Bookwild - Good for Her, Female Rage, and Sisterhood: Molly Fader's Lady X

Episode Date: July 14, 2026

In this episode, I talk with Molly Fader about her ragey, dual-timeline thriller Lady X! Listen to hear all about: How her teenage daughter and Taylor Swift inspired the story. Molly shares how frustration with real-world misogyny, a personal experience involving her daughter, and one song combined to spark the idea for Lady X.  A thoughtful conversation about women's anger—and why we're often taught to suppress it. We discuss how patriarchy, complicity, female rage, and why stories about women standing together feel especially powerful today. The fascinating research behind 1970s New York City. Learn how Son of Sam, the 1977 blackout, Studio 54, and virtual pandemic walking tours helped bring the novel's gritty dual timeline to life. Behind-the-scenes of Molly's writing process. From plotting entire endings before drafting to rewriting emotional scenes until the anger felt authentic, Molly shares how she builds her novels. A nuanced discussion about morally gray women, celebrity culture, and public judgment. We dive into why readers react so differently to characters like Margot and why society is often quicker to blame women than the men who betray them.   Check Out Author Social Media PackagesCheck out the Bookwild Community on PatreonCheck Out My Stories Are My Religion SubstackGet Bookwild MerchFollow @imbookwild on InstagramOther Co-hosts On Instagram:Gare Billings @gareindeedreadsSteph Lauer @books.in.badgerlandHalley Sutton @halleysutton25Brian Watson @readingwithbrianMacKenzie Green @missusa2mba 

This week I got to talk with Molly Fader about her revenge-fueled book, Lady X, that you are all going to love. Here's a short synopsis of it. After a public betrayal by her movie star husband, Margo Cooper returns to her childhood home and uncovers evidence suggesting her mother may have been the original Lady X, a legendary vigilante who disappeared decades earlier. As Margo investigates, a parallel story reveals how a group of women in 1977 New York accidentally. sparked a vigilante movement that spiraled into violence, leaving behind a mystery that still echoes into the present. This has all of the good for her energy. It has dual timeline. We have a present one. We have one in 1977. And Molly has a really cool story about what inspired this book for her. So that being said, let's hear from Molly. Well, I am so excited to talk about Lady X. I'm a big

fan of a good for her moment. So we have lots to talk about there. But I do always want to get to know a little bit about the author who wrote the book first. So Molly, what was your journey to writing like? Did you always know you wanted to write? How did that all come together for you? Yes, yes. I did always want to write. When I was a kid, you know, when you first see a movie or read a where somebody's a writer or is in a career that you're interested in and you're like, yeah, that's a thing people, that's a thing people can do. So for me, it was the Emily of New Moon series, which is the Anne of Green Gables sort of lesser known series. Okay. Series better if I'm being asked, but yeah, that has not gotten the fame that Anne has gotten.

But Emily's a writer in that book. And as soon as I read that, I was like, oh, yeah. And then I, you know, I went to university and was going to be very serious and be a journalist or a speechwriter. And that didn't happen. I had always wanted, I loved, I was exposed to romance novels at, I would say, a too young age. For a long time, I wanted to be a romance novelist. So I was in university and in high school, I was just quietly working away on these, you know, bookish girls falling in love with cowboys. Yes. I mean, it's a good place. There are worse things you could have been introduced too early on.

100%. Although it was like, you know, when you're an early reader, it's like romance novels or Stephen King. Right. I did hear both of those. Yeah. It's changed a lot. Y.A. is now, you know, all. a lot bigger. Everything, but it's time. Romance with Stephen King. So how do you approach writing a book?

Is it different for every book? Do you outline? Do you go with vibes? What does it look like? You know, it really is different for every book. For like, you know, I really, it is, it's remarkable how different it is for every book. For the book that I wrote before Lady X, it was a book called the Sunshine girls and I had a dream that I was at my mother's funeral. Wow. She's not dead. She's fine. Uh-huh.

But I was at my mother's funeral. And in walks like this very famous woman and she's like, you don't, you don't know who your mother is. You don't know who you're, you know who your mother. And I was, I woke up and I was like, wow, what an idea. And it took me a long, long time to sort of like flesh out this story idea. Yeah. And for Lady X, it was just like, you know, like everybody else in the world, I was furious and watching, you know, rich white men get away with terrible, terrible crimes and, you know, be elected into office and et cetera, et cetera.

Yep. And so I was angry. I had that vibe going on. Same. Same time. My daughter was in eighth grade. and like every eighth grade girl since the dawn of time was being harassed by an eighth grade boy and all the things you usually say you know you know tell him to stop put up boundaries talk to your

teacher and just kept escalating and i found myself saying what my mother said to me what i'm sure her mother said to her which is just ignore him and yeah it was the wrong thing to say and my daughter I was like, mom, no. And she and her friends took it to the principal and, you know, wouldn't, wouldn't stop about it. Like, and got the kid in trouble and probably ultimately got him the help he needed. But I just realized how I was, like, facilitating the growth of an abuser, you know? Yeah. It was deeply embarrassed and deeply, like, troubled by my complicity.

So I was, I had those two vibes going on. Yeah. And I was just sort of waiting for a lightning strike moment that would make this into a book. Yeah. From God. And Taylor Swift released the Midnight's album with the song, The Lampy Shit. And I heard that and I was like, oh, there we go. Oh, I love that. So that's how Lady X came to be.

And every book is different. But it starts with vibes for sure. Yeah. Yes. I mean, I think that's cool that you're able to even just talk about like, oh, I found myself kind of participating in it. Because I think that's like an important thing. We still need to have some nuance with like sometimes just being in a system. Like you're not trying to be harmful.

You're just kind of doing what was there. But good for your daughter for being like, no. No, I don't think this should be happening. Yeah. The unexamined, you know, complacency, the unexamined role of women in patriarchal systems in place, right? Yeah. Boy, did I do it. Right.

Well, and I think some of what's hard about it, too, is like, if you're coming from a place of, like, harm reduction, sometimes, like, there's really good intentions with saying, just ignore him. Because like, what if he retaliates and he's worse? Or, like, what if the fact that it is very patriarchal system? What if just nothing happens and now you feel more vulnerable? So I think there's so much that goes into it, too. I agree. I agree. And, like, and part of it is, like, you know, walking that line between safety and being nice.

Yeah. But I will say the thing about my daughter. and her friends is that you know they talked about it together they went to yes like they were their own little girl gang and yeah and i mean that was a very uh infantizing way to say it they were they were a girl gone yeah to take it and i you know yeah it was so cool yeah yeah i think definitely a lot of listeners and a lot of my other reader friends or women as well and i think a lot of us find these stories of like sisterhood and and standing with each other to be really cathartic right now. So I, from the get-go, I'm just telling people you're going to love this book, basically.

I appreciate that a lot. You're so welcome. So that was kind of the emotional inciting incident for this book. It sounds like, what kind of led you to the dual timeline? and kind of like having the culture of like women in the 70s kind of compared to the culture of like present day women, when did that kind of come together or how? It was pretty early on in the process. I kind of knew that I wanted to tell a story about how, you know, so much has changed,

but nothing has changed. Yes. That kind of thing. And I was really, Margo is a real, she's my character in the present day timeline. she's a real divisive character some women are so mad at her and they can't yeah get over how kind of chicken shit she was no not everyone is like chomping at the bit all the time yeah and i found her really sympathetic and kind of fascinating um because she's a a rich white woman with all the privilege in the world and she's still you know disrespectful and and and

humiliated by men. She is not protected by her wealth or her privilege. Right. I thought that was kind of interesting. And I also thought, like, telling the story from two different places, you know, one woman really had to kind of get in touch with her anger. Margot really had to find it. Yes. I think presently, I mean, the world has never loved an angry woman.

You know, the world is, you know, that has never been the thing. that gets rewarded in the end. So that was kind of interesting. And then in the past timeline, I really like the idea of how these women find and what inspires them, like inspires them to get mad. Yeah. She arrives like a lit match.

She's just looking for a place to explode. Yes. Rachel is harmed in a big way. and finds her anger. And, oh, my God, why am I bling? Ginger. I'm always scared that's going to happen to me as an interviewer, so now I feel a little bit better. And Ginger, I really, like, Ginger, who's had all these shitty things happen to her,

but she's sort of compartmentalized it and, like, made it all okay. You know, it's just part of the job, that kind of stuff. She gets mad on behalf of her friends. Like, she finds her anger and her rage. because her friends have been hurt. Yeah. I just thought that was all kind of an interesting way to talk about the ways that we get angry. Yeah.

Yeah. I have seen some of the reviews that struggle with Margo as being like, you know, poor little rich girl. And I understand, like, I think you're even saying that. I understand that there's that feeling. And I understand, you know, eat the rich is more and more prevalent right now. However, like, we also can't get in the... idea that like no wealthy white woman will ever have anything like painful happen to her like we don't we

don't want to think that either and I think when you're just kind of talking about all of the women I feel like there's also like a very like wide representation of different types of women and how they handle it and not everyone is going to like do something with their rage and like you're saying some people aren't even in like in contact with their rage yet for all kinds of reasons. So I think that is Margo. Like Margo, like it takes her a while because she's kind of living this weird, inauthentic life. Yes. It takes her a while to like remember who she is. Mm-hmm. You know, thank you know, thank God for her sister to there to. I know. I did love Julia very much. There are a couple of highlights about Julia where I was like, well, like the one about

how like Julia basically like runs head first toward like confrontation or injustice. So I was like, okay, I feel you, Julia. But I think it was so great having a range of them. Did you, were you in New York in the 70s at all? Or like, how did you research for that timeline? No. I, so once the, once the idea of like this vigilante girl gang into my mind, my husband and I watched a Dutch,

about this New York City in the 70s, particularly the former of 77, which was just, I mean, like, everything was going on. It was son of scam. It was the blackout. You know, the city was bankrupt. The police were fighting with City Hall. Trash wasn't being picked up. And yet Studio 54. Like, you just had so much stuff happening. And I needed a reason why Lady X was a thing, but she was kind of forgotten. And, and, you know, Son of Sam and the relationship that the press had was Son of Sam and every article, every headline was Son of Sam. So it was kind of perfect. Yeah. And then I was like, oh, God, am I really going to take you this on? This feels like a hard one. But then it was again, it was during the pandemic that I was doing a lot of this research. I found a walking tour company in New York City that was still doing tours. But in one case, it was just a guy. with his cell phone, like walking around the empty streets of New York City. Yeah.

And another one was a man who had created a tour, a historical tour, but he had all this old press, all these old pictures, all these old headlines. So I took these, you know, walking tours. Yeah. Incredible. Like just they were, they were incredible. So I, that's how I did a lot of the research. That's cool.

It has because like the, especially the, I don't know if it's like the, the purpose. prologue. I think it's a prologue at the beginning. Like it feels very like not even neo-noir because of the time period. It felt very like noir in the past timeline. Was that like a goal when you were writing it? Or did you kind of just write it and then now we all can like see that it feels noir? I will. I'm going to credit my editors, Shana Summers and Bovna in. in Canada. They kept going like, do more, do more. More New York.

Like make it grittier, make it hotter. You know, like really. And they really pushed that. So that you feel that way is incredible. And it is because of them. Yeah, I read the first chapter. And I was texting my friend who had read it. He read it already as well.

I was texting Gare for the listeners who know who he is. And I was like, this like, opening part. I'm like my noir loving heart is so excited already. And he doesn't read tons of noir, but he was like, yeah, basically he loves the beginning too. He loves the whole book. But yeah, I kind of, I liked that it didn't feel like the present timeline was a totally different genre, but like they did feel like very different as well. With that more contemporary timeline that we're working with, what? What was it like kind of like developing the scandal and as well like just developing the present

family dynamics that are a little more prevalent in that that timeline? That's a great question. I mean, you know, obviously the the internet scandal of a man behaving badly, a famous man behaving badly on the internet, that was that was all over the place. Right. That was not hard. I could take my pick. Yeah. unfortunately and then I had like obviously I had that situation with my daughter that reflected margot and skies situation which was um like an interesting

way to rewrite my experience like Margo gets to go and show up at the at the principal's office and like stand up for her daughter in a way I never did you know in a you know so I that was that was an easy thing to write. And then her real arc became about how is she going to get mad and how is she kind of change her story? Yeah. And I found those scenes, the two scenes where she got mad to be very fun. Yeah.

It's just really cathartic for me perhaps as like, you know, a Midwestern nice white woman. Yes. You know, it was really nice to write those scenes. Yeah. kind of get to process it. Yeah, exactly. Or who was it that I heard? Oh, it was Emma Brody.

I talked to her about her book, Into the Blue. Have you read it? Oh, I sobbed my way through the last like 20%, I think. But she was saying one of the fun things about being an author is like when you have, when you need your characters to like have a fight, like you'll write it. And then like afterwards you'll be like, you know what? It would have been cool. She could have said this.

So I wonder if that's what it was kind of for you too, or you're going to. kind of getting to like, what if I had said this or like, here's a, here's what I could have done. I mean, being able to, to, I mean, God, I think about that into the blue, this, the back half of that book where she's, where they're doing the play. Yes. She must have like written a version of that and then gone for a walk and been like, nope. Yes. And then going back, because that's exactly what it, like, those scenes were like for me. Like, I was able to go, I would write the scene and I'd be like, oh that was great she got really mad and then i'd go for i walk and i'd be like no not mad enough and come back and and be able to like just push it with a little bit more yeah yeah totally

what else did emma's say no noah was who came to her first and he like showed up in multiple like other books that she started and never finished and she at one point said she was like who is this huge man that i can't get out of my head And so that's where she started with it. He had been in like other books that she kind of worked on. And I was like, that's, I always feel so magical to me when like a character just sticks around. And when a character is compelling to an author, I really feel like that that resonates with audiences. I mean, I think we're seeing that in a big way.

Obviously, knowing into the blue, I feel like Dilia Rosanov and the Heated Rivalry series, like they're just, they're, they were fascinating to the author. Yeah. And so that translates really well. Yeah. I think you're right. I think you're right. That's like I think Hallie Sutton is the one who has said like you can tell when an author was having fun writing a book. Yeah. And then it tends to be more fun reading it. Not that every book has to be fun either, but we talk about that sometimes where we're like, oh, this is a really good one because you can tell the author was like really enjoying the subject matter or whatever. Yeah. I call I say you can tell when an author is running downhill.

I think they're running downhill, they're just like, what? Yes. Yes. Well, kind of adjacent to The Blue, I know you wrote romance before this, and you kind of mentioned that. Was there, were there any, like, habits you had to break? Or was there anything from writing romance that you also think kind of helped with writing this one?

Well, I was incredibly lucky to be able to write romance for a long, long time. And like sex was a fascinating way to tell women's stories. Right. And still is. And it's, I mean, it's why it's the biggest selling genre ever. Right. But then rage became really interesting. Yes.

Yes. So I followed that. Yeah. It is, you know, the, the rhythm of a romance is so specific. that happily ever after. So I felt like I really needed to buck against that. Like writing Lady X, I kind of kept giving it this weird, not happy ending. And my editor was finally like, Molly, like, we've been through it. Let's just let them be happy for a minute. And I was like, oh, okay, I could do that. Yeah. But the understanding kind of what readers want,

because romance as a romance author i got so much reader feedback that's been that was been that has been crucial yeah you know you're the work ethic of every romance author i know but just sit down and write just yeah you can fix it later you can you know um you can't be precious about it right it's just that's been helpful too. Yeah, that's good to know. One of the things that I always love in books too is found family or chosen family and that very literally almost has to happen, especially in the past timeline between Fay and Rachel and Ginger. And in that case, it's also because like we've kind of talked about like systems are failing them. So they're kind of having to like create their own system within each other to survive. And I just always love stories like that.

Was that like when you started writing that past timeline, did you know that's kind of where you wanted to head with those characters or did it just kind of come as you were writing it? Well, you know, you know those friendships you make in your early 20s and how it changes who you think you are? It rewires your brain. Like it's, like falling in love. Yeah. And particularly when those relationships are formed under duress. Yeah. It's just so powerful. It's just so, so powerful. And I really was excited about that. Yeah. You know that these women don't know each other for very long, but it doesn't matter, right? That that chemistry of like, you're mine, I'm yours. We're in this together. I just was really,

really excited about exploring that and hopeful that I could because it while it is universal it's also really specific yeah experience you have with your friends at that age yeah so I just really wanted I'm you know I'm grateful to hear from readers that I I nailed that part of it and that's good yeah yeah I was excited about yeah I meant to pull the direct quote but I don't totally have it but bell hooks has something um in community in her book communion where she She talks about how sometimes the relationships with female to female is almost the best version of romantic love that they have because there's an actual equality component to the relationship that like socially just still doesn't totally exist for us if we're with men. And yet that's always that's always stood out to me and kind of like you're saying sometimes it feels like falling in love when it is another woman. just because sometimes you can be seen in a very different way than you could with a man.

And the way you don't reflect upon yourself through a gaze, you know, all of that. Yes. You know, as a woman who's well past 25, you know, the new information that's coming out about how women with female friends. Yeah. Live longer. Yes. And I, like, I feel that that is true. I am not a scientist.

Yeah, same. But I really feel that that is true. I mean, it is a powerful relationship. It is a powerful, powerful relationship. It is a powerful. It's huge. It's so important. The other part of the story for this very interesting socially to me is morally gray characters as women. And I think what's interesting to me is like, especially when you think about a vigilante in general, it typically means that, something bad already happened and you're more reacting to what happened. You're not just

going out there and, you know, like beating someone up for the hell of it, essentially. And I think that's what's also really powerful, especially about like the women coming together in the 70s timeline is like there are people who are going to like, you know, think no one should have acted out that way. But to me, it still goes back. to like the men's bad behavior that instigated it all. So did you re-worryed at all about writing characters like that or how did you kind of approach like, yeah, they're doing some reactionary stuff, but like, can you see why? Yeah. Yeah, I was not, I was not worried about that. Good. The only thing that was sort of worrying to me, but I mean, listen, we're living in a

a weird world was having the police officer be quite so bad, right? Yeah. Listen, we're in the days of ice. Yes. So, yeah, we have a nuanced conversation about how there are a lot of men in authority who abuse the fuck out of that authority. Totally. Yeah, and did with Margot's timeline, oh, what was I going to?

It just was in my mind what I was going to ask about Margot. Oh, no, I was going to ask which one came to you first? Like, was it, was it Margot's timeline that kind of came to you since that was kind of what mirrored your experience with your daughter? Or did the other characters come to you first? No, Fay. Fay was the third character that kind of, that, that landed fully and full of anger and secrets, right? Like, it's really exciting when a character arrives and they're fascinating, but also, you're like, oh, I don't know exactly what's happening.

Yeah. Do you do any like free writing to like get to know her or is it just kind of like as as you're kind of drafting it comes out? So I, um, I, I am a plotter. And the way that it usually works is I get a very, very exciting idea. So in this case, vigilante shit lands. Yes. Changes the story. I see that 1977 documentary and I, the, the, the world is starting to get another. And then I really like, this is where I research. This is where I think that I'm like taking dog for a long walk. Like lots and lots of books. I'm just kind of sussing this out and slowly I kind of get to the first third of the plot.

And then I really, really, really want to write. Yeah. You can't yet. You have to like, how does it end? Like you can't start the book without knowing how it ends. So then I jump ahead to like figure out what the end. is okay I satisfy myself in the vaguest sense about that and then start writing and then at about 30,000 words I go shit I should have thought about the middle a bit more and I think some more

and I have to do some rewriting so in in that period of time you know I've never labeled it free writing but I'm writing a lot that doesn't get used yeah like trying doors and you know seeing what what comes of what yeah yeah like you're you're doing the part of writing that isn't typing always basically yeah that makes sense um did you then write it so it alternates back and forth did you write it in the order that we read it or did you write like the past all the way through and the present all the way through you know i wrote it um uh how you read it okay i'm a super linear writer and And again, like thanks to romance and many years writing, the rhythm of the book, like you can feel when you're ready to shift, right? Like cliffhangers and, you know, leaving the reader wanting more and that kind of thing.

So I was able to write it chronologically. The part that, the worst part of the book for me were the interstitials, like trying to figure out how to do the lore of Lady X without. giving it all the way or not being interesting. So that that was a part that took a lot of trial and error. I have a lot of those interstitials saved. Yeah. Yeah. It is a fun element to have though.

And it kind of like breaks up the story telling. Yeah. And you can't info dump a little bit without it being boring. Yeah. Yeah. I, I, um, oh God, the storm. the heiress, the villa, Rachel, Rachel Hawkins. Yes, yes.

Yeah, I mean, like, I love those books for that reason. Like, she puts those, like, I don't know, just kind of creates the world, creates the stakes. Yep. I love it. Yeah, I do too. Was there anything about, I always wonder with, like, I know the 70s for some people, it's like, that's not historical fiction. But with things where you are researching, like, a time period.

that's not the present. Was there anything that surprised you that you weren't able to like work into the book? Oh, that's a good question. Every now and then someone has some random story when I ask. You know, I think because I was so fixated on the son of Sam stuff and the my club is called the orbit room, but it's clearly a studio 54. Yeah. Adjacent. You know, I was so fixated on those two things and then the blackout that there were not, I, I, no, the answer is no. Sorry. That's okay. Okay. It's not always the case. Studio 54 will keep you busy. Yes. Forever. I mean, did you, did you want to call it something else so you didn't have to like try to get all the things right? Or did you just kind of want to make

something fictional anyway? Uh, both. Okay. Yeah. Like it was, it was, it, I, it's, Studio 54 is kind of one of those things that if you're going to get it wrong, there's still people live that, you know, remember. And you can do as much research as you want. And there were a lot of photographs. Yeah. But it was madness. It was absolutely.

It really was. And yeah, absolute. All of it. All of it. Yeah. Did the son of Sam stuff make you even angrier as you were writing? Like the way he got attention? Yeah.

And the way you got attention, I think because both men and women were killed, you know, there were a lot of women going missing in New York City, women of color, you know, sex workers. Yeah. But because I think they were white women and some men, I mean, not that it's not terrible. It is awful. Yeah. And obviously, like he, you know, he wrote to a news. he wrote to a journalist like he he engaged with his own fame in a way that was incredibly

compelling yes and mysterious but no i think it researching it it was really frustrating like yeah it was a really dangerous place for women i know we we barely know anything so yeah i know I know and it's I struggle with like true crime I don't have like a definitive judgment on it but I struggle when in like what you're talking about like we're in the present while it's still happening people are being entertained by it maybe because of what like what you were saying the way he interacted with the media and it's it's so hard for me to go toward that when stuff is still happening like I will get interested in the details like when there are cases that are happening. But it is so tricky when it's actual real people, which I think is

why I tend to gravitate towards fiction for those kinds of stories. But yeah, I mean, it had to be terrifying living, living while that was happening. And like we didn't have cell phones or cameras, like everywhere like we do now. It's like an extra creepy to try to even think about. Yeah, you really, like, said something that I, I've struggled to verbalize, too, about why I resist. Yeah. True crime. Like, I can't get over the fact that we're talking about real people. Yes.

You know, and that, and that we're, I mean, like, you look at the serial podcast and how it is, anyway, it is. It's sticky. It's sticky. Yeah. It's sticky. Yeah, it's a hard one. with where did it go my brain just lost it completely like if you have anything written down i can't even tell like you're just truly engaged in this conversation that's incredible you thank you

i do have stuff written down you're fooling me fooling me that's good that's good my my eyesight isn't going too far off off whatever um what is i going to say Oh, I had to take Benadry last night because I got really bad bug bites and it sometimes lingers in my brain a little bit. Okay, we went through that. We went through that. Oh, obviously we kind of talked about how the, like, Margo's husband, like the scandal is very like me too, s, like very similar to what we have seen.

Was there like, not that you can't list all the ones that are the inspiration, but was there anything where you're like, maybe I won't do this specific detail because then it'll seem exactly like this person's or was it also just like, of course, a man would kind of do something like this and I can know how to write it. Yeah. You know, like, I know, we all know. Yeah. that Adam Levine is probably a cad.

Like, we get it. But when his bullshit came out, I was weirdly betrayed. I don't want to get that. It was just like, dude. You know. So he was part of it. And then, you know, it's just imagining, like, you know, and that these people that we think are something aren't, you know.

But, you know, Tom Hanks being referenced in the very, great movie voicemails for Isabel. I don't know if you've seen it yet. I haven't seen it. I'm seeing all, like, I'm seeing everyone crying about it.

It's very, it's very well done. It's a great, great rom-com. And, you know, he, the main hero says, something about being

a modern day Tom Hanks. And he's like, Tom Hanks is America's sweetheart. And the other people are like, you're not Tom Hanks. Like, how devastated we would all be if Tom Hanks ended up being terrible.

But, you know, that's partly on us, idolizing people we don't know. Right. You know. Yeah. Anyway, it was part obviously real thing and part worrying about Tom Hanks. I don't know. Well, and I think like on that subject, I think the people who or the reviewers who are like, who struggle with how it took Margo time to get to her anger. I feel like that was still a really good example.

example of like if you truly just weren't seeing anything like especially with actors who can travel and like it's not like you know exactly what he's doing when he goes to work or is on set there are women I do believe who can be pretty blindsided by it and like even you and then as a collective society I think we are so quick to do the same thing but like you're saying with Tom Hanks, there are people that we would be like, oh my gosh, him. Yeah. We're like, so then imagine you're married to a guy and you just have never found anything that makes you think you should be suspicious.

And surely there are some men out there who are popular and not cheating. So it's like it's also perfectly normal to kind of like eventually feel safe with your husband that you've been with for like maybe a decade at that point. And I think we're always just like, oh, you should have known. You should have expected of any, any popular man or any actor. And it's like, but you also don't want to go all the way that direction either. You know, it's insane to me how badly we want the woman to be complicit in a man's bad behavior. Yes.

You know, like, why would she know? Like, why would she have to know? Right. This guy's a liar and a cheat. And an actor. Yeah, like let's just focus the, you know, the shit piling on this bad dude. You know, let the poor woman who's been betrayed, you know, have some dignity. I mean, I also think the thing with Margo is she had bought into for want of something to fulfill her.

Like, you know, she had an vision of a different life for herself. And that got sweat, her, you know, her husband got extremely popular. Like, you know, she's not going to do anything but kind of hold on with both hands at that point. Right. To try to, you know, keep her family together. Yeah. But she's bought into their story. He is as much a part of, like, the facade as he is.

And I don't know how else you would, you would survive. a relationship like that that's so in the public eye. Yes. Which is interesting to me. Yeah. Good or bad. It's just sort of fascinating. And I think it was also reminding me, I don't know.

Talk about another hot topic in media where we're, some people are vilifying the woman. I don't know if you've read strangers by Bell Borden, but you've probably at least heard of it. Yes, yes. It was making me think about that too because like Margot, Margot kind of. has like you're saying the idea of like i did marry him i knew that we were going to have these kind of like staged parts of our lives and we'll have to do different things to kind of have a version of privacy but then like you want to think you're all in on a marriage so it's like maybe you won't go after the career that you're wanting in the moment which kind of happens with margot and it happens

with bell too where she's like uh this is my marriage of course i'll like use all like use all of my trust to buy our first house, but put it in both of our names. And I think she's another great example in the zeitgeist right now of people thinking it can never be poor little rich girl. There's a lot of people that are like, he did not leave her destitute? And that was what got me to finally read it because I'm like, did she say that? She doesn't say that. So I think there's a lot of conversation with people that aren't even reading the book. But I think it's a book that is helping a lot of women for the first time think like what would I had what would I do if I did need to like stand on my own and have a life on my own but it's hard to reconcile that with like wanting to be

all in with your marriage as well I mean I don't know where like where you know I don't I have friends and family who've been through really terrible divorces and yeah and and everybody that I am a um a confidant to two that is in that situation, every one of them said, how do I walk away if I don't do everything I can? Right. I have to do everything I can. And I, like, that's how I would feel about, right. That's how I feel about parenthood.

That's how I feel about friendship. Like that to me makes you a very, a good person. Like, you're seeing through yourself and what, you know, so why are we judging them for doing everything that they could do? Yes. And when the fault is their partner wasn't doing shit, you know, like, bit so i yeah the the the blaming women for men's bad behavior and and listen i i haven't read the book i do have it away for the weekend and that's what i'm going to be reading yeah the first chapter

is very similar to your first chapter oh you're going to be reading it and you're like oh wow yeah yeah it's very easy to judge it is it's very easy and i and i and i think you could can have conversations even about strangers. That's fine. We can all recognize that she's a really wealthy white woman and that her life wasn't, you know, the hardest financially when she left him. But like, you can also be a wealthy white woman who thought that you were really in love with your husband and that he was really in love with you too. Like that hurts too no matter how much money you have. So the conversation deserves more nuance. Real pain. Like, Yes.

Wealthy doesn't insulate you from real pain. Yeah. Yeah. I think, and I mean, I'm all, where am I trying to go with this? Like, yes, let's tax billionaires and trillionaires now. Let's tax them more. Let's like get the money back into the system. On the flip side, all of us would love to have, in terms of an author, a book go crazy, crazy popular.

And now you're like a millionaire, maybe, which isn't even as. like wealthy as it used to be. But like all of us want that, but then we're like quick to judge and be like, oh, all rich people suck. And you're like, you would like it too if you had the opportunity. I mean, like we're watching, I feel like we're watching this happen with Taylor Swift. Yes. You know, the woman just donated $26 million to charities. I know. And we're going to be real mad about her Madison Square Garden wedding. I mean, let the woman live.

Like what are you? You know, bankrolled some real scientific discoveries and some real good in communities that needs to happen. Like, let her have her fairy tale wedding. I know. And how about just be like joyful that she gets to have joy too?

Yes. I don't know. We're weird. People are weird. Humans are weird. All of the stuff around Taylor is very weird right now. I do not idolize her. She's not my God.

I don't think she's perfect. I don't think that about anyone. However, everything you just said, first of all, this isn't even the first time she's donated millions. It just, she just does. Second, the people who keep being like, that'd be like the equivalent of me donating $1,500. It's like, okay, so did you donate $1,500? And they're like, no. And you're like, okay, so why are we debating if this money can do good?

It's so crazy. It's so crazy. not to mention like New York. I saw someone who had a really good take talking about like she knew she was going to have a huge wedding. She chose a city that she's like had a residence in for over a decade. And she chose a city that is like used to really big celebrity events. And like a lot of celebrities are like already comfortable in the city and kind of know how to navigate it. They're like.

So I thought that was a really good like logical point too. Because some people you're not creating chaos. Yeah. Island you're not like. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy. It's crazy. I understand how she represents or can seem to represent a lot of what's wrong in, like, class warfare. But I don't think she's the one we need to be the most concerned about. I agree with what I land on. Well, all of that to say, if you love some vigilante shit, if you love angry women banding together and sticking together, you're going to love ladies. And as the time that this is airing, you can go get your copy now. So go read it and you can DM me or even Molly.

Tell her how much you loved it. Even if you didn't like Margo, you can, you can. You don't have to like every character in a book. I mean, it'll be a boring book if you did. Right, right. But I do always ask at the end if you have read anything recently that you loved or if there are books, you just always recommend to people. I am listening to the children by Melissa Albert.

Oh yeah, this has been on my TBR. Very much, very much enjoying it. Okay, cool. I'm really deep in my audiobook. Same. Finger Smith. Another audiobook. Yeah.

That's an older one. Yes. I keep hearing about it. More and more fingers. I think it's Sarah. Sarah Water. I keep wanting to go. It is, it's a just, it's one of those where you just can't stop walking the dog.

The dog's like, I get that. And the house gets really clean. Quick silver or quicksilver and into the blue, into the blue was one of those. I mean, Julia was like, I know. Unbelievable. She's fantastic. Paperback. I just finished.

I just finished this one. Didian and Babbitts. Oh, yeah. Fantastic. Did you like it? Okay. I wondered about that one. It's nonfiction. Yeah. The voice, it's a super voicey. Nice. Really fun. Really, really fun. Yeah, this is my, this is my TV art there. I love that. Oh, well, I'm going to be adding a few. I'm going to have to bump some of those up. Those are all on my TVR. Don't sleep on it. It's an older one. a lot of people love it and i especially like i really do like some like gothic vibes and i'm pretty sure i've heard that's what it is too oh yeah oh you're like yes stop doing whatever it is you're doing and then tell me when you get to the end of the first um point of view

when you can do that, just send me a message. Okay. I'm going to clear my schedule. It's a big read, but it's kind of one of those historicals that you're like, historical fiction that you're like, I could read about these people mending dresses and taking walks in the terrifying forest for. Yes. I love that feeling. That's awesome.

Well, where can people follow you to stay up to date on everything? I'm Instagram, all over Instagram. Molly Fader author. I have a website and a newsletter. I do not send out a lot of newsletters. It's all due and it's very important. You can find that at molly fader.com. And I'm going to be all over the Midwest in August. So yeah. Yeah, come come join me at some events in Wisconsin and Michigan and St. Louis. Nice. Love to see you. Perfect. Well, thank you for coming on and talking about Lady X. My pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. Oh, yes.