Brain Soda Podcast - Episode 35 - The Walled in Dead

Episode Date: September 30, 2023

On this week's episode we're talking about the first three volumes of The Walking Dead comic series and the densest city ever, Kowloon Walled City!

Alright, Rambles, let's get to Ramblin. Brain soda. It's the Brain Soda Podcast. I, as always, am your host, Kyle. joined by my co-host and cohort, Brad. How's it going? Today, we're going to be talking about the walled city of Kaulun. But first, Brad? Yes.

Almost 20 years ago, by the release of this episode, the number one issue of arguably one of the most important independent comic books of all time was released. Spawn. Abs of... Oh, no. I mean, arguably Spawn is very important, but that's 1993. Which one then? In early October of 2003, issue one of the Walking Dead graced us in the comic book stores and eventually television video games and various other media.

And we will be covering its first 24 issues, its inception and pre-production from Robert Kirkman and Tony Moore and the litany of early media kind of associated with the canonical timeline of the Walking Dead. Oh man, like yeah, this is gonna be a good one. Like, Walking Dead, okay. This is like a phenomenon that like, stretch more than just like a comic book,

or it almost like, it broke into like Marvel Comics like type deal, because like this is like, stretch more than just like a comic book or it almost like, it broke into like, Marvel comics like, type deal because like, this is like, it's just about zombies but for whatever reason it got huge, like, it is a very good story and I can't wait to talk about it. Well, so that is actually kind of why I gave this wide berth as a topic is because like, in 1968, one of the most important films of its time and the genre itself, Night of the Living Dead, George A. Romero's classic film was released. And that film, in black and white, in all of its glory, ended up going in the public domain and spawned a litany of sequels that kind of like transform that franchise into something different, but regardless, it is that core principle film that really inspired Kirkman to make this as a story.

And when we're talking about the pre-production and the initial like thought process that goes into Kirkman's original work, pitching, walking dad precursors. One of them is literally a loose continuation of the story of the night of living dead. But regardless, that black and white Romero film that is beyond cult classic, it's like integral film, right? Like it is so important to so many different facets of horror films to this day, right? Like even now that like Kirk, Kirkman just wanted to keep that going and write his own stories in that universe. And eventually that pitch kind of changes to like, it is a character driven like melodrama almost

with a zombie apocalypse that has already happened as your background, as your backdrop for these characters to interact with and feel. Exactly. Yeah, because it's not really, I mean, it's not just about zombies, especially towards the end. Like, it's definitely like, as it goes on,

it becomes more really about like the relationships and people first, people, less so zombies. Like zombies almost are just like, you know, oh, there's some zombies. Let's kill them really quick. But that is a through line that goes through this in the preparation for what we're going to talk about today Which is just the first four volumes issues one through 24 even in the early early stuff here the first six six issues days gone by

You know It's so funny that we talk about how this becomes It's so funny that we talk about how this becomes. The zombie horror stuff is really in a sense almost secondary. You know what I mean? Like, it is a crux of the book. I would say it's always an important thematic thing that's there and stuff like that, but like it gets to the point where on top of having to worry about the walking dead, the undead mass of the remnants of humanity, we learn that the threats from other people trying to survive, and many times by any means necessary, is a larger threat to a certain extent or a more prevalent one to a certain extent. And I think something that really captures that so well is Rick Grimes, the sheriff from Kentucky,

wakes up in a hospital bed and has to proceed forward, find his family and navigate his world forward find his family and navigate his world through this zombie-ridden wasteland. That is rural southern America, at least for the largest part of what we're going to talk about here. Yeah, one aside, there's a car wash by us and it says like door, door open or door down Hong Kong or something like that and it just reminds me that it's like don't open dead inside or whatever just write it in like in like sinew and viscera anyway and everybody's being like no I get it though that is buddy Bissera. Anyway, it reminds me of the one.

Yeah, I know I get it though. That is funny. Hong Kong door closed. Pretty much. You know, throughout the the latter parts of that where you've met back up with Rick and his family and you learn that his closest friend, his partner in the field, Shane, the leader of the group who Rick is trying to like kind of convince like,

bro, sitting out here on the outskirts of Atlanta is actually like a really dicey move. And he's like, no, that man, the government's about to come out and save us. You know, like he is, I picture him like Charlie Day in the memes. You know what I mean? Like he's just sitting there trying to triangulate this weird f***ing imaginary world in which he's going to be saved by the government and everything else. And like the personal conflicts and dramas that come from the situational aspects of what's happening

with those characters in that moment. Shane is worried about not only like a potential relationship with Laurie Rich's wife, but like his stake is the leader. He's worried about his place in the world because they're probably not going to get rescued if they haven't already, right? Like the fact that Rick has seemingly unearthed himself from the dead to come back to his family. You know what I mean? Like all of these different things are these high pressured situations that weigh on Shane and make him not only your antagonist, a really flawed person as a character and that lens and that scope changes

throughout different volumes and different elements of stories that we tell for different characters at different times and they all kind of lead into this really kind of pulse pounding beat when they come about, right? Like there is one element of the story later on where you really think this one person's about to go, hey, wire and just like start killing people and he never does.

And like I'll never forget that moment. It's not included in our discussion today, but it is like one of those moments where it's a total bait and switch because you're so used to seeing these high-pressure situations and like yeah they rudimentally kind of change the way a character acts and behaves. That really like I think that's what the Walking Dead does best is it almost like it shows what a post-apocalyptic world would be like, you know, like it shows like how humans would interact like we have to like scrounge and grind and you know, try to get everything

you can. One thing that kind of, I mean, and this happens in the comics and in the show is they like keep getting cans of food and like all these other different foods and stuff like that. And it like becomes like years later and it's like by then, I mean, well, some, oh yeah, yeah. It'd be fine, but most things would go bad when you would have to, like, it have to be like all the stuff. Right, right.

And like they never show, I guess they do show canning, I guess, but like, that's one thing that makes me kind of mad. I was like they never show canning, you know, like traditional canning with like the glass jars and all that. I kind of think by the time you get to Alexandria and things like that stuff is implied. It is because they have like livestock and all that, but sure. Yeah, but I mean, this is like way after. Because I mean, yes, and true,

at that point, like the first couple of years and what we're talking about today, like this is almost like just getting by. This is surviving, trying to even get to the point to be able to build a community because you still do have the zombies. The reason why the zombies, I guess, become like kind of a background plot is because they get so good at protecting themselves from them, they are a background plot in their lives, you know? Yeah, yeah. And throughout the early parts of this books, there's tons of like nine to twelve panel layout pages of just zombies getting blown away in a paste from your cast of characters because like it's very true.

Fish in a barrel. You know, they're just these lumbering corpses and everybody's just like, oh, we got Here's the point. Walker's And they just start dumping, you know, like a routine. Yeah, almost. Yes. I think there's a point like in the comics where they're like all right zombie like they kill like this giant horn of zombies. I think like Rick does, a couple of them do. And this is way way down the road. We're skipping ahead, definitely. But he's like, alright, zombies are not an issue really anymore.

You know, like they're like, he just says that, like we can control the zombies. We know how to kill the hordes. Isn't there? Yeah, I mean, there's, there's a portion even within like, I think what we're talking about today while they're at the prison where Rick just literally has to go ham and cut his way through to achieve some level of goal. I can't remember exactly what it would be, but.

Yes, the prison though. I can't if it, okay, so it starts off their, you know, Rick meets back up with all the the group of people, right? And then they ended up on the farm. Correct? Well, so you have the death of Shane when Shane is about to kill Rick. Oh, Shane doesn't even get to the farm. No. Shane gets to the farm. No, and the show he does. Oh, yeah. I didn't know that. Shane has kind of lost his footing, although he's still technically like the head of the group and he's about to blow Rick away and Carl rolls up and Carl's first kill in the series. Oh, and I believe the first human to human kill we see in the series. No, really? Carl? Yeah, I believe so. Yeah.

No, issue six Carl? Yeah, I believe so, yeah. No. Issue 6, Carl shoots Shane in the city or something. I don't think we see it. Really? Yeah. And we've met Dwight, we've met some characters, we have Glenn, we have Andrea, we have Dale, we have, you know, the core small group of people that we have Andrea, we have Dale, we have... Sure. You know, the core small group of people that we have, and they're not exactly like the most able-bodied of fighters or anything like that, then we disembark from outside Atlanta once Rick has like established himself as the leader of the group.

Now, I wanna make it a very important point that like, as far as characterization, the fact that this guy is kind of like the white, you know, the white hat cowboy, you know, like, he's a literal sheriff walking around in full garb, post a zombie apocalypse, like kind of shuddy supposed to be the morality of this universe you're in, but he's also like the ride along character because while you're walking into the series by opening up that comic book, he is waking up from a coma. You know what I mean? Like and that's something I feel that really works so well, but from there we go to

the reference you had made earlier, the West view of states, and that is a place just littered with zombies that is overrun, and they have to escape and evade that and get towards the farm, once Carl gets shot, via a hunting accident. Wait, okay, Carl gets shot. Yes, I like this is, because it's been so long since I remember like the beginning.

I'm like, yeah, it's okay. He gets shots in the stomach, right? Like the chest or the stomach, the midsection it is. Yeah, and it was like someone that was at the farm, correct? Yeah, I think it's Otis. Yeah, I believe that's Otis. Yeah, I believe that's who he is or whatever. No, that's Bill. I think Uncle, I think he's just an adjacent character to her show.

Exactly. This is one of the few complaints I feel like people could really regularly make about this book, because in this initial 24 issues, more so towards the beginning, but definitely around this point, like, bro, it is snappy. And there is a long list of characters that you're introduced to become interweaved with our group and like realistically, one of the things that that right exactly that first volume will tell you so much because like Shane is the main antagonist in a well-detailed plot of a love triangle and ricks

Chase back home to his family and everything else and he is dead by the end of that story now That's because Kirkman didn't necessarily know if this thing was going to get picked up for more than six issues. Sure. And the other thing that's notable about the issue six two is it's the last issue fully drawn by Tony Moore. Kirkman and Moore had known each other and worked together on comic books during most of their creative careers up to that point but they'd known each other since like the seventh grade. And more would continue to do the covers up until the end of what we're talking about today

with issue 24. Really, that's for that van. That's like, yeah. Kind of like us. Yeah, from there, we go to the farm like we've alluded to before. Herschel Green's farm and we meet his sons and he has his daughters and several other people from around his adjacent area held up in this barn

and because he is a god-fearing man he believes that you know that these are just people you know, these are just people locked into a position. They are probably unwilling, unconcent of, and thus like if some sort of curious found, if some way to get through this is found, and those people can be essentially like cleansed of this, then we'll keep them in the barn until that time comes, and that time does not come because they end up, you know, yeah, taking care of that problem, but that kind of ends Rick and their groups stay.

Although they've kind of started to weave some bonds there and things like that. We've met Ty Ries at this point, a former pro football player, and he wasn't with him at the beginning? No, he joins in volume two. Really? Really. And then they find the prison by the end of volume two. And volume three is mostly the interactions that happens with the remaining prisoners within the building and The group as a whole as they come to take the prison as a as a refuge Yeah, and like man the prison. I think it's probably If not one of the best the best like volume in the whole series I would say that whole whole arc, exactly.

Just that they're staying at the prison, I think is almost better than Alexandria, because that is the real, if we're gonna squat somewhere, right? Where's the best place to squat? The funny thing is, is that a prison, honestly, it might be the best place, because it keeps people in,

but it also keeps people out, right? I mean, it might be the best play. You know, because like it keeps people in, but it also keeps people out, right? I mean, like it's the same way. The thing that is the ultimate downfall of that is like the common kind of through line for the Walking Dead is that people will compete over your ability to keep zombies at bay. That's the thing. It keeps it keeps people out in a civilized society. Right. Because these are at the end of the day, it's just some

fences. And because and like that's not going to keep like some of that really wants to come in. That's not going to keep somebody out. You know, like yeah, you can have guards and stuff. But I mean, and that's what happened. But. And for people to be able to be together into a, you know, a shambled society or whatever you'd want to call it, but they have to amass a level of power

and they'll have a power clash that happens, right? I mean, and that is what we see towards the end of what we're looking at here where, for the the most part all the prisoners that were at the prison at this point have pretty much gone, died or kind of folded into the group. And by the end of this arc, there's become a large conflict between Rick and his really kind of second and heavy hitter, Tyrese, like we mentioned before, the Michonne comes in towards the end of this four volume kind of sprawl we're talking about, and Carol, right? Carol and a couple other characters that have either allegories or are directly represented and adapted for the show are yeah they're just they're so difference between the two universes that like it's to me it's it's two

different things that we have to talk about like at different times almost because otherwise we would just be sitting here all day going well this thing happens here but then it happens here at this point and it it's like, by the end of this arc, the conflict between Rick and Tyres is kind of boiled over, but also kind of simmered down. And at that point, we have a council of four people between Dale Herschel Tyres and Rick. And another thing I wanted to bring up aside from the show recently released on the Switch, the tailtail games tie in because one of the people who should be at this prison is Lee Everett, the arguable protagonist of the first tailtail walking dead game. Really? Yeah. And like, tailtail games, by the way, are like the first of that kind of,

well, modern genre of that, like, you know, choose your own path, things, right? Yeah, right, right. That I could think of, yeah. So it started with walking dead. That's pretty cool. Yeah, that's like, yeah. Interesting. And that's one of the few games I've 100% it on my ps3 back in the day, too Really, I've never 100% of the game. I went through and replayed it I went through and replayed at the opposite way of what I played before yeah, they won't let you 100% Kids games I tried a hundred percent a kids game with one of my kids and they don't give you a platinum for that. What? Kind of pisses me off, yeah.

Wow, way to gatekeep Sony. It's why I used to play Switchbred. And with that, I mean to be fair, there's no achievement system on Switch. But yeah, with that, I want to say like, like a lot of other people, the show is more than likely your greatest reference point for this thing. like a lot of other people, the show is more than likely your greatest reference point for this thing. And for a large part, when they cover these specific issues we're talking about,

this is when the show is at its best, arguably, right? Yeah, and that's most shows. I don't know why it can't make me think of Game of Thrones. But it kind of is, it's very similar. That big ensemble cast. Yeah, exactly. Like, it's very similar and like, you know, it's got the background, the written background,

and like, there's, like, yeah. But one thing, you know, made me think of, well, you said you were doing Walking Dead. I was thinking of what would happen in Caldune if it happened, you know, in things, if the zombie apocalypse happened in Calune. Yes. Oh, I don't know. Because this place, I don't know if you've ever heard of it,

was the most densely populated city ever. Oh, wow. Yes. Okay. Tell me a little bit more about it. So Calune city or Calune wall city was, and I hope I'm saying this right. It looks like Calune. I don't know. I'm, you know hope I'm saying this right, it looks like kaolun. I don't know, I'm not good at speaking Chinese, but, or Cantonese, I guess.

And it's peak. It had over 50,000 people in 6.4 acres, or around like 2,600 meters squared. Okay. Yeah, it's like 6 acres of 50,000 people. I don't know, you know, like six acres is not very much, you know? This is like a couple of blocks. So like one of the things I'm wondering about this conceptually is like, did they burrow this wall down

so that it could not be tonaled under? It's not, okay. So you're probably thinking of like this giant, like there's like there's like a wall wall and really it's called the wall city because of it's like it's origins it really didn't have a wall at all. There was no wall like it was actually a mostly ungoverned city in the middle of Hong Kong. Like that's the crazy thing. Sick. Yes. So the reason why is because kind of the first opium war, which I would like to talk about someday, I have no clue about it though, which is why I'm kind of afraid to talk about it because like I've only heard like about it. That's right. Right.

And it happened around like 1839 to 1842, right? So this is like, you know, early 1800s, early industrialization and stuff. I know like Britain, like kind of like forced China. When there were opium things, openly in certain places, right? Force China to trade with them essentially, you know, was the gist of it. And we need some of that H2.

Yeah, well, they like, they made them do the opium. Like they're making the Chinese people take the opium to like kinda like, yeah, no. Yeah, as far as I know, like from, yeah. I don't know again. Here's some of that indentured attitude. I mean, yeah. Relaxed social environment.

Yeah, that's great. Like, because of that though, like the British one, right? And that's how they gain control of Hong Kong. And like, they still, like, I think even to this day, they don't have complete control of it. They don't actually, I think China has complete control of it now. I was gonna say, man, isn't the Mao Warn like that?

That was, it played a role in that thing. Like, yes, but, well, actually, no Hong Kong didn't really, we'll get into that. Okay. But during that, like, so during the first opium war and after that, so after the first opium war, they built this fortress in Caldune Bay, which that was like what became to be known as the Walt City, right, because of the walls

of the fortress. Like that was the Walt City, but it really, like it didn't last that log. It lasted only like, I think like 50 years or so, you know, but that that place is With that locale is where people continued to stay at even though it didn't have the fortress there Exactly. Yes, because like because after that there was another war like less than 15 years after that in 1856 The second opium war when Electric Booulu Right, okay. When Britain, like, finally took control of Hong Kong, and like, they made, sorry, when

they finally took control of Hong Kong, and they made a 99-year lease with China to have Hong Kong be controlled by the British Empire for... Man, the balls, bro. I just... I know. We got a 99- year lease on like your capital city. No biggie. It wasn't it wasn't even a capital city. I'm here.

I was I mean it was but it was. Oh yeah, probably wasn't you're right. China. It was like the industrial capital, you know, commerce capital, right? Like I mean, I again, I have I don't know enough about Chinese history. So I might be speaking on my ass here, but I do know like right now Beijing is their capital city. So that's like way up north, right? Whereas like Hong Kong is like South China, you know, so like okay It's a big city. There's tons of huge cities in China, but like Hong Kong

So yeah, like so because of that though, like there was this like, you know, there's this Chinese influence at Calune versus the rest of Hong Kong. Like if you look at a map, right, like the Calune district is like the northern part of modern day Hong Kong. Like, okay, yeah, like I tried to look it up and I'm like, well, this is like all of Hong Kong. Like it's like Hong Kong's like two two cities on a island or well on an island in the mainland. Essentially, you know, if you look at it. Okay. Yeah, but during World War two though, you know, which is again, we'll talk about someday. You know, I don't I do know a little bit about world world or, but the Japanese, though, took over China. Like that's, you know, and like obviously that disrupted Hong Kong and all that.

And afterwards, a bunch of refugees fled to Calune, and that's kind of where the city, you know, the end of being the Calune-Wad city. What we're talking about today for the most part, right? Exactly. Yeah. So like, over time time through the 50s and 60s, there was like a massive construction boom in Hong Kong itself, you know? This is when Hong Kong became the Megalapalus that it is now. The Metropolis? It's almost not a Metropolis. Okay.

Because it's like, it's huge. Like Los Angeles is a mega-lapolis. Right. Okay. Mega City for, right? So it is. Like, because like a metropolis, you think of a metropolis.

A metropolis is like skyscrapers and stuff, right? That's what you think of, yeah. Yeah. A mega-lapolis is like a super city. You know, you're like you're your Chicago area Well, even your New York area your Eastern you know your North Eastern Right, right or Los Angeles or obviously Tokyo and Hong Kong places like that right that's like it's huge I guess like it's this giant city if you like yeah

Um, so during that time though, obviously this place wanted to build too, but there was an issue because like was it under British control or Chinese control? Like I forgot to tell you, during this treaty, this 99 year lease, Calune was not included. So. Okay.

That's why the Chinese people fled there. Right, right. Yeah, I guess that's the major thing. I forgot to mention. But, so like during that time, this is again, in the kind of the middle of the city, in a way. So there wasn't a way for China to really govern this area.

And the British were like, well, it's your area, we're not governing it. Like there was just like no regulations whatsoever. Hands off, washing our hands with that, yeah. Yeah, so it just kind of was like almost an anarchy. Like it was like an anarchy in the middle of a city. Right. Yeah, and like, they did like follow some regulations. Like there was like an anarchy in the middle of a city. Right. Yeah. And like, they did follow some regulations.

Like there was a regulation. You couldn't build any building more than 14 stories high. And they kept that, but they just built the whole thing of 14 stories high. Right, right. Yeah. And it became like, everything though, it became like in a city of itself,

because it was, again, it was this own thing. It had stores and homes and health services, particularly Dennis, which we'll get to in a second. And other amenities, though, shops and stuff at the bottom, there would be all different sorts of food stands and all that. Okay.

And that would serve things. be like all different sorts of food stands and all that. Okay. Yeah. And like that would like serve things. Like you wouldn't even, like things you wouldn't see in Hong Kong or even like in the world. You know, like specific like cultural or you know, or specific like special. I was just thinking of Louis K. Bit where he's like, there's just a random scoop or full of duck

because in this Chinese market. That's what I mean. Like things like that though, probably. Yeah, like this is like that type. Delica sees of the culture, etc. yeah. Exactly. Like if you, like this thing was like, there was roads and stuff.

It was this, so it almost lit to me. Looks like if you gave 50,000 people a chance to just build something. You're like, go build something. You have no regulation, just build it. And that's what this place is. Look, it's essentially, it's just everything imaginable, from brick to concrete to iron to, you know, probably wood in there, you know, like, it's just this crazy mishmash of everything you can think of all building materials, no regulations. It was it, but it worked. Like they had piping,

they had electricity. Granted, it was pretty crappy. But these, you know, this was obviously a slum type environment, unfortunately, but, you know, it worked. It's a fucking refugee city for the most part, though, man. I mean, that's the thing, isn't it? It's like the most... I mean, at that time, in the early fifties, but it became a side-up to itself, you know?

Right, but that's my point. Is, okay, so like we said, the British government has a lease airquo around all the adjacent areas for a hundred years and people flee that area to try to live a life not under British rule. It might be like that. Yeah. I wonder what that's like as I sit here in Michigan. Exactly. It could be like that. Yeah. Right. So it's a refugee city because nobody's putting infrastructure in there to be able to make it a place where people could live a life not under British rule.

What do those people then in turn do DIY do with themselves? They do it themselves. Okay, this consists of around 350 buildings, over 8,500 businesses, and 10,700 households. Right? So, like, this was a huge thing. Yeah. Right. Looking at the pictures, you know, please, if you're not, you know, drive it over, listen to this, look at the picture of this place. K-O-W-L-O-O-N. It's a crazy place.

It really is. Like, and like, we we'll get to it later but some things were referenced like a lot of things were inspired by this this place a lot of like media type things I can see blade runner and just from the little bits and pieces I'm looking at here yeah yeah but because of like the deregulation obviously it was like very unsanitary like you know because it didn't have like plumbing and stuff like like that. It did have, though, it did have water and they like dug their own wells. Oh, yeah. Right. It's crazy. In the city, they dug their own wells. That's kind of insane to me. I guess that's what they do. You know, like, you need water, right? You're going to dig your own well. There are so many subregions in this giant expanse that is a country that like there's little mini-civilizes. There's a

handful of people from over here that have been doing things like digging their own wells and like that for generations or centuries maybe even. And then a handful of them end up over here. Well, now you can train all these other people to help you dig the well for all your, you know, your household and a couple of Jason buildings and then they go down the road and do it for these households and adjacent buildings or whatever. You know what I mean? Like it might be one of those things. It's definitely, I mean, yeah, it be one of those things. It definitely is. Because like, it will get into this in a second. Like they are, the community was very close knit there.

But there was actually like triad gangs. That was like what ran at. Like it was like, it was more like, I mean, there was a lot of bad stuff there, you know, like. I'm sure the triad had a good hand in it. The triad essentially governed the place, you know, and like because the police the police did go in there a little bit But like it was very limited. They would like send a couple people in there to govern, you know You try to like work and like like they were and most of those people that would go in there were like, you know

Bride by the triads or we're working with them or something. Oh, yeah. Yeah, bro. Yeah, so like, I mean, because there was like, you know, gambling, strip clubs, drug dens, brothels, oh, you know, everything, all the vices, you know, it was all there. Just like to kind of describe this place, right? This is, again, 14 stories high,

and there's like roads in this, and every place, it's not just, just a kind of building. It's not one single building. This is six acres again. This is a huge like couple blocks of a city like a few blocks, I would say, right? And there was like alleyways essentially throughout this building or you know, this structure, this conglomerate of this like, you know, mishmash of everything, you know this structure, this conglomerate, this like, you know, mishmash of everything, you know.

So like it was like, I don't even know how to explain it, man. It's so crazy to think about what this thing is, you know? Yeah, and especially in the time frame that it is too, man. I mean, you gotta think, like this is, this is like the 50s through the 90s is when this was active again. It's like the old West almost, you know what I mean? Like once you enter into this territory,

the rules have changed. And I don't mean that in like necessarily negative sense although we're talking about the triad being like heavily involved in like the Cummings and Goans of Kao Loon. We're also talking about the fact of like, the governance of every adjacent place around it is either under British rule or direct government control from the Chinese government.

And like, it ain't not but not here. Exactly. Compadre, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, that is a super interesting aspect. Yeah, it's a weird, because even Hong Kong, like they had the lease, right? But there wasn't a ton of British people living in Hong Kong. Yes, there was a British presence, but even now,

it's mostly Chinese people, the whole city's weird. But this thing's carried on, right? This carried on pretty much you know about 40-50 years until about January of 1987 when it was announced that Hong Kong was going to start like getting rid of Kaolun city essentially just good to demolish it essentially they're going to evict everybody and just demolish the whole city. No, yeah. And this is something that we don't really have in America. 400 officials, the 400 people from the Hong Kong housing department arrived and started cordoning off all the streets

or what alleys, essentially, all these alleys. And you know, they over the next six months, they started, they went through knocked on doors, they started taking note of all the residents, you know, taking a census essentially, like a very detailed census of everybody there. And it took place like- I could only imagine. A detailed, yeah.

Yeah, like, I mean, China, you know, it's like they do things differently than America. For sure, they definitely do things. I mean, like, well, no, what do you think? Well, no, what do you do? Yeah, I mean, honestly though, that's true though, with, oh, oh yeah. This ironically though, was like right around,

like a couple of years after the Sinnoh British declaration, which gave total control of Hong Kong back to China in 1997, right? In July 1st, 1997. Okay. So this is when they went Hong Kong, went back to China. The leases of. Yeah. Exactly.

Which wasn't, I don't think, 100 years. It was, or 99 years. Those after 1860 was the second of P.A.B. War. 130-ish years after this 99-year lease, you know, you know some leases need extensions, Brad You know, that's exactly. I think what Britain said, but likely likely Exactly so because of that I think they're like we need a deal with this the city like Yeah, so over like like I, over the course of six months,

these officials started gathering all this information and stuff. And they were compensated. People were compensated. But the thing is, is that you gotta like prove that you live there, right? Like, this is not like, you just took a census to prove I lived here.

Exactly. Right. I mean, this was more than just like, there just took a census to prove I lived here. Exactly. Right. I mean, this was more than just like, there was people that were still like homeless in this city, you know, like that's right. Right. True. Because like, you know, there's people like that don't have homes there or businesses or anything like that, but still live there, right?

Right. Right. So, but still, there's people that didn't want to leave too, is people that live there for, you know, generations, you know, their My or grandma were there, right? And there was a deal worked out though. The Chinese government worked out to give What amounts it to be? 2.76 billion dollars and you know, in American dollars, which was about three hundred and eighty thousand dollars per person. was about $380,000 per person. So like, okay, I mean, they were offered in, you know, I think 1990s money, if I'm not mistaken, right?

So like this is, like that's, you know, that's a good bit of money. I don't know, man, if someone offered me $380,000, even right now, I'd be like, yep, I'll move out, give me, give me a month. So all of the 50,000-ish though, 33,000s agreed to that. Agreed to move out by November of 91, okay? Okay, the ones that did it though in July of 92, the Hong Kong Center riot police to evict the last of them and like Oh yeah, but there's definitely pictures and stuff you can see if it was called

pictures and stuff. You can see if it was called Hakhnam, which is city of darkness in Cantonese. So like, I mean, these are like alleyways, you know, it's all like just fluorescent lights and stuff. This is, you know, there's no light. It's just think of it like a giant city, a hotel, like a giant hotel city, but with wide hallways, essentially. But so again, 92, the Hong Kong police sent in, right, right, police. And afterwards they installed the tall fence, and that was pretty much the end of it. That was the end of the walled city. And nine months after that, they demolished it. And there was things, there was like a big ceremony and everything. Like people like, you know, like a farewell festival for it, I guess.

Right now though, there is a big park that stands there. And like memorials and all that. And it was completed in August of 95. And there's like, it really does pay a lot of like cultural, like, it thinks about the legacy of the walled city. Like, it has like different like monuments to it and artifacts from it. And there's actually like this little, this administrative office that was like originally built there when the fortress was built there back in the 1800s. Yeah, and that's so preserved. So that's pretty cool.

That is really cool. And like, like you were saying before about like that, that tunneling effect that has to come in from the alleyways and like that, like it really is this kind of like underground kind of feel, I guess, that look. And there's things. There's things. The kind of anarchy or whatever you would like to call it, which and there's things that kind of anarchy or whatever you would like to call it which Mind you Anarchy does not mean no rules. It means no leaders You know what I mean like it's in a city too. Yeah, I think like like we're just gonna pack in as much as we can yeah and like some of the things that are referenced in American culture is like call duty black ops

There's a level that's based on the city. Yep. Also Batman begins takes a lot of things from cyberpunk 2032 or whatever it is 30 whatever. 2077 is the 2077. There you go. Yeah. But yeah. Yeah. That's kind of like that. Like a lot of those like really cramped quarters with the small alleys and all that. Yeah. Yeah. But it's crazy though man look up pictures of it anybody else yeah look up pictures of it because it is it's a crazy city and I just had to talk about it but with that call you want to leave us out and with that we'd love to thank you for joining us here each and every week you can find us on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and Patreon, where you can

get early access to these episodes by one week. Let us know any questions, comments, or suggestions you have about the episode. Share this with your friends, give us a rate or review on your platform of choice and for Brad I'm Kyle and we will see you again here soon. Zia! Blamety Blam! Brainsoda