Blocks w/ Neal Brennan - Jordan Klepper

Episode Date: April 30, 2026

Neal Brennan interviews Jordan Klepper (Daily Show, "Fingers the Pulse") on the Blocks Podcast about the true nature of MAGA, what he witnessed in Washington D.C. on January 6, how the American attitude toward shamelessness and hypocrisy has shifted since Trump's rise to power, using his improv background in field pieces, taking a Trump supporter to a Kamala rally, interviewing a guy who pleaded guilty to punching a cop on January 6 but still believed it was an inside job, what he learned from Jon Stewart & Trevor Noah, hosting his own show and how it affected his nervous system, becoming a parent, his drift from Hitchens-era smug atheist certainty back to agnosticism, Dominos vs. Papa Johns on the road, connecting flights, Camus and philosophy, and being smug. 00:00 Neal & Matthew McConaughey's Shininess 1:40 Jordan Klepper Fingers the Pulse 3:00 Road life 8:15 Field pieces with Jon vs. Trevor 10:32 MAGA 13:10 January 6 18:54 Trump's superpower 20:40 Ad Break: Ultra Nuro Pouches 22:58 Ad Break: Zocdoc 25:25 Interviewing approach 30:24 Bringing a Trump fan to a Kamala rally 32:43 January 6 41:27 Ad Break: Harry's 43:37 Ad Break: Mando 45:44 Math vs. Comedy Brain 54:05 Marriage & Parenthood 1:06:30 Religion, Atheism & Agnosticism 1:26:36 Information overload 1:30 Jon Stewart & Trevor Noah Thanks to our sponsors! Don't sleep on  @UltraPouches  . New customers get 15% Off with code NEAL at https://www.takeultra.com ! #ultrapouches #ad Stop putting off those doctors appointments and go to https://www.Zocdoc.com/NEAL to instantly book a doctor you love today. Our listeners get the Harry's Plus Trial Set for only $10 at https://www.Harrys.com/NEAL #Harryspod Control Body Odor ANYWHERE with @shop.mando and get 20% off with promo code NEAL at https://www.shopmando.com ! #mandopod Live Better Longer with BUBS Naturals. For a limited time get 20% Off your entire order with code NEAL at https://www.Bubsnaturals.com ---------------------------------------------------------- Follow Neal Brennan: https://www.instagram.com/nealbrennan https://twitter.com/nealbrennan https://www.tiktok.com/@mrnealbrennan Watch Neal Brennan: Crazy Good on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81728557 Watch Neal Brennan: Blocks on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81036234 Theme music by Electric Guest (unreleased). Edited by Will Hagle ---------------------------------------------------------- Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Here we go. Do I have to promo? I don't have to promo anything with you, right? You don't have to. I got some shows I'm doing it on the road, but they go to my website. If you want to put... This fucking guy, it's a real regular. Watch the daily show, you know? Support linear television. Watch it at 11 o'clock at night. Would you shut up?

Guys, you're not even gonna... Guys, I knew of intro with you here. I know, I am. A lot of... Maddie McConae was on here. He patted himself down, brought his own padding. Yeah. We kind of give it a time to kill feel. Extra sweat on that. Yeah, a little sweaty.

I like to shine because it gives it a sense of urgency. Like I'm, like, I'm, like, I'm, like, it's frantic. With you or the audience, it's like, I need to switch to audio only. Is that that the kind of... Well, they know that this is urgent. This is, I'm trying to diffuse a bomb over here. I'm going to get a close-up of a sweat gland, a sweat droplet coming down to my... This is a...

I haven't even done the intro one time, uh, intro for this episode. I'll give you a little anecdote. When are we starting? This is gone off the rails before he even got on the rails. One time I was pitching a movie with Mike Scher. The year was 1999. Mike Scher's gone on to create a lot of shows you like Parks and Rec, whatever. Pitching a movie, it's not going well.

Okay? And it was Scher's turn to talk and he's, and I, and I, like, did a zoom in with my eyes and he just had one droplet of sweat coming down his, then sure we'll confirm that. I'm sure he watches the show if not every episode every other one. Guys, my guest today is

a stalwart daily show correspondent. So you're saying JFK Jr. is still alive and spending his time in the background at Trump rally. Yes. And hosts. They're all hosts. They're all player coaches now.

Comedy Central said, why make a decision? If we name one of them the hosts, we have to pay them host money. If we keep them all as correspondence, they get correspondence money. Is it a bump? Yeah, it's a bump, but it's probably not great. Although this guy, I feel like because he came from a position of power, he started doing field pieces called Jordan Klepper Fingers the Pulse. At one point, I watched one early on and said, you should close everyone by saying, I'm Jordan Klepper and you just got fingered. He didn't go for it. I still think it's a good idea.

And he's a, he's a very good host of the show. He's a very, these, these, these finger the pulses, are they still called Franglinger pulse? They're still called Fingham the Pulse. They get millions of hits. Now, having said that, he has to take at least two flights to every place he shoots in. There is no direct flights. He is not filming in places anyone wants to go directly. Does he go to Charlotte a lot for a lot for a lot?

connection he does Atlanta you betcha Dallas yes anyone anything I'm missing Chicago probably I don't stay at any of those places no these are he then he stays the airport connects to a flight through Atlanta yep or even driving so deep into Pennsylvania which is a one-day drive but there's still a layover because time works differently when you're driving to the middle of nowhere Pennsylvania it really does doesn't it has your diet on the road terrible you know yeah I have gout and so literally and literally have gout Literally?

This is what happens. This is all like, oh, it's glamorous. This is, this is, this guy's paying the price. This guy's paying the cost to be the boss. Oh, yes. This is, when you live in weird airports across the country. Yeah. What's a good restaurant?

When you see. On the road, you're always rooting for a Panera. Okay. Panera's going to give you the best options. Why? You get a bacon turkey bravo at a Panera. Okay. So, bacon.

Well, bacon's not great for the gout. No. But you're not getting burgers. You're not getting fried chicken. You're not getting French fries. You have an option for a salad. You never take it. No, you know.

So you're hoping. You get the soup and you throw it away. You throw the soup away. They offer you the bread, the apple. And if your friend's not looking, you take the bread. Yeah. You always take the bread. You're, moreover the night, you're getting Arbys.

You're getting McDonald's. You're getting that. It's what I try to do. My healthy move at these hotels usually is you just try not to eat and then you splurge on a late night dominoes or Papa Johns. Papa John's. Domino's. Domino's better. I think so.

Are there more dominoes in general than Papa John's? I believe there are. Papa John's, you dip in butter? You dip in butter. They have the garlic sauce. You dip that in butter. On the road, you know, coming from New York, I expect, you know, we have long days of shooting or what have you, and you're like, oh, I'll get some food late at night.

Everything shuts at about 8.30. Yeah. Yeah, 830 in America. Except for domino's. It's soul crushing. when you've been working and you go to and you're like and then you see them you go to the restaurant and you see them doing ketchup wiping things down and you're like I don't are you when I do when I do like stand-up shows or storytelling or what I yeah I don't eat at all there's just no the timing never works

yeah it's like oh it's do you want food before I don't want to eat before yeah you get out at 930 I'm like oh everything everything is closed yeah you got nuts do you eat nuts I mean honestly you end up you end up almonds you're not you're not nuts you end up almonds you You raid that Hilton thing, which gives you, like, ice cream, like, microwave burritos. What's the Hilton thing? The club? Or, like, no. Oh, God, no.

No, like, you walk in there and behind the guy at the desk. Oh, right. Right, right. You're probably a member of the club and they'll give you one free item. I don't like you money at them. No. Oh. I'm one of those guys.

That every time. You're from the Bill Burr school. Bill Burr once screamed at me about this. That they're going to use it against you somehow. I mean, screaming at me. I think they're already using it against you. You're not a reliance on going to Hilton's. Yeah, but if I can get something in return, I feel like I'm very cheap.

So I'm very like I'm going to use the mile. They're not, trust me, these miles are not expiring. Look at me. They're not where I'm, I will stay alive to use these miles. To use them continuously? I mean, I have friends who will never touch them because they have some vague idea of a wild trip 10 years. Yes. No, I use them. I've used, I, I, family, flights, hotels, stuff like that. It's they get used. Yeah. Somebody's using it. I cash mine out every like six months.

Catch my money. Okay. That I do. You cash or you use them? No, I use them. Okay. Yeah, I go, I go back down to zero. Every year, I usually use them for some sort of. What's your highest membership? I think I'm, I think I'm platinum now. For Hilton? Delta. No, see, the hotel I'm about to be, guys, your boy's about to be diamond on Is that right? Yeah. What is that? There's a weird HQ or a TQ's you have to get?

You've seen the circle. Yeah, it's, I did it with, I did it with cash. I don't, I haven't, I've gotten like three flights for $40,000. Like, so I've really, I've been having to go to Europe a lot and it's not been, it's been, it's been, thank you to my sponsors. Better help, thank you, rag and bone, some of the others. Tushy, of course. That's Tushy's, I don't know if they're still around, but.

You got a ragged bone, that's a high end. That's nice. Thank you. That's a lot of trust. They've done like four ads. This is a ragamone shirt. I was gonna say, that's like a, that, that, that confers a stylish attitude. I know.

I know. Gerard Carmichael once referred to Ragamone as showrunner clothes, which is, he, I think it was a diss, but it was, it was a great, it was great. Anyhow, so are you, okay, so you were, you were like, you were at the, you were at the The way it works the Daily Show, it's a bit of a, not a sink or swim thing, but it's a bit of like, hey, you know, if you have any ideas, pitch them. If we have ideas, we'll make you do them. Yeah. And so when did the fingers of the pulse start working?

I was, when I got in, I got in like a year and a half before John left the first time, the first leaving time. And at that point, this is why I'm saying John's leaving. John, no, that's not. No, no, no. He learned, no, John learned his lesson. He's not leaving it. Nobody's leaving any late jobs. Yes, that is correct.

At the time, I took over John Oliver. I mean, they're going to get, all get canceled. What have you heard? Have you heard stuff? They're all going to get canceled, but they're not leaving them. They're going to leave them, but it's not going to be it. They're not going to quit. No, we are, you're going to have to J6 us out of them.

We are in it. When I took over, John Oliver had left, I took over essentially his position. And at that point, like, Sam B. Jason Jones were there. People have been there for a long time, Jessica Williams, and I was the hungry one. So they were throwing me out on everything. And so I was already doing it. And you really were like, I'll go anywhere. Of course. I was the dream job. I love doing the field pieces. I felt I'm coming, I came from an improv background. So field stuff was always most playful. And I would do man on the street. Then after John left, you know, Trevor came in and that

as Trump was taking over and things were all shipping. There were, there were, there were, any political season, there's more man on the street, more events like that. Yeah. And we're also sort of looking for like ways to brand, niche and what have you. And I was like going to these rallies. And also, Trevor was very loose about what he wanted from like field pieces. In the John days, some of the field pieces, which was the aesthetic, it was also sort of John's purview. Like, you had a clear idea of what you were going to get before you walked out the door. Yeah.

There's space for serendipity. But you sort of knew like, this take. It was kind of written. It was like, I know, yeah. I know that we're talking to these people. We pre-interviewed. And so just straight man on. the street we really did that at the show at that time and Trevor came in and was sort of like

go go with god and also this was the this was the maga world for suddenly it's like what is going there we just have questions go we still don't really know that's what's great about it still going out no idea we have no idea we'll never really know what happened no that it truly is like the bermuda it's the big foot the bermuda triangle now and now the irony is it's the same i'd say i think the the greatest analog, yeah, for MaguWorld is the National Enquirer. Like, Elizabeth Taylor, Elvis, aliens, Bigfoot, conspiracies, Swiss drug, spas, just, and it's that, like, bubbled up. And then you can actually get outside and meet other people who do that. The convention is off the open.

Yeah, and they're used to not, there was no way to meet those people. And now they're, it's as much a. lifestyle convention as a more lifestyle than political. I think people miss how attracted that is also to like these older generations. I went to an event in Wisconsin after Roby Wade. Two fights. It was. I think it was Madison.

Maybe an hour and a half outside of Madison. And I remember talking to old ladies, probably late 60s, grandmas. Yeah. Sweet Wisconsin grandmas, I thought we were going to talk about abortion. Roe v. Wade was all the conversation on the news. And we went out there and they were deep Q&N. They were deep. JFK Jr. still being alive.

So JFK Jr. is still live. What? Yeah. And it was their hobby. And then probably and merch, hats, macromay, t-shirts, yeah. Keychains. That's, they hop online like it was quilting. Yeah.

Oh, I got two hours what I'm going to do. Searching out conspiracies gives you a sense of power and pride and you figure something out. then you come to this event and that other person has done that conspiracy and it's it really is. And you compare conspiracies. You compare conspiracies. You buy fun merch for it all because the parade has come through town. Yeah. There's parades don't usually come through town. No. And the most important person, the most famous person who's ever existed on planet Earth of all time comes to your little shit town. I somebody, Sam Harris said that Donald Trump's the most famous person who ever lived. And I, I don't want to acknowledge it. It's a, it's a, I, I,

I think it's probably true. It's a terrible fact, but I would, you'd be hard pressed to think of. A living, living. Because you got to Jesus. But if we're really doing this. You're right, living, yes. As far as like a cultural figure, but somebody at their time who was aware of them, the population is a, if you're talking of like, the Genghis Khan, what have you, like,

information didn't travel like you did now. Information travels now. The population is so big. I also think like January 6th is perhaps the most well-documented. crime of all time. There's more cameras, more footage of an ongoing crime.

Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, you want to talk about the thing that I would have bet money wouldn't. I thought if everyone got body cams, that would be the end of kind of like criminal

defense. Just like, ah. And no. It's because that we got Amp, like, endless video evidence, and then at the same time as AI, and at the same time as complete

disinformation. There's, truth is not a salve, it doesn't, it doesn't end the story. No, it's just the beginning now. One of my favorite, I interviewed so many people, I was there January 6th. Excuse me, is this sedition happening over here? To interview people after January 6th. What if he said

everybody should go a f*** little pigs? Would that, would you still vote for him then? I would still vote for him. People I talked to beforehand were there at January 6th. But one of the guys who stands out the most, I interviewed a man after he served time for January 6th. He did his time. Three months. He did three months.

But this guy, he told me the story. He paid instigators, agitators and motivators that were in that crowd. He drove to D.C., met up some guys outside D.C. They shot gun beers over breakfast, and then they went to the Capitol. They, he got in a fight with a police officer. It was on tape. Before. Before?

On January 6th. Okay, like during the riot? This is pre-gaming. Pre-games. He pre-games because we got to be there. He meets strangers. Because it's a high school, it's a high school field trip. It is.

And it really, the other comparison that's always apt in this is, I'm from Michigan, like college football. It's tailgating. Let's go, blue! And it's that energy. And it's, and when I go to Michigan games, I put on hats, I put on silly outfits and you see other people who believe. Fight cops? Yeah. If you fight some cops, it's great.

You fight a cop. Ashley would have a get shot. Go on. It happens in every Michigan game. But this guy, he's there, he's for that, and then he gets in a fight, and it's caught on camera, and then he goes inside the Capitol, and then he gets arrested. Do you not see your actions as violent that day? I see the self-defense.

Then they arrest him. He has his trial. They show the video. He pleads guilty. And then I asked this man who chose to go to January 6, who chose to punch a cop. There's a video of him punching a cop. I pled guilty. I asked him, who did January 6.

And he says, it was a guy. was an inside job they were manipulating people absolutely how did they manipulate you to punch a cop now you're just trying to be funny that makes no fucking sense it's not him it's like this is the guy who did january 6th he did january 6th he did january job who's he talking about he the FBI agent that he i believe he he's like he's like that's how crime works if an a if an fbi guy waves you through then it's not a crime i think i think yeah i think deep state is his idea right but he was just so but i know people that were I know somebody, people that didn't believe in COVID, got it, almost died, and then said, like, yeah, but I think it's overstated.

It's like, how much more proof do you need? And the truth is some more. Well, identity. Identity. I know. I know. It really is. It's like, this is. What does it say about me if I, if I believe that COVID exists, then I'm a, I'm a bitch. I've already created a narrative for this. Yeah. And our brains are constantly. working to try to create a narrative so that we are the hero and everything you say is correct. And you just see that constantly working. I'm sure this guy. So far so good for us. We're doing great.

We are the heroes of our own story. Protagonist here. But that is where it's not a piece of information that will do that. I always got to ask that. How do you change people's minds? And it doesn't happen on the road. You don't. You don't.

And that's not the purpose of those pieces. Right. But the closer you- The purpose is to say snarky shit. You have to be snarky and funny. Do you think they think you're funny? No What do they think?

Do they Is the energy going into it For them Is it like I'm going to Best this I'm going to beat this Yankee Some

The people who recognize me They're like screw this guy Don't talk to this guy Are they hostile? Sometimes Yeah Some people are like Oh I see this guy

Let's get at it And then that becomes more debate They're eager to best me And I know this guy, he's an internet guy. Let me take him down. More often than not, people, I mean, they all sign waivers. They know they're on TV, but they- What's the waiver say?

Is it paramount? Is it, is it, is it- Bi-com? It says it's, I don't, Micahom doesn't exist anymore. Yeah, it's all in there. And so they're aware of this. Sometimes they're aware of the Daily Show. Sometimes they're aware of Paramount.

Yeah. But they are signing this, they agree to be on the camera. And I think they don't enter into it. More often than not, they're not entering into it combative. And they're not walking out. that way and that's usually not our intention. So some of these retorts that I have or what have you go over their heads.

Yeah. Or again, hypocrisy is not landing on them. Yeah. More often, I will have an interview with somebody, and I will, especially when the campaign was going on, I'll go to another rally a month and a half later, and I'll see that person. They come up, they'll be like, you want to talk again?

And they'll have seen it. And early John days on the road, we lived in worlds where somebody would have seen a daily showpiece, and they would have been a big. embarrassed by it. Right. That was the point. The general understanding of culture

was that what you believe right here is ludicrous. Yeah. But now I do think Trump has warped this. They can fully see them say something what that appears insane to perhaps a left leading audience. But to them, it's just being parroted by everybody around them. And they got saying on TV to the face of this guy. And so it's like, great.

I got another crazy one for you. So that is, the hypocrisy of it is no longer, shameful. In fact, it's disregarded. They don't have to indulge them. I said on here, shamelessness is, is bravery now. I like that. It's like literally like I'm, I'm strong. I'm a soldier for it's nonsense, but I'm dedicated. And that's rewarded. The dedication's rewarded more than ideological consistency or ideological like hygiene. or just like morality. And that's his, that's Trump's super power. By the way, they think they're gonna beat the Pope. Yeah.

J.D. Vance? I think it's very, very important for the Pope to be careful when he talks about matters of theology. It's like, do you guys? It is the Trump superpower that he feels those. I believe it's, I mean, I did a joke that he's like he Trump is Drake. And the joke was that, and he's got the worst entourage, like Drake did, that Drake was like,

I'm gonna disc Kendrick, and they're like, you gotta disc Kendrick. What's he gonna do, call you a pedophile the Super Bowl? But it's also, did you say, I mean, Trump, a week or so ago, you know, they asked, he said how he likes to hang out by losers because, like he just, I love, how bare it is. I like to hang out with losers because they make me feel better by myself.

Yeah, I always like to hang around with losers, actually, because it makes me feel better. But again, but everybody's in this bubble, Well, they're like, well, they're not talking about me. He's talking about everybody else. Like, J.D. Vance thinks that about everybody else. Marco Rubio thinks that about everybody else. Doug Bergam thinks that about everybody else.

He dropped the Bergam bomb. We haven't talked about Bergam yet. Why are we getting into some weird? What are we doing this or what? Guys, you know I used to smoke cigarettes, and I'm one of the best ring poppers. You literally, I can't. I was, I couldn't, my rings were so good. Ask my old writing partner.

They were incredible. You know what I used to do? I used to wake up and I'd like drink a drink two cups of coffee and smoke three cigarettes. And it was, this is a long time ago, but it was, it was wild. But now they, now the young, the youngsters of which I'm very much one of, I'm going to get a mullet and a must and a mustache any day and a fishing hat. It's the ultra pouches. I was like, I'm not doing that.

And then, and then I, it was like, let me try it. And, uh, I got to be honest. Pretty good. It was good for focus. I'll say that. And like energy levels. They're nicotine free and caffeine free. Like what?

So you're like, well, all right, then what happened? It's a great question. It's a great. Everybody knows a great question. Ultra partner with leading neuroscientists to design these pouches. They use clinically proven neutropics and adaptogens to deliver immediate focus and smooth energy that lasts one and two hours. More specifically, they use infinity PX, a cleaner, smoother energy.

boost and caffeine, L-theonine, and amino acid promoting calm energy and attentiveness, alpha GPC, a new tropic for enhanced mental processing, and vitamin B and B-12 for balanced energy and mood. I don't have it on me, but there are a bunch of my house. Come by my house. Don't come. No crash. Good stuff.

Didn't affect my sleep. My scores were nice. I think I use, yeah, I do. I use watermelon and it was, it was, it was fruity and nice. I'm a, I'm a sucker for. for you know flavors here's the call to action everybody shut up ultra is the ultimate guilt-free pouch delivering instant focus and mental clarity without nicotine or caffeine new customers can use code n-e-l get 15% off at take ultra dot com that's take t-a-k-e-u-l-tra dot com for 15% off with code neal

after you purchase and i'll ask you where you're worried about them please support our show and say sent you even though you already typed the code in. Just keep saying my name. Just yell kneel at your computer. I care about you. I got to say finding a doctor is a kind of a nightmare. I always feel like I'm doing something wrong. I have insurance. I have it. I pay for it, but it's scary and weird. There's no other way to put it. In network, I don't like I don't understand half the stuff. And then you when you find something, you want to get a doctor that like listens, you're comfortable, you're not nervous. They explain things clearly. A lot of doctors seem like. like they're kind of big time in you. I don't like that. So the good thing, here's the thing.

This is an ad for Zoc Doc. I don't know if it picked up on that, which I didn't realize what it was until they advertised in here a while ago. Not the best way to let someone know what you're doing, but that's what they're doing. So what is Zock Doc? Zocococ is a free app and website that helps you find and book high quality in network doctors so you can find someone you like. We're talking about booking in network appointments with more than 150,000 providers across all 50 states whether you're looking for dermatology dentistry primary care eye care or one of the other 200 plus specialties offered on zoc doc you can easily search by specialty or symptom to build the care team that's right for you want to see your doctor in person great prefer a video visit you can do

that too view thousands of verified patient reviews those are always pretty good because especially if they like let you write about the person you and then you can see there a real-time availability you can book instantly you don't have to leave a voice memo or voicemail they doesn't it feel like you never even when you leave a voicemail feels like no one's hearing this I've used it you what I've used it and it was great and I booked an eye appointment through it thanks for asking stop putting off those doctor appointments and go to Zoc doc.com slash Neal to find and instantly book a doctor you love today that Zoc Zoc doc doc dot com slash

N-E-A-L. Zocdoc.com slash N-E-A-L. Thanks Zok-Doc for sponsoring this message. And like last time, I mean, they all go to jail. Meaning all the people, they don't realize, like everyone who worked with the guy goes to jail, they got pardoned, but they all were supposed to go to jail. Maybe, but maybe not you guys.

I mean, I don't know. My faith in accountability is, is waney. So who knows? I know. Maybe. Maybe. Yeah. Okay.

The, what do you find in terms of doing those pieces? Do you go into them with any performance style that you aspire to? Is it about like clear your head? Is it about like what are you going into it with? Yeah. I think it's a few things. I learned something from Jason Jones early on. which is shut up and give people space to hang themselves.

Yeah. You know, my Midwest nice and my improv sensibility, you know, hates that silence in that scene. Yeah. And I would do those initial interviews and remember these were more traditional daily show interviews we're sitting down across from somebody else. And there's that weird awkward beat in that weird awkward moment, and I would relieve them of that awkwardness. So step one is let that moment sit.

Yeah. Play. It's revealing. And do you find that they bite 70% of the time? I mean, for me, I will say. When I walk in there, there is a lot of prep work that we do before a field piece. We sort of think of it as debate prep. You know, I'm going out this week as well.

And we have a meeting. We talk about where you go. Basically, I'm going to Phoenix. Okay. Direct. Direct. Yeah. And then probably a little puddle jumper an hour outside.

Flagstap. Yeah. Can't wait. You got to break my man off a flagstap. Please. Panera be in the area. Shit. But we will, we'll just talk about, you know, possible things we want to talk about.

some holes in logic, some jokes. You know, we usually leave with like a few pages of like jokes or bits or things to talk about. I read them over my head, then then you let it go and you just chat. Right. They go in much more interesting places. And if you're trying to play towards a joke that you thought was funny, three days ago, you're not gonna find it.

No. And all the best moments are these moments of revelation. And the improv improviser slash improv teacher in me is, I walk in there, I want to make that person feel as comfortable as possible. The best stuff comes when they're talking me like I'm that buddy at the bar. They're revealing something.

They're not on guard because, and this is where you see it with the news media, where sometimes there's more revealing things that will happen with, I think, the pulse piece than what you'll get with the news media because they're guarded. And then the news media has to be stoic in their approach to somebody else. I'm very kind in my approach. And that's not disingenuine. It's earnest. It's like, I do want to know.

I want to make you feel comfortable. I want to make you feel open about the things that you believe. I want to say yes to the things. And so do you feel, do you approach it like you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you have value as a person. Like, meaning political disagreement aside, like, you're just like, no, they deserve their day in court. They deserve to be heard out.

Every single person has, you know what I mean? I like to think that I approach it with a sense of kindness. I'm simultaneously furious at some of the things that I hear. Yeah. But from the Midwest, we all have people with differing points of view and political views in our families. I get that.

I spent a lot of time at these rallies now. I made friend at these rallies. Yeah. I brought somebody who I've seen it, he's been to a hundred rallies. I brought him to a Kamala rally last year and we spent a day and a half together. Edward, he's great.

When we don't talk about politics, we talk about music, we have a great time. Was the, did you do a piece about him being in the Kamala? We did, yes. He was fascinating. He was such a good sport. What are you expecting today at a Kamala Harris rally? Oh, I expect to see the paid actors who pretend to be here,

So many people who are there, again, they make this their identity, but they hold the politics loosely. What time do you usually get in line? At least 24 hours in advance in the Trump rally, if you want to go to one. If you get there by 9 o'clock, you're not going to get in. Which is where sometimes the liberal argument of like these facts will change it. It's the show that's fun and this is the identity. And this guy was... It's like, hey man, fish isn't good music.

Right. Like, what? I just torn around, falling on him, yeah? What are you talking about? This is this guy, Edward, Edward's great. Edward was a Grateful Dead. He was a deadhead. He was Obama, big Obama supporter.

Yeah, I would have said 20 years ago I said, Grateful Dead's not good. Again, but I don't, it's not my kind of music, et cetera, but the people that like it, like it. Fish is a great example. My buddy took me to a fish show. I'm not a fish fan. I don't listen to them.

Show is great. It's so communal. I remember I went to a fish concert and Madison Square Garden And the first thing that I reacted to, I walked in 30 minutes before the show starts, and the whole bottom floor is people in circles talking to one another. Nobody's just staring and looking at the stage. They were all talking to each other.

Yeah. It's like, what is this alien experience? And it was like, oh, they'd been the night before or the night before that. And they were all just, they're just seeing each other. Yeah. I was like, I've never, I go there, I stand in the corner, I look up there, I try not to make eye contact. But this fish experience. It's fellowship.

It's fellowship. And boy, I wish I had more of that in my life. And you see in Edward... 93 rallies with Donald Trump. Who found it and finds me... And that's... You add meaning. You go to this place and Donald Trump says you're a patriot.

Also, you can be an influencer. All of these guys have side hustles of influencer, which just might mean 30 people now subscribe. Yeah, but... But 30 more than before. They're part of the conversation. And it's so important to them. And yet they get caught up in this perspective,

so they have to, it's not only becomes their livelihood, or it's at least their community, and then it has to be their belief base. When I brought Edward to the Kamala rally, again, I really, I love Edward. He's kind, he's thoughtful, and he didn't change his perspective on any of the big political issues. But at the time, he thought, he believed the narrative

of like, there is nobody who could ever support Kamala Harris. These are paid actors who are at the events. There's no energy or what have you. And he showed up, and it took him him a while. But the one concession he made, he was like, oh, well, there's people here. They're misguided. I disagree with them. Yeah. And they have the wrong info. But, oh, there's, there are 10,000 people there who are very excited, who were dancing and we're happy. And after, after like an hour, he was like, oh, they're not, these are not actors pretending to be happy.

These are people who want to be a part of a movement, just like you are there. And so, so I'd like to think I approach them with grace understanding that. And at the same time, I'm very frustrated with like the misinformation that they peddle and are buying into. And so a good thing in the pulse piece for me is funny, but is as a moment of revelation where like they're in their bubbles and they're not having these conversations with their pals. They're not getting, none of this is getting pushed on them. They actually haven't thought through why they think this about trans athletes. Right.

They haven't thought through this thing about Iran. So I get to have that conversation with them the first time. And in that space, you see them working through these holes the first time. Yeah. And so I love that. So I walk away from that, like, oh, that's the gem. It's anthropological in nature. Yeah.

And the comedian, it doesn't make TV unless I have a joke on it. Yeah. Or I have a way in which to contextualize it for an audience so they see what I'm seeing. So that's the work. I have to be an improviser who creates space for that person to reveal themselves. And then I have to be a comedian at the end of it to create context for an audience to digest it. Have you worried I think in the January 6th one, you guys ended up believing, right?

We did. Because it was too, we got too hot. Yeah, got too hot. Thunder, cannon, tear gas. Let's not wait to find out. Was it hot at you? Was it hot in general? Was it hot at that guy?

Both. We had, we were, there was the million Maga March a month before. Yeah. A couple weeks before, I think. Which was he wanted a million people there to protest the election results. There's not a million people that. It hadn't happened yet. The election had happened.

lost, but they had to stop the steel campaign, and they had a big thing on the mall. We went to that, and the attitude had shifted the rallies from being, we're the winners too. Holy shit, we lost. They wouldn't say they lost, but the temperament turned, and they were very aggressive. It was probably more like a disaster zone afterward, right?

Very much. Like FEMA, like the tornado came through here. What are we going to do? Yeah, they were, they were antsy, they were scared, they were angry. And Trump throws, Trump, there's no organization to Trump rallies. And so when he invites people to the, it's when he invites people to the, uh, D.C. to, to, to have a Trump event.

It's a day of love. It's a day of love. It's a day of love. When he has a day of love at DC, uh, he doesn't pay for enough speakers for people to hear it. He doesn't pay for enough guards for people to keep them safe. And so you, what you end up having is a lot of people who don't get inside rallies, who don't know how to get in there. Like the, the fashion, fascism is poorly organized.

And so on this, you end up, you know, and so on, that event, we got harassed. He cheaps out. He cheaps out. And that's what happened on his birthday. The thing when people talk about, I mean, I am afraid about what is happening here, but when I went to his parade on his birthday that he had last year, all he wanted was a North Korea style picture of him with the tanks and everybody cheering.

And he didn't get it. He had all those empty stands. Yeah. Now, there were not a million people in D.C., but there were 50,000 people in D. Yeah. And I was talking to them and they couldn't find a fucking seat because they blocked off all the roads. Doge fired all the engineers who work. And they couldn't figure out a plan to get the 50,000 people that he needed for his picture.

Yeah. They didn't know how to get there. Because D.C. was blocked down and people are coming through. And now there's tanks here. And so there were so many mad Maga people during that who are running around like, where do I go? Where do I go? Cell phones aren't working because that's all done. There's no app that was there.

The people who are working there don't know where to send you. And everybody's furious and he doesn't get his picture. So more often than not, that is the experience. If you're getting up close, yeah, it's Donald Trump. If you're just outside, it is, it's chaos. Yeah. And when we were there, that chaos turned on us and we had to flee and guard. What's that feel like?

It's scary. But what's the, how do you, what are the signals of it turning on you? We're very careful about where we do our interviews so it doesn't become a mob situation. Meaning like on corners, like you exit, exit plan? Yes. And that's what January 6th did. Like we once people, people had nothing to do at that day. And so they saw me getting tense with somebody and then people came over and started

and started yelling at me, and then like two people become four, become 15, become 30. What's tense with somebody look like? Well, I think, I can't remember what we were talking about. Sometimes it gets... Religion. It's probably politics. Oh, religion, like literally religion.

It might literally be religion. And sometimes that stuff gets dark and doesn't make TV, either because it goes to a hateful place, we don't want to put it there, or it's not interesting. But the person didn't like my schick, didn't like where I was going. I was probably being a little bit curt as well. There's times in those interviews, I'm like, I'm done. You're not, you're no angel.

I'm no angel, you know? So it got, it got testy, and if somebody else sees it getting testy. And does that look like, like physical or it's just energetic? That, it's energetic. And then people start coming over and they start yelling. So then it becomes taunting. And then it becomes guards holding people back. I mean, I get called.

I mean, all of the homophobic slurs. Right. Judy, Jew, and anything Jewish? No. Oh, okay. No. I'm not Jewish. I don't know if they've done the research.

I know, but I'm not even, they, people think, yeah. I don't think, I don't think you have to be doing. That's the feeling I'm getting at an answer. Like, if you read my Wikipedia page, you know, maybe Dutch, I don't know what are you. Something. It's mostly just anger, like, lib. They love to live in like the lib land. Fake news, fake media, all that kind of stuff.

Like, as soon as that is there, which again, fake news, good on you. You're right. God bless. That's weird. We are fake news. Yes, objectively, intentionally fake news. We are, that's what we do. do.

Yes. Google it right now. This is fake news. I am making jokes. That is what I'm doing. And then they get mad and then it becomes a bunch of people and guards are holding them back. And at that time... How many guards did you guys do it?

I think we had three and then for January 6 we brought four. And then we didn't do interviews where there were groups of people because of that. We kind of had to be specific. So you get someone and go, hey, you want to come over here? We mostly were like, we would go through and we would film a little bit around like the mall and you'd be like, if we do an interview right, here 20 people will listen and it becomes mob and angry yeah so we're gonna we're gonna go 20 yards over here yeah we're gonna grab people and talk with them there and also we knew that day they were gonna go to the Capitol so we were we were

right at the front of the Capitol when it happened but always kind of 20 yards off we we hung out by the the African-American Museum where nobody was hanging out that day and so we did a bunch of interviews there that was a safe that was a safety that was a safe spot you touch it you were good you could All good. And then we... Guys, I'm invisible. And...

Yep. It became then chaotic and our camera guy got, like, shoved and our guards were getting harassed, and then like smoke bombs started going off, and they were like, we can't control the situation. They're harmless one-on-one. Yeah. They're keyboard warriors who, at their best, Our earnest grandparents were just so excited to be there and haven't thought things through.

But they, that mob mentality on Jan 6th, it was wild to watch people get up on, get up on banisters and all fake, like, military bullshit. Yeah. Like the move, like, look at my eyes, this kind of stuff. Like, you're seeing guys and stuff that they bought at the airport of the train station. Yeah.

Ludacris outfits pretending to be in some war movie. I was worried that we were in trouble, but then I saw that we got the tyranny response team here and I feel a lot better. And feeling it. Yeah. And a lot of people I could see like they were surprised and had gotten this far, but they were in it

because this is how we're moving, this is how we're doing. At the same time. It is funny how quickly the human being like, because what are we doing? Mm-hmm. Oh, I know the language. Yeah. I know the vocabulary.

I know the movements. I know the, and I can do like a decent. And it's creepy. It's very creepy. It's really, because you just go, oh, okay, I understand how most things have gone sideways in world history. They just say people would be doing a bit. Yeah. We were doing a bit.

And it went too far, got too realistic. Somebody got, there was one inciting act. And then that was, we started doing this with the railings and then like. I guess we're all doing this. Yeah. You see that. Yes. And I, to be clear, I saw plenty of the people who were there to start shit.

We saw the proud boys march and they were ready and then fatigues right up front. So you see like these people, they have a plan, as proud as they could be. But I interviewed a guy. I interviewed a guy on a segue. He's like going up on a segue. And it's just, man, what are you thinking here? A regular person on a second. A regular, like probably 65 year old man on a segue, mug it out, going up, up the cat,

on the lawn up to the Capitol. I'm in, I interview, I'm slowly jogging alongside this guy as he's like bumping over this, thinking he's going in there to overthrow America's democracy. Yeah. And he, that day was- And nothing could have been further from the truth. They were this close, but don't worry about that. Don't worry.

It doesn't take much more than a segue is what we, we quickly found out. Yeah. But that day, that, what that day was. That day was horrifying and so comically absurd all, all in one basket. They were peaceful people. were great people. The crowd was unbelievable and I mentioned the world. I've never seen anything like it. Yeah. All right, let's do some blocks. What are we doing? What do we doing here? Guys, you want to know about my shaving routine? I thought so. About once a week, I will use like a, you know, a hair, whatever the one they use, the clippers on my beard.

But then what about your neck now? Well, it's where hair. comes in. I go, I call my old buddy Harriet in. And, uh, it's just a good, it's a good ass razor. Am I allowed to say that? I'm from the, I'm from like the plastic razor days. They were just kind of a bummer. You just felt like you were in prison and not, not no more. Not no more. Harry, they got Harry's plus. Uh, it's a, it's, they got an advanced pivoting system to reach every corner of your face. It really is good. and they got a refined blade tech for a closer, smoother shave, and weighted metal handle so it doesn't feel prisony. Blade is honed at three different angles to cut hair cleanly at the root without tugging. I don't even look.

I don't, I'm not one of these like blade counters. You know, I'm a little autistic, but I'm not out here counting blades. Blade spacing is optimized to glide smooth. It is smooth. I don't cut. It doesn't cut on my Adams apple. It's got a lubricating shirt with aloe and vitamin E. it's also affordable, right?

They got their blade factory in Germany, so there's no outsources, no middleman. If you don't love a shave, Harry's will make it right. No questions asked. That's what Harry's about. Risk-free trial means there's zero downside to giving it a shot.

Here's a call to action. It's mandatory. For a limited time, our listeners can get the Harry's Plus trial set for only $10 at harries.com slash N-E-A-L. Harry and Neil together in the same U-R-R-I.

That's harries.com, h-a-r-r-r-s dot com slash any al. This set includes the all-new Harry's Plus Razor, one refined five-blade cartridge, a two-ounce foaming shave gel, and a travel cover to protect your blades on the go. Just head to harries.com slash any al to claim this offer, and after you purchase, they'll ask you where you heard about them. Please support our show until we sent you. Guys, you know, some men mask their be-o with scents. Mando men get the job done right. Don't mask it, mando it. Head to shopmando.com because for a limited time, new customers get 20% off site-wide with our exclusive code, N-A-L.

This is an ad for Mando. I'm probably on my fifth. I don't, maybe my sixth Mando roll, whatever, deodorant. I use it every day. I've used it on three. continents. I, guys, I went to Morocco. So I've used Mando on three continents now. You know, I'm a Mount Fuji guy. I, for the most part, I just use it on my pits. Don't mind if I do. It doesn't, here's the thing. It doesn't streak my clothes. It smells good. It's just not a fussy.

It's not fussy. You don't, it's, it smells good. It doesn't go on and on about itself. It's just, it's good. It's a whole body deodorant. You can use it anywhere you want. You, they've been. It's, it's good. It's a whole body deodorant. You, they've been, it's clear about this. I use it on my pits. It's made by a doctor who saw first hand how normal B.O. is being misdiagnosed and mistreated. Clinically proven to block odor all day and control odor up to 72 hours. I've tested it. It's true. Uh, they got a solid stick deodorant. That's my baby. They got a spray deodorant. Never used it. I'm sure it's great. All products are baking soda free and paraben free. Clinically proven to control odor better than a shower with soap alone. Mando's clinically proven to control odor better than Old Spice.

They're naming names. Shots fired. We don't say shots fired anymore, not in this country. Want to try America's number one whole body deodorant formula right now. For the best deals, go to shopmando.com and use code N-E-A-L for 20% off. Shop M-E-N-O, S-H-O-M-A-N-D-O, use code N-A-L, 20% off. They got wipes. They have a lot of good stuff.

They have cream deodorant, which I think I use once. Say goodbye to sweat stains and say hello to long lasting freshness. Mandoz got you covered. Please support our show and tell them we sent you. Bye. Oh, okay, this is good. I can relate to this. What do you got?

You got. What, it's not what I got. That's what I have sent you that now you actually don't do a shit about. The, the... Sorry. I'm being flipped. You know, we're joking. This is...

I'm not one of your MAGA people. Don't come at me with little... You think I don't... You think I don't speak snide. With the right, with the right. with the right media diet. Creatively ride logic versus absurdity, how to let go and take risks.

I was a math major. Well, I'll let you get to take the rest. I'm not going to blow the punchline, but he was a math major. This is, stay tuned, guys. You too could be a math major. The, the, how I take it is, I have what I call grid brain.

so like I don't like do an LSD because it's just like no I'm already here so I don't need quadrants and grids it's already it's already happening and if now it's really helpful organizing editing timing shit that is it's linear what's the tell the people about the downside well like I was a I was like a nerd and a math kid and sort of the structures of of comedy and even the places I took classes, what have you, like that structure provided a safe place for me

to be creative. They call it a game and improv. Well, that's a structure. Improv. It's a formula, format, structure, whatever you want to call it. Yes. And so for me, I loved studying comedy growing up. I did literally my college thesis on sketch comedy. but what I always gravitated to

is I think the control within that and what I was always jealous of is like the freedom and the looseness. And that's, I feel that's a constant balance of like, where do I go wild and brainstorm and be loose? And yet, how do I add restraint to it and clarity and repetition and timing? My brain is made for the timing and the math.

Yeah. But I keep having to challenge myself with the risks of going weirder and stranger. Like Python was a first instance for me of like a type of comedy that was outside of what I could

sort of conceive of like flying circus. Like I was like, oh, this, I don't understand this, but I like it. My brain doesn't work like this. I want more. Can you get into it? Meaning, not get into it,

nonlinear can become a structure. Yes. I find myself most creative with a deadline or a wall I'm up against. I stumbled into it with improv, but I was Chicago improv, which is much looser, but you're up against the wall

of the audience and of time. Yeah, like I would get out there and you can't go in it with any preconceived ideas. You say a thing and you gotta make that thing work as opposed to figure out what the best thing is. The creative projects that I work on that are open-ended, the writing projects and what have you that work on this script, what have you, I get mired in the perfectionism

as opposed to the making the half idea a great idea. like waiting for that great idea is a constant challenge. And the more success you find in this space, the more you hold onto the things that have worked and or like the logic that you know how to do. Yep. But I'm fully aware of the need to break that open and to be loose.

What I love about field pieces, like especially like a, and I do specials is that it's more documentary work. And that mindset to me is you go out, and you find and you create. And then from that, you piece it together in the editing bag. Like, I often think of myself as more of a sculptor than a painter. And like, give me a thing, it's this, make this better.

As opposed to, here's a blank slate. What do you want to do? That always, that's hard for me. But I know also what is so limiting about that. When you host the daily show, it's a little bit of both world. The first more, the morning is throw stuff out, see what you can do. It's a great day. It's a great, low-stress day.

It's a little day. I love it. that. But it moves. I think for me, you have to make decisions throughout the day. Yeah. And you have to be open to ideas because you got nothing. So let's create 100 things fast.

And then let's quickly make those 100 things, 12 things, and sharpen it and then just do it and then sell the fuck out of it. That to me really works well with my brain from a hosting standpoint and a creative standpoint. Do you judge yourself? Obviously, it feels like you judge yourself for not being purely creative. Yeah, I think I, yes. I wish I was more loose and free. I feel very comfortable in an improv setting,

but I also know the cheats of that. And I'm doing some stand-up in a couple days. That's just like, I got a lot of time and I'm going to just throw some stuff at the wall. And that's terrifying to me. But I'm trying to give myself grace and space to not overthink it right now. Right.

Because in that, I'm like, I need to override. overwrite, overwrite. And that, like, in my head, I'm like, you need to put in more work to make this good, which I think is partially true. But I think at this point, I need to put in more space to discover and give myself grace to do that. But that's a hard conversation to have.

This fear comes in. And also, like, I want to be successful. I assume, I just assume failure. Yeah. Meaning, I assume failure. I do a new joke show every week. Yeah. It's a lot of failure.

Mm-hmm. And, and I just, I don't, I always say, like, I'm not a genius. I will, the only way I can do is out craft and out work people. But I'm not, I'll have good ideas, but like, that's so. Yeah. So it's like literally like, that's not enough. You have to have like, I'm not, like, I can't write an hour a year. I can't, I, but yeah, just give yourself, like the, except that you're,

because it's the only thing you control is effort. Yes. So I, that is a constant battle. Yeah. And stand up to me is new and has such a different structure than, than the improv world or the sketch world. Yeah. So that is something I haven't cracked because I'm still new with some of these tools and figuring out how that is. And want to bring some of the like looseness of improv to it, but don't.

But in trying to figure out the right balance. Yeah. The audience is such a different expectation too. I think that was a quick thing I learned of a stand-up audience. Like this show that I'm doing is a new show. And I think with that understanding up top, I think there'll be more grace for where we go. Because I'm also trying to figure out format stuff.

My last show I did, I didn't want to do stand-up, I wanted to do storytelling. So I did a bunch of new material that was essentially comedic essays, which was a fun way to sort of explore, like, what does this format look like? Can you read essays on stage? What does Sedaris do? I want to talk about January 6th. I'm like, oh, I kind of do it on the show. I don't want to just do a couple jokes about it.

I actually have some stories. I want to kind of write something about it. And so I like, I wrote stuff and then I perform it. And then you perform it from an audience, and you realize the rhythms are very different for that. And so that was an exciting experience in that like, it starts to become a stand-up show. Well, it doesn't, you can't really manipulate it.

You don't get so much say in what they like. I think that might be. In fact, you get no say. I well that's what it was they literally go I just I've literally said on I'll be like guys I'm just gonna put the Food on the on the tray and if you want to eat it eat it But they're not gonna eat it if they don't want to eat it Nothing you can do about you can be like you know this is this is a Delicacy yeah there you go we don't like that no I would not from you that yeah

That's but that is the fun that seems like the fun space like I wish I I I I keep challenging myself to have more balls to try in that space to see like where are you and there you're not a neurotic guy though i'm not no you're not are you what sort of uh husband are you great question uh i think a good kind somewhat controlling go go i will say my the critique i received from my wife recently is i think i'm a fairly well-balanced person i've heard you correctly riff on the stoics jerry sanfield reads Marcus Aurelius' meditation. Him and 50,000 dickhead influencers also read Marcus Aurelius on a daily basis.

You have to let it all go. Fear, doubt, and disbelief. It means nothing unless you actually apply it and aren't making videos about it. But I find like, I read a decent amount of philosophy and approach certain things of like, the things you can control, control them. The things you can't let it go

and get rid of that anxiety that way. And the last thing your partner wants to hear more often than not is like, check out this Marcus Aurelius. I think that's gonna help you with the issues that you have right now. So I, but I think I am pretty good at like accepting this situation as shit or good and just making the good out of that. That I think is a skill set I have.

But as a partner, my wife is like, oh, I'm the kind of guy who doesn't stress about the things until the last minute and then has sort of a panic attack when we haven't figured that thing out. And she's the sort of person. Well, are you expecting her to be thinking about? She's been thinking about it for two and a half weeks. Right.

And then... What do we tell about? Trip. Everything. Everything. Form. A trip. How we're getting home, what we're going to do with our child about the school that's going on and about like the thing that her father said that she needs to take care of because it's an health issue.

Like my mindset is like, can you control it now? You can't? Then put that away and focus on what this is. And then she's sort of like, I need to obsessively think about this until we get it fixed. And then we hit that point right before it happens. And I have a meltdown. And she's like, well, about... I've been having this meltdown.

And in some ways, we're all having the same meltdown. She loses twice. She gets ignored and then freaked out on. She has a two-week meltdown. I've never been on someone's side more in my life. She would love her. You guys would really... I'm gonna steal her.

Take her. Let me tell you. Take her in the two weeks she's freaking out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And let me work out my 30 minutes beforehand. Do you... What's your... Are you a yeller? No.

You're a brooder. I'm... I'm sarcasm and snippiness. I mean, you see it at my fingers the pulse. What's your flag say? Come and take it. Come and take it. Do you have a weapon?

No. No? Why not? Did they take it? Sorry, bro. At my worst, I am like that well-actually guy. Yeah. You can suss out hypocrisy or you said this thing when you said that before.

But it all seems like your fault. You're saying it's my fault? Well, your wife is. I'm a great. The scenario you've set up sounds like you've, been negligent. In that scenario, I have been negligent. I think I would approach that scenario as there is anxiety in all experience. Let's limit the time with which we dwell in it. And that leaves me at a fault in the moment where we needed a little bit of preparation. So do you, I mean, the truth

is you can buy your way out of a lot of things. Look, we're living in a world where like, there's fee that you can there's a late fee there's there's just there's ways around it do you mind I mean my guess is your wife's like I it's not about the fee it's about the fact that you ignored my yes well then this the problem is she would use that argument this is why you guys would get along I I'm I'm very cheap I grew up so so when we reach that point where now there's a financial way in which to take care of this or we're taking the easy way because we're throwing a little bit of money on it then I become

Um, snippy and bitchy and the worst version of myself because the, you know, middle class Midwesterner pops in my brain and you're suddenly like, why, why are we wasting this money or these resources here when we could have dealt with it in this way? Is it a thing you're working on? Does she think you're working on it? No, I'm not. Because what is that what's the approach is like, I need to get ahead of stuff? I would say the question that I probably pose to myself within this and maybe it should be more

relationship based, but like the project. of self, I think... What a project. What a project. But I try to... But it's mixed in... I would say it's mixed in with what we were just talking about. Is, yeah, I'm 47. And trying to, like, I honestly feel...

I feel pretty good dealing with the anxieties of life and what you can control. My job, I love doing my job. My job has been through so many iterations in the last 10 years that I've dealt with, like, the fear of it ending and the grace of it going.

That I'm... I'm able to accept that. So I feel good about that. But I still balance. So what? I have to be a good parent and a good spouse, and I also want to be creative. How do I do that? I do that through, like, I try to let my brain go to weird places.

I read a ton. I read about this stuff. I try to, like, indulge in arts that are surprising that, like, will expand where my mindset is. I find myself getting too in my head about, like, how to piece together a life that is a worthwhile life, which is part of the whatever midlife crisis I'm probably going in. But I don't, it's not, I'm not necessarily going through. I would say I've been in a midlife crisis for 27 years. How do you get out?

Have you figured it out yet? No, you dig in. You dig in and you just, you love it. You dig in, right? And then you look up and you've actually dug your own great. It's incredible. It's great, yeah. Uh-huh. Well, I'm right in the middle of it right now.

Me and your wife are standing up and we're getting ready to throw the door on. Just throw the door on. Guys, just relax. We can get to this later. That's what it is. I just want to put it up my midlife crisis till the late 70s. What do you think is a life well lived? I mean, I think it's someone who who, who, who,

is able to exist in the most pure present and still acts morally and kind. I think having a kid was wonderful in all of the ways they tell you, but was such a clean focal point. I feel pretty well adjusted and don't, I had a wonderful family growing up and what have you. And you can talk the talk of like a kind moral person lives in a space where they're caring about others.

But it's still, it's still Project Numero Uno with the way in which a guy who's taking improv classes and doing things. And somebody in a marriage who has a career, you're focusing on yourself all the time. You're living in your head. And then you have this kid. And it becomes very clear that person needs you to live. Put your energy in that. Make your choices about that.

Your financial choices are based on that. Your care. And even just walking down the street, you're helping mold who that human being is. So be present with them. Be kind. Feed them food. That is good for them. Like, it was like a wake-up call of like, oh, you talk to talk.

you read the shit about how to live a good life. Now you're giving a child that you have to give you. No, I have to do it. Oh. So I think that is, that has been helpful to focus on like, well, do it. How do you find the nervous system effect of a child on you? Meaning how it, because it's a journey. It's just a day is like, what?

You experience more in a day with a kid than you do in like six weeks as your own person. Oh, yeah. It's very New York. I think New York, you know, I think the New York experience is of the highs and lows of life. Yeah. As a homeless person. Yes.

Not as a person with an apartment. No, print, the apartment, yes. Oh, yeah, you're great. Kid is your homeless. But no way, it really, like, where, and you see like, oh, I don't deal well with seven minutes of crying. Oh. straight. Like we said, it is a, it is a test.

The fun part is that it is a test. Where I'm like, oh, I've been, I've been bullshitting this. I read pretentious, books, I do, therapy, all these things to become better at life. And then a kid screams for seven minutes on a street corner and you're like, now is the time. Yeah. What have you figured out? It is right now.

Yeah. Do you want to be, oh, you listen to 12 hours of Alan Watts? Congratulations. Well, Al Wants has a great, or it's, Ram Dass has a great quote about if you think that your enlightened ghost spend a week with your family. Is that right?

Yeah. Which is like, it's actually three days with your family, which is like, yeah man, hang out with a kid that wants French fries. Yes. That's, it's test time. And you can't get them. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Because he said he was done with dinner, you ate the French fries and they're gone.

This is your, this is life. Yeah. So to me, I'm like, oh, the work of life is not trying to change the parameters. So you're not searching for French fries for 12 minutes or standing on that tree quarter. It's like how do you subsist in those seven minutes of screaming, like present and kind? Have you learned about how to deal with people overall from that? Because that's funny. Obviously, my basic son was like crying about fries recently.

Right? And you go through like what your parents would have done, what you'd like to do as like a petty person, what you like just all of the stuff and you end up, I don't know where you end up. I mean, you, but it's almost like you go on your own journey and then they finally stop crying and you're like, you travel through time.

You confront yourself and then, yes, it is. That's exactly what it is. It's like, oh, my parents would have done this. Yeah, book I just read would do this. I will, and you live all of those lives. I have that moment where I am so petty and I, I, like, slam my son. Like, not physically, but I like, I say that snippy thing to, like, piss them off. Or like, oh, you think that, the, I did the, my child gave me a little, my child said they hated me.

Really, it's like, this, we're in a hate space. We're like, oh, I don't get this, that's why I hate you, I hate you. And this was going on and was being mean about something. and then gave me this little piece of paper that said love on it. And I thought my child was pranking me and then went back to yelling at me. And I was like, well, I'm going to, you can't keep doing that. I'm going to take something away. But here's the problem with this new parenting.

There's nothing to take away. You have to be like Montessori kind. And so there's not, there's not TV to take away or snacks. Oh, oh, it's the worst. And so they're like, what are you going to take away? What? What? What is it?

And I get up. I jump up like, well, well, well. And I tear up the little piece of paper that was given to be. And he breaks into just tears, which was the right response to him. And I'm like, why did I have to, why do I have to win this moment? Yeah. I don't have to win this moment. Like the better version of this is being kind and spacious and just fucking taking it.

And my parents were there. They'd be like, no, stick him in the room. It's time out time. Yeah. I, in that moment, I threw out time out for the first time. And my child's like, what's the time out? I'm like, I don't even know. I don't know how it works anymore.

I thought you would know. I was like, please, it worked for me. I was so scared of timeouts. Yeah. But I'm going to put you in your room. I'm not going to lock the door. You're going to walk on out. And then I'm nowhere.

Yeah. But that's the experience. The funny thing is, though, I still believe that timeout were. I mean, it's funny. Timeout was a response to hitting. Yes. Right? And it was like, there's a better way.

Yeah. You just. Now we're back. We're just like, let them hit you. Let them get it out. Tell them it's okay. Have the big feelings. but you can't.

Yeah. You can't, you can't hit. But that's, I've had the conversation with prevent, they're like, well, you just tell them they can't hit. You're like, yes. But then they hit again. And again. Well, I think it's, I don't want to indict myself. But I think it's, I think it's, there have to be guardrails.

Yes. I was talking to my mom about it the other day of like, saying I hate you to your parents. It's like, I, no one said, we don't say. that but it was I understood that we don't say that mm-hmm I I remember a buddy mind saying it to his parents and then beating him up see we say you know I also dealing with the reality I had a kid late in life and have also lived through the last 15 years and I grew up a kid who was raised a pretty normal Midwestern life who believed in authority who thought there's the police

you respect the police yeah go to college you're supposed to go to college firefighters thank you for your service The president, way to go. Yep. I have very different feelings, complicated feelings about all of these institutions, about what schooling does, about what the government does, about what, like, all of these institutions do. It's complicated now.

And so when you have a job asking you about these things, I'm unsure. These guardrails about it is like, oh, I wish I could give you the clean guardrails. I know. Say yes to your elders. If they say it, do it. Well, it's complicated. I don't feel that anymore. Yeah.

And I want my child to have a more nuanced view of it. It's a bit like the Catholic Church where it's like, okay, take away homophobia and the molestation, right? It's not a bad, what they're espousing is not bad. Yeah. Well, I guess they can't, women can't be briefs. Why was he wanted, whatever. Fucking get out of him. You're welcome.

But it's not, but it's, we got, it's like shame. We can't kink shame. I don't know. Part of, like all these. things of like no we don't uh ah maybe maybe there's some value to it obviously there's collateral damage to anything pretty much but i've gone all the way around and being an atheist as well like to being so anti-institution to like we need elements of these institutions to create a roadmap uh you but it's a bad again um i think um people need people need guard rail

unfortunately and religion is a pretty good one if you you you know you Yes. If you take away the crusade, you take away like everybody did their, like the crazy elements of it. If it's just like a personal discipline, it's pretty valuable. Very much so. As long as you retain your own agency and perspective. Like there is one of the philosophy, but I'm reading a Camus, the myth of Sisyphus right now.

And there's a quote of talking about institutions, critical of institutions, says, like, it relieves you of the weight of being human, which means. many times feels like a necessity. But when I go to Trump rallies and I interact with people, they've given over empathy or the way in which they act towards their neighbors towards this institutional knowledge, this party, Manga. Some have done towards Christianity, you know. But they have given it over because being a human is so hard right now.

And sometimes we search into our phones to kind of get away from our own mindset or sometimes we turn to Maga or that religion. And I get that. But we are, we're Succeeding. our ability to engage with who we are in a way that is, I think, could be so detrimental. Now, it's hard to imbue that into a kid. Like, I think you give them guardrails

that you can then perhaps dispose of. I think you give them guardrails, and you give them training wheels and you go, take them off when they become stupid. But if you have to build, if you build the training wheels, what is the shape of the training wheels that you build?

Circular wheels. Next question. wheels okay there are wheels okay but the metaphorically yeah do you do you lean on like christianity do you find a religion to i i personally wouldn't lean on christi i i would lean on elements of it you know what i mean like decent basic decency basic respect it's like respect elders up to the point of molestation do you know what i mean like literally i had that thought in my head the other day of like yeah man you got to respect all but then there's also like molestation was the collateral damage of respecting elders.

It's like, for instance, like corruption. It's just like there need to be guardrails and but you put they didn't really tell us. Don't get molested. Do you know what I mean? Like they right. They was just kind of like, eh, bah. There was not. He got popped.

He got popped. He got popped. Like, so I think if you give people guardrails, give children guardrails, give people, I did a daily show piece that didn't, you're not going to believe it didn't do that well. Where like Republicans need Jesus. Republicans, y'all need Jesus. People need something to, they need a system. Literally they need institutions, they need marriage, they need like literally. Without like a career track, a relationship track, people need tracks.

People are hoes and they need to get on the hoe track. They need to get on the hoe track. I agree with you to a point. I think the idealized version of a human being doesn't need those tracks. Right. They are a, yes. Right, but you're reading fucking Camus. So get there.

Get there. Get there. Come on, Manga. But again, Camus is an ideology. It's the Stoics are just a different ideology. They are. Yes. They're a different track. Yes.

But the people who are laying the major tracks in this country are then manipulating where these tracks go, right? So I think like you can't use MAGA as a track to like teach a kid anything right now without it going off the rails. Religion was built in a, well, complicated, but there's elements of a religious tract that can give good guard rails. But the deeper you go into that, I think the more you give away your own agency towards who you are in identity.

There's element, like, I've looked at Quakerism. I've looked at, like, some of the things they're doing. We all, we all have, we've all window meeting. I mean, look, it's the Scientology of the 1800s. But there's, there's, you, I, I wish there were stuff like that. 1700. I mean, I think, technically, I think George Fox was in the 15,500. That's, I mean, let's, we're going to go.

If we're going to, we want to do it. But there's, I, what is the level of guardrail, I guess is the, the argument we were. And I also, it's the same way, like, Republicans need to, Jesus. Republicans, y'all need Jesus. You know, liberalism, atheism is, I've said it a million times. Martin Luther King worked because he offered people, he offered white people's salvation. Like, hey, I'm a minister. I'm a reverend. Just a, yeah, the guy thing, have you, right? Right? Yeah, oh yeah. That's way more effective and appealing than the, you want to be on the right side of history, which is what liberals are. It's, it's, it's, Kurt Metzger has a great line, which is the right side of history is,

uh, is white liberal heaven. Yeah. And it's like, it's fucking useless. You don't, you get nothing. Yeah. You get, you get smug satisfaction, which is as, that's real white liberal heaven. Spug satisfaction. Oh, you can live off. Oh, good. Look at us. If we're not, who is? I've got empathetic towards the artists who have found God. I, like, I'm a big, Bob Dylan fan. And I think in wrestling with this question of like trying to live a life without guardrails and what have you, I see like Bob Dylan's God years are the worst years. And I can understand it as a songwriter. But like the deeper you get into, you're like, oh, of course. Like once you, once you explore all of these things, like, that is such a compelling

place for both relief, but also like an elevation of some of the things that are outside of who you are. So I'll probably do that. In my 50s, I think I will find folk singing God and then relate that to my kid. We hope, right? It's what the people want. You want to talk about an audience that has no standards. You can get in there. I mean, you can literally say, hey, this is a folk song.

They're like, where do we sign up? It's about this land. It's about land. Oh, I thought about there was a hot second where I was like, there's got to be a hip-hop. D.C. talk. Do you remember D.C. talk? They were a go-go band, right? I think the D.C. talk I remember was the Christian.

They were the Christian rappers. They were like Fushnickett. They were like. Yeah, late 80s, early 90s. Yeah. We, I was going to do, we might still do the segment where Jordan knows a lot about 90s R&B. The, guys, you know, getting older hits harder and it happens to all of us, even me, Neil Brennan. Stiff joints in the morning.

Mine aren't, well, I don't. Longer recovery after workout, guilty. Skin losing that sort. smooth glow. Yeah. Yes. These are some of the things that everyone deals with at some point. They want me to say it started for me at the age 30.

It didn't because I'm what you call a late bloomer. Let's say, I don't know, 40 something it started. I'm still over the mind that I look okay, but I know it's not true. I recently learned that your body's natural collagen production begins to decline in your mid-20s. For those who don't know, collagen is a crucial. protein that provides structure and support to your muscles, joints, and skin. It's often referred to as the glue that holds our bodies together. So you can probably imagine that a decline in collagen production has some big impacts on your

body. It does. In fact, I saw a thing on Reddit today about the most effective supplement, whatever thing, and collagen was in the top seven recommended things like across all literature and stuff. Here's the thing. You can actually reverse the clock for your your body to make sure your joints, muscles, and skin are getting the collagen that they need. This is where Bub's natural collagen peptides come in. B-U-B-U-B-S. Bubbs helps restore collagen levels closer while your body naturally had into youth. Since I started taking Bubbs collagen peptides, looking, feeling like I'm in my 20s again, am I allowed to say? I mean, is that my place?

My girl did notice that I look, my skin looks better here, she said specifically. But for real, my joints don't feel stiff or achy. My recovery from the gym is faster. And my skin has that natural glow back. Again, am I? Is that my place? I mean, it does, but you don't say it. It's super easy to use to.

I just mix bubs in my morning coffee and I'm good to go. It's tasteless, odorless, and dissolves instantly. No clumps, no weird aftertaste. It's honestly crazy that just one scoop of bubs in my, it's not coffee. I have one of my protein checks. Each morning can have such a positive impact on how my body feels every day. On top of that, Bubbs is built to the highest standard. No junk.

Zero sugar, sweeteners or fillers. It's third party tested, NSF certified for sport, Whole 30 approved, and sustainably sourced from grass-fed pasture-raised cattle. Shut your mouth. Bubbs naturals doesn't just make the cleanest and most effective ecology and peptides in the world. They also make MCT oil creamers. vegan friendly now we're talking solutions for enhanced energy and mental clarity

that also regulates your appetite and supports a healthy gut now you knew what was coming here's the call to action live better longer for a limited time only our listeners are getting 20% off at bubs naturals by using code N-E-A-L at checkout just head to B-UBS naturals

dot com and use code N-E-A-L and you're all set after you purchase they will ask you, were you heard about them? Please support our show and tell them our show sent you. Well, okay, well, yeah, I mean, I'm, I was an atheist and now I believe in something from doing drugs. Yeah. I was skin and all that stuff.

So, what has that something, do you define it as something? A central, I call it central creation force. The animator. Okay. The thing that gives everything motion. Do you think that's an actual force? Do you think that's sort of like just an idea? an idea

on these drug states I have experienced it and it's still when I leave the drug state it's still in me still on me in me inside whatever you want but you you project that on something outside

of like an experience you're happening within your brain has something that is happening in the universe yeah but I'm not gonna hold anyone to it I don't it's not I don't it's that there's not a list of rules like yes and therefore because I because the my defense so it's one of the defenses of it is like so the dome on the rock and the the wailing wall the the the Muslim holy site the third most famous Muslim holy site and the most famous Jewish holy site same address it's like ah so it the joke the joke that didn't work is like it's a romantic comedy where it's like you're fucking the same girl.

Yeah. This is the same like every, so everyone's, again, that's a, that's like one example. I just think it's everyone's all saying the same thing. It's just different. It's the narcissism of small differences. Like, don't eat fish. No, don't eat pork. You're way off.

It's all these things that are, everyone came to the same. It's like, it's like hieroglyphs on one cave and then on another cave. Oh, yeah. The God stories are all the same. Yeah, 7,000 miles away. It's like, this seems like everyone's saying the same thing and came to the same conclusion independently. So that would be like my anthropological defense of it.

And I went from like no to like, oh, okay, all right, I'm not going to I'm not going to, there's no point in questioning this. And I can't say like I'm evangelical or like, like, I'm evangelical. or like I don't need you to believe in or whatever. But that's what I think. I don't and and but it doesn't, but I think all my ethics are Catholic school. Yeah.

All of my like, you know, beliefs in terms of behavior. But I don't think anyone are bad. Are you going to heaven? Do you believe in that? No. I don't think I'm going to heaven anymore than anybody else. Yeah. I don't think, I think when you and I die,

the same thing is going to happen. Do you think that extends in some... Fireworks. Let me tell you. Fireworks. January 6th. People, people, people, people riding. I, just, that's just what I think.

Yeah. Like, it would, it's, I, it's a thing that I experienced that I think I will re-experience in some writ large way. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Which, again, I'm not, it's not, it's not, it's, I'm not. I can't convince anyone of this. I can't convince, nor do I think it, nor do I think it matters.

I think it's basically, I think it's purely insecurity that, like, I need you to think that the Patriots are the best football team in the fucking league. And you're like, no, it's the Raiders. I don't care. Who gives a shit? Who gives a shit? Like, why I need you. I don't think it's going to make a different.

Yeah. Yeah. I just don't think it's going to make a difference in like, yeah, just it's all, it's very small and human. Yeah. With the, like, what people have tried to do is so like, what? Even, yeah. So, but I don't expect you to believe it and I don't expect, I'm not even going to say it's easier for, to explain them. I think kids, I think there's a moral, I think we have an inherent moral framework.

Yeah. You ever hear you to hear about that? study where kids like pre-verbal kids like three months old have they they like there's i i i'll get the experiment wrong but like they don't there's blobs and one blob stops another blob from going and the kids don't like the blob that stops the other like this inherent fairness that i think like the human being has yeah i buy that um and i don't think it's it's probably evolutionary. Yeah, I mean, I would assume in some ways that, yeah,

our bodies have built up in a way where we go farther together than apart. Yeah, I relate to a lot of that. The deeper I get into it, I think we all start to agree on a similar narrative. I think the power we give to that is sort of our own and what we do with it. I would say I'm like Rob Blow with the NFL hat. I just believe in the NFL. You really does. I think I love it.

Like I just I'm here for the I'm here for the I'm here I like the I don't I don't care about I'm literally like yeah I don't I don't Jews Muslims Chris I just don't know it's all saying the same thing yes and you can see the human part which is like you can't eat fish can't eat meat no gays and we got to kill some of the other groups that doesn't seem like that's second it's the second part it's that let's all get together and figure out how to tell somebody else what to do with it that becomes very problematic and what I why do I care yeah if you what you also people don't even believe it no they memorize it they know what they have to say but they don't actually it's a bit like the Constitution where it's like people don't even know I mean Christopher Hitch you say all the time do you I'm sure you read God it's not great yeah that that was a start you know that I I cringe a little bit the well Sam Harris the David Dennett what was the Four horsemen of being an ass to your friends for the next seven years? The four horsemen of smugner.

Look, Sam's a buddy and he's done the pot. I love it. But yes, those were very important. Yeah, it was fun. It was fun. But we'd listen to the, I remember when I drove to L.A. I listened to God It's Not Great and the pickup artist book. Really?

Yeah. And it defined the next 10 years from my life. But the Hitchens would always say, like, people don't even know what's in the Bible. Yeah. And it's a bit like people don't know what's in the Constitution. 100%. I talked to somebody. I think it might have been January 6th about the Constitution.

Yeah. And he was quoting the top. I was like, well, have you read the Constitution? He's like, no, nobody's read the Constitution. How could you? You can't get it. Impossible to find. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, I got part of it tattooed on my arm. Yeah. Yeah. But who cares? Who has time to make it. to the elbow. But so,

no, I'm not, but I'm not worried about you being in a, I'm probably, I probably I shifted to atheists in the Hitchens era and it probably shifted back to the agnostic era where I think like, yeah. So yeah, I am open to it, hopeful, hopeful for something more and have lived into being almost.

Think about the things you think you understand. Yes. And then think about how little you understand The evolution for me, for lack of a better term, in that has been in my certainty, where I do think that is something like that Hitchens part of my life, that smug period, was like a certainty of like, oh, well, we've disproven this there. So it's not. And atheism in and of itself is also a certainty of there is no God.

Where then you see like, oh, no, I think they're then becoming aware of like the things you don't know and open for surprise becomes what is most compelling in this phase of life. Imprope, I believe they call it. They do call it improv. Hold on, let me see if I have any more blocks for you. Certainty. Certainty. I was giving it to you.

And being open and comfortable to uncertainty, doubled up. This is one that we talk about a lot, but information overload. What do you, you go into print? How you read in Camus? You read hard? Paperback? What do you read? I got a paperback for that.

Great. What became fun about that? Was going to pop in coffee shops and reading it in the front window. Just holding it up high. Hold it up real high. Oh, are you curious about them? at this is a festival. Yeah, and you would hold your daily show, Mike,

so people knew it was you. Oh, yeah, it's me from the daily show. If you want to post this, that's fine. I'm just studying, I'm thinking about life and French existentialism. Actually, absurdism if we're being technical. Yes, I have a family. Don't worry about it.

I'm not stressed about it. My wife is. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I'm fine, I'm living my best life. You know what I started to do is, I picked up that book. That has a funny premise to it. Well, it's essentially the only philosophical question

is whether or not you should kill yourself, is how that book kicks it off. I think it's kind of hilarious and kind of spot on. And so I've been carrying that around and writing all my jokes in that book. That whether you should kill yourself or not? Kind of. I was like, this is sort of funny and also like,

let me actually just read it and if I have a joke about what I'm reading or just about my brain going elsewhere and use that as a notepad. So that's my new thing of like, how do I use this as, how do I use books as notepads? What is the- I like keeping them on me. Like in the terms of the information,

I'm like, I'm trying not to, stay away from my phone so keep like these little tiny books yes that i go out i do that read something write something and don't get on the fucking internet while yeah um and has it made a difference a little bit i like i know what i need to do to be a better person as far as information goes and i'm battling it every day like when i did the i hosted a show i left the daily show got to host my own late night show it was a blast but it drove me crazy just with anxiety Oh, it was not fun. It was not first person enjoyable on your nervous system.

Exactly. Yes. In fact, I think some of the stuff. They very rarely are. That's what I always ask people when they have a show. I always go, do you like having a show? I loved it. But, I mean, my wife was the first to say, like, you were terrible health.

I would just wake up at 4 a.m., super stressed out. And in my mind, it was like, you need to read all of the news before you get to work. And so that was like, I thought information would be the answer. to being smart and funny and aware. Also, you know, hosting a show and EPing a show, you're like, I kind of have to have an awareness of what this whole thing is. And that wore me thin and exhaustion.

And so when I came back to the Daily Show, I was sort of like, one, I was like, just be grateful. Because the one thing I felt regret about was that show ended. And I was like, you were really rude to people. I hated it. I was so mean. I was just like, fuck you, fuck you. You were, you know.

It was wild. Burn it down. I wanted people to write about it. I kind of wanted a I wanted a reputation I didn't fully get it but you were taking writers you went around the writers room and you were like no come with me oh you got to do it you have to send a message yeah yeah send a message and you kept saying I'm never coming back here done I'll do this is this is on Jordan Klepper does not fail was well I think was their working title that was totally was that 100% was and so So you realize, well, okay, while we're here, I want to talk about how good Trevor and John are. Yeah. Meaning you do it, you have a show,

and then you see what your, happens to your nervous system and your performance ability, your synthesizing an episode, and you go, fuck. So what do you talk about John and talk about Trevor, and not in a, you know what I mean. Yes. I mean, getting to sit behind the desk doing my own show and getting to do it, the Daily Show,

you see what, you get to see how hard that job is. Yeah. And I already had nothing but respect for both those guys doing it. You know, coming in working with John, you know, I looked up to John. I was a fan of the Daily Show for decades before getting to be on the Daily Show.

And one of the things I was so impressed by was his decisiveness. Like that day, to John's credit, and also setting a giant burden for Trevor, like, John sort of revamped how a lot of late night rooms worked. I think in some old school late night shows, the host could come in midday and yes or no, some jokes. Yeah, I remember hearing Dennis Miller would get in, like, he'd come in on Thursday. Yeah. Like for the first time, maybe Friday. Like everything else they would send, they would fax to him.

Yeah. I think John's sort of over time. I don't know if that's true, but that's what I heard. I mean, I think a lot of it at the late, you were a host, you know, and some hosts were more hands-on than others. You know, as by the time I got to The Daily Show with John, like the show ran through John. His name is on the building, and so he is picking the stories in the morning.

He is working with the writers on the jokes. He is the most vocal person in all of rewrite. The field pieces that we would do, um, uh, John would approve every single one. of them before we went out I would go in and have a meeting with John about the things that we need to get with the field pieces and so like the show all ran and he knew what and he would I've heard stories of him like reworking pieces and amazing and yet from a field what was interesting about the field shit you'd go well this is like rock Chris Rock told me one time

no one got more jokes in other people sketches than Adam Sandler and you and so like Sandler would just walk down the and go hey my one yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah Like sketches that you go, Adam, I'll tell you who had nothing to do with that sketch, Adam Sandler. And he would always have, like, a very good joke in them. But similarly, John. John got to the point where it is his show. He knows what he wants to say. He has, he's so thoughtful on the news.

He has the best batting average in the building. Yeah. And by the way, he's gotten the most reps. He's literally done every, he's downfield pieces. Which is sort of if you, not to get in the nerdiness of like a late night room, but it's sort of wild to do a field piece where you're filming something in Wisconsin about some other thing

and John Stewart's writing a show that he's putting on in an hour and a half and doing these other ten things and then he's hopping in an edit Yeah. On his way to the rewrite. It's like all right you have and I remember that it was like he's walking through

we have five minutes. Yeah. So he would watch the piece and you'd sit next to him nervous and John would look at it, digest it and then give you all the notes and you made those things happen. And like Trevor walks into that.

And not only is that a hard job to walk in to be the host of the Daily Show, but the show was suddenly built like, you have to be the expert on field pieces. Well, yeah, it's John's like newspaper editor. Yes. And Trevor's more akin to a really good musician who's. figuring out his sound. And and and but also like Trevor's like sharp as fuck so like yeah so like he could he could do that he like he grew into more of the editorial thing but you're absolutely right there was a little like it's the expectations were like it's more like producer

expectations than like host expectations. Yes. Oh what was so fascinating when he first came because I remember the first time I met Trevor he he did a few like correspondent bits on the show. And I had just, I was like the new guy in, I think, at that time. And so like, I'd just been through, like, what it's like to be on the Daily Show for the first few times. And I remember sitting in a rewrite with him and the writer Joe Miller on something. And it's just like, this guy has like ice in his veins.

I was like, this job is hard. You just came in, you're here, and you are just cool as a cucumber. Like, there was just like an ease to him that was remarkable in me. Somebody was like, wow, I just had to do this, a version of this. It's almost like he grew up in apartheid time of him. That's, I mean, that was just like he grew up in apartheism. I mean, it really became the thing where it was like, you know what? This isn't going to be my stress.

But when he came into those writer's rooms, I just, I have so much respect for both of those men. They are heroes of mine. But I remember what was fun with Trevor's, I got to sort of collaborate with him in a new relationship. And watching him, like, come into a writer's room. Like, that writer's room had been conditioned to, like, wait for the host to sit right there and then to sit and then just look and be like, well, what do you think about the world and how do we put this in action? And Trevor walks in and it's like, okay, well, I'm learning about the world. I'm super smart.

I have great takes on all these things. But I don't know all of the players. And the person I'm sitting next to has like a photographic memory of everything Mitch McConnell has done over the last 12 years. And everybody is here. I just found out who Mitch McConnell is two weeks ago. Exactly. And it provided like fun fresh takes on stuff. I remember he saw Trump clearer than so many other people who just like, we've been in this for a lot.

This isn't what's going to happen. Trump was like, I think this might happen. This guy is actually really compelling in this way that the room was like, what is this guy talking about? Yeah. And he was able to, it wasn't until like I got my own show. Trevor was instrumental. When I left and got to do the show after the Daily Show,

like that was Trevor EP'd it and was one of the reasons, like vouched for me in there. And I remember after having started to do this show and also I built my show on the way in which the Daily Show was set up, which was set up to run through one person like John. Like the show is now evolved in a way that takes some of the weight off all of it. It's still very much host specific,

and John is all over the show on his days, but like, it takes, it uses people better. And people have gotten more confident in themselves in that space, so it's not just what is the one person say. It's like, oh, how do we all make this work in a way that is much better for all of us? But I remember, like, coming back to Trevor being like,

I don't know how you do this, man. This is, it's like impossible. He was like, oh, I was terrified this whole first year. I was like, really? Because you were so calm. Yeah. You let everything roll off your back. You were cool in the rooms, but you were constantly being asked to do everything. And I think that's what was, to his credit, he is exactly that. He is, he knows who he is. He's so confident in that. He's a history that has allowed him to not let that one thing stress him out. When I had to do it, I let that one thing stress me out. That one little thing that I don't know enough about maybe. He's not really an obsessor. No, no. He's just more like, huh. No, why is this? Let me do this. So it's remarkable what he was able to do and make that his. his own. And he was really gracious with me. We hit it off right away because I think he walked into a situation that felt almost nearly impossible. And we did these promos before the show

started in like the weird month interim. And it's actually the same thing that I think maybe even endeared me to John Stewart. My audition for John Stewart, I think, went well partially because I could improvise with him as a comedian off script. And I didn't treat him as the Mount Rushmore John started. I dream as a comedian. And I think in a day-to-day job like that, like, we're here to do work. Can you handle it? Do I not have to worry about you? Great.

On set with Trevor, like, we fucked around. We improvised. We played. We did status games, comedy status games where I go high status, he goes low status. It's a really fun play for Trevor. He loved that. I wasn't afraid of him or sacrosanct around it. He wasn't inviting that, but I think the situation was in a way that is so alien for anybody coming in.

And so what was really fun was Trevor liked the spark of that. He liked being a comedian in the room there and was really open with everybody else as well because he brought in Roy and Ronnie and Desi and sort of at the time was like, I want comedians around me to play. And also this is wild. I'm sort of on this pedestal in this building

that has crafted everything to go through me, but also how do we play with this? So we tried improv stuff on the show or in rehearsals or he gave more freedom on field pieces because he, I think rightfully so, wanted us wanted a perspective on stuff but at some point he was like well you guys know what you're doing go i also kept yelling at him that the field pieces as they existed were so fucking boring it's like just let them fucking go dude just let them do a man i literally just like i showed him

chris rocks field pieces it was just like chris in harlem everyone's crazy well i wonder i mean that's where feel like fingers the pulse it might have been around that time what when were you in you I mean, you were in and out. 26, I think 16. Yeah. 16, 17, a little bit. Yeah. Again, I take no credit.

Like, it's because of me. But it was like, I needed, you know better than I do there, but I think he needed allies in the comedy world to help him trust what, not that he didn't need that. Again, part of his superpower is that he, he was confident up to execute that all the time. But you could see where, like, ally ship with doing bits with Roy here or there or where we could. or where we could riff on this. Yeah. Like, the one thing I wanted, when I was host, I realized when I had to hire 100 people to work for me

what became super clear. It was like, I'm hiring you if you can take one thing off my place. Can you fucking help me? That's the only question. Help me. It's like, yeah. It's like, you have that? Do I have, I have to see you in two weeks?

You just take care of that? Thank you. Can you find 90 other people who can take something off my plate? But that was it, you're like, oh, oh, right, that's what this is. You don't need a buddy. You don't need somebody to kiss your ass. You don't need somebody who wants to, has a million questions because they're being deferential. You need somebody who can get shit done?

Literally, do I, can I have a conversation with you? And the next time we talk, you handled it. You did it. Like a hit man. Guys, you just got fingered. Oh, see, do you like it? I love it. You love it.

I think that's how I'm going to end my show. That was Jordan Klepper. And I think we, I think it was a good. representation of who you are you think so yeah let's do a post-mortem real real quick yeah what do you think what what could I have I felt you know referencing Camus feels like it's very pretty that was rough but maybe I know but it's maybe it's no it wasn't very no I like I'd rather reference Camus than Carlin I mean I mean like I find I'd find there's so much comedy talk

shop talk about like philosophy or not not getting into it again but I would I I would argue I always, it's just easier. It's more fun to figure out artists who don't do comedy. I get so much more out of that. Give me a writer who does weird stuff and study that as opposed to a comedian who does it. Yeah. To me is more liberating and fun.

Yeah, I remember somebody going, why don't you date a comedian and me going like, being like, what, I got that. I'm good. Be like, why don't you date a free slam poet? But for what? That's not a thing. I need... I don't need that.

Jordan Klepper, ladies and gentlemen, the Klepp. The Klepp. They call him the Klep. They do. They've just started. They just... and it's never gonna stop. Mm-hmm. Go to his website. He's... go to his website.

Jordan Klepper. I should have said it earlier. They probably already went. If I know my audience, I mean, the show notes, they are in. They are in the show notes. They love the show notes. They're like a pig and show notes. I don't know how to end this.

You got finkered. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. We got fingers. Free spring.