Bookwild - Jaime Lynn Hendricks Joins Us!!

Episode Date: May 18, 2023

This week, Jaime Lynn Hendricks joins us to talk about her third novel, I Didn't Do It, out May 23rd!  We all also discuss every book, tv show and movie we've loved recently.Follow us on Instagram:Gare @gareindeedreadsKate @thegirlwiththecookonthecouchJaime @jaimelynnhendricksauthor Books We Talked AboutI Didn’t Do ItJar of HeartsIn My Dreams I Hold a KnifeChloe Cates is MissingThe Last Mrs. ParrishA Stranger on the BeachOn a Quiet StreetThe Vanishing HourFinding TessaIt Could Be AnyoneDid You Hear About Kitty Karr?The WhispersThe Gay Best FriendWhisperThe Last WordStone Cold FoxThe ShardsA Twisted Love StoryDon’t Forget the GirlTV Shows We Talked AboutClickbaitCruel SummerSchitt’s CreekHouse, M.D.Law & OrderEuphoriaMad MenBillionsBad SistersMovies We Talked AboutBasic InstinctFatal AttractionBarbarianWatcherSmileFreshThe Menu Get Bookwild MerchCheck Out My Stories Are My Religion SubstackCheck Out Author Social Media PackagesCheck out the Bookwild Community on PatreonCheck out the Imposter Hour Podcast with Liz and GregFollow @imbookwild on InstagramOther Co-hosts On Instagram:Gare Billings @gareindeedreadsSteph Lauer @books.in.badgerlandHalley Sutton @halleysutton25Brian Watson @readingwithbrian 

Hey guys, welcome to the Killing the Tea podcast. This is Gare and Kate. And we are going to be discussing all things, chills, thrills, and kills. Kate and I are going to be talking about our favorite books, TV shows and movies that are in the thriller or crime fiction genre, as well as some reading habits and other items related to how we met on Bookstagram that will fit in with this podcast. So, Thank you so much for joining us, and we hope that you have fun and get totally terrified. So we have, like, a fun little, like, icebreaker. It doesn't always, like, relate to, like, you know, books or TV or anything like that. But I think a fun one would be... What God. I know. What is your, like, fun, guilty pleasure?

Like, is there anything if you're having, like, a shitty, stressful day, whether it's like a glass of wine or like a TV show. Is there anything that like... No. She's a physical comedian tonight. Is there like any like thing that just is like your guilty pleasure that will like take your mind off from like a shitty day? Yeah. You know what it is?

And it's it's so weird. Well, it's not so weird. I think it's what a lot of authors will say. Reading. reading for me is is a guilty pleasure when I have had enough I can't do my own writing I can't deal with the world I can't deal with anything else that's going on with anything I'm like let me get lost in the book I will escape I will move I will do my thing and I will get lost for a few hours and then I I love that I actually love that

that is my guilty pleasure I do love to read I read so much and I'm I'm so lucky to to be able to do what I do because not only do I just get to read, a lot of authors ask me to like blur their stuff in advance. So I get a lot of advanced stuff. So I'm just so lucky. I get to read all of like the awesome and cool stuff, man, which would be for everybody else does. Yeah. My guilty pleasure. That's what I like to do. I love to read. Well, you know, to piggyback off from that, there's a lot of people in this world that are lucky that you're a writer as well.

Yes. Yes. So, because we love. Yes. We love all of them. Oh, lucky you. It's a Jamie Buket. Because I thought these guys behind me.

Yeah, that's true. I didn't get this guy yet because I thought those were too big and I'm like, I don't want another big one. So I'm just holding. The only copy I have left. Everything in my publisher sent me, this is the only one I have left. I have done a bunch of giveaways. I've done a bunch of like things. And so I'm holding this one because I'm going on for anybody is watching on May 22nd.

I am going to be on Fox Tampa 13 on their walk-on, walk-on in studio for their reading segment. That's amazing. It's so cool. It's so cool. That is cool. That's cool. I'll be a movie star. I think I'm going to get a poll, but, you know, everybody.

thinks that so it's fun. No, you're going to be amazing. They're going to be like, oh my God, where has she been all our lives? Yeah. Wait for you. Wait for your boyfriend. That's amazing. Kate, what's your guilty pleasure? Well, she kind of, I mean, that really is mine. But TV would work the same way. But I do, I do read a lot more than I watch TV nowadays. but it's the same thing like for me like I feel myself like downshifts out of work mode once I like actually get into like the rhythm of a story like more than 10 pages without a dog barking at me. Yeah. It's a great feeling when I can get past those two pages. I haven't done your dogs yet.

I know. I know. There's one under the desk and one behind me so I'm sure we'll hear them at some time. The dog up at any... I know. They're so amazing. Yes. I love that.

Yeah. So that's definitely, I mean, that's like all I want to do when I'm not working. So... Yeah. Same. I'm going to be the twisted sister out then because I always... Just murder people. Like, literally, like, a true crime show at the end of a stressful day

puts me back into the headspace of, like... It could be worse. Oh, so, yeah, so you're like, so you're like a basic white girl. You just like, at the end of the day, you just want to like listen to true crime and murder. And it's like, okay, now I can fall asleep. Yes. Yes. Yes.

To sleep. Yes. 100%. That is, yeah. I don't like have to like listen to it before I fall asleep because I have that like general vibe of being the basic bitch of being like, I'm going to scroll through a tick. talk for like a half hour before I go to bed. We all do it. Yeah.

So it's like that. But like if I remember having like a shitty day and I'm like, okay, like what is my lot turning into? It's just kind of like I'll like listen to like crime junkie or I'll watch like I survived a serial killer and I'll be like your day wasn't that bad, Garrett. Right. You know? Right.

It could have been worse. You could have been locked in a cage somewhere. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. And I would be dead very quickly because I'd be like, what means you pick me? You know what?

I think that charm, Mr. Gare, I think that charm would knock you right. You would get right out of the cage. You've got some, you've got some charm. I try. I try. But you know,

the funny thing is, is only women think that. No man, no man would say that. You're savage. What are you saying? That only men could be horrible serial killers? No,

I'm saying that only women find me chariote. man. When I decide to snap and lock you up, you're going to totally get out. You're totally going to get out. Oh, my God. I would be honored. You're the favorite human stuff. And you're going to be like, oh, look at me.

I could do this. And I'm going to be like, oh, my God, you're right. And I love you so much. Or I'd be like, here's my debit card. You want to go get us Taco Bell? Right. Yeah. And I was just like reading.

somewhere unaware. Yeah. Yeah. I'm really, yeah. I love you. Yeah. Kate and I have like joked that like I have like shitty tastes in men. So like basically like if a man ever kidnapped me, Kate might like find me and I'd be like, no, I'm fine. Like I'm good here. And yeah, giving me all this attention. Oh, I'm good. I'm good. He's feeding me. It's always yeah. Like he'll be sick of me in like a week, dude. I'll talk to you. Oh, you guys are so fun.

Oh, you're like, too many, like, favorite people. Oh, my God. We love us so much. We, like, gush about you all the time. This is like... As do I about both of you. You're amazing. It's both in the back of...

Do you want me to read it? I've got the finish. I didn't. I haven't read it yet because it wasn't in mine. Okay, so my acknowledgments, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah. thank for this. So the Bookstagram is, you're all great.

Hold on. First, there's only so many pages I'm allowed to fill so I can never possibly name you all, but I have nothing but love for Gare Billings, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Your first. And then I said, also,

the support from people like Sarah DeVello, Kate Hergot, Lesnarcote, Lori Schoenfeld, and others who features on their videos, blogs, and podcasts, help. It's literally anybody wants to see it. It's there. That's amazing. It's there. This episode is so special

because you brought that up, but you also, you're the reason that we even have a podcast together. That's true. God, I can't even. I love that. You are the podcast, Cupid. Because I told you, I told both of you, know this great human,

why don't you connect with this great human? And I love that. I love that you guys love each other. Oh my God. It was so fun. It was so fun. You told me about Kate and you were like, she like, the way that she podcast, like her personality, she's just so intelligent and so much fun. Like in the beginning, because I think that was one of your first 10, maybe.

Oh, yeah. You were like, well, I don't know if like authors like what I do. I'm like, first of all, every author loves when somebody's going to reach out and do this. I was like, yeah. And you're so engaging and you're so fun. And I just thought you guys were a perfect match. So you. Yeah.

Yeah. And it works. I like, I like, oh my God, I love your podcast. Uh-huh. Then like,

we realized that we like actually liked each other. Like, you know, very quickly. And I was like, I would love to do a podcast someday. someone like you, like the Adelsso. No, seriously, it makes me so happy to know that two people that I love so much,

love each other so much. Oh. Yeah. Like, you know, I'm going to just float over and die. That's fine. And we love you so much. This is what we do. We make sure everybody that we love, I'm like, you better love that person.

Yeah, exactly. You're right. You're right. I mean, that's what we do every week with authors, too. You know, it's a very full circle moment. I've said it on so many of these, like, podcasts and Zooms and everything. Like, and I'll say it over and over again. Like, authors are literally the greatest people I've ever met in my life.

They are. And I've said it before. Like, there's no pieces of pie. There's no, like, where somebody says, like, oh, you better like my book. Like, of course, we all want you to like our book. But just because you like somebody else's doesn't mean you're not going to like ours. So, like, authors just constantly promote all of our friends, all of our people. And every author does it.

I just, I don't know a selfish author, man. Like, wow. And especially, and I have to, you know, of course, I'm leached in the thriller, suspense mystery. Man, these women and the select men that are in there. And, you know, I could, I can name them. But it's mostly women. just man these women are just the greatest people I've ever met and I am just so lucky to be in this industry with these amazing uplifting women it's it's just fantastic it really

I agree and you guys know you guys know everybody I do like you guys know I can say if it wasn't for women in crime fiction we wouldn't have the hobbies that we have and wouldn't have a podcast. Right. Right. I agree. If we did it be a Bravo one maybe. Yeah. But again, I am not pulling out anybody's hair. I am, I'm not screaming and throwing a glass down. Yeah. Yeah. I wouldn't even know I would have modeled it after. I don't, I do not watch reality TV. Shockingly. You're probably, it's probably healthy for your sanity to not because yeah. There's a lot going on up here. So, you know. The rabbit holes that you fall under with reality TV is crazy.

Murder or so there's a lot going on up here. She doesn't need the extra drama. Yeah, right, right. She's like, there's enough drama. And not going on all the time. You know, though, we've used you as an example before, too, about women in crime fiction and how, like, the sweetest, kindest people that you will meet have these such twisted,

dark stories. And it's just such so amazing. Look at Ashley Winstead. She's one of the most sweetest people I've ever met in my life. And look at the twisted shit she writes.

But man, how great. But that's a thing. That's what makes her a great writer because you meet her and she's like the sweetest person you ever met and she writes the most twisted crap and it's so goddamn good.

And I still say anybody who's watching in my dreams I hold a knife, still one of my top five, top three reads ever, ever. Yes. Oh, anybody's watching or listening? Ashley Winston, in my dreams I hold a knife, go get it. You won't be sorry. Yes, yeah. I say the same thing about Jennifer Hillier, too.

You do. Jar of Hearts is one of my favorite books in the entire world. Well, look, it's actually on my top right here. It's right here. Look. So look, I'm only gone for. second. I can tell the funniest story about this. Okay. God, I love it. This is, it was 2019. I did not have an agent and did not have a publisher. I did not have a book deal. I was a rando

going to, um, Thriller Fest, meeting all the people, doing all the things, going to the panels. That's what you do when you're trying to be a thriller writer and doing all this stuff. So this had come out and it was up for the thriller of the year. And I was like, oh my God. And I know. And I knew it was up for Thriller the Year. I knew Jennifer was going to be there. So I brought my copy. And I was like, okay. I'm like, and then I remember I was like, I saw her come into the bar. And I was with Vanessa Lilly and Kelly Garin. And Kelly was like, oh, I'm friends with her. You want me to go get her? I'm like, can you go get her? And she was like, yeah. So she comes over and I was like, and I pulled this out of my backpack. And I'm like, I love this. I'm like, I know you're

up for the Thriller of the Year thing. I'm like, could you sign it for me? And This is one of my favorite things. She signed it when I was nobody. There was nobody. I had no agent. I had no book deal. And again, she was just as as uplifting and as wonderful as candy.

Yes. This is still what this is in the top three also. I love this book, Jar of Hearts. This is just. I talk about Jar of Hearts. Like it's a family member on this podcast. You really couldn't be a better first author guest because your answer was that like reading is your favorite hobby. And then you brought up the book in my dreams.

I hold a knife that we bring up like every other episode. And then you guys said jar of hearts together. Yeah. Literally right there. She's like a natural in our podcast. I'm not signed, but I have it right there. That's amazing. But you want to see it?

Yes. Yes. Yeah. This is, hold on. These are my, and this was, what was called was on top. Jarrah cards was on top. These are my favorite books. Oh, okay.

I was going to ask you about that. Obviously. Yes. Yes. Anybody knows me and Nicky. Oh, yes. I love that. So good.

Obviously, Liv Contentine, the OG, the left of the parish. Yes, that one's so good too. And bam, there it is. These are my top five favorite reads ever. And that's why I always have them on. Well, wait, hold on. Hold on. About one more.

Two more. I lied. I lied. I'm such a liar. I'm a liar. It's okay. We love liars here. Oh, my God.

I love that book. You're reading a book until you don't even know what you're reading. And it's like, oh, my God, I was reading something completely different the whole time. It's so good. And then. I need to read that one. last year. Serapina Nova Glass on a quiet

street. Her second one comes out, well mine comes at the 23rd. First comes at the 30th. Oh, okay. God, I forgot what it's called. I don't want to be a butt about it because I pre-ordered it. But this is,

this was one of my favorite reads last year. So, just telling everybody. The vanishing hour. Go buy, go buy. Don't just buy my books. Buy all of these two. The vanishing hour. The vanishing hour. Well, speaking of the 23rd.

Yeah. Big thanks. Big thanks. I also love, I loved your very heartfelt discussion of how authors are the best people. But we do have to segue to your book about bad authors. Yeah. It's about you tonight. I've got them too, Gare.

Yeah. Mine's in here. So the 23rd, your third novel, I Didn't Do It, comes out. Yeah. So do you want to give your, like, little pitch about what that book is about? Okay. This book, if anybody has ever been to Thriller Fest, it is not based on Thriller Fest because that is a, I don't know, I could probably get sued or something.

So it's Murder Paloosa. It's Murder Palupa. And it is a thriller, mystery, and suspense writer conference where one of the favorite authors is found dead in her hotel room, the morning, the first morning where,

like, the award ceremony is taking place that night. And she was a frontrunner to win the award. So she is found stabbed, her hotel room. So all of the authors and everybody, you know, everybody's like, oh, my God, what happened? But then for specific authors, start getting text messages from a burner account. And they start getting followed by this horrible, horrible Twitter account saying maybe you're next because I know that you have a secret that is connected to the dead writer who is Christian Bailey who by the way everybody in this book first name and last name is somebody I know

oh originally had I originally had the dead author was Kristen Henry out for my sister and my father Kristen and Henry but my editor said it sounded too much like Kristen Hannah you know that oh Chris and Hannah she goes so you have to change the name and I was like okay I'm going to keep Kristen for my sister I changed somebody else's name to Henry, you know, later on. But I named her, I named the dead author, Kristen Bailey for Samantha Bailey. Samantha Bailey. Yeah, that is actually for Samantha Bailey.

She knows, she knows. It's, yeah, so yes, Kristen Bailey for my sister and Samantha Bailey. So she is the one who was found dead. And then these other four authors have found out that they, they know that they have something connected to her. They just didn't think it was going to come out in public. But then this Twitter account and this burner phone keeps texting them saying, I know what it is. This is what I know you have connected to her. So they all band together trying to kind of find out what's going on. But then as the secrets get revealed, they start thinking, they start distrusting each other. And they say,

well, maybe your secret was a motive to kill. Maybe your secret was a motive to kill. They become distrusting of each other. And then it becomes kind of a cat and mouse game to find out, you know, a bunch of mystery and thriller writers who've done it. Yeah. Oh, my God. It's so good.

Such a cool premise. Yeah. Yeah. I absolutely loved it. I loved how you combined, like, something classic. like an Agatha Christie style plot with something very modern with murder paloosa and, you know, this anonymous account. And you just like, everything was woven so well together when you like present the story.

And that cast, I had. That's what I wanted to talk about. Oh, my God. I like, first of all, I always like say when I like, say when I like, pick up a new book from you. I'm like, I don't know how she's going to top Tessa. I don't know how she's going to top. It could be anyone. And then I read, I didn't do it. And I was like, oh, my God. But like, the thing that I love so much is they're all so different. But you don't fall into any cliches with your plot, but you also have always a pretty large cast without falling into

cliches with any of your characters. And I think that is like such an admirable thing. But it's also so refreshing for your audience. But see, I thought this one, well, it was done on purpose. This is more satirey. It's kind of tongue in cheek about the writing industry and about writers and about agents and publishers and readers and everything. It's kind of tongue in cheek. Yes.

But I did that on purpose. So anybody who thinks, you know, anybody who thinks I'm doing it, anything, I'm not. The characters are. The characters are. I'm not doing anything. The characters are because that's what some characters do. Now anybody who's read this, you guys have. Yeah. I know, Gera, I know we talked about that. There is a duchy character. His name is Davis Walton. And Gare loves him. I love him so much. But he is supposed to be a douche. He's supposed to be a douche. He's supposed to be a duchy. be a dude. You're supposed to hate him. He's supposed to be like a bad character. He says bad things.

He thinks bad things. He's he's a bad guy. So anything that goes on with him, that's him the character doing it. That's not me the author doing it. That's him the character doing it because he's supposed to be the bad guy. That's why I think it's funny that it's tongue in cheek is because I make characters do things. And you guys have read it. I'm not giving anything away. But you guys know how it ends. You guys know how it ends, how it's brought into where certain things that you will think I said. I obviously didn't say and they were resolved by the end as a, you know, thumbs up type thing because it wasn't me. It was these, it was these characters. Yeah. Yeah. But you did like a really good job of having satire, but avoiding cliches as well,

because there are, there were a lot of things that I was like, oh, I wonder if this character could go in this direction because it's happened in different stories before. But like, you kind of flip the script on a lot of these characters, but also still having that tongue and cheek way of doing it. And I just like, that was like my favorite thing with the story is that, you know, you kept the satire aspect, like, very lively, but you kept me on my toes the entire time. Like, there wasn't anything where I saw that coming kind of thing. Well, I know, obviously I know Davis is your favorite character. We've talked about this. Kate, who is your favorite character? So I was about to say one of my favorite things. I need to pull up who she is though. I am so bad at remembering character names and I should know this,

but I, I loved your character who was like editing her own thoughts. Vicki. Yes. I loved that as like a narrative thing so much because it felt so niche to like being an author that you're like even editing your thoughts. That was so fun. That's what we do. But my favorite character, was Mike. But I think, I think, Gary, I think you and I touched about this, because Mike was, he was a person who was very huge back in the day,

like, you know, 15 years ago. He had four bestsellers. One was a movie and blah, blah, blah. And it just kind of started to fall off. And, you know, he wrote like detective things, like I think fedoras, you know, and the splashier things with all the twists started to be, to become popular.

So he kind of fell to the wayside. He was my favorite character because in my head when I was writing it, I saw him as like Robert Sean Leonard, who like I have a, I was going to, I've got to say a bad word. I have a freaking mean crush on like Robert Sean Leonard from the early seasons of house because I loved his hair and his cheekbones and the whole thing. But like that's just who I pictured as Mike. And then the more I wrote him,

I'm like the more I see him as that. And then I'm like, then the more I just fell in love with him because I love Robert Shaw and Leonard. I love you. So that's why Mike was my favorite character because I already had an actor in my head as playing him. So that's why I love to watch him. And he was, he was kind of cool.

He is. He is cool. Well, I think he did a good job of making all the characters empathetic. Or like you could, they're all accessible still, most of them. And share. He likes the douche. one. I do. You know what the thing is, too, is I feel like, yeah, right?

I feel like the thing is that if you would, if somebody took my copy of this book and they put white out on the character names for each chapter, I think I could read it and I would know who was speaking. Yes. I hope so. And like, because they were also different. I really do. But the thing. Yeah, no, you did. You did. And you know what the thing is too is I feel like, I do like the douchy or the bitchy character. But the thing is, I feel like because of your personality, you have such a fun,

vibrant personality, and you're so quick that it's almost like when I read them, I can tell how much fun you have with like the villainous character or like the duchy guy. He was a douchebag. I loved writing.

He was so fun to write. Yeah. That's also the thing. Like, there's a big thing about, you know, like readers and writers about likable characters. And I'm like, you know, and I wrote an article for for crime reads last year. And it was like my seven most favorite unlikable characters. The reason why I loved these books is because these characters were unlikable. And it was like Amber from Last Mrs. Parish, everybody from the East House seven in my dreams

to hold a knife. Right. A lot of things where I'm like, you know, do I root for them? No. But do I hate them? Absolutely no. I want to see what they're going to do next. I want to see what trouble we're going to get into. I love all of this stuff.

I love an unlikable character, which is why it could be anyone. Everybody was like unlikable. But they had a little bit of charm, you know. But that's the thing with like an unlikable character. I love, like honestly. I'm not reading romance. I'm reading thrillers. I'm reading about murder, secrets, backstabbing. Give me your unlikable character. Am I going to root for them to win? Probably not. Does that mean I hate them? Zero percent. I probably love your unlikable character. Give me a bad character all the time.

I love that. I love that. I do too. Yes. I do too. I just love like a little like villainous. I love like snarky. And I also love realistic. because like I don't usually even say likeable or unlikable characters because if you take a thriller or a mystery or a suspense book and you're like, wait a second, like I'm going through this situation. I'm an author at Murder Paloosa and one of the most beloved people in our community was just murdered. I'm not going to be likable. You know, I'm going to be like what the fuck is going on? Am I next? Who's doing this? I don't trust this person. This one's shady. This. This guy probably did it. You know, like, you just like all of those motions that you go through, it's hard to be. I didn't do it. Yeah, right? Like, it was a bit. But like, you know, I was doing something shady on my own, but you don't need to know that because it has nothing to do with murder. But like all of the panic with those situations, it's like, how do you find somebody who's a likable character when you're literally fearing for your life? Yes. And when, and when they're supposed to be unlikable.

They're supposed to be unlikable. Like I always go back to Amber from Last Mrs. Parish. Man, I ate up this novel, Last Mrs. Parish. I ate up this novel because of Amber. And the first shot, the prequel and the one, the next Mrs. Parish that's coming out. Just the whole thing with Amber, she was horrible. She was literally the worst. That's what made me keep reading.

I didn't, I mean, look, what was her name, Daphne? I think Daphne was the wife. I think was so good. Yes, Stephanie, yeah. And, you know, I liked her and I was rooting for her. I was not rooting for Amber, but that made me like her more because I'm like, show me you're crazy. Like, I read thrillers.

I don't want things wrapped up in a bow. I don't want somebody who's going to kill animals because that's right. Oh, no, no, we don't like that either. I don't need you to pet the puppy. I don't need you to pet the, I don't. I definitely don't want you to kill the puppy, but I don't need you to pet the puppy. You know, don't kick the puppy. Just don't kill it.

Like, I don't care. You're mean, you're cheating. You're, you know, you're crazy. You're doing all these bad things. You're manipulative. I love that. I'm like, but that's why I love the brothers. I'm like, give me more of that.

Give me more of the bad, bad characters. That's what I love to read. If everybody's likable in a book, it's women's fiction. unlikable characters. I need unlikable characters. I love you so much. I love you so much. It doesn't mean I'm rooting for them.

It just means I love to hate you. I love to hate you. Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. Well, I think that was an amazing explanation. So I'm going to give you a little Easter egg for my cast. Okay.

I'm going to tell you. who I picked for Mike. Do not even say Sebastian Stan because you pick him for everything. It's not Sebastian Stan. It's not him. I picked Bradley Cooper. Oh my goodness.

Oh, my goodness. And as soon as you said that, and Gare, as soon as you said that, I was never here, but as soon as you said that, I'm like, my God, he's Davis. Oh, really? Because I just thought about him

in Hangover. Oh, so you know, I thought about him in a star is born, how he can kind of play that like washed up kind of character that like wants people to sympathize with him. That's good. That's good. That's good. I love that. That's perfect. And, you know, if the writer's strike is ever finished, we'll have this figured out, you know, commercially.

I know. That's so exciting. No, you know, it's like vague publishing tweet. Yeah, right. Basically can't say anything. Yeah, yeah. Not much going on at the moment. Nothing going on.

Zero. Done. That's perfect. Did you have this idea when you were at Thriller Fest or did you have it away from? Oh my gosh. That's exactly what I was going to ask. I was going to be like, we haven't talked about that question. All right.

No. No. We prepare nothing. I'm going to tell you where this was born. I'm going to tell you where this was born. Okay. I wrote this in 2021 from April to July of 2021. Now, I had gone to Thriller Fest as a non-agented, non-book deal, just, you know, a writer,

which is I think anybody who is just a regular writer who is trying to break in, go to Thrillerfest, this is where you're going to meet your people. You're going to meet your tribe. You're going to get your people. You're going to make friends who are going to come out for you later. Thriller Fest is in the ITW. They do so much for just so many, for all writers. And I'm thankful every day.

So the last live thriller fest I went to was 2019. Obviously, everybody remembers 2019. And then I got my agent in 2019. And I was like, yay. I was actually at Thriller Fest. I was with, and, you know, they all know. I was in nobody. This is why authors are great, and I said it a million times.

So everybody knows Vanessa Lilly. Everybody loves her. Her and I were friends before either of us had anything. We go way back. But she had already gotten an agent and a book deal, and I still hadn't had either. So when I was going to meet her for Thriller Fest, And then I met the same in 2019, met Daniel Gerard,

Kyra Ruta, Kimberly Bell, A.F. Brady, Jennifer Patchley, just a whole bunch of Wendy Heard was there. It was just a whole bunch of people who were just, I was nobody, they all had book deals and books coming out. And I was just a little baby writer.

And I was, you know, stars in my eyes. And everybody just accepted me. And I remember we were at the bar on Thursday, night at Thrillerfest. And I got an email that I had sent out a bunch of queries with my book. And I got an email saying, I would like to read the full. And you know, when you get a full request when you're just a querying writer, it's like the greatest thing in the world. So I was like, I got a full request from my now agent. So that was on Thursday night at the bar. And everybody was like, yay, see, like you're hanging out with us. Everything's going to work out. And I was like,

I know the manifesting, these women, the can't even manifesting that went into this. So I sent, I sent my now agent the full manuscript on Friday and she signed me on Wednesday. After five years, five hundred of being rejected, hundreds and hundreds of rejections, hundreds and hundreds. It happened in five days. She asked for it on Thursday. I sent it to her on Friday. She signed me on Wednesday.

And it was like, and it was just while I was at Thriller Fest and I just happened to be with all of these wonderful people. So that being said, that was in 2019. So I finding Tessa ended up being my first, my debut novel. That sold in July of 2020. So do you guys or anybody watching or listening want to know? know what 2020 was like. Yeah, really. Have we all forgotten yet?

So that was when I wanted to go to Thriller Fest being like, I have an agent now, and now I have a book deal, and there was no Thriller Fest because it was 2020 and I get it. It was a different place. And then in 2021, they were still not doing it. And this is when, I'm sorry, not this, when finding Tessa, my debut came out was in 2021. and there was still no live thriller fest. And I was like, wow, like, it's my debut year. And there was no.

Yeah. Everything was just on Zoom. And I was like, I'm not, I didn't even sign up. I was like, I'm not even going to Zoom meetings. I'm not going to do these eight hours a day. I just didn't want to. I wanted to, I wanted to be in the club, if you will. Yeah.

All of my other friends were already in the club. I kind of wanted to be in the club. and there was no club. So I started missing Thriller Fest. So I was like, I'm going to write something about Thriller Fest. Not Realer Fest, it's Murder Palozo. Right.

Don't assume me. It's just a thriller conference. We'll go to a thriller conference and they're all together. And I wrote that in 2021 when there was still no live conference. So I had, I had submitted a different book to my publisher saying, take this one for book free.

But I wrote this one so fast. I wrote this one in like 11 weeks, so fast. That's crazy. And then they had already had my publisher had already had my other book. And then I told my agent, I was like, you know what? I finished this one. I really like this one better. I'm like, why don't we like, let's just pull the other one.

And she's like, well, you know, it's like a 30 day thing. If we pull that one, the 30 day starts over. I'm like, I don't care. I like this one better. So then my editor had both of them at that point. And she was like, I like both of them. She's like, I need to figure it out. And then she even came back to me and said, I think I like the one that you gave me

first better. I need to figure it out. And then she came back and said, you know what? This one, she goes, this one just, it's a little bit more timely. it's got a little bit more stuff. She goes, I think I want this instead. So this ended up being book three. And then you would think that other one would end up being book four, but it's not because

I wrote another one in between. And then I gave her the other one. I was like, how about the other one and this new one I wrote? And she was like, oh, no, I like the new one better. I'm like, oh, so I've got this book that's done that's been sitting around for like three years. Oh my gosh. But it's okay.

But it's okay. it's okay I just I just want to say if anybody's watching my publisher my actual publisher which is Scarlet you guys know Charles

Charles Perry is he's the publisher for Scarlet he actually designed this cover and did he not grasp this did he not grasp the cover the way you should and to Louisa my editor

I just could not love her more. I mean, honestly, even more than you, Gare. I mean, after all of this and, like, banging out a book of year, I love her more than me, too. Right. Well, you know you're my favorite human, but I do. My editor is just, I love her. So, Louisa, if you're watching this, you were literally the best. and I thank everything every day that you are my editor for three books about to be four and hopefully five, six, seven, whatever it is.

But I know. I am so excited for your career, especially to finish a book in 11 weeks. Yeah. This one, well, you guys know, can I plug myself for a second? Oh, yeah. Yes. Yes. Kirkus Star Review. Yes.

So when Louisa, my editor emailed me, she was like, capitalized up to you. And I was like, okay, it's a start review. Like, what does that even mean? I know a Star Review is good. I just didn't know what it even meant. Yeah. And I looked it up. And I was like, wow, a Kirkus Star Review was like pretty good.

But then it got the, it was on she reads, right there. It was also on crime. reads as a best of May novel suspects from hatchet said it was a best of May um amazon put it as a edders pick which is on my amazon page forever for best mystery thriller and suspense and and not allowed to say that it's going to be an eight reader's guide on june fourth on a very big national newspaper known for its book reviews nice and paid that's amazing though

I mean that is truly amazing it's not even out and you have all of that you know what all authors think though now I'm like oh book four can't wait failure book four I'm like this is what I think I'm like I'm already I'm like book four is going to be a failure

but it's never going to get all of these accolades I'm like book four is going to be a failure because that's what we all know that's that's what we all do and don't let any author ever tell you differently. We all have imposter syndrome. You liar. I know. And that's why we love people like you guys. You're like, all of you guys are like,

no, like we love your books and we're like, thank you. We need to hear that. So yeah, when you love a book, tell the author, not even just me. Tell all your, tell, tell, tell, I have my pen. I have one too. I have my pen. No. No, I had one. It was. here. Oh, no. No, I had one. I don't know where it. Oh, here it is. Oh, it's right here. Yeah. I mean, your swag. I don't, I mean, I just think that you're writing gets better and better. That you love them. Yes. Not me. Tell all your authors that you love them. We are, we suffer. We suffer. That's literally what we do on this podcast every week is just gush about,

like, all of the authors that we love, the things that we're looking forward to. Um, We tried to keep our auto buy authors to 14 last week and it ended up being 23. So. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You've got auto buy. I've got every author has an auto buy author as well.

Yeah. I mean, I will buy anything from Michelle Campbell, Mary Kubica, Lyft Constantine, Serapine and Nova Glass, Ashley Winstead. Like, you know, and that's just, that's just this big. Like, I. Gabeland Hendrix. yes obviously you need to buy everything that I write

you guys know Vanessa Lily has a new one coming out in October I just got my copy talk about the one to punch in two pages the one two punch of the twist I'm like I still can't even wow yeah blood sisters right you know um you know I've got my people that oh god I was So lucky. Did you guys read, did you guys read Twisted Love Story by Samantha Downing yet? I haven't read it yet. I just got a copy of it. And I don't have access yet. I got to blurb that one. I was so freaking lucky. I still think about that book. It was like four months ago. I'm still think about that book. I'm so excited. I can't wait. And then you know how you read a book and you're

like, oh my God, like I'm mad that I finished it. Like I'm not mad that I finished it because I'm like, oh my god why did I finish that? I meant that I finished it because I would have read that for another year. Wow. That's what I told you about finding Tessa when I first found you. Yeah. Literally the best. That's what I said about finding Tessa.

Like I think I messaged you and I said I just finished it. Told you all my thoughts. I was like, I'm obsessed. But I like immediately was like I'm so satisfied with this story, but I immediately wanted to start it over again. Oh. I know, especially with that one, like, to see what we, like, missed. Yes.

You know, I think that would be fun. Well, that's what people say when they, some people have told me they've read it a second time just to just to get up to that, that part. Do you guys know? Yeah. And then be like, wow, it was there the entire time. And I'm like, yeah. Yeah.

Like, I had to be so careful with my wording. I bet. I can imagine. I can imagine. Like put blinders on. on certain parts of it. So can I ask a question? Yeah, of course.

What, both of you? What have you guys read lately that is like that you're, you want to tell people that everybody should read? I want to know because I want to add it to my list because, you know, I want to know what you guys are suggesting. Hey, I'll let you go first. Okay. Last week I finished, did you hear about Kitty Carr?

And I was totally obsessed with it. It's not a thriller. I didn't know about that one. Who wrote that? Crystal Smith, Paul. It's not a thriller. So it's kind of like in the vein of Evelyn Hugo, but a little more focused on the civil rights movement in Hollywood in that time period. And it was so, so, so, so, so good.

I'm trying to think of the other one I read was The Whispers by Ashley Audrain, but that one doesn't come out until July. So it's not totally helpful, but I might find another one when while Gare's talking. I know you read them all. I know. I just read a gay rom-com that I absolutely loved called The Gay Best Friend, and it was such a fun, like story. Nicholas Dim Dinsio, I know I'm going to butcher his last name, but I absolutely loved it.

It was so good. and it was like laugh out loud funny. There's one coming out in July called Whisper by Brian Deerborn. And it's like a slasher thriller like kind of in the vein of like the scream movies. And it's so twisty and so much fun. I absolutely loved it. Whisper? Whisper.

Okay. But the last one that I read that's out now is the last word by Taylor Adams. Oh, God, I know that just came out like a week ago, right? Yeah, yeah. Okay. Oh, my God. I texted Kate like a psycho when I was reading it. Like, I was reading it at like 1 o'clock in the afternoon.

And I was like, I'm like legit scared right now. Like, I'm like going around my house, locking the doors. Like, I cannot read this when the sun goes down. So I need to finish it. TVR, the new Taylor Adams one. Oh, my God. That is my TVR then. So, so good.

Amazing. Good, because I always love book friends because, you know, I mean, obviously, like, I get so many because so many my friends write so many amazing books. But, you know, I don't know everybody in the world. So I want more. I want to know more things that I don't know. Yeah. I don't know. I will, I want them on my TVR.

I want to shut out these people. Yeah. Did you read Stone Cold Fox? Oh, I have that. Oh, where is that? Oh, that might be on the upstairs shelf because my I loved that one so much. Oh, and thanks, Dennis. I'm scared straight reads made me do it. Yeah. That's one of my, um, that's one of my, um, Dennis made me do it books. I think that's on my chair shelf because that's what I'm grabbing stuff off of. But yes, I do. Yeah. I heard that really amazing. Yeah. I have to shout out the shards by Brett Easton Ellis. Yeah. Which one? The Shards by Brett. It's the guy that wrote American Psycho, Brett Easton Ellis.

Oh my God. It's like 700 pages. It's so good. It's like serial killer in Los Angeles in the 80s. And it's so much fun. Well, things that I love. You don't have to sell me so hard, Gary. I just like never wanted it.

to stop and I was like reading it and I was like on page like 650 like getting toward the end and I was like I wish this was a thousand pages. Wow. That's what I felt about. That's what I felt about Samantha Downings when I said like I'm mad that I finished it and it's not because you know, sometimes you're like oh my God this book was so bad. I'm so mad that I fucking finished it. No, you're allowed to swear on here. We're an explicit podcast here. We swear a lot. I say that when I I'm mad that I finished it. I'm mad that I finished it because I would have let that go on for like another 300 pages. Yeah.

I'm like, and I even text every once a while. I'm like, what happened to Wes and Ivy? I want to know. Yes. Yeah. I need to know. The plot. I already want to know.

The synopsis to that kind of reminds me of the War of the Roses. And I think that's why I'm like very interested in it. Yes. Except. except more modern, obviously, and better. I said it, it's better than more of the roses. That's going to be, that's exciting. But I love her.

I think it's July 14th, I think it comes out. Yeah. I think you're right. But, or maybe July 11th, either, it doesn't matter. July 14th, 11th, it doesn't matter. It comes out in July. Yeah. If you pre-order it now, you'll just get it when it comes out.

So, yeah. Downing, man. That was a great book. July 18th. 18th. July 18th. Yeah. Everybody go get that book.

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to that one. I'm really looking forward to that one. That's going to be so good. There's another one I'm really looking forward to. Don't forget the girl by Rebecca McKenna. I don't know that one. Tell me more. I haven't read it yet, but I'm really looking forward to it,

but it has like the, these three girls were friends in college and one of them disappeared. And the police basically, even though they didn't find her body, they said that she was the victim of a serial killer. And so, like, years later, the serial killer is going to be executed. And all the media is, like, kind of treating him like Ted Bundy, right? Like all of his flashy murders, focusing on him. but they don't really mention these two, like these two women, their friend that had went missing. So even though there's been like a lot of distance between them, they kind of reunite when he's about to be executed. And then why are they going to?

They begin to wonder if maybe he was like if maybe he wasn't responsible for their friend's death. Ooh. And the plot thickens. Yeah. I just can't wait to read it. It sounds so good. It sounds so good. It does.

I love stuff like that. I always, especially from like people like you guys, like, you know, who read so much and you're in the genre, I'm like, if you guys have recommendations, like, throw them out, man. Like, I'll buy him. Yeah. You like that you think is good, like I'll buy it. It's fine. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Like, I will read it. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Is, I have a. very specific question. I've been thinking about asking you since you said yes to us. And I also would like to hear Kate's answer too, but I am dying to know because I've talked to you a lot about TV and movies. Oh, God. Yes. We have a fit. So I want to know, like, have, are there any TV shows?

Are there any movies that you've watched that you like love so much that you're like, I wish I would have thought of that or like I wish I would have wrote that not that I wish I would have thought of that or I wish it would have wrote it okay lie lie um the wish I would have thought of it Gare I think we watch this together it was I forgot the name of it but it was um pro summer not pro summer not pro summer if I know we watched that one um so one with um Tell Me Lies. From the guy from the Hollywood thing.

He was, he was. Harvey Weinstein? No, the guy was, his name was in the show. He was Vincent Chase. Vincent Chase. He was Vincent Chase. And his agent was Ari. Oh, entourage?

Entourage. Okay. So, anyway, the guy from. Montaraj who played Vincent Tace? He was in this other show called,

it was like an eight episode arc. That was it. It was only eight episodes. It's over. There's not going to be a season two at all. I forgot what it was called.

But are you finding it, Kate? Oh, yeah. She's the friggin. But that. Click bait. Click bait. What was it called? Clickbait.

Click bait. Okay. That was amazing. tell you click bait was was it was it was just eight episodes and it was just like you know you get what you know is happening and then it's like and then you get but each each thing was eight different points of view the cop the sister the mom the the the son's girlfriend like everything was just completely different and every single thing gave you a different yes um kind of thing about what actually happened.

So I did think about trying to write something like that, but I can't because I can't, I can't put that much. It would have to be an entire character arc into one section. Right. Yes. Then it would be like a 300,000,

it would be 300,000 word book and nobody wants to read it on an epic fantasy. Like I just, I put. We would read it. We would read it. But as, far as TV shows I will watch over and over and over, for the same reason. You know, anything that Netflix puts out is, or Hulu, as you know, Gare,

because we've got her thing, I mean, we've got June, what is it, June 6? We've got her, we've got a date June 6th. Cool summer. Oh, my God. I love stuff like that, but also if you're going to give me anything viable, and it's every day. And when I say I watch four episodes a day of each of these shows, I am not joking. It's every day I watch four episodes each of these shows.

Ships Creek, because, you know. Because obviously. This line is awful. Get me in other class. That's what Moira said. But David Rose is my spirit animal. And I will always, you know, that. And then also house MD because I thought.

House was brilliant and I have a crush on Robert's phone letter. But I will watch. I will watch. Well, this was funny and she's watching and she's watching. I was, I make fun with my husband because I watch. Here's the thing. I watch House MV so much.

It's eight seasons. Like between 20 and 24 episodes of season, eight seasons. So I will watch the entire thing. And as soon as it's over, I will start back at season one. Because I love Robert Schenlutter. If I did not mention that. But then I will start watching again.

But I have done that probably 12 times to the point where I'm like, I'm a doctor. Like, I am literally a doctor. You are. I have watched so much. I am literally a doctor. Yeah. That's amazing. So I'm in Pilates with, you know, this girl I go to Pilates with.

And she was telling me that her daughter had a problem where she started gaining a lot of weight and blah blah. I'm like, have you checked her cortisol levels? I was like, maybe she has Cushing's disease because I watched house so much. So she went and she brought her daughter and she was like, can you check? And the doctors were like, no, no, no. She was like, check her for Cushing's disease. So she was like, yeah, she has Cushing's disease.

I'm like, so she probably has a tumor in her pituitary. I'm like, but you know what? That's fine because I'm just going to go up under her lip. And they could, like, go up under her lip because the pituitary is right here. I'm like, it's going to be fine. It's going to be an easy surgery. She did the entire thing based on what I saw on house and I told her to do. I am a doctor.

That is amazing. Thank you, Robert. That is such a cool story. Thank you, Dr. James Wilson. Your DMs are going to be, like, blowing up when people, like, find this out. And they're like, listen, like, I have this, like, I have this, like, pain back here. Like, what do you think of it is? But I was like, you should check her?

I'm like she gained weight and you have no idea. I'm like, check her for Cushing's disease. She's got a cortisol build up. Go get a check. And then it turned as she had it. And then I was like she's probably got a brain tumor, but it's an easy one. They'll go up through the lip and they'll take it out.

That's amazing. Cheryl, if you're watching. That is insane. I love that story. Mine are like, I don't know. I watch the same shows over and over again too, but it's like Law and Order SVU and Euphoria. Oh, Euphoria.

What's her name? Sendia? Yeah. Love her. She's amazing. She's amazing. She's absolutely amazing. She's absolutely amazing.

She made that show season one. Yeah. Wasn't so much about her anymore, but she made that show. She made that show what it is. Yeah. Yeah. It's so wild. I love it. I love it. Kay, what would you watch anything? You don't. Come on, Kay, you watch something. Well, what I was going to. Oh, I watched tons of. I watch tons of stuff. I just don't rewatch

stuff. But I was going to say what we watch at night, which I'm assuming is kind of what you're, like, what you watch every night. I don't know. We watch podcasts at night. So it's kind of like every week, there's like three or four new ones each a week and so we end up watching them. So it's kind of like rewatching stuff because it is like the same people. Um, where like we did used to like sometimes we would rewatch like the office, but we haven't in a really long time. And I think it's just as a podcast. So the office is your thing and then what else? That's it. Oh, what else? So, oh, I mean, I watch a lot of stuff. Rewatch. Even if it's old, it's okay. I just want to know. I really don't though. I'm not kidding.

Then where am I wrong? Because I tried watching The Office twice. Oh, yeah. I mean, and I'm not talking about two episodes. I watched all of Season 1, and then I watched all of season one and halfway season 2. And I'm like, I don't get it. And I know, go ahead, shoot your shots. I am the worst person in the world.

Everyone I know is like, oh, this is the best show in the world. I'm like, okay, I just didn't get it. I didn't get it either. People tell me that they think that, John Chris Creek is they don't get it and I'm like if you don't get Ships Creek we are not friends yeah yeah yeah I think culturally for us at the time I was in college when the office was airing and so I had started a couple were really boring office jobs and so if you had done that it was a little bit fun because you're used to the money

dayness of it. But it was also so big with like kids in college. Like he was finishing as I was in college. So there's just it kind of before memes were memes, you would like quote the office. Like people would quote Anchorman. So there's that. But I have we have rewatched it Creek once. So when you said that, I was like we did work our way back through it at night. No, it's so funny. like you could literally just say anything that any of them said ever and i would be like um that is episode three um uh season five episode three this is the name of it and this is it happened about 1410 in the episode i am psychotic about shit's creepy i feel like that's how i am with euphoria so i can't say anything yeah and see we all we've all got our thing man yeah i think it's great i think it's

Hey, is there anything that you like wish you had the idea to write? Yep. So I don't know why I was like, yep. Yelp. That's what I was about to be. Did I hide? Bad Sisters on Apple TV evoked that feeling for me where I was like, I would love to write a story like that. So it's like it starts off where this like really dushy guy, not your kind of dushy, like actually a terrible guy.

I love him already. He dies of like natural cause. You don't totally know why he died. But all of the sisters of his wife hate him and his wife hated him. And it's six or eight episodes, and each episode is actually really similar to what you said about clickbait, where each episode you're following someone else and the reason why they might have actually killed him. And so the whole time you're like, did someone kill him? Well, is it natural? Did this person do it?

And it like changes your perspective. Or a book or it's never. I know. You know what? Yeah. That's the next book somebody needs to write. plot twist. He just happened to die of old age. Yeah. Nobody murdered him. Nobody poisoned. He just happened to die. That's the plot twist.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I kind of feel like in some weird way you did that with it, could be anyone, where you had a guy who died and it could have been natural. And it also could have been like a hundred people. It could have been 100 people who wanted him dead, you know. I think that's something that would be fun with like somebody died naturally as being like, oh, I didn't know that they died naturally, but like having all of these people want him dead, you know? And you kind of did that already. Would you feel let down? Okay.

Okay. For anybody who hasn't read it could be anyone. No, he didn't die naturally. And that's fine. It could be anyone. He didn't die naturally. But would you have felt let down if he died naturally?

No. It would have been let down. No, I wouldn't. What's the point? I wouldn't have been... What's the point of the exposure and all that stuff? Because to me... Somebody to kill him.

But to me, I think it would have been entertaining with... It could have been anyone. I wouldn't have felt let down because the thing that I enjoyed about it could be anyone was finding out why each character had it out for. for him. So even if he died naturally, I still would have been like, this is fucking amazing because you found out all of the reasons why everybody was like, it could have been this person, it could have been this person, it could have been me, you know, just like that's the

thing that I would have found very entertaining about a story like that. I have a paperback of it could be anyone that I want to give away to somebody. I will sign it and send it to you. Give-way time. I will sign it and send it to somebody. Anybody here. Hold on. Gare,

I know I texted this to you before. Hold on. If anybody follows me and Gare, they know that we have this wonderful secret love language, which is lovely. And I would, I like literally,

I will, like, die for you for this. I love that. is literally the best. But if anybody could figure out what this means, hold on. Okay, I'm going to say it. So I don't know how you guys monitor this, but if anybody can figure out,

I-L-Y-B-S-M-A, I'm sorry, S-M-A-Y-B-F-H-H-I-T-T-T-W-W. figure that out. This is coming right to your doorstep. Type it out. Yeah. Yeah, we'll type that out. Nobody's ever going to figure that out. So no one's ever going to figure it out, Gary, because, and Kate, because that's an us thing.

You guys figure out something for somebody to grab this. You guys figure it out. I will honor it. I will sign us a blank. Yes. I love that. that. You guys honor it. Yeah. Yeah. We'll figure we'll figure something out. We'll always more people need to read it. So. Oh my God. I know it's so good. Especially like right now.

Yeah. Yeah. Especially right now like you could binge it before the 23rd. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, that's, oh my God. So hi publisher. If they're watching. Thank you for putting out my hard cover of, uh, of I didn't do it on May, 23rd. I'm very, very excited that you put out the soft cover of this the same day. So I don't have enough to do. Hey, that's amazing though, right? Like, all those stores, like, this was supposed to come at May 2nd. And then it's like, oh, no, it's May 23rd. I'm like, I'm kind of busy May 23rd. Right. Excuse me. But I will give away this copy signed and mail to one of, your readers or listeners,

you guys pick the parameters. It's up to you guys. Yeah, we got it. I thought it was funny about the ha-ha, but like nobody's going to figure it out. That's like a... I don't think so. I don't like it.

I will send a soft cover. It could be anyone's signed to whoever. However. I love that. Yeah. Yeah. I'm glad. I'm just like loving.

the combination of your two shows that you love so much because the reason I thought of that question for you is because do you know what movie I wish I would have had the idea for and written basic instinct well if I could have a typical thriller thing it's like a psychotic woman the boiling bunny thing nobody saw that coming that's fatal attraction you just broke his heart basic instinct is the one with Sharon stone and Michael Douglas where she's the author yes the leg cross she and are both like spreading legs and you're like trying to give a serious synopsis I'm like oh no I love that that's another great one because it was yeah I you know she wrote the book about how to kill somebody

and that's why you would not think that she wrote the book about how to tell somebody, except she wrote the book about how to tell somebody. Yeah. Yeah, it's just so good. That and I know what you did last summer. I would write the shit out of I know what you did last summer. I know what you did last summer. Mm-hmm.

Oh, the original? Yeah. That was good. Yeah. Original was good. They screwed it up by, and you know what? I would normally say they screwed up screen by doing it over and over, but they didn't.

They made it better and better. I agree. Nothing's ever going to rival the first screen. No. No. Ever. Ever. No. I have this like conversation with my friend Shelley because she's like a big like horror movie lover. But I like said to her like I like listed off these main points of I know what you did last summer and I was like if you watch this as a drama and not like a horror movie, it's actually one of the saddest movies in the entire world. Oh my God. Did you ever watch? Do you ever look at? up and I'm going to implore you and everybody is watching this. I'm going to implore you to watch this. There's a thing called, you guys know Robin Williams was Mrs. Doutfire? Yes. Okay, you guys have seen Mrs. Datfire. Yes. Correct. Both of you have. Yes. Have you ever seen the trailer if Mrs.

Doutfire was a thriller movie? No. I have seen this on YouTube. Okay. Okay. So Kate, you haven't seen it yet. I have not. Look it up. If Mrs. Doubtfire was a thriller. Oh my gosh. It's psychotic. It is so excellent. And it's like, who made this? Who made this? This is the best thing. That would be. Yeah, Kate would get such a thing. It's not a comedy. It's, it's Mrs. Doubtfire is a thriller. It is so well done. And it's a two-minute trailer. And that's all it's like, oh, if it's a two-minute trailer, if Mrs. Doubtfire was a solo. Kate is like the perfect person to watch that

because she's so good at editing and producing that like for you to watch something like that, she would absolutely love it. I'm going to start doing it on other ones now. I'm going to find that and I'm going to text it to you. I might be the one to produce it for you. And I'm not going to make you search for a girlfriend. I love you.

Kate might be the one to edit it to edit my I know you did last summer trailer to make it look like a sad movie. Yes. Yes. We should. I will. I know what you did last summer and scream. You know, back in like 96, 97, they can't scare us the way they did back then. Those were great movies. Those were great movies. Yeah. They scared us the way they did back then. Barbarian. Barbarian will scare the shit out of you. Barbarian. Yeah. Yep.

It's a new one. It's, um, this woman goes to like an Airbnb that she rented and there's already a guy there, but they can't get a hold of the owner. So he's like, listen, like you sleep in the bedroom. I'll just sleep on the couch and try to eat her. It sounds like barbarian. It sounds like he tries to eat her. No, he doesn't try to eat her.

But it is very like messed up and scary and twisted, but it's such a good movie. Like, people are going to be talking about. Yeah. What is it on? Hold on. I watched it on HBO Max. HBO Max. Hold on.

Look, we're all watching here. HBO Max, Barbarian, you said it's called? Yeah, Barbarian. Okay. Thank you, Anne-Marie, because I'm using her. Bill Scars Guard is in it. Yes. Barbarian.

That's it? Yes. Yes. Okay. Yep. yeah that'll scare the shit out of you. You did? It's on my list.

I'm probably going to watch it because I'm a lot to take it. Because now I'm a little curious. Yeah, it'll scare the shit out of you. It'll scare the shit out of you. You know, that's another question I have for both of you. What is scared the shit out of you? Because nothing has scared the shit into me. And I'll tell you why real quick.

When I was a child and I watched first. I watched Freddie Kruger when I was a child. And I was like eight, nine years old. And my father was like, oh, yeah, look at that. He's like, you see that? Like, that's not real blood. That's an actor. That's no, nobody's doing anything, blah, blah, blah.

So I never got scared of it me because I looked at everything. I'm like, whatever, it's an actor. It's fake blood. Like, I don't care. And I had asked this question once before like five years ago. Like, what has scared that F out of everybody? So I got a bunch of recommendations. I watched them all and I was like, yeah, literally none of this is scary.

None of this is bad. What has literally kept you up at night? Keep me up at night. Like movie or TV show or just like anything in general? Literally anything in general. My biggest fear is a home invasion of any kind. And they're done that. So the, the item.

got an ABC. No. Yeah, the like the Idaho case with the four college students that were killed. Oh my God. In Idaho? Yeah. That terror. When that case was happening, I was actually losing sleep because my house is set up kind of similar to theirs where I have a sliding glass door on the second level of my house,

but you can you can get in through the. Oh, my God, man. And I just like one night, I forgot to lock it. and I like literally like beat the shit out of myself for like three days. Like just like you idiot. Like this could happen to you. Like you need to be more vigilant. So like any any home invasion kind of.

And I think that's why the beginning of the first screen movie scares me so much because like any home invasion. So real that can happen. Yeah. And some popcorn. You're watching a movie. Yeah. And I live in the middle of nowhere. So like my house is set up kind of similar to the house.

and scream in the beginning. Like there's four different ways to get into my house and I live in the middle of nowhere. So like if I call the cops, it'll be a half hour, 45 minutes before we get here. Yeah. Like I'm just in the middle of nowhere waiting to be stopped. This is why I worry about having to go save him. What scares the bejesus out of you, Keith? That's what I'm trying to think of what scared me.

I literally can't be able to be. recently. So sometimes... I'm asking for you people to scare the bejesus at only. Yeah. One niche thing is sometimes in books when like there's a lot of description of dismembering bodies. Like if I'm reading that before bed, sometimes that sticks in my head in like a gory way. The one that happened most recently, it would kind of be a spoiler to say who it was. So I'm not going to say it. I'm going to think of another one. Can I guess that? Yeah.

Is it Karen Slaughter? I just say Karen Slaughter. Yes, Karen Slaughter has, but in Jar of Hearts, there were a couple of things that like, just like the image of them cutting everything up was like in my head right before I went to sleep. And then sometimes you're like, my body feels weird. So there's that. What about something that you watch that you can tell me? No, that's what I'm trying to think of.

Real quick. It's not a book. could get in and out in 90 minutes. Right. Yeah, right. So I saw Barbarian in theater. That was like... All right. Well, I've got that already.

I know. I don't know. I haven't been scared, like, stay up at night. Go ahead. I have one, I think, might be for the both of us from K. And I. Oh, nice. The movie Watcher? Oh, yes.

Oh, I saw that. With Michael Monroe. Fresh. On Hulu. Yes, I loved it. Okay. That made me uncomfey. Which actually fits into my theme.

I was like, okay, blah, blah, blah. He's just, you're run-of-the-mill psycho. And he's like, no, I'm going to sell your flesh. And I'm going to eat your ass right now. And I'm like, that part made my stomach hurt. And I didn't expect. Oh, no, that one, that one still sticks with me. Yes.

I just kept texting Gary. I was like, I'm so uncomfortable. Yeah. But watcher like. I really sure it's not true. I never know. It scares me about it. Watcher scares me because she's in a foreign country.

Shit like that is not actually happening. Yeah. scares me about it. Because it could be true. And anything that could be true scares the be jesus out of me. Like, yeah. Freddie Kruger and like, you know, Jason Rohrehe's fine. Like, yeah, you're jumping.

out of a lake and you're 100 years old and you know you're the macheteing me yeah that's fine right but like like literally being kidnapped as like an human person and like having your meat sold that could literally happen out and that that that that's that's what scares me because it could yeah that's what scared me about watcher though is that she's dealing with a serial killer in a foreign country and then she doesn't speak the language oh wait we're We watched different watchers then. I watch the watcher on Netflix. You're thinking of, like, of video games. I'm talking of the movie, not the show with Naomi Watts. There's a movie called Watcher on Hulu, and it has Micah Munro in it. It's incredible.

Okay. And it's on what? Hold on Hulu. On Hulu, and it's called The Watcher. It's just called Watcher. Watcher. Hold on. I got to put this on my stuff. Yeah. Blue and it's just watch. Oh, they're so good. So good. I love that movie. Nope. Hold on. I spelled that wrong. Okay. Here it is. No, it just is. The watchful eye. Oh, the watcher, thriller movie, 2022. Bam.

Yep. Yes. Here it is. Now it's on my stuff. Okay. It's on my list. Thank you. That scares me. Thank you. If you like horror satire, but like not going to scare you, the menu was so funny and I watched the menu. I watched the menu. Yes. And you're right. That was total satire. Yeah, it was so good. It would have been scary if it wasn't funny. But it wasn't even funny. It wasn't funny horrifying it was pretentious it was so good yeah yeah it was pretentious that was oh smile that was what i saw after i saw that in theater smile was pretty scary it didn't keep me up at night but it was good are we supposed to be talking about books on your

no we talk about any thriller and just really anything yeah food we love to discovered when I started uploading it into AI that we talk about food a lot. It's like, this is a podcast about people who are enthusiastic about books and food. Food and apparently, um, serial killers. Yes, definitely that. That's what scares me in a horror movie is if, if there's like a serial killer and you don't get the, um, you never find out their motive. Mm-hmm. Like that terrifies me. And see, I don't be terrible. I have a thing that. If it's a book, I have a thing. If you don't give me a motive,

I have a problem with it. I have a problem with it. I have a problem with, because, you know, as a reader, I need to know why you're doing all this stuff. I need a little bit of your backstory, you need a little bit like whatever. Oh, I decided to become psychotic for no reason,

except for the fact that I'm going to be psychotic. And I'm like, but what is your backstory? Like, why are you psychotic? But I get none of that. And she's like, well, I'm just psychotic. Yeah. I'm like, okay, sure. That's great.

That leaves me no freaking satisfaction. Like, I need to know why you're psychotic. If I read a, yeah, if I read a book, I need to know, like, the backstory and everything. But there's a movie that I watch. And I won't say what it is in case it's a spoil. but there's a movie that I watched and it shows this masked killer, killing all of these people in like very horrific ways. And then the very end of the movie,

you see a van pull into a driveway and walk into this really nice house. And you see the mask come off and this little girl runs up. And she's like, Daddy, you're home. And it's just that this man did all of this horrifying, horrible thing. And then went home to this nice house. And he's like this father, this husband. he has like a normal life. Like it's literally the...

It's like a secret life. That's like... Like Dexter. Yeah. But he's just like a monster who goes out to places and puts on a mask and murders people.

And then he comes home and he's like, you know, then he comes home and he's just like your average family man. Ouch. Yeah. Ouch. That's freaky.

Mm-hmm. Or like the original Black Christmas movie. That's stuff I like better. than like super duper fiction. I like stuff like that better. Or I'm like, okay, like you're, you're, you are a monster, like you said. You're a horrible fucking person. Yeah.

Blah, blah, blah. And then you go home and like, oh, you're putting pigtails in your kids head. And it's like, oh, blah, blah. I'm, I'm making you frank fritters. And I'm, you know, I'm doing all this because I'm super dad. Yeah. You're not your monster. Like, yeah.

You know, but that's a lot of things where it's like, you know, with a lot of these thrillers, it's like, okay, like they have what they do, but then they have their outlet. And their outlet needs to be, I need to do what I got to do. I need to do and I will be a good person the rest of the time. I like those better because I really, I really like it when I can see somebody who is doing like a regular, and then it turns out that they're not regular, that they are literally as horrifying person ever seen or spoke of or have heard of or whatever. Yeah.

I like that. Yeah. That was one of the coolest things that Madman did, which it's been out for so long. So this is just not really a spoiler, but the first episode. Madman the show with, um, okay, I watched all.

John Hamm. Yeah, John Ham. Yeah. But we won't go there. Yeah, we'll talk about that separately. I'm sure we haven't already. But in the pilot, when you meet John Draper, you spend like 50 minutes, like, seeing him, like, doing ads at work and, like, being a baller at work. And then he goes and hooks up with someone, like, on his lunch break.

And he's harassing everybody else. Yeah, yeah. And then he like hooks up with another person like after work and he doesn't have a wedding ring on. We're like, oh, he's just this single guy who's really good at his job. And then the episode, the first episode ends with him. The first episode is the one that got me. That hopefully. Yes. He walks in with January Jones and his kids just waiting for him. Yes. He's not having no idea. They hadn't done that in TV really up until that point. Like you hadn't seen stuff like that. And it was like right when the anti-hero was becoming like Breaking Bad was on Madman. Like you had your anti-heroes. And so you could do that now on TV. Did you ever watch Billions?

Oh, yes. All right. So you know the beginning of billions. Yes. He was being stepped on and somebody was stepping on his face and the whole thing. And at the end of episode one, you find out it's his wife was doing that. yes it was just one of those things where it was like wow like yeah there were so many layers to these characters and i want to find out more yes more about these layers oh my gosh i can't

remember his name i remember bobby at bobby axelrod or whatever ax oh yeah well axel yeah and then there was um and then i can't remember who the oh who he was just he was the i know i got so I watched every single one that right now I just can't remember. But, oh. I never watched him. I look at him. I'm like he's pig vomit. It's called Gi-Madi.

He plays Chuck Rhodes. The Howard Stern movie. Private parts. The Howard Stern movie when Howard Stern made his actual movie. That guy who was the New York District Attorney, he was in Howard Stern's movie, but he was named pig vomit. Or he was the president of NBC, but Howard kept calling him to pig vomit. So every time I see him in any movie now, I'm like he's pig vomit.

What a legacy. Yeah, right. I know. It's not a good legacy, but every time I see him now, I'm like, oh, it's pig vomit. Yeah. And I hate that idea of him that way because he's such a great actor. He's amazing. And he's been in so many different things, but I'm like, oh, so many.

Because I'm a moment. So, you know, you got to a mold, a mold. So when Howard Stern brought his movie out in like the late 90s, I was definitely in my mid to late 20s. And I was like, okay, like, I thought he's pig vomit. It's fun. I love that. But, you know, back then, it was fine that you literally work with somebody like that, and you called them that.

It's right. And no, it used to be okay back then. It's just this whole, you know, thing that goes on with now and then. And people are like, well, you know, it wasn't like that back then. You know, Al Bundy was great back then. And you know what? I still love married with children. It's still one of my favorite shows.

Oh, me too. But I could look at Al Bundy right now and be like, I think he's fucking hilarious and I think he's literally the worst person in the world. There's even stuff from the early 2000s you watch now and you're like, that's a lot on TikTok. A lot of things on like sex in the city and stuff where they're like this would never be on today. Carrie Bradshaw is literally the worst person that ever lived. Everybody knows that right now.

Yeah. Everybody knows that right now. Yeah. Now we have a word for it. Yeah. Yeah, but she was like, I watched all the new ones. I think they lift a little too hard on the new one, but if you try to go to old Carrie Bradshaw and be like, oh, yeah, she's just doing her thing and living her life. I'm like, no, she's an asshole.

She was literally out of all four of them, she was the worst one. She was the worst one out of all four of them. my thing i'm sorry i look back now like Samantha was literally the best one because she didn't give us shit about anything she's like i don't care i don't i will have sex with anybody i don't care if you're gay i don't care if you're straight i will have sex with anybody you do you let me do me i don't care if you're gay or straight or trans leave me alone if i'm a whore it's all good and i'm like this is the that is the best that is the best attitude ever she had like the healthiest self-perception.

Nobody can't f about anything. Yeah. Everybody to everybody. Yeah. She was always my favorite. Me too. Well, I found that out later. Yeah.

He's literally the best. She didn't get me to do that anyway. She was like, everybody could be who they want to be. Just let me be who I want to be. She's like, I want to, I want to sleep around and I want to do my thing. And I'm like, the older I got, I'm like, you do that, girlfriend. Like, you do what you gotta do. Like, and anybody who has a problem with that, screw them.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. I loved her. She's always my favorite. She was the greatest. Because she was, like, she just lifted up everybody. Even her toxic friend Carrie.

She even loved her. She was supportive of Carrie, even though she didn't need to be. Yeah. But so May 23rd, I didn't do it. Make sure everybody reorders their copy now. Do I have to hold it up again? Because this one's heavy. I'll hold it.

I'll be the Van of White. They gave it cool. Fine. Look at that. I know. I love that. It's fine. I love it.

Like a lime yellow spine. Yeah. I know. It's so cool. Like my publisher actually made this. but they gave me a cool spine. Like, could you imagine this in the,

and like the shelves with like, yeah, it's going to stand out. Yeah. And we were just talking about how much we love neon. So it's perfect. We were. As I sit here glowing and pink.

Yeah. Well, like to see, Kate. I love you. But I'm so happy and honored that you were our first author guest. on killing the tea.

Me too. Happy and honor. It means so much to us that you joined us tonight. Right. Two of my greatest people who are, as you saw in the back of this book, you and you. Literally. Literally.

And I think I message you guys earlier that I was going to discuss in the first two minutes, but that didn't happen. So guess what, everybody? I'm going to guess now about him and her. These are two of the best people you will ever meet in your life. I'm not going to lie. Kate and Gare are literally the greatest people you will ever meet. Once you have them in your corner, you are the luckiest person in the world.

they are so supportive of everybody. Not only all of my thriller, all their friends, which by the way they are, but so supportive of everybody, they think of themselves as second and the authors and the books is first. These are the people that you need to associate yourself with. Kate and Gare are literally

two of the best people I have ever met in my life. And I want anybody who's listening or watching to know that. This guy, that girl. Best people are so nice. That is so nice. Yeah. Oh, I love you so much. No, seriously, best people in the world.

I think you're the best person. Yes. I that will that will never go away for me you too like the best people in the world and that's why they're in the back of this book because they're the best people in the world so anybody who has me doubts about anything don't look any further than these you are literally the best people that you will ever come in contact with thriller thriller writer thriller author thriller reader thriller adjacent

right yeah if you keep writing books we're going to keep having it on too these two yeah I can't even I can't even more

I literally can't even more like these are my people in our reading era my favorite human my favorite human I mean Gara knows he's my favorite human in the world

I love you so much and he just is. There's, he doesn't, he doesn't, he doesn't even try to be. He just, and, and the fact that I knew Kate for, for so long before that and that, um, I hope these two up. I'm just, I'm so, like my heart swells. My heart swells. My heart swells for, for you guys.

Like, I, I literally love you guys so much. And, and. And not just for me, for everything you do, for the entire thriller community. And everybody, I mean, you guys know, everybody loves you, right? Everyone has made that weird. In case you didn't know, anybody who you think is not, you're not good enough, you are. Any New York Times bestseller or any USA is a bestseller or anybody, anything, Just reach out to them.

Anybody would be, it would be a thrill for any author to be in contact with either of you. So I'm just letting you know. And yes, and yes. I am speaking for everybody. I am speaking for everybody.