And instead he's a weak man. You know what I mean? Like he is. Yes. You know what? We agree. He's more villainous than that. Exactly. And he is like America's America,

1950s America has worked. He's cowardly. He's quick to judgment. Yeah. He is arrogant about his own like place in the world. Um, and then of course when he gets in trouble, he's just like,

ah, fuck it. And like tries to run away. Right. Uh, he's a great character. So then the of course, when he gets in trouble, he's just like, fuck it, and tries to run away. Right. He's a great character. So then the second night, Hug-Hug goes out looking for the Iron Giant again, right? Oh, sure. We're going back to that.

Yeah, well, yeah. He meets him again. The giant finds him, tosses the switch at his feet to say, you saved me. And then he eats the railroad, so has to like fix the railroad all suddenly he's trying to get to line up just right he gets hit by the train

and like knocked all over the place so we see that he can like fix himself yeah which is so well which is awesome and then

that's when Hogarth hides him in the barn and it's such a great image when his like I love that each part of his body kind of operates like its own creature so the way like his arm will be like dragging itself each part of his body kind of operates like its own creature. So the way like his arm

will be like dragging itself along. Yeah. Like some weird kind of snake, you know? But then there's- And then his hand runs like a spider. Right, because there's that sequence later

where he's at home and he realizes the hand is stuck in the home and he's saying grace and talking to the hand at the same time. I think that's really funny. And get out of here! Satan! Do you know who designed the iron

giant joe johnston oh interesting but he was already like uh yes he was but so he just designed like the the look of the guy like he didn't he wasn't there on set every day or whatever was he he didn't animate it right yeah but but he designed the sorry joe johnston who directed honey i shrunk the kids of course the rackete. The Rocketeer. The Rocketeer. Captain America 1. Yes, but was Jurassic Park 3. A Spielberg-Lucas-y guy,

designed Boba Fett. Worked on Star Wars. Very big in the Star Wars films. Is kind of one of the best character designers in history. And Brad Bird, as a favor,

was like, look, we can't crack this sign. Can you come up with something? He also made that indie movie that was like, that launched the Welcome to the Jungle franchise. You know? You know what I mean? Remember?

Everyone knows America's most popular movie, Jumanji Welcome to the Jungle. You should talk about the prequel to Jumanji Welcome to the Jungle. Yeah, but there's this little scene prequel to it starring Robin Williams. What do they fucking do for the third movie now that Jumanji Welcome to the Jungle has become the highest grossing movie in history?

Just name, I don't know, like VR. Right, is it a fucking app now? Yeah, it's an Oculus Rift. Is it an emoji? Yeah, you're an app. I'm an app now. You go see the movie and it makes you an app. Yeah.

And says, fuck you. They've like written themselves into a bad corner where it's like, ah, everyone loves these four big stars we put in our movie. Right. Who are fictional avatars for the character right in a version that gets a fictional vintage arcade game that can't be played again that is smashed to pieces at the end of the first movie spoiler alert yes and also was it also colin hanks named his daughter after the cartoon avatar he wanted to have sex with in the movie yeah what look He did what?

David, there's one rule in life. Do you think his wife was like why'd you pick that name? And he's like, yeah, no reason. There is one rule in life. You always name your firstborn child after the person you want to have sex with most but didn't in life. Oh, I see. Always.

Okay. Always. Okay. Not creepy. Especially not for a jumanji sequel right um yeah the iron giant can we talk about that yeah so he's a perfectionist he derails the train he comes back together um and his hand goes in the house for a while but it's quickly enough hogarth reveal realizes we got a problem moves him to the barn dean's barn yes like that's that's that's that's how they meet dean he needs him to hang out in dean's barn because dean is an industrial artist who has a ton of metal in his barn right and dean buys the half-eaten tractor off of uh the crazy farmers yes uh because he wants to use it for art but isn't that why the

giant is is close to dean anyway because he sees all this metal and he's like, fucking buffet. Yes. Look at this. Yes. I'm at like a Shoney's here. I guess he hides him his own barn first because his family has a barn. Right. Right.

Isn't that when he does the scene with the comic books? Shows him Mad Magazine. And shows him Atomo. Atomo, who's a bad robot. The metal menace. No good, very bad, don't do it. And Superman. Very good. Yes, yes don't do it and Superman very good

yes yes do do it right and they talk about having a soul and choosing to do the right thing and doing the right thing

and he says I super bad and he takes a shirt off because it's a Vin Diesel and he puts an S his shirt's never been on and he puts an S on his chest

so pantsless this movie yeah which is Vin Diesel will do that in any movie. Do you know Vin Diesel has never worn pants on camera? If you see him wearing pants, it's CGI. Wow. What a fact. What a fact.

Everyone who's ever worked on a Vin Diesel movie has seen Vin Diesel's butt and penis. Vin Diesel's butt and penis? Vin Diesel's butt and penis. No, I like it without the possessive. Anyone who ever worked on a Vin Diesel movie, see Vin Diesel's butt and penis. Yeah, good. This is the worst. This is the number one worst episode, right? It's crazy.

We did it. We did it. No, this is actually a good episode when you think about it. When we think about it with distance and time? Take a break and think about it? Yeah, it's actually really good.. And when you think about it, when we think about it, when you think about it, it's actually really good. Take a break and think about it. Yeah, it's actually really good. Maybe you'll be like,

that's why we need a break. We got to loosen up. Well, I mean, we're moving quickly through the movie because it's a short, simple movie. I mean, it's not like we're like rushed for time on the movie itself.

Do you think when this episode comes out, it will bomb really hard, but then like 15 years later, everyone will accept that it's a family classic. Yeah. And episode comes out, it will bomb really hard, but then like 15 years later, everyone will accept that it's a family classic? Yeah, and then like Steven Spielberg will make another movie in which this features?

Insane. We'll get to that. No, we've talked about that. And we're going to talk about it more. No, we've talked about that. Yeah, and we're going to talk about it more. Okay, fair enough. I'm just saying,

this episode's posting in mid-May. Oh, yeah. Ready Player One is a six-week-old movie at this point okay so then never mind we're not gonna talk probably not yeah i forgot we've done a whole episode already well we haven't yet but we will in the future jesus christ wow it's like predestination you ever think about that shit like destiny versus free will yeah he definitely has of course yeah all right yeah it's like what is there to talk about i mean but but yes dean dean just talk about the things we like like the scenes we like right such a cool dude yeah it's just so good looking he's got such a great jawline he does he's got

a great jawline yeah and the smoky eyes honestly and if i lived in the 50s like being a junk artist oh yeah in like rural Maine out of all the occupations you could have yeah at that time and you got a motorcycle

yes and an espresso machine and an espresso and the hots the hots for Jay Aniston and sous-glasses he's got

nice sous-glasses sous-glasses yes sunglasses um like the two plots of the movie at this point are hogarth trying to avoid kent because kent like is living with them starts boarding right because he's like trying to solve the mystery of the metal man because he finds the hog hug gun hog hug right and so he right so he knows something's up with hogarth he's trying to

catch him and jeff riston says like, oh yeah, Hogarth's been weird lately. He keeps on talking about this giant metal man. I also love that scene where he's trying to push the hand out the window and he's making all the noises. Yeah. And they're like outside the door when they bust in. He's pretending to take a poop.

That's true. He's pretending to take one poop. All right. That did it. Now it's the worst. Now it's the number one worst. uh let's let's let's talk about one of our friends today uh you know these guys are for hims you know they're for the boys oh they're definitely so let's talk like boys for a second about a problem that 66 of men have which is that

they lose their hair by age 35 and the thing is when you start to notice hair loss it's too late yeah i don't mean to you know i don't mean to bring it up but you know you're a little thinner on top than you used to be oh yeah i've noticed and i wish i had done something sooner david well a lot of guys turn to weird solutions or they do nothing when they could turn to medicine and science to deal with this okay i'm listening so if you go to forhims.com it's a one-stop shop for hair loss for skincare for sexual wellness for men all these issues that you might be you know ignoring or not thinking about so i'm scratching my mostly bald head you are i can confirm for the listener and and so you're saying thanks to science, baldness can be optional?

Yeah, basically they connect you to real doctors with medical grade solutions to treat hair loss. There's no waiting room. There's no awkward doctor visits. You save hours. You just go to 4hims.com. So order now. Our listeners can get a trial month of HIMS

for just $5 today right now while supplies last. So you can see the website for full details. It would cost hundreds if you can see the website for full, full details. It would cost hundreds if you went to the doctor or pharmacy. So wait, do I have to go to the, like a waiting room and then like have this weird chat with the doctor and nothing. There's no doctor visits.

They ain't awkward over for him. So you just go to for him. Dot com slash check. That's F O R H I M S. Dot com slash check for him. Dot dot com slash check that's so easy and it's real easy and then like are the products are they labeled like the box is like bald dude stuff is that what it says on the box i haven't i mean just particularly seen that box but probably right i mean you know bald dude stuff or is it maybe discreet no no no i think i think

it just says in loud big letters oh no you're right i think you know what dude stuff or is it maybe discreet no no no i think i think it just says in loud big letters oh no you're right i think you know what they are discreet good now that you bring it up i think that it's just not awkward at all yeah i don't want to i don't want to be embarrassed when i go into the lobby of my apartment building pick up your bald dude stuff box yeah no yeah no it's all it's all very simple and easy and like it's just avoid all this sort of weird embarrassment of these this stuff wow all right so just making sure i got this right that's f-o-r-h-i-m-s dot com slash check yes for hymns dot com slash check cool all right back to this bad episode this is a great episode all right and then right and then the other thing is him hanging with Dean and the Iron Giant. And the kids club, yeah. And they're just being cool. They go swimming.

Nice chill friends. He does cannonball. Oh, that's a really good, fun, great, awesome, loved, best, amazing, so good part of the movie. The cannonball? Hey, Ben, I don't get it. Keep going. It's surprising. Electrify.

It leaves you wanting more. True. It is nice, fun, and friends are good part of the movie. Yes, it is nice, fun, and friends are good part of the movie. Put that on a t-shirt. The splash is so big, we just put it on a baseball cap. The splash is so big that it sends Dean into the middle of the road. Yes. And the guy goes, you're in the middle of the road.

He goes, yeah. Say it. Now I feel like I'm going to fuck up the line. Just say something else to me. It's like you're in the middle of the road and then he goes, yeah. You have to say something. How are you doing? Yeah.

It's funny. Yeah, it's funny. Yeah. Yeah, it's funny. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it is. Yeah. But somewhere around here, we're getting the order of all this shit wrong. But they're in the woods in what feels like the most Disney-ish section of the movie,

the sort of idyllic, sun-drenched forest walk where they come across a deer. And Vin Diesel is very taken by it. Sort of gets down on one knee. Likes the deer. Right. They hear people coming. Right. They hide.

Deer gets shot. Boom. It's Maine. People are hunting. And he sees this rural Maine. Dead deer there. And he tries to pick it up.

Yep. Weekend at Bernie's it with his hand. That's the the quote we did at the top of the episode where they're talking about right the will I he's it with his hand. That's the quote we did at the top of the episode where they're talking about, right, he's like, will I die or will you die?

Hogarth's pretty real in that scene. He's like, I'm going to die. I, Hogarth Hughes, will die. Yeah. They said their biggest struggle in writing was they need the scene where the Iron Giant learned about death. Sure.

And originally it was supposed to be that the Iron Giant killed the deer accidentally. Sure, sure. Sort of Frankenstein monster-esque. That was their exact notion. I don't like that. And they said the problem was when they did that scene, they couldn't believably have the Iron Giant get over it.

Yeah, right, right. It would be too upsetting if he did it himself. For the rest of the movie, he was... I think it's better this way anyway. The audience couldn't get over it. The Iron Giant as a character wouldn't forgive himself and would just be down in the dumps for the rest of the movie. No, I think also it just is stupid because I think what's more important is that he's grasping with a concept,

not like his own monstrousness. Right, and the gun thing, underlying the gun thing really... I am not a gun. I'm not a gun. Welcome to down, down Coolsville population. Us. That's something home earth says.

Uh, yes. Did you watch the, uh, signature edition or the, I did. I watched the signature edition, which has that dream,

right? Yes. That is that the only addition to the movie? It's the only thing to me that I did not remember from like the original. I think there's one other scene between dean and aniston maybe maybe it's when she's complimenting the art in the bar no no no i think it's earlier when he's back at the diner and she says i have the right to refuse service yes that wasn't in the movie i don't those are the only two that were at it yes uh yeah the dream sequence is not necessary in my

opinion they were new animated sequences 15 minutes later. And Brad Bird says... 15 years later. Yeah, sorry, 15 minutes. Brad Bird says that he doesn't consider a director's cut. He's happy with the version. He wanted the dream sequence because he thought it was a cool opportunity to do very extreme abstract expressionist imagery. Right.

And so when Warner Brothers came to him and they were like, we want to do something. Is there anything new you'd want to add in he took the opportunity but he doesn't think it's more his version of the movie with it in but I do have the signature Blu-ray so yes

my brother owns the soundtrack on vinyl my brother is a huge Brad Bird obsessive I got him into Brad Bird we saw this movie together in theaters and we would watch this and The Incredibles and Ratatouille over and over a lot yeah I got him into Brad Bird We saw this movie together In theaters And we would watch this and The Incredibles and Ratatouille Over and over a lot Yeah good movies

Good movies all And Mission Impossible Okay well now you're just fucking bragging This is you once again looking for awards It's already the worst episode Why are you trying to make it worse I think people wish we fought more Really? Are you serious why are you trying to make it worse i think people wish we thought more really yeah are you serious or are you doing another bit i don't know at this point honestly i

don't know okay iron giant has this nightmare depending on which version you watch sure in which he sees these images of himself becoming a horrible right monster yeah that's why i think you should not have that sequence because i think it's scarier when he just does it i agree yeah is the sequence then saying basically they're from like he's from somewhere else he's from somewhere else he's a weapon from space right okay and he's just a planet destroyer he's at least like a tank destroyer i mean this guy can do some damage essentially okay but when he lands on earth he gets this dent in his head yeah he's got the little bump in his head so he doesn't like remember how to work yeah okay and he uh first like shows sign of trouble when um hogarth is pretending to shoot him with his ray gun right right when they're playing by the water iron giants uh eyes go red and he shoots like a ray at him but like hogarth misses it because he's like

ducking down and then when he does it again dean like saves him so dean's the one who figures out like oh god this guy like you can't point a gun at him right he viewed it as a threat the design is so good because his face is so fucking simple and they get so much out of it it's so sweet though like that the thing early where he smiles yeah like is you you love him he's got these like big open eyes and like his face is a smile like cause his jaw is separate from the rest of his body cause that's the thing

his jaw is just a hinge and his and his jaw is in like a smile shape two big lights but then Brad Bird was like A I can have the eyes change color

right and you can have them narrow B I can give lids on the top and bottom and C I can have the jaw also work on like a Y axis in addition to an X axis so it can shift around.

You get a lot out of him. He does kind of look like Van Dazen. A little bit. And I also feel like the way his top- It's a wonderful design. He's so top-heavy. You know what I'm saying? His legs are kind of sticky.

Yes, yeah. He's a big torso with these sort of stick limbs. Yeah. I want to find the Ted Hughes drawing because it's so different. Yes. Yes. saying his legs are kind of sticky yes yeah he's a big torso with these sort of stick limbs yeah i want to find the ted hughes drawing because it's so different yes yes yes it's very odd and the animation they show in the giant stream of like the concept reel for the um townsend version is so fucking ugly it's insane sure yeah um i like the scene i before we're getting to the ending now so i just want i like the scene where hogarth drinks the espresso and goes on a crazy monologue i think elon merenthal is wonderful in this movie i do too it's such uh honest

performance like it's like it's a great kid performance that doesn't feel like so many animated kid performances which are like oh mom you know like really really over the top i i think this like when he says i love you at the end which is obviously a big line yeah like it just feels like very normal and human like not like sort of sickly or sort of over the top agree which i i think that's a big thing in this movie is that the characters never dip into caricature. Sure. It is a very character-based film

that has these sort of subtler moments to build an arc rather than having to take these huge swings at a sort of hypermanic pace. Oh, there's also that scene

where he gets in the car in the Iron Giant and spins him around. It's a lot of fun. Super cool. A lot of fun, great time. Great to have a friend who's a massive robot.

A nice space friend, you could say. Yeah. Brad Bird of fun. Super cool. A lot of fun. Great to have a friend who's a massive robot. A nice space friend. You could say, um, Brad Bird animated the coffee scene himself. Oh really? He said he always likes to animate one scene himself. So he remembers what, you know,

he gets back in the thick of it. Right. And he said like, that was the scene that if I was working on a movie, I would have died to get assigned because it's all performance. Sure. It's all comedy through behavior and physicality. Yeah.

And it's like fucking, it's great. It's great. It's great. But there's the scene around then, I guess, when they think they figured it out where the giant is, tracked it back to Dean's. Right. Kurt Kent's on the trail.

Manning. And they pretend that they are in Giants' culture. Now this is very funny comedy. Kent Mansley. But you're right. Where they're like, show us what's in the barn. What's in the barn, Dean? I've been saying the wrong name the entire

episode. No, you just said it wrong one time. I thought I said Manning the whole time. No, I think you should have been saying Mansley. Kent Mansley. You should have been saying Mansley. You've been saying Mansley. Are you sure we don't have to re-record the whole episode? I've been calling her Crandall! That's one of my favorite Simpsons lines. Miss Krabappel, I've been

calling her Crandall! Did you read, this will be... Such a weird line. 17 years old by the time this episode comes out, but I read the New York Magazine interview with Zach Galifianakis the other day. No, I haven't read it. He was like, you know, I'm happy with my career now. I don't need to do these big movies. I'm happy just making

buckets. Sure. He says buckets. And like whoever the interviewer is said like, I was trying to figure out if he knew he made a mistake and then he just looked back at me and said, that's what my parents think it's called. Season four of buckets season three three i think but even so that he's gotten three seasons out of that is crazy love that show it's a great show but like i think like eight people yeah that's a real blank check it's like galifianakis's parents you me maybe zach

i don't think his parents watch it i don't't know what it's fucking called. Fair enough. It's so good, that show. It is great. So, they pretend the Iron Giant is art. Yeah. And Aniston comes in and goes like, you know, I'm not crazy about that piece. It feels like those scraps you put over, like, his limbs. It feels a little less intentional than some of your other stuff. So, she's kind of got an eye for what he's doing. Right.

And he's got an eye for her. Right. And she's also got an eye for what he's doing. Right. He's got an eye for her. Right. And she's also got an eye for him. As do I. Yeah. I've got an eye for Harry Connick Jr. in this movie. She wants him to let the squirrel out of his fly if he catches my giraffe. Sure.

Excuse me. Worst episode ever. Number one worst. So bad. We're going to win a razzie yep the sponsors are gonna call us and be like how could you put our names on that thing good thing the sponsor is the razzie's oh that's another perfect simpsons line yeah that's not the image you want with long for long john sil's murderous pirate. Let's just do Simpsons lines now.

I mean, Bird worked on The Simpsons. Yes. So then when does Mansley get his... He's putting me on track. No, Mansley what? When does he get his proof where he's able to call it? Because he calls his superior early on in the film, played by... John Mahoney. Yeah, he gets the picture.

He finds the camera. Right right but early on he's like he calls him and the guy's laughing and i'm basically saying like yeah give me a footprint right you know i can get you a scientist i can't go off of a feeling if you give me a picture or like you know a piece of the guy then we can send in some army troops because yeah this this film is about sort of like atomic age fears yes you see those cartoons of the duck and duck and cover drills are so good which are so good and like it's crazy to think that like my mom went through those when they were like it's fine just get under your desk like if we get you nuked in utica new york you know like there's that great moment at the end where he's

like that's not gonna help anything yeah well that's i love that it's not just like an aside right where they're like that's it that's it and and even like harry connor you know even dean like the mom's like should we go to a shelter and he's like won't matter we're fucked yeah we're gonna die i mean imagine if america nuked a town in maine by mistake almost happened if not for a very nice dry that's true um but he finally gets the photograph uh he gets the photograph um and uh i think but it's he's not the one who exposes it it's just that um the giant saves the kid well right it's like after dean like tells the giant to get out of there when he's shooting the ray gun at um hogarth and the giant like runs away right there when he's shooting the ray gun at Hogarth and the giant runs away. Right. Is that after they've disguised

him as the sculpture? Yes. Okay. And he runs into town and saves the boys. He sees the kids hanging off the side of the building. And so the townspeople are like, oh, great. But then Kent is like, blow him up. Right. The military is already there. And that's when the giant starts just automatically

wiping them all out, which is also awesome when he's shooting fucking raid. And all his weapons are different. The one that makes the weird energy ball, that's cool. Can I do a merchandise spotlight? Or the one that's like like that. It's like a spinning disc. Yeah, it's cool. Can I do

a merchandise spotlight? Yeah. I had an Iron Giant action figure from when this movie came out. They did make merchandise that then became super fucking valuable because it wasn't produced in very large quantities, and the movie bombed, and then like five, six years later when it was beloved, people wanted to go back and get it. It's hard to get your hands on.

And I had an Iron Giant that turned into the Bad Giant. Oh. He pushed his head down. The chest opened up. Bad giant boy. Bad giant. His hands could turn into guns. Came with a little mansly. He's big.

He's bad. Well, it was little. I mean, it was a toy. Okay. Yeah. But could I get like a foot tall iron giant? That one is super, super valuable. Oh, really?

There was a crazy big one they made that came with all the supporting characters human size you got dean you got hogarth it was like i don't know like 14 18 inches tall and it came with scrap metal that he could eat cool came some cars and stuff that he could eat and talk it had the voice of vinnie d limited hard to come by mondo the company that does all the posters and the vinyl releases. Yeah, I'm looking at it right now. They have recently released this new $300. That's $300, yeah.

But that's like the cheap version of the thing you're talking about? Well, I think the original one probably goes for that amount now on the secondary market. At the time of its release, it probably went for like $40 or $50. The Mondo is like the high-end adult version. I have heard it is very fragile i've debated buying it a couple times it's i've debated buying a 300 toy as i've said i'm a blue collar toy collector i don't like to get

these fucking upper crust right caviar and wine toys right i debated it my great friend derrick simon i almost got to him for him for his wedding and he told me that he thought his wife would divorce him if he received that as a wedding divorce right yes what did you get him instead like a bottle of wine or something i don't know yeah you just got a two-pour son dvd hbo's divorce i got him the first season of divorce i bought him a season pass on itunes that's actually kind of a funny gift to give someone it'd be good yeah Yeah. That's good. Hey, you guys out there, you can use that.

Can I say something? Spring for the Blu-ray. Okay? It's a wedding. You know, at least do him the kindness of improved picture quality. I love how we keep finding worse things to do. I think the 10 worst bits we've ever done are on this episode and we keep on eating them.

Great app. Great app. Um, but he had told me that he was reticent. I had offered to buy it for him. He said, we're still on the wedding present story because he had coworkers who had it and they said it was so fragile.

It was, they didn't even want to, you know, touch it. Yeah. I mean, that would annoy the shit out of me. Yeah.

I want it to be robust. Yeah. I want a robust giant. I mean, he's a fucking giant. Like I don't want to you know touch it yeah i mean that would annoy the shit out of me yeah i want it to be robust yeah i want a robust giant i mean he's a fucking giant like i don't want to be fragile uh yeah they'd shoot in this showdown the tank shoot at him and it's like nothing yeah he's like forget it so he's tassing out his eyes are red he's got fucking gun arms and dean's like screaming like he only reacts if you shoot at him. Stop shooting. He's like, go fuck yourself. Yeah. And the general's into it. And then. Our boy, Hog Hog.

Yeah. He gets knocked out. Runs up to the front. Yeah. He runs up to him to try and calm him down. He gets knocked out. Giant looks at this. He's a deer situation.

Yeah. And he's like, you killed him. And that's when his little head bump goes away. And he just turns into like the metal man what do you call it right Atamo like basically and he like almost blows up

a battleship and he only stops because like Hogarth wakes up yeah and pleads to him yes I wonder if I can find the line it's bad to kill guns kill and you don't have to be a gun you are what you choose to be you choose choose no one should be a gun you don't have to be a gun you don't have to be a gun it's so good you don't have this is where i just start

like uncontrollably crying basically and then the rest for the rest like the next 10 minutes whatever's left yeah uh so he turns back and he chills out the boy's alive the general's like all right everyone chill out this was a weird thursday but i can move on with my life at this and then ken as i already described grabs the mind says not to nuke he's like you fucking moron it's really funny i love john mahoney's really funny where he's like, where's the nuke going, Kent? It's targeted on the giant. Where's the giant? Kent?

And Kent's like, sorry? He's like, Gilly? Gilly, Kent? Sorry? Remember when we went from doing our own bad bits to stealing bad bits from other people?

Yeah. Great. So then Kent demands Remember when we went from doing our own bad bits to stealing bad bits from other people? Great. So then Kent demands more cowbell and... They're all going to die. They're all going to die and the giant realizes what he has to do. He thinks of the image of Superman. Yes. Flying to save the people.

Right. And he flies up into the sky. Yes. Before he does that, doesn't he say something to... He says, smell you later. Is that right? Is that something nice to Hogarth, right? Yeah, I'm trying to find the exact... Yeah, right.

I go, you stay, no following. It's a repeat of something they said earlier right it's kind of the i fix as well he like looks up and he goes i fix which i love it's the inverse of the the wreck it ralph ending bang because at the end wreck it ralph he's flying down with his fist saying it's okay that i'm bad and iron giant's flying up with his fist saying i I want to be good. Sure. It's about a bad boy realizing he's good and a good boy realizing he's bad. And both of them have to punch a thing in a direction. Both are great movies.

Both have good ends. Yeah. Yeah. And both are about big thing, big people. Yeah. Friends with little people. But the giant's bigger. And that's okay.

Because again, the big people are represented and you should have little people represented. Oh, interesting. oh interesting so you like well it's good to have both because then you can tell how big the people because that's the thing if everyone's big then it doesn't it doesn't look like doesn't look like there's no scale yeah sure right sure um but yeah he flies up he's superman i'm like like at even like whenever i saw this movie in theaters like at 13 like i'm, uncontrollably sobbing. Right. Right? I mean, how do you feel about this? I see.

I don't cry at this movie. This movie is just, like, an auto-trigger for me. I find this movie just kind of, like, perfect. It is perfect. It doesn't rile me up that much emotionally other than the very end. Like, you mean the ending ending? Yeah. Because after he blows up and saves the town, one, Dean builds a really nice statue for him.

Good statue. And hey, good commission for Dean. True. Two, Dean builds a really nice marriage. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah? With Annie?

Mm-hmm. They build a nice marriage together. Hogarth has friends now, which, like, I don't even care about that. Right. I don't need him to have friends. He's awesome. He has friends with a giant. Who are even care about that right I don't even have friends he's awesome he's friends with a giant who are these fucking dicks

are they giants don't look like it they're little they probably eat their own boogers probably that's actually pretty cool yeah that is cool what if we tried to make

booger eating popular in 2018 what if we just start passively referencing booger eating as if we all like they eat their own boogers which is cool anyway We should start passively referencing booger eating as if we all like it. They eat their own boogers, which is cool.

Anyway. Other than I was hanging out eating some bugs. What if we instead they were called, them being called blankies, everyone had to be called booger eaters? What if we opened an artisanal booger bar in Brooklyn? That's a good idea. That's just a business idea brooklyn that's a good idea that's just a business idea that's just a good business that's just good business good business good business we gotta get into the booger business the booger biz all right yeah we actually because we're going to want to

talk about the reaction of this movie so let's i mean the the end of the movie is lovely it's uh he's got the screw that's the one piece they have. Which is a cool, just so cool. And Mondo made that too, which is cool. I've always wanted to get the screw when it lights up. That's a good idea. Yeah, it's like a desk ornament of the screw. And then, yeah, one night he wakes up and the screw is like rattling around. Clinking on the window. It's tapping the window. And he realized what is, and the music starts to swell

and you see it rolling and rolling. And I love that it's like he's in fucking like Antarctica. Iceland. He's in Iceland. He's on a glacier in Iceland. And you slowly see him piecing together. When that happens, I get tingled. It's so good. And the last shot is like his big smile on the head.

One big tracking shot that goes through like the winds in the wilderness. It's great. Until it gets to his head lighting up and the eyes open up. And he's a very nice robot. And he's going to come back and have nice fun adventures. And he's great. He learned he wasn't a gun. And I like that he doesn't come back to Hogarth. Like obviously their intention wasn't to make a sequel. And there's going to come back and have nice, fun adventures. And he's great. He learned he wasn't a gun. And I like that he doesn't come back to Hogarth.

Like, obviously, their intention wasn't to make a sequel. And there's no sequel. Yeah. But it's also like, he's just going to go on being good in different places now. Maybe. Or maybe he'll go back to Hogarth and, like, open a booger store. We don't know. Imagine those boogers.

So this movie. Look at the huge. This guy's booger, it's probably a steel bookshelf. You know what I'm saying? It's so big, it's like... Did they release a steel book of this movie? They have. Do you have it?

Mondo made it. I don't have it. I think it was only in the UK. Wow. Well, this movie was popular in the UK. Really? I don't know if it was like... I mean, this movie wasn't popular anywhere.

It was not a big hit. So they're making it... Warner Brothers is kind of ignoring it. They think it might get dumped. They wouldn't give them a release date, which is nuts. I can't even imagine that. Because they were like, we don't want to be in the animation business.

I don't know. I know, but it's so crazy to me. It's like the way the movie business works now where it's like three years out. You're like, we'll come out that. That's when we're coming out. And especially in this era, it was all about your partnerships, your merchandising deals, your licensing deals, your cross promotional things. It was like you didn't seem like a legitimate kids movie if you weren't at Burger King or McDonald's.

Right. If you weren't on cereal boxes. And it wasn't just the money you would get from those licensing agreements. It was also like it gave you a stamp of approval of like this is a real thing because it's in every

fucking store. And those things take years to set up. Right. And so they didn't have any of that in place. No tie in.

Alison Abedi who is the producer of this movie who speaks very openly about what difficult times she had working with Brad Bird which he includes in the documentary that he

approved of which I give him points for being like, I will let people say bad things about me. She said she went to the licensing fair and they were showing clips. Everyone was like, this is great. When's it coming out? And she was like, I don't know. And then they just leave because they couldn't make a deal. One of the animators leaks a

VHS work print, unfinished, including storyboards and a lot of uncolored sequences to Drew McQueenie from Ain't It Cool, a time when they were real needle movers. And he, having known of Brad Bird and his reputation, puts it on and writes, this is one of the great American animated films ever. This is an American masterpiece. And Warner Brothers goes, oh, they're kind of shamed about it. Brad Bird was angry that it had leaked out but it finally got them to pay attention.

So they do a test screening. They get A+. They get the best scores Warner Brothers got in 15 years. According to Brad Bird. Warner Brothers now gets really bullish on the movie and they go, oh, cool. We'll release this in five months. Right. With no lead time to be able to put together a proper campaign. Right. So they did have this limited

run of toys that I guess they had put in place from when they didn't know when they were going to get released. But then their only other cross promotion is they have a deal at Johnny Rockets. Hey, love a Johnny Rocket. I heard it tells the story about driving around opening weekend at Johnny Rockets and none of them had put the poster up. And the giveaway

was they didn't have toys, you got a cassette that had Looking, which is the song they play when mansley is looking for the giant great just like an old like r&b song that was the tie-in you got a cassette like a single and uh you know they they didn't have like proper advertising they only had one poster which was the teaser poster they have on the blu-ray the tv ad which was on august 9th get ready for a whole new kind of heavy metal and it's literally playing like generic license-free hard rock as it shots of him like eating stuff that's weird the iron giant that's very strange

movie comes out in a crazy loaded box office weekend we we've already talked about. We'll see if I can remember it. Yeah. It comes out the same weekend as The Sixth Sense. Right. August 6th. Bombs. Just flatlines. 1999. Yes. And stuff. It comes out to 5.7 million dollars. According to this thing I'm reading right now, the studio wanted an 8 million

dollar opening weekend. It couldn't even get that. I know. And it grosses 23 million in the US, which is far less than dollar opening weekend. It couldn't even get that. I know. And it grosses $23 million in the US, which is far less than its budget. Yes. It is a bomb. And look, under different

circumstances, his career probably would have been over. At the very best, he would have been like, hey, Brad, it's your agent. I got a great offer for you. They'll let you co-direct the Wild Thornberrys movie. He could have just been a steady hand brought in. Yes, but the film is critically acclaimed. It's not just a movie that people discovered later.

It got great reviews. As you say, it tested well. People won critics awards for animated feature. It was a well-regarded movie. But animation's at a weird fulcrum point. Yeah. Because all the other studios doing traditional 2D animation are all shuddering. Yep.

Disney has already pushed Bird out the door. Yep. And he probably would have been kind of boned if not for some old classmates of his who had started an independent animation studio across town. But he needs to accept that he needs to make a 3D movie, which I think he was reticent to do. We'll talk about that next episode. When he first went to them, he said,

I got two scripts for you, Ray Gunn or The Incredibles. And they picked Incredibles. So it's always lingered as a possibility that he could make Ray Gunn at Pixar. I want to see it so badly. Me too. I'd love him to. By all accounts, one of the great unproduced screenplays. I mean, could Pixar

make a movie for adults? We'll talk about this. That's interesting. Is that a thing that's going to happen? We will talk about this. Because another thing that very nearly happened, Brad Bird almost made a live action Pixar movie. What was it? The 1906. 1906, right.

1900 to the other movie. Yeah. I think it? The 1906. 1906, right. Yes. Interesting. 1900 to the other movie. Yeah. I think it could happen. We'll talk about this in future episodes. Yeah. But yeah, I mean,

the movie, like, even at the time, the reviews were like, why isn't this working? Why are they dumping this? And I feel like it built up a reputation super fast. Yeah.

Like super, super fast and it's just grown and grown and grown and grown and grown. And of course, it's part of that magical Hollywood year of 1999 where all these amazing movies came out. Toy Story 2. Yes. Were there other movies in 1999?

No. Can you tell me the box office? Okay, so for- August 6th, 1999. Okay, I can tell you what all the new releases are. Five new releases. And I can tell you all five. Yeah. They were The Sixth Sense 1999. Okay. I can tell you what all the new releases are. Five new releases. And I can tell you all five. Yeah.

They were The Sixth Sense. Number one. Iron Giant. Sure. I'm not going in order here. No, you're not. Number nine. Mystery Men.

Number six. Dick. Number 12. Which is brutal. Such a good movie. And then the other one Opens at number 4 Opens at number 4

It's a remake It's a remake Thomas Crown Affair Thomas Crown Affair Great movie Lingered Thomas Crown Affair Directed by John McTernan

Joining the Century Club Didn't I? Uh no Made 70 Not bad Did okay Good movie So number 1 is The Sixth Sense

Number 4 is Is The Sixth Sense yeah Unass is The Sixth Sense, yeah. Unassuming opening weekend becomes one of the ten highest grossing films. Well, a good opening weekend. 26 million is pretty good. It's healthy, yeah. That's like what a booger eater is looking for. Yeah.

Good. Thomas Crown is four. Number two is one of the hugest movies of 1999. Phantom Menace? No. Blair Witch Project? Correct. Phantom Menace is number 11.

It's been a long time. Jeez. Can you imagine being Dick and being like, we're behind the Phantom Menace? The Phantom Menace in its 12th week. Everyone's been dunking on it for three months and we're still coming in behind it. Number three, we've talked about it. Classic comedy duo. Mickey Blue Eyes?

No. Is it in the 10? Mickey Blue blue eyes which is a terrible movie i think it maybe comes out the following weekend yes i mean no grant and con obviously a classic triple horn trio they were the next uh marks they call them the triple horn okay classic comedy duo 1999 bowfinger No Man and a Woman Man and a Woman Yep Classic rom-com duo

I suppose you could call them Oh oh right It's Runaway Brad Yes Geeran Roberts Yeah And number five at the box office Is a

An action Film With something That Donald Trump does not like. Deep Blue Sea. That's right. What doesn't he like? Sharks.

Yeah. He also doesn't like introspection. Yes. His own mortality. Living in the real world. Thinking about what he's done. Being nice to people. Raising good children.

Having a conscience. All right. Yeah, you've also got Inspector Gadget, which I am on the record as saying they should reboot starring Griffin Newman. That is an on the record. David Sims prediction that they're going to reboot

Inspector Gadget starring Griffin Newman. I mean, yeah, I'd crush that shit. No question. You'd crush the shit out of it would it be no inspector gadget okay i appreciate it it's been a while like we can reboot inspector gadget and i just want to remind everyone i just want to remind everyone matthew broderick hits someone in ireland with the car murders Murders. Murdered. Dead. Dead. Just want to remind people because we seem to forget. And I'll say this. I have never murdered anyone with a car because I don't even have a license. Yeah.

So don't get behind the wheel of a car. You might murder someone. Yeah. Why do you think I've avoided getting that license? I don't want to be a new Maddie Bro. Well, I don't want to get a good career. Yeah. I'm trying to avoid that.

Clearly. That's the whole point. Recording episodes like this, that's how you avoid a career yeah trying to torpedo baby so let me just reiterate here are the Griffin Newman passion projects that we're trying to push into development at Blanchack Pictures Midnight Run remake

sure Naked Children Griffin Gal what is that? Griffin Gal in Midnight Run Newman naked children griff and gal what is that griff and gal griff and gal in midnight run okay newman good note

midnight run origins midnight run directed by paul thomas anderson midnight run forbidden kingdom right what's the naked baby thing what's that it's an animated

darger oh right yeah right we got that we got the esther zuckerman biopics we got the buzzed we got theopics. We got the buzzed. We got the buzz. Fuck, we do have the buzz.

Yeah. Inspector Gadget Reboot is probably just called Gadget. Yeah, or Go Go Gadget. Drop the Inspector. It's cleaner. You know what's cool? Inspector Gadget. Yeah. Cool. Good slate. Get ready for those pictures coming out.

I just want to say guys it's a great episode that we just did i mean i think honestly maybe the best one i think we did a great job leave your uh please remember to leave your comment on the episode well don't step on my well i realized i was going to so instead i said that weird clunky thing that i just said okay well i would like to ask our listeners to please remember to rate, review, and subscribe. Hey, maybe this time around we should start

reading them again. Remember how we read the reviews to get people to actually do them? You know what we should do right here? Because we were going to do it for months? Burger? We should take a call from the Burger Report hotline. Oh, yeah. Good call. So let's place that in. Thank you for calling the Burger Report hotline. Oh, yeah. Good call. So let's place that in. Do-do-do-do-do-do-do. Thank you for calling the Burger Report hotline.

802-8-BURGER. Please leave a message with your FAMO type of burger and location, and we will try to put it on the podcast if we can. That's 802-8-BURGER. Hi, my name is Erin, a long-time listener, first-time caller. I'm sure you haven't gotten that joke before. I would like to phone a burger report from Los Angeles, California, City of Angels.

I was at Shake Shack in West Hollywood with the David 2 by Griffin. And hot off the heels of the Dawson's Creek GW Reunion Edition, I saw Kerr Smith. I'm not sure exactly what he ordered, but I did hear them calling his name Kerr, and he did have, I'm not sure if it was a burger or fried chicken sandwich, but it was something in that form. He was with somebody else. Looked like they were having a nice time. He looked very handsome and gray, and that was my burger report. Looked like they were having a nice time. He looked very handsome and gray.

And that was my burger report. Pretty random, but wanted to phone it in. Thanks, guys. Cool. Oh, thank you so much for that call. What a good scoop. You want me to find a review, Ben? I know what you mean.

Like, it was fun when we did that. I just think it's good. Yeah. Get, like, people to leave reviews again i mean so like here's a here's a great review right from um i want to get this right one eight four nine four nine nine two nine one dollar sign four question mark semicolons nine dash oh three subject so okay review who are your guys that's a good example yes did you see that a blankie tweeted at i believe it was brandon mcdonald producer of wtf asking yeah uh when the damon wayne story was first mentioned and he said i can't remember pretty sure it came up a number of times though because you've always accused me of focusing latching onto this one moment that was isolated and i have always protested no he in fact told

this story many times right so at least i've been confirmed in that oh here's a good review um bad one star okay so this is from a sith lord uh dandelion mayday so darth dandelion mayday not allowed to listen to podcasts anymore right they think they are funny and smart dot dot dot sigh dot dot dot well why bring the singer gangnam style into this review okay you did it thank you you found the worst thing i saved it i saved the episode rate review subscribe thanks to andrew gudo for our social media. Lane Montgomery for our theme song. Thanks to Pat Reynolds and Joe Bowen for our artwork. And go to blankies.reddit.com for some real nerdy shit that is increasingly bordering on creepy. Manic. I logged this movie on Letterboxd

Within a minute they had it Someone's getting like alerts So I've been logging a lot of other shit to throw them off the scent I'm not gonna Log any of the bird movies We can't shit on those people I'm cutting this out Hey they're great friends I think they'll enjoy just being talked about Ben

I think so too And thank you to Brooklyn and Casper and Hems for sponsoring the show. And, and as always, hey, treat yourself nice. Get yourself a bug.

That's the worst. Eat a bug. It's the worst. Pretty good. So everyone makes the joke about the fact that Goofy's a dog and then pluto's a dog right right yeah they're both dogs but one is a dog and one of them's like a person

so is pluto just like a mentally challenged dog that they torture by carrying around on a leash they torture him they're like get on the fucking ground but we're putting a leash on your neck but that doesn't make sense no no no i'm saying it doesn't make sense. Why? No, no, no. I'm saying it doesn't make sense. I'm not saying your thing doesn't make sense. Yes, thank you. But does Pluto usually have a leash? He's just sort of running around, isn't he?

He's got a collar. He doesn't have a collar. Sometimes he's got a leash. He's always on the floor. They make him sleep in a house, a little dog house out back. But do he- Goofy has to sleep in a fucking bed. Do he and Goofy interact?

Yeah, all the time. And Goofy goes, no, your fucking place. All right.