Breaking Bread with Tom Papa - Episode 140 - Tom Dreesen

Episode Date: January 31, 2023

The great Tom Dreesen serves up legendary comedy stories with a big healthy side of Sinatra.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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From binge all episodes exclusively on Paramount Plus It's time for Breaking Red with Papa Hey! Don't you know? Hey, it's how we go. Hey, it's time for Breaking Bread with Papa. Hey, don't you know? Hey, it's also a show. Hey.

Hey, everybody, welcome to another edition of Breaking Bread with Tom Papa. I am Tom Papa and I'm joined today by, and I'm starting to get this now, so you must be really sick of it. The legendary Tom Driesen, right? Once they say legendary, you're like, all right, I'm not young anymore. I'm very excited. I actually ran into Tom while I was food shopping, which I'm doing all the time. I actually baked you some bread. You can feel underneath.

It's still probably a little warm. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'll take that with me. And I was there getting my wares because I cook all the time. And that's where this whole podcast came from. And I ran into the great Tom Driesen. And when I first started coming to L.A., I started off going to the Laugh Factory and the

improv and stuff. And you were on the shows all the time. And I was like, who is this guy that is a little older than the other guys, but killing more than the younger guys? Working clean, but crushing. And I was just like totally drawn to you as soon as I got here. And it gave me great comfort to become friends with you and talk with you backstage and stuff. And we're very lucky to have them. I saw when I was shopping for food and I'm like these are stories that we need on the podcast because

your career spans over 50 years opening for Sinatra more I think tonight shows than anybody I think ever how many tonight shows did you end up doing? Holy shitballs there were guys David Brenner did more than me and so did

I think Joan Rivers Rodney maybe but there might have been I might be four or five. And that was, were they all stand up? Were they all standing and? Oh, yeah. Always stand up.

David, I did over 50 David Letterman shows, but he never wanted me to do standup. He wanted me to sit down and tell stories. Did you want to do standup? Yeah, I would like to have done, you know, because that's what we do. I would be marketing what I do. Right.

But David, I mean, being on his show, helped me sell out shows sometimes. Right. I do a one-man show. called The Man Who Made Sinatra Laf. It's a 90-minute show. And so David helped with that. I want to digress for a moment.

You know how you become a legend. Thank you for that. That's a compliment in a lot of ways. Whenever they introduce me as a legend at the laugh actor at the comedy show, when I'm working on a new material, I say, you know how you become a legend? All my critics are dead. I help them live them all. Right, exactly.

I'm still going. I mean, really, that is kind of a thing. I mean, not critics, but how many guys that you started with are rolling in to clubs on sunset to work out new material. Yeah. Well, you know, Tommy, this is the truth. Many years ago, I was working Tahoe. I was working at Tahoe. With Sammy Davis at Harris.

And George Burns was working next door at Caesars in Lake Tahoe. And I had done the Dean Martin Rose with George Burns, and I knew him and I liked him. I thought the world of him. Yeah. Now, I ran over to catch his show. This guy, after my show, this guy was 95 years old. He didn't run out to the microphone,

When he got out there, he did a strong hour in 10 minutes and just killed the audience. And I went backstage afterward to say hello to him. And he was looking at three by five cards. He was in his dressing room. We were looking at three by five cards. I walked in. He said, oh, hi, Tommy. He said, I was working on some new material tonight.

I said, that's what I want to do. I want to be 95 years old working on new material. God. That is so great. Whenever people say, when are you going to lay down, when are you going to quit? I always tell that story. Yeah. Yeah.

Do you ever, I mean, there's no quitting. No, if you still, if you love it and I love it, and I know you do too. I love making people laugh. It's not a, it's that what's that old cliche that if you love your work, you never, if you love what you do, you never work a day in your life. It's the truth. Yeah. I know.

When I keep getting all of these pop-up things of like retirement, you know, online and stuff, and it's like to retire, it's like, and I have friends, you know, they went to high school with that are planning it now and some of, some have bailed, but they didn't love what they did. Think about it's the greatest profession on the planet Not because you and I are stand-up comedians and I'm blowing smoke It truly is now before I was ever a comedian Yeah I spent four years in the military I came out I was married I had a wife and three kids

I work concrete I work construction I help poor sidewalks Basements you know concrete I worked for carpenters I was a labor all the time Was the Chicago? Chicago yeah on the south side The suburb called Harvey Illinois I worked on a loading loading trucks, and I became a teamster, and later dropped my card and became management, you know. I was a bartender. I was a truck driver. I helped my brother in photography. I was a private

detective for a while. I had all these jobs and was never fulfilled. Always was very fulfilled. Being a stand-up comedian, think about, first of all, the insurance companies of America did a survey many years ago, the 10 Fears of Man. They did it for eight years, research around the country. The 10 fears of man. Death was fourth. Pain was second. Second, getting up in front of an audience was a number one fear of mankind. God.

That we can get up in front of an audience and make people laugh. If you can get up in front of an audience and talk about being a house painter for an hour, or a lawyer or a bartender or whatever, you're in less than 1% of the population of the world. If you can get up and make people laugh for an hour, you're in less than 1 millionth of the 1% of the population of the world. So how fortunate we are to be able to do this. But the other thing, too, is laughter is he. healing. It always was a theory before. Yeah. And hold your point because I'm going to wrap it. But laughter was, it was always a theory. Ten thousand years ago, Indian tribes had a, their medicine man made you laugh. He was like a clown. So even then they knew laughter. Laughter is psychologically a deterrent that if you're watching a comedian, you're not thinking of your problems. The brain cannot think of two thoughts at the same time. It can't function two thoughts at the same time. So if you're watching a comedian or listening to a comedy album, you know, you're not thinking of your problem. laughter is psychologically deterrent.

But because of Norman Cousins, the man who wrote two books, Laughter Math, and the other was the anatomy of an illness, he was told he was going to die. Doctors told him he didn't have longer live a heart ailment in the hospital. He's landed because of the stress in his life. He laid in the hospital and he thought of negative input,

stress made me ill, then positive input should make me well. So he checked out of the hospital. He'd only watch I Love Lucy reruns, Candy, Camer, Three Stooges, and Mark's brothers. Wouldn't watch the evening news, wouldn't read the papers. He lived 27 years. years after the doctors told him he was going to die. Wow.

So now, because of that, UCLA did research. When the body laughs, a hearty laugh, endorphins are released from the brain into the bloodstream. Right. So after a hearty laugh, you go, oh, and that sense of well-being comes over because your body's going through an actual chemical change. So laughter is not only psychologically a deterrent, it's physiologically therapeutic. Right.

So comedians are physicians of the soul. So Dr. Papa. It is amazing. Like when people come up to you after shows, they are grateful. I mean, grateful. And you realize they don't laugh. I mean, even close to what you just did for an hour and a half. But in their everyday life, the amount of times that some people laugh are so small.

Yeah. It really is incredible. And it's part of your health. And how many times in your career people come up to you and said, I got to tell you, you made me laugh? I was going to a problem. A divorce of death in the family. I've been in the doldrums. I didn't want to come here tonight.

My friend drug me here, but, man, you made me feel so much. That's happened to all of us so many times. At first, you don't absorb it. But as time goes by, you start looking into it. It's the greatest profession on the planet. Yeah. For those of us who can do it, I'm, you know. Yeah.

I mean, those odds are so crazy. I never thought of that. Less than 1% will even get up there to do anything. Yeah. And then even smaller just to get up there and make people laugh. I have to say when you said private detective, I could see you in Chicago. You could have rocked that for a long time. Yeah, it was an interesting.

It was for a Polizzi Detective Agency, and he hired street kids. I don't have a degree from academia, but I got a doctorate from the streets. I grew up on the streets. I signed shoes in taverns. I set fins in bowling alleys. I caddied in the summertime. I sold newspapers on the corner. Right.

I had eight brothers and sisters. Whoa. We lived in a shack and we were raggedy poor, you know. Wow. Holes in my shoes, you put cardboard in there. If a window broke, you stuck a rag in it, you know. Were both your folks around? Yeah, both them were, and both them had drinking problem at one time.

And then my dad died drinking, you know, and my mom finally quit drinking, you know. Right. But, you know, when you were a kid, you learn to love the human being but hate the illness, you know. Yeah. And we didn't, I didn't think of them as alcohol. Because where I'm from, you know, people just did that. Yeah. In Harvey, Illinois, a suburb on the south side of Chicago, as you mentioned, there were like 36 taverns.

There was maybe 15 factories, steel mills, factories. He made everything from clutch plates to crankshafts. Yeah. People worked in a factory, went home, got a shot in a beer on the way home or weekends. The corner tavern was a social center. Right. You know, everybody hung around the corner tavern. Keep people sane.

Yeah, and Fridays they had fish fries, you know, for the weekends. And so I grew up around saloons, taverns. Frankson, after God rest of soul, a New York Times guy once said to him, why do you have Dresen open for you all the time? And we were sitting in a place called Patsy's on West 57th Street. Oh, I love that place. In New York, yeah. Oh, God. Just because you guys ate there. Really? But the guy said to Frank, he was walking out and he was joking, but he said, Frank, how come you keep this guy Dresen around? He said, you mean besides the fact that he's funny? And the guy said, yeah. He said, well, if I'm a saloon singer and I am, he said, then Tommy's a saloon comedian. By that, I mean, we're just a couple of neighborhood guys.

Right. And I never forgot that quote out of it. Because that's what I truly am. I'm a guy from the neighborhood. I, you know, attended bar in the neighborhood when I came out of the service where my mom used to attend bar, you know. Did you feel that with him when you were, I mean, I'll go back and, well, you know, let's do that. Let's go back because I know some of the listeners won't know the story. You mentioned in the beginning that you had already been doing stand up for how many years

before you run into Sinatra. I had been doing it for God. Well, I was with a comedy team six years. Tim Reed and I were America's first black and white comedy team. History shows were the last. They may now be doing a mini-series about Tim and Tom.

Oh, really? There were no comedy clubs in those days. Right. So we worked all black clubs in the north and the south what they called the Chitlin Circuit. Yeah. Black-owned, black-operated.

clubs and we worked all white knuckles too we worked the playboy circuit and stuff but but we paid dues that no other act really had to pay it was it's an interesting story but so six years that and then when the team broke up i was doing it um i in 1975 i did my first appearance on the tonight show and then i start touring with sammy davis so i met frank after i'd been in business about 12 years 12 years including the duo including the duo including the duo yeah i'm sorry i'm going to i'm going to do this lot because you're you're your dream i know this is uh all all common for you and but you drop things and i'm like wait i have i'm going to have so many questions i'm going to be doubling back a lot i know that's the way this is going to go uh there are no comedy clubs uh you meet up with what's his

name tim read tim read you meet up with tim how i mean now it's like people grow up seeing comedy on youtube and all this stuff and it seems like a kind of a sensible business path career path. Yeah. How do you guys come? There's no duos. There's no comedy clubs. There's no biracial.

How do you? Where's the first thought come? It's like a gift from God. And I'm not making that up. I was wandering aimlessly from job to job. I had a wife and three kids. I never, I would do a job good. But then I'd be in a bar with my buddies at 2 o'clock in the morning.

Yeah. I'd say, I don't belong in here, but I didn't know where I belong. Yeah. Honestly, started praying. I said, God, what is it I'm supposed to be doing? Because I was so frustrated. Yeah. I joined a civic group called the JCs, the Junior Chamber of Commerce in those days,

teaching your leadership training program, how to form committees, subcommittees, how to Robert's Rules of Order, you know, how to conduct meetings. They worked on the problems of the community. Right. And by helping solve the problems of the community, you had a lot of leadership training programs. So one of the biggest problems in those days were drugs in our youth. So I wrote a drug education program teaching eighth graders, elementary school kids, the ills of drug abuse with humor.

Wow. A concept that had to make the kids laugh, play some records and everything. Right. You know, I was never a comedian. Never thought I'd ever be a comedian, but I was a guy who could tell a joke. I was aboard ship when I was on a service and stuff like that. The guy in the neighborhood, when I was a bartender, people would come in, I'd tell them a joke. Hey, Tom Papa was in here the other night, and I'd tell the neighborhood joke.

Yeah, right. So you were getting laughs. I was, but I enjoyed it. Yeah. But I never thought I'd ever be a little. in Shobans. So on this drug education program, I proposed it to the JCs one night at one of the meetings. I wanted them to sanction it. I had a guy, a white guy, a white friend of my name, John DeBoer, that was going to work with me on that program. When I finished proposing it, this young black guy

comes up to me with his sponsor. He said, I'm a new JC. This is my first meeting. My name is Tim Reed. He said, and I'd like to work with you on that project. I said, gee, I already got a guy, but thank you. Again, divine intervention. The next day, my buddy John DeBoer calls me and said, Tom, I can't do the program with you. I got a new job. I said, gee, what was that black guy's name? Tim Reed. I meet with Tim.

We rehearse, rehearse, rehearse. We go into the schools. And the moment I walked in that class, I went, whoa, what a blessing. I never even thought about it. The children were black and white. The children were integrated. So, you know, two white guys, it maybe got over,

but we got their attention immediately. Yeah. How great that you didn't premeditate it. Yes. Right? Yes. And now we're getting the kids laughing, playing records and everything. The program became very successful.

successful. The JCs through their publications made it a model program through 50 states and 22 foreign countries wherever JCs were. One day a little eighth grade girl walking out of the classroom said, you guys are funny. You ought to become a comedy team. A couple days later, Tim and I were sitting at a bar we're talking and what we're going to do. He told me a joke. I told him a joke funny. He said, you remember what that girl said, would you do that? Would you do that? We didn't know the first thing to do. Yeah, where to go? Where are you going to go? Well, we start writing. Well, we start writing. what we thought was funny driving his wife crazy my ex-wife what was her name again oh yeah plaintiff she hated the idea of a comedy team and I don't blame her right we don't blame her of me going in the show business you know she had a dad who worked 38 years in a factory never missed the day brought a check home every Friday she was raised and in the blue collar like I was sure

the regular routine the regular life bill is paid you know I go into this business so we didn't have food coming we had a wife and three kids Tim had a wife and two kids How old are you at this point? At that time, I was in my 20s. In your 20s. 27 or something like that. Now, there's no comedy clubs. Yeah.

So we kept driving his wife crazy, you know, do you think this is funny, Reader, you think that's funny? Funny shit, go do this somewhere. So we went to a jazz club where they have a jazz trio. Yeah. And we asked them when the group takes a break,

could we get up? Yeah. And the owner of clubs said, yeah, he's a nice guy. So Tim and I got up, and we were so bad because we, All we did was we memorized our material. Just spitting it out.

No, we're just going like a machine gun. Hi, we're to come to him and Tim Tom. He's Tim, I'm Tom. He's Tim. I'm talking. Pretty soon. Some guy in the back hollered, slow down. I said, oh, sir, please don't heckle us. This is our first time.

We come upstairs. We get the owner in a corner. How do we do? What do you think? What do you think? He said, I don't know. You never gave me a chance to laugh. Come back tomorrow and slow down.

Oh, nice. Next day we go back. One of the lines I had written. and got a big laugh right from the start. Nice. At that moment, it was like a B movie. Like one of those B movies where the dark clouds opened up and the sunbursts through.

My whole being went, oh, yeah. Right. This is what I want to do. This is, Tommy, I couldn't sleep that whole night. It was a Friday night. Yeah. I couldn't sleep that whole night. I'm tossing trying to get up in the morning.

I go down to the church where I had been an altar boy where my mom sang in the choir, where I sang in the choir when I was a boy. I got on my knees. I prayed. I said, oh, God. The church was in the church was in. There was no service there anything.

Yeah. I said, God, I know. Now, I know now I want to be a comedian. Wow, man. You might make a living, making people laugh. Overwhelming. Yeah. And I'm trying to say, God, I'll do charities.

I'm making promises. Right. That was September, 1969. In September, 2019, 50 years later, I went back to that church, Ascension Church in Harvey Illinois, and I gave a sermon on the power of prayer. Whoa. Because I told you, I said, I know right there. everything I prayed for happened.

I've been making my living as a comedian for 52 years flying in Frank Sinatra's jet all over the world, doing it tonight shows. Yeah. Again, it was amazing. Do you still pray? Oh, every night. Every night.

I'm not, it sounds like I'm some kind of saying. I'm not, I'm a sinner like the best of them. But when I was given the sermon, I said to the congregation, I said, how many of you out there were thinking of a friend, you hadn't seen for a long time or a relative? And the phone rings, you go, and it's that person. And you go, I was just thinking of you. And they say, you know, I was just thinking of you too.

And how many times you haven't seen someone in years and you're walking down on the street and you bump into them? I was just thinking, and they see, you know, I was thinking of you too. Yeah. Raise your hand. And the whole congregation raised their hand. Sure. I said, if we human beings can transfer thought and obviously we can, then how powerful is a supreme being to transfer thought? Right.

It's not rocket science to me. It just makes sense. Yeah. Yeah, it's completely. So you start doing these jazz clubs in Chicago. The Chitlin Circuit. The Chitlin Circuit. So you just kept, so that's pretty interesting.

There were probably no white performers in the Chiltern Circuit. So he's, that's kind of an opposite showbiz story, right? It was always the, the black performer trying to break into the white clubs. Yeah. Now you're on that circuit. That had to have been a, it must have been a tough, I mean, you have to have, gone through a lot together. What decided, when did you decide and why did you decide,

I'm going to go out of my own? I didn't. He did. It broke my heart. Really? I thought Tim and Tom could be the greatest, or at least it was my dream and my prayers, the greatest comedy team of all time, because there's never been a black and white comedy team before or after, you know. 69. So you were. 69 to 75.

It's a pretty heavy time for race. Think about it. Yeah. Martin Luther King was a. assassinated. Bobby Kennedy was assassinated. African Americans were riding in every major city in America, including Harvey, Illinois, had one of the largest riots right in my neighborhood. I grew up in a predominantly black neighborhood.

We were raggedy poor, like I said. So I played basketball on an all-black basketball team. I played football on a black football team. So I had a lot of experiences. Years later, I have an album in front of an all-black audience called that white boy is crazy. Because Richard Pryor wanted me to call it that honkies crazy. Right. Because, you know, he had that N-Words crazy.

I said, I would do that, Richard. but no black guy ever call me honking my whole life. They always call me a white boy. Right. When I played, they say, hey, white boy, come here, you know. White boy's on, you know. If I went home right now and they were arguing about a game we played, and the guy's saying, I scored two touchdowns,

a white boy was there, white boy, came here, tell him, you know. Right, right. So it was always an affectionate term. Yeah, yeah. So, again, we work in the Chicago, there's the high chaparral, the Chitland Sugar, the Cotton Club, the Burning Spear, guys and gal's lounge. Right.

In Boston, the Sugar Shack. in Detroit. That was when Motown was in Detroit. They had a place called the 20 grand were a gangster on that named Kbrecht, B.K. And all the Motown acts broke in their shows

at the 20 grand before they went on in Las Vegas, you know? Wow. The Club Harlem in Atlantic City, you'll love this. This was before they had gambling. On Kentucky Avenue,

the Club Harlem. Right. Most nightclubs in those days, you opened on a Monday, closed on a Saturday night. At the Club Harlem, you opened Saturday night, closed on the following Friday.

But your first show Saturday night was 10 o'clock at night. Your second show was 2 o'clock in the morning. Your third show was 6 a.m. They called it the breakfast show. And all the waiters and the waitresses and the bartenders, all the night people came to that show, and all the pimps brought their hose from Newark, from Bronx, Queens, Brooklyn, Manhattan.

They came down in Cadillacs and Rolls, voices, and they had what they called their barn. The hose were their barn. And they'd pay as much as three, four, five hundred. And they'd say they'd sit down front. Jeez. And they'd like to come in late so they could come in with the ladies behind them, you know. Oh, my God.

The show would open with Mamaloo Parks and her dancers, a heavyset black woman, with all these young kids dancing, get the show rocking. And it would be a male group, sons of Robinstone. Then it would be a female group, the quiet elegance. Then comedy. Yeah. And the headliner would either be Smokey Robinson and Natalie Cole, Gladys Knight and the Pips, the Dells, you know, whatever. Isn't it crazy that?

that at the time, there's no comedy clubs, right? Like, you have that era of live performing in all those kind of acts that you're mentioning, like 50 years later, the only ones that are really still touring and there's an audience for our comedians. Well, no, Smokey Ramerson's. Well, I mean, big music acts,

but like at that level, like, there's no going out to see that variety of stuff. It's just now it's... See, that's what... Prior. That's where... Yeah. That's where...

You know, everybody... It's a special time. And I'd be the only white guy. Yeah. And the MC, opening night, the MC'd say, Ladies and gentlemen, we got a comedy team here.

And the comedy team, first of all, he'd say, y'all ready for some comedy? You read to me? Yeah. He said, and we got a comedy team.

Somebody said, hey, funny. Man, I don't know if they're funny or not. I ain't seen him either. He'd be talking to you on. But he'd say, we got a comedy team here. And this team,

He kept saying team. This team came from Chicago, and it's the first time this team has ever been here. Please welcome the comedy team of Tim and Tom, and Tim would go out by himself. You see, we're really happy to be here. Yeah, we just came in the other day, and we've never been in pretty soon people saying,

we, we, I see, we, I see, and I would slowly come out stage left, and the spotlight would hit me, and I'm going up stage left, he's center stage, and I'm looking in the audience, and you hear, oh, oh, what do we got here? Look out. I'd get up a center stage and I finally worked my way over to him.

I'd say, he'd say, man, where you've been? I don't see any of my people out there. He'd look and he'd say, no, I don't think any of your people out there. I'd put my arm around and I'd say, well, he'd better be funny. He'd say, what do you mean we, white man? Boom, the roof would come off him. That is amazing. God.

So he split. So why did he split? We were open for Dala Reese at one time. and she and him got, you know, we were both married, Tim and I both married. She and him hooked up a little bit, and the next thing I know, he was out on the West Coast, staying in her Bel Air Hotel, about her home, you know, and he ended up leaving his wife, and then he told me, you know, he wanted to go on his own. Right, yeah.

And, you know, as it turned, I broke my heart at the time, but it turned out, we're still the best of friends today. Oh, yeah. I think the world of me. Everything I have, everything I own, everything I've got, Because I met Tim Reed. Yeah. And he feels the same way about me, you know. Did he continue performing?

Yeah. Tim later became Venus Flytrap on WKRP Cincinnati. He was on a show called Sister, Sister. Oh, right, right, right. Sister, he played the father. He was on a show called Simon and Simon. He's probably done more sitcoms and then he's actor out there. Yeah, he was so good.

Yeah, he's a director. He's a, and he's my brother. I mean, I love him to death. His children call me Uncle Tom. Ever since they were little kids, they call me Uncle Tom. Yeah, that's great. Tim and I wrote a book called Tim and Tom an American comedy in black and white. In 2005, we were touring around with the book.

And both had our separate careers, of course, but we went to Norfolk State College where he graduated. It's a historical black college. I'm at a buffet before we're going to go talk to the students. And I'm in line with seven black professors. We're getting our food. And Tori, Tim's daughter, hadn't seen me in a year. And she came in the back and she saw me and she started hollering, Uncle Tom.

Uncle Tom Uncle Tom These professors turn around And I said She's talking to me She's coming around She's coming around the pugging me

I said honey She's cool I never even thought about that So there must have been an adjustment When you decide That's now your dream I'm going to be a comedian And now

half of your being Has been cut off It was devastating Yeah God that must be scary It was like a broken marriage It was like everything that I put in six years into I knew was over. Now, I'm sitting in the bar with my buddies late at night,

and my ex-wife wanded me out of show business. She thought, this is great. He's going to finally get out of the business. Even though you found success? Yeah, well, Tim and Tom won't a great success. We did show. You got by. We just got by.

And sometimes it wasn't work for a while. And you're not around. Yeah, and all that stuff. So she thought I'm finally going to stay home and get a job in the factory. Yeah. I'm sitting in the bar one night with my buddies. and they're getting ready to close. They closed the bars at 2 o'clock in my neighborhood.

And I had two beers in front of me. In fact, there was shot glasses. If somebody's buying you another ear, they put a shot glass there upside down. So I had like two of them. But I'm sitting there. What am I going to do? I was real good at alternatives in my life.

I said, I'm either going to, I could find another black guy and do the same act. I could get a job and make my wife happy, get a job, and just give up this dream of mine. Or I could go alone and thought, I could go it alone. I sat there, and I said, yeah, I'm going to go it alone. I'm going to go it alone.

And I always set goals. I said, and I'm going to try to get to the Tonight Show. Because in those days, wherever you went in America, people say, what do you do for living? I'm a stand-up comedian. The next question out of their mouth was, oh, yeah, you've ever been on Johnny Carson? And Freddie Prince, who we had worked with many years, he went on the Tonight Show and one of the parents got a sitcom the next day. So I said, I'm going to get on the Tonight Show. I said at the bar.

And they're getting rid of the classroom. Where's this bar? Where are you now? Harvey in my hometown. Still there. Yeah. And I said, that's what I'm going to do. And I'm going to get to the Tonight Show.

But I remember a book I read by W. Clement Stone, positive mental attitude. It said, if you know what you want to do in life. And if it's a noble endeavor, search your life and see if there's anything in your life that can deter you from that noble achievement and get it out of your life. And I thought, what could stop me if I wanted to make it all the way to the tonight's I said, alcohol. I love drinking beer.

I love baking beer. I said, and you know, you can't have hangovers and go out on stages and write. So I took the two beers. I said, my buddy was just, he was ten and barry. He could walk it up. He said, two for the night. Tommy, I said, I quit. He said, two for the night.

I said, I said, I quit. I said, I quit. I said, no, I quit drinking. And he goes, yeah, right, I'll see you here tomorrow. And I never touch another drop. No. Yeah. And for years, I never, I went out after years and when I was doing it tonight.

Yeah. I went out and I had a couple of beers. I said, it's just not what I want to do anymore. Really? Did that bother Sinatra? Well, you know, once in a while I'd have a beer with him, but, you know, once in a while what I'd do, I'd get it, I'd say, I'd tell a waiter, when I say rum and coke, just put Coke in there. Uh-huh. And I'd have a stirr in there, you know, because Frank used to say, drink a real drink, you know, or something like that.

Because we stayed out till dawn. He never went to bed until the sun came up. Yeah, I wanted to ask you about that because that, I know that was, it almost seems like mythology, the stories of Sinatra at this point. And I got this, my daughter gave me this great book. Frank Sinatra has a cold. And it's like all this, it's like all these photos, great photos of that era when that article is coming out. Great story. But did he really not go to bed until the sun off every night?

Whether they were on the road or off the road. That was just his schedule. And they'd sleep till noon? He was nocturnal. He would catnap during the day, you know, sleep off and on. But he was nocturnally. And I don't know whether he got it from the big band era. I used to think that maybe, you know, I always, my brain works overtime,

but I think maybe he's afraid of the dark, maybe he's afraid of the night. Somebody he knew maybe died in their sleep or something. I don't know. But he was a night guy. So when you do the shows, you know, we're turning around the country. We were like Vegas. He'd hang out to like three, four in the morning, five in the morning. One of the nights, the hardest one of the nights I made him laugh so hard.

We'd just been doing one-nighters all over the country. We flew in the Las Vegas in his private jet, you know, and then you, We opened at the desert end, did two shows. Now, it's after the shows. It's 4 o'clock in the morning, 4.15. He's got four or five guys around, and I could see he's going in the second gear. And I was beat. I got up from the table, and he said, hey, where are you going?

I said, I'm going to bed. He said, what for? I said, I've got to get up early in the morning with a cemetery. I said, I got to get up early in the morning go to the cemetery and visit those guys. He said, what guys? I said, all the guys who die trying to stay with you every night. And he laughed, and he laughed, and he laughed. He said, go to bed.

But he made me tell that story. He said, tell them what you told me the other night. Oh, man. So you decide I'm going alone, no more alcohol, and you just start cobbling together and act? You just start? I had some things about going to Catholic school. You know, I had some things sometimes when I would emce something I could do a joke or two.

A couple of the Catholic charities, even though I was with Tim, I would emcee. And I had jokes about going to get. So I started putting the, as you know how it is. You put together one joke, and you put together two jokes, then three jokes. And before you know it, you got five minutes, you know. So when do you get on the Tonight Show? December, 1975, you know. 75.

Yeah. And you said you broke. Well, we broke with Tim about early 74. We had one more gig to do. So I broke with Tim, like early 74. So I'd been less than a year. That's quick. Well, I got to tell you, but then I come out here.

My wife, I told her, I'm just going to L.A. for a week. I figured I'll come out here, get on at the comedy store. I figured it was going to be a snap. Yeah. The little that I know. And there was no other clubs out here. There was no improvisation in those days. There was no other laugh factory, just the comedy store.

Right. And it was the hottest place in town, man. Every night somebody was getting discovered there. Wow. These were the shows that were talent coordinators. Johnny Carson, Mike Douglas, Merve Griffin, Dinah Shore, Midnight Special, Rock Concert, Soul Train, American Bandstand. They were all looking for.

And Canada had TV shows up there. They were sending their talent coordinators down there. to bring convenience up there. God. I get here. I never, I didn't have any more money left. I didn't have a place to stay. A girl that I had gotten a job singing one time said,

I'm going on the road, you can house it. I thought, and my neighbor at house sitting was going to burglarize the place if you're sitting on a house. I didn't know what house sitting was. But I stayed there for three weeks before she was on the road. She came back. She said, my boyfriend's very jealous. You can't stay here.

And in those three weeks, I was going to the comedy store and the hitchhiking. and have a car, begging to work for free every night. And I couldn't get on. And finally one night, Mitzie was going to see me. And she sat in the back. And when I got done, I did my five minute for her. And I came off and she said, well, you've got stage presence.

And I see that you've, you know, everybody, when they do Mitzie, they go, well, you know, they always have to do her voice. There's two people in comedy, wherever they are, wherever you talk about them, you do their voice. Jay Leno and Mitzie. Right. And they both have the same kind of voice. Right. You know what I mean? Hey Tommy, how you doing?

They're pretty close. Hey, big guy. Jay never calls me Tommy. Hey, big guy. But anyhow. So she liked you right away. And she said, you know, we'll find a spot for you. And then I said, you know, I emcee sometimes.

And I'd gladly do that because no one of you emcee, you're still getting stage time. Yeah. She said, that's an idea. She was always looking for the, so I started working my way into the system. Meantime, my wife writes me a dear John. No. Yeah. She writes to the, she knew the house I was staying at.

She said, this is your dream, not mine, and blah, blah, blah. Ooh. I get thrown out of the house sitting thing. I end up sleeping in an old car. There was a Nash Rambler in the back up that was up on blocks. It was, the front seat came down. You know, that's another story. I had to argue with my friend's boyfriend, you know, Pat, the girl, was a great girl,

but her boyfriend was insanely jealous, and he thought we were having an affair, and we were not, you know. But anyhow. So, but I finally get on at the comedy store, work my way into the system. them. Finally, I'm doing real well now. They booked me in Canada on that TV show, the Tommy Bank show. Then they were going to fly me back to LA. I said, fly me in in Chicago. I opened for Fats Domino, Mr. Kelly's. I worked my way in there. I had worked there with Tim many years. And I convinced my wife and kids had come back with me. Not my kids. My kids wanted to go with dad, you know. Yeah. But I convinced her to come back. And so she came back. And she did.

And we ended up having a home, the pool, the dog, the car. At one time, we never, we never, ever had a car now we had several times and did you move them out here yeah out here sherman oaks right and then finally after all the kids were grown we were married about 26 years she wanted to divorce and i did too you know it was it was time yeah yeah 26 years yeah geez so you got together this i mean that's a quick run before you're on the tonight show yeah from when you're sitting in the bar and saying yeah this is my goal i'm going to go make this happen but i worked on it Tommy i worked on material I was constant state of writing new material. Yeah.

You know. And what was that first time like? The time show, tonight show. I've been bugging Craig Tennis, the talent coordinator of the Tentai Show, to come and see me. I was doing all kinds of tricks that get him to come and see him. I finally got him to come and see me. He was looking at three acts that night. Baum and Esten was Bruce Baum, who later became Bruce Baby Baum.

He had a comedy team, Larry Esten, who later wrote for Chubboh. years. So he was looking at Baumanness, then me and a new kid named Billy Crystal, you know. So I don't know what ever happened to Billy. I wonder what he's doing now. Heard him. But anyhow, here's the thing. It's a Tuesday night and I pull up in front. I'm real concerned that, you know, a Tuesday night, I hope they have more than 10 or 12 people because, you know, as a comedian, the more people, the more we're going to score. Sure. A better chance to score. I pull up in front and look who's out in front is about 110 people, packed out in front. I said, oh, wow. What I didn't realize, Billy Crystal was with Rollins and Jaffe,

a management firm. They brought all these people. There was Carl Reiner, Mal Brooks, some of the biggest name, every coordinator from every show, talent coordinators, casting people. I'm thinking, wow, man, they kept them outside, wouldn't let them come in until Billy was going on. Oh, no. But it's a smart move. If I was a manager, I'm not going to bring all those people in for Tom Driesen. I don't know. We don't handle Tom Dresen. You know. Yeah. So they kept them outside.

And I had to go on in front of 12 people. But I scored. I did a good set. When I came off, Craig Tennis said, I like what you did. Come to my office tomorrow morning and we'll talk. I get there the next morning. He said, okay, you did 20 minutes. Show me the five that you would do.

Uh-huh. I stood in front of him and said, I'd do this. He said, don't do that one. Take that. I'll put another. And pretty soon he said, okay. God. He said, you're on next Tuesday.

What? A week later. He said, you'll be on next Sunday. Now I tell the world. I'm on the tonight show. I get there in makeup. Take me up to my dressing room. Bring me down to the green room.

Man, they come in and they said, we ran out of time. You'll have to come back next week. They did that three weeks in a row. They bumped me each week. Come back. I get there the fourth week. I'm in makeup.

Fred de Cordova comes in. He said, I got bad news for you. I said, what? He said, you're going on tonight. Now you get a lump in your throat about the sides of this wine bottle, right? Carol Burnett's on the show that night. Oh. They come and get me, Bert Convey's singing a song.

They come and get me in. He puts me behind that curtain and Craig Tennis said, are you okay? I said, yeah, I'm fine. He goes away and I'm going, what's my first joke? I forgot my first joke. Now, all of a sudden, the lights, you know, the curtains start. All the lights come on to curtain. Yeah.

And you say, we're out of commercial. Doc Severnson's playing, right? Yeah. And Johnny says, we're back now. And I'm glad you're in such a good mood tonight because my next guest is making his first appearance on the tonight show. That one line, I'm glad you're in such a good mood tonight. Yeah.

What a beautiful thing for you. him to say he never does it again only at the person they open up that curtain and you walk out and then bright lights i can't see the audience and i hit your market well you know you hit that mark i can't see and they're still applauding you go i get the first joke out and it gets a laugh that second joke it gets a laugh third joke gets a laugh now i hear johnny and ed mcmann laughing behind me now i'm on a roll i get applause i end up getting eight applause i finished with i said you this is you've been a marvelous audience this is my first appearance on the tonight show and show business a tough life. So if you like me tonight, just if you like me, and you're Protestant, say a

prayer. If you're Catholic, light a candle. If you're Jewish, somebody in your family owns a nightclub. Tell them about me. I go through the curtain. Craig comes running around. He said, go back, go back. I said, go back and talk to Johnny. No, don't go talk to Johnny. Just go back. Johnny was calling me out for another bow. So I went back out. He goes like this, you know, that little circle thing used to. And I never stopped working from that night on. Oh my God. I never stopped working in show business from that night on. Sammy Davis Jr. saw me took me on the road. I never stopped working. That's insane. I mean, the, the landscape, the power of that is, it's insane. Like the entire country. Not only people that could hire you, but the entire country knew. Well, in those days,

26 and a half million people watch it tonight show. Yeah. 26 and the next day. There Happy now if a million people watch the Tonight Show. 26 and a half million people. That show could launch you. Again, Freddie Prince got a sitcom the next day. CBS signed me to a development deal the following day. A guy named Lee Curlin was watching the Tonight Show in New York. Yeah.

The guy on CBS. Next day he called William Morris, and he talked to a girl named Nancy Dockery. He knew it. Nancy Doherty. He knew her. And he said, there was a comedian on the Tonight Show last night. I wonder if, and she said, do you know his name? No.

He said, no. But I wonder if you were handling him. She said, let me check. I'll call you back. She calls this agent, Herb Karp, who I played softball with. I knew him. William Morris didn't want me. I couldn't, they wouldn't let me walk by William Morris, let him sign me.

So she says, there's a comedian on a tonight show. He said, oh, a friend of mine, Tom Drieson. She said, do we have him signed? Because she had said to Lee Curlin, you liked him a lot? He said, I liked him a lot. She said, like, deal? He said, yeah, I'd make a deal. So she tells her, sign him right away.

We've got a deal waiting for him. Shee. Herb being a good guy, not like most William Morris agents. Right. But I always say William Morris agents have two hearts. One's as big as a P, and the other one's just a little bitty one. But anyhow, Herb calls me. He said, Tom, I'm not going to lie yet.

We've got a deal waiting for you. You know, you don't have to sign with this. You can go and say, I said, Herb, I'd love for you to be my, will you be my agent? You know, long story short, I get signed with William Morris. And they signed me. Now, I had my wife and kids out here, living in Van Nuys. Yeah. The rent was $225 a month.

month and I couldn't sometimes couldn't get the rent money that day the next day CBS I gave me a check for $10,000 and gave me $1,000 a month for a year as a development deal of holding year that meant my groceries my rent every god I could focus on this comedy career now how relieved was your wife oh I mean you know to tell her don't worry about the rent for the rest of the year by the way don't worry about groceries for the rest of the year yeah you know in those days god 1850 dollars a month was a groceries are like 40 bucks a week. God. Did you move immediately?

No, we stayed in the apartment for a little while, and then I ended up buying a home in Sherman Oaks and all that, you know. Oh, man. What an amazing turnaround, you know. Amazing, amazing. Yeah. It really is like the power, you know, you talk, a lot of people now talk about visualizing, you know,

and all these different things. But there really is a power to this story of just that you saw it. And you weren't going to stop. Well, by the way, I read many books on this. I give motivation talks now to high schools, colleges, to corporate America on four subjects, perception, visualization, self-talk, and develop a sense of humor. And I elaborate on those four points for corporate America. For comedians, when I give a talk like that, I've done it in Chicago, in Philadelphia,

in New York. I call it the joy of stand-up comedy in how to get there. But one of the books that totally changed my life around was a book by Joseph Murphy called The Power of Your Subconscious. mind. Whatever the mind can see and believe it will achieve. It was written thousands of years ago. It's biblical in nature. But there was a science in it. How the subconscious mind works. It doesn't work. Subconscious mind works off of images. You know, when you say, what was his name? Talk about it. What was his name? Two days later you see at Starbucks, give me a couple of Tompapa.

Where did that come from? Once you gave your subconscious mind an image and an emotion, it puts all those cells in the action. What was his name? What was name? So the subconscious mind, again, doesn't know the difference between truth or fiction. He only knows what you program into it. And the way you're hypnotized, they put your conscious mind to sleep to rest. And when your conscious mind is at rest, your subconscious mind is open the suggestion. And then they tell you hop like a rabbit and you hop like a rabbit. Right. So the book teaches just before you go to sleep at night. And just when you first wake up in the morning is when your conscious mind is most at rest. See the end result. See the end result. you want see it feel it and believe it see it feel it and believe it i when i was sleeping in the car

and couldn't get on at the comedy store i used to envision johnny carson talking to me saying you're a funny guy tom dreason you're a funny guy knowing if i was sitting next to johnny i'd already succeeded over there because in those days you had to do three or four shots before johnny let you come and sit down he wanted to know you had stained problem you know right i would see it feel it and believe it today when i give motivation talks, the comedians, I hold up this 8x10 glossy photo of Johnny Carson laughing at me. I say, this is the picture that I imaged in my mind when I was sleeping in the abandoned car, when I couldn't get on at the comedy store. You see, this is the vehicle you're given.

You need to file a flight plan. The pilot who lands at 747 every day, leaves L.A. and goes to Boston. He doesn't drive to the airport, 120 miles an hour, go out to the tarmac, slam on the brakes, run aboard the aircraft, take off down the runway and say, now where I'm going? Where am I going? he files a flight plan. You have to file a flight plan. And that's what I learned from those books, you know.

Yeah. Let me ask you this question. That's kind of a deep question, but you were saying before that you pray all the time. And is there a difference between praying to a God for forgiveness or for blessings or for whatever? and this visualization for your subconscious. They work together.

One is, what's the oldest cliche in any religion? The Lord helps those who help themselves. You know, you remember the old joke where the guy, the guy's, the lottery is now $45 million, and he says, oh, please, God, let me win the lottery, you know, and then it doesn't win the next week. So please, God, God, now it's $500,000, please, God, let me win the lottery. And from heaven, he hears, Larry, do me a favor, buy a ticket.

Okay. So if you're not going to, so that they work hand in hand. You have to do the work. You know, I'd see it, feeling, believe it, but now I knew that this is what I wanted. But all the energies, you know, the strangest thing, sometimes it takes months, sometimes years. Yeah. Sometimes 10, 15 years ago when you realize something. I'm going to tell you a true story. It's in my book. Cheap plug. Still standing. Still standing. What's the subtitle of it? My journey from streets and saloons to the stage and Sinatra. And talk about it in my book, when I was a little boy, you know, selling newspapers on the corner. And Harvey, Illinois, 155th Street had a post office on one side of the street, the Alks Club on the other side of street. I sold newspapers on the corner. One day, and when I was selling these newspapers, horns were blowing all over the place. This is October, 1948. I'm 10 years old.

Horns are blowing all over the place. You know, cars are, and I ask one of the elders what's going on. They said, Tom, it's Lubidro day. I said, Lou Badrow. He said, Tom, Lubidro grew up here in Harvey. He went to the high school. They took the basketball team to the state championship three years in a row.

He went to the University of Illinois. He's kept on the basketball team. He's a baseball player. He went to the Cleveland Indians. And he became a shortstop. And at age 24, he managed the Cleveland Indians and played shortstop. The youngest player manager in baseball.

And they won the World Series. They beat Boston in the World Series. Lou Badrow. I said, he's from Harvey Tom. That was Lou Badrow Day in Harvey. So the horns were blowing him. And he was going to go down to the house club and come out and get in the car to convertible.

The crowds are going to follow them down to Thornton High School Field and sign autographs. I quick sold all my newspapers. My dad never owned a car. Thank God he had to run people over, you know. I sold all my newspapers, and I get down to the Elks Club, where I sold newspapers, and I waited. Lubidro came out with these other baseball players and some celebrities,

and he settled out of the crowd, and people were cheering, and he gets in the convertible and takes off, and as a little boy, I'm going home. This is a true story, like little boys do. I said, wow, somebody from Harvey, Illinois is famous. And I'm thinking, one day, and we have a parade for me, and I'm picturing the cars and the horns blowing and all that. August 22nd, 1992, I went back to Harvey, Illinois,

and 155th Street, they named that Dresen Street. And the guy who introduced me to the crowd was Lubidro. No. That's the God's honest truth. That's in my book. Now, you might go, ooh, but you know, when I thought about it, as a little boy, I emblazing the world. I emblazoned that in my mind.

There are hundreds of stories like that. Whatever the mind can see and believe it will achieve. Yeah. No, it is amazing. And I have a lot of that in my own life. But I always wrestle with the concept of or even if there is a difference between your subconscious and what you're dreaming up and what you're visualizing and making happen. And then there's this tilt into talking to.

talking to God. They're very similar. They're very close. You're kind of doing the same thing. But there's a slight difference. Joseph Murphy explains it in the book that your subconscious is connected to. That's through that channel,

through the subconscious mind. And, you know, when I was a little boy, I went to Catholic school. You know, again, my parents were drinking, my mom worked in a bar. My dad was a nice guy, but he wasn't a dad to me. He didn't take me fishing hunting.

I didn't feel bad because he didn't do the other kids either. But when I went, the nuns told me as a little boy, you have a father in heaven. I'm six years old. Yeah. A father in heaven. Wow. And his son came here to tell you about it. And they taught us the prayer, our father, who are in heaven.

Now, as a little boy, whenever I had a problem, I would pray to this father that I had in heaven because I didn't have one. Like I say, he was a good guy. but so and I know it's to people who are not of faith it's always like you know you're some kind of a nutcase yeah I remember even saying that you have to have the faith the size of a if you have the faith the size of a mustard seed things will happen in my whole life I've had hardships I've been knocked down I mean I'm physically knocked down you know but when I when I when I'm you know the old saying is when I got knocked to my knees I was in position the prey, you know. Right, right. And it works for me. Yeah, yeah. And now there's a power to it. There

absolutely is a power to it. And, you know, who knows what we're tapping into? All right, let's talk about another God. You're going, you're doing, you're doing stand-up forever. Not forever, but you're working now, your Tonight Show regular, you're cruising along, and you run into Frank Sinatra. Who, by the way, I was saying to my daughter when she gave me that book from Christmas, I said, I don't think there's a day that goes by that I don't listen to some Sinatra. There's always Sinatra. I mean, it's such, it's woven into the culture in such a deep, profound way. How do you first run into him?

Being glib at the right time. When I was a kid, I was a big Sinatra fan. When I was shining shoes in all the bars, Frank was on the jukebox. You know, I was in the boy, he was on all the jukebox. I'm shining shoes. Yeah. You know, that's thus the title of my book, you know, from streets, in saloons to the stage in Sinatra.

When I came out of service, I'm a bartender. You know, he's come fly with me, let's fly away. And my buddies would say, man, what would that be like? Can you imagine that flying with Frank Sinatra and Dean Martin and Sammy Davis? You know, I wasn't in show business at the time. And years later, I'm flying in this private jet room. Frank saying, good show tonight, Tommy. I'm going to wow.

This is so surreal, you know. Yeah. But what happened, I've toured with Sammy Davis for years. I was doing the Dean Martin Rost and everything and doing a lot of television. and I'm touring with Smokey Robinson and we're at Caesars in Lake Tahoe and Frank Sinatra's appearing next door at Harris. And the whole week that I'm working there,

I could have went any night why I went this night, I don't know, but I called the matriety over to Harris because they knew me over there. I'd perform there. I said, I want to come over here. Tommy, we'll take care of you. I finished my show and I bolted out the side door.

I didn't even change out of my stage clothes because his opening act, his daughter Natchie at the time, was still, so I rushed, and I'm running through the casino because I didn't want to miss Frank Frank's opening. I saw Frankson not to perform twice in arenas. He created more excitement walking to the microphone than most people do with their whole act. When this guy walked out, whoa, man,

the crowd would go crazy, you know. So I didn't want to miss that opening. I'm running into the showroom. The vice president of Harris Hotel, a man named Holmes Hendrickson, is out in front of the showroom with a heavy sit guy with a cigar and they're talking. I'm bolting by Holmes Henderson saw me. He said, Tommy, Tommy, Tommy, come here. And I reluctantly, he went over because I didn't want to miss that opening. He said, Tommy, this is Mickey Rudin. Well, I recognize the name. That was Frank Sinatra's lawyer. Powerful guy in our business. He said, Mickey, this is Tom's recent. And I think Tom would make a great opening act for Frank Sinatra. And the lawyer rolled his eyes like he'd heard this a million times. He had a pained expression. But he winked at the vice president. He looked

at me. He said, hey, kid, if I gave you a week with Frank, would you want more than a 50,000? I said, Mr. Rudin, put it this way. If you gave me a week with Frank, would you want more than 50,000? He said, oh, he said, I like this kid. He laughed, you know. A week later, they call me. Would you like to do one week with Frank at the Golden Nugget in Atlantic City? What year is this time?

This is 1982. 82. So he said, we like to do it. And I thought, wow, I'll go to, and I'll work with him one week. And then I'll try to get a picture taken with him and hang it in every bar back in Chicago, especially where I grew up at it. The second night I'm with him, he takes him out to dinner, him and his wife Barbara, after the show.

And I can remember like it was yesterday He's eating We're sitting just like this He sits his knife and his fork down He said I like your material And I like your style I'd like you to do a few other dates

With me if you're interested And I didn't say let me check my calendar Yeah I said yeah And it turned into 14 years 45 50 cities a year Working arena's 20,000 Cedar arenas 40,000 in Hawaii

A friendship That I'll always treasure I was a pallbear at his funeral And I spoke at his funeral And I miss him every day in my life God. How, I don't even know where to start. When you're around people like that,

you, uh, when you, when you know how lucky you are, you start to absorb things like a sponge, right? You just, you're not learning just from the performer. You're learning from being around, being backstage, watching them in. I mean, 82s, right? So from the, from the beginning, what was the, what was the show biz, uh, thing that you, if there is a single thing. What was like the show biz,

him carrying, going, showing up at the venues, putting on the shows, getting off, getting ready for the next show. Everything with him is the show is the most important thing.

You want to party? He'll hang out with you all night long. You want to sit on whatever you want to do, but not showtime. Never. In the history of Frank Sinatra, it's something you won't believe. This is arguably the greatest career

show business ever known. Forget about the fact that he was the greatest pop singer of all time. Forget about that. This guy danced with Gene Kelly in movies. He won the Academy Award. Never took an acting lesson.

One night I was sitting, I was sitting at Frank's compound. I'd stay at this house six times a year. That's another story. I used to ride around in a desert until the sun came up, you know, him and I just alone in a car. Yeah. But sitting around, all the women had gone to bed. It's Clint Eastwood.

It's Gregory Peck. It's Kirk Douglas. It's Robert Wagner. It's Jack Lemon. All these people I saw in the movies when I was a little boy. But they're sitting there, and they're talking film, and they're talking, directing, and all. And I'm noticing that they're paying great tribute to Frank, you know, and finally, I was just curious, because, you know, in Hollywood, we say, who'd you study with? You know, I studied acting in Chicago and out here, but people like that drop names, Stella Adler, or, you know.

Yeah. And, you know, I was curious. I said, Frank, did you study acting, and Gregory Peck grabbed my arm? He said, acting lessons would have ruined him. He was a diamond in the rough you didn't fool with. Wow. So that's why when you gave Frank a song to him, it was a script. What did the writer feel?

The night the writer took pen and hand. He'd immerse himself in that lyric and become that lonely guy in a bar whose woman left him. And he's never going to find love again. And you felt that. Yeah. You felt that. Big time. But to him, whatever you want to do, but showtime, I'm only digress.

The greatest entertainer of all time, never, ever, ever late, ever late. The one thing you had to learn if you're going to tour it, Frank Sinatra that if he told you wheels up at nine o'clock and you showed up at nine o one you're gonna watch that plane going down the runway I'm not making this up you know show time you know you know always on time you're right always you know you see these young artists today they're 35 minutes late yeah say to crowds for not Frank man and I had been in the military so I also was about punctuality yeah I experienced that that classic show biz with the respect for the show thing

when I worked with uh with Don Rickles and his manager, Tony, and, you know, they just, they came into just for Lafts festival in Montreal, which is, you know, a lot of younger comics doing whatever and it's kind of casual when they showed up, and it wasn't a large number of people, but when they showed up and it was, it was clear the halls, this is our time to work, this is our place to work, and the atmosphere changed instantly. I was like, this, they have, and that's the little thing I came away, who was just what you're saying, the respect for the show.

Frank, you know, I've said to him one time, you know, every act I worked with, when I worked with Sammy Davis, it's his show. Yeah. I'd say, how do you want me to dress? He said, Tommy, I feel we should dress at least as good as those who came to see us.

That's why even at the laugh factory, I don't overdress, but I'll dress at least as good as those who came to see us. Right. When I said to Frank, I said, why do we wear tuxitos? He went, you always wore a tuxedo. He said, Tommy, if we were going to do a show for the king and the queen,

a command performance. Would we wear a tuxedo? I said, well, yeah. He said, well, that garage mechanic in Detroit and his waitress wife who worked all year long to afford two tickets to our show. There are just as much royalty

as a king and a queen, and they deserve just as much respect as a king and a queen. And I never forgot that. But again, that's the way he approached him. Yeah. Yeah. What was it about him

in the arc of his career when he went from, I know it's been written about a lot, but just to get a vibe from you, you know, when he starts out as like this pop star, this young guy, but then when he returns, after his kind of fade, it fades and comes back, he does have that saloon thing, that depth to it,

that was that, in your opinion, was that the just age and him kind of owning who he was? Or had he gone through things and changed? First of all, he retired, you know. He retired, and then he came back. You know, the main event, Howard Coznell, you know, at the Madison Square Garden, you know. But I think he had time to reflect. He had some, I think, nodules taken out of his throat of somebody, he had time to reflect.

But his approach, again, it's so hard to describe his approach to lyrics. Yeah. You know, Steve Allen, who's a, not Steve Allen, Steve Lawrence, who's a great singer, wonderful guy going to problems right now. Steve Lawrence, one of the great singers of our time. One night we're having dinner, and he said to Frank, you know, you ruined it for all the rest of us. This great singer, he said, because once they heard you sing it, they know how it's supposed to be something. You know, he had a sadness about him sometimes. And he had, you know, he'd gone through a terrible love affair with Ava Gardner.

And if you go listen to a song called I'm a fool to want you, he went back in and re-recorded that song after she left him. He was crushed. It was absolutely crushed. I'm a fool to want you. Pity me, I need you. Those lyrics. And you felt it. Yeah.

You know, he, he, he was, he always gave great respect to the writer. Every song he introduced, he wrote it. Right. Yeah. Yeah. One time I was in. That'd be cool because you're, the way you work is very, the words mean something are very important to you.

You don't, you don't waste a lot of, you're not frivolous on stuff. stage, you have a very poetic kind of compactness to your jokes. I appreciate that. I have to tell you, I took with Sammy. I sat in the wings every night and watched Sammy Davis Jr. I toured with him for three years. I toured with Frank Sinatra, 14 years. I sat, watched them night for night.

Yeah. When they hit that stage, they took a man. They took, oh, this is our stage. The first time I work with Sammy Davis at Caesar's Palace, I never worked in Las Vegas before. He takes me in the Vegas, touring around the country, he takes me in the Vegas, Caesar's Palace, opening night. They had rehearsal on everything. You know, we do.

We do sound check. But I, I, everybody went to the dressing room. I mean, there's no one in the theater. Two hours before the show, I walk out on stage. I just want to familiarize myself with this big stage, you know. And Sammy saw me in his restaurant, and came out and he said, you nervous a little bit, baby. I was going to be busy.

He was nervous a little bit baby. I said, wow, it's opening night. I never worked Vegas before. I'm opening for you. My name's on a marquee that he made sure. They put my name in a marquee. He said, Tommy, see these boards. the boards on the stage.

He said, you earned every single one of these boards. These boards, you earned the right to be here. This is our stage. If they could do what we do, they'd be up here. They can't do what we do. That's why they're out there. And also, and I teach young comedians this all the time, when you walk out on a stage, even it's foreign to you,

if you were home, Tom, and your wife said, Tommy, we got 25 people in the living room. I don't have dinner ready yet. Tommy, go tell them some of those funny stories that you tell. And you walked out and you're living in a little while, but I got to tell you, I'm at Galsons yesterday. I run into this, Tom, and you're doing funny stuff. I said, it's a convert. I tell the young comedians, it's a conversation, not a presentation.

Right. Is it your act? You damn right, it's your act. It's your job to make it look like it's not an act. That's right. You tear down that fourth wall. Yeah, and so that's, every time I walk out on stage in those days and not even now, this is my house. Oh, look who's in my house.

Right. See, what intimidates young comedians and myself included when I was new, Yeah. We keep thinking those people that they own that place, that when we're invading their territory, once I started getting the mind frame that, oh, no, no, this is my house. Right. And you're in my house. And then it's a conversation, not a presentation.

And I'll tell you what helped me with that. Years ago, I'm watching Robert Klein. I was new in the business, about five months in the business. I'm in Chicago, and he's at a place called a quiet night. And I'm a paraphrase, but basically I'm waiting from, he comes on stage. He said, I'm on my way over here. I'm coming between two-par cars. I got to tell you, you know the street.

And he said, and this guy pulls out. And I'm saying, geez, he's ad-libbing. The whole show, he ad-libbed that whole show. It was amazing. I go to the second show. He gets on the stage. He said, you know, I'm on my way over. I'm coming between these.

I went, it was just act. Holy cow. You know, what a lesson. It's a conversation. I've literally been going through that recently where I realize a great place to put your new stuff is in the beginning. right in the fat beginning, because they think you're just ad-living.

They think you're just getting to know and you're sneaking in all this material and doesn't have that thing that it will later of, oh, now it's an act, you know? You know, whatever works for you. Just drip it in. Woody Allen used to say, you're going to break in new material,

breaking your new material on a Saturday night in the hottest crowd in the middle. He said, so you're giving it a good chance. He said, you're doing it on a Monday night in front of 12 people? He said, do your strong stuff. stuff and in the middle put in that new material, then close you. He said, at least you're giving it a chance.

Yeah. Because, you know, I've written stuff that it said, well, that didn't work. But later on it did work. Yeah. It just wasn't the right night for it or the right placement for it. Yeah. You still enjoy the writing? No.

No? No. The best question I was ever asked, and I've done 10,000 of these interviews, but that's an exaggeration. I've done 20,000. But the guy said to me one time, are you a comedian who's a writer? Are you a writer who's a comedian? I said, well, that's a good question.

Because I'm a comedian who's a writer. Because I love stand-up comedy. I don't love writing. It's necessity. I can write. Yeah. But you know what I used to do? I used to put a gun to my head.

Necessity is the mother of invention. I read that years ago. Necessity is the mother of invention. I want to do another. I did 61 appearances on the night show, but it would be like my 25th appearance on the central show. I got to come up with a new six minutes. Yeah.

What I would do, I would call the Tonight Show. In those days, I had. had carte blanche, you know, and that's auditioned for anybody by that time. They knew I could deliver. I'd call Craig Tennis and say, I'm available March 18th or whatever it is. And that's four weeks away. I said, okay, you're on, Tommy, and I didn't have the first joke written. Now, Manick set in. Yeah. I'm going to the comedy, so I'm going to the improv. And everything you said, let me write that down there. And I would come up with a second of routine. Sometimes when I look back when they show those reruns.

I cringe. Really? Oh, I cringe. I say, geez, that's a dumb joke. You know, but my life. Tell me about your, tell me about your relationship with Letterman. When did you guys,

was it the comedy story you mean? Yeah, he first came out in an old red pickup truck. I had already been doing stuff at a comedy store, and I came off stage one night, and he said, Mr. Jason, I really enjoyed you. Material. You know, he's just kidding.

And me, I'm so extroverted. Yeah. I took it to him. I said, oh, what is your name? He said, Dave, well, you're from Indianapolis? I said, really? Now, I'm a sports nut. So I said, what Major League Baseball team did you for us?

Hope he's going to say the Cubs? But, you know, of course, he said, because he, Indianapolis, he likes, for some reason, Cincinnati. So we talked about that. Now, every time I saw him, I took it to him, hey, Dave, how are you doing? Had I realized a shy, reclusive guy he was, I probably would have respected that and left him alone. But by the time I realized that we were friends, we were playing. playing racquetball together, playing basketball together. And I liked him.

He was totally not like anybody that I grew up with because I grew up on the streets. Right, right. He was an intelligent guy and also not confident in himself. Always thought it wasn't going to work or something like that. Right. I got to tell you a funny story. I've told this a few times, but he said to me back about six months ago, we were talking.

He said, you know, every time you do an interview, where I do an interview, they said, how did we meet? We always tell the same story. You came offstage at a comedy store. I was there. I complimented. I said, yeah. He said, well, it's a boring story.

I said, maybe boring, but it's true. I don't care it's boring. From now on, tell people that you came offstage. I stole some material from you in the park. You were in the parking lot, and you beat the shit out of me. I said, now, why would I tell? He said, because it's a better story. He's right.

Now, two weeks go by, he calls me. He said, do you know the governor of Illinois? I said, I met him, but I don't know him. He said, because there was a plot of land in Illinois that his wife had a good friend who had an adult son who had autism. And these autistic adults were planting corn, beans, flour, tomatoes, you know, I mean, flowers, you know, corn bean tomatoes. And when it came into fruition, they would give it to the homeless. And somehow the state was taking that property away. He said, I want to call the governor, try to stop that law from being passed.

I said, I know the Senate Majority Leader, a guy named John Collerton, he's a friend of mine. I'll call him. I called him. I said, John, blah, blah, blah. I told him, he said, oh, tell Dave, don't worry about that. We're taking care of that. That's going to be that. I said, would you do me a favor?

Because you know the statute. You're telling him, could I give Dave your phone number? And you explain it to him. I said, oh, John, John's a great guy. I said, John, when you tell him you helped him, tell him the reason you helped him is because Driesen beat the shit out of him in the parking lot at the comedy store. He said, okay, now, I wait. 10 minutes go, and my phone's ringing.

I knew it's Dave. I go, hello. He said, didn't I tell you that's a better story? I told you that's a better story. That's great. Dave Letterman was never, he never liked stand-up comedy. He did it, but he didn't like it. And you'll note that all the years he was on TV,

he never went and did like Jay, went to Vegas every weekend and all that. Constantly, yeah. He never, but I love to watch him work. I loved it, especially if he had a heckler. Yeah. But Letterman could cut you to ribbons, you know. Just that attitude.

Man, oh man. When, towards the end of touring with with Frank, tell me how it, how it wound down. Well, I told you, I stayed at his home six times a year. Yeah. I'd just hang out with him sometimes. Sometimes we do a show down there. Then he'd come and get me like in my bungalows sometimes,

he had on the outer perimeter of his compound for bungalows, New York, New York, strangers in a night, tender trap my way, named after a song. Nice. And, you know, he'd come and get me and we'd take a ride. We'd ride around until dawn. Wow. And when those are amazing times, Because at the end of his life, he got a little more melancholy.

And sometimes in the car, he wasn't Frank Sinatra, the singer, and I wasn't Tom Driesen, the comedian. I was a kid from Harvey, Illinois. He was a kid from Hoboken. Yeah. And we just talked about the neighborhood and growing up and saloons. Yeah. Because my mom was a bartender. His mom and dad had a saloon.

So we talked about that a lot. But he started to forget lyrics, you know. Yeah. You could see that it was time. But the other thing, too, is what's the thing, too, is what's the same. people didn't realize is it you know I'd see him before the show sometimes 20,000 people out there yeah now this guy is 77 78 you know uh and and you'd see him first of all when I in the big in Vegas when I finished the show or a casino when I walked off stage we crisscrossed I'd exit

stage right he'd enter stage right the band would keep playing and he'd get the center stage and he's Tommy come back and take another bow whatever is that's my man you know I'd take a half bow bow you know I'll wave him in the arenas they'd always take an intermission I I'd do like 35, 40 minutes. They'd take an intermission. Oh, wow. And then like a 15-minute admission. Now, at that time, Frank, usually if he had a guest or something,

he would have them before the show. He never, you know, because he wanted to be left alone. Now, I'd come off stage, talk to him a few minutes. I was a crowd, oh, great crowd, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay, and when you had to leave him alone, and then he had five or ten minutes ago, everybody left him alone. Sometimes he had pace. And I'd look at him, I'd say, this poor, oh, God, Jesus,

he should be home with his grandchildren. and then it's 20,000 people out to it. He felt the responsibility of that. He'd look kind of forlone. He'd get out to the orchestra set up, and the light would hit him. Boom. Come fly with me. You know, 20 years would fall off his face.

Yeah. And so he had, he had to, no, he had the teleprompter because he would forget lyrics every now and then. Yeah. But, you know, finally got the times where he'd have little lapses. Yeah. But I tell this story. You may have seen it on the Internet because what happened was I told it

on Kevin Neeland's show one time. Kevin puts on YouTube the greatest sonata story ever told. I cringe, I said, this ain't the greatest sonatra story. But it got a million and a half hits. 12 years go by. Andrew Schultz, the comedian.

He sees that little video. He says, wow, he puts it out and sends it to Joe Rogan. Joe Rogan says, effing, incredible story. It got another 2 million hits 10 years later. This is the story I'm going to tell you. He's like 79 years old.

And we're all wondering, when's you going to lay it down? When's you're going to lay it down? Because he's starting to forget lyrics and stuff. But he'd get through the night. We go to a place called the Mark Auditorium in the Quad Cities in Benton, Court, Iowa, Davenport, Iowa, Illinois. You know, two cities in Illinois. Moline, Illinois, you know. Anyhow.

So I go out in a great crowd, you know, huge arena. Great crowd. He comes out and he's killing him. He just going to three songs, just knocking them dead. He gets to the fourth song and he totally blanked on the lyrics. And the orchestra is in the pit down below. I look and he's going, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry. I went, whoa, whoa, this is it. Now, the orchestra, we're still playing, not realizing with him, they start winding their instruments down one at a time to an eerie silence in this huge arena. And now you hear him saying, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

Now, I'm staged left. I'm thinking, I'm going to say, let's go home, Mr. S. It's been a great career, but it's time to go home. Just as I think he's going to leave, a guy way up on top of the arena stands up, and he screams as loud as he can. That's all right, Frank. It's all right, Frank. Because we love you, Frank.

It's all right. We love you. And he started to applaud. And the guy next to him started to applaud. Pretty soon the people around applaud. Then 50, 100 people. now a thousand pretty soon the whole arena is applauding this guy and he looked like he was going to walk off the stage he had like a tear in his eye turned on looked like he looked like he said the microphone down and he went back to center stage and he stood there and they would not stop cheering

they kept cheering and cheering until i thought it would never end and finally they stopped he went into the next number come rain or come shine and never miss the lyrics i'm gonna love you like no buddy he'd love you come rain or come boom bang like he was a kid again When he got done, they stood and I thought it was never going to end again. Finally, they stopped. He's going to go on the next song and he goes, I love you too, pal. That guy doesn't know it. He brought him from the ashes that night.

Yeah. It was over. Frank sang about another year after that. Jeez. Amazing. Yeah. So where are you at now? I'm here talking to Tom Papa.

It's pretty great. It's all downhill from here, pal. It's pretty great. I'm on the happy. time of my life. I mean, I'm just, I love, I love comedy. I always say I love show business. I hate getting there. Yeah. It's the planes, the airport. Hey, you fly in Frank's private jet for 14 years. Oh my God. Squad cars and limousines picking me up. I mean, if time to go on the road, two big guys had come up in a limo, they'd carry my luggage down. They'd carry me down in the body. Drive you out

to the airport. You get out of the limo. They carry the luggage. You get on the jet. Frank puts his foot on the jet. The moment he put his foot on the jet, he'd say to the pilot, Johnny Spots was his name, he'd say, let's go with spots. We take off down and run. All that pre-flight stuff better be done. We pick off down the runway. We land squad cars and limousines rush us to the airport, rushes to the gig. We do the gig, squat cars and limousine rush us back to the jet. We're flying over the venue people aren't even their cars yet. We're on the next city. Now, you guys got any looking for a flight on Southwest? Oh, yeah. And it's the traveling, but I love making people laugh. Yeah.

I've got a 90-minute show called The Man Who Made Sinatra Laugh. It's stand-up comedy, but it's storytelling. Yeah. The theater, they're playing Sonatra music while people are filing in. And then when the people are seated in the showtime, there's a screen on the stage, and the lights go down, and Dennis Farine, God, rest of his soul, my friend narrates three minutes of my life. You know, my growing up in the comedy team, you know, the military, then comedy team, and then the tonight shows, and then the Sammy Davis.

the Dean Martin and to Frank, you know. Yeah. I come out and I do stand-up comedy. Right. And I do 25, 30 minutes, I get him rolling. And over on the stage right is a bar with a bottle of Jack Daniels, which was Frank's drink of choice sitting on the bar. I segue over to the bar and I tell a funny story at the bar.

And the audience is laughing. All the lights go out in the theater. And on the screen, Frank is singing to the, I'm a bartender. He's singing. It's quarter to three. There's no one in the place except you and me, you know, like he's singing to me. Yeah, nice. That's one for my baby.

When he gets to the chorus, make it. One for my baby and one more for the road. He goes off the screen and the spotlight hits me. And now I'm in a bar and I've come home. And I tell the audience the first time I heard that voice, I was 10 years old, shining shoes in the bar on the south side of Chicago, Harvey, Illinois. And he was on the jukebox. Then I take the audience from that little boy hearing Frank Sinatra and Harvey Illinois to one day

carrying his coffin out of a church in Beverly Hills, California. So I take them on the journey. Yeah, that's great. A lot of laughs. A lot of laughs, a lot of laughs. And then some real serious stuff. Yeah, that's great. the funeral, I have them in tears. Yeah.

I turn it around and I close with a very funny monologue. And then I get the Jack Daniels at the end at the monologue. And when I close, I say, I wish for all of you, what Frank Sinatra wish for you, the very last song that he ever sang on stage is that the best is yet to come. Good night, everybody. Nice. Frank is singing, the best is yet to come as people are leaving the theater.

Oh, that's great. This is amazing. See, it's nice going to the grocery store. Yeah. I love watching you work. You know, we work together a lot at the factory. Yeah, and Clint's stuff. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. I always like standing back and watching you work because you're a good stand-up, you know. Oh, thanks, man. That means a lot coming from you. And I'm glad we got to spend this time. This was really perfect. Oh, thank you so much. Yeah.

Well, I've watched your podcast, you know. Here's your bread. Take it home. I'm taking home. Eat it. It's not bread that will make you fat. I know you like to keep you. your girlish figure.

Yeah. Just toast and put some butter on it. It's not bread that don't make it. It won't make you. Then if I was you, I'd start selling this, folks. Tom Papa's bread. Thank you so much. Thank you all for listening.

We'll see you next time. We got it, Aaron.