Bookwild - Books That Got Us Into Reading, Changed Our Life and Changed Our Brain Chemistry with Gare Billings and Steph Lauer

Episode Date: August 16, 2024

This week, Gare and Steph and I talk about books that got us into reading, changed our lives, and changed our brain chemistry!Books That Got Us Into ReadingHeartsickThe Good GirlThe Fact of a Body Books That Changed Our LifeA Density of SoulsThe Seven Husbands of Evelyn HugoAnd Then She Was Gone Books That Changed Our Brain ChemistryThe ShardsThe Good DaughterThe Chain Gang All Stars Books We’re ReadingThe Lion Women of TehranThe Lies We ToldTalking to Strangers Follow us on Instagram:KateGareSteph Get Bookwild MerchCheck Out My Stories Are My Religion SubstackCheck Out Author Social Media PackagesCheck out the Bookwild Community on PatreonCheck out the Imposter Hour Podcast with Liz and GregFollow @imbookwild on InstagramOther Co-hosts On Instagram:Gare Billings @gareindeedreadsSteph Lauer @books.in.badgerlandHalley Sutton @halleysutton25Brian Watson @readingwithbrian 

I'm back with Steph and Gare, or as AI tried to name them, Stefan, Stefan Gare. That's so fancy. I know. That is so fancy. That would be like, I just picture Aaron Taylor Johnson as Stefan Gere. Because like if you combine us, he's got to be smoking hot. You're just, you've got him on the brain right now. I do because I just read a book and I thought he was a serial killer in it and he was not.

I just had a let him. What did you read? Tell us what you read? Well, I just read all the wrong places by Joy Fielding, and it's my first book by her. But it was very like soap opera drama, but it's about a serial killer in Boston who is trying to find victims on online dating sites. The cover is so cool. The cover is so cool. It was like fun. It kind of reminded me of like that. Valentine by Tom Savage and like a lifetime movie and like a little bit of like Desper Housewives. Because you have these like women that are like all connected. And like you're just like wondering which one's going to go.

You know? And you get like a little bit of an inside look into the killer. That's cool. What was the author's name? Joy Fielding. I love stuff getting her stuff. I know. stuff is walking there and I are sitting.

Well, my doctor told me that I should take like short walks when it's like not very hot or cold out. And I was like, okay, that's like two months of the year. And he's like, it'll be really, yeah, it's like really good for your pots. And I was like, okay, so I bought a walking pad just to like walk in front of the TV a half hour a day. It's been sitting in the box in my living room for two weeks now. I haven't even like opened it yet. I kind of want one too because the out of doors does not always do well with my lungs. It just doesn't do well with my personality.

That too. There's like bugs. It was only my dog's treadmill. It was not my truck. Your dog's treadmill? Treadmill trained. Your dog has to walk on a treadmill. Oh.

It's really cute. But I just started getting into it myself. Oh my god. Did you tread on? train your dog? I did not. She came that way. Her foster mom was a trainer. Oh my god. But since she doesn't really like other dogs, it's really a nice, like, backup. Yeah. That's so cool that they are treadmill trained. I can't even imagine having, but then again, Murphy is like the worst being dog. He's just bad. Like, he is so bad.

I've used to like a mental workout for them more than a physical one. that's yeah yeah that's what we saw a tic-tok that was talking about when dogs just want to sniff on a walk they're like it's like when they're just like having fun and it's like you scrolling tic-tok forever so now we're always like Harley just needs to scroll the grass yeah I try to do that but then every time I do that Murphy finds something in the grass and like is like nod on it and one time it was a dead dehydrated frog. And I was like screaming bloody murder

in a park where like all these kids are playing like softball or some shit and I'm like movie jump the frog what the fox? It was so scary. I told you this story so we like walk our dogs and like this there's just like a loop it's like a

it's like a shitty park basically around a bunch of warehouses but they're typically aren't dogs there. Um, and so one, this was a few summers ago when, I don't know, it doesn't matter. This was a few summers ago. And, um, there were a bunch of people parked in the parking lot. Like there were six cars that were basically just chilling there on their lunch break. And so I'm trying, I'm walking both of these dogs, both pivoles by myself.

And when we get back to like where there are a bunch of trees, um, they saw a squirrel. And we had been running a little bit because I was trying to burn their. energy really quickly. So they already have all the running momentum. They pull me towards the squirrel and they both go on opposite sides of the tree and I was like stuck smashed against a tree with my arms like crucifix style spread out. These people watching me, I'm just stuck wrapped around a tree. It like cut my arm open. I had to like walk back to the car with like blood coming down my arm. I'm like, this is so embarrassing. too many.

Yeah, you have a lot. No. My ankles still have not fully recovered. I have a good walking story from this week, and it kind of reminds me of like, did you guys watch Screen Queens with like Emma

Roberts? No. Okay, well, she plays the same character she plays in everything, like the bitchy, like brat, whatever. Which was me on Tuesday. I was... I went for a walk after work and it was like, it said it was like under 80, like it was like 77, 78. But it felt like it deceived me. Like when I got outside, I was like, it is hot as fuck out here.

So I start walking and I like go around this trail in the middle of nowhere by myself, nobody else is around. And then, oh my God, am I still there? Yeah. What happened? We see you. Oh. I don't know. I don't see myself anymore.

But okay. So I'm walking around this trail and I'm rage texting Kate because I had drama that I was dealing with this week and I just needed somebody to vent to. And I was like rage texting Kate walking like huffing and puffing like, like literally this guy like Ted Bundy style has his truck pulled over in the parking lot right next to my car. And he has his hood up and he's like, hey. could you? And I was like, I, no, I'm not, I, I can't help you with anything. And I keep rage texting. And I was like, basically like, no. And like, I just kept late sexy Kate with my headphones in, like, stomping away on this trail by myself going into the fucking woods. Oh my gosh. You just joined the serial killer. And like,

but like, when I went to, like, come back around, like, his truck was, like, gone. So I was like, first of all, if you're trying to kidnap me, like, you literally cannot just be like, can you help me with something automotive? Because I'm going to be like, no. I don't even, I've never even had my oil change. My dad does that for me. And, like, secondly, if you think that you are convinced that I'm going to help you with your engine, you're beyond out of your mind. If you see me walking and you think that I'm your only help, you're better off with, like, sending a smoke signal. Or like a flare gun would help you more than I would.

So, like, I don't know if I got, I don't know if I avoided a serial killer or this poor guy actually did need help. But, like, if I did avoid a serial killer, it was by far the bitchiest way to do it. Like, I was like, no, I can't help you. Lip on my triple A card. You're like, I don't talk to strangers. Yeah. I don't even have a triple A card. I've called it one time and he barely had any cell phone service and it would have taken them so long to get their.

that we ended up calling like a nearby gas station and it was way faster so I don't know I if anyone knows if it's worth it to keep it please let me know I don't know I don't know same you have an icebreaker I do have

an icebreaker and I'm really excited for it because I feel like it kind of jumps off from our last episode that the three of us did but like I said I read that book all the wrong places. And I was like, I'm excited for the new Fiona Barton book because it's something that's similar with this woman that they think may have gotten murdered from somebody

she met through online dating. And I was like, online dating in a thriller is like my new shit. Like I just think that's so cool and like clever. And so I was wondering if there is either a trope that you guys love to read in a thriller or there's a trope that you would like to see more in a thriller like something similar to how much I love like the online dating dangers in a thriller

well that is a good one I was so proud of myself I love it I am always always always always always a sucker for like taking down a corrupt system. I think that's kind of broad, but it kind of fits.

I like that. So like your fuck the patriarchy? Fuck the patriarchy. Fuck the cult. Fuck the whatever. Yeah. I love that too. You know, I feel like I was thinking about this recently,

but it will definitely not come to me now. But I recently I recently read it's not a thriller, but I really loved Margo's Got Money Troubles. It's a book that recently came out, and it does talk about, like, this woman who has a baby at a really young age, and she doesn't know how to support it, support her family, and she starts doing OnlyFans. And there's just like, and just like the dynamics of, like, how her family feels about it, how she goes about it. I think that it's really like relevant in today's world. So I think I'd be interested in reading more about that.

Yeah. I like that. Like sex work? Kind of. And just like how people like that's probably a really realistic way to make money. Like we were kind of talking about before we started recording. And so I think I maybe would be interested in reading. I was like we doubt.

We're going to start with me fans. am I just going to be verbally abusing people for money? It's just like I think I'm a really interesting trope to hear about in a thriller. Have you read the Deanna Madden series by A.R. Tor? Yeah, I have. I sure did. And I really loved it. I read the first two books and I'm still waiting to read the third one because I don't have it yet. But man, those are really good. But I would love that too. Yeah.

hurt from me by Heather Levy Levy Levy? Oh, yeah, that is a really good one too. Yeah. Oh, what's the name of that? Real Easy by Marie Rutkowski. I love that. I'm obsessed with that book. Holy shit.

I know. Wasn't there things we do in the dark by Jennifer Hillier? Yeah. she used to be or something right like a dancer maybe a dancer yes yeah I read that forever ago I did too I like I like the sex work trope I guess yeah I'm really interested in it now too because I feel like it is really common and there's like a little like a lot of different things under like sex work umbrella yeah that you could do um so that is really interesting oh my god yeah and I think it like I guess I got the idea from like a non-thriller, but it also worked well in like a

women's fiction, general fiction, kind of humor type way as well. So I play to a lot of audiences. I even like that plot device they, or the way they did it in Euphoria with Kat. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So I mean, love her. I know. I love her. I don't think she's coming back. What? She didn't come back for the second season, right? Or the... She wasn't in the most recent one.

Yeah. But she was, like, not in it hardly at all. Yeah. She lied about having a brain tumor so she could break up with that guy. Oh, yes. I thought you meant in real life. No, no, no. No, no.

I was like, oh, God. Well, you had a good idea from a TikTok for us to talk about it. I did. I did. We're just all of ideas for this episode. I had a really good idea, I think, because I saw a TikTok. But sometimes I see these TikToks and I'm like, oh, okay, like, that's a good one for, like, my TVR or like that would be fun for like an Instagram post. But like there are just some that really jump out at me that would be like perfect podcast episodes, especially with like the three of us. Because we're all besties.

so I'm going to think now I don't know who started this trend but the person that I saw her name is Erica E-R-I-C-K-A-W-T-H-A underscore C-K on TikTok

Erica with a check I don't know Erica with a C-K yeah oh that makes sense yeah like Eric has a check I don't know she wants to make a lot of money Yeah, thanks Erica. She had done this trend that was like a book that changed her life, a book that altered her brain chemistry, and then a book that got her, what do I have balloons? I don't know what happened last time, too.

And then the book that got her into reading. So I thought those would be really fun for us to discuss. discuss in the thriller fiction genre, whatever we want to read. Because, yeah, I feel like we talk a lot about books that like we recently read that we loved or like upcoming things or what we read recently. But like these are things that we don't really talk about a lot, like what got us into reading and stuff. So yeah, that was my idea.

I love it. Endless scrolling on TikTok. I love TikTok so much. me too yeah well do you want to start off with the book that got you into reading sure I will um so I went through we talked about this earlier before we started recording but um I went through my good reads to see like what I had like when I started keeping track of what I read and after pretty little liars I like dove right into like hardcore thrillers that were like super twisty.

So the one book that I can remember that got me really into reading thrillers that were like super dark and kind of like put me on the path that I'm still on today is heart sick by Chelsea Cain. And it is about a damaged Portland detective named Archie Sheridan who spent 10 years tracking down Gretchen Loll a beautiful serial killer. But in the end, she was the one who caught him. So two years ago, Gretchen kidnapped Archie and tortured him for 10 days, but instead of killing him, she mysteriously decided to let him go. She turned herself in, and now Gretchen has been locked away for the rest of her life, while Archie is in a prison of another kind, addicted to pain pills, unable to return to his old life, and powerless to those 10 horrific days

and getting them off his mind. Archie's a different person, his estranged wife says, and he knows she's right. He continues to visit Gretchen in prison once a week, saying that only he can get her to confess to the whereabouts of more of her victims, but even he knows the truth, he just can't stay away. When another killer begins snatching teenage girls off the streets in Portland, Archie has to pull himself together enough to lead the new task force investigating the murders.

A hungry newspaper reporter Susan Ward begins profiling Archie in the investigation, which sparks a deadly game between Archie, Susan, the new killer, and even Gretchen. I remember you talking about this one like forever ago. This was so fucking long. I was like, I'm reading you guys the first three chapters. Yeah, it's a six book series. That's what I thought it was a series. Oh, M.G.

Yeah. It's so good. That sounds really good. So good. It's like, it's like that TV show The Killing combined with like, like, like basic instinct. Ooh. It's just so good.

It's so good. Yeah. It's got like the, it's got like the dangerous femme fatal like serial killer vibe and her because like she's so terrifying. Yeah. You can tell why like men and I'm sure women as well like

would want her. Yeah. But women are smarter than men so I'm sure a lot of the women like sniffed out her bullshit. But like Archie's like obsessed with her and like you can kind of see why and then there's like the journalist aspect and it's just so good. That sounds really nice. Yeah. So that's my first one that like really got me into reading dark thrillers.

It sounds dark. It was so dark and I loved it. Yeah. Well, mine. Well, first of all, I definitely have talked about Gone Girl and the Kind Worth Killing. a lot in answer to that question recently. I got asked it on another podcast. So I was like, can I just pick another one around the same time?

And so one, or the one that I picked that I probably picked up shortly after those is the good girl by Mary Kubica. So good. So good. So snaps for this one is one. is one night Mia Dennett enters a bar to meet her on again, off again, boyfriend. But when he doesn't show, she unwisely leaves with an enigmatic stranger. At first, Colin Thatcher seems like a safe one-night stand, but following Colin home will turn out to be the worst mistake of Mia's life. When Colin decides to hide Mia in a secluded cabin in rural Minnesota, instead of delivering her to his

employers, Mia's mother, Eve, and a detective gave Hoffman will stop at nothing to find them. But no one could have predicted the emotional entanglements that eventually caused this family's world to shatter. I just remember the twist at the end, just like, jaw-dropping, being like, what the fuck just happened? And it's really, the end of that is really bleak. It is really bleak. It's like I knew I was going to meet you one.

Wednesday. That's really funny too because that was one of the books I used to post on my personal Instagram when I like would post about reading. And I had like so many people come up to me and say like I read that book because you recommended it and like you should recommend more books to people. So like that is so cool. The good girl by Mary Kubica is like like if I if I hadn't read that book I probably wouldn't be on bookstagram. Oh my gosh. I'm so glad I picked it. I know. That's so cool yeah that was I think it was the first of hers that I read it was actually it made me a Mary Kubica fan yeah yeah it's so good it's so good and she just delivers every time she does it is a full castile though anyone wants to listen to them oh that's cool I had kind of a sexy voice

sign me up I was like okay and then I like I was like I hope things happen so I like I'm having a hard I'm having a hard time

with this one so I'll say this I almost think of a silent patient because it was my first book I read in one day but this one actually I read right before that and I remember thinking it was like an really like a five-star read for me.

It was called the fact of a body by Alexandria Marzano Lesnevich and it's categories as a memoir but I think it's kind of a mix. So before

Alex Marzano Lesnevich begins a summer job at a law firm in Louisiana working to help defend men accused of murder, they think their position is clear. The child of two lawyers, they're staunchly anti-death penalty. But the moment convicted murderer, Ricky Langley's face flashes on the screen as they review old tapes, the moment they hear him speak of his crimes,

they're overcome with the feeling of wanting him to die. God, this sounds really dark. Okay. That's the TBR. Yeah. Shocked by their reaction, they dig deeper and deeper into the case. Despite their vastly different circumstances, something in the story is unsettlingly, uncannily familiar. crime, even in the darkest and most sayable acts, can happen to any one of us. As Alex pours over the facts of the murder, they find themselves thrust into the complicated narrative of Ricky's childhood, and by examining the details of Ricky's case, they are forced to face their own story, to unearth long-buried family secrets and reckon with a past that colors their view of Ricky's crime.

But another surprise awaits. They weren't the only one who saw their life in Rickies. An intellectual and emotional thriller that is also a different kind of murder story, the fact of a body is a book not only about how the story of one crime was constructed, but about how we grapple with our own personal histories. Along the way, it tackles questions about the nature of forgiveness, if a single narrative can ever contain something as definitive as the truth. This groundbreaking heart-stopping work, 10 years in the making, shows how the law is more personal than we would like to believe, and the truth more complicated

and more powerful than we could ever imagine. That was also a really long sentence. That sounds deep. That sounds so good. Um, it was, so now that I'm reading that, I remember loving it so much because I really love books that make, like, challenge your way of thinking and make us realize that so much is like, kind of gray and not black and white. Like, if you have a really strong opinion of something, like, then you meet somebody that's been through something and you're like, wow, now I have like some empathy and compassion. Right. So it was, I think it's like a little, my thing is, as I don't know how much of it is exactly a memoir.

I think some of it is dramatized. But I'm not sure. Because it's been like four years. Well, it sounds really good. Yeah. I highly recommend. It's one of those books that it's like, when you read something, what? I don't know what's going on with your camera, Kate.

Anyway, that book sounds amazing. You go ahead. I similarly love books that get into the gray. Yeah, I think that there's, you know, those books that you read like in the beginning of your reading journey and you're not sure like if you read it again where it would like how you would feel about it. Yes. And so part of me just wants to like leave it on the. this like pedestal but I actually do think I would like still really enjoy it. It was just one of the first murdery books I read I think. Yeah. Yeah. Now I want to read Heart Sick again and the book that

you recommended. Sweet. The fact of a body. The fact of a body. I hope you're enjoying this episode of Book Wild and if you are, could I ask you a favor? Could you go and rate and review this podcast and whatever platform you're listening? Ratings and reviews make the biggest difference in discoverability of the podcast. And I definitely want to find all of our fellow thriller readers out there. So if you could go rate the podcast and leave a short review, that would make a huge difference. Thank you. And let's get back to the show. I feel like there was like something that I read, but you know how horrible my memory is. But there was like another book that came out around this like same time. And it was like a memoir about like a woman who's like

friend was murdered. Oh. And I think it said something about a body. Sounds familiar, but I'll never think of it. I'll never think of it. I haven't read a ton of memoirs. I read a few celebrity memoirs. I had a celebrity memoir kick while I listened to them. Those are fun when they read them when the celebrities read them. Yeah.

Yeah. I want to read the Demi Moore one. Did you see that Britney Spears is getting made into a biopic? I mean, I don't know how you couldn't have seen it. Yeah, I did see that. It's everywhere. I am very interested to see who they cast. I know.

Yeah. That would be a tough one, kind of. There's this girl on TikTok who is doing like me posting every day until I get an audition for it. And I just like, I like respect it so much too. So she's just like doing different Brittany choreography from the years over the years. and she just like wants to be an actress and is a dancer. And I so badly want her, she probably won't be because they'll probably put a huge person in the role. But I so badly want it for her so that I can be like, I saw her TikToks.

I knew her before she was famous. Yeah. I feel like it's going to be Sidney Sweeney. I heard the short list is Sydney Sweeney, I can't, Sabrina Carpenter. Um, someone said Margaret Qualey was included and that seems like an odd choice. Oh, yeah. Who knows? I don't know if she like acts, but like I could see like Tate McCray.

That was the other one. Yeah, Tate was on the short list. How she dances reminds like of her and Brittany. So similar. Mm-hmm. Yeah. She would be great. Yeah, she would.

We'll see. Yeah. Well, what book changed your life? Yeah. Oh. Oh. It's my sad book. Oh.

I would not be a reader if it was not for the book. A Density of Souls by Christopher Rice. I have never sobbed as much during a book as this one. I've never had so many devastating moments. This book is so bleak. There's a lot of trigger warnings, but it's just so good. It's about four childhood friends in present-day New Orleans that are torn apart by envy, passion, and a secret murder. Five years ago, Meredith, Brandon, Greg, and Stephen quickly discover the fragile boundaries between friendship and betrayal as they enter high school and form new alliances.

Meredith, Brandon, and Greg gain popularity, while Stephen is. is viciously treated as an outcast. When two violent deaths destroy the already delicate bonds of their friendship, the friends are drawn back together. New facts about their mutual history are exposed and what was held to be tragic accident is revealed as a murder. As the true story emerges, other secrets begin to unravel with more dangerous, far-reaching consequences.

Yeah. I read this book when I was in high school. That's what I thought. That's what I was about to ask. Was that his first one that you read? It was his first book that I were came out. That's what I thought too. Yeah.

Yeah. And I was, I think it came out in 2001, maybe. But yeah, it's just, I mean, it's probably one of the most powerful books I've ever read, but it also has like a huge cast that's all going through something completely different and like how their lives intertwine. And like it follows over like years and years into their. their lives, it's just so good. It's so good. But it's bleak as fuck. Which is why you love it.

It's, there's like violence, there's sexual assault. There's a lot of deaths. This is how I felt reading the women of the line women of Tehran this week. Eating disorders, domestic violence, and. Basically, if any trigger warning matters. to you, it might not be for you. True. True.

True. Yeah. I think a lot of our listeners probably don't have too many, though. But I don't even think I have a baby on this cover, the author. Like, you seem so young when he wrote this. I think he was like very young when he wrote. Like, I think he was like 20 or 20. No.

No. He's like, I think he was like. I follow him on TikTok. Well, he and Instagram, but he's, he's kind of funny. He's so nice. He's so nice. yeah but yeah I still need to read that one

yeah what was the first why can't I think of the series of his that I read 22 he was the Burning Girl series that's what it is Burning Girl not Blood Girl I was like that does not sound right

there's probably a Blood Girl series too somewhere probably we could write it we could well interestingly enough i kind of chose my what book changed my life off of similar criteria because it is the book that it was the first book i cried like sobbed in sobbed reading sobbed in i don't know sobbed reading um and it's the seven husbands of evelyn hugo

and i also feel like it changed my life because it was the first book that also opened me up to non-thrillers for the most part that made me like okay maybe I should consider them sometimes I feel like people probably know what it's about but maybe someone doesn't so aging and reclusive Hollywood movie icon Evelyn Hugo is finally ready to tell the truth about her glamorous and scandalous life but when she chooses unknown magazine reporter Monique Grant for the job no one is more astounded than Monique herself why her why now Monique is not exactly on top of the world. Her husband has left her and her professional life is going nowhere.

Regardless of why Evelyn has selected her to write her biography, Monique is determined to use this opportunity to jumpstart her career. Summoned to Evelyn's luxurious apartment, Monique listens in fascination as the actress tells her story. From making her way to Los Angeles in the 1950s to her decision to leave show business in the 80s and of course the seven husbands along the way, Evelyn unspools a tale of ruthless ambition, unexpected friendship, and a great forbidden love. Monique begins to feel a very real connection to the legendary star, but as Evelyn's story nears its conclusion, it becomes clear that her life intersects with Monique's own in tragic and irreversible ways. I forgot that that was in the synopsis, that their lives crossed over. I was going to say, there's definitely like a reveal, even though it's not a thriller.

Yeah. Yeah. There were, honestly, though, there were a few reveals in that book that I did not see coming. Yes. I agree. So. And it is just, oh, my gosh, it's so, I have a fly terrorizing me. I keep getting distracted.

Terrorizing me. Tara. As you're talking about your non-thriller, you're like, you're like, you're like, I'm like, that's on some drama to it. And I'm like. But yeah. I, I, I, it was the. first one, it was the first book I'd read in years of only reading thrillers. And I sobbed like a freaking baby through multiple parts of the end of it. I think I cried more in Daisy Jones in the

six, but TJR can make me cry. Taylor Jenkins read in case anyone didn't know, I think I didn't say that part. I remember reading that one, I think, in a day as well. I definitely read it. quickly. Didn't think that I was going to love it as much as everybody thought I was. Yeah. I felt similar. Yeah. It's one of those books where I was like, oh, everybody loves it so much.

Like, I wonder, like, maybe kind of like you're saying, is it going to be as amazing as everyone says it is? It can't be that amazing. And then you read it and you're like, okay, it's amazing. All right. There's a reason for this. Yeah. I also love when it's something that gets you out of the genre that you usually read. Yeah.

Like I talk about the book, The Paper Palace all the time because that's like what I like got me out of like only reading thrillers. Because I was like, I don't think I'm going to like this. And my friend was like, I think you will. And then I was like, I'm not going to like this. And then all of a sudden I was like, this is one of the books that like I will forever hold dear to my heart. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I got, did you hear about Kitty Carr because I read? Actually, because I joined Taylor Jenkins reads, uh, email this. And she, like, emailed about that book, and that's one of my favorites of all time. You're going to get a TJR tattoo when I get my Jessica Null tattoo. Do it. Yes. That or maybe, and then we can get matching Ashley Winstead once. True.

True. Yeah. She would love that so much, I think. I know. She would probably go with us and hold our hands while we got tattooed, like, just like for emotional support. We can go to Texas. We can go, we can go to her and get tattooed. Done.

I heard Houston has really good food. Oh, yeah. Sold even more. Yeah, I was like, you didn't have to keep selling me. Yeah. I'm like, my comfort show right now is Top Chef and I just watched the Houston one. I was like, got to go there. Okay.

Mmm. I wasn't like, oh yeah, take me to Texas. Then I was like, okay, food is good. Yeah. So when we all get famous, that can be our first live podcast when we go on like a podcast. when we go on like a podcast tour. Okay. Yes.

I'm down. Me too. Oh, that would be so cool. I know. Steph shows up with her treadmill to every like episode. I get my 10,000's going off. Okay. So mine is actually a,

it's kind of action-y, but it's not a thriller, really. I picked chain gang all-stars for mine. I picked it because I truly felt like it altered my brain chemistry in a way during my reading experience. I, there's like a lot of characters that you kind of hit a lot of different, like once I read the synopsis, you'll tell that it's based around these like people in prison who are fighting for their freedom. And it's like a money making event, almost like the NFL. And so you see the perspective of fans and athletes and the prison guards and the prisoners. And so you,

there's so many different perspectives that you read that I had to like put it down sometimes and I almost thought do I not like this and then I realized I just had to take time to process it like I had to take breaks and I've never experienced that in a book before that even if you're enjoying it you still have to take breaks yeah it was so crazy and then all of a sudden like everyone else I was crying really hard so I'm just So the synopsis is two top women gladiators fight for their freedom within a depraved private prison system not so far removed from America's own. Loretta Thurwar and Hamara Hurricane Stack's Stacker are the stars of chain gang all-stars, the cornerstone of Cape or criminal action penal entertainment, a highly popular, highly controversial profit-raising program in America's increasingly dominant private prison industry. It's the return of the gladiators and prisoners are competing for the ultimate prize, their freedom. In Cape, prisoners travel as lynx and chain gangs, competing in death matches for packed arenas with righteous protesters at the gates. Therwar and Stacks, both teammates and lovers, are the fan favorites, and if all goes well, Therwar will be free in just a few matches. A fact she carries as heavily as her lethal hammer. As she prepares to leave her fellow links, she considers her.

how she might help preserve their humanity in defiance of these so-called games. But Cape's corporate owners will stop at nothing to protect their status quo, and the obstacles they lay in Thurwar's path have devastating consequences. Moving from the links in the field to the protectors, to the Cape employees, and beyond, chain gang All-Stars is a kaleidoscopic... I don't know that word. You said it right, though. You do know it. Are you?

E-X-C-O-R-I-A-T-I-N-G. Look at the American prison systems on holy alliance of systemic racism, un-tectualism, mass incarceration, and a clear-eyed reckoning with what freedom in this country really means. So it's really interesting because reading this, I'm like, this is not a book for you, in the sense that, like, it's very action-packed and a little, like, near future in things.

that like don't always work for me just like my brain can't always comprehend like near future machines or things that are being described um but it actually ended up really working for me so i really want to read that one i've got amazing things about it yeah you get so like certain relationships between the prisoners and like do i want my freedom or do i care about the person next to me. And then like these fans that are like, this is disgusting, but then they binge watch it like any other reality TV show and all of a sudden they're super into it. And you're like, but it is kind of disgusting. Like it's just wild. Yeah. It seems like R-rated Hunger Games. Yeah. Meets Orange is the New Black. Yeah. Yes. Yep.

Nice. We should be blurbs. We did that. Oh, yeah. Blurbies. We'd all be good for that. Blur babies. That's what you name our group chat. Blur babies. Oh my God. It shun.

I love it. I'm obsessed. Yeah. Same. What's the last one? Well, I think you did. I think you did the book that altered your brain chemistry.

That was that one. Was that supposed to be last? Yeah. So you did the last one. Yeah, and I were like trying that I thought I was, I could keep it together, but then I would see him smiling too. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. Were you guys to the one that changed your life?

Yeah. Yes. Did that for last, baby. The good news is they're pretty similar, like changing your brain chemistry, pretty similar. I know, but honestly, they kind of are similar. But whoopsies. Yeah.

Yeah. So I guess what also did your brain chemistry gear? Oh, yeah. Sort of gear. What altered your brain chemistry? This episode. The episode of this podcast has altered my brain chemistry, and I realize that the three of us need to be together constantly. So.

Okay. I picked I don't know how to explain how this like altered my brain chemistry but the shards by Brett Easton Ellis who changed something in me when it comes to like reading because I love that

it's kind of loosely based off from certain aspects of his life in a sense that like the main character's name is Brett and he lives in Los Angeles but there's like a serial killer aspect to this, and there's so much going on between the characters that I was like, I think this is how some people would be in real life and the sense of like, usually in a thriller, it's like, there's a serial killer on the loose and whoever you're following is like, I'm terrified.

What if I'm next? What if my friend's next? But like with this one, it's like there are certain times where it impacts his life. And then there are certain times where like you and him, like, just don't give a shit about a serial killer because there's so much going on. So the shards by Brett Easton Ellis is set in vibrantly fictionalized Los Angeles in 1981 as a serial killer begins targeting teenagers throughout the city. 17-year-old Brett is a senior at the exclusive Buckley Prep School when a new student arrives with a mysterious past. Robert Mallory is bright, handsome, charismatic, and shielding a secret from Brett and his friends, even as he becomes part of their tightly knit. circle. Brett's obsession with Mallory is equaled by his increasingly unsettling preoccupation with

the trawler, a serial killer on the loose who seems to be drawing ever closer to Brett and his friends, taunting them and Brett in particular with grotesque threats and horrific, sharply local acts of violence. The coincidences are uncanny, but they also filtered through the imagination of a teenager whose gifts for constructing narrative from the filaments of his own life are about to make him one of the most explosive literary sensations of this generation. So, yeah. Dude, what's crazy? Something you said about a density of souls reminded me of the shards, and I almost

mentioned it earlier. So when you just said that, I was like, holy shit. That's awesome. When I was trying to pick, I was, like, thinking of, like, different books that I, like, changed my brain chemistry in a sense of, like, how I am as a reader. but like this is one of those stories that like stuck with me so much because like I could see this being what happens through the eyes of a 17 year old high school student because like kids under the age of like 20 think that they're invincible yeah so like there's times where he's like

oh I'm going to go out and party and I'm going to do this and like who's got the drugs and who am I going to hook up with and it's like there's a serial killer out there but like you are so lost in your high school mind that like you do not think that this affects you and even when it starts to affect you you just think that you're like like it's never going to like harm you yeah yeah that's a really cool perspective thanks you're welcome what makes that book even more trippy is that he reads the audio so like he reads it exactly how he it like it just makes it even more almost like a memoir in a way like yeah And like the way he says Robert Mallory will be ingrained in my brain forever.

But that book is like probably 16 to 20 hours plus and I like couldn't get enough of it. I was like, please keep reading to me. Like I love you. Yeah. So good. It was so good. I think I have three copies of it. Nice.

And it is humongous. Yeah. Like if you can see this yellow book right here, that's one of them. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. It's so long. It's such a long book. And I read it on Christmas. Like, I was reading it, like, as my, like, cozy, like, Christmas Eve, Christmas Day read. And I was like, this is perfect. Yeah.

This is perfect. That's awesome. I just love that book so much. And it's one that I really want to reread sometime, but it's a billion pages. It is. Yeah. Well, mine, as I was just scrolling through my, this fly, man, I almost knocked the mic over. This one, the way it changed my brain chemistry was, I think this was the first one where, like, something so graphic happened that I had to just like pause for a second. just because like the darkness is so much in the good daughter by Karen Slaughter. It's also long. It's 528 pages.

Damn. So two girls are forced into the woods at gunpoint. One runs for her life. One is left behind. 28 years ago, Charlotte and Samantha Quinn's happy small town family life was torn apart by a terrifying attack on their family home. It left their mother dead. left their father, Pikeville's notorious defense attorney, devastated, and it left the family

fractured beyond repair, consumed by secrets from that terrible night. Twenty-eight years later, Charlotte has followed in her father's footsteps to become a lawyer herself, the ideal good daughter. But when violence comes to Pikeville again, and a shocking tragedy leaves the whole town traumatized, Charlotte is plunged into a nightmare. Not only is she the first witness on the scene, but it's a case that unleashes a terrible memory she spent so long trying to suppress because the shocking truth about the crime that destroyed her family nearly 30 years ago won't stay buried forever. That's another one where like there's a lot of trigger warnings. I won't say them necessarily, but there was, I think it was like the first time I got to a scene and I was like,

ouch, kind of like I need a moment. I felt nauseous. Yeah. I felt really nauseous. It is stuck in my head. But she just writes darkness so well. Yes, she does. Yes, she does. Did you read Pretty Girls? I did. Yeah.

I feel like I read that one before. And, like, I know that one had a lot in it, too. But I think this one still, like, there's just one scene that stands out so much. Yeah. There's that scene that stands out for the good. daughter was my first Karen Slaughter book that I read. Oh, wow. Yeah.

And I think it was my second. I was like, wow, this is really dark. And then I got to that scene that you're talking about. And I was like, did I just read what I think I just read? And it was very intense. And then pretty girls, I was a little bit more disturbed. I was a little bit more disturbed with pretty girls because there's an aspect that I find extremely disturbing. Oh, yeah.

Do you want to cut it? Yeah, go for it. I have my book that changed my life. There we go. So I had just a little like pass in probably between 2019, I was like I'm going to try and start reading and scrolling less. It was not that successful. I found some good books like love the silent patient, the fact of the body, but it just never worked. And I think it's because I realized I wasn't reading my genre.

And so then I was on a vacation and I brought, then she was gone by Lisa Jewel. And that was in April of 2022. And that like, I have never stopped reading, joined Bookstagram. So I will credit her as the queen who like really got me back into reading. And so that changed my life. Yeah. Because like, hey, I'm on with you guys now. because one day

and decided to keep going. So Ellie Mac was the perfect daughter and then she was gone. Ten years after Ellie's disappearance, her mother, Laurel Mack, is trying to put her life back together when she meets an unexpectedly charming man in a cafe. Before she knows it,

she's meeting Floyd's daughters and his youngest, Poppy, takes Laurel's breath away. Because the eerily precocious Poppy is the spitting image of Ellie. And now the unanswered questions she's tried so hard to put to rest, begin haunting Laurel anew. Where did Ellie go?

Did she run away from home as the police have long suspected, or did something more sinister happen? Then she was gone as a gripping and emotionally resonant tale of one mother's quest to uncover the clues she failed to recognize and finally discover the truth of what happened to her daughter. The more I think about it, I didn't really realize it as I was reading it, was how dark it is. It is. Yeah.

The ending. Yeah. is heavy and bleak. Yeah, when you find out what happened, it's like, oh my God. Yeah. Yeah. So I think as I was reading it, you know when you're reading something and you're just like turning the pages and you're like, wow, this is crazy. This is good. Like, I'm into this.

And then you look back on it, you're like, that shit was dark. Oh, my God. She has like a way of like really sneaking up on you with like how dark her books can get. Yeah. It's really crazy. Oh. Kate. Mom. Mom, Mom?

Does it still record? Yeah, because it doesn't on my end. Yeah, me either. I'll just edit this one. Do you imagine? I don't know. It's just a clip of all of us laughing and me going,

oh. Yeah. I'm feeling my face. I did. I thought it was really cloudy all day today, but apparently it's not, because I thought I was just like hot or laughing really hard, but I think I'm actually sunburned. I feel like, I feel like your face is getting tanner from when he started recording to like now. Earlier today, and I'm just like, wow, I thought that it was like not. Sometimes the UV index is high even when it's cloudy.

Yeah. I know. Some moron that didn't put on sunscreen. when I'm like, everyone should put on sunscreen. Yeah, whatever. I do the same thing. One time, my friend for her Bachelorette party, they went whitewater rafting. And I was like, I had my sunscreen on, but there was like a little break from like my hairline here in the helmet.

And my head got wet. So I had like a sunburn right here, like a strip. And I was like, this is the worst thing of my entire life. I should have just not worn it at all. Yeah. Oh, we go. That experience as a a bachelorette experience?

I had the most fun I have ever had in my entire life whitewater rafting. Really? With a ton of people. The only thing that made me nervous is that I thought I was going to be like the odd man out because I was the only guy there

but also like the only one who nobody would ever imagine going whitewater rafting. I'm shocked. The girl is right. The girl. next to me was like freaking out and the thing is is like when they give you your paddle they're like keep your hand on

the top of the tea because if you hit a wave and your paddle goes up and your hands not on top you could knock people's teeth out with the handle and she kept like taking her hand off and her paddle was flying and I was like if you knock any like fucking teeth have been going on so that was the only thing that scared me but like

honestly I had such a blast that like it was I think the summer before COVID because we were supposed to go like the summer of 2020 and like we had to cancel everything but it was so much fun because if someone asked me to do that I'd be like are you sure we're close enough that like I'm going to your bachelor at party but like then when you say it's fun I'm like oh okay maybe it's maybe it'd be fun I don't know yeah she and I were really good friends um at the time that she got married so like she was like I know that you're not in my wedding and you're

just going to be coming as a guest, but like my whole family loves you and like everybody who's going really likes you. So like, you might as well just come and go whitewater rafting. And I was like, I'll go. I'm not going to go whitewater rafting now. That's not me. And then like all of a sudden I was on there and like everybody got knocked out of my boat at one point except for me and the instructor. Well, that's shady. Yeah. I was like, we hit like a wave and he's like, I went back like this. And he's like, your head touched the water and decided that like you were just like, I'm not going in there and like you came right back up and like everybody else just like

flew out. Oh my gosh. Am I good at this? But I was like so are you saying like am I going to be in the Olympics for Whitewater Rafting? Because like Is this going? Yeah, so you're saying I'm a pro. Oh my God. That's awesome.

I don't know that I would do very well. I don't know. And then, but then I hear good things. So maybe I should just try it. I mean, it was definitely. an easy course. Don't get me wrong. Like, I'm not like the river wild with Merrill Streep. Like, I'm like literally like an easy, easy course. Like the black, I'm on the black diamond. Yeah, yeah. I'm just like, I'm like, I was like on the bunny hill of white water rafting. Yeah. Oh my gosh. I'm a skeet in forever.

Me either. Before we go, can we talk about what we're reading right now? Because I'm like your, or you can stop recording it or. You can stop recording it. I don't know, whatever it works for you, but I'm just curious to hear what you're reading. I love it. Me too. I know it's really random, but I thought of, like, the books I just finished, and Gare just posted about both of them. And so I was like, oh, I'm going to talk about it. So I'm technically, like, literally just finished a book.

So I'm just going to talk about that. I mean, not like any of you would have, like, known that I was lying or something. Thanks. Oh, man. You're like, I saw you posted your review already. But, okay, also because I think this is kind of a fun story and it adds to the podcast lore, I was supposed to have an interview with an author on Monday. And I logged on and someone else's name appeared in the Riverside studio.

And I was like, I don't know who Marjon Kamal. is. So basically her publicist added who the person who I was supposed to interview, she added the interview to Marjan's calendar. And so long story short, I was like, I could, I basically had to tell her all of this. Like I haven't read your book, but I just read your synopsis and like I totally talked to you about it. And she was like, what if we just reschedule? So that is how I ended up reading the lion women of Tehran by Marjan Kamali. And it is, I'm trying to like think, it's about two women. It spans their whole life from like seven to 80. They meet when they're seven. And it's their, the whole story of their lives living in Iran during the 50s and the 80s

when women's rights just like disappeared overnight, basically, when the religious fundamentalists took over and, like, exiled the Shah. So it's basically about these two women, and one kind of comes from the wealthier class, and one doesn't. And one is a really active, She's like very politically active and like so passionate about justice. I loved her dearly, if you can't tell. I loved Homa so much. But it's kind of how they both deal with their journeys through life differently. One is not as politically active when one is.

And their lives are very different, but they just stay friends through all of it. And it is extremely heavy, like extremely heavy and sad through almost, all of it, but her writing is beautiful. So it's like nothing like any of the books I ever talk about on here, but her writing is stunning. I love that that accident happened and then you found this book that you love. Yeah. I know. It's like it's a five star. It's so emotional, but it's definitely a five star for me. And the cover's cool as hell. The cover's very cool. And I, I just love, I love Homa so much. It's the main character's friend, but she, I loved her so much.

Aww. Yeah. What about you? What are you reading stuff? Well, I just finished two kind of salacious. I finished the Hollywood assistant by May Cobb, and then I finished listening to it had to be you by Eliza Jane Brazier. And that was juicy on audio.

I'll tell you that right now. Oh my God. Right. I bet it was. And then I just started because I heard of it from this podcast. Ooh. It's called Camilla Way, the lies we tell. Oh, yes.

It's got a purple cover. I think you talked about it like one or two times. And I was like writing that down. And then. That sounds so familiar. Yeah. It's the call. Wait, I don't think that's completely.

The lines were told. Here it is. I feel like I know what she's talking about. The lies we told. Oh, yes. Yeah, I totally remember that cover. Yeah. Yeah.

So it's about, it's multiple timelines. I'm maybe only like 10% in, but I'm into it so far. The first line was like about a beheaded little bird. I don't remember that part. It was like, holy shit. And then I was like, okay, I guess we're having, like a creepy kids trope into that. Love that.

Very much. So I'm interested to see where this goes. Yeah. Me too. You really, the Hollywood assistant and it had to be you back to back really would be salacious. Damn. I know. There's some good stuff in there.

Mm-hmm. Well, May Cobb's books are like 400 pages and I'm just like, I probably, if I didn't have stuff to do, could have just sat there and read it so quickly. I feel the same way about her books. Yeah. Like, they're 400 pages, but I'm like, where is it all going? Because, like, all of a sudden I'm on page 200 and I'm just like, I'm not stopping. Yeah.

And then, like, the thrillery, like, there are some flashbacks that happened really quickly, but I would say it happens in maybe the last third where really like kind of the thrillery part starts. But I'm like, I didn't even care. I was, like, so into it. Yeah, I was so invested. Yeah. I'm starting talking to strangers by Fiona Barton. And it's about a woman.

who gets murdered on Valentine's Day and this like detective thinks that the man that she went on a date with that she met online could be the killer but like the local people are kind of divided where like half of them are like

we need to protect women against violence and then the other half are like if you go on a date with a stranger you meet on an internet and you get murdered you kind of deserve it and then there's like this journalist who is like Courtney Cox and Scream where she like, I'm going to get to the bottom of this no matter what.

And I think that she's going to, like, try to, like, go on this internet dating to see if she can find the killer. Ooh. Nice. It sounds really good. And the cover is, like, creepy as fuck. It is. Yeah, I just looked it up.

I love black and white. Me too. Me too. Oh, you are. You're wearing it. My little Binnieana Republic t-shirt. You what? Yeah.

I'm obsessed with Fiona Barton. I actually have... all of her hard covers right here next to me. And now I can add this another one to my collection. The Widow. The Widow by Fiona Barton is one of my favorite endings to a book. I still haven't read any of her books. Oh, she's good.

She is good. I thought I'd read one, but I don't think I have now that I look. Yeah, the Widow is really, really, really good. Like there's like, just like the last chapter, you're like, fuck yes yeah it's so good it's always good

like the whole time I was like oh this is like pretty good it's pretty interesting and then like all of a sudden in the end happened and I was like that was a fucking masterpiece nice

isn't it cool when books there's some there's been a couple books this year I feel like that that's happened yeah it was such a bad influence I remember

oh yeah I think I don't know all of you I don't know if I read that one. I don't remember you talking about it. I don't think I have. Like, whoa, was it? The ending to the teacher by Frieda McFadden really fucked me up.

I've heard. Yeah. It's wild. It's really, it's really fucking crazy. And I was like, this woman does not give a shit what she puts in her books. Like, she's like, everyone's awful in my book. Thanks.