Breaking Bread with Tom Papa - Episode 208 - Jimmy Carr

Episode Date: May 14, 2024

Jimmy Carr joins the table dressed to the nines and ready to talk all things comedy, parenting and his new special "Natural Born Killer" on Netflix now. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you to our sponsor Wild Grain! Any combination of breads, pastas and pastries shipped to you, plus $30 off the first box and free croissants when you go to https://www/wildgrain.com/papa. Thank you to our sponsor Nuts.com! Right now, Nuts.com is offering new customers a free gift with purchase and free shipping on orders of $29 or more at Nuts.com/PAPA. About Jimmy: Jimmy Carr is an award-winning comedian, writer and television host, famous for his dark humour and one-line jokes. You’ll think of him as either a politically incorrect equal opportunities offender or a fake-toothed donkey-laugh plastic-haired comedy mannequin. Either way he was scientifically proven to be the funniest comedian in the UK. About Tom: Tom Papa, a celebrated stand-up comedian with over 20 years in the industry, has made significant strides in film, television, radio, podcasts, and live performances. Notably, he's a regular on "The Joe Rogan Experience" and various late-night TV shows. Papa's literary skills are evident in his books “We’re All In This Together” and "You’re Doing Great!: And Other Reasons To Stay Alive," a collection of essays, and "Your Dad Stole My Rake: And Other Family Dilemmas," a comedic look at family life. His latest stand-up specials are “Tom Papa: What A Day!” and "Tom Papa: You’re Doing Great!" on Netflix. Beyond comedy, Papa's engagements extend to hosting "What A Joke With Papa And Fortune" on SiriusXM and appearing on NPR's "Wait, Wait Don’t Tell Me." His love for baking led to hosting the Food Network series "Baked." As an actor, he's worked with notable figures like Rob Zombie and Steven Soderbergh and has appeared in several films and TV shows, including the HBO film "Behind the Candelabra." Additionally, Papa has contributed as a writer to projects like "Bee Movie" and various TV series. Residing in Los Angeles with his family, Papa continues to balance his professional life with personal interests like baking. Jimmy Carr returns to Netflix with his latest stand-up special Jimmy Carr: Natural Born Killer out now. Jimmy’s brand-new international tour Jimmy Carr: Laughs Funny and his double headline show with Jim Jefferies, The Charm Offensive Tour are on sale now. For tickets and info visit jimmycarr.com. Website: https://www.jimmycarr.com Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@jimmycarr Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jimmycarr Threads: https://www.threads.net/@jimmycarr Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/jimmycarr Get in touch with or go see Tom live on stage! Radio, Podcasts and more: https://linktr.ee/tompapa/ Website - http://tompapa.com/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tompapa Twitter - https://www.twitter.com/tompapa Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/comediantompapa #TomPapa #breakingbreadwithTomPapa Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hey. Don't you know? Hey. It's also a show. Hey. Thanks for coming. I know this is a crazy week. There's so much going on.

I'm glad you snuck it in. It feels like the Netflix is a joke festival. Feels to me like summer camp for comedians. Yeah. We don't get to do this enough. And especially when you get to a certain level, and this is real first world problems. I'm sure lots of guys starting out in the clubs are watching this.

But when you get to a theater level, you're kind of isolated. Yeah. You're kind of hermetically sealed and you go out and you do your show and then to be around other people. I know. And it's my favorite line. Alan Havy gave it to me in comedy. We're out for ourselves but in it together. Wow.

There's a lovely camaraderie in comedy. There is. And you kind of bump with it. Like last night at the store. Yeah. It's like killers. Yeah, I know. Sebastian was on.

Martin Lawrence was on before me. I mean, it was insane. John Mullaney's doing pop-ups. But you, you, you, you're on. go, there's something about actors where they're so in competition with each other. Yeah. And with comedians, it's escape competition through authenticity. Yeah. So we're just ourselves, but through sort of finding your own voice, you kind of go, yeah, well, no one does this better than me. Yeah. I mean, you might not like this. Yeah. I'm doing it well. Yeah. I know whenever people

say, well, oh, you're in comedy, well, that's a competitive business. And yeah, like there's, in certain degrees, it's, you kind of competing just with the market. You're not, I'm not competing with you. But, but I think it's the wrong end of the telescope as well. Yeah. Everyone's always looking at, oh, this guy just sold out three nights of the Hollywood Bowl. And you go, yeah, but, but you make a living doing dick jokes. What? You don't have, you get up at noon. Yeah. What are you, you, you're comparing it to the wrong thing. We never kind of look back at the guys we started with and somehow it didn't work out. Somehow that didn't, it didn't fall right for them or they got distracted or something.

something else happened. Yeah, we were saying that we were at the comedy brunch where all the comedians from the festival get to go to Ted Sarandos for brunch. Yeah. And we both had that moment of how great that we're here. This is like, just a, just take this in. You've got Chappelle walking over there and you've got Leah and Morgan over there. And you've got all these great people, just Kevin Hart and eating with you.

And it's just like, waffles with... This is insane. Yeah, this is insane that we're all here. This is very special. Well, it feels like that thing with stand-up for me, matter how you feel about your career, how long are you, how long have you been in center? 30 years.

30 years, yeah. I'm not quite, maybe 25. Right. But it's that thing where you kind of go, I feel like we've ridden a wave. I don't think it's really, I don't think it's us. I think we came along at a very, like the gratitude to go,

a comedy's very new anyway. I mean, trace it back to, I think sort of the two John the Baptist are, Richard Pryor and George Carlin. I mean, you can trace it back further, obviously. Yeah. So many, you know, Maltzol and Louvreuse and all those guys. Mark Twain in a way.

Yeah, Mark Twain, toward, basically. Exactly. But the idea that you go, these guys kind of did what we did, traveled round, played rooms. Yeah. It feels like the growth in that. That didn't used to be an option. Going to comedy, when I was 20, wasn't really a thing.

Yeah. Yeah. No, it's very new. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about the state of comedy. because I've just got off my radio show for Netflix and I'm going through what's going on just tonight. Yeah, it's crazy.

It's insane. It's 50 shows, 10 of which are some of the biggest names in comedy. But I mean, you say comedy, but you go, expand that out. You go, I would, I go, I'll go toe to toe with a rock promoter and talk about who can fill an arena. Right. I think I can name more comedians that could fill arenas in, you know, around the world as well, you know, in Australia or in London, in New York, anywhere.

Yeah. I think there's more comics that could do it than rock bands now. And it's, it's a, it's a strange thing because it's the, it feels like it's the authenticity that's very attractive. Yeah. Of comics and you go, it's a very personal thing, your choice in comedy. Because you don't really choose your sense of humor. You know, what you find funny and you go, the people that really make you belly laugh. Right.

Right. And that thing of like going, buying, you buy the ticket. As soon as you have the ticket, it's already kind of giving you value because you're going, it's an intention to go and to laugh. And with you, like, all right, we're going to go and see this and we saw the last one. And it's, I was thinking the show is an advert for the next tour. Right. I know.

Yeah, when you come through again. You already bought the ticket. I know. It's really endless that way. Yeah. I know, exactly. But that thing of like, people want to come out and have a good time and feel that. Yeah.

It's kind of weird. I've said it before. Like, I see us as drug dealers. Right. You know, dopamine and serotonin. Yeah. And people come and we can kind of work the magic. Yeah.

And get. get them to get them in that kind of, it's almost like a fugue state of, like, and it's very performative being in the audience. Yeah. I think a lot of comics take that into consideration. I know. You know, the way that you direct them on, I was watching Sebastian last night, direct the crowd with these kind of, a sort of elaborate body movement.

Yeah. That's so perfect for this joke. Yeah. The facial expression. You know, it's just. I know. Do you think that it's how comedy is dispensed that is given at this moment, also the Netflix of it all.

I think YouTube was very interesting because YouTube was, YouTube's become the biggest television channel in the world. And it happened while NBC and ABC were fighting over Saturday night viewing figures. Right. And something over here just, yeah, the whole thing. And if you think about it, it's almost like a, used to be called TV schedules that would decide when things were on.

Yeah. And what would come after what. And now everyone is their own scheduler. Yeah. and they decide what they're going to watch. And we did great. Comics did great. In the mix of all the things,

comics did great. People like to laugh, it turns out. Yeah, music doesn't really translate the way that getting a comic on your phone does. Like, we're talking about the moment of where comedy's at, what we do and the way it's delivered is very unique.

This is a very special, like you're saying, like riding that wave. It's weird. I think the technology as well as it's a, it's a prop. So you watch something on Netflix or on YouTube and you know it's funny and you're on your own isolated, you know, on a bus, on a train, wherever you are watching it. And it's good and you enjoy it.

But you don't laugh in the same ways when you're in the room. There's something about the tribal coming together. It's kind of interesting how the technology is almost that. That feels like it's an advert for the live experience where people go, I'm into this, I like this. Almost in the same ways you used to buy a record and then you'd want to go and see them live. Now, the music was arguably better on the record. Right. But seeing them live was something about that.

You know, the technology does change, you know, it's the medium as the message. The technology always changes. Like with music, I feel bad for musicians now. I know. Because it used to be, you buy the album, read the sleeve notes, you know everything about it. Yeah. And I think it was, it's that thing, music is now like a scented candle. It's like you put on a playlist and it's just kind of in the background.

Yeah. And there's some music that, I mean, I really try and learn the name. to the bands and know what I'm listening and I listen to all new music. Yeah. But it's hard to keep up now because you don't have the physical thing. Yeah, I know. It's very much a, it's, do you think this fortunate moment is going to last? In comedy?

Yeah. I think it is only getting bigger. Yeah. It's only getting bigger and more people are doing it. And it's, I think there's like, there's a career path. There's a, you know, I'm working on a thing now where I'm writing with my friends, Amanda Baker who sort of directs my live shows and Abby Grant who writes with me and we're working on a book on how to teach comedy.

Oh really? How to write jokes and how to perform. It's kind of a, it's going to be a long process to get to. But I think that thing about more people entering into this, more people learning it. I mean, I know my daughter's in university and there's a major in comedy. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the issue is I think a lot of people don't know how to teach.

I've read all the books out there. There's a lot of stuff out there. That's kind of, you go, what do you, there's nothing in this. Yeah. So actually analyzing there's 50 joke types, you can all take and breaking those down and reverse engineering it and giving good examples and saying, right, this is how jokes are written. I think there's a bit too much. There isn't like the language like there is with music.

With music, they're set music. This is how music is written. Right. You could go to Nairobi or you can go to Tokyo and those guys can come together and they can play the same piece of music. It's beautiful. With comedy, we don't have that language. So maybe I'm trying to put something together that would maybe make it easier for people to make a start and go, well, I know there's something funny here.

How do I make this into jokes? Because it's often like the jokes are hidden. You know, with me, I'm a one-liner guy. Yeah. So everything's a fastball. So you can really see the setup and punch. Yeah. Quite old-fashioned in a way.

And there's something about when you watch you or you watch Malaney, there's something about that there's something about that, the jokes are in there and they're kind of hidden. So for the audience, it's easy. They kind of, they go on laughing every 30 seconds, but I don't see. I don't know why. Where's the punch. You know, it's so well kind of constructed. It's like, isn't it interesting?

And this has got to be an interesting thing when you're trying to put together a book of how to do it. Because I look at you and am mystified. I am, you're so good, you're so funny. But the construction of it is, so different from, like, I feel like I can, I can make a big giant tomato sauce and throw lots of stuff in it and just keep going and blah, blah, blah. And you're making this exquisite pastry that is just the amount of this and just the amount of that. And it's just, it seems to me, it seems to me from the outside. It seems like creating an hour of that seems so much harder

than what I do. But, but again, you know, that's a very flattering analogy in my favorite. The analogy in your favor is, I'm building with Lego bricks, you're carving something out of marble. So you're telling a story in a special and you're saying kind of where you are and giving this picture and sharing. Right. And taking people on an emotional journey. I'm working on that. You know, because I've got the fastball, so I'm working on the last special and like doing longer bits and being able to kind of perform in a slightly different way. You know, kind of working with the pace.

I noticed that with your special. which is called Dressed to Kill. Natural born killer, but so close. So close. I did that to him last night at the...

No, last night I said killing me softly. Yeah, natural born killer. But I did it with the previous one as well. I called the previous one his dark material. Yeah. So I'm just knocking S's off things.

Yeah. Seems to be... No, but in the specials great. They're all great. I'm a huge fan, as you know. And this is why I was actually when I was heading over here, I was like,

this is going to be one of my favorites. to sit down and spend time with because I've been such a fan of yours and we run into each other, but we never really have had a conversation of any length. No, because it is that thing about you're hermetically sealed when you start touring. Yeah. We're not in the clubs every night shooting the breeze because we're off doing shows. Amazing. It's really, it's really great.

But back to your special, you pull this kid out of the audience. Yeah. You don't pull them out. You're not doing tricks with them, but you're talking to him, and you're telling them pretty much how to be a man. It strikes me. That was born out of a conversation I had in COVID with a friend about, and, you know, when the whole me-to thing sort of happened. Yeah. And I felt like a lot of people on the, I suppose, broadly speaking, the left went, this stuff is obvious.

It's obvious what consent is. It's obvious. And you go, yeah, to you. Yeah. But if you haven't had the conversation and you're full of hormones and you're 17, who's having the conversation with these kids? kids. Right. Exactly. And to present it in a funny sort of way and go, well, what's the right thing? Yeah. Yeah. But I mean it's... And is that what you mean? Because you still had your jokes. Yeah. But it was in this broader conversation, a broader kind of, it was a little more thematic.

Yes. It was like that what you're saying when you're... Like a 12 minute chunk. Right. Is huge for me. Yeah. To do something that's on one subject. And obviously my love language is going to be jokes. Yeah. But there's longer kind of bits within that. Yeah. And also imparting something. I think the audience So they're very good at picking up on that is clearly a joke. And we're laughing at the wrong thing because we know what the right thing is. That's fine.

And then there's other stuff that's kind of, there you go, okay, no, he means this. That's, so I'm working on a couple of bits in the new show, in the show that I'm touring now, a couple of new bits that are interesting that are kind of doing the same thing.

Like going, okay, I'll tell the jokes to sweeten the pill. And then it's kind of, there's a little point there. And maybe that's, it might be a time of life thing. Might be kind of my 50s and kind of going, I could, you know, I feel like I could say something now and it's not ridiculous. You have a perspective now. Yeah.

Right? Don't you find that? Like now it's, I don't want to come off in my comedy as just do what I say. But I kind of know what I'm doing about life. Like there's a different perspective than when I first started. I think so, yeah. It's a weird thing. I've often sort of thought about comics that I really like, like Mark Maron and Louis

K were ridiculous when they were in their 20s. Right. Because there's always something about Mark Maron that was get off my lawn. Right. And there's something about Louis that's like it fits him being, oh. It's like somehow like he hit, I don't know, 45, 50 or whatever. And he just hit his scribe as this performer because everything just kind of fell into place. Yeah.

And it feels like that's good. That happens with a lot of, you know, changing the way that you perform. It's also that thing of like development in comedy. Yeah. I think a lot of people sort of. Not get lazy, but they're good at doing one thing and they kind of stick with that. Yeah. And you kind of, there's audience capture.

So the audience want this thing. So you keep on feeding that audience. Yeah. Deeper, deeper down that road. And I've been as guilty as anyone of that. I've going, well, they expect, edgy, dark one-liners. Gotcha. Right.

And then, but doing other things that kind of surprise and, you know, fun. The audience stuff is always great. It is that really, that thing of being on the outside of, and this is why show business works. it's like you're in show business and then you walk on someone's set and you're like oh this isn't a real restaurant you guys have like this is it's uh it always works like the mystery of it always works and watching

your act I'm as deep into comedy as I can be and I watch and I watch I watch everything I'm I'm such a huge sometimes kind of you meet new comics and you go how much you how much you're watching actually my friend Amanda Baker is always saying this you know how much you're watching yeah how much you're watching

Yeah. How much are you taking in? Yeah. How much are you aware of new people out there? You should be. Yeah, you should be. You should be kind of watching it and going and how's it changing. And I think the big thing that's changed across our careers, I think, is the frequency of the laugh.

Right. Like that thing of like a five-minute story with a big laugh at the end is like almost kind of the attention span that the way, the what people are expecting, how funny a thing could be. Maybe, but I see a lot of young comics. kind of really taking their time. Like, I've seen some specials, you know, I watch a lot through when people are coming on Netflix and that thing. And so a lot of times you're like, well, they've been up there for five minutes and there's, there hasn't been a joke yet. Yeah, I think that's going to be an issue for them.

Yeah. I do too. I never think that's an issue on the first special. Yeah, right. I think that's a, that's, you know, when they talk, it's when they, you know, you know, you know, we can lay names, but some guys go from arenas back to theaters, back to clubs.

You know, it happens. Right. Sometimes where you go, you're not delivering the thing. And I think some of that is about the the alchemy of comedy. There's a, there's a kind of a mysticism of, oh, well, it just comes to me on stage.

And it's just a funny guy and you go, no, learn to read music. Yeah. Learn how to do the thing. How to, you know, when you're on the road as well, you're punching up a bit. So you've got the initial funny idea. that gets, okay, that gets a laugh.

Yeah. And I think of like trying new stuff in clubs at the store last night, like trying a couple of new bits. Yeah. And you go, okay, if I just read that, it gets a laugh. Right. But there's no performance in that. There's no facial expression.

There's no kind of attitude behind it. It's just, okay, that's the line. Yeah. Anyone could do that. What can I bring to it? Yeah. And you're kind of trying to, you know, get better. How, how, do you ever think about being more physical in any way?

Yeah. because both of us are pretty much, the mic is in the stand. Sometimes you don't even use a mic stand special. And it's, I did it intentionally. I used to be really hammy and really, and I was like,

let me see if there's material under all of this acting. So then I just kept the mic in the stand. I wanted to see, like, is the material as good as it could possibly be? And it was a great experiment. And it was like, it really put the weight on it, but I haven't taken it out.

since. Well, it's an interesting thing where you, the, where the focus is in the room. So it's that thing if you go, the less you move, the more your movement matters. If you're running around the stage, you know, how big does it have to be? Right. Right. So some people are incredibly theatrical. Yeah. With mine, I've kind of, I've noticed a thing of like, I'll have movements for certain jokes. Sorry to get into the weeds, I might be boring. But that thing of like, you have certain things that you do where you kind of beat out what you're, what you're expecting the audience to kind of do. and it's it really helps with the performance of the joke and kind of remembering the physicality of it

yeah but it helps I think working with the director yeah you know working with someone that's going to sort of sit with you and go yeah that joke is it's not delivering because it's you know sometimes when a special is boring as well sometimes some specials are boring it's because you're just doing pullback reveals you're doing the same sort of joke right you've got eight of them in a special what you're doing right

and two of them are back to back yeah just dude the audience is never going to go So there aren't enough joke types in this show. Yeah. But they will go. While we're in the weeds, I'm going to ask you a question. It's going to take us a little deeper. I've seen you say that the great public speakers,

that the secret is, I believe, 92 beats per minute. Well, this is all Amanda. So Amanda and I work together with Abby Grant as well. And Amanda Baker is a jazz musician. She's a great friend of mine and, you know, direct to the live show. So she's a jazz musician. So she's always, like she's much more when she's directing my show. It's like, yeah, you do the jokes.

Jokes are great. But there's no performance in it. What's the rhythm of this? What are you, what are you hitting? Uh-huh. What's the cadence of the speech? So that's kind of what we're working on. It's the, yeah, that's a deep one.

But it's that thing of like, how do you, what makes a speaker great? what makes it, you know, kind of knowing how to communicate. And it's not really about how fast you're speaking. Right. It's about what you're hitting. And the point, what word is coming at the end of the joke is so bizarrely important. Yeah. But it's innate.

But for us, I mean, to hear you put math on it at the end is kind of like, wait, what? Do I do that? Like, because it's just naturally our cadence. We've kind of created a rhythm for the way we work. Yeah. And it's so different, actually. And, you know, watching you kind of go on at the store last night, and you get to the stage.

And it's your room. Right. It's your room. It's your rhythm. And you're kind of controlling it. Yeah. So it's that. I mean, you had the best line on this.

Ron White had the, had the best line. If you're doing badly, slow down. Mm-hmm. If you're doing well, slow down. Right. Everyone's always like, everyone's like, hey, yeah, yeah. Like me, like me. They haven't heard it.

They haven't heard this. I know you've heard it. You even know what the punchline is. Just relax everyone. I know. It's really true. Yeah, that pure thing, it's so great that you can be this far and and you're constantly relearning the lessons like every...

It's not even relearning. I think it's that thing of like, it's the reason to do the project and to write something and maybe teach a course. The reason to do it is to go, well, you kind of, you're aware of it kind of, there's unconscious competence. So you can do it, but you're not quite sure how you do it. And then there's conscious competence. And so you really got to think about it.

But if you can do something, but teaching something, you really learn it. Yeah. Because you go, well, how can I explain this simply? Yeah. Because I think if it's a big complicated explanation, you don't really know what's going on. Yeah. And it is interesting, kind of in my act, that way when it's the same thing is sometimes a joke won't hit. And you're like, and you realize, oh, no, you're not telling them exactly what you have all this,

background information for this joke in your head. Think of the words. If you're just sitting out there for the first time, you're not telling them exactly what this is about. Just be really, give them, give them everything. And actually, and what's the key word? Because often a joke will just have a turn. Yeah. It's got a turn. So it's turning on that word, that piece of wordplay. You need to remember. That's the thing they need to remember. And if you're not hitting that on the beat, then it gets lost in the shuffle. Yeah. And that, you know. Right. Exactly. Yeah. If you ever, you're going a lot. and you just garble a word.

It's like the whole structure falls apart. That weird thing of like going, I messed up one word in the setup. Yeah. And it got 40% of the laugh. Why would that, why should that relate? It's still the same funny idea.

Yeah. Well, because it's performance. Yeah, and they're thinking about it. It's a piece of music and there's a bum note in it. Yeah. Of course it's not as enjoyable. It was so interesting watching the roast the other night. I loved it.

The tighter you, the performer was with their jokes, the better it was. I mean, if you were looser. I was, I was hanging out with Nikki Glazer the day before, and it was the subbing down. And I think she probably, you know, pound for pound did the best on the show. And it's because

it was five minutes. And all killer. All killer. Yeah. No space, no fumbling. And executed perfectly, flawlessly. Yes. Yeah. Because there were other people that had some good jokes and stuff, but the garble thing, like it

kind of didn't come out or it was a little it was couched with some extra stuff, not as potent. Yeah, I mean, Ben Affleck was, oh, that was something. I was convinced I was with Shane Gillis watching it. And I was going, and we were kind of, whoa, this is, this is, this is going bad.

And I was convinced, I said, oh, no, no, no, what's going to happen is Matt Damon's going to come out. He's going to be the guy he's talking about shit talking online, and there's going to be a hobbit, clear, clearly. He's not having a breakdown. He's doing a bit. He's an actor. Oh, no, wait.

Yeah. How wrong could you be? It was the perfect example of thinking it's going to go great without having the, like, Nikki obviously ran those jokes for weeks before she got there. Tight. Yeah. You can't just be like, it's funny enough and get up there and think it's going to go. A lot of paraphrasing your ideas.

And Tony, Tony Hincheliff, just kind of gone up and sit next to dawn and he's in the audience. So it's even like, it's even better because you kind of go, the audience are going, he's just a guy getting, he's just, this is all just off the top of his head. I know. Where's this coming from? I know. Oh, yeah, precision is a thing. It really is a thing.

You can't. Yeah. It's so valuable. It really is. Yeah. Do you live your life with precision? I don't think so. No, not.

I think this is. You're very put together act. You always look sharp. But I think that's part of the. It's a very visual medium. So I always like, I always like it when, actually, I like it on your specials when you, when you dress up. Like, when you dress up for the special, like seeing you performing casual clothes last night. Yeah.

Those cars, really scary. But I like it when you've got a shirt and tie on. Because it's that thing of, I said it's a Sebastian. He's not special. He turned up in black tie. Right. And you turn on the special and you walk out, you walk out, you know, suited and booted. Yeah.

We can all relax as a professional. It's really true. We don't have to. And someone walks out in a sweatshirt, I go, well, let's see. Right. You better bring it. Yeah. How is your suit game?

Now, the problem is you look so good in a suit. You look perfect builds. You look like Carrie Grant. But no man has ever looked better than in a suit. No, whatever version of that guy is. Yeah, it's like that's the best you can, we've hit upon this is it. You're right. At what stage as wild as fashion fall away?

and you just go, I just need a suit. Just put a suit on me. How do you run your suit game in your everyday life? And what is your packing like? You've been here for a week and a half. My packing's pretty light. It is light. How?

Spare shirts, just shirts, and the suit can, the suits, great. It's been the suit, the one suit the whole time. Yeah, and I'll change it out tonight for the show, because my tour manager's with me. He'll have a spare, but, yeah, it's great. Tom Sweeney, shout out to Tom Sweeney, my tailor. God bless them. I really, I'm like, I'm going to need shirts and shoes and suits and I'm going to be, I'm going to have a trunk when I tour.

It's a, it, I like that thing of that hand luggage only, and being kind of being very, very light and quick through the airports and yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's nice that thing of, uh, I like the suit as well, just wearing a, I don't know, it feels very comfortable to me. Yeah. Where do you get your shirts? Um, my, my tailor, Tom Sweeney.

Mm. That can make it, that can make a break your experience. during the day in a suit. Yeah, I would say. Having a starchy kind of uncomfortable thing, you're all of a sudden, now you're back in second grade, why'd they dress me up? Yeah, but it's also that,

I suppose that thing of like stand up being quite a visual medium. And what do the audience think when you wander on stage? Yeah. Because they've already, they've already made a decision about you by the time you get to the mic. Yeah. It's kind of, I suppose, that thing of like, that's with both things as well,

if you're trying, if you're a salesman or trying to pitch something or, you know, or going on a date. Yeah. It's kind of a date, right? We're all dressing up. Are you taking notes on this, Joey? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Maybe no short sleeves when you're working the board. Okay. Yes, he's dressed as a toddler. As are many American men. I know. Everyone seems to have gone comfort is the comfort is the, yes, I understand you want to be comfortable. Right. But you're at work right now.

Is that the most important thing? You think it's all about comfort. You have a job. Dress up. Yeah, exactly. Did you always go suit? Yeah, pretty early? Pretty early on, yeah. Yeah. Pretty early on. I mean, I don't know.

Yeah. I think if I, it would be so weird if you rolled out in a track suit. Isn't life simple, though? You just take the decision out of it. You just go, well, I don't need to make any decisions about what shall I wear tonight. Yeah. What colors are going to go with this? No.

Yeah. Yeah. Just do it. So you're not that methodical in your everyday life, though. Like you're, you're now, you're now of a family. Yeah. Are you, at night, can you go to sleep with the kitchen dirty? I mean, I mean, yeah, you're being crazy now. No, no, I don't, I'm fairly kind of, I don't think I'm that uptight.

I mean, I think having kids may be relaxed you a little bit. A little bit. Yeah, so you can kind of. I railed against it. Did you? We're cleaning this place up. I need things in their place. I need things kind of order, orderly.

Yeah, I'm pretty. I'm pretty ordered, I think. Yeah. I can like things my way. But I don't know. I don't know. I mean, it's kind of, it's that thing as well where you go, well, it's fine, isn't it? It's always okay.

Yeah. I'm fairly relaxed about that. I mean, it's like you choose what to worry about in life as well. You can only worry about so much. What's your big worry now? Well, I mean, that I'm trying to be more stoic in life. I'm trying to just focus on the thing that matters. And that's, for me, stand up.

And writing jokes is the thing that makes a difference. So what's actually going to, uh, move the dial. I was listening to Tim Ferriss talk on a thing recently. Oh, yeah? And he was talking about efficiency and effectiveness. Uh-huh. And efficiencies is how you do things.

Mm-hmm. But effectiveness is what you do. So there's a lot of people doing things very efficiently. Right. It's nonsense. It's not their job. Right. It's not their trust.

Who cares about that? Yeah. There's a great story about two comics, like, backstage at some club. Uh-huh. Pissing and moaning about, like, someone's manager. didn't get them the booking and someone's blaming their agent for something and they should be doing more and they should have a deal with something. And Dave Attell kind of wandered past and just went, be funnier. Isn't that? It's very, I mean, I'm not sure how much Marcus Aurelius Atel reads on a regular

basis, but it strikes me as like, what a brilliant remark. Yeah. Because there's only one thing that matters here. There's only one metric. That's right. And actually as comics, you kind of go, the other stuff doesn't really. It doesn't really. matter. Yeah. It doesn't matter. Do you have to fend off distractions from sticking to the stand-up? I know you hosted shows and you must get offered things. That's a lovely kind of bit of gravy. Yeah. A lovely side hustle, which I think for a long time people thought was the main thing. Yeah. No, no, no, stand-up's the main thing. I always kind of kept it going. Not really. I mean, there's not much in a way of distractions. Right. In terms of, you know, I don't get off for things that I'm tempted by.

You never like, I should start auditioning for things. No. Actually, I kind of stopped probably three, four years ago going to meetings in Los Angeles. I don't really do meetings now. Yeah, they're kind of pointless. Yeah, and I've had so many meetings about things that are definitely going to happen. Oh, yeah, don't worry about that. It's not a question.

You could, James Gordon said a great thing to me. One time we were having lunch, and he said, the problem in Los Angeles is you could die of encouragement. It's like they're just so. Oh, this is amazing. So excited you're here. So excited. Everyone's always excited.

It strikes me that the, what's better being a, um, an actor or a comedian while being a comedian's better. Because you're in charge. You're, you're not waiting for someone to bring you flowers. You plant your own garden. Right. What's better being a TV host or being a podcaster. Being a podcaster is better because you decide what the show is and how the show is and you,

you know, it's, is that not perfect. You're, it's the, it's the, where's the locus of control here? Yeah. What are you in charge of? fewer number of meetings. Yeah. It really determines your happiness. And the kind of all-turthing of just going,

well, with the internet now and with Netflix or whatever, you find your audience. Yeah. The people that look like you. So you don't have to compromise or have a meeting with a studio executive to go, well, we're going to have to take that joke out. Right. Because it's a little bit offensive.

Not to my audience. They love it. They can't believe I said it. Exactly. I had a show on the Food Network. they were pitching for me to be because of my bread and stuff. And they said, yeah, they love the idea. They love the idea of you going around and talking with bakers around the country.

And it's, they're very excited about it. They don't want to mention that you're a comedian. I was like, so why am I here? Like, you want me to pretend I'm not, like, I just like cake? Like, I don't understand. Yeah, and we're not sure about the name. Yeah, but we're not. sure. Mr. Bake. We're going to call you Mr. Beck. What's what you talking about?

We would like to thank the good people at wild grain, wildgrain.com. Beautiful company. Look, we love bread here. We're always making bread. We're always sharing bread. And often we've thought, how could we get this bread out to people? Wildgrain.com figured it out. They ship you these breads. They ship you these pastas. They come. They cookies. They come. You get this nice little bread. You get this beautiful, whatever you choose, say a sourdough loaf or a sourdough cranberry loaf. And it comes and you put it in the freezer. You get your whole order. You stick the stuff in the freezer and you're looking around. I myself look around when I come off the road and I don't have bread around and you think, well, that's going to be two days before I can make some bread or I open

the refrigerator, go to the freezer, take out this loaf, don't even have to thaw it. Just put it in the oven, heat it up, and you've got this really quality bread right there at your fingertips, just from wildgrain.com. It really is a great company. I don't know how they figured it out. I'm a little upset that I didn't figure it out. They're the first ever bake from frozen subscription box for sourdough breads, fresh pastas, and artisanal pastries. Every item bakes from frozen in 25 minutes or less, and you can now fully customize your wild grain box, wild grain box so you can choose any combination of breads, postures pastries. You can even build a box of

only breads, only pastas, and only pastries if you'd like. It's a great service and it's really quality. That's the biggest thing is that you're actually getting, you know, bake goods that kind of warm your heart. For a limited time, you can get $30 off your first box plus free croissants in every box when you go to wildgrain.com slash papa to start your subscription. Free croissant. in every box and $30 off your first box when you go to wildgrain.com slash papa.

Wildgrain.com slash papa. You can also just use the promo code Papa at checkout. Also, we'd like to thank the good people at nuts.com. Whether you're someone who's always on the go in need of snacks to fuel your day or simply enjoy a plethora of snack options within arm's reach for nights on the couch, nuts.com is your ultimate snacking destination. This is how I use it, Joey. I always want nuts around.

I always want trail mix around. You go to nuts.com, you pick out the stuff that you want. They come in these giant boxes, and they'll give you, like, they'll give you this great big bag, and inside it, little things to go. My daughter grabs, and my wife takes them off on our way to school. It's just great, and it's fun, and it feels good, and it's delicious, and you always got snacks right at your fingertips. fingertips and also you throw in a couple things that are sweet and that you maybe you don't aren't the healthiest thing in the world but that you're eating them in moderation and you what's wrong with having fun once in a while nuts dot com is your one-stop shop for freshly

roasted nuts fried fruit dried fruit fried fruit sweets pantry staples like specialty flowers and more their wide selection means that there's something for everyone they also offer gluten-free options, organic choices, and other diet-friendly products. Shop a la carte at any time or opt in to hassle-free auto deliveries, so you never run out of your favorite items. Right now, Nuts.com is offering new customers a free gift with purchase and free shipping on orders of $29 or more at Nuts.com slash Papa. So go check out all the delicious options at Nuts.com slash Papa. You'll receive a free gift and free shipping when you spend $29 or more. That's nuts.com slash papa. Two great sponsors, two companies that I truly, truly use. Thanks. So I made this bread for you last night before I came

out to the comedy seller. I shaped it, but then I woke up and I made it today. And I know you're in a hotel and stuff, but I hope you can enjoy it. Yeah, well, what's the, should we eat some now? It's up to you if you want to eat some now. I'd have a piece having anything. You haven't anything to eat? Yeah. Are we got coffee? What have we got? We've got coffee.

Joey, can you... Yeah, maybe... Ooh, that sounds nice. And maybe put some proper clothes on. If you're not... If there's any out there. You know, what do you think of this idea? I'm thinking of taking Joey

and putting him in like a little vest, like you're at Mousson-Frank's, like a waiter uniform when you're here. I love the idea. Right? I mean, I'm 100% in. You should be... Yes.

And a little little... Dickie Bo? Yeah. But those guys, that waiter in that restaurant, I'm serious. That guy's not comfortable. No, no, he's working. But he's doing a job. He's doing his job for crying out loud. Of course he is. It's a little difficult to cut because it's just came out of the oven. And what's the this is fabulous.

Yeah. This is a great podcast. Who cooked for you when you were little? My mother was not a great cook. I think I had pretty... Irish, right? Yeah, Irish. I'm sort of from Limerick, our family. So it's a weird thing of like, I'm a I always kind of talk about this, but your character and your reputation. There's that thing of how people see you and who you know you are. So I'm seen as like, like, very, very British.

Right. I carried an Irish passport and Irish family, Irish parents, you know, very Irish. And that kind of feeling slightly other. Right. It's often, it's kind of amazing how much, kind of, how many migrants become comedians. Right. And maybe it's a perspective thing. Yeah. I know. I was going to ask you that. And I guess I can because we're on a podcast. You're so global.

Well, I keep on trying to get Americans to go to other places because you go the, and, you know, I know it doesn't probably make as much financial sense because America is so huge. Yeah. You could tour America for two, three years. Do you have any sugar? Oh, shit. We don't. No, no, no, well, don't worry. Don't worry. Don't be right. I'll live. Sugar, Joey. Would you like a toasted or not toasted? Toasted? Joey, can you toast this for the man? I mean, we aim to please.

This is kind of great, isn't it? Yeah. It's lovely. I'll take an espresso too, please. This is, what we're talking about there? We're talking about you being global. Oh, well, the global thing of like going, if you've been going 30 years, we've been going 25 years,

there's something about how do you make the best job in the world feel new? Because there's a hedonic treadmill. We get very used to how great our lives are. And one of the things you can do is a gratitude practice. I'm just trying to be more grateful all the time for how great this is. This is amazing, right? Just sitting here talking to you. Yeah.

You know, you're an incredible comedian. I love your specials. I'm sitting in a room with you eating bread and drink a coffee. Yeah. How lucky. You're at work. But that thing of like going, how do, and one of the ways I made it feel new was traveling the world.

I like going to interesting places and doing comedy there. And it's ultimately. it doesn't change much around the world. Right. It's always going to be self-selecting because they're choosing to come to see you. Right. But it's amazing how you can kind of build an audience

in different countries. And then you go, well, this is our guy. He's come here, we're going to go and see the show. Yeah. You know. But I was thinking about that last night because we're there at the comedy store. Everybody's American.

And you have really pulled off this amazing thing where you belong there just as much as everybody else. but you've grew up in a much different place, you've toured the whole world, but you've seemed very at home. Like you really seem like you adapt in a very, in a very profound way. Well, I've kind of, I suppose that thing as well,

but with the comedy store in Los Angeles and the comedy cellar in New York, I've really put all my eggs in one basket and spent a lot of time in those clubs, so I'm very, you know, comfortable in those spaces. Yeah. And with that kind of group of people that kind of hang around there.

Yeah. But yeah, I mean, it's very nice you to say, but I like that thing of the way that those clubs work. Yeah. There's nowhere else in the world that has that. Uh-huh. I mean, that's really the thing that needs to be exported. Right. Like those clubs where people just drop in and do sets.

And I think you're going to see way more comedy scenes around the world the next few next decade. Yeah. Because as people get into it, obviously, you'll see that it's obviously that, you know, the big hitters with a huge comedy specials. Yeah. And then it filters down and people go, well, I can do this. Right. do this in mine. I just did, what I do for the first time, Istanbul. Really?

Unbelievable. Unbelievable crowds. Really? So right. Man, oh, man. You know, and it's not often we find out of the new territory, but it was so fantastic. And it was like, you know, four shows kind of sold out in a heartbeat. That's so crazy. And then it was like, and Istanbul was, I mean, it's so delivered on being, this is, this place is properly incredible. Wow.

Loved it. And any beat? Is there any, are they behind by a step in your delivery or anything? or are they right there? I mean, they're pretty much there. I mean, I think it's that that thing of going, you have to be a little bit kind of sensitive to the, they're going to take four or five minutes to tune into your accent. Because they speak great English, but it's like that thing of like, you sometimes get it when you travel even within America. Yeah. If you're down in Louisiana, for sure. You can't, you, it takes you a beat to, okay, no, I get, of course. Yeah. Yeah.

It's not, you know, it's not crazy, but it's, you can, it takes a minute. Or travel around the you care if you've got a new castle that takes you a moment just to okay well you've got to respect the fact that they're going to tune into me and then they'll be fine do you travel on the plane in the suit yeah so great really my hero how long have i been talking about i just want to be in a suit all the time yeah what my tailor's just opened in uh in in he's got a place now in melrose oh really go and go and go and see him all right go and see him get you a suit let's get you dress let's get me dress i got to shoot my next special in a month. It's time.

In a month. So are you... June, yeah. Okay, filming the special. June 15th. How are you, because I directed my last special. You did. Or be it with my friend Brian Klein, who's fabulous.

Actually, yeah. And Amanda directed the live show. But what I kind of... So my idea was, why a stand-up special, sometimes great material. I love this guy. I saw the show live. I'm going to watch it again.

Like 30 minutes in. you're like, ah, this could be, it's maybe a bit. And it's three shots on rotation. Uh-huh. It's the close, the mid, the long. Right. Close, the mid, the long. Right.

Audience shot, close, mid, long. Right. So everything's a moving shot. Everything's a tracking shot. So I've got like a guy on steady cam that kind of walks around me. Yeah, I want to ask you that. So, you know, those aren't retakes as well. That's like the guy just walked at the beginning of the show.

It wasn't retakes. No, no. So I say to the audience at the top of the thing, or I've actually got someone to go out and say, look, there's going to be a cameraman on stage sometimes because we're filming tonight for Netflix. Yeah. It's kind of excited to see behind the curtain of how filming works. So this guy just comes out with a steady cam, a case of wonderful setty cam up and just

rotates around you. I thought for sure you stopped down and got that shot. Joey, check that toast. I don't want it to burn. I can sense it. It feels like you should be running a restaurant with that tone. I could sense it. See, the ding?

Yeah. Oh, boy. Is it okay? The ding. Who was talking about it? about that recently, Rory Sutherland, who I'm a huge fan of. He's not a comic. A very entertaining guy, Rory Sutherland, if you ever get a chance to listen to a podcast with him. Oh, yeah? He was on Rick Rubens recently. He's just fabulous. But you're talking about the best product that never took

off. Uh-huh. I'm saying, there's a see-through toaster. There's a see-through toaster. Someone made it. No one's buying it, but everyone should. It's absolutely amazing. That's perfect. I'll be shy with that. Is it salted butter? Salted. I don't think I can have salted butter in my house. It's just too delicious. I would go crazy. There's a French butter that I get from this place that we should have. Unpasteurized? Yes.

Yeah, when they've got like an unpasteurized French butter, you go, I don't know what pasteurization is, if I'm honest, but whatever it's doing, it's taking away from. It's ruining our. I think it's not giving us botulism, sure, but something is lost. 100%. Joey, write down French butter and sugar. Wow.

we've learned something today. I mean, this is what a treat. So you baked this. Yeah, I baked this. Do you find that, like, is that your relaxing, do you get into kind of a state there where you're just, it's like a flow state? It's very calming. And I really found when I started writing my books, it just fit into the rhythm of writing. Like, because you write and you spend some time at the desk, and then you go and you tend to the bread.

And then you come back. And it's like this ebb and flow. and it's very much like comedy in that it's humbling. Like you get really good at it, you really know what you're doing. But at any moment, it could all, it could be a weird night. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Yeah, the souffle might not rise. That's really delicious. Is it good? Yeah, very good. It's not as earthy as I would like, but I'm using this new bread flour. It's interesting that thing of like flowstores.

states. Like, what's happiness? A lot of it's flow states. You know, we get to do it on stage. Yeah. And, you know, even how you define that of like, where do you lose track of time? Right. Where you kind of in a, you can't think about anything else. Yeah. And often that focus is the thing. It's like you kind of want your conscious mind to get out of the way so your subconscious can kind of just sort of relax. Yeah. It's amazing. Realizing how much you can feed your subconscious.

Like you don't have to be omnipresent and have, you can, like if I haven't performed in like a week on, like the long set, just listening to it or just reading it, half distracted, it's still, it's being put into the hard drive.

and you walk out there, you're much more in tune than if you hadn't. Not even that you're really working that hard on it. You're just giving the information to that part of your brain you're not even really that aware of. Well, it's kind of the illusion of life, isn't it? There's an, there's a, is it Ian McGilchris? I think it is. That's the master in his emissary about the left and the right brain. Uh-huh.

And the idea that we sort of think we're running the show. Right. We think the left brain is running the show because it's lists and it's in our society's very kind of set up for the left brain. Yeah. But actually it's the right brain which does kind of the gestalt the whole thing. Right. And they're not doing different jobs the left and right brain. They're doing the same job, but very differently.

Yeah. And often it's that thing of like with creativity, it's kind of, it's getting out the way to let things kind of bubble up. 100%. 100%. Do you find that after you're very successfully of this great career, and this, uh, do you feel like it is ultimately been,

uh, satisfying to you in your, in your life? Or do you feel like this feeds me, this does a great thing? I'm content. I'm, I really love doing this and getting better.

But it ultimately isn't the main spring of happiness. Well, I think that, I mean, it's a, it's a great question. I think there's lots to unpick there, though, in terms of what is happiness and what is satisfaction. Having done things, I don't think brings you happiness.

I think doing things brings you happiness, but you get a lot of satisfaction from having done things. So it's the experiencing self, which is about happiness, and the remembered self, which is about satisfaction. And they're both important. And it's finding a balance between the two. So very much enjoying the process of, I like being a comedian. I like the job. I like the road. And I think maybe the secret is that it's a feature, not a bug.

Everything about it is great. Right. Traveling is great. Right. Getting up at 5am for the hotel call is great. The whole thing is great. Because the whole thing is about, and you get to perform comedy and think about the, you know, you work during the day, you collect the money at night. Right.

You come up with these ideas. You present them to people. They come and see you. It's like you're in the service industry. Yeah. And you feel like you've served a lot of people. And that you get satisfaction from that. And then the happiness is the day-to-day thing.

The happiness for me is the, it's often, you know, it's either expectations exceeded. I thought the bread would be pretty good. It's better than I thought. Right. I'm pretty happy right now. Yeah. You know, it's that thing of life. Yeah.

Why a birthday is terrible or New Year's Eve. It's terrible. Right. It's going to be the best night ever. It's just okay. Right. Yeah, it's all right. Yeah, but it's not the greatest.

Yeah. It's that, you know, that thing of like, okay, well, I thought it would be better. But actually, if you're, you know, Tuesday afternoon and it's fun. Right. Yeah, and then it's that thing of like, it's happiness is your life minus envy. It's a great. It's George Mack, this friend of mine came up with this. Who's George Mac?

George Mac is like, he's a marketing guy, actually. I met him through Chris Williamson, who does Modern Wisdom. And which I saw a thing on Twitter. He was actually a guy I met. from Twitter. He posted this thing. He posts on Twitter once a week. It's just mind-blowingly great, George Mack. He's such a smart guy.

He's kind of marketing. But that idea of like going, happiness, your life, minus envy. What else you're looking at over there? What have they got? What's everyone else doing? And everyone, because we only ever see, you might see the life. You might, oh my God, I'd love to be Tom Papa traveling around the country, telling jokes. This is fantastic. But of course,

they don't see what it takes to be Tom Papa. They don't see the the mind you have to have and the work you need to put into that and they just see the results. Yeah. So it's kind of that weird thing of like if you saw how hard people think they want to be professional athletes. Right. No. Right.

Have you seen their lives? Yeah. You see what they have to do. Yeah. What are they willing to sacrifice to get that thing? And it's also the constant looking out that creates the envy. It's like, you know, there's something about being motivated and seeing where you can go, watching other people do what they do.

But it really should be in here. The blinders should be on. If you want to eliminate the envy. I think Pete Holmes said a great thing on recently. And it was the world order to stand-up comedian. You've got to respect that. Like there's a lot of guys in our industry. And we could all know, like, they go off and they want to be in movies.

What? What's right? We've got loads of actors. And they're better looking than us. Right. And they're really good at acting. Yeah. What are you doing?

Why are you taking bread from their table? Right. You know, we've got our little bit that we do. Is this not enough? I want to go to more. Right, exactly. Yeah. I think the general public get irritated by it.

You know when an actor wants to be a musician? Mm-hmm. Ah. Okay. I guess. Right. Who do you think you are? Yeah.

We know who you are. We ordered a comedian. Right. stay being funny. Yeah. Did you have to wrestle with envy on your way through your career? We all do with some degree. I think I worked for just long enough.

Mm-hmm. In a proper corporate job that I can remember that and keep the gratitude there. Right. But no, I mean, I started off. The first Edinburgh show, Edinburgh's like this big, you know, the arts festival and you go and everyone puts on a show. The first, not the first Edinburgh I did. The second Edinburgh, Edinburgh idea. First time I just kind of went and did little sets around the place and loved it.

Second time I went up with three friends. I went up with my friend Robin Ince, Steve Merchant and Ricky Jubase. Oh, wow. And Ricky and Steve were working on this thing called The Office. And we were putting together here. And we were all kind of in it together. And he was working on the office with Steve. And it's great to have started with someone that did that. Yeah. Because very early on you go, oh, okay. It's a great. Yeah.

Good luck. Have a great time with that. Mm-hmm. I'm doing my thing. Right. Right. Right. Exactly.

It kind of knocks it out of you early. Yeah. Yeah. It's a great thing. I remember, you know Nick Tappalo? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I did some gigs with Nick DePallel. I did a gig once with Nick Tappalo and Patrice O'Neil.

Oh, wow. I was a lot of anger in this room. You guys seem upset about something. What's going on? So great. Both so cutting. Such great joke writers. And I remember Nick getting really pissed off at the comedy seller.

Sorry. Sorry, Nick DePala got, he got pissed off to him. It was very unusual. It was an unusual day. I mean, this is, this is going to go viral. People are. And he was, he was really, he was really, he was really pissed off about a comedian who got something that he thought was not deserved.

Right. He didn't even want the fact. Probably not. He didn't even want it. He just didn't want you to have it. He didn't want that guy to be successful. I've got like a definition of like, envy versus jealousy. Whatever way you want to divide the words, but one is very good, one is very bad.

Because envy, maybe to a degree, tells you what you want. So if someone gets a Netflix version, you go, well, I want a Netflix version. And you go, oh, okay, we'll work hard and make it inevitable and write these jokes and take the tour out. And that's good. You know, you want that thing. And jealousy is that thing of like, I don't want them to have that. I don't want them to have that. They just got a sitcom. Do you want a sitcom? No, but I don't want them to have one either. Why? That's brilliant. Yeah, and I said to Nick, I said, Nick, who cares? You know, I mean, in every business, lawyer, plumber, whatever,

there's someone else in their industry who's getting success that maybe you don't feel is warranted. And it happens in every industry. And Nick said, yeah, but only in our business do I have to see that guy's face on the side of a bus? I often think as well, when someone has success at a huge level and you don't think it's deserved, what's going on is you can't see what they're doing. So you go, sometimes I work on charisma. I've got no charm. There's no warmth here.

There's no warmth. Nothing. But sometimes you're saying that about yourself? Yeah. It would be rude if you said it. But that thing of like going, sometimes you see a performer. And then people will pay to be in a room with that guy. Yes.

They've gone to see him. They come to listen to you. Right. It's a different thing. And sometimes you could be tricked into thinking, oh, you're doing the same thing. No, you're doing a very different thing. And why? So sometimes people will go, oh, that guy's playing the wieners, but his material's terrible.

And you go, yeah, but have you seen how he performs? Right. It's belletic. This guy's incredible. Yeah. And you can't recognize that. It's almost like, I suppose, a classical musician going, who these guys, ACDC? This is nothing.

It's very different to what you do. Right. It's a really different style. Yeah. Yeah. And a lot of times you can't do what that person's doing. You literally can't do that. And again, back to gratitude as I always try.

You know, you go, that person's making the cake bigger. Right. The person playing the stadium is making it bigger. That's right. They go, you know, and a proportion of those people that went to see them will go, well, we had a great time at comedy. Yeah. Comedy store, please.

I had a moment of that. Someone came to a theater show I was doing recently somewhere. And Nate had just, and it was a young person, like the 14-year-old who brought the parents. And they were just trying to knock off their favorite comedians. And they were just so happy to be there. And they said, we just saw Nate last week. And I said, oh, where was he playing? And because everywhere I go, they're like, you're sold out tonight.

Great job. Nate was here. He was playing that football. arena across the street. He played the Enormon. Right, exactly. And you're like, well, I felt good for... How big is the Enormon?

I felt good for 30 minutes. And, but I said to them, like, so where was Nate playing? You know, he's a good friend of mine. And he said, oh, yeah, he played in that place where the Pacers play or whatever, where the sports team plays. It meant nothing to them. It meant nothing to this kid and the parents. It was like, no, we.

saw him last week and we're seeing you tonight. Yes. You're as important in their heads. Yeah. It's also that thing. It's a very good judge of whether it's someone is a real friend or your frenemies. Right. Like if their success is your success.

Yeah. It's like sometimes someone gets something and you just go, oh my God. Yeah. He's playing, you know, 10 nights at Radio City musical. It's my boy. Yeah. Exactly. It's amazing.

If it's somehow, you go, hmm. You need to, you know, oh, okay, let's have a, let's pause for a second. think about what's going on. Right. It's that person really your friend. Yeah. Well, it's, I don't know. Yeah.

It's weird as well what we choose to be jealous of. Like, it's often like the sibling rivalries. Like the guys you came up with in your general. Who were the guys that you came up with? And where are they now? Right. And if I asked you to name them, I'm sure it would be you name the ones that are doing fabulously well.

Right. And you don't name the ones that no one's ever heard of. Right. So you only look to that. And those are the ones that you tend to be. Because you're closest to them, somehow you being in the same class at high school. Yeah. So you can be jealous of them, but you can't be jealous of someone 10 years younger because you go,

well, that's a different thing. Yeah. I was talking with someone who I'd started with back in New York when we were kids. And we were talking about like so-and-so died and so. And there was this one girl, Jackie, who just was brighter than all of us. And she just stopped. And we were like, wait, whatever happened to Jackie? I was like, why, how could she was so good?

Where did she go? It's amazing that in those early days, like, there were people funnier than on everybody who, for whatever reason, don't end up still around 30 years. But it is that thing of like going, funny isn't the only metric in comedy. How badly you want it and how hard you're willing to work. Yeah. Tell me what you want. Now tell me what you're willing to sacrifice. What are you willing to sacrifice to do?

that what what um yeah uh what what what what what you give right yeah and we were willing to give everything everything without thinking about it was that without even considering and it wasn't work for us no it was we found something very lucky people we found something that felt like play to us so no one could compete because to do 12 hours a day it's nothing for me nothing they want me to get up at this time a fly there to do what to do two shows yeah done done done great I think back of like the the amount of money young Tom was living on in the beginning of comedy. Literally some weeks, five, five dollars a night. Like I wouldn't, this new Tom would be panicked.

I'd be like, just take me to the emergency room. I'll never make it. And that kid was so happy. I can get a bagel and an orange juice. Of a five dollars a night. It's so happy. Just so pleased. So now that you have children, do you feel you obviously have a good grip on life and a good perspective?

Do you feel like, is it your job to impart this on your children or just kind of let it fly? I think there's a responsibility there, isn't there, to kind of, yes. Are you asking, do you think, do I think I need to parent? No, no, no, no. I'm going to wing it. I'm going to wing it. I'm going to step back. No, but there is a thing.

I carry a lot of what I think is some wisdom, but there's when you're in a parenting situation, there is a, I feel like the lessons I've actually taught them happened when I wasn't trying to teach them. Well, I don't think they'll ever listen to what you say. They'll look at what you do. Right.

So that thing of like going, well, okay, if I have a work ethic Yeah You know Some of that's just I mean it's also how much is factory settings And how much do we Oh my God yeah

Oh my God My kids are exactly the same But that nature nurture thing You go Oh people go always about 50 50 Nature nurture But when you But a lot of nurture

Is nature Because it's how you chose To you know Create their environment Yeah Really their environment Is only us For the first kind of five years

Yeah And then at school and the world. Are you touring any less? I'm touring differently. So I now do two shows a night, a 7 and a 9.30. And so it's fewer dates in a year. And I do fewer days of the week. Right.

So I have like full days at home. And I'm at home most of the day. I mean, most of my touring is in the UK. Even though I play 45 countries, most of it's in the UK. Right. So most of the time, I'm kind of around. Yeah. need to set off too early.

That's great. I kind of like that thing of arriving. Like you can even drive or get the train or whatever. Arriving 15 minutes before I go on. It's like that's the absolute dream. Yeah, I know. There is a part of me though on the road where I'm in the hotel and they're like sound check is doors open early at this place.

So the sound check's an even hour before that. If you show up for sound check, you're going to be there for two and a half hours before your show. I haven't done a sound check. You never do a sound check? I've never done a sound check. Never. My tour manager, Gav, God love Gav.

Right. Does the sound check for me. Oh, that's pretty great. Yeah, I'm going to be speaking with this voice. The sound man's going to be there during the show, is he? Okay. If it feeds back, turn it down. There you go.

Okay, I think we got this. Yeah. It's also like the sound check is, I think that's them going, oh, we've got a performance this evening. Right. We need a sound check. Right. But what they're thinking is an orchestra or a rock and roll band. Right.

I're playing in this venue. No, no, it's just me with the one of the one of the one of them. It's one mic. Yeah. We're going to be fine. Stop treating us like we're in real show business. Right. But I do find that lately, I just had this weird thing of, I'd rather be backstage than here in my hotel.

Like, I get to go to the show. I'm going to the show now. Yeah. I do like the back, especially sort of in the States, the last couple years, some of the theaters that you get to be in and the backstage areas. And they've got the pictures of the guys that are. played in the thing you go oh wow yeah you know those kind of you know big rooms you know i got to do yeah chicago theaters like yeah phenomenal or carnegie or or uh the wang in boston yeah yeah it's very special kind of spaces you see those people those bands those legends that were

on that same stage it's mind-blowing and then and then you get to walk out there too yeah how did this happen is anyone aware okay but it's also like that thing you know to the you know comedy's kind of this is a golden age. You kind of go, well, yeah, no one was doing this in the 70s. Right. You know, George Colin and Richard Pryor may be touring a little bit, but not to the same extent. No, not at all. Where's your writing at now?

How's your head? Because you have the special out. So special out. So I've got the new tour show, which is laughs funny and done. So I do a thing where I write, I do new stuff every show. Every show. So the end of 90 minutes on stage, I pull out a piece of paper and I do new jokes. Oh, that's great.

And if they work, great. And if they don't. So if they work, I'll try them a couple of times and then bank them. And then the writing process for the new show is just ordering that stuff that works. Right. And letting the audience decide really on kind of what's the, what's getting the bigger laugh. So that's kind of an editing phase where you're kind of getting rid of stuff. Yeah.

Yeah, it's just being parsed out. Did you ever drink on tour? No, I didn't drink for the first. 12 years of doing comedy. Oh, yeah. I, uh, drinking a bit before, not like problem drinking, but drinking a bit before. And I just, as soon as I found comedy, I just, there was something in me that just went, this is, this is the thing I got one shot at this.

Mm-hmm. And a hangover isn't going to help. Yeah, exactly. And that's very early on, I've seen guys kind of after the show being bought drinks and yeah. Every night's a party. Yeah. Oh, are you going out after the show?

Yeah. No. There's two shows a night. I know. I'm crawling back to my room. Yeah. I know. Yeah, I never understood it.

That and also any activity during the day I know is going to be, is going to take away from the show that night. Like any, like, I'll go to coffee if I want to see a friend. I'm not getting my, I'm not taking my brain to a museum and knocking it around and Yeah, I think there's a thing about diet on the road. And everyone thinks about what they eat, you know, they get that focus. But no one thinks about their kind of intellectual diet of like, what are you taking in that's making you happy, that's uplifting, that's great. Because if you watch, I don't know, just the Kardashians or do whatever, Love Island or something, you know, okay.

That's all processed fast food. That reaction is exactly how I feel when I see that stuff. But if you listen to interesting things, all like, I love a book on tape and I love a, and it's also kind of, I don't know. don't quite know where you get material or why you decide to joke about that thing. Yeah. It tends to be you're going to heard something and it's, it's in the ether. It's out there. So listening to great stuff for me, that kind of diet of, because you're on your own a lot.

Yeah. And thinking. Yeah. And that's the work. Do you read a lot? Yeah. I mean, I always think I should read more, but I read, yeah, a lot of nonfiction. Yeah.

What are you reading now? Well, I'm trying to read Ian McGillacrest, the Master of Zemistry, but it's pretty. It's like, I like to. I like to kind of stretch myself a little bit. Yeah. And I was trying to read Parfitt's reasons and persons, but that's again. Yeah. It's like...

A heavy lift. It's like... It's like being back at college. It feels like this is... Yeah. This is really good. I think the best thing I read in the last year, he's my big book club. Tim Urban wrote this book called What's Our Problem?

And genuinely changed my mind on, like, a lot of things. Oh, really? A brilliantly... together book, almost like a self-help book for society. Ah. Of like how people think about things and whether they think like, what is his, um, it's like you either think like a, um, uh, a scientist. Uh-huh.

Absolutely even just weighing up the information. You think like a sports fan where you have a side, but fairness is important, the rules of the game. Right. You think like an attorney. Mm-hmm. Where it's like you're, you're on one side and you're, you don't even want to see the other one.

You'll die hard. Uh-huh. Or you think like a zealot. So it's not really about left or right. It's about how you think about it. It's an entertaining, brilliant book. He's got an amazing. Were you one way and, and more thoughtfulness and went to a different?

I think everyone's different on different things. Yeah. Like when you think about your, it's one of my favorite questions is what's the last thing you changed your mind about? Uh-huh. Because you kind of go, well, if you haven't got an answer to that. you haven't been thinking. Right. Yeah.

You know, it should change. Like, it's a weird thing that we're awful to politicians. So we go, the hypocrisy. Yeah. You said. Well, yeah, but I mean, you ran on this. But you have to remember, Obama ran on no gay marriage. Right.

Of course he did, because that's what was going on at the time. But then he knew new information came in. And then switch it up. Yeah, fine. What is the last thing you change your mind on? Do you have anything big? They're like the big things you kind of read about whatever the, yeah.

probably be in favor of Putin yeah huge huge fan I don't know it can't it it ebbs and flows I mean the the big sort of societal things maybe maybe environmentalism where you go well clearly something is going on and what to be done about it is the is the question yeah what to be done that kind of I'm kind of I don't think someone gluing that you know throwing tomato soup over a painting is going to make any difference down the line really you don't see that being affected. It just warms everybody on to their side and yeah. Yeah, I think, I think, I think, I think technologically will probably find our way out of it. That's my hope, is that great minds that are working on, on different ways of tackling the problem,

because there's no, you know, I thought, I thought, so I think we've done it. I thought, we did it, we split the atom, we've got that energy. We've got that energy. Right. We've released a huge amount of energy, and we haven't used it. We've only used it to scare ourselves. Yeah. And we've already got the downside. We've already got all these nuclear weapons, and it's terrifying.

Yeah. And the upside is we don't need to burn any fossil fuels. Yeah. The whole place could run on this. Yeah. And the testing's being done. If I said to you, oh, we're going to start nuclear testing, what are we going to do? When it sticks 60 guys in a tube and put them under water and see if they can live next to a nuclear reactor.

you say we cannot do that test. Well, the good news is we have. We've done that for the last 70 years. Guys have been underwater next to a nuclear reactor sleeping in bunks, and they're all fine. They're out there right now. They're out there right now. They're out there right now. Right.

Yeah. I suppose the other big thing I changed my mind about recently was American foreign policy. It's boring, but that's what I changed my mind about. Really? Yeah. You think we're the good guys now? I think we haven't been grateful enough the rest of the world for what America did the last 70 years. Like since the Cold War, the idea that isolationism, you went anti-isolation and you pleased the seas.

The American Navy made globalization possible and trade possible. And as America becomes more isolationist with every president since the fall of the Berlin Wall, you notice things are popping off. Right. The world is becoming less safe. people are a little more dangerous. If they don't have that many, if they can't police all of this area, then maybe we can mess around.

So yeah, that kind of... Yeah. It's, uh, I just had my, my nephew over and he's, um, I guess communist and, uh, he's what's sorry? Communist.

He's a communist. I mean, that's as close as you can get. That blows my mind. The idea that we learned one lesson from the last hundred years of history, like fascism is wrong. and people are walking around in a chairman Mao t-shirt. Do you know what Mao did? Do you know how many people he killed?

Yeah. And how many people Stalin died? And you go, oh, and they say it's never been tried properly. Yeah. What? Well, no one's saying that about national socialism, you lunatic. I know. But they really, they hate, they just hate America.

They really do hate America. And there's, they. I don't see it. I can't see what the, there is a, There is a we are imperialists and we cause suffering around the world. And we did it here and we continue to do it around the world. Sorry, there's no. There's just one side of the equation, yeah?

We just look at one side of the equation. We won't talk about the medicine. We won't talk about healthcare. We won't talk about, you know, the improvements in transportation. We won't talk about, you know, what's America given the world? Never mind culturally. But just in terms of, they're

airplanes. They're handy, aren't they? I'll tell you what's good. Motor cars. Aren't motor cars good? Isn't the modern city?

That's a nice place to live, isn't it? Like, the stuff that you just sort of take for granted in that equation where you go, yeah, imperialism,

bad, you don't take any of the, I mean, it's the, it's the perfection. It's the, if it's not perfect, then it's shit.

But that's my issue with communism as well is it's very much religious. So if you promise someone heaven, then, of course, by any means necessary. Right. Heaven for everyone, the perfect world, by any means necessary.

Right. It doesn't matter how many people need to die. We can get to this place. Right. So that's kind of religious elets, but also communists. Like if they're, they famously ask, I think it was Eric Hobbsbaum, who was the communist historian, and they asked him on his deathbed. They said, look, 30 million people, no, 60 million people have died in the quest for communism.

in Russia in no that was Russia China if you put it all together yeah I think it was 60 million I mean it's yeah the numbers don't even make sense and they said if it was

if communism could be achieved and it took another 60 million would it be worth it and he said yes well that's a mad man right you're mad you're mad as a nail 60 million people

yeah yeah but there is that undercurrent it is a very strange thing like, ah, it really is frustrating. This is, I'm sorry, I've probably said this on too many podcasts, but for me, traveling around America, it's, this is objectively the best place in the world and subjectively the worst. The idea that people think it's, oh, we're really divided as a nation.

Yeah. No. Right. No, you're not. You're thinking of Syria. Right. That's divided as a nation. You know, when you, compared to what?

Mm-hmm. What's your alternative? Yeah. It's kind of great. And we're living in these kind of amazing... I mean, I'm very positive as a person. Yeah, me too. And I think a lot of the time, kind of people, you know, saying they're communist.

What is your cousin, nephew? Where is he from? Back east. In New Jersey. And he's a communist, is he? Pretty close. Yeah. Yeah, pretty close.

I don't think they're going to take New Jersey. I just... I'll be honest with you. Yeah, there's just a hatred for the country. There's a hatred for both parties. There's a hatred for everything we've done. There's a great shame. If you have a flag, you're a fool.

If you say we've done great things, you're naive. I think the Cold War was won. How many people have been liberated from poverty the last 20 years? You know, through technology and through globalization, which was all facilitated by America. America didn't need to do that. Right. You know, just look at the fact.

It's America is a net exporter of fuel and a net exporter of food. You don't need the rest of the world. We need you. I don't know what's to hate. Right. I kind of don't get it. I don't get it either. And even on social issues, it's great to be frustrated as a young person and want things to be better.

That's great. I'm all for it. Yeah. But the way we treat women, the way we treat LGBTQ, it's so. so far ahead of most places in the world. I understand you being frustrated and it's not perfect, but just to be a woman in this country is much better than other places. And to say that we're like awful because it's not perfect, that argument is just... Yeah, I mean, I think the Stephen Pinker thing is, you know, the better angels of our nature, that idea of, look, this is the best

the world has ever been. And is it perfect? No, but it's, we're moving in a direction. Yeah, we're still heading there, right? Exactly. Yeah, it seems, I don't know. And that thing of like, comedy's in this wonderful place where it's, people are coming out and they're laughing and that doesn't happen in quite a lot of nations.

Right. Yeah. We're the, yeah, we're borsh is the main thing on the menu. Yeah, no, it's, it's joyful. I keep wanting to, like, pull them out of it. Like, you can't have fun. we can you can enjoy yourself it's not all it's not all falling apart yeah but it is a generational thing they do definitely feel and i think from seeing firsthand at a young age things on their phone

of like actually see the suffering that goes on in the world it creates an imbalance in their brains yes well it's also that thing of like um you know the kind of masloves hierarchy of need you know You need your food and your shelter and your safety kind of first before you can start thinking of these higher order things. Right. Purpose and meaning in life. And it strikes me that we've solved all of the low-level ones. Yeah. You know, people are not.

You don't even think about it. You don't, of course not. No, you know, there's no one that's poor in America as we would have understood poor 100 years ago. Mm-hmm. Because it's a different. Yeah. A third of the world don't have flushing toilets. Right.

It's, you know, we get used to this thing. And that's easy for us to say. Right. I'm sure as the comment section, good luck. But then everyone 100 years ago, when there was lots of poverty, had purpose. They kind of knew what they were meant to do. And often there's a lack of purpose. Yeah.

No, that is a big, that is a huge thing. I think it's a big thing for nations as well. It's a huge thing. There was it when, when there's a struggle and every day is going off and how we're going to survive today, you're not you're not thinking about your mood you're not thinking about

whether or not you're anxious or you just don't you've got work to do yeah and it's it's kind of a blessing and a curse to be as comfortable as we are

well is that the great sadness of kind of America and it used to be kind of the to feed a family and to bring up your kids and to provide for them you were kind of a hero

yeah kind of that was the you put bread on the table, literally and metaphorically, and you took care of your people, and you had your place in the world, you were a hero. I still subscribe to that. I still think the, you know. Oh, 100%.

Yeah. That thing of like the, was it the last special of the one before? You're doing great. You're doing great. Yeah, two ago. That's kind of that thing. It resonated.

It really did because, you know, people are going to watch it. Yeah. Thank you for saying it. That's what people would say. We're doing so well. We even made it out to a show. Right. We got everything's done.

Yeah. We booked a babysitter. We got the car, sort of, we got here here. Yeah. We've eaten. Yeah. It's actually, yeah. And then walking around, everyone's walking around with what's next.

How much more? How much more? How much more? How much more? Because people were literally coming up to me after shows saying, thank you for saying that. I feel like I'm doing the best I can. Everything's all right, right? I was like, I'm just a comedian up there throwing a line, but yeah, you're doing great.

Oh, thank you. I think it really suits you, yeah. What's the theme of the next one? What's the... It seems to be taking shape that my children have been raised and have left and I've completed a mission, and I have now the freedom to go back to discovering who I used to be and my wife as well. Yeah. Yeah.

No, I was, I was kind of. It's not as deep. It's a lot more personal. You know, it's a lot more of, oh, I can, I can drink now. What's this microdosing you guys are talking about? Yeah. All that kind of thing. It's kind of nice, though, isn't it, that idea of, I kind of found that with parenting,

it's like the, the bullshit involved in parenting. Well, you have to pretend you don't like watching TV for hours on end. And you love broccoli. I say what we're into, broccoli. Yum, yum, yum, yum, yum. Yeah. No, we, I, no. Me and your mother, we might, we'll smash a McDonald's and watch, you know, a

murder. A four-hour documentary on Netflix. That's a weekend, kids. Yeah. Never mind this. Oh, we love walking in the park. I know. We love fresh air and broccoli.

Yeah. Total bullshit. I feel like I say that in my act. I feel like I've been play acting. for 18 years. I've been pretending to be Superman, a guy who's fearless and has everything under control. And now my kids know I'm just a guy and they're lucky to be alive. The bit last night. The bit last night, I don't want to ruin the bit for this question. But the bit about the darkness, I found so funny. Oh, good. Yeah. Because you never, I don't know, it's, I suppose, that realization of like, it's very

Wizard of Oz. Yeah. The idea that you never really feel, no one ever goes, you were a grown up now. Right? We're all play acting. Yeah, you're just thrown in it. How old are your kids now? Oh, they're young. They're young. Yeah.

Yeah. I do take plenty of time. They're young. Yeah. Tini tiny. I get annoyed when they get things right. I get annoyed when they get things right. You know, like,

I know. Like when they can't say a word. Yeah. Uh-huh. And then they say it right and you go, well, they're never going to get it wrong again. I was thinking of this. Someone corrected my boy saying a word. You're doing.

It's adorable. Yeah. My daughter used to say avidicado. Avidicado. Avidicado. Of course. We've been saying avidicado ever since. There's no avocados in my house.

There's avidicados. Avidacados. It's nicer. What's the famous one? Butterflies, the famous one, isn't it? Butterflies. Butterflies? is a kid made a mistake. It was a flutterby.

A flutterby. And someone called it a butterfly. Stuck. I had, I was in New York and a hotel. And there was a, a fired alarm went off in the middle of the night. And, you know, in the hotel, you're like, am I really getting out of bed? Please. Is this place really a blaze?

This is crazy. Ladies, you've got to go. Classic Tompapa. You two have got to go. You can stay. And the guy came on, the head of security. came on and gave an announcement. And he was a guy who's never got over his childhood saying things wrong.

And he got on and said, everything's okay. Stay in your rooms. The fire twucks are here. That would make me think, if this guy's in charge, I'm going to leave. I'm not taking a chance. Get your shoes. The fire twucks are here.

A grown man. Adorable when there's a kid. When you're a kid, you're like... Was there anything more to the message? Did he say, so you might want to look out the windows because they've got the lights on? I like the wed ones. Oh.

Oh, so it was brilliant. I'm like, well, that didn't instill much confidence. It's adorable when he was two. I'm sure everyone applauded him. And he just stuck with it. Nice. Bless his little heart. What's your show tonight?

You have a big show tonight. I've got the, it used to be called the Ace Hotel and it's now called. It's where I was. It's now called the... United. No, it's now called the used to be the Ace Hotel. It really is. That's what it's now called.

That's how I was promoting it the whole time. You used to have a bit about that. I never quite made it work, I never made it to a special with the idea that says Pepsi should be called, is Pepsi all right? Because no one's ever ordered a Pepsi. Right. No, we don't know. I like a Coke.

It's Pepsi all right? Well, I think you know it isn't. But yeah, I guess. But your boss bought it, so give it to me. Beautiful theater. Have you been in there? Yeah, I know. Not been in.

Oh, it's gorgeous. If you get there, well, I know you get there right as they're saying your name. But after the show, take a look at the ceiling. When they walk in to a theater and they go, this is already good. Yes, this is running. That's what it is. It's gorgeous. We're in this place and we don't even have to sit through an opera.

Excellent. You're going to love it. And it's right up on you. It's a good one. Right. Yeah, I think you'll really enjoy it. This is our last chance because we're going to go back out and I'm going to go do a show in a different place

and you're going to do a show in a different place and hopefully we'll be closer and be able to see each other more often. Come out. Come to the rest of the world. I'll be there. All right. Have you taught in the UK? Have you?

A very little. I did the... I've got great news. Yeah. I've got great news. Your kids have left. Yeah. They did.

You can now travel the world. I know. You could now say, well, I'm going to do gigs in London and Scotland and Dublin, and I'm going to do gigs in Australia. And I'm going to do, I'm going to travel a little bit. Yeah. And you could, by the way, you don't have to work seven nights a week. You could just come to London and do two shows and stay there for five days and, you know,

that thing of like, how do you want your life to be? Yeah. I mean, you know. Amsterdam. People will, it's also that thing of like a three tour plans really good on that. Mm-hmm. Where you kind of go, well, the first one, I'll let them know who. I am.

Right. But those people are going to tell their friends because they have a great time. They'll be a bigger venue the next time, bigger. Right. And they just roll through it. But that thing of like, that could be amazing. I know. I know.

If only the, yeah, the dogs are going to have to pass. But we can work that out. How old are the dogs? Yeah. Not old enough. They're pretty healthy. Yeah. But they do a runaway instincts.

These kids are in college, yeah? Yes. Great news kids. Great news. We got your dog. Your mother and I are very worried about you. Security-wise, we got you a dog to look after. Yeah, that would be brilliant.

All right, we can ask each other one last question of each other because if we see each other at the comedy story, we won't ask a question in the same way that we would in an interview podcast setting. You, you... I go first. Yeah, let's set the tone. Okay. Let's see.

What do I want to know? do you i really got all the suit stuff out uh okay do you have you have now that you're father and you have little children uh do you feel like since you had children the world is a more hopeful place or a more fragile place? More hopeful. I mean, definitely more hopeful. Yeah. There's a great book by David Deutsch called The Beginning of Infinity.

And I read it, and it's basically this guy saying that the scientific meme is the great thing. There have been roughly 100 billion people that have ever existed, that we recognize as human beings. and there may be trillions in the future. We may go multi-planetary. We may go on for billions of years. This could be just the beginning of things. Isn't that an incredible thought? I like that.

To go, this could be the beginning of infinity. We're the cavemen. Yeah. Yeah. This is, and it will just expand and expand and expand. And at every point in the last 200 years, people have gone, oh my God, we've had such a run of progress. it's over now, of course.

This is the finished iteration of society. But what a run we had, the last 50 years. It could never increase again, obviously. But this has been amazing. And then it's increased and increased and increased and got better and better and better. I do have that feeling lately looking at cities. I feel like we're going to look at these cities that are really come as far as we can. We're going to look at them as caves.

We're going to look at them as rudimentary. tree forts that we built. They're just like big and clunky and misshaping. I tell you what doesn't get the praise it deserves, suburbia. Yeah. All the cities that are like the best places to live in the world, it's like Melbourne and Toronto.

Yeah. Places that urbanized relatively slowly. So they built outwards. Right. And they had great transport links in. So people could live out and have a house with a garden. Yeah. Front yard and the backyard and a great place to bring up kids.

Yeah. And those trees. Always like the nicest. Yeah. need to be in nature. Yeah. Because we've kind of lost God, so you need nature because you need to feel like something's bigger. Right. All right. I like that. More hopeful. Good job, kids. Question. Yes. Okay. When you pass, there's going to be an obituary. It's going to be on the news. Tom Pappa, National Treasure. Yes. They're going to play a clip of you. They're going to play a little bit of

you on stage in that moment. What joke? well for the message i think for the message i think it's the you're doing great the you're you don't realize it but you're this is prime time you're you're living it right now in the not too far distant future people are they ask you to do something and you're going to say are there stairs you're doing great and then and then the bitch will say someone ironically he died falling down the stairs. Right, exactly. And he couldn't make it.

But I have the one joke that I really love that people kind of linger on was a joke about how we're all disgusting when we sleep. All of us, we're all discussing when we sleep. Have you ever seen your favorite pillow without its pillow case? It looks like a bandage from the Civil War. for some reason. It's that image. It's a great turn of phrase.

You've never thought about a bandage from the Civil War before. It may never come up again, but you know exactly what you're talking about. Yeah. It's conjured it. A hundred percent. And just a name drop. I did a show for Clint Eastwood's family, and it was late at night. Well, they need cheering up.

They were, it was a... And we were at his hotel, and the restaurants were closed, and he's like, I'll try and get you some food, let's go over to the restaurant. And we're walking from the area to across this gravel driveway in the dark. Me, and Clint Eastwood. And Clint says, I got to tell you, every night when I go to sleep, I think about that Civil War bandage joke when I put my head on my pillow. Wow. I was like, I guess I'll retire. I guess that's it. I guess I'm not going to top it. It's not a lovely thing. Lovely.

Oh, so perfect. Yeah, so great. All right, we got it, Joey.