Breaking Bread with Tom Papa - Episode 227 - Robert Smigel

Episode Date: August 27, 2024

Robert Smigel and Triumph, the Insult Comic Dog, come on to Breaking Bread with Tom Papa! Triumph reveals secrets about his life as a bachelor. Smigel talks Triumph hurting people’s feelings and getting the truths that no one else can. Smigel recounts the beginning of his comedy career, the start of youtube, The Dana Carvey Show, working with Lorne Michaels, and the legendary SNL 25th anniversary show. Tom and Smigel recount memories of growing up in New Jersey. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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From binge all episodes exclusively on Paramount Plus And one of the things we bonded on was we were like the first two of that group to imitate Lauren Like, we discovered our Lorne impressions. Oh, really? Yeah, it's like, oh, you do them too? I'd be like, this kind of a thing. And he's like, yeah, yeah, I do.

He's like, yeah, I think the show's looking good. It's breaking bread. Welcome, Triumph. It's so nice to have you here. Oh, my goodness, I can't tell you. I can't tell you. This is so exciting for me, you know, because as a performer, you always want to challenge yourself.

You always want to stretch, you know? And in this case, it's, How low can I go in show business? It's very exciting. I believe this is the lowest point in my entire career since the time I was molested by Alf. Back in the 80s. Well, Triumph, we like to start our podcast off with a toast.

And allow me to toast you. You have been an inspiration and a show business icon. So here's to you. Here's to me. Okay. Okay, we're done with that? Good. Okay, back to my jokes.

No, it's great. No, that was terrific. Tom Papa, so exciting. So exciting to be looking across from you in a shitty fake restaurant. Tom Papa, my God. How long have you been doing podcasts now? Probably about eight years. See, that's beautiful.

It just goes to say the old saying is true. Podcasts never get canceled. That's the beauty of podcasts. They just keep going. There's no ratings. Doesn't matter whether anyone's listening or not. No one's in charge of saying, enough. Oh, wait a minute.

I shouldn't say that because you also work for serious. Yes. A whole other show on serious XM satellite radio. Yes. That's true. beta max of broadcasting isn't it does anyone it comes truck drivers a lot of

truck drivers really they they don't have access to uh you know telephone where they can just put what's the name of the one that Joe Rogan the Spotify

truckers are that dumb they don't know how to operate their phone to put on Spotify and avoid yeah we've got to listen to Tom Papa's episode with Robert Smyga. That's, oh no, this is a podcast. Yeah, this is the podcast. This isn't the radio show.

Thank God they can turn away. This is the podcast. Oh, good. Which, yeah. And they can, and some people actually see this, right? Yeah, it's, uh, yeah, on the YouTube. You could be, you could, people can see you on YouTube. Isn't the point for you to not be viewable? No offense, but I mean, you know, we all know how you, you know, you, you know, I

I mean, he's had a great career. He's a great stand-up, and he hosted that game show, the marriage ref, and he made the natural transition into shitty podcast. The lifeboat. The cruise ship of broadcast. I like that's sorry. That's okay. You know what I want to know is why not, why do you call it Breaking Bread, yes? because I'm a bread baker and I feel like breaking bread.

I'm sorry. No, I'm back. I'm back. I'm back. Why not? But I just, did anyone ever suggest the Papa podcast? The Papa podcast. No, I never heard that.

Papa Papa Papa podcast. No. See, that would have been. It's yeah. There's still time. There's still time. No one's seen this show. Right.

Just start fresh. We're here with Tom. Papa, on the Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa, Podcast. This way, you know what else is good? What? This frees up Breaking Bread for when, uh, who's the short guy from that show, the sidekick? Which guy?

The actor, what was the guy who, next to Brian Cranston? Oh, and Breaking Bad? Yeah, and Breaking Bad. Yeah, what's his name? Yeah, what's his name? The, uh, the actor in, uh, Breaking Bad. Google, we make an edit here. Yeah, Google it.

While you Google it. Aaron Paul. Aaron Paul. Yeah, no, see, here's the thing. Now that you freed up that name. Right. Breaking Bread with Aaron Paul for when his money dries up in a couple of years. And like every has been from every popular show, they start the podcast going over episodes.

Episode by episode. Breaking Bread with Aaron Paul right after, they pop, pa, pa, pa, Wow, this is very exciting. We're all set. I've done my work. Well, hold on, trying, because I have, we did a deep dive. And there have been people that say that you and Robert Smigel are somehow together. But it seems we've come up, we found a couple different photos. It seems like maybe you and Smigel are not.

one in the same. Really? This was a picture of you at the Playboy Mansion? I don't know who you're talking about with this Robert Smigel's nerdiness. If you're talking about this thing underneath me, this growth coming out of my ass,

I've been to many doctors and I can't get it removed. It's not safe. So I just call him crouching grouching loser, hidden Jew. Here is a, Oh, there's more?

Yeah, there's here. Here's you at spring break. Oh, okay, yes. Surrounded by a lot of... I remember that, yes. That was in Las Vegas in... No, not Las Vegas. That was in Daytona Beach.

Uh-huh. And, yes, after we partied with those girls, I met up with Tony Orlando, and I helped him, me and Scooby-Doo helped him bury some hookers in the... And it's... I have never seen this show, but is this true that you are, it's doing a Vegas show, Triumph without Smigel with Rita Rudner?

No, it's supposed to say without Smigel and Reader Rudner. That's the big draw. It's a Vegas show without Reader Rudner. That's the main, actually, her name, without Reitha Rudner is in the big letter. And then it says, Triumph also without Smigel. I'm telling you, not of coin that way

you should try it maybe call this show without Reader Rudner starring Tom Papa Papa Papa Papa Papa Bagas Bram guaranteed no Redner without read the Reddner

to say your name sold already all right oh you're so wonderful to have you here you've been a great this has been a wonderfully mediocre podcast

for me to poop Oh, no. Magic. Absolutely. Oh, that was beautiful. What was beautiful. Oh, hey, Nate, nice to see you, Robert. Hi.

Nice to see you. No, it's okay. We were just... Oh, you know, we need the real... Oh, shit. Like I said, what happened? God. What was that?

I was accosted by Triumph. Oh, that guy. Who really is... Man in the ass. it's like the beauty of him is that he really can get to the inner demons in everybody's head I don't think he meant the word of what he said I overheard as I was climbing up seven flights of stairs so my breathing was drowning it out oh so but no I uh no he didn't mean any of that although I do like the pop pop pop pop pop pop I like it too it's really funny it's like Aaron Paul can you

over and like do it and like and like and like re brand something i remember saying the colin quinn once i was like i was like why don't i you know you see these guys with characters like doing stand-up and it's like larry the cable guy and people like that i'm like why don't i come up with a character and i was like but then i'd lose all my people he goes you don't have that many people what people are you talking about when suddenly he's got people you really who are you disappointing with this zigzag of your career It's not exactly Garth Brooks. Oh, man.

That's seriously, Aaron Paul, he's got that gambling app money going. Right, yeah. Gambling commercials are going to get banned at some point, right? Yeah, there's going to be a big problem. All that, the bottom's got to fall out. I mean, how are we even allowing that? I know. My kids love sports, and like every commercial,

is for a betting app. I know. And then it's like their favorite people like Charles Barkley in the middle of the, see a little inset with Kenny Smith. What do you think, Kenny? I'll, you know, and he's like, they're suddenly talking in this pre-scripted. They're the coolest guys on TV. And then they're suddenly like, I think minus five.

Yeah. It's just like, so sad. I would jump on that bed. I know. And it's advertised on college campuses. Like there's going to be. Yeah, exactly. It's targeted toward the most vulnerable people.

Yeah. Imaginable. Yeah. It's got to be a problem. I can't believe no one, I guess I'm going to have to enter politics, too. If you don't, if you want to wonder, if you want to wonder what gambling can do to people, visit Atlantic City. Oh, I've seen it. Where I just performed last week is rough.

Oh, no, it's just the cargo pants and the sweat and the elderly. and is anything sadder than spending your golden years in front of a machine watching your money go away joyless too I know right there's just no one cracks a smile no and then the money finally comes and then they have a seizure I remember their bodies can't handle a jackpot that would be the worst thing that could happen to them I performed it the Tropicanna in the beginning of my career in the Lenox City. And I think it was my wife was performing, and I was there.

I don't know. But anyway, on the monitor, we watched them. Someone married him? We watched somebody taking all the tables out of the front row in front of the stage. I'm like, what's happening? Why are they doing that? It was to make room for all the carts, the people's elderly fat carts. coming in and in parking.

They had to move the table. That's what you want in the front row. That's exactly what you want. It's so insane. When you found Triumph, yeah. This is kind of happened to me in my life, just in life.

Like, did you, doing his voice, did you, were you able to riff at a faster level than you can just normally? Like, there's, Definitely, definitely. Is that a strange thing? Well, you're freed up to be meaner and release your id. Yeah.

You know, I mean, I'm just a nerdy, you know, I'm still a nerd deep down. And like, the other, like, I got to do that on Conan, not just with Triumph, but like when that show started, we created this bit where he speaks to photographs, like celebrities' photographs. And they always cut the lips out and it was always, almost always me. And it was like this amazing release to just be able to do the silliest impression and say whatever the hell we wanted. And by the way, I don't write a lot of people write Triumph with me and a lot of people wrote those bits. Right. So there is riffing within scripted stuff. Yeah.

Yeah. There's, yeah, it's a strange thing when you put on like a veil that you could actually. Oh, yeah. It just frees something up in you. And the beauty of triumph is that it's also. So just this level of silliness and absurdity that makes people, people's feelings aren't hurt. Right. When this little stupid puppet is doing it, it has sort of a four-gesture kind of quality.

Right. As opposed to like an aggressive-looking comedian saying the exact same thing. Yeah. I mean? When he was in the Ted Cruz's face. Oh, yeah. So great. That line about Trump neutering him.

Oh, yeah. That was an improv. that was he gave me a softball though that was if i feel like i should have turned in my triumph card if i didn't come up with that one because he literally said like the democrats remember the democrats were the ones who had you neutered and it was right at the time where he had just he was just groveling for trump after being accused of uh his dad right trump said right killed kennedy with Oswald. Yeah, it was Raul and then the whole thing about his wife not being as hot as Melania.

Right. Yeah. And then he, then triumph just comes right back. Yeah, yeah. That was satisfying. I give myself credit because the improv was, like I said, I thought it was a softball, but I was surrounded by hate all around me. Like, I didn't think I was going to get to talk to Ted Cruz that time.

I was there to cover the campaign. I thought maybe I'd yell at him. right from a distance but he saw me he saw the puppet and uh and he's so he loves comedy he also thinks he's really funny wow so he's like triumph get over here yeah he was like i'm ready i'm prepared oh my god yeah i had made fun of him a couple of years ago on a hulu special that i did and i'm sure he had seen it so right some of these things i he probably had imaginary conversations with triumph in the shower. I can get them.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then afterward, he actually, I'll give him credit, he said, he actually went high-five triumph. And I had to give him the paw back. You know, I had that long, ridiculous paw. But then I cut it out of the piece. It was on Colbert's show. I didn't want that to be a meme, you know.

Right. Or a gif of triumph high-fiving Ted Cruz out of content. That's nice. then he comes over and he wants to talk comedy with me he did bob no what do you think about saturday night live what do you think about it i think it's gotten too political i was like well i kind of think all comedy's gotten too political which is yeah because of people like him right just infuriate just the rage i divide the country yeah i know did you have when you were a kid did you have Did you have like screw around time where you were, I used to do this thing with popsicle sticks and put little faces on them.

Oh yeah? And I would do little impressions. Like I would have like a stack of them and just kind of like flick through. Oh, that's great. Were you doing that kind of thing when you were a kid? I had different stages. I think when I was super young, I used to, I was really into drawing. That was the first real skill that I had that like people were like, maybe.

me feel special and i could draw like fred flintstone and charlie brown like really pretty well when i was five years old wow i just ran with that and wanted to be a cartoonist and then i just started drawing my friends in class and that was another way that you know i got my uh you know whatever my comedy yaya's out and and made friends and people loved me for being the funny guy who could do that and then i started impersonating all my friends and my teachers, and I would write songs. That was the other thing I would do, is write jingles.

Oh, yeah. Like little 30-second jingles about people to make fun of them. How old are you doing this? This is like nine, ten years old. It was like, I always liked writing songs, but never seriously. But then I ended up doing a comedy album and writing classics like Underage Bishon. We'd like to thank the good people at Quince for sponsoring today's program. If you spend a lot of time cooking at home, it's time to elevate your game.

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Yeah, with Weird Al. Oh, yeah, yeah. That was great. That run that you had of doing Weird Al type of songs to Weird Al. It was so funny. I know, and now Weird Al wants me to, I told him someone on Twitter said,

you should do a whole album covering Weird Al. Like, the way it's like, like, Ele Fitzgerald would do like, Ella does Ellington. Right. You know? It would be like Triumph does Weird Al.

It's just an entire album of songs that Weird Al did not parody. Just shitty. So inane. Yes. Incredibly shitty. Weird Al parodies.

So people, if you listen to, if you see the show, it was like, I would do, I sang something like Stevie Nix landslide and I would say to Weird Al,

oh my God, that was such a touching one. The parody of landslide. What was it, Mudslide, you know, well, I've been drinking Starbucks latte and Chipotle is right next door. You know, and it just goes on about straight out my acid pours. It's like that kind of thing. All about just taking a huge dump.

And see my reflection in the blue water bowl and the mudslide will turn it. brown yes the mudslide turn it brown and weird al yankovic everyone one of his best he's going i didn't do that now please he's so modest oh weird al you're so modest yeah those are really fun those game shows that i yeah they're really good they're really funny michael winslow is the he was the announcer i mean i've done him i actually wanted to do it as a podcast and i started one i did one in 2019 And back then, I did it in Brooklyn with Pete Davidson and Lawrence O'Donnell and Scaramucci. Wow. And it went really well.

And the announcer was Black Wolf, the Dragon Master, who if you know, the time Triumph went to Star Wars. Oh, God. Who doesn't know that? Black guy who was a wizard, dressed as a wizard. With his fish sandwich. Yes. Your fillet of fish. So he was my announcer, which was sadly he passed away.

but Michael Winslow has done it for me a couple of times. Right. Yeah. Man, the impact of that Star Wars Triumphus thing in New York, that was on Conan, right? That was on Conan. But what really made it famous was that was the first thing I ever did that went viral on the web. And it was before YouTube. It was something called I Film, I think, was the name of the website.

and it was kind of like YouTube and they actually I think coined the term viral video and like the thing did great on the show yeah I thought okay that's it right you know maybe in normal I'll tell people when the reruns on right it's so crazy and then like a few months later I started getting it in emails from people and they showed me this link like this is so fucking funny I you never saw it and then that was the beginning of wow of when the things that was the first thing from the Conan show that that hit that way and then and it was so ironic so then here's what happened so then a couple of years later i do this michael jackson trial uh-huh go to the michael jackson trial in santa maria which was incredibly challenging because like you know his most devoted fans came from all over the world to protest yeah and they're all dressed in these crazy outfits they were perfect straight men they were so mad at triumph they would literally, if I was, if I would get any of them to be interviewed, people right, right off camera would start screaming, fuck, fuck, fuck, like to ruin the audio. Yeah, we had to stay like an

extra day to calm them down. But anyway, we got a great big piece out of it. Yeah. And then people started talking. I brought lemonade and, and seriously, and sun tan, sun, sunblock. Wow. And, uh, friended them. Yeah, yeah. And they were. like, oh, we're just, we're just, we're just desecrating the reputation of your, you're here. You're idol. We're just reocating your, here's some lemonade. And we got just enough people to make the piece work. And it did great on this I film thing.

And then NBC, finally NBC like catches drift of this and takes it down. And I went through this whole back and forth. And Jeff Ross, the Conan producer, tried to make the case. Like, this is good for the show. No, it's our property. No, we can't do the. And like literally six months later, Lazy Sunday

happens on Saturday Night Live with Andy Sandberg and the only island. And that becomes, and that basically invented YouTube. Right. YouTube existed, but no one heard of it. And that became this enormous thing. And then suddenly all the networks catch on. Right.

And now we have what we have today, which is, you know, nobody watches anything live anymore. No, it's crazy. Except for the Tom Brady roast, I think. Yeah, I know. It was insane. Yeah. Has Triumph been on any of those roasts of the big roast?

I haven't done a lot of those roasts. And there are a couple of reasons. One is, I feel like there's something about what Triumph does out in the field and in one-on-ones is that's what makes him different. When he's doing it right to people's face in that kind of setting. And I've done a couple of them. I did years ago, I did Rob Reiner's and it was great. And then I did, Alec Baldwin asked me to do his. He loves triumph.

Right. So I did it. And that did, that was good. Okay. You know, Nikki obviously stole that one. It was amazing. Right. And the new one.

And the new one. Yeah, yeah. But, um, but, you know, I was fine. But I always, I always felt like, you know, he, he's not that different than everybody else when he's just at a podium, just telling him. just telling jokes. It's not quite the same. Yeah.

So it's not that exciting for me to do roasts. But I probably should have done more because the visibility is so great. But I really enjoy stuff I do on Conan. And then after Conan went off the air, he was cool with me doing stuff on Colbert. So I did that Ted Cruz bit. Yeah. Colbert. And I did a few things, political things for him.

And now this summer I did a bit for The Daily Show and I'm going to do some more for them. Oh, cool. Yeah. Oh, it's so great. I mean, do you get nervous when you're in those situations? Like the cruise one, when you're surrounded by all that hate? I was definitely. Do you have any nervous?

But there's something, something just clicks. Like, fear actually just sets your neurons in motion. They're just firing out of fear. Like, okay, I've got to focus. Right. You know, and I'm just in the moment. And I'll just stay in the moment and I'm triumphant. and I'm not really thinking about it.

And, you know. But just like even like putting them in your bag and like walking back to your cars. Like, I mean, really like seeing Jordan Klepper like on. Oh, yeah. Like it's, I really, I don't know if I have that in me to go stand among those people. You know, sometimes it's been, there have been times where people have more after Trump got elected. like I went to the inauguration for Conan. Trump's inauguration in 2017.

And it was a different vibe because I had covered a Trump rally in Iowa earlier that year in 2016. But this was the celebration. This was their, you know, biker prom, whatever. Right. And there were bikers there and one biker was like, what the fuck are you doing, man? The fuck out of here. with that fucking shit

and another guy's like brother brother it's okay he's just he's just a comedy guy it's nothing calm down brother it's like they're all like you know so weird multiple Hulk Hogan conversations and then

and then and then a couple of different people yeah like literally broke my cigar like I'm like hi how you doing they're just like nope we're not taking

that shit anymore. We're in power. Yeah. And then, but there were been other times, one time I was covering Ted Cruz and, a woman started crying because of it. We made fun of Ted Cruz in different ways.

We had him hawking. Triumph was hawking Ted Cruz T-shirts. I can't remember one of them was, oh, shit. Well, the one that made her cry was, made her cry. It did. And I understood it.

It was like the t-shirt said, I support a woman's right to cruise. Uh-huh. You know, so. Or no. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, because it was making fun of his abortion. Yeah. So it was like an, and she was like, she just, it was a, you know, a Latina woman.

And she was in her 50s and she just starts, you know, crying earnestly about murdering babies, you know, and making light of it. And I, you know, just broke character and, like, just talk to her for a little bit.

Right. I'm sorry. It's just, you know, I understand your position. I understand this position. And it's just, you know,

yeah. People, uh, it's just meant to be a joke, but I, I, I'm sorry if, uh,

hurt your feelings. And, uh, and I'm not, I don't mean to dismiss it. I know it's a complicated issue, blah, blah, blah. Right, right. But yeah, I mean, you know, because the last thing I ever wanted to do,

I really don't like hurting people. Right. I really don't. And usually, almost always, when I go up to someone, I ask in advance if I can talk to them. Oh, you do? Yeah. Right. Yeah, unless it's somebody really repellent, like Lindsey Graham or something like that.

Yeah. Because there's no way he's going to say yes. Right. Yeah. You got to ambush. And I have enough anger in me. that I can get over my impolite, my anxiety

about being impolite. But in general, I really like to, I don't like to dehumanize people that way. Right. Like I've seen people, like I'm not a Marjorie Taylor Green fan, but I've seen people like run up to her

and just call her names and make fun of her, like, you know, her body and whatever. And I just couldn't do that. Yeah. Couldn't do it that way. It is a weird thing when you see some of them just out in the world.

We were seeing like Anne Coulter at the comedy seller. She was just like came in and like and it's like and even watching like Tucker Carlson is on this run of podcast now where he's going and like buddying up to people. Right, the Joe Rogans of the world. And it's just like Tony.

This guy, you don't get like to them it's a game. Exactly. To them it's just a game. Exactly. And they can be busted lying and then be like, And then they're the ones calling out liars supposedly. And it's, I know, I can't get over the thing of not,

I cannot absolve you from the responsibility of all of your broadcasting and, yeah, and lying to people for all this time. You're not cool now. There are certain people that I won't engage even as triumph, because I don't want to give them oxygen. Mm-hmm. You know, even if it's making fun of them, I just like, like some of the people you mentioned, I see, I feel like there are people.

that I don't even think mean everything they say, as if that's some revelation. But no, but there are people specifically who really don't mean what they say, and they really just want to provoke and divide. And I don't want to give them any more... No. FaceTime or, you know, even if it's a comedy bit

where I'm making fun of them. I just... Well, there's that danger. It's like responding to people on Twitter. Yeah. You know, people who get into fights on Twitter with people who are shitting on them, them, they're just feeding them.

You're giving them fuel. Yeah. You're giving them fuel. I saw this documentary on political satire. And it was really, I forget where it was, but it was well done because it was talking about that line of, it happened in the UK where they were really coming after Margaret Thatcher and stuff with these puppets and stuff. Yeah.

Yeah. And it happened with Sarah Palin on SNL, you know, when Tina was doing that. Oh. And it was that- Tina made a point of not having a chummy moment with her. Yeah. She was like, if she's going to come on the show, I do not want to have one of these tap, tap, tap, tap.

Oh, it's you kind of. Right, right. And we're cool now. Yeah, she made it very clear that that wasn't going to happen. But just being on the show, just being in the environment, it kind of, you give them a little bit of. Oh, without a doubt. We're cool.

Like, you're in on it. You're kind of, we're all cool together. And it's like the thing that you're being really incitement. and kind of nailing them in the early rounds. Right. It starts, they kind of like get co-opted into it and then it kind of... No, they're like, this will be good for me. It shows I can take a joke.

It shows I'm here. Oh, the funniest one of that was when I overheard once. I don't know if we're on or not, are we? We don't have to be. No, we can be. Okay, yeah, okay, cool. Yeah. One time, so I did this show Look Well with Conan.

It was a vehicle for, Adam West, the original Batman, and he played a has been who had starred in a detective show in the 70s, and he's mostly out of work now, but he thinks he can solve crimes. So he bothers the police, he harasses the police, and he ropes in people in his acting class to help him solve crimes. And it was very funny, but it didn't get picked up by NBC. It's like 1991. It was a single camera. comedy. Too early. No laugh track. Yeah. Right. So it was very different at the time.

Yeah. Anyway, Bernie Brillstein, legendary manager, represented Conan. Well, Howard Klein was his manager, but he was under this Brillstein. Oh, and Brillstein was also Lauren's manager, Lord Michael's manager. So we hear Brillstein getting this call from an executive name of Rick Ledwin at NBC.

Oh, yeah. And we just... Are you fucking kidding me? you're going to pick up that piece of shit, Tooncis the Cat? And not Adam West? Adam's fucking hilarious in that show, Rick. And this was Lauren's show, too. It was from Saturday Night Live, ToonSys the Cat. But Bernie himself was only producing The Lookwell Show because that was Conan's,

whatever. He didn't have a stake in Toonis. That was only Saturday night. That was only NBC in Browell's show. Broadway video. But he still learns his client and he's like, you're going to pull on that fucking tunes his show and it's going to fucking bomb. Anyway, that was the funniest way I've ever heard one of my projects.

Right, exactly. Getting to hear third hand from 200-pound old, old manager. It's nice to hear like somebody really caring, though. You know what I always picture? I always picture representation being like, You're not going to pick it up? Okay, well, yeah. But I've got this other guy, and he ain't interested.

Right, right. You know, that old school manager thing of like, I always pictured like one guy. I'm going to cut your fucking balls off. You understand that. Let me make myself clear. You're no longer going to have balls as of tonight at 8 p.m. Yeah, it wasn't Leno's, Leno had a manager that was like that. Yeah, she had that same reputation of.

What do I have? Helen did it all? I don't know anything about it. I barely know the woman. Helen's the one who planted the room. I didn't know. How could I know? I only talk to her day and night. She had a wire when I was in the closet listening in to Warren Littlefield. Now I'm getting really inside here. Yeah, exactly. I'm sorry, Jay. I'm sorry, Jay. I'll let it go. What was your first thing with Lauren? Was it Funhouse? Was it that stuff? No, I actually was hired as a writer at SNL. What was that year in 1985? Holy shit. 85?

I'm really old. Wow. Yeah, I was hired. I was a Chicago improv guy. I had a show with a bunch of people. And Franken and Davis were shooting a movie. Oh, man. They were not part.

of Saturday Night Live, they were, you know, flailing in their careers. And now they were making a low-budget comedy that was being shot in Chicago. And one of my friends who was in my comedy group got cast in it. He was very funny. And they loved him. And so they came to see our show. They really liked it and took us out for beers afterward. We had a great time.

And it was like, nice validation. Okay, that was nice. Yeah. And then two weeks later, I'm looking at TV Guide, which was the only source of news back then, like that front page of the non-glossy part. And it said that Lauren Michaels was returning to Saturday Night Live after five years, and he was hiring Al Franken and Tom Davis as producers. And I just was like, how is this possible?

Wow. And I was like, I know the people now. In the book. They like me. And then sure enough, we got, three of us got to audition, and one of us came very close to being hired. as an actor on the show, this guy, Doug Dale, and, but I ended up being the one person

who was hired as a writer. And I worked there for eight years. Did you audition his talent though? Only, only, I didn't get to the real audition stage. Like the three of us did some bits from our show. Okay. We did them in Chicago in like a talent agency and Lauren just watched us like, hmm.

And then he clearly only liked the guy that got close. Yeah. So he's just like, Doug, where are you from? Just like I didn't exist at that point. It was hilarious. It was my first encounter with Lauren Michael's idiosyncrasy. Right.

But I love him, and he's done everything for me since then. Yeah. But yeah, it was very intimidating when I got hired, and I thought he hated me for a good year. Oh, really? Pretty much. Does he know what he's doing, or that's just what he does?

I still don't know. I think it's kind of what he does. Uh-huh. And other people like, oh, no, he's manipulating everything. You know, some of the things people write in the, or say in those SNL books are pretty severe. I don't know, you know. I, I, all I know is,

I mean, I think the show, here's, here's something interesting. So a couple of years later, so I did that show, then I left, started the Conan show, that was great, did that for a year and a half. And then I did the Dana Carvey show on ABC. Man. It was a disaster, but I was like the Lorne of that show.

The first time I was in that position of running a sketch show. Right. And we hired people who were complete unknowns, but by like the third week, I felt this stress of like, they're mad at me because I didn't pick their sketch. I felt like what Lauren must feel. Yeah. And like, and I remember calling him. I went out of my way to call him and just say, I just want to say, I'm sorry.

Like, I don't think I've ever understood what it's like to be in that position where you're constantly set up to disappoint people after week. And, you know, so I think there's like, I think it's a back and forth. There's an inherent, because I wasn't behaving in any kind of manipulative way. And I was like trying to be really touchy feeling. but people still I could feel it I could feel the resentment coming from certain people

and they were getting in their sketches or writers too and I remember just having to tell him I just like it's I get it I get it's so strange to be in that position and so I'm sure that

that affects him in a way did he kind of acknowledge it like he laughed he laughed he's like because he knows it it must have really amused him because I was like a squeaky wheel at times at SNL. I was like

how many years? I was there for eight years and I'm just not one time he said to me Robert you have no poker face. I can see every emotion, everything you're thinking without you don't have to say a word and I got it. It was true. I'm just not, I was raised

by like Jewish parents who yelled at each other but they were like madly in love with each other. Right. And it just wasn't that kind of nobody held stuff in. No reserve. Yeah. held stuff in and they also treated me like i was the second coming so there was that i had a lack of perspective you know i just basically went from you know a couple of years of trying improv in chicago to getting on this show at relatively young age so it's quick yeah so it's i think it's very

easy and then you just get caught up in the competition you know and i don't like competition i hate it Uh-huh. But you're just, you just live and die with what happens, the decisions that are made, because it's so claustrophobic there. Everything, you know, the hours are really intense. Mm-hmm. And your whole life becomes that show. And then you walk home, you know, or the next day you're trying to be a normal person,

but you're just reliving Saturday night. Yeah. You know, the whole day. Who did, did you have talent that, like, was like your camp? you I mean there were people I loved everybody I in the cast you know I mean Dana it was but there were people that I was drawn to both as comedically or personality wise and Dana Carvey was really more than anybody as a as a performer my guy because I love to do voices and I love to make silly music out of comedy right and so the

two of us, and one of the things we bonded on was we were like the first two of that group to imitate Lorne. Like, we discovered our Lauren impressions. Oh, really? Yeah, it's like, oh, you do him too? Yeah, I do like, this kind of a thing. And he's like, yeah, yeah, I do, like, I think the show's looking good. He had this weird, like, thing that he ended up dropping later from the impression, but I loved it. It was really surreal. Yeah. I like taking it to the silliest levels. And I actually did something similar to that on the anniversary show. The 25th anniversary show was so strange because so I now I was back and I was doing TV Funhouse cartoons. They were very successful.

And so Lauren asked me to make a cartoon for the SNL 25th anniversary show. And I remembered being part of the 15th one. And I was like, and I just had such an attitude when I was younger. Like, not that I don't anymore, but I, I, I quell it more now because I have kids and I have the perspective of real life now. Yeah. But back then it was like, fuck, man, I'm going to make fun of the anniversary show, you know, because I remember thinking the 15th was like kind of pompous. It's just people at podiums celebrating and showing clips and making corny banter. And so I made it.

And also there's this, there is a protocol of like, where people get to sit. Because he invites every host ever and every cast member ever. Right. And there's definitely like, you know, Eddie Murphy's not going to be on the balcony. Right. He's going to be, you know. So I wrote a whole song about Lauren, a patter song about,

and he's running around with cards that he's putting on seat. But if Paltrow's in Road 1, Gary Kroger's in the back, you know. I don't remember the lyrics, but he's just dancing around taking all this delight in his power, you know. And this year, I don't even know where I'm going to sit. We're going to have you suspended from the ceiling. The writers, there'll be a rope, it'll be comfortable, there'll be a little cushion. underneath so that you're not completely in full dangling mode. But you'll get a good view of, you know, Kelsey Grammer's hairline.

Whatever. But anyway, we, so I did this cartoon. And Lauren didn't really know about it until, like, it was done. And it kind of freaked him out. Oh, really? Yeah. And so he couldn't tell if it was going to come off mean and make the show feel. I don't think he was that worried.

He's got a pretty thick skin. If you read the Tom Shales, Jim Miller book, it's not like Lauren stopped them from having people say horrendous things about him. Right. There are certain people like Harry Shearer who just like, it's amazing what they say in that book. Yeah. But Lauren's cool with it because he's like, hey, this is reality.

it'd be but this is like his anniversary show you're right so he literally calls me into his office and like at two hours before the show and paul simon's the only other person in the room and he's like i i'm too close to it i i can we play it in front of paul and see i just want to get paul's take and just see if you know if it's too much i i can't judge i'm too close to it so so it's the strangest and i'm just thinking back to like 14 year old me. Yeah. You know, or whatever age I was when the show started and how much I love the show.

And I love Paul Simon and, you know, bridge over trouble, everything. I love Simon and Garfunkel. And just 14 year old me, if you had told me 25 years from now, you're going to be in a room with Lauren Michaels and Paul Simon making both of them uncomfortable. It's so crazy. It's insane. It's like, it's not like I could enjoy it. It felt so bad that he was like not taking it necessarily that great.

And so Paul Simon watches it completely stone-faced. And one section of it literally has, because before he gets into the song, I have him like hawking SNL merchandise. I'm like making fun. I was really in my rebel mode and I'm like, I'm going to make fun of the commercialism of the show that they never would have done in the 70s. these man. So it's like here's Chico Esquela's very, very good soda.

You know, and here's a Dennis Miller squeeze toy. He presses the button, and chach, cha. And then he gets into the song. Oh, no. And here's a preview of the 45th anniversary show 20 years later. And it's literally, it's already happened. on the 40th. It was Dana and Mike Myers doing Wayne's World, except I made them really old and fat. They looked a lot better on the 40th, but they did it.

And it was Paul Simon, literally Paul Simon, singing still crazy after all these years, which he did on the 40th. But this was the 45th, and it was literally a skeleton with a toupee and a guitar. Say, it's still crazy.

after all is. And Paul Simon's watching this. But he's already established himself as being completely stone-faced through everything else. It's not like you put any pressure on himself to laugh. Because he hadn't laughed once when that thing came on. And the whole thing finishes, the whole song, dancing, Lauren, putting cards.

And Paul Simon never makes a move. And then it's over. And Paul, any thoughts? And Paul's just like, well, Well, it's not very funny, but I didn't think it was very funny, but I did think it was affectionate. And I took this huge sigh of relief because honestly, that's what I cared about. Right. By far.

Just them, yeah. More than the other thing. Funny I'll worry about. I'd already played it for like Paul Schaefer and Lorraine Newman and John Lovitz. John Lovitz was in it at the end and he's like, you got to see this. And they're all laughing. So I knew that it would be funny to the right people. Right.

I wasn't so worried about that. But when he said that, I just had this huge sign. And I almost, and again, it was like, don't have a poker face. So I wasn't cool about it. I was like, oh, see, Paul, yeah, no, that's what I was going for. I was like, yeah, okay, shut the fuck up. Robert, just shut, Robert. Don't fuck with me.

Just walk out of the room. I'm going to put it on the show. Enough. See you after the show. And he had out. Baldwin set it up. Uh-huh. A little disclaimer, like,

Alec Baldwin's like, everybody, every, every office space, everywhere in the world, people love to make fun of the boss. But it's always with affection at SNL. So here's our little affectionate tribute.

That's one. And the man in charge, Lauren Michaels. So he, like, softened it before. And then it played, and I think people were afraid to laugh, to be honest with you.

For real? It didn't do that great. Didn't do that great. Really? It was no comparison to, like, John Lovitz and Paul Schaefer laughing in the dressing room. So my expectations were way high after the dressing. Yeah. Do you think it plays funnier if he doesn't set it up that way?

No, not necessarily. I think people in just the room were like, I'm supposed to laugh at this. Right, right. I think there was a little of that. Right. And after, but what did happen was there's a moment at the end where he's going, Kajic, my. And he's like, like, dressed like Liza Minnelli or something.

and he's a show and he's still holding this note and it just goes on and then people started applauding spontaneously and I felt that they were applauding him I really felt it was like a heart felt and I told Lauren afterward

and he was like yeah maybe he's just he's just amused at this point that I'm just trying to dig myself out of this thing but I really felt it I'm like sitting down with him after the show and I said, did you hear that applause?

Because he never came out. He never even came out. Oh, wow. And I think, and I actually worried then, well, did he not come out? Because I made him feel like he was a, you know, a glory hog or something. Right, right. About that. But that moment, at least, was a huge, the biggest applause of the cartoon got. Yeah. And I said to him, I really think that was just applause for you, not the cartoon.

Right. That's nice. And he really believed it, but he just laughed and just, like. like, yeah, okay. But what a unique relationship it must be for you? Because, I mean... It is. I mean, just from that story in Chicago, like, just...

That's the beginning. That's the germ... A lot of people have those kind of stories with them. But for you to, like... Evolving. ...and to go, leave and come back. And, like... Yeah.

I mean, that's such a unique, unique thing. It is. And I think a lot of people go through things like that with him where they eventually feel really close to him, you know, because, you know, you get past the stress and you see how much he appreciates you. When I did the cartoons, he treated me just like a princess, I used to say. What was the first one? The first cartoon I ever did, the ambiguously gay duo.

That was the first. I had actually done it on the Dana Carvey show because I wanted the Dana Carvey show to have different books to it. And the things I thought is we should do cartoons. And so we did that one there. Okay. And then that show got canceled. Which was crazy, by the way. If I could just put a, just stop for a second.

Sure. That was 95? Dana Carvey. Dana Carvey was 96. Yeah. 96. Yeah. Because I, just as I was starting comedy. Oh, yeah? Yeah, 93. Uh-huh.

So, and I just moved to New York. Yeah. And there was, everyone was rooting for that. Like, it had such a energy. And you had plucked writers that were, like, somewhat in our orbit. Well, Louis C.K. Yeah. Dino Stamatopoulos, who was a great writer on the Conan show.

And it had such energy. And it was the first time since Estenal that there was a comedy thing happening. Yes. That was raw and different. And the people of all ilks were really rooting for. Yeah. And it was on prime time. And that was what really excited me because Lauren actually wanted me to go back to the show as a producer at one point.

Like when the show was kind of on the ropes. After I had done Conan, there was like some mean article in New York Magazine. about it. And he kind of had to reinvent it. And that's when he brought in Will Ferrell and Sherry and all those people. But I just, I never really wanted to do that show, even though it may have seemed that way because I was like a punky, know it all. But I really did want to produce a sketch show. Yeah. And the Dana Carvey show, the chance to do it in prime time was really exciting to me. Yeah. And so, but like a takeover. Yeah. But what we didn't realize was, that, and we said, we agreed, like, we're going to have late night standards.

Like, we're going to be allowed to do whatever we did in late night. And they were cool with that because NYPD Blue was right after it. But I had never seen home improvement. And I thought home improvement, oh, that must be kind of racy. Tim Allen was busted for Coke and Pamela Anderson's in it. And then I never even watched it like an idiot. And then, like, like, five weeks in and we're just like punch drunk at this point from all. the criticism we're getting.

And I would turn it on and I'm like, this is something parents watch with their kids. That's why it's the number one show. Just because it's on at nine, it's something parents watch with their kids. And we put on Bill Clinton breastfeeding puppies and kittens on the very first show. And I just felt like the dumbest producer in television history at that moment. If I had only watched, Tomipzig. I only watched one episode. But what could you have done at that point?

Well, I wouldn't have done that. Yeah. I would have put that on at like 940. You would have begged for, yeah, right. Or I wouldn't have put it on at all. Yeah, or begged for another time slot. We had, like, a lot of stuff that didn't have to go that far. Right.

That was, like, probably the most offensive thing, not, well, okay, maybe not the most offensive thing we did. Yeah. But it was up there. Yeah. It was the first thing we did. Right. Right. And I felt so much guilt at that point.

But I was, uh, man. It's a lesson learned. Was it Dana's idea or your idea? The breastfeeding? The show. I think Dana was offered. And then we just kind of formulated it together. And I had the idea, Dana had the idea of calling it like the Taco Bell, Dana Carvey show.

He had the idea of doing a sponsor every week. And that ended up biting us in the ass because the joke was it was going to be a different sponsor every week. Yeah. That we were horrors. Right. But after the first one, after the breastfeeding sketch, Taco Bell decided. to make a big public show of like, we're pulling out. Really?

It's like you were never going to do the second show. We're pulling out. We have nothing. We didn't see the script, another lie. And so then the joke seemed to be that every week we would lose a sponsor. People didn't get what we were doing at that point. So we were really in a did from like the first five minutes. Yeah.

But, yeah. Then I pulled ambiguously gay duo and brought it to Lorne, and he wanted, it was the easiest deal I've ever made. Right. He was like, absolutely, let's do cartoons. Because over that summer, I had this other idea for this gimmick fun with real audio where I would take. Right. It was sort of the reverse of the clutch cargo, where it's a joke on the audio instead of the photograph. Right.

Or I would take real audio from interviews and then make a cartoon around. And so I got really excited. And then, yeah, so that's, I ended up doing those cartoons for like 11 years. 11 years? Yeah, yeah. Holy cow. I was in heaven. I got to do that.

And I was doing triumph and clutch cargo on Conan. And I had overall deals with both shows. Wow. So I didn't need any other jobs. Jeez. And I felt like the luckiest person on television. I was like a major part of both of those shows. God.

A late night and S&L. Man, it's so special. Yeah, yeah. It was great. Oh. And then they both... Both in New York. Both in New York.

I know. And I couldn't move because by 2008, when... Well, S&L finally dumped me. Because they just kept slashing the budget. This was like after Will Ferrell left, it was like a little bit more of a struggle for them, ratings-wise. And then they figured it out. And, like, I mean, they had amazing people.

Fred Armisen, Kristen Wigg, Will Forte, and they rebounded. So they got rid of me. It was really not Lorne. Lauren was very nice. He called me, and he said, they've been asking me to get rid of you for like two years because it's so expensive. Were they expensive? They were.

They were, you know. And time consuming? No, we would get them done in like two to three weeks. Whoa. But they were partly of the reason they were expensive was because of the rush job. Right. And then, and then Lauren, so I lost that gig, and then Conan moved to L.A. And I couldn't go because I had an autistic child.

There was just no way I was going to uproot for anything that wasn't going to suit him the best. And the best setup we had for him was in New Jersey. We ended up moving to New Jersey. We had already moved by then. So, anyway, we. So they both went away. They both went away. And then I've been writing movies primarily since then and the occasional Triumph stuff.

Amazing. Yeah. Are you going to tour with the Triumph thing? Because that San Francisco thing, which people can see on YouTube. Yes, on Triumph's YouTube page. Also on Team Coco's YouTube page. And I'm going to come out very soon with a Chicago one. I interviewed Rod Blagojevich.

And it was great. And I shot that last month in Chicago. So we're going to put out another one very soon. Awesome. But yes, I would like to. So funny. You tour, it should be... I'd either want a tour or just try to do like multiple ones and get them on a streamer.

Yeah, yeah. Like a topical special kind of thing. That would be a great tour. Yeah, I know. I know. The hard part is you have to like change the material for every city. Right, yeah. That's always been the challenge with...

Right. Like there's so much value in the immediate. Yeah. So when I would tour, I would always like, we'd write a bunch of jokes for, Buffalo and then okay now we're going to be in you know Boston and yeah and and then I always love interviewing people so I would like yeah always like to interview local people from the town right and a local celebrities so so it's a lot of work yeah it's not like I just have just run out with

a puppet yeah yeah yeah and just riff yeah we do a thing on this program where we we talk about the finer things in life and food wise and no and artisanal stuff, but I'm... Artisanal is one of my favorite words. But I'm from New Jersey. Nice. We're in New Jersey. My love, Bergen County, Park Ridge, Montfail. Holy shit. We'll click lake.

Very close. I'm not going to disclose because there might be some hikers from the Trump rally. I live in Bergen County. Oh, you do. It was great. I was just with my friends from high school just on Saturday. We're all still tight. And it really is because it was such a great place to grow up. It really was. kids one of my kids so we went to we were in this area where right we started them both in this

private school uh-huh and then one of my kids by like fourth grade was like i want to go to the public school yeah i want to be around the kids in the neighborhood yeah you know i know also that's burgen county has a really good big have great school system yeah schools may be better than the private school in some ways yeah so he moved and now yeah he's just yeah knows everybody in the neighborhood so great loves it and they just go go and hang out and it really does have that. Yeah. My wife grew up there too. And we didn't meet until we were comics

at the comic strip. Really? But we were kids in like the same I was in the same town. And it's funny because I remember as a kid thinking, this kind of sucks because you want to get away from where you grew up, but this is pretty nice. Like I can see

coming back here. I was like, I'm not going back. No, I'm after we're empty nesters, we're actually thinking of moving to be closer to my autistic son. Oh, yeah. He lives in Massachusetts, and he got set up in a beautiful school there, a residential school. He had a lot of issues. Yeah. And the school has really helped him. He's much happier.

And now he lives in a house with like six other young adults. Wow. And I don't think we can replicate it in New Jersey the same way. So we're probably going to move up there. Wow. And the boys are not happy about that. Oh, wow. They understand, but they feel like they really have roots there. Yeah.

You know? I know. We have one, her brother still lives there. And I'm so thankful for it because I get to go back and visit. Yeah. Go through, like, go to the Ridge diner. Oh, I know the Ridge. Yeah, sure.

It's such a great thing. So anyway, I come from New Jersey. We do a taste test on this program of the things like I find just that are kind of absurd that America's eating. Oh, fantastic. I saw this and I thought, You would be good at tasting this. Absolutely. It's candy pop popcorn.

Flavored with Butterfinger. Popcorn with Butterfinger. That might be an improvement on Butterfingers. I'm not a big Butterfingers guy. You're not? No, but I like everything in Butterfingers, but not the actual item itself. I like the Butterfinger Blizzard,

which I get at the Dairy Queen. These are good. These are excellent. See, they don't have, it's the texture in the Butterfinger. the texture of that peanut that snap. Yeah, I'm not a fan of this. This is way better than a butterfinger.

This is pretty good. Well, I'll have more. Out of ten? Oh, this is a nine for sure. This is really good. Candy pop. This exists. I thought it was going to be ridiculous. I thought it was going to be like...

No, sometimes the most ridiculous things are the killers. Like, I mean, just think about it. The whole idea of like salted caramel 20 years ago putting salt on anything sweet was just like absurd.

It's disgusting and now it's like more popular than regular ice cream and shit. I thought when I got this this is going to be Smigel's opportunity to shit on America. Sorry. This is too good.

It's way too good. You know what else is? We crazy shit at home. You do? Yeah, we try stuff. My kids love to experiment. combined foods. Nice. So, we eat sun butter because one of my kids has allergies.

This is going to sound incredibly disgusting. But you put sun butter on watermelon? What? I'm not kidding. Probably works with peanut butter, too. I'm sorry to speak with my mouthful, but I learned my table manners from my dad. He used to lick the plate. Just a Jewish guy.

from Lower East Side. He literally would live a plate in front of everybody in the house. Are your siblings funny? My sister's very funny in her own in her own way. My dad was the funniest. He was. He was hilarious. He was a dentist. Very successful dentist, but he

he loved to fuck with people all the time. He would like have patients that had cotton in their mouths, full cotton in their mouths while he's like doing tooth bonding. And then he would just like It'd be like a 60-year-old woman. And it's like, you have grandchildren, right?

What if they were all drowning at the same time? Which one would you say? I love the licking the plate. Oh, my God. And also, he would eat the watermelon all the way down to the rind. It would literally make me want to throw up at the table. But, you know. So who came up with the idea of...

That's the kind of life I led. That's like the trauma. in my childhood is like, ew, watermelon, Ryan, really? Yeah, you do a one-man show. Pretty pathetically happy childhood.

I would say that, and this is how sad, like I have no, like, how easily my life was as a kid. I just, I think some of my most painful memories are trying not to laugh

at like a wedding or a bar mitzvah. Or at Passover Seder. Oh my God, my dad would get mad at me and my sister. It was our turn to read. Yeah. And she would actively try to make me laugh, and he was never amused. And I'm telling you, that was pain like I'd never experienced. Think of anything.

Think of the cat dying. Just get through it. Yeah. This is your trauma. This is my trauma as a child. Pathetic. So who came up with the idea to put? butter on a

watermelon. One of my sons. One of my sons tried it, and I was like, this is amazing. Really? Turned into Regis Philbin. Calvin, come over here. He's got to try this.

Don't be a pussy. Sun butter and a watermelon. Have you ever been hurt by sun butter? Have you ever been hurt by a watermelon? Put them together. Oh, tell me about your movie. Oh. Yeah, well, now we're writing a sequel,

but... Writing a sequel. Yeah, it was a very successful movie. It was called Leo. Adam Sandler and Bill Burr played a very jaded turtle and a lizard who shared a tank in fifth grade class. They were class pets. And they've literally, the lizard's been there. Adams, the lizard, Leo.

He's literally been in that tank for like 75 years. So the beginning of the year, they're just jaded. They know every type of kid. Okay, here's the tween queens. know, the girls who, you know, are snobs and, uh, and here's the, uh, here's the, always sick and should have stayed home kid, you know, they're just so jaded. And then over the course of the movie, he realizes he overhears somebody talking about his breed of lizard and he starts to believe that he's going to die this year. He thinks about he's never done

anything with his life. So he tries to escape when the class pets are taking and home. And he gets caught by this girl. And he tries to escape getting caught. And he hurts himself. Like, somehow you, like, flies through a curtain and slams

against the wall and screams. I can't remember what it was, but it's in English. It's some kind of... And he's like, you talk? We're like, no, no, no! And then they... But he's busted. So they end up talking. I can't believe I'm still eating the fucking candy.

stuff is so good i'm just i'm my father's son it's it's rude it's not good for me i'm going to take it away from you it's getting in the way of the story it's so good now i'm supposed to plug but for god's sakes it's good candy pop holy shit i think i've eaten half a bag anyway anyway he he and the girl start talking and she starts sharing stuff with him because she's uninhibited around this lizard. And then he actually is able to give her some clever advice because he's seen every type of kid. And then next week he gets another kid taking him home and he tries to escape again, gets caught.

And then he starts getting more and more. Then he starts wanting to, he starts liking giving kids advice. And they start really liking him. And then he realizes that's his purpose in life. And he doesn't need to, like, see the world and escape. Right. And it sounds very serious, actually. But it's not.

It's really funny. I remember. It's really funny. I saw a very funny clip of when the girl's crying. Oh, that's my favorite. And the little lizard is just talking about how ugly she is when she cries. Well, you see, he's got a song. I actually wrote a bunch of songs for the movie.

That one's called Don't Cry. And it's like, don't cry. Cryings for weaklings Don't cry It's lazy and dumb It's like this beautiful Mary Poppins kind of lullaby We're talking about how you look so ugly when you cry Yeah, no, yeah

Dry those eyes They make you look ugly Suck it up You mustn't succumb Yeah No but the movie I was asking about is the temples movie oh oh shit yes i'm in a movie you're in a movie as an actor oh okay you didn't write it no but it's good oh okay it's a really good movie it's an independent film

Sony classics uh bought it at sundance okay it was a big hit there and it's opening uh last week of august nationwide and it stars jason swartzman carol kane and uh wow a lot of other great performers in the temples between the temples between the temples and it's about a canter who loses the ability to sing because he's going through, he's gone through a lot of trauma. And he's still teaching, I play the rabbi. I don't know how they pulled it off. Hours and hours.

I called Martin Lawrence and I was like, you think you had it bad. Try turning me into a rabbi. Big mama's making her money. No, so, so yeah, I play the rabbi who doesn't understand what he's going through and is trying to set him up with his daughter. Nice. It's a really funny movie and it's really sweet. And what I love most about it is that it's about religion, but it doesn't mock religion. Right.

It's kind of, it sort of reminds you what religion is supposed to be, you know? That's nice. I'm kind of an observant Jew myself, actually. and I always get tired of like it's such an easy target in comedy, shitting on religion. And some of it is deserved. I think I feel like Catholic. Oh, my God, yeah. No, Catholicism.

It is hilarious in many levels. No, but there are so many good aspects to religion that get, you know, swept under the rug because people focus on, you know, the easy stuff, the extreme stuff. Yeah, exactly. And they don't, like, you know, when my dad passed away, I got to actually, he really wanted me, I knew he wanted me to, like, say this prayer cottage every day for him. And I went to Shul like twice a day. Wow. Said it three times a day in these different services.

But I got a lot out of it because, like, I got to, like, listen to sermons every. There was an amazing rabbi in, you know, Farallon, New Jersey. Uh-huh. in Rabbi Uden. And he just was so he just took me through the whole Bible and just reminded me of so many great lessons that you can

glean from being religious. Helps your life. Yeah, it's really, it really can be a blueprint for how to not be an asshole. There's a right, exactly. There's something to people figuring all this stuff out for thousands of years. Yeah.

Of like, no, there's a lot of archaic stuff in there, but you can't just dismiss all of it for that reason. Right. So this movie, you know, I'm kind of a, I'm kind of a, you know, my rabbi is like not the best role model for Jews, I would say. Oh, really? No, but he's like, he's the kind of rabbi who's like very concerned with who's donating to the synagogue.

It's like kind of into himself. Right. That kind of thing. Yeah. But that serves a purpose in the movie as to like, you. You know, then Carol Kane comes in, who's not formally religious, but kind of represents a lot of the great aspects of being a good Jew. I always say this about my wife. My wife does so much for other moms with autistic kids.

She's such a generous soul and to her own children. Right. And to my son, Daniel, just when I think of just the, and all, you know, I just think of her as like she was not brought up nearly as religious. as I was, but I wish I could be the kind of Jew she is. Yeah. That level of, you know. I have that thing with my way. Where it's, yeah.

Women are better in general. Like, I take a lot of, like, all the things you're talking about, like, the lessons of the Bible, like, dealing with your, helps you deal with anxiety and treating people nicely. I know. All this stuff that I'm like. Just perspective. She, it just happens to her naturally. I know. I know.

And that's just nice to people just because. But it's like, you know, these religious, even the rich. rituals, like, they help remind you of how lucky we are. Yeah. Like, Jews, I'm not that I'm this observant, but, like, there are prayers for everything. Yeah. Like, people, like, most of religious Jews, there's a prayer for before you take a piss. Oh, really?

Yeah. Yeah. Just, like, thank you God that your, everything's working. Right. Thank you, dear blessed art thou who did not, who, you know, without whom I would have sharded at that party. I mean. Yeah. It is a weird thing though when you start kind of going drifting back and accepting it and taking in lessons and stuff.

There is a part where you start to think, am I going crazy? Without a doubt. Right? No, it's so easy to mock it and dismiss it because you don't even have to believe that there's God necessarily. You could suspect it. It's almost irrelevant, you know, because it's really about gratitude. It's really about the miracle that we're here in this shitty room. Right.

This make-believe room. It could be a lot worse. We could be downstairs in the real room. Exactly. Holy shit. Oh, man. Well, thank you for this. This was so great.

Talking to triumph is a dream. Talking to Jiminy Glick is the only close. Oh, he's the best. It's a very similar thing, though, isn't it? It is. Well, he does all one-on-one. but I'm just in awe. I love him.

I love Jiminy Glick. Yeah. His new ones, his new ones on Kimmel. Yeah. With Hater was so good. No, he's so good. But I don't know.

He's a force of nature. I don't know. Triumph, holy cow. Triumph does his thing. And I'll listen. Even to be included in that conversation is an honor. I have so much, I'm in such awe of Martin Short.

Well, I'm in awe of you, sincerely. You've created so much great stuff. just such a force. For real. It's nothing but respect and gratitude. Really, because like you broke through. There's a prayer for my cartoons. It's in the Bible. I was shocked. I was like, really?

I mean, you know, it mentions A's and Gary. There's always been stuff that you run into as you're making your way as a fan and that's funny and pretty funny and kind of funny and your stuff was always holy shit funny.

And that is a big deal. Winging for the vents is like, yeah, that's something Conan and I always love to just not hold back. Yeah, so great. Thank you for this. Thank you. Appreciate it.