Boonta Vista - EPISODE 75: Dead Posts Society

Episode Date: December 3, 2018

Andrew, Lucy, Theo & Ben recap the Victorian election and discuss the use of old social media posts to discredit Greens staffers and candidates. Support the show and get exclusive bonus episodes by subscribing on Patreon: www.patreon.com/BoontaVista *** Merchandise now available: boontavista.com/merchandise *** Twitter: twitter.com/boontavista iTunes: tinyurl.com/y8d5aenm Stitcher: www.stitcher.com/s?fid=144888&refid=stpr Pocket Casts: pca.st/SPZB RSS: tinyurl.com/kq84ddb

Welcome to Bonteavista episode 75. It's me Andrew. I'm here with Lucy. Gooday. Gooday. All the way from Hawaii. I wish he's continued to call in a dedicated tropical correspondent. Tropical correspondent wearing a lay wearing a Hawaiian shirt, sweating profusely. chased by dinosaurs. Chased by dinosaurs. wearing a lay, wearing a Hawaiian shirt, sweating profusely. Chased by dinosaurs. Chased by dinosaurs. That's what you understand to be happening on all islands, Theo? That is correct.

Let me just roll this back a little bit. So your understanding is that because they chose Hawaii as the filming location for Jurassic Park, because they were dinosaurs there. All right. That checks out. Okay. It checks out. That's they saved money on having to do CGI ones or animatronics. That's right, the first Jurassic Park famously no CGI.

And of course we are joined by in the same room for once. Theo and Ben. We've done this once before. Like the first time. But we're in different rooms. Yes. I I I I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, that. I, that. I, that. I, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that's, that, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's. Yeah, that's. Yeah. Yeah, that's, that's. Yeah. That's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's th. Yeah, th. Yeah, the. the. that's that's that's that's that's that, that, that, that, that's that's that's that's that, that's that's that's that's that's this once before, like the first time, but we're in different rooms. Yes. I remember that. I think because you only had like two power points in your entire apartment. I don't think that's what the problem.

I think we were worried about microphone bleed. Oh, which we are now no longer concerned about. We got a high-tech mic set up now. We do. Which is microphones being held in our hands on the same couch. As opposed to a $50 USB microphones placed somewhere in the room as you yell at them. Yes. Yeah. Well, we've got some breaking news here in the wake of the Victorian election, which is that Tim Wilson,

a libertarian MP for the Liberals, has just announced on Twitter that he has formally resigned as a member of the Victorian Liberal Party. Oh boy. But I wonder if he's just like resigned from the Victorian Liberals but is still a member of the Federal Liberal Party? You would assume so. Just distancing himself from the losers. So the liberals got slaughtered, we should clarify that. Just absolutely slayed, murdered into the ground. We have just had the Victorian state election and there has been a murder committed,

the victim is the Victorian Liberal Party. They, did they lose even more seats? They lost a lot of seats as far as I know. It's a huge amount of seats. 15 or so. Whom. Significant amount. And some of them were like safe liberal seats too.

Damn. So going into it, I mean, I think they were expecting maybe a 4% swing to labor who were already the incumbent party. Which is, you you know obviously very strange for a second-term premiership and it ended up being an almost 5% swing towards the ALP. 52 seats to the ALP still still calling 10 more and 24 to the LNP so just an absolute slaughter. Yes, so that was Premier Daniel Andrews, his Labour Party,

and they've done good things. They've done quite progressive things. We're all centrist now. They've, well, they've actually invested in infrastructure. They rolled out like the safe injecting rooms. Which the, which the LMP um well they said they were going to get rid of it yeah they pushed to kill it within like the first week yes and they asked them why and so well you

well it's a room we're injecting evidence well well it's a room to thrown well I was watching the debate where this came up actually. So, well I should say, the other good things they've done, they're subsidizing IVF treatment for families. Free dental for kids. Yeah, those were the election promises going in. Yeah, but they have also done stuff like changing the rental tenancy laws so you can be wild shit now like hanging up a picture without a written permission from your landlord. Was that specifically one the picture hanging thing? Yeah.

It was about being able to do extremely minor modifications without getting permission from the landlord. that's the pet one obviously that rules as well a picture. That fucking kicks ass. The pet one obviously that rules as well. That shit, it's fucking, it's so good. Well they also strengthened the, I think they strengthened and clarified the requirements around what they actually have to provide for people. So I think the laws were loose enough before that they, you know, had things like, oh, you have to have a like working way to heat and cook to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the, the, their their theirle and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook and cook the the to the the the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, theirluck, theirluck, theirluck, the laws were loose enough before that they, you know, had things like, oh, you have to have a like working way to heat and cook food in the house, you know? So like, so people would call their landlords and say, hey, my stove top has broken,

and they would go, well, the oven still works, so I'm not going to fix it because technically you can heat food in that house. Yeah. So, so they they've they've really they've really really they've really really they've really they've really they've really the the the laws the laws their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their thea. Ia. I can't thea. Soooosea. Sooosuua. Sooooooosu.ea. Soooom. Sooosu. toeathea. toeathea. toeathea. I the you can heat food in that house. So they've really strengthened the laws around stuff like just what constitutes like a baseline of an acceptable dwelling to rent to somebody basically, which is very good. But Andrew, what about the landlords? What about... What about... Poor landlords? You're going to have to cut down from 10 to 8 rental properties. Well, yeah, that is a great side benefit of this of just making boomer landlords extremely angry. Oh, I bet the Whirlpool forums right now must be like going. Absolutely nuts.

Tenant is demanding that the light switches should work now, and apparently that's protected by law. Yeah. So in the course of their re-election, they absolutely destroyed Guy Matthews, who looks like a haunted ventriloquist dummy modeled on a depressed version of Pee Wee Herman? Were you jokingly calling him Guy Matthews or are we just calling him Guy Matthews? Gye Matthews? Like Guy smiley, but Guy frowny. Hey, uh Hey, uh, last time the headlines were saying Guy destroyed, it was about that missionary that went to the island. Oh, yaiak.

Oh, bless those islanders. God bless them. I hope they never let anyone on the island without putting arrows in them. That's their policy. If you've got an arrow on your body, you can come right onto the island. They are not interested in Wi-Fi. As a general assessment. So yeah, Matthew Guy, who sucks incredibly, he was the planning minister under the former liberal state government in Victoria. He said plan to win. He was basically he was basically known for just

rubber stamping fucking awful corporate developments and bulldozing heritage sites to put up like a 200 story apartment block and all that sort of shit. Just a chowed Bielke Peterson over here. Just terrible terrible terrible to that one. Just a terrible terrible terrible, terrible. Just a terrible, terrible history there. And yeah, in that debate, my wife was watching the town hall debate between the two leaders. And when they got to the safe injecting rooms thing where they said, ah, we will get rid of them, we'll shut them down in the first week if we're elected. And somebody asked them a question where they said, ah we will get rid of them we'll shut them down in the first week if we're elected and somebody asked them a question about it and said well all the evidence shows that it saves lives and helps people quit drugs so

what are you basing this on like doesn't the evidence say that these things are worthwhile and working and And he said, nope. And they went, so, why are you doing this? And he said, oh, it's a values judgment. So you can be shown all the fucking evidence in the world of a thing actually working and having a positive effect for society? But you can just ignore all of that and revert back to, um, druggies are bad. Yeah, my values junkies should thies, junkies, junkies, junkies, junkies, junkies, junkies, junkies, ths, th, th, th, th, th, so th, th, th, th, so, th, so, th, so, th. th. th. th. th. thu, so, th- thi, thi, so, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, th. So, th. So, th. So, why, why, why, why, why, why, why, why, why, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi, doesn't, thi, thus, thus, thus, thus, thus, thus, thus, thus, thus, why, why, why, why, why, why, why, why, druggies are bad. Yeah, my values are junkies should die, so... Which is very similar to the New South Wales state government,

where they had like that handful of overdoses and deaths at a music festival a month or two ago. And in the wake of that, lots of people were saying, start allowing pill testing, legalized pill testing. People are going to do this thu thu thu thu thu thu thu thu thu thu to do to do thu to do to do thu to do thu thu to do thu, thu, so thu, so th- th- th- th- th- th- th-so, so, so, so th-so, so so, so so, so so, so so, so so, so so, so so, so so, so so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so so, so so, so, so so, so th-so, so th-so, so th-so, so th-so, th-so, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi thi thi-i-i-i-i-i, th-i. Which, th-i, thi of that, lots of people were saying, start allowing pill testing, legalized pill testing. People are going to do this stuff no matter what, at least make it so they know if they're going to die if they take the things. And yeah, that liberal government's response was, oh no, we're not going to do anything that makes people thi. taking drugs is okay because it's not okay. It's like, so you would literally rather young people die? Yeah, they would.

They're like, we're opening ourselves up for expert input into this commission, into this thing, but regardless of what the experts say, this is one thing that we're absolutely not going to do. It's great. It's really great. Just from a starting position of we will absolutely not allow this thing because it's like tacitly endorsing drug use. But isn't it the same as any fucking argument over like prohibition style stuff where it's just like, people have done this and will continue to do this. It's the start of fucking time. So you can look at evidence or you can say, my position is that junkies should die.

So while it's good that the Liberal Party got fucking destroyed, we can all agree on that, I think. And again, it also continues to bode very poorly for the federal election, the liberals. Yeah, and it's hard to tell which, I think Matthew Guy put together a campaign so incompetent that it's actually bizarrely difficult to tell which way the blowback is going. Yeah. The actual campaign was just terrible. Yeah, because usually it goes from federal to state, right? So you have a shitty federal government that just can't stop having his pants fall down and doing a shit in the street.......... the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. Um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, the, th, th, the, the a, the a, thi, thi-s, thi-s, thi, thi, um, um, um, um, um, to state, right? So you have a shitty federal government that just can't stop having his pants fall down

and doing a shit in the street. And that blows onto the state government. But this is just a, this is like, yeah, it is absolutely. It is actually murder. Yeah, and so I think this will then, in term blow back on the federal government to really like discredit them. Well, there was, I mean, as part of the campaign, they have run on the only thing that conservatives know to run on when they can't think of anything else.

Black teens. Yeah, black teens coming to get you, coming to get you in your home. And they mainly ran on like, law and order and being tough tough tough tough tough tough tough tough tough tough tough tou tou tou to to th, thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. thi. Well thi. Well, thi. Well, thi. Well, thi. Well, thi. Well, thi. I thi. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I this this this this this this this thi. I this this this this this thi. I thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. This is thi. This coming to get you in your home. And they mainly ran on like law and order and being tough on crime and gangs and everything, despite again all of the actual evidence that crime in that state has gone down by like, I think like youth crime has gone down by 40% over the last 10 years or something. And like again, evidence-based stuff and the directions of the actual police saying please stop making this stuff into like Sudanese gangs and everything like your but they had like the cops out there saying every time you go on about this shit in the newspaper you are the ones glorifying this and like you would be making groups of young guys go,

whoa, look at that. We can be a badass gang too. They're just like just stop it. I think that we're saying as well, like a lot of the time they were like the kind of stuff that you're talking about of just like some kids getting into trouble and shit is not. You are absolutely giving them way too much credit to call them like a gang, a street gang, all that sort of shit. Yeah. So, um, like, I was watching the election coverage last night and they crossed to a liberal candidate and they were talking to him about the campaign they had run. And he said, um, well, you know, I tell you what, when I'm door knocking, or like when I'm at an event, and somebody comes up and they grasp me by the hand and they say,

I'm not, I don't feel safe in my own house anymore. I'm scared all the time, I freak out when a possum jumps on the roof because I think people are trying to break in and come to get me. I was just like, that's the whole campaign you've been running, is that everybody should be scared of all this shit all the time. Like what you're describing is someone who's saying, well, nothing's happened to me, but I'm deathly afraid of it. I'm extremely scared that the brown teens could be coming to the roof.

I'm extremely scared of this. I'm a very scared of tha scared of tha scared of tha scared of tha scared of tha sa sa sa. I sa. I'm scared of thiiiiiiia. I'm scared of thia. I'm scared. I'm scared of thioling sa. I'm scared. I'm scared of thiol-I sa. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared thiol-I's scared. I's scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I's scared. I's scared. I's scared. I's scared. I's scared. I's scared. I's scared. I'm scared. I's scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared thi thi thi. I'm scared thi. I'm scared thi. I'm scared of a th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th this. I sympathize with getting terrified that someone's coming to get you when a possum jumps on the roof because that's a lot of the time I spend in my house when I'm high. Ah, very frequent. I don't know what those possums are doing, but it is terrifying. Mostly screaming, I think is my, um, worst noises in the world. Yeah. Oh, they sound horrifying. Do you have opossums over there Lucy? Not in Hawaii. There's like no scary nature out here. Nothing. I saw a poison dart frog which you shouldn't lick but you can touch it. Huh. That's a good distinction to make. Why would you want to touch it?

Because it's a cute little frog? Okay. He's very cute but you shouldn't lick your fingers. No, don't lick your fingers. They have enough poison to stop a human's heart which is adorable really. Cool. It's very cute. Good for him. I think that was too big in nature corner. So they asked that same liberal candidate about whether or not he thought that the leadership turmoil on the federal level had had had an impact on the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the to the to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to too too too too to touch fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers fingers to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to their their the campaign. don. don the campaign. Don the campaign. Don the campaign. Don't the campaign. Don't to to to to to to too too. Don't touch touch touch touch their touch. We touch. Don't touch. Don't to to too. Don't to to he thought that the leadership turmoil on the federal level had had an impact on the campaign. And he said, and it was another one of those great moments where they totally just show their ass when they don't mean to, and he said, oh look you know, I've been out

there door knocking for months, I had my billboards up four months ago before the election started. He said, well, a picture of me with my family to demonstrate my values. My values of having a family. Look at these people I've produced by fucking. I've fucked. Yeah, my, my, um, I wanted to demonstrate to the community my values that mainly revolve around raw-dogging my wife. One, condoms are bad they feel terrible.

Get him out of here. So, you know, he says, oh, I've been campaigning and everything, and they said, well, and he said, when the leadership challenge and everything happened, that was a pretty rough week, you know, that was, um, he said, you know, we were having some pretty hard conversations with voters when we were going out and door knocking about that. So we just, we decided to take a week off and then everything settled and we got back to it and talk to people about their issues. And the guy went, so you stopped campaigning because of it.

He was like, anyway. It's just like, you don't, he doesn't even register with him that what he's saying is like the fallout from it was so bad and the negativity with which it was received was bad enough that we just stopped talking to people. That we couldn't be seen in public. Yeah, it was like we cannot mount a coherent argument about this so we're just gonna duck out. Yeah, if you're out there like door knocking then part of what you want to be doing is like talking people around to say well look no Scott Morrison's got a vision of the future you know we're all

be going like onwards and upwards with him but they can't even do that not even like reaching that level. I think it's taking a week to make sure you reflexively learn what the PM's name is. It's been like, for a minisotubble, oh, fucking God damn it. Just getting drilled. Taking a week for self-care. Doing coloring books. So while it was good to see, in the words of Stone Cold Steve Austin, it was good to see the liberals getting a mud hole stomped in their ass, as he would say.

What I was very concerned about during the last sort of couple weeks of the campaign was what seemed to be a whole bunch of very fucked up punching to the left by the Labour party. There seemed to be a bit of a consensus that they had decided that Matthew Guy was not a threat and that they were going to win the election and so it was more important to focus on taking back some of the seats that the Greens hold in the inner city you know obviously they see. Which they did. Yeah. The Greens did not do very well. Well and I think that part of the reason for that is that there were a handful of candidates and staffers that had people go through their social media posts dating back, you know,

like up to a decade kind of thing, and then supplying all of that to the fucking Herald Sun, which is an absolute rag. What I heard was that the guy that did it, Jet Foggity or something, absolutely ridiculous name, had shopped it around everywhere, but the only place shitty enough to run it was the Herald Sun, which is maybe like the most damning thing. Maybe a sign as to what it is exactly that you're doing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, like so it was very, very shitty and so one of the people that this happened to was a friend of the show, Joanna Nilsen, who we actually kind of talked

to you way back when we sent a friend of the show Andrew to a screening of the red pill. And because we bought a ticket we to a screening of the red pill. And because we bought a ticket, we thought that we would donate some money to offset the harm that we would do. And at Joanna's urging, we donated to the YWCA that she volunteers for, she volunteers for a lot of women's groups and domestic violence groups and that sort sort of thing and she was running as a candidate for the Greens and she found herself splashed across the front page of the the Herald Sun in Melbourne and she wrote a piece about this for the Guardian and I will just read a

little chunk of this from the start here. She says about 5 p.m. a couple of weeks ago I was sitting at my desk when I called back a missed number. It was a news court reporter who had been ringing me for about 15 minutes. What could they possibly be wanting for me I thought as he introduced himself in the sort of tone that immediately makes you panic to the point of dizziness. I've got some posts that you've made on Facebook he said my ears started to roar. What? What posts?. the the the the the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. I I I th. th. th. I th. I th. I th. th. I th. th. th. I th. I th. I tho. I was tho. I was tho. I was that. I was th. I was th. I was th. I was th. I was tho. I was tho. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I. I. I. I was. I. I. I. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was th. I was th. I was th. I was th. I was th. I'm. I'm. I'm. t. t. t. tode. toda. t. today. t. t. t. t. today. today. today. today. I next day I was splattered across the front page with Melbourne's Herald Sun while the entire state of Victoria muttered, who? Into their morning coffees? Unless you're unbearably familiar with Australian underground punk bands or the minutiae of local leftist politics, you'll have no idea who I am. I'm Joanna Nielsen,

a former Greens candidate. My notoriety came about because four years ago I was in one of those secret Facebook groups for women. It was a place where we could be rude and ridiculous full of braggadocio, vulnerable, sad and truthful. We thought it was a safe space. I was, and we all were very naive. I joked about shoplifting and minor recreational drug use. I made off-color remarks. I was foolish. After a while, the group started to implode, and I left, I had forgotten about it. So basically, somebody has found posts to just a Facebook group from years ago. Again, we're all guessing. Clearly joking, too. Just joking posts. You know, nothing actually offensive. Even if they would, right? So the posts that were highlighted were like,

I'm very good at stealing from Woolworths. I like Nangs and I have a lot of weed. Those were like, the three posts. If anybody personally told me those three things about themselves, like first off the bat, I'd be like, you and I are going to be friends. Fantastic. We share the same values. So, so she withdrew from her candidacy on the basis of this. And it's obviously been a very rough time for her as well. And like, it's just, it's just so clear how fucking disingenuous the whole thing is.

Like, yeah, when you take somebody's post. So the post they had on the front page here were her saying, don't steal from coals, go to Woolworth, take a plastic bag full of other stuff, put it in your basket, then load all the expensive stuff in that, take it out and go through the checkout with that on your arm, and pop through a soda, thowa. And another post saying, oh, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, tho, tho, th, th, tho, th, th, th, th, th, th, the, th, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th, the, th, th, th, th, the, th, they, th, th, they, thu, tho, tho, tho, thoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, their, their, their, oh please bitch, I am the baddest shoplifter there is. So, and they cast this as like her teaching people how to steal

and saying that stealing is good. It is, stealing is good though. It is good, but they don't believe that. They know that it's bullshit. Yeah, and then so, particularly in the case of another person that I think we may they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they may may may they may they all they all they may they may may they all they all they all they all they all they all they all tho. they all they all to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to pop. to pop. to pop. to pop. to pop. to pop. to pop. to pop. to pop. to they all they all they all. they all. they all. they all. they all. they all. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the. Yeah, and then so particularly in the case of another person that I think we may all have known online, a Twitter user who went by Max You Think, who was a staffer for a Greens member. Just a staffer. But also this account had no association to the Greens.

It didn't have his name on it. I had no idea who he worked for. Yeah, it didn't say I'm a staff or anything like that. So yeah, I've I have met this guy real life. I made him a delicious brunch one time. Nice. All right, no need to brag. Strange flex. Strange flex. Strange. Strange. Strange flex. Strange. It's a meme. It's a meme. Curious flex. I don't think you have to recite the words, like incantation. Strange flex, but all right.

What an odd flex, but certainly go on. So, fuck on. So, he, he got doxed again to the same newspaper about tweets from like 2012 shit posts so just like six year old shit posts about like and again so here's the excerpt from the article right in which they are casting this as they said that he had posted pro pedophilia, Islamophobic, and something else tweets, right? Something about sex fetishes? So, apparently.

He worked for Greens Northcote MP Lydia Thorpe and joked that, quote, if we started locking up everyone who's addicted to child porn, there'd be nobody left. And, that Muslims addicted to child porn, there'd be nobody left. And that Muslims wanted to, quote, ban my favorite hobby, greasing myself up in pig fat and oinking like a grunter. So again, to attempt to cast this as though these are the serious things that somebody thinks is just so fucking disingenuous. And like, even the fucking maroon at the Herald sign that wrote this up knows that it's the opposite.

Like it's satire. It's satire. It's satirical. But it doesn't matter. You don't have to do these things in good faith. You could just be like, this tweet says the words child porn, therefore this person is a child pornographer. So, well, here's the worst part about it to me, right? Is that these things and some of the other candidates have been used specifically to say, ah, the Greens have a massive problem with sexism and misogyny in their ranks, right?

Now I agree that there is a clear problem in the New South Wales Greens where they have had a candidate who has been accused of sexual assaults and harassment and been investigated internally and recently two of their MPs or senators or whatever, Marine Farooqui and Sarah, Sarah? No, I've forgotten this lady. Have like used, they used under privilege in parliament to call on Jeremy Buckingham to resign. Because they have said, we believe the people have made these accusations about you. De Natale ended up backing as well. He went on record saying he didn't think that he should re-contest the next election.

Yep, so the leader of the federal party has stepped in to say this guy should step down and get out of here. And so, so the person who got banned from this, Max, you think, he posted online about Jeremy Buckingham is a piece of shit and he needs to step down and I want to be in a party where people are held accountable for this stuff, where actual action is taken, where we listen to people who are accusing him of this sort of thing. Like that was very much his position. He was like, fuck yeah, Marine Farooqui. Like, thank you for doing this.

This is a thing that needs to be said and done, right? So that is very much what he believed and what he very frequently spoke about. A tweet that they have screened and put into this article is him saying, if I was a Greens MP under suspicion for sexual assault or a party figure implicated in a wider culture that is unsafe for women, I would simply claim that any and all claims are a factional attack. And they have put that in the paper as him saying, genuinely saying that this is how you get out of being held for it. Oh my god. It's bullshit.

And like as anybody who is familiar with posting, as we are would know, this is just the format of a meme which is if I were to be in situation I would simply overly obvious answer to this thing. And it's not even hard, it's only one layer of irony. Yeah, very basic irony. It's not even particularly deep irony. So it's a very obvious reference to to to to to to to to to the, the, to the, the, th, thi, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, like thi, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, thi, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, th is th is th is th is thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi's thi's thi's thi's thi's thi's thi's thi's thi's thi's not even a basic irony. It's not even particularly deep irony, you know? So it's, and it's a very obvious reference to him calling out the culture within his own party that has led to Jeremy Buckingham not having to step down yet, you know.

He's been a staunch advocate for the women who came out and accused him of this stuff. It should be noted as well that's like, theee, and it's, and it, and it, thiiii, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, and it's thi, thi, thi, and it's not thi, and it's thi, and it, and it, and it's, and it's, and it's, and it's, and it's, and it's, and it's th, and it's th, and it's th, and it's th, and it's th th, and it's th thi, and it's thi, and it's not thi, and it's not thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi's not thi's not thi's not thi's not thii's not thiii's not thioli. It's not thi, and it's not thi, and it's not th stuff. It should be noted as well that like Jeremy Buckingham in response to these accusations said, I was cleared, I was cleared by this investigation and like the the actual language used in the investigation was like we cannot find sufficient evidence under the definition of these acts in the law to to like beyond, prove beyond all shadow of a doubt that definition of these acts in the law to like beyond prove beyond all shadow of a doubt that this thing was committed. Yeah. It's basically just them saying, look, we can't prove it in court.

It didn't make a ruling either way. Well, it was, it was, you know, the fact that he used that language as like, I've been exonerated. These people saying, we technically can't prove he did it. th. th. th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi. thi. thi. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th is is is is th is th is th is th is th is th is th is th is th is th is th is th is thi, I thi, thi, I thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi, th people saying, we technically can't prove he did it. Yeah. It's like so fucking shady. So there was also the, so Paul, Max you think, has resigned from the party. He had to offer his resignation. He has lost his job now. And Angus McAlpine, who was also a candidate, was formerly a rapper. I think he is a dude who's obviously from a very working class background. He does a lot of his stuff in just his high viz from work, you know.

And he had, so they unearthed lyrics from his rap songs from 2010, about, uh, lyrics about date rape and I guess the general misogyny that you find. lyrics from his rap songs from 2010 about uh... lyrics about date rape and i guess the general misogy that you find in hip hop pretty much and the party leader Samantha Ratnam said we're not going to ask him to resign

uh... because you know this is the person that he used to be and the person he is now is different uh... so her quote here is uh... she said, the the general, the thi's the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the general the the general the general the general the general the general the general the general the general the general the general the general the the the the general the general the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the general, I the general, I the general, I the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th is the is the is thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th is the person that he used to be and the person he is now is different. So her quote here is she said Mr. McAlpine had been on a quote journey of change and it was important for men to own up to their mistakes. Those lyrics were reprehensible, unacceptable and have no place in our community, Ms. Ratnam said. It speaks to the culture of toxic masculinity masculinity that so many men, so many young people are vulnerable to and fall and fall and fall and fall and to, and to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, their, to, thii, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, their their their their their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to to to to toe, to toe, toe, toei.a-a-a-a-a' thoooo-a-a-a-a-a-a-a, tho-a, tho'e.a speaks to the culture of toxic masculinity that so many men, so many young people are vulnerable to and fall prey to. If we are going to change the culture of toxic masculinity, we need more men to own up, take responsibility, apologize and commit to change. Wow, that's surprisingly very reasonable. Yeah, and I completely agree with that. Well, I mean too. And you know, he himself has said. He's like, I am sorry about that and I feel bad about it. And it's shit, and I have gone through a lot of change over the last like six to eight years or whatever of learning about all this sort of stuff.

If I could go back in time and explain to myself why this is all a shitty attitude to have and shitty stuff to record, I would, but I can't. This is where I'm at now. Which again is pretty reasonable. And so the problem with all this is acting like everything that everyone has ever said at any point in their life is equally applicable now. And also just acting like other parties don't use drugs and stuff like that. Just in general acting like anyone who's a political candidate can never have done a thing wrong is not great. Well yeah like and this is a thing that's going to apply to like basically everybody who was younger than me. Yeah all of us. Well yeah like I think I was I was I was I was I was I would. I would consider myself. I. I would. I would. I would consider myself. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. to. I. I. I. to. to. to. to. th. th. th. th. th. to. to. to. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. I. I. I. I. I. I. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. to. th. to. th. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. the. the. the. the. the. the. I. I. to. I. I. I. I. I. to. to. I. to. to. to. to. to. I. to. to. the. I. the. the. the. the. the. the all of us. Well, yeah, I think I was, I was, I would consider myself of that first generation of people who like, you know, got the internet on when they were teenagers and then it has been there forever. Except now for people who are, you know, 10 years younger than me, it's been, they've had access to the internet and Facebook and all that shit for their entire lives.. th th th th. th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. I was thi' thi' thi' thi- thi- thi-I I was thi- I was thi- I was, I was, I was thi-I I was thi. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I was thi. I was thi. I'm that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that been, they've had access to the internet and Facebook

and all that shit for their entire lives and it is just part of the fabric of our society for better or worse. The difference is, I guess, like, you know, if I had been posting shit stuff online on various websites like, you know, in the fucking, whatever it would have been, the, like, around the year 2000 or something like that, let's say, there's probably just a lot more chance that those websites would have like shut down or gone into disuse or something, whereas if you've been using Facebook since you were 12, you've probably posted something fucking dumb on that. What a nightmare. What a fucking nightmare. It's bad enough reading my old post from when I was like 18.

It's like, let epic World of Warcraft for the win. I mean, how is that different to what you're doing now? Oh, now there's black ops. So. Well me pick Cole of Judy for the win now. There was another candidate of theirs. There's another candidate of theirs. The ABC can also reveal that the Greens candidate in the safe liberal seat of Sandringham, Dominic Phillips, liked Facebooks that are degrading to women and racist. The pages Mr. Phillips liked included, period pains,

try waiting for your porn to download. Oh boy. Wow. Fair enough. Twinkle, twinkle, little sluts. Name one guy you haven't fucked. Oh, goodness. And I'd swim in the ocean for you.

Lul J.K. I'd get my turban wet. I don't. for you, lull jay I'd get my turban wet. I'm not sure I follow. I don't. Me either. In response to questions from the ABC, a green spokesman said Mr. Phillips had made some stupid decisions on social media. Quote, these are pages that he liked as a young teenager and do not reflect his values. They are offensive and crass and he apologizes. So like, we're talking about just a dumb page that you liked when you were like

fucking 14. And also there's like there's never any attempt to like talk through this stuff to say well look what do you believe now like what are what's your stance on these issues and you know what do you feel about getting your turban wet? Well that's like you know the I guess the grossers like sexual s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s s like th. the the th. the the th. the the th. the the th. the th. th. th. th. the the th. th. th. th. th. th. the thi the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. you you you you you you you are you are you the the the th. the the the th. th. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the thi the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the well that's right yeah like you know the I guess the grossers like sexual stuff and what have you it's all just like hey look at this turd that you laid 10 we caught you we caught you yeah we got you like there's absolutely no and it's it's kind of like I guess like so a lot of this is irony but obviously some of it's you know, you do

stuff that you're ashamed of when you're younger because you're younger and you haven't fully formed your brain yet. And like, if you don't, if there's no room for these people to succeed, then what's the point of rehabilitating yourself and changing your behaviors as you as you go along? If you're just going to be punished for the things that you have th you you you you you you you you you you you th th you th you you th you you you have you have th th th you have th tho you have tho you have tho you have tho you have tho you tho tho thi thi tho tho you you you you you you you you're you do you do you do you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you do th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the the the the the the the the the the the. the. to do the. the. to do the. to do to do to do to do the. the. the. thea. the. their the. their the. th what's the point of rehabilitating yourself and changing your behaviors as you go along? If you're just going to be punished for the things that you have done or believed previously, right? Like there's no, you lose the ability for people to grow and to, and to move forward. But the other thing, I think Lucy said it like earlier that you just, like, the only

people then that succeed in politics are these horrible mutants that were like birthed at age 46 with no hair on their entire body and they just like they get out of the pod and they put on the worst suit in the world and then stand in front of an LMP podium and say yes we're for getting rid of safe schools, whatever that is, right? Like that's the only room then that there is in politics for those people, there's just these horrible mutants that haven't lived a day in their life. Yeah, like they're right now as a political class across the spectrum that are just like doing lines after their cocaine by being like, ha ha ha ha, they they thought they're they're they're they're they're their, their, their, their, their, their, th.. th. th. th. th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, like, like, like, like, thi, their, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, thi, thi, thi, thi, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, thi's, thi's, thi. thi, th ha, they thought they could get into politics after saying that they liked weed.

Yeah. Like, it's this weird sort of, it's a, it's a purity that selects for these polished, visibly, by just-futche-fut people. Yeah, yeah. Well, it's, it's ridiculous ridiculous though because it's this complete Inversion of what I think a reasonable society should consider to be an actual virtue So to me having done shit stuff in your past and being able to admit to it and like you said explain what you have learned and what your

Understanding is of what's different because I can certainly say from my own perspective that like, yeah, thinking back, I think of myself as in my teens in high school and stuff like that, just being a piece of shit. Just making tons of, tons of sexist and racist and homophobic jokes because those are things that you hear and you repeat them and in my case I grew up in a very white town. I Was not exposed to a lot of like a lot of different kinds of people. I Like I don't think there was anybody who was like out in my high school. There were definitely tons of people who were gay, but there was nobody who was out. So it was fine for everybody to make jokes at the expense of gay people, because we all

watched fucking Eddie Murphy raw and said, ha ha, I'm going to make all the same jokes. Hey, now I'm just going to give you an idea for like a comedic bit, and now you tell me how funny this is, what if Mr. T was gay? Oh! Oh! Now, do you reckon you could get 10 minutes of material out of that? Absolutely. Get it, maybe a tight five. But like, yeah, and so, so for me, I can absolutely admit to that and say that's where I was at in life with the people that I was surrounded by and the things people tell you are funny and all that sort of stuff. I can look at it now now and th a tho th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the the th people that I was surrounded by and the things people tell you are funny and all that sort of stuff. I can look at it now and go, hmm, regretful, but I'm not like that anymore because it's fucking, you know, 20 years later and I have changed and I have grown and all that

sort of thing. Nobody is perfectly woke, all that sort of shit. Whereas instead what we're presenting as a virtuous person is instead somebody who has been groomed from a very young age to come out of their fucking awful Tory private school and instead we've got these people who you know also have all these shitty qualities but the difference is that they've been taught which ones to keep hidden from the public and by doingthat, you're instead providing those people with far less of a chance to grow. By having those sorts of people where it's like, oh, you know, you can make awful sexist and racist jokes and everything, but here's all the people you don't do it in front of,

you know, you don't make it on record, you don't post it online and all that sort of thing, which is a much like, like way, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, th, like, th, like, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii.a, and that sort of thing. Which is like way more like saying, yes, this is good and correct, it's everyone else who's wrong about it, you know? Now this brings us to something that I wanted to figure out on the show here, which is the whole thing of, in the case of some of these people who have now lost their jobs over posts basically, I wanted to formulate a show-canon position on doxing people and getting them fired. Now, I'm going to start from a simple proposition. Trying to get someone fired for posts is a cop move. Agreed. It is cop cop move. Agreed.

It is cop behavior. I mostly agree. Appealing to someone's employee, employer is knock behavior. I've to my mind. So as a baseline for this conversation, that is what I would say. I think that like whenever you see, well yeah, whenever you see that shit on like Twitter of, you know, a writer or someone else like, just tell someone to fuck off and stick their head up their

ass and they reply, like I saw a friend of the show Karen Geyer, who like tweeated something at one of the Krazenstein brothers or even just about them. And he replied to her and she said, uh, uh, uh, their, and to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to their to their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their th th th. thr told to to to to to their writer, their their their their their their their their their their the something at one of the uh... crassinstein brothers or even just about them and he replied to and she said uh... get out of your dickhead and he replied by tagging in all of the different publications that were in her byline saying oh i just wondered what they would think of this kind of thing and she's like yeah great job trying to get me fired he's like oh i'm not trying to get to get to get a a a a to get a to get a to get a to get a to get a to to to to the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the one one one one their their the the' the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi thi. thi thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi thi thin thin thin thin thin thin thin thin thin thee theeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee an thin thin thin the th of this kind of thing and she's like, yeah, great job trying to get me fired. And he's like, oh, I'm not trying to get anyone fired. I'm just curious about what they think of someone who writes for them posting this kind of stuff. And it was just this pathetic charade

of trying to act like he's not actively trying to get somebody fired for this shit. But it is a total cop move move. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I I I thi. I I thi. I th. I I th. I th. I I th. I th. I th. I thi. I thi. I thi. I's. I's. I's. I's thi. I's thi. I's thi. I'm thi. I'm just just. I'm just just. thi. I'm just. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. I'm just just just just. I'm just. I'm just just... I think the only exceptions are things like, this guy's the head of a women's committee and posting insanely misogynistic shit or something. Yeah, I think there are all these various lines and I would say like, I think one of the big problems with it as a thing in general, something that has become a thing is that when left-wing people say, hey here's

someone who posted like dumb racist shit online and we've figured out that they work at Starbucks. So let's all tweet at Starbucks and say look at this person doing this thing and get fired. Let's get this minimum wage employee fired because she said, eat my ass bitch to Bill Mitchell or something. Well, and like left-wing people do it to right-wing people too. And I think that the problem with that is, It's bad precedent. Well, you're setting the precedent.

Okay, this is the battlefield and this is now a valid thing to do. Yeah, and I think we're sitting down here and we're having all these moral considerations or what have you going, oh, you know, in this case, we're maybe, and then, oh, when you've got this, then maybe not or whatever, but like, you put that into 4chan or like, you know, the truly dire like Reddit's that are on the right or what have you, and they, it's just a feeding frenzy, right? Like they don't have those qualms, which is why it is a horrible precedent to set, I think, to try and do this, because while we're aminariing, they're just waging absolute nuclear warfare. And we are making it okay, I think. When you do that, you're making it okay for the same thing to happen to, like, a leftist who said that Jeff Beezos should get the guillotine, you know? Oh, they advocated for murder, a prominent figure.

And I think another problem. Yes. And I think that there is another issue which is that it's something that continues, like, you're actively participating in continuing to blur the line between having a private life and a public life. You're continuing to blur that line between like your boss's ownership of your behavior out in the real world, what you can say and do in your private life? Like you, if you're setting the precedent that everything that anyone says online

at all times, you should be thinking, what if someone showed this to my employer, then all you're effectively saying is that, ah, well, we're all signing up to the idea that our boss owns everything that we say and do outside of work too. And that fucking sucks. I'm very not on board with that. Yeah, that's no good. And like, I do think about thiiiiiiiolk, I do thiolk, I do thi, I do thi, I do thi, I do thi, I do thi, I do thi, I do thin, I do thin, I do thin, I do thin. thin, I thin, I thin, I thin. that. that, that. that's that's that's that's that's that, that, that, that, that, that. that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's thin. thin. that, that's that, that, that, that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that. that. that, no good. And like I do think about just just for like generally shitty sort of right-wing or conservative posts or someone, just somebody being like racist and shitty or saying like oh I hope all the people who you know show up at the border should get shot by the National Guard or I hope that like any any refugees who turn up in a boat get sunk by our Navy or whatever. The fucking terrible that that that that th th th th th that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that thi thi thi the right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right right their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their that to to to to to that to to to to to to to to tho-up. tho-up. that that that that that that that I hope that like any refugees who turn up in a boat get

sunk by our Navy or whatever. It's a fucking terrible thing to say but it is the kind of thing that makes me go like if you're just talking about general shitty right winginess, what are we achieving in that case by like making someone's life more economically precarious by having them fired from their job? Is that going to actually do anything beyond... Yeah, I mean you're not de-platforming them because like there's no way that's going to make their views any better or less heard? Well, my question is in the case of some of those people, like if you're talking about people who already held a position of, oh leftists are the new senses and we're

living in 1984 where the SJWs will punish you for wrong think and all that sort of shit, is having someone fired for a shit tweet going to do anything other than possibly pushing them further down the path to being radicalized against the left Now I I think that there is a line there obviously between like just general Shitty sentiments versus like the Richard Spencer's of the world. Yeah, I mean if they like post a photo of them in their like fucking Comcast truck wearing a KKK outfit You know that presents? Like I don't know I don't know I don't know. I don't? I they, I they, I they, I they, I they, I they, I don't they they, I don't they, I don't they, I don't they, I don't they, I don't they, I don't they think, I don't think, I don't think, I don't think, I don't th, I don't th th thi, I don't th th th th th th thi thi thi thi th thi th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th think, I don't think, I don't think think think I don't think I don't think. I don't think think I don't think I don't think I don't think think thi thi thi thi thi thi to thi thi thi thi thi thi the thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi th in their like fucking Comcast truck wearing a KKK outfit. You know, that presents, like, I don't know, I think there are some lines there where it's like, ah, okay, well, I'm probably happy with you not being able to be openly a Nazi at your job, sort of stuff, you know, like,

there are definitely lines where I think it is fine to actively. Well, see, that's an interesting one to me as well though, because in that instance that you're talking about, I would look at that and say, I am sure that in that situation, Comcast would be interested to know that somebody is like, you know, if you're doing that shit where you're posting from your Facebook thi- th-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-n-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-, like, like, th, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, th, th, th, th, th, like, like, like, th, th, th, like, do you give a fuck about whether something like reflects poorly on Comcast and its shareholders' values? I do care about, like, I mean, obviously that's a made-up example, but I mean, I don't know, there's something about allowing openly white supremacist people to be able to happily thrive is not

ideal. Well, see, this is where I was sort of thinking that to me where the line starts to come in is when people are, not just someone who has shitty views or says, you know, just racist staff or misogynist stuff or whatever. To me it's when it is clear that somebody is like, you know, like someone organizes rallies of Nazis. Somebody is actually like in some kind of leadership position in one of these groups. Somebody is actually involved in organizing for like alt-right or far-right groups. That's the point at which I want someone to see that being involved in that kind of stuff should not be compatible with living in a pluralistic society. Yeah. That's the point at

which like you you want the Richard Spencer's of the world Yeah, to go oh if I like organized Nazi rallies I get fired from my job I can't hold down a job I can't fucking just get through life doing this stuff like that's the activity that I genuinely want disrupted versus someone that's perhaps just swept up in it and may not be, may be too ignorant perhaps to understand the full like. Even just, just, like, you know, just general shitty posts that are doing nothing other than kind of just trying to upset a stranger, you know what I mean?

Just the back and forth that we all get into with people online. That kind of stuff I wouldn't go, I'm gonna try and fucking get this guy fired. But when you're talking about like your Blair Cottrells and your Richard Spencer's and your people, like you're baked Alaska's, people who actually want to like make a living out of this shit and have a really active influence in radicalizing other people at that point I'm fine with Get someone fired from their job tell the police about what they're doing whatever the fuck if you think someone's presenting some kind of real danger That is kind of fine to me Um

And I like I guess I do think that there are times when this type of thing can be good. And like, let's have as an example, Clementine Ford, right? So Clementine Ford, a feminist writer, she writes a lot of very feminist things and accordingly receives lots of death and rate threats online via Facebook. Now she has also made a thing of when people send these things to her from their Facebook account with their real name on it that says I work at this place. She will contact people's employers and that is her prerogative to do that. But she also

does it with like school students because she gets things from like teenage boys. Yeah she gets things from like 16, 17 year old boys from their Facebook account that says, I go to fucking Tory Grammar, Sydney Private School at this place. And she contacts the school and goes, hey, what do you think of this that your students are sending to people. And I look at that as an example and think, that's probably the perfect time to do that. Yeah, that may actually be corrective. Yeah, like that to me is like basically the perfect teaching point

at which to show someone. The stuff that you're doing has impacts in your real life. You are affecting other people. It is affecting yourself, in a way that is probably going to scare the living shit out of that kid, but also in a way that isn't necessarily going to like totally derail your life. I think my, I reckon the perfect way to deal with that sort of stuff. I don't know, I feel a bit iffy about doing it with the school, but like, dubbing these people into their mums. That is always the best and the funniest fucking thing in the world.

Well, like, just imagine having your mom be like, huh, it looked like you said a message to someone saying, I'm going to rape you, you feminist slut. And I feel like having your mom talk you out of that would probably be one of the most formative experiences. Just devastating conversations. Yeah. Like, because you're really the thing that needs to happen there, which is like, as you said, is having them realize that you're not just typing in words into a box and they're going nowhere. This is something you're genuinely doing to another person. And I genuinely, I think as a teen you have you have you have thi you have thi you have thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi, thi, thi, thi, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, like, like, like, like, thi, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. their, their their their thi.'re genuinely doing to another person. And I genuinely, I think as a teen you have this like weird solipsism where you don't...

You don't realize? Realize? It's an actual person on the other head. Yeah, and also like up to a certain point of childhood and adolescence, your brain genuinely does not comprehend like long-term repercussions for things. Like that that actually takes a certain amount of time for your brain to grasp that and I think having having a very stark reminder of that at a very formative age in your life before you have

properly gone out into the real world is pretty much perfect. Obviously they aren't all going to be the situation but like it's like I said I just I genuinely feel torn about normalizing the behavior of trying to get people fired from their jobs. I think that there are also potentially like unseen repercussions to that where yeah, maybe a guy does really shitty posts and then you get him fired and then him and his wife and child are homeless. Like, yeah. Because as far as, as far as, like, financial precarity goes, if you very suddenly get fired and can't find a job anytime soon, for a lot of people, it's only a couple of weeks between that and being out of the street. And you genuinely don't know from this sort of stuff, like

who else in that person's life, that's going to affect. And like, there is the one big area of this that I'm torn on, right? Which is, I understand the motivation of people who want to do this stuff. I understand when the motivation is, to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be thi thi the to be the thi the thi the thi the thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. I thi thi the thi. I thioliolioling thioling thioling this thiol people who want to do this stuff. I understand when the motivation is, I want this person to be forced to take some responsibility for the thing that they're doing. I want this to have an impact on that. It is satisfying. Like you can't deny that seeing someone who's been like a huge, fucking racist shit on the internet is like, well, I just got fired from the waterpark that I worked at........... there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, that, that, thi, thi, thi, I their, I their, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I th. th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, thi, that, thi, that, I thi, I like, well, I just got fired from the waterpark that I worked at.

There is a moment of being like, you fuck. Like, but it sucks. Yeah, and I guess like, you know, if there's someone that we can possibly talk to about being a woman who has been harassed on the internet a great deal. Lucy. Oh, me, me, right. I'm sure you have received more than your fair share of just very dumb shit from guys, right?

And I'm just very conscious that when having this conversation about like, oh well, if you, if you, you know, get a guy fired, maybe it'll have some other effects in his life, or maybe it'll just drive him further down the road to be extremely right-wing and murdering people and all that sort of stuff. What I'm very conscious of is that, that, as a conversation, can also be cast as, well, where is the line in exactly how much shit women are supposed to put up with? Yeah, it's true. That's just a nuanced thing. Like, we're talking about like teenagers, I think that is the time where you're, you know,

tell someone's school or something like that, where it's like, when you're a teen, you're a fucking, thiii........ And you're a stupid, thi. A stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid, and you're a stupid. that's a stupid. that's a that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid... th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, that's a stupid, and a stupid, and you're a stupid, and a stupid, thi.'t understand has consequences and hurts other people. And that is a time where you would, you know, tell someone's school or something like that. But then there's the guys that are just genuinely like 40-year-old, fucking misogynes, pieces of shit. And I don't know. It's difficult to know where to, like, to thrown. It's probably also worth noting that we are a podcast, a a a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, a podcast, thia, thi, a podcast, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, to, to, to, to, to, thi.a.a.a. thi. thi. thi. thi, talking about the proper response to being harassed by racists on the internet. Like it's, it is very easy for us to say, well, you know, of course you want to get them fired,

but you shouldn't, but we're also not on the receiving end of any of this. I mean, to, yeah. So it's tough. I suppose we are also talking about a very wide-ranging thing thing thing thing thing thing that, you know, we've moved all the way from disingenuously presenting someone's decade-old shitposts as a mark of them being unfit to operate in a job or in society, all the way through to... fuck you bitch, I'm gonna kill you. Yeah, how are you supposed to respond to like, uh, rape and death threats and stuff like that. th. th. th. th, th. th, th. th, th, th. th. th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, thi, thi, thi, tho-to-to-to-to-to-to-s, tho-s, tho-s, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s, thi-s thi's thi's thii's thiii's thi's thi's thi's thi's supposed to respond to like rape and death threats and stuff like that. And I like personally I think that... There's a big spectrum in there where we can say something's a fine and some things are not fine. There is a spectrum but also like in an ideal world if somebody was like sending you a bunch of things online saying I'm going to rape and kill you, you could turn that over to the police.... the police. the police. the police. the police. the police. the the their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their their. their their. their. their. th. th. th. thi. thi. And thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. I th. I th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, thi. And, like, like, to rape and kill you, you could turn that over to the police and the police would go and knock on that person's door and say what the fuck are you doing? But we don't live in

that world. But that's not the experience so many women have. I mean and it's also the same deal as like, it's not exactly the same as doubling someone into their employer, but when you empower corporations to police, I don't know, it's hard. Because say you did, like giving police the power to do that as well based on speech is hard because it's very, very, very hard to tell how sincere or how serious something is on the internet. And like, you know, I've tweeted, like this is something that I got in trouble with, with like Twitter. I got suspended a whole bunch of times because someone that we were fighting with on the internet search my tweets for kill.

And my like stock response for any time anyone did a good own on me was to say I am going to kill you. Yeah you said that to me a bunch of times. Yes. And like if you don't know who I am and you don't know that I'm friends with someone and I have just literally tweeeded a death threat at someone you know I can't expect that some cop is going to be like, wait a second, I think this is on irony level three. And it's a reference to this meme. We need irony cops. Irony cops, trained, irony policemen. No, you need good irony community policing.

I think, yeah, that kind of overlaps with another conversation we've had Ben about, like, yes, you would make that joke to me, but then if like, someone you don't know attempts to do that online and says, I'm going to kill you, you go, huh? Like, um... People see that, they're like, oh, that's how the guys do jokes. Well, I'll do one of those. I'm going to fucking kill you, motherfucker.

I have no idea who you are. Why, have you tweeted this to me? Well, it's like, I, I tweeted something incredibly inane during the week about my, my like shut the fuck up. He's like yeah. Please don't do this please don't try to talk to us like friends talk to each other. It's a very strange very of a person. Person who doesn't follow me who I don't follow who I've never interacted with before. It's not that true. I'm particularly incensed because you have the correct McMuffin opinion as well. Wait, what is the? I just see it is with it. The sausage and edge egg muffin is superior to the bacon and that's correct. Yeah. And then, and then the

worst part about it was having to receive like 600 replies from people who all went on to present a third option and then say I choose this option I'm like what's the possible third option? Well people are like oh the mighty muffin is better or what you got to do Just is that the two of them combined? Possibly and then like oh those Americans going well you actually want to get the? Grittle. Yeah, you want to get the McGriddle or the fucking... What the fucking... Or the sausage and egg biscuit?

They get fucking biscuits? And I was like, it's not what we're talking about. I presented a breakfast scoons here, right? Just to be clear. Yes, it's like a breakfast scone. that I presented a binary of choice and said out of these two things this one is better and all these people chime in to go, well here's another thing that I like more than both of them. It's like not even the conversation.

Yeah. If I was going to formulate the perfect McMuffin, it would be a sausage for McMuffin, but also, if I was going to choose a breakfast, thi, I'd be a big their the big..in, it'll be a sausage in McMuffin, but also there's $100,000 in cash bills in the middle. And I take them out before I eat them. I'll take mine on the side, please. You don't want sauce on your money? But yes, like we said, it's all very complicated. There's all the different levels of, to what extent is this person being sure. Our official show policy is it depends. I don't know. It depends on lots

of things. Well, please don't try and get us fired for irony. Thank you. Yeah, I think the official show policy is that it's a bad precedent to set to try and get someone fired for tweets in general because like you said Ben you're effectively getting into the realms there where you're saying hey you know who polices social behavior in our society corporations. Yeah and because I think that the key thing here is that although it might work in your favor when they do fire someone who is clearly fucking racist they're not doing it because it is according to like good internal values on their behalf. They're doing it because of a like morally agnostic social media policy.

You know, they just want to divest themselves of any risk whatsoever. So if someone was like, oh look, you've got someone who's an anarcho-communist who works for you, who tweeted stuff about guillotines, they're going to be like, well that's the same as racism and we will get rid of them. Yeah, if they, if somebody got doxed as being like a member of Antifa, they would be like, oh, lots of people think that that's a violent extremist organization, so we will fire you. And yeah I think it's all just putting power into the wrong hands. The power should be in my hands. Yes, clutching a clutching a $200,000 McMuffin. Yeah. So perhaps we will close out with with what Joanne

and Nilsom wrote in her article, which I agree with. So as she said what I've come to realize is this. We've all said and done stupid things on the internet, especially if you're under 40. That's what normal people do. What politics needs is more normal people. Nurses, activists, single mothers, social and disability workers, tradies and young people. Legislators should not just be from a background of wealth and privilege, groomed for politics for decades, with power to make their mistakes vanish. Young people without these resources are going to have the specter of social media looming

over them if they put their hands up. But we have to ask ourselves some big questions about what we deem to be acceptable foibles in our representatives. Very true. I agree. Wonderful. So, um, shout out to Joanna. . Wonderful. So, um, shout out to Joanna. Yeah, it was fucking bogus the chair to step down.

Honestly, that sucks ass. Especially since, I think after it happened to more than one candidate, they decided to rally around the other ones, but she was... Yeah, it became clear that it was a pattern that was happening. And, yeah, big, big boo to the Labour Party for leading that effort because... Boo to you. But also congrats, Daniel Andrews. Yeah, congrats.

But also, I don't know, like I said, it's just really disappointing to see how hard they were all, including Daniel Andrews. They were all leaning into this like, ah, see, more proof that the Greens have a problem with misogy and sexism in their ranks. Because someone said, fuck a sucker, ding-dong, 12 years ago. 12 years ago. Yeah, well, really ahead of the curve. Thanks for joining us folks.

As always, if you would like an extra bonus episode every week, you can go over to Patreon.com forward slash Buntavista. Slap down your five clams on the counter. Someone will wrap up a special episode for you in Butch's paper. Push it across the counter to you. You will receive no change. Crime Pass for this week. You can tweet about how good Nang's are.

Tweet about your, or Facebook post. Yeah. Or your drug of choice. If that's not your thing. Whatever you like. Yeah. A Nang's illegal? I don't think they're... Not really. I don't think they're... Not really. I think they're... I'm not really sure. If you know the legal status of Nangs in Australia. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thi thi- I thin that that that that that that that threat threat threat threat threat threat threat threat threat threat threat threat that that th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th are th th th th th th th th that thatnangs are thatnangs are thatnangs are that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that th that's what you're... If you know the legal service of Nangs in Australia. I don't know if it was in Melbourne, but there was the, um, there was the place where... Someone was just running a delivery service, a late night delivery service, and they would bring you around crates of Nangs. Can you imagine the sound that car makes?

It's going over speed bumps. Click, click, click, click, click. Clink, click, click. It's just like... Anyway. My goodness. So, until next week, everybody. Thank you for your time.

We'll see you later. Fine. Bye. the